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Jay'sAnalysis
DEBATE: Jay Dyer vs Captain Tazaryach: Trinitarian Vs Unitarian -Modern Day Debate
03:16:40
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Transcript1,020 lines
- [00:00]
Mike (Moderator)
Get that AMEX Gold card ready. I'm too tired to cook.
- [00:02]
Jay Dyer
We feeling Five Guys or the Cheesecake Factory? Both earn up to $120 a year
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Mike (Moderator)
in statement credits of participating partners up
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Jay Dyer
to $10 each month when you pay
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Mike (Moderator)
with the AMEX Gold card.
- [00:11]
Jay Dyer
Learn more@americanexpress.com Explore Gold enrollment required terms apply.
- [00:15]
Captain Crackrock
From taco night in Tulum to sushi in Tokyo, make every bite rewarding with gold from amex wherever you dine four times. Membership rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more@americanexpress.com Explore Gold terms and points cap apply.
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Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, We're dancing in the street there's nothing left to eat we're on our
- [01:14]
Jay Dyer
winning streak Going out in style.
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Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I hear you. I'm not dead yet. Get out of here.
- [01:44]
Jay Dyer
Yeah.
- [01:47]
Mike (Moderator)
Break out the hand grenades. You know it's time to play explosions to the rain going out inside. All right, check, check. We are live, guys. We are live. Turn that off. Welcome back to modern day debates. We got a really exciting one tonight. If you have been keeping up with the debate lore, this is going to be round two. And first one was. It was a doozy. That was fun. I watched that on. Was it no Fugazi's channel, right? Yeah. Shout out. No, Fugazi met him in Nashville at debatecon, which we got tickets right now going. A couple of them left. Get them debatecon8 in Dallas. We got a lot of. Lot of heavy hitters. So without further ado, we're going to be debating tonight Trinitarian versus Unitarian worldviews Chat. Let me know how the audio sounds and if they start breaking up or anything, just give me a. Give me a word and I'll do my best to fix it on the spot. And other thing I wanted to mention is we do want you to like the video. Check these guys out on their channels as well. And if they're dual streaming, we appreciate that as well and it's always welcome. You can put these up on Yalls channels. So who. Who was going first here? Just to double check. Is that Jay?
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Captain Crackrock
Yeah. That was never set, so I'm not sure who's going first.
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Mike (Moderator)
Jay, can you hear us? Okay.
- [04:28]
Jay Dyer
I can't.
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Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. All right. And I believe it was agreed upon to do 12 minute opening. So I'll start the timer for Jay as soon as he starts speaking. And ready when you are, brother.
- [04:47]
Jay Dyer
All right, so I'll start with my opening statement, which is that the Trinity is found early on in the Torah. The Trinity is part of the teaching of the Old Testament and hold on one second.
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Mike (Moderator)
Getting a little bit of feedback. And if you could turn your mic down just a little bit. It's coming in hot. Appreciate it. I'll stop your time. Oh, got the chat on screen.
- [05:34]
Jay Dyer
Sorry, I'm almost gonna.
- [05:36]
Mike (Moderator)
It's all good, man. The chat's renowned for being super pat. Our chat says you don't need to turn down, but could be audio trolling. Shout out Max, I believe he will be dropping the link for those debate con tickets. Throughout the debate, He's not muted chat. He's fixing. He's fixing the mic. I'm not gaslighting you chat. You're. You're gaslighting me.
- [07:06]
Jay Dyer
Are you ready now? Sorry.
- [07:07]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, all good, bro.
- [07:09]
Jay Dyer
Okay, so the Trinity is a teaching that's found in the Hebrew Old Testament. It's not a doctrine that's made up by the church fathers or anything post apostolic. It's something that we find multiple references to in the New Testament attacks, whether it's the Gospels or the the Epistles, we find dozens of references to the teaching in the Old Testament, both the Torah, the prophets, and the wisdom literature that in the Old Testament, God appeared, for example, in Genesis and was seen walking with Ab and Eve. Yet a Theophanic manifestation, as we call the Orthodox church. In Genesis 12, the Lord appears to Abraham. In Genesis 15, the Lord again as the Word or the Logos, the voice appears to Abraham. In John 5, Jesus says to the Pharisees, no one has seen the Father at any time. And yet we already have in the first few chapters of Genesis, Yahweh appearing, Yahweh walking around with a form. That form is identified by Jesus in the Gospel of John in chapters five through nine, as himself, the one that dined with Abraham, the one that Abraham looked forward to as his salvation, as his Messiah, the one that went up on the mount that Moses went up on the mountain to eat with. In the latter chapters of Exodus, this Yahweh angel of the Lord is also seen in Genesis 16, where when Hagar sees the angel of the Lord, she says, I have seen Yahweh face to face. In Genesis 18, God again appears in a manifestation. In Genesis 22:14, 15, the Lord appears and is called the messenger of yahweh. In Genesis 24:7, the angel goes before them. And that angel, that angel messenger is referenced in Exodus 23 as the same angel messenger that goes before the Israelites to battle against the Canaanites and the parasites and HIVites and others, and is called the one who redeems and forgives sins. If you compare Exodus 23 with Exodus 3 and with Genesis 49 when it talks about the Joseph says that the angel redeemed him out of all of his difficulties. In Genesis 26:2, Yahweh again appears to Abraham. 26:23 it appears the well of vision is where the Son of God appears again. And then we know that that's the Son of God because in Genesis 28 there's a ladder that Jacob sees. And that ladder is referenced in John 1:51 where Jesus says that the angels descend and ascend on the Son of Man, which is a reference to Jacob's ladder at the well of vision. When Jacob again sees God or sees yahweh in Genesis 31:11, 13:13, the angel is again referred to as God, as divine. In Genesis 32:30 the form of God is seen. God is seeing it face to face. In the wrestling in Genesis 35:1 God appears. So notice remember in John 5 Jesus says no one sees the Father at any time. And yet over and over and over within the first 35 chapters, 32 chapters of Genesis, we've already seen Yahweh, God, Lord appearing, manifesting at theophany, doing things in time and space. God appears. In Genesis 35:1 again Genesis 46:2, the angel is identified from chapter 22 as God. Remember that the word angel has multiple significances and meanings. It doesn't just mean a created being like Gabriel. It can also just mean a messenger. It could be human, it could be an angel, or it can be divine. And of course Jesus says that angel son, that angel messenger of the covenant, who again he identifies himself as throughout all these Old Testament passages. In the New Testament, specifically John 5:9, Jesus says he was the one manifesting in all these instances. In Genesis 41:38, the Holy Spirit is said to be in him and is God. That is in Joseph. The Spirit in Genesis 1:1:2 hovers over the waters. And if you look at the work of the Holy Spirit throughout Genesis, you'll notice that he's ascribed personhood. He's described action. He couldn't do that if he was a force or if he wasn't equal in divinity and in power to the Father and to the Son or the angel messenger. In the Old Testament. In Exodus 3 we read, for example,
- [11:16]
Mike (Moderator)
that get that Amex Gold card ready. I'm too tired to cook.
- [11:19]
Jay Dyer
We feeling Five Guys or the Cheesecake Factory? Both earn up to $120 a year
- [11:24]
Mike (Moderator)
in statement credits of participating partners up
- [11:26]
Jay Dyer
to $10 each month when you pay with the AMEX Gold card.
- [11:28]
Mike (Moderator)
Learn more@americanexpress.com Explore Gold enrollment required terms
- [11:32]
Captain Crackrock
apply from Taco Night in Tulum to Sushi in Tokyo. Make every bite rewarding with gold from Amex wherever you die four times Membership rewards points at restaurants worldwide are piling up. Learn more@american express.com Explore Gold Terms and
- [11:46]
Jay Dyer
Points Cap Apply I am that I am is identified as the same angel that goes before them in Exodus 14:19 and in Exodus 20:3 that means Yahweh speaking in the burning bush is the sun speaking in the burning bush, and the sun is the angel messenger who in time and space goes before them to defeat their enemies. And God says in Exodus 23 that this messenger has the name of Yahweh in him. You can't equate created beings with God or with Yahweh. In the previous debate with this person, he admitted that the Father and the Son have the same nature, and the Father's nature is uncreated. Apply that logic to all the things that I'm saying here about the Old Testament. In Exodus 31:3 we read that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of wisdom, is who came and enlightened the Israelites to do the works that they do in that chapter. In Exodus 33 we read that the angel fights and this angel is the one that is face to face where they meet God. And it says that this is where Moses sees God's goodnesses face to face. So the angel messenger, lo and behold, we find out is the Son of God. In Leviticus 9 the glory of God appears to all of Israel. This again is the angel messenger who comes down and becomes present in these theophanies. These theophanies are again the kill shot proof that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament. Jesus is the second Person of the Godhead even in the Old Testament. And the Holy Spirit is also present throughout these passages as well. We read, for example, that when God appeared at Bethel, the name Bethel is given because it means the house of God or God's body. And this ties into the way that Leviticus 14 structures its argumentation about the house and the house of God. In Numbers 9, the Glory Cloud of God is present and appears. And that glory cloud is the same Holy Spirit cloud that overshadows Mary at the beginning of Luke. So notice the parallels between creation and the Shekinah glory that appears in Genesis 1, the Glory Cloud that comes into the temple, and then the glory cloud that overshadows Mary, which is again all Trinitarian references. The Holy Spirit, for example, in Numbers 11 is placed upon all of the elders, and it's that same cloud that appears as the fire and as a cloud in the wilderness. And Numbers 12, the Lord descends in this pillar of cloud and fire, and he stands there and they see him face to face. The Father has no form. The Father has no body. This is the Son called Yahweh, appearing same thing in Numbers 14:21. In Numbers 16:19, the glory again appears to all the congregation. This is the face of God. Ezekiel 1 through 10 identify this glory as one, like the Son of man who rides the chariot in Ezekiel 1:10. That is of course the Son of God, because Revelation 1 and 2 identify the same figure through deified language and through deification as the same figure of Ezekiel 1:10. Revelation 1:2 identifies that white bearded figure, that deified glowing figure as Jesus. Revelation 1 and 2 compared to Ezekiel 1:10. Numbers 23 says that the Holy Spirit comes upon Balaam, and in Numbers 24:2 he prophesies by the Holy Spirit and then he sees the angel of the Lord. When the angel of the Lord opens his eyes to see who the angel of The Lord is.
- [15:17]
Mike (Moderator)
Four minutes left.
- [15:18]
Jay Dyer
How many? Four. How many? In numbers 27 the Holy Spirit is called the glory. So again the equating of the divine power and the divine energies not just to the angel messenger, but also to the power and work of the Holy Spirit. We see the same thing in Deuteronomy 4:12 and Deuteronomy 35. 6. In Deuteronomy 5:24 they say that they saw his glory. In Deuteronomy 34, Joshua has the Holy Spirit of understanding. So just working my way up through Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy. In the theophanies alone, we can already see a harmony and a consistency with the New Testament passages that that demonstrate beyond any shadow of a doubt that Jesus is not just a human in the sense of having a human nature, but that his divine personhood is from all eternity. When I debated him last time, we got into the passage in John 1 about monogones or Monogenes. Theos. This is the term in the Greek that is the only begotten God. That means that the Son is eternally generated, eternally begotten from the Father. It's not Jesus. God didn't become a Father when he had a Son in time, as if he lacked fatherhood as an eternal attribute. He's an eternal Father. And so Monogones Theos means that he's eternally begotten of the Father. Likewise in Luke 1 we read, for example, that Elizabeth says when she meets Mary, who am I? That the mother of the Lord, the mother of God, the mother of the Theotokos, the God bearer, who am I, that the mother of God should come to me. And then we see that when Jesus is born, the glory of the Lord appears and shines around those who are witnessing the birth of the Messiah. We read, for example, that the Holy Spirit came upon Mary and was active throughout the Gospel of Luke in a way that shows that he is again personal and has agency and has the same powers as the Father and the Son.
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Mike (Moderator)
Two minutes.
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Jay Dyer
We read, for example, that when Jesus is baptized, all three persons of the triad are manifested. The Father speaks and says, this is my beloved Son. And Jesus is baptized. And the Holy Spirit appears as a dove or like a dove. And so all three persons, the triad are again present just at his baptism. And lastly, I will point out that early within, and this is just in the Gospel of Luke, we can go other elsewhere. It is said that when Jesus comes, the fulfillment of the prophecies are that John the Baptist would prepare the way for Yahweh. Jesus is the Yahweh that comes, that John the Baptist prepared the way for. We read the same thing in the Minor Prophets. You can read about Jesus being the messenger of the covenant that was prepared for by the coming of the Messiah. So John the Baptist is said to be, for example, like Elijah in that he prepared the way. And Jesus says in before Yahweh. Okay? Jesus says in Luke 4 that the Holy Spirit this is citing all the Old Testament. So he's citing the the interpretation the Old Testament that I've been giving you. He says that when Isaiah says, the Spirit of God is upon me because he has anointed me, this is the year of Yahweh. Jesus is affirming in his own words the deity of Christ because he's saying that Isaiah was talking about him. And you have all three persons of the Trinity present. Just in that example, in Luke 4, when Jesus reads. And then when he's tempted a few verses earlier in Luke 4:12, he says to Satan, don't tempt your God. When Satan tempted Jesus, well, that means Jesus is God. So we see just in the Torah and just in the first six chapters of Luke, the way it reads and interprets the Torah, as well as John 5, 9, that the old Testament teaches the Trinity. And so that's the strongest immediate reputation for his Unitarian cult nonsense.
- [19:21]
Mike (Moderator)
That was right at 12 minutes. Great job, man. Thank you Chat for all the involvement so far. You guys are going crazy. Hard to keep up with it. But we're going to turn it over now to Captain Tazariac. Before we do, I just want to remind everyone we have our flagship debate conference coming up in July. Get your tickets now. If you were late to join earlier, we got them in the description, they're pinned in the comments. And then Max, I believe, will be posting them throughout for you to get reminded. But yeah, we're going to turn it over to Captain now. We'll get your 12 minutes started whenever you begin to talk.
- [19:59]
Captain Crackrock
Thank you. Based on my opponent's 12 minutes, every angel that does something in the name of the Lord is a part of this trinity. That just makes it bigger. My opponent just broke down scriptures where Jacob wrestled with an angel. I guess that's God. Samson's parents sees him, I guess that's God. When Joshua sees him, I guess that's God. So now it's not an angel representing the Most High. This is somehow fulfillment of the Trinity. Those are the things that you have to do when you're trying to teach such a horrible doctrine. And if I start off in Matthews 11 and 25 at this, at that time Yahavishah answered and said, I think, oh, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou has hid these things from the wise and prudent and have revealed them unto babes. Amos 3 and 7 says, surely the Lord God would do nothing, but he revealed his secret unto his servants. To prophet, you don't have to do all that wiggle, Rigorama roll, whatever you're doing to try to prove a point. For example, if I say God is the only God, I can read Deuteronomy 6 and 4 when it says here, O Israel, the Lord our God is one. I can read Psalms 83 and 18 when it says that thou whose name alone art the most High over all the earth. That just shows how easy it is to show God is one, as opposed to trying to break up God into a trinity or a selection of gods. If I was to go to. I'm just going back to John 17:3 when Christ says this is life eternal, that they might know the the only true God. So at some point in Christianity, y' all gonna have to rethink your thought process because is it about what you think or what someone taught you, or is it about the words of Jesus Christ? Because if, if it's the words of Jesus Christ, Yahusha Mashiach we will call them if he said the Father. Now when you read John 17:1, it says, the Father, the hours come. Glorify thy Son, that thy Son may also glorify thee. And as. And thou has given him power over all flesh. So now this is Christ requesting something from the Father. Because the head of every man is Christ and the head of Christ is God, so how can he be. It doesn't say the head of Christ is the Father. So a Trinitarian can't break that up and say, okay, that's talking about the Father, because that's talking about God. So if the head of Christ is God, how can he be a part of the Godhead that is the head of Him? The logic just doesn't line up. So when it says, this is life eternal, that they might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou sent. So that means the Father sent the Son. Even in John 3:16, a beloved scripture says, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life. When there was an opportunity for Christ to take the title of God in John the 10th chapter in John 10, when they wanted to stone him, and he asked them, he said, what? What do you stone me for? They said, of a good work. We stone thee not, but for blasphemy, because thou, being a man, makes thyself God. Christ gave such a skilled and perfect response when he said, is it not written in your law? I said, ye are gods. Why is that important? Because Psalms 82 and 6, it says, I matter of fact, let me just read it just to make sure I got it right. It says, this is Psalms 82 and 6. It says, on me I have said, ye are gods, and all of you are children of the Most High. When they start bringing up lowercase capital case and all that stuff, I crack up when I hear that, because I've never really seen lowercase in Hebrew and Greek. And you don't need the lower case context because we understand what that means when it says they are God. So the first thing Christ does is custom. But says, does it not say, in your law? I said, ye are gods. Meaning if he wanted to take the position of being God, he had every right right there. Because the Scripture says that God made them gods. Verse 35. If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the Scripture cannot be broken, say ye of him, the Father have sanctified and sent it to world. Excuse me, sent into the world. Thou blaspheme because I said I am the Son of God. All throughout this conversation I'm going to have with my opponent. You're never going to see a direct verse that says that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are God. You're going to see a verse where it says they are one in first John. I think it's five and seven. But that one is talking about in judgment, in your record being on One Accord. And we're all supposed to be on one accord. You can read that In John the 17th chapter, when it says I and me, they and them. So it's not like being one means you're a part of this trinity that just doesn't exist. And I want everybody to remember my opponent made every angel of the Lord in reference to something to do with God, then that means every angel must be a part of this trinity. That makes no sense at all. When we can see men are called the angel of the Lord. If I were to read second estrang 1 in 40, it says a Nahum and Habakkuk and Zephaniah and Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi, which is called also an angel of the Lord. Haggai 1 and 13, then spake Haggai, the Lord's messenger. That word messenger is talking about the Lord. That's what it's talking about. So we got to think about those things when we're talking about is this one. Is this about a trinity? Is Jesus God? Or if not that, to the moderator, if I could. I don't think I'm on the main screen like Jay was. I don't know if you.
- [25:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, yeah, it's on zoom. It's not going to show you what they see on YouTube.
- [26:01]
Jay Dyer
No worries.
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Mike (Moderator)
You got about five minutes left.
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Captain Crackrock
No, appreciate. Appreciate it. You said five minutes. Yeah.
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Mike (Moderator)
You got six minutes left. Sorry.
- [26:11]
Captain Crackrock
That's right. No problem. So as I continue, when I go to. I did that one. When I go to Hebrews 1, when it says God, who has sundry times, a diverse man has spoken to the fathers by the prophets, having in these last days spoken to us by his son. And so in that same chapter, when they run to verse eight and it says, thy throne, O God, that throne is not even talking about God's throne in heaven. That's talking about God's throne on earth, because that is the throne of God. You can read that in 1st Chronicles 29 and 23. Then Solomon sat on the throne of the Lord as king instead of his father. So the person, the ruler on earth, receives worship. So Solomon received worship, David received worship, God received worship. Because they're the representation. That throne in heaven is God's, that throne on earth is also God's. So you cannot get around that. The throne, when it says thy throne, that that's talking about God's throne on earth, regardless of who's sitting on it. So when Solomon was sitting on it, it was the same exact thing. So it's not unique to Christ that he's going to sit on the throne of God because Solomon, or to say David sat on the first, Solomon sat on it second. And Revelations 3 and 12, it says, he, him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God. Now this is Christ speaking again because they want us to believe that it's just God the Father. Christ doesn't do a break. There is no breakdown that Christ gives of God the Father, he says directly, him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God. And he shall go no more out. And I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, which is New Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God. Now, if Christ says this, who are we to try to change it and say, well, he don't really mean what he's saying right there. He really talking about the Father. But the Father is the one true God. He already said that. That's the one true God. If I was to read further down in that same chapter, Revelations 3 and 21, it says to him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne. Even I, as I also overcame and sat down with my Father in his throne. So this ain't no long throne that everybody gets to sit in. It's talking about a position Christ earned, a position in rank. It's the Father, it's the Son, and then everybody else. Whether you say angels, man, however the rank structure goes, nobody denies that. But there is no such thing as Trinity that we're going to find. My opponent is not going to read a verse that says the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit of God. That's my challenge tonight. He's not going to be able to read that. He's going to try to philosophy and point Scripture to Scripture, to Scripture. But I'll be able to read if I was to take another one in John, the 20th chapter and the 21st verse. I believe no John 20 and 17 Yahavishah saith unto her, touch me not from yacht. Not yet ascended to my Father, but go to my brethren and say unto them, I ascend to my Father and. And your father. To my God and your God. This is going to be a hard conversation to have because all we're going to do is have semantic arguments. He's going to point to, like he just mentioned John the Baptist. Preparing their way. And because you see Christ come, that means that Christ is God. No, because Christ is also preparing the way. You know that it's a preparation. Because as Christ come in that same John the third chapter, Christ says, God so loved the world, he sent his only begotten son. So when it says prepare the way, when Christ comes, it's still not him being God. Because Christ's own mouth says, a God sent him so that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. That's even a stepping stone, because that's not the completion.
- [30:11]
Mike (Moderator)
Two minutes.
- [30:12]
Captain Crackrock
The completion. The completion is when Christ returns and then sets up the throne of God on earth. That's the prayer. Our Father, which are in heaven. Thy kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven. So preparing the way. And Christ coming does not now make Christ be God because Christ did something to prepare the way. So we got to think. We got to think about the logic behind that. I mean, we'll see. We won't see that scripture. This is Matthew 17. I'm sorry, not Matthew 17. I got about a minute left. Let me see which last scripture.
