LPN Deep Dives: HOSAB / Episode 4: Livin' on the EDGE

Summary

Podcast Summary: LPN Deep Dives: Crescent City – Episode 4: Livin' on the EDGE

Release Date: July 1, 2025
Hosts: Natalie Jean and Jackie Zabrowski
Podcast: LPN Deep Dives: Crescent City by The Last Podcast Network

---

Introduction

In Episode 4 of LPN Deep Dives: Crescent City, hosts Natalie Jean and Jackie Zabrowski delve deep into Chapter Four of Sarah J. Maas's acclaimed adult science fiction novel series, Crescent City. This episode, aptly titled "Livin' on the EDGE," offers listeners a comprehensive analysis of pivotal plot developments, character dynamics, and emerging themes within the narrative. The hosts seamlessly blend their personal anecdotes with insightful commentary, providing both entertainment and depth to their discussion.

---

Plot Recap and Analysis

Cormac Donal's Arrival at Rune’s House Party

At the heart of this chapter lies the dramatic entrance of Cormac Donal, a charismatic yet antagonistic figure from Avalon, into Rune Danan's opulent house party. Natalie and Jackie recount how Cormac's sudden appearance introduces tension among the main characters, particularly impacting Bryce Quinlan and Hunt Athalar.

[14:50] Jackie Zabrowski: "We're at chapter four, and we are getting to this other new character who we met last week a little bit. A1 Mr. Cormac Donal. Who is he? Well, let's find out together."

Confrontation and Engagement Proposal

Jackie describes the confrontation between Cormac and Bryce, highlighting Cormac's declaration of an arranged union between Bryce and himself, orchestrated by their fathers—the Autumn King and King Einar of Avalon. The hosts emphasize the tension this introduces, noting Bryce's resistance and Hunt's restrained fury.

[27:35] Jackie Zabrowski: "He steps closer to her in this moment as she's kind of stressing about everything that just happened. And they come close to kissing, but instead he just snatches his hat back off her head like they are in eighth grade, knowing now wasn't the time to take the kiss."

Character Dynamics and Development

Bryce Quinlan and Hunt Athalar's Relationship

Natalie and Jackie discuss the evolving relationship between Bryce and Hunt, especially in light of the new challenges posed by Cormac's intervention. They highlight Bryce's growing assertiveness and Hunt's complex emotions as he balances his protective instincts with his burgeoning feelings for Bryce.

[31:23] Natalie Jean: "Yeah, Hunt crazy."

Cormac Donal: The Antagonist's Motivations

The hosts delve into Cormac's backstory, exploring his motivations rooted in heritage and power dynamics. They touch upon his strained relationship with Bryce's father and the implications of his arrival at the party.

[38:55] Natalie Jean: "I just think it’s fun to sprinkle in a couple theories."

Themes and Insights

Power and Heritage

A significant portion of the discussion centers around themes of power, heritage, and the burdens of royalty. Natalie and Jackie analyze how these themes are intricately woven into the characters' interactions, particularly focusing on Bryce's struggle with the expectations placed upon her.

[22:00] Jackie Zabrowski: "I think maybe that is because there's royalty in these books. And it is a sort of mention of how royalty kind of is in Earth side, which is there's a lot of distant cousin kissing or supposed to be kissing."

Fan Theories and Speculations

The hosts engage in spirited speculation, discussing popular fan theories such as genetic mating and the significance of the star sword in Bryce’s destiny. They ponder the potential romantic developments between Bryce and Cormac, and how these might influence the overarching plot.

[24:34] Natalie Jean: "Same, which is why. And why the star is being. Is so It's. It's a fan theory."

Writing Style and Narrative Techniques

Multiple Points of View

Natalie and Jackie commend Sarah J. Maas for her adept use of multiple points of view (POVs), noting how this technique enriches the storytelling by providing diverse perspectives and deeper character insights. They draw parallels to Maas's work in the Throne of Glass series, highlighting her growth as a writer.

[62:04] Natalie Jean: "And we actually see that also play out in Throne of Glass where because over the years she wrote that series, towards the second half of the series, she's doing the same thing in Throne of Glass as she is in Crescent City."

World-Building and Lore

The episode also touches upon the expansive world-building in Crescent City, discussing the integration of various mythologies and the intricate lore that Maas crafts. The hosts appreciate the depth and complexity that these elements add to the narrative.

[65:31] Jackie Zabrowski: "So we're with him in this chapter and. And we're in his thoughts as he's on this tiny boat caught in the stormy, turbulent sea, which is not where he usually is."

Character Spotlight: Tharion

A notable segment is dedicated to Tharion, a mer-character from House of Earth and Blood. Natalie and Jackie explore his motivations, relationships, and the challenges he faces, particularly his quest to find Sofie Renast and Emil. They discuss his strained relationship with the River Queen and his internal struggles, adding another layer to the complex tapestry of Crescent City.

[73:21] Jackie Zabrowski: "And the river queen's daughter fell in love with him, and then he was like, honey, you should have gotten to know her a little bit more."

Humor and Personal Anecdotes

Interspersed with their analytical conversations, Natalie and Jackie inject humor and share personal anecdotes, particularly related to cosplay and their experiences embodying the characters. These light-hearted moments provide a balanced listening experience, making the deep dives both informative and entertaining.

[38:53] Natalie Jean: "I can say that I'm a river queen."

[75:46] Jackie Zabrowski: "I do want to have a band called the pseudo penises, but we don't know."

Conclusions and Future Expectations

As the episode wraps up, the hosts reflect on the intense developments in Chapter Four, expressing excitement and anticipation for the unfolding plot. They commend Maas's ability to intertwine personal growth, complex relationships, and high-stakes drama, leaving listeners eager for the next installment.

[82:15] Natalie Jean: "I'd love that."
[83:21] Jackie Zabrowski: "We'll talk about this in a little bit more as he breaks the story down. But I'm not necessarily. Not on River Queen's side."

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Jackie Zabrowski [14:50]: "We're at chapter four, and we are getting to this other new character who we met last week a little bit. A1 Mr. Cormac Donal. Who is he? Well, let's find out together."

• Natalie Jean [22:00]: "I think maybe that is because there's royalty in these books. And it is a sort of mention of how royalty kind of is in Earth side."

• Jackie Zabrowski [38:55]: "I just think it’s fun to sprinkle in a couple theories."

• Natalie Jean [62:04]: "And we actually see that also play out in Throne of Glass where because over the years she wrote that series, towards the second half of the series, she's doing the same thing in Throne of Glass as she is in Crescent City."

• Jackie Zabrowski [73:21]: "And the river queen's daughter fell in love with him, and then he was like, honey, you should have gotten to know her a little bit more."

---

Final Thoughts

Episode 4 of LPN Deep Dives: Crescent City offers a thorough and engaging exploration of Crescent City's Chapter Four. Through their dynamic conversations, Natalie and Jackie provide valuable insights into the characters' motivations, the intricate plot, and the underlying themes that drive the story forward. Their blend of humor, personal anecdotes, and deep analytical prowess makes this episode a must-listen for fans of Sarah J. Maas and enthusiasts of the series alike.

Listeners are encouraged to tune in for future episodes, where Natalie and Jackie will continue their deep dives, unraveling more layers of the Crescent City universe.

Transcript

[Natalie Jean]

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[Jackie Zabrowski]

And you can too.

[Natalie Jean]

Join us in spring of 2026 at the Dreamers and Readers Festival. A three day event chock full of choose your own adventures.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Multiple Fae balls, fashion shows, photo shoots, Hoteez, everybody at least fear 15 different events at the otherworldly Gaylord Texan resort that you can customize to make the perfect trip fit your Fantasy Dreams.

[Natalie Jean]

Visit fantastiquecollection.com and use our code Faybayes at checkout to receive $10 off of any of these events.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Dreamers and Readers Night 1 and 2.

[Natalie Jean]

Mythical creatures Masquerade, Fantastique, Starfo Ball and the Farewell Fae Bash.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Not only that, but if you use our code fayebays at checkout for those events, you will receive an exclusive, exclusive swag bag from the weekend.

[Natalie Jean]

I'll do anything for a swag bag, Natalie.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Swag. Give it to me.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes, that's right. Use our code faybays F A E B A e [e-mail] to get your $10 off of any of these events.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Dreamers and readers. Baby, I cannot wait for this.

[Natalie Jean]

Gimme, gimme.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Give me that.

[Natalie Jean]

Swee. Welcome to Crescent City with your hosts, Natalie Jean and Jackie Zabrowski.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I heard about you just doing a show. You tell us when you do shows sometimes.

[Natalie Jean]

No.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Would you prefer it to be secret creator?

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay. Yes, that's fair. That's totally fair.

[Natalie Jean]

Valid especially. I was trying out something new, so I wanted to actually. I mean, I guess this is off my conversation. It was actually really great to perform for a whole crowd that didn't know who I was.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, my challenge, like it was. I had to win them over, but I did. And it was just like one of those that I was like, I forgot this muscle. And I was like, yeah. I was like, that's what I wanted. Yeah. And so it was. So that's why I didn't tell anybody. Because I Was like, I just kind of want to see if I. I mean, Jeff was there, but it was like, I want no support. Yeah, no, he did smile.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He what? He stood in the back with his arms crossed and shook his head.

[Natalie Jean]

You're bad. You're bad at it. But, yeah, I do forget sometimes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's so. That's awesome, dude. I know. I very much get that feel, and I think that that would be a very good challenge to have.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Gotta win em. You gotta get em.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's why we're now out on YouTube. We gotta get you new ones in there.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Suck you in.

[Natalie Jean]

Come on over.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You're never coming out again.

[Natalie Jean]

You're trapped in our snail shell.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's not necessarily the best introduction to me dressed like this because I do look like a villain.

