Tex And Jinx 50-01-06 Guest - Mary Gordon

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Harold’s Old Time Radio

Episode: Tex And Jinx 50-01-06 Guest - Mary Garden
Date: February 21, 2026 (original episode aired January 6, 1950)
Main Theme:
A nostalgic return to the golden age of radio, this episode features interviews with celebrated opera singer Mary Garden and writer-diplomat Clare Boothe Luce. Hosts Tex and Jinx discuss Mary Garden’s legendary career, her current lecture tour, and her reflections on life, music, and aging. The episode closes with Clare Boothe Luce sharing anecdotes from her travels and her perspective on political and social leaders of the time.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening: A Glimpse into 1950

• Host Recap of Current Events ([02:29])
  • Contextualizes the times: postwar political tensions, focus on communism, and major headlines.
  • Commentary on shifting US/Britain policy towards communist China.
  • Lively New York and Broadway scenes, personalizing the “front page” feel for listeners.

2. Interview with Mary Garden: Style, Longevity, and Life in the Spotlight

On Fashion and Aging ([07:08]–[08:27])

• Shorter Hair and Skirts?

  • Mary Garden: “I think short skirt for the day are divine. And short hair is perfectly beautiful because it's very youthful. But I like long skirts for the evening. ... I don't like the hair up at all. It makes women look older than they are.” ([07:08])
  • Tex/Jinx: Playful exchange about remaining youthful—“You think that women should always look young?” ([07:29])
  • Garden: “Just as young as they can for as long as they can.” ([07:31])

• Should Men Marry Older Women?

  • Discussion about life expectancy and traditions in Scotland.
  • Garden: “If they want to live a long time, they better go to school. ... When they get to their hundredth year, they get a letter from the king.” ([07:55–08:13])
  • Playful ambition: “I'd like to live to be 200.” ([08:24])

On Her American Lecture Tour ([11:31]–[15:16])

• Mary Garden’s Tour, “Men, Money, and Music”

  • Tex/Jinx: “Which comes first?” ([11:50])
    • Garden: “Men.” (immediate reply, with laughter)
    • Prioritization: Men, Money, and Music—“It's the only thing I know about ... Always.” ([11:54])
  • Description of her lecture stops—12 to 15 cities, enjoying university audiences most, especially Monmouth College (a Scottish college in the US), which gave her an honorary Doctor of Music degree ([12:38–12:52]).
    • Didn’t want to be addressed as “doctor” (“No, you cannot call me doctor. You call me Mary Garden.” [12:55])
  • On why she accepted the tour: After a grieving period for her mother, Mary Garden was invited by the National Arts Foundation and relished the “newness” of the project ([13:07–14:05]).
    • “I'm a very peculiar woman, but I like anything that's new.” ([13:19])
    • Proud of having introduced French opera to America.

• On Her Relationship with America

  • Stayed away due to family obligations; surprised and touched by her lasting popularity: “I had to come back and find such a welcome. ... It just warms me all up and I just adore it.” ([14:46])
  • Speculates on her enduring American appeal:
    • “Because I love the people. ... The American women ... saw the beauty of my work ... and they, from word of mouth, made my triumph in America.” ([15:16])
    • On criticism for modern opera: “When we don't understand anything, what do we do? Well, we ignore it. Yes, we do.” ([15:14])

On Stage Nerves and Advice ([15:55]–[16:14])

• Jinx: “How about your nervousness?”
• Mary Garden: “Oh, I had none. I'm much more nervous talking to you now. ... I have never had nerves.”
• On confidence: “Only people who are not ready that are nervous. When you're not ready with anything, you're nervous.” ([16:06–16:14])

3. Clare Boothe Luce: Travels & Political Reflections

Meeting Winston Churchill ([17:37]–[21:23])

• Vivid portrait of Churchill at home (“He was wearing a very elegant ... yellowish tweed ... and that enormous gold watch chain ... belonged to his father.” [18:15])
• Discussion of Churchill’s hobbies and well-being; he offers Luce a book he wrote called Painting as a Hobby and recommends busy professionals have “at least three hobbies.” ([19:13])
• “Some of [his paintings] are darn good, you know. ... He does very well indeed with it as a hobby.” ([20:06])
• Churchill’s optimism and possible political return as the Conservatives gain momentum ([21:23])

