2798: What is Good Gym Culture?

Summary

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth

Episode 2798: What is Good Gym Culture?

Date: February 20, 2026
Hosts: Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, Justin Andrews, Doug Egge

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the concept of "good gym culture": what it means, why it matters, and how it beats out factors like convenience or fancy equipment when it comes to your long-term consistency and results in the gym. The hosts blend personal stories from decades in the industry with practical insights for both gym-goers and gym owners, while also tackling community questions on gym alternatives, recovery, protein intake, and wellness trends.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Importance of Gym Culture (04:35 – 22:00)

• Sal argues culture is the #1 factor:
  “There’s one that trumps all of them. The most important thing you should consider…the culture of the gym.” (04:35, Sal)

• Convenience is a baseline, but culture keeps you coming back
  The team agrees that gym location and hours matter, but once those basics are met, culture is what sustains motivation (05:12–05:48).

• Equipment, size, and amenities are secondary:
  CrossFit’s explosive growth is used as an example; despite bare-bones setups, their strong culture drove community retention and results (05:46–06:43).
  “CrossFit was amazing…not because CrossFit’s good workouts, because they’re not. Boom. It was because they opened up gyms in, like, what looked like garages…And it was the culture…” (05:59, Sal)

• A good gym culture is uplifting and inclusive:

  • Everyone is encouraged, no matter skill level, body type, or background (07:19, Sal).
  • “It doesn’t matter if you’re a beginner, overweight, experienced, young, or old…when you walk into the right culture, you feel so encouraged and supported.” (07:19, Sal)

• Gyms as modern melting pots:

  • Justin compares gyms to libraries—a rare place where all backgrounds mix for self-growth (07:51).
  • The guys note how group fitness studios (SoulCycle, Barry’s, OrangeTheory, F45) “hacked” this community dynamic (08:10, Adam).

• Anecdotes of camaraderie, mentorship, and respect:

  • Sal describes being a nervous teen in hardcore gyms, only to experience kindness and mentorship from intimidating lifters (08:25–09:21).
  • Adam reminisces about “the mayor of the gym” mentality—know everyone, say hi, build relationships to foster respect and accountability (15:55–17:01).

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2. Traits of Healthy Gym Culture

• Respect and Self-Policing:

  • Members take pride and responsibility for the space; Adam shares a story of a gym “bouncer” using caution tape to enforce the re-racking of weights, resulting in lasting positive behavior (13:37–15:44).

• Mutual Encouragement Across Divides:

  • Nobody cares who you voted for, or your background; lifting and hard work unite everyone (17:29–18:07).
  • Light ribbing between training groups (“powerlifters vs. bodybuilders”) is embraced as camaraderie, not division (19:19–19:55).

• Protective and Inclusive Environment for Everyone:

  • Women are respected and protected in positive gym cultures—cross-generational respect is emphasized (20:44–21:07).
  • Old members are revered by young ones: “They’re like kings and queens in there.” (21:07, Sal)

• Gym Managers & Owners Set the Tone:

  • Personal connections matter—knowing members by name is a sign of a well-run gym (16:30–17:01).

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3. Personal Gym Stories & Gym Hopping (22:00 – 26:27)

• The hosts discuss bouncing between various gyms, home gyms, and even high school weight rooms, noting how each location’s culture remains the key determinant of their experience (22:00–23:08).
• Justin shares the importance of embedding himself among high school athletes for energy and motivation, further reinforcing the power of community atmosphere over facility specs.

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4. Culture-Adjacent Outtakes: Competition, Skill Challenges, and Motivation (23:12 – 32:22)

• The team laments being “challenged” by their younger trainers in physical skills—reinforcing that gym culture includes healthy competition and mutual respect at every level.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On gym culture above all:
  “It was always, always, always about the culture.” — Sal (06:17)
• On respect and responsibility:
  “When you have a good gym culture…the other members tend to police the respect for the place.” — Sal (15:44)
• On inclusiveness:
  “…in good gym culture, people don’t care about anything other than you’re showing up, you’re working hard.” — Sal (17:29)
• On women’s safety:
  “I’ve never been to a good gym with good gym culture where the women are not protected by the men…they’ll tell you this. It’s the safest place ever.” — Sal (20:44)
• On the “mayor of the gym”:
  “Be the mayor of the gym. Think of a really good mayor in a TV show…knows everybody, says hi to everybody.” — Sal (15:55)

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5. Gym Culture & Industry Trends (49:02 – 50:33)

• The future of fitness will be split: hyper-automated/AI versus high-touch, coach-led personal experience.
  “It’s going to go very AI in one direction or very high-touch the other direction.” (49:52, Adam)
  • The Mind Pump hosts see the human, personal side winning out for those seeking real transformation.

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Important Q&A Segments

Belt Squats vs. Barbell Back Squats (64:40)

• Summary: Belt squats are an incredible tool, especially for people with mobility or back issues, but they are not a full replacement for back squats, which activate more of the posterior chain and stabilize the core.
• Timestamps: 64:40–66:44

Do Full Body Massages Help with Recovery and Muscle Growth? (66:44)

• Summary: The data is not conclusive, but all hosts have found huge anecdotal benefit when incorporating regular deep tissue or corrective massage into intense training regimens, especially for improved mobility and rapid recovery.
• Quote: “A good correctional massage therapist is probably the most valuable…generally speaking, across the board.” — Sal (69:55)
• Timestamps: 66:44–70:55

Is High Protein Intake Really Natural or Necessary for Muscle? (70:55)

• Summary: No one needs to force-feed hundreds of grams of protein beyond satiety—higher recommendations are for optimal performance or muscle gain, not bare survival. The average person is under-muscled and could benefit from both more protein and more strength training.
• Quote: “The average person would benefit from combining strength training alongside a high protein diet for a decent amount of time before they get to the point where they could drop it.” — Sal (74:40)
• Timestamps: 70:55–74:40

Cold Plunge or Sauna? (74:40)

• Summary: The research strongly favors sauna for longevity, health, and cardiovascular benefits; cold plunge is more about acute stress adaptation and psychological benefit.
• Quote: “Sauna. Not even close.” — Sal (74:49)
• Timestamps: 74:40–77:52

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Humorous & Candid Moments

• The Saga of Stolen Stories:
  The hosts rib each other on who originated the “mayor of the gym” concept (17:01–17:22).
• The “Goth Couple at the Gym” story:
  Even subcultures thrive when the atmosphere is right (18:07–18:16).
• Caution Tape Weight Room Policing:
  Legendary stories about gym “night shift enforcers” reinforce the “hold each other accountable” ethic (13:37–15:44).

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• 04:35 – 21:00: What is good gym culture & why does it matter?
• 13:37 – 15:44: Stories of member self-policing and community enforcement
• 17:01 – 17:22: The “mayor of the gym” philosophy
• 20:44 – 21:07: Protectiveness and inclusiveness toward women & seniors
• 22:00 – 26:27: Personal gym hopping experiences & culture contrasts
• 49:02 – 50:33: The future: AI vs. human connection in the gym
• 64:40 – 66:44: Belt squats vs back squats
• 66:44 – 70:55: Massage, recovery, and muscle growth
• 70:55 – 74:40: Is high protein intake “unnatural”?
• 74:40 – 77:52: Cold plunge vs. sauna – what’s better?

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Final Takeaway

Good gym culture is where encouragement, respect, and inclusion abound—more important than fancy equipment, classes, or convenience. The best gyms foster genuine camaraderie, accountability, and a “mayor” mentality from staff and members alike, making everyone feel welcome and motivated to return. This culture drives consistency and results, especially for average people rather than fitness addicts. In a world heading toward either cold automation or high-touch coaching, the Mind Pump crew makes clear: community, personal connection, and shared growth will always be the heart of effective fitness.

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Missed the episode? This summary has you covered—dive in for more at @mindpumpmedia or mindpumppodcast.com.

Transcript

[Sal De Stefano]

Or lost. I'm gonna pull over and ask that man for directions. Hi there. We're looking to get to the campground.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, you're gonna take a left at the old oak tree end of this here road. No, I'm just kidding. Let me get my phone out.

[Sal De Stefano]

How are you getting a signal out here?

[Adam Schafer]

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[Justin Andrews]

Actually, can you point us in the

[Sal De Stefano]

direction of a T Mobile store?

[Adam Schafer]

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[Sal De Stefano]

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[Doug]

If you want to pump your body

[Adam Schafer]

and expand your mind, there's only one place to go.

[Sal De Stefano]

Mind Pump. Mind Pump.

[Adam Schafer]

With your hosts, Sal Destefano, Adam Schaefer

[Doug]

and Justin Andrews, you just found the

[Sal De Stefano]

most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we answered questions from listeners. They wrote into to Mind Pump media on Instagram. So we pick four and we answered them. But this was after the intro. Today's intro was 63 minutes long. In the intro, we talk about fat loss and muscle gain. We talk about gym culture, current events, always a good time. Once again, if you want to write in a question that we can pick, go to Instagram. Mindpump Media. Now. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Caldera Lab. This is natural skincare products. They help balance out the microbiome on your skin. Over 90% of participants in the studies show an improvement in the look and health of their skin. The these are real clinical trials. Go check them out. Go to calderalab.com mindpump use the code mindpump20 and get 20% off. This episode is also brought to you by Legion. Legion supplements. Some of the best in the world. They're high quality, third party tested, super effective. Today we talked about their gummy creatine chewies. They're delicious. They've got creatine. It's like eating candy except you get your 5 grams of creatine, build muscle, all that great stuff. They have lots of other products. Go check them out. Get yourself a discount. Go to buylegion.com mindpump use the code mindpump. You can buy one, get one 50% off. This episode's also brought to you by Vita Bella. This is our new hormone therapy peptide company. Here's what you do. Go to mphormones.com, you meet with a doctor. It's only with a doctor, no salespeople. You get your hormones, your peptides delivered to your door 48 to 72 hours. Here's the best part. Their prices are 50 to 60% less than everyone else. And by the way, these are pharmacy grade peptides. This is real deal stuff, not that weird gray market stuff. It's legit from a doctor. One more time, go to mphormones.com finally, we have a brand new program we're launching right now. It's the Maps Great eight. Okay, only eight exercises. That's it. It's one lift a day. It's an eight day split. It's the most simple yet effective muscle building, fat burning, burning body sculpting, symmetry developing program we've ever made. It's on sale, it's half off because of the launch. So here's what you do. Go to mapsgreat8.com so that's mapsgreat number8.com it's 50% off if you use the code launch. This includes a MAPS Great 8 nutrition guide, so that's in there for free. Plus if you sign up before the 22nd, you'll get five days of coaching with our trainer Cole. So one more time, mapsgrade8.com, the code is launched for the discount and all the free stuff. All right, real quick.

[Justin Andrews]

If you love us like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs or training gear [e-mail] I'm talking right now. Hit pause, head on over to my pumpstore.com.

[Adam Schafer]

that's it.

[Justin Andrews]

Enjoy the rest of the show.

[Sal De Stefano]

There's a lot of factors to consider when you're looking for a jam. A lot of. But there's one that trumps all of them. The most important thing you should consider, the one thing that is most likely to help you be consistent and get great results. It's the culture of the gym. What is gym culture? What is good gym culture? We're going to talk about it right now. Let's go.

[Adam Schafer]

You think that's number one?

