2508: The Best Eggs to Eat for Building Muscle & Losing Fat (Listener Coaching)

Summary

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth – Episode 2508 Summary

Release Date: January 10, 2025

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1. Introduction to the Power of Eggs

In Episode 2508 of Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth, the hosts delve into the nutritional powerhouse that is the egg. They emphasize eggs as "the world's natural multivitamin," highlighting their role in muscle building, fat loss, and overall health.

Adam Schafer opens the discussion by stating, "Eggs are one of the best foods you could possibly eat for performance, strength, and health" (00:43). This sets the stage for an in-depth exploration of egg types, their benefits, and debunking longstanding myths.

2. Types of Eggs: Conventional vs. Free-Range vs. Pasture-Raised

The conversation progresses to differentiate between conventional, free-range, and pasture-raised eggs. Adam Schafer explains the distinctions:

• Conventional Eggs: Produced by chickens kept in cramped crates, fed a grain-based vegetarian diet. "They’re just in these little tiny crates, can’t move, and then they just become egg-making factories" (07:31).

• Free-Range Eggs: Chickens have access to the outdoors, though actual outdoor time may be limited.

• Pasture-Raised Eggs: Chickens roam on expansive outdoor spaces (108 square feet per chicken), foraging naturally for bugs and worms, which enriches the nutritional profile of the eggs. "Pasture-raised eggs tend to have this orangey colored yolk... they’re higher in vitamin A, vitamin E, omega-3s, and vitamin D" (10:38).

Justin Andrews adds, "Pasture raised eggs aren't just better for you, they’re better for the chickens too" (12:33), underscoring ethical considerations alongside health benefits.

3. Nutritional Benefits of Whole Eggs

The hosts highlight the superiority of whole eggs over egg whites in muscle synthesis and cognitive functions:

• Choline and Vitamins: Found predominantly in the yolk, essential for brain health and muscle function.

• Omega-3 Fatty Acids: Higher in pasture-raised eggs, beneficial for heart health and inflammation reduction.

• Anabolic Properties of Cholesterol: Contrary to past beliefs, dietary cholesterol in eggs does not significantly impact blood cholesterol levels and may aid in muscle building. Adam Schafer remarks, "The muscle protein synthesis signal is mysteriously higher with whole eggs, even when controlling for macros" (04:10).

4. Historical Context: Myths and Misconceptions About Eggs

The episode traces the fluctuating perceptions of egg consumption over the decades:

• Demonization Era: In the 1980s and 1990s, governmental guidelines vilified eggs due to their cholesterol content. "They were told to not eat eggs or throw the yolk away because of cholesterol" (02:45).

• Reevaluation Period: Fitness professionals and bodybuilders advocated for whole eggs, leading to a gradual shift in recommendations. Adam Schafer observes, "They finally came out and said eggs are healthy, thirty years later after demonizing them" (03:03).

5. Eggs in Muscle Building: Scientific Insights

The hosts discuss studies comparing egg whites to whole eggs, revealing:

• Enhanced Muscle Protein Synthesis: Whole eggs provide a more potent signal for muscle building compared to egg whites alone, likely due to the presence of cholesterol and other nutrients in the yolk.

• Cognitive Benefits: Consuming whole eggs is linked to improved cognitive performance and higher IQ in children and adults, attributed to choline intake.

Adam Schafer emphasizes, "Eggs are basically nature's multivitamin and they are great for fitness" (05:20).

6. Listener Coaching and Questions

The episode features a segment where the hosts address listener questions, providing expert coaching on various fitness topics.

a. Best Exercises for Rear Delts Without Upper Back Overlap

Question from Kathy Steinhilb: "What is the best exercise to really target my rear delts without the upper back taking over?" (55:59)

Adam Schafer recommends the Rear Fly, emphasizing proper form to isolate the rear delts:

"Keep the elbows out, roll your shoulders forward... It’s a very short movement to isolate the rear delts." (56:55)

Justin Andrews adds the effectiveness of cable-based exercises for consistent tension:

"My favorite movement is the cable rear delt single fly... real lightweight and full range constant tension." (57:43)

b. Challenges with Reverse Dieting and Fat Gain

Question from Kat M. Sherman: "What do I do if reverse dieting never works and I just continuously gain fat above 1800 calories?" (59:30)

Adam Schafer identifies incorrect workout routines as the primary culprit:

"If you’re not strength training and just bumping calories, you’re going to gain body fat." (60:07)

Justin Andrews emphasizes the importance of protein intake in reverse dieting:

"If you’re eating in a surplus but not hitting your protein intake, those additional calories just get partitioned to fat." (60:23)

c. Building a Hybrid Trainer Business with Multiple Revenue Streams

Question from EFN Coaching: "If you had to pick a way to build a hybrid trainer business from the ground up with multiple revenue streams, how would you do it?" (61:41)

Adam Schafer advises starting in a Big Box Gym to gain foundational experience and understanding:

"Start in the big box gym, work there, learn their systems, get experience... Master that before considering anything else." (61:41)

Doug Egge echoes the sentiment, highlighting the value of mentorship and iterative learning:

"You have to just get going and iterate as you go... Shadowing qualified trainers is invaluable." (64:11)

Justin Andrews suggests leveraging social media and proven content strategies:

"Use our top 100 YouTube videos as a litmus test and build your content around what has already proven to engage audiences." (64:40)

d. Thoughts on Weight Vests for Walking

Question from Jenny K.: "What are your thoughts on weight vests for walking?" (66:49)

Adam Schafer expresses skepticism about the effectiveness and safety of weight vests for general walking:

"Changes your biomechanics, increases your risk of injury, and does little to improve the health benefits of walking." (66:49)

Justin Andrews acknowledges specific scenarios where weight vests might be beneficial but maintains that strength training offers superior benefits:

"Strength training once a week will do so much more for reversing osteoporosis than walking with a weighted vest." (72:57)

Doug Egge reinforces the message by comparing weight-bearing cardio to targeted strength training:

"Weight training is literally much more effective at building bone density than any weighted cardio." (69:35)

7. Discussion on GLP1 Drugs and Their Impact on Health

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the discussion of GLP1 agonists, drugs commonly used for weight loss and diabetes management.

Adam Schafer highlights the potential negative consequences of widespread GLP1 usage:

"People on GLP1s eat less, which can lead to muscle loss if they don't increase protein intake and engage in strength training." (16:30)

Justin Andrews expands on the societal implications, connecting the rise of GLP1s with increasing sedentary lifestyles exacerbated by technology and automation:

"AI and automation are reducing our physical activity, and GLP1s might just replace one health problem (obesity) with another (muscle loss)." (20:29)

Doug Egge emphasizes the importance of maintaining muscle mass for overall health and longevity, warning against the frailty that comes with muscle loss:

"Muscle is what makes you insulin sensitive. Without it, health declines rapidly, especially in older adults." (23:11)

8. Importance of Protein and Strength Training

The hosts collectively stress the critical role of protein intake and strength training in maintaining muscle mass, bone density, and overall health.

Justin Andrews underscores protein's foundational role:

"The most common thing I found in all clients is the undereating of protein." (19:01)

Adam Schafer ties protein intake to metabolic health and muscle preservation:

"A higher protein diet has a protective effect, especially as you age, because it helps in muscle sparing." (19:31)

Doug Egge adds the necessity of discipline in diet and training:

"Putting in the work with strength training and adequate protein is still essential, regardless of other factors." (18:53)

9. Personal Anecdotes and Parenting Insights

Towards the episode's conclusion, the hosts share personal stories related to fitness, parenting, and maintaining healthy habits amidst technological distractions.

Justin Andrews discusses strategies for managing children's screen time and fostering independence:

"I have three books I want my son to read before considering giving him a phone. He has to understand the reasons behind restrictions." (37:18)

Adam Schafer speaks about balancing parenting with promoting healthy and unique interests in children:

"It's important to foster uniqueness in kids... letting them embrace their differences builds confidence and individuality." (33:35)

10. Final Thoughts and Key Takeaways

The episode wraps up with a reiteration of the importance of strength training, adequate protein intake, and informed dietary choices for long-term health and muscle maintenance. The hosts encourage listeners to prioritize these foundational aspects over quick fixes and fad solutions.

Adam Schafer concludes, "Strength training builds muscle, and building muscle builds bone. That's the most profound difference you can make for your health." (73:32)

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Conclusion

Episode 2508 of Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth offers a comprehensive exploration of the benefits of eggs for fitness, debunks historical myths, addresses contemporary health challenges related to GLP1 drugs, and provides actionable listener coaching on various fitness topics. The hosts blend scientific insights with practical advice, emphasizing the timeless principles of strength training and nutrition for optimal health.

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Note: Timestamps correspond to the highlighted sections for reference.

Transcript

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[Sal Destefano]

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump Mind Pump with your hosts Sal Destefano, Adam Schafer and Justin Andrews.

[Adam Schafer]

You just found the most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump, right? In today's episode we answered listeners questions. People wrote in and we picked some questions to answer. By the way, you could do that on Instagram @mindpump media. But all of that was after the intro. Today's intro was 53 minutes long. In the intro we talk about current events and fitness studies. It's a good time now. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Paleo Valley. Today we talked about their caramel salt bone broth protein. This tastes so good. I can't believe there's no sugar in it, but there's no sugar. It's just protein. Minimally processed, easy to digest. It tastes so good it's ridiculous. Go check it out for yourself. Go to paleovalley.com mind pump on that link, you'll get a discount. This episode is also brought to you by Vuori. This is the best athleisure wear you'll find anywhere. And we have a link with one of the biggest discounts you'll find anywhere. 20% off. Go to vuoriclothing.com mind pump also brand New year means we have our bundle specials. Our New Year's Resolution Bundle specials. Each bundle includes multiple workout programs. Each one is $300 or more off. That's how big of a discount they are. So here they are. There's the New to Weightlifting Bundle, the Body Transformation Bundle, the New Year Extreme Intensity Bundle, and the body transformation bundle 2.0. You can find all of those bundles with the discounts [e-mail] all right, here comes the show. Eggs. They are the world's natural multivitamin. They're great for muscle building. They're great for fat loss, they're great for recovery. They're one of the best foods you could possibly eat for performance, strength and health. But which eggs are the best conventional pasture free range? Do you pick one? Does it matter? That's what we're going to talk about.

[Justin Andrews]

If you can afford them right now.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Oh, I know. They get crazy, right?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

A dollar a day.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Diamond eggs are doing like black market sales right now.