On Bernard Baruch: Loyalty and Friendship ([22:06]–[25:18])

• Praises Baruch’s loyalty and his habit of giving credit to his team.
• “He is a lovable and loyal person.” ([23:27])
• Describes his approach to friendship: protects friends during the crisis, only critiques after the fact when emotions have cooled.
• “He listens to whatever anybody has to say. He listens even though he doesn't hear very well. He listens to every word ...” ([25:09])

Will Luce Run for Senate? Eisenhower for President? ([25:32]–[26:57])

• Deflects rumors of her candidacy with wit: “If I make a statement about politics, it'd probably be just as much of a surprise to me as it will to everybody else.” ([25:42])
• On Eisenhower: “I think he is a terrific character. I think he's a very fine man. I think he's a great vote getter, and I think he has a very fresh, open and liberal mind about politics. So if Eisenhower is saying no, all I can say is I hope he doesn't mean it.” ([26:11])
• Would Luce run if Ike does? “There could be no possible connection ... Although ... if Eisenhower were in the White House, it would be a pleasure to be in the Senate ...” ([26:57])

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Timestamped Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Mary Garden on Style:

  “I think short skirt for the day are divine. And short hair is perfectly beautiful ... But I like long skirts for the evening. ... I don't like the hair up at all. It makes women look older than they are.”
  — Mary Garden, [07:08]

• On Living Long:

  “If they want to live a long time, they better go to school ... When they get to their hundredth year, they get a letter from the king.”
  — Mary Garden, [07:55]

• On Tour Priorities:

  “Men.” (laughs)
  — Mary Garden, [11:50]

• On Fame and American Audience:

  “Because I love the people ... the American women ... from word of mouth made my triumph in America.”
  — Mary Garden, [15:16]

• On Confidence:

  “Only people who are not ready that are nervous. When you're not ready with anything, you're nervous.”
  — Mary Garden, [16:06]

• On Churchill’s Style:

  “He was wearing a very elegant plaid tweed ... that enormous gold watch chain ... belonged to his father. He’s very proud of that gold cable.”
  — Clare Boothe Luce, [18:15]

• Churchill’s Hobbies:

  “He advised me ... that they should have three hobbies. At least three hobbies in order to stay happy and cheerful and effective under the pressure of a public career.”
  — Clare Boothe Luce, [19:13]

• On Bernard Baruch’s Loyalty:

  “That’s his really endearing quality, that ... his friends know that they can count on him and that is, that’s much more important than anything else about him, that he is a lovable and loyal person.”
  — Clare Boothe Luce, [23:27]

• On Political Ambitions:

  “If I make a statement about politics, it'd probably be just as much of a surprise to me as it will to everybody else.”
  — Clare Boothe Luce, [25:42]

• On Eisenhower:

  “I think he is a terrific character. ... And I think he has a very fresh, open and liberal mind about politics. So if Eisenhower is saying no, all I can say is I hope he doesn’t mean it.”
  — Clare Boothe Luce, [26:11]

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Episode Flow and Tone

• Tone & Language:
  Warm, playful, conversational, and insightful, mixing wit, charm, and wisdom. Tex and Jinx’s chemistry brings out engaging anecdotes and candid moments from their guests.

• Useful for New Listeners:
  The episode is an evocative time capsule reflecting shifting gender roles, the joys and tribulations of legacy, and intimate insights into public figures of the era. Not only does it illuminate the personalities of Mary Garden and Clare Boothe Luce, but it also frames their reflections within the larger currents of mid-century history and society.

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |--------------------------------------------|--------------| | Opening news monologue | 02:29–07:08 | | Mary Garden on style and aging | 07:08–08:27 | | Mary Garden on her tour and lecture themes | 11:31–15:16 | | On confidence and nerves | 15:55–16:14 | | Clare Boothe Luce on Churchill | 17:37–21:23 | | Clare Boothe Luce on Bernard Baruch | 22:06–25:18 | | Political ambitions and Eisenhower | 25:32–26:57 |

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For more classic moments from golden-age radio, tune in next week for continued interviews and timeless stories from icons like Mary Garden and Clare Boothe Luce.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Visit spinquest.com for more details. WNBC and WNBC FM New York save water James Stewart stars in Magic town tonight at 9 o' clock on Screen Director's Playhouse. Be sure to hear it. Portions of the following program are transcribed. We take you now to Tex and Jinx in their home at Manhasset. Hi Jinx.