[Natalie Jean]

I am very scared of you, but also, I'm gonna say it, low key, sexually attracted.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Thank you. I was a little concerned about how into this outfit my husband was.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, interesting. I don't want to think about the fact that Henry and I both love a stern woman sometimes, you know, just don't want to think about that.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, you know what was very funny is that when I came out, he said, oh, you look a little Elsa. She wolf. Which is the reference I made on the show that she did not know.

[Natalie Jean]

That's great. I love that. Means you're mfeo. You're made for each other. I do completely understand because the character that I just did, which, of course, it makes sense, it's just not a style I usually wear. I purchased a Morticia dress. Like a full, absolute Morticia dress. And I came out and my husband was just like, I. It was like I watched his eyes pop out of his head, and he was just like, where did you get that? And I was like, oh, this Morticia dress.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

This is this.

[Natalie Jean]

But it is kind of great when. Because here's the thing, you know, Jeff will see pictures of me dressed as Cormac or, you know, where I also look like a little Charlie Bucket. And, you know, that's not really seductive that I forget if he was into.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That, I'd be like, wait, Jackie, we need to have a conversation with your husband.

[Natalie Jean]

I guess I'd be proud of him. I'd be like, yes, gang, you know, own your worth if that's what you're into.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You know, like a little boy woman.

[Natalie Jean]

But also like a murdering mother. Thank you very much. Yeah, I think it was also like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

A little bit of that medieval mommy.

[Natalie Jean]

But, yeah, it's kind of nice that I Forget that. We can cosplay. I mean, I am wearing an evening gown right now.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I know. This is. This is a. You had one for one of our Fae Ball appearances. You're wearing that gown, which I love. We love Reusing, reducing recycling.

[Natalie Jean]

I re.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Wear my dresses all the time and you look sick. Honestly, this crown is killing.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, my God. Thank you so much. It is a seashell crown. And yeah, I'm really. I'm giving river.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You are giving river.

[Natalie Jean]

Ocean. I know.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You could be the ocean. Ocean Queen. We haven't met her.

[Natalie Jean]

I know we haven't met her yet. But like, this is. I'm. I am. I guess. How do you give river and not give ocean? I. Maybe I should be mossier. Do I need more. What is it? Yeah, but then that's seaweed and that's ocean. I don't understand river life. Can someone sticks at me?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I know someone.

[Natalie Jean]

Tell me about river life.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You need. I know fish swim upstream sometimes.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes, yes. Salmon kings.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I think if you're a river queen, you need a lot of like, rusty beer cans. Because there's a lot of floating along rivers.

[Natalie Jean]

You damn right. Oh, yeah, actually. Oh, yeah. I wonder if she stops a gator. Because there ain't nothing like, oh, man.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Are gators in the river.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, in Florida, when you go tubing down rivers, there's usually. You can usually see somewhere there'll be a gator chilling somewhere. And then you just. Oh, I don't like taking a gravity bong hit out of the river. And you're like, just Logan over here, man.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Florida just is somewhere else. Wild, isn't it?

[Natalie Jean]

It's wild. It is a place that is fun for a time. I tell you what, it can be fun. But then you wonder why you run away. Run away. And I think that we all know a couple of reasons why maybe sometimes we run away. Run away.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I think we could find a few news articles about it.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. But I think it's just because of like, you know, bath salts and it's only bath salts.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, that's it. Otherwise, great.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, otherwise everybody's fine with what they are and are not allowed to read. I think it's good. Put us in a box.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm so tired of thinking about stuff.

[Natalie Jean]

It's like here, you know, it's like sjm, you know, It's. It's scary for people to feel and to connect. I understand. Get rid of the books. Get rid of the books.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, wow. You're being a real lake queen.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I'm a in height 420.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

There is no Lake Queen because who needs to. Lakes with no moving water.

[Natalie Jean]

All the bugs. But what about the big.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm not a lake person.

[Natalie Jean]

But about the, the big.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The Great Lakes are great.

[Natalie Jean]

Interesting.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's why they're called that. But they have. They have ocean waves.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, because they're so big. Oh, they have ocean waves.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They do.

[Natalie Jean]

So maybe the lake.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I have family that lives on Lake Huron. Okay.

[Natalie Jean]

Is that the best of them?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sorry?

[Natalie Jean]

Which one's the best?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I don't know, but Lake Huron's beautiful and it's super clear.

[Natalie Jean]

Huron. Lake Huron. You get your diggings and then get the slippins.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Diggins and sluggins and.

[Natalie Jean]

You know, I, I think that. I was thinking of the muck sometimes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

There's no muck in it. There's no muck in Lake Huron. What do you mean?

[Natalie Jean]

I thought lakes were all muck.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, no. Lake Huron has like a sandy bottom.

[Natalie Jean]

It's great sandy bottom lake.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But the lake that my family actually lives on, which is a man made lake right off of Lake Huron, is manslaughter.

[Natalie Jean]

I only woman made lakes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, this woman that. Women should have never touched this lake as a child. Women have never touched this lake as a child. I used to swim barefooted in this lake. And a leech. I think I've told the story. My uncle had to burn a leash off of me with a cigarette. That is my 90s, huh?

[Natalie Jean]

Back when a kid could be a kid.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Parents barely paying attention.

[Natalie Jean]

Definitely drunk man. And the amount of grape Tylenol chewables I would eat, I was just giving them just for. I feel like I. I think I just like them like they were candy and always be like, my belly hurts, my head hurts. But it really was all a way to get more grape chewable Tylenol.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's the. It's the. You know, the price you pay for making medicine taste good.

[Natalie Jean]

This is what we get, you know. Then the kids need the diamond tap bears.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's why I make milkshakes out of Pepto Bismol.

[Natalie Jean]

Good for you. Never have a hurt belly again.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, can't see there's any problem drinking a whole bottle of Pepto Bismol on weekends.

[Natalie Jean]

No, I don't think. I think that the chalk is good for your body. I think that's what they say, you know, I think it's like a stone. We're not going to talk about doctor things here, all right? I don't know anything. Obviously. I know nothing about bodies of water. I don't even know how to swim. And this is irl, Jackie. I'm not talking as the River Queen, because if I was being the River Queen, I hope she knows that as well.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

She's a. She's an elemental. I think so. I think she is the river.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Thanks.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Mm.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, I am some sandy bottom either.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I am not a good. People always say I look like a dom. I'm not good at it, though.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, man. But you do look like a Nazi she wolf.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, very much so. Again, that's. I think I have to reiterate. My husband does not. Is very anti bigot. I think it's because I look like I'm also at a goth nightclub from 1985.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. Yeah, you do. You definitely look like the one that got dragged there by all the other ones that were, like, you know, sucking back the ski slopes up through their nose, and you were just like, yes, I will go with you. And then you soften and then in time, like, all of a sudden, like, oh, your hat's kind of falling off. And, oh, your pants fall off.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Whoa. I thought I was one of those dancers at the club that's sort of like dancing but, like, not smiling at all.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, that's usually how you dance. No emotion whatsoever. Honestly, I feel like. I do feel that if you did that at Henry, that this would be foreplay. And so I am worried about looking at you.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, don't look.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know how you. The idea of sexuality is introduced in your relationship, and I'd like to keep it that way.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel like that's healthy for our family relationship for us.

[Natalie Jean]

See, but it's good we talk about these things. And I hope everyone out there is talking to their in laws about sexuality, talking about their sex life.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Safe words.

[Natalie Jean]

Especially when everybody reads the same smut every. I mean, y' all know my mom now reads the same smut. It's. It is. You gotta learn how to navigate conversations. Talking about plots. And man, there is a lot of plot in these books. Thank God.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I support talking to your elder generations about the sex stuff. I cannot.

[Natalie Jean]

I cannot. I don't know how to do it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I can't do it.

[Natalie Jean]

I know some people are really good at it, and God bless you.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, goodness. But neither of the characters we are right now are in the chapter we're starting with. However they are in the book.

[Natalie Jean]

I am also. I do have the Cormac wig threatening us from off to the the side.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I love it. Obviously. Was it big Hit with the listeners, everybody, man. Oh, no. People. Are you kidding? People love it.

[Natalie Jean]

It was. It was. I mean, now you see, at least it was given bucket, but I think it was adorable. Thank you. Yeah, thank you so much. Yeah, it really, man, it really did wonders for my self confidence.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, why?

[Natalie Jean]

I mean it in a positive way.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay, good.

[Natalie Jean]

Because I looked like a murdering queen. And I also looked like a b. Tch. That can burp their way down from a fan.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

My most awkward wig. I looked the room. What's his name? From the room.

[Natalie Jean]

Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's not fun. What's the fuck his name?

[Natalie Jean]

Tommy Wiseau.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I look like Tommy Wiseau in my awkward wig, man.

[Natalie Jean]

We have a great signed paint, like a picture that Jeff had made of Tommy Wiseau by Tommy Wiseau. And he asked who he wanted to make it out to, and he said, oh, you don't need to make it out to anybody. And he just wrote Tommy Wiseau loves Tommy Wiseau on it. And that's apparently how he signs his things. And that makes a lot of sense.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I quite enjoy that.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Good for him.

[Natalie Jean]

Also, I saw him one time, and I apologize if I ever told you this story, but we didn't know who this person was in this huge white Hummer and the hand sticking out had a cigar, and I think like three rings on every finger. I've never seen so many gold bracelets on a hand before. And I was like, who is this? And then we pulled up and it was Tommy Guiseau Drive. And I was like, that makes a lot of sense. Only in Los Angeles, baby.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

California.

[Natalie Jean]

But to be fair, he was just at the con that we were at, so it wasn't like, oh, he was just there for no reason.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I don't think he goes places except for when people are going to pay.

[Natalie Jean]

Him to do it. Yes, I think that.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You know what?

[Natalie Jean]

I think that's it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's the life.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, I feel like it's like, you know, you're an Angelino when you're talking about seeing Tommy Wiseau and Jay Leno. Baby. When you see Jay Leno multiple times a week. Ah, only in la, baby.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's almost like, go home, Jay Leno.

