Secrets Of Scotland Yard - Servant Problem - Harold's Old Time Radio

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[00:00]
A
It's sam.
[01:08]
B
How do you do? This is Ty. When one woman meets another, there is a subject they'll nearly always talk about. The servant problem. Or so I'm told. Anyway, this program concerns the same question. The servant problem. There are all kinds of servants. Loyal, disloyal, honest, dishonest, present and unpleasant. However, I doubt if there was ever a servant who would spite such a problem to a mistress as Kate Webster. Now, in olden times, when a servant left for employment, there was always a suspicion that she packed in her box more than she brought with her. In the case of Kate Webster, that was certainly true. For in her box she took with her the body of her mistress. You're right. It's a case of murder. To begin our story, we will pay a visit to a world famous exhibition, which as yet has not appeared in this series of programs. I refer to Madame Tussauds in the Chamber of Horrors, occupying the basement of the famous Madame Tussauds building off Baker Street. The Chamber of Horrors is a waxworks exhibition of some of the infamous criminals of the past. We pay our admission price 2 and sixpence. It used to be only a shilling, but horror, like everything else, is suffering from inflation. And down we go. Off on the left as we go in is the effigy of a tall, gaunt woman dressed in the period of 1880. She wears a black coat and around her neck is a thin fur tippet. Her black hair is drawn back severely from her stern face. Her whole appearance is grim and threatening. I'm sure if she'd come to me for a job, I would have thought twice about engaging her. And yet, on that January morning in 1879, Mrs. Martha Thomas must have thought differently when she answered the door at Mayfield Cottage, Richmond, and met for the first time Kate Webster.
[03:26]
A
Good morning, man.
[03:28]
C
Very well. Good morning.
[03:30]
A
I'm Ms. Webster, Ma'. Am. Miss lady said she told you, sir.
[03:34]
C
Oh, oh, yes, that's right. I happened to mention to her that I was looking for the surface and she mentioned her name. I.
[03:41]
D
Forget it now.
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A
Webster. Kate Webster, man. I've done some charging to Ms. Lod. I'm looking for a regular job.
[03:48]
D
You told me you'll be wanting a general service.
[03:50]
C
Well, I do really need someone. Of course, I'm not sure that I'm strong, ma'.
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A
Am, and they're willing.
[03:56]
C
Well, I'm usually in the habit of. Of making carefully. Sorry. Still, you see with Miss Lodas, won't you?
[04:02]
A
That's right, ma'.
[04:03]
D
Am.
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A
I can start runaways.
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C
It's really difficult to make up my mind. Well, there'd be no harm in giving you a trial. After all, I am in rather the sick. You prepared to see dinner for?
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A
Yes, ma'. Am. As a matter of fact, I brought my box with me just outside.
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C
You must have been very sure of getting the situation.
[04:24]
A
I usually get me way, ma'. Am.
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C
Well, you'd better bring your box inside.
[04:28]
A
Is it very heavy? No, ma', am, not very heavy. Just a few clothes. Plenty of room inside.
[04:50]
B
And so Kate Webster went to work. Let's pause for a moment here and examine the previous history of Ms. Webster. It isn't, I'm afraid, a very edifying story. Born in Ireland, she was sentenced to her term of imprisonment for thieving at an early age. When she came out of prison, she went to England and soon perfected a system of robbery which was to be her principal livelihood for some years to come. Her method was to call at boarding or lodging houses in quest for a room. If the opportunity occurred, she would steal anything she could without engaging the room. Failing that, she would take the room and then disappear, having robbed either her fellow or her mandated the time she was 28. She was serving a sentence of four years penal servitude. No sooner out of prison than she was up to her old tricks. And yet with all this, she never seemed to fail to attract the confidence of innocent people. So in 1879, we find her living at Richmond among unsuspecting press. A new employer, Mrs. Thomas, was regarded the neighborhood as distinctly eccentric. He wore a good deal of jewelry and posed as being much better off than she really was. Twice married but widowed, she lived on her own until she engaged Kate Webster. And so we find these two living under one roof. Mrs. Thomas Trim, genteel, a little nervous. Kate Webster, clever, cunning and evil.
[06:10]
C
Kate. Kate.
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A
All right, I'm coming. I can't believe what you want.
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C
Kate, I don't want to speak to you again about Mano, which you address me kindly, has a care.
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A
All right. What do you want, Mr. J.
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C
Clean the sticks.
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A
I'll give them yesterday and you will
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C
do them again today.
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A
What about?
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C
I think I just heard about a lot of you. Perhaps it will be great if you
[06:35]
A
look to the end of the story. You know what you're doing?
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C
Yes, of course I do.
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A
Yes. Sure you've made up your mind?
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C
Why? Why, Mrs. That is, unless you're going to improve yourself. I don't want it to be difficult.
[06:54]
B
No, Mrs. Thomas didn't want to be difficult. But there was a look In Kate Webster's eye, which had terrified sterner women than Mrs. Thomas. Determined to get rid of her servant, Mrs. Thomas was terrified of offending her. Even now that Kate was under notice, Mrs. Thomas was frightened of living in the same house with her. In a matter of weeks, the servant had begun to dominate her mistress.
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C
I'm a princess. You'll think I'm very silly, Vicar, but you are the only person I can Turn to now.
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E
Mrs. Schoff, I really think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. After all, what do you know against this woman?
[07:32]
C
No, nothing. I haven't any reference I have yet. But it's just that now I've been in the same house with her for these weeks, I can't help feeling that there's something wrong with her. She's. She's wicked.
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E
She's stolen something from you or done anything positively wr.
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F
No.
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E
And you've given her notice?
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C
Yes. That's because she's rude.
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E
Well, there's nothing to worry about. She believes the end of the month and what you call me, you'll be well with of her. Of course she has done something wrong. It will be different. But as I said before, Mr. Thomas, a mountain out of a mohi.
[08:13]
C
Yes, but I must say, I'm nervous.
[08:16]
E
Have faith, Mrs. Thomas. Have faith. I'm sure you.
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B
And so back to Mayfield cott, nervous little Mrs. Thomas. The usual arrangement was for Kate to have Sunday afternoon off, and the following weekend, Mrs. Thomas went as usual to Sunday morning service. When she returned to Mayfield Cottage, Kate was out. She must have spent an afternoon drinking because he didn't get back until late. Mrs. Summers, who didn't like having the house left unattended, had, despite her fears, become quite impatient and annoyed when eventually Kate did return.
[08:52]
A
Oh.
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C
Oh, there you are, Kate. Oh, now, you know I can't go to church until you get back. It really is too bad of you.
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A
What's the matter with you?
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C
I've had enough of your insult. I give you the afternoon off and how do you repay me? By coming home late. And if I'm not mistaken, intoxicated.
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A
And I don't know. You silly old woman. You don't think you can sell me off? Well, you sniffed. You have some fun. Right, let's do one day.
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D