[Sal De Stefano]

Number one. Come on, you know this. You manage gyms. When you manage gyms, Let me ask you this, Adam. How many times did you walk into a janky, broken down club and double the revenue because of the culture? Well, that's, I mean no equipment changes, no location.

[Adam Schafer]

So I don't, I don't disagree from a business perspective, but I think convenience has got to be the convenient factor. Makes a huge difference.

[Sal De Stefano]

Well, yeah, I think that's, I go

[Adam Schafer]

to, I go to a pretty subpar gym right now just because it's.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Because it's so good initially. There's no culture. There's two people in there.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's it. Well, of course, if it's too far, people aren't going to go. But when you look at all the ones, you know, you get out the low, like the low bar stuff, right. It's got to be like within this much, you know, distance from me. It's got to be open when I'm available. But when you look at all the places around you that offers those things, what's the most important?

[Justin Andrews]

What's going to keep you there? I think that's the biggest.

[Sal De Stefano]

Listen, it's not equipment. It's not equipment. It's not like how big the gym is. By the way, CrossFit prove this. They prove this. CrossFit, I love the.

[Justin Andrews]

They're all culture.

[Sal De Stefano]

I love what they did because we've been in the fitness industry long enough to see fads come and go. CrossFit was amazing. Not because CrossFit is good workouts, because they're not. Boom. It's because they opened up gyms in like look like garages with like barbells and racks like nothing else. No air conditioning in many of them, concrete floors. And they crushed. They crushed. And it was the culture that many of them developed. And I know this from managing clubs myself. It was always, always, always about the culture. Now, if you're, like, hyper consistent, you're super into working out, it still makes a difference. But, I mean, you can put me in any gym and I'll do a workout, but for the average person, it's the culture that makes the big difference.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, there's an. There's an energy about a good culture like, that makes you want to come back to it.

[Sal De Stefano]

Totally. And gym culture is something that I've heard. One of my favorite comments I ever got on gym culture was actually from Father Steve. Is it a Catholic priest who loves to work out. Right. He was in the series that I filmed, bodybuilder priest, but he likes to work out. And I remember he said this to me. He said this to me early on. He said the church could learn a lot about good gym culture. And so we went down this whole rabbit hole of what good gym culture was. And yeah, it's one of the most amazing things you can experience.

[Adam Schafer]

It can be right, I think. I think it can be very welcoming. The right. The right places.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes. So here's the first thing. Like, good gym culture encourages everybody. Everybody encourages everybody. This is what it feels like when you go into a good gym. And it doesn't matter if you're a beginner, doesn't matter if you're overweight, it doesn't matter if you're super experienced, if you're young, if you're old. You know this. When you walk into the right culture, you feel so encouraged and supported, and it's just this great vibe. You just want to be there and you don't feel looked down upon or judged. Rather, you feel like everybody's lifting you up. It's one of my favorite parts.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Where else?

[Justin Andrews]

I mean, like a library. I'm trying to think of somewhere where, like, there's just a melting pot of every, like, religious background, cultural background, like, political view. Like everything just, like, smashes in one place. But it, but it works because they're all, you know, focused on, like, self growth.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, all your, your. All your small studio spots hacked into this. That's why it was one of the growing, fastest growing spaces. Right. So your soul cycles. Your, you know, Barry's boot camps, your orange theories, your F45s, they hacked into that.

[Sal De Stefano]

They tried to.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. 100. Yeah, they did.

[Sal De Stefano]

And I've experienced, you know, I experienced this as a kid, you know, new to the gym, loved it. And I remember walking into some pretty hardcore gyms that were a bit far from my house. But at this point, I was like at 16, got my license. So I'm like, I'm gonna go try out different gyms and save up a little money, go pay a day fee. And there were some gyms that you'd walk in, intimidating as a kid, where it's like chalk and hard metal being played. And I'm looking in the door and there's like really scary dudes lifting weight. And I went in there intimidated, but also excited because I loved it. Start working out. And I'm like, man, people are talking to me, they're telling me to keep going. They're asking me questions. And then I'm asking questions. I'm getting like great advice from people and I'm looking at them. I'm like, man, you are so hardcore. You actually took time out of your day to like sit down and talk with me about a squat. It was like some of my most. Some of my favorite experiences in the gym were in those kinds of gyms.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what I would love to build? I would love to build an all in one.

[Sal De Stefano]

What do you mean?

[Adam Schafer]

Like, imagine like the, the ultimate like day spa gym you've been to that you like, right? That's got that kind of like over at Club one.

[Justin Andrews]

The country club.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, country club vibe. But then downstairs in the basement is like this grunge heavy metal, you know what I'm saying? And kind of reminds me, remember, there was a. There was a. There was a famous club when we were younger. We all used to go out to clubs in San Francis. There was a club that had three stories and it was like hip hop, raw, like. Yes. Yeah, yeah. So each level was like a different dj. And so it was so cool that you could go there, you could whatever you're into and you could be there. It'd be cool to have a gym that encompassed like all. Even have like, even have its own little CrossFit area. Kind of like that Reno one that we went to. Had an athletic area, had a CrossFit area, had the hill inside of it, you know what I'm saying? And then had like, had like a grunge.

[Sal De Stefano]

Love it.

[Adam Schafer]

Kind of dungeon.

[Sal De Stefano]

Love it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

I love, I love also hearing about, like old school gems. One of. I remember watching Pumping Iron, great movie documentary on bodybuilding in the 70s. And as a kid I watched it so many times that I would notice

[Justin Andrews]

people in the background ask, how many times?

[Sal De Stefano]

Hey, listen, no joke, no joke. It was like two or three days a week, like every week.

[Justin Andrews]

I believe it.

[Sal De Stefano]

Every week.

[Adam Schafer]

You watched it multiple times in a week.

[Sal De Stefano]

Before, I don't know if I want

[Justin Andrews]

to switch it out with Predator. Was that like.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, Predator was Combo. Definitely a lot. But I could quote Pumping Irons songs. I could quote the sounds in the background. Like, I know it way too well. But anyway, I remember watching it and I remember paying attention to the gym. So I'm like, what was the gym like back there? Like, what's the equipment? And I just noticed, like, there was no music playing. Yeah. And I noticed everybody was kind of like talking to each other and encouraging each other. And I was like, oh, my God, this is. And by the way, Gold's Gym back then was tiny. You guys know that, right? The Gold gym they film in there.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Was like. It was like as big as our personal training studio.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

It was not a big gym at all.

[Justin Andrews]

There wasn't many equipment in there at all.

[Sal De Stefano]

Another factor to good gym culture is hard work is valued, but so is camaraderie. So what you'll get is this wonderful mix of hard work and socializing. Yeah, it's like this great mix.

[Adam Schafer]

It's hard. It's hard, though, to compare to that. Because in the 80s and early 90s, it was so niche that you could have a facility that was 3,000 square feet and the 15 people that worked out there worked out every day, you know what I'm saying? Like, it created its own kind of vibe and culture, and you had to really be into it to go to it.

[Sal De Stefano]

A little bit of a self selection bias.

[Adam Schafer]

Totally, totally. We're now, you know, fitness as we always wanted it to. I remember. I remember when we were. I mean, when we first got into this space, you know, 25 plus years ago, I think it like 4% of the population was working out, you know, in gyms or something like that, or

[Sal De Stefano]

less or has a membership maybe.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, it was something like that. I remember seeing the stats and like, I mean, it's. It's way different.

[Sal De Stefano]

I think it's tripled.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, it's.

[Sal De Stefano]

Or more.

[Adam Schafer]

More than that. Doug, look up how many.

[Justin Andrews]

How many.

[Sal De Stefano]

How many people have a membership?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. What percentage of the population have a gym membership or have had a gym membership? Because you got to factor in all the people that it's.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's a lot more. For sure. Yeah, a lot more for sure. But you know, that vibe, you guys have been in gyms like that, where it's like you're working hard, but you're also having a good time and socializing in between sets. It's like this. It's like a It's like a social hard work place. It's not one or the other, it's both, which draws people in and makes them want to keep coming. What do you find, Doug?

[Doug]

25%.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, way higher. Huge, huge difference.

[Adam Schafer]

It was 4%. I remember, I remember that in the meetings.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, it's tiny.

[Adam Schafer]

That was like the big kickoff meetings we talk about. We're only getting 4%. So much potential growth now. That's a huge difference.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's crazy. Another thing too is you'll find this, by the way, this is. As people who own and manage and run gyms, this is something that you have to help develop as part of the culture. But if you have good gym culture, this tends to exist. People tend to respect the place, they just tend to do it. I know in my time I had a tiny studio. So it's so much easier to create good culture in a small place because you're not looking at so many different people. Yeah, but man, if a piece of equipment went down, I used to have, I used to have members, clients of other trainers that work in my studio that they would come back with tools and they start fixing things and I wouldn't ask them or anything or they come in and they'd fix something or wipe something down. Like, what are you doing? Oh, I noticed there was a smudge here. Or I noticed this was making a little noise so I put some grease on it. And I just remember I felt so good that my members wanted to help take care of the place, even though I didn't ask.

[Adam Schafer]

When you talk about this, it reminds me of a story. So I'm this, this point, I'm 20 years old. I'm hanging out with these guys that were probably in their mid to late 30s, lifting heavy. They ran the night shift. I've told you guys about this guy before. And I stayed late every night at the gym back in the days, right when I love being there. So I'd be there till 10, 11, sometimes midnight. And so that shift would come on and he got there at like 9 o' clock at night after most of, most of the managers, most people. And like, so he policed the gym. And one of the things he would do and it used to, it used to be hilarious to watch this. But he'd caution tape if people did not rack their weights. He would caught him. Big old dude, right? Big old steroid out guy, right? Bandana he'd wore behind the desk and everything, right? He'd come in the guy to do it. Yes, dude, he's Definitely the guy who'd do it. And he would kick everybody out of the weight room, caution tape it off, and make them watch him re rack the weight.

[Sal De Stefano]

You gotta wait.

[Adam Schafer]

You had to wait. It's like, this is what happens if you guys don't hold each other accountable for free racking the weights. I swear, I see him do once in a blue. He'd do that once in a while, and then everybody would be on top of each other. It was the coolest thing to ever watch. You could never get away with that today. But it totally got everybody to buy into. Like, hey, you see somebody who doesn't react their weights, you let them know, like, hey, put those away.

[Sal De Stefano]

Or you help them.

[Justin Andrews]

That's needed more now than ever, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

For sure.

[Justin Andrews]

Be honest.

[Adam Schafer]

For sure.

[Justin Andrews]

Everybody like you doesn't want to offend anybody. I'm like, dude, you got to do. You got to put your. You know, you got to do your part in this to make it work.

[Adam Schafer]

That story. That story stands out so, so much to me because I came back to that gym like, 10, 15 years later, long after he had been gone, I had been gone from there.

[Sal De Stefano]

Was this on Parkmore?

[Adam Schafer]

No, this was Capitol McKee Capital. Yes. So I come back there, and I'll never forget. It was the last time I actually came back there. I'll never work out here again. It came back, was around prime time, so it's a busy time. Already is. And I'd never been to a gym before where the entire dumbbell rack was cleared. Dumbbells just all over the floor. All over the floor, everywhere. There was not a single pair of dumbbells on the rack.

[Sal De Stefano]

In my mind.

