2754: Stress is Making You Fat! Here's how and how to fix it.

Summary

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth

Episode 2754: Stress is Making You Fat! Here’s How and How to Fix It
Released: December 20, 2025
Hosts: Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, Justin Andrews, Doug Egge

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Episode Overview

In this episode, the Mind Pump crew dives deep into the relationship between stress and fat gain, busting fitness myths around hormones, metabolism, and behavior. They not only break down the science but also provide practical, actionable strategies for managing stress—both for fitness progress and better overall health. As always, the hosts field live calls from listeners, offering raw, experience-led coaching and advice on programming, work-life balance, and overcoming fitness hurdles, especially for busy people.

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Main Discussion: How Stress Impacts Fat Gain and Fitness

The Fat-Stress Connection

• Sal sets the tone: “Stress, it’s making you fat…It is true that stress can change how your body stores body fat. There’s lots of studies that show…too much stress and your body stores more fat. It’s connected to a loss of muscle as well.” (03:58)
• It's not just about eating extra calories; chronic stress actually alters where and how fat is stored through hormonal changes.

Stress, Hormones, and Metabolism

• Caloric balance still applies, but stress changes burn and storage patterns:
  • “The law of thermodynamics still applies…but stress affects how you burn calories.” (04:44)
  • “Stress is potentially also slowing the metabolism down? Putting [your body] more in this kind of survival mode…” (05:38)
• Cortisol is not the villain—it’s essential, but chronic elevation is harmful.
  • “Cortisol is not a bad hormone…But stress elevates it. Too much exposure can cause problems…but you need it.” (05:52)
• Long-term, disrupted cortisol patterns wreck sleep, insulin sensitivity, and anabolic hormones (testosterone, growth hormone).

Hormones vs. Calories: Industry Debates

• The hosts push back against black-and-white industry narratives:
  • “It’s not one or the other, it’s all of them. And one affects the other.” (08:38)
• Hormones and calories are deeply interconnected through their combined effects on behavior, cravings, and physical outcomes.

Behavior, Sleep, Cravings, and Exercise Dysfunction

• Chronic stress leads to:
  • Stress-eating (often salt, sugar, and fat—the “palatability trifecta”), disrupted sleep, // and dysfunctional exercise patterns (overtraining or undertraining).
  • “Stress has very powerful effects on the foods that we choose to eat…processed food consumption goes through the roof.” (10:19)
• Even sleep disruption alone triggers more severe cravings and worsens food choices.
  • “Poor sleep is a stress. It throws cortisol off, does all these things…” (11:31)

Key Cycling: The Stress Feedback Loop

• Negative feedback: Stress worsens sleep → sleep disruption affects hormones → that worsens cravings and adds more stress—a vicious cycle.

Misuse of Exercise

• Overtraining to “burn off” stress or as an emotional outlet, or conversely tanking motivation entirely.

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Practical Solutions for Stress Management

1. Don’t Just “Eliminate Stress”

• Most can’t quit jobs or family, but perception is powerful.
• Purpose as an antidote: “When you have a sense of purpose behind what you do, stress is not nearly as stressful. How you perceive it makes a tremendous difference.” (15:13)
  • Practice reframing. Assign meaning to effort.

2. Practice Gratitude & Positive Self-talk

• “Our brains are not wired to notice positive things…If something bad happens, you remember…good things, you take for granted.” (20:58)
• Hosts emphasize out-loud gratitude and conscious reframing—practice matters (“You have to say that to believe it, and then feel it.” - Adam, 18:54).

3. Social Support—Choose Your Circle

• Friends at similar life stages (young moms/dads with same struggles, etc.) provide perspective and resilience—but avoid purely negative company.
  • “Misery loves company. A lot of people surround themselves with people doing less, and those [aren’t] healthy for you.” (25:31)

4. Exercise Appropriately

• “Strength training is a really effective way to make your body resilient. But it has to be appropriate—the right dose.” (26:16)
• For most stressed clients: emphasize brevity and effectiveness (e.g., MAPS 15-minute routines).

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Notable Quotes

“Stress, it’s making you fat…It is true that stress can change how your body stores body fat…also connected to a loss of muscle.”
— Sal (03:58)

“Cortisol is not a bad hormone…You need it. But stress elevates it. Too much exposure can cause problems…”
— Sal (05:52)

“It’s not one or the other, it’s all of them. And one affects the other.”
— Sal (08:38)

“Stress has very powerful effects on the foods we choose to eat…processed food consumption goes through the roof.”
— Sal (10:19)

“When you have a sense of purpose behind what you do, stress is not nearly as stressful. How you perceive it makes a tremendous difference.”
— Sal (15:13)

“You have to practice [positive self-talk]. And then through that practice it starts to sink in—you start to believe it.”
— Adam (16:14)

“Surround yourself...with people that really love you, that you admire…They will elevate you. They will tell you the truth.”
— Adam (25:31)

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Key Timestamps for Segments

• Intro to Stress & Fat Gain: 03:58-04:44
• Calories vs. Hormones Debate: 07:17-08:38
• How Stress Alters Behavior: 09:54-13:25
• Fixes: Perception, Purpose, Gratitude: 15:01-20:58
• Social Support & Exercise Recommendations: 25:18-26:43

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Live Coaching: Highlighted Call-Ins

Anthony (Trainer, MN) — Programming Order (57:09)

Q: Should I alternate muscle groups (chest/triceps) or finish all sets for one before moving on?

• A: Generally, finish the larger muscle group (e.g. all chest) before the smaller (triceps). Supports CNS learning and prevents premature fatigue. Exceptions: if a weak point needs focused attention.
• Advice for Trainers: Study established programming to master structure—don't just string exercises together.

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Emma (Mom, Iowa) — Stress, HRV, and Overtraining (66:17)

Q: How do I interpret low HRV (Heart Rate Variability) as a busy, stressed mom? When do I cut back?

• A: Stop obsessively tracking—HRV is for elite athletes in-season, not busy parents. Most selected programs (Split, Aesthetic) are too much.
• Prescription: MAPS 15-minute routines plus restorative activity (walking, yoga).
• “You’re going to get so strong and see such crazy results, it’s going to blow your mind.” — Sal (73:40)

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David (Young Trainer & Bodybuilder, AR) — Work-Life-Build Balance (73:49)

Q: How to balance gym work, growing a business, and personal life with a wife?

• A: There’s no daily “balance”; expect sprints and lulls. Crucially, communicate with your partner—a timeline and goal is key for buy-in. Leverage your transformation but don’t get stuck doing competitions for ego.
• “If your wife is on your team, you’ll probably drag yourself across glass…” — Sal (76:40)

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Natalie (Ex-trainer with Underweight History, MN) — Gaining Weight, Stress, and Body Image (86:00)

Q: How to gain muscle after being underweight and chronically stressed, without slipping into overtraining or disordered eating?

• A:
  • Don't fixate on scale or calories—track protein, focus on strength gains.
  • Counter negative self-talk with specific positive truths, spoken aloud.
  • When tempted to overtrain (group fitness background), do the opposite: longer rest, lower volume, focus on strength.
  • Use MAPS 15 Power Lift. Flexible approach if limited by Smith machine.
  • Celebrate outcomes like strength and resilience, not just appearance.

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Memorable and Relatable Moments

• The “Super Burrito Effect” — Adam describes stress-driven food choices:

  “When I wait to that moment of awareness—or not even in it—almost mindlessly deciding to go eat…that is really difficult.” (12:12)

• Transparency about personal struggles with stress and reframing:

  “The last 30 days of my life have been, if not the worst and hardest I’ve ever been through, a top three…But I have so much peace, joy and gratitude. I’ve had to say that, to believe it…” — Adam (18:54)

• Parenting stories and reflections on generational stress, food choices, and resilience.

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Science-Backed Takeaways and Tactical Steps

To break the stress-fat cycle, focus on:

• Perceiving “good stress” through purpose and gratitude
• Circling up with positive, resilient people in similar life stages
• Practicing and verbalizing self-compassion
• Selecting exercise intensity and volume based on recovery capability
• Using nutrition to promote recovery—not to numb stress

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Flow and Vibe

• Spirited, real-world, and unfiltered—equal parts science and storytelling.
• Hosts blend personal admissions, client anecdotes, and direct, research-based coaching.
• Practicality reigns: No silver bullets, but tools for everyday, chaotic lives.
• Emphasis on empathy: Understanding why clients or listeners act before offering fixes.

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For New Listeners

This episode is a goldmine if:

• You’re confused about the stress-fat link, especially in the real world
• You struggle with plateaus, motivation, or overdoing it “for stress relief”
• You want a no-BS, nuanced take on calories vs. hormones
• You want actionable tactics for building resilience and mental strength

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Listen for These Gems

• Sal’s stress ‘positive feedback loop’ explanation (13:25)
• Purpose-as-antidote to stress (15:13)
• Adam's raw story of reframing through hardship (18:54)
• Practical recs for burnout-prone lifters and parents (MAPS 15 & more) (26:16; 66:59)
• Live caller Natalie’s discussion around recovering from underweight and negative thoughts (86:00, 92:02)

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Transcript

[Sal DeStefano]

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[Adam Schafer]

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[Sal DeStefano]

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[Sal DeStefano]

To pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump. Mind Pump.

[Adam Schafer]

With your hosts, Sal Destefano, Adam Schaefer.

[Justin Andrews]

And Justin Andrews, you just found the.

[Sal DeStefano]

Most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we had live callers call in and we got to coach them on air. But this was after an intro. Today's intro is 52 minutes long. This is where we talk about fitness and fat loss and current events and family life. By the way, if you want to be on an episode like this one, submit your question to mplivecaller.com now this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is fatty 15. So fatty 15 contains a special fatty acid that has been shown to reduce inflammation, improve cognitive function and Improve athletic performance. It's called C15. It's a fatty acid I guarantee you're not supplementing with and it makes a huge difference. Justin and I have been using it now for about two months and I've seen a radical reduction in inflammation which now is allowing me to lift heavier. You gotta try it out. Use this with your fish oil. It's gonna give you complete fatty acid in terms of your health. Go check them out. Go to fatty15.com mindpump that's fatty15.com mind pump and you can get an additional 15% off with their 90 day subscription starter kit if you use the code mindpump. This episode is also brought to you by caldera lab skincare. That is natural, that works, that produces healthier skin. And over 90% of the studies done using caldera lab, it's the only skin care products that we use religiously. Go check them out. Get yourself a discount. Go to calderalab.com that's C-A L--E R-A L A B.com forward/mind pump. Use the code MINDPUMP20, get 20% off. We also have a brand new program, Maps 1540 Plus. So if you like Maps 40 plus, this is the 15 minute version of it. Super effective and it's 50% off. Here's the link. Go to 1540 plus com. That's 1540 plus com. Use the code DECEMBER50 for the 50% off discount. All right, real quick.

[Everett]

If you love us like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs or, or training gear over atmypumpstore.com. i'm talking right now.

[Adam Schafer]

Hit pause.

[Everett]

Head on over tomy pump store.com.

[Adam Schafer]

That'S it. Enjoy the rest of the show.

[Sal DeStefano]

Stress, it's making you fat. Well, that's a little dramatic, but it is true that stress can change how your body stores body fat. And there's lots of studies that show that there's a relationship between too much stress and your body storing body fat. It's also connected to a loss of of muscle. So we're going to talk about that today. How you can fix this is the reason why you're not making progress. Your stress. Let's get into it. Everybody relax. Yeah, that's it. You're fixed. Yeah, it totally works.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Now is this is like there's a bit of this that's controversial, right? Because is this only in the context of a calorie surplus or can this possibly happen to somebody who is operating in A place of, say, maintenance or even a deficit and still store body fat from there?

[Sal DeStefano]

That's a great question. So. So first off, and we'll get into this, but stress affects how you eat, so it's hard to separate the two. Okay, so it does also affect your caloric intake, the types of foods that you eat. We'll get to that. But independent of that, the data does seem to suggest that stress itself has this like special quality of increasing or changing, I should say especially fat disposition or where you store body fat. And this is probably due to hormones. Now, that being said, your calories out does get affected by the stress also. So yes, the law of thermodynamics still applies, meaning you can't gain extra tissue without extra calories. But does stress affect how you burn calories?

[Adam Schafer]

Or another way of saying that stress is potentially also slowing the metabolism down?

[Sal DeStefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

Putting it more in this kind of survival mode of I'm taking on all this stress, I need to conserve.

[Sal DeStefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Energy.

[Sal DeStefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Is that kind of another way of saying it?

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. So. So stress does have a different direct effect on hormones. So we'll start there for a second. Everybody knows cortisol is a stress hormone. I do want to say cortisol is not a bad hormone.

[Adam Schafer]

No.

[Sal DeStefano]

If you had no, you would be miserable with no cortisol. You need cortisol. But what stress does do is it elevates cortisol. Because cortisol is this kind of energy producing hormone now over if too much exposure to it, it can cause problems, but you need it. Okay. And cortisol in a healthy individual spikes in the morning and slowly comes down at night.

[Everett]

It's problematic.

