From First America: "Merciless Indian Savages"

Summary

Podcast Summary

Podcast: HISTORY This Week
Episode: From First America: "Merciless Indian Savages"
Air Date: July 16, 2026
Host: Rebecca Nagle (with contributions from Nick Estes, Ned Blackhawk, and others)

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Main Theme

This episode explores how Indigenous peoples and conflicts over their land were central—not peripheral—to the founding of the United States. The show challenges the standard narrative of the American Revolution, highlighting that the desire for Indigenous land fueled not only settlers’ grievances against Britain but also provided a foundation for American identity and policy. The phrase “merciless Indian savages” in the Declaration of Independence is critically examined as a window into America’s origins and the ongoing erasure of Native histories.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Revisiting American Origins

• The narrative begins with a visit to Fort Snelling, Minnesota—an historic and traumatic Indigenous site—establishing a modern parallel to the ongoing marginalization of Native people.
• Host Rebecca Nagle is joined by Nick Estes (Lower Brule Sioux Tribe; Univ. of Minnesota history professor), who explains Fort Snelling’s dark past and its erasure from mainstream American memory.
  • Quote: “This is a sacred site for Dakota people which was later appropriated by the US Military to build their fort.” — Nick Estes (05:19)

2. Memory, Trauma, and Erasure

• The fort is a “perfect metaphor” for America’s treatment of Indigenous history: physical sites are present, but their realities are ignored or glossed over.
• The episode moves from field trips and skiing at the fort to the hidden presence of a memorial for those who suffered there.
  • Quote: “Do you think most people who come to this spot...come here to honor the atrocity that happened here?” — Host (07:52)
  • Quote: “No. They're doing winter sports, recreation. I mean, you can see right here, you can see these parallel tracks. People cross country ski through this area.” — Nick Estes (07:59)

3. Historic and Contemporary Violence

• The show draws direct lines between historical campaigns to remove and destroy Indigenous communities and present-day government actions (e.g., ICE raids).
  • Quote: “150 years ago, they were hunting us down to kill us. And now they're hunting down immigrants to deport them.” — Nick Estes (14:34)
• Nagle’s reporting is interrupted by news of ICE violence—underscoring the persistence of state violence and displacement.
• Local protestors at Fort Snelling draw parallels between Holocaust history, Indigenous genocide, and ICE actions.
  • Quote: “Silence is what allowed this to happen in the Second World War.” — Protestor (11:44)

4. The Declaration of Independence & Indigenous People

• The Declaration of Independence explicitly references Native Americans as “merciless Indian savages,” a foundational but often ignored section.
  • Quote: “There’s a racial slur in the Declaration of Independence. Native people are called savages.” — Rebecca Nagle (22:24)
• Nagle challenges the conventional telling of the Revolution—no longer just about taxes and liberty, but also about the colonists’ hunger for Native land.
• Public readings and reenactments repeat the sanitized story; the “real anger” of the founders was toward Indigenous resistance to colonization.

5. Expert Interview: Ned Blackhawk (Yale Historian; Western Shoshone)

• Blackhawk explains the global context of the Revolution, focusing on the Seven Years’ War and the consequences when Britain tried to broker peace with Indigenous groups (Pontiac’s Rebellion).
  • Peace required Britain to restrict colonial expansion, infuriating colonists who wanted new land.
  • Quote: “Land mania, we might say, overwhelms the colonial system. Gentry leaders understood that their lands were becoming increasingly less valuable.” — Ned Blackhawk (29:34)
• The king’s “proclamation line” (1763) tried to limit settler expansion, paving the way for colonial rebellion.
• The “Black Boys” militia attacked British convoys—considered by Blackhawk the real start of revolutionary violence—specifically to block peace with Native nations.
  • Quote: “The first shots of the American revolution are fired in March of 1765 when one of these backcountry militia groups known as the Black Boys attacks a British force escorting trade goods to Pontiac.” — Ned Blackhawk (31:33)
  • Quote: “The Black Boys create an anthem and that anthem calls native peoples the enemies of mankind.” — Ned Blackhawk (32:19)

6. Erasure from Textbooks and National Memory

• Blackhawk reflects on why this anti-Indigenous foundation is omitted from U.S. history education.
  • Quote: “To my knowledge, that Black Boys history that we’ve been discussing has yet to appear in any US history textbook. Why we can’t tell that story is a mystery to me.” — Ned Blackhawk (34:16)
• The shot glass bearing the Declaration’s text becomes a metaphor for how history is “easily digestible”—the hard truths omitted.
  • Quote: “The Declaration...does also have this darker history to it.” — Ned Blackhawk (35:05)

