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Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth
2543: Beware of This Kind of "Scientific" Fat Loss or Muscle Building Study...It May be Flowed & More (Listener Coaching)
01:07:57
In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin answer four Pump Head questions from the Sunday @mindpumpmedia Quah post. Mind Pump Fit Tip: If you follow scientific studies to determine what to do for fat loss and muscle gain, STOP NOW!...
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- [00:00]
Mandy
If you love chilling mysteries, unsolved cases and a touch of mom style humor, Moms and Mysteries is the podcast you've been searching for. Hey guys, I'm Mandy.
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Melissa
And I'm Melissa.
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Mandy
Join us every Tuesday for Moms and.
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Melissa
Mysteries, your gateway to gripping, well researched true crime stories.
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Mandy
Each week we deep dive into a.
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Melissa
Variety of mind boggling cases as we.
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Mandy
Shed light on everything from heists to whodunits.
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Melissa
We're your go to podcast for Mysteries.
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Mandy
With a motherly touch.
- [00:26]
Melissa
Subscribe now to Moms and Mysteries. Wherever you get your podcast, stop wasting.
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Mandy
Time scrolling through endless clickbait, social media and emails trying to keep up with the news.
- [00:36]
Melissa
Instead, listen to all the news you need in just 10 minutes. Welcome. Welcome to the Newsworthy.
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Mandy
The Newsworthy podcast makes it faster, easier.
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Melissa
And more enjoyable to get unbiased news on the go. It helps us navigate the news without feeling overwhelmed, even when my time is limited. So much detail and information in 10 minutes.
- [00:55]
Mandy
Listen now by searching the newsworthy in your podcast app or go to thenewsworthy.com if you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go.
- [01:07]
Sal Destefano
Mind Pump Mind Pump with your hosts Sal Destefano, Adam Schafer and Justin Andrews.
- [01:14]
Mandy
You just found the most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. Today's episode we had listeners write in and we got to help them out on air. So we answered questions. This was after the intro by the way. The intro was 53 minutes long. In the intro we talk about like current science, fitness, diet information. It's a great time. After that we got to answering the questions. By the way, if you want to write in some questions that we might pick, go to Instagram indpump Media now. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Element Electrolyte powder that you put into your water. Tastes good. No artificial sweeteners, no sugar. Go check them out. Go to drinklement.com mindpump on that link. You'll get a free sample pack with any drink mix purchase. This episode is also brought to you by Caldera Lab. They make natural skin care products that are exceptional. They're blowing up. Go check them out. Go to calderalab.com mindpump Use the code mindpump20. Get 20% off your first order. Also, we are offering group coaching here at Mind Pump. If you want to get coached by our trainers and by us, go to mindpumpgroupcoaching.com Sign yourself up. So long as there's Spots available. You can do it. Finally, one day left for our February special, Maps Anabolic and the NO BS six pack formula we put together for a price that's Super Low. It's $59.99 for both programs. You can find them now. They're going to be gone tomorrow. You can find them now@maps February.com. all right, here comes the show. You're trying to burn body fat and build muscle and you're looking at scientific studies. What's the best way to do. So stop right now, don't look at those studies. Consider this first. All right, I'll start with the first thing you'll look at, which is how big was the sample size in the study? This is important to look at. And by the way, studies can be very valuable, but sometimes they're not valuable at all and they can point you in the wrong direction. And this is when you need to be very, very careful. And one of the things I look at, I just said it, which is how big was the sample size? Was it 10 people? You know, if it's 10 people, then I would be very cautious at interpreting the result as something you can, you can count on. Or was it done with a thousand people? You know, that's something to pay attention to.
- [03:26]
Adam Schafer
What do you think in terms of the average person, percentage wise, just reads the title.
- [03:32]
Mandy
Everybody.
- [03:33]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [03:33]
Adam Schafer
Versus like actually like going through the.
- [03:36]
Melissa
These abstract.
- [03:37]
Mandy
Yeah. Abstracts. Okay, so you know what, because this is obviously, this is my expertise as health and, and fitness, you see a lot of, especially like weight loss study headlines. You see a lot of them, right. Like compound in chocolate has been shown to blah. You know, compound and red wine or this fruit has a fat burning. You know, whatever studies show. And, and I know as a coach and trainers, worked with lots of people and I was also taught a long time ago how to read studies that, that people aren't going to read this study. They're going to pay attention. They're just going to look at this and then they're going to move away from what really is going to make a difference and towards something that makes no difference whatsoever. You know, years ago I had a client who was a professor of psychology and she sat me down because I would talk about studies. And she goes, do you know how to look at studies? And I said, what do you mean? And she broke this down. That was one of the things she said. She's like, we got to look at the sample size. If there's a lot of people in there, that's more likely to be accurate, because very few people. If we pick 10 people to study, I could very well pick out of those 10 people, seven of them who are going to respond really well to what I'm studying or people who may be biased. And so now my study's going to show that something works really great, when in fact it may not. For example, If I pick 10 people and I'm testing the results of a vitamin, maybe six of them actually lack this vitamin. Well, now this vitamin looks like a miracle drug.
- [05:06]
Adam Schafer
Oh yeah.
- [05:07]
Mandy
You know, amazing. Absolutely. So it's really important to pay attention.
- [05:10]
Melissa
I'm looking ahead at all your other points and I don't see this. And I feel like it would belong here. Then with that is also the length of a study.
- [05:18]
Mandy
Yes, yes.
- [05:19]
Melissa
And, and even if it's a good length, it's also something to just be considered like no matter what. So even like a good 90 day or six month long study. Okay, that's great. But in, in the context of what we're talking about and we understand how adapts like that, that still needs to be considered as part of the point.
- [05:38]
Mandy
I'll create a fake example that I think will illustrate this. Right. If we studied cocaine for depression over 30 days, it would look like a great antidepressant. Over 30 days we tested cocaine's effect on depression better. And it was like, this is the most.
- [05:53]
Melissa
Client woke up two hours earlier, client was more productive at work.
- [05:58]
Mandy
Everybody's super happy. Yeah.
- [05:59]
Melissa
Positive, you know, say, yeah, but follow that out for dancing on the side. You know, follow these, all these, follow.
- [06:06]
Mandy
Up for three years and all of a sudden you see cocaine was, you know, terrible on their, on their psyche and their health. But that just gives you your great point, Adam, is the length of study. Exercise studies are, that's one of the things I really look at with exercise studies because when it comes to exercise, strength training and other forms of exercise, cardiovascular training, even flexibility, mobility training, especially with strength training, just changing the very, just, just the novelty effect. Almost always, unless it's like crazy or terrible, almost always has a positive effect. So you could take almost anybody who's strength training. Change a variable like make the reps go high, make the reps go low. Yeah.
- [06:46]
Melissa
How does it say almost everything works until it doesn't?
- [06:49]
Mandy
Almost everything works, but nothing works forever.
- [06:52]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [06:52]
Mandy
So when I look at like a strength training study, I, I always take it with a grain of salt because of the timeframe. And I'd like to see a study that's done for like a year or Two years to make a determination. For example, very. A very commonly cited statistic in strength training. And this is backed by many studies, although now we have so many studies that actually prove what I'm about to say. But, you know, 10, 15, maybe 20 years ago, if somebody said, what's the best rep range to build muscle? Well, the studies were all showing 8 to 12. 8 to 12 was the hypertrophy range. Right. Low reps weren't as effective. High reps were definitely not as effective. But the studies were like 12 or 16 weeks long. If you stretch that out long enough, you'll see that the 8 to 12 reps really stops working and they have to switch out and move into a lower rep phase or a higher rep phase. It also didn't illustrate the fact that all the rep ranges built muscle. So it's not like 8 to 12 built muscle. All the others did nothing. They all built muscle. So then the thing to consider is, okay, when do I use each of those rep ranges and as a trainer when I train people, you know, I noticed if I kept them in a rep range for too long, would stop working. Didn't matter how great my programming was. One of the best things I could do would just change the rep rang. I didn't have to change the exercise or anything else. Just change the, you know, lower the weight and make the reps go higher or vice versa. And then it was like magic. People would start getting results again.
- [08:16]
Melissa
Yeah. And I think the point of this conversation, because I know right away it always tends to ruffle the feathers of the kids that love to the science people touted to lead with all the studies. It's not that to completely disregard studies. It's just that there's another point with experience that I think matters. And I think that you have to take that into consideration and just the nuance when it comes to individuals. I mean, you could have two people that are the same weight, same goal, same age. Yet the approach and results will be vastly different based off of many factors. Their sleep, their hormones, their prior dieting, their attitude, diet habits, their attitude, their. I mean, there's. There's so much when it comes to getting results in building muscle, losing body fat, and such a wide individual variance that what worked for this person. Fantastic. Or what worked in this study so well may not for somebody else. And you just have to consider all that.