[Adam Schafer]

It's crazy. All right, so eggs in general, first off, Finally. So what an example of don't listen to the government for health.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

They finally came out and said eggs are healthy. Yeah. Thirty years later, after demonizing them, they've.

[Doug]

Literally ping ponged it back and forth and back and forth.

[Adam Schafer]

At first they demonized eggs. When we were younger, in the 90s, 80s and 90s, you were told to not eat eggs. Or if you did, throw the yolk away, please, because it's so terrible. God forbid, the cholesterol.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm skeptical now.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

They're doing something to them now.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, maybe. Why are they saying eggs are good?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

And then they were kind of quiet about it for a while, by the way. Meanwhile, all the fitness people, especially bodybuilders, were like, you guys are crazy. Eggs are good for you. Said, we're bad. Then they came out and said, they're probably okay. And now they're like, yes, they're actually healthy. And it is interesting that they encourage people to throw the yolk away, which is actually the most nutrient dense part of the egg. The egg white essentially is just protein.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

The yolk, is that what contains the choline. It's what contains most of the vitamins, like the vitamin a, the omega 3 fatty acids.

[Justin Andrews]

It's also most of the cholesterol.

[Adam Schafer]

And the cholesterol, which. Dietary cholesterol has some interesting muscle building.

[Justin Andrews]

That's the main reason. That's the main reason why they would say to throw it away.

[Adam Schafer]

They said to throw it away because dietary cholesterol. Yeah, yeah. They thought, oh, this is what makes your cholesterol grow up, which is not true. That's not what makes your cholesterol grow up. It doesn't cause problems or very rare instances.

[Justin Andrews]

Now, even, even the bodybuilders fell for that one for a while.

[Adam Schafer]

At least they did. But at least in the off season, they would eat full egg because they would say, oh, I noticed an effect.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

It's funny because they did studies, we have really good studies now that compare egg whites to whole eggs. And they control calories and protein and everything. And the muscle protein synthesis signal, which is essentially the muscle building signal that happens from whole eggs, is quote unquote, mysteriously higher. With whole eggs, even if we control for macros and all that stuff, I think it's the cholesterol. There's also great cognitive benefits from eating eggs. You look at the studies on children, mothers when they're pregnant who eat whole eggs, and children who eat eggs have improved cognitive performance and higher IQ affects your iq. Yes.

[Justin Andrews]

Crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

And that's probably due to the choline that's in eggs, which is arguably essential. Most people would say it's not an essential nutrient, but I think it's essential because when you look at the, the data on consumed choline, you just see this boost in cognitive performance and health. And eggs are just, they're basically, they have everything in them. I mean, you could only eat eggs and get away with that for a little while. Not encouraging that. Don't think that's a good idea. But they are nature's multivitamin and they are great for fitness. Great for fitness.

[Justin Andrews]

I think there's such a, it's such a, I don't know if maybe I've just trained myself to be okay with eating this sort of. But leftover dinner with a couple scrambled eggs. It's like such breakfast, such a great breakfast. And eggs, eggs scramble so fast. So whatever, you know, chicken, steak, fish dinner, whatever you had the night before, like a smaller portion size of that, throwing an iron skillet and crack three, three eggs on it real quick, you're done in less than two minutes, you've got, I mean, faster than you could probably microwave something, you've got a full blown breakfast now that high in protein, starting your day out. And I just think that that was one of the biggest challenges I personally had. And I had, I saw my clients had with staying ahead of their protein count. Like, if you got behind in the morning time, it was really difficult to hit your protein targets. And so finding strategies for clients to have high protein breakfast was always key. But then a lot of those, you know, high protein breakfast take a long time to make.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, right.

[Justin Andrews]

Because you're cooking up or people just.

[Adam Schafer]

Think all two eggs, which is great, but it's only 12 grams of protein.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Which is people who are trying to hit protein.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Targets. Luckily for me, I, you know, when I started working out, I became a student of just the history of muscle building, bodybuilding. And I read up Vince Garanda who was like, he was like so ahead of his time in the 50s and 60s, and he advocated for 12 eggs a day for some of these guys. Right. And he talked about how anabolic it was. So I identified this early on. And so if anybody wants to try this, if you're otherwise healthy, try eating eight or 10 whole eggs a day. Even control the calories, reduce calories somewhere else. It's anabolic. You'll get this muscle building effect that lasts like about five, six, seven weeks. That's quite pronounced. And I think it's the dietary cholesterol. But nonetheless, when you go to buy eggs, is there a difference, is there a difference between conventional free range and pasture, which are the three main categories? So I have some of the regulations around those and what they mean, so I'll go through them first so we know what they are. Right. So conventional, conventional eggs are essentially chickens that are in crates all the time.

[Justin Andrews]

Anything goes, Right.

[Adam Schafer]

And they're fed grain or a vegetarian diet. Now, keep in mind, chickens are not vegan. No, that's not a natural diet. Chickens in nature eat lots of grubs and bugs and stuff like that, but they're fed just grain. By the way, the crates, you guys want to know how big a crate is per chicken?

[Doug]

They're vicious, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

It's tiny, eight and a half by 11 inches. It's a sheet of paper. So they're just in these little tiny crates, can't move, and then they just become egg making factories, essentially. Free range means that the chickens have access to outdoors. Doesn't mean they go outside, but they have access to go outside. And then pasture means that they're on 108 square feet of outdoor space per chicken, plus barn space. And they tend to eat a lot of bugs and worms because they could forage and eat and they'll supplement their diet. But a lot of the diet comes from, you know, bugs and worms and stuff like that. Nutrient wise, there is a difference. So for anybody wondering, by the way, if you've ever had pasture eggs and you've eaten conventional eggs, they look different when you crack the egg and you open it, put it on your pan. Pasture raised eggs tend to have this, like, orangey colored yolk, Whereas your conventional eggs tend to be really pale yellow, which I thought was growing up, that was how eggs were supposed to look. Yeah, yellow. The first time I had a pasture raised egg, I was like, oh, what's something wrong with this egg?

[Doug]

It's like neon color. This is crazy. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

By the way, side note, fertilized eggs seem to have anabolic growth Factors within them. And there's some supplement companies that have made supplements based off of fertilized eggs. So just a little side note, I don't have a lot of data to support that supports that. There's are a few studies, but if you're like one of those people likes to nerd out on muscle building effects of, you know, things or whatever, look up fertilized eggs and the anabolic compounds that you'll find in them.

[Doug]

There's cultures that like eat that, right?

[Adam Schafer]

They're. They're so not. So fertilized egg is still an egg. It's just an egg. You're talking about.

[Doug]

Oh, I'm talking about grown. Yeah. Developed like halfway, I remember. Yeah. That was like a bit of a dare, you know.

[Adam Schafer]

Did you?

[Doug]

Yeah, well, it was.

[Adam Schafer]

You eat the bones and everything.

[Doug]

It was not pleasant.

[Adam Schafer]

Dude.

[Doug]

It was, it was more of a haze than anything. Yeah. But I just remember that was like a part of like this, this Asian market and they bought it.

[Adam Schafer]

It's a specialty.

[Doug]

It was. Yeah. Delicacy.

[Adam Schafer]

What's the name of it? Doug, do you know what that's called?

[Sal Destefano]

I don't know. I know the Vietnamese. So they eat these duck eggs.

[Adam Schafer]

That's it.

[Sal Destefano]

And they have like a little duck embryo.

[Adam Schafer]

Fertilized eggs. They look like normal. They're just normal eggs. They're just fertilized. What was that supplement years ago that guy tried to get us to work with? Oh, and it came from fertilizer.

[Sal Destefano]

Manafort.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes. Yes.

[Doug]

Oh my God. And then takes it back.

[Adam Schafer]

So there is a. There are anabolic compounds on fe eggs that seem to have these muscle building effects as well. So it's just another level if you, you know, kind of want to go that far with it. But nonetheless.

[Justin Andrews]

So to Doug. Doug made a point when we were talking about this the other day that I was unaware of that some of some of these companies are also using stuff to dye the color of the eggs. So it's not even that you can't even just go off the way it's colored anymore because they're, they'll feed them.

[Adam Schafer]

Things specifically to make the. Or the color of the yolk and not necessarily how it's supposed to occur.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

So the reason why they're more orange is they're higher in typically vitamin A, they're higher in vitamin E. Talking about pasture eggs. Eggs. And they're higher in omega 3s. They also tend to have higher vitamin D levels because the chickens are exposed to the sun.

[Doug]

Wow.

[Justin Andrews]

So I mean, vitamin D and omega Alone, that should be motivating for most people.

[Adam Schafer]

Now some people were like, oh, one egg versus another. It's not that big of a difference. Well, yeah, if you. Only one egg.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

But if you eat eggs weekly or especially daily. Yeah, if you're somebody like me who can eat on average between five to 10 eggs a day, and I do this day in and day out now, it makes a big difference. To go with the pasture eggs, I.

[Justin Andrews]

Mean, I feel like this is the same conversation where we talk about grass fed meat. It's like if you rarely ever eat grass fed meat though, if you choose, I mean, rarely, every steak or meat, you know the difference between one steak, grass fed versus one, it's like, okay, not a big difference. But if you eat steaks on a regular basis and over time, like, that's a massive difference.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes, yes, 100. So I, I always opt for pasture raised because I eat so many eggs. And if you give them to your kids, I would say it's probably a good idea to go pasture. If you don't eat a lot of eggs, maybe it doesn't make that big of a difference, but.

[Justin Andrews]

And most likely anytime you buy it from, or buy breakfast from a restaurant, I'm assuming they're not going pasture, they're going conventional. It's cheaper.

[Adam Schafer]

No, if they go pasture, it'll say menu. They'll literally list it that way. But yeah, it's higher. So you're eating nature's multivitamin. You know, I, I think it's a good idea to go with the, the best source. But that's not to say that conventional eggs aren't healthy. Conventional eggs are still healthy. So even the worst ones are good for you. And then of course there's another side to this, which is a lot of people do care about the well being of the animals that are, that we farm with and you know, chickens stuck in a crate that barely fits them. That doesn't sit well with me, you know?

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Think of it like just sitting.

[Doug]

They get sick and then what? You got antibiotics and. Yeah, it's, it's just depressing.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, well, isn't it? Don't they say like all animals that they release stuff when they, when they are like stressed?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, it's a stressful environment.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes. You gotta think that changes, changes the makeup, by the way.