[Natalie Jean]

Maybe, or, I don't know, don't protect yourself. Jay Leno just keeps, like, falling down hills.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, he's driving all these. Okay, we got to talk about.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, do we have to.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay, we're at chapter four, and we are getting to this other new character who we met last week a little bit. A1 Mr. Cormac Donal.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Who is he? Well, let's find out together. Yeah, he does have a very Irishy.

[Natalie Jean]

He's got a bit of a brownish. He's got a bit of a sounding.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Name that I guess maybe that's who he's supposed be to. To. Maybe we're supposed to visualize. I'm not sure. Yes, we're with Bryce and she.

[Natalie Jean]

I think it's because of, like, the island aspect. Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, I think so. That it's like, UK Ish.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We're with Bryce and she's wondering why her star started glowing at the sight of the stranger, which is no good, because we're kind of getting the idea that it shines around Hun Hunt.

[Natalie Jean]

So why is it shining right now? Man, that's got to be such a. It's like a fun mystery. But I'm so glad I don't have something, you know, like a hernia that pops out every time I get. You know, I see Jeff, and every time I'm just like, oh, God, I gotta put this hernia back.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Like when you. Your love is shown.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, I mean, also painful.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Imagine if your. Your love language was you, like, being doubled over in pain.

[Natalie Jean]

I know. Or like. Yeah. Or a hemorrhoid popping out and you're just like. Oh, yeah. Don't make me. Lance.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Don't make me think about holding right now.

[Natalie Jean]

So it was. It. Was it the hernia or the hemorrhoids? Either from hernia to hemorrhoids, the whole story. You gotta remember to tell him this.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

All right, it's clear Bryce has no idea who this guy is who's just shown up at this party. If you'll recall, we're at Rune Danan's house. He's having a big old house party. All of them. The main cast. Oh, yeah, I was. The main cast is all with us, and they have come across this dangerous threat. This big void is open in front of the house, and they all get into their hero positions, and then this jaunty little dandy man comes out.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, did you see him as that? Because I saw him as a brick wall of a man. He is.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But now, because I'm. Now I'm just cartoon. I'm sorry for the British people out there. Now I'm just going like, oi, hello, Mary Poppins in him.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, you're Poppins in them? Does that mean you're gonna dance with penguins with him? Is that what they do? Is that that movie?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yes. Neither of you have seen Mary Poppins, Right? It is a classic. Disney. That is a fantastic.

[Natalie Jean]

I know, it's good. It's one of those, you know, I hear that Sound of Music. I feel. I'm like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I know I had.

[Natalie Jean]

I know they're good.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Show Henry Sound of Music for the first time. And it is an amazing movie and you would like it if you'd watched it.

[Natalie Jean]

I don't know how we've just missed out on, you know, I don't know why. I don't know why we missed out on those, but every, you know, horror movie made from 1988 to, like, 1999, we probably watched.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, yeah. We all miss some of those kids movies. We all miss. There's a handful I've never seen in my life. So it's clear Bryce has no idea this man is. He is a blonde hunk, though.

[Natalie Jean]

And remember the one that was here a couple of weeks ago, guys?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, yeah, that was a couple weeks ago. But Ruhn seems awful familiar with this character, and he asks this blonde hunk what the f he's doing here. He's described as ruggedly good looking with light brown eyes in an accent Bryce describes as rolling and rich. Again, kind of playing into probably Irish, Scottish somewhere. He draws that he was invited, that he then looks at Bryce and looks her over and comments on her appearance, stating that she looks better than he expected. And we're immediately just like, who are you?

[Natalie Jean]

Who are you showing up in a portal at this party that we're having.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And objectifying Bryce while my star is shining, who just saved the entire city. I guess that doesn't matter.

[Natalie Jean]

Squeeze.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Just because she has exquisite breasts.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. So maybe it's good. You look like Charlie fucking Bucket.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. Ruhn looks pissed, but not overly afraid of this outlander. What the fuck are you doing here, Cormac?

[Natalie Jean]

Ruhn ground out, stepping closer. But he sheathed the star sword down his back. Once more, the blonde Cormac faced her brother. He sniffed once, then chuckled.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You smell like cunt.

[Natalie Jean]

That is not. That's not what he sounds like, Natalie.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, I can't keep that voice up the whole time. So.

[Natalie Jean]

Natalie. No, you're very good at it, though. I very. You're right, Joshly. Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

British ish.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes, I am. That. That's not where my brain is. But now that it is, I. I feel like. Well, I guess I want to. Pinocchio.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yes. You smell like cunt. Kind of. This grosses Bryce out, obviously, because that's her brother.

[Natalie Jean]

Like. Yeah. And also it's like, what an intro. Line. Cormac, Come on.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So we can see that he is being very disrespectful, as at at the very least, the males continue to bicker and not acknowledge Bryce. Cormac makes it clear he knows run's friends, too. So there. There is some recognition between most of the parties here.

[Natalie Jean]

Interesting.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And he calls Tristan Lord Hawthorne, presumably because he knows it would annoy the. The trio. The boys. The FA Boys. So this guy is being, again, antagonistic towards them. But why?

[Natalie Jean]

But why? And also to show up at somebody else's party again that you' throwing barbs the moment you come in here. Oh, my God.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Somebody needs attention, I guess.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I guess so. Big, thick man.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

She can tell by his accent that he's from the island of Avalon, which likely meant that he was trained to be a warrior of sorts, because I guess they train a lot of their males out there on that island.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay, tell me more.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And we saw that map that was commissioned by the fan of the books. And we see, like, Avalon's actually this very small island kind of to the west of the big continents that we're usually on. Just a nice visualization for me. Cormac notices Bryce eyeing him and tells her that he, Cormac, is her cousin, which, gross. Because of what we're about to reveal.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. But also, you know, royalty.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I think maybe that is because there's royalty in these books. And it is a sort of mention of how royalty kind of is in Earth side, which is there's a lot of distant cousin kissing or supposed to be kissing. And these keep it in the family line, which is a very, you know, sort of cool. Yeah, yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

And like. And, like, fun.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Like, sort of a. Like, elitist slash gross. Weird. What's it called? Ethnic. Like, it's sort of saying, like, only our bloodlines are the pure.

[Natalie Jean]

Keeping them pure.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, it's gross. And also just like.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, so there ain't nothing pure about Zabrowski blood. I will say. I don't think anybody wants to see whatever that would make.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Almost all of my DNA comes from, like, a very small section of the uk, and so probably there is a bunch of cousins in there. You know what I mean? Back in the day.

[Natalie Jean]

Whoa. Well, I know that we came from a very different place, so at least you know that your husband is definitely not one of your cousins.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, I don't think we. I mean, beyond. Beyond us all being, you know, from the same cluster of people originally. I don't think we're very related at all.

[Natalie Jean]

Adam and Eve.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yes. Adam and Eve.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. Good. I just love being the rib of a man.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm a rib. I'm but a rib of the man, which is hilarious to me. As I say on my other show all the time, everyone is conceived as a female whenever the egg is fertilized. Yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

Sly bit, ye.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

If you believe life begins at conception, then you're all fucking girls.

[Natalie Jean]

Whoa, Mic drop. Sorry, Mic drop. So you're not a Zeit goat, you're a girl.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. So he's kind of being sexual towards her and also being like, I'm your cousin. So he goes on to explain that though he's related really more closely to Ruhn through his mother's kin, which is not Bryce's biology. They have trace ancestors through her father also. And Bryce is stunned when he uses Bryce's bio father's name, which we only know as the Autumn King. And his name is King Einar. Einar.

[Natalie Jean]

Einar. Einar, I believe, is if I remember the audiobooks at Einar. Bryce blinked. Her mother had never once spoken the Autumn King's name, and Bryce had only learned it through the news when she was old enough to use a computer. Man. You know you hate somebody when you have never said their name.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's interesting, too. Like, do you think that that is alluding to something else? There's a reason why it's got to be.

[Natalie Jean]

It has to be. It has to be. There has to be. There it. Right. I feel like SJM doesn't do shit like that for no reason.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Right.

[Natalie Jean]

And usually.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And there is a fan theory. I don't think this is a spoiler because there's been.

[Natalie Jean]

No, it's just a fan theory.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Fan theory. But that they are mated and that it's one of those, like, genetic mates where you can't but help but be drawn to each other. So maybe, like, that's why she's the.

[Natalie Jean]

Same, which is why. And why the star is being. Is so It's. It's a fan theory.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's a Van theory.

[Natalie Jean]

We don't know.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We don't know. Oh, I meant actually the King. Inar and.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh. Oh, and Ember. Oh, definitely. That is. I mean, I feel like that is a rumor, but I feel like it has become such a big rumor that it's kind of. There are certain ones. It's really crazy for the people that are out there, like, in the booktok world of it, that really just makes so much sense that it's like, it's got to be.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's unfortunate that we are also like, we're part of this community, but whenever there's fandoms of stuff and they create entire side things for the characters, and then I feel bad for the authors because then they're kind of beholden to all these insane people who are like, no, that's not correct. And like, she made them up in her head.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, she.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They're. She.

[Natalie Jean]

They're hers. They're hers.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So we just.

[Natalie Jean]

I just. We. I just think it's fun to sprinkle in a couple theories.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I do, too. I think that there's a very healthy way to do that, and then sometimes people take it a little bit far. Yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

It's like when you only eat one bag of twin snakes instead of four bags of twin snakes. Because yesterday I went to go buy a bag of twin snakes. It is gummies, and they are one. It's. One snake is sour and one snake is sweet. And they are connected to each other. So I really like chewy fruity.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm glad that you explained this, because that did not.

[Natalie Jean]

I just needed you to know. And it was just so. The angel at the register was like, oh, you're only getting one bag of twin snakes. I said, I really should. And she said, but they're buy two, get two free. And I was like, I mean. I mean, if you're gonna tell me I should buy four bags of twin snakes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Did you eat them all?

[Natalie Jean]

No. Just one.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay.

[Natalie Jean]

I did eat one.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel like you would have a sick belly.