- [09:18]
Mandy
Absolutely. You know, another one would be like, what are the controls so control? Like, are they able to weed out variables that could be potentially influencing the result of the study? For Example to do the cigarette and coffee one. I love that one. That's one of my favorites. You know, for a long time, people, studies showed that drinking coffee was correlated to cancer risk. So they thought, they actually used to say coffee probably or may cause cancer. But what they didn't do very well was control for the fact that back in the day, people who drank the most coffee smoked. This was a thing, you know, 30, 40 years ago and before. Right. Everybody.
- [10:00]
Adam Schafer
There's no Starbucks.
- [10:01]
Mandy
Yeah, yeah. Everybody who drank the most coffee was doing it with a cigarette.
- [10:05]
Melissa
Whenever you talk about that, I have, I have such a vivid. I live with my. When I first moved to the Bay Area, I moved here when I was 19, turning 20. And I live with my grandmother. And my grandmother started every morning she would, she would move her little chair and she'd sit over there with her arthritis and she would, she would have a cup of coffee and smoke her cigarette. You know, I'd be getting up for work, getting ready to head off. Yeah, head off to the gym.
- [10:29]
Mandy
Every diner.
- [10:30]
Melissa
There's my grandma at 7:00 in the morning having her cigarette and drinking her coffee at the same time.
- [10:36]
Mandy
Well, there's a synergistic effect between nicotine and caffeine. Everybody knows this. And people now power using the, the nicotine lozenges with caffeine.
- [10:43]
Adam Schafer
Zen and all that.
- [10:44]
Mandy
Yeah, it's like a synergistic, you know, people like the way it feels, but that's what happened. So people thought, until they controlled the cigarette smoking, when they controlled the cigarette smoking, here's what they found. Not only did coffee not cause cancer, it actually prevented cancer. It was actually the opposite of what we thought. Yeah. Another, you know, common one in especially even fat loss and muscle building your health studies is the healthy user bias.
- [11:08]
Melissa
Okay.
- [11:09]
Mandy
That you have to control for. So people who eat a lot of. I'll make one up. Right. People who eat a lot of oranges tend to be healthier. You might think to yourself, oranges are really healthy. But what we don't know are do healthy people who follow healthy lifestyles, who exercise, get more sleep, do other things, do they also eat more oranges? So really, are we looking at a bias of healthy people isolating one thing? Here's another one that I love. Okay. People who eat a lot of red meat have worse health. This is often one that's cited and quoted.
- [11:40]
Adam Schafer
They forever.
- [11:42]
Mandy
And, and the problem with that is.
- [11:43]
Melissa
For decades tease out the fast food people.
- [11:45]
Mandy
Not only that, but for decades we've been hammered. It's been hammered into us that eating red meat is bad for us. Okay. It was government policy, right. Since the 70s on. Even today, they still try to hammer this. And so what ends up happening is you develop a poor health user bias. People who. Average person who generally. And it's changing these days because people are now starting to figure this out. But over the last 60 years, especially if you go 20 years and then before, people who ate the most red meat were people who were typically unhealthy because they ignored the health advice. So they didn't cut their red meat consumption. They also smoked cigarettes. They also didn't exercise. They also. And so you're like, oh, yeah, people eat the most red meat, have the worst health. Because we had a poor health user bias. We now know with controls, which is what I'm talking about, where they actually go in and control all these other factors. Not only is red meat not bad for you, it's also positively correlated with health, with good health, good cognition, et cetera. And I'm talking about whole natural red meat, not just. Not, you know, processed meat, which they often don't also control for.
- [12:51]
Melissa
Well, that's probably what I think the biggest is like, when you don't control for. Because there's a lot of McDonald's and Burger King and Carl's Jr. People, Carl's Jun. Hot dogs and salami that eat that way. And if you include all those, there's nobody. I don't think there's anybody who's trying to say any of that is healthy whatsoever. And so if you, if you just simply took that group out.
- [13:10]
Mandy
That's right.
- [13:10]
Melissa
And then just compared everybody. Oh, be massive.
- [13:13]
Mandy
Yeah. Look at healthy people who eat a lot of red meat and then healthy people who don't eat a lot of red meat. And then what you find is red meat is correlated or connected with better health.
- [13:21]
Adam Schafer
Better health.
- [13:22]
Mandy
In many cases. Um, the next one is like, who was studied. You know, a lot of. I remember when my. My client brought this up to me because she sat. We were talking about a great discussion. One of my favorite. You know, it's one of the things I love about training people is there's, there's. There are moments I distinctly remember with clients because they were all really smart people, where they just taught me a lot. And she sat me down and she said, where do you think they do most of the studies, Sal? And I didn't know. I don't know. They do them like, I don't know, labs. She's still laughing.
- [13:47]
Melissa
She's like, Colleges, young college men.
- [13:49]
Mandy
And they, and what they do. Yeah, what they do is they recruit, they put out a study and they say we're looking for, you know, 50 people to be a part of a study and we're going to pay you like, you know, 40 bucks a day.
- [14:00]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [14:00]
Mandy
And she's like, and she's like, who do you think signs up for that? She's like young college men who, who don't have a lot of money gig.
- [14:07]
Adam Schafer
That you could just go get, you know, a couple bucks.
- [14:09]
Melissa
Don't mind me, the guinea pig.
- [14:10]
Adam Schafer
Don't worry about the risk.
- [14:11]
Mandy
Yeah, it's a bunch of 20 year old dudes who are like, don't have no money. They're like, I'll take a pill or I'll go, you know, do the study where I don't sleep for three days or whatever. And so you have is a bias of young college aged males, typically in many of these studies. So what if you're an older man, what if you're a woman, what if you're pregnant, what if you're, you know, menopausal? You have to look at who was studied and does it actually apply? This one is another great one with exercise. You take a bunch of college aged males and you're looking at hiit cardio and it looks like a panacea. But when I trained lots of middle aged everyday people, hiit cardio was hit or miss. Sometimes it was great, sometimes terrible. It was just too intense and too stressful. But you take, you give me a bunch of 20 year olds and hiit cardio is probably gonna outperform any other form of cardio. So you have to look at who was in the study as well. And then here's another one. Does it follow a consensus? Okay, I like meta analysis because meta analysis is where they, it's a study of studies.
- [15:18]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [15:18]
Mandy
So they're like, what effect does carbohydrate.
- [15:21]
Adam Schafer
Them all together, right?
- [15:21]
Mandy
Yes. What effect does carbohydrate intake have on fat gain or fat loss? How effective are low carb diets for this? How good is fasting for that? How good is whatever? And then what they'll do is they'll take 10 studies that are peer reviewed, meaning they're all accepted as studies, and then they'll give you the consensus of all the studies. Meta analysis are, for me, that's one of the best places to look in.
- [15:47]
Melissa
Terms of any idea how often those end up disproving a lot of studies? Like once they start to, to, to draw correlations from other data points. Does that many time end up like throwing a lot of studies off?
- [16:00]
Adam Schafer
Some of them, yeah.
- [16:01]
Melissa
Like, do you know how often?
- [16:01]
Mandy
Like, I don't know how often, but I do. Like, I'll give you a diet example. When low carb, you know, keto dieting or, or Atkins kind of became popular in the 90s, the initial study showed it was like great for weight loss. It was great for weight loss. But then we had more and more and more and more studies and we found that it didn't assist in fat loss. But what happened is people lost more water weight faster, which is what happens. Right. So if you're measuring just weight and you go no carb and someone else goes in a calorie deficit, both same, everything's the same. The difference is one's low carb, one is whatever, you know, higher carb, but the calories are the same and let's say the protein is good. What you end up seeing is initial weight loss being on the scale, showing up faster and greater in the low carb diet. Or that's because of weight, because of water weight. When you go low carb, your body flushes out a bunch of water. It's a very easy way to lose 10 pounds on the scale. I mean, if I went no carb today, I would lose 10 pounds by the end of next week. But probably 1 pound of fat if it was in a deficit. If not, I'd lose no fat. I just lose a bunch of water weight.
- [17:05]
Melissa
Yeah. And for the person who's freaking out saying no way, it's you. So three to ten pounds is what I used to say. Like I have a lot of muscle mass, you're a big guy and you would lose 10, easily fluctuate that. But I mean, most of my female clients, it was a good solid three, four pounds.
- [17:21]
Mandy
Yep.
- [17:21]
Melissa
You know that they would lose just by pulling all the water out.
- [17:24]
Mandy
That's right. Next up is, does it apply to you in any way whatsoever?
- [17:30]
Melissa
Oh, yes. Will you even do it?
- [17:32]
Mandy
That's it. Like if I look at this study and it passed the test, like, big sample size done for a long time, great controls. It's a meta analysis and it's telling me that I'm going to burn 15% more body fat if I exercise at 3am outdoors.
- [17:51]
Adam Schafer
Consistently do that.
- [17:52]
Mandy
Yeah. I'm using an extreme example, but that, no, it doesn't apply to me. I'm not going to wake up at 2:30.