- [30:46]
Mike (Moderator)
I want to go just over a minute.
- [30:49]
Captain Crackrock
Yep. Second. Which one I want to do.
- [30:54]
Mike (Moderator)
Are you sharing your screen? Okay.
- [30:56]
Captain Crackrock
No, no, no, no. I'm just looking at which scripture I want to.
- [30:59]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, you hit share screen there.
- [31:02]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't. I'm not even. I'm on my PowerPoint. I didn't hit. I did, but.
- [31:05]
Jay Dyer
But I'm gonna share when I'm ready. I'm sorry.
- [31:08]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. It's all good. It just got.
- [31:11]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, yeah.
- [31:11]
Jay Dyer
I didn't change the scene.
- [31:12]
Mike (Moderator)
It's all good.
- [31:13]
Captain Crackrock
Yep. I'm okay. Do I get some of my time back for that?
- [31:17]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, yeah. I'll give you. I'll give you back at a minute there.
- [31:20]
Captain Crackrock
Thank you. He did that. I didn't do that. Thank you.
- [31:23]
Mike (Moderator)
It's okay. I forgot to let him know. Just to let me know in advance. Same with you. If you want to do that, just give me a heads up.
- [31:30]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I appreciate it. And Zechariah 12 and 8. This. This is Going to be another question. Remember he talked about that angel of the Lord in Zechariah, chapter 12, verse 8. It says directly. It says, in that day the Lord shall defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and he that is feeble among them in that day shall be as David and the house, not a single person. And the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the Lord before them. One thing that we always forget about is in the text, the angel told Mary that Christ was sitting on the throne of his father David. So David has a coming. So Christ has an earthly father whose throne he's sitting on and a spiritual father who gives him the power to sit on that throne. So where does David fit in that? Because the angel clearly said David was his father. Even Christ said, I am the root and offspring of David. So where does David fit?
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Mike (Moderator)
All right.
- [32:31]
Captain Crackrock
Fit. All right.
- [32:32]
Mike (Moderator)
That was your time, cap. Appreciate you guys. Okay, so we're going to be getting into the 60 minute open dialogue. Try to be as respectful as possible. I really do.
- [32:42]
Jay Dyer
Wait a minute. Is there. There's not a rebuttal?
- [32:44]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. If you guys want to do 5 minute rebuttals to your opening rebuttals.
- [32:48]
Jay Dyer
Because I want to do. I mean, there's too much stuff.
- [32:52]
Captain Crackrock
Can we do that in the Q A? I think it's 50 minutes, right?
- [32:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, we got 50, 60 minutes of the open dialogue, which we can break up into however we want.
- [33:01]
Jay Dyer
They're going to forget all the stuff that was brought up within the first 12 minutes.
- [33:05]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, but I don't want to change it on the fly. Those are the rules of the debate. I think we should.
- [33:09]
Jay Dyer
I didn't get any list of any rules.
- [33:12]
Mike (Moderator)
It's usually three. Three ways that it's broken up. Opening open dialogue. Q and A. The open dialogue. As long as you guys can agree I'm down to do it. However, we always kind of do that on the fly. It should be fine. But we can shorten.
- [33:27]
Jay Dyer
There's no reason why we can't do. Yeah, two five minute rebuttals.
- [33:30]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, you don't have to use the
- [33:31]
Captain Crackrock
whole five minutes to the moderator in the beginning of this conversation and with Jay on the line, I said is 12 minutes, 50 minutes, 40 minutes. There was no mention of a rebuttal. So we have 50 minutes to talk back and forth. He can now.
- [33:45]
Jay Dyer
You are muted.
- [33:46]
Captain Crackrock
I don't.
- [33:46]
Jay Dyer
I didn't hear anything you said.
- [33:48]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, you must have been muted because James responded to me.
- [33:51]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, let's. Let's do this. Remember how we talked about if it gets a little contentious, we were going to break it into timed responses anyways. Let's just consider this a timed response and we'll start it now.
- [34:01]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Let's just include that in the fifth. We don't need a separate or try to change or alter the debate.
- [34:08]
Jay Dyer
You brought up. You brought up like 50 things. I brought up 50 things. Why would we not have a point of clarification about all this stuff that's
- [34:15]
Captain Crackrock
been brought up that should have been said before the 15 minutes came about, like in the beginning, is what I'm saying?
- [34:20]
Jay Dyer
Well, I didn't hear what you. I didn't hear what you agreed to because you were muted.
- [34:24]
Captain Crackrock
I was not muted.
- [34:26]
Jay Dyer
You were muted. He said you were muted.
- [34:29]
Captain Crackrock
James, in the beginning of this debate, before we went live, I spoke to James and ran down, dude, it's five minutes.
- [34:34]
Jay Dyer
What's your problem with five minutes response for me and five minutes response to you that we can do all open form you want, man, it's five minutes. What are you scared of?
- [34:42]
Captain Crackrock
I'm not scared. I just think we're able to stick to within the 50 minutes that we had.
- [34:48]
Jay Dyer
And then also, you're gonna yacht for the next 50 minutes. You're not gonna address any issues. So I want five minutes to address all your nonsense.
- [34:54]
Captain Crackrock
And James, if I could highlight, when Jade speaks, he does pop into the screen, but when I speak, I stay. I don't know if you noticed.
- [35:02]
Mike (Moderator)
I think that's just the way it is on your zoom at the top right hand corner. If you hit gallery view.
- [35:09]
Captain Crackrock
Gallery, you say gallery view?
- [35:10]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, top right corner. Gallery view. Should put it in all three.
- [35:14]
Jay Dyer
So you can't do five minutes in response. Five minutes and then all the. All the open form you want.
- [35:21]
Captain Crackrock
So, James, basically, it was my fault. I appreciate you telling me.
- [35:23]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, no worries. Zoom's a little weird. It messes up what I do sometimes. Let's just start with a two minute time for Jay and then we'll go three minutes. Three minutes Compromise. Okay.
- [35:37]
Captain Crackrock
I do three minute rebuttals.
- [35:38]
Mike (Moderator)
I appreciate that. All right, three minutes. Jay, on the clock when you start. If you could mute up cap, we get that correct over here. Looks like zoom did it again. Chat, get your questions in. It's going to be a fire. Q and A. Okay. Display capture. Okay, here we go. We are transitioning.
- [36:23]
Jay Dyer
Is the screen share working? It looks like it's four screens. There we go. Okay, so in response to the first point, he didn't Hear what I said? Because I specifically made the point that he misunderstood. The word angel does not mean that everybody is a created angel and part of the Trinity. The word angel has different uses. It's a messenger. It's a created angel like Gabriel or a man, or it's a Theophanic angel. As you can see, the Blue Letter Bible, basic Hebrew text, show you the word Malloc can be either of these three things. And I said that he then made a straw man argument that I was saying that every created angelic being or person is a part of the Godhead. So he made a stupid blunder there. And he doesn't listen to the arguments that his opponents are making. And that's why he continually makes this mistake. The same point with the word gods which we brought up last time. I said the same point, that the word God is a generic term that can refer to different things. You heard him at the beginning say, who cares about grammar and proper nouns? Well, it's not a semantic issue. It's a grammatical issue that this person can't understand basic grammar. And that's why he makes half of the mistakes that he makes in Judges six. I said that the text says, according to Jewish scholars like Benjamin Sommer in his book the Bodies of God in the World of Ancient Israel, it says that the text, when the angel messenger here meets with Gideon, it says that Yahweh turned his face to Gideon. So verses 12, 14, 16, and 21 are very crucial for showing that it's Jesus that is the face of Yahweh present here in the Old Testament. I never argued that all of the manifestations are the Son of God or are the angel messenger of the covenant. For example, Gabriel comes to Daniel. He's an angel and he's a creature. But I didn't argue that. He argued something I never said. In John 17. Jesus doesn't just say that the Father is his God, because as I said last time, we believe in monarchical trinitarianism. I said that Jesus refers to the Father as his source because he's eternally begotten. John 1:18 says, Monogones theos. That means the. The eternally begotten God. So you'll notice in John 17, he didn't leave. He didn't quote the part where Jesus says, I glorify you. I had glory with you before the foundation of the world. No creature can claim to have the same glory with the Father before the foundation of the world, or else they would be absolutely blasphemous idolaters. In the text that he referenced about from Paul, where Paul says that the head of every man is Christ. Excuse me, woman is Christ. Every man. The head of every man is Christ. The head of every woman is man. Head of Christ is God. Paul explains what he means by that in First Corinthians 8, 6, where he says that for us there is one God, the Father. So he says, you can't say that that's the Father in that passage. Yes I can. Because in First Corinthians 8. 6, Paul clarifies that the one God is the Father. This is monarchical trinitarianism, as we said. So on top of that, if you look at the passage in Hebrews, what he says that. Okay, the, the throne, by the way, is this throne in heaven?
- [39:49]
Captain Crackrock
Yep.
- [39:52]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, appreciate you guys making that compromise there. I was left out in the beginning of the email chains as well. Just let you know. So apologies that we couldn't have that beforehand for you, Cap, but I going to go ahead and turn over to your three minutes whenever you start talking.
- [40:11]
Captain Crackrock
Can you hear me all right.
- [40:12]
Mike (Moderator)
Yep.
- [40:14]
Captain Crackrock
All right, I'll start talking. That three minutes was a total waste of time. And again, this is a semantic argument. This debate is not is Jesus the angel of the Lord? And we've already proven, and he's even proven that the angel of the Lord also applies to other people. I read it. I thought he was going to rebut the scripture where it directly called Malachi the angel of the Lord. So if Malachi is the angels of David shall be as God and the angel of the lord. Even in First Corinthians 8, when he says, but to us there is but one God, the Father, that kills the argument. One God, that Father is the one God. What are we doing here? Talk about multiple and trinities and all that stuff like that. And then the rest of it says and one Lord Jesus Christ. That word Lord. There's curios, the same Lord that's applied to Abraham in first Peters 3 and 8 when Sarah called Abraham Lord. So again, I don't know why we had this three minutes. So when you said I, I can't believe he did that. And then when he says, glorify me with the glory that I had, nobody could lay claim that they had glory with the Father before the world. Nobody's making that argument. Nobody's taking the power that God gave his son. What I'm taking away is the lie of trinitarianism that they all make up that God because he's never going to produce one verse that says the Father, Son, Holy Spirit are one God. He's never going to produce it. But he just read a verse from Paul, First Corinthians 8 and 6, that says to us. And why is Paul even saying that? Because in the top part, first 1 Corinthians 8 and 5, it says, for though there be that are called gods, like y' all making Jesus God, for those there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, as there be gods many and Lords many, but to us there is one God, the Father. Why is, why is Paul even saying that? Because he knows Deuteronomy 6 and 4. He knows Psalms 83 and 18. He even said Romans 15. 4 whatsoever was written. The fourth time was for our learning, that through patience and comfort of the scriptures, we might have hope. Nowhere in the Torah does it say anybody is God. Excuse me, anybody is the most High God, except the most High. So if he got a verse that said the Father, Son, and the Holy spirit are God.
- [42:38]
Jay Dyer
30 seconds. Anyone?
- [42:39]
Captain Crackrock
Just get ready, y', all, for a 50 minute field of semantics from my opponent. I am solid with Christ's words, with God's words, with Paul's words, with Peter's words, with everybody words that the Father is God and Christ is the Son of God.
- [42:58]
Mike (Moderator)
Alain, awesome. Appreciate that. We can, we can get a little bit more open here. You guys can ask some questions back and forth regarding what we just did, or you can make a different statement if you'd like. Chat is going crazy right now. We got 3, 000 people in here. Please. Like the video. Appreciate everybody showing up. Yeah, it's, it's going, it's going right now. So go ahead, Jay. We're going to kick it over to you. And I'm not going to start any timers or anything unless we explicitly need it or if you really want it.
- [43:30]
Jay Dyer
He says that I need to show a verse that says the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit is God. This assumes that there's some criteria that he's made up that to believe a doctrine, it must be explicitly stated in the text. Of course. Do you have a verse that tells you explicitly what books make up the Bible? Yeah.
- [43:51]
Captain Crackrock
No, I would say. Oh, you don't? No, I would say.
- [43:56]
Jay Dyer
Okay, so you don't have to abide by that criterion.
- [43:59]
Mike (Moderator)
Let's, let's let him get the full response out there, Jay, and then you can ask your next question, please.
- [44:06]
Captain Crackrock
Great moderation. Thank you. I don't make a position or take a position or present a Position about the books of the Bible to have to show that verse. You're making a position. You're interrupting again.
- [44:21]
Jay Dyer
It's a cross examination. He said we can do that.
- [44:24]
Captain Crackrock
You're taking the position that the Trinity is in the Bible, so you're saying something explicit. I'm taking the position that God the Father is the only God. So I'm taking that position because when I read the Bible, Jesus. On my counter question, did Jesus say the Father was the one true God? Yes or no?
- [44:45]
Jay Dyer
He is the one true God in the sense of monarchical trinitarianism.
- [44:49]
Captain Crackrock
Wait, I just. So, yes, he did. Yes. Jesus said that the Father. Not your filibustering, answer my position. He directly said that the Father is the one true God. Correct.
- [45:03]
Jay Dyer
That's monarchical trinitarianism. Correct.
- [45:06]
Captain Crackrock
Okay. Monarchical trinitarianism is not in the Bible because one can't be.
- [45:10]
Jay Dyer
Well, you can say that, but that's my position.
- [45:12]
Captain Crackrock
No, I'm not saying that. One is mono. That's what mono is. One. And if Christ said the Father is mono, you can't call it mono. Trinitaire. As if.
- [45:24]
Jay Dyer
Because there's other passages. There's other. I can. Because there's other passages that also refer to the Son and the Holy Spirit as God, because the word God's a generic term which you don't understand.
- [45:36]
Captain Crackrock
All three together are referred to as God.
- [45:40]
Jay Dyer
You just admitted that we don't have to follow the principle that a verse has to explicitly state it to believe it's.
- [45:46]
Captain Crackrock
No, I did not say that.
- [45:47]
Jay Dyer
Yes, you did. You said you don't have to. You said there's no verses. You said there's no verse that lays out the books of the Bible, and you're not bound to that. Right. So why do I have to have a specific verse that has the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit of the Trinitarian God.
- [46:00]
Captain Crackrock
I would only be held to that standard if I created a false doctrine of this is the criteria for books of the Bible.
- [46:07]
Jay Dyer
No.
- [46:08]
Captain Crackrock
So you created Christ.
- [46:10]
Jay Dyer
You're begging the question. You admit in principle. No. You admit in principle a doctrine doesn't have to be explicit.
- [46:20]
Mike (Moderator)
Captain, let Jay say that point real quick, and then I'll let you respond.
- [46:23]
Jay Dyer
Kevin, he admitted that a doctrine can be believed that is not specifically stated in a verse. And so I'm saying, yeah, the Trinity is not a doctrine explicitly stated in a verse, just like the Bible is not explicitly listed in a single verse. So he doesn't have that criterion for his views. It's Not a criterion. That's on my view.
- [46:42]
Captain Crackrock
That's too.
- [46:43]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, go ahead.
- [46:45]
Captain Crackrock
He just admitted it's not in the Bible and he admitted that Christ said.
- [46:48]
Jay Dyer
You admitted that your position is not the Bible either.
- [46:50]
Captain Crackrock
So that's the point. I don't. My position. My position on this debate is in the Bible. I haven't taken.
- [46:56]
Jay Dyer
You don't even understand the argument I'm making.
- [46:58]
Captain Crackrock
You presented a hypothetical question. Question. But I didn't take a position. Yes, you did. You talked about the book.
- [47:05]
Jay Dyer
You admitted that it's. You admitted the canon is not in the Bible.
- [47:11]
Captain Crackrock
Is the one true God.
- [47:13]
Jay Dyer
You can just restate your position. But you just admitted that I don't have to give that level of Christ. It's a false criteria.
- [47:20]
Captain Crackrock
It's not a false criteria.
- [47:22]
Jay Dyer
You just admitted that.
- [47:23]
Captain Crackrock
You don't have to do that.
- [47:24]
Jay Dyer
It's a double standard. You know what a double standard is?
- [47:27]
Captain Crackrock
What you're trying to waste time on.
- [47:29]
Jay Dyer
You know what a double standard is?
- [47:30]
Captain Crackrock
You want to waste time on double standard books of the Bible. That is not.
- [47:34]
Jay Dyer
Because that's a fallacy. I'm not wasting time. If you're.
- [47:36]
Captain Crackrock
If you're setting up a fallacious argument. I'm. I once I got you to admit that Trinity is not in the Bible.
- [47:43]
Jay Dyer
I didn't say that. I said it's not in one verse, you idiot.
- [47:47]
Captain Crackrock
It's not in any verse.
- [47:49]
Jay Dyer
No, there ain't.
- [47:50]
Captain Crackrock
No.
- [47:50]
Jay Dyer
I gave you dozens of verses.
- [47:52]
Captain Crackrock
Give me one.
- [47:53]
Jay Dyer
Listen. I gave dozens of verses. Let me finish my point. I gave dozens of verses because I believe it's a doctrine that is derived from hundreds of texts. It's not a doctrine that's found in one verse. And I said you don't even have that same criteria for your own view. That's why it's a double standard.
- [48:11]
Captain Crackrock
I don't have a view that you telling me I have to have a criteria for you're trying to place. Are you listening? That's not my view.
- [48:18]
Jay Dyer
Show me a verse that says Trinity.
- [48:20]
Captain Crackrock
That's what you said, right? That I did. Because you're pushing a false doctrine. Once I got you to admit that
- [48:27]
Jay Dyer
that's what you think. That's the fact that you think it's false. Doesn't matter. That doesn't mean your criteria is consistent.
- [48:33]
Captain Crackrock
Like I said in opening statement.
- [48:35]
Jay Dyer
Do you even understand the argument that's being made? Do you even understand the argument? Can you understand my argument? I don't think you do.
- [48:41]
Captain Crackrock
Can you try again to help. You need to help us Understand this dumb argument. Can you try?
- [48:45]
Jay Dyer
You. You have laid a criteria upon me that you don't support.
- [48:48]
Captain Crackrock
No, no, no, no, no.
- [48:50]
Mike (Moderator)
Let him. Let him finish what he's trying to restate as the argument, and then you can. You can give your response.
- [48:55]
Captain Crackrock
Okay, wait, you're talking to me, James?
- [48:57]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, yeah. And someone super chatted me. Wanted me to let you know my name is Mike, actually, so.
- [49:02]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, it's James on the.
- [49:03]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, we use the company Zoom, but it's all good.
- [49:08]
Jay Dyer
What is argument?
- [49:09]
Mike (Moderator)
Let me. Let me just let Jay say his point real quick, and then we'll give you your time.
- [49:13]
Jay Dyer
The argument is a fallacious question in a line of argumentation. That is not. It doesn't hold up. It's not a valid line of argumentation because it's a fallacious question that assumes an impossible criteria that he doesn't hold for his own positions. That's why it's a double standard. There is no verse that says this is the Trinity doctrine. And I didn't argue that there was. I said it's a doctrine derived from dozens of texts. And I pointed out that he doesn't even hold that old standard for himself because there's no verse that says what the books of the Bible are supposed to be. So he admits in principle that you can believe your position without it being explicit in scripture.
- [49:48]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Cap, go ahead.
- [49:50]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah. He won't answer. That is not the question that's on the table right now.
- [49:54]
Jay Dyer
It's illustrating a fallacy.
- [49:56]
Captain Crackrock
You got to be quiet, dude. Thank you.
- [49:59]
Jay Dyer
You're not answering the question.
- [50:01]
Captain Crackrock
I. I'm. First of all, you can't do fallacy. Technically. You might told me to be quiet for you to answer.
- [50:07]
Jay Dyer
You're not doing.
- [50:08]
Captain Crackrock
You're doing your question like you can't say I'm not. There's no question for me.
- [50:13]
Jay Dyer
It's a double standard fallacy.
- [50:14]
Captain Crackrock
I'm responding to your response.
- [50:16]
Mike (Moderator)
Guys, want to go back to timed responses?
- [50:18]
Jay Dyer
Sure.
- [50:18]
Captain Crackrock
No, no, we don't need no time response. J just should be quiet while I'm responding. Like I was quiet.
- [50:23]
Jay Dyer
Are you not going to have a fallacy then I'll. I'll be quiet.
- [50:26]
Captain Crackrock
Once again, I'm responding to your response when I'm done. So now my response to Jay is I wasn't asking any no anymore about showing me Trinity in the Bible. He already admitted that he could not. Then he made the statement no, now you're lying. You want me to explain? I said, yes, explain your position. So now we'll move past the first question, sins.
- [50:54]
Jay Dyer
I didn't say that. You're lying. Moderator. Moderator. Yeah, I specifically said that there's not a single verse that says the Trinity. That's what I said. He's lying when I. He's lying. When I said Trinity is not in the Bible. I said it's from dozens of verses. It's a lot.
- [51:10]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I did hear him say dozens of verses as kind of like a. Like he's come. It's compiled into an idea that is. Is elucidated through the. Through the compilation.
- [51:20]
Jay Dyer
And he asked for a single verse.
- [51:23]
Captain Crackrock
I'm trying to move to that. He's. Keep talking. He keeps talking.
- [51:28]
Mike (Moderator)
Clarify what. What exactly you're trying to move to, Captain, Just so we can see.