If I don't give you what's coming for you.
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A
It's all right.
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D
I'm not going to touch.
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A
I'm going to my room and you're
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C
going to leave in the morning. Not another night will you stay in this house. You Awful person.
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A
Where are you going?
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D
To church.
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B
When she arrived at church that evening, Mrs. Thomas's friends noticed how agitated she appeared to be. She didn't sit in her usual seat near the footage, but on that particular night he Joseph Pewl close to the door. Probably her thoughts were not on what the preacher was saying.
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D
This evening I am tasting with the text of my sermon the story of a faithful sorrow as Warner.
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B
It is a story of.
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A
Death and son, my playful.
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D
One day they won't give me what time. I am going to.
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B
Now comes one of the strangest and most terrifying aspects of the case. Although Mrs. Thomas was almost paralyzed with fear, she actually went back to the house. Went back to Kate, not even asking a friend to accompany her. You know the simile of the rabbit and the snake. Well, that's the only explanation I can give for her action. Perhaps Kate, when she originally came to the house, had not intended to murder Mrs. Thomas. But by the evening of that awful Sunday night, her mind was made up. Passersby noticed that the gaslight of the hall was lit and Kate thought that a darkened house might scare Mrs. Thomas away. And by now Kate was using all her evil cunning to attack back the fly for the spider's wet.
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D
Kate.
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C
Kate, where are you?
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A
Kate. Where.
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B
So much for the crime of Kate Webster. Now let us leave the murderous and cross over to the other side of the street to learn the story of the case as it affected Scotland Yard. It is now two days later. Henry Winkley, a coal porter living at Mortley, is driving his cart along the banks of the Thames. Just before reaching Barnes Bridge, he catches sight of an object lying half in and half out of the mud of the Thames.
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F
What's the matter?
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E
Over there.
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F
Sticking out of the mud. It's that trouble, can't it?
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B
Yes, well, you never know. Might be something valuable washed ashore.
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A
More likely old clouds.
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B
Ah, well, on to have a look.
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F
Please yourself. Waste of time, I called it.
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B
It's a box.
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F
Wooden box. Here, come on, give us an end.
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A
All right, all right, all right.
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D
Let's pull it out of the water.
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F
Well tied up here. Lend us your knife.
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D
Forever.
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F
Open your name. Come on in.
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D
I'll put in it.
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F
Let's have a look.
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B
I read the horrifying contents of the box. Your imagination. Winkley, the coal porter, reported his discovery to the police of Barnes. At first it was thought that the box contained the butcher's meat. But examination by the doctor revealed a more horrifying truth. Some of the newspapers of the day attributed the discovery to a hoax. Perpetrated by medical students. The police, however, thought otherwise.
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F
The person who did this had no
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B
knowledge of an affidavit.
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F
The body has been roughly chopped up. No, this is no medical joke. But how in heaven's name we're going
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B
to identify the body, I don't know. For over a fortnight the case rested. There was no way of identifying the human remains with any degree of certainty. And then, as nearly always, the criminal made a fatal sip. Inspector Pearman, the officer in charge at Richmond police station, received a Visit from a Mr. John Church.
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D
Good evening, Inspector.
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B
What can I do for you, Mr. Church?
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D
Well, it's my patience special, of course. There may be nothing in this, but frankly I felt a bit suspicious and I thought the best thing was to go to the see the police.
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F
Yes, very wise, Mr. Church.
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D
Now let's hear your story. Well, as I expect you know, I'm the proprietor of the Rising sun, the Pin Royal Gardens. About A week ago, two customers of mine, Mr. And Mrs. Porter and their son William Cameron, to the saloon for a drink. I had with him a lady called Mrs. Thomas. She was rather a hard looking woman, but quite well spoken. We got a coffee of one thing and another and this Mrs. Thomas tells me she's giving up her house and that she wants to sell the furniture. She's very nice about the whole thing and polite. Indeed.
[15:55]
A
Yes, I've decided to move. You know how one gets tired of a place. If you get a good offer for the furniture, I'd sell it tomorrow.
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D
Well, of course it all depends on the furniture.
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A
If you're interested, why don't you come and have a look at it?
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D
Hold on a minute. I haven't said I want to buy it. I know.
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A
I'm having a look. Is there? Why don't you come?
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D
Oh, maybe I will. The following Tuesday I went round to Mayfield Cottage in Richmond. That's perhaps my pretty place. She opened the door to me and you showed me around the house.
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A
It's very nice of you to come around. Come into the parlor first.
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D
Thank you very much. Very nice too.
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A
I'm glad you like it. I'm getting ready to go. I got all the papers ready. Come into the dining room now.
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D
What? Is that so, folks?
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A
Oh, that Mr. Thomas. My like el.
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D
When did he, darling?
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A
Several years ago.
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D
Met?
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A
Oh yes, most natural. What made you ask?
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D
Oh, I don't know. I've been reading about that box they found in the plums last week as
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A
I was in newspapers. Can't believe a word they say. Like the furniture.
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D
Yes, Very nice. Rather depends on how much it wants.
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A
Yeah, we won't quite.
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D
Well, it's about making a list of what furniture you've got. We'll see what it amends. I made her an offer for the furniture. The following Monday I went round to the cottage and together with Mrs. Thomas and got some of the stuff loaded up to move away. I was just walking out of the van when I noticed Mrs. Thomas speaking to her next door neighbour. I couldn't wait her anyway.
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C
