Episode 349: Bird-Watching, Pet Mediums, and Sticker Charts with Annie Hartnett

Release Date: April 21, 2025

Introduction

In Episode 349 of Forever35, hosts Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu delve into an engaging conversation with acclaimed author Annie Hartnett. This episode explores Annie's unique self-care practices, the inspirations behind her latest novel, and the importance of community through accountability workshops. Rich with humor and heartfelt insights, the discussion offers listeners a comprehensive look into the creative and personal lives of the guests.

Personal Updates and Opening Chats

Before introducing their guest, Doree and Elise share personal anecdotes, setting a warm and relatable tone for the episode.

• Elise's Middle School Dance Experience ([03:35] - [07:12]): Elise recounts her observations from her daughter’s first middle school dance. She notes, “the girls were clustered in groups of girls and the boys in groups of boys,” highlighting the social dynamics and the ‘sneaker ball’ trend where girls paired dresses with sneakers. This reflection leads to a humorous exchange about how the current generation dresses and interacts differently compared to past generations.

• Elise’s Dog Crisis ([07:16] - [12:11]): Elise shares a distressing experience involving her dog, Oscar, who swallowed a large stuffed toy. She describes the ordeal of managing Oscar’s health emergency while dealing with personal disappointments, including missing a concert she was excited about. At [09:25], she vents, “I couldn't go because I was in the emergency room again with my dumb dog,” showcasing the challenges of pet ownership and the emotional toll it can take.

Introducing Annie Hartnett

At [20:37], Doree introduces the episode’s guest, Annie Hartnett, highlighting her impressive literary accomplishments:

“Her books have, like, won a gajillion awards... 'Unlikely Animals' was one of the best books of 2022, according to the Washington Post and Book List.”

Annie’s background as a novelist with accolades such as the Julie Award and the Howe Prize for fiction establishes her as a distinguished figure in the literary world.

Self-Care Practices

The conversation shifts to self-care, with Annie discussing her personal routines and challenges in maintaining balance between physical and creative pursuits.

• Weightlifting as Self-Care ([20:58] - [21:57]): Annie explains her commitment to weightlifting, inspired by author Amy Tan. She shares:

  “I have started lifting weights... Amy Tan... said, if I'm going to keep writing, I need to be strong because you spend so much time sitting.”

  This practice underscores Annie’s dedication to maintaining physical health to support her writing endeavors.

• Writing and Sticker Charts ([21:57] - [24:31]): Annie reveals her innovative approach to writing through sticker charts, a method inspired by her daughter’s potty training routine. She says:

  “I made myself a sticker chart and wrote 'Annie's Potty Chart'... crossed out 'potty' and wrote 'novel' at the top.”

  This playful yet effective strategy helps her stay motivated and track her progress, demonstrating her ability to blend parenting techniques into her creative process.

Annie’s New Book: The Road to Tender Hearts

Doree invites Annie to discuss her latest novel, "The Road to Tender Hearts," providing listeners with an insight into its storyline and themes ([24:55] - [26:12]).

• Synopsis: Annie outlines the plot, centered around PJ Holiday, an older man grappling with alcoholism and hoarding, who discovers his high school friend has passed away. Driven by unresolved feelings, PJ embarks on a road trip to reconnect with his past and confront his present challenges. The journey becomes more complex as he gains custody of his great niece and nephew and is joined by a cat with the uncanny ability to predict death.

• Themes of Second Chances and Connection ([40:23] - [41:43]): Doree and Annie delve into the enduring nature of high school crushes and their representation in the novel. Annie reflects on her own middle school crush, illustrating how these early emotions shape one's understanding of love and connection. She articulates:

  “PJ is looking for a way to connect with his younger self and trying to get back to when everything felt possible... the novel is really about second chances in many ways.”

  This discussion highlights the novel’s exploration of nostalgia, redemption, and the human desire for reconnection.

Exploring Themes of Death and Animals in Annie’s Works

Annie shares her fascination with incorporating themes of death and animals into her storytelling, linking them to personal experiences and broader existential questions ([26:37] - [36:00]).

• Personal Influences: Annie discusses how her father's heart attack in 2016 profoundly impacted her writing. She states:

  “Ever since then, I've been waiting for... I know he's gonna die someday... always wondering, what if this is the last time I talked to him.”

