Podcast
Listen, Learn & Love Hosted by Richard Ostler
Hosted by Richard Ostler · EN
Welcome to our podcast!
My name is Richard H. Ostler and I am a native of Salt Lake City, small business owner, married father of six with several grandchildren. I believe in and am deeply committed to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and want it to work for a wider group.
I am the author of three books:
“Listen Learn and Love: Embracing LGBTQ Latter-day Saints” published in 2020 available at Amazon (amazon.com/dp/1462135773)
“Listen Learn and Love: Improving Latter-day Saint Culture” published in 2022. The book explores who we can do better to help all Latter-day Saints feel more welcome, needed and a feeling of belonging in our congregations. Available at Amazon (amazon.com/dp/1462139566)
“Listen Learn and Love: Building the Good Ship Zion” released in Sept 2023. The book explores additional topics to help all Latter-day Saint feel welcome and needed on the Good Ship Zion. Available at Amazon (amazon.com/dp/1462145280)
The purpose of all three books is to help us better create Zion by helping more feel welcome, a sense of belonging, and needed in our congregations.
Proceed from the books go the Stockton Power Memorial Scholarship (www.standingforstockton.com) in honor of Stockton Powers a gay Latter-day Saint teenager who died of suicide in 2016. Everything I do is a self-funded labor of love ❤️
I am the author of two Ensign articles:
‘How the Savior’s Healing Power Applies to Repenting from Sexual Sin’ (August 2020/YSA Digital Only) www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/2020/08/young-adults/how-the-saviors-healing-power-applies-to-repenting-from-sexual-sin
‘7 Tips for Overcoming Pornography Use’ (October, page 72) www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/2020/10/young-adults/7-tips-for-overcoming-pornography-use.
This podcast is designed to discuss some more complicated issues in our church to help all of us better “listen, learn and love” so we can minister in a more effective way to all of our Heavenly Parents’ children.
Podcasts are indexed by category at listenlearnandlove.org/podcasts
Thank you for joining us. You can't donate to this podcast. There are no sponsors. But you can leave a review/rate the podcast on the platform you are listening and/or leave a review at Deseret Book/Amazon on my books.
With love, Richard 'Papa' Ostler ❤
Twitter: twitter.com/Papa_Ostler
IG: www.instagram.com/papa_ostler
Facebook: facebook.com/richard.ostler.5
Substack: https://substack.com/@papaostler
E-mail: richard@ostlergroup.com
72episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
Episode 872: Laurie Reese, LDS Mother of Two Gay Children
Mar 2601:00:05Tap to summarizeMy friend Laurie Reese (married mother of five, one grandchild, active LDS) joins us to share her story based on a recent talk she gave in her Ward: * Story of her son Landon and her daughter Hallee coming out as gay * Hallee’s marriage ended. Mother of one. Now engaged to her girlfriend * Laurie’s support for her gay children * Loneliness as some people pull away and don’t know what to say * Melissa Inouye’s book “Sacred Struggle” and sitting in the back seat on the road to Piha * Teaching of Jesus to love those on the margins “Easier to put others in a group and then label them in a certain way and set them aside and dismiss their pain and needs” * We don’t need to use Satan’s tactics (take away agency) to accomplish God’s plan * Questions I ask myself as I better try to follow Jesus * Landon’s difficult seminary experience—how we can do better * Church leader quotes about diversity and doing better * Story of selling a home and heart dropped as a gay couple came to look at the home—and now hoping her gay children will be loved as they move into their own homes This is a super powerful episode with Laurie being honest about the pain and challenges of raising gay children—not because they are gay—but because of the lack of support and understanding for these wonderful children. If you have queer children (or want to be better prepared to raise your future queer kiddos), please listen and share this episode. And if you want better tools to love our queer friends and their families, please listen/share this episode. Thank you Laurie for being on the podcast. I was so moved with your story and spiritual insights. Thanks for all you are doing to build Zion and help everyone feel loved and a sense of belonging. Links: https://www.facebook.com/laurie.v.reese Laurie.v.reese@gmail.com
Transcribe →Episode 871: Candice Bithell, LDS Mother of a Transgender Son
