← Good Inside with Dr. Becky
Good Inside with Dr. Becky
Jersey Shore’s Mike “The Situation” and Lauren Sorrentino on Sobriety and Parenthood
00:50:36
You might know Mike “The Situation” and Lauren Sorrentino from Jersey Shore. Today, they’re parents of three, navigating recovery and raising resilient kids. In this candid conversation with Dr. Becky, they share how sobriety shapes their parenting, how they plan to talk with their children about substances, and why connection - not perfection - is the key to breaking cycles.
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- [00:00]
A
So today I have two what might seem like kind of unexpected guests on my podcast. Mike and Lauren Sorrentino. You might know them from the Jersey Shore franchise. I mean, I think GTL is one of the most known acronyms. Am I right? So here's the backstory. Lauren reposted something on Instagram from my Instagram account that led to us exchanging a dm, then voice notes, then we had a real conversation. And I learned so much on this phone call. I learned about her and Mike's family history around addiction. I learned about Mike's commitment to sobriety, and I learned about their incredible commitment to intentional connected parenting. I knew so many of the themes from this conversation would resonate and so I brought them to the studio to talk about it. I'm Dr. Becky and this is good inside. We'll be back right after this. When it comes to school snacks, I've never been the pack my kid a portable charcuterie board kind of parent. If you are more power to you. I'm more of a grab and go type. I want something simple, nutritious and easy for my kids to reach as we're heading out the door. That's why I like Chomps. Their full size meat sticks have 10 grams of protein and zero sugar. They're filling and made from real ingredients so it's one less thing to think about. And if you've ever opened your kid's backpack to find a half eaten snack from who knows when still wrapped up in there. Chomp links are great. They're smaller sticks, the right size to toss in a lunchbox or that little front backpack pocket with 4 grams of protein and zero sugar. Chomps are made of high quality ingredients like 100% grass fed beef, venison and antibiotic free turkey. They're also free from the top nine allergens so you don't have to worry about sending them to school. Check out all the sizes and delicious flavors@chomps.com DrBecky for 15% off plus free shipping. That's C-H O-M-P-S.com-R B E C K- yeah. Welcome.
- [02:18]
B
Thank you.
- [02:20]
A
So I want to talk about so many things today. I know we'll end up talking about parenting. You're both parents of three. I'm a parent of three. I know we think a lot about how we raise our kids and what really matters not only in these early years but how it ladders up to what really matters in the kind of teen adult years. But sometimes I think the best way of understanding what matters to us today is actually to start by rewinding a little bit and thinking about our childhoods and kind of where a lot of things came from. And so, Mike, if I start with you, one of the things that really has stuck out to me beyond what people know about you is just the resilience around your own childhood and your own story of cycle breaking. And so I wonder if we could just start there a little bit. If we rewind a couple decades, I don't know, tell me a little bit about how you think about your childhood, what it was like, what really kind of sticks out to you.
- [03:21]
C
I was probably punished more oftentimes than not punished because of my own wild and careless reckless behavior. So, you know, that definitely sticks in my brain because, well, I mean, we only have a four year old now, but I can definitely see a lot of his personality in me. So me and my wife have constant conversations, which is always a moving target with your child, your children, about what we should do and what we shouldn't do going forward.
- [03:59]
B
And he's also my deeply feeling one.
- [04:01]
A
Yes.
- [04:02]
B
The others have not revealed themselves as DFKs yet. He sure has. And he is, you know, he's how I really started to seek somebody like you and good inside. So.
- [04:13]
A
And so maybe we could jump in then. There, like a lot of us were raised with punishment. We act out, you get punished. Now I think a lot of us, at least us here in this room are thinking, okay, well what am I really trying to teach my kids? Why do kids act out? What might they need in the moment to actually learn? You know, whatever they don't know so they can act differently in the future. So I'm curious kind of how you handle those moments now with your son, but maybe also is that similar, different from what happened back then and how has that shifting been?
- [04:48]
B
I think we kind of were both say. I think we both were raised in a similar, you know, model. Like both of our families were in suburban New Jersey, Italian American, very hardworking.
- [05:00]
A
Yes.
- [05:01]
B
Providers as the father figure are moms versus stay at home moms. We each were one of four. So very, you know, parallel in that sense. So. But for my upbringing, you know, punishment was a big thing and my parents were great parents. They did the best that they knew then. I agree and I have a great relationship with them and I love them deeply. But I do remember a lot of the go to your room, you know, those kind of things when you were in trouble. And I remember those feelings now, like as an adult Like, I could not remember a lot of things. But those feelings of the go to your room type thing, when you kind of feel isolated and you don't know why that happens. And that's what keeps me making sure I don't send my son to his room. Cause if he's feeling that sense of, you know, powerlessness, which is a lot of why they're whining or acting out. Because he can't achieve the goal that he has set out to do because he's four. So why would I send him alone to his room? You know?
- [06:08]
A
So one of the things I hear from parents all the time is, okay, so I'm not supposed to send my kid to their room. So it's just okay that they act out. It just is something that I'm reinforcing. And I know you and I probably see that there's something in the middle, right between, go to your room or let's throw you a party because you hit your sibling. Like, no one's throwing a party for these kids. Right. But it's a new thing. And I think a lot of us did grow up where punishment, because it was just so common, generation to generation. Anything I think that we've done for generations has moved kind of from the fiction shelf of the library to the nonfiction. It just feels like, well, that's the way it's supposed to be. Right. So how do you think about that? Like, what, what does your son need when he acts out? And how is that something you're thinking about when you're trying to intervene, maybe in a not always just punishing way.