[Natalie Jean]

It's the problem with you, all the steaks. Because the chewy fruity. You're like, I could eat it forever and ever and ever. And then you eat too much.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

And then you'll hurt your belly.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. No, I agree. I try to not always have those in the house because they are easy to eat. And then. Then it hurts.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. And doesn't fill you up until you're sick.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Then you're sick.

[Natalie Jean]

Oops. I'm like a dog. Don't give me too many twin snakes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And then she eats the throw.

[Natalie Jean]

Yep. And then they throw it because, I mean, what, am I gonna waste the money?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Look at these snakes right here.

[Natalie Jean]

This. I mean, the snakes are. How much are they broken down at that point? They're made out of what, horse hooves? Oh, yeah. Man. They hoove those snakes into the little moles. Oh, stop it. So they're good at their jobs, Natalie. I'm giving them jobs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I know. So what's this about him never being named? Rune asks Cormac for, like, the fifth time, why he has literally darkened their doorstep. Get it? Because, like, he darkened it.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He did Hunt now and is now enraged at the disrespect towards Bryce. And he has his lightning sizzling a clear threat to the new fae.

[Natalie Jean]

Yet Cormac smiled. His dead eyes gleamed with nothing but contempt as he bowed mockingly to Bryce.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm here to meet my bride.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, no. Oh, no. What you talking about? Who bride?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Who bride?

[Natalie Jean]

Bryce?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Bride?

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, man. Oh, no.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We cut to Hunt's POV at this moment. And he feels like the wind has just been knocked out of him. Bryce, on the other hand, takes the approach of laughing hysterically like you do sometimes when you hear an insane thing and no one joins her. Everyone else is sort of stunned.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

She just asks him what in the actual hell he is rambling about. And Cormac informs her that her bio father and his bio father, the High King of Avalon, have negotiated a union. We are too progressive in Lunathian to be doing this.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Hunt wills his lightning to crackle along his shoulders and wings as he stands aside Bryce. Which is pretty hot, bro.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh my God. Drenched in lightning. Please give it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

To defend his woman.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, my God.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But Cormac only sneers at them. Another sneery sneer sin we got here.

[Natalie Jean]

He is a sneer boy.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Biting out that Bryce is to be handled. Between the men in charge, we finally see Fury, who has reappeared and is also strapped now.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So she has, I think probably dropped Juniper off somewhere safe and then gotten her weapons. Even Cormac looks a little worried at the sight of Fury, who has a reputation far and wide because she's a mercenary. A very scary. I love Fury too. Cormac eyes the Star sword behind Rune's back with interest.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Noting that Bryce is said to have power over it as well. So he's kind of eyeballing their big strong stars. The sword. Because that is what Rune 1 in his ordeal. And also now we have learned that Bryce has this star power and can also handle this special sword that only Star Star people can.

[Natalie Jean]

You know, the starboard.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The starboarden. Bryce at this point has had it and perhaps to a fault, is not intimidated by these blustery men.

[Natalie Jean]

She ain't taking no shit from nobody.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sometimes to like a point where she puts herself in danger.

[Natalie Jean]

But sometimes that I wish that it's.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Like, you know, if you could use think back, think. But she doesn't. And I do also admire that she tells him to beat it and that she's not marrying him. Take that ever good one. Cormac expresses admiration at her quote mouth, which pisses Hunt off in an entirely different way. But he restrains his rage and zaps, knowing the fallout if he attacked a prince would be catastrophic.

[Natalie Jean]

Fae were highly sensitive babies. Their tantrums could last centuries. Which, of course.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. You don't want to start a land war.

[Natalie Jean]

No, no. Especially with someone that is presumably. I mean, as at this point, we know royalty, it's like you don't want to start. And especially Hunt was literally. We were just told if you guys could just keep it easy, that everything's gonna be fine. I mean, we know obviously they ain't gonna keep it easy, but especially right now, it's like, you're gonna do it over this.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They've got some hysteria eyeballs on right now.

[Natalie Jean]

Y. Time. Hunt.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No. And he does. He holds himself back.

[Natalie Jean]

I know. Because. Oh, yeah. He knows how to control.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He can restrain himself. Even though he could destroy Cormac, he doesn't. Yeah, I definitely. You said you felt more for Rune this time around of reading that. This time doing this. I'm much more like, oh, I get why people are Hunt.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, Hunt crazy.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So defiant as always. Bryce tells him to get out of her brother's house and allows her starlight to brighten. Hunt is sort of titillated at this, but also is sort of wondering what will happen if she releases her full star power now that she's made the drop. None of them know what will happen now because since this has been released and she made the drop, the hysteria were immediately like, okay, you can live, but don't you dare ever use all of the huge amounts of power in your body. And we're gonna keep you alive for some reason.

[Natalie Jean]

And she's like, totally. Like, I'm definitely never gonna use all the power that I have in my body.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

This magic horn in my back. Like, I can't even see it.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, it's. Yeah. And I totally can control it. Like, yeah, I definitely know when it's going on and how to make it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's fine. Don't worry. So Hunt is sort of like. He's. He doesn't want her to sort of take this power on, but he's also kind of like, turned on by it. He looks at Ruhn to gauge his reaction to all of this and is sort of surprised to see that Ruhn is also glowing with pride at his sister. Like, he has welcomed having her as a comrade in arms. Like, he also doesn't want Bryce to pop off right now. But it's like, fuck yeah, girl.

[Natalie Jean]

But also. And they're on the same side, especially after years of not really seeing eye to eye, that it's got to feel. Feels so good. Coming full circle from where they were at the beginning of the last book.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

For sure, Which I love. He doesn't want to be like, you have to go hide in the closet while we take care of things. Because she doesn't want to do that. Cormac only smirks at the crew because he's gonna smirk and sneer and tells them thanks for the confirmation that Bryce has the power after all. And so he basically had goaded her into doing this for himself and that he'll see her later at the altar when they are getting married.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, that's so annoying.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So annoying. He falls back into the darkness.

[Natalie Jean]

It's so hot. And it's so annoying for you to say.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So annoying. He falls back into the darkness from whence he came. And the doorway turns to normal again. Bryce's star also blinks out when he leaves, which is. What does that mean? Does Hunt have some kind of competition?

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, God. Is this what we need right now?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, no, we don't need any of the things that happen in this book. And yet even all of them.

[Natalie Jean]

But like, Bryce and Hunt ain't even banging yet. So it's like imagine all of this while also feeling this pent up sexual energy for someone. I feel like I destroy the house with my horniness, you know, and anger.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

In this reread for all this. This stuff. It edges, but I forgot, once it goes, it kicks up overdrive, so don't you worry.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, yeah, baby.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We cut to just a little later with Bryce. And Cormac has really killed the vibe at the party. So everyone's kind of filtering out of Rune's house. He's sort of like, parties over. Guys, this is. We gotta take care of whatever this was.

[Natalie Jean]

Once a portal opens, I guess the party's gotta end.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Party lights are up to the brights again. It's the end of the night. Nobody ever likes when that happens. When the lights come on, you're like, no.

[Natalie Jean]

And then you hear the closing time.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Which I have not been to probably in 15 years. But.

[Natalie Jean]

What? Closing out a bar? It's been a minute.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's been a minute. But Bryce is only thinking about one thing. Getting her mom the heck out of town before she hears the news about Bryce's apparent engagement. Because Ember's gonna pop up.

[Natalie Jean]

Amber go, Papa.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Amber's gonna turn into a whole forest Fire.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, dude.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Fury has threatened to hunt down anyone at the party who was present who dare leak the news about what just happened.

[Natalie Jean]

I can't imagine if Fury ever threatened me, I would turn into silly Putty.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And everybody agrees at the party?

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. Yes, ma' am.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yes, ma' am.

[Natalie Jean]

Anything you say.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

If you needed to punish me or something.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. It would be so bad.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So everyone is afraid of enough of her that they comply and they like to delete photos. And basically, Fury says, if I hear single, I will track you down if I find out you leaked something about this. So it's only a matter of time, however, before the news spreads in one way or another. And Bryce wants to be a few cities away from Ember when that happens. So now Hunt and her are sort of tasked with figuring out how to get her parents out of town. Because if you remember, they were there for the ballet. Not to mention she needs to get Ember away from the Ottom King.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

In case she tries to go burn his house down or something.

[Natalie Jean]

I. You know, can you only imagine? Oh, the fury of a mother scorned. Oh, you don't want to scorn a mother, especially one like Ember. That's for damn sure.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Who's a feminist and will not be wanting to have her daughter sold off to somebody.

[Natalie Jean]

I also love that Ember is a human being and that, like, I love that she's still. Even though it's not like, oh, because she's gonna come in with her, like, shape shifting ability or she's gonna come in with her lightning or she's gonna come in, it's like, nah, I'm just like, regular mom scary member. Like, she is just like, because she loves her child. And that is sexy scary. All in its own right.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Being mother is its own superpower.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, my God, it is. I've heard they pick up cars.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

There's definitely a Facebook ad of that shirt somewhere.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. Woman in total control of herself, yourself.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The remaining crew all gathers around the foot of the staircase after the last revelers leave the house. So we now have the main cast. They're the ones left at runes. The mood is a bit soured from this evening's surprise. Run's face is unreadable to Bryce, so she broaches the subject. I take it that's the cousin from your ordeal. The FA boys all confirm. Yes, it is. Cormac was a part of Rune's ordeal, something we learned about originally in Chapter 16 of House of Earth and Blood. Though he wasn't named Bryce recounts Ruhn's tale of his ordeal in that first book, which entailed entering somewhere called the Cave of Princes, where he retrieved the Star Sword even as his, quote, hateful cousin had tried to stop him by any means necessary. So we have learned of Cormac through mythology and storytelling, but we. This is now this guy. He's the guy who tried to get the Star Sword before Rune, Tristan and Declan were there with all of them, offering a sort of mirror to the Bat Boys, reaching the peak of the Illyrian. Right.