What's happened to her? Where is she?
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A
I don't know.
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C
But you must have a seat now.
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A
I tell you, I don't know.
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C
Well, it's most unsatisfactory if she's disappeared. You ought to go to the police about it. You introduce something
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D
at the time. The poor. That night Mrs. Thomas came down to the Rising Sun. She looked a bit excited and borrowed a pound of the misses the following day I went round to collect the remainder of the furniture, Mrs. Thomas's next door neighbour who had the key of the coffee. She locked the door and I couldn't get in. I told me she promised the money or rather the deposit and I didn't have a note of it. When I got back to the pub I had a good look through the furniture and already collected them. In the wardrobe I found a dress a. In the pocket was a letter signed by Mrs. Thomas. It was not the same handwriting of the Mrs. Thomas.
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F
I knew.
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B
Kate Webster's impersonation had failed. Inspector Pearman, the officer in charge, immediately set to work. He went round to Mayfield Cottage, the residence which Mrs. Thomas, alias Kate Webster, had so recently.
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F
Sergeant, come over here.
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D
Yes, sir. Look at this.
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F
Burning company. I'm not very much mistaken. Something human.
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B
The cottage was full of evidence that the bird had flown. Flown where? Kate Webster, who had been so ingenious in perpetrating a crime, had lost her nerve. She had gone to the one place where the police were sure to look her home in Ireland. On 28th March she was arrested there and brought back to London. Focused upon the case. The horrible circumstances on which the body had been removed from the scene of the crime attracted the engine of newspapers in the public. Whilst the case against Kate Webster was already a formidable one, another link was added, but a crash that came forward. Now you will recall how Church, the publican of the Rising sun, had first met Kate Webster in the company of a Mr. And Mrs. Porter and our son William. This young man related how Kate Webster had used him to aid her in her flight to justice
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A
some while back.
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F
He had not seen for several years. Until she turned on to us that Monday morning. She told us that she filled us her money. She'd married a Mr. Thomas who was dead and then left the rest of the together with all the furniture and everything. She said she was going to live with her parents in Scotland and wanted to sell the property. She asked dad if she knew anybody would be interested in buying it. Dad thought of Mr. Church. That's when we went on to see him. After left arriving, she asked daddy for it for a dollar and with her and give her a hand with a trunk she wanted to lift. He said all right. And so they went back together. It was a wooden box tied up with cord. And she told me that she wanted to detachment bridge to deliver to somebody and buy it.
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A
We're trying now.
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D
Now I'll give you seven for my father to go.
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A
We're at the fridge now.
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F
Where are you meeting your friend?
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A
Just here. Fill the box over this house. So that's it there.
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F
Well, shall I. Shall I wait here with him?
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A
No, you walk back. I'll catch up with him.
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F
I don't see anybody.
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A
We're off with you.
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D
All right.
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A
I'll walk on down river.
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F
It was quite dark and I was a bit nervous. But I walked to the end of the bridge and stopped there. I waited a few seconds and then I heard you. I wondered what it was. And then a few seconds later she comes up to me.
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A
Oh, there you are. I told you to walk on.
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F
I was nervous.
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A
What have you got a bit nervous about?
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F
Nothing. What's happened to the box?
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A
I've given it to my friends. The one whose boar hits.
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F
You must have come up quickly.
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A
Yes, he did. Now don't bend here all night. You'll get along with you. Anyone would think you were frightened of the dark.
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B
William Porter identified wooden case as the box which he had helped Kate web through the carriage of the bridge. The chain of evidence was complete. On Wednesday 2 July 1879 at the Central Criminal Court in London she was brought to trial. But this time she got her nerve. Her defense was ingenious but unsuccessful.
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A
I asked you, is any other person in custody?
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D
For the murder you ought to be the innocent seventh Stephen.
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A
For the guilty I'd have killed Mrs. Thomas. There was Churchill, didn't it? Well, I improciated her only to get her money like I'd done before. I brought Church down to the house and it was ill killed her and certainly helped him.
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D
I'm innocent.
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B
But her lying tricks were not out Church had been direct in his dealings with the police. And there was no reason to disbelieve it. Realizing that her original defense was leading nowhere, Kate changed her story once again. But by this time, the more she lied, the more her lies were apparent.
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A
All right, look.
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D
I help with this murder, but what?
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A
The church really killed her?
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D
Cut up the body.
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A
We come back from the services, we killed her. Then the two of us had. I put it up the stairs and she slipped in it.
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D
It was an accident.
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B
Lie upon lie, each contradicting the other. Until at last, even Kate Webster realized there was no hope. You have found guilty and sentenced to death. On the eve of her execution, she confess to the crime. But even then, the habit of lying had not entirely left her. In a signed statement, she said
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F
before
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A
a usual hour, Mrs. Thomas came in and went upstairs. I went up our swift and had an argument with Washington to explore. And in light of my angering waves, I from the top of the stairs never fall. I felt that she was here as to visit what had occurred. Once all control of myself and the preventers grooming and giving me a porter Barbara threatened and the struggles in this church I threw up on the floor.
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B
But if this story was true, the next door neighbor would have heard, at least somehow. No. Kate, right up to the last moment lied and lied until she could lie no more. Well, that's the story of Kate Webster. The next time you see dust on the mantel or you can't get anybody to scrub the front door's tent, don't complain of the servant problem. After all, there are worse things than having no servant at all. You might have one like Kate Webster. Well, that's all for now. But I'll be back again soon to tell you some more of the secrets of Scotland Yard. Meanwhile, this is live Brook. Saying goodbye and pleasant dreams. Sa.
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D
It.
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B
How do you do?
[28:55]
A
This is.