- [06:59]
B
Right. I think that I've just equated much of his needs to what my needs are as a human. And I know how I feel. I'm a mom of three children, so I'm overstimulated all the time. We have lots of businesses.
- [07:13]
C
She does a great job. I, I, I, like, step back and let her do her thing. And I try to emulate what she does, but you continue on, honey.
- [07:21]
B
We, you know, we have our relationship, we have our children, we have our businesses. We're entrepreneurs. So our house can be a revolving door sometimes. And our kitchen, and we're very blessed. Our kitchen and our family room connect, but it's a large space. So when he has these moments, they're obviously in that family space. So what I do is I usually take him. Either I take him or my husband takes him and we go with him to either the guest bedroom that's right off the family room, or we'll go to his room together.
- [07:49]
A
Yeah.
- [07:49]
B
And we'll give him just a clean space with no distractions, no TVs, no siblings, and let him calm down and then talk to him about why he's feeling that way or why he's frustrated. And it naturally happens a lot quicker when we remove him from the house.
- [08:05]
C
It usually works. And that's been our go to. We go together with him. And this is something that I followed my wife.
- [08:14]
A
Yeah.
- [08:15]
C
I take the lead. And it has been working. And we take him to either room and we usually say, do you want a hug? Do you want some love? And nine out of 10 times, it works every single time. And then we bring him down and then he sits down at the dinner table or something like that.
- [08:32]
B
It's always usually when we're trying to have dinner. It's a nightly thing.
- [08:35]
A
Yeah.
- [08:36]
B
So.
- [08:37]
A
Well, look, just to kind of flesh out what you're saying a little bit, because kids act out mostly because their feelings are more kind of intense than their skills are. In that moment, their feelings overpower their skills. They feel overwhelmed. They feel nervous about something. They feel angry. Right. And then they're not born with skills to manage any of those feelings, and so they don't have the skills. And for any of us at any age, when our feelings overpower our skills, it comes out as kind of bad behavior.
- [09:07]
B
Right.
- [09:08]
A
And I think about the model that so many people in our generation were raised with, which is some version of like, go to your room or you can't act this way. And it's not to say I don't have those thoughts, too. I'm sure you have those thoughts. It's inconvenient. It's annoying sometimes. Right. But when you do send a kid away as kind of the predominant way of interacting, what ends up happening is a kid goes to their room and maybe. Actually I'll pause there because you remember it, Lauren. Like, what's happening in the room?
- [09:37]
B
The room is. It doesn't feel like your safe space. The room feels like an isolation box. Because even though it's your bedroom and it's like all your things, you know that you're there because you're in trouble. And you don't really know why you're in trouble, because you don't back then, you know, now I have the understanding I was doing something wrong or who even knows why I went there, but it's because. But I felt confused.
- [10:02]
A
Yeah.
- [10:02]
B
You know?
- [10:03]
A
Yeah. What about you, Mike? Do you remember that? Do you remember being punished?
- [10:06]
C
I do. I do you know, it started out as punishments, just, you know, go to your room. And then eventually, as the behavior continued and there was a non change in my behavior, then they would start to remove TVs, remove the door, remove, you.
- [10:28]
A
Know, remove the door. Your bedroom door.
- [10:30]
C
The Sega. The Sega period of time.
- [10:32]
A
You both had no doors.
- [10:33]
B
We both had no doors on the hinges.
- [10:35]
A
Were you slammers? Is that why Slammer.
- [10:38]
C
I think the door equated to. They wanted to know what I was doing in there. And also no girls in the room too, because they wanted to know what I was doing in the room. Eventually after that, then it turned to a chore list, a very in depth chore list of, you know, waxing cabinets. I mean, we're talking everything, the floors, the cabinets, because they had to keep.
- [11:00]
B
For that.
- [11:01]
A
I was going to send you over to my house.
- [11:03]
C
Now, I will say, I will say that chore list had helped a little bit because it, it had. It had structure, it had routine, it taught me a bunch of things. So I'll be honest with you. I'm not really against, like, choreless.
- [11:19]
A
I want to mark that over here because like anything, when we make changes in parenting style or anything, it rarely is the case that the old way you need to throw completely out without taking lessons from it that were useful. And it sounds like there are certain things, structure, purpose, capability, helpfulness, that actually were really helpful to you.
- [11:40]
C
Yeah, and that's why I say I'm not against choreless. I believe that builds, you know, structure and routine and later in life. You know, once I got together with, you know, my now my wife, I knew how to do laundry. I knew how to like, you know, be somewhat of not a homemaker, but.
- [12:03]
B
Take pride in your home and like.
- [12:04]
A
Contribute to the household like a functional.
- [12:06]
B
Adult, like everyone should.