[Natalie Jean]

You say it very interesting.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The Fae boys recount to Bryce and Hunt the story again here, adding that Cormac might be so salty and partially.

[Natalie Jean]

Because he's from an island.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

From an island. He doesn't like being on a boat. Because of salt water. Because of the ocean.

[Natalie Jean]

I can say that I'm a river queen.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. Oh, whoa.

[Natalie Jean]

So you don't have insult. Yeah, I don't have salt. So that's why I'm.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's not a body.

[Natalie Jean]

You're judging. No, I'm judging. Whoa.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I don't think you can say that.

[Natalie Jean]

No, I. I feel like the different bodies of water would be against the other bodies of water.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, we learn a little bit more about the relationship in the chapters coming up.

[Natalie Jean]

We'll see.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So, yeah, he also. He wanted the Star Sword. He assumed because he had some heritage connected to Star Powers that the sword was gonna call to him. And that Rude got it Instead, makes him a little baby brat about it.

[Natalie Jean]

Get over it, bitch. Not yours. You're not strong enough.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Ruhn glumly points out that Bryce actually probably has more claim to the Star Sword than him and that it's technically hers too.

[Natalie Jean]

I know, but, like, you know, you got it. Like, you went through all that and he's like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, he's not being passive aggressive about it.

[Natalie Jean]

No.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He feels in himself that he's not good enough and that he's proud of his sister, but is like, you know, technically, this is your. Like, you have more Star power. And then Bryce and Hunt make some very dorky jokes about splitting custody that are very cute because you can see their bond really growing.

[Natalie Jean]

He got her her humor, her fears, her hedging, whatever it was athelarc got her.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I mean, you should be dropping your panties, I think.

[Natalie Jean]

Dude. Yeah, let him fucking get that then. Dude, come on. I know. It's good. It's nice. I know you say he's good with the hedging, but I think he's good with the fucking edging. And I think that he is doing a very good job with being very patient. Yeah, she should be.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

She's salivating for him.

[Natalie Jean]

I know. And I, I. It's a strength then it's. It's fun to play with.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sure. Bryce, as we said last, I think, last episode, just tell your partner that it's a fun game. You're not gonna have sex for 60 days.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, it's sexy. It's so sexy.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They will love it. Yeah, they will love it. So Bryce walks towards Ruhn to take his whiskey out of his hand to take a swig, and can't help but notice that when she gets near to him, the star sword starts to hum. She's like, oh, I'm sure some. Some other reason that happened. Some other thing I can't think of right now.

[Natalie Jean]

Let's change the subject. Let's change the sun.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Ruhn then talks into her mind with his mind speaking skills that he has, basically telling her that it's okay. The sword calls to her. And we know he means that real men aren't threatened and emasculated by strong women. Nothing.

[Natalie Jean]

And that's why, of course, Ru Na, babe, you just like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You do know it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

And he even treats Bryce with just the utmost respect as well, which is just.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's what a real man is. Those red pill bros are the saddest people on this weary earth.

[Natalie Jean]

Damn right.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And we know Ruhn is the polar opposite of that.

[Natalie Jean]

Damn right.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And when she balks at the offering, he gets a little annoyed, almost insinuating that he's kind of insulted that she would think his ego was so fragile. Which is fair because she is sort of dancing around it being like, well, I don't want to take this away from you. And he's like, I'm not. You don't need to worry about that.

[Natalie Jean]

Right. I'm strong. You can. Like. It's not. I'm not saying, but I also feel like if I were put into Bryce's situation, and oftentimes a lot of us are socialized to be people pleasers. I feel like it's also like a. You got it. It's your thing. I'd rather not shake the boat. Can we just.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's like if you suddenly made ballet your personality.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Which. Which I'm glad, because I was gonna bring this up today. I was like, natalie, I need you to know I have started stunting too.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I. Actually, the thing is, I would be thrilled by that. I would be so excited.

[Natalie Jean]

What if I started doing backflips and like. And then I'm. Everyone knows that I'm made to do aerial work. And they'd be like, I've been waiting for her to swamp.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Are you kidding me? I would be so fucking excited that somebody else do with me.

[Natalie Jean]

This is like, whenever I find out someone watches Sister Wives, I'm like, like, you, you, you. Also me. I. I don't know what to say. Where do we start?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It should be me as somebody who's doing so much LDS stuff from my other show, but I have. I don't go down Sister Wives path, really.

[Natalie Jean]

They. I. And also, I feel that a lot of them left the religion. Yes. So it's really. I think that they've gone off.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They're also a side. There's a side branch of the main LDS church in the first place. And it's like, there's a whole. There's a whole thing there. Yeah, I.

[Natalie Jean]

And they're always buying houses and selling them, though. And I just feel like apparently that's.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Like, they all flip.

[Natalie Jean]

Where's the money? I don't know if anybody knows this, but apparently there's like, a lot of money in that. And something like, you have to, like, have all the money and then you can make even more money. I don't know if anybody's heard about this, but, like, apparently that's what they do.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You should do a money course in this costume, please.

[Natalie Jean]

I'd be like, well, not that I need you. Like, I'm gonna go. I'm in the character.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I don't need a house.

[Natalie Jean]

But you do. Yeah. Like, it's like my shit's made out of shells. And hopefully a motherfucking otter got on that shit, because I ain't making it myself. I know that they're busy giving their messages, but also, if you could make.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

A bitch make a house for me. I'm the River Queen.

[Natalie Jean]

I'll take one big shell, like in Little Mermaid. Like, I'll do one of the. Like, I'm the pearl now, dog. And that's what I would say every day when it opened.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That'd kind of just be like living in a coffin.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, okay. Well, I guess that's good for you.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. I've watched enough now Interview with the Vampire that I'm ready to at least. I mean, I have to fuck in a coffin at least once. I don't know. Like, I. I guess you got to get like a double wide. Like, if they sell them double wide mount.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You mean with the. With the door closed.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, when the sun is up, what else are you supposed to do, Natalie?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

How about just in an open coffin?

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, but then I feel like I'm at a wake. You know, rather than being a vampire.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You don't feel like you'd be buried underground if the coffin lid was closed.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, but, like, in this fantasy, I'm a vampire, so it's really where, like, I rest. Like, that's my relaxation.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Hey, listen, I ain't trying to take away kink.

[Natalie Jean]

If I get rid of the bed and move in a coffin and I don't tell Jeff, it would be fun. It would be funny. I don't know if he'd appreciate it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You both couldn't sleep in it, so.

[Natalie Jean]

I'll get a double wide. I'll get it commissioned.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay, so what?

[Natalie Jean]

So anybody out there? If you could commit. If I could commission.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, actually, there is a furniture company that I'm hopefully gonna get something from at some point called Haunt Cult that does make a coffin bed. Haunt Cult, Guys. See, they have amazing furniture, and I'm very hoping we're. We're gonna buy something from them at some point. But they make coffee beds.

[Natalie Jean]

I. All right, I see this. Like, now that's a reason to have a kid.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm kind of upset you haven't complimented my torque this whole time.

[Natalie Jean]

I love your. I thought you meant twerk for a second. I was like, well, show me. I can't compliment it if we're not looking at it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You haven't seen my twerk.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I've seen, man. Natalie's always. She's like, when, you know, the music is pumping, the butts be bumping, and she goes, I can't work pretty good. I'm sure you can. I know that you can. It's just not usually something you're doing in front of me for me. And I am questioning why you don't perform for me more often.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Just can't cross those lines.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I guess that's what it is. And I. You know, I know that I've been watching a lot of Love Island. I just feel like that I can handle seeing it and separating myself.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay. All right. All right. Right. You got it. Right after we record.

[Natalie Jean]

When in Villa. I tell you so.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

When?

[Natalie Jean]

Six days a week.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Natalie, no.

[Natalie Jean]

Six days a week.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I do. I refuse a week. Refuse to talk about Love island, so.

[Natalie Jean]

But she's just. Man, she's gotta get out of the villa. But sisterhood. Sisterhood might be toxically ruining Love island.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

This season, but I'm gonna take this episode Back home.

[Natalie Jean]

All right, we'll take it. You take it back. It's just like, when in river.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

When in river. I don't know what that means. Is that a Love island thing or a river?

[Natalie Jean]

No, that's a river.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay, great, great.

[Natalie Jean]

So thank you for asking, though.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

She bugs at this, he gets insulted.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But she makes a joke about Cormac and how Runes earned the sword from having to deal with Cormac.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, he went through the ordeal.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Right. And they all move on. The group all agrees to look into any legal loopholes they can find that will allow her to decline this marriage.

[Natalie Jean]

Love this.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I wish she didn't have to find a legal loophole. But it's not much better in America.

[Natalie Jean]

But also, like, them's the royalty breaks. Like, I. I mean, I have currently been reading Spare Prince Harry. Spare. And it is called Slog. And I feel that it's like, you know, they're. Yeah, yeah, I said it. I feel that, you know, there are lots of things that they are forced into doing that it's like. Well, I know at this point in the book, you're not thinking like. Like. I mean, Cormac also doesn't have any choice over this.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Do we know right now, though? We don't know.

[Natalie Jean]

We don't. But it's like the way he's talking about it says if the men that are in charge of both of them, like, now reading back, it is interesting that it's like the men that are in charge of both him and Bryce have made this decision, but for sure, I know we're not thinking about that yet. I'm just saying that, like, royalty, man, they got to deal with shit we don't got to deal with. I. They are all. A lot of them are still very evil.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, yeah, because you have to make them do special rules so we can pretend like they're different people from us, thus being able to just be special. Yes. Magical.

[Natalie Jean]

Chose it, right.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And then so they have to be like, well, you have to cross your ankles every time you sit. Because then people will realize that you're just a person. And for some reason, you're given trillions of dollars in power because that you were born, man.

[Natalie Jean]

Have you ever sat with your ankles crossed in the way they teach it in the etiquette class? In A League of Their Own, quite literally.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, I don't.

