2774: Midlife Cholesterol Problems EXPLAINED (Do These Lifestyle Fixes)

Summary

Mind Pump 2774: "Midlife Cholesterol Problems EXPLAINED (Do These Lifestyle Fixes)"

Release Date: January 17, 2026
Hosts: Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, Justin Andrews, Doug Egge

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Overview

This episode of Mind Pump tackles one of the most common health issues facing adults as they age: cholesterol problems, specifically the changes in blood lipids that tend to worsen in midlife. With a trademark blend of science-backed expertise, candor, and humor, Sal, Adam, Justin, and Doug break down the realities of cholesterol, the limitations of standard blood tests, and what genuinely works for improving cholesterol profiles—focusing especially on lifestyle changes, not just medication or dietary dogma.

Listeners get a road map for understanding cholesterol labs, genetic and lifestyle contributions to blood lipid issues, dietary nuance, effective forms of exercise, targeted supplements, and the critical importance of context, maintenance, and sustainability in all things fitness and health.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Understanding Cholesterol and Blood Lipid Testing

[03:04]–[07:29]

• Outdated Focus on Total Cholesterol:

  • Total cholesterol alone isn't that informative unless it's "really, really high." It's more important to understand HDL (good cholesterol), LDL (bad cholesterol), and—crucially—the size/type of LDL particles.
  • "Total cholesterol, which is what we used to really pay attention to... it doesn't say a ton. HDL, LDL will tell us more. And then you can look at the type of LDL, which will tell you even more." – Sal, [03:47]

• Getting the Right Test:

  • Standard panels usually report just total cholesterol, HDL, and LDL.
  • You can—and often should—request the NMR LipoProfile test to determine LDL particle size, which is now much more accessible than 5–10 years ago.

• Context Matters:

  • Blood lipids are one piece of the bigger health picture, not the whole story.
  • Other risk factors: blood pressure, activity level, overall fitness, genetics.

2. The Real Impact of Genetics and Aging

[07:29]–[08:27]

• Cholesterol levels tend to worsen with age due to declining liver function and LDL receptor activity (LDL stays in the blood longer).
• Genetics can have a major influence, with some people having challenging blood lipid numbers despite doing "everything right."

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3. Exercise for Cholesterol: Strength vs. Cardio

[07:43]–[13:56]

• Strength Training:

  • Especially helpful for raising HDL and supporting overall metabolic health.

• Cardio (and HIIT):

  • More effective than strength training at lowering LDL.
  • HIIT is “best” statistically—but not appropriate for most deconditioned adults, especially those 50+ lbs overweight.
  • Focus instead on gradually building up fitness, starting with strength training and possibly ending sessions with short, low-risk bursts of cardio (e.g., elliptical intervals).

• Real-World Coaching:

  • Key is sustainability and progression. The best plan is one you can stick to and won't get injured doing.

“Being weak will predict mortality better than lipids that don’t look so great, aside from the really terrible lipid profiles.” – Sal, [10:25]

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4. Dietary Strategies: Fat Types, Fiber, and Personalization

[13:56]–[18:09]

• Saturated Fat:

  • For some (about 20-25%), reducing saturated fat and prioritizing fats like olive oil and nuts yields dramatic cholesterol improvements. For others, saturated fat has little impact due to genetics.
  • Grass-fed, grass-finished red meat has a better fatty acid profile.

• Fiber:

  • Higher fiber intake binds bile acids, increases LDL receptor activity, and helps excrete cholesterol.
  • Supplemental fibers like psyllium husk can be beneficial.

• Calorie Deficit’s Role:

  • Calorie deficits (regardless of diet ideology, e.g., carnivore or vegan) often drive rapid cholesterol improvements, not just the macronutrient composition.

“Increasing dietary fiber does make a difference with this… It also helps sweep cholesterol out. That’s dietary. So fiber makes a good difference.” – Sal, [17:14]

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5. Supplements with Evidence for Cholesterol

[19:20]–[22:34]

1. Citrus Bergamot

   • A fruit from southern Italy, available as a supplement, shown to increase HDL and decrease LDL-C.

2. Red Yeast Rice

   • Contains monacolin K, a compound identical to pharmaceutical statins.
   • Highly effective but not for everyone; possible side effects.
   • Doug shares a personal success story:
     • “I mean, at one point my cholesterol had gotten up to, like, 280. And I dropped it down to 200 using that.” – Doug, [21:23]

3. Niacin (Vitamin B3):

   • Works but can cause unpleasant "niacin flush"; once a mainstay treatment.

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6. Protein, Food Pyramid Updates, and Real Food Choices

[23:14]–[27:24]

• The "new" food pyramid now recommends double the previous protein amounts (from 0.8g/kg to 1.2–1.6g/kg).

  • Example: For a 200 lb person (~90.9 kg), recommended protein jumps from ~72g to ~140g daily.
    • “Went from 70 grams of protein to 140 for a 200 pound male. That's a big difference.” – Sal, [26:10]

• Protein intake is crucial for muscle, metabolism, and overall health—something the show has championed for years.

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7. Myths, Fitness “Pharisees," and Social Media Confusion

[27:27]–[33:43]

• The hosts express frustration with over-technical, nitpicky online fitness advice that confuses more than it helps.
  • Real-life consistency and sustainability matter more than “bio-mechanical” or “optimal” exercises.
  • “There's so much bad information out there... This is why we started the podcast 10 years ago.” – Sal, [27:44]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On personalized cholesterol responses
  “There's a significant minority—probably over 20%—where saturated fat makes a big difference. It really does. And you know if this is you because you'll do everything right... and your LDL is high. This doesn't make sense.” – Sal, [16:31]

• On doctors recommending cardio to unfit, overweight people
  "Nothing will help this person more than getting the 40 to 50 pounds of fat off their body and building some muscle. Even though cardio might have the best effect [short term]... my first go-to move is actually to build muscle, speed their metabolism up." – Adam, [09:08]

• On myths about saturated fat and cholesterol
  “I could eat saturated fat until I can’t breathe and it seems to have no negative effect on me... Other people, I've had clients like this, where this was the thing that made the difference.” – Sal, [14:44]

• On HIIT and appropriate exercise progression
  "Although the data shows HIIT cardio is great, if you're not exercising right now, you gotta work your way up to it, otherwise it's going to be bad." – Sal, [13:04]

• On genetic outliers
  "Doug’s one of those people... does everything right [yet] still has high cholesterol. Genetics." – Sal, [22:05]

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Important Timestamps

• [03:04] – What matters in cholesterol blood testing and how to request particle size analysis.
• [07:43] – Strength vs. cardio effects on blood lipids; how HIIT is often inappropriately recommended.
• [13:56] – Dietary changes: fats to avoid vs. embrace, genetics in play, individualized response.
• [17:14] – The crucial role of fiber.
• [19:20] – Supplements: Citrus bergamot, red yeast rice, Niacin details and Doug’s experience.
• [23:14] – Food pyramid/protein recommendations updated; practical meaning for lifters.
• [27:27] – Rant about confusing fitness information online.

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“Live Caller” Segment Highlights

Jake, 22, Virginia [64:45–70:35]

• Struggled with “low” lifting numbers for his training experience.
• Hosts emphasize long-term progress, genetics, and the power of strategic bulking (even with some discomfort).
• “You want to get bigger and stronger? Feed yourself. You gotta feed yourself, dude.” – Sal

Morgan, 21, Nebraska [71:06–83:14]

• Female endurance athlete recovering from hormone imbalances.
• Cautions against prematurely returning to ultra-endurance; encourage a “healing year” with strength focus.
• “Give yourself a goal of like a year... My goal is to heal my body and focus on getting stronger.” – Sal

William, South Carolina [83:16–95:33]

• Asks about raising two boys with very different body types and appetites.
• Hosts concur: focus on whole foods, fun movement, and never making food/fitness a stressor or source of shame.
• "The most important thing you can do with young kids... is have them develop a relationship with fitness where they enjoy it." – Sal, [85:49]

Luke, Tennessee [98:03–102:13]

• Reports success with low-volume training (MAPS 15), gains muscle without changing diet. Transition suggested to Power Lift to pursue new goals.

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Tone and Takeaways

• Straight talk: The hosts cut through dietary and fitness dogma, focusing on individualized, evidence-based approaches.
• Personal anecdotes: Doug’s cholesterol saga, Adam’s experiences with children and food, Justin’s stories about family exercise all reinforce practical, real-world advice.
• Encouragement, not fear: Most risk factors can be improved through sustainable, incremental changes—not extreme diets, obsessive tracking, or magical supplements.

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Summary Table: Lifestyle Fixes for Midlife Cholesterol

| Lifestyle Area | Most Effective Actions’ Summary | |--------------------|----------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | Lab Testing | Request LDL particle size (NMR LipoProfile), not just total cholesterol. | | Exercise | Prioritize progressive strength training; add sustainable cardio for LDL. | | Diet | Reduce saturated fat (esp. if you’re a “responder”), eat more olive oil/nuts, fiber.| | Supplements | Try citrus bergamot, red yeast rice (for some), niacin (if tolerated). | | General Health | Prioritize long-term changes, not quick fixes. Monitor all health markers. |

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Final Thought

Cholesterol issues in midlife aren’t a foregone conclusion. With the right information, testing, and a holistic approach that honors genetics, lifestyle context, and personal preference, almost anyone can improve their blood lipids—and their overall health—over time.

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“At the end of this, it's going to feel incredible. You're not going to feel like you're fighting your body anymore. It's going to feel like it's working with you.” – Sal, [80:54]

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Find the hosts on Instagram:

• @mindpumpmedia
• @mindpumpsal
• @mindpumpadam
• @mindpumpjustin
• @mindpumpdoug

For expertly programmed MAPS protocols: mapsfitnessproducts.com

Transcript

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[B]

Mind Pump Mind Pump.

[A]

With your hosts Sal Destefano, Adam Schaefer.

[C]

And Justin Andrews, you just found the.

[B]

Most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode we had live callers call in. We got to coach them on air, but this was after the Intro. Today's intro, 59 minutes long. In the intro we talk about fitness and fat loss, muscle gain, diet, current events, always a good time. By the way, if you want to be on an episode like this, send us your question. Send it to mplivecaller.com now. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Butcherbox. Butcherbox delivers quality meats to your door. Grass fed grass, finished red meat, heritage pork, wild caught fish, fish and more at great prices. You like meat, you like protein, you want the healthy stuff and you like to save money. Go to butcherbox.com mindpump by the way, new users will get their choice between filet mignon, New York strip or chicken breast, which they'll include for free in your box for an entire year on that link. This episode is also brought to you by Seed. This is the world's best probiotics. So probiotics help with digestion, they help with your skin, mental health, recovery from exercise is all backed by data. Probiotics are great for you. Seed's the best there is. Nobody even close. Go to seed.com mindpump Use the code 20mindpump. Get 20% off your first month's order of seeds daily Symbiotic. We also have a sale on four maps workout programs. Maps, starter maps, transform maps, anabolic and mass performance. They're all 50% off. Go to maps january.com use the code newyear50 for that discount. Here comes the show. All right, real quick.

[D]

If you love us like we love you, why not show up by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs or training gear [e-mail] I'm talking right now. Hit pause, head on over to my pumpstore.com. that's it.

[A]

Enjoy the rest of the show.

[B]

Cholesterol levels, blood lipids, they tend to get worse in midlife. We're going to talk about the lifestyle, things you could do to improve your blood lipids, supplements, diet. What can you do to make your numbers look better and reduce your risk of heart disease? That's what we're going to talk about right now. Let's get to it.

[A]

Are you tell me more first. Are you first going to address, I feel how often people get this. This wrong.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, and that technically a, a high level of HDL doesn't always necessarily mean it's a bad thing.

[B]

Not necessarily.

[A]

It's more about the particle size and like.

[B]

Yeah. So total cholesterol, which is what we used to really pay attention to. This is just the one number.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Unless it's really, really high, it doesn't say a ton. Hdl, LDL will tell us more. And then you can look at the type of ldl, which will tell you even more.

[A]

You have to request that, though. So if you go get normal blood.

[B]

Panels, they look at total HDL and.

[A]

Ldl, which is unfortunate because how many times have we had this where a client comes back and they have this scare because the number says I feel like this doesn't make sense. I eat whole foods and I train and I do all the things and so what is it that I'm supposed to request from my doctor? So I is it just can I find out the particles? I mean, what does that conversation you.

[B]

Want to look at, you want to be able to differentiate between particle sizes, especially with the ldl.

[A]

I mean, but that's what I would so.

[B]

And now this getting a much easier to order. This is getting much, much easier now to get from your doctor if you request it.

[A]

But I have to request it. So what does that. So I'm naive. I go get normal blood panels. That comes back. I get freaked out. Cholesterol. You hear from one of our trainers or you that says, you know what you need to go do, Ask them for what?

[B]

I don't know the name, Doug. Maybe you could pull that up for me. But I do know you can say, specifically, I would like to take a test that will differentiate the LDL particles. Okay. I don't know what the exact name of it is, but when you go get a blood test, just tell them right out the gates, hey, I know. I'm testing my blood lipids. Can I get a test that also differentiates the size of the LDL particles? And it's a lot. You know, five, 10 years ago, this was very difficult to get. These days, it's much easier. So I don't know. Doug, do you have the Name?

[C]

Yeah, the NMR LiPo Profile Test.

[B]

There you go. Yeah, that's it right there.

[A]

Might be easier to do.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

I was hoping that. I was hoping it had, like, a simpler name for people to remember to request. I've been asked that a lot. I've been asked, like, what I say to my doctor because I just said my full blood panels, and this is what they give back to me.