- [51:32]
Captain Crackrock
So my first question was, is Trinity in the Bible? He asked me about the books of the Bible. He said I was a logical fallacy. No, he said he can't.
- [51:40]
Jay Dyer
You said a single verse. Stop lying. You're a liar.
- [51:45]
Captain Crackrock
You said asking me the question, but you're not telling him to be quiet.
- [51:49]
Jay Dyer
But you told me because you're lying again.
- [51:51]
Captain Crackrock
You're misrepresenting.
- [51:53]
Jay Dyer
Misrepresenting the argument on purpose because you're a liar.
- [51:55]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I get. I get where Jay's coming from. Trying jump in to just clarify what he thinks is being said specifically versus what, you know, you think you're saying. So let's. For the sake of the audience, real quick, let's. Let's go back to timed responses so it's super clear what. Who's saying what.
- [52:11]
Captain Crackrock
I just want to move past this part. We can go past this portion of the question. I'm. I'm fine with it. For whatever reason, he wants to stay here. I don't need to keep asking this because you want.
- [52:21]
Jay Dyer
You can't stop lying about what I said. You're incapable of accurately.
- [52:28]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't lie about anything you said. I just disagree.
- [52:32]
Jay Dyer
No, you lied about. You said that. I said there's no verses, and I admitted it. No, I didn't. I admitted that there's not a single verse. That's what you asked for.
- [52:39]
Captain Crackrock
Let me try this one more time. When I said, you said there's no verse. You're no verse. What I was asking for. That's what I said. I said. I asked, is there reverse that says the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are God? And you said, that's not in the Bible. That's what I'm talking about. Because. Okay, how are you gonna say correct now you see what I'm saying?
- [53:01]
Jay Dyer
Because you just changed the position.
- [53:02]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I think it was. That was my first question. Okay. I think it was.
- [53:06]
Captain Crackrock
That was my first question.
- [53:08]
Jay Dyer
Says you're lying, dude. They already caught you lying.
- [53:10]
Captain Crackrock
Mike, was that my first question?
- [53:12]
Mike (Moderator)
I think it might have been stated. This might have been stated slightly different, which is why I gave Jay that impression.
- [53:19]
Captain Crackrock
Mike, when y' all go back and play this tape, you're gonna see me say, is there a verse in the Bible that says you can't.
- [53:25]
Jay Dyer
You're not capable?
- [53:27]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, well, we'll. We'll let that.
- [53:29]
Captain Crackrock
I even said it in my 12. Let me ask you something. All right, so what I'm saying.
- [53:33]
Jay Dyer
Let me ask you something.
- [53:35]
Mike (Moderator)
None of us. Yeah, none of us want to waste any more time in this. We got a lot of people watching right now. So what we're gonna do. What we're gonna do is we're gonna move on. We'll let. We'll let that get. Get scored points wise after the debate, and then we'll. We'll just go to the next point if we could.
- [53:53]
Jay Dyer
Who decides what that is?
- [53:55]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, I thought you guys. I thought you guys kind of had a road map back to trinitarian versus Unitarian on that.
- [54:00]
Captain Crackrock
I technically asked the last question. We would just talk about. So he has the right to ask. Yeah.
- [54:07]
Jay Dyer
Do you hear me say that every angel is God?
- [54:11]
Captain Crackrock
No. You said the way you broke it down was that when you see this angel of the Lord, the way you presented it was that when you see the angel of the Lord, it was a precursor to Christ.
- [54:22]
Jay Dyer
But I didn't say that.
- [54:24]
Captain Crackrock
I'm just telling you you can always clear it up when you respond again.
- [54:30]
Jay Dyer
Can you ever represent a person's position or accurately at all, ever?
- [54:36]
Captain Crackrock
I think your position was ignorant because you started referencing.
- [54:39]
Jay Dyer
I don't care what you think. Can you just
- [54:44]
Mike (Moderator)
accurately. Let's let captain get the point out, Jay. And if you disagree and you think it's misrepresented or a lie or anything like that, I'll give you more than enough time to respond.
- [54:53]
Jay Dyer
You're have to go to time responses. This is not. This is talking to a child.
- [54:57]
Mike (Moderator)
All right? We're gonna do. We're gonna do two to three minutes back and forth, so everybody has plenty of time. If you don't want to use the whole time, you can concede. If you ask a question that's going to concede your time.
- [55:07]
Jay Dyer
Time.
- [55:07]
Captain Crackrock
Okay, recommendation. Can we have 30 seconds to ask the question, 60 minutes to response. That way we can ask more questions
- [55:14]
Mike (Moderator)
or 60 seconds yeah, that would be better than an hour there, but yeah.
- [55:19]
Captain Crackrock
Okay.
- [55:19]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, so if you want to listen, whoever's getting asked the question, do your best to keep.
- [55:26]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, he was asking me the question. He can react if he wants to.
- [55:29]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, so, Jay, I think your claim is. It's a misrepresentation of the position. So just go ahead, give that.
- [55:36]
Jay Dyer
Early on, he argued that his position mean every angel, God, every angel be in the Trinity. That's what he said. I did not argue that. Again, totally. It's a total straw man policy.
- [55:48]
Captain Crackrock
But what's your question?
- [55:50]
Jay Dyer
Did you hear me say every angel was in the Trinity or part of God?
- [55:54]
Captain Crackrock
No, that's not what I said. I said the way you did say that.
- [55:57]
Jay Dyer
You did say that.
- [55:59]
Captain Crackrock
It's supposed to be a minute of silence. That's what we just agreed.
- [56:03]
Jay Dyer
I'm not going to let you just lie about everything.
- [56:05]
Captain Crackrock
I'm not lying. What I said was.
- [56:07]
Jay Dyer
You said every member, every angels in the Trinity. You said that the first. Every angel would be in the Trinity.
- [56:13]
Captain Crackrock
You said that you can't even follow the rules. That we just all agreed.
- [56:16]
Jay Dyer
You just keep lying.
- [56:17]
Captain Crackrock
It's open debate. It's a 60 second silent response.
- [56:23]
Jay Dyer
You're lying.
- [56:25]
Captain Crackrock
It doesn't matter. Listen, it doesn't matter.
- [56:27]
Jay Dyer
Exactly. Thank you for admitting your lie. Exactly.
- [56:31]
Captain Crackrock
Whatever. But I'm supposed to. 60 seconds. The moderator. Mike, you're supposed to enforce my 60 second response. Yeah, it's not happening here, man.
- [56:41]
Jay Dyer
Like, did you hear me say that I will.
- [56:43]
Mike (Moderator)
I will start using the mute button from, from here on. But it's gonna.
- [56:48]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah.
- [56:48]
Jay Dyer
When we just have time responses.
- [56:50]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I was, I was trying to do the time response there.
- [56:52]
Captain Crackrock
60 seconds is a time response. You can't be quiet.
- [56:56]
Jay Dyer
You said that if I ask a question, it's. That counts as my 60 seconds.
- [57:01]
Captain Crackrock
No, I just said 30 seconds to ask the question. 60 seconds to respond. You agree? If you're done asking the question.
- [57:12]
Jay Dyer
Who said I was done?
- [57:14]
Captain Crackrock
You see how stupid this white man is?
- [57:17]
Jay Dyer
Oh, here he goes to the race stuff. Because he hates white. His whole cult. His whole cult is based on hating white people. He can't do grammar, so he hates white people. Your whole cult is about hating white people, you idiots.
- [57:30]
Captain Crackrock
Let me know when you finish.
- [57:31]
Jay Dyer
Notice that it comes out right.
- [57:32]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, let's, let's, let's go back to the question one more time.
- [57:37]
Jay Dyer
And he stated that my argument would mean that every person in the trend, every angel in the Old Testament becomes part of the Trinity. Explicitly said that I wrote it down when he said it. Now he's saying you didn't say it. And I asked him, did you hear me make that argument? That's a straw man. That's a fallacy.
- [57:53]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay now Captain, I'm going to mute him on your response, but we're going to keep it to a short 30 second response to that.
- [58:01]
Captain Crackrock
All I said was the way he presented it, meaning whether he thought he was saying it or not, the way he presented it by the scriptures that he presented was as if he was saying all the ain't. When you see the angel of the Lord, you're seeing God. That's why my response was it must be the angels in the Trinity as well. That's how it was presented to me. I didn't say he did anything directly. That's why I said the way he presented it. I was clear. And I even went to the scriptures that he went to when he's. For example, when he says Jacob wrestled that angel, that angel is not God. But the way he presented it as if it was or would be Samson's parents. As if it was or would be. So he may not have thought that's what he was doing, but that's how he presented it to me. Very clean.
- [58:49]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, Jay, you can unmute now.
- [58:52]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, again, this is a fundamentally just incapable of grammar per and it's not semantics, it's actually just basic grammar. I said specifically in my opening statement that the word angel. I even showed you the Hebrew text from Strongs that it's three different possible meanings. I never argue that every angel I said specifically in the verses that I referenced in my opening statement. All those Genesis passages, they refer to this angel as Yahweh, as Lord, as seeing God face to face as being worshiped. You're not allowed to worship a creature. A creature in the sense of Latria. There is honoring and revering a creature like Joseph bowing before Pharaoh. But that's not the same thing as worshiping in terms of adoration a the uncreated God. And you can't call creatures God or Yahweh. That's why the angel in Exodus 3 and Exodus 23 has the name of Yahweh in him. So that's what I said. And he just ignored all of that and said, oh, he gonna go to a bunch of grammar and all these. These semantics. Yeah, grammar and semantics matter when it comes to interpreting these passages. So again, what I said still holds. He didn't actually address any of the points. He's talking around it and. Okay, he asked for a position.
- [60:11]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. That could be your last statement, and then we'll turn it over.
- [60:14]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. He asks for a position that he himself admits he doesn't have to follow a specific verse that lists the doctrine.
- [60:23]
Captain Crackrock
All right, where in the. Where in the Old Testament estimate is the Trinity?
- [60:29]
Jay Dyer
The doctrine of the Trinity is derived from dozens of verses throughout the Old and New Testament. And I listed all of the passages in the Torah in my opening statement that we derive this doctrine from. That show the Father. That show the angel messenger as divine, having the same powers as the Father that sent him to remit sins, to redeem, to do miraculous works and powers, and the Holy Spirit as well. All three of those persons are given the same power and attributes throughout the Torah. And that shows the Torah teaches the Trinity.
- [61:03]
Captain Crackrock
If we see angels using that same power outside of what? Whatever angel of the Lord that you say is Jesus, whatever Holy Spirit you say is separate. If we see angels outside of that doing the same thing, if we see men outside of that doing the same thing, how can you isolate and say this is Trinity? Because we don't see Trinity in the Old Testament. We don't see Trinity in the New Testament, but we can see the same men and other angels doing the same works that you're saying is the coming of a Trinity. So, again, can we get a verse instead of rhetoric that we can dissect something, go over that leads to. That leads to a trinity? Like, give me a verse that says, okay, this is a sign of a coming Trinity. I'm asking for a verse, not rhetoric.
- [61:50]
Jay Dyer
I didn't give rhetoric. I gave you dozens of verses. I gave you every theophany in my opening statement, which I'm arguing proves the Trinity. How do I know when a theophany is God or when it's a created angelic being? Well, usually the text helpfully identifies that. For example, when it calls that the often is God or Yahweh.
- [62:08]
Mike (Moderator)
One second, guys. They're saying the streams. I don't know if they're trolling or not. Mute.
- [62:16]
Captain Crackrock
And I'm asking for a verse to go.
- [62:17]
Mike (Moderator)
I don't think anything's muted, guys.
- [62:20]
Captain Crackrock
No, we hear. I hear you. I mean, I guess we would hear each other. So that don't.
- [62:25]
Mike (Moderator)
What the heck. Yeah, no, I think you guys just got to refresh the page. If. If that's the problem. Everyone posting the thing to refresh the page to those audio trolls. There's a lot of people saying it, so that's not cool. All right, sorry. To interrupt, guys.
- [62:42]
Captain Crackrock
No, that's fine. I'm asking for a verse to go over that he's saying is Trinity. I'm not asking for him to say. I just want to finish.
- [62:52]
Jay Dyer
Again, I gave you an entire finished class.
- [62:56]
Captain Crackrock
I just want to finish. To clarify, I'm not asking you for what you did in your 12 minutes, as I, in this 12 minutes, gave
- [63:02]
Jay Dyer
you what you're asking for.
- [63:03]
Captain Crackrock
More like, you got to learn how to have some patience, man. So like, I, in my 50 minutes, quoted two verses, John 17, I think First Corinthians. So I'm asking you give me a verse where we can say, this points to the Trinity.
- [63:22]
Jay Dyer
And we get that you're a fundamentally ignorant person because you already admitted that my position doesn't come from a verse that teaches Trinity. It's from dozens of verses, all collated, that teach the Trinity.
- [63:36]
Captain Crackrock
I don't know.
- [63:36]
Jay Dyer
There's not one verse. You're asking for action.
- [63:39]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, no problem. Let's go through your litany of verses where we can dissect them. And you could say, okay, see, this is Jesus or this is God.
- [63:48]
Jay Dyer
I'm gonna give you the first instance leads to it.
- [63:51]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, that. That's all I'm asking. I mean, what's so hard? I mean, a child can understand the question.
- [63:55]
Jay Dyer
I'm going to give you the first instance, and I'm going to quote. And can I have my time response?
- [64:00]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I'll start it right now. And I just want to let the chat know I don't have control over the speed of chat. I'm not logged into that aspect of it. If James is watching, he could do that.
- [64:10]
Captain Crackrock
I haven't spoken on. On his time response this whole time since it's been time. Only he has.
- [64:17]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, as long as you guys can just return the favor if I do the timer. All right, here we go. I appreciate you for respecting it. And we'll get to it right when Jay starts.
- [64:29]
Jay Dyer
So one of the many. There's dozens of theophanies in the Old Testament. I listed just the ones in the Torah. Stepping outside the Torah, we can come over to Judges six, and I'm going to quote the non trinitarian Jewish scholar who's very well known. This is a Cambridge companion text. Benjamin Sommer in his book Bodies of God in the Ancient near east, he says the reader may share some of Gideon's confusion. The text identifies the speaker in verses 14 and 16 as Yahweh. Yahweh's Malak. That's the angel that we Just saw in the strongs that says it can be three different categories. Right. So we're going to use Judges six as a test case. How would we know whether it's the uncreated, the authentic manifestation, or there's a created being like Gabriel or a human messenger like John the Baptist? Verses 12, 20 and 21 use the word malach. Gideon's visitor is sometimes speaks in the first person of God, God, verses 14 and 16, and sometimes in the third person, verses 12. One might want to argue that Yahweh is in heaven, but speaks through a divine being sent to earth, specifically Yahweh, who turns his face towards Gideon in verse 14. At the same time, we are told that this is Yahweh's malak, or angel messenger. It was the malak who left the place. Verse 21. So it's not the Father. Because Jesus says in John 5, no one sees the Father at any time. The Father has no form, but the Father has a representative face of Yahweh. That means he's uncreated and he's God because God's glory is eternal. That is the person of Christ who is their meeting. And Jesus says from John 5 to John 9 many times over that he's the one appearing in the Old Testament as this theophanic messenger of the Lord. So there's one example right there. Yahweh turns his face to Gideon.
- [66:22]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, that was two minutes. Perfect.
- [66:24]
Captain Crackrock
And then that's a quick. If you could have a 30 second. Well, just a quick response. You said Christ said in John where. That he was the one.
- [66:34]
Jay Dyer
Where is that at chapters five through nine, as he debates the Pharisees, he explains that he was the one talking to Abraham and Moses.
- [66:43]
Captain Crackrock
John, chapter five and what Verse five through nine.
- [66:47]
Jay Dyer
All those chapters are debates about him and the Pharisees.
- [66:50]
Captain Crackrock
I'll give. So you're saying from John chapter 5 all the way through 9. I disagree with that as well. Okay.
- [66:56]
Jay Dyer
I mean, he says it, but you can disagree.
- [66:58]
Captain Crackrock
He doesn't. He doesn't say it at all. In Judges, it just says angel of the Lord. It doesn't say Jesus unless you're saying Jesus is the name. Doesn't.
- [67:08]
Jay Dyer
You're not here.
- [67:08]
Captain Crackrock
The argument I made, the reason. I know the argument.
- [67:11]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I think he was talking about John. And if you could address that. And then we'll go to Judges.
- [67:18]
Captain Crackrock
No, no, no. He did Judges first.
- [67:22]
Mike (Moderator)
I might have missed that. I'm trying to keep track of the super chats as well. Guys, this is a one Man Job.
- [67:27]
Captain Crackrock
No, I got you. And I shouldn't be interrupted again. Jay keeps interrupting and you're not saying nothing. Mike. I'm quiet every time a moderator moderates. So now and judges ask me a question.
- [67:42]
Mike (Moderator)
That was the only reason I didn't jump in. I thought it was the answer after
- [67:45]
Captain Crackrock
he answered the question of the verses, and I go to speak. There's no reason for him to speak again. He gave the verses. I mean. I mean, I don't know how long y' all been debating. I've been debating a long time. And judges, the sixth chapter. When you use the criteria. Here's what Trinitarians do. Trinitarians want to pick and choose what angel of the Lord. They want to make Jesus because they know they can't make every angel of the Lord be Jesus. So I disagree with a criteria where you say an angel in John. Excuse me. Judges 6:12. The angel of the Lord appeared unto him and said unto him, the Lord is with thee. Because we can see angel of the Lord refer to Malachi. We can see angel of the Lord refer to other angels. We can see angel of the Lord in other places. We can see where there. They say they seen God. So what Trinitarians want you to believe is that these verses that they decide to pick lead to Jesus being God. Follow up. I got two more questions, and then you can ask me three questions, because I would have asked you three questions. In Luke, the first chapter, the angel tells Mary that he's going to sit on the throne of his father, David. I'm assuming you agree with that. Yes or no? So where does David fit in the pantheon of the Trinity? Trinity.
- [68:57]
Jay Dyer
If you look at the book of Hebrews in Hebrews 10, it explains that he sat at the right hand of the throne, and that's quoting Psalm 110 from Hebrews. Hebrews 7 quotes the Melchizedek that he sat on the right hand of the father to inherit the throne of David when he ascended. It's in heaven. Hebrews 7 and Hebrews 10.
- [69:19]
Captain Crackrock
I don't think you understand the question. Where does. If. No answer. You're telling me that Jesus is God, so you're telling me God is sitting on a human man's throne?
- [69:30]
Jay Dyer
No, no, no.
- [69:33]
Captain Crackrock
Christ. Christ is sitting on the throne of his father David. That's what the text says. So where does.
- [69:41]
Jay Dyer
Answered your question. You didn't hear me. You're not. You don't listen.
- [69:45]
Captain Crackrock
David's throne is on earth. No, it's not.
- [69:48]
Jay Dyer
No, it's not. That's my answer. It's in heaven. Hebrews 7 and Hebrews 10 say that.
- [69:53]
Captain Crackrock
So David. So there won't be no kingdom on earth?
- [69:56]
Jay Dyer
No.
- [69:58]
Captain Crackrock
So when Christ says, our Father, which are the heavens, thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Where is that?
- [70:06]
Jay Dyer
In the church. The church is the kingdom.
- [70:09]
Captain Crackrock
Where's the kingdom?
- [70:11]
Jay Dyer
The church is the kingdom. Matthew 16:18.
- [70:14]
Captain Crackrock
Where?
- [70:15]
Jay Dyer
The Orthodox church. That's where.
- [70:17]
Captain Crackrock
So. So the church is the kingdom.
- [70:20]
Jay Dyer
Matthew 16:18. The church is the kingdom.
- [70:22]
Captain Crackrock
Yes. What is it ruling?
- [70:25]
Jay Dyer
Rules the church? You don't know the Matthew 16 passage? 16:18.
- [70:29]
Captain Crackrock
Kingdoms don't rule. Kingdoms don't rule. A church?
- [70:32]
Jay Dyer
Kingdom don't rule. No church. You don't even know grammar. Kingdom don't rule.
- [70:35]
Captain Crackrock
What do you mean rules?
- [70:36]
Jay Dyer
The people.
- [70:37]
Captain Crackrock
They don't rule. Rules land. When the Romans had their kingdom, ruled the land.
- [70:41]
Jay Dyer
What are you talking about? All right, you don't even. You can't even grammar. What are you talking about? Kingdom.
- [70:47]
Captain Crackrock
Don't relate. My last question, like I said, three questions. It's brutal.
- [70:52]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, we got about, we got about 12 minutes left in the, in the, in the, in the hour here. And we'll get to the Q&As, but I think that was your last one. Okay.
- [71:03]
Captain Crackrock
No, I was saying I was going to ask three.
- [71:04]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, yeah. I'm just making sure we're on the last one so we can turn it back over to Jason
- [71:10]
Captain Crackrock
in the Trinity. So God is following the priesthood of another man in male Chester Day. That's my question.
- [71:21]
Jay Dyer
Can I answer now?
- [71:23]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, absolutely.
