Pt 1 -DEBATES! CIA & Dalai Lama, Eastern Religions & TANTRIC SECRETS W/JAMIE!

Summary

Jay'sAnalysis Podcast Summary

Episode: Pt 1 - DEBATES! CIA & Dalai Lama, Eastern Religions & TANTRIC SECRETS W/JAMIE!
Host: Jay Dyer | Guest/Co-host: Jamie
Date: May 30, 2026

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Overview

This episode of Jay'sAnalysis is a sprawling, at times satirical, exploration into a wide range of topics including debates with online religious influencers, the geostrategic politics of Islam and Europe, the relationship between Protestantism, Orthodoxy, and modern internet culture, as well as a detailed foray into the intersection of Eastern religions (especially Tantra, yoga, and Buddhism) and Western exploitation. The episode features Jay Dyer's signature blend of comedic sketches, live call-ins with challenging discussions (especially on controversial race topics), long-form rants, pop culture references, and ultimately a deep-dive with Jamie into the abuse-laden underbelly of Tantric and yoga cults in the West.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Satirical Openings & "Cholo Church" Bit

[00:39-08:26]

• Jay opens with a comedic, irreverent bit mocking online church exclusivism, poking fun at "Chicano/Cholo Church" as the "only true church."
• Satirical references to online follower counts and monetization, lampooning the “cringe-core” side of ‘Christian influencer’ culture.
• Notable Quote:

  "Cholo church is the only true church and how could you refute me or whatever? Exclusivism, bro. Chicano Church, bro." – Jay Dyer [00:39]

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2. The Techno-Political Plan for Europe & Islam

[14:23-20:08]

• Caller Chris raises concerns about Western underestimation of the threat from Islam and Turkey’s “blue homeland” policies.
• Jay contextualizes this within his recurring theme: deliberate technocratic restructuring of Europe via engineered migration.
• Jay claims prescience in discussing the "Kalergi plan" decades before it became mainstream right-wing talking point fodder.
• Notable Quote:

  "It’s a technocratic plan by design... a warfare to replace European peoples, to then restructure the continents, especially in the West, into a new technocratic federation." – Jay Dyer [15:06]

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3. Debating Christian Influencers, Calvinist History, and Online Theology

[22:26-32:06]

• Jay criticizes modern Protestant influencers (e.g., Ruslan), accusing them of slander and performative piety rather than real theological debate.
• Reminisces on early 2000s blog debate culture, contrasting it with the present’s superficial posturing.
• Plays a clip mocking superficial understandings of the Gospel and accuses internet Protestants of theological ignorance.
• Notable Quote:

  "There’s no point in even debating them. There’s no way JP Uncut is going to actually show up to do a formal debate with me." – Jay Dyer [27:41]

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4. Video Game Symbolism, Liminal Spaces, and Existential Arguments

[32:07-45:39]

• Caller brings up the symbolic, liminal space aesthetics of the original Halo video game, and its Christological themes.
• Jay and another caller speculate on the existential “unsettling” of liminal spaces as indirect arguments for God’s existence.
• Notable Quote:

  "Liminal spaces tend to question meaning... it's a question of meaning in an architectural way and also in the sense of them being labyrinths." – Jay Dyer [43:51]

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5. DEBATE: Race, Biology, and Orthodoxy

[45:39-68:48]

• Extended, tense debate with callers about race mixing, Orthodox theology, and the morality/biology of racial distinctions.
• Jay presses callers for a coherent moral philosophy; exposes the arbitrariness and “biological determinism” of alt-right/race-realist arguments.
• Posh joins to critique the “powdered wig appeal” (appeal to Founding Fathers), discusses ethnic/national versus racial identity from a theological perspective.
• Notable Exchanges:

  "I don't know what racism even means. So to me it seems like it's inconsistent... I don't buy that there is a sin of racism." – Jay Dyer [45:50]
  "So what is the IQ genetic cutoff for who is and who isn’t a human? Is it 81, 85?... a retarded person isn't a human being?" – Jay Dyer [50:26]

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6. The American Experiment, Protestant Libertarianism, and Church-State

[76:37-86:43]

• Discussion transitions to the roots of anti-authoritarianism in American Protestantism, the contrast with Orthodox and historical Catholic views of church-state synergy.
• Jay rebuffs conflations of Calvinist determinism with monarchism and clarifies the Orthodox “symphonia” model (church and state as dual authorities).
• Notable Quote:

  "Libertarianism is premised on a strict minimalist view of the state. The position of Orthodoxy historically is that the state has a duty to God and to the church. And that’s not a libertarian position." – Jay Dyer [80:48]

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7. Race of Christians: Liturgical Language vs. Biological Determinism

[86:43-93:12]

• Caller asks about liturgical prayers referring to the “race of Christians.” Jay explains “race” as “group” within the spiritual, not biological sense, drawing out the distinction between traditional Christian unity and racialist misreadings.
• Jamie and Jay discuss how Orthodoxy preserves ethnicity/culture within Christianity, unlike globalist erasure.

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8. Sabbath, Judaizing Heresy, and Protestant Critiques

[94:08-96:12]

• Caller struggles with a friend’s Sabbatarian claims.
• Jay situates the Sabbath in Orthodox typology: Christ fulfills the Sabbath; Sunday is the day of Resurrection.
• Jay laments that Protestantism defaults repeatedly to “judaizing” errors.

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9. Orthodoxy, Exclusivity, and Salvation Outside the Visible Church

[125:06-125:49]

• Discusses Orthodox exclusivist ecclesiology versus the possibility of God saving those “outside the Church” via extraordinary means, referencing the nuance and pastoral caution in Orthodox tradition, contrasting it with Protestant “once saved” assurance.
• Notable Quote:

  "We have a different conception of salvation... For us to say that we can warn you that you’re outside of the ark, it still doesn’t give us the position or the place to say I know your eternal Destiny..." – Jay Dyer [125:49]

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10. Satirical Critique: The "Manosphere," Masculinity Grifting, and Parallels with Evangelicalism

[124:37-136:32]

• Jay roasts the “manosphere” influencer subculture, comparing their self-help events to evangelical megachurch theatrics and Power Team strongmen.
• Notable Quotes:

  "It’s just so performative and, like, not even real. It’s like shitty entertainment, right? Just like the evangelical churches are." – Jay Dyer [131:50]
  "The power team is cooler than these weirdo dudes. The power team will rip a whole phone book." – Jay Dyer [132:18]

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Deep Dive Segment:

Tantric Secrets, Yoga Cults, and the West's Obsession with Eastern Mysticism

(w/ Jamie) [137:47–End]

10a. Twisted Yoga Documentary and the Cult of Gregorian Bivolaru

• Jamie introduces "Twisted Yoga," a documentary about Romanian cult leader Gregorian Bivolaru, who built a vast, international, exploitative sex cult network behind “healing yoga” retreats.
• Bivolaru’s network, the Atman Federation, is exposed as a multi-national front for sexual exploitation, using beauty pageants (Miss Shakti) as recruiting funnels for his harem.
• Many women are funneled from partying to “spirituality,” made to send nude photos and sign NDAs before being exploited at retreats.
• Notable Quotes:

  "This whole thing is a funnel into a porn collection, into a pageant, into a sex T, R, A, F F for this goober in Romania." – Jamie [150:24]
  "All of these Buddhists religions, these Eastern mysticism, Hindu Bon Tantra, Tibet, are extremely turbo misogynist. Like, to the point where it’s Jesse Lee Peterson level." – Jamie [160:14]

10b. The Dalai Lama, CIA Involvement, and the West's Fetishization of Tantra

• Jay connects the boom of Eastern mysticism in the West post-1960s counterculture to intelligence agency projects—specifically, the validation of reports that the Dalai Lama and Tibetan Buddhists received CIA support as part of anti-China Cold War strategy.
• Jamie and Jay stress that the “feminist” veneer of yoga/tantra in the West is actually counter to their source cults, which in fact are deeply misogynistic and exploitative at their esoteric core.
• “Holy Smoke” movie (Harvey Keitel, Kate Winslet) is panned as an example of this inversion—what appears to be a critique of Eastern cults ultimately becomes an endorsement of "Shakti" goddess worship and a denigration of Western rationality.

10c. Core Takeaways from the Tantra/Yoga Cult Analysis

• The prevalence of fake gurus, sexual predators, and “energy vampires” in the Western yoga-spirituality scene.
• The West’s naïve, ignorant uptake of these systems—often for the sake of “spirituality without religion”—plays directly into the hands of exploitative cult leaders.
• The “empowerment” supposedly offered is illusory, often coming at the expense of autonomy and safety for vulnerable seekers.

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Notable/Representative Quotes

• On Kalergi Plan & Population Replacement:

  "It’s a battle, it’s a warfare to replace the European peoples, to then restructure the continents... into a new technocratic federation. That’s the long term plan." – Jay Dyer [15:06]

• On Race & Orthodoxy:

  "I don’t know what racism even means... I don’t buy that there is a sin of racism." – Jay Dyer [45:50]

• On Tantra, Yoga, and Instagram Culture:

  "All of the women, by the way, the pattern is... party girls who are damaged and unfulfilled and they run off to a yoga retreat. But the thing is... Bearu doesn’t publicize himself... it’s an inner core criminal thing that’s protected by innocuous sounding yoga retreat centers." – Jay Dyer [151:27]

• On the Exploitative Nature of Eastern Spirituality:

  "All of these Buddhists religions... are extremely turbo misogynist... to the point where it’s Jesse Lee Peterson level... the Instagram chicks don’t know." – Jamie [160:14]

• On Church-State Distinction and Orthodoxy:

  "Libertarianism is premised on a strict minimalist view of the state. The position of Orthodoxy historically is that the state has a duty to God and to the church." – Jay Dyer [80:48]

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Timestamps for Core Segments

• [00:39] — "Cholo Church" satire and the mockery of exclusivist church culture
• [14:23] — Callers on European Islamization; technocratic plans, Kalergi
• [22:26] — Critique of Protestant influencers and theological debate
• [32:07] — Halo, liminal spaces, and existential meaning
• [45:39] — Debates on race, ethnicity, and Orthodoxy
• [76:37] — America’s Protestant anti-authoritarian roots vs. Orthodox church-state
• [86:43] — "Race of Christians" in Orthodox liturgy
• [94:08] — Debating Sabbath, Judaizing heresy in current Protestant movements
• [124:37] — Satirical critique of manosphere/evangelical “performative” masculinity
• [137:47] — Deep dive: Tantra, "Twisted Yoga" documentary, and yoga cults with Jamie

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Memorable Moments

• Booger Whistle Flute: Satirical musical interlude lampooning cult energy vampires [08:26, 140:21]
• The “Power Team” and ‘strong boys’ riff: Satire of evangelical performance culture [131:50–136:32]
• The recurring parody of “monetizing followers” and “grifting” (meta-jab at the entire monetized influencer ecosystem) [06:52, 23:13, 119:35, 137:47]
• Jay’s detailed, forceful rebuttal to race-essentialist callers, highlighting distinctions between arbitrary assertions and coherent moral philosophy [49:19–68:48]

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Tone & Style

The episode is raw, sarcastic, and irreverently comedic, but makes room for deeply serious social, religious, and cultural critiques. Jay balances biting humor, satire, deep-dive theological/historical analysis, and live debate with combative callers. Jamie’s contributions during the Tantra segment are meticulously researched and provide a sobering look into the abuse in Eastern spiritual cults.

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For New Listeners

If you missed the episode, expect a wild ride through internet Christian subcultures, geopolitics, alt-right race debates, and the dangers of Western adoption of Tantric/Yogic spirituality, all passed through Jay Dyer’s filter of humor, pop culture, and hard-hitting polemics. The podcast oscillates rapidly between entertainment and serious critique, offering both laughs and substance.

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Transcript

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Want to keep up with everything trendy? From breaking news to shareable jokes, pop

[Ryan Seacrest]

culture bites to viral food spots, it's

[Jay Dyer]

all on TikTok Download TikTok now to explore. But listen, what are you gonna do if I say to you the true church isn't the papal church or what? The true church is Chicano Church, bro. Cholo church is the only true church and how could you review me or whatever? It's exclusivism, bro. Chicano Church, bro. Cholo church is the only true church and how could you review me or whatever? It's essay exclusivism, bro. What's up, bro? Hey, fool, unmute or whatever, dude. Hey, dude, like, I went to Victory Church one time or whatever. I seen Holy Tamale in the sky, bro, and it converted me. Chicano church, bro. Church is the only two church and how could you refute me or whatever? It's exclusivism, bro. Chicano church, bro. Cholo church is the only two church and how could you review me or whatever? It's exclusivism, bro. Chicano church, bro. Cholo church is the only true church and how could you refute me or whatever? Exclusivism, bro. Chicano Church, bro. Cholo church is the only true church and how could you refute me or whatever? It's s exclusivism, bro. A mute or whatever, dude.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I need seven figures. I need seven figures.

[Jay Dyer]

I need seven figures. Cringe core, bro. I got the following.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I got 28,000 I got 200,000 on Tik Tok. How do I monetize these people? You know what I mean?

[Jay Dyer]

Do I monetize these people?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I like money and I like shoes. How do I build a business?

[Jay Dyer]

I don't really care about how many followers I have from an Oriental to a boring rental wigger. I'm Rus and I'mma boost these Protestants for every dime Buy my merch this my ministry, my church.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I'm blessed

[Jay Dyer]

for Y every itty bitty ry got me fascinated Protecting my pride it's my duty like Mufasa baby my testimony get me money better watch away I'll be back for more super chats like I'm I need to monetize you so fight Christians I need some money from them that's my mission and if I'm coming up against real Christians I run like hell not to take an L A J Don't make me play myself I'm here A ticket for the dinner bell this my meal ticket Please don't make me fail Please please please,

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

please Bro I got the following I got 28 000.

[Jay Dyer]

I got 200000 on tick tock how

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

do know what I mean?

[Jay Dyer]

How do I monetize these people?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I like money and I like shoes how do I build a business? I don't really care about how many followers I have I need seven figures

[Jay Dyer]

I need seven figures. Yo, we got to do the booger whistle flute because we're talking tantra tonight. Speaking of tantra, your boy Stang just popped up. More like stank stanking. Can't, can't handle toxic masculinities. By the way, we got another banger remix of Cholo church coming from Dr. Evo. Shout out to Dr. Evo. Killing it as usual. Let's see, we got to do Mormon Space wives and then we're gonna take calls and booger whistle flute. Cuz my beautiful wife Jamie will join me later as we take your calls, your challenges, your questions, any topic except tag. Otherwise you're welcome to call in. Let's see, we gotta do booger whistle flute. Where's it at? Booger whistle flute. I got a booger whistle flute. Booger flute. This is in honor of Hindu Tantra Buddhist nonsense. Tonight let's see. Marks and traits of the cult guru they do not typically like you doing well.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

What?