[Sal DeStefano]

You want it to go down throughout the day because otherwise you can't sleep. And you want it to go up in the morning, otherwise you can't wake up. And chronic stress can cause just constant elevation of cortisol. Or what becomes more common is an inverted cortisol curve where it's slow to come up in the morning. And then. And so you wake up and you're like, I need coffee, I need energy. Drain something I'm dragging. And then by the end of the day you're tired, but wired and you're like, why am I having trouble sleeping? What's going on? And that's related to cortisol. Now elevated cortisol also affects insulin sensitivity. Makes it worse. It has, has effects on all kinds of different things, including anabolic hormones like testosterone and growth hormone, which start to get dysfunctional as well. So from a hormone perspective, definitely Definitely has an impact.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. But I like, I like having this question in relation to the whole calorie thing, because I think this is where there's a divide in the fitness industry, where the science community will, you know, will point to the, the people that are talking about cortisol and hormones and say, oh, that's all fear mongering. It's all calories in versus calories out. But what you, what we understand when, when those hormones are imbalanced, when you have these, these spikes of, of cortisol, when you shouldn't be like at nighttime and stuff like that, this throws off behaviors. Throwing off the behaviors ends up throwing off what you eat many times. And so they're not independent of each other. And so I get really annoyed by our, our space when we, when we do this, when we start pointing at each other. Who's more right about it? When someone's communicating about the importance, it's a real impact. Has a massive, definitely influence. Has a massive impact. And this is an area where studies fail us because when we talk about these, these people in studies where it's, oh, it's just the, it's just a lot of, it's just the calories thing. So it doesn't matter that person's insulin's a little this way or cortisol that way if they were to eat these calories. But the reality we know is that that person who's all over the place, insulin, cortisol, doesn't eat the way that control group does, and therefore it affects their behaviors and therefore makes that.

[Sal DeStefano]

Even if they didn't, Adam, even if they didn't, we'll get to that, by the way, because it has a very, very powerful influence on your eating behaviors. That's what stress, Stress is like. Stress eating is a thing, right? Yeah. So it does affect your behavior strongly and we'll get to that. But even if it, even if your caloric intake didn't change, your hormones will change or influence how many calories your body burns anyway. So, yeah, law of thermodynamics still applies, but law of thermodynamics doesn't change. But suddenly your caloric burn changes. In other words, if you take a man with really low testosterone and you put him on testosterone and you change nothing else, they get leaner. Well, what happened there, it built muscle. Yeah, it changed. It improved insulin sensitivity, built some muscle metabolism boost. You know, he's leaner as a result of more muscle. And does he actually lose pounds of fat? A little bit. That's what the Data shows you do the same thing with women with their hormones. You start to see changes in body composition. So do hormones play a role? Yeah. Is it along with thermodynamics also apply? Yeah, it all applies. It's not one or the other, it's all of them. And one affects the other. You could also affect your hormones through your diet, through trying to manipulate the law of thermodynamics by under eating or by overeating too much.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

So it all plays a role. But let's talk about how it affects behaviors. Stress has very powerful effects on the foods that we choose to eat. And it can look like this. It could either look like I don't want to eat. So extreme stress will do this in some people, which typically is followed up by a rebound in appetite. Or more commonly, when you feel chronic levels of stress, you want to escape.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Everett]

You want comfort.

[Sal DeStefano]

You want comfort. And in the moment, really hyper palatable food does that. In the moment. It's. It's normal. And so what people tend to do when their stress levels are not managed properly, which we'll get to, is a increase of consumption of salt, sugar and fat, which are the three main ingredients in palatability, the trifecta, or to be even more specific, processed food consumption. Fast food consumption goes through the roof. And that's just what stress does.

[Adam Schafer]

Now, is it this related to what's going on with cortisol, insulin and then how it impacts ghrelin and the. And that impact is now all of it. Okay.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's not just that. It's also neurotrans way more complex than that, but it's also that. But it's also neurotransmitters. It's also, I feel crappy. I want to feel better psychologically.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, there's. I remember, and we've talked about this on the show a bunch of times, but I remember that being such a, like a big hack for me was becoming aware of that. Those cravings for just like junk food or foods that I normally don't crave and connecting the dots to. To poor sleep. And I remember just like.

[Sal DeStefano]

Because poor sleep is a stress.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes. And then it throws all. Throws the cortisol off, does all the things that you're talking about right now. And so realizing, just becoming aware that that's coming because I got like waking up and going like, oh, grogging. Oh God, terrible night asleep wasn't good. So that like just going, oh, I'm going to have a challenge today made making those decisions and being Good like with my food choices that much easier. Just simply being aware versus oh feel good slamming that coffee or energy drink to get me going and then just like ignoring that and getting my day going and then getting busy and then realizing I haven't eaten anything and then now I'm now I'm starving and oh.

[Sal DeStefano]

My God super burrito.

[Adam Schafer]

The only that sounds good is a super burrito or something greasy fat like and, and then, then that and then when, when I wait to that moment of awareness or not even in the almost mindlessly deciding to go eat or buy it's really difficult to make that right decision. Simply understanding the impact of what you're talking about. Knowing that man, I had. It's been a crazy week. It's been very stressful. What's going on my family, I had a rough night last night where the temptations come in.

[Sal DeStefano]

Right, right.

[Adam Schafer]

I know like oh tonight, around today, around this time or tonight I'm going to be really wanting that thing. Like it's wild how much just the awareness it doesn't mean it's easy. And I still don't have to make that choice.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're just not caught off guard.

[Adam Schafer]

But I'm not caught off guard totally. And so and I'm aware and that has made a massive impact on making it easier to make which by the.

[Sal DeStefano]

Way is a good, a good coach will do this for a client. They'll tell them hey anticipate to feel like this y and their odds of success are so much higher.

[Adam Schafer]

Right. And a lot of times I tell them like listen, I'm not going to tell you not to enjoy the thing or not do the thing. Just go do this first and then tell me how you feel. And a lot of times what will happen is they'll go eat and this is all I've learned to do is like my brain's going oh man, I really want that thing. It's like well let me go eat this first. And then if I still want it I will. And then many times that right. Worse will. Yes, that's right.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's right. So stress and what's interesting about what stress does to the body so it has a negative impact on sleep. Either making you sleep a lot through depression or more commonly broken up sleep where you kind of either have an insomnia or you wake up at 3am and it's tough to go back to sleep or you're restless. It has a negative effect on sleep which then also has a negative effect on hormones which then also has a negative Effect on cravings and appetite, which your eating behaviors then go back and affect your hormones negatively, which also go back and affect your sleep poorly, which all add more stress. It's a positive feedback loop that makes things a lot worse. It also does this. This is what we deal with all the time as trainers. A lot of stress can create a dysfunction around exercise. And what that looks like with people is either I over train because I'm needing more cortisol, because in the temporary cortisol feels good, so I'm going to push it out through these hyper intense workouts, or I'm distracting myself by moving all the time or I don't want to do anything. Yeah. And so the relationship with exercise in a, in the context of too much stress is dysfunctional.

[Everett]

That's a very common one too, to overexercise in this state because you do get an energy spike and a surge from that cortisol.

[Sal DeStefano]

Totally.

[Everett]

So, yeah, I mean, we see this common all the time with our clients.

[Sal DeStefano]

Totally. All right, so let's talk about the fixes now. I'm going to. We're going to go off of what the actual data shows to be the most effective way to deal with chronic levels of stress. What people typically think they need to do with stress is eliminate it from their life.

[Adam Schafer]

Or sweat it out.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, or sweat it out. But typically it's like, I got too much stress. I need to change. I need the stress out of my life. Here's why that's not a great approach.

[Everett]

Meditate it out.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oftentimes you can't because it's my job, just reframing or it's my kids or it's life. And if you look at the data, you could look at people who objectively have more stress in their lives, who do far better than people who objectively have less stress in their lives. And you think, well, what are they doing different? There's a few things that they do different. One of them is they add purpose. They're driven. Right. There's a difference between I have to go to work, oh my God, I have to do this job. And I'm lucky to do this job. And I want to. I'm choosing to do this job because of all these other things that are important to me. When you have a sense of purpose behind what you do, stress is not nearly as stressful. Literally, how you perceive it makes a tremendous difference. And adding purpose makes a big saying.

[Adam Schafer]

That saying that is easier said than done. And so a lot of times when I'm helping or coaching Somebody through this process, a lot of times you got to kind of just practice saying it before you believe it.

[Sal DeStefano]

Of course, you know, like, you got to train yourself.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, you do, you do. And so, and, and that's, it's a hard step for people because people go like, yeah, but I hate the job and I don't want it. And all the things is like, yeah, but it also provides that roof over your, your kid's head and your wife. And it also does this thing. And it also does.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're doing a great thing.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah. And you're good at it. And you actually have been successful and you've been doing it for a long, like, it's like, like you have to reframe it. You have to say it out loud and then you're gonna continue because it's not like you do it one time. You're like, oh, now I feel this purpose. It's like you have to practice that. And then through that practice, it starts to sink in and set in. And then you start to believe your.

[Everett]

Eyes are set on the other side of that too. Like a lot of these obstacles that you're facing that are stressing you out, it's like avoiding it is going to cause way more stress than actually like pursuing your way through.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's funny too, when they do studies on men and women, or in particular married couples, when. And it's a little different for men and women, but just illustrates what we're talking about. When a wife tells her husband, who's working real hard, let's say he's working 12 hour days grinding, and she's like, you're such a champion for our family. Something like that. It changes how he perceives the stress of the work. When a wife goes to the husband and says, oh my God, today was.

[Everett]

So big reward signal.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. She's like, today was so hard. And instead of trying to solve it for her like a lot of men do, he's like, yeah, man, it is hard. She suddenly feels different about. Yes. And so it makes a huge. That's just one example. But you can do this for yourself. You know, I had to go through this as a young father, trying to, when I was, you know, first became a dad, accept that my life is different. A lot of people will start going to have kids and they'll say, kids are so stressful. It's a different kind of stress when you're, when you can't let go of your previous life. When you're like, wait, I can't go with my buddies. Anymore, or I can't go do that thing anymore, versus, wow, this is a new stage of my life. This is who I am now. This is what I do. Yeah, it changes quite a bit.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Another one is to practice gratitude. People have heard this so many times. I know, you guys, this is so effective precisely because how our brains are wired. Our brains are not wired to notice positive things.

[Everett]

They're just, I think the Adam's earlier point about, like, really verbalizing that. Because if you're constantly saying things that, you know, nag you out and you're, you just catch yourself in conversations with people, like bringing things up and you're not in that positive mindset, you know, it really comes out. And so if you practice actually verbalizing positive things in gratitude, not just journaling, and yeah, that's great. I, I, I practice that as well because that's a whole nother part of the process. But like to actually say things that are going well and say that and maybe out compete the negatives.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

The last 30 days of my life have been, if not the worst and hardest I've ever been through. It's definitely a top three. And it's not just because of the stuff that I shared on the podcast with Draws. We've had a ton of other stuff behind the scenes that most people have no idea about that has put a level of pressure, stress, pain, all the things on me. And of course, I have a lot of great family, friends, brothers that are consistently texting me, how you doing? How you doing? And I mean, these guys have been on the other end of that text message. And I go, I'm honest. This is the hardest, craziest thing. Followed by, but I have so much peace and joy and gratitude. And I've said that every single time. And it's amazing how I feel going through this whole process. But I do believe that a lot of that has to do do with. I've had to say that. I've had to say that, to believe that, to then feel that. And it's been crazy to think back. I mean, my own wife is just continuous to remind me. It's just like she goes, it's been so wild to watch you go through all these things that's been happening, both personally business and what you've gone through, and just to see you happy and joyful and everybody knows I'm the moody. All this stuff that. So you would think that my personality type would defer to just this raging pain in the ass to be around, but no, I've I've. I've reframed the. This, this hard stuff as like, you know, I would. There's nobody else I'd rather do it with. I'm so blessed in so many things. It. This could have been so much worse, but I still got this going. You know, I'm saying, like, it's. That's, that's what's being said in my head constantly, and I had to verbalize it, and I've done it enough now that I really feel it and believe it.

[Sal DeStefano]

You know, what's, what you're saying? First of all, it's. The data shows works. It works.

[Everett]

Yes.

[Sal DeStefano]

Here's the challenge that people have. We've been told that it's invalidating. Oh, you have stress, but, you know, a difficult life and you're trying to think of the positive that's so invalidating of your struggle. No, it's not. It's not. It's not saying you're not going through difficult times. It's. It's realizing and understanding this. You are. Minds are not wired to notice the positive. They're wired to notice the negative. Period. End of story. Whether or not you're going through really difficult time or not, if something bad happens, you will remember it. Lots of good things happen all day long that you take for granted. Yeah. Or you don't. And look, I come from a family of poor immigrants. And I remember as a kid growing up in my family and then being around other families and being like, wow, this is really. It's kind of different. Why is my family different in some of these respects? I'll tell you why. Because they were poor as hell when they came to this country. My dad had. I mean, he slept in the same bed with six siblings until he moved out at the age of 18. Literally.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't even know how you fit six siblings.

[Sal DeStefano]

They had to put two beds together. My grandma would put a sheet over it, and they would sleep head to foot. Head to foot. Up until he was an adult, didn't have a bathroom in his house until he was in his mid teens. They didn't have a phone. And, you know, this is just the story of my family. And they were always so, like, grateful and so. And he would tell me about how he blessed he was that, you know, we have these things. And it's because he, he had that gratitude because he had that contrast, which is gift, which is actually a gift. And I've practiced this, by the way. I've practiced this. You have to do this consciously. What I'm Trying to say is if you consciously pay attention to blessings. And I've done this where it's every other hour, because otherwise I forget. So if it's every other hour and I think, what am I? What was great that happened the last couple hours? It changes your filter and you start to notice these things, and it's really awesome.