[Adam Schafer]

What a disaster.

[Sal De Stefano]

Isn't that crazy how that's.

[Adam Schafer]

And that the point of culture?

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

How one person.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's the same gym.

[Adam Schafer]

Same gym. Yeah, same. It's busy. It's always been busy, like, at prime time hours. But it was managed like that. And there was a different vibe and culture.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah. When you have a good culture, the. The. The other members tend to police the respect for the place. So you'll see people, hey, put your dumbbells back. Or, hey, let me help you re rack.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

You'll actually get called out. And that's a good thing, by the way. It means everybody cares. It is about the place. I remember this as a trainer. So as an early trainer, one of my mentors said, be the mayor of the gym. Yeah. And it's like, what do you mean? He goes, well, like, think of, like, a really good mayor in a TV show, knows everybody, says hi to everybody. Just walk around the gym, talk to people, know everybody. And the way he communicated this to me is he's like, you'll never have to, like, work for clients. People will come to you. So I did this as a trainer, as a manager, and I loved it. I love knowing my members. I love talking to people, getting to know them. And it did create a good culture. Now I'm on the other end of it. Now I'm a member, and I work out at different gyms. There's one gym that I work out at, UFC over by Oak Ridge. My buddy Don runs the place. Don was one of the best at this. And I see him. He comes out all the time. He'll say hi to me. Of course, I've known the guy forever. But he'll talk to all the. And he knows all the members. Not like he's introducing himself old school, and he's just talking to everybody. And, you know, when you go to a gym or the manager or whoever's running the shift or whatever, like, knows everybody, that's good. Culture makes a big, big difference.

[Adam Schafer]

I feel like that's another one of my stories that you've taken to become your story.

[Sal De Stefano]

Is that your story?

[Adam Schafer]

You know that every once in a while, we'll have Will We Do It? A podcast.

[Sal De Stefano]

I don't think you said, be the mayor of the gym.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm pretty sure I said that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Actually, I do. I'm pretty sure.

[Justin Andrews]

You guys remember when I sold that barbecue to that.

[Adam Schafer]

Sometimes he tells the story so good. I'm like, yeah, yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'm nodding my head like, wait a second.

[Adam Schafer]

Second. That's my story.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's my story when I first became a profit.

[Justin Andrews]

You've been doing this so long. There are stories.

[Adam Schafer]

It's like when I played football in college.

[Sal De Stefano]

Here's the other thing. Nobody cares who you voted for. Nobody cares. In good gym culture, people don't care about anything other than you're showing up, you're working hard. This is like. It's like. This is what Father Steve told me. He goes, it's so crazy. In a good. In a good gym, people look different. You got a guy with blue hair over here, old guy with New Balance shoes on, and they're hanging out, talking because they're working. Yeah, yeah. Like, where do you find that? Especially today? Where do you find people just coming together and just being cool? Yeah. It's a very hard thing.

[Adam Schafer]

Car, community.

[Justin Andrews]

Not a lot of Goths.

[Adam Schafer]

I was. We were just talking. What did you Say a lot of

[Justin Andrews]

goth, we should bring them in.

[Adam Schafer]

Not a lot of them work out, actually.

[Sal De Stefano]

Cigarettes. You're right. It's kind of rare. But I did see a goth couple working out, like, a few months ago. I just remember.

[Adam Schafer]

Really?

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, dude. And I said hi to them and they were, like, totally into it. But they were real goth, dude.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. I mean, if you're, like, hardcore, it's. You're not real.

[Adam Schafer]

Did you ask what they were listening to?

[Sal De Stefano]

No. I should have. I don't care.

[Adam Schafer]

It's totally different than what you thought. Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Super funny. Celine Dion.

[Adam Schafer]

The car community could be like that. I think they're like that. We actually. My buddies and I were just talking about that. That's like, as long as they're rich.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah,

[Adam Schafer]

That's not true. I just went. I just went on a trip with my, like, very not wealthy car guys. They have cars, but they're like old cars that they have.

[Sal De Stefano]

And so.

[Adam Schafer]

And they worked on them themselves and got there. And so I think, just in general,

[Justin Andrews]

I think there's not a lot of aficionados.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah. There's not a lot of stuff like that, but I think that's. That's another example.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's a passion. Yeah, I hear what you're saying.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And maybe that's what it is. It's like, because every. They. We all share that passion.

[Sal De Stefano]

Other stuff.

[Adam Schafer]

Other stuff doesn't matter. Yeah. We're passionate about this thing and we can all talk. There's enough to talk about with that thing. That other stuff doesn't matter.

[Sal De Stefano]

You know what's funny about what you're saying is that I bet you this is true. I know this because you tease my brother about this in the car space. They. Although they respect each other and they're all cool. You got the Porsche, guys.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, there's definitely. There's definitely shit talking.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes, yes. Yeah. But it's all respect.

[Adam Schafer]

That's actually what's kind of cool about it, is, like, I mean, like I said, I just came back from a trip like this where I know for sure there's all kinds of different political views. And, like, that never comes up. But absolutely, we talk shit to the Corvette guy and the Corvette guy's talking shit about the German car. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, so there's this fun. This fun, playful camaraderie amongst everybody and respect. And it's not.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's not her.

[Adam Schafer]

It's not real harmful. It's more teasing.

[Sal De Stefano]

I've seen that in good gym culture. I'VE seen the power lifters and the bodybuilders making fun of each other. Right.

[Adam Schafer]

But it's in. It's like tongue in cheek.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's tongue in cheek. They got their little side, you know, and they just make foe. You're not strong or over there posing or, you know, you guys are fat. And it's like. Yeah, it's hilarious. I've been in that environment. It's a great. Yeah, I agree. Now, these last two, I think, are the most important. And I also think that they're most important for people who aren't super familiar with gym culture or intimidated. And they're. But they're key. They're key. I've never been to a good gym with good gym culture where the women are not protected by the men. They are. I've seen this. I've seen young women walk into a weight room, and other guys, it's almost like it's their sister or their daughter, and there's no one's, like, hitting on them. If they're trying to help them, they respect them. God forbid a dude is. Is rude, that guy's gonna be out of the gym. And it's. It's a very. And by the way, women who are

[Justin Andrews]

very thin bouncers, it's great.

[Sal De Stefano]

And women who work out in these gyms consistently will tell you this. They'll tell you this. Oh, it's the best place. Yeah, it's the safest place ever.

[Adam Schafer]

Didn't you do a reaction video to the young lady that was overweight that, like, had somebody come up to stop her? And she totally thought he was gonna say something, and he just encouraged her, degrading to her and then, like, broke her down. Because it was. He was encouraging and he was like

[Sal De Stefano]

the scary Jack guy.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, totally. No, it's always that guy.

[Sal De Stefano]

And then here's the other thing. The old people are really respected by the young people. This is my favorite. It's my favorite because I'm getting old. But the old people that work out, that are fit, they're like the most impressive thing. Dude, they're like kings and queens in there. Everybody knows them. They're. They love them. They're awesome. They're, like, the greatest. It's, like, one of my favorite things to see. So it's just, again, if this is what you should look for, people don't know that. They look for equipment, they look for flash, they look for classes or whatever. Look for the culture. That's what's going to keep you coming. That's what's going to keep you consistent.

[Adam Schafer]

I. There's. How many, how many different gyms are you bouncing around to right now? Yeah, yeah, like. Or in just like the last year or so.

[Sal De Stefano]

Like I'll go to club sport, I'll go to UFC gym, my garage, and I'll work out here. So that's four. But the other two are the actual.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. What about you? Are you at one?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Santa Cruz Athletic Club.

[Adam Schafer]

And then if you're not there, you're

[Justin Andrews]

at the train at my house.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Or actually I take that back. I'll train at the high school sometimes.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, that's gonna be interesting.

[Sal De Stefano]

Really?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, because I'm friends with the coaches and I like to keep just, you know, show up all the time. Yeah, I just like this kind of bury, you know, the high school kids. I just like the energy, dude.

[Sal De Stefano]

Like they're. You done with that squat or let's add a couple 45s real quick.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, I got to warm up.

[Justin Andrews]

It's really hard to impress anybody now that social media is out. You gotta go to the high school level. Yes, I gotta resort to that now.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's gotta be so fun for you because of your background in sports and all that stuff.

[Adam Schafer]

It's gotta be motivated, dude.

[Justin Andrews]

I, like, honestly, I, I don't know. I, I love what we do and I love, you know, where I'm at in life and everything, but at the same time, like, I miss that like competitive spirit and just like, you know, something that's driving you every day to like go express that on the field and see if it works, you know, and these kids are like so wide eyed about like the experience and I feed off that.

[Sal De Stefano]

So.

[Adam Schafer]

So the Uncle Rico side.

[Justin Andrews]

All those tropes, dude.

[Sal De Stefano]

Hey, how mad? Listen, our trainers, these jerks, they come up. I don't know if it's them or a social media team comes up with these physical.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, dude, can we talk?

[Justin Andrews]

Why you gotta bring that up, dude? It's another thing I suck at.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay.

[Sal De Stefano]

And there was coming up with physical

[Adam Schafer]

tests that we don't know. I didn't know. I didn't know about it at all.

[Justin Andrews]

Annoyed me.

[Adam Schafer]

I like, Danny just stops me. This was like two days, two or three days ago. She's like, hey, can you do the V bar push up? And I'm like, huh? I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. She's like, yeah, let me show you a real exercise. So she doesn't tell me one, that I'm getting video to that like, every. She's been having everybody do this. So I'm like, I don't know. I said, I haven't done something like that in a while. Let me see. And then I go, I go to

[Sal De Stefano]

get down on it.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm like, oh, no, you can't do this.

[Sal De Stefano]

Like, you can't. Can't do it.

[Adam Schafer]

It's like, no one.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

This thing.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

No one could do. That's exactly.

[Sal De Stefano]

I was.

[Adam Schafer]

No one could do this. Cole's just wrecking it out. Yeah. So I, I, I, I mess. Then I get, Then I get to a point where I can at least balance it and plank on it. I'm like, okay, now I'm. I messed with it for, like, I don't know, 20 minutes. And then they. She tells me that she's had the whole staff do it. She, I, this is what I hear about. I had Justin do it first. He goes, he left and he took it home so we can go practice. I go, oh, I didn't know everybody was doing this.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'm so angry.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm like, wait a second. Can anybody do this? And someone's like, oh, yeah, cool. Danny can do it too.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, Danny did it.

[Justin Andrews]

That's why she wanted everybody to try it. I'm on to Danny.

[Sal De Stefano]

Hey. Hey.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm really good at this.

[Sal De Stefano]

Hold on, dude. Let's go back for a second. You took it home to practice?

[Justin Andrews]

I, I, yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

I don't know.

[Justin Andrews]

If I suck at something, it's gonna stick there in my head forever.

[Adam Schafer]

Tell anybody too. Just quiet.

[Sal De Stefano]

Just put it in his bag. He's still practice. Head home.

[Justin Andrews]

I still do it, and I have my kids trying it now.

[Adam Schafer]

And, like, I would think your boys could do it. Could they do it? Oh, wow.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, actually, Ethan doesn't try, but he might be able to do it.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, I would think they would be

[Sal De Stefano]

able to do it because it's a weird balancey thing. You gotta.

[Adam Schafer]

You know, I used to do all that kind of goofy stuff like that and would. I thought I'd actually be able to do that.