Summary5 min read

Podcast Summary: Harold’s Old Time Radio

Episode: Secrets Of Scotland Yard – Servant Problem
Date: July 30, 2026
Host: Harolds Old Time Radio

Episode Overview

This episode of Secrets of Scotland Yard dives into the infamous 1879 case of Kate Webster—a servant whose crimes shocked Victorian England. Through dramatic re-enactment and rich narration, listeners are transported to 19th-century Richmond to explore the chilling true story behind the so-called "servant problem," culminating in murder, deception, and one of the era’s most notorious criminal investigations.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Setting the Scene: The Notorious Kate Webster (01:08–03:26)

Entry at Madame Tussaud's Chamber of Horrors: The narrator introduces the episode by describing a waxwork effigy of Kate Webster and situating the tale within the context of Victorian-era fears about servants.
Memorable Quote:

"There are all kinds of servants... Loyal, disloyal, honest, dishonest... However, I doubt if there was ever a servant who would spite such a problem to a mistress as Kate Webster." (01:08, Narrator)

2. The Crime Unfolds: Webster Arrives at Mayfield Cottage (03:26–04:50)

Kate’s Introduction: Listeners hear Kate Webster ingratiating herself to Mrs. Martha Thomas, her soon-to-be employer, through a mix of charm and presumptuousness.
Character Dynamics: The interplay between the stern, genteel Mrs. Thomas and the cunning, manipulative Kate is established, portending conflict.

3. Webster’s Sinister Reputation and Dominance (04:50–07:18)

Narration of Webster’s Criminal Past: The episode details her background—petty crimes, repeated imprisonment, habitual lying, and thieving.
Rising Tension: Despite Mrs. Thomas’s mounting fear and attempts to terminate her employment, Kate quickly asserts dominance in the household.

4. Heightened Fear and Supernatural Undertones (07:18–09:57)

Mrs. Thomas Confides in the Vicar:

"I can't help feeling that there's something wrong with her. She's... she's wicked." (07:31, Mrs. Thomas)
Dramatic Conflict: Mrs. Thomas, unnerved by Kate’s rudeness and threatening demeanor, resolves to dismiss her, leading to a tense confrontation.

5. The Murder and Discovery (09:57–13:33)

Mrs. Thomas’s Fate: Despite her fears, Mrs. Thomas returns alone to the house, a decision likened to “the rabbit and the snake.” Later, her body is disposed of in a wooden box.
Discovery of the Box: Henry Winkley, a coal porter, finds the grisly remains by the Thames—initially mistaken for butcher’s meat but quickly revealed as human.

6. Scotland Yard Investigation (13:33–18:41)

Complications of Identification: Early confusion and lack of evidence stymie the investigation.
Breakthrough via Mr. Church: The local pub owner, John Church, reports a suspicious encounter with a woman claiming to be Mrs. Thomas, trying to sell her household furniture.

7. The Imposture and Unraveling (18:41–22:38)

Kate Webster’s Disguise: She impersonates Mrs. Thomas in an effort to sell the victim’s belongings, but inconsistencies in handwriting and stories arouse suspicion.
Porter’s Testimony: William Porter, having helped her move the incriminating box, describes Webster’s manipulative tactics.

8. Arrest, Trial, and Confession (22:38–25:09)

Webster’s Failed Alibis: She desperately tries to implicate Church and construct alternative narratives but is ultimately found out.
Multiple Contradictions:

"Lie upon lie, each contradicting the other. Until at last, even Kate Webster realized there was no hope." (24:08, Narrator)
Final Confession: Even as she confesses, Webster cannot stop fabricating, reinforcing her reputation as a compulsive liar.

9. Epilogue and Moral (25:09–26:42)

Narrative Closure: The host warns against complaining about household help, wryly noting that things could always be worse—one could have a servant like Kate Webster.