[Adam Schafer]

You guys know, I. I've shared before, I love Shaquille o' Neal stories, and so many of them are buried and hidden because he doesn't talk about them. I saw a new one that I hadn't heard about that was really cool. And he tells a story when he's. His early years in the NBA and he just. Terrible game. Didn't show up his best self or what like that. And his dad, oh, I love this. Calls him up and it was just like. He's like, what's up? You didn't. You didn't. Yeah, I was just basically telling him it was tough. I didn't. I didn't, you know, I didn't bring my game. I didn't show up like this and that. He's like, get your ass on the plane right now. Dad, I gotta go. To hear him. Get your ass on the plane right now. Made him fly all the way across the country back from where he's at. Literally gets him in the. Gets him in the car, drives till he finds a homeless man, and he says, get out. Get out and go talk to him. And then he leaves him. Literally leaves him. He goes, get out. Go take care of him. Go help him out. And left, sits, meets the guy, figures out. Now, at this point, he's already making good money, his connections, all the things. And so he ends up like, literally making a couple of phone. He asked the guy what he did before. He used to do landscaping. Lost his job, he has a family, doesn't have a place to live, all these things. Makes a couple of phone calls. A buddy who owns condominiums and apartments. Get him a plate. Pays for his living for the next year, get. Gets him a job in landscaping, stuff like that, Literally. But it completely reframed, like what he was bitching about. This guy gets to do what he loves to do for a living, get paid millions of dollars. And you can't show up. You can't show up. You can't show up. You can't be grateful for what you have, what you do. Like you're complaining, you're bitching, you're making excuses. Like, no, let me show you. Let me show you what real it was.

[Sal DeStefano]

You have to practice it. It doesn't happen naturally. By the way, what we're talking about changes the effects that your normal stress has on your body. So what we're saying is, is your normal stress that you're not changing your life necessarily still go to work, but because of these practices, your hormones change, your insulin sensitivity change, your body changes how it reacts to this stress and you become more resilient. Another one the data shows is to be around good friends, especially good friends who are in the same life stage as you. You would be shocked. It's remarkable how helpful it is if you're a young mom struggling with your kids or whatever, to hang around other young moms going through the same thing, or if you're a new dad or if you're an entrepreneur or if you're a new trainer or whatever. You hang around other people who are friends of yours that you have good character, who are going through a similar struggle. And you'll find that it makes things feel a lot different.

[Adam Schafer]

I would add that there's a fine line there. And what that fine line is, is it does have to be the right people, of course, because you don't want.

[Sal DeStefano]

To be over negative.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I mean, and a lot of people do this.

[Sal DeStefano]

A lot of commiserate.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right, a lot. Misery loves company. And a lot of people surround themselves with people that are doing less in their lives to make themselves feel better. And those people in those situations are not healthy for you and actually can bring that or exacerbate a situation like that. So having people that really love you, that you admire that, that emulate things in life that you want to be like that you consider a brother or a sister or someone like that you're that close to, to you surround yourself around those people because they will, they will elevate you. They will tell you the truth. They will. And that, that is super powerful. But it can also work in the other direction if they're the.

[Sal DeStefano]

You know who they are. If you go to them and you feel worse. I've known people like that.

[Everett]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Don't talk to them.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, no, for sure.

[Sal DeStefano]

Lastly, use exercise properly. Strength training is a really, really effective way to make your body resilient. But has to be appropriate.

[Adam Schafer]

The right dose.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, right. Maps 15 would be the kind of program that most people who are feeling too much stress would. Would do great with and nothing else. Like don't add a bunch of other exercise. And if you do those things, you could, you'll literally change how your body reacts. And responds and your hormones and all those things to the current stress that you have in your life. And again, this is backed by the data.

[Adam Schafer]

I'd say that's probably, I don't know what percentage. If you guys had a guess, I'd say at least 30, maybe even as high as 50% of the, the callers that we get.

[Sal DeStefano]

Mass 15.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And a lot of it's due not because they're not doing enough or doing the things, it's because they have so much stress in their life and they're, they're training, standing in on top of it. Yeah, it's like, I mean we had one today, at least one or two today. Low calorie, 15, 000 steps, only eating 2,000, you know, 2,000 calories, training four days a week plus playing some sports here and there, like just doing all these kids job 50 hours a week. It's like, man, that is a lot. And you're thinking going to the gym, is that with that type of intensity and consistency should be showing you it's not. And that's part of the reason why is they're not taking care of the stress.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right, I gotta talk about a supplement that I've been taking now for 45 days, maybe two months consistently. And I talked about on a previous podcast. I noticed a pretty big reduction in inflammation, wanted to keep using it. And it's for sure this, it's for sure this. And it's the fatty 15 and it's the. Doug, what's the name of the fatty acid? In fact get that for me because I forgot the name of it. But it's a fatty acid that has really good anti inflammatory effects on the body. And I was talking to Justin about it because he's been noticing the same thing.

[Everett]

Yeah, I've been noticing that and I was gonna ask you, does it have any relation to sleep in terms of quality? Yes, because that's something that's changed a bit for me.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yes. So C15. C15 is the name of the name of the fatty acids found in high amounts in whole, in whole dairy. Which by the way, to get the amount of this fatty acid from whole day, you have to eat a lot of it. Because some people might be like, well, I have milk. You actually have to consume a decent amount.

[Adam Schafer]

It's so interesting that it's, that it's, it's, it's not derived from that because it's considered vegan.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's. Yeah, no, that's, that's a good point. Yeah, they made the Fatty acid.

[Adam Schafer]

So that's interesting. So it's, it's, it's four people but.

[Sal DeStefano]

It'S the same thing. Yeah, it's the same thing.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. So you're getting the benefits of dairy without consuming a product.

[Sal DeStefano]

Particular fatty acid. Yeah, this particular fatty acid has these effects. So I, I was getting lift and I still have a little bit of it. Left hip pain. All truth. You know, truth be told, I probably have a little bit of damage in my left hip from just lifting like an idiot. Yeah. And. And since taking that, it's went down 80.

[Everett]

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, we commiserate about that because like for a while there consistently wake up and the hips were the first things to talk to me. And I was just like, oh man. And I just. Regular workouts and just anything squat related, any kind of hip hinge and I, I would pay for it. And I say I haven't had that.

[Sal DeStefano]

Experience in a while. It's the most, it's literally the most effective anti inflammatory thing I've done a long time.

[Adam Schafer]

And it's different than omegas.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's right.

[Adam Schafer]

So it's like you would do it in conjunction.

[Sal DeStefano]

You could take it with Omega 3.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, yep.

[Adam Schafer]

I've been consistent with that. I haven't been with the fatty 15.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's why I have it right next to me.

[Adam Schafer]

The sleep thing makes me really want to try it. Oh yeah. I didn't realize that.

[Sal DeStefano]

No. Today I was just telling Justin about my world record hip thrust.

[Everett]

I tried to act in pr.

[Sal DeStefano]

I really hate. Hey, can I tell you right now, I hate that it's an exercise you can't brag about. Because I want to brag about it. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean you can call, you call your boy Brett.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hey, bro.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, text him. Yeah. I told you he'll pump your tires. Trash.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, he'll pump your t. Well, show me.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, Jorts.

[Sal DeStefano]

I told, I told Justin when I came in here that I'm going to have the biggest butt. I'm going to have the biggest butt in here. Oh, I'm coming after Justin.

[Everett]

I think you have the juiciest, but I, I think mine will be the, you know, powerhouse, bro.

[Adam Schafer]

Don't worry about it.

[Sal DeStefano]

Just kidding. If my butt was barely, you know how disproportionate my body would look.

[Adam Schafer]

You look like a Brazilian but freaking Minar, dude.

[Sal DeStefano]

Dude.

[Adam Schafer]

How many, how often are you hip thrusting right now?

[Sal DeStefano]

Once a week.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay. And then like how many till you cross over to the other side? You know, like too many hip Thrusts. You've hip thrusting twice that line, dude.

[Sal DeStefano]

You know what? I like it because it. It's making me feel strong in my posterior chain, of course, but it feels good. And it's a very simple, basic exercise.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, you're just doing. Because we don't have a machine here. You're just doing. And you're doing it. Where do you put the bench? Against the squat or the deadlift thing?

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, and I get the lower bench.

[Adam Schafer]

Because that's the only thing I can't stand.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. And I'm. Yeah, six plates today. I was just repping that out, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

How do you like that, Justin?

[Adam Schafer]

We're all in trainers impressed. We're all the trainers, impressed.

[Sal DeStefano]

I mean.

[Adam Schafer]

That's cool.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're in the great. Your bikini. Anyway, it was. It was a good time, too. It was a good time, you say.

[Adam Schafer]

Though, you know, you do notice it translate over into your squat and deadlift.

[Sal DeStefano]

Squat. Deadlift. Yeah, yeah. And it's a safe. It's a safe hip hinge. Ish exercise.

[Everett]

I mean, I would anticipate maybe more even deadlift.

[Anthony]

No.

[Sal DeStefano]

What do you mean?

[Everett]

Like, it translates.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, More deadlift.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oh, yeah. But I, you know, I'm not deadlifting a ton these days because I get carried away with it. I get strong real fast.

[Adam Schafer]

I feel like you always say that. And then I catch you, like, you.

[Sal DeStefano]

Know, I'm going for 700 guys here and there.

[Adam Schafer]

The next day, I feel like that's why I don't. I feel like he says it and then I'll. Sudden I go walking by and it was like, you know, the five plates.

[Sal DeStefano]

Over there, like, okay, guys, that's not heavy, dude. That's my. That's my normal.

[Everett]

Yeah, he threw that at me.

[Adam Schafer]

And I'm like, wow, dude. Hey, you're no good to us in a wheelchair, dog. I can still talk.

[Sal DeStefano]

You know, I've had that thought.

[Everett]

True.

[Sal DeStefano]

You know, I had that thought. I actually had that. Oh, my God, what a morbid thought. I had such a morbid thought the other day because we've had some.

[Adam Schafer]

What if I broke my spine from dead?

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, I was. I was thinking, this is how crazy. I've had some. We've had some terrible stuff. I won't go into it because it'll make everybody crapped out.

[Adam Schafer]

But some.

[Sal DeStefano]

Some bad things happen to my family recently and we've had some loss. But I was thinking I had these morbid thoughts like, wow, what if something. What if something happened to me? And then I felt blessed? I'M like, dude, I. I have a job where I could lose half my body and we'd be all right. You know what I mean? You just put my. Just put me in my chair and I would just do this.

[Adam Schafer]

Sal's head like maps up her body.

[Everett]

It's a Futurama or, you know, you encapsulated head. We'll keep this podcast going forever.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hey, speaking of, of big dude, I did you. What do you guys think of that picture I sent my.

[Adam Schafer]

My bro his belly? I don't remember him being well fed that. Well fed.

[Sal DeStefano]

He looks like a, like a, like a little mini strongman.

[Adam Schafer]

What were you guys doing?

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, yeah, it was Jessica, dude. Just so she.

[Adam Schafer]

Which is so funny because you always tell the stories of like the Italian grandmother who's fallen around food.

[Sal DeStefano]

Was that like he ate it? She didn't force feed him. He. He ate it. He loved it. But what she used to do, she.

[Everett]

Broke like, like steak and stuff, right?

[Sal DeStefano]

She broke. We got those. What's the super industrial strength blender? What's that called?

[Adam Schafer]

Vitamix.

[Sal DeStefano]

Vitamix, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Vitamix or Ninja.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay. We bought the, like the, the like the real powerful one. She broke three of them. She would broke. She would break them. The engine would burn out because she put tri tip and sweet potato, but.

[Everett]

Like tri tip, like sludge.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. And she like the whole thing. And she'd make these little meals, you know, for him and that kid. I'm sure he was one and a half eating 70 grams of protein a day with that.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh my God.

[Sal DeStefano]

And he got so red, that picture in his little shorts and his little beefcake. Oh, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

How do you guys. Do you guys feed him? I know you have like your kind of your foods they can have all the time and they can kind of roam and that's their, their snacks. But they typically eat the same thing you guys eat every night for dinner or is.

[Sal DeStefano]

It depends. It depends. We always. Jessica will always have ground beef and rice for them. Yeah. So they can pick that anytime they want. Yeah. And sometimes they'll just eat that because we'll have something else that they're not interested in. Do you want your meat and rice?

[Adam Schafer]

Sure, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Give it to them.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

And that's such a great easy dish. You know, some just grass fed ground beef rice.

[Adam Schafer]

Steak. Steak and rice is what Max eats almost. Yeah, dude, Steak and rice, chicken and rice. The. The go to stuff like that. I tell you, when he went to his friend's house, he went to his best friend's house. And you know, when he, we're now at an age where I'm totally like, I'm cool about what everyone feeds him and does now. And like, I feel like we've done such a cool job of like laying a foundation that he navigates. Yeah, he did two nights ago with his, his Auntie Jerlene. They, they, they have a tradition where they, they do cookies and they taste test and we don't tell him you can't or you have a certain, like. And he comes back and mom's like, how many did you have? He, I had two. You know, it's like you just have two cookies. And he could have had more. He, he had a dozen with him, carrying with him when he came back. And he, he'll. He'll say no to it. He went to our friends, his friend's house and his, his dad ordered five guys burgers and he gave him the buns back. Yeah, I don't want the buns. Yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Look at that. Hey, look at that picture. Doug scrolled out. Look at this.