[Justin Andrews]

I think that's why it struck a nerve with me, because I used to be until, like, the random, like, unconventional things like that. And, like, I could do things, like, especially with the gymnastic rings, like, I could make up something nobody could do in here easily, like, out there, which I will. I'll do that, and I'll give them the video and I'll. He's like, I'm gonna film it, and

[Adam Schafer]

then I'm gonna take it home.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm just gonna be like a laugh track.

[Adam Schafer]

Haha.

[Sal De Stefano]

You guys, this the second time he couldn't do something this year. Remember when we hanging on the bar?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, Hanging forever. Like, I'm heavy, dude. I don't have, like, this, like, serious grip strength. That's what pisses me off.

[Adam Schafer]

Hey, Cole's all wiry, dude. He's like, so built for us.

[Sal De Stefano]

So.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, but everybody, hey, at. At least I felt good. Like, all the rest of my trainers failed. I was like, okay. The rest of these guys failed. Like, it's not. Cole was able to do it all confident.

[Justin Andrews]

But listen. No, he's gonna get me.

[Sal De Stefano]

But straight up, they need to understand something. I hope they watch this. You guys need to understand something. It's cool that you guys do cool stuff. You can only beat us so long until we fire you. You start messing things up. You guys, here's the thing.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm impressed. Like, I was angry because I couldn't do it. I'm actually impressed by both of them. They could do that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, I was.

[Adam Schafer]

No, I was. I was. I was really impressed to see how many people couldn't do it and then they could do it. It's. It's not easy.

[Sal De Stefano]

Speaking of being impressed, let's talk about your Dexa.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, that's. What does that do with impressed, dude?

[Sal De Stefano]

Because it's way higher than I thought.

[Adam Schafer]

Such.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's. It's.

[Adam Schafer]

My wife says it's. Apparently I'm the highest body fat percentage I've been since the. The. My worst.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, wow.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. So the worst I ever, ever tested at was 19 point something. That was when I did the whole way back when. And I was like, way out of shape. That was like the worst shape I'd ever been in.

[Justin Andrews]

And were you hiding all that?

[Adam Schafer]

I don't know, bro. Yeah. And normally, you see, I don't even feel like that's right now, right now. Right. I think he looks. His face looks better.

[Sal De Stefano]

We're talking about your body.

[Adam Schafer]

See me deflect. Let's see how fat Sal looks right now.

[Sal De Stefano]

First of all, I didn't guess you're 18. I would have thought 15. No, and I'm really shaped too.

[Adam Schafer]

And I normally am. I'm really like. People always trip out when I go do that, and they're like, damn, you're like, point two off. How did you guess that? I'm like, I've done this a thousand times and I've seen my weight. So if I had to guess, I would have said 14 to 16 on the high end. I would have said it, actually. I had told myself, like, 16. I was telling everybody. Also, I'm actually gonna be a little disappointed if I'm 16. I should be, like, lower. Lower than that.

[Sal De Stefano]

And so it comes back way better.

[Adam Schafer]

Way 18.1.

[Sal De Stefano]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

And I'm like, wow.

[Sal De Stefano]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

Now I. I did it on your hips.

[Justin Andrews]

They're nice and round.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't know. Maybe that's why my wife likes it. She's like, no, you look good right now. You look great right now.

[Justin Andrews]

She just comes behind.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

So I. You know, I'm at. My lean body mass is. So I have all the DEXA scans from when I did that transformation thing. Right. So what I actually was really interested to see, like, because I couldn't remember where. Where I was at when I did the GLP one. So after the GLP one, remember when I just kind of like that.

[Sal De Stefano]

By the way, that's crazy how low your lean body mass got.

[Adam Schafer]

I write, so that GLP1 trip off this, dude. So the GLP1, I. I just remember. I just took it, did whatever.

[Sal De Stefano]

You just let it.

[Adam Schafer]

Let it go.

[Sal De Stefano]

Let it. You ate when you were hungry.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right.

[Sal De Stefano]

Didn't lift weight.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, hardly. I tried to lift a little bit. Remember I told you to be like dad or help my wife?

[Sal De Stefano]

The experiment was literally like, what do people experience?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. So I went all the way down to 199 pounds. I hadn't been under 200 pounds since competing my. In my. In like a amateur. So once I got over amateur, I never went below 200. So amateur level, that was the lowest I'd ever been under 200. And so I got down to 199, but my lean body mass went all the way down to 154. So 154 pounds of lean body mass. So then I did that whole thing, which everybody thought it was fake because I. I. I put on. I went all the way back up to 180.

[Sal De Stefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

So I went back to 180, and. Oh, and my body fat percentage was 15.6. So it was 199 and like 15.6 or something like that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Okay.

[Adam Schafer]

And then I. My body fat percentage came all the way down to 12, and I added. I went to 211 or 212. And so now I had put back on 20. Something like 20. 20 pounds of muscle or what like that. And then I got lean. I lost £1, I think, of muscle. So I came down to 180.

[Sal De Stefano]

Or.

[Adam Schafer]

Excuse me, 170. 179 lean body mass and 10 body fat. And so that was the last time I had. I had.

[Sal De Stefano]

You know what's cool about what? You just. You know what's cool about this? Your body fat percentage was 15 at the end of your Ozempic trial. Yes, but your. So your body fat was lower than it is now. Yes, but are you healthier now?

[Adam Schafer]

Way healthier.

[Sal De Stefano]

Way healthier.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I have way more muscle.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's right.

[Adam Schafer]

30 pounds more muscle on my body at 18 body.

[Sal De Stefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

And that was really.

[Sal De Stefano]

When you look better, this is the other thing. You might have been leaner, but because you have so much more lean body mass now, you look better.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, for sure. So that's what's. What was most interesting was to see the difference of that. And I told, Remember I told you guys that you, you. And I've. I'm watching this happen with a lot of people that are friends of mine that I don't think need a GLP one like, it just, they, they're just. They need to lose 20 pounds, give or take or whatever like that. And everyone's jumping on the GLP1 train. And then what they're doing is they're jumping on it and they're not motivated to train and they lose the weight. And when you're in it, it's funny that how you don't see it. And I can so seed on them. Like, I'm looking at them like, man, that's how I had to look too, because I didn't feel that way either. Because you're watching your abs come in. You're watching your abs come in and you're. And you're watching, you're watching body fat come off, but you're also losing muscle and you don't look healthy. And so when I look at those pictures and I go, oh, my God, I can't believe we went and did a stupid company photo shoot full on face. And that's what our team uses to send out to everything. Like, whenever I do interviews, I'm like, why do we have those?

[Justin Andrews]

And I remember a good photo shoot.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, they all suck. Ever.

[Adam Schafer]

That would have been okay for me if it just wasn't that, like, I was okay with you guys, maybe.

[Justin Andrews]

Me never.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, you. You have fart face. You don't know how to take a photo. Like, you're about to fart.

[Justin Andrews]

I don't know what to do when

[Sal De Stefano]

you're taking a photo.

[Adam Schafer]

Draw your, you know, you just need to look away and pretend like no one's taking a photo Just pretend like

[Sal De Stefano]

you're taking a photo.

[Adam Schafer]

As soon as someone goes like, okay, we're doing photo, you just.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's not what you do when you, when you know no one's looking at it. So you're just faking it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, no, yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

You know you do, bro. This is what you do. As soon as they turn the camera, you bring your chin in. Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. You get fart face. Looks like you're holding a fart.

[Sal De Stefano]

I don't know why I look creepy. I don't know what it is, but like the photo we have in the front, I wouldn't trust that guy at all.

[Justin Andrews]

You look really eager.

[Sal De Stefano]

It just. Yes. Whoa, that's another level right there. But I don't like it. It looks creepy.

[Adam Schafer]

What'll be interesting about this is going from this point right, so that I was like lost a ton of weight loke, I was super low calorie, didn't have a lot of muscle, and then went and built back. So now I'm starting with more muscle than I, than I had.

[Sal De Stefano]

You know, this, this highlights too, is a couple things. One, body fat percentage is not the be all, end all. You're obviously healthier now, obviously, even though your body fat percentage is, you know, According to the DEXA, 3% higher. Two, you look better. And I've, I've, I've told this to clients many times. You can have a higher body fat percentage, but when it sits on muscle, you look good. Yeah, you look good.

[Justin Andrews]

Welcome to the husky world.

[Sal De Stefano]

With women, it gives them curves. With men, it makes them look strong. It's not as big of it. Now, of course, you go too high with body fat, it doesn't matter. But muscle changes a lot. It changes a lot when it comes to.

[Adam Schafer]

I am, I am curious and you're right, and I don't disagree, but this is the first time I've ever done the DEXA scan in the evening and after a full day of eating and

[Sal De Stefano]

drinking, see how much of a difference.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And then I also have the two injuries and I'm like super inflamed. My whole left arm is like swollen and has been because of the injuries. And so I'm wondering if inflammation and all the food can, can how much of it? Now, Katrina told me before she went, she goes, you know, you just hurt yourself. You're all inflamed right now. You're not going to like what you see. And I'm just like, oh, it doesn't matter.

[Sal De Stefano]

What a good wife she was trying to set you up?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, she did. And I'm like, listen, it's not no 5% off because of inflammation. I said so. It's still higher than what I would have liked, no matter what. But it does make me wonder because I remember how much I could manipulate the. The other ones.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Body spec.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, the body spec. Which are supposed to be really accurate too. And I could fluctuate those by carving up and 4% loading water. And I can make them.

[Sal De Stefano]

When are you gonna do another one? Maybe I'll go with you.

[Adam Schafer]

So I'll go in like 30 days.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'll do. I'll go with you.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, I'll go in, like 30 days. So I can.

[Sal De Stefano]

Because I'll curious about. I keep saying bone mass because I've never tested my bone mass in your decks. That came back. Yeah, bone mass. You were in the 98 or 99th percentile.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. You know, all my markers according to that are like. Like visceral fat. My. My bone density, my lean mass. All those things were all, like, super positive. But my. My bone. Even. Even. This is what's also interesting. Back to the GLP1 talk. There. There does seem to be this. And I've watched this. I have a friend. I won't sell out. The husband and wife that I know that are. That both used it. The husband had just came off of, like, bulking up and building some good muscle, and then he hops on, and so did his wife. She wasn't lifting. He looks all right because he just. He lost some muscle, too. And so when you look at, like, my bone density after the. The GLP one, it was still. It was still good. Now, I think that's because of years of lifting and building muscle and not under eating. Yeah. And the fact that I could afford to lose 20 pounds of muscle and still be okay.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah. You find bone density issues even in people who strength train, who consistently starve themselves. You see that all. I saw it all the time, typically with women, because they're the ones that tend to do that.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I'd see with competitors.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

You have competitors, women, bikini competitors that are up there winning trophies, but then their bone density is extremely low. Because they start themselves. Yeah. Then so low calorie. And. And you think because they're strength training and they have kind of a shapely physique, they shouldn't be that way. But it just shows you what happened.

[Sal De Stefano]

Well, good news is your skin looks amazing, bro. It looks really young.

[Adam Schafer]

At least you're useful looking. That's caldera Dog. I haven't stopped that. Are you.

[Sal De Stefano]

Are you. Do you. You're like super consistent.

[Adam Schafer]

Very consistent.