- [17:57]
Melissa
Okay. A good example of this is the way we talk about taking your Creatine. This, the research shows that the most optimal time to take your creatine within 30 minutes to an hour of your workout. Yeah, but if you're somebody who is not going to be carrying all your supplements everywhere you go and you're, it's very easy. You can take first thing in the morning with your vitamins and breakfast or at night before you go to bed, you're more likely to follow that. Then it doesn't matter. So even though the, the studies will show this is the more optimal time, if you're more likely to be inconsistent because that's inconvenient at that time, it's not effective anymore. Exactly. Then the other times are superior because you'll be more.
- [18:34]
Mandy
Let me piggyback off that. Right. Creatine monohyde. I'll use creatine like you said, you know, five grams a day. Let's just say great studies show that's great, it's awesome. And then company comes out like some of our partners with gummy creatine, and it's like, wow, gummy. Oh, but that's going to add seven grams of sugar. Except I don't like powder. I don't use the powder. A lot of people don't take the powder. They stop taking it. So the gummies are going to make me take it more. So I had seven grams of sugar. Who cares? Because now I'm going to be much more consistent. So does it apply to you in any way at all? I'll give you another example. When somebody asks me, what's the best form of X for, you know, cardio, for example, I'm always going to reply by which one do you like the most? Because if you hate it, it doesn't matter, you're not going to do it. So you have to, you have to always ask, does this apply? Even if it's true, does this apply to me in any way whatsoever? And then finally, my favorite one, what do experienced coaches say? And this is because experienced coaches experience meaning coaches who've trained or worked with people for 10 plus years. And for me personally, if you're to ask me, when would you consider a coach to be really experienced, I would say about 10 years. And I'm using my own. I've trained lots of trainers. I know you guys have too. And we were trainers. I was good five years in. I wasn't experienced about 10. It took about 10 years for me to really be good. What do experienced coaches say? And experienced coaches will often say the opposite or maybe something different than a Study, for example, fasted cardio in the morning burns more body fat. A lot of coaches will say this, man, when I have my clients do cardio first thing in the morning, fasted, they just get leaner. And then you do. There's all these studies, there's meta analysis and the studies are clear. Fasted cardio burns no additional body fat than cardio at other times of the day. But why the hell then are coaches, what do they keep saying? Fasted cardio burns more body fat.
- [20:29]
Melissa
There's other behaviors that are attached to that.
- [20:31]
Mandy
It adds more activity to their day because they wake up and move.
- [20:33]
Melissa
That's right.
- [20:34]
Mandy
That's probably what's happening. Right. Or water, you know, additional water intake doesn't cause more fat loss. Right. We got all these studies that show as long as they're drinking what they're supposed to, doesn't make that big of a difference. Well, why do coaches say, man, when I get my clients to drink a half a gallon, a gallon of water a day, they all seem to get a little leaner. Well, I'll tell you why. Because they're not drinking other stuff.
- [20:51]
Melissa
Because all the behaviors attached to it.
- [20:53]
Mandy
That's right.
- [20:54]
Melissa
I think why the coaches want to so important is because a coach who's experienced with a bunch of clients on that, they're not just taking the studies in consideration, they're also taking human behavior into consideration. And to me, this is where it's really good. Right. When you have good research and studies to point you in the right direction, paired with 10 years or more of experience, you can then take what we know from the studies, you can take what you know from human behavior. And together you have probably the more ideal answer for the average client. But many times that doesn't perfectly align with what this the study say. Sometimes it could even be counter what the study says, because human behavior is so strong and that's more likely for them to adhere to. That's what you're going to.
- [21:39]
Mandy
Oh, you remember?
- [21:40]
Adam Schafer
Yeah, I remember Mike Boyle kind of breaking this down with. Because he's been, you know, using the Rice method and using ice after like heavy training sessions with his athletes. And he's more concerned with longevity and making sure like the recovery is there. Not necessarily. Because there was like this study that talked about the decrease in muscle building signal. You know, everybody stopped doing that with their athletes. And then it was just like one of those things where he's like, well, I've been doing this, you know, for decades and this is how I've applied And he's got the best track record for keeping athletes healthy.
- [22:14]
Mandy
And it's like we, we actually are, we actually argued that. We said that when you're pushing the limit and you're redlining often which athletes are. It allows you to work out more.
- [22:23]
Adam Schafer
Yeah.
- [22:23]
Mandy
So that. So, so now it makes sense. Yeah, now it makes sense.
- [22:26]
Adam Schafer
So didn't even apply to him. Yeah. It's funny, I want something that. This is the conspiracy guide side over here in the corner too. It's like I'm always looking at who's funding the, the study.
- [22:35]
Mandy
Yeah. I'd even say that. Yeah, I didn't even say that.
- [22:37]
Melissa
But you're right because especially in nutritional studies. Yes.
- [22:40]
Mandy
Here's what happens.
- [22:41]
Adam Schafer
So biased.
- [22:42]
Mandy
Here's what happens. They can do things with studies to keep them within the parameters of what's considered legitimate. Like they can shorten a study or lengthen a study, for example. Then this has been shown, this has been hap. This has happened. A pharmaceutical company will do a nine month study, but at six months everything looked good and side effects got started to really pop up. Around month seven, they'll stop the study and they'll publish the six month study and not show nine months. And that's cherry pick. That's happened before. Pharmaceutical companies got sued over stuff like that. Or I'll give you a great example. In the 1970s there was a study that was funded by the US government to connect cannabis to cancer risk. They said, well, it definitely causes cancer because cigarettes cause cancer. Let's do the study. And when the study started showing that it wasn't causing cancer, in fact, it might actually have a slight protective effect. They stopped the study and didn't publish it. So sometimes they'll do that as well. They'll fund a study. We don't like those results. No one ever knows about it because. So. So that's another one, that's another thing to kind of consider. But the reason why I'm careful going down that path is because I also don't think you should be like, I don't trust any study.
- [23:58]
Melissa
Well, no, you also. I've heard Lane defend this.
- [24:01]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [24:01]
Melissa
And he's like, the only way you're going to get money sometimes is from the people that are most interested in getting that study. So it's like, you know, expecting somebody to fund a study that has no benefit for them whatsoever is almost impossible. So that's.
- [24:14]
Mandy
Sure, that's right.
- [24:14]
Melissa
Studies wouldn't get done if they didn't have biased contributors to getting done.
- [24:18]
Adam Schafer
And so the meta analysis I think is great for that though, you know, because then you can kind of pit like who. Who's biased versus the other bias and see where we're at.
- [24:27]
Mandy
That's right. And this is, this is one thing that we aim to do as we try to get in there and kind of figure it out. Like a great one. We just did an episode recently on hip thrusts versus squats and the studies show that they both build the glutes the same. But so much anecdote from people online saying that hip thrusts build their butts more. Well, it's because the self selection bias that we're dealing with are people who have trouble building their butts doing squats.
- [24:50]
Melissa
Right.
- [24:51]
Mandy
And in that case, a hip thrust which allows you to feel your glutes more. It's easier to feel your glutes on a hip thrusted as a squat. For those people it is more effective. But they're not going to show that in those studies.
- [25:01]
Melissa
So true.
- [25:01]
Mandy
Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of studies and human behaviors, like you brought up, Adam, interesting side effect from element, our partners with the electrolyte powder. Do you know what I'm finding? So first off, we did a poll for all of our listeners and it got first place. Was the most most frequently used.
- [25:19]
Melissa
Yeah, a lot.
- [25:20]
Mandy
By far.
- [25:20]
Melissa
I was, I was surprised.
- [25:21]
Mandy
Of all the partners we work with, it was the number one most used product among all our products.
- [25:27]
Melissa
Quite a bit. Yeah.
- [25:28]
Mandy
But here's what I found. The site. There's an interesting side effect or behavior change I'm noticing with people who consume a lot of elements. My whole family does it, my wife drinks or whatever. It makes people drink more water and it's because it's palatable. Yeah, it tastes good. It. Because it tastes good now. It doesn't have sugar, it doesn't have artificial sweeteners. It's the sodium combined with the stevia in there that gives you that kind of palatability. My wife drinks a lot more water when there's element. My kids drink more water if I add a little sprinkle of it to their water. So it's like, like as a coach, you might notice my clients drink more water.
- [26:05]
Adam Schafer
They're more hydrated.
- [26:06]
Mandy
Well, yeah, because, because they're using elements.
- [26:08]
Melissa
I also feel like I get like a little bit of energy from it. I think the reason why I feel like I get energy is sometimes when I'm really low calorie, I'm also low sodium and not hydrated. And just sipping on that always makes me feel a little bit Better. So you add that to it. That's probably why. It's simple, it's easy, tastes good.
- [26:27]
Mandy
I've narrowed down Adam, like, the best. We've talked about this before, but now I have it down to, like, a number. The best pumps. I'll get in the gym because I work out in the morning and I don't eat. I don't eat till after I eat. When I get here, I'll do a packet element in this big container right here, which is, I think, 42 ounces.