[Jay Dyer]

They are persecuting me. They do not have hair for eyes to cease. Therefore they must take down what they do not understand. That's that booger whistle baby. They're energy vampires. That's that booger whistle baby. I got a booger whistle flute. They're energy vampires. That's that booger whistleblower whistlebag. Oftentimes the communal living that the guru demands doesn't match up to the guru who's at y. How many swamis got a dang Rolls Royce? Maybe we will do tag today. I can I get. Yo, can you give me the atheist hotline? I'm on the banana fall. Let me Talk to m Monkey right now. That's that booger whistle B Their energy then purge that's that booger whistle B. I got a booger with some their energy Vampire guru Church yo, get yourself a church. It's time for church. And then of course, last but not least, we're gonna end it with Mormon Space Wives remix. Yeah, boy, yeah. What's wrong with going to Mormon church? If you could go to rap church, why can't you go to Mormon church? Space wife church Science fiction

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

let's create lives.

[Jay Dyer]

Every tone body

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

he looks good.

[Jay Dyer]

How do you not dance in this one? Underwear fitting tight magic underwear is feeling right space wise. With you on the planet of Naboo

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

magic.

[Jamie]

Let's create.

[Jay Dyer]

All right, let's stop there. What's up, man? Chris the Greek.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Summer is here and the sun is out. Make sure you take care of your skin this summer. Now through June 23rd, shop for you. Save days and get great savings on all your favorite skincare Essentials and earn 4 times points. Shop in store or online and save on sunblock from Neutrogena, Sun Bum, Hawaiian Tropic, Banana Boat and Coppertone. And earn four times points to use for future savings on groceries or gas. Offer ends June 23rd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Jay Dyer]

Why pay when you can slash with TikTok? Slash and free. You can cut prices down all the way to zero. Just download TikTok, search, slash free, pick items in TikTok, shop, share the link and boom. Free items unlocked, even with free shipping. So seriously, why pay, download, tick tock and start slashing now. What's on your mind today, son? Open topics. Anything? I guess I have to. If I say anything, it's got to be tagged too. What's on your mind?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

How you doing? This is Chris.

[Jay Dyer]

Yup, that's what I said. What's on your mind?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I think, I think that most Western Europeans and Americans don't like, underestimate the threat of Islam. Like my people have been fighting them since like 1071. You know what I mean? 1050. If, if, if the Byzantine Empire, the Eastern Roman Empire didn't, you know, hold off the Arabs and then, you know, reconquer areas and then hold off the turks for another 400 years. I think at least like 50 to 70% of Europe will be Muslim in Arabic right now. And they let him in through the front door. Yeah, you know, and they're paying for Their stuff. It's so crazy.

[Jay Dyer]

Like, you know, it's by design, though. It's a technocratic plan. By design it is, Yeah. I mean, we've covered that. It didn't make any sense. Like, you know, it makes perfect sense because it's a battle, it's a warfare to replace the European peoples, to then restructure the continents, especially in the west, into a new technocratic federation. That's the long term plan.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, but I mean, have you heard about what Turkey has been doing? They've been passing laws, their blue homeland laws and all this. They're trying to start with Greece and Cyprus.

[Jay Dyer]

What, what is, what's Turkey doing? Say it again.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Turkey is passing blue homeland laws, meaning, like they have exclusive, you know, territorial rights over Greek waters and like, you know, damn near, you know, 40 of the Aegean. You know, I mean, they're. People underestimate the threat. That's all I'm saying. I get it. Like, you don't got to be like pro Israel or whatever or Zionist, but people don't. They don't get it, man. They have no clue.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, well, we. I've been debating Muslims for almost a decade, so I do get it. And I've been talking about how both sides of this idiotic dialectic are wrong. I don't have to choose between Zionism and Hamas because they're both wrong. I don't have to choose between Qatar and Israel. I can choose none of them. And by the way, BB was always on good relationship, friendly relationship with Qatar, funding Qatar. So all that's, that's all carded. It's literally Qatar it out. Dude. We're one of, we're one of the few people on here actually saying both sides are bad. It's a false dialectic. And that Islam is the broom of Judaism. The Jews themselves say Islam is the brim of Judaism. So you got countless rabbis saying that. So not disagreeing with you, Chris. I totally agree. But I also want to make it very clear that we have been saying that they're both a problem for almost a decade, but people don't listen. And they immediately get. They get hyped up on Twitter to a false dialectic and then they come and talk to people like me or whatever, and they see me saying criticism of one side and then assume that you're on the other side. Right, because we get called Muslim collaborator every day if we criticize Israel and then we get called Zionist every day if we, if we criticize Islam. So. And also people are getting more and more design so yeah, they're destroying Europe by design. It's the Clergy plan. I've been talking about the Clergy plan before anybody was because I read it in Tragic and Hope and Anglo American Establishment. You can watch my video from 10 years ago on Anglo American Establishment by Quigley where he says they adopted Lord Curtis and Count Kudnov. Kalergi's plan. So I was, I was doing and saying this stuff before Nick Fuentes, before Candace, before Tucker, before any of these people. You can go just listen to my old podcast where I talked about it, but of course nobody listens. And then when it all becomes like mainstream Twitter language, nobody cares that you were way ahead of everybody else on this. So I know. Cacous, $50. Here's a new movie idea. Step up, part six. It's called Bless the Streets. There's a young gangster named Ruslan. He's given court mandated chorch appearance for hustling illegal snacks he stole from vending machine in the church. He creates a group with other kids like Janko and Bryce Bryson Gray. They dance and to hip hop and spread the good news. It'll be a coming of age pro LGBT drama. That's actually a hit right there, dude. That's what. That's. That's going to be on pure flicks that'll be streaming over there on Hallmark Channel. Right, Ruslan? Finding his. Finding himself, right? He said, I need to do it, I gotta find myself. Because apparently you can't do multiple things, right? You can't talk about geopolitics and do comedic stuff, right? You have to pick a thing. So I'm still trying to find myself. So when I do my Eat Pray Love journey, when I go down to India, I'm gonna get on a banana phone. I'm gonna call up some atheists to hook me up with the hottest of the gurus. And we all know gurus just touch buds. That's all. That's what they're up to. The Shiva Langum dude. So when I get down there, you know, I don't think there's a lot of women gurus. So I guess I gotta touch the butt of a man guru. So somebody hooked me up with a hot man guru. Who is that? Yeah, I'm on the banana phone.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Who?

[Jay Dyer]

Yo, tj, Kirk, what's up, dude? Is this the banana that was in your butt? Can you give me a get. Give me the hottest, sexiest Vivek Ramaswam Jamis down there in India, bro. Because I gotta find myself. I gotta do a Eat Pray Love vision. Quest. Dude, help me out. Dj. Y' all gotta help me out. By the way, that's relevant because when Jamie joins me, we will be going deep into the dark secrets, the dark lore of Tantra, Tibetan Buddhism, Buddhist philosophy, Tantrism, yoga. We're going to do a deep dive on yoga because Jamie's been reading extensive texts, both critical texts and texts from that religion. We'll be talking about the origins of Buddhism out of Hinduism and then Tantric Buddhism as its own Tibetan flavor out of Tibet. The Dali Lamo known admitted CIA operative for many years, as has been the several Dalai Lamas now, I think for a while have been working with intelligence for the last several decades. And that's because Tibet is a very important geostrategic location in regard to Eurasia and obviously China. So we'll talk about free Tibet, we'll talk about the vindication. It was recently declassified again that Free Tibet was a CIA operation, as I said, forever and ever. And I have people bitching at me in the comments forever about it. It doesn't matter how many times I'm right. I will always just be wrong because I'm right. So if you're right a lot, it means that you're just always the worst person and the wrongest person.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Why pay when you can slash with TikTok slash and free? You can cut prices down all the way to zero. Just download TikTok, search, slash free, pick items in TikTok, shop, share the link, and boom. Free items unlocked even with free shipping. So seriously, why pay? Download TikTok and start slashing now. And once again, I want to add to that. We're gonna. I mean, I would welcome all the Protestants to call in, but I'm kind of tired of this because it's not going anywhere. None of these Protestant goobers actually have any knowledge of anything. So I hope people are seeing this, that they're creating all the smoke and mirror to talk about bad online behavior. They do they do all the same bad online behavior? But none of them have an actual theological response. And that's what we've been saying forever, that it's. It's over, they're done. There's no one who will step up and publicly formally debate their cause to defend their actual commitments, because they don't have commitments. That was the critique of Ruslan. Like Alex Horn said, nobody was critiquing you just because you made money. It's because you are making money with no commitments. And is the making of the money the main goal? Because that's not the main goal. And then he tried to deflect and reframe it as, yo, you try to. You try to sound bad because I made money. You out for super chats, dude. Nobody was saying it's bad to ask for super chats. Nobody was saying that an online business or an entrepreneur is the problem. The problem is selling the gospel. And then every time he's been corrected on all these points, like churches selling baptism, he doesn't care. And he continues to reaffirm that we

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

are

[Jay Dyer]

working with the Muslims, which is actual literal slander. That's dangerous. Literal slander. Everybody take note of every time he says this to you, by the way, because if this ever escalates, all that stuff will be very relevant for those escalations, because that. That's delving over into the territory of, like, actual defamation and slander to allege that we collude with and work with Muslims after 10 years of debating Muslims. And they know that that's not true. Also, Ruslan, if you notice, called for me to be canceled again. So this is like the third time he's called for cancellation. He tries to marshal all the priests and bishops of the orthodox world as if they care what this. Like, they listened or, oh, we got to see. What's Ruslan's advice on how to handle ortho bros Calling for people to be canceled. So, like, it's over. Like, they don't have. They don't have a debate. They don't have an argument. It's all shifted into pearl clutching and performative piety. And that's when you're done. It's so different than it was 10 years ago. 15, 20 years ago. You know, we used to have these blogs. There was a. There was a Calvinist blog that used to debate and argue with me all the time called Try a Blog. And it was run by this absolute just. He was a total piece of garbage person. Steve, I don't forget his name. But he died right after the coup. So my assumption is stabbies. I don't know, but I'm not happy that the dude died. But he was actually. He was a total piece of trash person. However, even being a piece of trash person, he continuously, I suspect, by the way, he was one of the Calvinists who sent me a threat to get me fired in 2007 and 08 for talking about Zionism on a blog. I don't know that though, so I can't prove it, but. And this guy's already dead and gone, so nobody even remembers him. But try a blog was always focused on the theology. So even back in 2007 and eight when the Calvinists were being vicious and heated in their debating online, I would say Even back then, 90, 95% of it was the theology and argumentation. I mean, you got massive blog posts of 10, 20 pages of writing and then tens of 20 pages of comments going back and forth on the theology and the argumentation. That doesn't exist anymore. Now it's performative. Public whining and bitching is all they have. I'm going to play this brief clip here because this really illustrates how flimsy and empty this all was. When Andrew asks Mahler, what is the gospel? Try this one more time. All right, but don't, don't go off, don't go off on this. I wrote a brand new Bible that

[Ryan Seacrest]

brought more people to claim that they had faith in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. And more people followed that Bible. Am I doing a good thing or a bad thing?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

If they're believing in the Gospel, that would be a good thing.

[Jay Dyer]

So according to these people, you could rewrite the whole Bible, Just create a new Bible. And if it convinced people that Jesus is resurrected, you're preaching the Gospel so you understand that there's Aryan cults that believe in the resurrection. Muslims believe in the resurrection. By this idiot's argument, he doesn't have a problem with the Quran because the Quran is a rewritten Bible. So if the Quran brings more people to believe in Jesus resurrection or Jesus's ascension or whatever, and Muslims believe in the Resurrection. Muslims believe that Jesus will judge the world. You see how stupid this is? These people are absolute idiots. They don't know anything. And they're the most loud, pretentious, arrogant people on the Internet. So there is no point in even debating them. Right? I. There's no way JP Uncut is going to actually show up to do a formal debate with me. He will not. He's already running from Several debates. And I want you to look at, look at Ruslan's numbers here. His Christian TMZ is not working. The only video that has any views is about Ortho Bros. 46, 000 on this. David Wood, Andrew one here. He talks about Fuentes. He gets 5,000 talks about Chorley Cork and gets 7,000, talks about Queen Quandas. Gets 9,000, talks about Fuentes, gets 5,000. Ruslan's channel is garbage. It's Christian TMZ and it doesn't even get any views. Ruslan laughs when people apostatize. He thinks it's funny that young Don supposedly apostatized from Orthodox church, which isn't even necessarily the case. He was in some other dude's cult, a restorationist cult. And for Ruslan, none of that mattered. What matters is, is it an own on the Ortho bros who converted to this nonsense? Rabbi, synagogue.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

No, deep conversion.

[Jay Dyer]

I went to an Orthodox church for several months. So Ruslan's laughing when young Don got circumcised and left Christianity because of this stupid messianic Judaizing. He thinks that's funny. Look at this. He listen to his demonic laugh. That somebody apostatized from Christianity without any self awareness that it's because they sent him to these synagogues that circumcised him. And yes, people don't even believe that that's real. No, that's actually. That's what happened. And they think it's funny. Right? I mean, these people are just trash, dude. There is no point in. I mean, they're done. If they're not going to formally offer argumentation against the positions, then we've already won. It's over. Here's David Wood versus Jay Dyer. Guess what? Multiple times bigger. Here's JD versus God Logic equal right now and way bigger. I'm bigger than him over the year, so this proves that I'm not out clout chasing cloud chasing it. Me versus Ruslan, way bigger. Me versus Gavin Ortland, five times bigger. Nobody's clout chasing these goobers. We don't need to. But we will confront the Roman Catholic, the Muslim, the atheist, and the Protestant and the Evangelical. And we've consistently done that because as I said right here, churchless apologetics is like saying to a terminally ill man, hey, dude, get some medicine, bro. Gee, thanks. Where's the medicine that I get? Where do I go for the medicine? Oh, here's an instructional manual from a pharmaceutical company on medicines. Oh, thank you for the instructional on pharmaceuticals. Yes. Have fun reading the Diagnostics manual for the next five years. Good luck understanding it. By the way, Alexander, what's up? And no, we are not going to talk about Ruson all day today.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey Jay, how you doing today?

[Jay Dyer]

Sir, yes, sir.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey, I don't want to change up the topic if you want to keep talking theology, but actually I was trying to get on a couple days ago talk about the liminal space podcast.

[Jay Dyer]

Sure, sure.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, I noticed you talked about like some entertainment that had liminal spaces in it, stuff like that. But one of the things that I. That you should probably look into more because I know you played them before, but it's the original Halo game is rice with liminal space imagery.

[Jay Dyer]

That's a good point.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

The whole Halo ring itself is the idea of a liminal space in the sense that you look up in the sky, you'll even see horizon. You see a ring that kind of just goes on forever. Every piece of the underground that was built in the game by like the Forerunners is all just like never ending labyrinths that lead to nowhere. Everything looks familiar, everything's really empty, hollow. There's no life on the planet as well, for the most part.

