Mini-Ep 488: Group Dynamics

Summary

Podcast Summary: Forever35 – Mini-Ep 488: Group Dynamics

Hosts: Doree Shafrir & Elise Hu
Release Date: April 15, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Doree and Elise, known for their self-care real-talk, respond to listener questions about group inclusivity, spending intentionally in trying times, and finding joy in small acts of resistance. They also share product recommendations and crowd-sourced advice on gardening and skincare. The main focus is on how to foster welcoming group dynamics, especially in parent playgroups where cliques may form, and the challenges of supporting newcomers. Throughout, the hosts balance humor, vulnerability, and practical wisdom.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Navigating Daily Life Amidst Broader Unrest

• The episode opens with reflections on the challenge of staying grounded as major world events loom large. The hosts acknowledge heightened anxiety due to political turmoil (the “second Trump administration”) and the surreal feeling of “hypernormalization.”
  • Quote:

    "You talked about this in the very early days of the second Trump administration, which is, like, this concept that was very familiar to those in Eastern Europe and the former Soviet bloc of hypernormalization...having to go and get groceries and pick up your kids from school...while there's these large macro catastrophes happening."
    — Elise Hu, [03:16]

Personal Updates: Family Activities

• Doree describes bonding with her son Henry through tennis sessions, highlighting how persistence—and opting for informal over expensive professional lessons—can foster positive experiences.

  • Quote:

    "I'm not, like, coaching him exactly, but...I'm giving him some tips. And he actually had a lot more tolerance for it than I was expecting."
    — Doree Shafrir, [04:47]

• Elise shares that her daughter Luna is into football with her dads, but laments the lack of a shared sport, connecting this to larger themes of family connection and adaptability.

Listener Q&A: Intentional Spending & Joyful Resistance

• Listener Text: A listener is working to reduce spending in response to political events by gardening, crafting, and supporting local activism, and wonders how to keep it joyful rather than restrictive ("not 'diet culture' by another name").
• Hosts’ Insights:
  • Elise points out the value of reframing spending as generative (making/baking/growing vs. buying), and cautions against rigidity, drawing parallels to the harms of both diet mentality and obsessive tracking:
    • Quote:

      "We watch our screen time, we can tend to watch our screen time in the way that we police our food intake...that extends...to watching my bank account."
      — Elise Hu, [08:05]

  • Doree suggests self-kindness and setting broad intentions, not strict goals:
    • Quote:

      "It's going to be basically impossible to spend nothing...but you're making all these other positive choices. So just...take comfort in that."
      — Doree Shafrir, [10:24]

Main Topic: Group Dynamics & Preventing Cliques

[15:00] Listener Voicemail

• A playgroup leader asks for strategies to help new parents feel welcome and prevent established cliques from forming, especially when icebreakers are difficult (since kids are always in motion).

Hosts’ Strategies:

• Elise suggests:

  • Proactively identifying new members and formally pairing them with established attendees—a “buddy system.”
    • Quote:

      "You could even more formally say, 'Hey, I'm looking for volunteers to be assigned a new person...to be their buddy.' It's almost like a mentorship-mentee program..."
      — Elise Hu, [17:00]

  • Setting behavioral norms that encourage physical and social openness (e.g., opening up circles to new people), inspired by conference facilitation techniques.
    • Quote:

      "...when you're standing in a circle...always, like, be opening up to more people...those norms and just setting them from the very start can really encourage belonging and group dynamics that are inclusive."
      — Elise Hu, [18:10]

• Doree reflects on baby group experiences:

  • Notes that cliques are nearly inevitable and often exacerbated when new people are introduced to already-established cohorts—suggests the idea of “waves” or starting new group cycles by child age, to align interests.
    • Quote:

      "Once that cohort with a baby group has formed, it's really hard to let new people in...maybe starting different groups with different cycles of kids."
      — Doree Shafrir, [21:16]

Community Wisdom: Master Gardeners & Free Plant Help

[22:46] Listener Email from Anne, Master Gardener Program, UF

• Master Gardeners are an underutilized resource for free, science-backed, hyper-local gardening advice in the U.S.