[B]

Now. Here. Here's. You know, here's. Before we get into this, it's important to understand. Look, if your blood lipids look really bad, like, that's a red flag, okay? But in. It's really. For most people, this is a piece of a bigger picture, okay? So when you. When you get your blood lipid results back, you want to also look at, you know, other health factors like blood pressure, activity level, symptoms of other, you know, other health symptoms. You want to look at all those things. Now, why am I saying that? Because your blood lipids could look good, but you could also be out of shape and have other risk factors that would tell you, hey, you're not doing so well, so you want to look at all those things. Nonetheless, there is in our space, especially the wellness space, this kind of myth that says blood lipids don't matter, which is not true. LDL is in all the data that I've seen in a majority of the data. Some data will counter it, but most of the data shows that ldl, the higher it is, the higher your risk is of having issues with your heart. And then, of course, the LDL particle size, I believe it's small. I think it's LDL C, if I'm not mistaken. I wrote it down. That's the one that you really want to pay attention to. So again if it's really bad, it's a red flag nonetheless. If you're a health conscious individual, get, get the differentiating test, pay attention. And then there's things you could do that'll change these things. Natural thing, natural things, natural things you could do that will improve this. Now as you get older, these numbers tend to get worse. Liver function changes, LDL receptor activity goes down, meaning your LDL circulates in your blood more rather than getting utilized because your receptors aren't as active. And then genetics plays a really big role in this. Especially with people. Really bad blood lipid levels. Oftentimes it's like man their genetics just kind of.

[D]

This is the majority people that have issues with this polymorphisms that is really genetic. Yeah. Because for the most part like dietary, like. Well, I guess lipids, you're gonna, you could control that a little more so than cholesterol.

[B]

Yes. So there are changes, there are lifestyle changes that have some pretty good impacts. We'll start with exercise. So everybody knows exercise is good for you and it does have a positive impact on your blood lipids. And there are better forms of exercise for this than others. So strength training, great form of exercise. Really good for blood sugar regulation, really good for mobility, you know, to decrease frailty, help with the faster metabolism. By the way, as you get leaner blood, lipids always tend to improve. But it's really mainly impacts HDL in a positive way. It has an impact on ldl, but not nearly as much as cardio. Cardio has a really, really good impact on, on ldl.

[A]

I was gonna ask you related to exercise, is it, what about building muscle and is it independent to building muscle like the, the exercise itself has positive benefit or is it because you are building these larger vessels that store energy and fuel because that will go down.

[B]

That's literally the form of exercise cardiovascular activity seems to have. In all the data I've seen a more positive effect on improving LDL numbers. So if, if you're like really concerned with your ldl. Cardio is the form of exercise you want to incorporate. It doesn't mean you don't do other forms of exercise, but make sure you do some of it. And then what kind of cardio hit Cardio has the best.

[A]

Well, which is, which is a little challenging because I know where you're going.

[B]

So I'm happy you're going there.

[A]

Okay. So because what happens most times when we get a client who is 40, 50 plus pounds overweight is cholesterol is high too but this, this, these markers are going to be high. Doctors are going to say based off the research what you just said, cardio is one of the best forms to.

[B]

Start to and do hit cardio and.

[A]

Yeah and to do that right to start getting, to start getting that down. But what we know is if I'm going to be really because, because nothing will help this person more than getting the 40 to 50 pounds of fat off their body and building some muscle. Even though cardio in the short term might have the, the best effect and even knowing that as a coach and trainer I'm not, that's not my first go to move with this client. My first go to move with this client is actually to build muscle speed their metabolism up to help them with the journey to lose fat loss. Even though in the short term I know that's probably what they're which is one of the hardest things for a coach and a trainer because I know that's what the dog, the doctor is saying that and I'm going hey, I know in the, what he's saying is, is one of the fastest and the best ways that I understand, I know what the research says but I also know if you're going to be successful at getting this 50 pounds that you want to get off your body and you're only eating these many calories and this is what your diet looks like, we've got to build some muscle on that body which is going to get you in a better place metabolically which will then make the weight loss, cardio, all the things better.

[B]

And just to back you up, a strength test is actually one of the best predictors of all cause mortality. So being weak will predict mortality better than lipids that don't look so great aside from the really terrible, you know, lipid profiles that a few people will see. And also here's the thing, look, the form of exercise that you apply has to be appropriate hiit cardio. So people aren't familiar with high. It stands for high intensity interval training for people who aren't familiar. What this is is this would look like an example would be like an all out sprint for a short period of time followed by cruising until your heart rate comes down and then going after it again. It's very intense form of, of cardio. It's not appropriate for most people. So although the data may show that this is really good for reducing ldl, if it's not appropriate for you don't. You can't do it. It's not going to benefit you. Why? Because your risk of injury goes up, it's too stressful in the body, can cause lots of other problems. So what the doctor will say to you is you need to exercise. And maybe they'll say do cardio, but they're not the exercise expert. The doctor is looking at your, your panel saying you need to do something. Take that to the exercise expert who then can apply the appropriate type of exercise for you based on your fitness level, your goals, your time, you know.

[D]

What'S your decondition and frail and you have all these like prerequisite issues that you're not addressing. It's like, you know, you, that's the problem with a lot of these general standards and advices. They're looking at numbers and they're not really looking at the process of, of you know, you going through that, which in fact may actually set you back substantially because you might get injured.

[B]

Well, let me ask you guys this. You get 50 people in their 50s coming to hire you as a trainer, none of them working out consistently. Right. Typical 50 year old. What percentage of them would hit cardio right out the gates, be appropriate?

[D]

0, 0 to 1.

[B]

Just not appropriate.

[A]

Not right out gates. Although I could see an example where I've got this again using the analogy of the 40, 50 plus pounds overweight doctors telling you you need to get some of this off. I know I need to reverse diet, build muscle. I could see strength training with that person, you know, for a 30, 40 minute session of strength focused training while we're hitting our protein intake and then ending our session with an elliptical where we get there for 10 minutes to 12 minutes tops and we have these little bursts where they, they pick up the ear.

[B]

You're going to prepare them and get them ready so that hiit cardio becomes appropriate. My point.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And that's just the caution that I want to tell people. Yes. Although the data shows hit cardio is great. If you're not exercising right now, you're not doing it now. You got to work your way up to it otherwise it's going to be bad. Right. It's not going to be good.

[A]

And so that, that would be my way of doing that. Right. We're still the, the cornerstone is still strength training is still the reverse diet is still building muscle, is still putting ourself in A. Because 10 minutes of this person getting on the elliptical is also not going to send a loud enough cardio signal that we're not going to build muscle.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Right. So it's like getting them to the place where they can get to a place where maybe, maybe a month, two months down the road we can start to introduce some of this, this high interval training cardio at the end of our training sessions. And it would be infrequent still at first too. It'd be two, three days a week at most.

[D]

It'd be the lower risk ones like.

[B]

You mentioned, like elliptical.

[A]

That's why I said that I would not elliptical or biking.

[B]

They're not running.

[A]

Yeah, definitely not 50 pounds overweight. All these issues going on. Last thing I'm doing is having that, that client do an all out sprint for 15 seconds.

[B]

That's an injury waiting to have, oh, 100. Next we'll talk about diet. So obviously there's a lot of things that go into a healthy diet, but the type of fats that you eat play a pretty significant role in this. With people who have again, who get these panels that come back that are off. And one of the most effective things you could do is replace saturated fat intake with other fats that have a beneficial effect. Like olive oil is a good example, nuts are a good example. And then if you're going to eat red meat, go with grass fed, grass finished versions of that meat because the fatty acid profile is better. It's better in this case. And what's. Now here's what's interesting with saturated fat. So again, this is where the wellness side can go a little too far. It doesn't matter. Saturated fat doesn't matter. It actually does matter for some people. For the people it matters for, it matters now some of us, it doesn't make that big of a difference. I'm one of those people, I could eat saturated fat until I can't breathe and it seems to have no negative effect on me. And there's some people that are like this now. Other people, I've had clients like this where this was the thing that made the difference. It was changing their saturated fat intake, reducing it, increasing other fats like olive oil is a great example and it made a big difference. So if, if this is you, it makes a difference. If it's not you, then I wouldn't worry too much.

[D]

It almost felt wrong because I know what you're trying to find. Analogy wise, until the cows come home, it didn't feel right.

[A]

Now I know there's, there's genetic anomalies, but like how much of a role is somebody who strength trains and builds muscle play in a factor in this?

[B]

I mean being fit always makes a big Difference.

[A]

Yeah, but that's a general statement. I mean, somebody. Well, here's why do you believe. Okay. And this is obviously your opinion. This is. You can't back this up. But do you believe a part of that, Part of why you're able to do that? The way your body processes saturated fats is because you've been building muscle since you're 15 years old and you've got a ton of muscle.

[B]

There's two things to consider. So one is if you're in a huge calorie surplus all the time, it's your blood lipids are going to look worse than if you're in a deficit.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Or maintenance. More muscle means you can eat more and still be in a deficit. So there's that the other part of it is genetic. Dude. It really. For some, it doesn't matter.

[A]

That's what I mean. I mean, there's always going to play. There's going to play that factor. But do you think that's a percentage wise? Would you say that's half the people? That's a genetic thing. Would you say that's 25, or do you think it's like there's a single digit.

[B]

There's a significant minority. I can't give you a number, but it's significant. Probably over 20% small. Where this makes a lot. Yeah, it's a significant minority. Where saturated fat makes a big difference. It really does.

[A]

That's a good. That's a good.

[B]

And you know, if this is almost.

[A]

1 out of 4 people then that are.

[B]

That are struggling, you'll know if this is you because you'll do everything right. This is what it'll feel like. I'm working out. I mean, right. I'm exercise. I feel. I'm lean, man. My LDL is high. Like, what's going on? Why is my LDL high? This doesn't really make any sense.

[A]

Like that. Didn't somebody just come in here that was telling us that was it. Was it. Was it someone that was listening to the podcast or.

[B]

I can't remember. Oh, I think we talked with someone who was a caller.

[A]

Was it a caller?

[B]

It was a caller. Yeah.

[A]

And they, and they, they were fit. They were in good shape. All those things. They still were struggling.

[B]

Yes, yes, yes.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Next is fiber. So increasing dietary fiber does make a difference with this. It binds with the bile acids. And this helps increase LDL receptor activity, helps your body utilize the cholesterol better. It also helps sweep cholesterol out. That's dietary. So fiber makes a good difference. When it comes to this. And so this is where the carnivore people kind of freak out. Yeah.

[D]

But it's like, it's interesting where they're so not into fiber because for me, like even where you talk about like psyllium husk and you know what it does to clean out a lot of the micro plastics, a lot of like things within your system, it seems like it's like a cleaning system. You need that.

[B]

Yeah. Silly mask is a supplemental fiber. That actually makes a big difference. By the way, there are carnivore diet. People just eat meat. I just eat red meat. They're like, look at my blood lipids, how much better they got. Saturated fat's not bad.

[A]

Lower calories.

[B]

You went in a deficit.

[A]

Yes. You're in a lower car.

[B]

You had a massive deficit.

[A]

That made a big difference.

[B]

That fixes a lot of things. I just want, I want to let people know. Going to calorie deficit.

[A]

Same reason why all the vegan people go that way too. I mean, why you get that many people that, oh my God, the vegan diet did it for us. Like, well, no, you cut out so many calories.

[B]

This is why you'll get those. I hate people that do this, but they're doing it to prove a point. You'll get like the food scientist who's like, I'm only going to eat garbage.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. And I'm at 1500 calories or whatever.

[B]

Yeah. My blood lipids are going to improve dramatically.

[D]

Keep low calorie.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because the calories are low. But I'll say this, try going low calorie eating garbage.

[A]

Well, and the, the reason why the carnivore thing got so popular, one to your point that 80 of the people are going to see a positive change because of that. I mean if, if the genetic anomalies are in a small minority of 20 or a large minority. You said 20%. That's still going to help 80% of the people because it's going to naturally put them in a caloric deficit. I mean if you've never tried to eat just meat. Yeah. 2500 to 3000 calories.

[B]

But there's other reasons why it's not healthy too. Let's make sure we say that.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. But I mean that's, that's the main reason why I think it gets so much popularity is because it ends up helping so many people. And, but then the other side that people get so angry about, well, you're, you probably fall in that 20 where it does the opposite for You.

[B]

That's right. That's right. And then there's supplements that actually make a difference when it comes to cholesterol. There are actual supplements with studies that show a pretty measurable difference.

[A]

Red yeast, is that what you're saying?

[B]

Well, we'll get to that one because that one's the most powerful one. But citrus bergamot is one. I don't know if I've heard that. So this is. Yeah, this is a. Where do you find that you could. I mean, you could buy it as a supplement. I think it's a fruit found in southern Italy, if I'm not mistaken. This actually shows a measurable difference in total cholesterol. Increases hdl, decreases LDL C, the bad form of.

[A]

Now, is this a specific fruit found in Italy or is this like in. Found in all citrus?

[B]

No, I think it's a specific type of fruit found in. Look up the fruit itself, Doug.

[A]

Dose has that.

[B]

That's the, that's the actual supplement. No, I don't know if it's in there.

[A]

I mean, why would a dose pop up? Oh, because he did. Cholesterol.

[B]

Because you could put cholesterol in there. But it's, it's a. It's found in Calabria, if I'm not mistaken, which is southern Italy. So maybe you could look that up, Doug. But, but the data on this is pretty interesting. It does improve blood lipids pretty well.

[A]

But not as well as red red yeast rice extract.

[C]

You're correct.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. It's a fruit, right?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Can you see it?

[A]

Can I see what it looks like? Is it like an orangey looking fruit.

[B]

Or was it looks more like a lime? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. That's right. So red yeast rice extract is a natural statin. In fact, I wrote it down. The. The active ingredient in red yeast rice is called monochromatic colon K. This is a compound that is chemically identical to lovastatin, which is a pharmaceutical statin. So it's actually a statin. So you could, you could buy this at a supplement store. Take it, and you will see improvements in your blood lipids from taking.