[C]

Hello Tex. It's Friday morning and it's Savarin Coffee

[B]

time and it's time for listeners Digest. Let's take a quick look at the index this morning. Two leading ladies, Mary Garden, the legendary opera star who's been making headlines for the past five decades. This time, though, not singing, but talking, touring the leading cities and universities of America, talking about men, money and music. You'll meet her in a minute. And also another chapter in the fabulous career of Clare Boothe Luce. And don't forget, she gets the whole program on Sunday at 12:30. But I drink the story for Saraburin. You know, I was just thinking of all the different places that we visited and in which we've had coffee here in America, many countries of Europe, South America and Asia. Between us, we've had a lot of coffee tasting experience. And when you come right down to it, no matter how the coffee is prepared or how it's served, it's really the coffee that you use that counts.

[C]

And that's why we use Savarin. And we'd like you to try it to taste Savarin's richness and flavor for yourself. It's blended from only the finest and richest coffee coffee's available. And that's why it gives you more flavor, because it has more flavor to give. Just a taste of Savin and you'll know that there's more to it. Savin is the one coffee that stands out because it's richer tasting.

[B]

And that's the story behind each cup of Saffron coffee that you use. The flavor never varies. It's in the richer Savarin blend, so you always get it right in your coffee cup. Try comparing Savin with other brands and you'll see that the difference is obvious. Savrin is the Richest, most satisfying coffee of them all. Buy some in regular drip or Silex grinds at Savarin. S A V A R I N. Now for the front pages. The first week of 1950 winds up with lots of storm warnings for this second half of the turbulent 20th century. At a time when we are spending a third of our national budget on arms against the world threat of communism and still more, billions of dollars to build up Western Europe and Germany against communism and millions to help bolster Tito against communism. At such a time, President Truman says that we're not going to spend another dime to keep the communists out of the island of Formosa, a strategic island which all top military leaders say is an essential and pivotal point in the defense of our front line in the Pacific. To further confuse the picture, Republicans who have blasted Truman for trying too hard to stop the communists in Russia, spending too much money in Europe, now blast Truman for not trying hard enough to stop the communists in China. And so 1950 begins, with the voice of America at home and abroad talking double talk. To top the confusion, after 10 years of lockstep marching side by side with Britain's foreign policy, Washington and London will split today over recognition of the communist rule in China. To protect her billion dollar investment in Hong Kong, Britain will officially recognize the Chinese Reds today. The decision has been made down in Washington. US Secretary of State Acheson says not yet for America. And so historians will recognize this as a sickening parallel of British and American confusion over resistance to Japanese aggression in China. Before World War II, the British 15 years ago yielded to the Japs in Manchuria and Shanghai. Americans talked big but did nothing more until Pearl Harbor. And today, the record, the maps will show that the communists control far more of Asia than the Japs ever did. On other front pages at the end of this first week of 1950, other headlines echo the times. Faye Emerson flies to Mexico to divorce Elliot Roosevelt, who is expected to marry a girl who looks just like Faye Emerson. As the winter heat wave increases water consumption, another no shave day is set for New Yorkers for next Thursday. After three years of military and financial support, another cabinet falls in Greece. The movie star who scored a great triumph in the Bicycle Thief seeks a job now in Italy as a day laborer. And last night on Broadway, our reporter Beth Blossom reports that audiences stood up and cheered for Ethel Waters, back on stage after 12 years. But in a bad play called Member of the Wedding, audiences cheered also for the brilliant performance of 24 year old Julie Harris, who played the part of a 12 year old girl. Critics unanimously turned thumbs down on the play, but joined the wild applause for the direction and for the stars. With so much news in the first week of 1950, the century old Son finally folded up and split its stars with a Hearst and a Scripps Howard paper. And that winds up what happened on the front pages in this first week of 1950. But now for our front page, let's bring one of our guests up here for a single question. Bring her up on the front page where she's been so many times before. Her name, Mary Garden. In Merry Garden. For a long, long time, you've been famous among newspaper men for the answers you always have to the same silly questions that ships news reporters always ask you when you come on to America for another visit. And I'm going to ask you another one of those dumb questions and see if you can come up with a new answer for us. Ms. Garden, what do you think of shorter skirts and shorter hair for women?