[Adam Schafer]

A hoss, bro.

[Sal DeStefano]

What a little meatball, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

He's a horse right there.

[Sal DeStefano]

I love. I don't know what it is about chubby kids, but they're the best, dude. His feet were as wide as they were long. He had little square feet.

[Adam Schafer]

Square feet.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. They look like little, little biscuits.

[Adam Schafer]

He's linking out right now, though.

[Sal DeStefano]

He is. He's growing.

[Adam Schafer]

I want to see him next to Max because he looks like he's taller than Max now, bro. He looks so much older than my.

[Sal DeStefano]

Three year old, my daughter is. Because he's got some muscle genetics from his mom. Dahlia is strong, bro. She's three. She grabs onto the edge of the counter and does a legless pull up just with her fingers. She pulls herself up to look over. I saw her do it the other day.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

I'm like, what did I look at my head? Do you see what she did the other day?

[Adam Schafer]

Did you hit you with, bro, she.

[Sal DeStefano]

Was jumping off the couch and she jumps and does jump kicks, which I don't know where she learns them. She does spin kick. Yeah, kicks or she'll jump and hit me. And she hit me with her teeth and it didn't hurt her, but she saw me bleeding and then she's like, cried.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

And I'm like, oh, it's okay. It doesn't hurt. I'm like trying to reassure her the whole time. Yeah, bro, she told me too. She go, remember I told you guys.

[Everett]

I gave her actually Bleeds.

[Sal DeStefano]

I told you guys. I gave her, like, the least angry look of all time, but it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, she was so upset.

[Sal DeStefano]

She brings it up to me now. You made the meanest face to me the other day. I'm like, oh, honey.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, it's. It's such a trip to me to see the daughters, man. Remember when I brought up a long time ago about where kids are most likely to act up and do those things are, like, the percentage. Yeah. With mom is so, so wild because I always. Katrina always hears me talk about Max, and she's like, you know, you say that about our son, but our son can be a little shit with this and that. I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. I've never seen that before. Because he will. He'll be. He'll. He'll.

[Sal DeStefano]

He's.

[Adam Schafer]

He can be ornery with her, but it's like. That's just. It is like he's. He's finding that boundary with her, and he's good once he tells her, but I don't even see it. Like, it don't happen to me like I did. She's already corrected it with her. With him, and she had to deal with it that by the time it gets to me, it's like, he doesn't. You know, he doesn't challenge it whatsoever. It's such an interesting thing to talk about with her because she's like, when.

[Sal DeStefano]

They get to teenage, sometimes they'll push dad a little bit. That's what I'll hear from other dads. Yeah, well, they'll do a little bit. And then they got to hear.

[Everett]

Yeah, they never did. And, yeah, they start kind of tone the line a little bit, and. And then you just bark one time.

[Sal DeStefano]

I'm.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm. I. There's a part of me that I'm wrestling with because there's. It's almost like I want a little bit of it, because I know. I know that. I know. That's the part I'm wrestling with. It's like, come on, don't be careful what you wish for. Right.

[Sal DeStefano]

Especially if he inherits any of your tenacity, bro. Didn't you, like, not talk to your mom for, like, a year because they got. They took your car.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Like, you literally didn't talk to her for, like.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's. That is some dedication, bro.

[Adam Schafer]

No, it's for sure. That's. That's like some trauma, dog. It's like some still kids still trying to figure out all the trauma stuff at that point. At that point. So.

[Sal DeStefano]

But he.

[Adam Schafer]

I. We're like, I cannot for. I think I tell you guys, his best friend and that they're inseparable, right? They do everything together. He's. He's hardcore into football right now. So at recess, like, his. His best friend goes and plays football, and my son's like, yeah, no, And. And I pick him up, and I'm always like, hey, would you do what you. I always ask him what he did for his elective. And then I. Who did you play with at recess and what'd you do? And I'm like, you didn't play with Julian? No, no, he. He played football. I'm like, how come you don't. You don't play with him? Dad, they're rough.

[Sal DeStefano]

And I'm like.

[Adam Schafer]

And I'm like, yeah, but that's. That's part of playing. So he's like, yeah. Can I tell you something? I'm like, yeah, of course you can. He. He always asks, can I tell you something? I'm like, yeah, you could. Yes, you could tell me. He goes, yeah, the. The teachers don't really like it. And I'm like. I'm like, why? And he's just like, because they're. They. They get hurt all the time. And he's like, so. Yeah, no, Dad, I don't. I don't. I don't really care. I'm like, oh, my God, this guy, it's too much. Oh. He's like, well, and Katrina, as her and I had a talk. We're like, okay, there's some things like, like, well, he don't even want. He don't want to ride a bike, right? So we're like, okay, we're gonna have to, like, he's getting to an age now where he needs to know how to ride a bike. Like, you need to know how to ride.

[Sal DeStefano]

Have you tried.

[Adam Schafer]

He probably already strider and all this.

[Sal DeStefano]

No, no, no, no, no. I mean, like something he really wants. And then you say, hey, if you.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, so this. So this is what we just decided was, okay. There's things that he's really into. Piano is like all these things, and there's always that. And that's what we do a lot of stuff. So what her and I just agreed is like, hey, I think Christmas, we're going to get him a bike, and we're probably going to do that. He's going to be a training wheel direction. And so we'll do that. And then what we're Going to do is just start to the end of the block, like. And when he goes, hey, let's play uno. Be like, all right, cool. First we got to ride to the end of the block, and then we'll. Then we'll play, you know, we'll do the.

[Sal DeStefano]

That'll work.

[Adam Schafer]

Baby steps of like, yeah, yeah, you gotta do that first, and then we'll play that. And I know he'll kind of be. Begrudgingly. He'll do it, but I think he'll start to get good at it and figure it out, and then I think he'll like doing it. But we're gonna have to do that. Like, we're gonna have to use something else to get him to introduce it to him.

[Sal DeStefano]

You have to do that in. In some direction, no matter what.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes. And so literally just this was last night's conversation. Her and I are like, are agreeing that, like, okay, he's getting that age now where all his friends are going to be swimming, riding a bike, doing these things and playing sports. And it's like, if we can't get him doing some of those things and we don't find a way to kind of almost force introduce it, but then also that delicate dance of, like, I'm not going to make him do something he hates. But I'm like, if I can go, hey, if you just ride your bike down to the corner, then we'll play uno. I think that's gonna. So I'll report back.

[Sal DeStefano]

Did I bring up on the show how Aurelius did with the BB gun? I know I told you guys off air, but.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I. I of course got excited. When you send that because your son's younger than mine. I'm like, hey, look at this. And I'm like, showing him, like, we should get one of these. He's like, that looks dangerous.

[Sal DeStefano]

Meanwhile. Meanwhile, I'll tell you what Aurelia said. So we were shooting. First of all, he's gifted. He is gifted with. And you guys know how I'm like the carnival guy. There's something there, I think, there, because I've always. When it comes to firearms, I've always been pretty. Pretty accurate. Yeah. Not that I go to the range often, but when I do.

[Adam Schafer]

No, he's for that. For that age. For him to be hitting the can is very impressive. We put it flat, so very impressive.

[Sal DeStefano]

So we got a huge. You guys know we have a huge backyard.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

And he. It took him three or four times to figure out how to aim. And then he was every time pink Bink. I mean, and he's hitting. It's far.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Then he said, can you put it flat so I could shoot in the hole, you know, the mouth of the can. And he was hitting it in the mouth of the can.

[Adam Schafer]

That's impressive with the BB gun. I mean it's. To me, especially since I have an older son watching that go. I'm going like, it's impressive that he's even handling the gun and even somewhat aiming it like, oh, it's great.

[Sal DeStefano]

And then we were. But then here's, you know, here, now you get a taste of him. My son, he's like, can I shoot birds? Like, no, we can't shoot birds. What about crows? We don't like crows.

[Everett]

You get crazy. Like back my yard, we have this whole dedicated. We, we were really into this for a while with like the pellet guns and BB guns and all that stuff. And you have the ones, the targets that spin. I, I drilled in all these ones, all of these trees and we had like, you know, can strings, like the whole thing. Dude, there's, there's really cool ones that they have now that like move. Yes. And anyways, you can, you can geek out.

[Adam Schafer]

I did all that as a kid. Growing up, we used to have like, we live in the country. We used to hang all that on barbed wire fences and fill the cans up with water so the water squirts out when you hit it. Oh yeah. I was, I was hardcore into wrist rockets and BB guns really young.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oh.

[Everett]

The paintball after that. And then it turned into like we just injure ourselves.

[Adam Schafer]

Gonna be 20 when I finally get to do it with him.

[Everett]

So fun though.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hey, hey, Speaking of kids, this study came out on the effect that processed foods have on adolescent kids. It's a stronger effect on adolescent and it has a longer lasting effect, of course, which definitely points to developing brain. That you introduce a developing brain to the engineered hyper palatability of these foods, it's going to have a stronger effect. And I bet you, I bet you kids who grow up eating a lot of this food are going to struggle more as adults because of the way that their brains mold.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I mean this totally. We just talked about this where I brought up the whole sugar thing. And I mean they've, they've done this before where you see how the brain reacts to a, a bunch of sugar. Comparing it to things like cocaine. And I know that's like the fear mongering that people do.

[Everett]

We pocket bagel bites.

[Adam Schafer]

But it's like your generation that's that's like a normal brain. You like a little child's brain like that. You let them go.

[Sal DeStefano]

It shapes itself off of these signals. What's, what's crazy to me is a majority of the food that is advertised and made by. Well, this is true for everybody. But if you go down the aisles of processed food. Of processed foods, how many of them are geared towards children?

[Everett]

All of them.

[Adam Schafer]

The colors and the animals and the characters and the.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Where they position it on the shelves like all the things.

[Everett]

All the cartoons were based on. Sony cereal.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah.

[Everett]

Yeah, that's it.

[Sal DeStefano]

If heavily, if heavily processed foods were invented today and we had the science available now, I bet you could make a case that they would be banned on anybody below a certain age bank.

[Adam Schafer]

So I bet. I don't know when you look at the data money.

[Sal DeStefano]

You look at the data. Well, you can make the case. I don't see what actually passed.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

But I think you could have the case that it would be, you know that speaking of banning, you guys see that? So I told you, I think Denmark banned social media for under 16. Australia just followed. Oh, under 16.

[Everett]

Interesting.

[Sal DeStefano]

And they're saying that this is the first of the dominoes. They think that the whole. That lots of countries are going to start banning social media for kids.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, I love that. I mean you could make the case for 18 years. You know, I agree. You can make the case for.

[Everett]

It's undeniable. When you actually look at the, the research and you know how, how it's affecting all these kids. It's. It's unreal.

[Sal DeStefano]

It is.

[Adam Schafer]

Because really you have to, you also have to. I mean, don't, I mean, wouldn't you guys agree that for your teenage girl or boy 16 and 17 and right in the middle of high school, it has to be some of the most detrimental time for them to get into that also. So I don't know how it'd be interesting what this will do. Right? Because what did we all do when we. We weren't allowed to drink alcohol at an ear at an early, at an early age, you end up and, and you, you sneak it, you do it. It's like this and then. And you don't just do a little bit of it. You drink a lot because you, because, because you can't have a type of deal. So does this promote that? Do kid. Do smart kids rebellion or. Yeah, well, do smart kids find a loophole around it or does another app get created that's like it. Bypasses I mean, what stops them from this?

[Sal DeStefano]

It still limits it, though, because there's a difference between I have to sneak around to get on social media and I'm just allowed to be on it all the time.

[Adam Schafer]

It doesn't. It doesn't. The. Doesn't. The, The. The. The research around as fascinating to you, like the kids drinking age in Europe and the, the difference of how they. It's abused and used versus the United States and their age is much lower in those areas.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, there's some debate around that, but part of the.

[Adam Schafer]

Here's the social media is way more addictive.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. But here's the other thing too, though. American culture is binge. It tends to promote binge everything.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

There's a thing about American culture that any type of consumption, you can multiply times 10 here. So when they say, well, European kids grow up with wine at the table and so they don't. Yeah, I get that may be true. That might be. So I'm not saying it's not true, but I don't. But if you look at American culture with any consumption. Yeah, we blow the doors off everybody. So I don't know if it's just.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, we want to. We want to win at everything.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean. I mean, more.

[Everett]

More.

[Natalie]

More.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, you do this. We have more.

[Sal DeStefano]

We can have more. Like, all drug consumption is through the roof here in comparison to other countries.

[Adam Schafer]

All.

[Sal DeStefano]

Any consumption, food consumption, you know, just. It's through the roof here.

[Adam Schafer]

It does feel like that people are figuring or figuring this out somewhat, or is that. Is that maybe I'm in my bubble? Like, do you think that, like, consumer is. I mean, I was just. I was just watching a clip from like a, you know, very big popular minimalist podcast. Like, that's like a thing now. You have tiny homes, minimalists. You have these guys that are talking.

[Sal DeStefano]

I don't know.