- [12:09]
A
Yeah, 100%. And so it's interesting to me about the no door, because I do hear this from so many people too. The removal of the doors from people who used to slam doors and then their parents would actually follow through. And this kind of mix of communication around. I don't, I don't trust you. Literally, I don't trust you enough to close the door, but I'm also not necessarily teaching you the skills. You didn't have to necessarily make the changes either, but it's so different from how you intervene now. You take your son to his room. I'm curious, Mike, before you were saying you're taking Lauren's lead on this. Is there a part of you or has there been like this is so. I don't know, this is. This is so permissive. This isn't gonna work. I have to show how the world works. This is not. No one's gonna take you to your room when you're an 18 year old.
- [13:05]
C
A little. A little more tough love, you're saying? Yeah. I think sometimes in my brain, the first reaction as a man of the home is to put your foot down. But I'm also a very mindful dad and mindful husband. I've been through so much in life that I'm able to easily rewind it and step back, take a. Take a deep breath.
- [13:29]
A
Yeah.
- [13:29]
C
Look around at my surroundings and find the best route forward. Sometimes it could be listening to my wife and stepping back. Sometimes it could be me being the father figure in the room to step up and handle my son and take him into the next room. But I do, like I said, take him in the other room and give him a hug. And it works. Nine out of ten times. Every time.
- [13:54]
A
Yeah. I mean, I think. How many times in our adult life when we're, I don't know, you never understand me, I can't talk to you. How many times that person said, hold on, do you need a hug?
- [14:05]
C
I actually do that with adults now.
- [14:07]
B
Do you? No, we do.
- [14:09]
C
I do that with adults. I don't know what TV show, you know, I'm on, but I do that with adults. And it works. It works. It diffuses the situation, pun intended. And you're like, listen, come on, just bring it in, bring it in. And it works.
- [14:25]
B
And I think a big part of that, I don't know if it comes to men the same way that it comes to women, because I don't want to say it's like a motherly instinct because I didn't have that with my first. But now that I have three children and I'm settled into my role as a mother, I look at everybody as children. And not insulting in. In a powerful way. Yes, in a. Like every adult, every professional, every. Everything. So when someone acts out of character or alignment, I don't dislike them or have any animosity to them. I'm like, what happened in your life that. You know what I mean? Like, hurts you that way. And that's at the level that I feel like I'm at. In trying to raise my children that way.
- [15:10]
A
So I just want to mirror that. Back when I'm with another adult, something at work or, I don't know, a friend has some huge reaction, they find out I was at a Dinner with another friend and they kind of attack me for not inviting them. It was a small thing. Something just like that. The thought process you try to access is, okay, something's happening here. Yeah, maybe even old. There's some, some wound. This is in some ways I'm talking to, I'm making this up. My 40 year old friend, but I might be Talking to her 8 year old left out self right in the moment, who maybe I'm making this up, but was alone with those feelings, never really learned them, never got a hug in that moment. And I think also a part of this is so many times people think, oh, so then it's my responsibility to. No, but just that shift in perspective changes maybe how angry you are or just what you say back.
- [16:07]
C
Yeah, we usually give everyone the benefit of doubt in every interaction and we usually lead with kindness.
- [16:16]
A
You know when I was talking to someone about, you know, having the two of you on. Of course, Mike, you're very known for, you know, gtl, like the ultimate acronym, Tanning and laundry. But, but my ultimate acronym, so I can go acronym to acronym face to face with you, is mgi. Most generous interpretation. If we think about the most generous interpretation of why my kid, I don't know, said I hate you, it's probably because they were upset and they don't have the language to say to me at age 4, I'm very disappointed with this decision. And so it just comes out as I hate you or why my friend, I don't know, had this reaction. My MGI might be maybe this is a little bit about the situation, but a lot. A bit about something that maybe happened a long time ago.
- [17:03]
C
Yes. They say what hurt people hurt people.
- [17:05]
A
That's right, hurt people, hurt people. You know how people say they need a vacation from their vacation? I never got it. Okay, then I experienced summer break. As a parent, summer parenting can feel like a full time job. So by the time back to school rolls around, I find myself wondering, okay, when is the real break happening? Because honestly, the most enjoyable trips we've taken as a family tend to happen during long weekends and fall breaks. No pressure for picture perfect moments, no meltdowns from the heat, and no built up tension after weeks of constant togetherness. My go to for these short and sweet trips, Booking an Airbnb. There's space for everyone to spread out, a kitchen for easy meals, and separate bedrooms that let the grown up stay up after the kids go down. But you know what's even better? While you're away, you can list your own Home on Airbnb, too. Hosting on Airbnb is simple, flexible, and gives you a little extra income to put toward your own trip or those mounting back to school costs. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much@airbnb.com host I'm thinking about, and it might seem like a leap, but I want to make it because it's interesting. My co founder at Good Inside is another psychologist, and she spent her kind of whole career before we kind of started Good Inside together and substance use and working with individuals and adults, you know, who struggle in that way. And when we've talked to people, they often say it's so kind of interesting. She comes from the substance use world. You come from parenting emotion regulation world. How did that come together? And the two of us always look at each other and we think actually those things are really intimately connected. I know parenting matters to you. Emotions matter to you, and I know substance use has been a part of your lives, is now in some ways at the forefront of what matters to you and a lot of your business. So let's kind of bring that together. Maybe we can start with when you think about how you're raising your kids and the importance of recognizing their emotions, being with them, teaching them to manage emotions. And when you also think about substance use and. And the role that's played, you know, in the past, how do you bring that together?