[D]

I think short skirt for the day are divine. And short hair is perfectly beautiful because it's very youthful. But I like long skirts for the evening. I mean, for parties or theater or anything like that. I like the long skirt and I don't like the hair up at all. It makes women look older than they are.

[B]

And you think that women should always look young?

[D]

Just as young as they can for

[B]

as long as they can.

[D]

And for as long as they can.

[B]

You know, we have a little crusade over here that we'd like to get your opinion on. We're trying to persuade boys to marry girls older than they are because apparently in America, the women are outliving the men. How do you feel about that?

[E]

Well, I don't know.

[D]

I think that if they want to live a long time. Well, if they want to live a long time, they better go to school. Because a lot of people in Scotland live to be a hundred, you know, lots of them. And then when they get to their hundredth year, they get a letter from the king.

[B]

And that's worth living to be a hundred.

[D]

Well, some of them think it is. I don't. But never mind. Some of them do. A letter from the king must be very complimentary.

[B]

Letter or no letter, you'll probably live to be 150.

[D]

Well, I'd like to live to be 200.

[B]

Okay, thank you. You've stopped us again.

[C]

And Mary Garden, that was just a teaser. We want to get as much of your story as we in just a

[A]

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[B]

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[E]

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[C]

Now it's time for our Savron bouquet, and this morning it goes to the Blind Veterans Association. We're going to send it to them at 433 W. 34th St. In care of the president of the Blind Veterans Association, Frank Kelly. And we discussed this the other night at the B' Nai Brith meeting and Frank promised that he would split it up with all the boys and they said, I hope it comes packed separately. Well, we want to give them the bouquet for just the job that they've done. And their convention is tomorrow, Saturday, January 7th at 1:30 at the Masonic Temple, their second annual convention.

[B]

And so to Frank Kelly and the Blind Veterans association, we send not only the Savarin bouquet, but a case of richer tasting Savarin coffee.

[C]

We have a one word definition for a good cup of coffee and it's Savarin because to us, Savarin means the best cup of coffee that your money can buy. These days especially, it's important to get the coffee that gives you more flavor for your money because it has more flavor to give. And of course, that Savarin, it's blended from the richest coffee varieties grown. It has the extra richness right in the blend and you get this extra richness right in your coffee cup every time you serve it.

[B]

And here's a simple test that you can make right in your own home. Buy a tin of Savarin at your grocer's and then compare it cup cup with your present brand of coffee. We're sure that you'll agree that Savin is the one coffee that stands out because it's richer taste and don't put it off.

[C]

Try Savarin tonight at dinner. We think it's the coffee that you've been looking for a rich, full bodied blend of the world's finest coffees. And don't forget, you can buy Savarin in your favorite grind regular for percolator drip for your drip pot, or Silex grind for your vacuum type coffee maker. And that's S A V A R I N. Savarin, the one word that means a truly delicious cup of coffee. And now let's get much more of Mary Garden's story. Tex, will you get it?

[B]

Okay. Merry Garden. We want to get the story of your amazingly successful tour in America. And you've also written a headline on that story yourself with the title of the tour, Music, Men and money. Now wait a minute. Is that the right order? Money, men and music. Which comes first?

[D]

Men.

[B]

Men comes first.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

And which comes second?

[D]

Money.

[B]

Money and music last.

[D]

It's the only thing I know about

[B]

men, money and music. You mean you start off talking about the things you don't understand.

[D]

I do. Always.

[B]

Always? Well, you're always. You always make people laugh and love it, no matter what you say. And I'd like to find out a little bit this morning about this tour of yours. Where have you gone in America?

[D]

Well, I've done already about 12 cities. 15 cities. And the thing that has interested me the most and the thing that I loved the best on this tour were the universities.

[B]

The universities.

[D]

I just love to talk to the

[B]

youth and the students and I know they love to listen to you and fire questions at you. What are some of the university towns that you've gone to? What small towns? Can you remember?

[D]

Well, the only I've gone to big ones, but the smallest was Monmouth. Monmouth, Monmouth College. It's a Scotch College.