- [71:25]
Jay Dyer
Right. So he didn't hear anything. He doesn't listen when a person answers. He's just wanting to yacht in response. I specifically answered his questions perfectly. I said Hebrews 7 says that Melchizedek had a priesthood that was a type of Christ's priesthood. Actually, Christ himself fulfills the Melchizedekian priesthood according to Hebrews 7. And it says in Hebrews 10 that this man Christ, after he had offered sins or offered sacrifice for sins, once forever sat down at the right hand of God. That's referring to the ascension. Sitting at the right hand of God is the fulfillment of Psalm 110. Every time it's cited in the New Testament, it's about the ascension. I don't think he even knows what the ascension is. But, but that's when Jesus ascended at the beginning of the Book of Acts. And you have, for example, Peter, you have, for example, Hebrews citing Psalm 110. Jesus himself cited it in the Gospels affirming that the ascension is when he sat at the right hand of the Father to fulfill the typological promise that ruling in the Davidic kingdom, which is the church, is his kingdom. Matthew 16:18 specifically identifies the church as the kingdom of God and that Peter in that case has the keys that he forgives and remits and retains sins. In Matthew 18, Jesus says that that same power is given to all the apostles to remit and retain sins. The office of the keys. But the Matthew 16:16 18 passage tells us that the kingdom is the church. But he doesn't know that. He thinks that his church comes from Harriet Tubman and some made up superstitious nonsense because he's in a cult.
- [73:01]
Captain Crackrock
I'm going to yield to him. I'm just going to take about 15 seconds. I just want everybody to pay attention. When I asked them, where does David fit in that he didn't have an answer.
- [73:08]
Jay Dyer
Hebrews 7, Hebrews 10.
- [73:10]
Captain Crackrock
When I asked him about Jesus following the order of another man, I don't think people pay attention. He would have to say Melchizedek is a part of the Trinity because there's no way you're going to tell me that a God is about to follow the priesthood of another man. With that, he has the right to access three questions.
- [73:31]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Jay, go ahead. This is going to be basically the final five, six minutes of this middle section. And you can, you can definitely turn it over. Get a question cap. He can interrupt when he's asking these questions just to remind you, so don't get upset about it. I know, I know you didn't. It's just the way, you know, if he's cross examining your position, he wants to get to his next point quick.
- [73:56]
Captain Crackrock
But you know what, you should have said that because I thought we were still under the rules of our question. He has the time to answer. If I would have known that, I could have interject.
- [74:05]
Mike (Moderator)
I just let you kind of set that because you're being very generous with his response time that you wanted to give him. He never took the whole 30 seconds though.
- [74:12]
Captain Crackrock
So I thought that's, that's not fair, Mike, because I thought the rule, the reason why I was quiet, because if
- [74:19]
Mike (Moderator)
you want to do 30 second responses, it's not a problem. Interrupt and keep you to it because it seemed like you guys, guys were, you guys were doing well.
- [74:29]
Captain Crackrock
I just want the same respect I gave.
- [74:31]
Mike (Moderator)
Absolutely. All right, Jay, well then if you could just, if you could just ask your question, give them the, the time to respond. Even if you want to hurry and get to the next point, we'll, we'll, we'll give them that full time. It's, it's only fair.
- [74:43]
Captain Crackrock
Okay, thank you. Right.
- [74:46]
Jay Dyer
Can you tell me what equivocation or word concept fallacy is?
- [74:51]
Captain Crackrock
Which you said of the word fallacy is.
- [74:54]
Jay Dyer
Can you tell me what equivocation or a word concept fallacy is? Don't use chat GPT.
- [74:59]
Captain Crackrock
No, I'm gonna actually look it up. I wasn't using chat GPT.
- [75:03]
Jay Dyer
You're looking it up. So you're at a debate, you don't even know the basic terms of it,
- [75:07]
Captain Crackrock
what word fallacy is.
- [75:08]
Jay Dyer
Okay, so you don't know. The answer is you don't know.
- [75:10]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, I don't have a problem. There's nothing wrong with saying, hey, I need to look up word fallacy. There's nothing wrong with saying no, actually
- [75:16]
Jay Dyer
in a debate you can't look up the terms and use chat GPT. I know you don't know that, but
- [75:20]
Captain Crackrock
you can use I just googled it. So if I can't look it up,
- [75:23]
Jay Dyer
that's cares if it's Chad, GB3 or Gemini, dude, it's the same.
- [75:27]
Captain Crackrock
So thank you.
- [75:28]
Jay Dyer
No, that's my time. He doesn't know.
- [75:30]
Captain Crackrock
That's all I wanted.
- [75:31]
Jay Dyer
I wanted to demonstrate that he doesn't
- [75:33]
Captain Crackrock
know answer without the usage of Google. But I will answer.
- [75:37]
Jay Dyer
How are you going to answer without the use of Google when you just googled it?
- [75:40]
Captain Crackrock
Sounds like I didn't look at.
- [75:41]
Jay Dyer
Excuse me,
- [75:45]
Captain Crackrock
I'm going to answer.
- [75:46]
Jay Dyer
Moderator.
- [75:46]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, typically. Typically. Yeah. We don't have time usually for people to do with that unless both parties are wanting to agree to that. But.
- [75:55]
Captain Crackrock
Right. So I didn't look at it. So I would answer.
- [75:58]
Jay Dyer
You didn't look at it. You googled it and didn't look at it. Dude, you're such a liar. You're the biggest liar I've ever debated, man. You just lied non stop. You lied also. You just said you're googling it.
- [76:07]
Captain Crackrock
Hey, I googled it, but I look at it.
- [76:12]
Mike (Moderator)
So what we're gonna do. Yeah, what we're gonna do is we'll let him answer again whether. Yeah, let him answer beyond this point. Let's try not to.
- [76:22]
Jay Dyer
He's answering from Google.
- [76:23]
Mike (Moderator)
I answering from Google.
- [76:25]
Jay Dyer
You just said you googled it.
- [76:27]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't get time to finish and you said you can't do that.
- [76:30]
Jay Dyer
So I just admitted you googled it.
- [76:33]
Captain Crackrock
I axed it off. I have not looked at it. The moderator.
- [76:37]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, the way the way I wanted to go down is. Is after. After this point. Yeah, after this point. Let's not do any extra time to look anything up if you don't know what it is. Just be honest. Say, you know, I don't know. Tell me. Tell me. Or concede to the rest of the argument. But, yeah, let's. Let's move it on.
- [76:56]
Captain Crackrock
Word fallacy sounds to me in a nutshell. When someone makes up a lie based
- [77:00]
Jay Dyer
on what they believe, that's not a word concept fallacy. So no clue what you're talking about?
- [77:05]
Captain Crackrock
Nope.
- [77:07]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Jay, did you have another couple questions there? You. You did?
- [77:11]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah.
- [77:11]
Jay Dyer
So, yeah. So that demonstrates, as I pointed out, which consistently, whether it's the word God or whether it's the word angel, he doesn't know what. What the equivocation mistake that he's making is. The way that we would know the context about whether it's a created being or an uncreated being would be indicated within the text. Indicators within the text, such as, for example, Yahweh having a face, or the manifestations, being called God specifically or being called Yahweh or doing actions that only God could do, like creating or forgiving of sins or redeeming people. So angels who are creative beings can't do that. I want to ask him Next about John 17. He said that.
- [77:53]
Captain Crackrock
Can I look that up? That's a scripture.
- [77:57]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. John 17. He quoted John 17 about the Father, but in verse 5, Jesus says that he has the glory to share with us that he had with the Father before the foundation of the world. How does a creature have glory with the Father before the foundation of the world?
- [78:21]
Captain Crackrock
Because in the creation and like in colossians, in Revelations 3 and 18, when it says, who is the image of God, the firstborn of every creature, the most High is referred to as the ancient of days. That means he's outside of days. The sun is inside of days.
- [78:41]
Jay Dyer
So he's gonna say inside of days. You're making up something. Where is that?
- [78:44]
Captain Crackrock
Inside of days is what I'm saying. Because.
- [78:46]
Jay Dyer
Where is that? Where? You're making that up. Where is that?
- [78:49]
Captain Crackrock
I don't know why I gotta get interrupted.
- [78:51]
Jay Dyer
I just said I can interrupt in this part, you idiot. You already agreed to that.
- [78:55]
Captain Crackrock
I don't know why I gotta be called that.
- [78:58]
Jay Dyer
I can interrupt in this.
- [78:59]
Captain Crackrock
I did not. I did not agree to that five minutes ago.
- [79:03]
Jay Dyer
That I can.
- [79:08]
Mike (Moderator)
Captain, can you just. Can you point out. Can you just point out real quick where the. The. In the days or what the specific.
- [79:16]
Captain Crackrock
Yes.
- [79:17]
Jay Dyer
He's making it up.
- [79:18]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, that's. Well, if that's the case, I'd like to just have that clarified real quick.
- [79:23]
Captain Crackrock
I was going to clarify, but I did not agree.
- [79:26]
Jay Dyer
Where is in the day. In the. In time.
- [79:28]
Captain Crackrock
You're making this up to be called names. I've not called him any names.
- [79:32]
Jay Dyer
Oh, come on, dude. Stupid white man. The stupid white man.
- [79:36]
Mike (Moderator)
I think that counts. I think that counts. But that's just me trying to be fair there.
- [79:40]
Captain Crackrock
Again, when I say crisis inside of time, time is based off. That's not what you said.
- [79:45]
Jay Dyer
Now you changed your argument. You said inside of days.
- [79:50]
Captain Crackrock
Okay?
- [79:50]
Jay Dyer
That's inside of days.
- [79:51]
Captain Crackrock
You change the argument when I say inside of days because time is based on Christ's life. When they say ad that's after the death of Christ.
- [80:01]
Jay Dyer
That has nothing to do with. That's not. That's.
- [80:03]
Captain Crackrock
I'm telling you why I say it. I did not say that it was biblical.
- [80:06]
Jay Dyer
But what you're saying is a dumb argument. Argument. That has nothing to do with what you're talking about. That's a medieval. That's a medieval usage. I can interrupt you and cross exam.
- [80:17]
Captain Crackrock
And I'm gonna keep talking since the moderator don't moderate. So there's only one person that's called the Ancient of Days.
- [80:24]
Mike (Moderator)
I just can't predict when someone's gonna stop, so I try to give them the benefit of the doubt.
- [80:28]
Captain Crackrock
I can't help it if the Father is the only one. That's the Ancient of Days. He's outside of time. Time, the sun is created.
- [80:39]
Mike (Moderator)
Let's go back for a second.
- [80:41]
Captain Crackrock
Every creation.
- [80:42]
Mike (Moderator)
Let's go back for a second. Because I think.
- [80:44]
Captain Crackrock
I think if Christ is the firstborn,
- [80:49]
Jay Dyer
first born is a title.
- [80:53]
Mike (Moderator)
I just don't know if you can hear me when I'm. When I'm trying to settle it up there. I don't want to be rude and hit that mute button. I've been really good about not doing it.
- [81:01]
Captain Crackrock
You ain't never hit it on Jay.
- [81:03]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, no, I'm just saying.
- [81:04]
Jay Dyer
Yes, he did.
- [81:05]
Mike (Moderator)
I did. I did mute.
- [81:06]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, he warned you first. He warned.
- [81:08]
Jay Dyer
No, he muted me.
- [81:10]
Captain Crackrock
That's a lie.
- [81:11]
Jay Dyer
He didn't mute me. He muted me about 30 minutes ago.
- [81:14]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm trying to be as fair as possible and make it to where you both get your points out.
- [81:19]
Jay Dyer
He's crying because you already agreed to.
- [81:21]
Captain Crackrock
I got to interrupt you across exam.
- [81:23]
Jay Dyer
I get to interrupt you across the same. You already agreed to that.
- [81:26]
Captain Crackrock
Did I agree to be interrupted? Yes or no know.
- [81:28]
Jay Dyer
Yes, you did. You agreed to that.
- [81:30]
Captain Crackrock
I'm asking Mike what we.
- [81:33]
Mike (Moderator)
We agreed that Jay would get his three questions and you would. You would answer them. Your responses. I know, I know you didn't want your responses interrupted, but thank you.
- [81:44]
Captain Crackrock
Interrupted.
- [81:44]
Mike (Moderator)
I get that. I get that. But at that point,
- [81:49]
Captain Crackrock
because he doesn't
- [81:49]
Jay Dyer
want to debate, this is his way to filibuster and waste the time.
- [81:52]
Mike (Moderator)
We've already had a back and forth, so that's why I was wondering if
- [81:55]
Captain Crackrock
the only one been fair.
- [81:56]
Jay Dyer
Did we just go to. Can we go to final statement? Yeah, we will.
- [82:01]
Mike (Moderator)
We will get to that here. One second. You want to just go ahead and land your plane for. For the last minute, and then we're going to get to the final closing.
- [82:08]
Captain Crackrock
When we talk about Christ having the glory, that's what the Father gave him. That does not make him God. That's why he's the Son. When Peter said, thou art the Christ, the Son of the most High, Christ said, flesh and blood did not reveal it, but my Father, which is in heaven.
- [82:25]
Mike (Moderator)
Heaven.
- [82:25]
Captain Crackrock
So Christ is not the Father. And Christ said, the one true God is the Father. Ain't no getting around that. That's plain on the text. I don't need to create a soliloquy of scriptures and say, this angel, the
- [82:38]
Jay Dyer
Lord goes with this angel of the Lord goes to.
- [82:39]
Captain Crackrock
This angel goes to this angel. That's Jesus. Oh, I don't need to do that.
- [82:44]
Jay Dyer
Oh, soliloquy. Didn't even know what. It's a little quiz.
- [82:47]
Mike (Moderator)
All right.
- [82:47]
Captain Crackrock
Is that.
- [82:48]
Jay Dyer
You gotta.
- [82:48]
Mike (Moderator)
You're gonna end it there, Kev, you got.
- [82:50]
Captain Crackrock
Yes.
- [82:50]
Mike (Moderator)
You got your planet. Okay. Okay. All right. So I'm gonna do five minute closing statements here, give you guys more than enough time. You don't have to use the whole five minutes if you don't want to. And I will mute the other party during the entire five minutes. Give you a chance to get it all out. And then we're gonna go to the Q and A Super chats. I might have to just stick with the 5 to 10 and up because we got a ridiculous amount to get through. Appreciate all y' all support. I appreciate the one guy making me super anxious in the middle saying, I dox myself, but that's actually James's name on the zoom them, not mine. So we're good. And yes, I know how to mute. I just was really wanting not to because I felt like we could. We can get through it, but we made it through the hour. We made it through the hour. All right, we're going to start. The person who did the opening goes first, right, Jay?
- [83:40]
Jay Dyer
I don't care either way. It's fine.
- [83:41]
Captain Crackrock
It's funny.
- [83:42]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. I just wanted to double check if you want to go first, since he had the last word there. Start when you, when you start, start.
- [83:49]
Jay Dyer
All right, so if we go back to my opening statement, I said. I said that my argument was that the Trinity is found from dozens of passages just in the Torah alone. For the sake of this debate, I later stepped out of the Torah just to make a stronger case from Judges with the. With the instance with Gideon and everything that he later brought up. I actually already pre addressed preemptive attack in my opening statement. I said that the word angel can have. Have three different possible meanings. Could be a human, could be a divine messenger, or a theophanic manifestation, or it could be a created angel like Gabriel or Michael. So I already addressed that and I said that in the passages, we would know when it's talking about which type of thing through the context. And so in all these passages we have that, I listed actual references to the deity of the thing or the one that appears, the divine nature, or in the case of, say, God. God, right. That's a generic term that can refer to gods. In the passage that he cited where Jesus said, I've said you're all gods, it can refer to the Son of God, John 1:18, where it says monogamy, Theos, that he is eternally the eternally begotten God. Or in John 1, when it says in the beginning was the Word, the words with God, and the Word was God. In that reference, God is referring to the Father and then is referring to the divine nature that they all share here. How do I get that? Because in a multitude of passages, we find consistent presentation that the Father, the angel messenger in the Old Testament and the Holy Spirit do the same actions of creating, of redeeming, of forgiving sins. They're called Yahweh, and they are given the divine nature. In many of these passages that I listed. For example, Hagar says that she saw God face to face at the well. Well, we saw in the case of Joseph, excuse me, in the case of Jacob, that he wrestled directly with God and that that same vision that he saw was the same angel that appeared when there was the vision of the latter. He said, ain't no anal passes said that Jesus. I specifically said John 151. Jesus identifies Himself as the angel who was there at the ladder, at Jacob's Ladder. So no, John 1:51 explicitly says that that so he never listens to any of the passages that you cite. And then he asked for one specific verse that says the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. I showed right away from the outset that that's a bogus criteria, a false criteria, because he doesn't hold to that criteria. Thus he's relying on a moving of the goal posts, a double standard. He says there's one, say, one verse that says Father, Son, Holy Spirit, God. And then he shifted to say, say, show one verse in the Old Testament that says Trinity or teaches Trinity. I argued from the very beginning that it's a dozens and dozens of verses. And so he never addressed any argument that I actually made. In John 17 it says that he had that glory before the foundation of the world. That's before creation. Hebrews 1 says that Jesus is the creator and that's why he's superior to the angels. That's how we know that Jesus isn't a creature. And the term firstborn, he doesn't understand this. This doesn't mean creature, it means in preeminence. It's a title of honor that in the Old Testament the firstborn sons had in terms of inheritance. So Jesus is the firstborn son of the Father. John 1:18, he's the eternally begotten Son. Monogones Theos is the Greek that means eternally begotten God. That means God there is referring to the divine nature. I gave many passages at the beginning of Luke that also supports this interpretation of the Old Testament. Specifically, when we have the Father, the Angel and the Holy Spirit doing all the same actions that God does, those names and those predicates, such as omniscience, such as creating the Holy Spirit created.
- [87:44]
Captain Crackrock
Right.
- [87:44]
Jay Dyer
We'll told, we're told that in the Book of Job, for example, we're told in the in the Book of Judges that Yahweh turned his face to Gideon. In John 5, Jesus explains that no one sees the Father at any time. And yet that throughout the Old Testament they were face to face with who? Well, it turns out in Second Corinthians 3, Paul tells us that when Moses went up on the mountain, he was face to face with Jesus Christ. Second, these three is abundantly clear that it's Jesus that's there. Jesus is the one that created the world in Hebrews 1. So captain does not listen and he's never even listened to the arguments in any debate that he's had because everyone has brought the same arguments up to him. And he just closes his ears and ignores it and just repeats his own nonsense because he thinks that Harriet Tubman has a tradition of superstition that is the basis for his cult's historical lineage. And I think he also claims to be a prophet, but I don't think he's a prophet. He's a false prophet, and he can't demonstrate his prophetic powers.
- [88:39]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, thank you for your closing statement, Jay. All right, Captain, you can unmute. And whenever you're ready, we'll start the timer back.
- [88:51]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I just want to go on record that my opponent is the weakest opponent I've ever debated in my life. I've been doing this for 17 years. And he is by far the least and weakest. The ad homs, the consistent Harriet Tubman's the mocking my voice. That's why I debated him on Cooley platform. I don't like Cooley. I debated him because I wanted to feel Jay out. And Jay showed me exactly who he was. That's why you not see me resort to those tactics. Because there's one person, person that was professional, and there was one person that was an absolute child when he picked those verses in the Old Testament. And the reason why I asked the questions that I asked is because, based on his logic, anybody can take angel of the Lord and treat it however they want to treat it. Anybody could treat Psalms 82 and 6, Deuteronomy 64, Genesis 32, where it says God, and I've seen God, and I saw angel, the Lord, and make up whatever belief, doctrine they want to make, make up. What you cannot make up is when Christ said, there's the. The Father is the one true God. You can't make that up. No legitimate response. He said, yeah, that was a lead to mono Trinitarianism. That's not in the Bible. There was one professional tonight. He never responded to Revelations 3 and 18. When Christ said, I'll give him the name of my God, the throne of my God, God, inheritance of my God, land of my God, city of my God. This man said that Christ said, the city gonna be here, Jerusalem is here. He said, heaven not gonna be here. He said, no man can forgive sins, but Peter was given power to forgive sins. So in this debate. These debates are very clear and concise and pointed. And the reason why I call them the weak is because someone like a God logic, someone like, like inspiring philosophy. At least they had textual responses, actual scriptures that we would dialogue in. My back and forth. I asked them to give me scriptures to dialogue. He Couldn't even give a scripture to show me how he got to the Trinity. Couldn't even do it. Couldn't answer the question. Zechariah, the 12th chapter, when it says, the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the Lord. So using the criteria of the angel of the Lord to lead to Trinity, don't line up because. Because he even admitted every time you see it, it's not applying to Jesus. So that means they're picking and choosing whatever it is that they're deciding to use. So I was able to present cleanly in my. Statement. I was able to present for. Is that it?
- [91:26]
Mike (Moderator)
No, no. You just froze for a second. If you want to repeat that last sentence.
- [91:31]
Captain Crackrock
I said to show the professionalism of. When the Q and A came up.
- [91:35]
Jay Dyer
Up.
- [91:35]
Captain Crackrock
He was not interrupted anymore. So, like I said, he's the worst opponent I've ever faced in my life of debating. With that, I land the rest of my time. I'm fine with the super chat questions that you have.
- [91:49]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, everybody, we are going to start the Q A here. We have a lot to get to.
- [91:54]
Jay Dyer
Are you gonna do a poll, by the way?
- [91:56]
Mike (Moderator)
I. I don't set those up. James does. I'm sure he will.
- [92:00]
Captain Crackrock
Okay.
- [92:01]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. If he's watching right now or if maybe one of the other chat mods are able to do that, that would be good.
- [92:06]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. Please do put the poll up. This was great.