[Adam Schafer]

You know, what's the other difference with pasture raised eggs is the integrity of the yolk. So I, I don't know if you, have you guys ever done this? If you crack two of them and you Leave them there. You know how the yolk is just kind of sitting there and then press on the conventional one versus the pasture raised one. And the pasture raised one is firmer. Firmer with a stronger integrity.

[Doug]

I can see that.

[Adam Schafer]

Versus the other one where it just kind of, you know, blah, kind of falls apart. Yeah, so it does make a, a bit of a difference. Okay, I got, I got an interesting, interesting study to bring up that Rhonda Patrick posted on X, which I think is really interesting.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, it's, she's been really, she's been quiet in the news at least. Remember what, Remember how popular she was after the Joe Rogan boost and she was like the hot topic for like a year and then I just happened.

[Doug]

And kind of took that spot, I think.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I think so. You're right. It was because before Huberman, she was the one that everybody was kind of quoting and talking about. And then I really haven't heard much.

[Doug]

She always has good information. It's very heavy, for sure.

[Adam Schafer]

So this is, so this study that she's referring to is talking about the longevity connection with muscle power. Not just strength, but actual power. Right. The ability to generate force quickly. In a recent study, older adults with normal and high levels of relative muscle power had better nine year survival rates than older adults with low muscle power. It's even protective against death in older adults with high levels of body fat. Okay. Being fat and powerful reduced mortality just as much as being lean and powerful.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay, so 43, 45%. Ready for this? Here's where it gets interesting. This is why I brought this up. Being lean and weak, however, provided no survival advantage compared to being fat and weak.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, wow.

[Adam Schafer]

Lean and weak is very bad for you. Just like being fat and weak.

[Justin Andrews]

Now, okay, so is that like on all, all cause mortality or is that.

[Adam Schafer]

Because this is just mortality?

[Justin Andrews]

Because you obviously having a bunch of extra body fat for survival purposes is more beneficial. Right. You throw a lean, weak person out and a weak fat person out in the middle of nowhere with no food, the person, sure, with all the extra body fat is going to live longer. But are we talking about heart conditions and everything?

[Adam Schafer]

It just says all cause mortality.

[Justin Andrews]

Wow. Now, now, interesting.

[Adam Schafer]

Now I, you know, I think you could argue obviously obesity past a certain point is just going to be bad regardless. But weak and skinny isn't, isn't great at all. And here's where that, my mind went with that, with that study after I read that. And I said, oh my God, is this what's going to happen with the misuse of GLP1 for sure. Because what you see with GLP1s, which, by the way, is not due to the GLP1. I want to be clear here. GLP1s don't make you weak. Okay. But they do make you eat a lot less. So if you take someone who's obese who also has low muscle mass, which is more common than someone who's obese with a lot of muscle mass, in fact, it's. If there was a long time ago, we dispelled the myth that being overweight meant you had more muscle. Yeah. We actually found that. And we know this now as a fact, being overweight actually increases the odds of things like sarcopenia, muscle weakness, and that kind of stuff. So you see when people go on a GLP one who don't bump their protein intake and don't strength training is they just eat less. So they lose body fat, but they also lose muscle as the body tries to slow its metabolism down to match the new reduced caloric intake. So what we may be doing is just changing the problem, but it's still a problem.

[Doug]

It just seems like a natural tendency, you know, because it's. It's like the path lease resistance. Like, it's already been trained. Like, okay, so if I don't have to eat as much now, like, then I'm just gonna. And I'm enjoying the benefits of losing weight, you know, to do work on top of that or to, like, add. They don't really have the discipline to, like, add the food that they need to have the building blocks to maintain the muscle mass. It's just not a consideration. I could totally see the mentality shifting, you know, from that to that extreme, which is.

[Adam Schafer]

Which is sad to me, because what I found through talking to people, if this is communicated properly, is more motivation to go to the gym. When someone starts a GLP1, you take someone who's struggled with losing 50 pounds, then they start the GLP1, they start to lose weight. If you communicate to them properly, like, look, when you do this, you need to lift weights and you need to hit protein intake because you'll lose weight, but you'll lose muscle, and your health may not actually improve, or maybe it improves a little bit, but not that much because you lost so much muscle and you communicated properly, and then they start losing weight, they might be like, you know what? I'm motivated to work out, actually. That's what I found. But what's happening is a lot of people aren't communicated to this. They go to the doctor. Doctor goes, go on a GLP1. We just got to get you to lose the weight. And the person doesn't realize that they maybe trade one problem for another. And this is kind of showing, like, skinny and weak, no protection over being fat and weight.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. This also highlights to me because I know we talk a lot about processed foods as being like, the big culprit for the obesity epidemic, but then I think this really highlights that inactivity. Yeah. And, and also lack of knowledge. Right. Like, I just, I think where maybe the resources should be focused in is maybe educating at a younger age. I think that that's what it is. It's just that you. It's not just this processed food that has been engineered to make you overeat. It's like, okay, even if we solve that, either there was no processed foods, or you create a drug that allows people or has people that don't want that anymore. GLP1s. It sounds like we're going to be in the same situation still. Just, it's, it's a, a similar amount of people that are going to be unhealthy, but just for different reasons.

[Adam Schafer]

We may improve.

[Doug]

Both sides are avoiding the work. You know, at the end of the day, like, it's, it's like, you know, it's. If I have to, like, go train, if I have to, like, be disciplined about eating protein, that's still like a discipline, you know, to, to absolve that.

[Justin Andrews]

You.

[Doug]

You know, it's misleading because it's like I, I'm now like helping myself because I'm losing weight. But you don't realize, you know, you still have to, to put the work in.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean, I feel like the number one. And I feel like we've been screaming this since the beginning of, of starting this podcast is the most common thing that I found in all clients is the undereating of protein. Yeah, I think that's become a bigger problem. I, like, I wonder if you didn't change anybody's workout routines, anybody's activity, and you just doubled everyone's protein intake, how much that would solve less eating because of the satiation from that and how much more muscle they would build or retain because of.

[Adam Schafer]

We already have studies on that, if there's a protective effect, especially as you get older, from a higher protein diet, which is precisely because it's muscle sparing to an extent. But strength training is. Look, you don't have to do a lot of it one day a week. One day a week would stop the muscle loss. In fact, one day every two weeks would probably stop the muscle loss that occurs from getting older. So through good strength training though. Okay. And on top of that, kind of stay relatively active. But that's, this is a big problem. It's a problem nobody's talking about. It's all about obesity, which is a problem. But being under muscle, not having enough strength, reducing the size, the health and the function of a very protective, for lack of a better term, organ musculature, your muscle without protecting that, maintaining that building that, you are not going to be in a good place. You'll just be frail. Which is what I'm afraid of. What I'm afraid of is you're going to get a bunch of obese people to lose a bunch of weight from going to GLP1.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Not strength train, not consider protein intake.

[Doug]

Now they're even more vulnerable and they're.

[Adam Schafer]

Just going to be more frail.

[Justin Andrews]

It's, it's, you know, it's such a, it's such a great and important conversation because Even if this GLP1 does what we think it's going to do, right. And you, you said what one in three people you think are going to have taken one?

[Adam Schafer]

I think it'll be more.

[Justin Andrews]

It's, it's not going to. We're going to have a new, arguably worse problem. And it makes sense because there's other factors that are exacerbating this too. With the introduction of AI and the outsourcing of work and activity that we're doing. I mean, look at our own lives. Just how much I know how much more inactive I am today because of all these great things. Like, I mean, I wonder what from age 5 or whenever the first time I went to the grocery store with my mom to, I don't know, at least into my teenage years, early 20s, I still grocery shopped every time. Like how much steps and activity in a year is that, that I've completely like eliminated now with delivery service. And then when we have AI that's going to be able to do our dishes or our chores in our house. Like, yeah, that was another thing. I, I still do that now today. Right. That's one of the ways on that.

[Doug]

Like everything is, is becoming simulated.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Doug]

You know, like it to the, to the next degree. Every time we make advancements, innovations, it's like now we have to simulate what we used to do for work and what does that look like going forward, especially when like things. It's so easy.

[Justin Andrews]

It's gonna become a must foundation for everybody to not just whittle away completely.

[Adam Schafer]

That's it.

[Justin Andrews]

If we outsource all of the physical activities that we do, which I, we're, we're just kind of blindly going that direction, thinking that that's utopia, like, let's get to the place where we don't have to work and do anything, not realizing some of the consequences of that. And I think you're seeing that. And this is only going to accelerate it with GLP1s that people are going to be and how shitty of a situation. Like we solved the obesity and then we're just now in just as much of a problem.

[Doug]

You could just like blow people over.

[Adam Schafer]

Listen, you, you have very little muscle. You could be skinny, you're weak and you have little muscle. Your risk of diabetes is very high. You know, muscle is what makes you insulin sensitive. Your heart disease risk is still high. You know what actually, really, what gets worse, you may get, you may reduce some risks of other things. But you know what gets worse when you're skinny and frail is falling down, breaking something, injuring yourself. You take somebody who's over 65, who's frail, doesn't have good mobility and they get hurt, not even a major injury. Just like I twisted my knee or my ankle. Now I have to kind of stay elevated for the next two or three weeks. Their health declines so fast. So fast.

[Doug]

What are the stats with breaking hip after? Yeah, like 60, 70, I don't know.

[Adam Schafer]

But it's not, it's really.

[Justin Andrews]

I remember seeing the most common way people go, right?

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, it's, it's, they say rapid spine.

[Justin Andrews]

Fall and break your hip, die of ammonia, right?

[Adam Schafer]

Yep. That's what my, my doctor clients used to tell me that all the time.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

So, yeah, so, and again, this study kind of points to that. But muscle is so protective. And the good news is for people who are listening to this, it doesn't take a lot. It's so protective to strength train just one day a week. You're not gonna look like a bodybuilder. You're not gonna be ripped doing one day a week. But it's so protective. You won't lose muscle. You will not lose muscle. If you do decent strength training once a week or if you do one exercise a day, even something like that. Right. Just a little bit of strength training will prevent the muscle loss that happens from aging. It'll prevent the deterioration process.

[Justin Andrews]

This is why I like the, the comparison or analogy of investing, because it's so much like that. It's like, of course, if you invest more and you do two, three days and you're consistent with that, you'll be set for life.

[Adam Schafer]

Compounding.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, because there's compounding. But even just a little bit, I mean, putting something away, investing something is going to go a long ways, especially if you start early and consistently just do a little bit and over time maybe you do a little bit more, but even if you don't, you've at least accumulated a lot more wealth than the person who decided not to do any saving or any investing whatsoever.