- [26:45]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [26:45]
Mandy
So I get up in the morning, I, you know, do my thing upstairs, and then I come down. My workouts typically around 7:15, 7:20 in the morning, 6am I drink a whole one of these with. With one packet element. If I do that, the pumps are, like, ridiculous.
- [27:01]
Melissa
I think. I think it's so funny because you think about all these crazy. There's so many products on. On.
- [27:07]
Mandy
To increase.
- [27:07]
Melissa
Yeah, to increase the pump. They, like, just like. Like some salt water does it better than that.
- [27:14]
Mandy
If I had carbs with, it would be even better. But I don't eat.
- [27:17]
Melissa
Yeah, that's. I had mine all the way down to the car. Like, I knew exactly how much water sodium and then carbohydrates to get to just the crazy pump.
- [27:25]
Mandy
Dude. So. So remember I brought this up on a recent podcast, and I was talking about the chemicals that people spray on the benches and machines. Yeah. So this was a thing that started really happening after, during and after Covid. So when I used to work out in gyms, the policy was, especially when I manage gyms, was bring a towel, wipe your sweat. That was it. Like, bring a towel, wipe your sweat off. And then some gyms, not a lot of gyms, but some gyms would have, like, paper towels and a spray bottle, but nobody was doing it. Nobody was doing. And then Covid came, everybody got freaked out, and it became like.
- [28:02]
Adam Schafer
Like just blasting it everywhere.
- [28:04]
Mandy
Yeah. Like the culture now is, after you work out, go get the spray bottle.
- [28:08]
Melissa
Spray the bed, sanitize the whole thing.
- [28:10]
Mandy
And sanitize the hell out of it. And I hate that. I hate following somebody who does that. When I see people doing that. The bench. Leave it. Because then I get on the bench and I smell the chemicals, and I know that the xenoestrogens, the hormone disrupting chemicals, I feel like, are not a good trade off. I would rather be on a bench that has a lot of.
- [28:31]
Melissa
It's not even close, is it? No, it's not even close.
- [28:33]
Mandy
We're so afraid of Germs. Now, I know being clean, that's great. That was a wonderful breakthrough in. In society was understanding germs. But we went so far with that that we antibiotic the hell out of everything. We have chemicals that cause. We know are connected to cancers and hormone disruption, where, you know, just wiping the sweat off the bench is perfectly fine. Or maybe a little soap and water. But they're spraying, like, Lysol on there.
- [29:02]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [29:02]
Adam Schafer
Which is killing it off.
- [29:04]
Melissa
No, it's all anti.
- [29:05]
Adam Schafer
Lack of exposure has its own problems.
- [29:07]
Mandy
Oh, yeah.
- [29:07]
Adam Schafer
Like, we need to build up a defense system against these and, you know, be immersed in it on some level.
- [29:13]
Mandy
A common antibacterial. That was in soap. I don't even know if they use it anymore. Doug, maybe you could look up triclosan health effects. So when you would get, like, antibacterial soap or spray, they would add something called triclosan. I think I'm saying it right. And what this does is when you spray a surface with it, it leaves a residue that has antibiotic properties. So it's an antibiotic. We know. And I don't know if they still use this, but this was everywhere. It's so it's still. It's okay. Here we go. Ready? It's still in a lot of products. It's an endocrine disruptor, meaning it can disrupt hormone metabolism and interfere with your hormonal system. It may impair reproductive function. It can cause or increase the risk of allergies, skin irritation, cancer. Some studies suggest that long term exposure to triclosan may increase the risk of certain cancers. It could cause antibiotic resistance. In other words, we're creating bacteria that are like super bacteria and a thyroid issue. And thyroid issues. By the way, soap kills bacteria perfectly fine. It doesn't cause any of that stuff. But it's in so many things, including toothpaste, mouthwash, hand soap, shampoo, lotions, deodorants. That's just an example. So in other words, just, you know, basic soap was perfectly antibacterial, the extent of which we.
- [30:35]
Melissa
I think that post is flying because I think it's. It's. I haven't heard anybody actually talk about that, but it's kind of obvious, dude. You know, I think most people understand now how antibiotics and antibacterial stuff isn't ideal for our microbiome. And then yet that's what we're blasting these things over versus getting a little bit of sweat on there. It's like, that's probably not a great. Probably not A great trade off.
- [30:57]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [30:58]
Adam Schafer
No, everybody's sore in your skin and. Yeah.
- [31:01]
Mandy
They're so afraid of, like, getting on a bench or because someone not wipe your sweat. That's fine. You don't want. No.
- [31:06]
Melissa
I wonder. I wonder how many. Because I. I think gyms need to.
- [31:10]
Mandy
Get rid of it. I want to make an announcement.
- [31:12]
Melissa
If you're in gym, all they have to do, Sal, is actually just put something more, you know, proper in the water bottle. Just water?
- [31:19]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [31:20]
Melissa
Spray and wipe with water would be fine.
- [31:22]
Mandy
Water or water and soap.
- [31:23]
Adam Schafer
Just a little bit of soap.
- [31:24]
Mandy
Just basic soap. But I even think that's not necessary. Just wipe your sweat. And then at the end, you know, tw. Twice a day, you have your porters go through and clean everything.
- [31:32]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [31:33]
Mandy
And you're perfectly fine. These. These chemicals are spraying everywhere. It's not a good trade off. And you're working out, you're breathing.
- [31:38]
Melissa
I say nothing. If everyone's constantly spraying those things in there, you know, you're breathing.
- [31:44]
Mandy
Freaking chemical warfare in the gyms with the amount of that they. I. If I see a bench that someone just used and I see it's wet with, like, the chemicals, I'll find I'd rather go on one that had a little sweat spot on it.
- [31:55]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [31:55]
Mandy
And I'll just wipe the sweat with a towel.
- [31:57]
Melissa
That's so true.
- [31:58]
Mandy
And I'm. I'm perfectly fine. I think it's. It's. I think if you're a jam, get rid of that stuff right away. It's worse. It's worse for people.
- [32:04]
Adam Schafer
That penetrates me with my mask on, though. I'm safe.
- [32:08]
Mandy
You work out?
- [32:09]
Adam Schafer
Yeah.
- [32:09]
Mandy
Dude. Hey, speaking of all this to keep it alive. Have you guys seen. So I've. Well, this is a low bar. Okay, well, here, I'll. I'll ask you guys this question. Have you guys ever felt positive or encouraged by government policy when it comes to health?
- [32:24]
Melissa
I know.
- [32:25]
Mandy
In any way, ever.
- [32:26]
Melissa
I feel like. I feel like it's too good to be true. Like seeing RFK get. Get sworn in and then the things that he wants to do just seem like, is this possible? Could there could. But then again, I've said this forever on this show that I'm. I tend to be the least alarmist out of all of us. And I really believe that the pendulum swings and we've swung so hard in that direction that maybe we're actually swinging back the other direction.
- [32:50]
Adam Schafer
He has a lot of experience going after big companies and challenging them and winning lawsuits. So, I mean, I'm I'm slightly encouraged.
- [32:58]
Mandy
Same because the bar is low government on, like, chronic health. And, you know, obesity is terrible. It's so bad that it's made us worse.
- [33:06]
Melissa
Almost doing anything is going to be positive.
- [33:08]
Adam Schafer
Worse caring in general. Like, I didn't even hear that from the other side.
- [33:12]
Mandy
And the stuff that they pushed forever for decades was actually the opposite. So it's like, it's so bad it was actually making people worse. This is the first time I feel optimistic. And it's not because he has experience fighting companies or because I trust the guy. It's because the stuff he says is actually more aligned with real health. Like, he said he did a post on X where he posted a picture of the breakfast cereals for kids.
- [33:37]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [33:38]
Mandy
And he's like, we need to, like, this is terrible. People feeding their kids this. We got to get in and make sure kids are not eating this crap. He's a government official talking about big company. I know, like, stuff talking about sugar and artificial dyes and stuff like that. I think it's amazing. But he. Dude, you got to see the stats that he was. He was quoting. I saved it on, like, the state of our health. This is going to crap everybody out, but it's pretty bad. So the U.S. 6 in 10Americans have at least one chronic disease. 4 in 10Americans have two or more chronic diseases, which is ridiculous. Autoimmune diseases are some of the highest in the world. Inflammatory bowel disease, psoriasis, multiple sclerosis. This is one of the highest, I believe, of all the Western nation for children. In 2022, 30 million children. 40%. 40% of our children had at least one health condition, such as allergies, asthma, or autoimmune.
- [34:41]
Melissa
That's crazy.
- [34:42]
Mandy
Autism is 1 in 36 children in the U.S. okay. Which is crazy. In the 1980s, it was. You want to know what the number was in the 1980s for autism? So right now it's one out of 36 kids.
- [34:56]
Melissa
Yeah. You want to guess one in a thousand?
- [34:58]
Mandy
It was one or maybe four out of ten thousand.