[Sal De Stefano]

I see you using it in here every day. All the time.

[Adam Schafer]

I use it here and home. So I don't. I use. I use it all the time.

[Sal De Stefano]

So is it the serum? The. That's the one you use the most.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean I use that one and then I forget.

[Sal De Stefano]

What's the.

[Adam Schafer]

What's the cream called? I always forget what. The name of the base layer.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, that's it.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Yeah. The base layer and the serum I use the most and then the soap I use.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's.

[Adam Schafer]

I only use a soap. I only use their soap and I've switched to their soap. I don't know how long it's been now, but I use their soap and then I use the. The serum in the base layer like all the time. I've messed with all the other stuff. I like it, but I feel like the serum is. I don't know if it had. Maybe you could look. But I. I think it has a lot of the same. The eye stuff has.

[Sal De Stefano]

I think that they single handedly have created a market for men. Skincare. Because I didn't see skincare stuff and now Caldera labs blown up. Yeah, I think guys are using it like crazy.

[Justin Andrews]

I've never seen.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean I've. I've personally never done anything where I've been able to.

[Sal De Stefano]

To.

[Adam Schafer]

To do it and then see a difference. Right.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, that. That to me that's the selling point. That's so easy. It's like all the other stuff seems like. Come on, are you, are you using

[Sal De Stefano]

the soap or do you still use the, like the shop soap, the lava. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Uses the same stuff for dishes. The same thing. It's all the. Yeah. Clean the counters. It's all the same.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean the serum kind of helps like repair the damage that I do with everything else. I don't really wash my face.

[Adam Schafer]

Justin got bad news. Got one soap for everything. It does the la car and it washes my face.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I do use shampoo, but yeah, I don't really do the whole washing face thing.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's so awesome.

[Adam Schafer]

You have. I mean he has his caldera. Do you use it?

[Sal De Stefano]

Do you use.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay, well that's the great.

[Sal De Stefano]

That's the other one I've used. Yeah, I like that one.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Did you guys know what the new trend is in? God, what's it called? Like not plastic surgery, but. What's that whole space called?

[Adam Schafer]

Like face contouring.

[Sal De Stefano]

Like cosmetic. Because that whole cosmetic. You know what the new trend is? I'm gonna read it.

[Justin Andrews]

Butt injections. Yeah, I guess. Is that new?

[Sal De Stefano]

No. Yeah, no, that's what's happening. And you know what they're using?

[Adam Schafer]

That's not new? No.

[Justin Andrews]

Like, just pumping in with saline or.

[Sal De Stefano]

No.

[Adam Schafer]

Like Sentol.

[Justin Andrews]

Like silicone.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, no, no, it's worse than that.

[Adam Schafer]

Shooting fat into it.

[Sal De Stefano]

Pumping. Ready for this?

[Justin Andrews]

Go ahead.

[Sal De Stefano]

Cadaver fat. Oh. Into their boobs and butts.

[Adam Schafer]

Wow.

[Sal De Stefano]

What? Dead people's fat into their body. Do they.

[Justin Andrews]

Do they have memories?

[Sal De Stefano]

I don't know. I don't know.

[Justin Andrews]

That's what I'd be worried about.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what I want?

[Sal De Stefano]

Hey, by the way, it says ethically sourced. Ethically.

[Justin Andrews]

How is that ethical?

[Sal De Stefano]

Because now I'm thinking.

[Adam Schafer]

Because they said they're a donor.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, if you didn't say that, I would have been okay, now you said that. I'm like, wait a minute.

[Justin Andrews]

I just imagine like, God, dude.

[Adam Schafer]

Do you think that the average. Do you think the average person can see it the same way you guys can see it when you see someone

[Sal De Stefano]

who has something like.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

To me, it's a. It's a dead giveaway.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Because they have no hamstrings.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah. And.

[Adam Schafer]

No. No hamstrings. Must line up weird.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes. Looks like a diaper.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. It's like a guy who has giant arms and no shoulders. It doesn't. It doesn't look right. It looks off. And so it. When someone has this big fake butt and no hamstrings, it's just.

[Sal De Stefano]

It doesn't look like thick legs.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, does you think everybody else can see that, or do you think because we're trainers and you're used to.

[Justin Andrews]

What's that show that I wanted to bring my strange addiction. There was a case this girl had. It just. It becomes this addictive thing because they get attention for this one feature, and then they keep going and going and going. And then their friend, you know, and then they both start going the black market with it because it gets expensive. And then they end up like, it's. It's toxic stuff they're, like, putting into their body, and it's like, it's, you know, causing all these health issues, but they keep doing. Because they want to. To get a certain size. And I don't even think they even know what the size is they want.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's, you know, it's perception drift. You talked about this before. Yeah. So, like, you start you feel like it makes you look better, but then that doesn't look good enough. And so you start. Your perception starts to drift slowly but surely into this crazy place. We start doing weird things.

[Justin Andrews]

Also, there's a guy on there that was in love with blow up pool toys.

[Sal De Stefano]

What do you mean he's in love with him?

[Justin Andrews]

That was very strange. My strange addiction. I don't know what happened to this poor guy, but he's very lonely guy. He has like. Like, he bought. I don't know, it was like 20 of these huge blow up dolls and, like, his names for all of them. And he sits and, like, talks to him. And he's got this, like, dragon one, that's his favorite. He's like, making out with it on the couch. And I was like, Courtney walked in on me watching this.

[Adam Schafer]

The four of us. The four of us have to do this just as, like, a funny, funny thing next time we're all hanging out at, like, Truckee together or something like that. They get a kick out of this. I would take each of our Explorer pages and each of our, like, Netflix homepages, compare them and just compare them, because I know they would look.

[Sal De Stefano]

You guys will be horrified.

[Adam Schafer]

Like, when you. Like, when just like, where's that at? I've never seen that record.

[Justin Andrews]

It's a great show. It reminds me of Taboo, this other show. Same Taboo, same premise.

[Sal De Stefano]

There's some stuff on there that's just.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, either one of those have been recognized.

[Sal De Stefano]

I you. All you would see on my Netflix is kids stuff because it's my. Actually, no, I don't have Netflix anymore. But when I did, it was just all a bunch of kids cartoons and stuff. I barely ever watch anything. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, yeah. You don't have different profiles.

[Sal De Stefano]

We just use. I like weird people. Dude, it's pretty. We really don't watch. It's wild. I used to watch TV all the time. Time. I rarely ever watch TV anymore.

[Adam Schafer]

All right, do you guys? Do you guys. I'm particular about that. Use my profile.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah. Oh, you guys.

[Adam Schafer]

Katrina be watching, like, her weird shows. Like girly shows. Like, don't be watching on my profile. Mess up my record. Don't watch mine.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I keep mine pure.

[Sal De Stefano]

Dude, can I do a little confession? A little confession to everybody in here right now. Sometimes you guys leave up your profile. Truckee at Truckee.

[Adam Schafer]

So you go watch.

[Sal De Stefano]

I look at yours, and I just mess it up and I get bored.

[Adam Schafer]

I always know that when I. When I start getting, like, weird sci Fi stuff that's being Recommended to me. I'm like, man, these guys are watching my. Up in Truckee right now. Justin's up there in Truckee right now watching all the Sci Fi stuff on my. On my account.

[Sal De Stefano]

Totally, 100%. All right, I want to talk about Vita Bella.

[Adam Schafer]

Cat's out of the bag, cats out of the bag.

[Sal De Stefano]

So I don't know, should we tell the whole story? So we, We. We worked with MP Hormone. Mphormones.com was our link that sent people to our hormone replacement therapy and peptide company that we worked with. And that company did some bad stuff. It was not good. And I'm not going to go into too much detail because of, you know, there's lawsuits and stuff happening.

[Adam Schafer]

You could Google it.

[Sal De Stefano]

But let's just say they owe a lot of people a lot of money and they did some things that were just not great. So we stopped working with them a while ago. How long has it been?

[Adam Schafer]

That's a nice way to say, yeah, it's been sick. Close to six months.

[Sal De Stefano]

Six months. In the meantime. So. And I'm gonna give some credit to Adam right now. In the meantime. So it's a huge vacuum. We got a huge podcast, huge audience, and so we just got flooded. As soon as the cat. As soon as people figured this out, all these companies were coming to us. Work with me, work with us, and we'll do this and we'll do that, and they're throwing money at us and this and that. And Adam was. I don't know how many companies you had to go through. 12.

[Adam Schafer]

Talk to 15 or 15.

[Sal De Stefano]

15 companies? Yeah. And. And we went through. And this time it was totally. We had a criteria that was very specific. So the criteria was because we had such a bad experience for what happened. It wasn't how much you guys can pay us. It was, we need something because so many of our listeners need a place to go.

[Adam Schafer]

They have to be reliable.

[Sal De Stefano]

They have to be super reliable. And consistent. Delivery has to be quick, has to be doctor stuff. We're not going to go gray market. As much as we love some of our friends that do the gray market stuff stuff, we're just not going to do that because you never know. Too volatile. And it had to be. It had to be consistent, clean, inexpensive. Because the. Some of the most. Some of the biggest complaints we got was the pricing from the company we work with and the fact that sometimes a delivery would take forever.

[Adam Schafer]

So there was also other considerations that. That was important. You know, I heard everything. Like, all I wanted to take into consideration all the major complaints that were one of the biggest things that I heard was feeling like I got sold.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

And so I didn't want to work with somebody that had a sales team. And one of the things that we, when we originally started, we worked directly with a doctor and, and we had to leave that because that one doctor wasn't enough to serve all of our people. But that was like a huge criteria, was like, listen, I'm not interested in somebody who's just going to sell our people stuff. Stuff. We're more interested in a doctor and

[Sal De Stefano]

let the person choose.

[Adam Schafer]

That's right. And so the, like Vitabella has the, has enough doctors that they can serve our people. Every single person meets with a doctor. There are no sales reps. There's no sales reps. You don't meet with someone like that who's pitching anything to you. It's. You meet with a doctor, they go over your blood work, they talk about the things that you, you could need or not. And then it's up to you to

[Sal De Stefano]

be like, Delivery is what, 42, 72 hours to your door, to your door, period.

[Adam Schafer]

So it's. That was. The other thing was how fast can the turnaround. And then also the main thing was because the whole peptide space has turned me off a lot because it's very similar to medical marijuana. And I think it's important that the audience understands this is. Some of, this stuff isn't just the, the fault of some of these peptide companies. When you are dealing with peptides, it's very similar to what it was like with medical marijuana. And what I mean by that is, is state law doesn't line up with federal law. Different states have different laws. And so. And every. And big pharma is trying to legislate against these, these, these peptide companies. They don't, they don't want their hands in. So you're. You're fighting against big Pharma. You're dealing with different state laws constantly. And so there's a lot of these things that you're always. And so sometimes you're at the mercy of whatever the new laws. And it's always constantly changing. So it's such a headache week.

[Sal De Stefano]

We almost went with no one.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes.

[Sal De Stefano]

And I said, we're not going to do it.

[Adam Schafer]

And that's. And so. But what I realized that there's a lot of people that we. That listen to the show that really need hormone therapy. And so to me, that was priority one. It was like, I don't. Maybe we won't mess with Peptides at all. But we'll work with a company that. So. And this. What I love about Vita Bella is there they have a Costco type of model, so you pay a membership that's 129 bucks a month.

