Mini-Ep 437: Reflection Not Perfection

Summary

Podcast Summary: Forever35 Mini-Ep 437: Reflection Not Perfection

Introduction

In this heartfelt mini-episode of Forever35, co-hosts Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu delve into personal reflections and listener stories, all centered around the theme of embracing imperfection. Released on April 2, 2025, episode 437 titled "Reflection Not Perfection" offers an engaging blend of personal anecdotes, listener interactions, and practical advice, all delivered with the hosts' signature humor and self-awareness.

Hair Loss and Beauty Industry Pressures

The episode kicks off with Elise Hu sharing her struggles with hair loss, a topic that resonated deeply with many listeners. At 04:05, Elise mentions a New York magazine article that questioned whether young women are genuinely experiencing hair loss or if it's being exaggerated by aggressive marketing from the beauty industry.

Elise Hu: "I'm like, am I losing my hair or not losing my hair? So that's kind of my latest worry."

Doree Shafrir concurs, emphasizing the reality of hair loss, especially as women age, and the added confusion caused by media and advertisements.

Doree Shafrir: "As ladies in our 40s, I think it is probably quite likely that we are actually losing our hair."

The conversation highlights the internal conflict many face between genuine health concerns and societal pressures to maintain certain beauty standards. They encourage listeners to consult healthcare professionals to discern the truth about their personal situations.

Listener Reflections on COVID-19

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to listener reflections on the five-year anniversary of the COVID-19 pandemic. Doree reads a poignant voicemail from a healthcare worker who recounted the traumatic experiences during the pandemic, including overwhelming stress and witnessing the fragility of life.

Listener Voicemail at 14:48:

"It was a really, really tough time... It was terrifying to know not to know whether you were going to get sick and not know whether you were going to live or die."

The hosts express deep empathy and gratitude towards front-line workers, acknowledging the lasting impact of the pandemic on both personal and professional lives.

Another listener's email shares a five-year journey from a toxic nursing job during COVID to becoming a nurse educator, highlighting personal growth and career transformation post-pandemic.

Elise Hu: "It's so touching... Thank you for all of the work that you were doing, too, to save lives."

Practical Tips and Recommendations

Amid the heavy reflections, Doree and Elise intersperse the conversation with practical advice and recommendations:

• Weeknight Dinner Idea (06:50): Doree shares a simple recipe for a pesto chicken penne dish, perfect for meal prepping and easy lunches.

  Doree's Recipe Highlights:

  • Cook penne pasta and mix with goat cheese and pesto.
  • Add shredded cooked chicken.
  • Reheat for convenient lunches throughout the week.

• Blog Recommendation (09:23): They recommend Pinch of Yum, a blog offering weekly meal ideas, which is great for listeners seeking new recipes and culinary inspiration.

• Houseplant and Biscotti Recommendations (25:45 & 26:20): The hosts discuss affordable houseplants available at Costco, such as fiddle leaf figs and lavender, and Doree recommends La Dolce Vita Classic almond biscotti as a delightful treat to enjoy with coffee.

Listener Support and Community

The episode emphasizes the importance of community and support, especially for listeners going through challenging times:

• Shout-Out for a Listener's Friend in the NICU (22:07): A heartfelt voicemail from Claire praises her friend Rachel, whose newborn is in the NICU. The hosts offer words of solidarity and practical tips, such as organizing meal trains and providing comforting items like fuzzy slippers or favorite throws.

Perfectionism and Personal Growth

One listener's email delves into the topic of perfectionism, resonating with the episode's theme of embracing imperfections. Doree and Elise discuss the recommended book, The Perfectionist's Guide to Losing Control by Katherine Morgan Schaffler, which explores different types of perfectionism and offers strategies for managing it adaptively.

Elise Hu: "It's really liberating since it takes the POV that perfectionism isn't something to get rid of, but rather work with adaptively."

Final Thoughts and Community Engagement

As the episode wraps up, Doree and Elise encourage ongoing listener engagement through surveys, emails, and voicemails. They remind listeners to share their stories and reflections, fostering a strong sense of community and mutual support.

Notable Quotes:

• Elise Hu at 07:50: "Wouldn't it just be my luck that I decide, oh, maybe I'm losing my hair and then I start taking something and it like makes my eyebrow problem worse."

• Listener Voicemail at 14:48: "It was just a really, really tough time that I hope never, ever, ever to experience again in my life because just a really, really dark time."

• Doree Shafrir at 16:50: "We got another email... Five years later, I'm now a nurse educator and able to teach new graduate nurses who went to school during the pandemic."