- [35:01]
Melissa
Ten.
- [35:02]
Mandy
Wow.
- [35:02]
Melissa
Even crazier.
- [35:03]
Mandy
I had a doctor that I had a doctor that I trained.
- [35:05]
Melissa
What is that increase?
- [35:06]
Adam Schafer
That's like a huge increase.
- [35:07]
Melissa
Thousands of percent increase. That's insane.
- [35:10]
Mandy
I had a doctor that I trained who said autism was so rare when he was getting his. When he was doing his. What do they call it when they. When they. Residency. Residency. He said it was so rare that there was a kid. There was a person with autism and that they all would go. They Went to go look at this guy because he couldn't find it anywhere was so rare. 18% of late adolescents and young, young adults have fatty liver disease. 30% of adolescents are pre diabetic and more than 40% are overweight or obese. It's, I mean he, and then he goes talks about add, talks about like all of this stuff. So he. They're going to talk about exercise, nutrition, they're going to examine SSRIs, they're going to examine ADH medications for kids. They're like going down the list of stuff and it's, I mean that's the.
- [35:56]
Adam Schafer
Biggest alarming factors is looking at the health of our kids. You know, I mean I understand, you know, adults, that's a major problem. But like if we're not addressing this at the root of it all, you know, if we're not giving them a chance from the very jump, like we gotta really take hold.
- [36:12]
Mandy
Well, what's scary to me is and I don't think that I'm not a person that's going to say that they, that the pharmaceutical industry is evil. I don't say that. I just think that, I think there's good and bad people in every industry. I think the pharmaceutical industry has some distorted incentives because of the nature of the beast. In other words, the incentive that a pharmaceutical company has to create a lifelong customer from child to adult is there's, it's very high. There is no incentive really to cure them. And then that's it.
- [36:46]
Adam Schafer
No.
- [36:46]
Mandy
Right. Or to prevent ever needing treatment at all. Yeah, their bottom line, it's a distorted incentive. So pharmaceutical industry, just because of the nature of it, that's not where we should look to solve these things. They're not going to give it, they're going to give us help when the shit hits the fan, but they're not going to prevent the shit from hitting the fan. Is, is my whole point when you.
- [37:05]
Melissa
When you say things like that, does it make you question like the whole idea of capitalism with, with the pharmaceutical industry, like almost like you're pro free market for most everything. But then when it comes to something like that.
- [37:17]
Adam Schafer
Well that's like saying it's the protection, you know, it's the, the ability to not question and peer into the data and law, you know, have lawsuits.
- [37:28]
Melissa
Well, the problem that be enough? Would that be enough?
- [37:30]
Mandy
Yeah, and the problem is something, you got to be fair with the comparison because what you're saying is is it better? Would you rather get stabbed with a needle a bunch of times or get Shot in the face with a shotgun. Well, I'll pick the needle, but that sucks. Still sucks. So capitalism is the better, the best option we have. And I think we could do it better.
- [37:50]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [37:51]
Mandy
But. Yeah. What's the other option? Give. Make it complete.
- [37:54]
Adam Schafer
That's the ugly side, right? Is that, you know, driven towards that continual growth and how do we do this?
- [38:01]
Melissa
Well, yeah, that's, that's what I mean, because, you know, they're obviously, they're. They're motivated to get customers. They're motivated and. Which is. Capitalism is built on that. And for most other industries that serves us as a species that, you know, they're out competing each other to give a. Something that is better for the. The customer. But when it comes to the pharmaceutical, it's in their best interest to keep you on medications or get you on another medication. And so if that's the desired outcome from a pharmaceutical company, and that's what's driving it, that, that capitalistic type of mentality, that can be really dangerous.
- [38:34]
Mandy
Yeah. What you're saying is that the special interests or selfish interests play a role in that, but they play a role in that socialism, too. They play a role. That's the. So I think the checks and balances need to be a little bit better. I think, like what Justin says with, like, lawsuits with the, with transparency. And I do think that because we have an open, you know, society, I think now people are becoming more privy to it. I think Covid sped that the hell up. Yeah, I think that really sped that up. A lot of people now are. Are looking, you know, twice at certain things.
- [39:09]
Adam Schafer
So it'd be interesting to see if he, you know, addresses the marketing of these pharmaceutical companies, you know, on TV and media and all that kind of stu as well.
- [39:18]
Mandy
Yeah, that one's interesting to me.
- [39:20]
Adam Schafer
It's interesting.
- [39:20]
Mandy
When I learned that statistic, I thought, that's true. Why are they advertising prescription drug companies that we can't even go buy? We have to have our doctor prescribe us. Why is that advertised on tv? It's like, oh, so they could pay the messaging. Yeah, they could pay these. These media companies and have a little bit of power over there, which is interesting. You know, earlier we were talking about studies. I'll give you guys a study that. Let me see if I have it here that, you know, now that we've kind of talked about how to read studies, see if. If you guys can kind of get to, you know, what's interesting with this. So this study showed that men who have sex once a month are 45 more likely to have cardiovascular disease compared to those who have sex two to three times a week. So there's two ways we can look at this. Right? So way one, I mean there's a couple things.
- [40:09]
Melissa
There's you, the guy who's stressed, the guy who's having the like low amount of sex. Like that's probably depressed. Yeah. Right. It's probably sitting on the end for. And it's.
- [40:18]
Adam Schafer
It's probably lifestyle's affected for sure.
- [40:20]
Melissa
What's a. It's a cycle. Right. So not only is he not having a lot of sex, but then he's sitting at home eating Cheetos, he's not exercising, which is not helping his case to have sex.
- [40:28]
Mandy
He's probably more likely to have erectile dysfunction.
- [40:29]
Melissa
He's more likely not to have that. So it's like a feedback.
- [40:32]
Mandy
Yeah. So there's, there's like a. There's a correlation that can, you know, one person, someone might look at that and be like, oh, if I want to reduce my risk of cardio disease, I need to have a lot of sex.
- [40:39]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [40:40]
Mandy
But it's probably reverse. Reverse causation.
- [40:43]
Melissa
Totally.
- [40:43]
Mandy
Yeah. Like. Like the guy who's having almost no sex. Why aren't you having that much sex?
- [40:47]
Melissa
Yes.
- [40:48]
Mandy
You're lonely, you're depressed.
- [40:50]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No 100.
- [40:53]
Mandy
I had, my cousin, my cousins were sharing that. We just. You just gotta have more sex.
- [40:57]
Melissa
Okay.
- [40:57]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [40:57]
Melissa
It's not that simple.
- [40:58]
Mandy
So the dude, the guy who wants to reduce his risk kind of sex, he should just go pay, you know, go to a brothel?
- [41:03]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [41:04]
Mandy
I'm lowering my risk.
- [41:06]
Adam Schafer
Can I get an insurance. Insurance reduction for this?
- [41:09]
Mandy
Can you get a write off?
- [41:11]
Melissa
Yeah, right off.
- [41:11]
Mandy
I know.
- [41:12]
Melissa
You know, speaking of studies, I saw God Saad talking about a study on behavioral stuff. That's what his background is. Right. And do you guys know what the, the number one predictor of child abuse is? The number one predictor. That is right.
- [41:29]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [41:29]
Melissa
I would have never guessed that. You would think alcoholism. You would think like, you know, prior the parent being getting abused prior. Like there's a whole host of things that would. But it's like it's not even close. Like so like huge. Yeah. Like you're having a step parent is more dangerous for the child than them being an alcoholic or all these other things. Not that that's a good thing, but it's that that's how much of it's a greater predictor is just simply a step parent. I thought that was really fascinating. Sad.
- [41:58]
Mandy
And there's a lot of. There's arguments like to try to support. Like, why is that the case? It's competition. It's. It's the responsibility without the connection. I have all this responsibility for this kid, either with resources or through my work, but they're not my kid. You know, resentment. There's a lot of things that can.
- [42:18]
Melissa
There's also something to be said about why you. That's why those Disney movies, why you don't. Why you don't. With a child that you just. Absolutely. Because it's yours and you feel this different connection and bond. I feel like, like I don't like when it's, when it's your child that shares a part of you. I feel like there's a different level.
- [42:35]
Mandy
When a kid has a really good step parent. That's like such a nice thing. It's a really great blessing. Like you'll hear sometimes. You'll, you know, I know a couple people like this where they're, you know, they, they, oh, that's my dad. It's my mom. I said, well, you know, actually, you know, he's been raising me since I was 4. Such a great, you know, like a great dad, a great mom.
- [42:52]
Melissa
I mean, that's. If you ever hear Katrina talk about. She talks about her stepfather more than she does her own father. Yeah. Yeah. So her, her, her own father is. She has a really. She has a similar relationship with her own father as I have my mother. And she's way more. Or was. You know, he passed. Troy passed away. But she, she attributes a lot of her good from, from what she's learned from him. And so he was a good stepfather.