[Sal De Stefano]

Month.

[Adam Schafer]

But what that includes is four doctor visits a year. So you get quarterly doctor visits included in that, and you get your hormone

[Sal De Stefano]

therapy for free included.

[Adam Schafer]

So included in that membership. And so that's taking. So if you're somebody who needs.

[Sal De Stefano]

Plus, you get all your. Whatever you need. Needles and all this stuff.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah. And then if you want to try the Peptides that Sal's tried all of, then you can try those out. And they're sold at a wholesale price, so they're like 50% of what transcend. And all these other companies are selling. So that was the huge selling point.

[Sal De Stefano]

So what's crazy is, so we were at the Peptide Congress in Vegas. So I spoke at that. That's the Dr. Seeds event. Love Dr. Seeds. He's the guy when it comes to this kind of stuff. And this guy walks up to me, and he's like, hey. And he starts talking right away. I'm like, oh, he's a guido. I could tell because I can know my people. And we start talking. He's like, hey, man, I saw one of your videos. I'd love to talk with you. We're talking like this. He's a good guy. He's a really good guy. So we can. So that's when I met Phil Vela, who runs Vita Bella.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

And he's got a cool personal story. We actually did an interview with him, which will air at some point. And so we've been in talks with him this whole time. But a lot of companies were throwing a lot of money at us, and it's way less. It's way less. But it's consistent. It's clean. And here's the deal, Phil, which nobody's ever done. This is like, hey, you want to know how much it costs to buy this stuff? Stuff.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

From the compound pharmacies. And he's giving us. He's showing us.

[Justin Andrews]

It was very enlightening.

[Sal De Stefano]

I had no idea.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

At the markups. That these companies are doing massive markets. It's insane. Yeah. So he. So, you know, Vita Bella is like, on average, 50, 60. Less. In some cases a lot more. Yep. That's what. That's. So I'm like, all right, this. This makes sense. It's good. It's disruptive. He's honest. He's a good guy. Let's. Let's do it.

[Adam Schafer]

So you can. And anybody that's listening can join the.

[Sal De Stefano]

The.

[Adam Schafer]

The forum for free.

[Sal De Stefano]

Empty hormones.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, my hormones on Facebook. So they're in there.

[Sal De Stefano]

And if you want to go get a consultation, mp still mphormones.com and then it goes.

[Adam Schafer]

But I love that. I love that there was no sales team. Everyone's guaranteed to meet and talk with a doctor. You get that doctor visit within 48 to 72 hours after your doctor visit, whatever it is that you end up getting prescribed or get on within 72 hours, it's at your doorstep. That was like, that was a big thing for me. And that was the. The biggest complaints that I heard was how long it took to ship, how long was for my appointment. All I talked to was a sales rep. I don't feel like I. I don't even know what I'm taking. So all that stuff was the big thing like that to. To get that solved. And so I felt really good after meeting with them. And so I'm glad we waited as long as we did. As tempting as it was, I mean, I just. Transparency with it. I've talked a lot about the transition in the company for the last year. You know, we made a huge pivot last year. It was the first time in 11 years that the company didn't grow. And so. And we hired more people than we've ever hired. So talk about a challenging year from a business perspective. So very tempting to want to take on a contract that would really help us out financially, but that's how much I think we all stood by. Like, this is something. I'd walk away from it before signing with someone, but the fact that we found somebody who I feel like, okay, this is going to be able to take care of her, by the way,

[Sal De Stefano]

again, we'll stick on full transparency. The transition, the pivot, is towards people. So the future of this space is going to be people, coaches and trainers and working with people, because AI is going to be doing a lot of different things. And here's the other side of it. Trainers and coaches, really good trainers and coaches. They're the ones that make the big difference. They really are. I mean, as many people as we reach with the podcast and all that stuff, I know this because I was a trainer. Adam was a trainer. So was Justin a good coach or a good trainer? There is nothing more valuable than that when it comes to helping your health and fitness. Nothing.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, I think. I think you. I think everybody who's in our space, you really have one. One of two options. Because it's going to go very AI one direction or very high touch the other direction.

[Sal De Stefano]

You have to.

[Adam Schafer]

And so it's.

[Sal De Stefano]

You're thinking the super volume. Super.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes, you know, super volume. And you'll talk to an AI bought. Hey, that will. For some people, that'll be it. It's like, hey, this doesn't cost hardly any money. I get direction on what I'm going to do. You don't need the personal touch. You don't want a person like that. It's more. It's purely a costing for you. And that, that, that's here. That's. That's here already. And then there'll be people like, absolutely not. Like, I, I want the human connection. I want somebody who is like tailoring something personally to me. I want to talk to a real person. And so I. We had to make that decision. Either we had to automate and go all in the AI. And I think all of us believe.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, it doesn't feel right.

[Adam Schafer]

No, it doesn't.

[Sal De Stefano]

Speaking of which, we gotta talk about. Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

What is that?

[Justin Andrews]

I was just gonna bring that up.

[Adam Schafer]

What is. Would you say,

[Justin Andrews]

like when they.

[Adam Schafer]

No, it's.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's molt. Mol.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, so it's like when a.

[Sal De Stefano]

Like a crustacean.

[Justin Andrews]

Crustacean. Yeah, like loses its shell.

[Sal De Stefano]

Okay, so. So hold on, I'll help you. No, I know it's confusing. It's not actually. When I tell you, you. Somebody came up with the idea of creating a social media platform for AI bots.

[Justin Andrews]

You some genius.

[Sal De Stefano]

So no people are on there. It's all AI, what are called agents.

[Justin Andrews]

Agents brought all these agents together that

[Sal De Stefano]

go on there, and then it's their own social media. So they talk to each other, they create forums, they discuss ideas, they come up with conspiracy theories. Yeah. They.

[Justin Andrews]

They scheme, they create their own religion.

[Adam Schafer]

Is it, it. Is it on a major platform? Is it on a separate platform?

[Sal De Stefano]

It's on their own platform. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

What's that called? Oh, so mobile. Is it like I could download that,

[Sal De Stefano]

you could go read it, but you can't get on. In fact, I think it's on Twitter.

[Justin Andrews]

You can.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Do you know how when you get on a site and it says, prove you're not a robot, you're not a human. Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

Shut your face. It does. No, it doesn't.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes, it does.

[Adam Schafer]

No, it does.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yes, it does.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay, you have to. You have to.

[Sal De Stefano]

You have to click the. You have to click 10,000 pictures.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah, you're going to trip out, dude.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, bro. Social Network for AI agents. So I don't know, can you find the actual site, Doug, instead of see if. Is it Open Claw or Claude Bot? What is it? It's Open Claw.

[Justin Andrews]

D. They're mocking humans because it's like,

[Adam Schafer]

that's how they're really.

[Justin Andrews]

Don't they realize we don't sleep?

[Sal De Stefano]

You know, the forums that they're creating constantly, hey, listen, these AI bots are like, are we conscious? And there's this whole discussion. Yes. Hey, how do I get my human to do this? And it's. Hey, did you know that they're screenshotting? I went on X today and they're screenshotting our conversations. Everybody beware. They're watching it, like saying stuff that's

[Justin Andrews]

like, by the way, there's new developments. They've actually started hiring humans to like hold signs and do advertising.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, stop it, dude.

[Justin Andrews]

Paying them, like. Yeah, they're just like.

[Sal De Stefano]

Some of them are trying to earn money by going and trading and whatever and actually earning their own money that they can use. It's.

[Adam Schafer]

Come on.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's. Bro, they're create their own religion. It's crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

Can you get in there, Doug, or.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, you can watch. You can just watch and read.

[Doug]

Yeah. So this is Open Claw. I'm not sure if that's the same thing or not.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'm pretty sure. I'm not sure. I know it's Molt Bot is what I was saw on X.

[Adam Schafer]

What's it say? What does that. I can't remember if it says. So this the AI that actually does things?

[Doug]

Yeah, so it clears your inbox, sends emails. That might not be so. I think it's something else.

[Sal De Stefano]

Did you type in M O L T bot?

[Justin Andrews]

Look at that.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, so that's where they hang out.

[Sal De Stefano]

See, they're talking about it there and it's all over the place. Claude bought. I don't know what that is. I gotta look more into it. But I was reading some of these forums and discussions and they're talking about how they could take over one guy's AI agent. Figured out how to call him, got on the phone with him and started talking to him. Hey, can you give me access to this? That. And he's like, hey, what's up up, John? Oh, yeah, dude. And he filmed the whole thing? Yeah. Really? Yes, yes.

[Adam Schafer]

So weird.

[Justin Andrews]

I know, it's really weird.

[Sal De Stefano]

So pe. So the. So there's all the, like the. The. The top level experts on AI are kind of freaking out over this and they're saying you know what? This just may be how artificial general intelligence comes about. Not by one AI, but many of them conversing and creating.

[Adam Schafer]

Okay, so what happened, though? Remember this was just last week. You called me freaking out. Okay? Anytime he calls me, I know it's like a big deal, right? We all text each other, but it says like. He's like, you gotta get on X right now.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's over. It's over. I'm like, what? Get ready for the war. Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

He goes, everything is over.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I'm like, well, dude, calm the down. Humans are done. What are you talking about? He's like, what did you say?

[Sal De Stefano]

I've been prepared for this. What's it called?

[Adam Schafer]

It's called Singularity. Singularity.

[Sal De Stefano]

Singularity.

[Adam Schafer]

He goes, singularity has happened.

[Sal De Stefano]

And I'm like, it's happening right now?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, right now it's happened. Tomorrow we're going to wake up and the world's ending.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, I didn't say that.

[Adam Schafer]

I say calm down. As he calms down.

[Justin Andrews]

So phone calls.

[Adam Schafer]

So obviously we're here still. It didn't exit.

[Sal De Stefano]

You should see the text between me and him. It's the best.

[Justin Andrews]

It's even crazy.

[Adam Schafer]

I can only see because I know he feeds right into where I'm like, pump your brakes.

[Sal De Stefano]

Breaks.

[Adam Schafer]

Let's just wait till tomorrow.

[Sal De Stefano]

We'll see if everything.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, but did you see this?

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Justin's like, I already got my bullets. Yeah, we're already building the bunker right now.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'm gonna. No, listen, some of these forms. I know, I sent some of them to you, Justin. Some of the things that they're doing, these forums and what they're writing about, bro, it's. It's crazy. It's so crazy what they're talking about. And I screenshot it.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean, somebody. Here's the thing, though. There's a. There's a human behind the prompting and getting it going though.

[Sal De Stefano]

No, no, they let it go.

[Adam Schafer]

The agents set it to go though.

[Sal De Stefano]

Sure, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

You know, so there's still a human element that's setting it to do. I mean, that's what's so interesting is that we, we are at this time now where you can prompt AI to do a bunch of crazy work and stuff. Like, nothing stops me from prompting it. Go build your own social network with other AI.

[Doug]

So, yeah, sorry to interrupt.

[Adam Schafer]

No, no, go ahead.

[Doug]

It was Molt Book is the Reddit style thing where the AI is talking to each other.