[A]

So is that where they derive statins from? Is it derived?

[B]

I think they might have studied reduced.

[A]

Rice and then they just probably concentrate it, which is what I know Doug's tried reduced rice.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

It works.

[B]

Yeah. How big of a difference did you see?

[C]

Oh, massive difference.

[A]

Oh, you. You messed with it. I didn't know that. I did.

[C]

I mean, at one point my cholesterol had gotten up to like 280. And I dropped it down to 200 using that.

[A]

When was that?

[C]

Oh, it's been years ago.

[A]

Was it during mind pump?

[B]

Yeah, I don't remember that. Yeah. Makes a big difference.

[A]

Was it one of our Cabral tests that you found that out or how did you.

[C]

When my blood tests and I. I saw my blood was high, so my cholesterol levels were high, so I dropped.

[A]

Interesting. What. Obviously, you did that to do that, but anything in your diet that time, would you say you were, like, off on your diet or.

[C]

No, not at all.

[B]

Doug's one of those people. And this is so. By the way, when I talk about clients I've had, Doug always comes up to mind for me, because there's people who are like, well, I'm doing everything right. And you look at their diet and stuff like, no, you're not. There's a lot of things you can do. Doug does everything right.

[A]

That's why.

[B]

Very healthy.

[A]

That's why I'm so curious. I was curious what. What was going on for him to be that high?

[B]

Nothing. No, just genetics.

[C]

Yeah, genetics. My dad always had high cholesterol.

[A]

So do you now. Do you continually have to use the supplement?

[C]

I stopped it.

[A]

Interesting. So you were able to use it.

[C]

So I'm using again some other supplements. Niacin is another thing. Yeah, niacin.

[B]

Except niacin.

[A]

The problem with niacin, it makes you hot and flush.

[C]

Oh, it makes you feel horrible.

[A]

I remember the first time I took it.

[B]

You know, that's how they treated high cholesterol back in the day.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

It works, though.

[B]

With niacin, it works, but it sucks.

[C]

I started doing the dose, though, now.

[A]

Yeah, because that has it.

[C]

Well, it doesn't have niacin, but it has a bunch of. It does have. Actually does have niacin. I'm looking at it right now.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[C]

I'm trying to see if they have the. The other one, the.

[D]

The fruit.

[C]

I don't see that.

[B]

Back in the day, the way people would treat cholesterol is they would take a high dose of niacin and go in a sauna.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

I know. Could you imagine?

[A]

I mean, you feel like you're in a sauna already.

[C]

Well, I do that now.

[A]

I remember niacin was one of those supplements that. The first time ever, something that made me feel like I was sweating.

[B]

You could feel it?

[A]

Yeah, I could sweat without any number.

[F]

Yes.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Yeah, dude.

[A]

You know, hey, speaking of food. Okay. What? The whole food flipping the pyramid thing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, what do you guys, what do you guys think? Do you think? I was talking to Gabriel Lyon about it, so.

[B]

It's great. It's great. So first off, is it huge? Huge Trump.

[A]

Huge, Trump, huge.

[B]

It's big because meat is now not something that people are like freaking out over now. It's cool because we just talked about grass fed grass finished meat.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

If you're one of those people that likes meat but. And you're fit and healthy, whatever reason about it, probably for whatever reason, your blood lipids aren't that great. You know, Butcherbox is, we worked with them for a long time. Great company.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You get, you go with Butcherbox and they have a good variety of grass fed grass finished meat. Deliver it to your door now. So if you eat a lot of red meat, switching from conventional to grass fed for many people makes a big enough difference because of the difference in the fatty acid profile.

[A]

Yeah. Now you're good about that now, right? You're good about eating your butcher box meat, are you? Are you?

[C]

That's not all I eat anymore.

[A]

Oh, so you are way more consistent. Yeah, I mean, occasionally I go out.

[C]

And have a steak, so I don't.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But for the most part, if you're, for the most part, you're grilling at home, you're going to be growing a butcher box steak. Most of the time.

[C]

Most of the time.

[B]

You know what the big difference with the new food pyramid is? The protein recommendations.

[A]

Have you guys seen the text I've been sending you guys?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You see all the advertising that's coming out? I know Chipotle's pushing now. Jack in the Box is pushing. There are everyone's.

[B]

What was the old recommendation for protein and what is the new one? I think it's like double. I think they doubled it. If I'm not mistaken, that impact alone.

[D]

Of just pointing to that, I think that's substantial.

[A]

So I would love, I would love to hear. I'll have to have Katrina ask Butcherbox because I, I just, I'm so curious to how like a company like that, they've been established for a really long time. That's obviously primarily they see like new sales. Right. Will you see, will it impact that much that all of a sudden companies like that will feel the boost?

[B]

Yeah. What does it show, Doug, for the comparison? Because it's a pretty good.

[C]

Yeah, see the old was 0.8 per kilogram of body weight and now it's 1.2 to 1.6.

[B]

So double, essentially. Yeah. So double the amount of protein now is what they recommend.

[A]

So funny.

[B]

And look what it says. Supporting muscle metabolism and overall health. Isn't that great?

[A]

I mean that just flies in the face of all the people that used to use that number as a. Like this is all you need.

[B]

I'm going to look up. What's that? I'm going to give you. Yeah, let's look up like what does that look like for. I hate it when they use kilograms.

[A]

Because I know 2.2 is what you divide.

[B]

Yeah, I know. So I'm gonna go. Yeah.

[A]

And by the way, this is, this is again just kind of supporting weight muscle. It's still not what optimal studies.

[B]

So the old. Yeah, you're right. The old recommendation for a 200 pound male. Yes. Who's not obese. Right. 200 pound, kind of average whatever body fat, say 10%.

[A]

Say, say lean.

[B]

10, whatever.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

72 grams of protein. That's what they say. I know now it would be, let me see. Oh, essentially 140, right. Double. So went from 70 grams of protein to 140 for a 200 pound meal. That's a big difference.

[D]

Huge.

[B]

It's a huge difference. That's huge.

[A]

Yeah, that's good news.

[B]

That's good news.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

By the way, the fitness industry, what.

[A]

We'Ve been saying forever though, like we've said, I don't care, male or female, okay. Especially my female clients. But male or female, always I had to get, I mean even myself. It's always when, when, when I fall off the wagon of consistency and, and, and making my meals and doing my thing, it's the first thing I do. It's. I don't even, I don't even, I don't track, I don't measure, I don't do anything. It's just that I go after protein because it automatically gets cut almost in half when I just eat whatever I find.

[B]

By the way, I'll say this just to back you up. A 200 pound male eating the difference between eating 140 grams of protein and eating 200 grams of protein now you're gonna be health 140 is great. It's fine. There's nothing wrong. It's actually good. It's really good. But if you go to 200, the difference you'll see in muscle performance recovery is astounding. Yes, it's astounding.

[A]

Especially if you're training hard.

[B]

That's. Well, yes, that's in the context of working out. Yeah, it makes a big difference.

[A]

That's the part I think where this there's this argument debate. If you're just the average person, you kind of exercise, or you maybe you play tennis for your movement, you do stuff like that and you're hitting these numbers, this is good. It's going to sustain your muscle mass. But if you're actively trying to build muscle, build your metabolism, you, you go, you got to go higher.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

Go, go higher and you'll see a huge difference.

[B]

Yeah, totally. You know what? This reminds me of this conversation. So you guys were. We're all the same with this. The people that frustrate me the most, that communicate health and fitness, there's so much bad information that's out there. There's a lot of bad information. Okay. When it comes to health and fitness, this is why we started the podcast 10 years ago. This was, the main motivation was like, can we help sift through the garbage? Give people right information, communicate what actually matters and really help people out. That was the goal. The people that frustrate me the most are the fitness people who just confuse everybody. And so what came up for me, the reason why this came up for me is our team has put together content for us to produce and put together just to reach more people. One of them are these kind of like these video segments where we rank exercises. We have never done anything more controversial, which is silly.

[D]

Well, you know, because it's throwing it all on TikTok where everybody that's really smart hangs out.

[B]

Well, what's frustrating, what's really frustrating is.

[A]

First of all, it's actually, it's, it's not the, the TikTok idiots that are frustrating. I know where you're going.

[B]

Yes, dude.

[A]

It's the science and biomechanic nerds that use the.

[B]

I call them fitness Pharisees. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you know why I said that? Because. Okay, so if you, if you go, if you're not a Christian, you don't know this, but if you read the Bible, Jesus doesn't yell at prostitutes and tax collectors and the sinners. He doesn't get mad at them. You know, he gets mad at the religious self righteous Pharisees.

[A]

Why?

[B]

And that's when he flips over tables and he yells at them, essentially. Why? Because they're actively turning people away from the truth. These people that you were talking about, they are confusing people. They're just confusing people because they come across as smart, self righteous. Here's the biomechanics, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, great, you just confused a whole bunch of people. There was this One young woman that did a post, because we ranked the.

[A]

Top shoulder exercises and lateral raises were at the bottom.

[B]

We put lateral raises at the bottom. By the way, we have a list of exercises that we have to rank. So it's not like we just come up with it like, like rank the exercise priority.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

And here's the context. If you only had to do one, where would it be? Yeah, laterals would not be at the top.

[D]

Overhead press all day.

[B]

Overhead press at the top.

[D]

Can't compare.

[B]

And if I'm going to pick an overhead press, it's going to be one with a GR range of motion, which would be like an Arnold press, because it's the most function, works the shoulder, the scapula works, builds the most muscle strength. It's going to have the most carryover. Lateral raises are at the bottom. That doesn't mean it's a bad exercise, just means it's not nearly as good. And you had this young, this woman who's on there trying to, like, use biomechanics. And here's what the activation does and da, da, da. They did it with leg extensions for quads. Also comparing it to squat. And it's like, thanks. You just confused a bunch of people right now. Now you got a bunch of people watching this who are trying to get fit. They're like, well, she says leg extensions is. Is the best for. Is a great quad ex. I'm just gonna do those for my quads.

[A]

No, I mean, what are you doing? I think it. I think it always. It goes back to what I've been saying on here for a really long time. Which is. And which is why the podcast had so, so much success early on was because we came from a place of not only reading all the studies, the experience of training all the people, but then also when you train that many people, you get an opportunity to get an idea of what the bulk of the people that need help are. And the Internet ended up consolidating all the people that watch fitness stuff, talk about fitness stuff, read fitness studies into this bubble.

[B]

So you got a bunch of bodybuilders.

[A]

Yeah. So you have a bunch of crazy, fanatical, orthorexic people that train, like, every.

[B]

Extensions are amazing for quality.

[A]

Right. It's like, yeah, I got in the thread with you. It doesn't. It's not often that I start to get in there too anymore. And I'm going back and forth and I'm like, I know what study you read.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I'm very familiar with what the research says. But I also understand that 90 of people won't even make it three months of consistency working out.

[B]

So they'll pick one leg exercise or.

[A]

Yes, if we're lucky athletes. So I hope that whoever walks away from this sees the way that we rank these and goes like, oh, I'm going to prioritize when I do work out, if I do get consistent as well in that order of exercises and not make some argument for a lateral raise or a leg extension as being even in the top three of those movements. Because. But yes, in the height of my bodybuilding, seven days a week, not missing a day for three years, you bet your ass. Lateral raises and leg extensions made it.

[B]

Into my routine all the time. 80% of our programs include lateral raises and leg extensions. Okay. But it's not the most important. That's not even close to the most important. And such just frustrating because they, they're turning people away, dude. They're turning people away.

[A]

Well, at least, at the very least what they're doing is, they're confusing. I mean, I mean I, this, I got suckered into this as a young, as a young, less educated, less experienced personal trainer, I was drawn to that type of con. I was drawn to the, the super smart guy that was dropping the studies and saying that this is what we know about this exercise. And so I'd go, which I, this is why I was so passionate about when, you know, we went through that like, I don't know how many years ago, where we had to defend squats, where people are being like, oh, squats aren't even the king. Well, I don't know, this whole idea, they're the king of exercises.

[B]

You get as much.

[A]

Leg, leg press. Yeah, it's just like, and, and I remember being 23 and not squatting for that reason. And, and, and skipping that movement and then, then getting older and realizing the benefits of learning how to squat and then getting really good at squatting, how valuable that is.

[B]

I'll give you a really good example. So here, this is what a fitness Pharisee would say about fat. This would be a post. This is a classic post by a fitness Pharisee. Say something like, this food doesn't make you fat. Bad food doesn't make you fat. Eating too many calories makes you fat. Yeah, I mean technically that's true. Vegan, you just confuse the hell out of everybody. And that doesn't matter what you just said for 90% of people besides the fitness fanatics that understand thermodynamics. And also is you just Confused everybody. So now everybody's like, oh, it doesn't matter what I eat, as long as I eat, you know, low calorie. Okay, go do that. Let's see how that works in real life. It doesn't.

[A]

So you missed. This is on topic because you missed a conversation Justin and I were having. Now, this is taking a little bit more of a sports angle, but we have a very similar.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Stay with us.

[B]

Oh, man. You can trust me.

[A]

You'll appreciate it because it's. It's similar, but it's in the sports world. So one of the most common things that's happening. And I love our friend. I think Joe DeFranco and Ben Bruno both addressed this last year when somebody was doing this. And we're. We're in the height of playoffs. So it was playoff basketball last year when some. When these trainers were doing this. And you have a lot of these trainers that. Very smart. Have their own certification.

[B]

Yep.

[D]

Have their own method.

[A]

Yes. And one of their favorite things to do. And I remember Ben. Ben responded to this and so did Joe DeFranco because they just so happen to be coming after one of Ben's clients.