7. Connecting Past and Present: The Roots of American Authoritarianism

• Nagle concludes that understanding America's true origins—including the violence and dispossession of Indigenous people—explains how present-day injustices are not new or un-American, but rooted in American history.
  • Quote: “We don’t need to leave the United States to understand the horrors of authoritarianism. It’s right here in our own history.” — Rebecca Nagle (37:00)
• Without reckoning with this truth, “the story of America is wrong.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Visiting the Memorial at Fort Snelling:

"It's like a camp circle, but in the center, it looks like there's prayer ties, sage, tobacco, etc. wrapped in cloth... I'm assuming it's the descendants of those who experienced that genocide."
— Nick Estes (06:28–06:48)

On Colonists’ Real Motive:

“Before the colonists are willing to die for lofty ideals like freedom and liberty and independence, they are willing to die to stop the Crown from making peace with indigenous nations.”
— Host (31:58)

On the Need for Historical Reckoning:

“If we don’t understand the full context in which our nation was founded, we won’t understand the full context in which our nation now finds itself.”
— Ned Blackhawk (35:40)

On the Omission of Indigenous Stories:

“What’s missing from the story of America is the truth. I want us to know how we got here. Because without that, we will never find our way out.”
— Rebecca Nagle (37:26)

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• Visit to Fort Snelling, Dakota memorial, historic erasure: 04:35–08:57
• ICE violence and its parallels to 19th-century genocide: 09:01–14:54
• The Declaration of Independence and “merciless Indian savages”: 21:40–23:23
• Global context: Seven Years’ War and Pontiac’s uprising: 24:27–29:22
• Black Boys militia and first shots of “Revolution”: 31:33–32:44
• Reflections on American memory, textbooks, and the real story: 34:16–37:00

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Tone & Style

The episode is investigative and reflective, interweaving historical storytelling, field interviews, and personal insight. The tone is earnest, urgent, and at times somber, staying true to the voices of Indigenous scholars and survivors.

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Final Thought

This episode reframes the American origin myth: The American Revolution was not simply about taxes or liberty, but was deeply entangled with colonial hunger for Indigenous land and the policies—explicit and violent—that continue to echo in modern American society. Understanding and confronting these origins is crucial to reckoning with ongoing injustices and moving toward a more honest national identity.

Transcript

[Rebecca Nagle]

If you could travel back through history, there are a few luxuries you'd probably miss. Electric light, indoor plumbing, air conditioning. And somewhere on that list, the ability to control the temperature of your bed. Because for most of human history, if it was too hot to sleep. Too bad. Today we have a different problem. The stress, the screen time, the just one more headline spiral. It all raises your core body temperature. And a body that's too warm cannot get into a deep sleep. You're not just tired because the news is exhausting. You're tired because your body never actually recovered. The good news, and yes, there always is some, is that science has a real answer. And it's simpler than you'd think. Your bed temperature. Enter Chilipad 2.0 by SleepMe, the water based mattress topper that actively controls your bed temperature from 55 to 115 degrees all night long. No new mattress, no renovation.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

It's.

[Rebecca Nagle]

It fits over what you already have. And water is the key. Fans just move hot air around. Chilipad uses actively chilled water to cool the bed, actually pulling heat away from your body. It's the difference between standing in front of a fan and jumping into a cold pool. If you told someone a hundred years ago or 1,000 years ago that one day you'd be able to dial in the exact temperature of your bed every night, it would have sounded like science fiction. The new Chilipad 2.0 comes with a redesigned dock that's quieter than ever, a washable performance grade cover with waterproof protection, and my favorite feature, the nightstand remote. It detects when you get into bed and automatically starts your sleep schedule. You get in, it kicks on. Visit www.sleep.mehistory to get up to $255 off your Chilipad 2.0 with code HISTORY. HISTORY. That's www.sleep s l e e p.mehistory. free shipping, free returns, and a 30 night trial so you can test it out. Dream big and wake up better. The headlines will still be there in the morning. You might as well wake up ready for them.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Evening.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Buyer's remorse. Buy a new car.

[Rebecca Nagle]

I'll be moving in.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Let's get started.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Sorry, I think there's been a mistake. I. I bought it from Carvana.

[Rebecca Nagle]

You what? Yeah.