[Natalie Jean]

I'm trying to do it right now. And I can't even get both. Like, my thighs are too juicy. That, like, I can't even get both, like, feet Flat on the ground when I cross my ankles like this. So I guess I'm just not made to be a lady.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You're too sexy for it.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Because I made. These knees are made to be open like a barn ungroundly. Yep. I think about it all the time.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Same.

[Natalie Jean]

So, God, when are we going to get into etiquette classes? Natalie, I think it's time for us to learn how to be real women.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We're tumbling backwards in time right now.

[Natalie Jean]

I think it's time we may need to. We don't know how to be a real woman yet. And I think that once we learn how to keep both those fucking heels on the ground when you are crossing your ankles then maybe we like like transcend into a greater level of.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We won't want human rights anymore.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Okay, cool. Let's give it a shot.

[Natalie Jean]

Tired of wanting it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm tired. I don't want to try anymore. So. Just kidding. This group will look into the legal loopholes. Lunatheon is progressive, relatively speaking. But the ways of the Fae are still quite archaic in many ways.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean they've been all around and they are alive for so long. Of course, they're steeped in traditional for sure.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Bryce steps outside to get some fresh air. Hunt of course, right behind her. So she walks out of the house. He questions her about how she's feeling. And Bryce reveals that she sees all of this as some kind of 4D chess that her father is playing. That it's not just about, you know, royal traditions. That he's playing some game that she can't figure out yet. And why exactly that the engagement isn't as surface level as it seems. Nothing is as surface as it seems with the Autumn King.

[Natalie Jean]

Can't trust him. Can't trust his turtlenecks.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No. You don't know what's under those secretive neck throats.

[Natalie Jean]

No. And is it hickies? I don't think it is.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I mean they do Run does insinuate that he walked in on him post coitus at one point. I think it's Run or Bryce. So yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

So he be banging.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I mean he's supposed to be incredibly good looking.

[Natalie Jean]

Of course he is. And it is like man. I really thought though growing up up that you really only wore turtlenecks if you had hickeys. Like I thought that that's what like if you have a turtleneck on then you definitely have hickeys. Like I feel like that was from the moment I heard about.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's a lot of like pop culture. Stuff, probably.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. And I think it's also because I had such a fascination that I was like, I want someone to chew on me to such an extent that I am bruised by it. But again, that was a young person's thought. I don't, I don't think I've had a hickey in 15 years. Like, I feel like it's.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I don't ever had a hickey.

[Natalie Jean]

Really?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah, I wasn't.

[Natalie Jean]

So I'm a bruisey baby, though. I, I, I bruise easily. I just wasn't getting chewed on.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No. Not in high school.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, no, no. Oh, yeah. No, I meant. No, I meant 15 years ago in my 20s. Because I'm old, Natalie. I wasn't talking.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You were getting hickey in your 20s.

[Natalie Jean]

I thought it was, I thought it was hilarious.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That's. I'm not, I'm not on it. I'm just. That didn't happen for me.

[Natalie Jean]

No. But now looking.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I guess I'm not delicious enough.

[Natalie Jean]

No. I think that for me, it was way more a problem with my self esteem. And I needed everyone to know that, like, I do get it, and I will get it. And I think it was a much more sad choice.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, I'm sorry. And I didn't mean to bring up your traumas, Natalie. Actually, you brought me.

[Natalie Jean]

You did this. You did to me. I'm going back in the river and you never remind me of the. And it's gonna be made out of us. Andrew's gonna come.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The LA river is pretty much a dry tunnel.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So if you go in, I'll just come get you.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Because I'm just gonna be laying there flapping on the ground, being like, help me, help me. Help me, help me, help me.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So Bryce sighs and tells Hunt that she'd been really enjoying the simplicity of their summer. And that's gone now because they had, after the spring, had had a few months of just being kind of. Of just domestic, and they were getting to know each other, and she was really enjoying it. And now, obviously, that is no longer the case. Now there's this other thing that they didn't know was gonna happen. She asks Hunt whether he thinks that her father planned the timing of this to coincide with the news of the new archangel, whose name is Celestina, coming into town, perhaps to rattle them both for some reason that they don't even fully know about, that maybe he was banking on Hunt attacking Cormac, and in doing so, giving Celestina a big grand gesture at the beginning of her tenure to get rid of Hunt for his insolence.

[Natalie Jean]

So, like, torture him or, like, use it, like, especially in the last book of, like, as an example. Like there's. Because of course they're gonna try and see if they can get it out of him.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Because at this point, the Autumn King can't override the asteri, giving their blessings to Hunt and write as a couple. And so now he has to kind of try to maybe trick them into fucking up so that Hun would get out. Because he doesn't want Hun around.

[Natalie Jean]

Don't you have other things to do?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He's always by himself, just looking at. He's turning knobs and like stirring potions.

[Natalie Jean]

It's like there's something else out. Can you, like, look into, like, you know, female heart disease? I'd rather you.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They never do that. They never do that.

[Natalie Jean]

Please take your time and invest it in a way that we could really use. That would be probably just sitting there.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Trying to figure out how to make sure gay people can get married.

[Natalie Jean]

It's like, oh, good. Oh, I'm so glad. That's why you're. You're wasting your time.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You saved us all. So as she mulls all this over with him, she calls her and Hunt a team, which seems to affect Hunt.

[Natalie Jean]

And that's just because they're robbing so insanely. Like, oh, team of what?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But also emotional.

[Natalie Jean]

No, it's nice.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He's like. Cause he's never really had that even. And we'll talk about that more in the book. But even with. With Shahar. With Shahar, he was not really a teammate with her. She was the. The boss. And he was in love with her.

[Natalie Jean]

He has been controlled for generations. Like he. For hundreds of years. And Bryce gives him a freedom, which is crazy to think of the umbra mortis as not having freedom ever.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, that's sort of almost him reversing gen. Like sgm reversing gender roles. And it's interesting to have put on.

[Natalie Jean]

A guy character and such a masculine character too, that like it. I. I like that she does play with this. And it is crazy that, like, I know obviously, I'm not saying in the last like 10 years, but like, in the world of fantasy, that has definitely not been the case for very long.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Right.

[Natalie Jean]

You know, so it's fun.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. And the last, you know, diff. Obviously different now in this generation, but prior to that there wasn't a ton of that.

[Natalie Jean]

Especially think about, like Dune, you know, what mean? Like, I feel like you wouldn't find. I know I know we, the wives of people that are obsessed with Dune. Yes, we know how to reference Dune. But I will say, very interesting how, like, Oscar Isaac could do no wrong. You know, it's like that he was in charge, even though the Benedict.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

All of the old fantasy epics that I also really like were steeped in patriarchal beliefs.

[Natalie Jean]

But you're. But Bene Gesser do have. I shouldn't even. I shouldn't even be talking about Dune right now because I can't feel Henry in the back of my head being like. But you're not talking about. I know. I know. I'm not talking about.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I actually think he wouldn't disagree with you because there is. There is a misogyny to a lot of those. And it's just because it's based probably on the time period they were alive and that, you know, because even the.

[Natalie Jean]

Bene Gesserit need him. Like, they need, like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I mean.

[Natalie Jean]

Right? Don't get me into Dudes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We can go into how that all connects to biblical stories if you want, but we.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, shit. Rib. I know. Rib. I can see. Ribbon. I know. I made from a real. Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And I'm the reason we can't beat a nude right now.

[Natalie Jean]

Sorry. Yeah. Because every time before we record, I'm like, natalie, today, can I be nude now? And she just keeps saying, no, I ate the apple. Oh, sorry.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I wanted to know information. And that's bad.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. And I just want to be like, goop. Taking off my shirt and making breakfast for my honey.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Goop.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, don't worry about it. Yeah. It's Gwen, all right.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sick of her. So he steps closer to her in this moment as she's kind of stressing about everything that just happened. And they come close to kissing, but instead he just snatches his hat back off her head like they are in eighth grade, knowing now wasn't the time to take the kiss. Because they're waiting and there's, like, a lot of bad stuff happening.

[Natalie Jean]

They're very good with their boundaries. I'm very proud of them.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Bryce tells him, screw it. I'm not going to worry about the entire world tonight. We just need to figure out how to get my mom on the dang train. And that's taken one step at a time, and I think that's good.

[Natalie Jean]

Gotta get her out of there.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They go back to a joking tone, and she begins to guide him away from runes and back towards their apartment, suggesting they watch some trash tv, make plans to sabotage her parents.

[Natalie Jean]

One of his wings brushed along her Back in the softest of caresses. Every inch it touched lit up like first light.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sounds like a normal Tuesday night.

[Natalie Jean]

I just love that. I love of just like. They're just having a regular conversation. But then it's like, don't touch me. Don't look at me.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

One of his balls rushes along her leg.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Just.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. I mean, you know, the second the balls touch your leg, I'm just like, get me to it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Give me them balls.

[Natalie Jean]

Give me them balls.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

They stroll back. Get the stick out of here. I need to get in the balls. They stroll back. And though Bryce has been joking, flippant, her thoughts are dark, wondering how she can handle this new kick in the balls.

[Natalie Jean]

Balls.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

As they enter the elevator to their place, she's considering telling her mom that she. Hey, you. You have to go because I have a job offer. Jesba. You know how you want me to work somewhere else? She needs something and maybe have a job there. And as she's having this thought, they come face to face with her front door from the elevator. And she sees it's not fully closed.

[Natalie Jean]

I just feel like, how do you ever leave your house ever again? If you. If there was ever a moment in time that you left the house to go out and get drunk and you came back and I'm talking about last book, and you come back and all of your friends are ripped to shreds in your apartment. How do you ever leave? Like, how? I don't know if I could ever process that. And then you come home and you see that I think that, like, my bot. I would go into a panic attack. Can you imagine? No, I'd flip out. I. I wouldn't be able to control myself.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But then you have to put it into the context of her being pursued by demons constantly. And then you're like.

