Podcast
Independence by Design™
Hosted by Ryan Tansom · EN
Independence by Design™ is a framework to help owner-operators get out of the weeds and lead from the boardroom.
I built it because I lived this trap. In 2009, I joined my dad in our $21M family business. We turned it around and sold it for eight figures in 2014 — enough to pay off debt, cover taxes, let my dad retire, and leave me with a chunk of cash at 27.
But the sale gutted our team, systems, and identity. It looked like a win, but it didn’t feel like freedom. I bawled in the driveway.
After 450+ interviews, thousands of owners, and multiple ventures, I saw the real issue: we didn’t know the difference between being owners and operators. Our goals weren’t aligned. And we had no framework to guide us.
That’s why I built iBD — to help owners avoid regret, reclaim their time, grow real equity value, and build a business that gives them freedom — whether they stay, scale, or sell.
This show is the one I wish I had.
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This co-hosted episode features Kim Clark, iBD's Chief Revenue Officer and Ryan's regular co-host on the podcast. Before joining iBD, Kim spent years at ITR Economics, bringing deep expertise in economic forecasting and revenue operations—insights that shape much of the discussion throughout the show.
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#504: How to Tell Which Revenue Line Is Actually Making You Money
2d ago00:52:13Tap to summarizeOne of your revenue lines looks incredible on paper. Another looks barely worth doing. Before you act on either, somebody has to answer what it actually costs to deliver each one, and in most companies nobody has. Kim and I are opening Module 6, Transferable Margins, with Milestone 16, and the honest version of this milestone is not a spreadsheet. It's an agreement. I told the story of my family's copier company, where we ran four divisions and every one of them lied to us in a different direction. The sales reps' entire salary sat in equipment cost of goods, so print looked healthy because it had no salespeople in it. We couldn't sell print without them. IT services looked fantastic because the whole industry parked that payroll in overhead. Document management looked like 95 percent margins until you counted the years of service behind the sale. We had no visibility into what we should do more of and why. Kim brings the revenue seat to it: her rates of change, the monthly margin-by-customer review, and the annual audit she calls losing the losers. Start with the benchmark. Then ask what your competitors put inside it.Top 10 Takeaways Predictable revenue tells you what's coming in. Margins tell you whether it becomes wealth. You can't choose what to sell more of until you agree what delivery actually costs. Transferable margins means each line runs without you, at the margin your goals require. Revenue is the CRO's number. Gross profit and gross margin belong to the COO. A line looks profitable when its real costs are sitting in another line's column. Start with your industry benchmark. Then ask what costs your competitors put inside it. Test every cost simply. Without this, could you deliver the work at all? Need the equipment to deliver? Its depreciation belongs in cost of goods, not overhead. Rising gross profit dollars can hide falling margins. Read the percentage, not the dollars. Land on your cost rules and keep them. A steady baseline beats a perfect one. Chapters: (00:00) Kicking off module six after predictable revenue sets the foundation(04:19) Revenue meets margins: the CRO and COO trade-off(05:30) Defining transferable margins and breaking out true line costs(09:56) Revenue is the CRO's number, margins belong to the COO(12:05) Finding your industry benchmark through an investor's-eye view of margins(17:00) Rates of change, three-month trends, and boiling-frog cost creep(25:29) The Goal, throughput, and does the customer value it(29:58) Customer profitability reviews and the annual lose-the-losers audit(31:43) Ryan's copier company: four divisions, four hidden costs(39:45) Start with industry benchmark, then check what's included(42:46) Test every cost: equipment depreciation belongs in cost of goods(47:00) Land on cost rules, consistency, and the CPI curveball This episode was produced by Castos Productions.Sound Bites"We might end up having a problem where I say our revenue is declining on our most profitable work, and our revenue is increasing on our least profitable work. That's a conversation the COO and I as a CRO are going to need to have." — Kimberly Clark"With those four divisions, we had no visibility on what we should be doing more of and why at any given point." — Ryan Tansom"My dad used to say, where there's mystery, there's margin. That's why we make it complicated." — Ryan Tansom"I haven't seen most people go through the process of even getting agreement on where they stand." — Ryan Tansom"It's better to be slightly off, but still be able to have a baseline to compare to over time, than it is to keep trying to tweak and adjust to reach perfection." — Kimberly Clark"We don't want to do that to our business. We want real information, even if it's bad." — Ryan TansomResources:The Goal (Eliyahu M. Goldratt) — the Theory of Constraints book Ryan names when he moves from margin to throughput inside a line. — goldratt.com 90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — where owners build the three-statement model and the per-line margin breakout with Ryan and Kim. — independencebydesign.io Ray Dalio — Ryan quotes him on worry: if you're worrying, you don't need to worry, and if you're not worrying, you should worry. — principles.com Consumer Price Index (CPI), U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics — the closing argument. Ryan's point is that it has no unit of measure and a shifting basket. — bls.gov/cpi Related episodes: Ep. 503 — Ryan & Kim: How to Stop Automating Chaos and Get Revenue Data You Can Trust — listen Ep. 502 — Ryan & Kim: How to Map Your User Journey and Stop Lighting Marketing Money on Fire — listen Ep. 499 — Ryan & Kim: How to Build the Revenue Blueprint That Makes Growth Predictable — listen Ep. 492 — Ryan Tansom: How to Analyze Your Margins and Gross Profit — listen Ep. 489 — Kim Clark: The Profit War Room — listen Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/Kim Clark — Chief Revenue Officer, Independence by Design (co-host)
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#503: How to Stop Automating Chaos and Get Revenue Data You Can Trust