[Adam Schafer]

Y.

[Justin Andrews]

So I think it's. So it's a. It's a. I think I'm.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm. So here's where I'm positive about this is. I think I actually had this conversation with Mike Matthews. I recently, recently through text. We were texting about. There was a study he sent talking about each generation's views of GLP1s and younger generations, like all for it, you know, type of deal. And I think that this will probably get more people to strength train because I do believe this message will get out to most people. So I think this will be a net positive. I also think if, again, if we communicate this properly, if doctors communicate this properly, you can actually trigger some motivation in somebody who has no motivation to work out by getting on a GP1 and seeing some weight loss.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, wow, I'm losing some weight. You know what? I think I will go to the gym.

[Doug]

That's definitely the optimistic view.

[Justin Andrews]

I still stand by net positive. We discussed this at the very beginning of this exploding and of course we're skeptical at first. The more, more doctors that we talked to, more of the positive studies that were coming out, but no way did I, I think any of us were blind to the negative outcomes they're gonna have. That's gonna happen. It's inevitable. But I do believe it's gonna be a net positive still. But it, boy, is it going to. I mean, it'll just get us to that point where maybe, maybe strength training will become this cornerstone conversation in schools and doctors and like, we just need to get there. Yeah, we're not there yet. We're not there to where I think.

[Adam Schafer]

It'S going to be the most mainstream form of exercise.

[Justin Andrews]

It has to be. It's has. It's good and it's going to force us in that direction. Right now. How do we measure up Sal to other countries with what? Just this, like where we're going with the GLP ones and weak strength and stuff like that. Like, oh, are we, are we declining faster? Are other Countries just as weak.

[Adam Schafer]

I think we have the greatest use or the greatest interest in use of GLP.1s of all the countries were the obviously the most obese.

[Justin Andrews]

We're the fattest too though.

[Doug]

Yeah, we're the most, the most in need of it.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I mean we're also just the cons. The consumers in America like you, you know, you want to make, you want to be a billionaire, you sell your products in America.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Health wise, Europe was behind us, but now they've, they're catching up very quickly. I know like the UK obesity is very bad. I know Italy for a long time, this is where my family's from. They actually did really well for a while. But now recent generations, the obesity rate has exploded.

[Justin Andrews]

Now what do you think is, what do you think that is? You think that has more to do with food or things changing activity wise over there?

[Adam Schafer]

For them there's two things. So the old countries like Italy, a lot of the towns and cities are.

[Justin Andrews]

Built on hills and you got to walk everywhere.

[Adam Schafer]

Not even hills. It's just they were, they're so old that walking is, is more common. Yeah, it's more common. There's not a lot of suburbs like you have in this makes more sense. Yeah. The second reason is they have a culture around food that is so strong that they, they, they reject like processed foods and, and more so than most countries now they've really started adopt them. But like if like I know this, Italians are food snobs about their food. Like you go to a coffee shop and you ask for, you know, a latte and you ask for soy milk, you're probably gonna get a dirty look like no, that's not a lot, you know, something like that. They're kind of like that, right? With food. I remember McDonald's was like shunned. There was, there was one town, I can't remember where I was near where my dad was from, where people protested because of McDonald's. But this was like now I'm sure, all over the place. So I think that's what protected them for a little while. But the obesity there is also, it's now taken off. So all these modern, modern countries that adopt, you know, this lifestyle of living sedentary and having convenient, you know, food.

[Justin Andrews]

And think about like, I mean, I know we've not to bring up the old argument of the whole dishwashing and the moon stuff like that, but I think it's inevitable that that stuff's coming. Right?

[Adam Schafer]

Of course.

[Justin Andrews]

Right. And so I mean, how far away are We. From all of your. I mean, I was. I just sent this. This Instagram reel to Katrina. A bunch of these things that. These tools that exist that I didn't even know that were, like, automated robot cleaning stuff. They have this. This robot thing that you just stick on a window and it sprays and wipes and clean. You just stick it on it. And it does big windows as well.

[Doug]

Yeah, I've seen that.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. I mean, just random stuff like that that we're creating that you automate and you don't have to do anymore.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what this might do? It might. I think it's already happened for some things. It might get people to realize that there's value sometimes in doing things just for the sake of doing them. You know what I mean?

[Justin Andrews]

Like, the reason why I don't believe that, Sal is because simultaneously, we also have this crazy increase of, you know, Ben's watching YouTube and Netflix.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, that's what I mean.

[Justin Andrews]

And so, like, we're just. We're replacing this extra time that we're creating from ourselves for more sedentary, distracted.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, that's what I mean. It's like. Like, I think people might actually hopefully start to be like, you know what? This is actually, I feel worse. I'm gonna go garden.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Or I'm gonna go wash my car by.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean, I think you're right that that's where we'll eventually end up. The question is how long? How long and how bad do we have to get before everybody kind of wakes up? And will. Will this message that you're presenting be popular anytime soon?

[Adam Schafer]

I remember there was a movie. It was. It's a kids movie, which we've talked about before on the show that I remember when the first time I watched, I got depressed. It was Wally.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I remember watching.

[Justin Andrews]

Depicted that really well.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And you had all these, like, kind of obese people in these little chairs just looking at the computer screen, not talking to each other. And I remember feeling sad, like, oh, no, that's too close to real. This is not good.

[Doug]

That hit kind of on the money.

[Adam Schafer]

And then I went to that year. So this was years ago. My oldest was just a little guy. We went to Disney World. And I remember there being traffic jams from people in those scooters.

[Doug]

Well, you'd see at the end of the ride, at first it'd be like one or two of those Rascal scooters. And then you'd see, like, a line of them going all the way out, and it was just stacked Up.

[Justin Andrews]

Disney World's crazy. Disney World's crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, because you got the south right there.

[Justin Andrews]

It's crazy. I mean, that was my first. This. This year was my first time ever going there.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right.

[Justin Andrews]

And that is actually the first thing I noticed was I. I. I took a picture because I was so. There's like. There was a time where I'm sitting and we just. I was waiting for Katrina. Go to the bathroom, Max. I was in there and, like, just in my peripheral, like, you could see.

[Adam Schafer]

Just a sea of scooters.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Just. And. And people with, like, you know, holding an ice cream and a big old Big Gulp. And I mean, literally, like, Wally. I mean, it was. It was so similar to that. It was eerie. It was like, oh, my God. Like, whoever probably created or wrote that probably got that from that. You know what I'm saying? They probably got that idea just hung.

[Doug]

Out at the park. From idea.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. No, totally. I think they. They. They had to get it from that.

[Adam Schafer]

What have we done to ourselves? Gosh, it's so crazy. No, it's so crazy. We. We try to organize our world by our whims, and it's like, how long is it going to take before we. It's so crazy.

[Justin Andrews]

It's numbing ourselves. Well, you're. You're numbing yourself with food. You're numbing yourself with distraction, entertainment, drugs. And, you know, I think the part that I find. Because I also don't. I'm not the other, like, hardcore other way. Like, I want to be Amish and have none of this stuff. Like, because here's. Here's where I find it, like, crazy, right? So, like, this break for holiday. Max and I were doing a lot of Legos, and that company's tech interaction with their Legos is so cool. Like, the iPad for that. For him, following along and learning and stuff is so cool that of course I want to use that tool. It's helping him. It's so. This hard part is, man, there's so many things that this great technology is doing for us as a species to move us forward in a positive direction, but then it has this other side that can rear its ugly head if you're not careful with how far you go with it. So it's learning that balance.

[Adam Schafer]

Almost all damaging things come from something that can be derived and looked at as, like, oh, there's a good.

[Justin Andrews]

For sure.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, there's a pleasure here, or there's a. There's a convenience here, or there's an entertainment here.

[Doug]

Well, I Saw a little bit of that with the AGI because you see how quickly people will be able to learn skills because virtually you can especially like piano or like, you can learn how to kind of build things and in. It takes you through that entire process. Like you're, you're almost doing hands on everything, which they've never had that ability before. So that's all going to explode.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. The thing that the, the conversation that these days that I have a lot of, because I have, like, I have four kids, but my two oldest are big gap between them and my younger ones. And when my older ones, the struggle was like, well, they're going to be different than their friends and their friends are doing this and I don't want them to stand out. And then as I've gotten older, I'm realizing, like, that's the point. You can't be like everybody. If you're like everybody.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Then you're. It's not going to be good. And the data, I mean, the data is clear. It shows you. If you're like everybody, if you eat the way everybody does, if you move the way everybody does, if you read whatever or watch what everybody watches, you're probably going to be unhealthy physically and mentally and spiritually.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

You have to literally be.

[Doug]

You'll be a radical weird.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I, I so agree with that. So strongly and passionately that the part of I, I totally believe that I played a role in fostering Max's whole, like, into Bowser and the bad guy and stuff like that, because it was so unique and different. And I saw that so early. I remember when he, we first saw that and Katrina was like, I don't like that he likes all the bad guys. I'm like, I love it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, let him get used to being different.

[Justin Andrews]

That's right. I said I want him to be different and I want him to be comfortable and excited about being different. I don't want to push him like, oh, like Mario. Because everybody else likes Mario. It's like, yes, that's so cool that you like this and nobody else does. Daddy loves that. And so I think it's such a good exercise if you find opportunities like that in a kid. Because he doesn't know what I'm fostering, really. He's just, he's into this guy for whatever reason, but the more I can push him into that direction of like, yeah, who cares that no other kid, you know, shows up on Halloween with a bowser? You're the only person who's that guy. Like a daddy loves that.

[Adam Schafer]

Like, you know, it's important too around that. Maybe not specifically that, but with just along that, that along those lines. It's so important as a parent that because you'll feel so isolated, let's say your kid eats healthy and they go to a normal school. They're gonna be like alone. So it's so important you find other like minded people with kids so you have like support and you have a community. Otherwise it's, they're gonna be like, if you have a kid, let's say you have a, like I have a 15 year old daughter, right? And she gets a grand total of five minutes on social media. Her phone is limited. That's it. Five minutes total.

[Justin Andrews]

Now what can you even do in five minutes?

[Adam Schafer]

That's it.

[Justin Andrews]

Is that really the, Is that real?

[Adam Schafer]

Swear to God.

[Justin Andrews]

You guys gonna give her five minutes?

[Adam Schafer]

She does. And her phone, her phone won't lock her out. She can't get more than five minutes. We set it up that way.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh my God.