[Natalie Jean]

I guess she's, like, used to it. I guess.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I think it is the level of the amount of trauma is that you just kind of blends in. Maybe.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So. Yeah. But no. Exactly. I mean, she does have those moments of being returned to that night all the time in the first book. I think we're maybe supposed to watch her growth or her feeling of security with. Not because of her partner. She doesn't need the man, but she feels a level of peace because of having these relationships in her life. However, not a great feeling, probably to come and see the door ajar.

[Natalie Jean]

No.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And she sees it's not fully closed. And you know what fresh hell this is.

[Natalie Jean]

Syrinx was barking inside. And Bryce lunged for the door. The memory of another night washing red over her senses. Now as then, the scent of blood was a coppery tang in the air in the hallway, on the threshold of her door.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So she is actually going.

[Natalie Jean]

She's feeling it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Hunt cuts her off physically using, you know, using his might to get in front of her, to try to protect her, to analyze the threat before she walks face first into it.

[Natalie Jean]

Violence written in every taut line of his body, his raised wings. Surprise flared in his dark eyes, and then he lowered the gun. Bryce beheld what was in the center of the great room and swayed into Hunt with relief and shock. Yes, the gods had clearly formed a how to fuck over Hunt and Bryce task force. Inside lay Ethan Holstrom, bleeding all over her pale wood floors.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Whaaaat? So just as we get with this book, a lot of the time we are going to in another pov, jumping to a whole nother part of Crescent City, of the world of Midgard. We are going to get into a lot of other side stories that are kind of also important to the core story. It's not necessarily even side characters, but.

[Natalie Jean]

This is really when it starts to like burst out there of like, oh, this bitch is playing with perspectives now. Like, I feel like way more than in the first book that she really does start to, and this shows even more as the next two books go on that I like that she starts playing with more perspectives. I love getting more into the heads of the other characters. It really builds out the world so much more. I feel like she learned like, I think now having read Throne of Glass between when we read Acotar, like, because Natalie and I read Acotar and then Crescent City and then Throne of Glass. And now having read Throne of Glass, it's interesting to see how much she has grown as a writer that she started playing with this stuff in this second book.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And we actually see that also play out in Throne of Glass where because over the years she wrote that series, towards the second half of the series, she's doing the same thing in Throne of Glass as she is in Crescent City, which she started much later in her career. So she you watch that progress happen in the other series too. It is a familiar face we're with in this new pov. And this is a bit of an intro into how the rest of the series is going to go. Grander scope, more plots. I again, like you just said, personally enjoy it. It can be a bit maddening whenever though you're at an almost climax in a chapter and then goes to Another part of the world.

[Natalie Jean]

We get there, definitely in book three. I feel like there's. We will talk about the. Like, there are points that I'm just like, I will burn the world to the ground.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. It's going so far in Throne of Glass, she ends up having two tandems books occurring side by side on separate continents simultaneously. So you're gonna get a lot of this in this book where you're getting to a very tense moment or a very sexy moment, and then you cut over to an entirely different story. But that's the art of seduction, isn't it?

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, yes. And we know about that here, obviously.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So this chapter, we're with Tharion, our old mer friend from House of Earth and Blood. We're going to learn a lot more about him in this book. So strap in.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And possibly strap on.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I do think that Tharion would enjoy getting paid, and I mean that as a compliment.

[Natalie Jean]

I also feel that, like, I need to separate Tharion from the Deep, which is a character in the boys, because I will say I have fallen off of the boys. But in the boys, a lot of, you know, there's been some speculation that maybe the fish fucking that this character does exhibit. But they are. He speaks to the fish and dolphins. So it is like he is in relationship. Like he's in a relationship with a dolphin. But it is apparently a la Tom Cruise having sex with fish. So that's not what's happening with Therian. But I think that I have to separate that. I'm like, he is. The Deep is definitely way more of a. I don't want to say sex pass. But he is more of a gimme than Therian is because I think Therian doesn't need to say gimme.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No. I mean, Therian is definitely an fboy through and through.

[Natalie Jean]

Cha.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But I wouldn't put him as sex pest because he's only flirting with women who are very interested in it, who are like.

[Natalie Jean]

But I think also all women are because he is who he is. So.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So we're with him in this chapter and. And we're in his thoughts as he's on this tiny boat caught in the stormy, turbulent sea, which is not where he usually is. He is of the river. His queen is the river queen.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Bitch. Hello.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But we're here and we're hearing his thoughts and he's very frustrated. The river queen is pissed at him for hurting her daughter.

[Natalie Jean]

I'm pissed.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

We'll learn more about that story too. That. And that the river queen needs is kind of an unseemly task accomplished. And he's technically her intelligence officer.

[Natalie Jean]

Bring me intelligence.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So he is gathering intelligence. Technically. But also she's kind of doing this as a punishment to him.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Because he's supposed to be in love with my daughter. All right. Yeah. Some of us have to make decisions for our wayward children, all right? Because you ain't doing what we need you to do.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'll talk about this in a little bit more as he breaks the story down. But I'm not necessarily. Not on River Queen's side. So we find out that Tharion, in this moment, is in search of the very character we met in the prologue. Sofie Renast.

[Natalie Jean]

I hate to break it to him.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, he's pretty sure she's dead. Yeah. But even as he's on this horrible ship in the middle of this dark, stormy sea, ever faithful Fboy Therian is fantasizing about all the veneer and humans who are thirsty for him on social media. Even as he thinks he's going to puke from being aboard this rocking ship, he's thinking. He's fantasizing about being back in Lunatheon and thinking about all the people who want to have sex with him.

[Natalie Jean]

I do think it's funny that I never thought about a mer being able to get seasickness. And I kind of like that he gets it. I think that that's just such a little note about Tharion that makes a lot of sense.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, yeah, especially.

[Natalie Jean]

Cause he's always so confident and so well.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But he wants to be part of our world.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, he does. Sorry, fan Fish boy. Get back in the water.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Get back in the water. Because that's the thing.

[Natalie Jean]

Because they can be on land for a while, but they always got to go back in. You got to come back to me, baby.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But veneer like Tharion only sometimes go in long enough to make sure the fins stay and then immediately bail back out. So he is on this rocking ship. He's accompanied by a small crew that he is employed due to their discretion. And it instructs the captain, the commander of the ship, who is a dolphin shifter, to help him search for what they presume is a body. Apparently, the River Queen receives news from the waters themselves.

[Natalie Jean]

I feel it from the water.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And all of the queens kind of get their intel through each other. Through the water. It's almost like a. Like a whisper system.

[Natalie Jean]

Yes. Bitch.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And through that, she somehow got the intel that a Thunderbird was thrown under the water into the world. For reasons that are unclear to Tharien, the River Queen, wants to locate and extract Sophie or Nast as quickly as possible in the slight chance she somehow survived. But even dead, his queen wants her body for some reason that he does not know.

[Natalie Jean]

Do not question me. And he can't.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He doesn't. He's very afraid of her.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And as he and the captain look through the glass in search of this girl, he thinks miserably about his current fate, how he ended up here, and how it was technically because he was promoted to this position after he found his sister's killer. We learned her name was Lycia, and he took vengeance out on her murderer. Though it brought him no peace or.

[Natalie Jean]

Healing, he did what he thought he had to do.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He did find her killer, caught the killer, and then was promoted through that work.

[Natalie Jean]

I gotta give respect where respect is due.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, also, you just realize he's useful, you know?

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. He's pretty good at it, so I'm probably gonna use him for other things.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. The boat reaches the rough area, the area roughly where she would have fallen. And Tharion thinks about while he's there, going, like, we're gonna go down and find this. He goes. Starts thinking about the horrific fate of Victoria.

[Natalie Jean]

He's like, can we please think about the bitch that was put into a box?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Somebod. Go get her.

[Natalie Jean]

Someone bring her back. You know, she's not dead.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Even Tharion thinking through Victoria's horrific fate is like, that must suck. Oh, well, I gotta go do this.

[Natalie Jean]

Gotta do other things, though.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Tharion thinks about how everyone seems scared to retrieve Victoria, lest it seem like some rebellion against the Asteri, even though the person who technically put her in that position. Micah dead as hell.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, but you can't trust the Asteri.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

If I was Victoria, I would become. If I was ever rescued, I would be full villain arc. If I was finally someone decided to go look for me or whatever, and they pull me out, I would be full joker.

[Natalie Jean]

Give me a whole book on her vengeance. SJM I will read it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I. Oh, my God.

[Natalie Jean]

Like. Like, let's go after. Let's go take down the Asteri from, like, Victoria needs to be back. Come back.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel like she is going to. She's brought up enough that I feel like she is going to return in some way.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, she's like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Like a mummy.

[Natalie Jean]

No, like a mummy, but also, like, you like that. It's like they really die when you never. When you stop saying their name or whatever. That has nothing to do with King Putankamen. I Just remember that I saw a museum thing about Dutenkamen. And they were talking about how really he's never dead because we're always talking about him.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's just one random guy. He was just a kid, wasn't he?

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Well, so you went. You didn't learn anything about him. But.

[Natalie Jean]

But I know the. That one line. And I know King Tutankhamun.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

All right, So I saw his corpse.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The crew pulls out a submersible and down into the ocean deep they go.

[Natalie Jean]

But not like the other. Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Think of. Have you watched the documentary about the Titan?

[Natalie Jean]

I. I don't know if like.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Wow. Holy. Holy cannolis.

[Natalie Jean]

I've watched.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I recommend watching it.

[Natalie Jean]

I've watched enough. TikTok. Like, I really got lost in the TikTok world of pulling apart what happened. So I feel like now I'm like. I know they made bad decisions. Many, many bad decisions.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel like you should watch it. It's mind blowing.

[Natalie Jean]

All right, I'll watch it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. So this. They have a submersible, but they are being responsible with it. They have the technology correctly figured out, unlike maybe some other people. And so they go down to the bottom of the ocean. They begin their search. As they're doing this, Therian is having a slight pity party for himself. Thinking about how he ended up so deep into the claws of the River Queen.