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

On Servant Trust:

"In olden times, when a servant left for employment, there was always a suspicion that she packed in her box more than she brought with her. In the case of Kate Webster, that was certainly true. For in her box, she took with her the body of her mistress..." (01:45, Narrator)
On Fear:

"There was a look in Kate Webster’s eye, which had terrified sterner women than Mrs. Thomas." (06:54, Narrator)
Porter’s Ordeal:

"It was quite dark and I was a bit nervous. But I walked to the end of the bridge and stopped there. I waited a few seconds, then I heard you. I wondered what it was... And then a few seconds later she comes up to me." (21:47, William Porter)
On Lying:

"Lie upon lie, each contradicting the other. Until at last, even Kate Webster realized there was no hope. You have found guilty and sentenced to death." (24:08, Narrator)
Closing Joke:

"The next time you see dust on the mantel or you can't get anybody to scrub the front door's tent, don't complain of the servant problem. After all, there are worse things than having no servant at all. You might have one like Kate Webster." (25:09, Narrator)

Timestamps for Important Segments

01:08 – Introduction and context of the Kate Webster case
03:26 – Dramatic reenactment: Kate Webster hired as a servant
04:50 – Kate Webster’s criminal background exposed
07:18 – Mrs. Thomas’s growing fear and consultation with the vicar
09:57 – The murder and return to Mayfield Cottage
13:33 – Discovery of the body in the Thames
15:04 – Mr. Church’s crucial testimony
18:41 – Evidence of Webster’s impersonation and unraveling cover
20:22 – Porter explains his unwitting assistance in the body’s disposal
22:38 – Arrest and trial proceedings
24:31 – Kate Webster’s signed “confession”
25:09 – Episode moral and conclusion

Episode Tone

The episode maintains a suspenseful, true-crime storytelling approach, blending period-accurate drama with a sardonic British narration. The moralistic final note delivers a tongue-in-cheek warning, reinforcing the period’s anxieties about trust, domestic help, and the capacity for evil in unexpected places.

This summary captures the structure and spirit of the “Secrets of Scotland Yard – Servant Problem” episode for anyone who missed this chilling Golden Age radio classic.