- [43:16]
Mandy
Yeah. There's a lot that. Some of that data is kind of hard to read too, because you'll read that you, let's say you lit. You're. You're in a marriage and you're unhappy and your spouse is not that great. They're not that. They're not terrible. They're like beating everybody and, you know, abusing drugs, but they're just not good. And you're really unhappy. And you'll hear, well, your kids will be better off if you get divorced and get happy. The data actually doesn't show that. Doesn't support that. Actually shows the worse. Yeah, they're worse off if you're, if they're raised by a single conundrum. Yes. And now people hate hearing that because. Because it's against kind of what we want to hear. But the data does. To show that or like I Divorced his dad and he's such a crappy guy. I want him completely out of their lives versus he's in their lives. But he's, he's not that great. Right. It's actually better that he's in their lives a little bit. And that also a lot of people.
- [44:10]
Melissa
I saw a marriage expert talking about this and supports the argument that I think I've made before about like why many people end up in divorce. Like one of the number one reasons is it's purely picking the wrong person to what I've talked about before. Like you're attracted to all of your insecurities and brokenness is what you, you mistake as love is. You're drawn to this.
- [44:31]
Mandy
You know, I would argue differently now. I would argue that, you know, if you look at the, the, the, the way marriage as we understand it, one man, one woman, where did that come from? Like where, where did that originate from? That how we understand it? And it came from the Judeo Christian religion and they actually have a framework in there of how successful marriage is supposed to work.
- [44:54]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [44:54]
Mandy
And if you look at the data on people that follow the framework like that, they have very successful marriages. But when you read the framework of how it says you're supposed to be within your marriage, it's the opposite of what you're here because. So I could give you an example. What you hear all the time from marriage therapists accounts, whatever is you got to get your needs met. You need to get your needs, know what your needs are, express them, and your partner needs to meet your needs. It says, it doesn't say that. It says you need to meet your, you need to. The key to successful marriage is you meet their needs, is you got to be other focused.
- [45:30]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [45:30]
Mandy
And it's, there's a lot of stuff in there that you read that you go, oh my God. But then you compare it to the data and it's like it actually works.
- [45:35]
Melissa
I mean, so basically what you're saying is you, your argument is that it's people not following the original framework to a marriage should be.
- [45:42]
Mandy
Yeah. Problem with that is their understanding.
- [45:45]
Melissa
Problem with that is though, that the, there's a, obviously a major correlation with just like we just talked about other studies and diets and stuff like that. If you're somebody who puts God above yourself, totally, that's exactly where you're going. Yeah, that's right. That in itself is already. And both of you think that way marry, then there's a super high chance.
- [46:05]
Mandy
That you would be the one that one Study I brought up a while ago. Couples that pray together. It's a very famous study. Couples that pray together every day, every night. So they pray together openly. Their chant, their odds of divorce are 1%. That's crazy. That's like, that's like. You don't find that anywhere.
- [46:20]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah. I mean, again, there's also an obvious, like, huge correlation. If you have the ability to, you know, there's an old don't go to bed, you know. Right.
- [46:29]
Mandy
If you believe in God, if you.
- [46:31]
Melissa
Got to sit down, if you got to sit down, the girl, you or you. The, you know, spouse you just got in a fight with, you know, you're gonna, you know that tonight you're gonna sit down and pray. You're gonna have to pray tonight together with them.
- [46:40]
Mandy
It's like you're talking to God. He knows everything.
- [46:42]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah. You got. You've got to solve that. Right? So there's definitely. There's something there just for that. Right. Because if, if the couple has the ability to do that, that means they have the ability to work through.
- [46:51]
Mandy
But even, even from, even from a secular perspective, the. My grandparents generation, the understanding around marriage was different than what it became. It became about falling in love. Irresistible. Meet my needs, you know, with Jerry Maguire, you complete me. Right? Everybody's, oh, that's so romantic. Whatever. Back my grandparents generation, nobody believed that it was all about like, we're signing up for this forever and we're gonna raise a family together.
- [47:14]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [47:15]
Mandy
And you're gonna do that job, I'll do this job, and we just go. We just do this together. This is forever. It was never about, like, yeah, you complete me.
- [47:23]
Melissa
I forget, I forget what I read too. What a huge part social media has played in divorce too. I forgot what it's. There's a.
- [47:30]
Mandy
A high percentage playing the biggest role right now. Pornography. Do you know pornography is listed as one of the number one reasons for divorce today?
- [47:39]
Melissa
Is it?
- [47:39]
Mandy
Yes, it is.
- [47:40]
Melissa
Number one.
- [47:41]
Mandy
Is one of the number one. I don't know if it's number one. Doug, you could put. How often is pornography cited in divorce today? It's one of the top and the.
- [47:49]
Melissa
Data shows, so I would say so. If you word that like that, it would also social media would pop up there too. There's like, oh, yeah, like, like cheating on there. Like there's always listed. Yeah. Oh, yeah, it's. It's listed in there. Be interesting to see what the order.
- [48:02]
Mandy
But there was a data on this too. It's like when. When a. A couple view Pornography regularly together, their odds of divorce go up quite a bit. When the. When the wife looks at it regularly, it goes up quite a bit. The husband looks it up quite a bit, you know, on his own, it goes up quite a bit. Pornography is playing a huge role today.
- [48:18]
Sal Destefano
It says divorce rates double when people start watching porn.
- [48:23]
Mandy
See? Yeah.
- [48:24]
Melissa
Wow.
- [48:24]
Mandy
Isn't that crazy?
- [48:25]
Melissa
Yeah. Yeah.
- [48:26]
Mandy
Well, what's crazy less than people?
- [48:28]
Melissa
What's really. What's really crazy and unfortunate about that is there's a lot of. I mean, there's somebody listening right now. I guarantee you. Get off.
- [48:34]
Mandy
Oh, it's good for.
- [48:35]
Melissa
That's a sex expert that tries to. Tries to make the case all the time for that. I mean, we've. We've communicated with them before and that's.
- [48:42]
Mandy
Their sex experts are such a. Here we go right here. It's such a. It's such a fine. You disagree with me, that's fine. You just keep listening if you disagree. But it's such a job. And I'll tell you why. Sex experts are experts in pleasure. Yeah, but. But the data will show the best satisfaction with sex comes from connection. Sex is a result of deep connection. It's not just a physical act. And so sex acts were telling. How do you satisfy your partner? Touch her here, touch him there, do this weird thing with your tongue or whatever. The best sex, the data shows us, the best sex experience by people is people who've been married for like 30 years. They're past their prime. They've only been with each other. They're not doing weird shit with each other. They're just. It's the connection.
- [49:28]
Melissa
I mean, I would have on straight up. I would have never believed that same. You know, 14 years ago, I would have said, no, that's no way. Not true. Novelty. The new. The, you know, no matter who I was with within six months, I don't care how beautiful, how amazing, how whatever she is then. Then something new or different is always with. But, you know, when you. I guess, when you truly find someone that you're in love with or willing to love like, that it grows, which is a trip. It's a trip to think Katrina and I always talk about this with each other. How amazed that we are that it's 14 years later. And the sex life, the attraction, everything. Better now. Because you always hear the honeymoon phase too. Like, people always say, like, oh, yeah, well, once you get.
- [50:15]
Mandy
Are you guys.
- [50:16]
Melissa
Wait till you get through the honeymoon phase.
- [50:17]
Mandy
Are you guys. You know, I'm putting on the spot, but are you Are you okay? I'll put you on spot. Are you objectively the hottest you've ever been?
- [50:23]
Melissa
No, no, no, I don't think so. She might say that though.
- [50:26]
Mandy
You know, that's what I'm saying.
- [50:27]
Melissa
Yeah, but I, and I would say the same thing. I mean, I, I look at when she was 29, 30, when we first got together, and I'm, I'm way more attracted to her in her mid-40s than I am what she was in her, in her 20s.
- [50:37]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [50:38]
Melissa
So, yeah, it's interesting. It's a, there's something to be said about that, you know, But I would have never believed it. Like, so if I was listening to this 20 and I'm 20 something, I'm just like, yeah, you guys know what you're talking about. I'd be saying things like this because you don't have any good sex for us. I'd say you obviously don't have good sex sex. Yeah. If you see what's going on over my place right now, it'd be a different story.
- [50:59]
Adam Schafer
Sign up for stripper classes. Look what I learned, honey.
- [51:04]
Mandy
Yeah, but I think you see, you see too, satisfaction go up when people pursue that kind of stuff, but it's because the intimacy level goes up. It's not because they learned a new trick.
- [51:13]
Melissa
Well, it's also probably a spike and then drop too, right? There's probably like the, the novelty. Oh, wow.
- [51:19]
Mandy
No, but what I mean is if, let's say you have a couple long time and they feel like our sex life is a little whatever, so they take. So then they read a book together or they, the intimacy level goes up because they're vulnerable with each other. Yeah. So that's, that's why you'll see.