[Jay Dyer]

It's a good point. I haven't played Halo in so long that I've forgotten a lot of that.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. And also one of the things about that game is that the people who built the rings and they are. And this is obviously just going off of the first two Halo games because they changed up and they retconned some of the, you know, story with the later ones. But the forerunners who built the Halo rings are actually were originally written to be ancient humans. So ancient humans eventually developed far enough and they became almost like a sterilized society. And they built these Halo rings as like a containment weapon facility. And also like one of the other cool things about the. The storyline is that if they kept that as the, you know, the, the creators of the Halo rings were actually humans, the Covenant are actually fighting like they worship the Halo rings and they worship the Forerunners as like their gods. So they're actually warring against God while worshiping God at the same time.

[Jay Dyer]

Huh. And it's like so, so like, like so they're like, so they're like Protestants.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. And then, and then so called the Covenant, obviously. And then John's number is John 1:1:7, which is obviously the law came through Moses, but grace and truth come through Jesus Christ. So Master Chief is kind of a Christological figure in the game itself and he's the one trying to discover this lost, you know, mythos of what happened behind the Halo rings. What's. Because it's basically a forgotten past and he's the one that's trying to bring about truth, while the Covenant people who are keeping to the law basically are the ones trying to destroy truth.

[Jay Dyer]

Huh.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Interesting in that they're actually antinatalist because, you know, the activation of the Halo rings in the games destroys all life and like a hundred thousand light years or something like that away. So,

[Jay Dyer]

yeah, I'm looking at the liminal spaces. Somebody. Somebody made a video about it, but it's not. It's just them playing the game. It's not actually showing liminal spaces.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, there's. Like I said. And it's kind of weird the way Bungie designed all their old games because they did this back in the day with, I don't know if you remember the game marathon that was on Mac back in the day. There's a trilogy of those games. But their game design focused heavily on using assets multiple times. So you actually play through things backwards. Like a lot of the levels in the original Halo where you going through prior levels almost backwards.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So again, that added towards the sense of it being a liminal space because everything's really familiar because you're like, I've been here before, I've seen this. It's because you actually have. You're actually just playing something backwards or in a different order.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, that's really cool. Appreciate that, man. Yeah, there's a lot of great examples of this stuff that we haven't even really tapped into because I kind of just did that liminal discussion on a whim and a lot of people really enjoyed it. And I am looking forward to seeing the Mo. The backrooms movie this weekend at some point probably so. And I did. Or our. One of our clippers, by the way, did just clip the one hour discussion of the back rooms right here. So if you go to the channel, you can watch the full. Just. Just liminal space philosophy discussion which was in this live stream. Longer live stream here. Ron. What's up, man? Appreciate that about Halo. There's so many. Even when I was discussing that, I was like, actually David Lynch's whole philosophy is. His whole thing is liminal space. What's up, Ron?

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Why pay when you can slash, tick tock slash and free lets you cut prices all the way to zero. Download TikTok, search/free and share the link. To get free items, start slashing now.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey Doug,

[Jay Dyer]

what's up?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey, I had a question. I heard one of your older videos talking about like Nephilim within the Bible and like the existence of them post flood. I was wanting to know your thoughts on that.

[Jay Dyer]

I don't know what to think about that. I go back and forth because I had a dude as a friend of ours that was a messianic dude on Ken Ami and he he offered a bunch of arguments on a separate so we did two different Nephilim streams and he offered a bunch of arguments as to why there couldn't be Nephilim after the fall after the flood. So I'm kind of iffy on that. I don't have a set position, but I do think the Deuterocanonical texts do confirm that the biblical idea of Genesis 6 because there's like four different Deuterocanon texts that nobody ever talks about in regard to the Nephilims because it talks about the Titans and it speaks to them as actual aberrations and giants. Right? So if we do take the Durocannon seriously, then it doesn't con it. It speaks contrary to the bloodline of Seth view or the bloodline of a cane or whatever. So. But honestly, I don't know. As you get older, a lot more things become iffy. I don't know what to say about that. So people are also pointing out, as Cleve pointed out, that God logic originally raised I forget what the original number was for his lawsuit in regard to Muhammad hijab, which we said, hey, yeah, that's fine. Actually it makes sense to support God logic against Muhammad hijab because. And the idiots over there don't even understand why I could agree with a Muslim on one point but also agree with God logic on another point. But now God logic, even though when he supposedly I haven't looked at the numbers, but supposedly he met his quota for the lawsuit and then to own the Muslims, he reopened it and got $70,000. Sorry, but that sounds again like grifting to me. So if you did this because you were trying to get enough money for a lawsuit, but then you're going to redo it to own the muzzies and you still won't commit to a church, and you still won't give me an example of a churchless apologist in the first thousand years and you're reopening your GoFundMe to own the Muzzies. It was sick. He raised 30,000 and now he's at 60,000. Right? I mean, if we did something like that, they would be all over our ass, right? They would be like Yoda, Ortho bros is all grifters, dude. He had, he met his quota and then he raised it, dude. Imagine what, how they would view this, right? It would be the end of the world. They would be talking about this for the next 10 years, right? So we got actual grifters versus people who do entertaining live streams, which is supposedly grifting according to Ruslan. But I want to remind you to help support the grift over here. Call me Professor Grift. You can support the griff right here by getting signed copies of esoteric Hollywood 1, 2 and 3 as well as the others. Now, many people were wondering where are the red books? They have been on back order. I got an email two days ago that they have shipped from the warehouse. So they were on backorder for about two or three weeks, but now the red, red books have shipped. That means they're shipped to me, not to you. They're shipped to me so that I can sign the red books. If you guys want red books. And then you can get Jamie's books and other other things there in the shop at Jay's Analysis, which is also in the show description. Remember too we have my third esoteric Hollywood book, Esster Hollywood 3 is now out. It's now available. You get signed copies in the shop as well. Turbo diesel, what's on your mind, man? By the way, the call in link is the X space in the chat. If you guys want to call Emperor of Wigs Antium, get that correct, please.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I'm sorry, Emperor of Wigsantium. Listen man, I'm currently in the town of very close to Mount Athos and I was hoping to get your name, Christian name and your wife's probably and some other people's here maybe so I can get them to the monks over there.

[Jay Dyer]

Sure, yeah. I'm Daniel. She's Anastasia and Anastasia. Right. So Saint Daniel the Prophet. Prophet Daniel and Anastasia the Roman, the ancient Roman Saint. Appreciate that dog Elijah. What's on your mind, Emperor? What's up, man?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

What's up, Jake Dyer?

[Jay Dyer]

It's Jay Gore.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So I gotta. I. I got a question about the. Or not a question, just a statement about the liminal spaces. Okay. One of the things I kind of thought was interesting about the. The liminal spaces was that I kind of think that the literal spaces, because of the fact that they're so, you know, unsettling, I find that to be a really interesting argument that could be in favor of the existence of God. And the reason why I would say that is because, you know, we're all created in God's image. And so there's some sort of inherently metaphysical, like, value to human beings. And so when you're in a space that is created by this image of God per se, but the. But the fact that this place that was created by them is not inherently inhabited by them, it makes people inherently, you know, unsettled. And it's very odd, very weird. It's kind of spiritually like, you know, like, I guess, degrading in a way. And so could you possibly say that that could be, like, an interesting argument for the existence of God? That liminal spaces are, in fact, unsettling?

[Jay Dyer]

I mean, it's in a roundabout way, because it's a question of meaning, right? And liminal spaces tend to question meaning in an architectural way and also in the sense of them being kind of labyrinths. Right. So we're back to the mythology of Theseus and the Minotaur and, you know, the Middle Ages, they had a tendency to, especially in the west, they would even put into the architecture of the church, they would put labyrinths on the ground. And the purpose of the labyrinths on the ground in the church or in a cathedral or even in other spaces is to cause the person to remember and to think of this life as a kind of labyrinth to solve. Now, that can get overly Neoplatonic because you can get in. Fall into this idea that, oh, this world is just a, like, series of mazes and labyrinths. And thus it's an illusion. And I have to, you know, escape this reality to go back to the 1 because this reality is bad and lesser or whatever. That's not the Christian perspective. The Christian perspective is that there's multiple goods. So something being a lesser good doesn't make it evil. In Neoplatonism, the tendency is to think that if something is a lesser good, it is in some way or some. In some sense bad or evil. But you can have multiple Goods. Right. Just like it might be better in some certain. Some circumstances to sacrifice marriage for service, but in other cases, it might be better to good for you to be married. So the fact that one is a higher calling doesn't make the other one bad or evil. But most human beings, especially in terms of Greek dialectics, they had a tendency to think in either ors. All right, so we got pagans that want to argue. We got neo, neo pagan, woden, Odin types. What's up, dude? Ht on mute.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey, I got a simple two questions really easy is, can you be pro white and racist as a Christian, or is that an oxymoron by the Orthodox standard?

[Jay Dyer]

I don't know what racism even means. So to me it seems like it's inconsistent. And I think all. If you look at the Russian church's recent statement, everybody should be supportive of their people and their people group. So I don't buy that there is a race. I don't buy that there is a sin of racism.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, well, like, I've seen pictures of like Russian Orthodox where if I was a pro white person and one of the priests was marrying a white man to a black woman, I would go, that's disgusting. But the church can't really object, can they?

[Jay Dyer]

On what basis is it disgusting?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Race mixing is Jewish.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, how is it Jewish if you mean like rabbinic Judaism, because they don't race mix, or do you mean that it's Jewish in the sense of a dysgenics operation or something?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, clergy plan, resgenation, it's all kind of like pushed through the Jewish media.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, but on what basis is it wrong?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, I mean, if you're saying. Excuse me, if you're saying that, that I'm like, it's okay to love my people. Well, I don't want my people to disappear. And they would disappear if they continued mixing their genes.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, but what I'm saying is, if there is, is there a moral reason why? Because there's not always a black and white situation of like, right and wrong. Right. There might be some situations where through economia, I mean, kings and queens have offered their. Their children to other kings and other queens in history as part of alliances and deals and stuff like that which could conceivably violate this principle. So what I'm asking, is in your worldview, is there a moral wrong or is it just a biological wrong?

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Yes, you can.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

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[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I'd say it's both because we have, I don't know where you guys are at with science, if you guys believe in science, but like, if we got like 80 IQ blacks mixing with, you know, average of 105 whites and then they can't do, like, they can't donate organs because of this. There's like scientific proof that it's like, it goes against nature. And I see nothing but like, the church, like, they can't condemn any of that stuff. Like you could have a black person and go marry a white person in your church, and if you spoke up, you'd probably be kicked out of church. Right.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, but what I said was there might be situations where that's allowed, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it ought to be always done. So it seems like there's a false equivalence between something that might be done or tolerated versus something that ought to always be done, which is a weaponized way to replace people.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Are, can you speak out, do you speak out against that in your church?

[Jay Dyer]

Well, it depends on exactly what you mean. Like I said, like, I could speak out against the replacement of my people group and I could have my own opinions about it. But what I want to know is, like, morally, you're saying it's morally wrong. And I'm asking, like, on what basis morally?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, I think if you look at like, like, just like take America for example, race mixing was illegal at one point in this country and they didn't view blacks as, on a level, they viewed them as savages.

[Jay Dyer]

So what I'm asking is how does that relate to it being morally wrong, the fact that something existed in American history?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, I mean, if your daughter wanted to date a chimpanzee, would it be morally wrong?

[Jay Dyer]

Well, that's a fallacy because that's a, that's not a human being. So I'm asking you, on what basis do you say so? Are you going to say that black people don't Have. They're not persons.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, there's like, ghost DNA that show that they don't, like, line up with Asians, Europeans.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so what is the. What is the IQ genetic cutoff for who is and who isn't a human? Is it 81, 85? So would you say. Would you say a retarded. So would you say like a. Like a retarded person isn't a human being?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, I would say that, like, well, dangerous, undeveloped frontal cortex of black people. This is why we have all these criminal elements in America. Like 70% of violent crimes by 15%. And that's not just a socioeconomic thing. That's in Europe.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so what is the cutoff for who a human being is? What IQ level?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

No, no, that's a good question. I would just say, like, what. What are the fruits of. Like, I guess we've done so.

[Jay Dyer]

So it's subjective. So you don't have an actual position on what human being is.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So somewhat. I mean, if. If you. If you're practicing cannibalism in Africa and your people haven't built anything.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so you. So you've listed a bunch of civilizational things, but how does that tell me ontologically who is and isn't a human being?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, I would say based on civilization. They haven't built a civilization.

[Jay Dyer]

No, I'm saying those are civilizational critiques. I know what you're saying. I'm well aware. I've read all this stuff since 2007. I know who Hans Eysenck is. I read all this. I know about genetics. I know about eugenics. I know about dysgenics. I know about race theory. I know all this stuff. I know about haplogroups. I know all this stuff. So what I'm asking you is, can you tell me what defines. Is it objectively, morally wrong in all cases? And what is the IQ cut off for who isn't a human?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I would say that we'd have to go, like, up to 90. And.

[Jay Dyer]

Yes.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, morally wrong. And it's scientific. It's science.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so people, down syndrome, they're not human beings.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. I mean, they technically are, but they're retards. And I don't think you should reproduce.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so now it's. Well, but you said that the black people aren't. If it's under 90, so. And how do you know that it's 90? Isn't that just arbitrary?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I think that's what. What the standard was in America. Like, that 80 was considered, my little

[Jay Dyer]

So I can just appeal to America. Okay, so can I just appeal to American standards right now? Would you buy that as an argument?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, let's do it for Europeans across the board, not just America.

[Jay Dyer]

You appeal to what America did at some point in the past and you don't understand philosophically why that would be a problem logically.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Can I ask you a question?

[Jay Dyer]

So now you're not going to answer my challenge?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

No, I, I just answered like four questions in a row.

[Jay Dyer]

No. Well, I answered your question and now, now that we're at the point of the debate where there's a problem, you don't want to answer it. So why can't I just, can I just appeal to America's standards right now? Can I appeal to America's standards right now? If you can arbitrarily appeal to American standards at some point in the past, that's why it's a bad argument.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I think, I think what I'm asking

[Jay Dyer]

you is, okay, so you're not going to answer the questions. So, so he's not going to answer the challenge. So people think that they have these really solid arguments, these really cool, awesome positions, and then when you actually start drilling into it, it's just arbitrary. It's, it's, well, America did this in the past. So like I need a logical argument, a consistent philosophical argument as to why I'm supposed to follow America at that point in the past. I don't need you to just appeal to an arbitrary IQ level. I mean, you're laughing, but you're not giving good arguments. You're just giving assertion. Do you know the difference between an assertion and an argument? You know the difference between an assertion and an argument?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I'm sorry, you got cut off. I was asking you about if you had a white daughter, would you.

[Jay Dyer]

Do you know the difference between an assertion and an argument?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

J.

[Jay Dyer]

So you're not going to deal with the actual argument. You want to go back. So you're looking for, you're looking for a clip.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Can you be Christ like and go back and forth with me politely? I mean, this is acting Christ like one sided.

[Jay Dyer]

No, that's called debating. Right. So you understand that if you, I

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

get to ask a question back?