  • Quote:

    "The important thing to know about Master Gardener advice is that it is all research based, science backed...We are not selling anything...just truly sharing what will work best for you based on university research."
    — Listener Anne, [23:20]

• Listeners are encouraged to seek out their local extension office for free expertise.

• Reddit Tip: Other listeners recommend the r/plantclinic subreddit for houseplant troubleshooting (“wish my derm were as good!”) [25:33]

Product & Lifestyle Recommendations

Listener & Host Tips

• Rob’s Question ([30:23]): Simple face lotion for men
  • Doree recommends Cerave (especially with sunscreen); choose the product for skin type.
  • Quote:

    "He didn't say if he has a particular skin issue. But Cerave makes a few different moisturizers for different types of skin..."
    — Doree Shafrir, [31:36]

• Trader Joe’s Dark Chocolate Covered Crunchy Corn Kernels ([32:21])
  • Listener-enthusiast recommended; Doree and Elise debate its merits and vow to try.
• Byoma Moisturizing Gel Cream ([33:21])
  • Listener finds it “very moisturizing, fast absorption, doesn’t feel sticky”—great value.
  • Packaging is the only complaint; “at this price, I kind of accept it.”
• Kindle Obsolescence ([34:32])
  • Listener laments Amazon discontinuing support for older Kindles; hosts express nostalgia and frustration at “planned obsolescence.”
    • Quote:

      "Why can't we just keep the things that we love? Keep and maintain old things. Why must we continually buy new things?"
      — Elise Hu, [35:09]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "All things considered...hanging on. Hanging on."
  — Elise Hu on coping, [02:41]

• "Try not to, you know, get upset with yourself if you spend any money...you're making other positive choices."
  — Doree Shafrir, [10:24]

• "If somebody sat down at your table...you would physically try to, like, open up your group to include more people."
  — Elise Hu, [18:20]

• "There were like two distinct cliques. And then there were a few people who were, like, left out totally...and also, like, I don't think the facilitator was that good."
  — Doree Shafrir, on baby group dynamics, [19:51]

• "It's going to be basically impossible to spend nothing."
  — Doree Shafrir, [10:14]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:26] — Beginning: Coping with world events, “hypernormalization”
• [04:14] — Family activities, tennis with Henry
• [07:38] — Listener text: Resisting consumerism, spending joyfully
• [15:00] — Main voicemail: Preventing cliques & group dynamics tips
• [22:46] — Gardening: Master Gardener program explained
• [25:33] — Reddit r/plantclinic plug
• [30:23] — Face lotion for men: Cerave recommendations
• [32:21] — Trader Joe’s snack and Byoma moisturizer recs
• [34:32] — Kindle obsolescence & planned obsolescence reflections

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Takeaways

• Group dynamics require active cultivation; establish explicit norms and buddy systems.
• Joyful, intentional consumption (vs. rigid avoidance) can be a form of resistance.
• Leverage community knowledge (like Master Gardeners) for accessible, expert help.
• The struggle to maintain beloved objects (like Kindles) in a world of planned obsolescence resonates widely.
• Humor, practical wisdom, and kindness—to others and oneself—remain key themes.

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For further details, visit forever35podcast.com.

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End of Summary

Transcript

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[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

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[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

Hello and welcome to Forever 35, a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Dory Shafrier.

[Elise Hu]

And I'm Elise Hu. And we're just two friends who like to talk a lot about serums.

[Dory Shafrir]

And this is a mini episode where we hear from you, we share your comments and your thoughts, and we answer your questions to the best of our ability. But please remember we are podcast hosts, we are not experts and we always encourage you to seek support first and foremost from a medical and or mental health professional as needed.

[Elise Hu]

I mean, especially with our president tweeting about the end of civilization and all. I would imagine a lot of us should be seeking any mental support and emotional supports as much as Possible. Somebody was asking me.

[Dory Shafrir]

So true.

[Elise Hu]

How I was doing. I was like, well, all things considered.

[Dory Shafrir]

Right.

[Elise Hu]

Hanging on. Hanging on. Maris Kriseman, who was on this show just last year, the author and literary critic. Merits. She had put some. She posted something on threads or something like that about, like, am I supposed to call my congressman.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

To tell them I'm very upset about the end of civilization.

[Dory Shafrir]

Totally. Like, is that something we're supposed to have to do or. Yes.