[Adam Schafer]

Now if we didn't have people around us with kids who had similar restrictions, yeah, she would be isolated and it would be this uphill battle, constant. My friends get to do this, but then you say, oh, my other friend's not even allowed on social media or I have another. So it's so important to surround yourself with people as a parent. Otherwise you're, it's like being a fitness person. Imagine if you were the only person that ate healthy and worked out and you're always around, like it'd be uncomfortable. You feel isolated. But then you hang out with your friends who are into it. It's like, okay, you know, everybody gets it.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I, I think that is so true. I also think like the, the education process, right. Like I'm not there yet, so we'll see. But I have a plan for like how I'm going to tackle the phone thing. And everybody has this like, you know, oh, I think this age or that age. And I think everyone's in agreements. The longer you can wait, the better. But who knows what happens when your friends all have it, this and that. And I want to believe that I've, I've raised Max good to when it comes to like listening to mom and dad and being patient and things like that. And I think what I'm going to do when that day comes is I have like three books that I want him to read and, and then after he reads them, he has to basically write me a report on why he should have a phone. And I Think if he goes through that process, then he'll understand why I have the parameters on it. And so. And if you really want that phone, he'll go through the work to do that. And if he's mature enough and. And actually will read those books and actually sit, take time, do that, then maybe I should reward him with that. And then. But still with restriction, but understanding that. So that's kind of the process that I plan to do with him is.

[Adam Schafer]

That if it's even phones by that time.

[Justin Andrews]

I know, right. I'm all prepared for it. Then it's like not nothing to do with that or whatever with that. But I think.

[Adam Schafer]

No, I get that. I get the whole.

[Justin Andrews]

I think. I still think the strategy plays the same. Right. Maybe it's a different thing that I have to tackle. But I think educating them on the reasons why I want to put restrictions and parameters and not just from me educating, telling them, but them reading and learning about it so they have a better understanding of why dad doesn't want you to be buried in this thing for tons of hours because of all these potential outcomes. Now you understand why I'm not just being a tyrant father saying, no, you can't because I said so or because daddy thinks it's bad. No, it's like listen, read, read the studies or read what we've learned for having these tools for this long and what's happening and do you still think you want one or need one? And then if you do you understand why Daddy just isn't going to give you unfettered access that I want you to only have the. So I just told you that that approach will help. Do I think it'll be easy? I don't think so. You know, nothing's been easy. But I do think that that is a better strategy than just earlier we.

[Adam Schafer]

Were talking about protein. I got to. I, I gotta say this, man. And I, I know I said this about Paleo Valley's chocolate bone broth. Their salted caramel is even. It's ridiculous.

[Doug]

It's another level.

[Justin Andrews]

So you. You ask.

[Adam Schafer]

I almost don't believe that it doesn't have sugar. Yeah, it's.

[Doug]

It's a dessert, dude. I use it like at night too.

[Adam Schafer]

I've never had a protein powder that tasted that good ever. So it's ridiculous.

[Justin Andrews]

You brought. You asked me. And not only do we use it all the time, I've actually got my family on it because I introduced to them adding it to coffee. That salt with coffee.

[Doug]

Yeah. Beautiful.

[Justin Andrews]

It doesn't even taste like it's, it like it's like it doesn't taste like you're drinking a protein powder.

[Adam Schafer]

No, it tastes like you drink a sweetened.

[Justin Andrews]

And I've done, I've done protein powder. I've done seasons of my life where that was like a thing where I was putting protein powder and I just, I like coffee too much that I felt like it was ruining my coffee. This does not taste that way. It actually goes perfect.

[Doug]

If you gave it a hard thing to do, if a lot of people have tried and it's just like if.

[Adam Schafer]

You give it to someone, I'll make this statement. You give it to someone who doesn't even know you put protein. Protein powder. They'll think you put.

[Justin Andrews]

This is what, this is what Katrina did to my sister in law. So she, she offered her her one time. She's like, oh God, no, don't do that. And so Katrina's like, okay. Then she was at our house over the holidays and she made it for. Made coffee for everyone and she put it in there. She just didn't tell her. And she's like, oh my God, what is this?

[Doug]

What'd you do?

[Justin Andrews]

She's like, I put that protein. She was like, no way. Right after that. Then she sent it home with a bunch of it. So no, it's definitely a very cool hack.

[Adam Schafer]

And it's.

[Justin Andrews]

And I like Justin's point. I've tried a punch like, and I've never been consistent with it because I've never liked it, but it's actually really good.

[Adam Schafer]

It's also the easiest to digest. I could do 70 gram shot of protein from there. Nothing.

[Doug]

It's like water doesn't affect your gut.

[Adam Schafer]

Not at all.

[Doug]

Zero dude. So I'm totally into this new. It's just a game. But I, I'm like, you know how pickleball took off? I'm like, this is going to be the next thing, dude. Jasmine.

[Adam Schafer]

What?

[Justin Andrews]

What?

[Doug]

Guys never heard of it.

[Justin Andrews]

Assuming it's badminton with like jazz music.

[Doug]

Just jazzed up a bit. Yeah, it's a terrible name, but tackle badminton.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, it's like that.

[Doug]

It's like a dude. We even play it inside my house. So there's. You set up. It's this big square and you're supposed to hit it inside the square.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, I've seen this on Instagram. You guys actually bought it?

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, you did.

[Doug]

Dude, it's so fun. Oh, because it has these like.

[Adam Schafer]

What is it?

[Justin Andrews]

So tight. Tight quarters, feathered shuttle. You're shooting the shuttlecocks. Through the square, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Doug]

It's just like a paddle. It's like a mix between beach, you know, paddle and. Yeah, shuttlecocks.

[Justin Andrews]

That's what they're called. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Doug]

We could, we could play on words with that all day.

[Adam Schafer]

That's okay.

[Justin Andrews]

So you actually, I was, I actually looked into like getting this. So you got it.

[Doug]

It's fun. Yeah, yeah. We get it for Christmas or for Christmas. And then we were just like, you know, messing around. I was like. Because Courtney got. I was like, that's a really bizarre thing. And then me and the kids got real competitive with it and it doesn't fly very far. So it's like, you know, you're not gonna, It's a close quarter damage. It's very close quarters. But it's like, I like this, it's very, requires. It's a lot of movement.

[Adam Schafer]

Mineral lateral movement.

[Justin Andrews]

So I got. Okay, exactly. Exactly.

[Doug]

Bro, you're, you're the carnival game, your Instagram.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I know. Sal probably really good at it. Your Instagram is probably the same as mine as far as like the stuff we're getting.

[Doug]

They got us.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Because I, I. There's a lot of. Actually that's like a new thing. Like all these little. You know, that's where I got the basketball idea. Right. With the, the basketball with the, the, the buckets from. There's a bunch of these games that they've made. There's. There's a golf one that I've seen where you like hit a, like a wiffle golf ball and you, and it's Velcro and you hit it up on. There's a lot of these little games that they've come up with.

[Doug]

They've been really innovative. Yeah. As of late with a lot of these, like outdoors were kind of games and stuff. There was so that another one that was cool that we got was called like a gibbon board, I believe. But it's a huge. Almost looks like a snowboard, but on the top it's like with a slack line. So you know how people like balance on a slack line. So I mean they try and like wrap in this whole fitness, like angle with it. But we were just like, I was like, this is kind of weird, but it's a cool looking board. It's like this actual gibbon like monkey. But anyways, it's. So we all tried it. It's hard because it's slackline, like balance. And it just became a competitive thing with that too. And of course Ethan's the Best because he's the one still doing gymnastics and was just able to like, yes.

[Justin Andrews]

Forever.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm like, sounds like an injury to me. I like. I like the Jasmine.

[Doug]

Yeah, you'd like the Jazz.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm actually considering getting one video of it. It looks really fun.

[Justin Andrews]

Okay, so it's great. I'm assuming the score is if way you score if it hits the ground or the person can't get it through the square. So you have to stay in the square the whole time.

[Doug]

Stay in the square.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I think I'll play that.

[Adam Schafer]

Which there's one game I see at the beach sometimes.

[Justin Andrews]

It's the one where you slap the smash ball.

[Adam Schafer]

Is that what that's called? Yeah, that one looks like fun. Yeah.

[Doug]

I've never played that. I've seen people play all the time.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but that one requires a little bit of lateral movement.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah. There's definitely more athleticism in that one than probably this.

[Doug]

You have to do some mobility ahead of time.

[Adam Schafer]

So this. So this one is slack. You actually stand on it and you try and practice balancing on a. Yeah.

[Doug]

I was surprised. A big, you know, big dude like me could, you know, I didn't break it.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, you know. Well, when you. Because you got the. The good, solid cankles that prevent.

[Justin Andrews]

I do.

[Doug]

Yeah. I get. I got a little stability, but I finally. I mean, I beat Everett doing it. So did you.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but not even.

[Doug]

I hope he listens to this one until he smashed his record.

[Adam Schafer]

That's great.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Dude. By. I'm at the age now. Can I just tell you guys? I'm sure you guys will identify with this. I'm at the age now where I get hurt. I don't know what I did. I don't know what I did.

[Doug]

That's why I'm doing all this stuff. Listen, I'm like, I don't know where my balance. Again.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't know what happened. I woke up the other morning. Okay.

[Justin Andrews]

Just hurt somewhere.

[Adam Schafer]

My. My hip. What? And of all places, too. That's, like the old person injury. My hip. And I'm like, moving weird. I'm like, what did I. I didn't even work on my leg. I did nothing. I slept.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

And I woke up with an injury.

[Doug]

Courtney would be like, adding all kinds of. Oh, my God. I have so many hip, like, complaints, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

As of late, for like, five days, I was like. For the first day, I was like, it'll. It'll be gone. Day two, I'm like, this is not going away. Day three, I'M like, do I have like, what, what's going on here? And then I looked at Jessica. I'm like, maybe I had cancer because that's how.

[Doug]

It's too much cancer.

[Adam Schafer]

Maybe I had a tumor. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I, you know, I have more sense.

[Adam Schafer]

It's almost gone now though. I don't know what I did.

[Justin Andrews]

I must have.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't know what I do. I was squatting while sleeping. I don't know what I did.