- [19:33]
B
That's what I ask myself almost every day, I think, with, you know, waking up as a mom to small children and having our life be out there in the open, but also, you know, wanting to be transparent with our children from the beginning. And right now, our oldest is four. But it's like, when is the right age to introduce language and conversation about recovery and substances and how, you know, it is a disease and how they affect every member of the family? You know, my brother, their uncle, passed away from an overdose. So I have a picture of him and myself in my family room, and I always talk about Uncle Chris. So these are things that I ask myself all the time.
- [20:21]
A
Yeah.
- [20:22]
B
And I think it's just, you know, us navigating that together.
- [20:28]
C
Well, I mean, I feel that, you know, our kids are so young right now, but at the same time, if. If every single year, dad is celebrating his 10 years of sobriety, his 11 years of sobriety, his 12 years of sobriety, and the kids are growing up with that. Do you see the trend that is following here? It's. It's awareness.
- [20:47]
A
Yeah.
- [20:47]
C
It's education at an early age. And that is some of the most important things that you can instill in a child. I also believe, like you said, the transparency is as amazing as well. But if we're putting so much emphasis as a family.
- [21:03]
A
Yes.
- [21:04]
C
Into sobriety, they're going to know what's important at an early age.
- [21:09]
A
What does that mean to you in terms of this stage in your life? Sobriety?
- [21:14]
C
I mean, it's probably where I. It's why I am where I am today in life, in every aspect of my life. I am my best self in every single area because of my sobriety, my mindfulness, my education, and my experience. And I also don't shy away from my history. What made me the man I am today, because I've turned those L's into lessons. I made the adjustments and the pivots where they needed to be, when they needed to be, to eventually grow to be the best version of myself right now.
- [21:51]
A
Could you share. Could you share one of them? Like what? More specifically, the lessons, like you said, our past teaches us. Right.
- [21:58]
C
Well, I mean, I was technically a victim of addiction, which in turn started out as experimentation, my own decision. But I was not educated on what addiction is and how it could manifest in my own life. In the early years, I'm like, oh, not going to happen to me. You know, I can have fun and experiment. And just like every other college kid out there in their 20s, they start out drinking and partying. And I always thought I was, you know, the life of the party, or everyone loved Mike, which in turn, it was true for a little bit. It was eventually. Addiction does not discriminate. Addiction does not discriminate, and it has consequences. So eventually I became dependent upon prescription opiates. And then after that, then it became. It seeped into every area of my life. Relationships. You're not making good decisions because you're intoxicated all the time. You start to distance yourself and isolate yourself from family. So as I'm giving you all of these symptoms, it affects every area of your life. Even though I was a millionaire, even though I was making millions a year from MTV on the biggest show in the country. Okay? And no one would say no to me. Still. My life started to go like this slowly because I was bringing in so much money, but it was happening slowly and people just didn't see it. So eventually, years later, Uncle Sam came knocking at the door. And he came knocking at the door because someone was intoxicated and was not on top of his financial house. See, if you have your wits about you in Life. Right. You're going to make good decisions for yourself, your family, your friends. Right. But if you are intoxicated, then you were not your best self. And I didn't file my taxes. And so then when they came in and indicted me, it was from my own decisions. So at the time when all this happened, it was definitely life changing.
- [24:36]
B
Had.
- [24:36]
C
To happen, and there had to be a reaction from me. And the reaction from me was I have to do something to save my life or else quite possibly I would not have one.
- [24:53]
A
You know, Lauren, what comes up for you, and this isn't your first time hearing this, obviously, but what, what's going on? What goes on inside you when you hear about this? And I know your brother. Right. Must be on your mind too.
- [25:03]
B
Yeah. I think that what's really important to me about sharing the substance abuse nature with my family, and when I say family, my meaning my. My young children in the future is that the awareness of their feelings. And oftentimes what you. What brings you to pick up a first substance, whether you're socializing, whether you're an addict or whether you're experimenting. What is the emotion behind picking something up? Because there's something there, whether it's a sense of wanting to belong or wanting to fit in or wanting to see what it feels to be out of control and out of your body. Out of curiosity. And if I'm able to educate my children on what these feelings mean and safety way. Safe ways to experiment with feelings.
- [25:56]
A
Yes.
- [25:56]
B
And how to get yourself to a baseline of a comfortability without a substance.
- [26:01]
A
I want to double click on that because a different version of a baseline I think about is kind of, let's talk about dancing sober. That's just a good example. Right. Even though it's not like that's the ultimate life goal, but something like that comes up and it's kind of representative of being in a situation that feels vulnerable, where other people see you and your level of comfort. Let's just say that if we think about baseline, what you're talking about here, for what you want for your kids, I think is I want them and their baseline to be comfortable enough with themselves or even comfortable enough with their awkwardness because not everyone's gifted. As a great dancer, I don't know about you, my moves aren't that great, but I want them to be comfortable enough in their awkwardness.
- [26:47]
C
Yes.
- [26:48]
A
That how much they need something to feel comfortable isn't a 10 out of 10. It isn't an 8 out of 10. Maybe it's a 2 out of 10. But at a 2 out of 10 it's manageable. Where at an 8, 9, 10 out of 10, it's much harder to manage. Is that kind of what you're getting at?
- [27:09]
B
Yes, that's where my goal is. But again, I'm speaking from the part of the half that is not in sobriety. So I really lean on him to share. I want him to be honest with them when the age is appropriate, you know?