[Elise Hu]

Holy moly. Yeah. So just trying to. You talked about this in the very early days of the second Trump administration, which is, like, this concept that was very familiar to those in Eastern Europe and the former Soviet bloc of hypernormalization.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes. Right.

[Elise Hu]

Which I think describes just having to go and get groceries and pick up your kids from school and, you know, make coffee in the morning and all these things that are normal while.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yep.

[Elise Hu]

There's these large macro catastrophes happening. So we're all just trying to get by.

[Dory Shafrir]

We're all trying to just survive here.

[Elise Hu]

That is right.

[Dory Shafrir]

Oh, boy. Boy, oh, boy.

[Elise Hu]

Do you have any. You have any exciting plans coming up that you want to talk about?

[Dory Shafrir]

You know, something I've been doing with Henry is I've been taking him to play tennis, like, just with us.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, cute.

[Dory Shafrir]

Because, you know, he's taken, like, he takes group lessons sometimes, but sometimes it's hard to schedule, and sometimes the group lessons, like, aren't. I don't know. They're not that great. But private lessons are also, like, private tennis lessons are pretty expensive.

[Elise Hu]

Right.

[Dory Shafrir]

So. Yeah. But I just wanted to kind of, like, get him in the habit of just, like, hitting, you know? Hitting.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

And we went last weekend, just. I just booked a court for an hour and we played, and it was really nice. And we're going to do it again this weekend. So I like that, too, because it's like an activity that we can do together. And, like, I'm not. Not, like, coaching him exactly, but, like, you know, I'm giving him some tips. Yeah. And he actually had a lot more tolerance for it than I was expecting. Like, the last time we had tried this, maybe, I don't know, at least a year ago, he lasted, like, 10 minutes, but this time he lasted, like, 45 minutes.

[Elise Hu]

That's great.

[Dory Shafrir]

And. Yeah. And I was like, okay, this is. This is great. Like, just kind of getting him out there. So I don't know. That was just like a nice little. Nice little thing.

[Elise Hu]

I wish I had a sport that my kids played with me or. I wish the kids played a sport That I played, you know, like, I love. Like, Luna is now super into football, and so she's learning football routes. This is like, American football, not soccer. And so she's learning from her, both her dads, from Rob, and from Maddie, like, how to run routes. Like, wow. And quick slant and. Yeah, and it's really fun for them. Like, they're having all this good times, but I'm not that great at throwing and catching a football. It'd be cool if they got back into tennis. Both those girls, when they were 4 and 6, started taking lessons. But I did find it to be kind of a waste of money.

[Dory Shafrir]

Like, yeah, it's tough, I think.

[Elise Hu]

I mean, they were able to last for the lesson. It was just that, are they really learning?

[Dory Shafrir]

Are they learning anything?

[Elise Hu]

Right?

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, exactly.

[Elise Hu]

And I don't really think so.

[Dory Shafrir]

I was skeptical. I was. I've definitely been skeptical.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

So, you know, we'll see. It's, like, it's fun for me. And if it's, like, if he likes it, then we will keep doing it. So.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. Great. You know, Elise, you were mentioning just sort of, like, everything that's been going on in the world, and we actually got a text kind of about this from a listener who said, with everything that's happening in the world right now, much of which has been instigated by a federal government I don't agree with, I find myself wanting to change my relationship with spending while I still can. I'm trying to grow more of my own vegetables and flowers. I know this is not accessible or desirable to everyone, but it truly brings me so much joy and calm. I'm doing more irl, signature gathering, supporting a local city council candidate, baking, sewing, all the cozy hobbies so that I make myself less susceptible to advertising. Is anyone else in the same boat? Has anyone successfully lowered unnecessary spending in a way that isn't diet culture by a different name?

[Elise Hu]

That's a great question. I love what she's doing more in real life with the mutual aid, signature gatherings, supporting local races, baking, sewing. Really leaning into neighborliness.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes.