- [51:30]
Melissa
Oh, honestly, I think that, I think that because they obviously they try and these sex experts try and pull and use the studies to support what pornography can do, to support their argument. But I would argue that that's just the vulnerability piece of like two of you agreeing you're going to do something. And some of, some of the best.
- [51:48]
Adam Schafer
Reported, taking the focus off of each other, you know, we're projecting outward instead of like, you know, with each other.
- [51:55]
Mandy
Within some of the best reported. If the data shows us some of the best reported satisfaction with sex lives are couples who are been married for a long time, they're past their prime, who were their first and only partners. That's some of the best satisfaction ratings you get.
- [52:12]
Melissa
Oh, I haven't.
- [52:13]
Mandy
He's the only man I've ever been With. She's the only woman I've ever been with. And they grew together through that process. That is so counter from what the world tells you. The world is like. You got to try it out first.
- [52:22]
Melissa
You've been eating that Sizzler your whole life. You have no idea. You have no idea what. You have no idea what Ruth Chris tastes like. You know what's crazy I ever had in my life?
- [52:30]
Mandy
Hey, you know what's crazy about that?
- [52:32]
Adam Schafer
Arby's.
- [52:33]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [52:34]
Mandy
By the way, that's actually. That's actually not true. However, even if it was true, you're happier.
- [52:40]
Melissa
I mean, that's.
- [52:40]
Mandy
That's so crazy to me. Well, you. You've never tried. You know, you're satisfied with your Honda, but you've never driven a Ferrari. That's why. Even if that was true, which is not true, the data actually shows. It has nothing to do with that. Because I can get in the data.
- [52:52]
Adam Schafer
You got a lot of accessories you can buy.
- [52:53]
Mandy
Yeah, but they're happier. Who gives a shit? You know what I mean?
- [52:57]
Melissa
I mean, it's true. At the end of the day, if you're happier, you're happier. It doesn't matter for what reasons, you.
- [53:01]
Mandy
Know, dude, speaking of happy. And it's just a funny story. So this morning I go out there and I'm talking to Cole, and so remember on the Christmas. What was it? The white elephant gift? Remember? He stole your caldera lab?
- [53:14]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [53:14]
Mandy
And he's like the youngest guy in there. How old is Cole? Is he 20? He's even 21 yet. Is he 21?
- [53:18]
Adam Schafer
Is he. He's not. No, I don't think so. No, because we. He's 20. We went somewhere and he. Yeah, he wasn't able to drink at the Christmas party.
- [53:25]
Mandy
Young kid, he's like, what are you gonna do with caldera label? He loves it.
- [53:29]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [53:30]
Mandy
That's why he.
- [53:30]
Adam Schafer
Yeah, seriously, he's already got the youthful skin on his.
- [53:33]
Mandy
Go backwards too far, bro.
- [53:35]
Melissa
Relax. You already look too young, dude. You look like a baby. You already look too young, man.
- [53:39]
Mandy
Dude, the combination of the base layer with the oil. Oh, that is like. What is that?
- [53:45]
Melissa
I actually had a dm.
- [53:45]
Mandy
I wasn't using the base layer before.
- [53:47]
Melissa
So I had a good, good time to bring this up on the commercial. Is that I. I had a. A DM the other day about. It was a female who said that her husband and her son both love and use it. And that is. Is it good for women too? 100%. It's all natural. So both men and Women.
- [54:04]
Mandy
My wife will steal mine.
- [54:05]
Melissa
Yeah. Katrina loves it and uses it too. So if you're a listener and you've been curious about it as a female like it for men. I mean, I think they. They marketed in that direction because there was a need in the market and they filled that need. But, yeah, no, I'd like to see their data.
- [54:20]
Mandy
I would be surprised if more men used it now, I bet you.
- [54:24]
Melissa
Oh, you think there's that many women that are using?
- [54:25]
Mandy
I think so.
- [54:26]
Melissa
Oh, I don't think so. I think I'd like to see. I think they market strong to men, and that's got to be their d. What would you say, Doug?
- [54:32]
Sal Destefano
Men.
- [54:32]
Mandy
You think so? Yeah.
- [54:33]
Melissa
Yeah.
- [54:34]
Mandy
You should ask them. I mean, because I know what happened in my house. My wife tried it, now she steals it.
- [54:38]
Melissa
But I mean, I think that's where it's just smart. There's so. It's. The woman's skin care is so compet.
- [54:44]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [54:44]
Melissa
That they. I think they Very similar to viori success. Right. I saw they. Instead of going after Lululemon directly in athleisure wear for women, they went to the back door. They went through men. Now there's a lot of women that are all wearing that also. But. And I'm sure the same thing as Caldera. Caldera is focused on men. And I think, you know, as a side effect, some women are trying it or using it, but I would think that's still their dominant market. So.
- [55:09]
Mandy
Probiotics have been shown to improve health, digestion, recovery from workouts, even reduce anxiety in some people and depression in some people. I don't think I need to convince you that probiotics are healthy, but which one do you get? Seed. Seed is the world's best probiotic, hands down. Check them out. Go to seed.com mindpump Use the code 25. Mindpump. Get 25% off. All right, back to the show.
- [55:34]
Sal Destefano
First question is from Skyreal Lejeau. Mess that up. Do trigger sessions still send the signal to build muscle and speed up the metabolism?
- [55:45]
Mandy
All right, so we gotta define trigger session first. Some people refer to trigger sessions like a feeder session.
- [55:51]
Adam Schafer
Grease in the groove or grease in.
- [55:53]
Mandy
The groove or micro dosing. Microdosing. So trigger session is just a term that we came up with with our program maps in a blog. Essentially what it is is they're little mini workouts in between your main workouts. And they're not really workouts. You're. You're using bands typically with a trigger session or body weight, and you're just, you're just kind of getting a little bit of a pump in the muscle. You're just working it a little bit. You're not anywhere near trying to break down. Yeah, yeah. So it's like, it's like, you know, I hit, you know, my full body on Monday. Today I'm gonna do a trigger session for chest. And let's say I could do 70 push ups straight. You know, I'm gonna do like three sets of like 15 just to get a little pumpkin in my chest. And really what trigger sessions do is they facilitate recovery and they actually make the adaptation signal louder. They take your previous workout, the main workout, and they just add a little.
- [56:47]
Melissa
Turbo to it, which is a direct connection to building muscle and speeding your metabolism. Definitely, yeah. If you have the ability to recover at a faster rate, you're going to build more muscle. If you build more muscle, it's going to speed your metabolism up. I think the way not to look at it is like, you know, is this work, this, this extra workout enough to be burning X amount of calories to burn body? It's not, don't think of it that way. It's that you're optimizing your training program and your sessions and you're helping facilitate recovery. Speeding that process up, you can speed that process up. You in turn build more muscles, feed your metabolism.
- [57:21]
Mandy
Now what I would like, what I would also like to add, now that we know what we know with cgms, right, Continuous glucose monitors, what we know about insulin activity, insulin sensitivity, which, which, you know, staying sensitive to insulin is a great strategy for health and for fat loss. I bet you trigger sessions have a really nice impact on blood sugar because throughout the day you're doing a little bit of movement and I bet you it's better than walking because it's a little bit more targeted and more intense than a walk. So I do think that, because here's what I noticed with trigger sessions. When I do trigger sessions, I definitely get a little boost. In my regular workouts, I noticed I get a little bit more, more juice out of them. But what I noticed the most is fat loss. I've always noticed fat loss from trigger sessions. So I'm wondering if that's the reason. It's not like I'm burning tons of calories. A total trigger session will take me seven minutes.
- [58:13]
Melissa
Yeah. But I, I had, there's another correlation or behavior I noticed that's attached to that for me is when I do the trigger sessions, I'm just more active through the day, too.
- [58:22]
Mandy
Because of the energy.
- [58:23]
Melissa
Yes.
- [58:23]
Mandy
Yeah.
- [58:24]
Melissa
Because I remember when the energy, the most discipline was, was around competing time. And I remember I used to hang the bands in my living room over this door was they were all set up to go. And if I just kind of just made it a habit that, hey, every hour or two go over there and do a couple exercises, and I just. There'd be times where I'm like, sitting down on the couch, not wanting to do anything, get up and do that after I do it. Now all of a sudden, now I'm doing the dishes, I'm doing other things. And so it would just promote more activity and moving. So I think there's something to be said there too, with, like, its connection to fat loss.
- [58:56]
Sal Destefano
Next question is from Risa Auger. When should you consider eating back your burned calories?
- [59:02]
Mandy
Oh, so this is like when you're calculating how many calories you're burning through activity. Should you make up for them with extra calories?
- [59:10]
Melissa
I'm assuming when you're trying to gain.
- [59:11]
Mandy
Right. Yeah. The strategy here, by the way, you got to be careful with this too.
- [59:14]
Adam Schafer
Because this is a tricky kind of mentality.
- [59:17]
Mandy
Yeah. Because like, what you'll calculate or what the apps will show that you're burning with activity isn't very accurate.