Conclusion

"Reflection Not Perfection" serves as a poignant reminder of the challenges faced over the past few years while celebrating personal growth and the strength of community. Doree Shafrir and Elise Hu expertly balance serious reflections with lighthearted tips and recommendations, creating a compelling and relatable episode for all listeners. Whether dealing with personal health concerns, professional transformations, or seeking practical advice, this episode offers valuable insights and heartfelt support.

Key Takeaways:

• Embrace imperfections and seek support from professionals when needed.
• Reflect on personal growth journeys post-pandemic.
• Utilize community resources and practical tips for daily life improvements.
• Foster connections and support within the Forever35 listener community.

Tune in to Forever35 for more insightful discussions on self-care, personal growth, and navigating the complexities of getting older with humor and wisdom.

Transcript

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[Dory Shafrir]

You know, before I lived in LA, I traveled to LA and those trips back and forth showed me that they don't call it the City of Angels for nothing. The sky is blue, the weather is gorgeous, and the food is amazing. Los Angeles chefs and mixologists draw inspiration from their varied cultural backgrounds and the city's diverse neighborhoods, making for a really exciting food scene. From game changing taco trucks to Michelin stars. If you're not a foodie, LA also has diverse cultures and communities that collaborate and mingle, elevating new voices in art, music, film and comedy. Did you know that Los Angeles has more museums and theaters than New York? From trailblazing street art to world class museums, art is everywhere in la. Plus LA knows how to put on a show. The worlds of sports and entertainment collide to create the kinds of events that could only happen here. Wherever you are in the city, you're never far from the next Only in LA moment. Find more ways to love [e-mail] hello and welcome to Forever 35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Dory Shafrier.

[Elise Hu]

And I'm Elise Hu and we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums.

[Dory Shafrir]

And this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share comments and your thoughts and we answer your questions to the best of our ability. But please remember we are not experts, we are podcast hosts and we always encourage you to seek support first and foremost from a medical and or mental health professional as needed. Oh before we get started we are doing a listener survey. Yeah so if you wouldn't mind just clicking on the link in our episode description and it's also linked in our link tree from our Instagram. It's on our website. It would be super helpful if you could answer just answer some questions over there so we can get a better sense of who's listening, who you are, what you want to hear about what you're into, what you're not into. Yeah, that would be great. So please, please click on that link. Yeah. Elise, how's it going?

[Elise Hu]

Fantastic. Well, I wanted to talk to you and the listeners because I've been complaining that I've been losing my hair. Right. Curiously, ever since, basically, January, the fires, and, and I had an episode like this during COVID actually, at the very beginning of COVID where I noticed my hair was falling out in the shower, and it was like, like I was shedding all over the place. And I can see it on my clothes and things. And then I've also had to deal with postpartum hair loss, which I think is very common. Like, after my babies are born, my hairline kind of moves back, and then I have little fuzzy baby hair at the front. And so I was actually looking at baby pictures of the kids and saw one from, like, 2015 when my middle daughter Issa was born. And, like, I could see all that fuzzy baby hair. My hair sort of looked like hers, but so I've been complaining about this. And then you all have written in with tips and things on our Patreon and also called in for these mini apps. But then a few days ago, the Cut from New York magazine put out a story. Did you see this story? It's about how a lot of young women are convinced they're losing their hair because we're being marketed to, like, with all of these hair growth products.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes, I saw their Instagram. I saw their Instagram post about it, ironically enough, but I didn't read the actual article.

[Elise Hu]

And so now I'm like, am I losing my hair? Or am I just, like, getting so many ads from hers or neutrophil or whatever, that now I'm like, oh, maybe I need to take that. So this is such a classic beauty industry thing, right? Like, problematizing something about you so that you can spend money to buy it or to buy a solution. And I'm sort of like, wait, am I losing my hair or not losing my hair? So that's kind of my latest wasn't the.

[Dory Shafrir]

Now, again, I did not read the full article, but just based on the excerpts that were in their Instagram post, it seemed that the gist of the article was about, like, women in their 20s and, like, early 30s thinking that they're losing their hair or being, like, influenced to think they're losing their hair. And I, I, I, I hate to say it, but, but, like, as ladies in our 40s, I think it is probably quite likely that we are actually losing our hair.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

And I.

[Elise Hu]

And it also talked about how during the COVID pandemic, a lot of folks were experiencing hair loss. And so it's. It's legit that it's. It's happening. I'm just sort of like, wait, because. Because our realities are so filtered through kind of the media that we consume now. I'm just sort of like, crap. Am I going to spend a bunch of money for something that isn't, like, a real problem? And how do I know if it's a real problem? And la, la, la. I need to consult. I'm gonna have to consult with an expert, because I've consulted with my hair person, and she's like, I don't know. Your hair looks fine. I mean, it looks the same.