[Elise Hu]

I think there's a real connection between affordability and the larger conversations going on in progressive circles or in the Democratic Party about affordability. But then also its twin, I think, is neighborliness and how we can support each other in a way that isn't requiring consumption, you know, or doesn't require consumption. It can be generative, like what we can make, what we can grow, what we can bake, and all those things. So I think about a lot of these Themes? I don't know. I think partially. Partially because of my general rejection of diet culture. I also don't monitor things like screen time because I think, like, we watch our screen time, we can tend to watch our screen time in the way that we police our food intake or have policed food intake in the past. And so. And that extends, I think, to watching very carefully my bank account. You know, like, I don't know if I'm spending more or spending less necessarily. And I imagine, though, that lowering unnecessary spending can happen without rigidly tracking.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes.

[Elise Hu]

And because you're asking the question, have you lowered unnecessary spending in a way that isn't diet culture by a different name? Like, being really rigid about it is what I'm thinking you're asking. And so, yeah, you could essentially set some. Set some, like, big picture goals. Right. Like, all the vegetables I'm going to eat this month or most of the vegetables I eat this month are my. Are going to be from my garden. And you're going to be invisibly spending less money on vegetables and produce.

[Dory Shafrir]

I love that.

[Elise Hu]

Without, like, a certain number, like, oh, I hit my goal of reducing my grocery bills by 20%, which, you're right, can get a little bit difficult or can. Can get us into a cycle of thinking that can be challenging for some of us.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. You know, I think that the diet culture feeling comes from tracking and so. But, you know, I also see how if you're not tracking, how are you gonna know if you're actually spending money? Right, right, right. Yeah. So, you know, I guess maybe for you, the solution is to just kind of, like, be kind to yourself and think about, like, your daily choices. Like, you know, maybe like, like Elise was saying, you know, you're. You're growing your vegetables, so if you're not, like, writing that down on a spreadsheet, you just know that you're spending less money on vegetables. So, you know, I think if there's just, like, things that you can sort of sub out. And the other thing that I would say is, like, and this goes along with the, like, be kind to yourself is. It's. It's going to be basically impossible to spend nothing. So try not to, you know, get upset with yourself if you spend any money. Does that make sense? Like, you're going to spend some money. It just. It is what it is, but you're making all these other positive choices. So just sort of, like, take comfort in that.

[Elise Hu]

Yep. Good answer.

[Dory Shafrir]

What I would say to that. All right, we are going to take a short break and I just want to remind everyone before we take a break that Our voicemail is 781-591-0390. Our email is forever35podcastgmail.com Our website is forever35podcast.com we have links there to everything we mentioned on the show. Our Instagram is @forever35 podcast. Our patreon [e-mail] Forever35 we have a free level where you get access to our semi monthly newsletter at $5 a month. You get access to our casual chat which is now on video. You get our live casual chats, we just did one last week and you access our community chat in the patreon app at $10 a month. You also get ad free episodes and a shout out on the podcast every month. Our favorite products are at shop my us forever 35 and after the break we have some really interesting questions. One of them is about how to make sure that like people in a group you lead are not being clicky.

[Elise Hu]

Oh very okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

It's a very interesting question.

[Elise Hu]

Yep.

[Dory Shafrir]

So stay tuned. We will be right back.

[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

All.

[Elise Hu]

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[Dory Shafrir]

All right, we are back. And as promised, here is the voicemail.

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

Hi Dori and Elise. So I run this playgroup of parents with young children, so babies and toddlers. And we have people who've been coming for years and we also have people who are new and we frequently get new people coming and people who've been coming for years have their friends in the group. But newer people have sometimes a harder time incorporating into the group. And I sometimes don't see them coming back. And I wonder if it's because they don't feel like they've been welcomed into the group. And I really want them to feel welcomed. I obviously welcome them and chat with them and I try to introduce people and I also say, oh, please, you know, make an effort to go say hi to someone new today. But I still feel like it's hard for those people to enter a group when people have been coming for years and they see, you know, their friend and of course immediately go talk to them.

[Dory Shafrir]

So my question is, how do you

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

incorporate new members into a group? I know Elise's goal is for all of her friends to become friends. So of Course, I would love that for new members to make friends in this group and feel welcomed. And I think there's an added challenge where, you know, they're always chasing around young kids at the same time. So doing an icebreaker type of activity is. Is pretty hard.

[Dory Shafrir]

So, yeah, if you guys have any

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

tips, I would love to hear them. Thanks.