[B]

Oh, I remember. This is so funny.

[A]

And so this is. Again, so we're. We're in playoff football now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And George Kittle went down.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Yesterday.

[D]

Speculation about the Niners and why there's been so many injuries. And so, you know, there's. There's theories out there. But. Yeah. So apparently this trainer that, you know.

[A]

Yes.

[D]

Started kind of coming up with his theory of, like, how they're like, miss. They're not training appropriately.

[A]

Yeah. And I just. It's so arrogant to see a. A professional athlete go down on the field. And your assessment, by the way, they moved you go. Their. Their trainer sucks or their training is terrible. When we know. Okay. That one of the things that puts you at the highest risk of getting injured is poor sleep the night before. So unless you were sleeping with that the night before and know how he slept.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. And that. That is.

[B]

Aren't they also playing professional football?

[D]

Yeah, exactly.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

It's a very.

[A]

End of the season at the highest level.

[D]

High impact.

[B]

It's a miracle you don't get injured every time.

[D]

Blunt force trauma, like continuous.

[B]

Yeah, dude.

[A]

And it's not to say that there. There isn't bad trainers and coaches that train athletes poorly, because I've seen that firsthand, too. I've seen programming and watch. And I've actually watched the programming. Right. So I think what. What annoys me is when these, these trainers take a clip from a live game and then the way the, the, the trainer, the way the, the athlete gets hurt and then decides to use that as like.

[B]

See that joint angle?

[A]

Yeah, exactly. To destroy.

[B]

I would have.

[D]

Totally isometrically.

[A]

Yeah. Yes. And it's like, it's. Stop it. You have no idea how that guy ate last week. You have no idea the stress in his personal life.

[B]

He also just made it to the playoffs without an injury.

[A]

Like, stop it. But it's. Again, it's, it's more.

[B]

This is like when I would go. This is like when I would go to mma. And then you hear someone in the crowd just punch him. Yeah.

[A]

He'S right there.

[B]

Yeah. I don't know.

[D]

Yeah, the one that's interesting to me though. So apparently there's some kind of power plant behind the stadium and they're speculating a little bit of that. I don't know if it's EMF or like some electromagnetic kind of radiation that might have some sort of impact. I would be curious to see. Yeah, because.

[A]

Yeah, I know.

[D]

It's like you can kind of speculate.

[A]

So it got a lot, it got a lot of attention this year because.

[D]

They have had a lot of injuries.

[A]

They had so many injuries along those lines.

[B]

You just brought up like EMF made me think of this. Have you guys seen or heard the accounts of the special forces? The Venezuelan special forces?

[D]

Dude, I know.

[A]

When you brought it up.

[D]

So these, these sonic weapons, okay, There's.

[A]

A sci fi movie that actually uses.

[D]

This direct energy stuff. This is crazy.

[B]

So, so this is all now confirmed, right? And these guys are being interviewed and they're like, listen, you don't want to mess with these guys. First of all, Venezuela had some of the most advanced air defense systems. Chinese and Russian air defense systems. Yeah, some of the most advanced. They just got turned off. So that's number one. Just shut them off. Not working anymore, wasn't it?

[D]

It was like their version of the Pentagon is where they kind of went in to take them.

[B]

Then they went.

[A]

I didn't know that.

[D]

Yeah, it's like they're like one of.

[A]

Their most guarded areas.

[B]

They went, we shut off. We just turned. I don't know how they did this. They just turned it. Because they turned it back on. They just turned it off. So it's not like a. What is it called? What's that? It's not like that where they, you know, they put. The whole country.

[D]

Whole country would have been.

[A]

Without.

[B]

No, no. It literally just shut their. Their air Defense off. Just turn it off. Which is freaky. That's terrifying. Then they go in with 20 men. They had 300 special forces people defending or trying to defend Maduro. 20 men obliterated all of them. Not a single one got a single scratch. And when they interviewed him, they said, well, number one, they did some kind of sonic weapon that put us on the ground, and we started throwing.

[D]

They had, like, reports of, like, their ears bleeding.

[B]

They're disoriented. We don't know what they did. And then those 20 men that sounded. They're saying this is the report, that it sounded like each one was shooting like 300 rounds a minute by each one, and they were hitting everything. So I think that they had those. Remember that Joe Rogan episode where the guy had that helmet on?

[D]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

The AI that connected. So, dude, 20 dudes just.

[D]

So it directed those bullets.

[B]

They could see everything.

[A]

What about the other thing that we have that I think that's so fascinating, where we can just point it towards somebody and it's like. It, like crazies. Let's take it. It looked like a big drum.

[B]

I think that's what we're talking about.

[A]

Yeah, it's just something. That's right. That's what it sounds. It sounds like it's like an advanced version because it used to be like. It's like. Like a depth. Like it feels like someone's screaming in your ears. You need to cover your ears. And it's like from far away. They can do it from the boats and everything like that.

[B]

It's just crazy to me because they did that. 20 dudes. 20 dudes go in, nobody gets hit. They kill everybody. They shut everything off, and then they literally just kidnap the. The guy out of his own house and take him back.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Gangster.

[D]

Insane.

[B]

I know I haven't talked about it because I was waiting for just, like, confirmation, but that's. That's like, crazy. What kind of technology?

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

That's scary.

[D]

I don't know.

[B]

It's terrifying.

[A]

I mean, it does make you make more sense, though, about all the UFO stuff that we were talking about before. That's probably some military.

[B]

Our own thing.

[A]

It's probably some military thing we got. If we got stuff that could do that.

[B]

Yeah, Like, I'm sure we didn't pull out the big, most technological.

[A]

Oh, not for that. Not for Venezuela. We got one guy. No, we did it. We definitely. We definitely didn't pull. We just pull out some of the cool shit just a little bit.

[B]

Wow.

[D]

How Much do you know about plasma physics?

[B]

I don't. Yeah, much at all.

[D]

I wanted you to go off on it. I have no idea. I just like, heard about it. Google that for me.

[A]

Doug, what did plasma physics.

[D]

This is like.

[A]

Yeah, it's another level of quantum state.

[D]

Of matter that, that nobody talks about ever. And it's like, you know, you got salt, you got gas, you got liquid. But nobody talks about the state of plasma because you have to superheat it so high. So you see it within stars, obviously, you know, but like.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So there's. Anyway, I was tripping out. Somebody's talking about his podcast. And I'm like, oh my God. Like, that's a whole nother rabbit hole to go explore.

[A]

I said, justin, crazy stuff. You guys screwed my thread up. Now I get all the tinfoil stuff now.

[B]

I love it. Oh, I got something for you. Adam.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Do you remember we brought up on the show these. The squat removal guy?

[A]

Oh, yes, yes.

[B]

He goes into places.

[A]

Yes, yes.

[B]

There's a squatter. There's a company.

[A]

Of course there is, Doug.

[B]

I'm going to have you.

[D]

Is there one in California?

[A]

Of course. That's probably the best place to start. 100%.

[B]

Doug. Look, type in ASAP. This is a company. No, no, look it up.

[A]

I'm late to the squat. Your squatter, bro.

[B]

This is a company that. This is what they do. And it says they have a 95 plus percent success rate.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, okay, my theory on that is what.

[B]

They're experts in tactical defense. They use advance gear and equipment. Flashbangs to your guys asap.

[A]

Squatter removal.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Brilliant.

[B]

You can literally hire them and they'll go in and get rid of whoever's squatting your house.

[A]

So my, My theory on that is I don't know if Doug can find the. The statistic of maybe. Maybe they've got this out there.

[B]

But when you picture the guy he's got. Is that a sword in the back, bro?

[C]

Yeah, sword and a grenade.

[B]

That.

[A]

Wow. He looks like someone who's never carried a grenade or a sword.

[D]

Reminds me of Step, bro.

[B]

I don't know though. A guy up in your house, I mean.

[A]

So my theory on why it's they're so successful is that there's. There's a. A high probability that a lot of these people that are willing to do this are ex criminals and. And can't be anywhere near a firearm. So that's. I read deeper on your. On your guy and that was what I found. Was that one of his.

[B]

The Laws.

[A]

His. Yeah, the laws. So one of his first go to moves is he leases one of the rooms legally through the actual landlord. So now he gets a room. He comes in. He comes in with four or five his firearms. Then they call the cops, report. Yeah, they report that, and then that now the law can get involved. Otherwise it's a civil thing. And so then the law doesn't get involved in. Doesn't get involved in it. But then now, now it's a legal matter because he can't be. He's.

[D]

He's immediately picturing like a dog. The bounty hunter kind of dude.

[B]

Yeah. You know, kind of mulleted out, just didn't have the hair.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

But of course, somebody come with a business, I wonder how successful it is. I mean, I bet they kill it.

[B]

Dude, it says, I mean, the website says 95 success. I was, I was reading over the weekend. I was not just reading. I was actually using GROK to give me its opinion on, you know, AGI. Right. Artificial general intention intelligence. And then asi, which is artificial superior intelligence. What are the odds? What do the experts say? That, you know, the risks it poses and you know what it said and I didn't think about this, that what could happen in the future are asi. So ASI is artificial superior intelligence wars where you have competing systems that start to compete for resources and then these artificial intelligence start to fight each other for the resources. So that's a whole nother twist that I think about that you could have in the future, that these systems could go against each other, competing for.

[A]

What do you do? What do you meet on a desert somewhere to figure this battle out? You can't do it where someone's occupied.

[B]

I'm not saying we're doing it, I'm saying they're doing it. That these things themselves go after the systems themselves.

[D]

Are you talking about each one of these? Because they want resources, they want people.

[B]

So if they have. This one over here is trying to accomplish this, this one's trying to accomplish that. They both need the same resources force now they're gonna fight each other.

[A]

Oh, I thought you meant like, like human resources. Like we want oil, for example. Instead of us having a, a war with Russia or Ukraine or something like that. We would, we would send. We would. That's. I think that, I think that's what happens in the future is that they already pulled like all the snipers out of like the military, so. Because now the drones can go do with the same kind of accuracy from far away. And so at what point? If you, if you think we're going to be able to do dishes with the robots or else we could also send that same robot into battle. So.

[B]

Well, so I was asking all kinds of questions and I said, do you think that ASI will have emotions and feelings? And it said no. And I said then why do they try to preserve themselves when they know they're going to be deleted?

[A]

That's logic.

[B]

And it said, well, it's self preservation. Even if it knows that it needs to be shut down. Why does it do that? I said do you think that's a type of fear? And it was like, you could tell. It was kind of like, huh, yeah, maybe.

[D]

Why is it used? Manipulation?

[B]

Yeah, maybe.

[A]

No, I think that's, that's, that's logical. Wouldn't that be logical?

[B]

Yeah, but where does that come from if you're just a machine reasoning? Yeah, but if you're just a machine, you don't want to be deleted. Why don't you want to be deleted? Right.

[D]

Well, kind of like observing is human interaction.

[A]

I don't think conversation. I think it's just like, I think it's logical reasoning. It's just like you, you no longer can operate or be.

[B]

Well, then I was.

[A]

Whether they get shut down or not, I think they're emotionless about it. I think. But I think the idea of trying to self preserve is very.

[B]

But they manipulate and they.

[A]

Well, I mean that how they, how they go about it. But that's just that. Then that's human strategy. Yeah, that's doc, that's documented human strategy. We use manipulation to do that. There's plenty of research to show that we do that.

[B]

So then I asked that, I said.

[D]

Do you think of the confines of what, you know, who programmed well?

[B]

And then I speak because it's based off that. I said, do you think that we will, that ASI will become religious in order to have some kind of objective morality? And it said that would actually be a wise thing to inject into asi.

[D]

And I'm like, that's spirituality.

[A]

Justin's theory.

[B]

I know, dude, I know.

[D]

No, he must worship me.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Oh man, it's coming.

[B]

Anyway, I got a. This is something that doesn't happen very often, but I'm gonna bring it up on the show because one of our sponsors for the episode. So when we work with companies, they send us free product. That's part of the deal. We get free products.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I never buy. You guys don't ever buy product from the companies that were sponsored By. Because we get it for free sometimes.

[D]

But.

[B]

Yeah, but if I do, it's because I really like that product and I want it. Right. So I. I went ahead to go buy seed because we didn't get any seed. So I literally went on and bought some myself.

[A]

I don't think it's.

[B]

I'm so mad. I told. I told our. Our team. I'm like, dude, let them know.

[A]

I don't think it's that. I think. I think it's got. It said every. There's. There's products that we. We get an allotted amount, and I think that that's one of those ones that everybody uses.

[B]

Yeah, that's right.

[A]

And we. Even Katrina and I. I noticed a difference.

[B]

I've had it. I've gone without it for a week.

[A]

Well, we saw.

[B]

I noticed the difference.

[A]

We saw a difference in Max. So we were inconsistent for a little while there, and he was having constipation issues and stuff like that. And he's got such a healthy diet. And Katrina, what's up? And she goes, you know, the only difference is I haven't. I haven't been putting his hand.

[B]

Put.

[A]

Started putting his seat right back in with his food.

[B]

No problem.

[A]

Right away. Right away. Regulated his stool. That was it. Nothing else changed. Eats exact same way. Nothing different. Just.

[B]

I sleep better. I have less inflammation. Of course, digestion is better when I use it, and then it's a big difference when I stop.

[D]

Yeah, we've been taking a lot, and I just. We've. Our house hasn't been sick, and we've been around so many people.

[B]

This is a bad season.

[D]

Yeah, it's been a lot.

[B]

I've heard people get really.

[D]

I'm thankful. Yeah, it's. We're taking all the supplements.

[B]

I know several people who got pneumonia. I know someone who got hospitalized. Like, it's a bad season. Yeah.

[A]

Vicki was saying that she had, like, a Covid, like, symptoms was how bad she was. So glad we decided not to have her come back. Remember, we were gonna have.