[Dory Shafrir]

So go to your. Go to your dermatologist.

[Elise Hu]

Mm.

[Dory Shafrir]

That's who I would. That's who I would talk to. I will say, you know, my dermatologist was like, it'll take probably about six months for you to see results from taking minoxidil. And we're getting up on six months, and I'm. I'm seeing results.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, that's good. Yeah, that's good.

[Dory Shafrir]

It's working. The other thing that's, like, really funny to me is, is, you know, they say that when you start taking minoxidil, you can get unwanted hair growth. Like, some people get, like, they grow a mustache or, you know, their. Their faces get hairy or whatever. And I have noticed a little more peach fuzz, but nothing crazy. But what I ha. The only thing that has started to be very noticeable is one of my eyebrows has gotten, like, really, like, pretty bushy. And I pretty much. Yes. And I have thin eyebrows anyway. And it's. They're not, like, fully. They're not filling in exactly. But I'm noticing the hairs are getting super long really fast. And it's just the one eyebrow is sort of, like, out of control, and I can't shape it. And I usually get my eyebrows done. Like, I. I have historically been able to go, like, 10 to 12 weeks between eyebrow appointments because I just don't have that much eyebrow hair. And now I'm like, oh, my gosh. I'm not getting my eyebrows done for another, like, two weeks. This is an emergency.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

So that is the. That is the one, like, other result that I have seen.

[Elise Hu]

That's exactly the effect I don't want on my eyebrows because I have one of those problems where, like, I get Burt and, like, Burt from Bert and Ernie eyebrows And so I have to like go every two or three weeks, I have to like have them on text because it's like, I gotta come in tomorrow. So.

[Dory Shafrir]

So you know what?

[Elise Hu]

Wouldn't it just be my luck that I decide, oh, maybe I'm losing my hair and then I start taking something and it like makes my eyebrow problem worse.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes.

[Elise Hu]

So that's just what I don't need. But anyway, ladies, you should listen or you should read this article. It's in the cut. It's called. The headline is why are so many young women convinced they're balding? By Laura Pitcher. So check that out before we take a break.

[Dory Shafrir]

Elise. I had put out a call for weeknight dinner ideas and a listener did text in and say for Dory's dinner dilemma. And then they, they put little trademark sign. So I like that. I like the alliteration. Yes. I wanted to send in a fave of mine. Cook 8 ounces of penne pasta. I actually like the mini penne. And while it's cooking, combine 8 ounces of goat cheese and around 8 ounces of store bought pesto that you like. My preferred pesto comes in seven ounce containers, so it's slightly less and that's fine. Drain the pasta and throw back in the pan. Add the combined pesto, slash goat cheese and 6 to 8 ounces ounces of shredded cooked chicken. You could use a rotisserie chicken. Or I'll often cook a couple of chicken breasts in the slow cooker to use throughout the week. Stir it all together. Sometimes it's helpful to add some of the pasta water and voila. I usually make this on a Sunday and divide it into four for my lunches for the week. It reheats beautifully.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, that sounds so yummy and easy.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, yeah. And then someone else wrote in to recommend the blog Pinch of Yum. Huh?

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

And they also have a newsletter with ideas for the week. I love a blog recommendation. Like, let's just go back to blogs. Okay, we're going to take a short break before we do that. Our voicemail number is 781-591-0390. You can call or text us on that number. And our email is forever35podcastmail.com and we will be right back.

[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

Oh yeah, I see what you did there.

[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

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[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

All right, we are back. We had asked for your reflections about COVID in five years. Yeah, in in the wake of the five year anniversary of COVID if you can believe that. And we got a few. So I want to share. I want to share a couple. The first is a voicemail.

[Listener]

Hi Dorian, Elise. Apparently all I do is call you on my way home from work. Now I am in to share my Covid reflections with you guys. I was a healthcare worker during the pandemic. I was. I'm a speech therapist who works in a hospital and needless to say, it was a very traumatic time for everyone involved. We didn't really know who was going to be well and who was not going to be well. And very frequently I would walk onto the floor and not have any nursery staff available. They were coding patients down the hallway. It was just a really, really tough time. And it was very, very trained on everyone. And, you know, it was terrifying to know not to not know whether or not you were going to get sick and not know whether or not you were going to live or die. And unfortunately, healthcare has not really improved since then. So it's definitely changed the way that I see the world and definitely changed the way that I practice. And it's also just shown kind of those cracks in our society that we have and. And has really made me kind of be empathetic to those who don't have support that we can't really do much about. So, yeah, it was just a really tough time that I hope never, ever, ever to experience again in my life because just a really, really dark time. So I hope you guys are doing well and have a good rest of your week.