[B]

A Scotch College.

[D]

A Scotch College. And there they gave me the. They made me Doctor of Music.

[B]

Oh, then I can't call you Mary Garden. I have to call you Dr. Garden.

[D]

No, you cannot call me doctor. You call me Mary Garden.

[B]

All right, Mary Garden. Well, now there's another interesting thing about the sponsorship of this tour. Who set it up and how is it being run?

[D]

Well, you see, I was living in Scotland after the Second World War. I couldn't get back to Paris, so I just stayed these nine years in my own country. And the eighth year of our stay there, I lost my mother. And I was in very great grief and lost interest in everything and everybody when one day Mr. Carlton Smith of the National Arts foundation came to Paris. They came to Aberdeen to talk to me and see if I would come to America for that wonderful organization that was just Beginning. Well, you know, I'm a very peculiar woman, but I like anything that's new. You see, I brought to America my modern French operas, which never had been heard here. And that was something new, and I loved it. So then this National Arts foundation is new, and that interested me. And so I said, very well, I shall come and do what I can for that organization.

[E]

And here I am.

[B]

I remember that. All we have to do to get you to do something is to say, this is a new idea.

[D]

That's exactly it. And you'll have a good fighting spirit.

[B]

All right.

[D]

I love to fight.

[B]

Well, now, why have you waited so long to come back to America?

[D]

Well, really, you couldn't come back. You see, the war finished in 45, and my mother wasn't well, and I couldn't leave her. I didn't want to leave her. And then those other three years passed so quickly. And that's why I had no reason to come back. I had no reason.

[B]

But you had ties here, didn't you? Because, I mean, your name today is just as fresh as it ever was.

[D]

Yes. Don't you think that's very amusing?

[B]

Well, I don't think it would be

[D]

amusing so long away from this country. I had to come back and find such a welcome. Such a welcome. It's just. It just warms me all up and I just adore it.

[B]

Well, now, you know, I don't want to be cynical or skeptical, but it's a habit of Americans to examine everything that's full of sentiment and tradition and legend and so forth. Have you ever stopped to figure out why you have such a deep, permanent, forever lasting hold on the memories of Americans?

[D]

Because I love the people. I loved the people. You see, when I came over with my great new modern operas, the critics pulled me to bits, as anybody does who doesn't understand. When we don't understand anything, what do we do? Well, we ignore it. Yes, we do. So the American women, the people of America, saw the beauty of my work, saw the beauty of those glorious offers. And they, from word of mouth, made my triumph in America. And that's why I love America.

[B]

How about your nervousness?

[D]

Oh, I had none. I'm much more nervous talking to you now. Much.

[B]

No kidding.

[D]

Oh, mercy. I had no nerves. I have never had nerves.

[B]

You mean the challenge was so great that you couldn't bother to be afraid?

[D]

Not a bit. And then I knew what I was doing. I was ready. Only people who are not ready that are nervous. When you're not ready with anything, you're nervous.

[C]

Well, it's very good to hear that bit of advice from as great a person and name as you, Mary Garden. Thank you very much and lots of luck on your tour. Men first, money and music. And we'll look forward to listening to you on Mary Margaret's show again next week. You're going to be on there for a second time. Text right here, a note from the wife of a top newspaper columnist, Mrs. Bob Considine, Millie Considine. She knows how you can get seats for one of the top hits on Broadway, the Alfred Lunt and Lynn Fontanne play I Know My Love to get good seats. Here's what you do. On January 12th, there'll be a benefit performance for the New York Heart Fund. Just send your check to the New York Heart Association, 45 East 47. That's the New York Heart Association, 45 East 47. The remaining orchestra seats are $25 and $15. Sounds like a lot, but the money is deductible. And with what you have to pay scalpers these days for good seats to hits, the seats are a bargain and the cause is a fine one. Thanks for the tip. Millie Considine. Now it's time to say that this is station wnbc, am and fm. 1 minute and 10 seconds before 9 o'.

[B]

Clock. You're telling time better. And now it's time for our next guest this morning, another chapter in the story of Claire Boothe Luce and this morning, Clare Luce.

[C]

We want to start off talking about your recent trip to Europe, and I know that you went to Rome and Paris. We're going to hear about that on Sunday at 12:30. But this morning, let's start with England and Winston Churchill. Didn't you see him when you were there?