- [59:22]
Adam Schafer
Yeah. So you usually equate.
- [59:24]
Mandy
Yeah. You got to be kind of careful with this. And I don't necessarily like looking at, like, activity is like this phenomenal way for calling it creating calorie deficit. The deficit should mainly come from resting metabolic rate and also the big things, your diet. So again, this is when someone's trying to gain. This is when I'm like, okay, you're doing it. More activity. Won't we bump your calories a little bit? Is typically what I do.
- [59:45]
Melissa
Yeah. This is. Okay. This is difficult because I need to know the person that I'm talking to, because if it was somebody who's like a hard gainer that they already struggle with hitting their maintenance calories or in a surplus, then I'm encouraging them to probably increase calories and pay attention to that every which way they can. But the average person who's just kind of maybe going through a mini bulk or like, oh, I've decided to go in a slight surplus right here. And you're trying to figure this out. If you, whatever you've decided is your surplus. Let's say there's a day where you burned more calories because you were just more active. That's okay. It's not like it Changes what ends up happening. And this is, I explained this in my little docu series I did, where in a month's time that, especially that first month I built, I think I built four or five pounds of muscle and I lost almost 20 pounds of fat. Well, how is that possible? Because we know you can't burn body fat and build muscle at the same exact time. Well, that's because it wasn't happening exact same time in that month. There was periods where I was a little bit in a surplus and there were periods when I was a little bit in a deficit. And so there was times when my body was anabolic and times when my body's catabolic. So there's times with this person who's trying to build muscle. So long as they're in a surplus most of the time or a lot of the time, they're going to gain. And the few times that they're a little bit in the deficit, they'll probably lose a little bit of body fat, especially if it's not a crazy amount of a deficit for an extended period of time. And so it's not something that I would ever, I've ever worried about myself or with a client like, oh, you burn an extra 200 calories a day. Make sure you bump your calories 200 more even day. It's like, we've decided your caloric maintenance is here. We've decided this is your goal calories. I'm not worried if that day you had.
- [61:19]
Mandy
It does seem like splitting hairs, right?
- [61:21]
Melissa
Totally.
- [61:21]
Mandy
Oh, I burned extra. I got to eat it. You know, now I got to eat an extra 367 calories.
- [61:26]
Melissa
And now you're trying to use your tool to measure every different kind of workout. And you're like, oh, that workout burned. That means. So now I get you this more. It's like, dude, it doesn't.
- [61:34]
Mandy
Wasted effort.
- [61:34]
Melissa
It does not have to be that, that complicated.
- [61:36]
Sal Destefano
Next question is from Mike. OK, 72. Do you recommend any kind of break from training?
- [61:42]
Mandy
Depends who you are. If, if you're a fitness fanatic, yes. If you're like, consistent, don't miss workouts. You push it. You love spending time in the gym. A break will give you better results, period. End of story. And a break can look like time off. Or if you're like me and time off is like, you know, you might as well tell me to cut my leg off. Then the break would look like four weeks or two weeks or three weeks of dramatically reduced intensity or volume. So your break looks like a much easier workout. But the data shows this with consistent with fitness fanatics. So that category of people breaks produce better results because they tend to push it too far for too long. And the breaks are needed for those individuals. Yeah.
- [62:28]
Adam Schafer
And for those. I like shifting the focus and working on other things that aren't as taxing on the body and like working on bouts of mobility and, you know, where I can find opportunities to kind of reinforce stability and control and, you know, all the other aspects of, you know, the pursuit towards fitness and health is. There's just so many things to cover and I know that I'm not always balanced.
- [62:54]
Melissa
Right.
- [62:54]
Adam Schafer
And so I'm just kind of continuously looking at this moving target of what, you know, where there's deficits. And a lot of times it's, it's taking a break from the intensity of the training and the weight training and, and focusing a little bit more on, you know, the movement aspect or focusing more on the diet aspect or, or just, you know, my overall mental health and relationships and that kind of thing.
- [63:15]
Melissa
So I'm gonna, I'm gonna give some generic but very specific advice to the audience that I've never have in regards to this that I think aligns with this. We've said before on the podcast that we think that almost everybody, if not everybody, should at least one period of time in the year run like a performance or a symmetry type of program. Right. To address all that, I'm going to make the argument that I think that everybody should, at least for one period of the year, run like a maps 15 type of a protocol. And what is leading me to say that is. And it just keeps getting confirmed with me, with our listeners and audience and people I know that have gone through this. A lot of people that listen to this podcast, I would say a greater percentage are, are fitness fanatic or fitness people that are really into it.
- [64:02]
Mandy
They don't miss days.
- [64:03]
Melissa
Yeah, they don't miss days. They're very consistent or they come from a history of training hard and pushing. And I can't tell you how many times I've, I've gotten dms and I'm seeing people report back to me like, man, I really didn't believe I'd see results on Maps 15. And I saw this and I saw that. I think the people that are hardcore fitness people tend to have a tendency to over apply the intensity and volume. And I think a period of running like a map 15 protocol, I think it will, it'll help you peer into that if you're that type of person. So I think that everybody should run something like that once a year.
- [64:37]
Mandy
Maps Anabolic Advanced has week, has back off weeks in there. After each phase there's a week where you're, you're really backing off on things. And I think it's pro. It's one of the reasons why that program people will write back and say I got some of the best gains I've ever had in my entire life. And it's because it's one of the only programs we actually scheduled it in there and said, you know, after each phase you have to take a week off.
- [65:02]
Sal Destefano
Next question is from Richie IE89. I have three consecutive days off a week. I want to try a full body workout. But is training full body three days in a row a smart idea? I currently do legs and biceps on Monday, chest and triceps on Tuesday and back and biceps on Wednesday.
- [65:19]
Mandy
It depends on how you do it. You could do full body three days.
- [65:22]
Melissa
A week, modify intensity.
- [65:24]
Mandy
Yeah, One day is heavy compound lifts, the next day is isolation and the last day is mobility full body, then you're perfectly fine.
- [65:31]
Adam Schafer
There's a way to do that.
- [65:32]
Mandy
Yeah, this split works perfectly fine as well. It's, it's not ideal to work out for three days and then take four days off. Yeah, but it's fine. You still progress is so long as you're smart with your programming, you could do it. But if I had to do full body three days, that's how I would do it. I go like heavy Monday compound lifts, Tuesday isolation exercises for the full body. And then you know, Wednesday would be mobility, you know, full body and then you know, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday off.
- [65:58]
Melissa
Yeah, I don't know how I would, I go back and forth on. I mean you could even do like the, the upper body, lower body type of toggling. Yeah, something like that. You could, There's a lot of different things you. I'd also always want a client like this to consider like a maps 15 type routine. Like I'm assuming your other days when you work are long days and so getting to the gym for an hour is just not feasible, but that maybe getting a 15, 20 minute workout in your garage or something is feasible. And so this, this kind of micro dosing approach versus trying to cram it all in your three days.
- [66:31]
Mandy
By the way, something else that nobody ever really considers. Bodybuilders do this often, but really nobody else does. Because our days are, our weeks are seven days. We, we tend to just set a convenience program everything into seven day blocks.
- [66:46]
Melissa
Yeah, we're start looking at it in the month.
- [66:47]
Mandy
Yeah, bodybuilders for a long time would do like a routine. They'd be like three on, one off, you know, two on, one off, you know,. Type routine. So like every week each day looks different. Right. But they're not looking at from a seven day period, they're looking at from a 30 day period or a 35 day period or something like that.
- [67:02]
Melissa
So that's how I think that's what I meant by I would actually go upper, lower, upper, lower, upper, lower at the end regardless. Yeah, irregardless. So at the end of the month. So some weeks you have two of them going to be upper and then other times you're going to have two or lower and you just toggle through the whole month like that.
- [67:15]
Mandy
I like that.
- [67:15]
Melissa
After 30 days though it looks like. Yeah.
- [67:18]
Mandy
So after the whole year it looks pretty, pretty.
- [67:20]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I agree. I think that's, that's some. Sometimes we look at everything in this like snapshot of seven days and it's like, no, you're.
- [67:26]
Mandy
I actually like that. I like that a lot. Yeah, because you could easily, you could easily go upper, lower, upper and then lower, upper.
- [67:31]
Melissa
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, all the way through. And then at the end of the month, if you do the math on, you've basically getting two really good workouts of upper or lower in a week. Like that's pretty solid. You can make some pretty good gains.
- [67:42]
Mandy
That works well. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. You can find justinpumpjustin, you can find me at mindpump, distefano and Adam mindpump.
- [67:49]
Sal Destefano
Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body dramatically improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super bundle@mindpumpmedia.com the RGB Super Bundle includes maps, Anabolic maps, performance and maps aesthetic, nine months of phase expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources@mindpumpmedia.com if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support. And until next time, this is Mind Pump.
- [68:58]
Mandy
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Melissa
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Mandy
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Melissa
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Mandy
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