[Jay Dyer]

No, you. Not until we finish the topic. So you made, you. No, you didn't. You made arguments that were arbitrary. They were arbitrary. Why am I supposed to follow argument? Why am I supposed to follow the American position from XYZ point in history? So you're not going to answer that challenge. Are you not going to answer that

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

challenge I want you to answer from a Christian perspective.

[Jay Dyer]

I'm giving the Christian perspective, which is an internal. You don't have an ethic. You have no objective moral ethic.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So you don't want to answer this question because you wouldn't want your daughter to marry a black Christian.

[Jay Dyer]

Are you going to answer the challenge before we go to that?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Sure. What's the question?

[Jay Dyer]

Why should I follow American state positions on this at a certain point in the past as an argument that you gave? If I can just say to you, no, we should follow America's positions right now. That's why it's an arbitrary argument.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, you're. You can follow whatever you'd like.

[Jay Dyer]

All right, so you're not. That you don't understand why. Can you restate what my argument is? I don't even think you understand the argument.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

It's a giant word salad.

[Jay Dyer]

Word salad. It's arbitrary. It's a fallacy. It's not word salad. I'm saying your argument is arbitrary.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

You're doing right now, this is a kike slave fallacy.

[Jay Dyer]

So that's all you have, is that homonym. So you, you act like a piece of automatically so that we won't continue this conversation. So you do that to get booted because you don't have an answer. Posh, what's up? If he can argue that we just follow America at XYZ point in the past in a debate, the other person can say, well, if you can be arbitrary, I can be arbitrary. So, no, we just follow America's positions right now. And why America's positions? It's so iq. Why not China's positions? Why not? I mean, it's so like, those are not arguments, those are assertions. And then he throws out the blasphemy and insults to obviously get booted because he can't answer it. Go ahead, Posh, what's up?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, yeah. Well, I'd like to appeal to the founding fathers for that.

[Jay Dyer]

Why the founding fathers and which founding father didn't they disagree?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Basically all of Europe except for the English specifically, and then the ancestral lands in Germany of the British, the English, sorry, you know, Anglia and Saxony and that part of Germany, because they didn't consider the Irish, the Scottish, the French, the Nordics, the Italians, Slavs. They weren't white. So if you wanted. They had a different idea of ontology.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, I know we can get into the half low groups. I understand that. So, and, and I, I didn't want to go in that direction because that's Just going to be an endless spiral, a purity spiraling as to who actually counts as white. I. I did. I know all this stuff. I read all this stuff for years. I read all. I've read yocky. I've read mine. K min K. I've read David Duke. I've read all of those books. I know the arguments, I know the positions. I was arguing with JF and people on the alt right 10 years ago. So none of this is new to me. But I want to know from these people, what's the worldview that we're supposed to have? I get it. You don't like this or that action that goes on in the world. So what's the solution here? Well, the morals come from America, you know, 100 years ago. But why? Why America 100 years ago? Give us a logical philosophical account or reason as to why that's the perfect time or the thing that we want to go to. And then we could follow with the point that posh is making. But the stricter you go in that position, the less you have. Okay, so now, oh, and these people have these debates. They'll be like, oh, if you're a Italian born below this city, you don't count as white. Oh, if you're a Slav in this eastern country, you don't count as white. It's just. It's.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, they have no ability to go through any fuss, you know, anytime something is fuzzy. But this is also part of ethnogenesis. You know, Northern French and southern French aren't identical genetically for obvious reasons, but they're so French. This isn't to say you can bring in a million people from wherever and declare that they're French, although that technically was the French idea of citizenship.

[Jay Dyer]

Exactly.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Revolutionary times and stuff. But that's revolutionary times.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

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[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Also, they are biological determinists, apparently.

[Jay Dyer]

I know, yeah. But that's where I was going to go next, was biological determinism. I was going to go to biological determinism next.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Right, so. But then you ask them, because they stop being that the moment something goes awry with their predictions. For example, the Nordics, so they were pagan and they were based Vikings and they went, you know, and used underhanded tactics to fight against Christians because, you know, paganism don't have, paganism doesn't have honor or anything. I'm not just throwing fuel to the fire. But, you know, but then they became Christians and then they basically even became Lutherans and you had the Carolingians, right, who were famously, you know, very, very tough soldiers. So the Nordics were based and based and based and all of a sudden they stopped being Christian in any sense. They became more atheists and the Church of Sweden and Norway and stuff. That's just ridiculous. But all of a sudden where's the biological essentialism, the determinism that makes them base to chat? All of a sudden they say, oh, they've been subverted. Well, that doesn't work with biological essentials. And now you're a social determinist.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, look, my position is that the, the attempt within the Darwinian ethos to classify the haplogroups in terms of Caucasoid and so forth, it's, there's, it's going to be somewhat arbitrary, but it also does overlap with the lineage, lineages of ethnoi from the Old Testament. So if you look at Genesis and you have the, if you have the Table of Nations, you could say, okay, generally speaking, what we call Caucasoid people are probably the descendants of Japheth. Right, so that makes sense. But let me, let me finish. So, but in the biblical sense, there's not like a, a giant civilizational group of the white people. Right. Because there's a lot of blurry, fuzzy edges around who makes it into that category. As we're saying with people like Serbs or with north versus versus South Italy, etc, so there's a lot of ambiguity. However, I do think that the fact that there's edges into an ambiguity, it doesn't follow from that that we can't say that there are quote, ethnic realities or quote, race realities. So if you mean by race, ethnicities, then there's nothing wrong with. In other words, it's a biblical Genesis based idea that there are ethnicities. Race is a general, more general category which is oftentimes used interchangeably depending upon who's using it with ethnos or with the broader sort of haplogroups. Right. However, I don't think that it's right for anybody to have their people groups destroyed. And you can even find older Greek Orthodox literature that speaks this way where it's not, you know, if, if the Turks poured a zillion Muslims into, into Greece and had them intermarried to get rid of the Greeks, which demographic warfare is a real thing. That's wrong, that's a form of genocide. But the, the response from most of these people is some form of biological determinism wherein there are no ethics, there are no morals. It's all just Nietzsche and will to power. And that's the sort of, you know, mine K approach to things. And in that book, for example, oh, Slavs are lesser people, they're denigrated. And you notice how arbitrary it was. Oh, the only people who count as human beings are 90 and above what, like who says who? But also down syndrome people. They're halfway people. So it's all arbitrary. Right. There's no actual argumentation as to. Because there's no metaphysics in this. This is an anti metaphysics based position because it's based on biological determinism and not science, but actually scientism. So there's a lot of things going on here.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So they have the idea of white, but that is a very American phenomenon. Because you go to Europe, people are like, hey, how do you do fellow white people person.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, they're like, oh, you're a, you're a French or you're.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you, you are from this part, you know, in the. With between Slavic nations there has always been tensions, but also the case with other nations. So you go to ethnos in the term of a nation, a cultural identity as well as a genetic identity. But again, you can't have these hard divisions because they break your entire system of categorization. It's self defeating. And as far as what counts, I think nationality counts much more because it's much richer in terms of culture, in terms of history. And you can make the same argument basically, you know, barring the IQ part, because I think that's just a cope. I think there's just a way they try to give some, you know, objective credence to their argumentation. But you can make the same thing, make the same argument about mixing between the ethnicities of the same race because you're destroying a culture basically because you have, you know, Someone who's Spanish and someone who's Swedish. Now you get a Swede, Spaniard, and he marries someone who's an Irish and Greek. Well, that grandson is going to be Swedish, Spanish, Irish and Greek. And that dilutes to nothing in terms of historic relevance or participation in the culture because you're just going to, I don't know, pick one or pretend to follow all four. But, you know, and you can logically play this out until it's just, you know, a negative category of, well, he's Caucasoid, he's not something else, but you lose all the profundity.

[Jay Dyer]

Exactly. Well said, Posh. I think also too, this is a fallacy, I see in terms of some of the argumentation about this. Sometimes people who are very hardline against ethnic realities, they will argue that, oh, well, because there's gray areas with, you know, people from different areas of Europe or whatever, or the Eastern bloc countries in terms of what they're defining as. As white or whatever, because there's gray areas. There is therefore no such thing. Well, if you think about colors, right? I mean, if you have red, you can move red more and more in the direction of pink or violet, and they're on a kind of a spectrum. It doesn't follow from the fact that there's pink that there's not red. So in the same way, the fact that there might be groups of people, you know, in the Caucasus Mountains that are a little more Asiatic in their appearance or in their physiognomy versus people that are a little more, you know, Nordic or whatever in their appearance, it doesn't follow from that, that, oh, well, then we don't know. And there is no, you know, there are no ethnos, there are no ethnicities or people. If you believe the bible, like Genesis 10 is very clear that clearly there's a table of nations and we all descend from these peoples. And obviously there's a difference between a Scottish person and a aborigine, right? I mean, the idea that there's no difference between a Scottish person and an Aborigine unless they profess abstract civic nationalism, like it's just super, super retarded. But it also doesn't follow from that that you therefore just purity spiral into, like that guy as an example, human beings are only the ones with 90 IQ and above. And also down syndromes are half human. I mean, it's just retarded. It's arbitrary. So they don't understand that. I know what you're arguing about, biology and genetics and Determinism. I've read all these people. I've got the Galtons. I've got, I've read Hans Eysenck. I've read all these people. But there are deeper, other questions that are not being answered or dealt with that aren't solved by just saying, oh, let's just not have, quote, race mixing. Okay, but where does that stop? Like, does that mean I can't marry a, a Serb?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, I'm not sure if you'd like to.

[Jay Dyer]

I was actually. I'm flirting with you, dude. Posh, I'm trying to marry you is what's going on here. Actually, actually, I am coming out of the closet here.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

A beautiful black woman I'm afraid of.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, you just heard it. Posh got exposed. He doesn't like sisters. He, he just doesn't want to see a slay queen. He sees a slay queen slaying and he feels that envy deep down. You know what I'm saying? Junior, what's up? Appreciate that, Posh. Great points by the way. Come back up if you want that. I mean, I wasn't booting you off. Feel free to, to come up.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I just wanted to point out one thing, is the fallacy that the gentleman engaged in is the age old one that we like to call the appeal to the powdered wig man fallacy.

[Jay Dyer]

That's a classic. Yeah, this comes from Chris back in the day on Hoaxbusters. Well, we all know that the pinnacle of Western civilization was the deism of Ben Franklin and his, you know, because he had, he had a guilf fetish and was a Satanist and Thomas Jefferson and his Jacobin philosophy and his Jesus list Bible. Right, that's, that's got to be. The peak of Western civilization is the founding fathers.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

They, I mean they had the, they had the magic powder wigs.

[Jay Dyer]

Yes.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

And quilt pens and parchment paper. These are the things I appeal to when I go to a civilization that was fully intact.

[Jay Dyer]

We gotta see. The real question is what happened to the, the dust that's on the powdered wigs? Because the dust in the powdered wigs is what endued the, the founding documents with the power that they have.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Protein packed meals in 10 minutes. TikTok's got millions of them.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Probably.

[Ryan Seacrest]

But hey, it's not a race. Grab the recipes on Tick Tock and start cooking.

[Jay Dyer]

For those that don't know they sprinkled

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

it on the Constitution.

[Jay Dyer]

They sprinkled it directly on the papers.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, directly on the papers. And that created the magicalness of those documents. But also any subsequent administrations have tried to find the remaining magic powder and that's what they're actually looking for.

[Jay Dyer]

You know what's funny? What's funny about his argument is exactly the argument that I heard from the Masonic scholar at the Washington Masonic Monument. They actually believe, kind of like Mormons, that like the founding documents, that was like the peak of civilization and that the great architect of the universe, the you know, all seeing eye deism deity is what providentially led America to be created as the non religious Freemasonic enlightenment utopia. That's how, that's the way it's described at the Masonic giant temple in D.C. when you take their tour, they describe it this way, so. But wait a minute, hold on. But I thought Freemasonry is like peak Judaic. All those same people will critique Freemasonry as peak, you know, Judaism for gentiles. And yet that guy's go to for why we're supposed to what position is actually just a bunch of like Masonic Deists.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I guess I missed, I guess I missed the best part.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah. Why did you leave right when the, the guy you said these people were going to come to bay and then they come here and then you leave. So. Yeah, Tactical evasions from fda. You saw it here?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, that's right. You got me.

[Jay Dyer]

It was a good round, boys.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

The magic powder, this will be Nick Cage's sequel to National Treasures is he

[Jay Dyer]

steals the powdered wig dust.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

FDA runs from the powdered wig argument because there is no response to it.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, you just got called out, dude.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Oh man. Well, I know where the missing powder is. They store it in the head of Jeremy Benson.

[Jay Dyer]

No, it's this black. Well now it's, now it's held by this black woman. So in the UK they got slay queen bipoc judges like myself and she got the, the wig dust right there. Used to be, you Know weird white women like this right here. And now it's the slay queens. So we coming up, y', all, but let's see, where's the dust? Can you still buy the dust for these.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Apparently new grift right there, Jay. You got to sell counterfeit powder dust.

[Jay Dyer]

So apparently it was a dust and it was called hair powder and it was part of grooming in the 1700s. And it says it was ground up starch, wheat, rice, flour and chalk or clay. And sometimes it was scented. So this is basically like white. White people version of dreadlocks. Basically what this is, although it's fake. You know what I'm saying? Listen, the founding fathers was getting their hair did. They was getting weaves before the black people was getting it. So they appropriated our culture. Black people appropriated powder wig culture. They didn't even know. It says it was a messy affair too. It says you had. They had to wear capes and to cover up because of the dust going everywhere. That's what it says right here. The trend died out, however, around 1800. So no more powder wigs after 1800. So I guess you. You can make your own powder wig dust, though, if you want to get it blessed. John, I got a question. If. If FDA blessed my own homemade rice flourish hair powder, would it count? Could we write up a new founding document?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

You know, we would have to. We'd have to get together.

[Jay Dyer]

Constitutional Convention. Constitutional Constitutional Convention,

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. That's the only way it's going to work. It has to be in Philadelphia.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, okay. We ought to have Nick Cage there too. He could be one of the Benjamin Gates to be one of the founding fathers.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Independence Hall.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, see that right there? That's American history right here, y'.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

All.

[Jay Dyer]

By the way, if you want to call in, feel free, hit like and share. Now, we are somewhat limited since we're on YouTube. So some of these topics, if all his other goons call in, it might get a little much for YouTube, but. David, what's up, dude? Your boy, David. Dave, what's going on, man? There is supposed to be a third national treasure. And I. I like FDA's idea. He's going to steal the powder wig dust. David, you want to mute or not? Last chance, David. All right. Bruce William the Bruce. What's up, dog?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yo, what's up, man?

[Jay Dyer]

What's on your mind?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So this is the perfect dovetail into what I was going to talk to you about. You have the libertarian topic there, right? And so this kind of church, fathers, rather, you know, fathers of the U S this, this kind of American experiment. Like I've been thinking about this as I've been thinking a lot about orthodoxy and normative authority. And authority. It seems like the United States being founded by like this rebellious Protestant sort of sectarian groups effectively is baked into the cake. This kind of anti authoritarian position, you know. Does that make sense to you with regard to like the Protestant ethos?