[Adam Schafer]

I heard this really cool guy respond to, like, all the stuff that he got away. And the guy was asking him, like, like, how do you. How do you, like, how do you like not having this and only having X amount of this? And when you go into a store and someone, you know, like, do you have this temptation? He goes, no. What I realized is the guy who's selling this to me wants to get rid of the shirt, and he wants what I have, which is to not have the shirt. It was like such a right. Like, his goal is to get rid of this. This stuff and give it to other people. And he goes, I've already got that because I don't have it. And so I, he wants what I have, which is to not have it. And it was a cool way to kind of like flip it. Yeah. To flip it on its head.

[Sal DeStefano]

It'. Know, but then there's, but then there's that other stat you shared. Who was it, Nagibi, that shared that?

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

11.

[Adam Schafer]

So just over the black Friday. $11.9 billion. My decimal might be off. It's like 11 something around there. Billion was, was sold. I mean, was financed for Black Friday.

[Sal DeStefano]

Financed.

[Adam Schafer]

And of that, how many billion?

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, there were. It was 60 something percent. Was financed.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

30 something percent. People are like, we're not going to pay this.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, they won't even, they won't even be able to pay it in 30. 30 to 60 days.

[Sal DeStefano]

So that's, that's three, bro. That's one out of three people. Yeah. Is like, yeah, I'm buying this and I'm going to pay it off over months.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Or not at all.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

That has to come to a halt.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, yeah, it has to.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, you know, eventually the, the banks and the people, like, they can't afford to let people do all these pain.

[Everett]

Stop punishing people for money.

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, it's just, it's like there's no.

[Everett]

There'S no incentive to that.

[Sal DeStefano]

But there's this weird. It's, I think, again, I think it's just, there's, there's a culture of consume and spend and you know, like if you just gave a bunch, like, okay, you know, Trump said, I don't know if this will happen. He's like, oh, we're going to get rid of income taxes because of the terror. Whatever. Okay. Let's just imagine income taxes stopped or suddenly people had more money. Do you think they would save that or they would just go spend it all? I don't know.

[Adam Schafer]

It'd be interesting because obviously they did. If they did that, all consumer goods would go up dramatically. Yeah, dramatically.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay. Tax. There'd be more tax. Of course.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Televisions go up, cars go up, all the things.

[Sal DeStefano]

Let me rephrase the question. If everybody just got a bunch of money, do you think they would suddenly save it or they would spend different?

[Adam Schafer]

I, I'm so, I'm, I'm such a fan of.

[Sal DeStefano]

But what you're saying. I get it. Because then there's another incentive that says, hey, buying things is more expensive though.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right. And so you better really want it.

[Everett]

You're going to burn it up real.

[Adam Schafer]

Quick, so you better really want that thing because it's really, really. I like that. I think, I think it creates. I don't think that that gets, eliminates anybody from living paycheck to paycheck or still like that's going to happen, but I think it would incentivize at least more people than now to hold on to their money and not buy that thing because that thing is now 4x more expensive than what it was. And I get, you know, I'm saying, like, I think it would be, I think it's a better way to, to run the society than the way we, than the way we do it right now where we're just, we're trying to.

[Everett]

Make everybody spin it somehow. Like we're all entitled to these things somehow. And so we have to like, you know, bail everybody out.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, well, when you have your, you know, AI, AI robot who can 3D print and build whatever you want whenever you want and work around the clock on it real soon here, like it's going to be, people are going to.

[Sal DeStefano]

Figure out that's not.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, everything. I mean, it's going to be interesting to, to see when that happens.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, I don't know, man. I don't know. It's wild. Anyway, I was looking up some, some data on skin health and there's lots of studies on there out there on what helps improve the health of your skin, the look of your skin. But do you guys know how much of it points to the microbiome of the skin? So much of it points to the microbiome of your skin. Like, if you have a healthy microbiome on your skin, you're going to have younger looking, healthier skin. And a lot of products that serve to make your skin look better, the ones that work typically are because they improve the health of the bacteria that live. Because bacteria lives on your skin. Yeah.

[Everett]

You have a microbiome antibiotic, like soap is like not a great idea.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, well, I feel like we're figuring this out because the past was like all these chemicals and things that would kill and clean and like cleanse and.

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, think of it this way. They're like here, strip your skin of its natural oils, destroy all the bacteria, replace it with this other fake oil or whatever when really healthy skin doesn't need much of that because the microbiome of when, when the microbiome is healthy, the skin produces, it'll produce it naturally, what it needs and stuff. So where I'm going with this is, you know, because Caldera lab went from a small Company to.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Exploded. Yeah. And people love them. And they're Re. The. The. The return rate of their customers is. Is. It's crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's in the stratosphere. And I. And I'm. I know why it works, obviously, but their products are all based off of improving the microbiome. It's all natural compounds that help your skin.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, it makes sense. It's the largest organ in your body. And everything that we've learned about the gut microbiome and. And the importance of that to all things is, like, it makes sense.

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, I remember I was tripped out when we first started working with Caldera Lab, their serum, which is an oil. I remember I looked at it, and it's an oil. I'm like, well, this will be for Justin because he's. He's got dry skin. I'm. I got oily skin. I'm not going to put oil on oily skin. That doesn't make any sense.

[Everett]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

It actually balances me out. And for him, it does the same thing.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Everett]

It's like a sponge, just.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. And my skin normally is oilier when I put it on. It makes it. It.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm. I'm excited to, you know, Benjamin Button over there to start putting the beard oil. Yeah. He's got. Now he's got a beard. It's almost ready. Going on over there.

[Sal DeStefano]

Make that beard.

[Justin Andrews]

I don't know.

[Adam Schafer]

Let's go. Keep it going.

[Justin Andrews]

You want me to keep, like, Santa Claus style?

[Adam Schafer]

Keep it. Keep it going. Keep it going until the lady starts saying, okay, it's a little much.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's too much. She like his girls.

[Adam Schafer]

I know my. My wife was complimenting. I think I've seen nobody but everybody compliment everybody who's talked to him.

[Justin Andrews]

I was honestly surprised.

[Anthony]

Surprised.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I didn't think people would think it looked good.

[Adam Schafer]

He's like, I should have done this years ago.

[Anthony]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Let the top go.

[Justin Andrews]

I missed out on so much opportunity.

[Sal DeStefano]

If I can convince you to let the top grow. Great. You would look amazing, bro. Yeah. The gray. Gray everything. Yeah. With how young your skin looks and how fit you are.

[Adam Schafer]

Misery loves company. Don't buy into all that.

[Sal DeStefano]

No, hey, listen. He didn't look like I aged in accelerated.

[Adam Schafer]

Come on, dog. Go all gray with me. Come on.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hey, my gray's gone. Almost. I'm losing it all, dude. I'm gonna be doing you.

[Adam Schafer]

You're like me and Justin combined.

[Sal DeStefano]

Justin's gonna be the last. Last man standing with his hair.

[Adam Schafer]

No, he's. He's still got.

[Sal DeStefano]

I'M gonna be.

[Everett]

I'm gonna be like doc from Back to the Future, just all white, but no hair loss. No hair loss whatsoever.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what? What if you were to really grow it out? What would it look like? Is give me an actor with it. Could you get, like, Kurt Russell?

[Everett]

Man, I don't know. Like, it's gonna be wavy. Really wavy.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Everett]

Like, at first it'll be curly, and then once it gets longer, it, like, kind of stretches it out. And I've done it one time, and it was just because I was going for this huge pompadour that went, like, up and back. And I hate curls, so I just grease it so it's straight.

[Adam Schafer]

Doug, look up. Pull up so you can see a sewing image. Show Kurt Russell as Santa Claus is what I want. It's great hair. I was looking at it when I was watching Santa Claus with my son.

[Everett]

You know, it's so funny because, like, Everett was, like, trying to prod me because he's like, I've never seen you.

[Sal DeStefano]

Try and grow your hair out long.

[Everett]

Because I always give them grief, you know? And he just, like, buzz cut it.

[Adam Schafer]

Now that you go the opposite.

[Everett]

Yeah, he's like, I just buzz cut that.

[Sal DeStefano]

Why don't you grow it all the way out? Yeah. What do you mean?

[Everett]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I want to put the image up because I feel like just if anyone has a chance to. To have.

[Sal DeStefano]

If Justin had long hair, he would look like. You know how some dudes, like, they just can't get rid of the 80s. Like, they're like, man, I was cool in the 80s.

[Adam Schafer]

Look at that great hair right there.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, well, yeah, you would. He would look like Santa.

[Everett]

I mean, I don't know if it looked that good. I'll be honest.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. Isn't it.

[Adam Schafer]

Isn't that good?

[Everett]

Yeah, he's good. He's got great hair.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's excessive, though.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, that's pretty excessive. That's great.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, he likes his. Yeah.

[Everett]

Kurt Russell's a stud, though, for sure.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, he's one of my favorite. I mean, if anyone. If anyone has a chance to do making that happen right there. I feel like. Like, Justin does.

[Sal DeStefano]

His head already doesn't fit in. His helmet I'm not gonna be wearing.

[Everett]

Yeah, like, one of my hats will fit, dude. I'm already on, like, that one last, like, notch.

[Adam Schafer]

I get mad that he wears hats all the time because he's got good hair. You have such good hair, and you wear hats all the time.

[Everett]

I've done this as a kid.

[Adam Schafer]

I can't I mean, who am I to talk?

[Sal DeStefano]

I'll be wearing.

[Adam Schafer]

But if I had hair, I would. You would you. I would be not wearing a hat as much as I wear.

[Sal DeStefano]

I might be wearing a hat here soon. I don't look in the hat, though. I don't. That doesn't look right on me. Probiotics have been shown in studies to have profound effects on health, athletic performance, fat loss, and muscle gain. I'm not making this up. Studies show that using a quality probiotic will improve. Increase fat loss. It's actually a fat loss supplement. It also improves athletic performance, strength, and recovery. And of course, it's good for your gut health. It helps you with digestion. All right, here's the question. What's the best probiotic? We have it. Seed, the world's best probiotic, hands down. This is the one you need to use. Go check it out. Go to seed, forward slash, mindpump. Use the code 20mindpump and get 20% off. Back to the show.

[Justin Andrews]

Our first caller is Anthony from Minnesota.

[Sal DeStefano]

What's up, Anthony?

[Adam Schafer]

How you doing, Anthony?

[Anthony]

Hey, guys. How's it going?

[Adam Schafer]

Good, good, ma'.

[Sal DeStefano]

Am.

[Anthony]

Hey, just want to thank you guys. I know you get a lot of them, but they're never going to be enough. The amount of education you guys provide is. It's just instrumental for me listening to you guys for the past five years, it's helped me in my business and with myself. So thanks again, guys.

[Sal DeStefano]

You got it, dude. How can we help you?

[Anthony]

Yeah, so I had a question revolving around hitting two muscle groups in the same workout and whether you should do the exercises consecutively with each muscle group or switch back and forth. For example, I'll do chest tricep. Should I do chest, chest, chest or do chest tricep? Chest, tricep, if there's any difference. There.

[Adam Schafer]

All chest, then all tricep.

[Sal DeStefano]

Real quick. Anthony, you're a trainer?

[Anthony]

Yes, sir.

[Sal DeStefano]

How long you been training people for?

[Anthony]

About five and a half years.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oh, good for you, dude. How many of our programs you have?

[Anthony]

I only just have the one, unfortunately.

[Sal DeStefano]

Which one?

[Anthony]

Well, a couple years ago, with my ego, I bought the aesthetics.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay, so I was going to ask you if you have our programs. You could see how we wrote them, and that'll teach you as a trainer, one of the best things you could do. Well, there's a lot of things you could do that'll help with your programming, but one of them is to look at established workout programming. There's good stuff out there for powerlifting. There's good stuff out there for athletic performance. You have our programming, which, you know, we have targeted avatars, which. With each one of them. And it'll teach you a lot of. On terms of how you would structure workout programming. And so what you'll find in our programs is that when there's multiple body parts done in a workout, you finish the large group before you move on to the smaller groups. And there's a couple reasons why, by the way, this isn't a hard and fast rule.

[Adam Schafer]

Sure.

[Sal DeStefano]

But it's a general rule, so there's a reason for this. When you're working out your chest, for example, or on a push day, your triceps are typically involved in a lot of the chest exercises. And if I go, chest, triceps. Chest, triceps, and really start to fatigue my triceps, it really compromises my ability to do those compound lifts. So if my triceps are really fatigued and then I go try to do another pressing movement, it's gonna. It's gonna compromise my ability to press. So you typically will start and finish the larger groups before moving to the.

[Adam Schafer]

Smaller, which is the biggest bang for your buck. So the last thing you'd want is a isolation extra exercise to hinder your compound lift if not to mention that. But you also gotta consider the CNS too. Right? So, like just the repetition of doing the same movement in three to four sets in a row, you get better at it. A lot of times you'll feel that even as you. Your strength progresses in the set many times, and it'll peak after. After your first set is rarely ever your best set. And so if you're always doing a set, then you go to another exercise, then come back, it's kind of like your first set again.

[Sal DeStefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

And so you know, you're. You'll benefit also from just the technique of it, staying with it and then finishing it and then going on to the next one. In addition to what Sal is saying.

[Sal DeStefano]

Now, here's where you could break that rule. You have a weak body part that, that you. You feel just isn't developing well. My triceps, let's say my triceps, they just don't develop well. Then you could work out your triceps before you hit your chest, especially if your chest is a strong body part and one that. So that's where you could kind of break this rule.