[Elise Hu]

I imagine our listenership has all sorts of great advice. So listeners, please call in. I know we have therapists, we have group leaders of various sorts. We have folks from, like, botanical gardens and museums that lead tours. And so please call in. But I do think about this, and it comes up in, like, conferences. I'll go to unconferences every once in a while. And I remember there's some. That some facilitators who do a really good job of just inclusiveness and making sure that clicks don't calcify in a way that makes it really difficult for newcomers. And so one thing is to identify, like, who's new or make sure that the folks who have been around for a while know, like, these are the five or six new people in advance. And then you could even more formally say, hey, I'm looking for volunteers to be assigned, like, a new person in this group, a new attendee to be their buddy. Like, and then you're. It's almost like a mentorship mentee program that you start off, like, asking people who are willing to be kind of the guide, the sherpa for the new person at the initial meetings or the initial five or six weeks or something like that, so that there's something that's a little bit more formalized, so. So that there's kind of a buddy system so that new person gets integrated. And if they're integrated, then they're. We assume they're going to get more integrated into the clicks in so much as they exist. The other conference I remember there was a conference, like, set of guidelines or norms that were set at this one that I went to in Berkeley last year. And it was about how, like, about opening up and not closing in. And it was essentially just that when you're standing in a circle, to take or just standing around, generally to always, like, be opening up to more people in the group because we have a tendency and it might just happen naturally. I think it's just like the way humans behave, like, where if we are in a kind of a circle at a party or at the initial reception at a conference, like, you're just in your little circle, but not having our eyes on a swivel to open up or think about how we can open up. And so it was a real norm. I remember explicitly at this conference that if somebody sat down at your table or if you were just standing around, that you would physically try to, like, open up your group to include more people and welcome them in, especially if you didn't know them. And I remember just feeling very, very less, like very much less alone and welcomed at this place because I was there on my own. I didn't really know anybody. And it was a lot of people from like, tech backgrounds. So it wasn't people who were even really in my field. A lot of science scientists and. But because of the norms set by the conference very early on, that this is one of inclusiveness, that we open up, we don't close in. That if you see a stranger who's kind of on their own, be sure to introduce yourself and ask them how they can ask them if they want to be a part or show them what you're up to. Like, those norms and just setting them from the very start can really encourage belonging and like, group dynamics that are inclusive.

[Dory Shafrir]

I think that's really good advice. I also just want to, like, note something about the particular dynamics of baby groups in general, because I did. I did two baby groups when Henry was a baby, one of which just lasted for one cycle. Like, no one wanted to continue, and the other went for like four or five cycles. The first group was very cliquey. There were like two distinct cliques. And then there were a few people who were like, left out totally. And we were all like new moms. So there was a little bit of sort of like, days about, you know what's going on. Yeah, but I don't. And also, like, I don't think the facilitator was that good. But then in the second group, they're also were clicks. And like, I was a part of one. You know, like, it. It happens. The thing that I think is especially tough about your situation is that you have.

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

You.

[Dory Shafrir]

It seems like you constantly have, like, new people coming in. And that is really hard. I think. I think if there's any way to start groups, like on a certain schedule or time frame, like you have your Monday at 1pm group that started, you know.

[Elise Hu]

Waves.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, yeah, like, waves. Exactly. Because it. Once. Once that cohort with a baby group has formed, it's really hard to let new people in. Like, I think there's just something about the dynamic of that group. Like, you want to. You kind of feel like you're all in this together for the second group. We did occasionally have new people come in and like, like most of them didn't last more than one cycle. Like it was just hard. So I wonder if there's a way. And then also you want to have these mom friends who have babies that are the same age as your baby. So if you have these moms whose babies are now like one and you have another mom coming in whose baby is like three months old, they're at different stages. Like I think, you know, it might be worth your while to start different groups with different cycles of, of kids. Yeah, that makes so I don't know. Just a thought. Okay, moving on. We got some more gardening thoughts. Got this really great email from a woman, a listener named Anne, who runs the Master Gardener volunteer program at the University of Florida. Yeah, like she, she's legit. And she said I was listening to mini episode 486 and was thrilled when another listener mentioned looking to the Master Gardeners for gardening advice. I coordinate a county master Gardener program and adore my volunteers. They are trained volunteers that work to assist local extension horticulture educators. The educator. Typically just one person per county cannot assist all residents. So we train our Master Gardener volunteers to help us with outreach and education. The important thing to know about Master Gardener advice is that it is all research based, science backed advice from whatever state land grant university the Master Gardeners are associated with. So this is the best advice for gardeners in that state slash region, slash county. We are not selling anything with the gardening advice, just truly sharing what will work best for you based on university research. This might mean plant selection, vegetable gardening and what to grow when tree care, how to solve your gardening and landscaping issues. So when Elise mentioned needing a plant doctor, you have them in every state in the us that is your local university extension office. This is where the master Gardeners operate out of a local level.