- [92:09]
Mike (Moderator)
It was fun. It was fun. Heated fun. Definitely. Probably the biggest debate I've hosted so far. I appreciate you guys giving me the opportunity. This is my 13th time moderating since I've started, so I'm thinking this is probably one of the better ones to cut my teeth on, so. So it's a good challenge. All right, first off, we got. Let me see. Go to these. All right, I'm going to just skip all the ones that are under five. Let's see. Wind. Oh, that's from last time. All right, guys, here we go. Laura, for 999 or for 999 says, why does anyone debate Captain when his cognitive dissonance is so bad, he's incapable of acknowledging logical fallacies posed, unable to ever admit he's wrong? Literally. What's the point? All right, Cap, set him straight.
- [93:06]
Captain Crackrock
I mean, I just disagree with him. I just can't. I mean, if I can dissect the person's position or dissect the person by just asking in one question, it's not my fault when they have to rant the rest of the time. So when I ask this. That Christ says the father is the one true God. That's it for me.
- [93:23]
Jay Dyer
Me.
- [93:24]
Captain Crackrock
So it ain't me ignoring them. I could just see through the minutia. That's my answer. I try to keep them brief.
- [93:31]
Mike (Moderator)
So I. I do allow everyone to respond to any chat. So if you want to give a quick response, Jay, you're welcome to. Otherwise you can just say I'm good.
- [93:41]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. Again, he doesn't listen to what the. The opponents say. He just wants to repeat sort of his pat response. But. But no, I mean, all of this is. I mean, it's just. I don't have a response to that.
- [93:54]
Captain Crackrock
Okay.
- [93:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Man, these super chats are relentless. You guys are awesome. Thank you so much. I don't screenshot them. They disappear. Because this is moving so quick. All right, next one is from say what now? 7365 for 5 bucks says Jay, please hold your peace and address this issue with your time. Time. You're making this unbearable to view.
- [94:19]
Captain Crackrock
Good.
- [94:24]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Cap, you want to respond or you want to move to the next one?
- [94:28]
Captain Crackrock
I mean, there was only one person. That was rude. I don't have. No response to that one.
- [94:32]
Jay Dyer
Okay, cool.
- [94:33]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, we do have a lot to get through, so I appreciate the.
- [94:35]
Jay Dyer
Yeah.
- [94:35]
Captain Crackrock
Because I think it's clear who was this real idiot here. I think it's clear.
- [94:40]
Jay Dyer
Oh. Oh. So see, double standard again.
- [94:45]
Mike (Moderator)
Paranoid Joe for 10 bucks says we was Kangs captain caught fibbing and lying and making straw man fallacies. Does he knows what a fallacy is? What that is?
- [94:56]
Jay Dyer
Oh, he didn't even know, as we saw.
- [94:58]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, I don't. I don't proclaim to know every word. I didn't have a problem saying I did.
- [95:03]
Jay Dyer
Every word.
- [95:05]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I don't proclaim to know every word.
- [95:07]
Jay Dyer
If you're going to debate. You said you've been debating a long time and you don't know what the word fallacy is? Says.
- [95:11]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, never looked it up. Never bothered to.
- [95:14]
Jay Dyer
But I am 101.
- [95:17]
Captain Crackrock
Beat you tonight without knowing what that term means. I just embarrassed you tonight without knowing what you.
- [95:23]
Jay Dyer
You can. You can say professional than you without
- [95:26]
Captain Crackrock
knowing what that term means. You died when you admitted that Christ said the Father is the one true God without knowing what that word means. Because I'm superior to you. To. And this is superior.
- [95:39]
Jay Dyer
So notice his false humility. Like he's. He's over here trying to flex.
- [95:44]
Captain Crackrock
At least I can flex of my own. I don't have to use.
- [95:46]
Jay Dyer
Are you. Are you a prophet Are you a prophet? Are you a prophet?
- [95:50]
Captain Crackrock
We're no longer asking each other questions.
- [95:52]
Jay Dyer
All right, so you're. You won't say if you're a prophet. Do you claim to be a prophet? You claim to be a prophet? Yeah.
- [96:00]
Captain Crackrock
This feeling. Look at it.
- [96:02]
Jay Dyer
Do you claim to be a prophet?
- [96:03]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I do. I do.
- [96:06]
Jay Dyer
Can you demonstrate your prophetic. Demonstrate that you're a prophet?
- [96:08]
Captain Crackrock
I do it all the time. What did Christ.
- [96:11]
Jay Dyer
How do we know you're a prophet?
- [96:12]
Captain Crackrock
Answer with the Bible. What did Christ say?
- [96:14]
Jay Dyer
How do we know you're a prophet?
- [96:16]
Captain Crackrock
Why are you interrupting? Man? And I'm answering your question.
- [96:20]
Jay Dyer
The Bible isn't going to tell me you're a prophet.
- [96:21]
Captain Crackrock
A child. The Bible does tell how to be a prophet. Man.
- [96:27]
Jay Dyer
How are you a prophet? A prophet.
- [96:28]
Captain Crackrock
Right? I'm trying to answer, child.
- [96:30]
Jay Dyer
Demonstrate that you're a prophet. You're a cult leader. You're a fraud.
- [96:33]
Captain Crackrock
I'm definitely a cult leader. And Christ said they'll get no prophecy except the prophecy of Jonah. And Jonah's prophecy was repentance.
- [96:44]
Jay Dyer
How does that say you're a prophet?
- [96:46]
Captain Crackrock
Why are you still interrupting? No, child.
- [96:48]
Jay Dyer
You're lying. That doesn't tell me you're a prophet.
- [96:51]
Captain Crackrock
You got to grow up.
- [96:52]
Jay Dyer
How does that tell me you are a prophet?
- [96:54]
Mike (Moderator)
It's funny. Half the chat. Half the chat saying, mike, stop this. And the other half is saying, this is the best TV ever. So I don't know who to believe.
- [97:04]
Captain Crackrock
Like, I don't want to grow.
- [97:05]
Jay Dyer
Does that tell me we will.
- [97:06]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, we will move on. And I'm sure there's going to be another question where this is going to come.
- [97:11]
Jay Dyer
Leader. He's a fraud.
- [97:12]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. Jay. There will be other questions where I believe this will come up again for him to address. This was the very first super chat. I just want to read this. It's. It's two bucks. But in the filth said Harriet Tubman established the college of apostles. That true?
- [97:29]
Captain Crackrock
I don't. I don't know, man. I don't know, man.
- [97:33]
Jay Dyer
He's laughing because he got called out on that in the debate.
- [97:36]
Captain Crackrock
I'm laughing because you couldn't resist.
- [97:38]
Jay Dyer
Do you say that? Harriet Tubman. You relied on Harriet Tubman?
- [97:45]
Captain Crackrock
Harriet Tubman. I know that Harriet is not the subject. Let her rest right now. She's in our family. Family.
- [97:52]
Mike (Moderator)
This is.
- [97:53]
Captain Crackrock
He's not in your family.
- [97:54]
Jay Dyer
He was the proof of your church.
- [97:55]
Captain Crackrock
Which is not the proof of my church. Man.
- [97:58]
Jay Dyer
Yes, it was. You use that as an argument in our last debate. Lying again.
- [98:05]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, for all the chat. For all the chat. There is some lore if you go watch Fugazi's stream if you're curious about that. But we do have to move on. Lots of super chats.
- [98:14]
Captain Crackrock
Again, I didn't say she did anything with the church. I said she knew she was an Israelite. Like.
- [98:19]
Jay Dyer
No, I think the basis for your church family.
- [98:24]
Captain Crackrock
I said her family. A brother from her family is in our school. I never said she was the basis.
- [98:30]
Jay Dyer
You said she was the historic basis for a true African madeup culture believe in. Yes, you did. You're a liar. I asked you for the history of your church. You said Harry told me.
- [98:41]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't say that.
- [98:43]
Jay Dyer
Yes, you did.
- [98:49]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, guys. All right, guys. I'm gonna move it on because Flavius sent a big hundred dollars said shabbat shalom. Yakub is getting owned. That's very generous, Flavius. Thank you for flexing on the rest of the chat like that.
- [99:02]
Captain Crackrock
Who's Yakub?
- [99:05]
Mike (Moderator)
We're keeping it moving, guys. We're keeping it.
- [99:07]
Jay Dyer
That's where you're gonna move next. When you move to the next call,
- [99:09]
Mike (Moderator)
you'll be in Yakub hush tones sent 499 says Jay is late to prove he is more bipartisan pock than Captain Word. Vegan skills for five bucks says Christ is risen. Let's go, boys. Josh Bond 2884 sent a membership. We appreciate that, Josh, for the support. Oh, you sent two memberships. Thank you. Okay, bubblegum, that's. I'm gonna skip that one. Sorry, bubble. Let's see with Ben moderator. Get off your phone. Look like you want to be here. I'm super happy to be here. So I was trying to keep track of super chats so you guys don't message me. How come you didn't ask my question? IMC fan for 10 bucks says, why did Christianity start colonizing when Greco Roman world and later European powers adopted it? Jay, that's up your alley.
- [100:00]
Jay Dyer
I don't know what that means. Christianity colonizing. I would say that the empire is all colonized prior to Christianity and after Christianity. So colonization is something that empires and nations have done historically. So I would. I think it's a fail to. A failure to equate that to quote Christianity.
- [100:15]
Mike (Moderator)
You guys stop spamming the chat. I don't set the poll. It's not. It's not.
- [100:18]
Captain Crackrock
I know, I know.
- [100:20]
Jay Dyer
Roman.
- [100:21]
Captain Crackrock
The Roman Catholic church created a doctrine of discovery that gave them Christians carte blanche to enslave people in the name of Christianity that's documented in it.
- [100:34]
Jay Dyer
Okay, source that you're asserting that. What's your source for that?
- [100:40]
Captain Crackrock
The doctrine of discovery. That anybody can look up. Anybody can Google doctrine of discovery. You'll see. When Columbus and all them came over here and discovered the natives, they enslaved them under that guise. They were given carte blanche to enslave under the doctrine of discovery. That's why half the Latinos are Christian, because it was forced. Forced upon them through the sword. That's facts.
- [101:04]
Mike (Moderator)
Rachel Wilson sends five bucks and says, quote, it has to be simple, clear and easy to understand to be true. End quote. Is the simplicity fallacy. Thank you, Rachel. I think you've sent multiple. So we'll get. We'll read all of those. See you guys at debatecon. You and Andrew. But yeah, go ahead. Yeah,
- [101:27]
Jay Dyer
that is a fallacy to argue that something's true because it's simple. And also the. If we're going to follow with that logic, how are we supposed to know that the tradition that Harriet Tubman had from an oral slave thing that's passed down orally is somehow backs up the historical precedents for his cult? That's what he claimed in our first debate. Is that simple too?
- [101:47]
Captain Crackrock
I tell you what, man, me saying that Harriet Tubman knew she was an Israelite hurts this man's soul because he can't stop talking about. About it.
- [101:55]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, it's a stupid argument.
- [101:57]
Captain Crackrock
Oral tradition is not a black thing. It's a nation thing, meaning other nations have oral traditions before it is written down. Everything starts off orally. The records of the truth. The argument that you're saying about Harriet Tubman is how we have arguments when people try to tell us the Bible is not real because it was.
- [102:16]
Jay Dyer
So you did argue Harriet Tubman is the basis. You said you didn't a minute ago. Now you're saying you did yourself.
- [102:21]
Captain Crackrock
You just contradicted like you are in your feelings. I'm not.
- [102:25]
Jay Dyer
You just contradicted.
- [102:26]
Captain Crackrock
I would be lying if I said Harriet Tubman is the basis for my school. I would be historical basis. I'm not lying.
- [102:34]
Jay Dyer
I'm not in our debate.
- [102:36]
Captain Crackrock
I'm not lying when I say within five minutes, every nation has oral traditions.
- [102:42]
Jay Dyer
What does that have to do with this?
- [102:44]
Captain Crackrock
Now because you brought up Harriet Tubman. Get out your feelings.
- [102:48]
Mike (Moderator)
That was the chatter. Who brought it up.
- [102:49]
Jay Dyer
Actually literally just contradicted yourself in his response. Yeah, because it's funny. It's so dumb.
- [102:55]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, no, I remember that.
- [102:57]
Captain Crackrock
Now he can't stop talking about Harriet.
- [103:01]
Jay Dyer
It's a Dumb woman on his. Just like you're a prophet.
- [103:08]
Mike (Moderator)
If anyone's going to get an idea,
- [103:10]
Jay Dyer
I am a black woman. I'm the biggest bipoc diva on the Internet.
- [103:15]
Mike (Moderator)
That's a great clip.
- [103:17]
Jay Dyer
Jealous because I'm a diva.
- [103:18]
Captain Crackrock
He's a black woman. Jay wants to be.
- [103:22]
Jay Dyer
I identify as a man.
- [103:25]
Captain Crackrock
What straight man would say they're a woman? Jay is a closet.
- [103:29]
Jay Dyer
Who said I was straight?
- [103:30]
Captain Crackrock
I identify as. I'm.
- [103:31]
Jay Dyer
I'm hotter than Beyonce. Dude, Tell me I'm not. Tell me I'm not higher than Beyonce.
- [103:37]
Mike (Moderator)
This is hilarious.
- [103:38]
Captain Crackrock
Nature of the white man y' all are witnessing.
- [103:40]
Jay Dyer
Oh, The white man.
- [103:46]
Mike (Moderator)
We'll have so much more time for that, guys.
- [103:48]
Jay Dyer
Good thing I'm a black woman.
- [103:52]
Mike (Moderator)
All right.
- [103:52]
Jay Dyer
Good thing I'm not a white man.
- [103:53]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm sorry. I got to mute you both just for a second, because only person who's going to get in their fields is me if we don't get through these chats. All right, six of spades. CC sends 10 bucks. Thank you so much. Remember, Captain Crackrock knows he's right because the church fathers were wrong. All right, Captain, I'm going unmute you. You go ahead and tell him how you feel about that. He sent money to say that. Go ahead.
- [104:14]
Captain Crackrock
I just want to say First Corinthians 6, 9 says, no effeminate shall inherit the kingdom of heaven. You can't pretend to be a woman. And. And then say you about God. No straight man would do that. No man of God would do that. As far as the church fathers being wrong, they're just wrong. And I go by the Bible. I learned from this cat, this Roman Catholic, by the name of voice of reason. He taught me Solar scriptor. He said, so you guys are solo scripture. I said, yes, Scriptures. I didn't think his voice was real either. And so once he said that, that I go by the scriptures, so if anybody goes outside of the belief of the scriptures, I don't abide by them. It don't have to just be church fathers. Clearly it's Christians today. Roman Catholics doctrine of discovery that we just mentioned is not in the Bible. So I would disagree with anybody that teaches something outside the Bible.
- [105:07]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, well, we'll just go ahead and go to the next one.
- [105:11]
Jay Dyer
Can I don't get to respond?
- [105:13]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, if you want to. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
- [105:15]
Jay Dyer
The voice of reason is the guy that talks like this. And he was probably sexting with my friend Kata Dazariak. You have a very plump booty.
- [105:23]
Mike (Moderator)
I think your impressions was on Chat's bingo card. So I appreciate, Appreciate that. Okay? We do gotta, gotta keep it going, Keep it going. I'm down to do this as long as you guys have time for it, but I'm trying to be respectful to y' all's time.
- [105:37]
Jay Dyer
I'm having a blast.
- [105:38]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, no, I just think it's gonna go on forever, and these are gonna get lost, so.
- [105:42]
Jay Dyer
Infinite money, dude.
- [105:43]
Mike (Moderator)
That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. But I want to at least honor the ones who sent the most.
- [105:48]
Captain Crackrock
Hey, my audience said Jay's new name is Gay Dire. Not Jay Dire.
- [105:52]
Jay Dyer
That's old dude. You stole that from Scam Shamu.
- [105:54]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, can I do my Jay Dyer impression? That's. That's so low tier, dude.
- [105:58]
Captain Crackrock
Solo, I. I never known a Christian.
- [106:02]
Jay Dyer
I identify as a woman. Get it straight, dog.
- [106:04]
Mike (Moderator)
Anthony, ajc. Since five bucks, he says, can Cap give us a galiggity?
- [106:10]
Captain Crackrock
I don't know what that means.
- [106:11]
Mike (Moderator)
I think that's a Jim Bob reference or a Kenneth Copeland reference. Excuse me, JB Free. Gotta. Sorry, I gotta go past that one. He's just asking Jay to unblock him. Left hand assassin for $5 says. Really? So the crux of his argument is a word concept fallacy, Correct As I
- [106:29]
Jay Dyer
argue the last debate
- [106:33]
Mike (Moderator)
stand stand outfit in 2063. Mike, you have to moderate better. No, I know, know. I know. I got. I'm doing my best, bro. I'm doing my best, but this is. This is not a debate anymore. This is not a debate anymore.
- [106:46]
Captain Crackrock
Who said that?
- [106:47]
Mike (Moderator)
Guarantee it is someone who I'm not going to shout out since they did not send money to say that. I just wanted to call them out. All right, let's see here. Not a Mossad agent, very clear. Sends $5, says, Captain. Is it. Is that a true Jew T shirt that says, quote imposter with an image of Jesus 666 in a tarp? Target?
- [107:10]
Captain Crackrock
Yes.
- [107:11]
Mike (Moderator)
All right.
- [107:14]
Captain Crackrock
This is another lie that the Christian church put out. This is not the true image of Christ. He doesn't look like this image. That's Cedric. He was a homosexual too, and had his lover paint him.
- [107:26]
Jay Dyer
This is a. An insane person who thinks that that Mormon image of Jesus is a medieval renaissance figure. These are insane people.
- [107:36]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, a lot of people don't realize this is a comedy show. And you guys are really getting on to me for not bullying them into mute submission. Just. You know, Edward Longshank says for 15 bucks, the BHI. I believe that's Black Israelite theory. Or yeah, black Hebrew, Israelite. Yeah. Theory hinges on the presupposition that Noah, Ham, Shem and Japheth were Kangs and Jeff descendants became white by way of genetic mutation.
- [108:04]
Captain Crackrock
No, we don't believe that. We don't believe that all at all. We believe the white man came from Esau or Edomites. We don't believe that Jaffet was a non melanated looking person. We believe Ham, Shim and Jaffa were all melanated. Esau is the first non melanated race that would become. We don't believe that.
- [108:26]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, thank you you for clarifying that. Sosa Baby 583 says 5 for 5. I'm sorry, Jay, go ahead. If you wanted to say something on that.
- [108:34]
Jay Dyer
No, it's funny on its own. I can let him say his own beliefs are the funniest part.
- [108:39]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, for five bucks, Sosa baby says James, can you let Captain know your name is Mike? I did, I did. Thank you Tangu, for five bucks. Thank you Tangu. For the Q and A at the end. Do we super chat questions or is there another method? Does anyone in the chat know? Thanks, appreciate the money. That's exactly how it works. Printer001for5 says. At what point did BHI start just denying God's grace in favor of revenge racism?
- [109:09]
Captain Crackrock
Can you repeat that question?
- [109:10]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. At what point did the black Hebrew Israelites start just denying God's grace in favor of revenge racism? And I know you said you didn't like that term. Did you have a better one that you'd like to substitute?
- [109:24]
Captain Crackrock
We just say either it's either Israelites or Hebrew Israelites. We don't just don't like the black part.
- [109:29]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay.
- [109:30]
Captain Crackrock
We don't. Well, actually in the book of Revelations it says he that leaded into captivity will go into captivity. He that killer with the sword must be killed with the sword. That's what the Bible says. So you can't say it's revenge for us because the Bible prophesies revenge. So. So that's not something that we push. We're also not racist. At best you could say prejudice. Because we don't advocate violence. We don't systematically oppress anyone. We're just really teaching repentance to our people. But we do reserve and have the right to speak about evil being done to us by anybody if it's our own people or if it's other races of people, just like every other race is entitled to do. Nobody tells the Jewish man he can't talk about whoever's Being something against him. Him. Nobody can tell the age of man. Nobody tells anybody else.
- [110:19]
Mike (Moderator)
What about moderators? You gonna stick up for the moderator when you mod?
- [110:24]
Captain Crackrock
If you. If you mod properly, I'll listen. I'll defend you listen. When you first did it, you ain't hear me give you that clock. I thought for you at first, but then you got lost in translation somewhere, man. I said, there you go.
- [110:36]
Mike (Moderator)
When there's a lot of question asking back and forth, I'm trying to play it out by ear. There's. It's hard to just cut people off if they're, like, asking the question right the middle, but.
- [110:45]
Jay Dyer
All right, can I respond?
- [110:46]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah.
- [110:47]
Jay Dyer
Can I respond to that too?
- [110:48]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah. Hey, before you respond, I'm gonna. My stop time is gonna be 11 o'. Clock, my time. That's about six minutes.
- [110:54]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, we got a lot. We got a lot more chats to get through, man. Can you do like another 20?
- [110:59]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I'll do 20.
- [111:00]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, so 11, 15. All right. We'll keep the responses really quick.
- [111:05]
Captain Crackrock
Thank you.
- [111:06]
Mike (Moderator)
All right.
- [111:06]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. I think if you look at his cult, it's a perfect example of something that's also typically run by feds. I'm not saying he is a fed. I don't have evidence of that.
- [111:14]
Captain Crackrock
That.
- [111:14]
Jay Dyer
But feds love those kinds of groups. And you can see right there, he's wearing a shirt that's intended to convey an image of violence as he lies and says that his cult doesn't believe in that stuff. Oh, it absolutely does.
- [111:26]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay.
- [111:27]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah. You won't find no record of ISGPK being violent against anyone. We've been established since 1969. I dare anybody to show a record of my organization being violent against anyone.