  This personal grief informs her narrative style, blending humor with poignant reflections on mortality.

• Animal-Human Relationships ([33:38] - [36:00]): The conversation touches on the deep connections between humans and animals, inspired by Annie’s mother’s bird-watching and unique interpretations of bird songs. Annie elaborates:

  “Animals are really intelligent in ways that we aren't. I love collecting stories about the way animals interact with people.”

  She shares anecdotes, such as a therapy cat named Oscar who could predict deaths, illustrating the mystical and comforting roles animals play in human lives.

Accountability Workshops and Building Community

Annie transitions to discussing the accountability workshops she co-founded with fellow writer Tessa, emphasizing their role in fostering a supportive community for writers ([42:05] - [50:36]).

• Origin and Growth: Starting as a mutual support system after Annie’s first book and Tessa’s memoir, the workshops have expanded to include around 80 members. Annie explains:

  “We met every two weeks on Zoom to update each other on what's going on... We added two writers to our mix, Rufi Thorpe and Claire Beams.”

• Structure and Purpose: The workshops emphasize accountability, community support, and creative collaboration. They include regular meetings, a book club, and access to Annie and Tessa for personalized support. Annie notes:

  “Everyone has a contract... if you need to talk something through, you make an appointment.”

  This structured yet flexible approach caters to writers with diverse needs, promoting sustained creativity and productivity.

• Impact and Philosophy: Annie shares her belief in the importance of external structures for creative success, aligning with philosophies from thought leaders like Gretchen Rubin. She comments:

  “Accountability groups are not our tools, they’re not training wheels... you need a partner of some kind.”

  This perspective underscores the necessity of community and accountability in overcoming creative blocks and achieving personal goals.

Book Club and Literary Discussions

The episode also explores the dynamic of their book club, highlighting current and past selections that engage the group deeply ([50:36] - [53:33]).

• Current and Past Reads: Annie mentions their upcoming book club selection, Lydia Yukonovic’s memoir, "Beyond the Waves," and reflects on previous picks like Miranda July’s "All Fours." She remarks:

  “So it's a lot to ask of a person I didn't really know, but she had opened the ask for... we're like this is what more writers need.”

• Community Engagement: The book club fosters rich discussions and diverse perspectives, enhancing the overall experience for members. Annie highlights the enthusiasm and participation, noting how certain books, like "All Fours," sparked lively debates and engagement.

Closing Remarks and Future Plans

As the episode concludes, Doree and Elise share their personal intentions for the week, including Doree’s planning for her son's birthday and Elise’s goals for attentive family time. Annie discusses her upcoming book events, emphasizing her love for connecting with readers during her tours.

• Event Announcements: Annie expresses excitement about her scheduled events in Portland, Seattle, New England, and North Carolina, encouraging listeners to join her on this road trip themed around her latest book.

• Final Thoughts: The hosts extend heartfelt thanks to Annie for her insightful contributions and encourage listeners to engage with her work and the accountability workshops. Doree urges booksellers and those in publishing to consider hosting Annie, highlighting the mutual benefits of such collaborations.

Notable Quotes

• Elise Hu on Oscar’s Incident ([05:35]):

  “I couldn't go because I was in the emergency room again with my dumb dog.”

• Annie Hartnett on Weightlifting ([20:58]):

  “I have started lifting weights... Amy Tan... said, if I'm going to keep writing, I need to be strong because you spend so much time sitting.”

• Doree Shafrir on Reading Ruts ([24:31]):

  “If you are in a reading rut and need to be unlocked, read Annie's Road to Tender Hearts.”

• Annie Hartnett on Accountability ([42:05]):

  “Everyone has a contract... if you need to talk something through, you make an appointment.”

• Annie Hartnett on Animals ([36:00]):

  “Animals are really intelligent in ways that we aren't. I love collecting stories about the way animals interact with people.”

Conclusion

Episode 349 of Forever35 offers an enriching blend of personal stories, literary insights, and practical advice on maintaining creativity and well-being. Through Annie Hartnett’s experiences and the hosts' engaging dialogue, listeners gain valuable perspectives on balancing life’s challenges with creative pursuits, the magic of animal companionship, and the power of community support in achieving personal and professional goals.