[Nick Estes]

Great price.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I even have seven days to love it or return it. So there's no. No, no buyer's remorse. More like buyers rejoice.

[Rebecca Nagle]

I guess I'll let myself out.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Congratulations.

[Rebecca Nagle]

I mean it.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Buyers rejoice. Buy your car today on Carvana. Limitations and exclusions may apply. See our seven day return [e-mail] if

[Narrator/Announcer]

you are a listener of history this week, you know that we examine the moments and decisions that have shaped not only history, but our perspectives on the world. There is a new podcast called First America that does something similar, focusing specifically on how the country's founders treatment of indigenous nations and their resistance shaped US democracy. As the United States reaches the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence, First America asks a deceptively simple what if the story we've been told about the American Revolution is incomplete? We've learned that the revolution was fought over taxation and representation. But when you actually read the Declaration, the last grievance is about Native people. He has excited the merciless Indian savages. It reads, whose known rule of warfare is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions. Why have Indigenous people been pushed to the margins of the American origin story when they were so central to it? Alongside leading Native historians, First America host Rebecca Nagle, an Indigenous author and the former host of Crooked's this Land podcast, looks at the real story of why the colonists rebelled, what kind of government they created, and crucially, how the forces that shaped America 250 years ago are still shaping it today. Here's episode one, where Rebecca sits down with historian Ned Blackhawk, Western Shoshone, to talk about how hunger for indigenous land drove the Revolution. You can find more episodes of First America wherever you get podcasts.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Where do you want us to park? Should we park right here?

[Nick Estes]

I think you have to park in here.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

The fort is that way.

[Nick Estes]

Yeah, the fort's that way.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

On a cold day in January, I visited Fort Snelling in Minneapolis. I was there with my friend Nick Estas. He's a history professor at the University of Minnesota and a citizen of the Lower Burl Sioux tribe.

[Nick Estes]

This is the historic Fort Snelling. Going to walk closer to it.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Can you just describe what the fort looks like?

[Nick Estes]

Well, the fort has a guard tower and then there's a wall that surrounds the entire fort. There's a series next to the historic

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

buildings are modern day trash cans. To let you know this is a tourist attraction. School kids come here on field trips.

[Nick Estes]

This is a sacred site for Dakota people which was later appropriated by the US Military to build their fort. So look at that bald eagle. Told you we were going to see one.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Yeah.

[Nick Estes]

I wish the United States never appropriated the eagle. Do you hear him?

[Narrator/Announcer]

Look at him.

[Nick Estes]

He's coming right towards us. I mean, I don't know, man. I don't know how you can't believe in the power of this stuff because those things happen for a reason. Told you we were going to see one.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

The history of what happened at Fort Snelling is significant to the Dakota people, and that history is acknowledged at the site. But you have to go and find it.

[Nick Estes]

There's like a healing site right over here.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

It's next to an underpass, down a long set of stairs on the edge of the woods. Can you describe what the memorial looks like?

[Rebecca Nagle]

Yeah.

[Nick Estes]

So it's like a camp circle, but in the center, it looks like there's prayer ties, sage, tobacco, etc. Wrapped in cloth. And there are also prayer ties in the trees that surround us.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Who do you think left the prayer ties in the trees?

[Nick Estes]

I'm assuming it's the descendants of those who experienced that genocide.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Over 1600 Dakota people were held here during the winter of 1862.

[Nick Estes]

This is the area actually where the concentration camp was actually at Dakota. People, people who dared to stand up to the United States were put into a concentration camp, and all kinds of atrocities happened.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

The concentration camp was just one part of a broader campaign to expel all Dakota people from the state of Minnesota. The campaign also included death marches, massacres, bounties placed on indigenous heads, open air prisons, and mass executions.

[Nick Estes]

There was a lot of malnutrition, purposeful starvation. There were reports of women being raped and violated. You know, it's a site of horrors.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Do you think most people who come to this spot, do you think that they come here to honor the atrocity that happened here?

[Nick Estes]

No. They're doing winter sports, recreation. I mean, you can see right here, you can see these parallel tracks. People cross country ski through this area.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

While we were standing there, some hikers walked by.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Hi.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Walking around Fort Snelling with Nick, it felt like this perfect metaphor for our country, all our terrible history. It's there. We just don't know how to talk about it. This all started as a conversation between Nick and me about four years ago. We were frustrated. Well, I was pissed at how native people are erased from the story of America. We wanted to tell the history of the United States with native people written back in. I wanted to correct the record. I should just go up here.