[Elise Hu]

Thank you for sharing that with us. Agree. Thank you for all of the work that you were doing, too, to save lives.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

It brings me a lot of dismay to hear her say, I don't think things are better or that we're more prepared or, you know, it's just like, great. We went through all of that and haven't improved. I think we've improved on some fronts, maybe, maybe not.

[Dory Shafrir]

I don't know.

[Elise Hu]

So, yeah, it's really. That. That's tough. That's a tough reflection, but really glad that you called us to share it with us.

[Dory Shafrir]

Me too. We got another email from a listener who said, I definitely have a Covid throwback for y'all. See the email below. It was the first time I ever emailed the podcast and wow, my life is so different since I quit that toxic job. I learned so much as a nurse slash human during the pandemic. Five years later, I'm now a nurse educator and able to teach new graduate nurses who went to school during the pandemic. Eek. All about how to be a nurse for real. This is my dream job. Anyway, love y'all. Thanks for everything, as always. I'm gonna just give some of the highlights here from. From the email that the listener sent us five years ago. At the time, they were 27 and they just like, they had really been through it during COVID They were working in a hospital that without good PPE and things were just rough and they eventually realized they needed to quit their job and then they started working in community health to distribute the COVID vaccine. But then that was a toxic environment. And then they put in their. Their two weeks and quit that job. And then they had a new job lined up. And it sounds like that maybe that new job was the one that that went well. So thank you for that update. I love a five year check in. My gosh. Yeah. How cool. It's crazy to, like, go back to these times.

[Elise Hu]

It's so touching.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. Elise, do you want to read this next one?

[Elise Hu]

Sure. Hello, Dori and Elise, Random pandemic reflection from me. I went from working two days from home to full time remote during the pandemic. I still work fully from home. One change that I've made during the pandemic that I've been able to stick to is that I brush my teeth for two minutes every morning and every evening. I was never able to get to two minutes in, especially in the morning, rushing to get out of the house for the morning commute. I've been getting compliments from the dental hygienists for the past few years on my excellent teeth cleaning habits. That's a great little change that lasted. Yeah. There's this great podcast if you're trying to encourage your kids or yourself to brush your teeth for the full recommended two minutes. There's a podcast called Chompers, and it's exactly two minutes. So you listen to it as the episode goes on, and so you know that you're supposed to stop brushing by the time it's over. It's so great. It's such a smart concept. So I'll make you that sometimes great.

[Dory Shafrir]

At doing the full two minutes.

[Elise Hu]

Me neither, me neither. Which is why I'm sort of like, I need to get Alexa to play Chompers.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, totally. That's so funny. All right, well, you know what? Before we take another break, I'm going to read another email on a different topic. And thank you all for sending in your Covid thoughts and reflections. And if you have others, please share them. We will happily read more of them, but this is a note we got from another listener. Dorian Elise, listener since season one here. So many things I want to say, but your open conversations about perfectionism were super relevant for me. Book reco for you and my fellow Forever 35 listeners that I found super helpful. The Perfectionist Guide to Losing Control by Katherine Morgan Schaffler. My lifelong bestie and I read and discussed it together. She's in South Korea and I'm in Massachusetts. Speaking of Staying in touch with long distance friends. We found it really liberating since it takes the POV that perfectionism isn't something to get rid of, but rather work with adaptively. It also outlines five types of perfectionism, so scratches that Cosmo quiz itch for we millennials, along with clarifying why I didn't feel like a classic perfectionist. Love you ladies. Love the pod. Thanks for being my favorite parasocial friends. P.S. dory, what's going on with golf lessons? You inspired me to look into programs at my local rec center. And what do you know, they had group golf lessons. It's been fun learning a new skill and knowing what to focus on when I'm less than great. And my husband is thrilled to have someone to play with. Totally worth a try. Thanks for the inspo. Oh, oh, I didn't sign up again. It was honestly just like too big a chunk of my day by the time I got all the way over there. The, the Like City Golf Academy is in Griffith park, which shouldn't be that far for me, but somehow always ended up taking like half an hour each way. And plus the time at the like, it was just like too much time in, in the middle of a work day. So I just haven't done it again. So. Yeah, so that's kind of what happened. Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

But good for the listener that you're.