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Transcript167 lines

[00:00]
A
It's sam.
[01:08]
B
How do you do? This is Ty. When one woman meets another, there is a subject they'll nearly always talk about. The servant problem. Or so I'm told. Anyway, this program concerns the same question. The servant problem. There are all kinds of servants. Loyal, disloyal, honest, dishonest, present and unpleasant. However, I doubt if there was ever a servant who would spite such a problem to a mistress as Kate Webster. Now, in olden times, when a servant left for employment, there was always a suspicion that she packed in her box more than she brought with her. In the case of Kate Webster, that was certainly true. For in her box she took with her the body of her mistress. You're right. It's a case of murder. To begin our story, we will pay a visit to a world famous exhibition, which as yet has not appeared in this series of programs. I refer to Madame Tussauds in the Chamber of Horrors, occupying the basement of the famous Madame Tussauds building off Baker Street. The Chamber of Horrors is a waxworks exhibition of some of the infamous criminals of the past. We pay our admission price 2 and sixpence. It used to be only a shilling, but horror, like everything else, is suffering from inflation. And down we go. Off on the left as we go in is the effigy of a tall, gaunt woman dressed in the period of 1880. She wears a black coat and around her neck is a thin fur tippet. Her black hair is drawn back severely from her stern face. Her whole appearance is grim and threatening. I'm sure if she'd come to me for a job, I would have thought twice about engaging her. And yet, on that January morning in 1879, Mrs. Martha Thomas must have thought differently when she answered the door at Mayfield Cottage, Richmond, and met for the first time Kate Webster.
[03:26]
A
Good morning, man.
[03:28]
C
Very well. Good morning.
[03:30]
A
I'm Ms. Webster, Ma'. Am. Miss lady said she told you, sir.
[03:34]
C
Oh, oh, yes, that's right. I happened to mention to her that I was looking for the surface and she mentioned her name. I.
[03:41]
D
Forget it now.
[03:42]
A
Webster. Kate Webster, man. I've done some charging to Ms. Lod. I'm looking for a regular job.
[03:48]
D
You told me you'll be wanting a general service.
[03:50]
C
Well, I do really need someone. Of course, I'm not sure that I'm strong, ma'.
[03:55]
A
Am, and they're willing.
[03:56]
C
Well, I'm usually in the habit of. Of making carefully. Sorry. Still, you see with Miss Lodas, won't you?
[04:02]
A
That's right, ma'.
[04:03]
D
Am.
[04:03]
A
I can start runaways.
[04:05]
C
It's really difficult to make up my mind. Well, there'd be no harm in giving you a trial. After all, I am in rather the sick. You prepared to see dinner for?
[04:17]
A
Yes, ma'. Am. As a matter of fact, I brought my box with me just outside.
[04:21]
C
You must have been very sure of getting the situation.
[04:24]
A
I usually get me way, ma'. Am.
[04:26]
C
Well, you'd better bring your box inside.
[04:28]
A
Is it very heavy? No, ma', am, not very heavy. Just a few clothes. Plenty of room inside.
[04:50]
B
And so Kate Webster went to work. Let's pause for a moment here and examine the previous history of Ms. Webster. It isn't, I'm afraid, a very edifying story. Born in Ireland, she was sentenced to her term of imprisonment for thieving at an early age. When she came out of prison, she went to England and soon perfected a system of robbery which was to be her principal livelihood for some years to come. Her method was to call at boarding or lodging houses in quest for a room. If the opportunity occurred, she would steal anything she could without engaging the room. Failing that, she would take the room and then disappear, having robbed either her fellow or her mandated the time she was 28. She was serving a sentence of four years penal servitude. No sooner out of prison than she was up to her old tricks. And yet with all this, she never seemed to fail to attract the confidence of innocent people. So in 1879, we find her living at Richmond among unsuspecting press. A new employer, Mrs. Thomas, was regarded the neighborhood as distinctly eccentric. He wore a good deal of jewelry and posed as being much better off than she really was. Twice married but widowed, she lived on her own until she engaged Kate Webster. And so we find these two living under one roof. Mrs. Thomas Trim, genteel, a little nervous. Kate Webster, clever, cunning and evil.
[06:10]
C
Kate. Kate.
[06:13]
A
All right, I'm coming. I can't believe what you want.
[06:18]
C
Kate, I don't want to speak to you again about Mano, which you address me kindly, has a care.
[06:23]
A
All right. What do you want, Mr. J.
[06:25]
C
Clean the sticks.
[06:26]
A
I'll give them yesterday and you will
[06:28]
C
do them again today.
[06:29]
A
What about?
[06:31]
C
I think I just heard about a lot of you. Perhaps it will be great if you
[06:35]
A
look to the end of the story. You know what you're doing?
[06:41]
C
Yes, of course I do.
[06:43]
A
Yes. Sure you've made up your mind?
[06:45]
C
Why? Why, Mrs. That is, unless you're going to improve yourself. I don't want it to be difficult.
[06:54]
B
No, Mrs. Thomas didn't want to be difficult. But there was a look In Kate Webster's eye, which had terrified sterner women than Mrs. Thomas. Determined to get rid of her servant, Mrs. Thomas was terrified of offending her. Even now that Kate was under notice, Mrs. Thomas was frightened of living in the same house with her. In a matter of weeks, the servant had begun to dominate her mistress.
[07:19]
C
I'm a princess. You'll think I'm very silly, Vicar, but you are the only person I can Turn to now.
[07:24]
E
Mrs. Schoff, I really think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. After all, what do you know against this woman?
[07:32]
C
No, nothing. I haven't any reference I have yet. But it's just that now I've been in the same house with her for these weeks, I can't help feeling that there's something wrong with her. She's. She's wicked.
[07:46]
E
She's stolen something from you or done anything positively wr.
[07:51]
F
No.
[07:52]
E
And you've given her notice?
[07:54]
C
Yes. That's because she's rude.
[07:56]
E
Well, there's nothing to worry about. She believes the end of the month and what you call me, you'll be well with of her. Of course she has done something wrong. It will be different. But as I said before, Mr. Thomas, a mountain out of a mohi.
[08:13]
C
Yes, but I must say, I'm nervous.
[08:16]
E
Have faith, Mrs. Thomas. Have faith. I'm sure you.
[08:21]
B