[Justin Andrews]

I noticed more issues. So I mean, you're super consistent. So you, you probably can't test this as much as I, I'm probably the most inconsistent out of us. Right. Where I have phases where I'm hardcore, then I'm off, hardcore off. And anytime I'm, I fall off for a week or two, that's when I notice all that stuff. My low back starts bothering me. Like my, like I get more bothered by like chronic pain when I'm not training. When as long as I'm training, even if it's low volume, low frequency, once or twice a week, just good. But give myself two weeks off and that's the first stuff I start noticing is I'll just, I'll be doing something. I'd be doing something and like my low back is just like fried. Yeah. Over some stupid little stuff. And I'm like, I have no such a good reminder, you know, I have no.

[Adam Schafer]

I wish I had a camera on me while sleeping. What the hell was I doing? Maybe I got up and just started.

[Doug]

Doing crazy Hip thrust.

[Justin Andrews]

Hey, have you got. Hey, by the way, have you got rid of the cameras yet? I was, Katrina, I was giving.

[Adam Schafer]

Which one? The cameras in my, my 4 year old's room. We don't have it anymore.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, you have got rid of it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, we got rid of it. I mean. No, we have a camera.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm trying to break my wife.

[Adam Schafer]

No, no, let me back up. We do have a camera in there. We only put it on if we're not, if we're not home, if we're.

[Justin Andrews]

Not the room like that's pretty much.

[Adam Schafer]

No, no, no. If we're not home and someone else is putting them down, then we'll, we'll have it on.

[Justin Andrews]

Okay.

[Adam Schafer]

But otherwise we close it. So he. We don't even have a monitor. We don't have a monitor that listens for sound in this room. Now my two year old, we do. Cuz she's two.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

So she'll wake up and. Yeah. Let us know.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

For sure. Breaking my wife is the hardest part of That I know is getting her to let go of that.

[Adam Schafer]

You just wait till. Yeah. What is she gonna do when he's a teenager's gonna keep it on?

[Justin Andrews]

Well, I know. That's why I'm like, I mean, that'll stop real. So if you say. If you tell her that she likes coughs. Of course not. But it's like, okay, well, he's five. Yeah, I know. Was it seven then? Is it nine? Like, what age are you thinking? Like, when does it become not okay to do that?

[Adam Schafer]

Because he could just come out and tell you guys or yell from his room.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, he could do all the things you can. Open doors, communicate. There's no. There's no reason. It's only her. It has nothing to do with him. There's nothing in there.

[Adam Schafer]

You know, put one in your bedroom from when you're not home or not around, and she'll be like, why do you have this in here? Like, I just want to make sure you're.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, you don't like.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I mean, I just don't. What I don't know is what that. What kind of, you know, repercussions from doing that for too long could be. And I just would rather not.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, he knows he's fire. He knows there's a king.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, he'll talk to the camera.

[Adam Schafer]

That's the repercussion, is that he always thinks, mom, Dad's watching him.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Yeah. So he. When he wants something, he. Dad, could you send daddy in here?

[Doug]

Little intercoms can do that.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Request. Could you bring me my water, please? He's like, no, bro.

[Doug]

Hungry.

[Adam Schafer]

Hey, did I tell you guys what I got? One of the gifts I got for Christmas? Actually one of the best gifts I ever got because it was thoughtful. So. My wife hates buying presents for me. She's like, it's your money. I don't like buying presents for you. I'm like, honey, it's our money. But she's like, I don't know what you want. You get whatever you want. But anyway, she was. She did a great job. She got me a mini fridge for the room so I could put my Peptides and stuff in there. I'm so happy about that. That's a great gift. So now I have, like, a little area.

[Justin Andrews]

That's a really good gift with my pep.

[Doug]

It looks like a guitar amp. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Really?

[Doug]

Yeah, same thing.

[Justin Andrews]

No, that's a great. Did you guys hear? I got Max. Did you see his. The bowser. Oh, the bowser jersey.

[Doug]

Yeah. I didn't see that? That was all framed. So nice.

[Justin Andrews]

That's so cool.

[Doug]

I didn't even know they had a bowser jersey.

[Justin Andrews]

I. I mean, shout out to Steve, right? Who does. Who gets my jerseys for me. And so that. He's so talented. So good. He does all this stuff. He creates all this stuff. And so good. And I. I was excited about it, so that was the thing I was most worried about.

[Adam Schafer]

Like, he can't play with it.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. He's five, right. So it's just like, you know, and it's not a small gift. It's like a big deal. Right? That was his big Santa gift. And all I thought about was like, oh, man. Like, this is gonna suck when, you know, he's like, oh, cool, dad doesn't really care.

[Adam Schafer]

Or can I open it and put it on?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. And so, no, I have a video, actually. I'll share the video so people on YouTube can see. But he opened it and it was like. I totally was, like, so happy that he. Katrina's like, do you like it? And he's like, I like it. I don't like it. I love it. Oh, yeah, dude. So, yeah, he was. Yeah, he's into it. It was cool. That was his big gift from Santa. But of course, we got him, like, you know, Santa also got him a train, train LEGO set with it. I, you know, I tell you what, I'm so impressed with, you know that LEGO is a privately owned company. Privately owned company. I believe it's worth 14 or 16 billion dollars.

[Adam Schafer]

Wow.

[Justin Andrews]

How many companies do you know that are privately owned? Privately owned and in the tens of billions of dollars. Do you know any? I don't know any other.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Do you know any other?

[Doug]

All the collabs with major brands, they've done so clutch, still stayed, you know, independent.

[Justin Andrews]

Like that, that, that. That Mario one they've done recently is probably one of the most. I mean, I wish they had that.

[Doug]

When I was a kid. I would have gone crazy.

[Justin Andrews]

They have. They've bled me dry. Because it just.

[Adam Schafer]

It's. It's also great. It's great learning.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, that's why. That's why it gets me. Because it's like, it's so good for him. I mean, he's quiet, interactive hours doing it, learning. It's good for dexterity. I mean, it's good for so many things. And so. And the fact that he loves it, it's like, I'm such a sucker for, oh, we built. What's the next one? You know what I'm saying? And so they just will you and they will you. They made them interactive now. Right? You know how they all.

[Adam Schafer]

You told me about that.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, yeah. So they all have, like, build your.

[Doug]

Level and he goes through the whole thing.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[Justin Andrews]

They have little QR things on it that scan it, and then they interact with different. And they all interact with all the other pieces. So like, once you buy the main one that has the speaker or whatever, the little Mario or Luigi or whatever main character is, and you build him, it interacts with every other one that you buy in the future.

[Adam Schafer]

That's great.

[Justin Andrews]

So, I mean, it's just a smart way to keep the kids, like, wanting more of them.

[Adam Schafer]

We got. Got Aurelius or so, you know, you get these flashes of like, oh, that's definitely my kid. You know what he wanted for Chris? And he got what he wanted. But he wanted an amp farm. He wanted a telescope, bro. And a rock polisher.

[Doug]

Hell, yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, you got the rock polisher.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Have you started it yet?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, dude. It takes.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I know.

[Adam Schafer]

A month.

[Justin Andrews]

I know.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay. I'm not exaggerating.

[Justin Andrews]

It is.

[Adam Schafer]

It takes a month.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

You put the rocks.

[Justin Andrews]

It's like three. Three week. Phases, processes.

[Adam Schafer]

But he's all psyched about it. He was all psyched about. About it. And it's. We have it in the garage running. And he goes out there, his amp farm. He'll just watch it. He'll just sit there and watch it and like, oh, they're building some over here.

[Doug]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

I think these guys are fighting.

[Doug]

Endless entertainment.

[Adam Schafer]

And then the telescope put spiders in there. Oh, what? Why?

[Doug]

Because you watch them tear it apart.

[Adam Schafer]

Shut up.

[Doug]

Yeah, they all gang up on him.

[Adam Schafer]

Swear.

[Doug]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

So I could put a spider.

[Doug]

Absolutely.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, my God. He'll lose his mind.

[Doug]

He will.

[Adam Schafer]

He will lose. You did that all day long while I'm doing that. For sure. I was the best.

[Doug]

We were always introducing other variables in there. How are they gonna react? Put a little yellow jacket in there.

[Adam Schafer]

Hell yeah, dude.

[Doug]

It's like gladiator games.

[Justin Andrews]

That's great.

[Adam Schafer]

Did I tell you? Oh, I didn't tell you guys what my 15 year old said. So she said, hey. She says, papa, you know what everybody at my school is wearing? I said, what? Vori.

[Justin Andrews]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

All the. She's like, they're.

[Justin Andrews]

They've made it, man. They're official.

[Adam Schafer]

Yori is now like, that's what the kids want, not the other.

[Justin Andrews]

I wonder. I wonder what. If you got any new articles. I haven't seen anything lately, but I'd love to See the comparison of Lulu, how much they've. They've caught up and.

[Adam Schafer]

Or Lulu's still huge. Still.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean, they're massive. And a huge head start. Right. But I mean, they. I tell you what, Viori has been taking a big chunk of that market share, I think so for a while now.

[Adam Schafer]

I know.

[Justin Andrews]

So it's.

[Adam Schafer]

But to hear that from my daughter, you know, she's 15, so.

[Justin Andrews]

And a girl. Because they really went after the male market first. I mean, that was like they did the flip of Lulu, which was such a brilliant strategy. Right. Like, Lululemon did the whole go for women yoga pants first, and then they have like a small men's line. Viori saw. Oh, here's a great. I'll go for the men and then we'll flip it and do the girls. Have you got any stats on them?

[Sal Destefano]

Well, the valuation for Lulu is 46 billion.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. See?

[Justin Andrews]

Wow.

[Sal Destefano]

I think Viori's four to six.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm not sure which is. Okay, so they're 10 times bigger. But Vori just. Yeah, it's just 10 years ago was nothing.

[Doug]

I know, right?

[Adam Schafer]

While it's huge 10 years ago.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Vori's quality is. Is, I think, light years ahead of. I have stuff from Vori that we got.

[Doug]

These pants are like five years old.

[Adam Schafer]

And they don't pill. You know, you don't, you know, like, like the other stuff will pill or whatever. No pilling. Looks like it's brand new five years later. And I wear it every single day. Their stuff is just next.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, no, I think. I think what's happened is I think Lululemon came out the gates early. They were the first and they were known for. I mean, come on. They were the first, like, you know, $100 yoga pants. They didn't even exist before them. So they introduced that athleisure wear market of clothes that you could wear to the gym and then also wear out. And so that they started that market. So of course they have a big. A good grip of it. But then I feel like their stuff is leveled or even dipped as far as the quality and with the innovation. And I think Vori has just been taking. Taking a piece out of that every year. So it's cool to see that happen.

[Adam Schafer]

All right, I want to give. So 1998 was Lulu. So that's. That company's been around.