[Adam Schafer]

I could think another way where I break that rule. Another way I could break that rule is if I know that I'm modifying intensity, and I'm not going after a hard, effective workout, but I just want to touch the muscles. I'm trying to get in and out.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

And so I'm kind of supersetting those two things back and forth. So I'm trying to move through it. I know I didn't get the best of sleep. I'm not the best on nutrition, but I'm going to show up to the gym anyways. I'm going to kind of hit. I'm not pushing intensity. I'm not trying to mat get the max out of my bench press. I'm trying to get the max out of my triceps. I just want to send a signal to my body that, hey, we lifted, we lift these weights. And so there's another example where I might do something like that. But you're always almost better off doing it the other way.

[Sal DeStefano]

We're talking about now, Anthony, when you train your clients, how do you do it?

[Anthony]

You know, mainly I try to get a good, you know, dynamic warm up in first. Right. Make sure. Really kind of getting that mind muscle connection already from the beginning, you know. So if it is a chest tricep day, you know, using some bands, using lights, you know, something like that, just get the body warmed up in those specific areas too. And then, yeah, I do start with the compound movement. It might be an incline bench press, for example, moving into free weights and then finally into like machines and really isolating the muscle. And sometimes I have a question, maybe know the answer. But let's say we're hitting chest, you know, two exercises and then two tricep exercises. And we really want to focus on growth in the chest. Does it behoove us to like add another chest at the end or maybe not so much.

[Sal DeStefano]

Depends. Total volume. You want to consider the person's recovery, what they've been doing. Progressive overload. So you could. But you could also just. It would be too much.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, yeah. Keep in mind that more exercises, more volume doesn't always equate to, to more muscle. So if, if we're talking about like one of your clients right now who wants to focus on chest, but they've only been training for you for a month and it's like you adding another chest exercise to a, like let's say a MAPS anabolic program is not going to serve you. Like there's already enough volume in there for that person to build a chest for months before. And then, then you have to take into account if I'm going to add volume to this chest, then I need to probably Take away from somewhere else or you're just going to end up over training that client. And so that's big mistake a lot of people make, even young trainers will make is just like, oh, this is an area you want to focus on. So I'm just going to do more of that stuff on top of what I was already doing. When you really need to account for that total volume, that total stress that you're putting on the body, it's like, okay, well, he doesn't care so much about say his shoulders or he doesn't care so much about his hamstrings. And so we're going to pull from there and we're going to increase more on, on the, the bench press. So. But yeah, there's more to it also.

[Sal DeStefano]

Generally speaking, if you're going to add another chest exercise, you do it at the end of the chest workout before we move on to triceps anyway.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

Nonetheless, it's the same kind of, same general rule.

[Anthony]

Perfect, guys. Well, hey, I really appreciate the guidance. Keep doing what you guys are doing. Appreciate it.

[Sal DeStefano]

You got to do it. And Anthony, if you haven't done our course, I highly suggest it. I think you would, you would gain a lot of value out.

[Anthony]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'll get right on it, guys.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right, man. Thanks, Anthony. I'm surprised.

[Adam Schafer]

Like, he's full of shit.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, well, I wasn't gonna say it like that, but cool.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, I could smell it through the mic.

[Sal DeStefano]

Come on. Well, here's the thing. I, I, I, I'm surprised at his question. And he's a trainer for five years. Yeah, that's a very, well, basic programming question.

[Adam Schafer]

It's not, it's not. If you've been listening to us for that long and you only have one program, it's maps you and aesthetic or.

[Sal DeStefano]

Just listening or just general workout programming. That's a very basic. Yeah. Workout programming question or your problem. So I'm surprised. When I asked him how long you've been a trainer, I thought he was going to say like a month, but five years.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, it's been a long time. We've communicated this on the podcast, but because we typically talk about the programs to the general population. But I think one of the most valuable parts of all the programs are for coaches and trainers. I mean, if this was 22 year old me and I was in the thick of becoming a, as a trainer at that time. Right. Only two years in and had found a podcast like this, I'd own every program even if I didn't plan to run it, not because I plan to do it. It's just that, like, okay, I'd like to see how these guys program for this type of client because I know in my 10 plus years I plan to be a personal trainer. I'm going to come across multiple people that are going to want to train this way. And yeah, I could go try and figure it out myself or I have mentors virtually here that I could go and go, oh, okay, I see how they did that. And then unpack it.

[Sal DeStefano]

I mean, that's how I learned, you know, powerlifting programming. You know, I saw west side barbells programming, I saw dinosaur training that taught me about full body workout. Like programming makes a big difference. The order of the exercises, reps, sets, total volume, how it lays out in the week, how the weeks all lay out together, how the monthly, like, it makes a big difference. And what this communicates to me with a question like this is there's still a lot of trainers out there that just look at exercises as exercises. And we're going to do this today and we're just going to put these and it as if it doesn't make a difference, it makes a huge difference, like to the tune of two or three times as fast results or at worst zero results in injury.

[Adam Schafer]

I think that's because we, if the industry communicates how important nutrition is, which it is so important so much where you see things like, you know, nutrition is 75 of the results or 80 of the results. And it's like, you know what, you're right. If you have a poor diet and you, you have a subpar training program, like you're going to see little to no results. If you have an incredible perfect diet and you have a subpar training, you'll probably see some good results. And so because of that, I think people just go, oh, well, then the program doesn't really matter that much as long as you're doing something or you're doing, you're doing what you like or you're doing exercise and it's like, like, oh, no, it can be far more effective than that.

[Sal DeStefano]

Way more.

[Justin Andrews]

Our next caller is Emma from Iowa.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hi, Emma.

[Adam Schafer]

Hi, Emma.

[Chris Gethard]

Hi.

[Emma]

Hi, guys.

[Adam Schafer]

How you doing?

[Emma]

Hey, I'm good. How are you?

[Adam Schafer]

Good.

[Sal DeStefano]

Can we help you?

[Emma]

Okay, I'll go right into my question.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Emma]

So I've been on the show once before and I've been diving deep into recovery metrics lately. I've noticed that my HRV drops for a few days sometimes when my workout, nutrition, my sleep are solid. I have a 2 year old, so most of the time it's solid. I'm a busy mom. I work full time. I have some side jobs. I strength train. At the time I wrote the question three days a week I was running aesthetic. I have now went to split and I'm at the last phase of split. So life stress, kids, all the chaos. It happens. How do you know when a low HRV score means you actually need to back off training versus when it's just reflecting daily stress, my hormones and life chaos.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, let's pretend like you don't have the HRV score. And you just told me those are the two programs that you lean on. I would tell you that those are probably not appropriate.

[Emma]

I knew you were gonna say.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean those are our two like highest volume programs. And so my mom of two without anything else would be enough for me to be like, yeah, maybe right now we run something a little bit different.

[Sal DeStefano]

Emma, are you. If I talk to people who knew you really well, would they say that you're like you just overachiever. Go, go, go. Do too much. Super busy all the time. Yeah.

[Emma]

And I married one too.

[Adam Schafer]

Gasoline on the fire.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. And it sounds like you're tracking a lot of things.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Emma]

Yes. So I've been working out for a of bunch 10 years just tracking the data is been my. It's my habits. It doesn't feel hard, it's just what I do.

[Sal DeStefano]

Well, what it does, it gives you a sense of control which it sounds like that's something you like so and so that's a stress. Yeah. We got to change your relationship with this so it's not so stressful. Hun. Yeah. Like tracking hrv. You know who should track hrv?

[Adam Schafer]

Nobody.

[Emma]

Athletes.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, hardcore athletes in season by their coaches.

[Adam Schafer]

And even then it's like the best coaches that we talk to, like they.

[Sal DeStefano]

Don'T even communicate it to their.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, they don't. They use it just as another feedback tool.

[Sal DeStefano]

But they don't tell the athlete.

[Adam Schafer]

They don't go like hey, you're loaded.

[Sal DeStefano]

Put that stress on them, it's over. Right now you need to stop that. In those workouts you picked the two most high volume that we have. Inappropriate workouts. Like whatever results you're getting right now are in spite of like that you're doing weight. Like if you did more appropriate programming, you know, much better your results will be.

[Adam Schafer]

I would love to see you on one of our maps. Fifteen programs. Maps.

[Emma]

I do, I do have it.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

And then.

[Emma]

But Can I plead my case?

[Adam Schafer]

I already know what it is, but go ahead.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, that's good.

[Adam Schafer]

Go ahead. Let's hear it.

[Sal DeStefano]

Let's hear it.

[Emma]

Okay, so the reason I like mat split is it keeps me in the gym five days a week, which gives me that hour. So I have a basement gym, an hour kid free. Jamming the tunes, lifting weights.

[Adam Schafer]

So we could still. We could still do this. Okay, so what it looks like is mass 15. You're in just as many days. Okay, Slow down the workouts, make them 25 minute workouts. And then the other 30 minutes walk on a treadmill or elliptical or mobility. Or mobility or read or some ab or some ab.

[Sal DeStefano]

I get the break, I get it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, no, I get that too.

[Sal DeStefano]

But you gotta, you gotta be able to have a break and not like work out.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. It doesn't have to be high stress on the body. It could be more recuperative. I would love sauna, I would love yoga. I would love like so do the strength training and then the back 30 or 40 is all mobility, all yoga, all sauna, all. I mean a list of all the recovery, a cold plunge. What do you want to do? Like you do a lot of other things, but pushing the body more during that time.

[Sal DeStefano]

Do you like results?

[Emma]

I love results.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oh, okay, then just do what we're telling you.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

You get so much better results. And stop tracking hrv. Stop tracking everything. Yeah, it's not helping you, I promise. Yeah, yeah, that's what. Yeah, I'm surprised. Surprised you're smiling.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, she knows. That's why.

[Sal DeStefano]

What work do you do for. What do you do for work?

[Emma]

Okay, so I am a receptionist my 8 to 5 and then I do photography on the side. And then I also answer 911 for a county that's close to us.

[Sal DeStefano]

Were you an athlete?

[Adam Schafer]

You should have like two more kids. You're not that busy.

[Emma]

Yeah, well, actually I do have four kids. One step and three daughters.

[Sal DeStefano]

Emma. Oh my God. You know what? You're gonna get, get crazy results with massive. You will, you will. You're gonna. You obviously only though. You're obviously resilient.

[Adam Schafer]

Only though, if you promise us that the other rest of the time is recuperative type stuff. Yeah, don't replace, start jump roping or doing something else. That's like more high intent. Like do something recuperative, do yoga, do mobility, you know, read. Yeah. Or walk on the tread. Walking on a treadmill would be awesome. I mean just a nice, nice stroll. Put the podcast in.

[Sal DeStefano]

Not a crazy like power walk.

[Adam Schafer]

Not trying to, like, not a 15 incline, hill climb and, like, get out. It's like a walk. Like, literally a walk.

[Sal DeStefano]

Dude, you're gonna get so strong, your body's gonna sculpt and shape your metabolism. Probably six, seven weeks in is going to kick up. You're gonna see your body get leaner. You're gonna feel amazing, and it's gonna give you more energy to do all that other stuff that is so important.

[Emma]

Okay?

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[Sal DeStefano]

Listen, do you have maps? You have MEPs 15?

[Emma]

I do have maps. 15.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay, so what did we release recently? Which 15s? We have other 15 that we just released.

[Adam Schafer]

We'll give her a Muscle mommy.

[Sal DeStefano]

There you go. I'm gonna send you muscle mommy 15 also. So you got two 15.

[Emma]

Awesome.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

And then. And then we're gonna do this, Emma, because I'm gonna. We're gonna talk to you again. So I know you did it. I'm gonna have you back on in 60 days. Okay?

[Adam Schafer]

This is the nice conversation. If we have to have this, you.

[Sal DeStefano]

Don'T do what we tell you in 60 days, I'm gonna take all your programs away. Don't do that.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay. Can we have you back on in 60 days?

[Emma]

I would love that.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right, good.

[Adam Schafer]

Please do it. Please do it.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're gonna get really, really good results.

[Adam Schafer]

Hit your protein intake. That's the only thing we didn't talk about. But just.

[Sal DeStefano]

I guarantee she tracks her protein if you do that.

[Adam Schafer]

Hit that while. Okay.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay.

[Adam Schafer]

So if you do that and you do what we said, you're good, dude. You're gonna be great.

[Sal DeStefano]

It's gonna be great.

[Emma]

Okay, I'll take some. Can I track photos? Can I take photos before and after?

[Adam Schafer]

Absolutely. Sure.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's fine. Sure. Sure.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but don't, don't, don't. Yeah. Don't obsess over the scale in the m. It's like, take. Go ahead, take some before every 30 days.

[Sal DeStefano]

Every 30 days, do a photo.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, there you go.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's it.

[Emma]

Deal.

[Adam Schafer]

Cool.

[Emma]

I can do that.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, let's do this.

[Emma]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

We'll see you in 60.

[Emma]

All right. Thanks, guys.

[Adam Schafer]

Bye. Bye.

[Sal DeStefano]

I knew it. I knew. If she's gonna tell me the program.

[Adam Schafer]

Like aesthetic and split.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

Bodybuilder.