[E]

Well, yes, I went down to Churchill's country home and saw him. And I wish to report to his fans that he was not wearing that zoot suit or whatever they call that zipper arrangement that he seems to have worn throughout the war. He was wearing a very elegant plaid tweed.

[C]

Wait a minute.

[E]

A plaid tweed? I mean, a slight tweed. You know, it was sort of yellowish tweed with red and brown stuff shot through it and a very nasty little bow tie and that enormous gold watch chain of his, you know, that looks like a hawser for the Queen Elizabeth that he wears strung across his little round front that is belonged to his father. He's very proud of that gold cable. And I thought he looked extremely well and in very good spirits.

[C]

Was he smoking a cigar as usual?

[E]

Well, yes, he was smoking a Cigarette as usual. At least he took his cigar out and rather waved it around in the air. I don't really remember whether he smoked it or not. He muttered something about not being able to or not being supposed to smoke as much as he used to smoke. But he had. He had that immemorial cigar with him all right.

[C]

With his painting also. While he was smoking and talking.

[E]

No, no, no, no. He and his charming wife gave me tea. And then afterwards he took me into the studio and showed me all his paintings. He's had them for years and years, you know. He practically won't part with any of them. Every now and then he gives one to a good friend. He gave me a little book, a little book that he'd written called Painting as a Hobby. And when he gave it to me, he advised me, he said it was his advice to every busy and well known person that they should have three hobbies. At least three hobbies in order to stay happy and cheerful and effective under the pressure of a public career. And he showed me all these wonderful paintings that he'd made. Some of them are darn good, you know.

[C]

Yes, I've seen them in Life magazines.

[E]

Yes. I mean, they're not all super duper. And perhaps he isn't a great master, but he's a very good painter. As a hobby, he does very well indeed with it. Did he tell you what his three hobbies are?

[C]

His two, besides painting?

[E]

Well, he didn't tell me, but I should certainly think that his new racehorse was a new hobby. And of course a very fruitful one. A profitable one, rather, in his case, because that. That horse has won half a dozen races since he bought it. And I remember the night before I came, he had. He and Lord Camrose had bet on the horse and the horse had won handsomely for each of them. I think camrose won almost 14 shillings. Well, perhaps Churchill did bet more than that, I don't know. So horse racing is one of them. And then of course, he's a writer, as you'll see. No, and that's a hobby. Well, that also is a very profitable and fruitful hobby, yes. I think he calls his career politics. And of course, he's 75 years old. He just had a birthday. Although why he should count his years when he has so many other things to count, I don't know.

[D]

But

[E]

he's now looking forward. And there are those in England who say with some assurance to coming back into power when the elections are held in the spring. Certainly the Conservatives have a far better chance this spring than anyone would have believed they could have last year. The Australian and New Zealand elections have shown that it is possible to repulse the rising tide of socialism. So that, of course, gives Churchill and the Conservatives great heart. Colonel.

[C]

Well, let's talk about the man that's told me more about you than about anybody else. He likes you as much as he does Churchill, and that's something. And, you know, I mean, Bernard Baruch.

[E]

Oh, Bernie is a wonderful, kind, generous man, isn't he? Well, he's been always giving me the best of advice. And, you know, now there is a man who understands, probably better than anyone who lived that I've ever known, the importance of loyalty to your friends. Sticking by the people that count, you know, always in his public career, in all these big jobs he's ever had when he was the head of the Atomic Commission or head of the War Industries Board or whatever he was given by the government to do, haven't you noticed the way he always insists on the men who work with him being given credit, and he insists that they be given the same respect and admiration and honor that he gets. Have you noticed that? Well, of course, that's his really endearing quality, that throughout the years his friends know that they can count on bm and that is, that's much more important than anything else about him, that he is a lovable and loyal person.

[C]

Well, does he give you advice also? Have you ever gone to him and asked him if you should run for Congress or if you should go to China or anything like that?

[E]

Well, when I see him, I always. He always asks me what I'm going to do do, and I tell him. And sometimes, sometimes I do ask his advice, and then he's likely to laugh and says, oh, well, I know you women, you're asking me what you should do, and I, of course, will tell you, and then you will go and do exactly what you want.