[Doug]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

When was Vori founded? Do we know?

[Justin Andrews]

Question 2015, maybe much later. Way later.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

So they were really early when we. When we got a hold of them.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

So I mean, 10 years. 12 years.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. What is, let's see, 2015. 2015. Wow. They went to 4 billion in 10 years.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

In less than 10 years.

[Sal Destefano]

5.5 billion.

[Adam Schafer]

5.5 billion. Okay, so that's crazy.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes. I mean, it's only a matter of time, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

That's a skyrocket.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. At this point it's just, it's just a matter of time before they, they take a bigger chunk out of. Out of them by that market.

[Adam Schafer]

I wanted to give a shout out to an Instagram page. It's actually a supplement company. We don't work with them.

[Justin Andrews]

You're gonna shout that page.

[Adam Schafer]

I am, dude.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh my God.

[Doug]

We were enjoying their videos.

[Justin Andrews]

Dangerous for you to shout some coming out and know very little about them yet.

[Adam Schafer]

The ad.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm gonna caution our listeners until we further. We know more information. Well, that's an early shout out, guy.

[Doug]

Hopefully they send us some products.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't know. Listen, they're. I've seen now 15 videos on Instagram. They kill me. They actually kill me. They're hilarious. It's. What, what was it? Stiff lip. Is it, is it, Is that what the name of it? Let me let, let me look it up. I think it's stiff lip pre workout or something like that. But their ads are just stiff lip sups Sif lips. Their ads are. It's a little, the humor is like.

[Doug]

Whatever, you know, it's my military guys.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm, I'm curious to see how the, how the they, how they taste. So we'll see when they.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, they're, they're, they're pre workout because.

[Justin Andrews]

To me it has to taste decent for that to be.

[Adam Schafer]

I just like the ads. I think they're brilliant, hilarious ads. They're so funny.

[Doug]

They're really funny.

[Adam Schafer]

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[Sal Destefano]

First question is from Kathy Steinhilb. What is the best exercise to really target my rear rear delts without the upper back taking over.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh. So first let's talk about the value of developing the rear delts from an aesthetic perspective. So the rear delts are important for stabilizing the shoulder. It's the back of your shoulder. Yeah.

[Doug]

Functional reasons.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, it's functional. It protects the shoulder joint from, you know, throwing or swinging. And you want that balance, you want that strength. But from an aesthetic point of view, a well developed rear delt will do more to give your shoulders that round look than any other part of the shoulder. Really. It's true. Everybody thinks it's the side delt. That's the side delt's important. So is the front delt. But it's the rear delta that gives you that real nice shoulder look, especially from the side.

[Doug]

A full line that goes across.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right. Now, the best exercise that I found is the one that's most commonly done. The problem is everybody. Not everybody. A lot of people do it wrong.

[Doug]

They perform it wrong.

[Adam Schafer]

Our rear fly. Now, if you don't want to involve the back muscles because it could easily turn into almost a row, you keep the elbows out, you roll your shoulders forward. Do not retract the scapula. It's a very short movement. This is a rear Dell isolating fly. If I start to bring the scapula back now, I come back further and I.

[Doug]

It feels weird because it's such a short range of motion, but, yeah, you really have to keep it to that.

[Justin Andrews]

So I have a lot of thoughts and opinions about this because it was a major focus for mine for a long time, and I find that the best exercise would be like a rear delt flight. The problem with it done free weight wise, which free weights typically are phenomenal, is it's such a short range of motion where the rear delts really kick in that it doesn't give people a lot of time to focus on that. And since it's such a very meticulous.

[Adam Schafer]

Weight is really only heavy at the top.

[Justin Andrews]

That's right. So I find cables are far better for this, especially when it comes to the teaching. Once you've learned how to activate the rear delts really well, then heavy dumbbell rear flies are incredible to do. And I. And I love doing them, but teaching somebody, I love to go really light on cables, and I've done a YouTube video on this. My favorite movement is the cable kind of pull through is where you do a rear delt single fly one side at a time.

[Doug]

One arm.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, one at a time, real lightweight. And I'm, and I'm, I'm taking it in the stretch position so I feel the rear delt stretch and the whole time I'm thinking about it and then I get a squeeze at the, at the end and I'm flying out, not back. And I, and with a lightweight full range like that, constant tension on it, it seems to be one of the best movements that I can teach clients on how to activate the rear delt really well. Then I could take them to other movements that I think are, are phenomenal. For rear delta, I think you do things like upright rows and you can do things like rear delt dumbbell flies, table cable. You do all kinds of stuff for them that are great pull apart. But the key is really learning how to do that. And it's so easy for the bigger muscles.

[Adam Schafer]

Go light is the key here because you add too much weight, you'll do the movement but then becomes a back exercise. Yeah, that's what ends up happening every time. So go real light. Like I, I mean I could go as heavy as 45, 50 pound dumbbells for rear flies, but if I really want to feel my rear delts and I really want to isolate them, it's like 20 pounds.

[Justin Andrews]

I've done several videos on our, our Mind Pump TV YouTube channel about rear delt stuff and the cues and the exercises that I like in there. So if you haven't looked at that, go to the Mind Pump TV channel.

[Sal Destefano]

Next question is from Kat M. Sherman. What do I do if reverse dieting never works and I just continuously gain fat above 1800 calories?

[Adam Schafer]

Okay. So the most common reason why this will happen is you, is it has more, has almost everything to do with your workouts. Okay. So if you are training properly and appropriately and you're getting stronger and building muscle, then the reverse diet will work because it's going to muscle and the metabolism is speeding up. If you're over training or just doing tons of cardio or not strength training and you're just bumping your calories, you're going to gain body fat. You're going to gain body fat because it's not going to muscle, it's not going to the faster metabolism. That's the most common reason why this happens. And I would say it's probably 85 or 90% of people who experience this.

[Justin Andrews]

That's why I would agree with that. And I'd say the other 15% are eating in a surplus. Let's say that they are Actually following a good program, they're following a MAPS program and they're still complaining of this. Then normally what the problem is, is they're eating in a surplus, but they're not hitting their protein intake.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

So I'll have clients are like, okay, we're reverse dieting. Okay. I've got this great protocol program, but. Oh, but I still have such a hard time hitting my protein intake. And it's like you're sending a great signal because you got a great program to build muscle. You're reverse dieting like you're supposed to, but then you're not hitting your protein. And the protein is the building blocks for building the muscle. And if you don't do that and you just eat in a caloric surplus, there's a very good chance that those additional calories just get partitioned over to building or building fat. So that is the. Is the problem. Normally it's one or the other or a combination of the two that cause people to not see the results.

[Adam Schafer]

There is a small percentage of people that have hormone issues where that can also contribute to this.

[Justin Andrews]

That would be the next one, I would say.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. So it's like low testosterone or your progesterone estrogen are off, your thyroid is low. That can also play a role in your inability to speed up your metabolism through a reverse diet. But vast majority of times you're just not properly strength training. If you're reverse dieting and not getting stronger, it's your strength training. If you're reverse dieting and just doing tons of cardio, it's not going to work. If you're overtrained, not going to work has to be appropriate. And if you build muscle, then it will work.

[Sal Destefano]

Next question is from EFN Coaching. If you had to pick a way to build a hybrid trainer business from the ground up with multiple revenue streams, how would you do it?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, I, first off, look, this is how I would do it today. So if I. And I'm going to rep us. And yes, I know I'm a little biased, but it's, it's also objectively true. If I became a trainer today, the resources that you are, you have available to you are, are pretty amazing. We didn't have these resources when we started as trainers. We didn't have almost any resources. But today, if I were to start out as a trainer, first thing I would do is get our course. The course that we have developed answers all these questions in depth. You get to hear three guys that did this for two decades and were Successful at it. Before we ever start a podcast and we break this down on what to do, whether you start in a big box gym or private studio or online or whatever, where to start first, what's going to work, how long it should take, what the process looks like. I mean we break it down for you so that, that would be the first place that would start. Now to be more specific, start. The best place to start in my opinion, in my strong opinion as a trainer would be in a big box gym. You work for the big box gym, you learn from their systems, you get their leads, because that takes a while to learn how to do. And you get experience working in a busy big box gym and start there and master that before you ever consider doing anything else. I think if you start out thinking you do five different things at one time and you haven't done any of them, it's your first time and you're like, I'm going to do four different things. I'm going to master social media, online training, you know, training people in person. You're probably going to fail at all of them. Start in the big box gym, kick ass there, then look at the next.

[Doug]

I mean, there's still the paralysis by analysis. Like a lot of times I think that we try to give really good advice, but you have to just get going and you have to iterate and then you have to obviously go for the resources that are going to help you succeed. And I do look like at our courses is the closest thing you're going to find to a virtual mentorship. And, and that's something that I found a lot of value in is really like shadowing other really qualified trainers and, and learning and, and really observing them and, and watching how they interact with their clients and picking up a lot of their business habits. And it's just so invaluable to, to peer into that and learn from somebody else. But really, I mean for me, like what I've seen the most is like just you gotta put it in, you gotta get going and you gotta sort of iterate as you go.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean this is all the stuff that we address in our course. But let's say this person doesn't get that and the things that I would tell this person, I would start in person training and I would also start social media. So Instagram, YouTube, Facebook, whatever. And all the posts that I would do would be related to my client that I'm helping out. So the idea is I'm getting practice by training people in person. I'm building content that's going to support and add value to my one or five clients that I have, which also serves as I'm hopefully going to attract other people that are like the people I'm already helping. So I've already proven that I can help those type of people, and so I'll slowly try that. It also works as a litmus test of how you would build an online business, because if you're putting out content and nobody is paying attention to you for free, you're certainly not gonna be able to sell people online, any sort of training program or anything you have to offer until you first prove that. Then I would go through mind Pump's top 100 YouTube videos that have got, that have already gone viral and have seen, you know, hundred thousand or millions of views. And then I would watch them, and then I would use that as a way to steer my content. And I just put in my own words. I would listen to what those three knuckleheads had to say that made it go viral and thought, oh, that's really good information. My values align with them. As a coach and as a trainer, let me learn to put in my own words and say that one that helps me learn because I, I listened, I watched it, I then regurgitate it, which means it's just going to hopefully concrete and into my own mind, become my own ideas, and gives me good practice. And then I'm using them as a litmus test because they've already gone out and created tens of thousands of pieces of content. And there's ones that have done great and ones that haven't done so great. The ones that have done great tells me that more people want to hear that information. And so I would build my online content around ours. I mean, I, I tell trainers this all the time. I think it's crazy that you try and reinvent the wheel, go do something different when you have guys like us that have already kind of paved the way. And we encourage trainers to use our programs to use our content. I mean, our goal was always to elevate the space. And so we're not trying to hoard our information or say, oh, don't copy us. Don't use. Use our stuff. If you're a coach and a trainer. We're trying to make better coaches and trainers. That's the way we're going to impact the fitness industry more than any other way.