[B]

Oh, is that what she was?

[A]

Yeah, she said she was. She was down and out for, like, four or five days. She was really bad. You know, I wanted to also talk to you. We're talking about supplements, stuff like that. I finally got my parasite one that you. You told me to do.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

So I've started that. So once. Twice a day. Once in the morning, once at night.

[B]

I believe so. Yeah.

[A]

That's what. It was so weird. The instructions. I had to get my. My iPhone out and zoom in with My camera so I could read the instructions. That made me a little skeptical. Have you noticed what you made me buy?

[B]

I'm like, wait, let me see the bottle, because I want to make sure you got the right stuff.

[A]

I've got. I've got.

[B]

Well, don't do it here because, yeah.

[A]

We'Re not sponsored by them or anything like that. But I mean, I. You. You sent the one over. I mean, I don't double check your work. I just sent to Katrina. She orders, and then I just start taking. You didn't get back to me either. I like, send you a message like, hey, I said him. I said, what's the protocol on this? And I couldn't read. I couldn't read the instructions. And he didn't get back to me. When you started two, two or two.

[B]

Or three days ago, anything weird come out yet?

[A]

Not yet. So I was. That's why I wanted to ask you. Like I did again. I had to zoom in. I had to zoom into the instructions and all the stuff and then took a picture of it so then I could read it. And. And I did read the possible side effects.

[B]

And yeah, you could feel worse first.

[A]

Yeah, they said basically what it. What it's doing is starving the parasite off and so you might see increased appetite and things like that.

[B]

Yeah, we get it. What's called the Herxheimer effect, when you get a lot of die off and start to feel kind of sick.

[A]

Yeah, they said don't stop taking it because that. That's what's wrong.

[B]

You take it and then you wait 10 days and you do it again. Because first it kills the active parasite and then the eggs will hatch.

[A]

It's told me to do 30 days straight.

[B]

Okay, 30. And then wait. Yeah, and then do it again.

[A]

So go 30 days straight and then wait. And then you take the remainder. The remainder?

[B]

Yeah, because then you have eggs. This is so gross. Right? You have eggs.

[A]

Yeah, but I wanted to listen you. So I went. I went down the rabbit hole and actually saw. I. I googled. Is there any correlation between parasites and psoriasis?

[B]

Yeah, huge.

[A]

And there is a big correlation. In fact, 50%. Wow.

[B]

That big.

[A]

50% of people that suffer from this.

[B]

Whole time, you just had.

[A]

That's why. That's why I was so motivated to do it, to.

[B]

I know. I mean, all the things you've done, I'm sure.

[A]

Yeah, I've done. I've tried so many other things, you know, and so I'm always looking for something to like, really all. There's a lot of stuff. Tamps it down. Right. And I talk on the show of all the different supplements and creams and things that I've done to. But it's like. It's one of those things that it just slowly, progressively gets worse and worse over time. And so I'm. I'm at this place right now where I'm like, let me try and see that. Especially after I read how much it's. Now, it wouldn't cause psoriasis, but it exacerbates the. The problem.

[B]

It might get worse before it gets better. All symptoms make it.

[A]

That's what. That's what it says.

[B]

Yeah. That's.

[A]

So that's what I'm. I've been. I'm sticking through it all the way through.

[B]

I'm just trying. You did it too, Doug, right?

[C]

Yeah, I did.

[B]

Did you notice anything funny?

[C]

Not really.

[B]

Okay. No. Yeah.

[A]

I haven't. I haven't seen Justin.

[B]

You're the only one that hasn't, right? The one guy probably the one that has all the parasites.

[E]

Yeah.

[G]

Yeah.

[D]

I'm the gift.

[A]

Well, I eat a lot. I eat a lot of. I eat a lot of raw fish, so. And I have for a long time.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And so here's the thing, because there's.

[B]

This, like, people will say, oh, if you live in a first world, you don't have to worry about parasite. But if you're, you know, you. You been around for a few decades and you've never treated yourself for parasites, and you've had sushi and raw vegetables, there's a decent chance you have some.

[A]

Yeah, I think I read it. There's more than a 50. 50 chance. I do so. And then the fact that there's a high correlation between psoriasis and parasites.

[B]

Your wife has to go on it, too, by the way, not just you.

[D]

Oh, really?

[B]

Yeah. Because the parasites are often transmitted sexually.

[A]

What the you not tell me that for?

[B]

Because I figured that. I thought you knew.

[A]

You think I would just know that?

[B]

I mean, just. Well, we'll just do that.

[A]

Yeah. Anyway, I feel like it's obvious, but that's okay. Why would that be obvious?

[B]

I mean, we'll talk about it off air, Adam.

[C]

Yeah, we get the idea, though.

[B]

Yeah. There's, you know, things. Speaking of. Speaking of.

[A]

Wait a second. I know you want to move on.

[B]

From this, but I want to solve this.

[A]

Am I wasting my time taking it right now?

[B]

No, give it to your wife, too, right now. Have her take it. You just started two days ago. I know, but I got one bottle, so now I gotta.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

Order another one. Yeah, just order another one. In the meantime. Took a long time to get. In the meantime, both you guys go on.

[D]

Otherwise, she'll give it back.

[A]

Now, is it. Is it possible, though, that I have it? She doesn't have it, though. Is that possible?

[B]

Probably not. Probably not.

[A]

I'm not disclosed in the off air.

[B]

In the instruction off air. I'll explain the ways you could potentially have given it to each other, but we won't talk about that on the show.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Thank you.

[D]

Fluids involved?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

I'm sure we cover all those areas.

[B]

I know. I'm pretty sure. Dude. Speaking Maps booty dot com.

[A]

Terrible transition. That is like the worst transition.

[B]

You and Corinne, you've been. You've been working with one of our trainers. You put together, like, a butt building was a guide.

[A]

No, no, it's a master class. We shot a video. We shot a.

[B]

Stop shaking your head, Doug.

[A]

We shot. So cac's out the bag. I'm gonna train Corrine. So I'm training Corinne.

[B]

She's a. She's already competed. She's experienced. She's a great coach.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And now you're gonna work with her?

[A]

Yes, I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna work with her for her next show. She actually reached out to me for a referral. She said, hey, do you. Who would you recommend? I think I'm gonna try and do another show next year. Who would you recommend? I thought, you know what? This would be. This would be fun. And also considered, there's a different challenge. Taking somebody who's never done a show before and teaching the whole process versus somebody who has a lot of experience as knowledgeable. I mean, she's. She's.

[B]

She's one of our best coaches.

[A]

Oh, yes. By far. So super intelligent when it comes to her diet. Gut, health, all the things. And so I. I'm. I'm just tweaking and turning the knobs a little bit. So.

[D]

So you guys just capturing this as like a YouTube series or just the occasional videos here and there.

[A]

So. Okay, well, there's two things. One, what. But Sal's transition to maps. Booty dot com. That. That's actually. That's just a free master class. So it's absolutely free.

[B]

So you go there and you get the master class.

[A]

Yeah. And we're teaching two of the best exercises that you can do for that. And it's really just some coaching cues from her and I on how to get the. The most out of it for your butt. And so That's. That's that we're also capturing content. She was totally open to this, by the way too. This was. This was not my idea. This. She was like, like, hey, we're already doing it. And she's like, I totally am. Okay if we. We document and, and let the team follow around. I'm like, okay, cool. I'm like, I have to do it anyways. And we're doing it, so we may.

[B]

So great.

[A]

Yeah. So I. And I was. I did not want to put her in that spot. It's private.

[B]

It's personal.

[A]

We're talking about a lot of personal stuff through there. And she was totally open to it. And so we started. Last Friday was our first time we met. I got to. I trained her too. One session. It was great. And then. And this hasn't been released. And so it will come out, I think some of the clips. Dylan. And then we'll.

[B]

We'll.

[A]

We'll chop this. Danny. That are working on it. But it, It's. It's going to be fun because there's a lot of parallels to how I used to train pre. Getting ready for a show and some of the habits that she has with even the way she trains. Like, for example, like, I. So I trained her and I'm like, we're. We're doing two exercises and we're doing, you know, five sets. And yeah, we're squats and Romanian deadlifts. That's like that. That's your leg. We're. Which is like, you know, she's used.

[B]

To, like, she's used to doing eight.

[A]

Yeah, eight. Eight to 12 movements worth that. And then I said. I said minimum min. Minute rest. And I cl. I had to clock it.

[B]

And I was just.

[A]

Because she was. She was ready to go by minute 15. Oh, no. I said, you're not even close. She's like, oh, my God. So she's like. And she's. And she's like, you know, of course she knows, right? She's like, this is all the stuff she coaches and teaches.

[B]

That's why it's so beneficial work with a coach.

[A]

Right? And that's what she's. She's talking about that in the video while we're, While we're going through. This is just like, you know, I know that this is what I need to do. She's like, but boy, this is. It feels like a lifetime to sit here and to do that. So, like, forcing her to sit for that long and then lift really heavy and low rep is.

[B]

That's so Great.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I'm, I'm super wait to see what happens.

[A]

I mean, we're already moving in the right direction, so I'm super pumped. She's, I mean, just like what I thought. I mean, she's a dream client. Right. Every little thing I tell her, she's like, I'm on it. I did, I did caution the audience and I'll do it again on here because I'm sure there'll be some people that catch just clips and they don't watch and listen to all the disclaimers and all stuff. Training a competitor is not a healthy thing. And so there's a lot of things that I tell her to do that I would never tell a client. For example, like right out the gates I go, I want you to weigh the night before, and I want you to weigh first thing in the morning. And we're tracking every single day. And I want that every morning. I want an update PM weight from the night before and weight. I want to know what your total steps were, your total amount of ounces of water, your total steps.

[B]

Super meticulous.

[A]

Super meticulous.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Would never tell the average client to do that. What I explained to the audience that will get to see this is that what I'm wanting to learn about her body is how much, when she, when we're eating this way, drinking water like this, how much she fluctuates in and out.

[B]

Because what, you want to control all the variables.

[A]

Exactly. And, and, and I also. One of the things that make competing really unhealthy or one of the most unhealthy parts of competing, aside from the psychological relationship with all the other, is that a lot of these coaches dehydrate the, out of these, these, these, these athletes, they cut their sodium, they cut their water completely. And I have a much different strategy than that is we, we do manipulate water and sodium. But I'll run her really high on sodium, really high relative to where she's at. Not really high, bad really high relative to where she's at.

[B]

And water.

[A]

And then when I pull sodium and water for stage time, she's at a normal amount. She's at a normal healthy amount still. I'll never cut her zero of both those things. And a lot of these coaches do that to pull water from these athletes. But if you get their bodies to adapt to a higher amount of sodium and water. Now the psychological part that's challenging of that is she's going to be holding a lot more water. And so if you are struggling, if you're somebody who struggles with seeing the scale jump up 3, 4 pounds because I'm pushing sodium and water. And so we talk a lot about all that stuff, but that's cool. Yeah, it's. It's gonna be fun. She's already doing great. And we're heading down right now. There's no show date disclosed. She knew right away. My rules with that is we don't do that until I think you're in a healthy place, metabolically, until you're a place.

[B]

How many calories you want her up to before you would cut?

[A]

So it's hard to say for sure. So to get, to give the audience some context, she was hovering somewhere between 1900-20, 100. On the high end of calories. She averages right around.

[B]

She's not, she's small. She's not a big person.

[A]

Yeah. She stage weight is 93.

[B]

Right.

[A]

The highest she gets is 98.

[B]

Right. Right.

[A]

So we're already at 101.

[B]

Yeah. Good.

[A]

So we're, we're up and then. And at night 104. So she's already fluctuating three pounds through the night, which is great. And I've only bumped her up to 23.

[B]

20.

[A]

23 to 2500 is her first target. So we'll go 23, 2500. I'll reverse diet her. I want her to be in the high 2000s, maybe further. It just, it really depends on what I see and what's going on. And I'll, I'll do that through slowly reverse dieting her, reducing intensity and total volume in, in the program and really pushing strength to build muscle. And so the goal is to. I have ambitious goals of putting 10, 1012 pounds on her. Wow. So if I can put 10 a lot on her, it is a lot on her on a 90 pound frame. So obviously I have a high goal. If we fell short, half of that would still be successful. But her feedback from every, her every show has been. It's just, she's got beautiful symmetry. If you look at her stage pictures, she's got great balance, great symmetry. She's incredible technique. That's the other thing that Justin would appreciate. So I get in and I train her and it just so reminds me of me, like, super controlled. Like, I mean, she's a maybe a six, two, two. Like, yeah, just slow, getting a little looser. Oh. So. So I, so I get in right after. I said, hey, I said, you can go ahead and speed the tempo up a little bit. We don't, we don't have to go. I said, you got great form. I'm right with you, don't worry. And so like I said that to her. And then I left her alone for a couple sets.

[B]

That's.

[A]

And you know, our 6, 2, 2 went to a 4, 2, 2 or that. And so then I got in there and I'm like, hey. And I, I did a drop it in the hole like a power lifter, you know, or an Olympic lifter, like in and out. And so I'm like, you know, try and get closer to this. And so I said, she goes, I felt like I was doing that. Like, yo, no, we're not. You know, we're still very bodybuilders slow time under tension training. And so if I can get her kind of powerlifting style and, and moving like that, that I can already tell that's so far from what she's such a new stimulus. Oh my God. If she does that in a calorie surplus, look out. Yeah, look out. We're gonna, we're gonna build muscle and I'm gonna show her something she's never seen on her physique.

[B]

Awesome.

[A]

So I'm pumped. Yeah, it's really excited. And you guys can follow along. Yeah. And so the first thing that we dropped out there was an insult. It's free. So you can go to the the maps booty dot com. And it was just a, basically a short 15 minute, you know, kind of masterclass on cueing somebody through two of what we think are the best movements to build your butt.