[Sal DeStefano]

Whenever you meet somebody, four kids, three jobs, and you're tracking everything. Everything. Hrv. Who tracks hrv? Yeah. No, too much. If your workout and your diet is another your. If it's stressful. And I don't mean.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but you remember, if someone like that doesn't think it's stressful. Would she claim it as, like, this Habits. It's a routine. I just.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, it's the whole, like, I gotta feel like I got it all under control.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

And that's. That could be a. I mean, once.

[Adam Schafer]

You unlock though, somebody like this who.

[Sal DeStefano]

Has, oh, my God.

[Adam Schafer]

Discipline and consistency, you know, how strong.

[Sal DeStefano]

I mean, you know, she's gonna get so strong and see such crazy results. It's going to blow her mind.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, no, it'll be incredible if she does it.

[Justin Andrews]

Our next caller is David from Arkansas.

[Sal DeStefano]

What's up, David?

[Adam Schafer]

How are you doing, David? I'm doing great.

[Sal DeStefano]

How are y'? All?

[Adam Schafer]

Good.

[Sal DeStefano]

Good, man. What's happening?

[David]

No, not much. I'm excited to be here. Thank you all for everything, really. I started listening to y' all about three years ago, right before I became a personal trainer. Y' all actually helped me decide that's what I wanted to be for my career path.

[Sal DeStefano]

Nice, man.

[Adam Schafer]

Awesome.

[Sal DeStefano]

Nice. How can we help you?

[David]

So in my question, I'd asked how you balance work, life and trying to be an aspiring entrepreneur because I want to start my own online business, but I'm also amateur bodybuilder and also work at a gym currently. And I'm married, so it's just a little bit difficult to find a good balance of everything.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[David]

So I was wondering how y', all, how y' all did that in the beginning?

[Adam Schafer]

How old are you and do you have kids yet?

[David]

I'm 22 and I don't have any kids.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, good. You're fine, bro. There is no balance. There is no balance. It doesn't. Everybody wants this, like, perfect balance, work, life, stuff. Like there's times in life and what that balance looks like. It doesn't look like a daily balance. It looks like there's periods of times when I'm sprinting at work and then there's periods of time when I'm very present and connected to my wife. Like, it's. That's what it looks like. And if you're, if you're building something, hopefully you have a good partner that you married that knows that you're off and you're building a future for the two of you. And she understands when you got those 10, 12 hour days sometimes and she supports that. But this idea of Gonna have a 9 to 5 and come home and then I'll always have this, this dinner and we're going to be together and it's on. I'll have weekends off and I have this. Nice. And I'M going to build the company. It's like, it's probably not going to happen. It doesn't mean that it may be somebody who has done it or got lucky, but most people that build a successful business had to really grind and sacrifice a lot while they were doing that. But then you can always have the vision like we did early on. I remember when I sat down with these gentlemen and we, we said long before anybody was paying attention we were making any money. The goal was to scale up and scale out so as opportunity grew and we could make more money and there was an opportunity to make even more money there, we'd look at each other and said, well, does that pull us back in and make us work more hours? Yeah, it's more money, but do we have to work more? We'd look at each other and go like, yeah, it's not for us. We'll take less money because we want that balance. We want to be able to still have weekends with our wives and do those things. But early on, man, it was a, a, it was a grind. We were all working full time jobs. Then we'd show up to a studio from 8 to sometimes 11 midnight, you know, so not a lot, a lot of time with the wife at that time. But she knew what we were building and so that's what balance looks like to me.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, David, it's, I'll use a fitness analogy, right? You can't both be the strongest that you can, you could possibly be and have the most endurance. You have limited capacity, you have limited ability, limited time. So if you want a little of everything, you could do that. If you want a lot of one thing, you got to devote more time and capacity and energy into that direction. Now, I'll say this because you're married, you want your wife on your team. Trying to do this without her on your team is you're gonna suck. So a husband isn't very effective when his wife at home is not on the same page with him. So what does that mean? Does that mean you berate her? No, it means you got to get her on your team. And typically what they respond well to is a timeline. And so what a lot of guys will do is they'll say, look, I'm just trying to build this business. And then it goes on for 2, 3, 4, 5. It's like, okay, what's the goal? Like, when are we going to stop this? But you could say something like, honey, I need the next 12 months to bury myself and I'm going to bury myself I'm going to work hard, I'm going to give it a year and it's going to look like this. So she knows what to expect. Can you support me in this? Because here's the goal. I want to build this life for us. That tends to bring people together. You don't want to do this open ended, like, you know, type of thing or don't even communicate it. So a lot of guys will make this mistake. They don't even communicate. They just go and expect their wife to be on the same page and she's like, what's going on here? So you got to communicate that. Look, here's what's going to sacrifice. Here's the goal, here's what I want for us before we have kids. I need a year to really get after it, make it happen after this year. If it doesn't work, then we'll reevaluate. But here's what, you know, I think I can do. Can you do this with me? And then get her on your team? And then you know this, like, if your wife is on your team and you feel supported by her and she's proud of you while you're doing this, you could, you'll probably drag yourself across glass. So that's the important thing about to understand with this is your wife could be your best, best asset. But you, it's your job as her husband to get her on the same page. And it's not going to happen by force or by guessing or just expectation. You got to communicate very clear with her. And then when she's on your, on your team, bro, then it's, you're unstoppable.

[Adam Schafer]

I, I also empowered Katrina to be the CEO of our relationship. Meaning, listen, I'm going to do this thing, I'm going to bury myself into this vision. And I know sometimes I can get tunnel vision. And if you feel like we haven't had time together or I'm, we're starting to drift apart because I'm so focused. You have the power and control to set my calendar. And I won't ever say anything so you. And so she still to this day does this because I still can run like this, where I put my head down because the season of the business that I gotta have to pull myself back in. And all of a sudden I'll open up my calendar and I'll be like, why am I blocked out on Friday, Saturday, Sunday? She's like, because we're going here, Mom's taking the kid, you and I are going here. And she's like, we need it. It's been a while. And so, and I don't, I don't grind. And, and I would never book that myself. I know that if I was, were to keep going when I'm in it, I'm like, there's always something I got to be doing where she knows and she knows us and where we need to be. And so I've, we've always made that agreement that if you feel like I'm starting, like I'm. Because there's, I can do this. I'm guilty of being home. And she can see me look through her because my, my brain is still on business. And she totally gives me that latitude to be that way when I'm in it, but only for so long. And then she'll be like, okay, it's time to bring my husband back. This Saturday we're going here and we're doing this and I don't say nothing. I go, and we, we, we, we connect again. And then I get, I get refueled. And then she goes, go, kill it again for us. And then I go do it.

[Sal DeStefano]

Now here's the other thing too. You mentioned you're a bodybuilder and entrepreneur. You're probably gonna have to pick one. That doesn't mean you don't work out if you pick entrepreneur. And it also doesn't mean that you don't work if you're a bodybuilder. But if you want to really excel at either one, you're gonna probably have to put most of your focus on that to try to excel. Because I know bodybuilding and bodybuilding a very time consuming, selfish sport. So it'll be really hard to really push and apply yourself entrepreneurially while also unless you're leveraging it for your business. But even that, I would say limited.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, I use that to get the original attention for mind pump.

[Sal DeStefano]

But after that it was.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but I couldn't wait to be done with that so I could focus on the business.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, yeah. So hopefully that helps you.

[David]

No, absolutely. But the idea was to leverage it because in the start of everything I was £300. And this past September I got down to 194 doing men's open bodybuilding, like heavyweight. So I was wanting to eat that as a leverage point.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, I mean, that's fine. Just so you know though, that that's enough right there. People, if people have watched you go from that overweight to being able to step on stage, that that's enough proof, you know, what you're doing, that's enough proof on the Internet, like, to get. And I remember when Katrina asked us when we were. We were competing, and I was on year. I think it was on year three of this. I remember she looked at me and she's like, hey, is this going to be our life? Like, am I going to be married to, like, a competitor? And I'm like, hell, no. Like, the mind pump thing is almost there. I'm like, trust me, once this thing. Once. It outgrew me once. Because at that time, I still had the biggest pull on the Internet as far as all of us together. But once the show even slightly outgrew my personal brand, I switched my name to Mind Pump. Adam got rid of bodybuilding, and I was done with it.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, you're done, dude. You got that before and after, and you know you're good.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, it's. Doing more competing isn't going to help that much. I mean, it's not. It's only going to distract from the. From building the business. You've already proven that you know how to.

[Sal DeStefano]

And you're building what, a coaching business, Personal training. Is that your focus?

[David]

Yes, sir.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's. That's the plan. Are you in our course?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, no, he looks great. I'm not.

[Sal DeStefano]

Oh, bro, we got. You got to get on our course. That's what we do.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, I'm looking at your photos right now, too, bro. You got. You. You've already. You've already proven you know what you're doing.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, that's great, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

Any more trophi you gain ain't gonna gain clients. None of my clients have ever been like, so how many trophies do you have?

[Sal DeStefano]

They just like to see the before now.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, none of them did that. Like, they see. See where my body was, see what I can do. And it's like, okay, it's. You know, that's. That's it. Like, you've already. You've done it in a better transformation than I did. You look, you're incredible. It's not serving you anymore. Other than feeding your ego. That's all it is now. Gotcha. Cool.

[David]

No, I appreciate that.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Now. Now the next step is just gonna get you in our course, bro.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yep.

[David]

Yeah, absolutely. Right after this.

[Adam Schafer]

All right, brother.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right, dude, let's have someone call him.

[Adam Schafer]

All right.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right. Thanks, man.

[Adam Schafer]

Thank you all.

[Sal DeStefano]

Take it easy.

[David]

You, too.

[Adam Schafer]

Hey, Looks great.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. You know. You know what work, life, balance conversations are about, because they are. It's important. It's important to understand it's what that's for, though, is for your life.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[Sal DeStefano]

Right. You can't live your life. I mean, I guess you could, but, boy, would that be dysfunctional. But there are seasons where you got to place a lot of energy. It's like, look, it's like this. You're gonna. At one point, you're gonna have an infant. You know, that season's gonna look like you're spending a lot of time trying to support your wife during the, you know, those initial six months or whatever.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, I'm always more. When I. When a. When a father or a mother is. Has a child also in the picture, I'm more delicate with that conversation. If you don't.

[Sal DeStefano]

Because those years are gone.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. If you don't have a kid, you ain't got no reason, in my opinion. And if. And then your only thing is, you better pick the right partner who gets that. That's if. Like, if you're gonna go be an entrepreneur and you go build that, you have to have a partner who's willing to support that.

[Sal DeStefano]

From my understanding, just when you look at the psychology of men and women, when you give a timeline and a distinct goal, and you're like, this is why oftentimes you'll get that support. And I'll say this, speaking to women, men, when they feel that strength and support from you, where you're just, like, you're pushing them out the door. Go do this for us, honey. He'll do anything. He'll walk across fire. Yeah. So. And it's an incredible team. When you work together, I mean, you.

[Adam Schafer]

Hit it on the head. I think that's an. I think a lot of men will say something like, I'm gonna go build this thing. But then they don't map out the plan.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yep.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. I mean, the Adam Lane Smith episode that go live.

[Sal DeStefano]

It did.

[Adam Schafer]

And there's a. I talk. I share about one of the challenges that Katrina and I had recently had. And the mistake that I made was I failed to communicate like. Like a plan.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's right.

[Adam Schafer]

It was just like, hey, we shouldn't do this with Max, or, hey, we should do this versus saying, like, hey, here's the things I'm thinking that we should implement, and, you know, if we can try. And then communicating to her, like, that changes that whole conversation. Versus I'm gonna go build a business. It's like, okay, well, what for the next 15 years trying to build a business? And, like, how long as a wife do I sit back and just watch you fail at this thing before I tell you, like, let's do something else. Versus I go, here's my plan. Yep. I'm going to use my physique. I'm going to transform it. I've done that. Now I'm going to go out and I'm going to build attention and build a community. And for the next year, I'm going to do these things. I'm going to go, you're on the same page. And then at a year, I'm going to know if this is for me or not. And, you know, can you hang with me then? And then she's like, okay, cool. I know what I got to do. Versus, like, I'm going to build this business. And then three years later, she's like, you've been trying to build this business for three years. I'd seen.

[Justin Andrews]

Our next caller is Natalie from Minnesota.

[Sal DeStefano]

Hi, Natalie.

[Adam Schafer]

Hi, Natalie. Hello.

[Natalie]

This is so crazy. They all say that, but it really is.

[Adam Schafer]

How you doing? Good.

[Natalie]

So, first of all, I just want to, as everyone does, thank you for everything you do. I've been listening to you every morning for over six years now, and it's a great part of my morning walk. You've completely shaped the way I think about about fitness and wellness. And as somebody who works in the functional medicine space now, I really appreciate the holistic perspective that you bring. You've really transformed my relationship with my own health and I'm very grateful.

[Sal DeStefano]

Awesome. Thank you.