[Dory Shafrir]

Doing for the listener. I know. I love that I inspired you to do this. It's awesome. Okay, well, we are going to take another short break and we will be right back with another couple of messages.

[Elise Hu]

Okay, we'll be right back. Foreign.

[Dory Shafrir]

We are back. This is a voicemail from a listener with a request for some tips.

[Elise Hu]

Cool.

[Claire]

Hi, my name is Claire. I was calling as a long time lover, forever 35 to give a shout out to my best friend Rachel, who turned forever 35 this year but also just had her first baby who was born with a congenital anomaly and is in the NICU for the foreseeable future, at least a few months. And she's doing such a good job as a new mom, even though the situation is horrible. And so I just wanted to call in. She also loves Forever 35 and we love talking about the show and also if any other people have any NICU tips, positive things to share, words of solidarity, anything, I would love to hear it and I'm sure she would too.

[Listener]

Thank you.

[Claire]

Love you Rachel and love you Elise and Dory.

[Elise Hu]

Well, thank you so much. What a lovely shout out to your friend and we are sending love and solidarity and support to our listener who is spending a lot of time in the NICU and wishing you all nothing but healthy and healing vibes for the baby. I imagine it's really stressful and exhausting to not be at home with the baby as you might have expected to and then having to deal with the grief too of like what you expected versus what the daily reality is in the NICU must be also very difficult. I will say that so many of my three children, 7 and 9 and 12, so many of their friends spent the early months of their lives in the NICU and are thriving and, you know, delightful and you will get through it. The one thing that I do recall from a lot of my friends who have had kind of eventful starts to their kids lives is that it's really cold in there. It can get really cold like in hospitals at night. So yeah, so like try and bring things from home to, to stay warm and cozy. Whether it's fuzzy slippers or, you know, your favorite throw, those kind of creature comforts can often be helpful. What does this make you think of? Door?

[Dory Shafrir]

You know, I was thinking about how like eating in the NICU when you're, when you're, when you have a baby in the NICU is, is often tough. And I, I know people who have babies in the NICU have often found getting like doordash gift cards to be super helpful. Stuff like that. Like just sort of like very practical, practical stuff.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

So that could be one way you could like organize a meal train. That could be something else that you do.

[Elise Hu]

And also just the shout out is really lovely too. So I'm so glad that you two have each other. Totally. You have a friend who cares all about you a lot and has reached out to us to amplify this shout out. And we are happy to. And sending you all of the healing vibes. Thank you callers and listeners for all of your submissions. And before we go, Dor, I know occasionally we like to do this, and maybe we didn't do it in last week's episode, but Costco Rex or Trader Joe's Picks, I have one that I just want to remind those of you who have Costco memberships about, which is like, this is the time of year when Costco has very affordable plants and gardening things.

[Dory Shafrir]

Ooh.

[Elise Hu]

So they often have like the fiddle leaf fig. That's very popular. It's very, it's like the hot house plant, you know, and they have the fiddle fig for like $23 or something like that. They have lots. They have they were. They had lavender at mine that you can plant in your front yard. They're also just, like, lots of gardening tools and hoses and planters. This is the time. So get out there. Yeah. If you want to get your affordable houseplants and gardening things at Costco. What about you? Have you spotted anything?

[Dory Shafrir]

Well, this is. This isn't, like, a new product. I almost mentioned it the other day when we were talking about, like, little treats that bring us joy, but they have this container of biscotti, the La Dolce Vita Classic almond biscotti. I think it's like 12 or $15, and it sees, like, kind of, like mini biscottis, and they're just like. They're really delicious. They're like, a nice little treat. And are they good with coffee? They're good with coffee. They're just like. They're just, like, yummy. I mean, are they the same as, like, what you would get in Rome? No, but.

[Elise Hu]

But that's not really a standard to which we should.

[Dory Shafrir]

No, exactly. But do they, like, scratch the biscotti itch? Yes.

[Elise Hu]

Great.

[Dory Shafrir]

So that is my. That is my recommendation.

[Elise Hu]

That's great because my parents are coming, and they are af. They are morning coffee drinkers and afternoon coffee drinkers, and my mom makes this whole ritual of making her coffee in the afternoon and having a little snack. So I should put this biscotti in the hu. Hideaway in the back house for them.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes, you totally should. You totally, totally coffee.

[Elise Hu]

I think that would be a nice hostess thing for me to do.

[Dory Shafrir]

That would be amazing.

[Elise Hu]

Okay, great.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right, everybody, thanks for listening. Elise, great to see you and talk to you. See you, and we'll talk to you soon. Bye.

[Sleep Number Advertiser]

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[Aura Advertiser]

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