[Nick Estes]

Ooh.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Oh.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Okay.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I need a birch. When we were in the car, Nick's phone rang.

[Nick Estes]

I'm gonna. My wife called me. Somebody got shot.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

He pulled up the news on his

[Nick Estes]

phone breaking witnesses report a woman was shot in the face by ice while trying to flee in central Minneapolis earlier

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

that Day, a woman named Renee Nicole Good had tried to block ICE agents with her car. An agent had just shot and killed her.

[Nick Estes]

Damn. The photos are really bad.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Oh, God.

[Nick Estes]

It looks like a deployed airbag. It was just covered in blood.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

We parked and watched the video.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Wow.

[Nick Estes]

Wow.

[Ned Blackhawk]

That's awful.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

That's awful. When I was in Minneapolis last January, thousands of ICE agents were on the ground.

[Nick Estes]

It's in, like, a residential neighborhood.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Federal agents had been rounding people up, including children, and sending them to detention facilities. People were afraid to leave their homes. Parents stopped sending their kids to school. It's interesting, given what we were talking about this morning, of the history of Dakota. People being rounded up and violently forced out of Minnesota. When I started this project, I thought I was making a history podcast. I read books, I interviewed historians. I went to important sites. I traveled across the country. But then this thing kept happening. I would be in a place learning about America's past, and then the same thing would happen right here in our present. You're listening to First America, the true story of how the United States came to be and how our current political moment is 250 years in the making. From Pushkin Industries and Critical Frequency, I'm your host, Rebecca Nagle. Gohin Daoudong. Jalecayetli Quein la citizen of Cherokee Nation. I didn't go to Minneapolis to report on ice. I had come to interview Nick. We just happened to be at Fort Snelling the day ICE shot and killed Renee. Good. I don't know about you, but I don't believe in coincidences. I canceled my flight home and stayed to report on what was happening. The next morning, there was a protest back at Fort Snelling. I go home. I go home. Because Fort Snelling is also the site of ICE's headquarters in Minneapolis. I was curious why you guys came today. Cause, I mean, you know, someone was literally killed yesterday for standing up to ice. So is it scary? Is it scary to be here today, knowing the violence? Yes, it's scary. And I'm angry. And the anger overcomes the fear. I have a good friend, and she lived in Denmark during the German occupation. And she has told me over and over again, you cannot be quiet. You must stand up. Because silence is what allowed this to happen in the Second World War. How far are we from the historic Fort Sutton?

[Nick Estes]

Just right across Highway 62 here.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And do you know what happened there? Oh, no, no. Don't ask me those kinds of questions. I'm not good with history. It's a historic Fort it's historic.

[Nick Estes]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Sorry to put you on the spot. I mean, the reason this is all happening here is because of the ICE offices that are there, not because of the historic fort, but. And the 1860s is actually a concentration camp for Dakota people. Oh. I'm just curious if any of that history feels relevant to what's happening now. Yes, clearly. You know, but, I mean, our state. I mean, just. I. Yeah, I mean, what's. I mean, you watched that video. Thank God that person was there taking the video on their cell phone yesterday so everyone can see what happened.

[Narrator/Announcer]

You know,

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

after leaving the protest, I went back to see Nick Estes at his office.

[Nick Estes]

The murder of Renee Goode and the history of Fort Snelling are actually inseparable. First of all, ICE is headquartered on the Fort Snelling area campus.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Do you know if that's because it's federal land?

[Nick Estes]

Yeah, it's headquartered there because it's federal land.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And why is it federal land?

[Nick Estes]

It's federal land because it was once a military reservation from the Zebulun pike treaty of 1805. And that was a treaty signed between some Dakota leaders and the United States government to create a military outpost.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

It's not just the same place. The same thing is happening.

[Nick Estes]

People are being hunted in their neighborhoods and their schools. Places that were considered sanctuary sites, such as hospitals and churches are no longer off limits. 150 years ago, they were hunting us down to kill us. And now they're hunting down immigrants to deport them.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

While I was out reporting this project, a lot happened. ICE killed people in the streets. I watched a kid and bunny ears get detained. Our government abducted the leader of Venezuela and started a war with Iran. Analysts kept talking about the stages of authoritarianism. And I found myself asking this question. I think a lot of people are asking, how is this happening? How is all this happening in the United States? The answers. I kept hearing YouTube. Lonely white men. The economy didn't feel like enough. I started to wonder if maybe the explanation was deeper than all that, Deeper than anything going on right now. I'm still trying to figure it out, but the more time I spend in the past, the more the present makes sense. Maybe the answer is is in that history we don't know how to talk about.