[Jay Dyer]

Of course.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Baptist theology support so prevalent.

[Jay Dyer]

Absolutely.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Individualism, that kind of thing in the

[Jay Dyer]

U.S. yeah, 100, a hundred percent.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So then the other thing that I'm trying to wrestle with though, like. So you have like your Calvinist reform folks that are like kind of, you know, deterministic Right there, no free will and you have this sort of libertarian free will position. I'm trying to understand how like you know, the Armenian or even say like orthodox free will doesn't lead to a libertarian ethos versus say like a monarchical deterministic ethos. That would be one of the Reformed fathers or say Westminster divines.

[Jay Dyer]

They didn't believe in monarchism. What do you mean?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Well, there's like a, there's like a streak of people that would have been pro monarchial and then there's also like this type that move towards.

[Jay Dyer]

No, there's not. There's not.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Right where there's a strong church with, you know, at the head of the country.

[Jay Dyer]

No, there's not. That's not true. I was in the Reconstructionist camp. I was a Calvinist. Calvinist. The Westminster Confession was developed out of debating and rejecting the monarchist arguments. That's why they're not Anglicans. And the Reconstructionists consistently have all argued for libertarian principles, whether it's Rush, Juni or Gary North. None of them argued any in any way consistent that there was a church is. One of the reasons I left Reconstructionism is because this was super inconsistent. And I still.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

That's right, that's. And I've heard Rustin even say like, you know, I'm more of a libertarian minded guy but like I don't see how that all comports with the theonomic,

[Jay Dyer]

you know, it doesn't. That's why I left it. I left it 20 plus years ago because it doesn't make any sense.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, and so then like how are they, how are they like working out the free will position in the world of orthodoxy and say monarchy or things like that?

[Jay Dyer]

Like what does that have to do with. But what does that have to do with structure of governance? I mean the structure of the government, for example. There's no church fathers in the first thousand years that teach strict predestinarianism like Calvin, and yet they all acknowledge the emperor or the monarch, so why would there be any? There's no necessary connection between the Orthodox doctrine of synergy and free will. I mean, synergy is what developed the Symphonia position of the double headed Byzantine eagle.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, so I was reading like some of that work you told you had recommended me of the of the Russian statesman. And so I'm trying to understand how that like how church and state really come together in the Orthodox position and how it doesn't. Like how you don't have Americans sort of adopting more libertarianism in their paradigm if they are Orthodox.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Want to keep up with everything trendy? From breaking news to shareable jokes, pop

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Jay Dyer]

Well, just simply that libertarianism is premised on a strict minimalist view of the state. And the position of Orthodoxy historically is that that the state has a duty to God and to the church. And that's not a libertarian position. So in libertarianism and in Protestantism and evangelicalism, although they've been inconsistent on this, it's not just a question of an establishment church or anti establishmentarianism. It's also a question of whether or not there is in the Orthodox tradition and in divine revelation a teaching and a tradition about the role of the state. And most Protestants just believe default that there is no coherent position. We got to reconstruct that out of the Scriptures. Hence Reconstructionists. Right? We don't have to reconstruct it because it's already there. It's already the Byzantine model that was what was the norm for the entire from Constantine to the fall of Byzantium. That's the norm. And even into Russia, that's the norm. So it's foreign to the Enlightenment and libertarianism because libertarianism is an Enlightenment anti state, negative liberty position. So it's premised on putting first and foremost the idea of commerce and praxis and human action versus divine revelation. So Orthodoxy doesn't begin with commerce and freedom of human action. Its starting point is divine revelation, Trinity Christology and ecclesiology. And then that informs the doctrine of the state.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, I think that's pretty clear. I think that's a good clarification. Is there not like the sort of Hyperion sovereign sphere argument within the Orthodox world? I mean, I don't really hear that talked about very much there. You know, this sort of sovereign spheres of church, state and family or household.

[Jay Dyer]

No, that has nothing to do with Abraham Kuyper. It has to do with the classical traditions that the Church has a sphere that. I mean, the state can't come in and tell the Church to ban icons or to not do the Eucharist. Right. But the Church can't. Like the Church doesn't determine what the death penalty is for offenders against the state. That's the role of the state. And the Church can't come into your house and say, you must sell me your property for the Church. Yeah, of course there's spheres of authority that's actually all out of the Christian tradition. It's not Abraham Kuyper.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, I was. So they would definitely like affirm that sort of basic tenet of sort of sovereign spheres.

[Jay Dyer]

That's why the eagle has two heads. If you look at the Papists, if you look at the medieval papal position as it develops, it moves from the. Even the Austro Hungarian Catholic Empire had the double headed eagle as well. But then eventually it becomes the papal triple crown. Well, the triple crown is a violation of the older Christian symbol of the two heads, because the two heads of the eagle are church and state working in Symphonia. It's the same body of people, but there's two roles. Right. Church deals with the eternal spiritual world. The state deals with the temporal historical world. But there is a Christian doctrine of the state. That's what's antithetical to all post Enlightenment philosophy. That's why people in America can't conceive of the things that we argue about. And what we argue for is because it's antithetical to the very idea of Protestant Evangelical Baptist America that there is a Christian doctrine of the state and that the state has a duty to the one true God, not any God, not the Masonic generic God, but to the Trinity.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, sure. And so then would, let's say a proper kingdom in the orthodox sphere would be a kingdom that affirms The Trinitarian God of the Bible. Not some random.

[Jay Dyer]

It would be the position. Yeah. Look up the, you know, history of all the Orthodox kingdoms, like the Serbs, who went to battle against the Muslims for the. For the defense of the Christian people. I mean, the Crusades themselves, even though there was a lot of corruption and papal nonsense. I mean, the whole idea of the Crusades is the same, same basic idea, defense of, you know, Christian civilization and Christian lands. Yeah. You had papal abuses and you had, you know, French kings that just wanted to get rich and all that. Sure. But the. The idea is still, I mean, that's going to be in any warfare. Right. Any warfare will have, you know, evil troops looting and doing bad things. Right. Well, we don't say, oh, well, then I guess the war was never just because you had a troop that did a bad thing. That's just retarded. Like, people just don't. Everyone thinks about things like their children. Everybody thinks of religion, and this is largely due to Protestant evangelical megachurch sickness. Everyone thinks of the religious world as Sunday school. I mean, you have puppet church for adults. That's what Randy Ball's church is. So it's like a bunch of children trying to think through vast, complex historical issues like Byzantium and the death penalty and just war, or is there no just war? Right. All this stuff has already been kind of worked out in history, but everybody's. They're all just a bunch of kids. So that's what we're dealing with. James, what's up? But I appreciate your call. Yeah. In fact, the very question that you raised there is why I left Reconstructionism. I did go into trad Catholicism because I thought that was like the. I didn't know enough about Orthodoxy at the time, but the basic idea that I had when I became Roman Catholic was, well, there ought to be a Christian doctrine of the state. And it looks like, you know, the Roman Catholic Church has always said, got to be, you know, when it's a. When it's a majority baptized Catholic country, you should have Catholic principles in government. Right. That was my thinking when I was a trad cat. And that's still true. That's why I'm a Orthodox to this day. What's up, man? James.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hey, Jay. Father had a nice. God bless. Christ has risen. Oh, Christ has ascended, actually. Yeah. Thank God. I got a question. So maybe this is for Father Ananias. I noticed that in some of the prayers that we have during, I think it's through an orthros where the clergy venerate the icon of the Theotokos. And if you would give me the space, Jay, I'll just say it because I think Father Ananias will probably get where I'm going and trying to ask about it. It says, open unto us the doors of Thy loving kindness. Almost. Blessed Mother of God, as we set our hope in Thee, let us not be confounded, but through Thee may we be delivered from all adversities. For Thou art the salvation of the race of Christians. When we. For this.

[Jay Dyer]

It's just the old. It's the. It's the usage of a lot of people in, you know, old English times, or it's just a generic word that just means a group. So I mean, the church fathers, when they're translated into English. Could you make me a couple espresso shots? Thank you. I mean, the church fathers, when they're translated into English, they use this language a lot like the race of Christians, right? So it's just talking about them as a Christian group, and it's a generic use of the term. So it's not. Has nothing to do with modern racial, biological determinism.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, so we. And I think the reason. And maybe you'll clarif or you'll correct me, but I think prior to becoming Orthodox, obviously I'm black, right? So I would come at most of life thinking in racial divisions, right? Separation, segmentation. But then as I looked at the church, I thought it as a unified body. I was like, oh, when I heard that prayer, I'm like, oh. So we are called the nation of. The kingdom of heaven is separated. It's a new kingdom. And so our race is now. We are realigned in the Spirit. So by baptism, we are changed. Yes. At the natural state. Our physical bodies may still represent, you know, Greek or etc. Etc. But our spiritual representation changes on Earth. That was kind of what I was thinking, but it sounds like, yeah, all

[Jay Dyer]

this means is people. Well, your race doesn't change because if you look at icons and you look at St. Moses the Black, he's still a black dude. He didn't. He didn't become a. A gray floating blob. Because the whole idea of the resurrection is that we retain who we are, even though we will be trans. Transfigured. There will be a change in our whole physio. Physiognomy. We don't lose our history. And so a lot of this has to do with erasing who you were and who we are in terms of our history. And anytime Orthodoxy goes into a culture, it Lifts up the good parts of the existing natural qualities or virtues that are there. Right. So it doesn't, it doesn't have to wipe everything away. A lot of modern NGO based fake churchianity, however, is a weaponized tool to go into other countries and to remake them and destroy them in the image of Americanism. And that's what we've been talking about forever and ever and ever about the Cold War stuff. The church has got, a lot of them got co opted in the Cold War to be essentially NGOs and forms of soft power for Americanism. And they do engage in this sort of just nonsensical absurdities. But if you look in the book of Revelation, when John sees unto heaven, he sees people out of every tribe, tongue and nation. He doesn't say we're all one, quote race and we lost all of our past. And again, we can show this by the Galatians 3 text, which is always misused. There is neither junior Greek slave nor free, male nor female. Oh, is Paul a trans advocate? So when you become a Christian and by the way, there are actual people who like at Fordham argue, yes, this is actually a trans advocate position. That's how crazy this stuff is. And it's not even like it's. If you read the Bible, even within its own holistic context, there's no point at which ethnicity or ethno goes away. It just can't be an idol. But it's not bad in itself. And it's the entire project of globalization and the globalist to erase your people group and your history.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

By the way, this comes up too with politics. People get frustrated with politics. Most of it's fake and gray. We all, we all know that. And so it's really easy for people to fall into the extremes that my kingdom's not of this earth. And we don't do, we don't, you don't get nation states don't matter and we're all one. It's the same, it's the same issue in politics. As Jay pointed out. You know, when priests are criticizing people's politics and stuff like that, they're not saying not to be politically engaged or proud of your nation or something like that. They're saying not put the first things first, like don't make the second, third, fourth things, idols above. But how many times have we seen that? Like, it's just, well, it's all, you know, fake and gray and I'm orthodox and I'm gonna just pray and none of this stuff matters. It's like well, you're an idiot. That's what this is called. So it's the same with this. Like. Yeah. It's not dissolving real identities and boundaries and stuff. And what that really means is in terms of dig, you know, dignity and salvation, we're all one while still keeping one's history and people and. And whether. And then it's also. Also nation, too. We're not gonna have one world because what's the other thing? Like, one world government. That's what I always say, too. Like, well, what's your options? Internationalism. Right. One world government or like a nation state. Like, and that's what Jay is saying. All this stuff's all funded to dissolve those things.

[Jay Dyer]

Grab thar, Jack. What's up, dude? Grab thar. What's up? Do you want to talk or not? On mute. Last chance.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

All right, Sorry.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, go ahead.

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[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

If you're into tech, you will love this.

[Jay Dyer]

TikTok is a live lab where users

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

post instant reviews of the latest trends. Download TikTok tok and check it out. Hey, I got a friend of mine who's been a pretty good source, got me into theology, long story short. But for whatever reason, he seems to be really stuck up on the Sabbath, and I don't really know how to. Or I'm not even equipped to challenge them on that stuff because I'm so new at this.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay, so, yeah, so basically, if you look in the Book of Acts, they're worshiping on the first day of the week. They're coming together for the breaking of bread, which is the Eucharist. You can look at the fact that the Hebrews 4 is very important because Christ fulfilled the Sabbath in terms of the Old Testament Sabbath. When he rested, when he rested in the tomb, that's the fulfillment of the Sabbath. And then when he resurrected, there's a new eternal Sabbath. That is the eternal state that Christ brought at the first Advent in the Orthodox church on The Saturday vespers, we still honor the Saturday seventh day, but it's more proper to go with the Day of Resurrection. Because John is in the Spirit on the Lord's day. That's when he sees into heaven and sees the heavenly liturgical worship. Because Christ fulfilled the meaning of the Sabbath. So Sabbatarians and SDA understand typology. They don't understand the significance of Christ's resurrection being the true real Sabbath, even according to Hebrews 4. And so they're stuck in judaizing. And the more we go through this, the more I realize that all of Protestantism is really just a bunch of judaizing heresy at every level. And that's, by the way, why God logic and IP and AP and all these people are in the tpusa ziosphere zio evangelical sphere. And that's why they send people to. To synagogues, to Messianic synagogues. It all makes sense to me now because all the Protestantism is. Is this Fumentari. What's up?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Hi, Jay. So back on the question about, like, paganism and stuff and the. What he was talking about, like, ethnicity and stuff in the. In the commandments, does it say about adultery? Like. Yeah, I saw on Twitter someone talking about this. Like, adultery could be considered like adultery in the blood. Is that something that could be the case?

[Jay Dyer]

I. I don't think so. I've never heard of that. Adultery. You mean, like, if I marry outside of my people group, am I committing adultery with my blood?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, like, you don't adult to the blood? I don't know. It was. I think it might have been a Catholic who was saying it, so it's probably a bunch of BS. But also, I'm banned on YouTube, so can you please unban me? I don't know why I am.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, I might have hit the wrong person, but what's your handle?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Is the same.

[Jay Dyer]

Same. Okay.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. Thank you, J.

[Jay Dyer]

Math enjoyer. Here we go. We know it's gonna be.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

It's Isaac, my buddy. Hey, how we doing today? Good, man. I'm coming.

[Jay Dyer]

I'm.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I'm gonna come and get you, man. Bring you back, bro. Listen, I'm not built for seven months worth of winter. I actually really like the pnw, but I'm glad to speak to you. I caught the last end of what you guys were saying about Protestantism and Zionism, the whole sphere, but. Which maybe we could talk about a little later. But I'm just more curious in terms of Islam, and I'm more interested in the historicity stuff like what is like. And correct me. And I want to tell you my take and I want you guys to tell me if I'm wrong about this. My understanding is that generally speaking, the narrative is that there is a reason to believe that the narrative, that the basic narrative around Muhammad, who he is, you know, where he's from, when he was born and when he died, is basically true. I mean, obviously the theological stuff and the claims that he made about, you know, obviously they're false, but in terms of like his actual, his actual existence. But I've also heard stuff that possibly that maybe he was born earlier, like a hundred years earlier than they claimed or that he might not even have been born in Mecca. He was possibly born in like Petra or some other city in, in what we call a southern Jordan, Northern Arabia. I mean, do you guys know anything about this or have you.