- [111:42]
Jay Dyer
Anyone.
- [111:42]
Captain Crackrock
Self defense. Every man, woman, and child has a right to defend themselves. You show me where we're violent or have systematically oppressed anyone. I dare anybody to do it.
- [111:54]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, for the sake of Cap's time, we're gonna just do the 10 and ups for for now. And if Jay has a little bit of time, we might circle back. But you guys, you guys keep it going. All right, flavius for another 10 bucks. Thank you, sir. For both. If Christianity is such a barbaric, colonizing faith, why did Papua New guinea convert? The warriors are coming. I think I know what he's talking about.
- [112:17]
Captain Crackrock
Is that from the movie the Warriors?
- [112:21]
Mike (Moderator)
No. Well, maybe there's could be a double entendre. You want to respond, Jerry? Can I move on?
- [112:28]
Jay Dyer
No, go ahead.
- [112:29]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. Rachel Wilson for a big 20 bucks. Thank you. Rachel, tip my hat. Recognizing the fact that words have more than one meaning and one context is not some semantics. Asserting that words can only have one meaning in every context is a fallacy. And what stupid people do. It's the root of all heresy.
- [112:46]
Jay Dyer
Amen.
- [112:48]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, the poll's up, guys.
- [112:51]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I actually agree, but she's as dumb as her husband, so I expect her to put that comment in the chat. She's as dumb as a husband. Her husband was stupid for marrying her.
- [113:01]
Mike (Moderator)
It's a fake poll, fake news.
- [113:04]
Captain Crackrock
Just. Just for the record, her husband was absolutely.
- [113:06]
Jay Dyer
I hope we get a real poll.
- [113:07]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I don't know who did that.
- [113:08]
Captain Crackrock
I bet you got a poll in there.
- [113:12]
Jay Dyer
I do. Thank you for that compliment. Appreciate that. Tangu says black man commenting on a white man's wenus. I like that. I like that. Wasn't an own.
- [113:25]
Captain Crackrock
Dude, you too slow to get it. You're just too slow to get it, man.
- [113:30]
Jay Dyer
No, you just up your joke, dummy.
- [113:32]
Captain Crackrock
Oh, you asked for a post. You actually asked for it.
- [113:35]
Mike (Moderator)
I. Yeah, you said I had it.
- [113:37]
Jay Dyer
You said I have one.
- [113:38]
Captain Crackrock
Thank you.
- [113:39]
Jay Dyer
Appreciate it, Cap.
- [113:40]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, let's not spend the last 20 minutes talking about Jay's poll. Yeah, we're not. We're not gonna spend compliment. We're not gonna spend the last 20 minutes talking about your poll, brother.
- [113:49]
Jay Dyer
This joke up. But that's all right, my man.
- [113:51]
Captain Crackrock
You die in this whole debate.
- [113:53]
Mike (Moderator)
All right. Tengu says shout out to Jortlandia. Just wanted to read that one. Six of spades. CC Says for ten bucks. Cope. Laugh through it, buddy. Buddy will definitely believe it if you awkwardly laugh through it. I think he's talking about me. Okay.
- [114:08]
Jay Dyer
Got that white man girth over here.
- [114:14]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm trying to do this with a straight face. All right, all right.
- [114:16]
Jay Dyer
Prod. You can't do it.
- [114:17]
Mike (Moderator)
No, I can't prod. Five star for 10 bucks says question for Captain. Can you accurately state the Cappadocian doctrine of the Trinity from the second ecumenical council that you're trying to debate against? Please?
- [114:28]
Captain Crackrock
These. Nope.
- [114:29]
Mike (Moderator)
All right. Paranoid Joe for 10 bucks says we was Kangs. Captain caught fib. No, I read that one. Can we just.
- [114:35]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, that's old. Like, I've been hearing the we was king since I've been on this app, this show called Kill Stream and stuff like that, so I'm kind of used to the weeds.
- [114:43]
Mike (Moderator)
I was having deja vu, like, over and over again. Okay, there are some. Some different ones here. Here we go. If Jay can't interrupt, he's cooked.
- [114:57]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, that's clean.
- [115:01]
Jay Dyer
Examinations always allow for that. So.
- [115:04]
Captain Crackrock
But anybody could see that in this debate. The only child.
- [115:07]
Mike (Moderator)
Why is everyone spamming the AX emoji in the chat?
- [115:10]
Jay Dyer
Because he say X, he don't know grammar.
- [115:16]
Captain Crackrock
You don't know what you don't know. One is not three, though.
- [115:19]
Mike (Moderator)
That's an explanation.
- [115:26]
Jay Dyer
You and our prison cult. You in a prison cult. You in a fed run.
- [115:31]
Captain Crackrock
I know one of prison cult.
- [115:33]
Jay Dyer
Don't even know.
- [115:34]
Mike (Moderator)
Q for captain from. From printer 001 for five. Do you deny the Muslim influence to forming of the black Hebrew Israelite religion man made?
- [115:44]
Captain Crackrock
Yes, I deny it. The Muslims have nothing to do with this because Muslims is trash when they talk about Muhammad. Police be upon him. He. He's. He would be on Epstein island if he existed today. So Muslims have no influence whatsoever on the Israelites. That's a trash man made religion.
- [116:03]
Mike (Moderator)
I am not muted, Chad.
- [116:05]
Jay Dyer
But the black Hebrew Israelite cult is not man made. All right? It's not. It's not a fed. Creative dumb cult. Yeah, sure.
- [116:12]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm not. I'm not muted. Refresh the page. Refresh everyone in the chat. Tell those trolls to refresh. Okay. Rats. Chosen V3 sends 20 bucks. Thank you. Chosen Q cap. In Isaiah 48, 12 through verses or 12 through 16, the Creator and First and the Last says the Lord God and his Spirit sent me. If Jesus is a creature and the Spirit a force, how can force and the eternal Creator, unless they are three divine persons.
- [116:43]
Captain Crackrock
They're not divine. What you're speaking about is we never deny that Christ existed before Jesus with the flesh and blood man. Christ. He's the first creation of Christ. So being sent has nothing to do with being God. I think that's where people miss the argument that we're making. We're not saying Christ don't have power. We're not saying that he's not the Son of God when we're just saying he's not the God. So he existed after the Father. The Father existed. He's the ancient of days. He creates the Son, then he gives the Son glory. He gives the Son the power to do the things that you see be so through him is how things are done. But he has a creator. Yeah, that's why he said, all right,
- [117:28]
Mike (Moderator)
we got to move through it, brother.
- [117:30]
Captain Crackrock
Sorry, I'm a land right here. That's why Christ.
- [117:31]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, go back to the original debate. I slipped it. I asked him if. I asked him if he has the same nature as his Father because he
- [117:39]
Mike (Moderator)
doesn't he did have one more sentence to go there. Sorry, Jay. It sounded like I was telling you to go. My. My bad.
- [117:45]
Jay Dyer
I thought he was telling me to
- [117:46]
Mike (Moderator)
go, yeah, my bad.
- [117:48]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah. That's why Christ says he's the beginning of the creation of God. That's why he says that. I'm done.
- [117:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Got it. Go ahead, Jay. And then we'll get.
- [117:58]
Jay Dyer
Christ never says I'm the beginning of the creation of God. That's not true. What I asked him in the previous debate was if Jesus is the son of his Father, does he have the same nature as his Father? He said, yes. And I asked him, is the Father's nature uncreated? He said, yes. Ass. So he's lost that already right there.
- [118:15]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay.
- [118:16]
Captain Crackrock
I just want to be a good quick response to remind everybody. He tried to give that analogy. He said, wait, I'm just continuing.
- [118:26]
Jay Dyer
He doesn't understand what. I'm out.
- [118:28]
Captain Crackrock
I'm just continuing. He made. He brought up my father and said that I have the same essence or nature as my Father, of which I agree. And I proceeded to tell. I proceeded to tell him, you see, that's why he got to interact. Interrupt. I proceeded to tell him that my father existed for 27 years without me. And it wasn't until he even this
- [118:48]
Jay Dyer
dummy admitted that the Father
- [118:52]
Captain Crackrock
and. And the same analysis admitted the Father
- [118:54]
Jay Dyer
and the Son are uncreated.
- [118:57]
Captain Crackrock
It. Are you in your feelings, man?
- [119:00]
Mike (Moderator)
I don't.
- [119:00]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't.
- [119:00]
Jay Dyer
Already admitted it. You're a liar.
- [119:02]
Captain Crackrock
Feelings?
- [119:03]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm not.
- [119:04]
Captain Crackrock
You already admitted they're both uncreated.
- [119:06]
Mike (Moderator)
You.
- [119:07]
Captain Crackrock
You compare my father to the Most High and me to Christ, and my Father existed without me for 27 years, just like the ancient of days. Yeah.
- [119:17]
Jay Dyer
And then you said that he's uncreated.
- [119:19]
Captain Crackrock
Christ was created.
- [119:20]
Jay Dyer
You then said he's uncreated.
- [119:22]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Chat.
- [119:22]
Captain Crackrock
Real pulse.
- [119:23]
Jay Dyer
Real Paul's up.
- [119:24]
Mike (Moderator)
Now.
- [119:25]
Captain Crackrock
Revelations 3 and 14. And unto the angel of the Church of Lacedonians, right? These things saith Amen. That's Christ, the faithful and true witness. That's Christ. The beginning of the creation of God. That's what he said. Said. He said that Christ didn't say that.
- [119:42]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, moving on. Because this. This could go all night. I'm trying. I want you to stay, Captain, so we could. We could keep going, man.
- [119:50]
Jay Dyer
He didn't say he's.
- [119:51]
Mike (Moderator)
I don't have a time limit. It's your time limit.
- [119:53]
Captain Crackrock
You said he didn't say he had. He was the beginning of the creation. I just read.
- [119:56]
Jay Dyer
Not in the. Not in the sense of being a creature.
- [119:58]
Captain Crackrock
No, I'm trying to clean it up now. He say creatures?
- [120:00]
Jay Dyer
No, that's what we argued last time. Not in the sense of being a creature.
- [120:05]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, all right, all right, all right. Did you know that Hebrew of Isaiah
- [120:09]
Jay Dyer
54, firstborn means honor.
- [120:14]
Mike (Moderator)
This might be related. It's another. It's another Isaiah. Super chat. Batman, Inc. 27.93 ten bucks. Thank you, sir. Captain, do you know the Hebrew of Isaiah 54? 5 refers to Yahweh as your makers and your husbands. John 5. 38, Jesus calling God his father, makes himself, quote, equal to God. God, in quote Hebrews 1:8, Father calls Son God.
- [120:37]
Captain Crackrock
That's a lot of verses. You said Isaiah 54 and 5 was the first one. Is that the first one?
- [120:42]
Mike (Moderator)
Yes.
- [120:42]
Captain Crackrock
Okay, I have that here. And then you reference John. What did you reference in John?
- [120:48]
Mike (Moderator)
It was John 5. 38.
- [120:52]
Jay Dyer
Can I read what that says?
- [120:54]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I'm actually pulling all of them up first. And then I was going to read him. So you said John.
- [120:58]
Mike (Moderator)
You could read it to the audience.
- [120:59]
Jay Dyer
Audience, okay. There's another one that ties into that. John 5. 18 says the Jews sought to kill him because he not only broke the Sabbath, but said that God was his father, making himself equal with God. 5, 18.
- [121:13]
Captain Crackrock
So John 5, John 5. Isaiah 54, 5 John 5 and 38. John 5 and 18. Was there any other verses?
- [121:23]
Mike (Moderator)
Hebrews 1:8.
- [121:25]
Captain Crackrock
Hebrews 1 and 8. Okay, so Isaiah 54 and 5 says, for thy maker is thine husband, the Lord of hosts is his name, and thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel, the God of the old earth shall he be called. Verse John 5 and 18. I'll read his verse first. Therefore, the Jews sought the motor killing because he had not broken. Sad. But he said God was his father. I don't see how that helps your point.
- [121:45]
Jay Dyer
Making himself equal with God. You didn't read the rest of the verse. You liar.
- [121:49]
Captain Crackrock
Right. That's what the Jews thought. He was making himself equal with God.
- [121:53]
Jay Dyer
That's what John said. Says he was doing.
- [121:55]
Captain Crackrock
No, no, no.
- [121:56]
Jay Dyer
Yes, it is. That's what it said. That's why you didn't read the rest of it. Cut the verse off. You cut the verse off.
- [122:04]
Captain Crackrock
So what is saying?
- [122:05]
Jay Dyer
You notice he didn't read it. Like he thought y' all were gonna making himself.
- [122:11]
Captain Crackrock
This is what? This is trash. I was actually.
- [122:13]
Jay Dyer
No, you're trash because you didn't read the rest of the verse. You cut it off, you liar. You're exposed again. You cut off the verse. Liar.
- [122:21]
Captain Crackrock
Can I read the verse again? Therefore, the Jews.
- [122:23]
Mike (Moderator)
I. I do want to just keep going because you. You gave me a time limit, Cap. You gave me a time limit.
- [122:29]
Captain Crackrock
I did. I'll give you two extra minutes if I could just break this down.
- [122:33]
Mike (Moderator)
All right. Make it fine. We got a deal.
- [122:35]
Captain Crackrock
No. No. 1117. Therefore, the Jews sought the more to kill him, comma, because he had not only broken the Sabbath, but also said that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. That's why the Jews sought to kill him, because they thought what he was doing. Doing was making himself equal with God.
- [122:51]
Jay Dyer
He said he has the same power as God and John.
- [122:56]
Captain Crackrock
When he went to John the 10th chapter and said, I am my father one, they wanted to stone him then, too. And he had to cut him and said, I'm the Son of God. He never said he was God.
- [123:06]
Jay Dyer
The word God is a generic term.
- [123:09]
Captain Crackrock
The Jews, the Jews did not understand nothing. That's what this is talking about.
- [123:14]
Jay Dyer
You that doesn't understand nothing.
- [123:16]
Captain Crackrock
You don't understand nothing.
- [123:18]
Mike (Moderator)
1313. Maryland said said for five bucks.
- [123:22]
Captain Crackrock
That's all it shows we got.
- [123:23]
Jay Dyer
Why 90 of the chat? Thought you lost.
- [123:25]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, guys.
- [123:26]
Jay Dyer
I thought you destroyed.
- [123:28]
Mike (Moderator)
I don't want to do it. I'm doing it. All right, I'm just gonna read a couple of these, and you guys can start responding again. 13:13. Maryland said for $5, we are together, not scatter. You're both Rabbi Hypocrites. That's cold. All right, chosen V2. This is going to be a good one for you guys to respond to. Question Cap. The Bible credits the Father, Galatians 1:1, Son, John 2, 19, 10 and 18, and Spirit, Romans 8:11 with resurrecting Christ. If not one God, how could a creation raise himself and an impersonal force be credited with this? Go ahead, brother.
- [124:05]
Jay Dyer
Amen.
- [124:10]
Mike (Moderator)
Asked to unmute. Go ahead, cap.
- [124:14]
Captain Crackrock
Galatians 1:1 says, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead, that. That's what it doesn't say, that Christ. I thought he was trying to say Christ raised himself, but that verse says, the Father raised him from the dead. That's what it says. So I don't know why he said that. I'm confused on the question, because Galatians one in one says, the Father did it. Doesn't say Christ did it. Maybe they were somewhere else. And you'll see all throughout the text where the Father raised him. The Father highly exalted him to be a prince and a savior. To give repentance for Israel. So I don't know where he was going with that.
- [124:54]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm confused, and that's fine. Jay, quick response. I'm going to keep going.
- [124:59]
Jay Dyer
The argument was that there's many passages that refer to raising of the dead as something that both the Son and the Holy Spirit do, and thus they have the same power as the Father. Father, which is what Jesus says multiple times in John, which means that he is fully divine.
- [125:13]
Captain Crackrock
I mean, Elijah raised the Son from the dead, so I guess he God.
- [125:17]
Jay Dyer
This is so stupid, because the argument was that they have the same power and nature as the Father, not merely raising the dead.
- [125:24]
Captain Crackrock
Elijah raised them from the dead.
- [125:28]
Jay Dyer
I just said that didn't work. He has the same nature as the Father. That means he has the same powers in the sense of being divine.
- [125:41]
Captain Crackrock
The person that sent that question, he
- [125:42]
Jay Dyer
doesn't even listen to the verses.
- [125:45]
Captain Crackrock
Well, Elijah raised the boy from the dead.
- [125:48]
Jay Dyer
I didn't argue that merely raising the dead proves that he's divine. I said that does all of those things and has the same nature. Argument was that. That's part of the argument. It's not the whole argument.
- [126:03]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, had to meet you guys again. We're gonna keep. We're gonna keep it going. This Sosa Baby 499 says this chat is like a old Modern Warfare 2 lobby. I agree. 13 13. Maryland sends another five to him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame and am set down with my Father and his throne. Revelations 3. 21. I'll unmute Jay as well if y' all want to respond to either of those real quick. Revelations 3. 21 was the scripture.
- [126:37]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, I actually had responded to that. Excuse me, that. That's actually one of the scriptures that I brought out because they don't share the same throne. I actually brought that out my presentation. The Father has his throne, that's for him. Christ has his throne, that's for him. But there's a power, there's a power structure. And so he, Christ, earned the right to sit in that type of authority. That's why Matthews 2818 says all power, power was given to him by the Father. That just doesn't make him God. So that's why I brought it out.
- [127:09]
Jay Dyer
The argument was, if you read John 15 and 16, everything that the Father has, he gives to the Son. So everything that Jesus has is communicated to him through eternal begetting. That's John 1:18. Monogamy. Theos only begotten God. And if he has the same nature as his Father, you can't have multiple gods. So this idiot's actually a polytheist because he thinks that Jesus is a God that you worship. That's the first creation. When Hebrews 1 says that Jesus created the world, so firstborn is not a creation. It's a title of honor. And that's why he says that he has the same nature and powers as the Father. That was the argument.
- [127:46]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Captain, this next question is for you specifically. Gooberang. That's an interesting name. 10 bucks says captain. Do you interpret the individual words in the dictionary on your own, or do you rely on the word work put into the definitions in the dictionary by people who gave you the dictionary?
- [128:04]
Captain Crackrock
I rely on this when we talk about the Bible only. I rely on the context, the spirit of the scriptures as well as the definition. So I use all three, because one word, especially when you're dealing with Hebrew, not some Greek, is a little bit more boxed in. But Hebrew has multiple definitions, so you can't just use one definition. You have to look at the context. And the Lord has to give you the spirit. That's why my opening statement. I'm Christ said, I'm glad that he kept this from the wise and prudent and gave it to babies, because a lot of people are studied and just don't know the text. That's why Christ used to beat the studied ones in the New Testament, and I beat the studied ones today.
- [128:43]
Mike (Moderator)
Ray, the way asked for five bucks. Taz, who was Jesus praying to before he was betrayed and then crucified his Father?
- [128:52]
Captain Crackrock
I mean, that. I mean, that's praying to God.
- [128:55]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, Jay, do you want to respond to those two?
- [128:58]
Jay Dyer
He doesn't understand what we argue when we argue monarchical trinitarianism. That's why he couldn't even say the word. He said mono trinitarianism. And so he doesn't even have the. The time or the energy to look into what his opponents are actually arguing. Because if he did, he would understand that he's making a word concept fallacy. The entire debate and our last debate, and he didn't even know what that was.
- [129:17]
Mike (Moderator)
Was chosen.
- [129:21]
Captain Crackrock
When Christ says I'm. No. That God is the only true God.
- [129:25]
Jay Dyer
Do you understand that? You have to interpret all the verses. You don't just pick one.
- [129:29]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, but that's heavy. Because if Christ says he's the one heavy, you can't make nobody else.
- [129:35]
Jay Dyer
So some verses are more important than the other one.
- [129:38]
Captain Crackrock
You can't join the Son to that one true God.
- [129:42]
Jay Dyer
You mean like John? One does.
- [129:43]
Captain Crackrock
Does it doesn't join him to that.
- [129:47]
Jay Dyer
The Word was God.
- [129:48]
Captain Crackrock
Where's the Holy Spirit at?
- [129:51]
Jay Dyer
He's mentioned later in the chapter, but
- [129:53]
Captain Crackrock
he's not in the beginning.
- [129:55]
Jay Dyer
So because he's not mentioned in the first verse. He's not in the beginning because it's later in the chapter, in the beginning with the word.
- [130:02]
Captain Crackrock
And the word was with God. And the word was God. If.
- [130:05]
Jay Dyer
And he's mentioned later, you idiot. So nothing left out.
- [130:10]
Captain Crackrock
If we're gonna say stupid you sense at the beginning.
- [130:15]
Mike (Moderator)
Let me just. Let me. Let me just ask you this real quick. Cap, can I just get through the. The 20, 35, and $50 questions before you leave?
- [130:24]
Captain Crackrock
So those three questions, you're saying it's
- [130:26]
Mike (Moderator)
probably about five total. You don't have to go crazy deep on all the responses or even.
- [130:31]
Jay Dyer
Well, no, I'll never go crazy deep. You don't have to Worry about that,
- [130:35]
Captain Crackrock
17, because I have something else that I. I have to do.
- [130:38]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, well, let me just get started here so we don't waste any more time. Rachel Wilson says for 20 bucks, I have watched Captain do four debates now, and in each one, he has accused the moderator of not moderating because he's always trying to change the rules or argue the rules to avoid having to answer all his fallacies. That's a long, terrible.
- [130:55]
Captain Crackrock
I won't answer that so you can get to the next one.