[Adam Schafer]

And we do free webinars all the time for transit coaches. That's right. Trainerwebinar.com mom, we do them every other Month. So we get on there and we teach you specific things.

[Sal Destefano]

So next question is from Jenny K. Mom, what are your thoughts on weight vests for walking?

[Adam Schafer]

I don't like them at all. Unless you're training to ruck. Unless you're doing something, you're going to train for an event that requires you to wear a weighted vest or a backpack or something like that, in which case then it makes sense. But here's why I don't like weighted vests for walking in general. Changes your biomechanics, increases your risk of injury, and it does very little to improve the benefits or health effects of walking. If anything, if you were to look at overall look at walking versus walking with the weight vest and looking at the health effects and you factor in risk of injury problems, the weighted vest actually decreases the value of walking. Now, the average person thinks wearing a weight vest is going to give me so much better results. It's heavier, it's harder. This is going to make it. No, it's, it's not. Yes, it'll make you better at walking with weight on you, which is, if that's what you want, great. But if you're walking for leisure, for enjoyment, or just for general health, avoid the weight vest.

[Justin Andrews]

So I'm assuming this is coming from probably somebody who listens to us and listens to our friend Chalene Johnson. Chalene's done a lot of content in the last, like, I don't know, couple months or maybe even a little bit longer since she's been wearing a weight vest every time that she walks. And I think that this stems from a study that she read about weight bearing on bone density and about reversing.

[Adam Schafer]

Osteoporosis, which weighted walking to reverse osteoporosis pales in comparison to just strength training.

[Doug]

Weight training, it's literally much more effective.

[Adam Schafer]

It's sending a weakened substitute signal for strength training. Okay, so strength training will do far more for bone density than weighted vest walking.

[Doug]

I'm not a fan of any weighted cardio. Really.

[Adam Schafer]

Weighted vest walking is going to be better for bone density than non weighted vest walking. If that's all you do. But if you want to. But again, if you factor in, because Chalene's fit, she's fit and healthy, you take the average person who doesn't walk, you know, more than 4,000 steps a day and they're like, you know, I'm going to start doing 30 minutes walks and they throw a weight vest on, they're gonna notice ankle pain, knee pain.

[Doug]

Changes your recruitment patterns.

[Adam Schafer]

And Then changes all of it.

[Doug]

Yeah. So it's, it's. Again, it's one of those things. It, it seems like it logically makes sense based off of, like, if I'm adding an increasing progressive load to whatever I'm doing, my muscles should be affected. But it's, it's really not gonna have the same kind of impact as just being disciplined in the training and building up your muscles through weight training that we've already proven. These specific types of exercises are much more effective at building. That's, you know, cardio is a totally different animal. And now adding weight to that, it, it, it's not as beneficial as you think.

[Justin Andrews]

So I'm gonna play devil's advocate because I think I've already said my opinion on weight vest for a very long time on this show and how I feel. We're all in agreements on it. After hearing Chalene's justification of how she does it, I would say that I understand the low barrier to entry person. Somebody who's never done any sort of weight training but walks all the time. And adding the vest to their walk may help reverse osteoporosis. That they're already heading that direction.

[Adam Schafer]

So they're already consistent. They're walking.

[Justin Andrews]

You're already walking and stuff like that. And you, and you add now £10 and you don't do strength training. It's better than that. It's better than not. Right. So I can, I can get that. And I also get the advice of this is just the first easy step that somebody can make. But to Sal's point, if I can get a client to squat just one time every two weeks, it'll be more than that. It'll be more effective than that.

[Doug]

Carry so much further.

[Justin Andrews]

So it'll be more effective than that person who walks every single day for a half hour to hour with a weighted vest. If I can get them to squat one time every two weeks, that's how. How powerful that can be. And so if I, if I had to choose as a trainer, I would always go that direction for sure, because I think I can convince my client to it. Squat at least once a week. And so we're going to get more benefits. But if I have somebody who is deathly afraid of doing.

[Adam Schafer]

Refuse to do.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, Refuse to do it. And it's like, well, at least do this.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

At least you're walking every day anyways. Just throw on a vest because that'll help slow down this osteoporosis that's happening for you. Then I could see Myself as a trainer going like, that's better than nothing.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

But I think there's better ways to skin this calf. That's what we're trying to do.

[Doug]

Yeah. Even in between that, I think I would, I would prefer for them to do more incline for resistance, if that's what they're seeking. A little more chance.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what's interesting too, about the data? So what gets communicated, and this is where it gets mixed up. Right. People are like, oh, weight bearing or impact is good for bone. Well, look at the studies on long distance runners and their bone strength. It's not that much better than someone who's sedentary. It is not a pro building form of exercise. And most of the bone density gains that they see are in the lower extremities. They see none in their upper extremities. A weighted vest will add some to the spine and some to the lower extremities. Over nothing.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Or over just walking quickly.

[Doug]

Adapt those.

[Adam Schafer]

But it's very, it's very, It's. That's it, though. You. You're stopped. You stop a little bit of strength training. So, okay, fine. You, you're gonna walk six days a week for 30 minutes or for an hour. What if you just did 30 minutes once a week of three exercises?

[Justin Andrews]

That's right. The reason why that this.

[Adam Schafer]

And it would surpass it.

[Justin Andrews]

This, this is why this information is not complete. Because again, I think I can convince anybody who's ever sat at the desk across from me and that's trying to get in shape, that is trying to also reverse osteoporosis, and they go, hey, Adam, I heard that I could wear a weighted vest. I already do these walks every day for an hour. I heard if I put this ten pound vest on, I, that could, that could help me. And they, they quote the study. So. Okay, that's great. Then I would come back and say, or what we could do is I could teach you how to squat. And we just do that once a week and over time, as we get a little bit stronger and we'll start with body weight, and then I'm going to add a, a 45 pound bar, and then I'm going to add 10 pounds and I do that over time with you, that is going to do so much more for reversing osteoporosis than you walking every single day with your weighted vest.

[Adam Schafer]

I had a client.

[Justin Andrews]

It pales in comparison. And unfortunately, we. Somebody hasn't done a study to show the difference of those two head to head and It's. But if it's a. I can't get them to do that and they're already walking, it's like, okay, well, then at least do that.

[Adam Schafer]

Here's an easy way to understand this. What builds muscle builds bone. So let's rephrase the question. What. How much muscle am I going to build by walking with a weighted vest versus lifting weights? Yeah, the difference is profound. That same difference. That same difference. So it's so.

[Justin Andrews]

It's so profound, Sal, that that's why I use the example of once every two weeks. You don't even need to do that much to pass all that walking with the weighted vest.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right. So my point with that is if you're walking now and you add ten pounds, you'll build a little bit of extra strength and muscle. But nobody's going to say that's a great way to build muscle. What builds muscle builds bone. Strength training builds muscle. That's why it builds bone. So damn effect. I had a client, I've brought her up before Linda. She was. She worked with me for years. She had a. They couldn't determine. It was an undetermined autoimmune, they think, issue where her bones were just getting weaker and weaker and weaker. They put her on Fosamax, I think was the name of the medication to try and stop the loss. She was a professor. One of her students happened to be a trainer that worked for me years ago, said, oh, you should go work with my friend Sal. Anyway, she hired me and we did strength training one to two days a week. And she got bone density tests relatively regularly because of how quickly her bones were weakening. Okay. And she was a tiny woman, petite, and she was active. She walked, she did weighted walking, she hiked, she did everything. She ate a healthy diet. This is why it was a big mystery. They couldn't figure out what was going on. We strength trained, and I mean, very appropriate strength training for a woman who was at the time, she was, I want to say, over 60, you know, never strength trained before. So it was like body weight squats, and little by little, we would progress her. I remember she went to one of her first bone density tests after training with me for, I think it was like four or five months. And her doctor did another one because he thought there was something wrong with this test. And he said, okay, this is crazy. What are you doing right now? She's like, I'm working out. And he's like, how much? Oh, I see my trainer style once a week. So he got in contact with me. And they actually turned her into a case study of strength training, its effects on bone density. And it was once a week, nothing crazy, nothing hardcore. We maybe complete three exercises in the session.

[Justin Andrews]

This is, this is why, I mean, again, anybody who's been listening to this show long enough has heard me gripe about, you know, taking a study and, and running with it is because it's, it's in this, it's always in this like very controlled environment and it doesn't tell the full story. And it's like, it's like 12 weeks. And it's like, yeah, of course, yeah, it's one, it's, it's done in a short period of time. And it's like, okay, well, let's take that out a year. Where's that same person? It's not fair. If it's like, okay, but if I could convince that person to squat once a week, how, how much do they compare to that person? It's like, dude, it's not even close. It's not even close. And I think, Sal, you're right. One of the best, easiest ways for somebody that's more concerned about bone health is the same things that will build your muscles are the same things that are going to build your bones.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right.

[Justin Andrews]

High protein diet, strength training. And if you, and if you're afraid to go all in on strength training and you want to ease your way in, then literally even just starting with body weight movements. Okay. Or like a map starter type of program, that's really basic and foundational, fundamental. That will do so much more for bone than walking with.

[Adam Schafer]

You mentioned protein. People like the bones don't require protein to build any calcium. And this, that and the other. First off, there's a little bit of protein that builds bone, but it's because muscle anchors on bone.

[Justin Andrews]

That's right. So as muscles build, they have to adapt.

[Adam Schafer]

They have to. So when the, when the muscles are stronger and anchoring and pulling on the tendons that pull on the bone and pulling on and the ligaments have to strengthen, the bone also has to strengthen. So the strongest bones you'll ever see, ever in bone density tests are weightlifters, powerlifters, bodybuilders. If you look at their bone density tests, there is not, there is no other type of human that has more dense, strong bones than those people right there because they lift weights. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. Justin can be found at mindpumpjustin. You can look at me. Mindpump. Distephano and Adam mindpump Adam thank you.

[Sal Destefano]

For listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically, improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB Super Bundle includes Maps, Anabolic Maps, Performance and Maps Aesthetic nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

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