1w ago00:59:11Tap to summarizeYou asked your sales leader what next year looks like and got a number nobody can defend. The pipeline is "strong." The CRM went in a year ago and half the team only touches it when they feel like it. Kim and I are on Milestone 15, the last stop in Module 5, and Kim's frame ran the whole episode: systems give you clear line of sight into the handful of data points that build a forecast, and governance is the guardrails, the business norms you can depend on, so "I want to grow 20 percent" has to survive the question of whether you have ever done it. The unlock for me was the difference between stages and influencers. The stages are the road. The opportunity is the car. Every podcast download, trade show, and phone call is an influencer pushing that car left to right. Confuse the two and you drown in data and still can't forecast. Then Kim gets into what most owners skip: making required fields required, reading close rates by rep instead of in total, and closing your pipeline every month the way your bookkeeper closes the books. I opened this one with the story of putting a new CRM on a screen in front of 30 people and asking what our stages should be. Don't do that. This is a Ryan and Kim teaching episode, closing Module 5 (Predictable Revenue). Ep. 499 set the revenue architecture (Milestone 13), Ep. 502 mapped the user journey and what a customer costs (Milestone 14), and this one installs the systems that track it and the governance that keeps it honest (Milestone 15). Kim takes the CRO seat and gets specific: her own arc from Excel to a custom-built CRM she calls a hot mess to a template system set up the implementer's way, which changed what she could see as a sales leader; the required-fields discipline she calls being "the asterisk queen"; why salespeople hating data entry is legitimate and the enforcement framing still has to be service, not policing; the activity-versus-opportunity tripwire that tells you which rep is hiding pipeline; and the monthly CRM close she named "start of month activities." Ryan runs the ownership frame: the meeting where he put a new CRM on a screen in front of 30 people with no ICP done and opened Pandora's box; the road-and-car model that separates stages from influencers; and the analogy that landed the episode, that closing your pipeline is exactly what closing the books is. One thing this episode does not do: the ground-up forecast math. Ryan and Kim deferred it on air to a Q4 episode tied to budgeting season. This one is about the data and the guardrails that make a forecast possible in the first place. Top 10 Takeaways Systems come last. Lock your ICP and your user journey first, or you automate chaos. "Grow 20 percent" is a wish until you check whether you have ever done it before. You're the leader. Design your sales stages yourself. Don't put them to a vote. Build stages from how you actually close deals, and deal in averages, not exceptions. Stages are the road. The opportunity is the car. Every touchpoint is an influencer. Three numbers build a forecast: conversion rate, average deal size, sales cycle length. Make required fields required. It's service to the rep, not policing. Read every number by sales rep. The team average hides your best and your worst. Close your pipeline every month the way your bookkeeper closes the books. Write down how revenue should work. Then you can tell a process problem from a people problem. Chapters: (00:00) Welcome to milestone 15, closing out systems and governance (03:11) Ryan's story: 30 people vote on new CRM stages (13:18) Build sales stages from how you actually close deals (22:53) Stages are the road, the opportunity is the car (26:36) You're the leader, design your stages, don't take a vote (29:18) Make required fields required, it's service to the rep (39:19) Read every number by sales rep, not just averages (43:20) Rolling out new sales KPIs without upsetting the team (50:14) Governance dashboards: catching red flags before they compound (57:33) Close your pipeline monthly, like your bookkeeper closes the books This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Sound Bites "The days of 'we can't track any of this' are gone. Now it's too much data, but we don't know how all of it connects together." — Ryan Tansom "You're the leader. You should know the ideal sales process, and so you build this out to being the ideal sales process, and then you make them follow it." — Kimberly Clark "I'm not doing this because I'm like the dark lord of the CRM system. I'm doing this because it empowers me to have insights that make your work environment and life better." — Kimberly Clark "It's not worth doing if it's not worth measuring." — Kimberly Clark "Bob is doing 100 phone calls a day, but he's only putting in two opportunities a month. But you see Cindy is putting in 100 phone calls a day and she is putting in 50 opportunities a month. That's a conversation with Bob." — Kimberly Clark "It's exactly what bookkeeping is. You close out all the transactions, categories, everything. So you can see how well you did. Then you literally close the books and move on to the next month." — Ryan Tansom Resources: Predictable Revenue OS Assessment — the CRO diagnostic and the episode's primary CTA. 90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — the program where owners build the revenue architecture, the three-statement model, and the revenue systems with Ryan and Kim. — https://independencebydesign.io/ownership-coaching Claude (Anthropic) — the AI that collapsed Kim's three-day August analysis project into about 10 minutes, and the fastest way to find the industry norms for your sales process and marketing metrics. — https://claude.ai HubSpot — Kim's example for opportunity line items. — https://www.hubspot.com Salesforce — the MCP-server voice-memo workflow that kills the data-entry excuse. — https://www.salesforce.com GoHighLevel — the CRM Ryan and Kim run IBD's own funnel on. — https://www.gohighlevel.com ActiveCampaign — named in Ryan's list of pipeline tools. — https://www.activecampaign.com Statista — where Kim used to dig for industry benchmarks before AI made it fast. — https://www.statista.com Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/ Kim Clark — Chief Revenue Officer, Independence by Design (co-host)
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#502: How to Map Your User Journey and Stop Lighting Marketing Money on Fire
2w ago00:59:08Tap to summarize[youtube:6pEjV5l82uU]You're paying for social, paid ads, SEO, a website redo, and an email tool, and you still can't tell which one actually brought you a customer. It feels like lighting money on fire, and every vendor swears their piece is the one that's working. Kim and I are on Milestone 14, the user journey and what a customer actually costs to acquire, and the unlock is Kim's reframe: your journey isn't one funnel. Every entry point, a podcast, a trade show, a referral, is its own lane to the same city, and each one drops someone off in a different psychological state, so the next step has to match the exit. We get into starting at the bookends (re-engage your dormant database for fast revenue while you build top-of-funnel reach), judging a channel on a three-month trend instead of one bad month, and the ownership move underneath all of it: decide what percentage of gross profit you're willing to spend to acquire a customer, then make sales and marketing one revenue engine that lives inside that number. Back at Imaging Path, we knew 33 percent of our cold-call leads closed every single month, and we took that to the bank for twenty years. That is what this milestone is chasing. This is a Ryan and Kim teaching episode, continuing Module 5 (Predictable Revenue). Ep. 