- [130:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, we got another big one here. Tengu sends a big 50. Thank you, Tangu. He said nice 666 shirt, dude. Straight out of the gate. You were bad faith straw manning the whole time and admitted to googling dueling. I was hoping for better from you heated moments. But I do sincerely pray God opens your heart to the divinity in all caps of Christ.
- [131:16]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, that should have been an immediate disqualifier. He didn't last debate too, because he doesn't actually know how to debate. He has to rely on AI. You're a fraud.
- [131:26]
Captain Crackrock
I can look up information. It's really nothing. You can't. You can't
- [131:31]
Jay Dyer
look up a fallacy.
- [131:33]
Captain Crackrock
This was a fraud.
- [131:34]
Jay Dyer
You got. You got exposed as a fraud. Dude.
- [131:37]
Captain Crackrock
Debate over a word fallacy, which had.
- [131:40]
Jay Dyer
No, you can't use AI in a debate.
- [131:43]
Captain Crackrock
I didn't use AI. I didn't use AI.
- [131:46]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, we could argue about that. We could set another debate up to argue about this.
- [131:50]
Captain Crackrock
Guys, I was looking up. If I was looking up something to prove my position, I get it. Word fallacy is not nobody's positions. Not his or mine.
- [131:57]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, twice. You're too dumb to know it.
- [132:00]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, six of spades says for 50 bucks, how am I supposed to listen? Listen to a person who can't pronounce basic words. You're in a prison cult. Come out. Come home to orthodoxy. Or don't. And then he called you a heretic.
- [132:12]
Jay Dyer
He's illiterate. He's functionally illiterate.
- [132:15]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, another $50. I think there's. There's only one left here. Question for Cap. Isaiah 48, 16. And now the Lord God and his Spirit hath sent me, plus PSA, Psalm 110. 1. The Lord says unto my Lord, sit thou at my right hand. You have one, the Lord God. Two. Two is spirit. Three. The one being sent. Looks like Trinity to me. Response?
- [132:37]
Captain Crackrock
It's actually not. Because when you read that, when it says, the Lord said unto my Lord, that's David talking to his son. That's why Christ echoes the same sentiment when Matthew, the 22nd chapter, When Christ said to the Pharisees, who is the Christ? What do you think of him? They said, son of David. Christ said, well, why did he in spirit say day? The Lord said unto my Lord. So there's a separation. The Lord is the most stupid to
- [133:03]
Jay Dyer
even know that it's about. It's a prophecy. It's a messianic prophecy.
- [133:08]
Captain Crackrock
I know.
- [133:08]
Jay Dyer
It's actually, I think he has a.
- [133:09]
Captain Crackrock
I don't know why you're in your feelings.
- [133:11]
Jay Dyer
Because I know it's about any feelings. You don't even know what you're talking about.
- [133:15]
Captain Crackrock
And I do know, because I do know it's a messianic prophecy. So again.
- [133:19]
Jay Dyer
Oh, then it's not just about David. So then it's not just about David. Thank you.
- [133:23]
Captain Crackrock
It is about David because the Messiah comes.
- [133:25]
Jay Dyer
Not just about David. David.
- [133:27]
Captain Crackrock
Christ is the son of David. Christ. Revelations 22.
- [133:30]
Jay Dyer
The whole chat, dude. Everyone's laughing at you.
- [133:33]
Captain Crackrock
Everyone's laughing at you, David.
- [133:35]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, someone just sent another 50 in because they know. They know. They don't have much time left, Cap. So paranoid Joe for 50, said Captain Cry man, can you name five people who are in your group in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th centuries? If you can't, that's tough, bro.
- [133:52]
Captain Crackrock
I wouldn't qualify that with an answer, because he can't.
- [133:56]
Jay Dyer
He does. There is nobody. It's a cult.
- [133:58]
Captain Crackrock
Give you an extra minute. 11, 18. That's gonna be it for me.
- [134:03]
Mike (Moderator)
All right. Okay, okay.
- [134:04]
Jay Dyer
Captain Rage, quit.
- [134:05]
Mike (Moderator)
Crash out Karen says for 25 bucks, Captain EBT, who built dim pyramids? Saint. Saint Tubman's Rosary is a string of food stamps. Well, that's rude. Crash out, Karen.
- [134:16]
Captain Crackrock
That's crazy.
- [134:17]
Jay Dyer
But I'm about to crash out. He gotta run right now.
- [134:20]
Captain Crackrock
That. On this platform. But y' all take care. I appreciate it. Till next time.
- [134:25]
Mike (Moderator)
Oh, dude, it was a lot of fun, man. You got the chat rolling.
- [134:28]
Jay Dyer
You gotta get back to that prison ministry.
- [134:30]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah, yeah.
- [134:32]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, it's been a pleasure. Thank you for stopping by. All right, let me.
- [134:57]
Jay Dyer
Sure. Well, I want to thank captain ebt for coming. I think they think he did. Being serious, I brought that up in the previous debate. Fair question. No comment. Greed. It's over.
- [136:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, There we go. Sorry, my mic did not transfer over to the. The screen share. Yeah, I got it, brother. I. I got it. Sorry. Yeah, sorry. I was running from reading the chat from you guys. Yeah, yeah. Okay. This is what happens when you audio troll. I don't pay attention to your. Your comments saying, I'm muted. All right, so let me just get back to this real quick. The first question was, do they think that Jesus has an Afro? Jay says he does think that.
- [137:43]
Jay Dyer
No, I'm saying I believe they do believe that.
- [137:45]
Mike (Moderator)
Well, yeah, not that you think that. That obviously.
- [137:47]
Jay Dyer
Right.
- [137:48]
Mike (Moderator)
The Jay believes that's. No, this is the claim. Okay. Sorry about that, guys. I. Marilyn, I read your other chat here. I read Rachel's. I'll read those real quick. Once more. Sosa Baby for Five says his cap is such a good listener. Why is he on his phone? Creation and evolution, or Psyops. We're all part of the one body of God. We always were, always will be your idol worshipers. That was from Maryland. Thank you. Thank you. Where? Detroit Dabbler says, where do I ask for an axe when axing? At the Axe store? That's a good one. It's like the chipmunk woodchuck. Okay, Rachel for Five says, captain is too dumb to understand any argument more complex than donkey pool cart. So Jay must be wrong. We did settle that. Jay was wrong. All right. If Jesus isn't God, how do you reconcile Hebrews 1:8? Okay, so we did. Did hit those verses specifically already. This was. This would have been maybe a good point to Zariac. You said the firstborn meant that Jesus was the firstborn creature. Does that mean David is the firstborn of Jesse when he was the youngest or the firstborn king when Saul was first? Maybe he could have.
- [139:05]
Jay Dyer
No, it's showing that the term. Yeah, it's showing that the term firstborn doesn't necessitate being a creature. It has to do with honor and preeminence amongst bonds.
- [139:14]
Mike (Moderator)
Orthodox chronicles. We will get to your. Your chat. I'm. I'm getting the ones that I skipped when I was going to the big. The bigger chats. So we're just. We're going back here real quick. Okay. We are now past that 50 chat in the pyramids chat. Captain. And Jesus is God. Accept Jesus as your lord and savior for five. That was Logan Messiah who read the Afro comments. All right. Before Robert Rson for five bucks says before Abraham was. I am. What exactly is the argument here? Captain knows nothing. Is an absolute idiot. God bless Jay. Keep going.
- [139:57]
Jay Dyer
Also a text that came up in the first debate.
- [140:03]
Mike (Moderator)
Thank you for saying that Patrick. Alb. There were some audio trolls. Maybe not you specifically. The stream. Glitching multiple times was not an issue for a lot of people. So I don't know why it was for you brother. Sorry about that. J. Constant Doodle 32 for 5 says Jay is explaining this. Super clear. How is this guy not getting it? Amazing.
- [140:26]
Jay Dyer
That's amazing.
- [140:27]
Mike (Moderator)
That's my best James impression there.
- [140:28]
Captain Crackrock
That's amazing. You obey him.
- [140:31]
Jay Dyer
Not you.
- [140:32]
Mike (Moderator)
I denied your questions to Captain. No, I didn't. I was reading them as they came in.6 of spades. Which question did I miss? I went. I wanted to ask your big ones that you paid for first. Maybe I missed one of the ten dollar ones. I knew he only had a short amount of time. So that's. That's the thing is I didn't want you to feel like you wasted 50, you know. Okay. You did send the. The Afro question, so apologies for that. I did ask Jay that though.
- [141:04]
Captain Crackrock
And
- [141:07]
Mike (Moderator)
Supa say And Jinjay for 10 bucks says Daz. Right. Crack rock. You were the most politest. That means you won Coco ray L for 10. Captain, please stop acting innocent. You were extremely rude and racist last debate. Now you're pretending to be cordial. You both give and take.
- [141:28]
Jay Dyer
Absolute lulu.
- [141:30]
Mike (Moderator)
Captain, please. Or that's. That's just another duplicate. Did you send that twice? Fluffin ho. 20 for 10 says Captain Heretic over here on a generational masochistic run. I think he's got a humiliation fetish. Alchemist for five Are African Americans under the curse of Ham? Even Tubman. Is that a Mormon reference?
- [141:56]
Jay Dyer
Not necessarily. It's. I mean it could be, but there's other groups that a lot of Protestants had that perspective in the 1700s, 1800s. Could I could we do a brief screen share? I'll make it really quick.
- [142:08]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah.
- [142:09]
Jay Dyer
As a response.
- [142:09]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, go ahead.
- [142:11]
Jay Dyer
Really briefly. I'll just point out that if you come over here to. This is Strong's 4416 Prototokos. This is. He always used this argument. First begotten or first born.
- [142:21]
Captain Crackrock
Born.
- [142:21]
Jay Dyer
You'll notice that the word does not necessitate creature. It refers to first, to experience, glorification, or simply preeminent over the created order. So in Revelation, when it talks about him being the firstborn of the created order, it's talking about the new creation is not necessitating that he is the first thing that God created.
- [142:41]
Mike (Moderator)
Awesome. Thank you for putting that up. I did not skip anyone's chat. We're going through all of them.
- [142:46]
Captain Crackrock
Them.
- [142:48]
Mike (Moderator)
Jerome, the DP since 10 bucks says where did it state Abraham laid with, slept with or went into Sarah to make Isaac? Where does it say Isaac slept with or laid with Rebecca to make Jacob? Want to clarify that for him, Jay? Or.
- [143:05]
Jay Dyer
I've never heard this line of argument. I. I mean, I think it would. I mean, does he think they magically popped out? Like. I don't understand the architect argument. I don't know what he's saying.
- [143:18]
Mike (Moderator)
You guys with the muting. Stop it. Batman Inc. 2793 just google doctrine of discovery. Not true. Check, check. No, I got signal, brother. Half. Half the. The chats. Like, I hate this mod. I love this mod. I don't even want to look at it right now. It's just they keep sending super chats. Jay, thank you for being here. Did you see the poll, by the way?
- [143:53]
Captain Crackrock
Yeah.
- [143:53]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay.
- [143:54]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, Appreciate that.
- [143:55]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, they did get a real poll in there. The first one was just a dig at me. Thank you, James Matan voice. I don't. I don't think I could do a baton impression. Not. Not a big baton follower. Captain, can you name 10 books? How would he say that?
- [144:16]
Jay Dyer
I don't know. I mean, just name any ten books.
- [144:19]
Mike (Moderator)
No, but you. You got to say that in a Matan voice is what the.
- [144:23]
Jay Dyer
Oh, I haven't worked on a maton impression. I was about to go on the tongue before I left la. But we did talk about a future. A future episode.
- [144:31]
Captain Crackrock
Done.
- [144:32]
Mike (Moderator)
Nice. Yeah, I've never really had them pop in my algo too much. Just here and there when people I follow go on intel is wild for five says ask Cap if we was Kangs and she there was a ridiculous amount of two dollar super chats saying the same thing. So apologies to everyone who sent that and didn't. Didn't hear me say it 30 times. All right, Justin. O Dizzle for 10 says, great job to Mike of the clan mod. Well done, bro. Brother. Thank you, Justin. Intel is wild since 10. He just sent another $10 to say, ask Cap if we was kangs. And after he sent five to say that. So really, I mean, we could have spent the entire Q and A just asking him the same question over and over again. All right, d jewels for 50. I did read that one. Yep. That was the one about the trinity with the response. Intel is wild for 10, says Cap. Get the hair lined up.
- [145:34]
Captain Crackrock
Wow.
- [145:35]
Mike (Moderator)
Egzen for five says for cap. I'll give you the St. Nicholas treatment at 125 Fifth in Lex. I don't. Is that a threat, or is he gonna give him a Christmas present?
- [145:48]
Jay Dyer
I don't know what that means.
- [145:49]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. Seafaring afro. I did not skip your comment. Here it is for 10, then. Ishwa is black. There is a tribe in Nigeria called Edo and Isan. Their sacred color is red. Japheth is white, Also hairy. Black people are Iswa. They are. They're pretending to be smooth Jacob. That's. That's an op to you, Jay.
- [146:13]
Jay Dyer
I don't know what. What's happening. I'm lost. You super. Just getting weird, dog.
- [146:19]
Mike (Moderator)
Is Ishua blind? Black?
- [146:21]
Captain Crackrock
Ishua.
- [146:23]
Mike (Moderator)
E, S, U, A. Is that spelled correctly? Maybe I'm saying it wrong.
- [146:27]
Jay Dyer
Esau.
- [146:28]
Mike (Moderator)
Is that what it is? Esau? I always thought it was spelled.
- [146:30]
Jay Dyer
Maybe they meant to say Esau.
- [146:31]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, I was trying to read it like it's spelled.
- [146:34]
Jay Dyer
Is he black? I don't think so.
- [146:36]
Mike (Moderator)
Got it.
- [146:37]
Jay Dyer
I mean, he's Jacob's brother. I don't think Jacob was black.
- [146:41]
Mike (Moderator)
The church. Church for 10 bucks says cap. Is buck breaking a real thing thing? I don't. I don't want to ask.
- [146:51]
Jay Dyer
That's a gay thing.
- [146:52]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. That's what I was unfortunately expecting. Ask Cap if we was gangs of for another 10 and tell us wild. Thank you very much. JV free, saying I skipped his $5 question for Jay. Did I? Was it in the beginning, or have I just not gotten there yet? Some of you guys are being really impressed.
- [147:13]
Captain Crackrock
Patient.
- [147:18]
Mike (Moderator)
I don't think I did. So we did start out saying we were only going to do 5 and 10 and ups, and then we had to go a little higher. I'm looking. I'm looking. All right. If we didn't get to it yet, we're just going to have to circle back.
- [147:37]
Captain Crackrock
All right.
- [147:38]
Mike (Moderator)
Going Back to where we were were. Jay is constant doodle. 32 for 5 says Jay is. No, I said that one. Okay. There was a lot saying that. You were being super clear there. I was getting that one confused. I talked to James about getting a like a lobby music for the Q and A. Okay, here we are again. We are back at six of spades. 20 bucks says you're a disgusting human. Captain crackhead. That's $20 to support the channel. We appreciate that. Okay, Seafare and Echo sent 35 saying Esau is black. This is so. This is more of an assertion on the same super chat. There is a tribe all over West. He said the same thing. Okay, I guess I'll repeat it since he sent another 35. That's. That's fair. There's a tribe all over West Africa called Ido and Hasua Isan. Another one in Cameroon called Sua. Okay, that's a little different. That wasn't in the first one. Also hairy black people are Esau because Esau was hairy. White is not Esau. No white tribe named Esau. Okay. It would have been better if we could have had Cap's perspective on that. Orthodox foreignes phronesis. Captain, you can't pronounce the word ask properly. Why would I trust you on anything? I did think I read that one to him. Deuce fault 1099 for 10 says Bro's church fathers are Harriet Tubman, Ashanti and Yakub.
- [149:30]
Jay Dyer
Literally, you know. Well, not Yakub, but can I point out real quick that a lot of people were asking, like, when are you. I don't mean to be if this is against you guys policy, but people have been asking when. When is my Jesse Lee Peterson interview coming up? It's going to be in. In about eight hours tomorrow morning. So it is going up.
- [149:49]
Captain Crackrock
So.
- [149:50]
Jay Dyer
So sorry.
- [149:53]
Mike (Moderator)
No, that's totally okay. Like this is the. The time where it's supposed to be a little bit more loose, you know, hopefully whatever he's got going on is good. Yes. If you haven't seen Andrew's debate with Captain, you should go watch. I agree. Guy goes golfing. That's a good one. How about a Wakanda voice says Justin. No, I'm not going to do that.
- [150:18]
Jay Dyer
That.
- [150:23]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay, Dewes, I read that comment. Who was the most persuasive tonight? It looks like from the time that I screenshotted this, that poll said Jay Dyer at 90%, Captain at 5, Ty at 2%. And I don't know. I'm faking gay at 4.
- [150:40]
Jay Dyer
Those guys, I wish I could have went over the faking gay people, but I'm sorry. Yeah, I tried to, I tried to admit I was as was kind of a, you know, bipoc diva. I thought maybe that would win over the, the fake and gay people, but I guess not.
- [150:55]
Mike (Moderator)
That was crazy work, bro. I said that was the last thing I expected. Robert Ryanson for 20 bucks says cap, I'll. I'll be honest with you, brother. You ain't no king, you ain't no prophet. However, can you explain who Isaiah is speaking about in all of Isaiah 50? If not, I suggest you not be bumbling pool for five seconds. That would be good to, to do a, a review video. Cap, if you're watching and, and every time I ask when maybe you can stop it and respond to that. That way you have more time. That'd be, that'd be good content.
- [151:29]
Jay Dyer
I want to remind all of my clippers too. Please clip the heck out of this and link back to James and modern day debate because we have multiple clips. I think we have five or six clip channels now, so everybody be sure and clip the heck out of this one.
- [151:45]
Mike (Moderator)
I'm not skipping the chats because of anything the chats did necessarily. It's. It's just a matter of respect for Jay's time and we had very short time with.
- [151:55]
Jay Dyer
Can I call out a person on I'd like to debate on NDD right now. Scam Shamu is out here complaining about me. He just started a stream over this and I would like to offer Scam Shamu to come on and to debate me on modern day debate and a formal moderated debate date.
- [152:11]
Mike (Moderator)
That's out there now. Clip it. Clip it. We got 12 clip people working for Jay that'll put that out there on
- [152:21]
Jay Dyer
the double and he won't. He won't do it.
- [152:23]
Captain Crackrock
But I want to.
- [152:24]
Jay Dyer
I want it out there that I'm offering to debate him.
- [152:26]
Mike (Moderator)
What was the topic?
- [152:27]
Jay Dyer
You said anything to do with church fathers. Anything to do with the Roman Catholic Church. He's a Catholic apologist. So I'd love to debate scam, shimmer move. It's got to be formal though because he'll scream and cuss and lose his mind if it's not formal.
- [152:44]
Mike (Moderator)
Makes sense. Center that right there.
- [152:49]
Captain Crackrock
Boom.
- [152:49]
Mike (Moderator)
Bother me. Robert Ryan for 20 says I came to holy orthodoxy due in part because of Jay's analysis. Many years spent searching for the reason why. Take this man to school. Jay, can you please assert why isaiah what Isaiah 96 says as well? Well, as who it is speaking of.
- [153:08]
Jay Dyer
I mean, it's a famous prophecy of Christ. You mean tomorrow the government will be on his shoulders? For unto us, a child is given, is born, a son is given. The government will be upon his shoulders. Name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. So Jesus says in the Gospels many times that he came in the name of the Father, Father. And because it's a messianic prophecy, it also answers the questions that Captain Crockrock brought up, which is, who's the throne of David? And it says Jesus will sit on that throne of David. He sat on that throne forevermore when he ascended and sat at the right hand of the Father.
- [153:48]
Mike (Moderator)
Thank you for clarifying that for Mr. Robert Ryanson. T. King 2199 for 5 says it's asked, not Acts. It's Bible, not Babel. Tyler W.2434 for 10 says I am a firefighter because I save. Am I a firefighter because I save a cat from a tree? No. Just because you do something Christ like doesn't make you God. I'd have to agree with that. CMAC 6686 for 10 says captain. What? One verse explicitly states the non Israelites cannot receive eternal salvation. Not by implication or inference. Would have been good to hear that response.
- [154:31]
Jay Dyer
Oh, I know a good idea. I will debate Sam Shamoon on the Vatican's teaching on Islam at Vatican II. Since he's a Catholic apologist who used 20 years arguing that the Muslims worship a demon named Allah, and now he's a Roman Catholic, so he has to affirm that Muslims and Christians and Jews all worship the same God. So that's a great topic to challenge. Scam show, move.
- [154:56]
Mike (Moderator)
Got it. I'll. I'll talk to James. He's probably writing some notes right now. El Mod. That was a perfect on a monop for how cap says Bible. Oh, my bad. Well, he didn't spell it like that. You spelled it more clear. Okay, I read six of spades, $50. Answer my previous question, Captain Crybaby. Unfortunately, he did not get that going. All right, anyone in the chat that thinks that they sent a chat that was not read, please comment it real quick. I'll say it real quick. Did Jules $2. Sam is reviewing your debate right now, Lowell. Oh, well, that's a good time to call it out then, Jay.
- [155:42]
Jay Dyer
That's why I offered to debate his newfound faith of Rome that believes the that Islam does not worship a demon.