[Jay Dyer]

I don't know. There's a lot of, there's a handful of, you know, YouTube evangelical types that are using this line of argument. I, I don't, I mean, maybe it's true. I don't know if it's that effective, but I don't know enough about it. I'm not a historian when it comes to, to Islam. I'm just focused on sort of the theological contradictions and that kind of stuff. So. And you know, with these kinds of debates it's always really, I don't think, I'm not saying they're not useful or that they don't matter, but like, it's kind of like the, the Jesus never existed line of argument, right? No, none of the Christians are really going to find that very compelling unless they're just super low tier and don't know anything about, you know, extra Christian sources about this kind of stuff. So I don't think you're gonna. Because this kind of a debate requires all this like PhD paper level historical investigation and Muslims are not going to do that.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Man.

[Jay Dyer]

I've been debating Muslims for 10 years. They don't care about that. It's, it's like 80, 90 IQ, people who believe. I mean, it's just, it's even doing the like trinitarian debates is almost a disservice because it's, it, it gives the impression that there's this like high tier Islamic metaphysic and maybe there's a few of those in the Middle Ages, but it's not, that's not what Islam is, man. Truffles. What's up? Truffles? What's on your mind? I'm mute.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Oh, hello, Jay. I actually didn't expect to get up here yet, so I'm having trouble rectifying the stuff about the Eucharist. It's a little confusing to my small retard brain.

[Jay Dyer]

Rectifying what though?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

It's not an orthodoxy. I understand it's not entirely symbolic, but it is still partially symbolic, correct?

[Jay Dyer]

I guess if you mean that like it to the, to the eyes it presents bread and wine, but in reality it's the real thing. I mean, you could say in that sense, but for the Orthodox, For Orthodoxy and actually for the ancient and medieval world, symbols were not viewed as we view symbols in the post enlightenment world. We view symbols as abstracted and divorced from any kind of metaphysical ontological reality. And the ancient medieval world didn't view quote symbols that way. So, you know, it's like we call sometimes the, the creed is called the symbol. Well, that doesn't mean that it's symbolic and we don't believe the creed. It's just a way to speak of the doctrine or the belief. So in that sense, it's quote symbolic. But for Orthodoxy, you know, icons are symbols, but they're symbols of reality. They're react. They're not just abstracted, they're actually reality and they're grounded in history. Right. Icons have the, the things about the person in history. Because we're not Neoplatonists, we don't erase history. Neoplatonists do.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

By the way, logically, symbolic comes from symbios, which means the bringing of two things together. So as Jade said in antiquity, we don't have this kind of modern notion that.

[Jay Dyer]

Go ahead, fda. I'm going to get run to the restroom and tt you go ahead.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

And symbolic is detached or just kind of metaphorical or spiritualized or something like that. And antiquities. Symbios means real. It just means like for example, with the Eucharist, the two things being brought together is the divine and the, and the sensible to like the, the right. It's really God right there. It's not simply an abstraction or a metaphor or spiritualized. It's literally God. And you are seeing the bread and in the wine as well. So two things being brought together very much like example that. And I think Saint Maximus says, uses this word too. The great, the great symbiotes. The great, the great sign is Christ. He's actually a symbios of God and man. And we wouldn't say, oh well, that's just a metaphor. It's like, no, it's actually ontologically and metaphysically United. And he Postosis right there. The point of it.

[Jay Dyer]

I have a talk that would be relevant for this on icons, how icons are real. It's the philosophy of icons talk. I know you're talking about the uk, Chris, but the principle applies. So everything in regard to our Sacramentology, it's all just derived from Christology. So all the principles of the hypostatic union flesh out to impact and determine our ecclesiology, our sacramentology, etc. And our. Our idea of iconography, too.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Understand? Appreciate it, you guys. Thank you.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, also I do have lectures through the entirety of John, including a podcast on John 6 where we get into sort of eucharistic arguments. Spinny, what's up? One of the things that helped me as a Protestant too was when Matix was debating Bonson and we need to do. We need to do a review of the Mad Bonson debate. Because when I was a Calvinist, it was Jerry Matix who hit me to the liturgical aspects of Hebrews 13. And that whole paragraph where Paul's talking about, we have an altar and we give a Eucharistia. Thanks. When I was Protestant, I never even thought about that. I was like, wait a minute, why is Paul saying there's an altar? And why is he using the word Eucharist there in that context? I never thought about that. Right, because if you're Protestant, you think that the continuation of the application of Christ's sacrifice is blasphemous. Right? Because it's once for all. It's once for all. So you're going back to the Old Testament. Well, then why is Paul still using the word altar? And then when it's funny, when you ask Protestants, they. They'll like, oh, it's spiritual. So Protestants literalize when it's spiritual and they spiritualize when it's literal so that they have a consistent problem with that. Spinny, what's up? Lil Duce says. Il Duce says, hold on a second. Are you gonna play the 007? I tried to play it yesterday. I couldn't get the chat to come up on the screen screen. So there was no point in me playing it if I couldn't see you guys chat. So, I mean, I toggled the display chat button on. It still wouldn't come up. So I got to figure out how to make that work. I see a lot of people saying it's woke. I've only finished the first part, which is like the training course for 007. And I do have a couple bipoc handlers. So if that's what it means to be woke, I might still play it. But Bond always had a woman handler. I mean, I mean he serves the queen right, So I mean, that's kind of a matriarchy. But Spinny, what's up, aj?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

How you doing? Thank you for having me up.

[Jay Dyer]

Yes, sir.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

I want to ask you about. I've been formulating a new argument for the Eucharist Based on a needgod.net I want to know what you thought about

[Jay Dyer]

it based on that. Dude, how is. How is that due to basis for argument?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

The. The argument where I will cite where Jesus says this is my body and then proceed to just say, well, you don't believe Jesus, so I believe Jesus and I'm scared for your salvation. I think you should believe God. That's about it. I just keep repeating that over and over.

[Jay Dyer]

It probably would work with that tier of people that's a very low tier group over there. So that would probably play pretty well.

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[Jay Dyer]

Protein packed meals in 10 minutes. TikTok's got millions of them.

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[Jay Dyer]

Probably.

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[Jay Dyer]

So it sounds like. By the way, I meant to mention this about AI. It sounds like because Sam Altman said they want to make AI a utility that you buy, like your water services or your, you know, sanitation services. You'll have AI services that you pay for. And then I and then I noticed Larry Fink talking about trillions of dollars for AI data centers. Watch this. Americans to think about growing with the United States States. We will have far than enough money to invest in this infrastructure. But as the governor was talking about, the need for electrons is growing every day. Some of these, you know, if we're

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

going to be the leader in technology,

[Jay Dyer]

which we are, if we are going to be the leader in AI, which we presently are, it's just going to require Trillions of dollars of investments. And if we don't invest in it, China will be the global leader of this. And so to me it's not weather. This is a must. And if you think about how that translates, it translates into a more dynamic economy. We need to the United States economy to grow it over over 2%. We need the US economy to grow at 3%. Are you guys saying you can't hear the clip at all? Or you can't or he's like low or something? It's looks like it's, it's. The actual clip is actually a pretty low volume clip. So that might be what it is. But let me make sure that I've got all this set right.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, you can hear it on X.

[Jay Dyer]

Can you guys in the chat hear Larry Fink? Or is it too low? Especially with the growing deficits the federal government has. And so much of this money, not just the project, is going to be coming from the private sector, from savings accounts, from pension accounts, from insurance companies, and on and on and on. So they want this to become the next utility. That's what Altman was saying. And that's why he's saying there will be trillions of dollars put into this and that's why the data centers are going up everywhere. I'm still not clear exactly on what its major use is supposed to be. Yes, I know we've been hearing forever for the last several years. It's going to replace the clerk, it's going to replace this person that. I get it and maybe it will, but. And even if there's AI data centers everywhere, I mean, I'm still not understanding how a glorified search engine is going to like. So this makes me think, could there be an Enron angle to this? Because a lot of the same people involved in Enron are also kind of involved in the background of this stuff, which Lord Voldemort mentioned that the other day, which makes me think maybe there's a giant like scam bubble going on. I'm not saying that AI won't have a role in our lives in the future or whatever and maybe it will get dystopian. I'm just still not understand. I had a guy on who worked in AI, I went on his podcast like two months ago and he went deep into explaining what all it was going to replace. And I maybe I just still I'm not understanding what it's supposed to be doing at that level. Like how, I mean, unless they're just preparing some sort of giant smart city Gulag that's run by AI data centers. Like what is AI going to do in Memphis, Tennessee where they just built this giant AI data center? That Memphis requires this much AI. You see what I'm saying?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Data storage and data grabbing.

[Jay Dyer]

But they already have that. That's what, that's what I don't understand why AI is. Maybe AI is the COVID for more of that. But the problem is. So back when I think, okay, back when I worked at AT&T, when I was just a low level like sales dude at like a Verizon, right. But I was at AT and T and we had to do training at the giant hub in Nashville, right? So they have this giant hub in Nashville and on the bottom floor, it's like a former Microsoft facility or I forget what it is, but it's just this huge, like boring business complex, right. Where they, with business Corp, where they make businesses complex, right. And then you go for the training and then there's all these underground servers and the whole giant complex has a giant. It's not an underground base, it's just a basement that is all servers. And they were saying that that was bait. This was back in like 2011, I want to say 2012. They were saying then, oh, this is all of the Internet traffic and data for the Bible Belt, basically. So they already have like giant data facilities. Maybe the, this is a way to do more of that. But I'm still just not understanding like what actual function AI is supposed to serve beyond, I mean, retarded Internet videos. Like what, giving you like shitty answers to every question you ask and then contradiction contradicting itself like five minutes later, like, what, what, what awesome service is this actually supposed to do? That we're being told. And that's what makes me think, is this like the Enron or like the, the dot com bubble where it was all hyped up and a bunch of money was stolen and lost and, and trading and options and all that. And then down the road, yeah, it eventually gets integrated like the Internet did, Right. So if you remember, when the Internet popped off, there was all. It was called the dot com boom where everybody thought, oh, here, it's here. The Internet's going to be in every area of our life. We're going to do all of our shopping online. And so there was this huge inflated stock market trading bubble and the actual infrastructure wasn't there to actually do all of this and all of our shopping online like we do now. Right. So people were correct that Amazon and these kinds of entities would take over. They would rule, but they were way too early. And I don't know, but I'm just wondering, like, is. Because all I see in my feed now is everyone fussing about the data centers. And by the way, AT&T actually, AT&T was doing this back in the Cold War. They were spying on people and had set up basically surveillance hubs for all communications. A long time ago. Bell Labs was what helped pioneer that with the. The CIA. That's in John Marks's book, by the way. So none of this stuff is, like, none of this is really new. This is all old. But now it's just being sort of normalized and becoming omnipresent. But there's so much smoke and mirror around AI it's hard to figure out what's actually going on. And what's the smoke and mirror? John, did you want to say something?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah. I think a lot of it has to do with. They want to integrate a lot of your information online.

[Jay Dyer]

Huh.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

And it's going to take a lot more data centers to be able to do all that.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So, like, you know, all of the things that you're looking at and connect, you know, eventually lead to, like, digital id probably. I don't know how fast that would come up, but even they might even have to do, like, And I was thinking about this not too long ago was they might even have to do like, stealth digital id because people are so, like, openly opposed to it. It's like they might integrate it in the background and then it's something that's been going on for like 10 years and you didn't even know. And then they're like, oh, hey, by the way, we've been integrating all of your information online. And now 10 years later, we're just gonna put this on a. Now a digital chip or credit card,

[Jay Dyer]

whatever Penoptics says, Jay, you're behind. AI can become an automated surveillance in identifying people and entities. I'm not behind. I wrote about that 15 years ago. I know all about that, and I know that that's what they want to eventually do. But what I'm saying is the infrastructure is not there yet for that. Yeah, maybe the data center is supposed to be the infrastructure for that. But even with the data centers, like, okay, so you've got a giant data center and everybody's got phones. I mean, you're all already in a Panopticon. All of this is already accessible to centralized entities. So I don't really understand what. Just repeating the fact that it's going to be a panopticon. I know that, man. I've been reading about that for two decades. But I know what Bentham said. I know what, what a goose comp said. I'm aware of that. Not trying to be a. I'm just saying, like, yeah, I know about all that. By the way, this was an interesting graphic. This is supposed to depict Islam in Spain, I think, right? And then Spain. Spain eventually responds, that's into France, right? And then the point of the graphic being that it's not the case that Islam has to win. The problem with this graphic, though, is that this was back, like in the Middle Ages when you had people who

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[Jay Dyer]

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[Jamie]

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[Jay Dyer]

Try TikTok now. Died and and lived a life of kind of battle, right? Spain and Portugal. And people were a lot more virile at that time. So I'm not sure that, that you're going to get Europeans being like medieval Spain to fend off because these countries have all been socialized into Fabian socialism. The whole EU was, by the way, an OSS project. And we encountered that in the ratio book, which nobody talks about because everybody thinks, oh, tiny mustache man created eu. No, he didn't. That's totally total bullshit. It's literally Bill Donovan, the European Economic Community, oecd, the European steel conglomerate, and the OSS that created it. It's the European project of the oss. And their working model was Fabian Socialism. Not capitalism, not Austrian economics, not Marxism. Fabian Socialism, Socialism, reformed Marxism, which is Marxism combined with monopoly capital.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay?

[Jay Dyer]

And that's not national socialism. It's none of those. It's international Fabian Socialism, which is amenable to the Fortune 100. That's why the Fortune 100500 push Fabian Socialist Marxist ideas. But they're not Marxist. This is what nobody can figure out. Even still, even though it's all in the books. And even though we talk about it nonstop and people think that we're fighting some medieval battle. It's not a medieval battle, dude. We're not going to have crusades again. We're in fifth generational sixth generational warfare. That's not, you know, kings and princes and stuff that doesn't exist anymore. And the kings and princes that do exist are Creeper Epstein, Butt buddies. Guys, if you want to support the stream, you can do so by funding the grift. According to Ruslan, you funding the grift right here, the guy with rap church is calling us a grift. There is the link right there to support the stream. And my beautiful wife Jamie will be coming on here in a bit. In maybe an hour or two, or no, maybe pretty soon. Jamie, are you coming on? And we will be covering the dark secrets of Tantra because Jamie has gone deep into some interesting texts and I thought that would be a really fun show. Let's take some calls as quick as we can before Jamie gets ready to come in here. Who disagrees? You go to the headline. Go ahead, John, you say whatever you want. Sure, say whatever you want.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

So I think what they want to do is they like. Like you were saying, like we already live in a Doctagon where it's easily accessible for them to see whatever you're doing online or where you've been.