499 opened the module with the revenue architecture (Milestone 13, the ICP and positioning). This one is the next milestone: the user journey and what it costs to acquire a customer (Milestone 14). Kim takes the CRO seat and reframes the journey as separate lanes off a highway, each entry point its own exit to the same city, walks the bookends-in build method, and makes the case that sales and marketing have to be one revenue engine owned by one person. Ryan runs the ownership frame: the domino sequence, why the CAC guardrail is a percentage of gross profit set before you spend, and why function beats title when you name who owns revenue. Next in the series: revenue systems and forecasting (Milestone 15). Top 10 Takeaways You can't map a user journey until your ICP and positioning are locked first. A user journey isn't one funnel. It's a separate lane from every entry point. Match the next step to the exit. A podcast lead and a trade-show lead want different things. Start at the bookends. Re-engage your dormant database while you build top-of-funnel reach. Your dormant contacts are low-hanging fruit. That revenue funds the slower brand build. You can't decide anything without data. No data yet? Start collecting it, even half-built. Judge a channel on a three-month trend, never a single month's snapshot. When conversion stalls, ask your customers. A survey beats guessing every time. Set your CAC as a percentage of gross profit before you spend a dollar. Sales versus marketing is a wall. One person has to own the whole revenue engine. Chapters: (00:00) Introduction to milestone 14: user journey and client acquisition cost (08:47) You can't map a user journey until ICP is locked (12:48) Start at the bookends: dormant contacts are your low-hanging fruit (17:06) A user journey isn't one funnel, it's a separate lane (19:01) Match the next step to the exit: podcast or trade-show (26:53) Judge a channel by a three-month trend, not one snapshot (28:42) You can't decide anything without data, so start collecting now (30:12) When conversion stalls, ask your customers instead of guessing (39:45) Set your CAC as a percentage of gross profit first (45:00) Sales versus marketing is a wall, one person owns it (48:45) Build the accountability chart first, then fill in the names (55:11) Don't promote your best salesperson before they're ready to lead (56:53) Take the revenue assessment to find your weakest link first This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Sound Bites "What my brain does is it's a series of dominoes. The first domino gets put over, but if you take one of those out, the whole thing stops." (@00:31:19) — Ryan Tansom "I don't see a user journey as one line. There are several entry points into becoming aware of a business." (@00:44:43) — Kimberly Clark "What if you just had an actual lifestyle instead of a crash diet?" (@00:51:45) — Kimberly Clark "We could literally take the 33 percent conversion rate to the bank every single month and every single year." (@01:03:00) — Ryan Tansom "I like to take the sledgehammer, crash down the brick wall between the two of them. You are one team because you are the revenue engine." (@01:13:20) — Kimberly Clark "When we do things out of order, without the right constraints, that's how we just light money and time on fire." (@01:09:01) — Ryan Tansom Resources: Predictable Revenue OS Assessment — the CRO diagnostic and the episode's primary CTA. Find your weakest component in this milestone and start there. 90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — the program where owners build the revenue architecture, the three-statement model, and the user journey with Ryan and Kim. https://independencebydesign.io/ownership-coaching Claude (Anthropic) — the AI Kim points owners to for the "how often should I post, what are the norms for my industry" questions that used to need a marketing specialist. https://claude.ai GoHighLevel — the CRM Ryan and Kim run iBD's own funnel and outreach on. https://www.gohighlevel.com ITR Economics — where Kim built the revenue engine (Brian and Alan Beaulieu); the source of the "start making money fast" and three-month-trend discipline. https://www.itreconomics.com EOS accountability chart — the roles-before-names method for designing who owns sales and marketing before you look at your people. https://www.eosworldwide.com Ep. 499 — Ryan & Kim: Revenue Blueprint — the prior milestone (M13), the ICP and positioning this journey runs on. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/499-ryan-kim-how-to-build-the-revenue-blueprint-that-makes-growth-predictable Ep. 480 — Kim Clark: What a CRO Does to Create Predictable Revenue https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/480-kim-clark-what-a-cro-does-to-create-predictable-revenue Ep. 439 — Kim Clark: How to Build a Marketing Engine That Ties to Sales, Value, and Cash Flow https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/439-how-to-build-a-marketing-engine-that-ties-to-sales-value-and-cash-flow-with-kim-clark Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/ Kim Clark — Chief Revenue Officer, Independence by Design (co-host)
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#501: Gary Kusin | Align in 30 Days or I'll Help You Find Your Next Job
3w ago01:08:13Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeYou have a strategic plan. It's in a deck somewhere. Your team nodded at it in January, and by March everyone was quietly back to running their own version of the company. That gap between a plan on paper and a company actually aligned behind one is why I'm pulling this conversation back to the front of the feed. We just crossed 500 episodes, and Kim and I are mid-stream teaching the strategic plan and predictable revenue material right now, so before we jump back in I want you to hear what a real one looks like when it has teeth. Gary Kusin co-founded GameStop, built Laura Mercier, then walked into Kinko's bleeding $11M of EBITDA and walked out three years later at $240M and a $2.4B sale to Fred Smith at FedEx. He didn't start with the plan. He started by listening at 2am town halls across 42 districts before changing a single thing. Then he put one plan in front of 150 leaders and said: align in 30 days or I will personally help you find your next job. This originally aired as episode 413. It's worth every minute twice. TOP TEN TAKEAWAYS: The moment you sell, you don't own it anymore. Pay your nickel, do your dance. Your ego doesn't make the company better. Your customers carry your DNA forward whether you're there or not. The GameStop fans who took on Wall Street were proof. The moment you sell, you don't own it anymore. Pay your nickel, do your dance. Your ego doesn't make the company better. Command-and-control and entrepreneurial cultures are different organisms. Drop the wrong heart in and the body rejects it. Before you change anything, go look. Run town halls on every shift in every district. The front line already knows what's wrong. Accountability without authority is failure. Spell out what you need, then hand over the hiring, firing, and capex to deliver it. Build a one-page dashboard with