[Elise Hu]

So helpful.

[Dory Shafrir]

Your extension office again, this is part of the land grant system throughout the US Operates to get research to the residents. I work to get the horticulture research done at the university out to the residents in ways they can use it and provide solutions for their lives. Most offices like mine offer a plant clinic. This is part of the office where residents can call, email, walk in with any and all gardening and landscaping questions and we will answer them for free. Elise, this is your free plant doctor service. Many Master gardeners truck I should just

[Elise Hu]

bring the plant in.

[Dory Shafrir]

Seriously. Many Master Gardener programs offer the same service when you see them in the community booth booths, at farmers markets, and such. They also offer free or minimal cost workshops to help you learn gardening skills. The extension offices vary from county to county and state to state. I encourage everyone to go to your local extension office and see what they have to offer. There are way more programs than just the Master Gardeners. We have four H youth programming, summer camps, nutrition and cooking classes, conservation programs, farming and more. Thank you again to whoever mentioned the Master Gardeners. This listener is also a certified arborist and is prescription pruning qualified.

[Elise Hu]

I will have you know I am not in Florida. I would want to take you out

[Dory Shafrir]

seriously for a coffee or a meal. Wow. I just learned so much.

[Elise Hu]

My indoor plants are doing great. Actually my outdoor plants are doing all right too. I have a Ficus Audrey tree. It's the national plant of India. It's just doing great. It's in. It's a new season for it and so it's just like all new ones. Yeah, stuff is looking good. So it's springtime.

[Dory Shafrir]

Happy for you.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

Elise, do you want to read this next text about how correct I was

[Elise Hu]

just following up to say Dory is spot on. That's what Dory likes to hear. R Plant Clinic. This is a Reddit. A Reddit sub. Reddit is where to go for Elise's plant doctor needs. I do not know how they do it, but they immediately look at a tiny spot and have a comprehensive diagnosis. Wish my derm were as good.

[Dory Shafrir]

This might become your new favorite subreddit.

[Elise Hu]

I'm just saying I. Yeah, I do need some new subreddits in my life.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. So head over to clinic. Okay, we are going to take another short break and when we come back we have a voicemail from a very special listener and a couple of recommendations. One is a Trader Joe's wreck. One is a skincare rack.

[Elise Hu]

So we'll be. Can't wait.

[Dory Shafrir]

You know, I feel like we put so much effort into our skin care with all the serums, the treatments, facials, routines, etc etc, but do we think about the thing touching our skin for eight hours every single night?

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

Our sheets?

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes. Let's spend some time considering our bedding.

[Elise Hu]

Good point. Good point.

[Dory Shafrir]

Bowl and branch bedding, from their organic cotton sheets to their breathable pillows and comforters, is made with ultra clean materials that are gentle on skin and free from harsh chemicals. Their fabrics are breathable, soft and temperature regulating so you're not overheating or tossing and turning. When your entire bed is made with better materials, it supports the kind of sleep that actually helps your skin recover overnight. Elise we just got new bowl and branch sheets.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

And I'm kind of obsessed with them.

[Elise Hu]

Oh, I'm so excited.

[Dory Shafrir]

Super soft, but they also, they feel like, substantial.

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dory Shafrir]

Like, I feel like I've gotten sheets in the past that just feel kind of flimsy. And these feel, like, really nice. Do you know what I mean?