[Jay Dyer]

Right, go ahead.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

But. But they want that to be accessible to everybody. Like, you know, the Black Mirror Social Credit School.

[Jay Dyer]

Interesting. Yeah, I don't doubt that at all. I just wonder. I mean, that also I think would require a lot of infrastructure that's still not there yet, but maybe, maybe the infrastructure is there and I don't know, maybe like everybody's phone is part of the infrastructure, part of the back door somehow, and we don't know or. I mean, if I'm. I mean, and I'm saying that because I'm not talking about being in downtown LA, but like there's 20 cities I could go to right now in the middle of Tennessee, in the middle of nowhere, and they don't have anything like this. There's no, there's not any of this infrastructure. So, I mean, okay, so maybe the AI can hack into a street light camera, but. Okay, so are the who's going to come arrest me? The robots? Are they going to have an infrastructure at the local police to arrest me for jaywalking? Because, I mean, it's just I'm not seeing where in the world all of this architecture is yet rolled out. Now it could be again. Maybe they're just going to. I don't know. Maybe there'll be a giant economic collapse and they'll say you got to get on the UBI or who knows?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Another war. Or maybe it functions like in the Fifth Element. Remember how, like, the cops don't even really know what's going on?

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, they just arrest you because it says to. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good point.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

That could be our potential future, too.

[Jay Dyer]

Great point. I forgot about that part of Fifth Element. Hey, Jamie, are you coming?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, it's like a functioning dysfunctional dystopian who disagrees.

[Jay Dyer]

You go to headline before beautiful Jamie comes on to discuss the secrets of tantra and tantric Buddhism and the epidemic of yoga chicks on Instagram and the takeover of yoga in the West. I'll be wearing my yogurt pants so you can all see my thick birthing thighs that I got. I attained those thick thighs just for y' all to help birth some new bipart babies to beat everybody in the battle. I'm joking, by the way. Joseph, you disagree? What's up?

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and safeway now through June 23rd. Shop for you. Save days and get great savings on all your favorite personal care Essentials and earn 4 times points. Shop in store or online and save on items like head and shoulder shampoo, Pantene shampoo, Tresemme conditioner, l' Oreal hair dye, Tresemme Hairspray, and Aussie Miracle Curls, and earn four times points to use for future savings on groceries or gas. Offer ends June 23rd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

If you're into tech, you will love this. Tick Tock is a live lab where users post instant reviews of the latest trends. Download Tick Tock and check it out.

[Jay Dyer]

Did y' all see this? Manosphere. So called manosphere. I don't even know what this is, but this dude charges a hundred thousand dollars a year for getting screamed at, I guess, at his men's meeting. We got to watch this because by the way, you're going to notice how similar this fake manosphere crap is to. To evangelical churches. Joseph, you got on me, man. What's up?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Yeah, can you hear me?

[Jay Dyer]

Huh? What's up?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Okay, so Gavin Orland dropped a small video today where he was just kind of talking while he was outside and he was mentioning this point and I kind of agree, agree with him. Maybe you can enlighten me. The claim that A lot of Protestants are making is that only recently have Eastern Orthodox Christians started saying things like, yeah, we know the church is the exclusive ark, but that doesn't mean God can't save people outside in like a non normative means. And he's saying that throughout history the Church is very clear that they are basically saying that you're, your eschatological position is anathema if you're not living within the Church. So what do you have to say about that?

[Jay Dyer]

No, that's, that's fully in line with what we're saying. Right. So in other words, if you persevere into the end outside of the mystical body, you are outside of the ark. But I mean Paul himself said who are we to judge those without. So he's confusing us judging a person's eternal destiny with judging the public confession of the heterodox group that they're in. Right. So for example, the anathemas of the seventh Ecumenical Council about icons, those aren't directed directly at your Baptist grandmother. So in the Orthodox conception, this is what he's missing. What he's not understanding is that heresy is not merely being ignorant. To whom much is given, much is required. The patristic definition of what a heretic or schismatic is is to, to obstinately and knowingly oppose the truth. Now you can have a sin of ignorance where you willfully are ignorant and you still have to give an account for that. But merely being ignorant of a thing is not the same thing in terms of the culpability for obstinately opposing the positions. So James White is a heretic, why? Because he has obstinately opposed the Orthodox Catholic position for decades. Gavin Ortland is a heretic because he obstinately knowingly opposes and lies about the things that are presented to him to recast it to prove his butt buddy church, which he's actually in a butt buddy church by the way, they just had a giant scandal. So that's why we don't immediately just say, oh, if you've not been baptized into the Orthodox Church, you're automatically damned. And again, remember, these people think of quote, salvation as a one time act where you pray the sinner's prayer or you confess Jesus with your mouth. That's not what salvation is in the Orthodox conception. So we have a different conception of salvation. And thus for us to say that we can warn you that you're outside of the ark, it still doesn't give us the position or the place to say I know your eternal Destiny, because I don't know your eternal destiny. But if you're not inside the ark, you will suffer a shipwreck. Right? And there are examples where there have been people who, you know, Cornelius has his prayer heard before he's in the church. So God can hear a person's prayer. There are graces outside of the church, or else no one would ever come to the church. You can't come to church without grace. Right. So the prayers for an unbaptized infant, for example, are different than the prayers for those inside the church. And we pray for our dead relatives, even those that have died outside the church. Why would we do that if I. There'd be no point of that if they're automatically damned. But we don't know that. So people are confusing the humble position of not knowing things and admitting that we don't know those things because we're not told those things in orthodoxy versus where you have strong statements in the church fathers about obstinate heretics. Right. Your grandmother might not be an obstinate heretic. And that's why we are rougher and more aggressive with obstinate heretics, as the church fathers were. They were much more obstinate and much more aggressive. Excuse me, much more aggressive with people like Arius or Nestorius, who were massive heresy arcs. That's why Ruslan is, what, much worse than a Baptist grandmother? Ruslan is out here literally directing people to get circumcised at these fake ass churches. And then when people apostatize, he laughs about it. He doesn't give a. He's a. He's a total phony, obviously. All right, so we're going to shift gears a little bit. That's a foot fart. Gonna go crazy thinking I'm just sitting here farting when I. Because I'm sweating like crazy. It's a sweaty foot fart. The air is on. It just gets hot as hell in here when you sit. And we are gonna shift gears a little bit to talk about. Thank you, guys. On the call in, you guys might not want to wait so you guys can come back over here on the live stream. What? Okay, I'll play this clip while Jamie goes and gets a pillow. I thought this was funny. This was some sort of man, red pill, mano, toxic masculinity person. And I'm saying that in a joke sense. Like, obviously, a lot of this shit's gay as hell from the left. But then because the left and feminism is so dominant, you get these sort of crazy level weirdo Grifter dudes that create almost like churches or cults. But notice how similar this is to, like, an evangelical church. Watch this. I don't know what that song is, so I'm not gonna play this song. But, like, so you pay a thousand dollars to go see. And he's got, like, a Las Vegas. The background is like a Ferris wheel. He's got smoke machines and dudes screaming, and dude's all acting and looking tough. Here's the thing about this kind of stuff is that it's so performative, right? It's like the evangelical church, which makes the religion into an external performative action. I mean, masculinity can have an external action if you are called to war or you work some sort of, you know, masculine day job where you're digging ditches. And sure, all that stuff is part of masculinity, but what's weird about this stuff is this is so performative and, like, not even real. It's like shitty entertainment, right? Just like the evangelical churches are. And you've got all these dudes wearing a shirt with this dude's name on it. Elliot. Who the hell is Elliot?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Dude, Elliot.

[Jay Dyer]

And look at this dude right here. Like, it's all. Here's. There's even women here. And. And then what? Elliot. Elliot screams at you to be a man, and then he's got a row of, like, paid. A row of paid tough dudes.

[Jamie]

When are they gonna rip phone books?

[Jay Dyer]

They're not even as cool as the strong boys. Dude. This is like the strong boys in the churches, right? The strong boy ministry. What do they call the. The Bible. They don't rip Bibles in half, do they? They rip. They rip encyclopedias in half. What are they called? Evangelical. What are they called?

[Jamie]

Strong boys.

[Jay Dyer]

Muscle boys. The muscle Muscle boys. Evangelical Muscle boys rip phone books.

[Jamie]

There he is.

[Jay Dyer]

Power team. I couldn't think of the power team. Dude, the power team is cooler than these dudes. The power team will rip a whole phone book. And this dude is just running around screaming at people with a dude's wearing his name on their shirt. This is just weird, dude. This is so gay. And then he's up there with his girlfriend, and then he just screams at you, dude, rip a phone book. At least the Christian strong boys can rip a phone book in half. In fact, he could do like 10 in a row. Look at this. Watch this. Boom. Look at that. I was going to say he ought to rip a Bible in half, but then that wouldn't work, would it? That would be blasphemous. Oh, wait, wait. What, is he ripping Bibles in it? He should be. He could rip the Urantia book in half. That's all right.

[Jamie]

Ripping phone books for Jesus.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

What is this?

[Jay Dyer]

This proves this is why you should say the sinner's prayer. Don't you want to pray the sinner's prayer? Look at what that dude did to a phone book.

[Jamie]

If you don't rip phone books, he might be going to hell.

[Jay Dyer]

If you don't pray the sinner's prayer, he'll rip you in half. Dude, come on down the altar. We've got strong boys. They can rip a phone book in half, perhaps even a Bible. But we won't do that. If you come down to altar, I'll give you a hot cheese pizza. Say the son of prayer. Let football into your heart. Let the strong boys into your heart. By the way, the reason that we're calling it the Strong Boys is because we were watching the Righteous Gemstones and in season three or whatever, they had the Evangelical power team. And Jamie and I were trying to remember what this. The name of this was. Because if you're in the Baptist church, you saw this. We grew up Baptist Evangelicals. Like, you know that, right? These guys come for youth group and then they rip the Bible in half. And we could not remember the name of it. And they're called the Power team. But the power team is cooler than these weirdo. These weirdo dudes, right? Look at that, dude. You got. That dude's doing full John Claw Van Damme right there. He just did a full on blood sport. Literally. Watch this. It's blood sports. I mean, it's. It's j. It's. It's Van Dam blood sports. What I'm trying to say.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Boom.

[Jay Dyer]

Dude, look at that. And then he does a little dance. What's this dude doing with balloons, Dude? He's huffing. He's huffing nitrous, bro.

[Jamie]

He's doing whippets there.

[Jay Dyer]

Why is it going so fast? What are you so. Just blowing up balloons to pop them. I don't understand this part of the power scene. Oh, lung capacity. I was like, what the heck is this? Yeah. And then the power to. Look at that dude's fat. How many? Yes. Oh. They're competing to see who can rip. That's Ibarra's papacy book. He's ripping in half there. He's like, this book is boring as hell, dude. It's just copy paste. Anyway, would you rather go see the strong boys or Elliot to Scream at you about what a man is strongly. It's just so performative, dude. And everything that you see Elliot doing here could have just as easily been an evangelical mega church pastor. It reminds me also, remember when Bill Gates is running up there and they're all doing the Microsoft. Remember that? The meme. You know what I'm talking about. You've seen it a million times. Jamie never knows any reference that I'm coming up with. And then like, you'll get it. Like an hour later you'll realize what I was talking about. This. Everybody made fun of this for when the Microsoft CEOs were doing their dance and Bill Gates is dancing, right? This is to hype you up, right?

[Jamie]

That's how I dance.

[Jay Dyer]

Are you getting hyped up or not? Stop me. Look at Bill Gates dancing, dude. This went viral before there were viral videos. This is like one of the first viral. I'm serious. This. See, it's one of the first viral videos. This is like Star wars kid era viral videos.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and safeway. Now through June 23rd. Shop for you. Save days and get great savings on all your favorite personal care Essentials and earn 4 times points. Shop in store or online and save on items like head and shoulder shampoo, Pantene shampoo, Tresemme conditioner, l' Oreal hair dye, Tresemme Hairspray, and Aussie Miracle curls. And earn four times points to use for future savings on groceries or gas. Offer ends June 23rd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Jay Dyer]

Yes, you can.

[Ryan Seacrest]

A five minute quick and easy calorie burning workout. Give it a try.

[Jay Dyer]

Come join our sweat sesh on TikTok. Okay.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

All right.

[Jay Dyer]

Jamie has done a tremendous amount of research lately on the bizarre realm of tantric, Buddhist philosophy, history and yoga. And so she's going to give us a deep. A deep dive here. We're going to get deep into this, guys. You can still support the stream, of course, with super chats. Super chats are done through streamlabs or natively through YouTube if you'd like. And I will give you the link right here if you want to support us. Of course. I will be splitting some of these super chats with Jamie as well. And we got to be careful. I don't think we'll get anything too.

[Jamie]

Did you.

[Jay Dyer]

Tantric yoga history. Let's. We gotta have some stuff in the background here.

[Jamie]

Did you play the booger whistle song I did earlier.

[Jay Dyer]

Do you want me to play it again. Do you. Would you like to have tantra with this man here?

[Jamie]

No.

[Jay Dyer]

Is this the guy who's gonna instruct us on tantra?

[Jamie]

He's gonna heal you with his magic.

[Jay Dyer]

I think this dude is just trying to get laid. That's my philosophy. So. And I think that's going to be a theme that we have with a lot of the gurus, is gurus are just trying to touch butts. Right?

[Jamie]

Well, that's why I called it Gurus Gone Wild a couple months ago when me and Courtney did that show.

[Jay Dyer]

Let me pull up booger whistle, because I'm sure we're going to play it at some point. So where do you want to start? Because there's a lot of information here, and there's a lot of. We gotta blow our noses here. So we don't have booger whistles. Marks and traits of the cult guru. They do not typically like you doing well. What? They are persecuting me. They do not have sail for eyes to cease. Therefore they must take down what they do not understand. That's that booger whistle, baby. They're energy vampires. That's that booger whistle, baby. I got a booger whistle fleet. They're energy vampires. That's that booger whistle. Do the Bill Gates. Often times, the communal living that the guru demands doesn't match up to the guru who's driving around in a freaking Rolls Royce.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

What?

[Jay Dyer]

How many small got a dang Rolls Royce?

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

What?

[Jay Dyer]

I asked Vision. Last night, the ascended masters came down to me. They says, swami, to get roll Booger whistle, baby.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

They're energy vampires.

[Jay Dyer]

That's that booger whistle, baby. I got a booger whistle fleet. All right, that is the introduction to the new segment where we cover tantra yoga. We're going to get into all of it. Why it came into the west, how it influenced us, us to be where we are, why it's useful to the global elite and the dangerous, spiritually speaking, ideologically speaking, to tantra, yoga and whatnot. And you called it Twisted Yoga.

[Jamie]

No, that's the name of the documentary.

[Jay Dyer]

Documentary. Oh, that's right. We did it. I forgot. We got to do this documentary or we got to talk about the documentary. Vivalaru.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Huh?