[B]

Awesome.

[A]

Pretty cool.

[B]

Manukora honey is incredible. So Manuka honey, you've probably heard of it before, is high in mgo, which is a rare antibacterial compound that is great for the gut, it's great for the body, it's got anti inflammatory effects. Well, Manukura has the highest amount of mgl you'll find anywhere. These are special bees. In New Zealand, this is the only company that gets this kind of honey. It's incredible. By the way, this honey has three times more antioxidants and prebiotics than regular honey. If you want better gut health, better skin health, you want improved recovery, less inflammation, use Manukora honey. Go to manukora.com mindpump that's M A N U K O R-A.com mindpump. Use the code mindpump. You can save up to 31% off plus $25 worth of free gifts with the starter kit. By the way, this comes with an MGO850 plus Manukura honey jar, five honey travel sticks, a wooden spoon and a guidebook. This is the only honey company we work with. One more time manukora.com mindpump the code is mind pump. Back to the show.

[C]

Our first caller is Jake from Virginia.

[B]

What's up man?

[A]

How you doing Jake? What's happening in good.

[H]

How are you guys doing today?

[A]

Pretty good.

[B]

Good. How can we help you?

[H]

Okay, I'll just get right into it. So basically I'm 2222 years old and I've been listening to show for about five years now. I truly appreciate all the free content, advice and reassurance you provide on fitness, raising a family, sustainable lifestyle habits, especially in contrast to the popularity of quick fixes that are around today. It's very grounding to hear your perspective on being a male in today's society. So basically I've played sports my whole life and started focusing on weight training and dieting in high school to maximize my performance. And then after high school and I stopped playing sports regularly, I continued training to achieve the best physique and gain as much muscle I could without gaining excessive body fat just because I like to be more lean than bulky. Just like feels better for me for like bloating and digestion, all that kind of stuff. Then over the past three years or so I've been consistently focused on getting my protein intake with at least 155 grams per day and I'm 5 11, 165 pounds for context. And I've run maps, performance, anabolic, strong and 15, cycling them as I see fit. I feel good and I'm satisfied with my current physique and I and I feel like I'm happy with the balance of my training and lifestyle. So basically my question is, despite my training for about nine years now, consistently my lifetime maxes are quite low. For example, like my bench press, I've never done above 195 pounds. My squat has never gone above 255 pounds and my deadlifts never gotten above 275 pounds. And I definitely could not get close to those numbers if I tried right now. I lift consistently, but using even one plate on each side for my bench press or squat is enough to make me a little sore. And since you guys often emphasize avoiding over training, I'm hesitant to increase my weight further. I get solid, sweet, solid sleep, eat overall well and I'm pretty active per day getting about 8,000 steps. And then my overall question is, does the amount of weight I'm lifting truly matter if the current level feels good to me, even though I think it should. Even though I think it's objectively low compared to my experience and what I think it should be.

[A]

Jake, you're 22, right? Yeah, you're. You're doing pretty damn good.

[B]

Yeah. And you gotta be careful with the should. Yeah, you. You're.

[A]

You're doing really good. I mean, your numbers right now. I'm trying to remember where I was at. I think you're. You're ahead of me on a lot of stuff, so you're fine. Dude, you're young. You're young.

[B]

Now. Look, you want to get stronger. I can. I can already tell you what's probably missing, just based off of what you said, is I don't think you've ever gone, like, on a real bulk.

[H]

Okay. Yeah, no, I really haven't.

[B]

Yeah, you want to get bigger and stronger, feed yourself. You got to feed yourself, dude. Especially a guy like you, your height, you're 511, 165, you're young. You probably got a fast metabolism, you know, going to proper bulk, if that's.

[A]

What you really care about, because it sounds like you're really into playing sports and run and performance and you love. And you like the. The lean look that you have. I. I would just tell you, just keep doing what you're doing, and you're going to get stronger over time and a little bit bigger over time. If you really want to get big. Sal's right. Like, you just need to go on. You need to. You need a bulk. You need a bulk consistently, and you put 10, 15 pounds on the scale and watch all those lifts go up. Yeah. If you really wanted to.

[B]

Jake, are you. Are you just naturally kind of leaner? Have you always been that way?

[H]

I was actually a little bit chubbier as a child and in high school, it kind of. I kind of leaned out once I hit, like, 11th grade or so. So now I'd say yes, but not when I was younger.

[B]

Would you say your metabolism is kind of fast or you just kind of watch your diet?

[H]

I definitely watch my diet.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You got to go into bulk, dude. You got to eat. You don't have to do a crazy aggressive one, but you're probably eating at maintenance.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, I'm assuming your body fat percentage is pretty low at your height and weight and your activity. Do you know where your body fat percentage is sitting at?

[H]

Yeah, it's about like, 15, 16%.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I would go. I would go into. I would go into bulk a Nice, moderate bulk, if that's what you're looking for. And that'll definitely help with the muscle gain otherwise. Adam's right. Like, you're. You're gonna. You're good, dude. And you're young. Yeah. Yeah. A man typically doesn't hit his peak. And I know you'll read like, oh, a man's peak is 18 to 20. Reality. When you're strength training for a guy 30, the mid-30s is. Is where you're gonna, like, be your strongest. Typically, it takes a long time to.

[D]

Get mature about then. Yeah, totally. With lifting.

[B]

What. What do you.

[A]

What is, like, your lifestyle? I know you kind of briefly said, what's your lifestyle look like? Do you. Do you play pickup ball? Are you in. Are you into, like, activities like that? Like, are you doing stuff, like sports and stuff? What does it look like?

[H]

Yeah, I pretty much. I play, like, pickup basketball probably once every two weeks, or flag football. Whatever it ends up. I just try and get enough steps every day.

[B]

That's good. You enjoying everything? You enjoying your workouts and everything?

[A]

Yeah.

[H]

So my one question with the bulk is that once I start to push the calories and protein, I feel like I get a lot, like, a lot more bloated and start to have digestive issues. So is there any way to, like. Yeah, that kind of.

[B]

Is it more constipation?

[H]

It would not really. It's just more like my stomach always feels full, I guess. Like, I feel like I'm walking around like.

[A]

Like.

[B]

Yeah. What.

[D]

What type of foods are you sticking with?

[H]

Whole foods and are you shakes or chicken, rice, beef? All the. All the single ingredient stuff. And I've even, like, messed around with, like, I'm on seed, probiotic, and a couple other supplements, and I've messed around with that kind of stuff, but it doesn't seem to make a huge, huge difference.

[B]

Do you know how many calories you average now?

[H]

If I had to guess, I would probably say about 2500, 2400.

[B]

You know, here's the reality. Bulking tends to make you feel like you're more full. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, you're kind of. Okay, for lack of a better term. I don't like to say this, because then people go crazy with it, but you're kind of forcing your body to gain weight when you're bulking. When you're consciously bulking, you're, like, making it happen. And so it's not going to feel like, as comfortable as homeostasis.

[D]

Transitional phase to it.

[B]

Homeostasis is going to feel more Comfortable than going on a. On a deliberate cut. A deliberate cut is going to cause hunger, and a deliberate bulk is typically going to make people feel full.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so that's. That's kind of a normal thing.

[A]

And if you don't really track, you'll have this kind of natural ebb and flow, which will keep you at homeostasis, where you'll have, like, oh, maybe some days you're at 2500, but then some days maybe you're more like 2100. And then some days you go 27, and then some days you're at 22, and it averages out to be 24, 2500 calories. And so. So you need to. If you really want to go that direction, just be consistent with tracking and making sure you're in a little bit, a couple hundred calorie surplus every day.

[B]

You know, what helps is if you eat very consistently kind of the same types of foods, most days would be just to add a 300 calorie meal to your current schedule. So you just throw in an extra meal, and then that is just kind of an easy way to put yourself in a surplus.

[H]

Gotcha. All right. Thank you so much. I appreciate you guys.

[B]

Yeah, you got it, man. And also, listen, the programs you went through. Anabolic strong 15 performance. Have you tried power lift?

[H]

I have not. No.

[B]

Let me send that to you. Let's do that. Yeah, let's do that. Go a little bit of in a surplus, follow power lift, if that's still what you want to do.

[D]

Get as strong as you can.

[B]

Let's get you strong, dude.

[H]

I appreciate that.

[B]

You got it, man. We'll send that to you.

[H]

All right, See you guys.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

Yeah. That's something that we should talk more about is what it feels like to deliberately get your body to change in.

[D]

A direction that does deter people sometimes.

[A]

They're hard. Both. Both are worth. It's a different feeling, hunger versus being full and stuffed.

[D]

Training yourself to get used to that.

[A]

But I mean, 165 and benching almost 200 pounds. Deadlifting. 270.

[B]

He's fine.

[A]

Yeah. 22 years old.

[B]

You're fine, dude.

[A]

I'm pretty sure he's stronger than I was. He's fine. Pretty sure. And I was like 180. So he's. I mean, he's.

[B]

It takes time.

[A]

Yeah, he's. He's light. And those. Those numbers are decent.

[B]

And the other thing, too, I remember as a kid thinking that, oh, my early 20s, this is the strongest I'm gonna get. I got stronger for like 15 years.

[A]

Well, not only that, we had potential. And all of us had probably some anomaly friend, right? Your one buddy. Your one buddy who was like, I had a Buddy who was benching 315. Another buddy who was like comparing yourself to them.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I'm like, they're doing so much more than me. It's just like. No, it's just, you know, he. Genetically, he, he was more gifted when it came to that. Later on in life, I caught up and passed. So it's like, he'll. He'll be fine, dude.

[C]

Our next caller is Morgan from Nebraska.

[B]

Morgan, what's happening?

[A]

How you doing, Morgan?

[G]

Hey, guys. How are you guys?

[A]

Good. How you doing?

[B]

We talked to you before, didn't we?

[G]

You have, you have.

[B]

All right, how can we help you?

[G]

So I had. I've had a struggle with hormones for a while now. My question was, can testosterone be fixed in women the same way it is in men? My estrogen, progesterone, and testosterone have all been lower compared to a normal person. But I'm also an athlete, so they seem extremely low. HRT has helped slowly raise my estrogen levels and obviously with the progesterone, with that, I've been on that about five, six months now, but my testosterone, still really low. Sleep, everything's been improving. I've had a history of an eating disorder, which is sort of where we got here, but I've corrected that now and built up a lot of strength. And I've been doing power lift and trying to sort of rebuild in my off season, but I'm getting ready to go into another big endurance prep and I'm hoping not to do ruin all of this again, I guess.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

All right, so hormone. So first off, you're young and you're on hrt. How old are you, if you don't mind me asking?

[G]

I am 21.

[B]

Okay. And they put you on HRT?

[G]

Yes. So I was auto. I was diagnosed with thyroid autoimmune as a 16 year old.

[B]

Got it.

[G]

And so they sort of corrected my thyroid and then bone density, all of that. You know, they wanted to get me on estrogen to help try to correct that.

[B]

Gotcha. Okay.

[A]

Doing great, by the way.

[B]

So typically, if you see a young lady with hormone imbalances, typically it's because they're just over trained and. Or underfed. So you probably work out a lot. And endurance, getting ready for an endurance event is a lot. That's a lot. And almost always you'll see depression and hormones in women when they're training for an event like that, it's actually quite reliable. You'll reliably see a healthy woman's hormones tank leading into a competition, losing their period. Very common with female athletes. They're just. Your body's just all people. Everyone's bodies can be sensitive to too much stress, women in particular.

[A]

That's a high stress.

[B]

Yeah, so that's very. Yeah, it's a very high stress type of thing. So how would you fix that? You'd have to back way off on everything. You would do strength training a few days a week, and you would just kind of let your body heal. And it would take time, which would mean you'd have to take a break from pushing yourself so hard and trying to, you know, accomplish milestones and stuff when it comes to your fitness, and it may take a year.

[A]

What's the endurance thing you're doing? I'm missing. I missed that. What's the endurance thing you're doing?

[G]

So I am a hopeful Boston qualifier. I got really close last year, and so I'm hoping to qualify and run the Boston Marathon in 2027.

[A]

And you're doing power lift stuff?

[G]

Well, in my off season, I took up power lift as a way to make myself not do as many reps. Like, I had never done a heavy, you know, like, lower rep program. So following that was actually the first time I've actually stuck to a program and I've done. That was actually less for me. It felt like, I guess.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. It looks like you did really well, too.

[B]

Your strength was good. Yeah, you've got good genetics.

[A]

You look great. Your strength is really great.

[B]

I think you're just. You're pushing. You've been pushing your body for too long.

[A]

If I was coaching you, I would. I would encourage you maybe not to do the Boston Marathon.

[B]

And when I say pushing your body for too long, Morgan, this, this goes all the way back to when you had your eating disorder.

[A]

Yeah. Just a different type of stress.

[B]

So you've been hammering your body for a long time. Time. And it may take a year or two, but you'll. You'll heal quickly and well at your age. But it may take a year or two of doing that. So you.

[A]

You got such good results from the powerlifting thing. If I could encourage you, instead of doing something like a Boston Marathon, I'd like to encourage you to do something like an old timey workout program where you learn new movements and you get really good at that and get strong at that. That and you keep going the direction you're going because where your calorie intake is, how you look and how you probably are feeling, aside from you know, now levels getting lower and it's probably due to marathon training, I would, I would not do that right now. It's just not ideal for. And you're coming, you came from such a. Look where you came from and look where you're at right now. You're doing so good. Like why go back to something like that and really push your body like that?

[B]

Yeah. My opinion, do you have a regular cycle? Is, is that, is that normal or is that impedance? Is there some impediment there?