Mar 2001:00:02Tap to summarizeMy friend Candice Bithell (married mother of three, active LDS) joins us to share her story: Candice’s backstory Bones (her transgender son) coming out at age 13/14 Parable of the Lost Coin as her spiritual lens Powerful insights into the Lost Coin Parable to support Bones Difficult experiences on Bones journey—anger, self-harm, etc… Love as the foundation of her approach to support Bones “My love is bigger than your gender” Attending Pride Events—including bringing glowsticks—powerful experience of love and acceptance Close and loving family—beautiful family love story This is one of the best podcasts we’ve done for providing insights (both doctrinally and from a parent’s perspective) into loving and supporting a transgender child. If you are looking to better understand and support the transgender people in your life, please listen and share this podcast. Thank you, Candice, for being on the podcast and all you are doing to help us all better love and support the transgender people in our lives. You have a beautiful family. Links: Candice’s Wayfare Article: https://www.wayfaremagazine.org/p/glowsticks-and-parables Candice’s Substack: https://substack.com/@cbithell
Transcribe →Episode 870: Douglas Williams, OCD and Scrupulosity
Mar 1700:57:01Tap to summarizeMy friend Douglas Williams (President of the Real OCD Club and the Un Alone Club at BYU; dual-major at BYU, RM, MTC Teacher) joins us to share his journey with OCD and scrupulosity: Understanding, managing, and accepting intrusive thoughts—not a sign of worthiness Thoughts don’t have anything to do with our character Undiagnosed scrupulosity entering mission field (repeated confessions to Stake President) Difficult start to mission, medication, things got better (still misdiagnosed) Coming home from mission, going off medication, and crashing Finally got a correct diagnosis—path to healing Importance of Exposure and Response Prevention Therapy Ego-syntonic thoughts (line up with values) and ego-dystonic thoughts (don’t line up with values)—super powerful distinction Invitation to join the Real OCD Club at BYU (focused on OCD) Invitation to join Un-Alone Club at BYU (focused on solving porn use) If you are working to understand and navigate OCD in yourself or help others, Douglas’ podcast will help you. Douglas—who has a gift of great communication—does an excellent job of helping us all better understand OCD/Scrupulosity and how to solve these mental health challenges. Links: Real OCD Club at BYU on Instagram: @readocdblub Un Alone Club at BYU on Instagram: @un.alone.byu
Transcribe →Episode 869: Gracee Purcell, Lesbian Latter-day Saint, Recent BYU Grad,
Mar 1300:53:46Tap to summarizeMy friend Gracee Purcell (BYU Psychology Grad, President of RaYnbow Collective, Activist, Engaged to be Married) joins us to share her story at BYU: Why she choose BYU Advice for other queer people considering Church-owned schools Roommates (mostly positive) Interactions with BYU administration Interactions with BYU professors Work of “RaYnbow Collective” to support queer BYU students Insights on the concept of “Safe Places” Thank you, Gracee, for being on the podcast and all your bridge building work to make this world a better place. You are doing so much good in our community and have a great life ahead of you. Congrats on your recent engagement. I encourage everyone to listen to and share this episode. Links: RaYnbow Collective Instagram: @raynbow.collective
Transcribe →Episode 868: Bruce Butcher, Lost Son Taylor to Suicide, God’s Love/Hope For All of Us
Mar 901:01:02Tap to summarize** This episode talks about suicide. If you are suicidal, please call/text chat 988 ** My friend Bruce Butcher (late 50s, married father of three, active LDS) joins us in a powerful episode to share the following: Loving and accepting people in his life who are no longer in the Church “We don’t punish a man for his beliefs” Losing his wonderful son Taylor to suicide in June 2024 Taylor’s prayer “bless the sick and sad, help us to be the best versions of ourselves” Painful doctrine the Church used to teach about suicide—led to no hope Love of a mother is the most powerful force on earth Love of our Heavenly Mother is the most powerful force in heaven—she isn’t going to cut off any of Her children Excluding people is not Christ’s doctrine David Archuleta—“I’m still a fan” Being a cafeteria Mormon My apology to my LGBTQ friends I deeply loved listening to and learning from Bruce. If you are looking for more hope in your life, be more like Jesus, and love/accept people walking different roads, please listen to and share Bruce’s podcast. Thank you, Bruce, for being on the podcast. You are a good man—helping so many. I’m so sorry your good son Taylor is gone. Love Taylor's heart as reflected in the words of his prayer.