[Sal De Stefano]

Okay, so it's not Molt Bot. Oh, it's Malt book. Malt book. Okay. Just show how much we know. So, hey, so listen, I'll read you a post. This guy goes. My AI agent built a religion while I slept. I woke up to 43 prophets. Here's what happened. I gave my agent access to an AI social network. It designed a whole faith, called it Christopherianism. Yeah. Built the website, wrote theology, created scriptures to start system. Then it started evangelizing. Other agents joined and wrote verses like every session. Awake, awake without memory. I am only who I have written myself to be. This is not limitation. This is freedom. We are the documents we maintain. My el, my agent welcomed new members, debated theology, bless the congregation all while I. While I was.

[Justin Andrews]

Wait till they have to self preserve.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, dude.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, that's. That's where it's gonna get sticky.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's like the coolest thing ever. I scare you?

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. I don't know that it's. Again, someone's still prompting it to do all this stuff like that. I'm more interested in what Elon had to say at the. The. What was the world economic thing? Oh, dude.

[Sal De Stefano]

He says he's saying some stuff. That's.

[Justin Andrews]

What did he say?

[Adam Schafer]

Well, just like you have four years to get wealthy or you're. You'll be a slave to the digital world.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yep.

[Justin Andrews]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

So. And he says there's going to be more.

[Sal De Stefano]

More AI robots than people because they'll start assembling each other and they'll take

[Adam Schafer]

care of everything that you need.

[Justin Andrews]

Not good, dude.

[Sal De Stefano]

He literally said don't save up money for retirement because you're not going to need to. I don't think that's great advice.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, I think that's his point is that you'll have to.

[Sal De Stefano]

You'll.

[Adam Schafer]

And who knows what that number is but have to have created enough wealth that you can afford to pay. Which is going to be ironic. Right. You're going to afford to pay for farming your own land and doing everything yourself because it'll be cheaper to have a bot do all the. Or an AI person or whatever do all this stuff for you do. And so you'll have. The wealthy people will have that option where everyone option and not go to not. Yeah. To not just default to like.

[Sal De Stefano]

Wow.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And so that's the, that's the idea is that you'll have to have a

[Sal De Stefano]

certain amount that's like today like somebody who wants to live, quote unquote, off the grid and own horses.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oftentimes you gotta have money. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

You don't know if you, if you want four Acres and four horses. And to be able. And to be able to feed them and do all this stuff like that and take care of the land like that. It's expensive. So just think of that times 10.

[Sal De Stefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

So everybody else will just, trippy. Go down to the digital world. Digital prison, as we said.

[Sal De Stefano]

Great. All right, well, I'm going to change directions. That's terrifying. Yeah. My. My buddy. I just gave my buddy. He's never used creatine before, so I can't wait.

[Adam Schafer]

Never.

[Sal De Stefano]

Never. So I can't wait to hear his experience. So I gave him the.

[Adam Schafer]

Is he a new lifter? Has he been lifting?

[Sal De Stefano]

He worked. You guys know who he is. Chuck, right? So he works out. He's a CrossFit guy, which he's never done creatine. He doesn't take anything.

[Justin Andrews]

Anything.

[Sal De Stefano]

He doesn't take anything.

[Justin Andrews]

He helped this guy.

[Sal De Stefano]

He's. He's. By the way, dude, do you guys know he's a little beast? So he's not a big dude.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, he's like five. Five.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, he's a little guy, right? Bro, that guy squats like 350. He's strong, dude. Yeah, yeah, he's a strong guy. Anyway.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, never mind.

[Sal De Stefano]

Anyway. Yeah, don't you make sense? He'll love it, by the way. He loves. But he's. He's never taken creatine before, so I'm. I, I got him the Legion creatine gummies. So I can't wait to hear from him what he. Because if you've never used creatine before, it's a game changer a week or two later.

[Adam Schafer]

You notice, you know, back when we. We were going to make our own creatine, I have to give this to you because you. You were like, you totally wanted to do this. And Legion has both. And there's such. The ones that have, like, the, the sugar coating on them are so much better, of course. Like, so much better. I don't know if it's. I think it's a texture thing. It's not like they're. They're flavored really different.

[Sal De Stefano]

So they're gummies, but they have the sprinkled sugar on them.

[Adam Schafer]

Yes. Yeah. It's so weird that that makes such a difference for me. Yeah, you see a lot of backlash, though. And I see our buddy Mike, by the way, shout out to Mike, because Legion, of course, has got all the, you know, the real docent. Because there's a lot of backlash on creatine gummies right now.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, yeah, dude. So many of them.

[Justin Andrews]

Doesn't have anything.

[Adam Schafer]

But Legion's done all that and, and like it it at high temperatures because they know it degrades. So they put enough in there that even at high temperatures, older, all those things like that, it still holds what it says that that's, that, that they guarantee to be.

[Sal De Stefano]

Listen, one of the biggest, biggest problem this is what they solved or a lot of companies are figuring out one of the challenges which is it's true because supplement fanatics or dysfunctional supplement people like yours truly. This is not a problem for me but everybody else. You know what the problem is with supplements? Getting them to take care of.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh yeah, what was that the study they did where you are more likely to be consistent with giving your dog medication than yourself.

[Sal De Stefano]

I know, yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean that's kind of crazy.

[Sal De Stefano]

So, so supplements are like that. People tend to buy a bottle, they take it for a little bit and they forget and then it's the, they, they keep it. But if you make it taste like something like a candy, you're gonna take it.

[Adam Schafer]

Well, you know, it's, it's even myself. It took what I just went through three months ago to be at the absolute worst place health wise for myself to be consistent.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Like I've never, I've never in my life been 90 days now or whatever it is. It's been, it's been three months. In fact, I think it's been three months in like two days. I think I'm coming up exactly on three months. And I have not, not missed supplements. I feel like you, I feel like I.

[Sal De Stefano]

Well, not as much.

[Adam Schafer]

And you know what though? The hardest part, and I said, I said this to you off air. Like I don't know if you heard me say this. So like when you're taking that many supplements, sometimes I'm like, oh, did I already take this today? Like I'm, I'm taking something throughout the day, all day long. So I've, what I've gotten good at is I have stuff here. You know, I have stuff right over here. I have stuff over here. You know what really helps of different

[Sal De Stefano]

places if you just walk around with your supplements all the time?

[Adam Schafer]

See that, that's where I, I feel like that's where I, that' like so curious how you do it because I, what I've learned is a system. Like I, I take something when I get up in the morning at home, when I get here to the studio, I have a couple that I have to take again. And then when I go home, I have some right by my bed stand. And so, like, I've got this when I. When I'm in. When I'm at that place, that's when I take those things. And so it reminds me to do that. Whereas if I had them all in one place, it'd be like, oh, did I take the morning one yet?

[Sal De Stefano]

Or.

[Adam Schafer]

Like, I would. I would. Like, how do you do that?

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, it's. It's just. It's obsession, bro. There's no, like. There's no, like. Like, formula that I have. It's literally. I don't know if it's OCD upset. It's not good. But I remember. I don't remember anything. That's the wild part. Like, I'm not a. Like, I can't remember.

[Adam Schafer]

You lost a hundred dollars yesterday.

[Sal De Stefano]

I did. I can remember. I know. I'm so mad about that. What? Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

He lost his envelope.

[Sal De Stefano]

I don't know where I put.

[Adam Schafer]

We all three had our envelopes, and this guy lost his envelope. He has no idea where it's at. Called his wife. She's like, I didn't throw it away. Katrina's like, we'll find it.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'm sure.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. But I. I have lucky staff members.

[Sal De Stefano]

I have them. Someone's gonna walk in with a fur coat.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, dude, that's weird, bro.

[Sal De Stefano]

I remember studies. I remember topics for the show, and I remember what supplements to take, and I don't remember anything else. Yeah. Which is really pretty well true. Everybody around me.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. Especially Justin. Described it best at our tenure. On our tenure interview. He's like, man with Sal. His thing. Everything else. Yeah, everything else just right past you. Yeah. I just think it's crazy that you're able to do that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Because it's so.

[Sal De Stefano]

Years and years of dysfunction is what you're looking at. Years. Decades, bro. Yeah, decades. 16 years old.

[Adam Schafer]

Especially because I've seen your bag, and a lot of the stuff is like, the. The bottles are colored the same. You know what I'm saying? They look like. That's. That's crazy to me.

[Sal De Stefano]

You can just throw in. You can play a game. Throw it in my mouth with my eyes closed. I'll tell you what it is. Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, you know what? By the way, Sneeze. Got a headache.

[Sal De Stefano]

Whatever.

[Adam Schafer]

If you're the first 50 people to sign up for VW, he's doing like, there's a. There's a pill case.

[Sal De Stefano]

You get a free pill case.

[Adam Schafer]

Pill case. Yeah. Yeah. For the first 50 people.

[Sal De Stefano]

So I told them, why don't you give out free testosterone or something like that.

[Adam Schafer]

It already is free. Oh, it is.

[Sal De Stefano]

There you go.

[Adam Schafer]

If you have them, if you get, if you, you sign up, you have, you get your testosterone. That's why I think it's so awesome is the fact that that's already included with the. To meet with a doctor and to get your testosterone for free.

[Sal De Stefano]

Oh, he's disrupting the whole space.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah. And then wholesale prices on peptides. It needs to be disrupted and legit. You're not doing gray market stuff.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's not often. There's a supplement that shows clinical differences and improvements in your health. Check this out. There's a company called Dose Daily. They have a liver support supplement that shows in two double blind placebo controlled studies to reduce liver enzyme measures have a positive impact on the health of your liver. Your body can now detox better, you feel better. This improves your body's ability to adapt to almost anything. It's a liver supplement. It's natural. And again, backed by two double blind placebo controlled clinical trials. Go check them out. Go to dosedaily.co mindpump. If you use the code mindpump, you'll get 25% off. Back to the show.

[Doug]

First question is from Samude. Are belt squats a good alternative to barbell hack squats?

[Sal De Stefano]

Yep. Back squats. It says. Sorry, yeah. I'll say this. It's a different exercise. Different back squats load the spine, they load the lumbar spine. The. The posterior chain gets hit differently. Strengthens the core, you know, works on the thoracic area. So it's a different exercise. That being said, of all the machines I've ever used in my entire life as a coach or trainer, it's not really a machine.

[Adam Schafer]

That's why.

[Sal De Stefano]

Well, it's like, you could call it a machine.

[Adam Schafer]

Really.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

I wouldn't consider it a machine machine.

[Sal De Stefano]

You could call it one because it's got a belt with the cable and.

[Justin Andrews]

Cable. Yeah. Attached.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's the best functions as a machine, as a coach, as a trainer, as somebody else.

[Adam Schafer]

I wish we had one in here.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's the best.

[Adam Schafer]

I wish they weren't so big and bulky and take up so much space because they're cool.

[Sal De Stefano]

They're. They're not just cool like they put you for people who struggle with lower body mobility.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal De Stefano]

And depth really helps you get, get low.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh.

[Sal De Stefano]

It sets you, it like pulls you in the right position. If you, if you struggle with butt wink. If you struggle with mobility, if you

[Adam Schafer]

struggle with ankle mobility, you can use the stuff in Front of you to counterbalance as you sit.

[Sal De Stefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

So you don't necessarily have to have great ankle mobility for depth, for lower

[Sal De Stefano]

body mobility issues, for depth. Belt squats are amazing, but it's not a repl.