[C]

But that's the kind of advice he gives you.

[E]

No, he will, if he will always sit down and very honestly and straightforwardly give you the benefit of his advice. And then a very wonderful quality about him, and I may say I know several people that have this quality, and I think it is a splendid thing in a friend, if you have made a mistake, he never criticizes you for it. When you are upset about it. Later on, when you're no longer upset and no longer excited and no longer being criticized by other people, he will then say, now, let's discuss this little mistake, and he'll show you how you made it and where you made it and why you must never make such a mistake again. But he always takes your side when you are under fire. He always does that for all his friends when they're being criticized. They can't be criticized in his presence. He may criticize later on, but only when, so to speak, the heat is off.

[C]

And I think another wonderful quality about him is that he listens to whatever anybody has to say. He listens even though he doesn't hear very well. He listens to every word and hears that.

[E]

Oh, yes, he's a very good listener. Cousins. Devoted to you and. And texting.

[C]

Well, he likes text very much. I just get in under the wire. But I still have to get back to politics for just one last question.

[E]

Claire. Louise, and that is something that you

[C]

said about a surprise statement whether or not you were going to run for the Senate.

[E]

Who said that?

[C]

I just heard that someplace.

[E]

I won't say who. Ah, now, one of those. One of those rumors. Well, I tell you, if I make a statement about politics, it'd probably be just as much of a surprise to me as it will to everybody else. You mean you're still not saying whether

[C]

or not you will run for the Senate?

[E]

I'm still not saying what I haven't been saying and what I have been saying for something like three years now.

[C]

It sounds very much like another person

[E]

who has been saying no.

[C]

General Eisenhower.

[E]

Well, now, if I say no, that probably doesn't matter much one way or the other, but it would be a great pity if Americans couldn't look forward to the happy possibility of having Eisenhower as a presidential candidate, because I think he is a terrific character. I think he's a very fine man. I think he's a great vote getter, and I think he has a very fresh, open and liberal mind about politics. So if Eisenhower is saying no, all I can say is I hope he doesn't mean it.

[C]

Well, now, if Eisenhower should run for president, would you run for the Senate then?

[E]

What if there's no. There could be no possible connection between. Between those two. Although I can tell you, if Eisenhower were in the White House, it would be a pleasure to be in the Senate or anywhere within 100 miles of

[B]

Washington, D.C. well, Claire, we almost thought we had you with a headline there, but you slipped out again. But you won't keep slipping out because too many people are gunning for you to make you make up your mind and in the right way. But now, before we remind you once more about a very special Sunday program, a Reminder to all of you about your weekend shopping list. You know, on this program, we work as hard as we know how to persuade everybody in New York to shop carefully. Shop wisely for everything. Shop carefully for news, for candidates, for movies, for books, for ideas, and for food. Just as the Boy Scouts who began their two million dollar drive this week at the Dawn Patrol Breakfast have a very good motto, be prepared. So in 1950, all wives should have a motto, Shop carefully for everything. If we could just make everybody believe in that idea, shop carefully. We could take a month off like Al the Butterman and go to South America or China or some of the other places we'd like to see again. Because if everybody shopped carefully, then of course, everybody would wind up by buying Hotel Bar Butter, the best butter in town. Already, thousands of women have learned that there is a difference in butter, and it's the best is Hotel Bar Butter.

[C]

And that's why you'll find Hotel Bar Butter selling in six times more stores than the next nearest brand.

[B]

That's right. Without any help from us, Hotel Bar Butter has made friends in more than 6,000 of the 20,000 grocery stores in and around New York.

[C]

The next nearest brand only scores a little more than a thousand, but six

[B]

thousand is not enough. We'd like all of you to help us get Hotel Bar butter into all 20,000 of those independent groceries stores. Al the Butterman has done his part. He puts up the best butter in town and he backs it with a guarantee, a money back guarantee that you will be happy with Hotel Bar Butter.

[C]

All you have to do to help us raise the score from 6 to 20,000 is to ask for it by name. Hotel Bar Butter.

[B]

Shop carefully. Shop wisely. And now, so long until Sunday at 12:30, when our guest will be once more, Claire Booth Luce. Portions of this program were transcribed.

[A]

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[B]

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