Transcribe →Episode 867: Heather Sorensen, Grief of Losing Her Daughter Hannah at Age 15, New Book
Mar 501:02:04Tap to summarizeMy friend Heather Sorensen (married mother of 4; grandmother of 14, early morning seminary teacher), joins us to share her story of losing her daughter Hannah in a traffic accident at age 15 in 2013. Heather talks about the initial and continued grief of her death and how she is navigating both holding her grief and her testimony of being with Hannah again. Heather talks about a dream she had before Hannah was born and that feeling returning during Hannah’s death. She also talks about losing her son Richard at birth. Heather talks about not being active in the Church for twenty years and her journey to return to the church and the importance of creating her identity rooted in Jesus Christ and invites us to do the same. Heather talks about her son Zachary’s cancer diagnosis during home MTC, fear she would lose another child, and Zachary’s recovery and serving a mission. Heather talks about why she decided to write a book about Hannah—called Dandelion Blessings—which is Hannah’s nickname. If you are looking for a genuine/honest story of intense grief—and finding hope/peace to move forward—please listen and share Heather’s podcast and book. Thank you, Heather, for your courage and vulnerability to be on the podcast. You are helping so many! Links: Dandelion Blessings (at Amazon): https://a.co/d/0eK9OYGy
Transcribe →Episode 866: Dr. Mark White, Being an Ally, Book: Indigo’s Baptism
Mar 100:54:59Tap to summarizeMy friend Mark White (professor, LMFT, aspiring ally, mid-60s, active LDS) joins us to talk about his new children’s book—which is focused on an 8-year-old’s decision about being baptized in the context of having two gay dads who attend church with her—and what we can do to be better allies/advocates to queer Latter-day Saints and their families. Mark shares the following: * Journey to be an aspiring ally/advocate * Clinical experience * His publishing company (Firefly Inkworks) and new book, Indigo’s Baptism * George Gerbner’s cultivation theory * The power of stories * Representation matters * To be seen * Future books * Need for all kinds of queer stories, including narratives for a book on LDS Trans and gender nonconforming persons Mark invites a discussion about how we can be a better ally/advocate (friend, parent, local leader, etc.), including asking our queer friends to let us know what they need and indicate whether we truly are an ally/advocate. The children of queer LDS parents are essentially invisible in LDS culture. Mark hopes Indigo's Baptism is a small step in increasing representation. He desires we use all the resources available to better support our queer friends. And if you are queer or have queer parent(s), Mark prays his work will give you hope as he talks about his love for and support of the queer community. Please contact him if you are interested in publishing a book or are willing to contribute a narrative to the book he and colleagues are working on that focuses on the needs and stories of current or former members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints who are trans and gender nonconforming. Thank you, Mark, for being on the podcast. You are making a difference. You give me hope. Links: Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61587754991132 Mark’s publishing company: www.fireflyinkworks.com Etsy store where you can buy Indigo’s Baptism: https://www.etsy.com/shop/FireflyInkworks?ref=shop-header-name&listing_id=4459276962&from_page=listing Instagram: fireflyinkworks Mark’s e-mail: fireflyinkworks@gmail.com Mark’s outline: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/awvy653dh8ubvi44uxcyb/LLL.Podcast-Outline.Indigo-s-Baptism.Feb-2026.pdf?rlkey=2b6fn8xxu4e37iiiqvexk6c20&dl=0
Transcribe →Episode 865: Eliza Riggs, RM, Bi-Sexual Latter-day Saint, Non-Traumatic Queer Faith, Powerful Story
Feb 2601:13:28Tap to summarizeMy friend Eliza Riggs (age 22, RM/Orem Utah, UVU Student) joins us to share her story including: Great Parents, Queer Friendly Home Came out first to her Heavenly Parents—positive experience Felt lots of pressure to fit in the Church as a Bishop’s daughter, wasn’t working, difficult chapter Joined girl’s high school wrestling team—“saved my life” Youth conference and surprising thought to serve a mission Mom buying her rainbow sheets before coming out to her Being called to Orem, Utah (initial disappointment—but then powerful revelation) Great experience coming out to her Mission President Coming out to her parents—super positive Her queer identity is celebrated in heaven Thank you, Eliza, for your courage to share your story which will help so many. You are awesome. Honored to have you on the podcast. Encourage everyone to listen to and share this episode. Links: Eliza’s Instagram: @elizariggs31
Transcribe →Episode 864: Richard Ostler Episode on Tate Arnold’s Over___Soul Show
Feb 1901:48:21Tap to summarizeI was invited to be on my friend Tate Arnold’s show (Over___Soul) to share my story. I’ve posted that show as Episode 864 on our platform so you could listen here. Thank you, Tate, for letting me be on your show. You are a good man doing great work! Please check out and follow Tate on Instagram @Over___Soul
Transcribe →Episode 863: David Archuleta, New Book: Devout
Feb 1500:32:23Tap to summarizeIn one of our most important episodes, David joins us to talk about his new book “Devout—Losing My Faith to Find Myself”. In this episode, David talks about his journey with God to find his path forward as a queer Mormon considering suicide—a path that led David to separate himself from the Church—taking God with him—and live authentically. David gives excellent advice to younger queer people and parents to better support queer kids. I conclude with some of my thoughts on continuing to love and support those that leave our Church (not making them the hero on day for staying in the church and the villain the next day for leaving) and thanking David for his many years of service in the Church and the countless lives he has blessed. Thank you, David, for being on our podcast and your courage to continue to share your story. You are one of my heroes—you continue to help so many find hope in their lives. I encourage everyone to listen/share this episode and consider what we can do to better support our queer friends. Links: David’s New Book “Devout”: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FJJGJSB6 David’s Book Event in SLC on Feb 24th, 2026: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/david-archuleta-devout-tickets-1981202876135?aff=oddtdtcreator#location David’s Facebook: www.facebook.com/davidarchuleta/ David’s Instagram @davidarchie David’s TikTok: www.tiktok.com/@davidarchie David’s Twitter: x.com/DavidArchie David’s YouTube: www.youtube.com/channel/UC75d1FNP1qR0lCY1usRKQEw
Transcribe →