- [27:25]
A
Yes.
- [27:25]
C
I mean, I learned and this probably takes years of practice for people, but when I go to the club, I'm happier than 99% of the people in the club because I've learned to sort of vibe out and be so comfortable with who I am that I'm happier, talkative. Right. Have better conversation. And then after about an hour when people start to slur and can't even get their conversations out, exit. And in the morning I go to the gym because I can get up and do my gym tanning and laundry. And again, it does take years of practice to get to where I am at. Because like you said, the two out of 10, a lot of people are not comfortable in their own skin. But what they need to realize is, okay, that authenticity is such an unmatched vibe. No one is going to be you, no matter how hard anybody tries.
- [28:23]
A
Yeah.
- [28:24]
B
And that's a good thing.
- [28:25]
C
So if you know that your laugh, your chuckle, how you speak, how you dance, you are a one of one. And that is why when I'm at the club, I'm like, situation's here. You know what I mean? Big daddy sitch is here. Okay? And everyone's like, why is he always so happy? It's because I've learned these tools.
- [28:54]
A
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- [31:18]
B
That's something that we're actively working on. Yes, I share a lot of that information from your app with him.
- [31:26]
C
Yes.
- [31:26]
B
No app.
- [31:28]
C
I'm guilty. You know, I'm definitely guilty. But I do know when that happens. Yeah, I'm definitely guilty of that because I just don't want my kids to, to be upset. But I know, but I know that discomfort is like a muscle and that it will eventually lead to growth.
- [31:48]
B
So it's strang.
- [31:49]
A
I think that's so important. Discomfort's a muscle. And I think also what you're saying is actually learning to tolerate discomfort is the muscle. Because when your kids, I don't know, are in their teen or early adult years, I don't think you expect them to call you every day and say, everything's smooth, everything's smooth, everything's smooth. I got the job I want, I got the promotion I want, I have the partner I want. I've never been in traffic in my life. Like that's never going to happen. So. Me too. And I think about my kids older on I just, I don't expect them to call me and say I've achieved everything I want to achieve all the time and I'm perfectly happy. I know I don't Know when they're in high school, when they're in college, after they're going to have disappointment, they're gonna have a breakup that they didn't want to have. Something as silly as, I don't know, they're gonna miss a flight or try to register for a class and get closed out. And how they cope with that or how they cope with asking someone out on a date, even though they're not sure, I don't know, they'll say yes. That's not something that just starts at age 16 or 26. And so when our kids are young and they're upset, helping them see that they can get through it without necessarily bringing it to a zero is the. Is kind of like the biggest gift we can give them.
- [33:12]
B
Yes.
- [33:13]
C
Right, honey? Honey, I think we do that. Right?
- [33:15]
B
We do do that.
- [33:16]
C
We do that a lot with affirmations. You are strong, you're courageous, you're smart, you're beautiful. To let them know that, to believe in themselves.
- [33:26]
B
And we really validate what the. You know, what the disappointment is. Why, you know, this morning I was in the shower. Okay, yeah. My son comes running upstairs. He's hysterically crying, opens my shower door, what happened? Daddy won't let me have a lollipop. It was 7am it's barely 7am you can't have a lollipop for breakfast.
- [33:49]
C
Yes, that's the thing. Yes.
- [33:52]
A
Yeah.
- [33:53]
B
So, you know. But I said, I know that you really wanted that lollipop if you eat lunch at school. Cause sometimes it comes home full. I said, then you can have a lollipop after school.
- [34:01]
C
She's very good with that. The kids will run to me. They'll run to me. My Mia bella, who is two and a half, she's gorgeous. She'll run to me and say, first thing out of her mouth, daddy, chocolate. Well, I think she, you know, and it's so hard. It's so hard for me to say, you know. And the same thing. The kids will, you know. Cause I am not. My wife is always around. I am less around than my wife. Soon as they see me, that's the first thing they ask for me. And it's almost like they know that I'm gonna do it. And now because of my wife taking the lead, I follow. And I say, no, you have to have breakfast first or no, you have to have dinner first. And if you don't eat dinner, then you can't have snacks or dessert or anything like that. So we're trying.
- [34:45]
A
And I just want to reflect back Something you said. It's interesting. When you were telling me the story around the period of your addiction, you said, nobody said no to me.
- [34:54]
C
No one. Doctors, people.
- [34:56]
A
But it seems like. But it seems like there was a hint of, even if I wouldn't have liked it at the time, it would have been good for people to say no to me.
- [35:04]
C
Yes, yes. Yes, Definitely at the time. If people would have made it a little harder for me, maybe that might have lessened the fall. Maybe.
- [35:17]
A
Because now we're talking about your kids. And I think parents, so many times they hear in their brain like, you know, I don't know, I don't want to say no. I don't see my kids that much. But it gets so powerful to redefine love. Even if we're not the primary parent. There's so many times looking back on our lives that we know hearing no from someone would have been the ultimate form of love because they're able to hold a longer term goal in mind for us as opposed to just give us what we seemingly want in the moment. And, yeah, like a lollipop for breakfast might be a good example. We all have times here and there. We're like, fine, have a lollipop. It's one of those days. But I think sometimes we feel guilty or we tell ourselves, oh, I don't want to say no. I like to be the good cop. But we're honest with ourselves. So many times we feel most seen and helped by people when they do set limits.