[Jay Dyer]

Is that his name?

[Jamie]

Yeah.

[Jay Dyer]

Bivalaru. Is that where you want to start or do you want to get into your. Okay, well, let me pull up the videos on that. So if you don't know, as a perfect test case example, there was a famous Romanian grifter man named Beaver Laru, and he created a tantric culture that's like a almost sort of trafficking, mind control type of thing. And the documentary that we watched was called Twisted Yoga. So here's the trailer for this documentary. Now, we didn't just watch documentary. Jamie's also read several books recently on this topic. And one of those is one that I read, not the entirety of, because it's a very long book, but many years ago, I found a book by the Tremondes, Victor and his wife Victoria Tremondi, on the Left Hand Path and Tantric Buddhism and the Dalai Lama. It's a very fascinating text. It's a good apologetic for this type of stuff. Because most people in the west, obviously, like the Instagram chicks, like, they don't get into the deep philosophy. They just want to be spiritual or whatever. So for them, it's just sort of a fad or a phase or a thing to. I don't go to church, but I'm spiritual. Spiritual, not religious. And this is everywhere, right? And it's been everywhere since the 60s countercultural revolution. Because a lot of that was underpinned with Transcendental meditation, Maharishi Mahesh, Yogi, the Beatles, they all introduced a lot of that to the West. But we're going to start with the documentary that was a lot of fun called Twisted Yoga. It was not my favorite documentary. We had a lot of people in the chat not recommending that we watch it. It's okay. I feel like there are better documentaries. There's some really funny parts in it, though. When this guy ends up going on Romanian national TV and trying to defend himself. That was the funniest part. Do you remember when he. And he starts doing magical breathing because he thinks that he can release energy to the audience watching it and they will receive his love. And. And the dude looks like the most, like, the grossest, just like Kumar, man, you've ever seen. He looks like he runs a prawn shop.

[Jamie]

Like, that's what they are.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, I know, but we're gonna get to that. I'm just saying, like, you could look at this dude until he's gross. Yeah, but all of these yoga chicks are, like, duped by this guy, which is bizarre to me. But it's a Apple TV documentary. I feel like they could have done it all in one. I don't think it needed to be like three 45 minute segments. They could have just done one. It would have been better, in my view. But the last one is the best one. If you. If you do want to watch this, I Recommend the third installment, which is just mainly about Bevalar, who, himself. So let's get into this twisted yoga. Tell us about the story.

[Jamie]

What's crazy about this is that it's not just one guy. It's an entire international federation of yoga schools called Atman.

[Jay Dyer]

Right. So this guy went kind of under the radar because all of the networked schools didn't list him as connected to it, but he was kind of in the background running it, which, yes, in my mind, this does raise the possibility of organized crime or intelligence agencies or foreign funding. And we actually will get to that, because as I'm watching this, like, my suspicions kind of were confirmed because Vivalaru came to prominence during Romania transitioning out of communism and into more of a Western, you know, neoliberal mindset. And that's going to be very relevant to the story.

[Jamie]

Yeah, he came to be famous for teaching yoga in Romania during the communist regime.

[Jay Dyer]

Right. So when they had Ceausescu in there. Ceausescu and the Soviets banned yoga, as well as all the other sort of religious, you know, mainline church practices that you would think of. Everybody knows that. They banned Christianity, but they also banned yoga, which I didn't even know that. But it doesn't. It actually doesn't surprise me because, I mean, if you're an atheist, like, you would obviously not be for Tantric Buddhism either. But that's relevant because ironically, and I'm not pro Soviet or communist, but ironically, the Ceausescu secret service had giant files on this dude, and they already knew he was a scammer. So even though, like, Soviets could figure out this dude is a. Is a scammer, by the way, to the people asking the chat, yes, we've already done several cults like this. We did Teal Swan's documentary on her Till Swan, I feel like you're. I feel like you're not in alignment with me right now. I feel like you're disagreeing with me right now. We did Till Swan's documentary. We did oh, show with Tristan Wild Ball country years ago. We did the Holy Hell. We did Kumare, and we did the Father Yod Family cult.

[Jamie]

And Gwen Shambling.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, we did Gwen Shambling cult. So for a lot of the people asking in the chat, many of those we have done, we might revisit some of them because it's. We're going to revisit, by the way, Eyes Wide Shut next. But it's fun to go back 10 years after you've kind of covered some of this stuff and see what your Appraisal is a decade later. So. All right, so we're in Romania, we got the Soviets. They're. They don't like this dude because he's a weirdo. He's a creeper. According to the Soviet records, he tried to creep on a young girl, like a 12 or 13 year old girl when he was like 16 or something. So they already kind of had. There's. You see the files there? Like they already had confidential files on him as a. They called him a. Just. I think they say it was a criminally insane or criminal. Criminal proclivities or something.

[Jamie]

Yeah. Oh, and I didn't know France had its own cult division.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, so there's. Oh, there's an Interpol dude in the documentary who works in Interpol's cult section because of course, obviously cults oftentimes tie into organized crime.

[Jamie]

So he was on the trail of this tantric master too. And so the documentary is like a couple people's testimonies. Three or four people who went through the whole school of his.

[Jay Dyer]

And then they were one dude and like five women.

[Caller/Guest (e.g., Chris, Posh, Isaac)]

Right.

[Jay Dyer]

And all of the women, by the way, it's interesting you notice the pattern is that they.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Summer is here and the sun is out. Make sure you take care of your skin this summer. Now throughout June 23rd, shop for you. Save days and get great savings on all your favorite skincare Essentials and earn 4 times points. Shop in store or online and save on sunblock from Neutrogena Sun Bum, Hawaiian Tropic, Banana Boat and coppertone and earn 4 times points to use for future savings on groceries or gas. Offer ends June 23rd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Jay Dyer]

Craving something specific.

[Jamie]

From global flavors to viral snacks, TikTok has it all. If you can dream it, you can make it right at home. Find your next favorite dish on TikTok.

[Jay Dyer]

Almost all the ones in this documentary are European or British and they're Australian. I thought some of them were British chicks. Okay. And then there's one dude who's kind of seems like he might be a little skittles. But the women are all like party animals who find partying empty. And then because they're looking for spirituality, they go into this yoga. So that's a consistent pattern with all these chicks.

[Jamie]

And they want to meet God through sex pretty much.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, yeah. All of these women were like, I'm gonna meet God, but like do sex or whatever.

[Jamie]

Yeah. So they are deemed worthy the women and allowed to go into the higher degrees, which is basically just joining this beauty pageant in Romania.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, this was funny. I didn't realize that he was kind of doing the pageant scheme, right, where he creates Ms. Shakti.

[Jamie]

Yes.

[Jay Dyer]

So he creates a pageant to. To be Ms. Shakti. And guess what you have to do to win being Ms. Shakti? Well, you got to show Vivalaru the goods.

[Jamie]

Yeah. But even before that. So when they're messaging these holy men, quote, unquote, to see if they're good enough to go to the higher degrees, the holy men are like show bobs and vaginas.

[Jay Dyer]

You must show your bobs and vagines.

[Jamie]

Yeah, they just want nudes.

[Jay Dyer]

Please show bobs and vegens to see if you're me. Shakti.

[Jamie]

This whole thing is a funnel into a porn collection, into a pageant, into a sex T, R, A, F F for this goober. For this goober in Romania. And there's this giant pageant every year called the Mishakti. And the Romanian coast turns into freaking Panama City with all of these gurus.

[Jay Dyer]

Oh, a bunch of gurus. Come. Yeah, see, I missed this part of the documentary.

[Jamie]

So it's like yogis gone wild down there in Romania on spring break and they have this giant pageant called the Miss Shakti where it's literally just a beauty pageant.

[Jay Dyer]

Okay. For example, here is a 2014 Instagram yoga chick who won Miss Shakti. Here's the Miss Shakti pageant right here. Okay. Every one of these chicks looks the exact same too, by the way. Like they all look like this chick that won it, right? Like this kind of girl. Like you would see her like outside of a fish concert or something, right?

[Jamie]

Yeah.

[Jay Dyer]

I'm thinking that this chick might be a weed smoker. What do you think? Do you think she smokes. She smokes weed or whatever. But again, every one of these people, it's always the same story that they are party girls who are damaged and unfulfilled and then they run off to a yoga retreat center. But the thing is, remember, Bearu doesn't publicize himself on any of the websites. So it's like a, an inner core criminal thing that's protected by innocuous sounding yoga retreat meditation centers. But it gets, it will get pretty insane with like hardcore like mind control, almost like MK Ultra type stuff going on. Go ahead.

[Jamie]

Well, when they get to this villa. So when the Shakti queens go to this meditation healing center retreat where they're supposed to get healed by his magic lingam they make you swear on a Bible not to reveal anything that goes on. So they make you sign all of these NDAs and all of these contracts before they go and take nude photos of you. And you have to answer all of these questions on camera. And they said that all these people are, like, walking around naked all the time. And so he's got this global harem of women from around the world, and they call the pageant the transfiguration.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, here's Ms. Shakti 2024. Do you want to see who she is? Yeah, she again. It keeps being girls from Denmark. So Denmark chicks like you got. Y' all got to get your act together. This is. She's bathing in the bliss here of the. Of the Indian poop. Poop. Water River. What do you mean? It's a totally poop.

[Jamie]

Ew.

[Jay Dyer]

No, it is. What are you talking about?

[Jamie]

Going to Ganges. That's disgusting.

[Jay Dyer]

She's bathing in it, dude. It's mystical. You don't understand. Okay, this year's color theme is green.

[Jamie]

They are not fit.

[Jay Dyer]

It's a lot of mids. Well, that's a lot of mids going on here.

[Jamie]

Five twos equals a ten.

[Jay Dyer]

Yeah, you could go with Will Smith logic, right? Two fives. That's the 10. Well, they didn't even show the girl, but this is supposed to be her here, I guess Ms. Shock, the. Miss Singapore. Okay, well, there's not a lot of videos of Ms. Shakti, but there is this one up here. So. Okay, what else is going on with people?

[Jamie]

So the whole point of this is they call it the Transfiguration, which sounds Christian, kind of. And it's about inviting in the goddess Kali and emptying yourself and letting her in. So we talk. Oh, there's Kate Winslet and Holy smokes.

[Jay Dyer]

I know about that. We got to talk about this. And do not watch it. Do not watch this movie. You are. You have been warned.

[Jamie]

She's way too, too pretty to be messing around with yoga and Harvey Keitel.

[Jay Dyer]

Go ahead.

[Jamie]

Anyways, so this all leads to, obviously, pee drinking and a giant orgy.

[Jay Dyer]

O R G Y. Remember, we're on YouTube here. And, well, the more that we say the note, the naughty words. Because we have to be children over here. We can't say big words. Yeah, we have to speak like children.

[Jamie]

This will all make sense when we explain the history of Tantra. But this is just what's going on in Romania. On the surface, that you can get to these places by joining the Atman

[Jay Dyer]

yoga, but it's not Just Romania. This guy had set up his studios in Australia, the uk. I don't know if there's an American one, Denmark. So it's all throughout European countries. But the weirdest part is that he came to prominence during the transition again out of communism in Romania under Celchescu and whatnot, into the. The liberal free market, neoliberalism. And while that might be good in the sense of now there can be Orthodox churches again, it also opens a floodgate for every freaking cult, right? So all the cults can then flood into the Eastern Bloc countries, which were previously Soviet. And the problem with that is many of the cults also have an organized crime and intelligence espionage component to it them, which we have highlighted a million times over. However, when I watched Holy Smoke, which I didn't really know what I was getting into, this is an old. I think it's a 2001 or two Harvey Keitel, Kate Winslet movie. And you think that this will be a cult deprogramming movie. Right. I thought, what is. I'm watching this. Oh, this is going to be interesting because it's kind of an independent film. It's a little bit satirical. She is an Australian chicken who gets swept up into the, you know, spirituality of yoga and eastern culture. She goes to an ashram in India and meets a guru and decides she wants to marry the guru and live in the ashram, right? And her parents find out about this and they're in a tizzy because they're just normies and they don't know what to do, so they hire her, Harvey Keitel, who's a cult deprogrammer, and his job is to sequester her in a cabin for three days and use his deprogramming techniques to bring her back to sanity. And supposedly he's been very successful. However, we find out that Harvey Keitel, although he may be successful at his deprogramming, he also just wants to bang the chicks. So essentially he's doing the same thing as the guru, right? So the film is sort of making the critique that all of the things that you think you want to save people from, in terms of the guru ashram call, you're going to be doing the same thing in America. So you're all just hypocrites, right? Because Harvey Keitel initially is like, I can out smart this chick. She's just some dumb yoga girl. But actually, ironically, she becomes the. Is it. Who's the evil goddess? Shakti?

[Jamie]

Kali.

[Jay Dyer]

Kali. She becomes an incarnation almost of Kali and taps into her and this Becomes up. This is not, my interpretation, actually comes up at the end of the film. She taps into her, like, mystical goddess powers and actually outsmarts and mentally mind Fs Harvey Keitel, the cult deprogrammer. Right. Meanwhile, you. She, you know, you think, oh, she's going to be trapped by Harvey Keitel. She, you know, arranges the stones into a SOS signal for somebody to save her from the deprogramming. And I won't. I'm gonna go ahead and spoil it because it's. It's really not worth watching. It might sound interesting. It's gross. Because they really want us to see Harvey Keitel doing it with Kate Winslet. I don't want to see that. It was gross. And long story short, Harvey Keitel goes insane and he becomes convinced that actually she was right all along. And he basically goes on this sort of desert walk and he's going to kill himself. He's just walking out in the middle of the desert and they'll and yet back. And he passes out and she rescues him and puts him in the back of a truck because he's about to die from, like, you know, exposure and starvation and whatnot. And then he sees her transfigured as Shiva. Right. Or Shakti. She becomes so. So she ends up being right all along. And all the dumb Westerners are stupid because we're not spiritual and, like, we don't get it or whatever. So it's. It's a bad message and it's a gross movie in the sense of, like, I don't think anybody wants to see Harvey cuts out humping Kate Winslet. But it also has a pretty subversive message. But it was really bizarre. Yeah, because it's an independent film. It's not like a big studio film.

[Jamie]

Well, so the power of Kundalini Shakti Kali is stronger than Western logic and family and patriarchy. Yeah. So this is.

[Jay Dyer]

But here. But here's what's funny that we're gonna learn from Jamie. Guess what? Turns out the goddess spirituality of these Eastern religions actually hates the feminine.

[Jamie]

Exactly.

[Jay Dyer]

And that's what the. The yoga Instagram chicks don't know.

[Jamie]

Right. So all of these Buddhists religions, these Eastern mysticism, Hindu Bon Tantra, Tibet, are extremely turbo misogynist. Like, to the point where it's Jesse Lee Peterson level. It's beyond that delusion. Oh, it's beyond that. So.

[Jay Dyer]

Well, Jesse Lee Peterson thinks women are the gates of hell.

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