[Natalie Jean]

I get it. I would be upset too.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Which involved him wanting the River Queen's daughter so badly. So when he first met the River Queen's daughter, he was like, honey, you.

[Natalie Jean]

Should have gotten to know her a little bit more.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

That he swore an oath to her and took her maidenhood, bro. And I'm sorry. You should have gotten your ice. I wrote murmur.

[Natalie Jean]

Natalie. Murmur. Get that murmur back down now. And there. Near fish murmur.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

How does it happen? How did I come up with that?

[Natalie Jean]

You gotta say it, you know. You listening to this? You want to say murmur out loud?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Say it.

[Natalie Jean]

It's fun.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So he should have gotten to control of himself if he didn't want to be in this predicament.

[Natalie Jean]

Bro, why'd you fuck my daughter?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Also took her virginity and swore no to her. I'm sorry.

[Natalie Jean]

Not that mommies should have control over baby's virginity. No. But in the world of the mer, you just should have known a little bit better.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It wasn't just because of the River Queen. It was that the River Queen's daughter became like she was emotionally invested. She loved him. And so the River Queen.

[Natalie Jean]

Boy.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He's a boy. And she did not know that because the river queen's daughter is very.

[Natalie Jean]

She is sheltered.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Sheltered. She is held against, like, she's kept away from society. And this river queen is a very overprotective and living in the deep, y' all. And so the river queen's daughter fell in love with him, and then he was like, oh, after he came, he had post nut clarity. Too late, bud.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, no.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Also, did I look up if any fish have penises during this? And turns out that some of them.

[Natalie Jean]

Do, because really, what kind do they? Is it like a cork screw? We talking like a barb or what do we.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Most fish don't have intercourse because they.

[Natalie Jean]

Just leave the fertilize for the eggs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But there are some who do, including, like, sharks and manta rays. But there's also some fish. There's this one kind of fish called. What are they called? Phallosetistes. It's Greek for penis chest.

[Natalie Jean]

Whoa. Penis chest. I've been with a couple of penis brains, but I don't know if I've ever been with a penis chest. I mean, does that make it throbbing?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It means. Well, they. Technically, these fish have penises on their heads that penetrate the female face.

[Natalie Jean]

I guess given head is a little bit different to them.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Men are always thinking with the penises anyway.

[Natalie Jean]

I just put them on that replace the brains with them.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So we don't know. There's also a kind of some. Some fish have something called a pseudo penis.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah. Been with a couple.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I do want to have a band called the pseudo penises, but we don't know. Also, because the river queen's daughter isn't fully immersed, she's a little bit of a mer. She's mostly an elemental. So now all I'm thinking about is, like, how do they have sex? Don't worry about how did he take her maidenhood and with what.

[Natalie Jean]

Don't worry about it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I am worried about it.

[Natalie Jean]

Elemental. All right, bitch.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I want to know what. I want some fan artists to please show. Show us.

[Natalie Jean]

I guess if you're elemental, does it count for sex if you just have your dick out and the wind comes through? Like, is that you having sex with the wind?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But if he's in mer form, does he have a penis?

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, I don't know. I feel like maybe he is. Maybe they. We don't know the sex that they had. Maybe he was a guy, did come on her eggs, and maybe that's why it's such a big thing, because it's like, bro, even more so than in the World of the humans. Like, you can really make a lot of fucking mer babies if you're squirting all over my egg. Eggs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

But I'm sorry if that was all it was gonna happen. He's just gonna masturbate on her eggs. Why did he want to have sex that bad with her? Like, that's not even him getting it off.

[Natalie Jean]

Maybe to mer coming on the eggs is a different kind of orgasm than just common, you know, like, maybe it's like an ind. Like, it's like, you know, the difference of orgasming when you're by yourself than when you're with your partner. Obviously, it's the same mechanics, but, like, sometimes it's very different. Different. So maybe it's like that, man.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm. Now I'm just thinking about comment people coming on eggs in a frying pan.

[Natalie Jean]

Coming on some eggs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And that is grossing me out. Hell yeah, man. Okay, well, I want to know if anybody has some fan art. They want to try to just make.

[Natalie Jean]

A diagram coming on eggs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

No, please, please do not send that to me ever. Please don't.

[Natalie Jean]

Unless there's phallus with this, their dick brain.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Unless it is art about how Tharien and the river queen's daughter consummated. I want to know that I do not want to watch. Don't send me any porn that has something to do with breakfast foods. Okay, just so we're all clear, but.

[Natalie Jean]

How do they get that? Canadian bacon slapping?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Ew, gross. I don't even know what that means.

[Natalie Jean]

I mean, where is it going to slap? It depends.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, I see. Okay.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I just imagine getting like. Like your ass getting slapped with a big piece of baloney, you know, I.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Mean, that's probably not even. Yeah, that's. I don't even think that that's that rare of a pornography problem. I remember that Fred. I think it was Fred Durst got filmed doing that to a fan.

[Natalie Jean]

Baloney.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Slapping a woman's butt with baloney. And it was like, wow.

[Natalie Jean]

That is very specific.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah. After a number of hours, Tharion spots something on their technology as they're scouring the seafloor.

[Natalie Jean]

The remote submersible had floated past boiling hot sea vents, past muck and rock and all manner of strange creatures. But there, tucked among a cluster of red and white tuber worms, a square rock.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I love a good deep sea creature.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, bitch.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Do you know the giant tube worms in the sea trenches in Earth? Earth can live up to sometimes. They estimate towards a thousand years. It's one of the old, longest living Creatures on Earth.

[Natalie Jean]

Whoa. What do they do to pass the time?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I guess just eat plankton.

[Natalie Jean]

Well, they are tuber worms. So is are they like YouTuber worms and then they become like worm fluencies? They have worm fluency, which would be good for them.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Yeah.

[Natalie Jean]

Bring it down there.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Give them something to do so they don't become radicalized.

[Natalie Jean]

Maybe that's what the submersible was doing, but was hidden because they don't want us to know about the content creation that comes from deep sea life.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Maybe we don't know a lot about the ocean floor still.

[Natalie Jean]

No, we don't.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

You really don't. Anyway, they've realized they've come across the weighted blocks that were attached to Sophie. When they see that square, like a, you know, sentient being made square block.

[Natalie Jean]

When first seeing the square rock, I don't know if it was just me, but how many of us thought it's Victoria and then it's not, but Victoria. I keep hoping.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel like if they saw Victoria, they'd be like, oh, man, look, that sucks.

[Natalie Jean]

Really shouldn't.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Anyway, we gotta go find Sophie.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So they see the chains attached to the rock after they, you know, start to inspect it, but find that there is no Sophie there. The captain suggests that she must have gotten taken away by the current or scavengers. And Tharion agrees with the captain. But see something that the dolphin shifter apparently missed. He keeps his mouth shut until shortly after they've returned to the surface, piloted back to land. On the phone with the river queen me. He tells her the bad news. That Sophie's no longer attached, but that he saw something. The shackles. They had been unlocked. The river queen is incensed, but asks if Tharion believes that she escaped.

[Natalie Jean]

Bring me the thunderbolt.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

He doesn't know, but he doesn't think that she made it to the ocean floor. Mystery. Apparently, his queen also knows about Sophie's brother, Emil. The waters know all and commands. Not all, apparently.

[Natalie Jean]

Just some. Just some of the things. I'm surprised. None of the fish would have told me that she got away. But I'll take it off with the fish heads. Yes.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And commands Tharion to find Emil as well. Perhaps seeking him out. Sophie will be sure to follow. Tharian knows his queen to be harsh and even cruel.

[Natalie Jean]

But beautiful. You may say it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And beautiful.

[Natalie Jean]

Thank you.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Very hot and doable. But doesn't suspect that she would go so low as trying to use children as. As soldiers. So he ponders on what exactly he wants with these two children.

[Natalie Jean]

But their little hands can fit onto the little bombs.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, like Snowpiercer.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, I think. Yeah. I guess. Really, I'd just be feeding them cockroaches. Is that what happens? Jelly cockroaches? Yeah. And I would just. Man, having a heyday in the front of that train.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Oh, you'd be the bad guy.

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah, of course I'm the bad. I mean, I'm the River Queen. I mean, that's true.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

The River Queen would be up at the front in the nightclub train.

[Natalie Jean]

I would be complaining the entire time because it would be so dry. And really, the conductor would probably be like this queen. Huh? Can we put her back on a river?

[Jackie Zabrowski]

If I recall, the front half of the train gets to have like, hot tubs and stuff in the. In their.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

In their car. So, yeah, you'd be all right. And you'd still probably be complaining. Cause, like, first world problems, you know?

[Natalie Jean]

Yeah.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

First train problems.

[Natalie Jean]

Nothing's good enough for me, baby.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

So Tharion gets this instruction from the Queen, but doesn't understand really what she's doing. What she could want with them remains to be a mystery for him and us at the end of this chapter.

[Natalie Jean]

Mystery.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

And we must stop now.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay. I'm so happy to leave you all enshrouded in my mysteries. And I hope that you. You can feel my power and my prowess from here. And I'm sorry that, you know, Natalie looks so good this episode and it was difficult for you to get through.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I'm just assuming it must have been really hard and.

[Natalie Jean]

Because we're scared of her, but we also really like it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

I feel conflicted looking like this.

[Natalie Jean]

Good. As you should. But I'm just saying, maybe this is like. Like a Wednesday night fit.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's not even finished. I didn't get to finish it in time, so. So I'm gonna have to fucking come with her again.

[Natalie Jean]

Okay.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

It's not like your uniform didn't have all the stuff added to it.

[Natalie Jean]

Oh, God. I mean, it is a really great uniform, though. I think you're killing it.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Thank you. It's not good enough. It's never good enough. It's never. It's never good enough.

[Natalie Jean]

Natalie. We can't end it like this. Natalie. Natalie, come back.

[Jackie Zabrowski]

Natalie.

[Natalie Jean]

Please read up until chapter nine for next week.