the metrics that actually matter. Manage to it monthly. Everything else is pablum. Nobody should ever be fired and surprised. Miss the plan once, we talk. Miss it twice, we both already know what's next. Hire only people who say they want your job. Then make it your job to get them there. Toxic culture is a math problem. The store with the closed blinds and the screamer manager is the store losing money. Build the principles you wish your old bosses had. Honesty, integrity, and respect aren't soft. They're the operating floor. Gary Kusin is the co-founder of GameStop (originally Babbage's), the founder of Laura Mercier Cosmetics, the former CEO of Kinko's, and a longtime senior advisor in private equity. He's mentored hundreds of executives and is the author of Always Learning: Lessons on Leveling Up from GameStop to Laura Mercier and Beyond. His career spans the full arc most middle-market owners are trying to understand: founding, scaling, professionalizing, selling, and integrating into a strategic acquirer. Mentored early by Ross Perot, with quarterly business reviews under Jack Welch and an eventual sale to Fred Smith at FedEx, Gary has seen how the people at the top either make the company or break it. This conversation originally aired as Ep. 413 in 2024 and is re-released as the bridge back into our strategic plan teaching series. Chapters: (00:00) Gary Kusin shares his leadership principles and mentoring approach, his journey from Texarkana to GameStop (05:00) Harvard Business School, unexpected career path, co-founding GameStop (13:00) Early days of GameStop, educating customers about video games, loyal fanbase, Wall Street challenges, maintaining relationships (20:41) Leadership's role in implementing a strategic turnaround, prioritizing trust, transparency, and open communication, leading to increased profitability and engagement (22:00) Building Team Culture: The importance of team buy-in, autonomy, and why "command and control" doesn’t work in every business, importance of empathy and communication for long-term success. (37:00) Thoughts on nurturing future leaders and creating a culture of ownership, Transformative leadership journey, hands-on management, high aspirations, hiring leaders with CEO potential, inclusive company culture, open communication, trust, recognizing diversity and privilege. (45:00) Foundational principles, clear communication, and empathy are crucial for a healthy work environment and team dynamics. (55:30) Transformative journey of navigating toxic workplaces, lessons from mentors, fostering supportive cultures, and making tough decisions with transparency and accountability. (1:06:44) Final Thoughts: Gary's advice for owners who want to scale and create lasting value without losing their identity. Share with the owner/operators you know! This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Resources: Always Learning: Lessons on Leveling Up from GameStop to Laura Mercier and Beyond — Gary's book, in hardcover, softcover, ebook, and audio. Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Always-Learning-Lessons-Leveling-GameStop/dp/B0CYRT9DS7 · Barnes & Noble: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/always-learning-gary-kusin/1145155226 GameStop (originally Babbage's) — The first software-only specialty retailer, founded May 1983. Laura Mercier Cosmetics — Global makeup brand Gary co-founded after GameStop. Kinko's — Where Gary turned ($11M) EBITDA into $240M EBITDA in three years before the $2.4B sale to FedEx. Ep. 413 (original airing) — https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/413-from-gamestop-to-kinkos-gary-kusin-on-building-scaling-and-creating-legacy-businesses Ep. 499 — Ryan & Kim: How to Build the Revenue Blueprint That Makes Growth Predictable — https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/499-ryan-kim-how-to-build-the-revenue-blueprint-that-makes-growth-predictable The iBD Workshop — Two hours, $100, walk out with your tools filled in and your Velocity Score. The first step. https://independencebydesign.io iBD Library — The public archive of the Ownership OS material. https://library.independencebydesign.io Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/ Ryan Tansom — Founder, https://independencebydesign.io Sound Bytes: "If you buy my company and you pay me what I decide is a fair price, you got, you paid your nickel, and you're gonna get your dance. It is your company. It is not my company." — Gary Kusin "You brought in an incredibly good command and control CEO, but you brought him into the People's Republic of Kinko. That doesn't work, guys." — Gary Kusin "Anyone who is not fully aligned with this plan, give me a buzz. I am gonna be a one-man whirling dervish to help you find another job. On the 31st day, I will find you and I will weed you out personally." — Gary Kusin "I will never in any company I'm involved in allow accountability without responsibility, because that's failure." — Gary Kusin "You don't have to remember what you told someone if you told them the truth." — Gary Kusin
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#500: In the Hot Seat: Time Is the Only Thing You Don't Get Back
Jul 201:27:35Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeIn our 500th episode, and the closest thing iBD has to an origin story on record. Kim Clark, iBD's Chief Revenue Officer and co-host, turned the interview around and asked Ryan how this whole thing got started. The real answer: Ryan started the podcast back in 2016 as a backup plan — if the business he was building didn't work out, at least enough people would know him that he could go get a job. But underneath that, the truth is he just can't stand having anybody tell him what to do. He sold his company at 27, got the check, and it still didn't feel like freedom. So he spent the next 11 years and 500 episodes talking to owners, trying to figure out the playbook nobody ever hands you — the 2016 beach in Fort Lauderdale where the idea landed, the wealth-management chapter that never fit, the original "Life After Business" title everyone mistook for a retirement show, and the allergic reaction to authority that drove the entire search. That's what turned into Independence by Design, and the framework that finally reconciled the mission with a business model: the time, cash, and wealth scoreboard, the owner-versus-operator distinction, the outcome-neutral playbook, and the group-coaching model built on a playbook instead of consulting. It comes down to something you probably already feel in your gut. Your time is the only thing you don't get back. Your cash flow protects your time, and your wealth protects your cash flow — the business is supposed to serve all that, not eat it alive. So if you've ever felt like you're working harder than everyone you know to build something that kind of owns you, this is the one. Ryan doesn't care if you sell it, keep it, or hand it to your kids — he just wants you to actually get to choose. He closes on where it's all going next.Top 10 Takeaways You started this business to be free. If it's trapping you instead, that's a design problem, not a you problem. Freedom was