- [155:51]
Mike (Moderator)
Okay. No, I. I found some more. Debate some more Comments here. Appreciate you guys. We got six of spades. Another 10 bucks. This is. Yeah. When we started going back and forth too much. The B H I R Y T haters. Who would have guessed? See. Hello, Sam. You don't know me. Thanks for reviewing. Okay. We got through all of those. Yep. There was just probably like three more that said we was kangs that I didn't read. Which you heard me ask it like five times, guys. Awesome. Jay, you got anything else you want to say? You want to do a book plug?
- [156:39]
Jay Dyer
Yeah, I do have my third book out. Esoteric Hollywood Part 3. Appreciate that. You can get this at my website. Jason elsis.com. they're all signed copies. I review and analyze the movies from a symbolic and conspiratorial perspective. So if people are interested, you can go to J's analysis.com in the shop. And you can also subscribe to me on YouTube and my website as well.
- [157:00]
Mike (Moderator)
Awesome. We got a gentleman named Creed saying that I miss his chat. Double check. I don't think I did. But I will double check one more time. Said question for Jay. How do you answer this argument? We was dazed. Let. We was day Z. Let me ask. Ask you something, Jake.
- [157:24]
Captain Crackrock
I don't.
- [157:25]
Jay Dyer
I can see. I can see that one.
- [157:26]
Mike (Moderator)
All right. We just. Creed. I didn't miss it. There you go. And Roven, you're saying I miss yours too. And a Roven. Let me see. I don't have one.
- [157:38]
Jay Dyer
They're saying Sam Chamon is deleting the comments because he won't debate because he's. He's full of. Of it.
- [157:44]
Mike (Moderator)
I asked you. I asked you to repost it. Josh088. I definitely read yours.
- [157:57]
Jay Dyer
Yeah. He always says he'll get another guy to debate because he can't debate me on that. He knows he'll lose. But there's nobody in the Roman Catholic world that will debate me on Vatican 2.
- [158:09]
Captain Crackrock
So.
- [158:09]
Jay Dyer
So by the way, if there is anybody, let's. Let's do it. Modern day debate can host it.
- [158:15]
Mike (Moderator)
Yes, we could. Absolutely. James should be back by then. Josh, I'll read it one more time. Even if you're gaslighting me, bro. Please ask the captain. How do you explain John 11113 which explicitly states in the beginning Jesus was with God and was God. It's very blatant. Ask him. If not, then I asked at least two more that said the exact thing. And I asked you guys to post the actual question in your thing. Don't just say mine because then I know you're trolling. Well, it's been fun. It's been fun, Jay.
- [158:49]
Jay Dyer
Absolutely. Thank you, man. Appreciate it. Good job moderating.
- [158:53]
Mike (Moderator)
Did my best, man. I. I will definitely put the. The pedal to the metal on the mute button next time. If I. If it's, you know, something discontentous again. I just, just. I had a lot more benefit of the doubt that it could. It could go better in terms of not talking each other over each other.
- [159:10]
Jay Dyer
I knew it wasn't going to work, but that's okay. Appreciate it, man. Have a good night, and thanks for having me.
- [159:13]
Mike (Moderator)
Yes, sir. Oh, if you could respond to my X DM by the end of the night. No rush, bro. It's point Stream, I believe is what my ex is.
- [159:30]
Jay Dyer
Let me see. It might be in the request section.
- [159:32]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah, you don't.
- [159:33]
Jay Dyer
I see it.
- [159:33]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah. You don't have to do it on air or anything. It's not like a question you have to answer. It's just. Just a little thing that I sent
- [159:38]
Captain Crackrock
you there
- [159:40]
Mike (Moderator)
that was.
- [159:41]
Jay Dyer
Oh, the email. Yeah, yeah.
- [159:43]
Mike (Moderator)
So that was just acknowledging. So I just wanted you to be able to see that so you could disregard it for one. And then the thing after that was more of.
- [159:51]
Jay Dyer
Okay.
- [159:52]
Mike (Moderator)
Yeah.
- [159:53]
Jay Dyer
I appreciate it, man.
- [159:54]
Mike (Moderator)
Yes, sir. It's good.
- [159:55]
Jay Dyer
All right.
- [159:55]
Mike (Moderator)
All right, bro.
- [159:57]
Jay Dyer
Have a good night.
- [159:57]
Mike (Moderator)
Snes. I'm going to read your comment before we get. Get going, Jay, you take it easy, bro. Let's see. I don't want anyone to feel like they got slighted, Obviously. I'm good faith. I'm good faith. See, there was
- [160:22]
Captain Crackrock
copy
- [160:26]
Mike (Moderator)
paste. Give me a second, guys. This is. I'm looking for the. The chat for. Snes. Did you. Did you post it? Yes. American nacho. I'm illiterate. Say it to my face at debatecon. I've met you in person, bro. I'm all right. Thank you. I appreciate that. Vegan skills. No, I did read yours, bro. I didn't miss any of the. The big ones. Snes, like I said, if you post what the actual question was, I'll read it for the audience. You. I don't see that you've done that. I'm trying to be good faith. Okay. He's trolling. Thank you. All right, guys. I appreciate y'.
- [161:30]
Captain Crackrock
All.
- [161:30]
Mike (Moderator)
It was a. A very heater. Heated. Heater of heating. And we're gonna. Oh, Sam declined before it started. Bummer. Anyways, we're gonna be back on Thursday with a. Another debate. That's going to be good. Let me see if I can shout out what it is Specifically. And while you're waiting for me to do that, get your tickets to debate Con 8 in Dallas.
- [162:01]
Jay Dyer
Okay.
- [162:01]
Mike (Moderator)
4:16 is going to be Elijah Moore versus Taylor Fogarty. I have moderated debate with Taylor before. Pretty good debater. I've not seen Elijah Moore. Who do you guys think is going to win in that one chat? Don't let them troll you, James. Okay, I won't. I won't. Yeah, so that's going to be 41626 at 8pm That's a pro choice versus pro life. So just to remind everyone, we do politics, religion, and science on this channel. So if you're ever wondering why, like, oh, I've never seen you guys. Yes, I am moderating life in hd. I've never seen you guys debate this topic or that topic. I mean, those are the parameters. So if you think you can get a really good one put together and you want to do it, send us an email and we'll. We'll consider it. I'm not nearly fatigued enough yet to deal with. Okay, thank you. I am tired, though, so I just wanted to hang out with you guys for a second. And all y' all saying you did good with moderating are now complaining about refunds. Mike will be Mike. And Mike is what Mike does. Thank you. Broken and humbled. Bring this back here. Is this. This not the best waiting music? You're waiting for me to end it? So surprised you guys are still here. Was 1.8 thousand people just chilling. I want to say good night. It's been a good decompression session. Constant doodles. Two bucks. Jay was great. That guy is insane. I just. Yeah, I just wish that I could not have to be so hovering over the mute button. And then the moment that I think I have to do it, it seems like it chills out. And then so I get. I get a little bit more relaxed and I start screen capping the super chats, and the next thing I know, it's back at it. They're. They're moderator, moderator. I'm like, oh, man. B. Scott, thank you very much. I think we. Yeah, we had a few interruptions during the main section, so I think it went on a little longer than maybe it was supposed to. But I just wish we had more time for the Q and A's, because a lot of. A lot of people had questions specifically for Captain. So the reason why I still wanted to ask him, though, whether he was here or not is like I said, he could still do a review stream, listen to the questions and Then respond to them. So you guys keep an eye on that. I'll email him, see if he will or dm DM him on X and see if he'll do that. And then you guys can get, you know, more a five minute response versus that. And then Jay could do a review of that response video and then give his response. That'd be a good idea, right? A ace of spades. Just got to tell you that money is already spent. Sorry, bro. They already spent the money. Debate Con 8's not cheap. Dark Brain 47 for 5. You did a heck of a job. Fun time was had by all. You're here. Thank you. Sub Live subtitles would be a good idea, Joseph, But we also need to get a like a sign interpreter right in the corner. We do the sign interpreter. That's going to really open up the audience. Deaf people might love debates, but you know, keep up with different people's lip reading. That's going to be intense. Okay, I'm going to. I'm going to spend five more minutes. You guys are still going at it in the chat. It's been a lot of fun. Like the video. Get your tickets to debatecon8. Subscribe if you are from a different channel. And this is the first time you're realizing I have not subscribed to mdd. I should just do it because they might have some more fire debates like this one. The sign interpreter should just do interpretive dance.
- [166:36]
Captain Crackrock
Wow.
- [166:36]
Mike (Moderator)
Marilyn, I see your comment to Dark Brain. I see that comment. Life in hd. Goofy Goobers. Stay for the after debate. Chilling. Yeah, that was the other thing. Normally Yerba Mate talks, does an after. I haven't seen that link going around here. Just gonna shout that out. Are you guys in the chat? Y' all doing that tonight? What say you, max? Jerome? The DP for 10 says Isaiah 54 is about Sarah per Galatians 4. 26:20. Thank you for clarifying that. Do appreciate your support, sir. You make it hard to to end it. When you guys come back in the hundreds and I was about to end it, it's like James is making ad money. Why would I take that away from him if I'm not gonna break the stream? If you guys know the. The name of the track on Tim Allen's the Santa Claus where he's eating the pudding and he is like taking forever. I've been trying to figure out what the name of that song is so that I could download it. Let's get the live chat to 2K boys. That's funny. Where. Where Are you getting them from where you. Where are you getting them from? Life in hd. This is our favorite part. Mike, just pretend to ignore us. Pudding eater. Yes. Yeah, I mean, if jv, if you think I didn't read your comment, I will look one more time and I'll confirm if I did or not. Oh, dude, I'm sorry. I. I will acknowledge that yours I did have to get through because we had super limited time and people are sending 30, 40, 50, whatever, and I wanted to be able to ask Captain all those. So JV free says for 199, prove that Jay is mean. He blocked me. I'll DM him on X and ask him to. I'll screen. Is that your name? That he blocked the JV Free? I'll make sure that he at least considers how mean he was to you. Now we got 2.5 K. No, that's it. That was from the screenshot. My bad. Okay, good. I was freaking out. I was like, I'm never getting off. You guys are going to chat too much and you like it too much. James G. 3582 for 99 cents. Just. He didn't say anything. He just wanted to show some support. I appreciate that. It was another question. I don't know. I see only one that I had. Well, what was your other question, man? Just paste it in the chat like I asked 30 minutes ago. Well, no, Jay does block people. There's usually like three people sending super chats or calling in on X when he does his lives, just asking them, asking him to unblock them. And I've only, like, tuned in for a couple of the streams, and every one of them I've known that. I'm a joke of a moderator. That's what I was saying. Not cool, bro. That's it? That's what you wanted to send me money to say that? Okay. Is it because you think I skipped one of your things? You're just hating because that's fine. I said multiple times on three different streams. I'm new. I'm gonna get better. And that's. That's how it is. So I appreciate your 99 cents. Oh, we just. We just spent it. Yeah, you don't. You don't gotta hate me. I don't even know. I mean, if you don't like it, I don't even know why you're in here. That. That's what doesn't make any sense. Well, okay. MLO 5049. I. I will. I will address your comment saying it's not about muting moderator, it's about knowing when to question or to make someone answer. The the situation is sometimes is everybody knows, including the other debater. You know what me stepping in and doing that constantly is going to do. And a lot of times the debater does that before me, so I don't want to just repeat them. And then also if I do that continuously in certain debates that I've been in, that's a common thing that I know that I'd be doing constantly, then it's going to come off very unbiased. And no matter how much I try, there's going to be a large portion of the audience that just thinks I'm like bullying that specific person and into one sided question answering. So I really do try to be hands off until it's impossible. And also it's not the moderator's job to call out fallacies. This isn't like a, a debate stand in school or college where there's judges. That would be a judge's job, bro. Tell me you don't know anything about debates without telling me. What. Name one other debate moderator on YouTube that calls out fallacies every five seconds that people are committing. Okay, you're Joseph Mullins. You're taking the bullying comment way more specifically than I meant it. Just replace bullying with, you know, pigeonhole or any other phrase you want. Appreciate all the positive comments here, But yeah, I, I do invite all you guys to set up your own debate between Captain and anybody else. And then when you do it, send me a little link. I'll be in the chat. Life in hd. Have we, have we met in person? You said you were from Austin. I was living in Austin last year. Just want to say hi to my old janitor in middle school apparently is watching Justin McDizzle as random. I don't even know how he emailed me. Maybe he's a stalker. You guys, what was the. Was the final end result of the poll? I read it like right after I first saw it. I told Jay, but where are we at now? Oh, we got a little change there. Who was most persuasive tonight? 88. Jay Dyer. 5% captain, 2% tie. The, I don't know, faking gay. That went up, up. And no. Ls for James. He's awesome. He's. He's been so gracious getting me experienced as a moderator, throwing me in the fires with the hard ones. So no Ls for, for James in the chat, only Ws. Go off, Doug. You know, honestly, that one, that one Got my, my energy so frenetic like right in the middle that that's partly why I'm chilling with you guys. I can't get up. Someone send me some royalty free music to throw in the background. Unless you guys just like to be on hold. For the brass. Shame on mod. For the brash in moderation. Brash brass. There's, there's a lot of comments that I, I did not read in, in the chat, not the super chat
- [178:16]
Jay Dyer
that
- [178:16]
Mike (Moderator)
were both, both ways specifically directed at me as well. So kind of you take it and you leave it, I guess. Guy goes golfing. All you got to do is be fair to both sides and make them answer questions while knowing when to change subjects. That's a good model. Moderator. Yeah, I tried to change subjects a couple times and, and they just didn't want to. It's like how many more times could I ask? They just wanted to finish what they said for that, that last sentence or two. And I'm a nice guy, so I'm gonna generally let them do it. I only had to mute them a couple times so that we could absolutely just move on time wise moshi Trash moderator. Well, thank you very much. Do you moderate, sir? I would love to, to compare. Genesis B. We're chilling. We chilling. I'll give it another 5, 5, 10. I mean if there are people from CAPS crew that were, you know, upset at the moderation, I don't, I would just like to know what you think should have happened. Honestly, I don't control how the guys argue. I can't say like, okay, now you have to say this. Now you have to say this. Now you have to say this the whole time. That's not, that's not moderation. I don't normally do this, but if you guys want, you can go sub to my own YouTube channel. I'm going to start streaming on there a little more. I wanted to wait at least 13 debates in before I made my own channel to make sure that I wasn't going to just stop doing it. It's point streams. Oh, I'm going to comment in the chat. If the, the people who think I'm trash want to go bully me, that's fine. Get a real job, you grifter of men. I'm chilling with a camera on and obs on and you're insulting a guy in a YouTube comment section. Nice. Yeah. Guy goes golfing. I wasn't, I wasn't criticizing your comment, bro. About criticizing. I thank you for your feedback. B. Scott says the best moderation is just making sure both are talking at the same time so the audience can't hear what either is saying or getting one person to answer the question. Otherwise, let them go. I agree. If people are talking over each other, it makes it really difficult to enjoy it. Even if it's funny. Like when you can piece it together. Yeah. You gotta kind of make sure that you don't let it go on too long. Moshi. I didn't argue at all for any points, bro. I'm the moderator. I gave no points at all. I just asked the questions that people paid money to ask. That's funny. Unite and create for life. Jacob. Try hard. I'm not. What am I trying? I'm just chilling. Just reading your comments. This is. This is now just a chill debrief that we're going to end very soon. And yet you guys are chilling. And I can. I can appreciate that we went back up from 1.2 to 1.4k just because we're chilling. I don't know why I'm just chilling. Everybody's chilling. Chilling. Chunk, I'm putting it in the comments. Babylonia, you can go mass report it now. Yeah, no, you're right. Unite and create. That was Call of Duty trash talk the whole way. That was. That's what was funny is like. Like, where am I? Just right there. 1108pm. Howdy. Mad Tuna says interjecting is what mod should do to keep the defense debate focused. Well, honestly, it was pretty focused. It's just there was some discrepancies on whether or not one person was saying what the other person was saying in relation to the specific topic. That. That's what was sometimes hard to stop because you have to let them hash it out until it seems like it's not gonna get hashed out. Which sometimes it would be like, you know, a solid minute of that before I start trying to cut in. And then they're just not listening. So I started hovering over the mute button, and then it seems like it quiets down. That was. That was the pattern the whole time. Wild boar, Grocery store. Golden hour. And more and more you casting spells in the comments. Duh, bucks. I'll be doing that. Lgo. Taney. Tanina. El go Tanina. That's what it is. Moderator was aura farming the whole time. Not gonna lie. It's funny. Rory Workmeister, bro. First time I seen you moderate, you did just fine. No problems at all. You could be a little more assertive maybe. You did fine. You did good. Well, I respected the. The fact that they're both men who, you know, men are going to like to handle things that they want. 17 years of debating versus 20 or however many J's done. And I thought there was going to be so many some decorum kept to that I wouldn't have to interject into SeaFaring Afro sends $5. Thanks, bro. The real land of Judah or Ludia was in Thailand, named by the Dutch. The reason they spell with the I because letter J was not created until the 16th century. Oh, okay. So that said I, not a L. I hate how capital eyes look like L's. They're just lowercase lobster. GPT says you will get better with practice, James. I know. I'm trying to be like Mike. Joseph Mullins. James is the. He reads all my controversial posts and laughs slow. Well, there's a certain. Yeah, there's a certain line. I'm not going to read things that are going to get James's channel completely taken down. I have too much respect for him and the platform and yeah, that's. At the end of the day, people are paying money and I want to do them the service.
- [187:15]
Captain Crackrock
So
- [187:18]
Mike (Moderator)
while we're. While we're getting ready to end it completely, we hung out for about 15, 20 minutes. I appreciate you guys still still being here. If you haven't yet, get your tickets to debate Con 8. That's. It's really going to be fun and we can chill Two days in Dallas hotel. Lots of debates from I think starts like morning goes to the afternoon. It is always a fun event. I've done three now and they're really fun. One or two and then I did a slew of moderations in between. We did six, seven. Then this will be eight. Seafaring Afro for another five white people were part of the empire. Two whites or Japeth. They were the Majapet empire of Indonesia, Japan and Java. Java One of the son of Japeth.
- [188:14]
Captain Crackrock
Okay,
- [188:25]
Mike (Moderator)
Are you Moshe? Are you talking about me or Jay? I don't know. You keep lumping us into the same category. I have not argued against anything. Are you guys able to hear the Cisco music in the background? I didn't know if that's even playing anymore. You call Blind dinosaur. Had enough? I mean, I'm not. There's no one here to debate. I mean, they can read your comment the same as anyone else. There's no one going to argue that point. From the tribe of Eldea. I've never heard of that. All right, guys, one more minute and then I'm off. Just wanted to Wanted to push myself to hang with y' all a little longer. Deal with it. I'm dealing with it. I'm not telling you to deal with it. You could obviously leave at any time. Carl Pittinger. What is my opinion? Mike, that's kind of. That's a deep question. But, bro, I don't think we have time in the minute for me to really get into it. Seafaring Afro since another five. Thank you, sir. You're single handedly keeping me from exiting out of this because I don't want to cut you off too early. It seems like you're on one of an educating spree here. King James, race was okay. That's not. That's gonna get clipped if I read that. But his descendants today could be white or black, depending on your last name. Around the world. Like James Stewart. Yeah, I know. I. Joseph, I agree. I want to. I want to build up the tolerance. That's why I've been kind of doing more and agreeing to any moderation that gets thrown at me. I want it to be something that I could build up like a resistance to too. And this one was highly energetic. Like I could. When we had. I think at some point it was like 3, 500 bucks or 3, 500 chatters at once. That was energetically overwhelming. Crucible. Andrew said, For 10 bucks, go to bed, doofus. I appreciate that, sir. No, I am. I'm. I'm trying to. I'm trying to just get those last couple reps in. If I would have went to bed any earlier, you wouldn't have said that. So that's. If you just check this out right here. I had literally 10 seconds left and you sent it. So now. Now the alarm's going off. 3500 rookie. Yeah. No, we can't all be Andrew and have 10,000 at any given time. That's. That's a lot of energy. I mean, I don't know how he stays so chill. It's just what he does. Seafaring Afro. I don't think Andrew was talking about you. Pretty sure he was telling me to go to bed, which I will at this point. Now. All right, guys, get your. Well, I'll say it one more time. Get your tickets to debate con 8. Andrew's gonna be there. His wife Rachel's gonna be there. We're all gonna be really stoked to watch those debates. It's gonna be fun. He's going against Dinesh d'. Souza. I believe it's one of the headlining debates. And then destiny is an undercard. The Same day, I believe, going against d', Souza, maybe the day before. Not sure exactly of the organization of that. If it's in the morning, most likely, that's what's happening. All right. Yeah, no W's in the chat for. For everybody hanging out. We do appreciate you. And then last thing, like the video, so James can push that out. And then if you could also give the. I think there's. Yeah, give the debaters a little bit of algorithmic love, too. I mean, even if you disagree, it's gonna push it out there, and then it's gonna do what it does, like just ignoring. It's not gonna be, I guess, the best turnout. If you agree or disagree, getting in the chat, getting yourself out there, if you're a debater, that's what's gonna cause some changes in the direction you're want. All right, guys, with that, I will send you off. Oh, I wish I could do raids on this side. I don't know when I can get that set up. I'll talk to James about that. All right, guys. Y' all take it easy. Yeah, that. Dancing him the song Street. There's nothing left to eat we're on our winning streak Going out in style. Yeah, I hear you. I'm not dead yet. Break out the hand grenades. You know it's time to play. Explosions to the brain. Going out in.
- [197:00]
Jay Dyer
Sa. Don't.