[Rebecca Nagle]

A little look behind the scenes. Producing history. This week some weeks eats my whole schedule. And Instacart is how I survive it. It connects you with thousands of stores, and as fast as 30 minutes, you can have quality groceries delivered right to your door. Last week is a perfect example I was locked in on sound design, headphones on, mixing some music under a scene, finding finally in the zone when everything clicks that flow state and the last thing you want to do is break the spell. Problem was, my fridge was basically empty and I hadn't eaten all day. But instead of stopping to run to the store, I opened Instacart. Picked out fresh produce, cold brew, real dinner for the night. Kept working, never took the headphones off, and a little while later, it was all at my door. Quality I'd have picked myself. No hours lost. If I can get time back to focus on what matters. Working on a show like this, that's a game changer. Instacart brings convenience, quality and ease right to your door so you can focus on what matters most. Download the Instacart app now and get groceries just how you like.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Hey there, it's Jill Schlesinger. I'm launching a new show. It's called Money Moves, and your money

[Rebecca Nagle]

is going to move.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

We're gonna help you make better financial decisions. We're gonna call out the B.S. you're finding all over social media. We're gonna give you actionable guidance to make your financial life clearer, less stressful. We're gonna answer your financial questions and take the mystery out of your financial life. Follow and listen to Money Moves with Jill Schlesinger. Wherever you get your podcasts ready to experience something new? Alltrails helps you find your next hike, whether you're looking for something nearby or planning a trip. Read reviews from real people like you to choose your trail and know what to expect. You can also download the map in case service gets spotty. Plan and experience your next hike with AllTrails, the app for exploring the outdoors. Download it today and find your outside. The first place I went on my quest to put native people back in the story of America was the Declaration of Independence. This year is the 250th anniversary of the signing of that famous document, and it made sense to me as a starting place. I mean, it's the most popular origin story of our country, right? But it turns out what I thought I knew about the Declaration was wrong. Native people aren't missing. We're there. We're one of the most important lines in the document, but somehow no one knows about it. When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another. A couple of summers ago, on a hot July day, this man in a large coat and a feathered hat walked up A small set of stairs surrounded by Revolutionary War reenactors, bayonets, and the twin speakers of the park service's PA system, he began reading the Declaration of Independence. We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. At the time of the document's creation, a lot of people were illiterate and printing stuff was slow and expensive. So word spread through public readings like this one. The history of the present king of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries in Houston. I think of the Declaration of Independence like a breakup letter. Our founders are breaking up with George iii, King of England. And the Declaration is at part of every breakup, or at least every bad breakup, where you tell the other person everything they did wrong. If Thomas Jefferson and King George were having it out on the front lawn, Jefferson would have his finger in Georgia's face yelling, and another thing, for imposing taxes on us without our consent. And so the Declaration is basically this long list of complaints. He has plundered our sea, and that list has an order ravaged our coast. It starts with smaller grievances, burnt our towns, and ends with the biggest ones and destroyed the lives of our people. People. We've been told the American Revolution was fought over taxes and representation. But the last complaint, the thing our founders were most angry about, goes like this. He has endeavored to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers the merciless Indian savages. There's a racial slur in the Declaration of Independence. Native people are called savages. Alongside those lofty ideals, our founders included, their deep hatred for indigenous people. The merciless Indian savages, whose no rule of warfare is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes, and conditions. In case you need a refresher, the popular story of the American Revolution goes like this. Britain unjustly imposed taxes on the colonists, and they got mad. But every time they protested, like when they threw tea into the Boston harbor, the king just imposed harsher laws. The colonists started to see their king as a tyrant. Some started talking about independence. Late one night, Paul Revere rode his horse to warn militias waiting outside Boston that the British were coming. The next morning, the militia squared off against the Brits, and the Revolutionary War began. America began. A year later, our Founding fathers gathered in Philadelphia to write the Declaration of Independence. But for two and a half centuries, that document has been telling a different story. According to our founders, in their own words, what they were most angry about was Indians. How did we all miss that? Can you please introduce yourself?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Hi, I'm Ned Blackhawk.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I went to Connecticut to find out. And what's your tribal affiliation?

[Ned Blackhawk]

I'm Western Shoshone.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And what do you do, Ned?