[Elise Hu]

They're lux.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yes, they are lux. And they were soft when I, like, picked them up out of the box. But, you know, you washed your sheets before you put them on the bed and they got even softer, like even just after the first wash. So I'm obsessed. I love. It was so nice to come back from vacation and just, like, get into my cozy, comfy bowl and branch sheets. Oh, so nice. A lot of people start with the bowl and branch signature sheets, and then they add the matching pillowcases and a waffle blanket because that combination makes the whole bed feel softer and cooler. It's one of those upgrades where you notice the difference in the very first night. So upgrade your sleep with bowl and branch. Get 15% off your first order, plus free shipping at bull and branch.com/forever35 with code forever35. That's Boland Branch. B, O, L, L, a, n d branch.com Forever35. Code Forever35. To unlock 15% off exclusions apply. Elise, I want you to picture this.

[Elise Hu]

Okay.

[Dory Shafrir]

It's the middle of the week. You want a home cooked meal, but you can't think of anything to cook except the same thing you cook every week.

[Elise Hu]

True story.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, it's like that's comfort food, but you want some adventure. But with hellofresh, you can cook up bold flavors from around the world without ever leaving home. Which I think you actually did do recently.

[Elise Hu]

I sure did. I made the hellofresh classic beef tacos, which everyone loves. It comes with restaurant style salsa and a little chipotle lime crema. So we kind of. Yep. We made it a little more authentic for taco night. And it's classic, yet sure to satisfy. It was great for the whole family.

[Dory Shafrir]

I love that Hellofresh really makes savoring new flavors from around the world. Delicious, simple and wholesome. With HelloFresh, no two meals will be the same. You can choose from over 80 recipes from all over the world every month, including Vietnamese, Moroccan culture, Caribbean, and more. If you've been interested in trying ingredients like lemongrass, gochujang and curry paste, but don't want to buy a whole like, thing of it, this is the perfect opportunity. They send those ingredients pre portioned for you, HelloFresh makes cooking effortless. You can always look forward to a homemade meal because nothing hits like home cooking.

[Elise Hu]

Go to hellofresh.com forever35 10fm now to get 10 free meals plus a free breakfast for life. One per box with active subscription free meals applied as discount on first box. New subscribers only. Varies by plan. That's hellofresh.com forever3510fm to get 10 free meals plus free breakfast for life.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right, we are back. Elise, you might recognize this listener's voice.

[Elise Hu]

Hi, I'm Rob. I'm a first time caller and just

[Dory Shafrir]

wondering if you can recommend some kind

[Elise Hu]

of face lotion to keep my skin healthy. Thanks.

[Dory Shafrir]

Well, well, well.

[Elise Hu]

She's so corny. Okay, this is the backstory. I, Rob flew to Scottsdale where he is and I guess sometime on the. During this flight he texts what is a skin lotion I can get to use on my face every day to help it stay healthy? Sarah V. Don't need fancy. And I was like, how do you not know this? Can you record that as a voice memo? Because that like is a legit question that a, as a 50 year old man you should know but have an answer to. But B, like that could be for the mini up.

[Dory Shafrir]

Totally.

[Elise Hu]

He wants to know what is a skin lotion I can get to use my face. This, this is a very revealing question because it shows how limited his current skincare routine is.

[Dory Shafrir]

You know, I actually do think Cerave is a good place to start.

[Elise Hu]

Okay. Yeah, great. Yeah, he uses Cerave skin or sunscreen on his face.

[Dory Shafrir]

Okay.

[Elise Hu]

So maybe just stay in that line.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah, I think stay in that line. He didn't say what his like if he has a particular skin issue. But Cerave makes a few different moisturizers for different types of skin. So I would just, you know, if he has dry skin, if he has oil, you know, he can get the one that corresponds and they also make a good sunscreen. He should definitely be wearing sunscreen every day. Yep.

[Elise Hu]

He uses their sunscreen.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. And yeah, I think that that's just where I would start.

[Elise Hu]

Okay. Okay, Rob, there's your wreck.

[Dory Shafrir]

I love that he called in. Okay. We got a recommendation from a listener for the Trader Joe's dark chocolate covered crunchy corn kernels.

[Elise Hu]

Haven't seen these. I don't know. I don't know.

[Dory Shafrir]

You're skeptical.

[Elise Hu]

I'm just, I. Chocolate and corn. I guess there's sweet popcorn. I mean, I like kettle corn. Salty and crunchy and chocolatey. Crunch is one of my favorite flavors. So I do like the idea.