And so back to Mayfield cott, nervous little Mrs. Thomas. The usual arrangement was for Kate to have Sunday afternoon off, and the following weekend, Mrs. Thomas went as usual to Sunday morning service. When she returned to Mayfield Cottage, Kate was out. She must have spent an afternoon drinking because he didn't get back until late. Mrs. Summers, who didn't like having the house left unattended, had, despite her fears, become quite impatient and annoyed when eventually Kate did return.
[08:52]
A
Oh.
[08:53]
C
Oh, there you are, Kate. Oh, now, you know I can't go to church until you get back. It really is too bad of you.
[08:59]
A
What's the matter with you?
[09:00]
C
I've had enough of your insult. I give you the afternoon off and how do you repay me? By coming home late. And if I'm not mistaken, intoxicated.
[09:09]
A
And I don't know. You silly old woman. You don't think you can sell me off? Well, you sniffed. You have some fun. Right, let's do one day.
[09:19]
D
If I don't give you what's coming for you.
[09:21]
A
It's all right.
[09:22]
D
I'm not going to touch.
[09:24]
A
I'm going to my room and you're
[09:26]
C
going to leave in the morning. Not another night will you stay in this house. You Awful person.
[09:32]
A
Where are you going?
[09:34]
D
To church.
[09:37]
B
When she arrived at church that evening, Mrs. Thomas's friends noticed how agitated she appeared to be. She didn't sit in her usual seat near the footage, but on that particular night he Joseph Pewl close to the door. Probably her thoughts were not on what the preacher was saying.
[09:58]
D
This evening I am tasting with the text of my sermon the story of a faithful sorrow as Warner.
[10:07]
B
It is a story of.
[10:20]
A
Death and son, my playful.
[10:22]
D
One day they won't give me what time. I am going to.
[10:43]
B
Now comes one of the strangest and most terrifying aspects of the case. Although Mrs. Thomas was almost paralyzed with fear, she actually went back to the house. Went back to Kate, not even asking a friend to accompany her. You know the simile of the rabbit and the snake. Well, that's the only explanation I can give for her action. Perhaps Kate, when she originally came to the house, had not intended to murder Mrs. Thomas. But by the evening of that awful Sunday night, her mind was made up. Passersby noticed that the gaslight of the hall was lit and Kate thought that a darkened house might scare Mrs. Thomas away. And by now Kate was using all her evil cunning to attack back the fly for the spider's wet.
[11:32]
D
Kate.
[11:33]
C
Kate, where are you?
[11:42]
A
Kate. Where.
[11:53]
B
So much for the crime of Kate Webster. Now let us leave the murderous and cross over to the other side of the street to learn the story of the case as it affected Scotland Yard. It is now two days later. Henry Winkley, a coal porter living at Mortley, is driving his cart along the banks of the Thames. Just before reaching Barnes Bridge, he catches sight of an object lying half in and half out of the mud of the Thames.
[12:29]
F
What's the matter?
[12:30]
E
Over there.
[12:31]
F
Sticking out of the mud. It's that trouble, can't it?
[12:34]
B
Yes, well, you never know. Might be something valuable washed ashore.
[12:38]
A
More likely old clouds.
[12:39]
B
Ah, well, on to have a look.
[12:41]
F
Please yourself. Waste of time, I called it.
[12:48]
B
It's a box.
[12:49]
F
Wooden box. Here, come on, give us an end.
[12:51]
A
All right, all right, all right.
[12:53]
D
Let's pull it out of the water.
[13:02]
F
Well tied up here. Lend us your knife.
[13:05]
D
Forever.
[13:06]
F
Open your name. Come on in.
[13:11]
D
I'll put in it.
[13:14]
F
Let's have a look.
[13:33]
B
I read the horrifying contents of the box. Your imagination. Winkley, the coal porter, reported his discovery to the police of Barnes. At first it was thought that the box contained the butcher's meat. But examination by the doctor revealed a more horrifying truth. Some of the newspapers of the day attributed the discovery to a hoax. Perpetrated by medical students. The police, however, thought otherwise.
[14:36]
F
The person who did this had no
[14:38]
B
knowledge of an affidavit.
[14:39]
F
The body has been roughly chopped up. No, this is no medical joke. But how in heaven's name we're going
[14:45]
B
to identify the body, I don't know. For over a fortnight the case rested. There was no way of identifying the human remains with any degree of certainty. And then, as nearly always, the criminal made a fatal sip. Inspector Pearman, the officer in charge at Richmond police station, received a Visit from a Mr. John Church.
[15:05]
D
Good evening, Inspector.
[15:06]
B
What can I do for you, Mr. Church?
[15:08]
D
Well, it's my patience special, of course. There may be nothing in this, but frankly I felt a bit suspicious and I thought the best thing was to go to the see the police.
[15:17]
F
Yes, very wise, Mr. Church.
[15:19]
D
Now let's hear your story. Well, as I expect you know, I'm the proprietor of the Rising sun, the Pin Royal Gardens. About A week ago, two customers of mine, Mr. And Mrs. Porter and their son William Cameron, to the saloon for a drink. I had with him a lady called Mrs. Thomas. She was rather a hard looking woman, but quite well spoken. We got a coffee of one thing and another and this Mrs. Thomas tells me she's giving up her house and that she wants to sell the furniture. She's very nice about the whole thing and polite. Indeed.
[15:55]
A
Yes, I've decided to move. You know how one gets tired of a place. If you get a good offer for the furniture, I'd sell it tomorrow.
[16:03]
D
Well, of course it all depends on the furniture.
[16:05]
A
If you're interested, why don't you come and have a look at it?
[16:08]
D
Hold on a minute. I haven't said I want to buy it. I know.
[16:11]
A
I'm having a look. Is there? Why don't you come?
[16:14]
D
Oh, maybe I will. The following Tuesday I went round to Mayfield Cottage in Richmond. That's perhaps my pretty place. She opened the door to me and you showed me around the house.
[16:32]
A
It's very nice of you to come around. Come into the parlor first.
[16:36]
D
Thank you very much. Very nice too.
[16:41]
A
I'm glad you like it. I'm getting ready to go. I got all the papers ready. Come into the dining room now.
[16:48]
D
What? Is that so, folks?
[16:50]
A
Oh, that Mr. Thomas. My like el.
[16:54]
D
When did he, darling?
[16:55]
A
Several years ago.
[16:56]
D
Met?
[16:58]
A
Oh yes, most natural. What made you ask?
[17:01]
D
Oh, I don't know. I've been reading about that box they found in the plums last week as
[17:05]
A
I was in newspapers. Can't believe a word they say. Like the furniture.
[17:10]
D
Yes, Very nice. Rather depends on how much it wants.
[17:13]
A
Yeah, we won't quite.
[17:14]
D
Well, it's about making a list of what furniture you've got. We'll see what it amends. I made her an offer for the furniture. The following Monday I went round to the cottage and together with Mrs. Thomas and got some of the stuff loaded up to move away. I was just walking out of the van when I noticed Mrs. Thomas speaking to her next door neighbour. I couldn't wait her anyway.