always the real goal. The business is just the vehicle to get you there. Time is the one thing you never get back. You've got a finite number of weeks, so build around that. Money was never the scoreboard. Plenty of people hit the big number and you still wouldn't trade lives with them. Your wealth protects your cash flow. Your cash flow protects your time. That's the whole order. You're wearing two hats. You own the business and you also work in it. Most owners never separate the two. "Should I sell?" doesn't mean anything until you know if you're talking about your job or your asset. Get clear on what you want first, or the business will eat every dollar you make. Nobody ever taught you how to actually own. You got EOS, a CPA, a peer group. The ownership seat sat empty. Sell it, keep it, or hand it to your kids. Doesn't matter. The only wrong move is guessing. Chapters: (00:00) Kim marks episode 500, origin story: the beach vacation and the wealth management chapter that never fit(05:20) Freedom was always the real goal; the business is just the vehicle(27:30) Money was never the scoreboard, even for people with a B net worth(29:00) Time is the one thing you never get back(44:24) A business that traps instead of frees you is a design problem(54:53) Nobody ever taught you how to actually own your business(58:50) You're wearing two hats: you own the business and you work in it(1:00:05) Should I sell means nothing until you know the role(1:01:55) Sell it, keep it, or hand it to your kids; the wrong move is guessing(1:06:41) Get clear on your goals, or the business eats every dollar(1:12:42) How the coaching business model and playbook came together(1:17:52) Looking ahead to the next 1,000 episodes This episode was produced by Castos Productions.Sound Bytes:"I'm going to learn all of this so I don't have to listen to anybody." (@00:08:07) — Ryan Tansom"I wake up and I get to talk to the people I love most about the most interesting problems on the planet." (@00:09:32) — Ryan Tansom"I've interviewed a lot of people with a B behind their net worth who are like, you couldn't pay me to trade lives with them." (@00:27:30) — Ryan Tansom"Wealth is to protect the cash flow. And cash flow is to protect your time." (@00:29:57) — Ryan Tansom"The word exit doesn't make any sense unless you know what role you're talking about. It's like arguing about whether the spoon in the Matrix is gold or silver. There isn't a spoon." (@00:59:44) — Ryan Tansom Resources:The Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel — the book Kim reads from on air. The highest dividend money pays is waking up and saying "I can do whatever I want today." https://www.morganhousel.com/Maps of Meaning by Jordan Peterson — on why we can only articulate our values after we've lived them out. https://www.jordanbpeterson.com/book/maps-of-meaning/Million Dollar Coach by Taki Moore — the coach's coach whose playbook-plus-coaching model shaped how iBD delivers. https://www.amazon.com/Million-Dollar-Coach-Strategies-7-Figure/dp/1539941671The Great Game of Business by Jack Stack — source of the stat that most Inc. 5000 companies can't hit two payrolls. https://www.greatgame.com/What Do You Do With an Idea? by Kobi Yamada — the book Kim gives every client. Starts black and white, ends in color. https://www.amazon.com/What-Do-You-Idea/dp/1938298071The iBD Workshop — two hours, $100, walk out with your tools filled in and your Velocity Score. The first step. https://independencebydesign.ioiBD Library — the public archive of the Ownership OS material. https://library.independencebydesign.ioEp. 482 — Matt Curry: He Sold His $18M Auto Repair Empire, Regretted It, and Built It Back Better https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/482-matt-curry-he-sold-his-18m-auto-repair-empire-regretted-it-and-built-it-back-betterEp. 499 — Ryan & Kim: How to Build the Revenue Blueprint That Makes Growth Predictable https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/499-ryan-kim-how-to-build-the-revenue-blueprint-that-makes-growth-predictableRyan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/Kim Clark — Chief Revenue Officer, Independence by Design (co-host)
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#499: Ryan & Kim | How to Build the Revenue Blueprint That Makes Growth Predictable
Jun 2501:08:31Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeYour pipeline is full and your revenue still feels like a coin flip. Some quarters you hit, some you miss, and you're still the only person in the building who can reliably close a deal. That's not a sales problem. It's a blueprint problem. Kim and I are kicking off Module 5, Predictable Revenue, and the first move isn't a CRM or an ad budget. It's the revenue architecture underneath all of it, Milestone 13. Most owners call "grow 20 percent a year to $20M" a strategic plan. That's a wish with a number on it. The real blueprint names one ideal customer, not three. One winning position that survives the opposite rule. Your actual addressable market. Every offer mapped to every segment. Built right, it becomes the filter that lets you, your team, and your AI say no. And here's what changed: the strategic-planning binder that used to cost $40,000 and sit on a shelf with zero team adoption, you can now build yourself from a voice memo and a transcript. You just have to feed it your real why, not platitudes.About This EpisodeThis is a Ryan and Kim teaching episode, the kickoff of Module 5 (Predictable Revenue). The Module 4 run set the table: Ep. 497 built the annual budget, Ep. 498 rolled it five years out to the valuation target. This one starts the revenue engine that feeds all of it. Kim takes the CRO seat on what predictable revenue actually is, a system you build, not a number you chase, and walks the components of the revenue architecture: ICP, winning position, TAM, sub-markets, and the offer-to-segment map. Ryan runs the ownership frame, why strategy comes before tactics, and how AI has collapsed what used to be a $40,000 consultant engagement into something an owner can build from a voice memo and a transcript. Next in the series: the customer journey (Milestone 14), then revenue systems and forecasting (Milestone 15).Top 10 Takeaways Predictable revenue is a system you build, not a number you chase. Get the revenue line right and your budget, hiring, and margins fall out of it. Build the blueprint before the tactics. Your CRM, ads, and funnels all sit on top of it. Your revenue architecture has one job: be the filter that lets you say no. "Grow 20 percent a year" isn't a strategy. It's a wish with a number on it. You have one ideal customer, not three. Best is a superlative. If the opposite of your edge sounds absurd, it's table stakes, not an edge. Map every offer to every segment. Find your cash cow, your rising star, your loss leader. Be willing to alienate people. Vanilla resonates with no one. AI collapses the $40K consultant binder into a weekend, if you feed it your real why. Chapters: (00:00) Welcoming listeners and kicking off the predictable revenue module(04:49) Predictable revenue is a system you build, not chased(06:35) Build the blueprint before the tactics, not after(09:09) One ideal customer, not three — best is a superlative(24:48) Three ICP filters: firmographics, demographics, and psychographics, with Bill's example(30:10) Be willing to alienate people — vanilla resonates with no one(43:00) Defining total addressable market without lying to yourself(46:23) If the opposite sounds absurd, it's table stakes already(51:57) Map every offer to every segment, finding your cash cow(58:53) AI collapses the $40K consultant binder into a weekend This episode was produced by Castos Productions.Resources:90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — the program where the revenue architecture, three-statement model, and forecast get built with owners. https://independencebydesign.io/ownership-coachingClaude (Anthropic) — https://claude.aiEp. 470 — Greg Meredith: Strategic Planning vs. Strategy — the advisor whose Opposite Rule and winning-position framework anchor this milestone. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/470-greg-meredith-strategic-planning-vs-strategy-why-you-need-more-than-just-a-plan Ep. 480 — Kim Clark: What a CRO Does to Create Predictable Revenue — Kim's deeper take on the CRO function. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/480-kim-clark-what-a-cro-does-to-create-predictable-revenue Playing to Win by A.G. Lafley and Roger Martin — source of the Opposite Rule. https://hbr.org/books/playing-to-winPeter Diamandis / Moonshots — source of the "massive transformative purpose" framing. https://www.youtube.com/@peterdiamandisMillion Dollar Coach by Taki Moore — the playbook Ryan references on brand voice. https://www.amazon.com/Million-Dollar-Coach-Strategies-7-Figure/dp/1539941671Predictable Revenue OS Assessment — the CRO diagnostic and episode CTA. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eaVXkuNS0E1sYi8CRWmZFfr_83tq2Gnu/view Additional resources: Statista — data source Kim uses for market sizing. https://www.statista.com U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics — referenced for labor/market data. https://www.bls.gov U.S. Census Bureau — referenced for demographic/market data. https://www.census.gov ZoomInfo — referenced as an example firmographic data tool. https://www.zoominfo.com Obsidian Web Clipper — the browser extension Ryan recommends for pulling YouTube transcripts into Claude. https://obsidian.md Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/
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#498: Ryan & Kim | How to Build a Five-Year Forecast That Shows Your Value Gap
Jun 1800:55:11Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeYou wrote a number down. Double the revenue in five years, or a valuation somebody floated at your peer group. It's on the whiteboard, and underneath it you know nothing connects today's financials to that number. That gap is the whole episode. Kim and I get into Milestone 12, the five-year forecast, and the first thing we throw out is the idea that a revenue goal is a target. A revenue number is one-dimensional. The real target is three-dimensional: your income statement, balance sheet, and cash flow statement five years out, tied together, so you can see whether the growth you want eats all your cash before you get there. That's the line between a forecast and a wish. A forecast runs on data, not desire. We walk the Advanced Solutions model live through all three lenses of value, and we get honest about the AI part: Claude knows the math better than I do, but it has no idea what you want, so you hold the goals and make it prove every scenario against them. Underneath all of it sits one trade you can't dodge. Either more cash today, or more wealth tomorrow.About This Episode This is a Ryan and Kim teaching episode, the capstone of the Module 4 (Sustainable Financials) run: Ep. 492 read the gross margin chart, Ep. 497 built the annual budget, and this one rolls it all forward five years to the valuation target (Milestone 12). Ryan runs the bottom-up frame, the owner's goals as the perimeter every scenario gets tested inside, and shares the Advanced Solutions five-year model on screen. Kim brings the CRO seat on the top-down view: business cycles, conversion rates, and the business-as-usual projection that exposes the gap. The screen-share is visible on the YouTube and Spotify video versions. Next up in the series: Kim's module, Predictable Revenue. Top 10 Takeaways A forecast runs on data, not desire. It tells you the truth your goal has to answer to. A revenue number is one-dimensional. Your real target is all three financial statements, five years out. Grow too fast and you eat your own cash and go broke. Better to see it on the model than in your bank account. Your business has three values: what it's worth if you keep it, sell it, or what you actually pocket at closing. A fat normalized EBITDA number with no cash behind it isn't a plan B. It's a countdown to a forced sale. Lock your goals first: distributions, debt, the valuation target. Those are the bookends. Everything gets tested between them. Run your business-as-usual line five years out. The gap to your goal is your value gap, and closing it is the plan. AI knows the math better than you do. It will never know what you want. That part is your job. Every big move comes down to the same trade: more cash today, or more wealth tomorrow. When keeping the business is worth as much as selling it, you're free. That's escape velocity. Chapters: (00:00) Introduction to milestone 12: the five-year forecast and valuation gap (00:53) A forecast runs on data, not desire, unlike a goal (04:10) The real target: three financial statements, not revenue alone (06:04) Three lenses of value: why normalized EBITDA isn't a plan B (14:36) AI knows the math, but never knows your goals (15:54) Ryan's story: building the Advanced Solutions model with Claude (26:33) Lock your goals first: the owner scorecard starts everything (29:49) Kim's top-down view: business cycles, conversions, and data (35:41) Live walkthrough of the five-year three-statement forecast model (47:28) More cash today or more wealth tomorrow, and escape velocity This episode was produced by Castos Productions.Resources:90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — Ryan and Pat build the three-statement model and annual budget with owners. https://independencebydesign.io/ownership-coaching Claude (Anthropic) — https://claude.ai — The AI tool Ryan uses to pressure-test five-year scenarios against fixed goalsEOS / the VTO (Vision/Traction Organizer) — https://www.eosworldwide.com — Framework where an ungrounded five-year revenue goal often originates ITR Economics — https://www.itreconomics.com Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/
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#497: Ryan & Kim | How to Build an Annual Budget That Predicts Your Cash