[Dory Shafrir]

This listener says they're salty, crunchy, chocolatey, but I don't. What does it. What is a corn kernel? Is that like an unpopped popcorn kernel? Is it a kernel of actual, like, corn on the cobbler? What does that mean?

[Elise Hu]

I don't know. All right, this. I mean, this is a wreck. That came with a photo and lots of exclamation points. Our listeners very excited about it. I am happy to at least tries it. I can. I will do it. Next, Trader Joe's. Next, Trader Joe's Run.

[Dory Shafrir]

Next, Trader Joe's Run. And then the same listener also sent in a skin care recommendation for the biomass moisturizing gel cream. Elise, do you want to read the. Their. Their recommendation?

[Elise Hu]

Yeah. Skincare rec coming in hot. Love, love, love this moisturizer, especially at this price point. This is the Byoma moisturizing gel cream. It's in a pale pink bottle. I mix it with hyaluronic acid every morning, and it's excellent. Very moisturizing, but fast absorption and doesn't feel sticky. My only complaint is the bottle function. You can't really squeeze out every last drop because of the design. It's designed, like, as a rectangular bottle, and you can't see when it's running low because it's not transparent. So however, the. However, at the price point, I kind of accept it for reference. My other favorite moisturizer is the biossance gel, which I think is overall a better product with more functional packaging, even though I think the glass is too thick. But at this price difference, you can't beat it. This byoma moisturizer is 1599. I know of it because my preteen Isabel loves Bioma products. She has a line of these products. I'm gonna have to go down there to her bedroom and steal it to try it out. Steal a little dollop.

[Dory Shafrir]

Okay. The. What it's like the roles have been reversed.

[Elise Hu]

I know.

[Dory Shafrir]

Now you're stealing from her. Okay, last text someone wrote us. Elise Bezos is taking away support to our old Kindles. What should we do? I love my 2011 Kindle. Touc.

[Elise Hu]

Mine's 2014 or 2015. I have a paper white. It might be one of my favorite objects that I own because it's so old, and I've. It's been with me all over the world. It's probably been to, like, 25 countries.

[Dory Shafrir]

What is the. What is the cutoff? Do you know?

[Elise Hu]

I have no idea. This is the first I've even Heard that they're gonna take away support.

[Dory Shafrir]

Oh boy, oh boy.

[Elise Hu]

Man. Why can't we just keep the things that we love? Keep and maintain old things. Why must we continually buy new things?

[Dory Shafrir]

I know my old plan is great. This is, this is a classic economics. You learn about this in Economics 101, planned obsolescence.

[Elise Hu]

So, yeah, I'm making a sad face.

[Dory Shafrir]

I know, it's very sad. I'm sorry. Yeah, it's a bummer.

[Elise Hu]

It sure is. I mean, we don't need to be buying from Amazon very much anyway. But that was a product that I had owned like in the early days of ebooks, you know, and has. Has just taken me, has been with me for so long and I just. Anyway, well, thank you for letting us know.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah.

[Elise Hu]

Listener and I will have to do some research to find out when this planned obsolescence is going to be carried out.

[Dory Shafrir]

Yeah. All right, well, thank you everyone. We will talk to you soon. Oh, also, just a heads up to our Patreon supporters, there is no casual chat this week. Elise is at ted. So we will casually chat with you next week.

[Elise Hu]

That's right.

[Dory Shafrir]

All right, bye.

[Elise Hu]

Bye.

[Dory Shafrir]

We're lost. It feels like we're going round in circles. I'm gonna ask that man for directions.

[Elise Hu]

Hi there. We're trying to get to the state fairgrounds.

[Discover Advertiser]

Well, you're going to take a left at the old oak tree at this here road. Nah, I'm just kidding. Let me get my phone out.

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

How is there signal out here?

[Discover Advertiser]

T Mobile and US Cellular are coming together. So the network out here is here huge. We get the same great signal as the city. Saving a boatload with benefits. And there's a five year price guarantee too. Okay, here's the turn.

[Listener Caller / Voicemail]

Actually, can you pull up the way to a T Mobile store?

[Discover Advertiser]

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