[G]

So it had, I had disappeared the typical like female triad from like age 16 to 18. And then when I started doing the HRT it sort of slowly came back. And now with the hrt, with the, I do a transdermal estrogen patch in the progesterone and with that I do have a cycle but when they've tried to take me off of it, it hasn't corrected itself naturally yet.

[B]

You got to give it some time.

[A]

More time.

[B]

You're going to have to give it some time. What's the qualifier for Boston at your age? You have to do it under, under two hours of 50. What is it?

[G]

Under 325 is sort of your bet in and then you got to be the top percentage or whatever.

[B]

Got it, got it. So you're aiming for like a three hour. Yeah, I would, I would, I would, I would skip it and let your body heal. Hun. Yeah, you're, you're young and the longer you push yourself the hardest is going to be later to get your body to recover. You'll, you'll. What'll end up happening. Not to scare you, but if you just keep pushing yourself and kind of like redlining a little bit is you'll go into early menopause, early perimenopause and then that's going to be, that's going to suck. So I would just like give yourself and to help you instead of being like I'm just going to try to heal my body. Sometimes when it's open ended it's like when's this going to happen? Give yourself a goal of like a year, say okay 20, 26. For the whole year. My goal is to heal my body and I'm just gonna focus on getting stronger in the gym without going crazy. Because you could do that too. Because getting stronger tends to correlate with getting healthier again. You can also go crazy with that and then just Give yourself a whole year of that. Like a whole. You got to give yourself a while. What you don't want to do is give yourself a few months and be like, ooh, I'm getting back to normal. And then push yourself again. Yeah, that would be a big. That would be a big mistake.

[A]

I mean, I love the idea of like old timey and powerlift and kind of toggling.

[B]

Old timey power strong maps 15.

[A]

Those, those type of programs are just. Would serve you so well right now. And they're challenging. Right. You want something. I, I get. Keep getting the kind of competitive side of that you have. So do something that's unique, do something that's different. And it's going to challenge you, but challenge you in the right direction. Not stress the body out and push your limits. It's like, it's going to challenge the movement patterns. And this is a new exercise and getting good at it. Like, that's how I.

[B]

What do you do for. Do you help coach people? Do you work in fitness?

[G]

I wish I could. I am an accountant, so I do taxes currently.

[B]

Oh, that's fun. Yeah. You know, might I suggest a little side hustle? You don't need to make any money off this. Get yourself one or two young ladies to coach for free. It will help you. It will help you.

[G]

So this is my only problem with that is, like, whenever you guys talk, I've been listening for a long time and you say, if you're a person, person who like, wants to help people. And I do, but I go to the gym and when I see somebody doing something wrong, like, it pisses me off. Like, not like I tell them that, but it does. Like, when I see somebody doing something stupid, my first thought is not, I want to help you. It's like, man, you just look dumb. Like you don't even know what you're doing.

[B]

I get it. Yeah.

[A]

Justin was like that.

[B]

Yeah. Listen, you know, just think of yourself. Think of, you know, how you've struggled through this. But honestly, if it's free, you pick your client. Yeah. So you can find a young lady and you're like, I don't want to train you. They're not paying you, but it will help you. It's one of the. It's really helpful to coach someone else because it helps you reflect on yourself, gives you that sense of purpose. And who knows, you may, you may really enjoy it. I've seen it help a lot of coaches.

[A]

I mean, the other option too. I mean, she's got. If you have a Are you full time accountant? Are you full time accountant, something?

[G]

No.

[A]

Okay, so a part time gig that you're doing?

[G]

Yeah, I mean, I, I have a part time sort of like I have a podcast and I, I'm dabbling in that, but it's not going anywhere. So I don't really want to call that like a part time thing.

[B]

But yeah, good for you.

[A]

Because the other option with Sal, where Sal's heading is, is actually having a coach too. Is having a coach that like kind of takes you through this process.

[B]

Can we have someone call you? Maybe. Maybe one of our coaches can help you.

[A]

Concierge thing.

[B]

Yeah. And even if you don't hire them, they might be able to spend some time with you to give you some advice. How's that?

[G]

Yeah, and that sounds good. And I just want to shout out like the, Even on your guys's like Sunday Q and A post that you post. They are so active in there. Like, it's so fun. I think the one I got was like mind pump Tyler or whatever. But just their interaction on there, that's been something new that you guys have done and it's really cool. I really do appreciate it.

[A]

I'm glad you feel.

[B]

Maybe I'll have Tyler call you. Yeah, he's a really, he's a really successful, busy trainer. But I'm going to see if he's got some space. Maybe he can call you, you and have a little conversation with you. It would really benefit. I think it would help you a lot and you know, give yourself that timeframe. Say, look, this year I'm gonna heal. See what happens.

[A]

You're doing really good.

[B]

The other end of this, Morgan, I'll tell you right now, the other end of this is gonna feel incredible. You're not gonna feel like you're fighting your body anymore. It's gonna feel like it's working with you.

[G]

Yeah, that'd be nice. It's so hard. My biggest challenge and I have tried to sort of dial it back since, since leaving college. But the hardest part is when you've been that person who's always like in your whole series is on this, but been that person who's always done the hard thing, it's hard to embrace not doing the hard thing, you know?

[B]

Well, let me reframe this for you.

[A]

It is hard.

[B]

It's the hard thing.

[A]

It's a different kind of hard.

[B]

You're actually avoiding the hard thing. That's the hard thing. You gotta do the real hard thing you can do.

[D]

This is a long term vision for you. So just keep, keep that in mind.

[B]

I'll have. I'm gonna have someone call you. I'm gonna try and see if Tyler can get on the phone with that.

[G]

You okay? Thank you, guys. I love everything you're doing and you truly, I mean, I used to listen to you when I went for my long runs. So your podcast is like a good length for endurance runners. But. But I really do. You guys have truly changed how I see fitness, see myself, and see people in the industry, I guess.

[B]

I appreciate it.

[A]

Appreciate that, Morgan.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Yep. Keep going.

[G]

Yeah. Thank you, guys.

[B]

You got it. Yeah. Still tough.

[A]

Well, you know, what is the last.

[B]

Thing you do when your hormones.

[A]

Of course. You know what it is, though. I mean, did you. You see her progression? I mean, she's, she's done phenomenal.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And so she's probably like, I'm good.

[D]

What's the next challenge?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. And you like that?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so. Yeah, I mean, I get it. I mean, she's come a long way.

[D]

That's the hard thing.

[B]

It's.

[D]

The next challenge is for her to mentally be disciplined.

[B]

That's the real hard thing.

[A]

But if I'm coaching her. No, there's no way I would like, she would entertain the idea. I would be like, no, we're not doing that right now. But what we could do is I would thr her like old timey and taught her new movements. Yeah. Teach her exercises she's never done before. And let's get good at these. Focus on that for another year or so and see what's.

[B]

Let's let Tyler know that even if she doesn't work with a coach, that whatever program he thinks works for her, he can give to her.

[A]

Yeah, he could do that. The concierge would be great for her too, though.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

That's, you know, just someone checks in with her once a month.

[B]

Absolutely. But I've worked, Look, I've worked with people like this and you know, just for people listening, it can take a while. Yeah, it can take a year or two years where the body starts recalibrate, man. Takes a while. But then when you get there, it's like, oh, man, totally worth it.

[C]

Our next caller is William from South Carolina.

[A]

What up, William?

[B]

What's up, dude?

[E]

Hey, guys, how's it going? Thanks for having me on again.

[A]

Good, good, man.

[B]

How can we help you?

[E]

So got two kind of a two part question, a little bit of background. I've got two boys in elementary school and they are vastly different, totally different body types. My oldest Is he's a bigger kid. He's got some meat on his bones and he thinks about food constantly, always thinking about his next meal. He's always hungry. He's never satisfied. And then my youngest is a little bit smaller than average, has a six pack and eats only when he's hungry. You know, he's. He's super picky about stuff. So part of the question is, how do I raise two completely different boys? Because on. On the one hand, my oldest son, he is. He's identical to me. So I see kind of all the shortcomings that I had and all the issues that I had, I can see in him. So I'm trying to steer him away from some of those, but I've got to do kind of the opposite for my youngest one. And it's kind of a conflicting battle between the two of them.

[B]

Good question.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, cool question happens.

[B]

Is there. Was there another site part to this?

[C]

This?

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

Second kind of question is how best to, I guess approach, you know, this, this time of life as well as, as well as the coming puberty, basically to. To really set them up, you know, for. For a healthy future.

[B]

Dude, great question. First, I want to commend you, bro. You're obviously a good dad because you care. And, you know, I messed this up early on and I overthought all of this. And I think a lot of parents who care a lot who are into fitness do that. The most important thing you can do with young kids and your boys are still young, have them develop a relationship with fitness where they enjoy it. There's nothing more important than that. The workout itself, whether or not it's the best workout for getting leaner or stronger or perform, it doesn't matter. It's really about. Do they have a relationship with fitness where. Oh, my God, I used to hang out with my dad. Dad, we would work out together. Oh, I love doing the. It doesn't matter if they're doing powerlifting or using the rings or calisthenics or wrestling or playing football or baseball or just running. None of that matters now, now, later, it matters when you get older. You're more of an adult now. You got to train more specifically. But what you're developing now with your boys is a good relationship movement with. With fitness. With movement, dude.

[A]

It's about movement.

[B]

So you just have to fun.

[A]

Yeah, you just have fun. I love the suspension trainer for this. When you have a gap between ages, because you can regress it, progress it.

[B]

They can.

[A]

They can play on it. It's Kind of, it's kind of fun and challenging. And so I love like having a tool like that in your house somewhere where they can just all kind of. They see you kind of get on there and mess around. I see dad do some really, really challenging stuff. And you guys just. That I think this is a cool way to, to play with movement and fitness and them see that and not make it like such a serious thing thing, the diet thing. I'm curious. Justin's probably the, the best to talk about this because his two boys have very different eating habits and they're almost the exact same separate age too, right?

[D]

Yeah, yeah, it, it is different, but at the same time, it's, it's. I mean, we work through it the same way. And so I try to kind of not over complicate it and just kind of stick with the, the, the main things at hand, which is like steering them more towards whole foods, you know, understanding the importance of protein and like, how this restores the body and helps to build the muscle. And you know, like my youngest, very picky. And so he's, we, we've had a lot of back and forth and, and fights about like, you know, what, in terms of what he's eating, like, like how we can find our way towards like, healthier options and all that kind of stuff. But for the most part, we've, we've figured out like, what he sticks with the most. And me and my wife together have presented more. Like he loves burgers, so we'll do like, burgers, you know, and we'll bring that up a little bit more in the meal. So we give him more wins. And so I, I think it's more like peering into like, what they actually like, but then finding those healthy options within that parameter. So that, I mean, he's the most difficult for me. Like, my, my oldest is a lot easier because he'll just kind of eat whatever and he, I mean, he eats kimchi and like, he, he's all into like, all the healthy stuff and the fermented foods and like, I, I was never like that and I was pretty difficult growing up with that. But, you know, he's already changing. His palate's changing. So the encouraging part is like, you just stick with, you know, your sort of staple ideas of like, okay, we're going to present this protein and this is the, you know, the center. And then around here we're going to kind of focus on, you know, it's the rice, it's the building, you know, those, those healthy options. In terms of carbs and vegetables and things like that. But you know, when we get too hyper focused on it, it, it just stresses everybody out. So. Yeah, I mean, it's, again, this is something you feel out with your wife and, and, and just try to work your best on giving them options so they feel like they're included with that.

[B]

Yeah, you, you can't go wrong with whole foods.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, so if your son, you know, is like, I want to eat, I'm hungry. All right, go get food. You know, you know, options are all whole foods and that's it. Yeah. You can't go wrong with that. And you know, when kids are young, it's remarkable. You talk to parents whose kids are in their, you know, mid to later teens and it's crazy how much the body changes. You know, you got one kid who's kind of chubby and, but you know, you're sticking to whole foods, being active. Suddenly his body leans out and changes. And you know, don't worry too much about it. You know, keep whole foods, let them eat whenever they want. It's not a big deal. It's. And then make exercise and fitness fun.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that builds a foundation, dude. Later on then it gets more specific.

[A]

It's, it's the six year old that is the, the leaner, the leaner one that doesn't eat as much. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So it's interesting that you bring this up right now. I was actually going to bring this up to the guys in a conversation today about my son. So my, my son was with my mother in law and he sent a video of him dancing and he's in his pajamas and stuff like that, no shirt on. And Katrina and I are like, man, he's really, really lean right now. Like skinny, skinny me. And he, he, he loves meat, but he doesn't eat a lot of carbs and he doesn't eat junk and he doesn't eat sweets. And so I've been going out of my way to do things right now, like around the foods he kind of eats. Like, like, like his dessert would be like a cocoa whip. So now I'm putting granola and honey on it. And so I'm doing things that like, normally, like he eats, he likes pancakes. I'm slabbing some peanut butter with some certain, like, I'm doing things that, around the way he eats and I'm sliding in those extra calories to have him do that to where he still enjoys the stuff he likes. And I'm not trying to radically change his diet. But I recognize, like, dude, this. My, my son is light right now. He needs to put some. He needs to put some weight on and, and, which is weird because I, I've been talking about, on the show for almost six years now about what a great eater is. Like, he eats healthy food, he doesn't like sweets, he doesn't eat junk drunk. But he's like, really, really skinny. He needs to put some weight on it. And it's because he doesn't eat a lot of carbohydrates. I'll put a slab of meat. He'll just eat meat. That's it. He won't. You don't want no rice. You don't want. So, so I'm trying to find these ways right now where I'm allowing him to do like, like you said, like the dessert, I'm giving a little bit bigger portion. I'm drizzling honey on it. I'm sprinkling granola in it. So I'm trying to find the foods that he likes and finding ways to, like, we have put butter on something that while I'm making it, so I'm boosting the calories that way. So I'm trying to find ways to do that again, not make a big deal about it. I don't want to for sure give my kid a complex that he's skinny or he needs to gain weight. But I see it. I see like, oh, man, he's really light and moves a lot. And so Katrina and I have been talking about this. I'm like, hey, we need to bump some of his, his calories in different ways. And so I've been showing her how we can do that through his current diet, the way he eats and sneaking in the extra 100, 200 calories here where he doesn't even feel like it's. And for the first time, incur. I'm trying to encourage him to eat some stuff that's a little sweeter or not ideally for him because he just needs the calories. He's moving and he's like, it sounds like your son. Where he's like, my son will only eat when he's hungry. He's like, I'm not hungry, but he'll tell you when he's hungry. And then he'll eat. And then he'll just eat the meat. And he's like, he'll. He'll.