[Ned Blackhawk]

I teach history.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Where?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Yale University. I was the first tenured American Indian to teach at Yale.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Wait, I just kind of want to back up, like, in the entire history of Yale. You're the first native person to get tenure here?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Yes. And I'm still the first. Still the only tenured faculty member. Yes.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Is it ever lonely? Ned wears a long ponytail and the kind of sweater you imagine a professor would wear. Ned and I have been talking about this history for years. He, along with Nick Estes and some other indigenous scholars, helped shape the idea for this podcast. I wanted Ned to tell me the story of why the founders hated indigenous people so much they put it in the Declaration of Independence. Ned says that story starts a couple decades earlier with this big, big war. Was it kind of like World War zero?

[Rebecca Nagle]

No.

[Ned Blackhawk]

It is the first World War.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

It started as a fight over who would control North America, and it eventually covered the globe. Great Britain won, and they got a bunch of land from France. This land spans from Canada to the Gulf of Mexico and from present day New York to Minnesota. The colonists are thrilled.

[Ned Blackhawk]

All across British North America, colonists are rejoicing. Sermons are being offered in Sunday's pamphlets and almanacs are being written about land possibilities in the interior. And there's this kind of growing sense of shared kind of euphoria that the British government and the British Empire are not just the largest in world history, but also the most virtuous and or free.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Those celebrations come to a halt in the summer of 1763, when news spreads of an indigenous uprising. The land England took over from France is still controlled by indigenous nations. What England actually wins in the war in real terms IS forts. About 13 forts stationed around the Great Lakes. As a new Fort Boston town. England thinks it can push native nations around.

[Ned Blackhawk]

They don't listen to the native peoples. They don't trade with them adequately.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And that angers indigenous leaders. An Odawa chief named Pontiac forms a multinational indigenous military alliance to push back. But could you just tell me a little bit more about who Pontiac is?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Pontiac is an Odawa leader, and he's fallen into close affinity with a preacher who's Delaware or Lenape, named Neolin. Neolin is the Delaware prophet. Pontiac is the political leader. And together they start articulating a vision for the future that is Transformative. They decide that they no longer want their followers to rely upon the goods of Europeans. And it's a process kind of similar to what the colonists are going through. Because once they start reimagining themselves in these ways, they decide that they're going to drive the English out.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Pontiac and his soldiers go around and attack British forts. One of those attacks was particularly brilliant. Some Anishinaabe warriors go to this fort in northern Michigan, as they often did, to trade. But while they're there, they pretend to play a game of lacrosse right outside the fort.

[Ned Blackhawk]

And one ball makes it over the fence. And so they ask if they could kind of get their ball returned. And so the fort officials are opening the doors to return the ball that's been taken and flood of warriors would come in and destroy the fort.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Pontiac's military alliance attacks forts all over the Great Lakes region. Remember, England took over about 1340s forts, while Pontiac and his alliance destroy eight.

[Ned Blackhawk]

They signal to the English that peace is going to be more costly than war has been for you.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And another costly war for the Crown is a big problem. England is broke. Like broke broke. That global war England spent almost a decade fighting, it was expensive. The Crown doesn't want to pay for another one.

[Ned Blackhawk]

And they decide, okay, we'll make peace with Pontiac.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And why would the King do that? Because like England is a global empire. So why wouldn't the King of England want more land in North America?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Have you ever been to India?

[Rebecca Nagle]

No.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Have you heard of the Caribbean?

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Yes.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Okay. The English Crown governs millions of people around the world. The British colonists in North America are a small percentage of that. The overwhelming economic priorities that the British Empire has in the Western hemisphere revolve around places like Jamaica and Barbados, not Virginia or Massachusetts.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Is that because Barbados makes the Crown more money?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Correct, because Barbados produces large quantities of slave produced alcohol and sugar that can be consumed across the British Empire.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

So in the interests of Britain, this global empire, peace with indigenous nations makes the most sense. It saves the Crown money. It serves the Crown's interests to preserve peace. The King of England gives Pontiac and his confederacy what they want.

[Ned Blackhawk]

The proclamation line of October 1763 draws this perimeter along the crests of the Appalachian mountains.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

The Crown promises to keep settlers off their land.