Jun 1101:03:15Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeYour P&L says you made money. Your checking account says otherwise, and nobody can tell you why. Kim and I build the annual budget that predicts your actual cash, a year out. Most owners don't start thinking about next year's budget until it's almost next year. That's the problem. By the time you sit down to build one, the months of groundwork that make it real never happened, so the budget turns into a wish. Kim and I wanted to walk through how we actually do it. Your CPA does your taxes. Your banker watches the line. Nobody is building the one thing that tells you how much cash will be in your checking account next year. Not net income. Not gross profit. Not even normalized EBITDA, which can read $2 million while your bank account reads $2. We get into building the budget as a closed loop: twelve months of all three statements tied together so tightly nothing can hide, starting from your ownership goals and cascading down through revenue, margins, and working capital. Kim takes the CRO seat and reverse-engineers the revenue number out of the customer journey. I run the chart. The payoff is the bottom right corner of the puzzle: the cash, a year out, predicted within a few hundred dollars. This is a Ryan and Kim teaching episode, the second stop inside Module 4 (Sustainable Financials) after the three-statement model. Ryan runs the financial model and the ownership-goals frame. Kim brings the CRO seat, where the revenue forecast gets reverse-engineered out of the customer journey. It's the budgeting piece of a connected run: Ep. 492 read the gross margin chart, Eps 493 to 495 built the executive comp plan off normalized net operating income, and the next episode closes the loop with the five-year forecast and the value gap. Top 10 Takeaways Your net income is not your cash. A real budget predicts the actual dollars in your account. Begin with what you want. Then pressure-test it against what your team can actually pull off. Don't just divide last year by twelve. Take your trailing twelve months, add seasonality, then growth. Build it as a closed loop. When all three statements tie together, nothing can hide from you. Break revenue into product lines. Each has its own margin, and the blended number lies to you. Your accounting system won't force good numbers. A real model does, and shows you what's broken. Go in order: your goals, then revenue, then operations, then your CFO ties it all together. Make your CRO reverse-engineer the revenue back through the customer journey and real conversion rates. Working capital is where your cash hides. Receivables, payables, and inventory will drain you dry. Don't try to build this yourself. Spend your energy finding the person who owns the model. Chapters: (00:00) Introduction: Why June is the right time to start budgeting (03:20) The closed-loop system: All three statements tied together (07:52) Begin with ownership goals: Cash flow, distributions, and valuation (13:40) The three-statement model: The only financial model you'll ever need (21:33) How daunting is this? Real talk on the 90-day boardroom blueprint (32:15) Break revenue into product lines — the blended margin lies to you (40:33) Working capital: Where your cash hides — receivables, payables, inventory (50:32) The CRO seat: Reverse-engineering revenue through the customer journey (58:07) Groundwork, collaboration, and what good actually looks like (1:01:30) Where to start: Atomic habits, baby steps, and blocking the time (1:03:30) Next week: Five-year forecast, valuation gap, and wrap-up This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Resources: 90-Day Boardroom Blueprint — Ryan and Pat build the three-statement model and annual budget with owners. https://independencebydesign.io/ownership-coaching Ep. 472 — The Only Financial Model You Will Ever Need — the on-screen walkthrough of the Module 4 financial model Ryan references. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/472-ryan-tansom-the-only-financial-model-you-will-ever-needAtomic Habits by James Clear — the just drive to the gym and show up idea. https://jamesclear.com/atomic-habits Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/ Contact - Ryan Tansom — Founder, Independence by Design. https://independencebydesign.io - Kim Clark — Chief Revenue Officer, Independence by Design (co-host)
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#496: Tom Walker | Where to Put Your Money When the Government Keeps Printing
Jun 401:32:58Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTubeEvery dollar your business makes, you have to place. Reinvest it, pull it out, or move it somewhere that holds its value. And that decision sits on a base layer most owners never see. The same three-statement math that runs your company runs the whole world, with one difference. Governments can print. That worked for 50 years because the US forced the world to buy oil in dollars, keeping the system afloat. That era is ending now: the Strait of Hormuz, supply chains breaking, a world that no longer wants the dollar or its bonds. Tom Walker came back on to walk through what it means, and it ends in more printing. More printing means more inflation, and inflation is what quietly decides whether you reinvest in your business or move into hard assets that protect what you've built. You don't control the base layer. But once you see how it works, you make that call with your eyes open instead of on gut. Tom Walker, Jr. is an economist and CFO who runs Walker Insight, the Minneapolis firm his father started in 1975 to bring real financial planning to independent farmers. Tom Jr. joined in 1989, and for decades he's built custom planning models for farms, food processors, and manufacturers, fusing economics, finance, and production so owners can weigh risk, prove a concept, secure financing, and track progress against their goals. He's a returning guest (first on Ep. 415, "Everyone Gets Punched in the Face"). His lens hasn't changed: you don't plan to predict the future, you plan to build a framework that survives the hit. Top 10 Takeaways You can't make a good ownership decision blind to how the game works. Learn the board first. Your business is a closed loop. Cash in, cash out, no printer. The government runs the same three statements you do. The only difference is it can print. Cash flow is the only honest scorecard. Every valuation is a bet on future cash flow. Paper wealth and cash wealth are different games. A marked-up asset is worth what someone pays. An asset that won't cash flow for a new buyer is a bet on the next buyer. Know the bet you're making. New money reaches the connected first. Know where you sit before you plan around it. The market gets propped because it has to be. Read the signal, not the headline number. Liquidity is optionality. Stay liquid and you get to decide instead of getting forced. See the game clearly, price on cash flow, and you decide on purpose instead of on gut. Chapters: (00:00) Introduction of Tom Walker, Jr., economist and CFO at Walker Insight (01:03) Macro sanity checks: Lyn Alden, Luke Gromen, and Larry Lepard (04:43) Your business is a closed loop — cash in, cash out, no printer (14:12) Farming as a microcosm: no soft landing, fiat conditions on the ground (29:50) The Cantillon Effect: new money reaches the connected first (38:39) Advice for owners and farmers navigating fiscal dominance (55:09) How fragile the system really is — 4% breaks the whole thing (01:09:10) Supply chain risk, locking in inputs, and who actually survives (01:25:23) Own the outcome: finding the right guide without outsourcing your freedom (01:31:14) Stay solvent to be right eventually — the Noah's Ark framework This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Resources: Walker Insight — https://www.walkerinsight.com/ Tom Walker on LinkedIn — https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomaswalkerii/ Ep. 415 — Tom Walker: Everyone Gets Punched in the Face — Tom's first appearance, the planning-framework episode this one builds on. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/415-everyone-gets-punched-in-the-face-a-framework-for-planning-with-tom-walker Lyn Alden — Macro analyst, author of Broken Money. https://www.lynalden.com/ Luke Gromen — Founder of FFTT (Forest for the Trees). https://fftt-llc.com/ Lawrence "Larry" Lepard — Sound-money investor, author of The Big Print. https://x.com/LawrenceLepard The Snowball: Warren Buffett and the Business of Life by Alice Schroeder — Ryan's favorite Buffett book. https://www.amazon.com/Snowball-Warren-Buffett-Business-Life/dp/0553384619 The Cantillon Effect (Richard Cantillon) — Why freshly printed money reaches the connected first. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Cantillon Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/
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#495: Ryan & Kim | How to Share Your Company's Upside Without Giving Away Equity
May 2801:08:44Tap to summarizeWatch on YouTube You've got one person you can't afford to lose, running an outcome you know you can't hit alone. They've started asking about the upside, and your gut says give them a piece of the company. Then you remember what real equity costs. A K-1 every April. A cap table. Permission required to sell your own business. Kim and I get into phantom stock: real money tied to real valuation growth, without putting anyone on your cap table. It's a contract and a balance sheet liability, pegged to the same four numbers every valuation already runs on. The catch is, there's no shortcut here, unlike on the annual plan. Build the owner's goals, the valuation, and the five-year model first, or you've got it backwards. We get into the one honest test for whether someone earned it at all (can you hit the five-year number without them?), Why you never tie the payout to a sale, and the worked example where sharing 5% of a $21.01M outcome costs you nothing, because it never existed without the person who earned it. Top 10 Takeaways A salary rents someone's effort. Long-term comp ties them to the value you build together. The one honest test: if you can hit your five-year number without this person, don't grant phantom stock. Go hire someone who wants a salary. There's no shortcut on a long-term plan. Build the model, the valuation, and the five-year forecast first, or you have it backwards. Phantom stock is a contract and a balance sheet liability. No cap table, no K-1, no operating agreement. Real equity ropes you together on taxes, distributions, and the decision to sell. Phantom stock doesn't. Never tie the payout to a sale. Do that and your executives start needing you to sell. Peg it to a cash flow valuation, not the private equity premium someone might pay someday. Have a neutral third party value the company every year. Ten to fifteen grand ends the argument before it starts. Size it like a budget. Percentages first, then meaningful dollars, then what the company can actually afford. The math is the hard part. Once it's clear, the attorney's contract is about three grand. Chapters: (00:00) Introduction: Ryan and Kim on sharing company upside without equity (02:20) A salary rents someone's effort; long-term comp ties them to value (04:05) What usually goes wrong without a long-term strategy in place (06:11) No shortcut: build the model, valuation, and five-year forecast first (13:15) Phantom stock: a balance sheet liability, no cap table, no K-1 (19:40) The one honest test: can you hit the five-year number without them? (41:00) Never tie the payout to a sale; executives will need you to sell (47:29) Peg it to a cash flow valuation, not the private equity premium (56:24) Have a neutral third party value the company; ten to fifteen grand ends the argument (1:02:09) ESOPs, SARs, and creative layered approaches to ownership transitions This episode was produced by Castos Productions. Resources: Executive Comp Workshop June 25 – 9 AM - 11am CST – Virtual, Live, Interactive: https://ryantansom.com/the-compensation-blueprint-workshop 90-Day Boardroom Blueprint Ryan's onboarding program that walks owners through the IBD Ownership OS, three-statement financial model, budget, and forecast — the foundation required before designing any executive comp plan. https://ibd-ownership-os.mn.co/plans/1974651?bundle_token=e7ab472deac3881f18ad4399f1fe79d9 Ryan Tansom's YouTube — ESOP Series Four-part, approximately nine-hour ESOP series featuring Corey Rosen of the NCEO and others, covering valuations, deal structures, and transactions top to bottom. https://www.youtube.com/@ryantansom VisionLink (Craig Rutledge) Long-term incentive design firm. Software platform that manages valuations, vesting, and drafts plan documents. Craig Rutledge is a Principal. https://visionlink.co Prairie Capital Advisors Chicago-based investment bank handling ESOP, management buyout, and third-party PE transactions. Ryan's recommendation for the annual independent valuation. https://www.prairiecap.com Dinsmore — Compensation & Benefits Practice National law firm for drafting phantom stock contracts. Their Compensation & Benefits practice handles SARs and phantom stock plans. Jim Calvello mentioned by Ryan. https://www.dinsmore.com/services/compensation-benefits/ Ep. 494 — Ryan & Kim: How to Comp Your Executive Team So You Stop Being the Referee The annual executive comp plan episode. Long-term comp sits on top of it. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/494-ryan-kim-how-to-design-an-annual-executive-compensation-plan Ep. 493 — Ryan & Kim: How to Tie Everyone's Compensation to Your Ownership Goals Last week's episode. The Module 8 foundation this episode builds directly on. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/493-ryan-kim-how-to-tie-everyones-compensation-to-your-ownership-goals Ep. 404 — Craig Rutledge: Design a CEO Compensation Plan Tied to Your Cash Flow & Equity Valuation Goals Craig's deeper interview on long-term incentive mechanics. https://independence-by-design.castos.com/episodes/design-a-ceo-compensation-plan-tied-to-your-cash-flow-equity-valuation-goals-with-craig-rutledge Ep. 336 — Craig Rutledge: How to Create the Best Executive Compensation Plan with VisionLink Craig's foundational phantom equity interview. https://youtu.be/gAi0s8jtBls Ep. 222 — Craig Rutledge: The Ultimate Guide to Executive Compensation Plans Foundational episode on aligning short- and long-term incentives to value creation. https://youtu.be/sInIywDALW4 Ryan Tansom Website: https://ryantansom.com/
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