- [36:08]
C
I had to draw the line. I had to draw the line in the sand this morning.
- [36:12]
A
Yeah.
- [36:12]
C
On the way here to Dr. Becky, I was like, you are not having a lollipop for breakfast.
- [36:18]
B
Yes.
- [36:19]
C
I knew this was happening.
- [36:20]
A
Yes.
- [36:20]
B
I have to tell you, I was so proud. And you know how it is when you see your children crying, that breaks every parent's heart. But to see him crying and tell me that daddy said no to a lollipop. I was so happy. I was so proud of him. You know, it was a good thing. And I think that everybody needs to know that no is not a bad word.
- [36:42]
A
Thank you.
- [36:42]
B
Even outside of people who are not parents, no is not a bad word.
- [36:46]
C
Even with adults, too.
- [36:47]
B
Yes.
- [36:48]
A
Yes.
- [36:48]
B
It's a boundary. It's.
- [36:50]
A
It's needed. That's right.
- [36:51]
B
To have a healthy life.
- [36:53]
A
And I think so many times when we're saying no to a kid, what we have to remind ourselves is we are actually saying yes to a limit or a value that matters to us. Right. So let's say It's a different example. I wanna watch another TV show. And we know my kid's been up late the last couple nights. I know they need sleep. They have school tomorrow. We tell ourselves, I don't wanna say no to our kid, but if we reframe it, as it's my job to hold the bedtime, my 4 year old, my 8 year old is never gonna say, mom, dad, I think it would be a good idea for me to get sleep. They don't understand the long term benefits of sleep. That's not their job. That's our job. We're the leader. And if we say to ourselves instead of, I might have to say no to them, but truly that no is only coming because I'm actually saying yes to something that I know matters. It does become easier because you remember, I'm the leader. I'm kind of the CEO of my family. And CEOs have to know what they value and what really matters. Right. And then like we said, your kid might be upset, but your kid being upset isn't a sign you're doing something wrong. Sometimes it's just the sign that you're holding a boundary that good leaders need to hold.
- [38:05]
C
So you're like saying no now, but yes to your future.
- [38:08]
A
That's exactly right. Which I think at any age, the people who've kind of been really important and influential in our lives, they are people who can see kind of a better version of us in the future and they make a decision today to help set us up for that instead of almost colluding with whatever version of ourselves we're in, in the moment. Right. I think when you're going through addiction as an adult, and I talk to, you know, couples who have kids and maybe one of the partners using, and sometimes it's an act of love for the other partner to say, we need to talk about this.
- [38:51]
C
Oh, yes, definitely. Right.
- [38:52]
A
I need you to agree to certain things. And I'm saying that not out of a place of anger or eating. I'm actually saying that because I love you and I know what you're capable of and I know the family life we both need. Right. That, that matters. So that, that is such an act of love.
- [39:11]
C
Yeah. Addiction can be debilitating in every aspect of your life. That's why we are so vocal.
- [39:15]
A
I know we're kind of circling around this, but to name it more directly, I think so many parents, they really, they really care about being cycle breakers. When you think about cycles you want to break or kind of new cycles, you Want to start with your own kid? Kids. What. What. What really stands out?
- [39:35]
C
I don't know. I feel like we are a very, very good example right now.
- [39:39]
A
Yeah.
- [39:40]
C
Of breaking the chains, of maybe how we maybe grew up. You know, I mean, the way that we parent today, the way that we operate. I mean, you know, dad is 10 years clean and sober. We're opening up treatment centers. We are.
- [40:04]
A
Is that about being emotionally present? Is that about what?
- [40:08]
C
Well, definitely because of that, I am very emotionally present. I am super mindful. The tools that I have learned over the many years are invaluable, you know, that I'm able to pass along to my family and my kids as they start to get older. So I feel like also just some of the things that I've learned in recovery, about running the tape and running. A lot of people don't even know what that is, but as a family, we, you know, do it all the time. About running the tape on your decisions.
- [40:38]
A
What does that mean?
- [40:39]
C
Just running on your decisions means that you play a decision out in your head, almost like a risk assessment tool. You know? And the easiest one to give an example of is if you were, you know, if I'm at the bar, I'm not me, but anyone at the bar, and you decide to drink.
- [40:59]
A
Yeah.
- [40:59]
C
What are gonna be some possible outcomes of that risk assessment drill in your head? And you would think to yourself, okay, I can possibly get a dui. I can possibly get into an argument at the bar and a fight. I can possibly get into a car accident and help my hurt myself and someone else. So as you put these. These line items in your brain. Right. Almost like a positive and a negative list. You're like, okay, should I make this decision, or should I not make this decision? You're like, well, you know what? Yeah, this. There's too much on the negative list. Probably not a good idea. But I did decide to drink. What are some other things I can do? Let's call an Uber. And now I just saved myself possible consequences and a very bad outcome that will hurt many areas of my life. So that's just one example that I gave you. And we. I do that in every single decision.
- [41:59]
A
You know what's so interesting? It makes me think about that idea of running the tape in a totally different context, too, which I don't know. You have this. But I hear from so many, especially moms, I end up being resentful. I feel so alone. I don't have support. And I'll say something like, if they do have a Partner. Okay, well, what would it be like to ask your partner to come home and help you with bath time? Oh, I can do that. Right. Okay, well, let's run the tape of what happens if you don't.