[Ned Blackhawk]

So everything east is British North America. Everything to the west is to be reserved for the Indians.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

While peace with indigenous nations serves the Crown's global interests. It angers the colonists because it takes from them what they want most. More land.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Land mania, we might say, overwhelms the colonial system. Gentry leaders, people like George Washington understood that their lands were becoming increasingly less valuable. People like Washington and commanding their enslaved populations to help bring nutrient rich soils from the bottom of riverbeds.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Because the fields are so depleted.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Because the fields have become so depleted.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

People like George Washington made money from this thing called land speculation. They'd buy up land that still belonged to indigenous nations to sell for profit. Once indigenous people were pushed out the the king's new boundary, it messed up their whole scheme. The boundary line angered regular and poor people too. People who couldn't afford to buy private property often squatted on indigenous land. Pioneers, frontiersmen, settlers, whatever you want to call them, were already living west of the king's line.

[Ned Blackhawk]

And there are numbers of settlers who are forced back east and they don't like it.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

And there's this other thing about the King's concession to Pontiac. The colonists don't like peace. You have to understand that the colonists have been at war with indigenous nations for most of their lives. And now the King wants to make peace with their enemies.

[Ned Blackhawk]

In fact, the British are going to give them ammunition, they're going to trade with them, they're going to recognize them. Hey, wait a minute. Didn't we just fight with you to control this world?

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

To help cement peace with Pontiac, England arranges to bring gifts, gifts and supplies. This was how diplomacy between indigenous nations and European powers worked back then.

[Ned Blackhawk]

80 supplies of mule trains are coming. Massive actually logistical undertaking if you think about it. At Pittsburgh awaits these traitors who are going to take these goods to Pontiac's confederate.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

The colonists organize a militia, basically a band of angry white men with guns and attack the convoy.

[Ned Blackhawk]

The first shots of the American revolution are fired in March of 1765 when one of these back country militia groups known as the black boys attacks a British force escorting trade goods to Pontiac.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

They're not attacking indigenous people. The black boys are attacking British troops.

[Ned Blackhawk]

They say things like we are willing to die to disrupt and destroy these relationships.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

So before the colonists are willing to die for lofty ideals like freedom and liberty and independence, they are willing to die to stop the Crown from making peace with indigenous nations. And we know why they are willing to die for this cause, because they wrote a song about it.

[Ned Blackhawk]

The black boys create an anthem and that anthem calls native peoples the enemies of mankind.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I asked Ned to read part of it for me.

[Ned Blackhawk]

On March 5 in 65, their Indian presence did arrive. But when this property is designed to serve the enemy of mankind, it's high treason. In the Amount.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

What does that line mean?

[Ned Blackhawk]

It means that the British trading policies of supplying native peoples are supporting the enemies of not just settler society, but mankind more broadly. That Britain is committing treason not to the Crown, but to humanity as a whole. And so this vision of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for mankind, the first time mankind is being articulated that I'm aware of, is in deeply anti indigenous settings.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Hating indigenous people. Seeing us as less than human helps the colonists come together and form a unified identity. It helped them come together to fight for independence.

[Ned Blackhawk]

I do believe the start of the fall of the British Empire in North America began on the Pennsylvania frontier. The sense of lawlessness or essentially fashioning one's own self governing principles and practices. This is happening before in Pennsylvania, before it's happening in Massachusetts.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

We teach the origins of the American Revolution as this drumbeat of violence and protest happening in Boston over Texas. But years before any of that, colonists are firing guns at British troops over native land.

[Ned Blackhawk]

And to my knowledge, that black boy's history that we've been discussing has yet to appear in any US history textbook. Why we can't tell that story is a mystery to me.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Before I left Yale, I gave Ned a present.

[Ned Blackhawk]

You want me to open this?

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

You may or may not want it.

[Ned Blackhawk]

Declaration of Independence shot glass. Thank you so much.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

What does it say?

[Ned Blackhawk]

We the people.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

What to you does that shot glass represent? If we think about how Americans think about their history,

[Ned Blackhawk]

I wanted to say something that is easily digestible,

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

goes down smooth.