[17:39]
C
What's happened to her? Where is she?
[17:41]
A
I don't know.
[17:42]
C
But you must have a seat now.
[17:44]
A
I tell you, I don't know.
[17:45]
C
Well, it's most unsatisfactory if she's disappeared. You ought to go to the police about it. You introduce something
[17:55]
D
at the time. The poor. That night Mrs. Thomas came down to the Rising Sun. She looked a bit excited and borrowed a pound of the misses the following day I went round to collect the remainder of the furniture, Mrs. Thomas's next door neighbour who had the key of the coffee. She locked the door and I couldn't get in. I told me she promised the money or rather the deposit and I didn't have a note of it. When I got back to the pub I had a good look through the furniture and already collected them. In the wardrobe I found a dress a. In the pocket was a letter signed by Mrs. Thomas. It was not the same handwriting of the Mrs. Thomas.
[18:31]
F
I knew.
[18:41]
B
Kate Webster's impersonation had failed. Inspector Pearman, the officer in charge, immediately set to work. He went round to Mayfield Cottage, the residence which Mrs. Thomas, alias Kate Webster, had so recently.
[18:58]
F
Sergeant, come over here.
[18:59]
D
Yes, sir. Look at this.
[19:03]
F
Burning company. I'm not very much mistaken. Something human.
[19:17]
B
The cottage was full of evidence that the bird had flown. Flown where? Kate Webster, who had been so ingenious in perpetrating a crime, had lost her nerve. She had gone to the one place where the police were sure to look her home in Ireland. On 28th March she was arrested there and brought back to London. Focused upon the case. The horrible circumstances on which the body had been removed from the scene of the crime attracted the engine of newspapers in the public. Whilst the case against Kate Webster was already a formidable one, another link was added, but a crash that came forward. Now you will recall how Church, the publican of the Rising sun, had first met Kate Webster in the company of a Mr. And Mrs. Porter and our son William. This young man related how Kate Webster had used him to aid her in her flight to justice
[20:22]
A
some while back.
[20:23]
F
He had not seen for several years. Until she turned on to us that Monday morning. She told us that she filled us her money. She'd married a Mr. Thomas who was dead and then left the rest of the together with all the furniture and everything. She said she was going to live with her parents in Scotland and wanted to sell the property. She asked dad if she knew anybody would be interested in buying it. Dad thought of Mr. Church. That's when we went on to see him. After left arriving, she asked daddy for it for a dollar and with her and give her a hand with a trunk she wanted to lift. He said all right. And so they went back together. It was a wooden box tied up with cord. And she told me that she wanted to detachment bridge to deliver to somebody and buy it.
[21:16]
A
We're trying now.
[21:17]
D
Now I'll give you seven for my father to go.
[21:20]
A
We're at the fridge now.
[21:22]
F
Where are you meeting your friend?
[21:24]
A
Just here. Fill the box over this house. So that's it there.
[21:31]
F
Well, shall I. Shall I wait here with him?
[21:33]
A
No, you walk back. I'll catch up with him.
[21:36]
F
I don't see anybody.
[21:37]
A
We're off with you.
[21:38]
D
All right.
[21:39]
A
I'll walk on down river.
[21:47]
F
It was quite dark and I was a bit nervous. But I walked to the end of the bridge and stopped there. I waited a few seconds and then I heard you. I wondered what it was. And then a few seconds later she comes up to me.
[22:05]
A
Oh, there you are. I told you to walk on.
[22:07]
F
I was nervous.
[22:08]
A
What have you got a bit nervous about?
[22:10]
F
Nothing. What's happened to the box?
[22:12]
A
I've given it to my friends. The one whose boar hits.
[22:14]
F
You must have come up quickly.
[22:15]
A
Yes, he did. Now don't bend here all night. You'll get along with you. Anyone would think you were frightened of the dark.
[22:39]
B
William Porter identified wooden case as the box which he had helped Kate web through the carriage of the bridge. The chain of evidence was complete. On Wednesday 2 July 1879 at the Central Criminal Court in London she was brought to trial. But this time she got her nerve. Her defense was ingenious but unsuccessful.
[23:08]
A
I asked you, is any other person in custody?
[23:11]
D
For the murder you ought to be the innocent seventh Stephen.
[23:15]
A
For the guilty I'd have killed Mrs. Thomas. There was Churchill, didn't it? Well, I improciated her only to get her money like I'd done before. I brought Church down to the house and it was ill killed her and certainly helped him.
[23:30]
D
I'm innocent.
[23:32]
B
But her lying tricks were not out Church had been direct in his dealings with the police. And there was no reason to disbelieve it. Realizing that her original defense was leading nowhere, Kate changed her story once again. But by this time, the more she lied, the more her lies were apparent.
[23:48]
A
All right, look.
[23:49]
D
I help with this murder, but what?
[23:51]
A
The church really killed her?
[23:53]
D
Cut up the body.
[23:56]
A
We come back from the services, we killed her. Then the two of us had. I put it up the stairs and she slipped in it.
[24:04]
D
It was an accident.
[24:09]
B
Lie upon lie, each contradicting the other. Until at last, even Kate Webster realized there was no hope. You have found guilty and sentenced to death. On the eve of her execution, she confess to the crime. But even then, the habit of lying had not entirely left her. In a signed statement, she said
[24:32]
F
before
[24:32]
A
a usual hour, Mrs. Thomas came in and went upstairs. I went up our swift and had an argument with Washington to explore. And in light of my angering waves, I from the top of the stairs never fall. I felt that she was here as to visit what had occurred. Once all control of myself and the preventers grooming and giving me a porter Barbara threatened and the struggles in this church I threw up on the floor.
[25:09]
B
But if this story was true, the next door neighbor would have heard, at least somehow. No. Kate, right up to the last moment lied and lied until she could lie no more. Well, that's the story of Kate Webster. The next time you see dust on the mantel or you can't get anybody to scrub the front door's tent, don't complain of the servant problem. After all, there are worse things than having no servant at all. You might have one like Kate Webster. Well, that's all for now. But I'll be back again soon to tell you some more of the secrets of Scotland Yard. Meanwhile, this is live Brook. Saying goodbye and pleasant dreams. Sa.
[26:42]
D
It.
[28:54]
B
How do you do?
[28:55]
A
This is.