- [42:23]
C
Okay.
- [42:24]
A
So you don't. You feel resentful. You're very overwhelmed. Your kid whines about one tiny thing, and what's gonna happen? You're gonna scream. Right. Okay, well, that's not the prettiest tape either.
- [42:37]
C
Right.
- [42:37]
A
So let's come back. And what would. Something different. It's such a helpful concept.
- [42:41]
B
Yeah.
- [42:42]
C
Yeah. We do that in every area of our life, including conversations. If you get into an argument with somebody and maybe they're being rude to you, if you take a breath. If you take a deep breath and step outside yourself for one second and be like, listen, if I get into an argument with this person right now, I might be on tmz. I might be in the paper. You know what? It's better for me. Thank you so much. Have a good day. God bless you. And walk away. It's just little details that me and my wife practice on a daily basis in every aspect of our life that we've learned over many years in TV and dealing in certain situations.
- [43:19]
A
Yeah. Okay. I'm not gonna sugarcoat it. This school year is going to bring some messy moments. And while we can't avoid the hard, we can avoid the alone. That's why Good Inside gives you expert advice, practical tools, and a community that's truly in it with you. And right now, memberships and upgrades are 20% off from September 22 through September 30, because you don't have to get it all right. What your kid needs most is connection. And what you need most is support that sticks with you all year. When the deep breath doesn't work, the routine falls apart, or you're wondering if you're doing it all wrong, Good Inside helps you feel sturdy in the moments that really matter. If you've been on the fence about joining, this is the perfect time to do it. Go to goodinside.com to get started. Some exclusions apply. What about cycle breaking for you? Like, are there things. Because I firmly believe this idea of every generation of parents. Every parent is doing the best they can with the resources they have. And most parents also want to do things differently than their parents did in some respects. Right. So those can be equally true. It doesn't have to be about blame. Yeah. So I'm curious. What? I don't know. Is there a form of cycle breaking? Or something that, you know, really matters for you to give to your kid.
- [44:43]
B
Yeah, definitely. For me, personally, cycle breaking means sharing more about my feelings and how I'm feeling, because there's moments where I'm feeling frustrated, I'm happy, I'm sad, and I want my kids to see all of those feelings. I feel like the. The generation I was raised in was hiding a lot of the, you know, if some. If a family member passed. You know, I remember seeing my mom. I remember seeing my mom cry when she found out her grandmother passed. And I felt so bad for her. And I wish I could have given her a hug, but I was young and we didn't really share those, you know, share about. Talk about certain things at certain ages. So I think that just really through all the therapy I've done.
- [45:32]
A
Yeah.
- [45:32]
B
Through his. Him getting sober, his sobriety, and now me really getting back into therapy through just wanting to be the best parent I can be, I feel like it's really important. I know that it's really important to share my feelings. So my kids have examples of what life is because life is not all rainbows and unicorns.
- [45:53]
A
I think that. I think that's such an important theme. Life is not all rainbows and unicorns. And ironically, the more we try to make our kids lives when they're young, all rainbows and unicorns, of course they're going to expect that a good life in adulthood means all rainbows and unicorns. And in the rainbow and unicorn world, there's no awkward feelings, there's no jealousy, there's no sadness. And I think we want our kids to feel prepared for those inevitable feelings. Right. And I think this example is such a beautiful one. You're upset. As a parent, there's a. There's a big difference between putting your feelings on your kid. You don't want to do that. And talking about your obvious feelings with your kid. Yeah, right. Yes. You're right to notice I was crying.
- [46:40]
B
Yeah.
- [46:40]
A
And you keep hearing the word die, cancer, or whatever it is. Let me explain that to you. Right, right.
- [46:47]
B
Yep.
- [46:47]
A
And now it's actually a point of deepening conn with your kid. They understand what's happening in their environment. They're probably that much more able to deal with their own sad feelings because they know, oh, mom or dad has sad feelings too, and they're able to talk about it and work through it. It's not some hidden agenda, as if it's shameful or wrong.
- [47:05]
B
Yeah.
- [47:06]
C
I think that because of my wife, she does so much research, like you know, I'm so proud of her. But we want our children to feel that they are being heard.
- [47:18]
A
Yeah.
- [47:18]
C
And I think that is very important and something we do in our home a lot. We. We do a lot of listening, and we want to make sure that they know that they are heard. And a lot of times, because of my wife, we want to get down on their level.
- [47:33]
A
Yeah.
- [47:34]
C
So these. There's been a ton of things that I've learned from my wife, and I'm so very proud of her that she's definitely taken the lead in the house, so. And I've also learned as well.
- [47:46]
A
Yeah. Lauren, you're the ultimate forever learner. Right. Which is, I think, the best it gets.
- [47:51]
B
Yeah.
- [47:51]
A
Nobody knows all this stuff. Yeah.
- [47:53]
B
Yeah. Life, you know, life's over when you stop learning.
- [47:56]
A
I think.
- [47:57]
C
Good phrase.