[Ned Blackhawk]

I think we as a country are losing a real sense of understanding about our nation's past. The Declaration, which is full of these beautifully rendered sentences and paragraphs about Enlightenment ideals, does also have this darker history to it.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Why is it important for the darker part of the Declaration of Independence and the American Revolution, why is it important that Americans know about it?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Well, if we don't understand the full context in which our nation was founded, we won't understand the full context in which our nation now finds itself.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I'm mad that native people have been written out of the story of the Revolution, but I'm also baffled by it. I mean, it's kind of wild, right? It's not like you have to dig through the archives to find out that hunger for indigenous land drove the Revolution. It's right there in the Declaration of Independence, in one of our country's most famous documents, in one of the most famous documents in all of human history, but somehow no one knows about. Feels like a magic trick, like making a rabbit disappear into a hat and When I started this project, that's what I thought. I was up against the pervasive and systemic erasure of Native people from US History. I thought the thing people couldn't see was me, my community. And then I started to realize what's missing from the story of America. It's bigger than that. After I left Minneapolis, I kept hearing politicians say the same thing. What is happening right now in America is fundamentally un American.

[Ned Blackhawk]

This is just so un American.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I understand where this comes from. It comes from the part of the Declaration of Independence we were taught the all men are created equal, life, liberty and happiness part. But when we tell the whole story, the truth of how and why our country was founded, the present moment doesn't feel like a contradiction. Violently rounding people up, putting people in detention, even shooting anyone who gets in the way. Our government has done this before. Not once, not twice. Many times. We just don't talk about that history because it happened to indigenous people. I keep hearing people go to Nazi Germany or Putin's Russia to try and understand the rise of fascism. We don't need to leave the United States to understand the horrors of authoritarianism. It's right here in our own history. And if we want to root that authoritarianism out, we have to know where and how it started. If we think we can win by defeating one leader, it will be like pruning a weed. It will only come back stronger. I thought what was missing from the story of America was Native people. But then I realized without us, that story is wrong. What's missing from the story of America is the truth. I want us to know how we got here. Because without that, we will never find our way out. Coming up on this season of First America. Are you guys big Chiefs fans?

[Rebecca Nagle]

Hell, yeah. Yes.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

Chiefs on three.

[Ned Blackhawk]

One, two, three. Chief.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I feel like that's going to happen a lot. Do Native Americans still exist?

[Ned Blackhawk]

Maybe.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

I don't really think so.

[Ned Blackhawk]

So the entire plan for funding the federal government was acquiring indigenous land and selling it. You were running for your lives, and you saw behind you everything you knew being burned down.

[Host/Interviewer (possibly Brendan Baker or a generic host)]

What democracy rounds an inclined entire ethnic group up at gunpoint and puts them into a concentration camp? Like, not a strong democracy, not a durable democracy. I would say not even a democracy. It's not. It's not a new thing. This is what we've done. We're good at this. If you like what you're hearing, please leave a review. It's one of the best ways to help listeners find this show. You. You can also support First America. By subscribing or sharing episodes with your friends. First America was made possible by the generous support of the Henry Luce foundation and the NYU Yale American Indian Sovereignty Project. Additional support came from Indian Collective, First Nations Development Institute, Yahavia Tom of San Manuel Nation Borealis Philanthropy and Black Liberation Indigenous Sovereignty Collective. Our Our fiscal sponsor is Red Media. I dreamed this project into the world in collaboration with an amazing group of Indigenous scholars including Maggie Blackhawk, Fond du Lac Ojibwe Ned Blackhawk, citizen of the Timok Tribe of Western Shoshone Phil Deloria, descendant of the Standing Rock and Yankton Sioux tribes and Nick Estes, citizen of the Lower Brule Sioux Tribe. I Rebecca Nagle, citizen of Cherokee Nation, also reported, wrote, hosted and executive produced the show. First America is produced by Critical Frequency and distributed by Pushkin Industries. Our managing producer is Amy Westervelt. Senior producer and Sound designer is Brendan Baker. Our story editor is Audrey Quinn. Jules Bradley, Kim Naderve Petersa and Jordan Gas Poor are our producers. Our editorial consultant is Connie Walker, citizen of the Onese First Nation. Fact checking by Naomi Barr. Our partnership's director is Lindsey Crowder. Our theme song is by Raven Chukan, who is Danae scoring by Laura Ortman, citizen of the White Mountain Apache Tribe and Raven Chacon. Artwork by Kelly Gonzalez, citizen of Cherokee Nation. The team at Pushkin is Greta Cohn, CEO Eric Sandler, Chief Strategy Officer Grace Ross, VP of Business Development Morgan Ratner, Director of Marketing Owen Miller, Content Delivery Associate Kyra Posey, Creative partnerships manager Jordan McMillan, social media manager Brian Strabinik, Senior Analytics Manager and Jake Flanagan, Production Counsel.

[Narrator/Announcer]

That was the first episode from the new podcast First America. Find more episodes of First America wherever you get podcasts.