[Natalie]

So my email was crazy long, so I'm gonna try and make it shorter and just tell you a little bit of background. I'm 26. I've been in the fitness world for a long time. I used to be a personal trainer and a group fitness instructor, and I definitely had a pattern of over training in the past. I'm no longer working as a group fitness instructor. I think it kind of started to push my body a little bit too hard. And I also have not trained any clients for quite some time now, but it's something that I really love. I have a complicated health history with gut issues, stress, and a history of being underweight due to those issues. I lost a lot of weight from 2020 to 2022, and I still haven't really gotten my cycle back due to being underweight, and I've also come off birth control since then, so I know that there's a lot of hormonal issues probably going on. Over the last year and a half, I've really focused on healing, increasing my protein intake. I've gone from, at one point being under 100 hundred pounds at 5 7, so very underweight too. Now I think I'm around 130 or so. I try not to really weigh myself. I do know that that's healthy progress, but as someone in the fitness industry, I struggle with, you know, the body image side of it, and it feels like the weight will show up in my stomach or thighs or, you know, where the women don't really want rather than muscle. So my goal is now to. To build much more muscle and strength without slipping back into overtraining. I've run Maps, Anabolic and Muscle Mommy twice. I'm currently going through Anabolic again. I love solid core for low impact strength and core work. And then I do love running. I'm a runner, but I try not to do it too much. I haven't run for a while due to an injury, but I love cardio, mainly for the mental health benefits. And I love walking a lot. So I try to focus on the walking rather than running. So my questions are, how should I structure my training so that I can keep building muscle while including things like solid core and occasional running without overdoing it nutritionally, how should I think about going about how much I should be eating? I try to track my protein. I think I'm getting about 120 to 150, 50 grams, but I don't. I try not to track my calories just because I don't want to slip into unhealthy habits there. Um, and then lastly, is the way that I'm gaining weight normal for someone rebuilding after being underweight and under a lot of chronic stress? So I hope that that was somewhat concise. Um, and I really appreciate your guidance.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, no, we appreciate you. So you're moving in the right direction. We're really moving in the right direction. And it sounds like you came from a very, very tough place.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

So you're doing good. So here's the thing with stuff like this. We can look at all of the symptomatic behaviors and we could try to modify those and that's okay. But if we don't address where they're coming from, then it's going to be very difficult. And so what I mean by that is if we address the root of why you struggle with some of this stuff, then the behaviors will match. And I think you have the information. I think you know a lot because of your background of what you do. You, you know more than most people in terms of exercise, nutrition, stress hormones. You said you work in functional medicine.

[Natalie]

I do Yes, I.

[Sal DeStefano]

So I think you probably could coach yourself really, really well. But we have to address where all those things kind of come from. Were you, were you ever. If you don't mind, is it okay if I ask you some direct questions? Yeah. Were you ever diagnosed with an eating disorder?

[Natalie]

I was not.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay.

[Natalie]

They. They really couldn't figure out because they, they were flagging that, that that could possibly be an issue. And they were never able to diagnose me with anything because I've always, I've always fueled myself, I've always eaten healthy. So it was really difficult.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay. When you talk about not wanting to track or, you know, because you'll slip back into to certain behaviors, what behaviors would you slip back into?

[Natalie]

You know, as a girl growing up in diet culture, just trying to not slip into controlling what I eat too much to change my body. And I'm also a, a type A perfectionist, as you probably assumed. So I just don't want to become over analyzed with that. I want to be able to enjoy my life because I already have a lot of like dietary issues or gut issues. Sorry. I've had sibo. I've gone through all of that and so I know what my triggers are. So I'm already like a little bit too hyper aware and so I don't want to get nitty gritty into tracking anything more.

[Sal DeStefano]

No, that's great. It's really, really good awareness. So how do you feel about. Do you get repeating thoughts about your fitness, your progress? Do you, do you criticize yourself?

[Natalie]

I do.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay.

[Natalie]

Yeah. I know that I have a lot of body dysmorphia.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay. There's, there's a way to counter that. And so it's not by stopping the thoughts. That's impossible. Like if I were to tell you to not think about a zebra, you're probably now thinking about a zebra. So the way to counter that sounds hokey is to counter it with truths that you know are true.

[Adam Schafer]

Right.

[Sal DeStefano]

So if, if your repeating thought is, I'll just make one up. You're not good enough or you're not.

[Adam Schafer]

You know, my body looks this way.

[Sal DeStefano]

Your body looks. Whatever. What I want you to do is say something that is true, that is positive, and I don't care what it is.

[Adam Schafer]

My squat's stronger than it's ever been.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. I'm moving in the right direction. I'm becoming healthier. I am worthy of being cared for. I am a person that I want to care about or whatever. And what you're going to do is you're going to repeat these to yourself out loud. When you catch yourself with the repeating negative thoughts. This sounds silly, but it's really powerful. It is really powerful, especially if you do it on a consistent basis. So I'd start there. It sounds. It feels hokey at first, by the way, and awkward, but that's the point.

[Adam Schafer]

So this is also where. Depending on where you're at in this journey, you know, investing in, like, a really good coach is. Is valuable. Where they're. They're helping you with that, reminding you of that once a month, kind of.

[Sal DeStefano]

Outsourcing it to someone.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Right. So it's just like you. You come, I meet with you once a week, and we get on these calls, and you're like, adam, I feel this and this. And then I remind you of how great you're doing and all the positive things. And it's just like, sometimes it helps to have someone do that. If you have the ability to do that on your own, then I think you're doing a. You're doing a great job. You're moving in the right direction.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're already moving in a great. Right.

[Adam Schafer]

Right. So you're doing great. But that is the next step to this is reminding yourself of all the other positive things that you're doing when that. When that creeps in.

[Sal DeStefano]

So repetitive thoughts. Psychologists will comment on this or talk about how repetitive thoughts actually repeating thoughts turn into beliefs. So they actually start to things that you. That are true because they're repeated. That's why it's important to counter when you become aware with a truth that you believe, but that is good and positive. So you just. Boom. No, here's the truth. And you just say it out loud. Say it out loud. Say it out loud. It's really powerful at shaping behaviors. Something else I'll help you with is because you need a direction. So we need a direction with your training.

[Adam Schafer]

Let's go get strong.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's the best direction I can point you, is to get strong.

[Adam Schafer]

Yep.

[Sal DeStefano]

If you. If you can take your laser focus, which I think you have, you're probably a pretty focused person. Am I. Am I correct? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Can you focus on getting stronger?

[Emma]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

You want to do powerlifting? Can you train like a power lifter? Yeah, let's do it.

[Natalie]

I want to get strong.

[Sal DeStefano]

All right, let's do it. Let's do it. Let's point you in the direction of powerlifting. And Doug, is it too soon for.

[Adam Schafer]

Me give her a Maps 15 power lift?

[Sal DeStefano]

We just. We haven't even released this yet. You're going to be the first one to get it. It's Maps 15 power lift. So it's two lifts a day. Except some days it's one lift when you're focusing on the core lift. And you're going to hit PRs in this. Okay, we're gonna send that. Do that program and let's. And all I want you to focus on with your training is can I get stronger and then feed yourself accordingly. The.

[Adam Schafer]

The last thing I have a little more questions on just because I. I'm not fully familiar with. Tell me a little bit about the core classes.

[Natalie]

Solid core? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's huge right now. It's like 50 minutes. It's on a Pilates inspired machine, but it's more of. It's more strength focused.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Natalie]

So it's less Pilates. It's full body. But each class will have different muscle group focuses. So they'll every class has core and oblique work on the machine and then they'll have a lower body and an upper body. So it'll be like center, glutes and shoulders. So then there's like movements focused on that with the cable tools and the. The machine.

[Sal DeStefano]

How often are you doing that?

[Natalie]

I go one to two times a week.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay.

[Adam Schafer]

So we're fine with mass 15. This is fine. This was my concern with Maps Anabolic. Maps. Anabolic is plenty of strength training. There's you. There's no ne. There's no reason to do any more. But if we pull you back down to Mass 15 power lift, then we can afford to do this. This core class.

[Sal DeStefano]

Then you're good.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. So you can still do that core class. Stick to your. When you're doing cardio that it's lists. So if you're on there walking, just walking. Do you track steps where your steps out on a regular basis?

[Natalie]

I'm like, I walk a lot now that there's snow on the ground in Minnesota. I. It's harder and it gets to be really cold. But I love walking, so I do walk more than most people. Probably like 15, 000 steps a day.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're good then. Yeah, it's.

[Adam Schafer]

That's.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're good. And then with your diet, I know you're tracking your protein, which is fine. Do you eat until you're satisfied or do you eat what you think is appropriate?

[Natalie]

I definitely eat till I'm satisfied. Sometimes beyond even. Like when I'm trying to get more protein in because I'm trying to.

[Sal DeStefano]

Okay.

[Natalie]

Actually fuel because as I want to get strong. I want to make sure I'm actually eating enough to get strong. But there is a little bit of a mental block there sometimes where I question, like, am I eating too much?

[Adam Schafer]

But no, no, no, you're doing great.

[Sal DeStefano]

You're doing great. Let's have you back on the show in a couple months. I want to hear about your strength gains.

[Natalie]

Yeah, Yeah, I would love to. Can we do that?

[Sal DeStefano]

Thank you.

[Natalie]

Yeah, yeah. But I do just have one other question about the powerlifting. So the. My access to gym equipment is like, there's a gym at my apartment building and it just has a Smith machine. So that's what I've been using for, like, squats, but there's no, like, free weight barbell. So I'll use dumbbells too. Like, what. What. How do you think I should.

[Sal DeStefano]

For the deadlift, you can. I'll let you use dumbbells, but you can use a Smith machine for everything else. Just modify your technique. It's not ideal, but it's okay.

[Natalie]

Okay. So the strength is still possible there. I guess I always. I get concerned about that.

[Sal DeStefano]

No, no, no, you're okay. Just modify where necessary. But the presses, the squats, you know, you're gonna have to set up the squat differently where it's more like a hack squat, but you can still chase strength for consistency.

[Adam Schafer]

That's fine. It. I would try to every once in a while make it to a normal gym if you can. Just so you can mess with barbell stuff. I think it would be great.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

But I would never make you do that and then it sacrifice the consistency of it. If it's like I consistently will do it here, then that trump, you're still gonna get stronger. That'll trumpet. But then I'd also be like, hey, if it's a Saturday and you can go work out or what that maybe go to your local gym where you have barbell stuff that you can practice. It would serve you.

[Emma]

You.

[Sal DeStefano]

But the deadlift one is the only one. I'd say switch to dumbbells.

[Natalie]

Okay.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah. Natalie, what is about what we're saying challenging for you?

[Natalie]

There's. I actually feel really good about it, to be honest. Yeah, I'm. I'm excited. I feel like I've been kind of crossing that line of I want to go to solid core, but then I also want to lift, but then I don't want to do too much so that it does actually gives you the opposite results. You know, when I'm not actually gaining strength and I'm overdoing it so that I can't. And so I feel like the 15 minute today is really going to be what I need so that I'm not over training. Um, and you know, I, as I said, I've listened to you for a long time so I trust you. Um, and it might be hard to, you know, like not be in the gym for a full hour, but if I can just push through that and.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes, make, make long rest periods. I don't that can. That 15 minute workout will easily stretch to 30 just by having long, long rest periods between.

[Natalie]

So yeah, that is something that I always struggle, I mean, as group fitness instructor. So obviously I'm one of like make it a circuit or superset.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm glad you said that. Then go the opposite with this.

[Sal DeStefano]

Go super long.

[Adam Schafer]

Turn Maps 15 into Maps 30, please.

[Sal DeStefano]

Let's get you strong.

[Adam Schafer]

I'd be happier to see that it's taking you 30 minutes than you get it. Make it 30 minutes.

[Sal DeStefano]

I feel good about this though. I feel really good about this. We're going to have you back on in 60 days so we could check in on you. Okay.

[Natalie]

And that's great. Thank you so much. This has been so much fun. So I can't wait.

[Adam Schafer]

Natalie.

[Sal DeStefano]

Thanks Natalie.

[Natalie]

Thank you.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, she's doing a good job.

[Sal DeStefano]

Yeah, I feel for her. She's doing a good job. Yeah. She's self aware. She's a kid, she's only 26 years old. But you know, the repeating thoughts, that's a difficult one. But if you replace it with pause. In fact, I was just reading an article about this, this and that can be tough for people, especially when they're thoughts that are, you know, ones that break yourself.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, I think this is so this is tough for everybody. I actually think, I mean the webinar that Kyle and I had just ran like the third, the third thing that where people fail we were talking about with just accountability, having a coach having support and help. And I said one of the biggest things that a coach and a trainer does support wise is literally just help people disconnect from the mirror and the scale and connect to all the other things that strength training and eating correctly does for you. And that's. It's hard for the average person to do that, much less if you have any sort of issue or condition or struggle or type of personality. It's like the average person, we've been conditioned to look at the mirror, look at the scale.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's it. And judge that and that's your relationship.

[Adam Schafer]

And it's like it does so many things for your energy, your libido, your hair, your skin, your mood, your relationships, your sleep. It's like the list goes, develop a.

[Sal DeStefano]

Complete relationship without paying attention to all those things.

[Adam Schafer]

To all those things. And so even the average person, I mean, you talk about somebody who admittedly has struggled with some of this stuff. It's like, no, I, I mean, I think the average person uses those two metrics and has a really hard time. I mean, most of I'm sure your career was the average person coming back to you saying like, hey, the scale's not moving or I look the same in the mirror and they're going like, yeah, but how's your energy? And didn't you just tell me about your libido? And look how strong your squad is. And it's like you have to help them make that connection.

[Sal DeStefano]

That's right. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see you at Mind Pump Media.

[Justin Andrews]

Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB Super Bundle includes maps, Anabolic Maps, Performance and Maps Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs with detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos. The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

[Adam Schafer]

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[Sal DeStefano]

Qualifying credit required.

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[Sal DeStefano]

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