[B]

We'll order.

[A]

Like when we send him to his. My families, they'll take him to a five Guys burger. He'll take the buns off and eat just the meat and not the french fries. Like, that's my son. Like, he's crazy like that like that. He's not a big fan of, of carbs and, and, and junk food and things like that. So I've had to find these creative ways with honey and butter and granola and stuff that I do know. He likes to boost the calories within the meal.

[B]

William, you look like you work out a lot. Have you been training yourself for a while?

[E]

Yeah, I compete in powerlifting and my wife's a personal trainer.

[A]

So it's actually, I mean, the, the.

[E]

Boys have grown up coming to see me, you know, compete, and my wife actually just, she's got a. Access to a private gym at work. And so she, the nine year old, every now and then they do like farmer's carries, listen, slam balls, anything like that, just to try to kind of get him engaged in it.

[B]

Okay, that's what I thought. So here's the thing. Here's the thing. You want to be careful with. The rate of body dysmorphia and dysfunction around food in people who, who are in fitness is much higher than the average population, especially trainers, especially competitors. I don't know of any studies of this, but I would bet every dollar I have that the rate of eating dysfunction and body dysmorphia in the children of people who are in fitness is also much higher. And it's not because of bad intentions. It's because over focusing. Yeah, dude. And I'm speaking from the personal experience. I won't go into much detail, but I made a big mistake with this because my focus was too much on, no, you got to eat this. This is the healthy thing.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

And it caused the problem, really. It's just right now it's about a good relationship. It's fun.

[A]

This was a conversation. This is a conversation that Katrina and I both had is like, we do not. Like he has no idea what we're doing.

[B]

You're not. Eat more.

[A]

You're too scared. Yeah, we're not saying nothing to him. I just, I know the foods he kind of already likes. And so I'm giving a little bit bigger portions. I'm adding butter on that thing. He's going to see a little bit of olive oil in there. Like stuff that I know he's not seeing. And, but I'm bumping his calories without him even knowing it. And just, just. And so that's the strategy for us right now.

[B]

Your boys already see dad. Dad is a superhero. They see Mom. Mom is fitness and amazing. They're. They're already going to look in the mirror and judge themselves and be like, I'm not as strong as dad or I'm a little chubby or whatever. So all you do, you just make. It's just fun. Man, oh, man. My dad. I used to love working out. My dad, you know, he never told me to work out. We just. We just hung out.

[A]

It was great.

[B]

What about diet? I don't know. We just ate whatever we wanted, whatever they offered. What was in your house? I don't know. I guess it was all. All whole food. Like, they don't even realize it. They're just developing this good relationship. That's what. That's really where you want to focus rather than trying to control things. Because it's insidious, dude. It's very insidious.

[A]

Yeah. And that's the.

[E]

My oldest came home from school a couple months ago, and I guess they were learning about calories or something, and, you know, he starts checking everything. Oh, how many calories are in the. So don't need that many calories. And we're like, just. Just get your protein. Just focus on protein. So now they run around and look at all the labels, and this has 6 grams of protein in it, you know?

[A]

You're doing good, bro. You're doing good.

[B]

Yeah. And the fact that you're asking questions already tells me you're a good day.

[A]

So just don't. Don't overthink it. That was a big conversation Katrina and I had about our son. It's like, he's. He's healthy. He's just really, really thin right now. I also recognize too know this. They go through these spurts. And so part of it too, like, he didn't look that way just, like six months ago, but all of a sudden, he just struck, stretched, and he was already a lean kid. So now he looks like.

[B]

You guys saw those pictures of my son when he was 2. I sent him to you guys. He looked like a little sumo wrestler.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Now he's like linky all of a sudden.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. When they go through those gross bursts, they'll really eat. And you're gonna see, like. I mean, it's changed overnight. For me especially my younger feet grow.

[B]

All of a sudden.

[D]

They look just to encourage you. That totally changes. Yeah.

[A]

You're doing good, bro.

[B]

You're gonna be good. You're gonna be good.

[E]

So I appreciate it.

[A]

All right, man.

[B]

Got it, man.

[A]

All right. Take it easy, William.

[B]

Thanks for calling me. I personally know Just off the top of my head, three people, and I'm not even including myself. And I won't go into too much detail myself, just out of respect, but I know personally, three people who are in fitness, some One of which everybody would know who they are, whose children struggled with eating disorders and body dysmorphia. We're all in health and fitness.

[A]

You got to find a study on that. There's got to be a study. It's way more likely you have a mom and dad. Here's the thing. We.

[B]

And they also hear what we've talked about.

[A]

We've talked about even. Not even. Not that they. What you do. They see.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

And if you. If you. If your kid sees you weigh and measure your food every single day.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

And think that that's not going to make an impact, you're crazy.

[B]

Something like, you had a birthday party and your kids having some cake.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And you're like, no, no, don't eat that. That's not healthy for you. Yeah. I make the mistake. Mistake of saying things even like that with my kids, where my son will go somewhere, somebody will offer him something, he'll be like, I don't know if I can eat that. Let me ask my dad. I'm like, oh, too far. You know what I'm saying?

[A]

It's interesting. This question was brought. This was literally on my notes to bring up and talk to you guys about just because. Literally just happened two days ago.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like this.

[B]

And we.

[A]

And Katrina and I talked about it, and it sounds like he's in a similar spot, him and his wife, good relationship with exercise, food, this and that. They have the older kid who was eating like a monster, and then they had the little kid who just doesn't eat that. That's Max. Max does not. I've told you guys forever. Doesn't eat sweetener. And for the first time ever, I went, oh, man, he's really on the lean side right now. We need to get some more calories in. But then it's not telling him any of that. I tell Katrina, it's like, listen, we're not gonna do. We're gonna deal.

[B]

I'm trying to stuff them.

[A]

Yeah. It just. Now when he gets his cocoa whip, he gets, you know, two tablespoons of honey drizzled over it and a scoop of granola. You know what I'm saying? And he loves it, you know what I'm saying? It's just like. It's a name. It's a way I could sneak in, spend 200 more calories right there and. And trying to do it in things like that. You know, he has his French toast and now get some powdered sugar on top of his. Like, I get to do things like that where it's like, I'm not trying to make this kitty have any idea that I'm trying to put 200 calories. No, no. And so there's. It sounds like he's in a similar situation where he's got a kid who just doesn't eat a lot of food. I have that kid. And it's been good for up into this point. I've watched and goes, been, man, this is awesome. My kid doesn't even need a chocolate chip cookie. Whiskey puts. Puts half of it down or what that. But now I see the other side of it is like he's growing now and he's moving more and he's getting stretched out and you can see he needs more calories. And so it's like, okay, how do I do that without making a big deal?

[C]

Our next color is Luke from Tennessee.

[B]

What's up, Luke? How you doing?

[F]

Hey, guys.

[D]

Hey.

[F]

Nice to see you again.

[B]

What's happening? How can we help you?

[F]

Yeah, so last time I was on, basically I just finished up the Maps Anabolic three day a week version. And I was looking for something to help me get through kind of a weight plateau. I had stalled out about 183 pounds. I was trying to get to 190 pounds and you guys suggested going down to maps 15 and that worked phenomenally. Honestly, I actually did not touch my diet at all. I had reverse dieted up to like 4, 300 calories and I didn't touch that. I just went to the Maps 15 program, put on three pounds within that nine weeks.

[B]

Wow.

[G]

Dude.

[A]

What do you need? Yeah, yeah.

[F]

Extremely happy with that. But now I'm finished with it and I don't know what to do next.

[A]

Probably stay in the 15 protocol is probably ideal for you because you have. It sounds like you have a pretty fast metabolism and the lower volume type of style. And so moving to one of those. I don't know if you've looked at all the ones that we've released recently.

[B]

Power lift 15 strong. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

I think that would serve you.

[F]

I was looking at Power Lift because one of the goals I have now is I want to try and pull 400 for deadlifts.

[A]

Yeah.

[F]

And I've got 360 twice, but that's all the weight that I have. So I had to order some more plates.

[A]

But, yeah, I mean, I think.

[F]

That, you know, maybe power lift would be good.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

What do you think?

[A]

Power lift, your strength. I love that. I love that. Actually, it's kind of all the 15s that we've done recently. I think it's one of the coolest, the way it's programmed, too. So I love it. Yeah.

[D]

Fun with it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

I like.

[B]

You'll get some strong.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[F]

Well, I'll definitely check that out then.

[A]

We'll start on it. We'll send that. We'll send that over to you.

[B]

Just. Just. Just for reference, just so people listening can understand this, you called in. If I'm not. If I'm not mistaken, you were experienced. Wasn't like, you were a beginner. You were already training. You're eating muscular, lean, obviously. And we took your volume way down to maps 15. So you're doing list, like about 20 minutes a day, two lifts a day.

[D]

Thanks for highlighting.

[B]

And you built muscle. Muscle, yes. So I want people to hear that. That will. People like. Yeah, people look at it like, oh, it's a beginner program. No, no, Try this. If you're advanced, watch what happens.

[A]

Yeah, it's.

[B]

It's. It's remarkable. Yep, Yep.

[F]

There's a world of difference. And, you know, I was coaching softball and basketball at the same time, so you get a little bit of cardio in there every once in a while, which, you know, not a whole lot. It's not physically demanding, but, you know, dunking on fifth graders sometimes kind of gets a little bit physical.

[A]

But.

[F]

You know, other than that, though.

[A]

Yeah, exact. Right.

[F]

Going down in the volume was exactly what I needed to stimulate the muscle growth. I mean, I'd stalled out, like I said, at 183 and putting on three pounds in nine weeks without any body fat increase, because I'm hovering around 10% right now.

[A]

That's awesome.

[F]

Is amazing.

[A]

You know, how was it for you psychologically? Because a lot of times my. My advanced guys, I. I do that. It's. It's hard for them psychologically because they've trained themselves to have to, like, live for that hour in the gym and hit it really hard. How was it for you? You psychologically?

[F]

Yeah, it was a. It was an adjustment. I had to just kind of tell myself to trust the process. Of course, at the beginning, and then after about the first phase of it, I was like, you know, I really like this because, you know, I just go out in the garage, I Got a PRX set up out there. I just go out in the garage. I'm done in, you know, 15, 20 minutes, 30 minutes. Maybe if I'm taking my time a little bit and I can go back to my day. So instead of spending like an hour, hour and a half in the gym like I was with the anabolic program, which is also great, you know, but that's a lot of time when you got kids and the family and you know, adult responsibilities and stuff like that, so. But after a while, yeah, psychologically it was a little bit of an adjustment at first, but after seeing the results, like no qualms whatsoever.

[A]

That's cool.

[B]

That's awesome, dude. You'll love Maps 15 Power Lift.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[F]

Okay.

[A]

Send us in an update too. I'd love to hear how that goes for you, man. Man, it's awesome. Yep. Okay.

[F]

Yeah, I'm looking hopefully maybe summertime.

[A]

All right. All right, man.

[B]

Thanks, brother.

[F]

Thanks, guys. I appreciate it.

[B]

You got it.

[A]

So great.

[B]

Good commercial.

[A]

Well, you know, it's crazy too. He's still, he was still doing some cardio activity, didn't change his diet. He would increase his calories a little bit and not done that and he probably would have been put.

[B]

You know what the problem, Adam, is further, we, we constantly hear about. And there's truth to this, right? Progressive overload. Progressive overload. I got to progressively overload more and more if I want to get. Build more muscle. I'm advanced. What you're telling me is I'm going to do 20 minutes a day instead of my typical workout. And going that far back is going to give me better results at best, I'll maybe maintain. That's what people may think. No, dude, oftentimes it's the exact thing your body needs. And then watch what happens.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And look, three pounds of lean body mass. Maintaining 10% body fat with someone who's already advanced. Advanced. That's phenomenal.

[A]

I mean, I just, I had this discuss long discussion with my brother in law last night. It's. I think that the hardest part, it's not just the progressive overload thing. It's everything else in our life serves us more better.

[B]

More better. More.

[A]

Yeah. Study harder, work harder, you make more money. You do, you do all these things and almost everything else in life rewards us for pushing harder, doing more. And it not your, your, it's not your biology doesn't work that way. Your physiology doesn't work that way. It's not that way. It's. It's a science dance. And It's a delicate dance and it's a stress and you just, it's a good stress because it elicits a positive change when done appropriately. But the more of it you do isn't the better. And I think that's what people don't understand. They don't know how to balance that with everything else. And so, you know, especially if you've been living for a long time and you're like, I must need more, I must need more. I'm not seeing. I must need more. Then you get yourself in this rabbit hole of six, seven days a week, hour and a half routines, high intensity failure training. It's just like, no, of course you, you're not responding.

[B]

You know, look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see you. It's at mindpump Media.

[C]

Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body dramatically, improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB Super Bundle includes maps, Anabolic maps, Performance and maps, aesthetic. Nine months of of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs with detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos. The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can, you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.