- [47:58]
B
And I've always been a hard worker. I've always loved working. When I worked in, like, our form, my former career and everything. And when I came into a role as motherhood, I had no idea what I was doing, and I felt like a failure for probably the first year with postpartum and all of that. And then as we had more kids, I got my groove, and I'm like, wait, how do you just know how to do this? This is so hard. And my sister is actually. Who introduced me to you and was like, you know, you really should check out Dr. Becky on good Inside. People rave about her app, and it was exactly what I needed to just give me that boost of confidence and really find a community for, you know, parenting.
- [48:46]
C
We've been talking about Dr. Becky in the home for months now, and we were very excited to come here today.
- [48:51]
B
Yes.
- [48:52]
A
Well, I'm equally as excited, and I just want to say the power of normalizing learning. Like you were saying, parenting is a job, right? Yes. And every other job. Continuing education, coaching, learning. I don't know one person who works at a company that if you heard them say, I want to learn more, I want to educate, I want to learn from other people, you would never say that. Must mean you're bad at your job. What? It's absurd. I don't know any athlete who doesn't want a coach or even a sports psychologist. We say, amazing. That's like, you're taking your potential, you're adding things, you learn, and that is how you reach, you know, heights and so to say that's. I think that's exactly how I wish people look at parenting.
- [49:33]
B
Yeah.
- [49:33]
A
There's certain moments that come naturally. There's a lot that Don't.
- [49:37]
B
Right, right.
- [49:38]
A
And we can supplement what feels instinctual with the same thing we do in any other area of our life, learning support. And then when you do, the irony is, like you said, Lauren beautifully, you don't feel like a failure anymore. You feel more confident. So beautiful.
- [49:52]
B
Yeah.
- [49:54]
A
The hardest part of parenting is.
- [49:59]
B
Being the bad cop.
- [50:01]
C
Good answer. That is. That is the truth for you too. Yeah. I love being a dad. I worked so hard to be where I'm at right now. And this is, for me, like the end game. End game is family, my legacy. So we are a. What's the word? We are learning while we're going, just like every other family, you know, and. But we are actively the word, actively working and educating ourselves to make sure that our kids can turn. Grow up to be the most best version of themselves.
- [50:40]
A
The thing I could have used to hear in my childhood was.
- [50:45]
B
I understand.
- [50:48]
A
What about you?
- [50:48]
C
I don't know if I can follow up after that one. No joking.
- [50:51]
A
That one's pretty good.
- [50:53]
C
That was a good answer. Probably what I needed was everything happens for a reason.
- [51:01]
A
One thing you do to stay connected in your marriage, even as you're raising young kids.
- [51:07]
C
Oh, good one. We actively work on that.
- [51:10]
B
Yes.
- [51:10]
C
All the time.
- [51:11]
B
We try to do weekly date nights or day dates. I'm really into the date, the lunch date, because I like my sleep.
- [51:19]
C
Usually every Single day at 11:11, I will text my wife, I love you with 11:11 and a heart and a kissy face or something, just to let her know that I love her. And then I'm thinking of her. That's just one of the things that I do on a daily basis.
- [51:39]
A
I love that. And both of you have an example. And I think it's so important. That's something to be proactive about, too. That doesn't just happen.
- [51:44]
C
No.
- [51:44]
A
Right. You have to do the text, you have to make the date. Right.
- [51:47]
C
The reason why I said actively, because relationships, all relationships. It could be friendships, it could be work, relationships, anything. It takes work.
- [51:56]
A
Yeah.
- [51:56]
C
Active work on a daily basis. If there is no work, there'll be no relationship.
- [52:00]
B
And you have to connect outside of your children, you know, because 99.9% of your combos are going to be logistics going on with them.
- [52:08]
A
Carpools. Exactly.
- [52:10]
C
It's also always a moving target, too, you know, and we're always trying to listen to each other's feelings. And sometimes she says that I'm being too hard, and sometimes, you know, I have to make adjustments, you know, on a daily basis, on A weekly basis, on a monthly basis, on a yearly basis. And we're always working on our marriage. HENCE we are seven years happily married this year, November 1st.
- [52:35]
A
Congratulations. Okay, my last quick question. Your kids are now older and you hear one of them describing you something like oh my mom or oh my dad. And they say one thing about you. What's the thing you hope they say?
- [52:50]
B
Loving and or kind of.
- [52:53]
C
My dad's an inspiration.
- [52:55]
A
Thank you. Thank you for your important work. Thank you for your openness and willingness to have hard conversations. So important, so impactful. And we'll do this again soon.
- [53:05]
B
Yes, thank you.
- [53:06]
C
Yes, thank you so much.
- [53:07]
A
There were so many important themes of this conversation today, but I can share with you the one that's feeling the loudest to me in my brain right now. It is so hard when we're parenting to tolerate the tantrum, to stay calm when our kid screams I hate you. To not fix our kids feelings when they're feeling jealous or disappointed. After today's conversation, I'm going to really remember how important this is. How it is such an amazing service. It is in benefit of my kids to help them tolerate discomfort that is going to set them up for an adulthood where not only where they'll be more resilient, well, they'll just be so much more comfortable in their skin in a wider range of situations. And so when you're in a tricky situation with your kid today and it's feeling inconvenient and hard, I hope that gives you a little bit more conviction in what you're doing. Let's end the way we always do. Place your feet on the ground, put a hand on your heart. And let's remind ourselves, even as we struggle on the outside, we remain good inside. I'll see you soon. Thank you to our sponsors, Airbnb, Chomps and Sitter City.