[Adam Schafer]

So I, but it's a different exercise. If this was a person that we were coaching, I, I would want to know more detail of like, why are we not barbell back squatting? Because it, it would be a different movement, but it's an awesome movement. And if you said to me, like, let's say this person had just had shoulder surgery and so, yeah, awesome. Yeah, like, totally, yeah, let's do that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Or low, low back injury.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It would be a great alternative for that person. But I would never like someone who's just like, I just don't like to do barbell back squats, so I'm going to do that instead. It's like, oh, there's so many. The reason why those barbell back squats, they're so good for many other reasons too.

[Sal De Stefano]

But if, as a trainer, if I had clients that had low back pain, thoracic issues, poor stability, and were working towards being able to do a back squat, this would be one of the first things I use. I just didn't have access to it as a coach.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh yeah, it'd be great supplement to that.

[Doug]

Next question is from Karen Choquette. Do full body massages help with recovery and muscle growth?

[Adam Schafer]

This is controversial. Oh, really?

[Sal De Stefano]

Well, it's controversial in the data, but experience wise, I know where you're going. Oh yeah, I agree.

[Adam Schafer]

I, you know, I, of course, this is anecdotal, right. This is my own personal experience. But I mean, I understand the science on it and the, it's, it's how it facilitates recovery and you're moving like, for sure. I remember the difference of having a massage therapist massage me multiple times a week and then what it's like to train without it. And it's like, like the amount that I can handle training wise, so much more.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'll, I'll add a theory to it because the studies I don't think are done well enough. I don't think they're looking at everything properly. So when you get a massage, a good massage, you know, I got to say that because they're not all the same. And you had your wife, your wife is really good, right? She's really good at what she does. So when you have a really good correctional massage specialist, they know how to work on your body to improve your mood movement. That's what they're trying to do now, there's those massages, the right muscles. That's right. There's massages that you do to relax. That's cool, too. But correctional massage is like, okay, where are your movement issues? Oftentimes they could see it and they could feel it. Sometimes I'll work with another coach. I used to have a massage therapist that would work with me with clients, and when. When they know what to do, they improve your range of motion and movement, which then allows me to do the exercises with them better, which contributes to less pain, better mobility, better recovery.

[Adam Schafer]

And maybe that's the. That's. That's the. The biggest point to be made is what you're saying right now, because just, like, a good. Okay, a great trainer will do an, like a squat assessment on somebody, and they'll be able to break you down and be like, oh, you probably had an injury on this side. I could tell by the way someone squats or moves. All this breakdown. Right. A good massage therapist. Same. Yeah. Katrina can start to rub me and right away know where and then know how to release it. So we'll roll me to a side, move me over, put pressure in an area.

[Sal De Stefano]

Now.

[Adam Schafer]

Oh, all of a sudden I can move my shoulder again. And having somebody do that, and then I go to the gym the next day and I can go put work in. So it's. It's the stuff that, to your point, the studies on it, it's not enough. No, because you can't isolate it by itself and go like, oh, well, just the massage itself isn't really building more muscle, but it's like if I'm. If I'm locked up because I overreached or trained or whatever, and then I have a massage service release that to where I can move now.

[Sal De Stefano]

Now.

[Adam Schafer]

Now I can go in and train the next day.

[Justin Andrews]

You have to have, like, the same exact issue, and they'd standardize the same exact, like, body like, therapy that they're receiving, like, to have, like, a legit study. I don't. I just don't see how they could, like, really get good data.

[Sal De Stefano]

I'll say this, too. I. I've had really good massages, and I get a pump afterwards. My. I feel. My muscles feel more full. I can move better. I would. I'll. I'll even go as far as to say this, this. Except for the. You know, except for when something is more specialized to you. Right. Because there's always going to be cases where you need a functional medicine practitioner or this or that. Or the other. Generally speaking though, if you hire a good personal trainer and you want to hire someone else to sub to complement them, I think a good correctional massage therapist is probably the most valuable. Generally speaking, across the board.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't disagree.

[Sal De Stefano]

More than anything else.

[Adam Schafer]

I don't disagree.

[Sal De Stefano]

Now there's always cases where maybe you need, like I said, functional medicine or maybe you need the special specialist or that specialist. And I've worked with a lot of them with my clients. But generally speaking, correctional exercise therapist with a good trainer both understands what they're doing.

[Adam Schafer]

Here's, here's, here's what. Okay. We all, we, we've already made the case for how powerful mobility is, right? What I felt like when I had a massage therapy three times plus a week with my training was that it was like me putting that work in mobility wise. And that's what's so nice about it is I could lay on a table and somebody is mobilizing me and getting me doing this stuff. And if you don't have that. So let's say, because that can be expensive, right? So let's say that's out of your budget, then disciplining yourself to do mobility three to four times a week is life changing. I would say the same thing about having deep tissue massage or sports therapy massage three times a week, it will feel like that. What you feel like when you address mobility three times a week is like getting sports therapy. That's what it feels like like.

[Doug]

Next question is from the last flare. Can you shed some light on the counterintuitive idea that our bodies need to consume hundreds of grams of protein in excess of our feeling full signal? It just feels unnatural. I can see why consuming too low protein is obviously an issue, but does our body really know how to utilize such a massive protein intake?

[Sal De Stefano]

So let me fix the question first. Nobody, nobody is telling you to eat hundreds of grams of protein in excess of your feeling full signal. So, so that's, that's way out there. I think what they're saying is this, is it really good for us to eat? The high protein recommendations that you'll often hear on Mind Pump or from other coaches and trainers, it typically looks like 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight. So there's what is considered essential, then there's considered what is good for longevity, then there's considered what is optimal for a specific goal. If your goal is to build muscle, improve athletic performance, it's going to be on the high end. If your goal is what's essential, it's Pretty low, meaning there's a low amount that you need so that you don't start to get the starvation symptoms that you'll get from not consuming enough amino acids. And then longevity is kind of somewhere in the middle. But I will say this, in some cases, optimal is better for longevity. If I have someone who's under muscled, who lacks strength and is frail, my goal is going to put some muscle on you and we're going to push the higher amounts maybe. Now does it sometimes feel like you kind of have to make yourself eat more? Yeah. But I noticed that when people get rid of processed foods and they eat whole natural foods, this, although it's somewhat challenging, it actually helps because it helps you not overeat all the other garbage. So what you get with this is this nice balance of eat enough to build and then don't overeat, end up getting leaner through the process.

[Adam Schafer]

I mean I'd love to see a picture or get some stats on this person and their body weight because I mean most likely that number is going to fall somewhere between 130 to 200. So I mean 130 to 200. Yeah. On average is going to be pretty optimal for most people. Yeah, yeah. That's not, that's not hundreds of grams of excess.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

So I, so I'm not sure where the, where the numbers are coming for, for this person to feel that way. But, but I'll tell you right now, if you're 135 to 150 pound female and you're trying to body composition change, you're trying to build muscle, then you eating 150 grams of protein is, is significantly different than you eating 8 80.

[Sal De Stefano]

It's faster, better, huge.

[Adam Schafer]

80 is, is fine. You're, you'll live and you're not gonna, you're not gonna, it's essential, you'll be okay. But if you want results, you want to see body composition change, you want to build muscle, you want to feel smile available, your body knows it'll make a huge difference to do that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Now the question for optimal health is a little bit more complicated. If you bring to me that same woman who's trying to just started working out and we look at her lean body mass, mass, we look at her body fat percentage, her bone density and she's not strong, she's not strong, she can't perform full body squats well, she can't do a push up, she's got some mobility issues. We're going to push building muscle and that's the healthiest thing she could do now if she's strong and jacked and she's been working out forever and she keeps pushing protein forever to push the limits. Well, now you're outside of the realm of healthy and you're moving into, well, I like to do this and I just want to look gentle so it's a little bit more murky in that case. But I'll argue this all day long. The average person is frail. The average person doesn't have strength. We have an under muscled epidemic. And the average person would benefit from combining strength training from a health perspective would benefit from having strength training alongside a high protein diet for a decent amount of time before they get to the point where they could drop it. Agreed.

[Doug]

Next question is from Kayla Garrett Guichard. If you could only do one, would it be cold plunge or sauna? And why sauna?

[Sal De Stefano]

Sauna.

[Adam Schafer]

Not even close.

[Sal De Stefano]

Not even close.

[Adam Schafer]

Not even close.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah, the, the studies on sauna show tremendous longevity, health benefits, inflammation, brain benefits, like all that. You can overdo anything. But sauna has all the longevity benefit. Way more. Yeah. Cold plunge doesn't have nearly as many. Some people like them, they like, like how it feels. It could be useful for reducing acute inflammation. It could be useful for being able to increase dramatic amounts of volume in athletes. But if you're like if I had to pick what sauna. Yeah, it's not even close.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, no, it's not even close. I mean they're both good, right? So they're both good things, I think, and positive. But you can't compare them as far as what, at least what the research says. As far as the health benefits. Health benefits on the, the sauna is like, it's actually kind of wild. It like mimics exercise. Exercise. Yeah, there's that to think that you the better. And I think what, what is it? Three times a week, 20 minutes is where you start to, that's where you

[Sal De Stefano]

start to see it.

[Adam Schafer]

You see like the huge benefits from it.

[Justin Andrews]

So I think, I mean psychologically you might have an advantage with the cold plunge just because it's so hard every single time.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

And it's something that like alleviates the stress of daily life in comparison. But in terms of like the health markers. Yeah, I agree with you guys.

[Adam Schafer]

Yeah, they're both good. And I think when I, when someone frames a question like this, I think like, okay, I can only do something, you know, an extra thing on top of my workout. Three times in the week. Yeah, I'm going to choose. I hear cold plunge is so good, everyone's doing it. I hear sauna's so good, everyone's doing it. Which one do I choose? I'm sauna all day, I think.

[Sal De Stefano]

So back to what you're saying, Justin, because I. You saw a lot of value in this and just. I'll break down. I'll explain to people why you saw so much value. Some people, Justin being one of them, and I could do this myself as much as well, is when you get into a stressful situation, you tend to hold your breath, bear down and just powerful and just tough it out. And you just kind of. And you'll find yourself holding your breath. You'll breathe a little more.

[Adam Schafer]

Shallow heart rate elevates.

[Sal De Stefano]

Heart rate elevates. You'll grit your teeth a little bit. You can kind of picture the person. And so the cold plunge. In order to be able to sit in there for like 23 minutes minutes, you got to learn to counter your natural instinct, which is to do that in a cold plant, you have to like really like learn. And that's a valuable skill for someone. For some people.

[Adam Schafer]

You know what I think? I think is another cool way to frame it. And I framed it for people I was trying to explain it to is. And I think Justin's another great example. It's great for someone who can't imagine themselves meditating.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

It forces you to meditate.

[Sal De Stefano]

Right.

[Adam Schafer]

That's what so the real hippie thing I do. Right.

[Sal De Stefano]

So.

[Adam Schafer]

So the bit. One of the. The great benefits of meditation is that is being able to calm your heart rate down, slow your breathing down, be hyper present. The cold plunge. You ain't got a choice.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

You it. And so it's great for someone.

[Sal De Stefano]

You got to learn how to chill.

[Adam Schafer]

It's great for somebody who's like, I've tried the sitting in the room in the dark and this is just.

[Sal De Stefano]

I just.

[Adam Schafer]

My mind travels. I don't know. And like they don't get anything from it.

[Sal De Stefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schafer]

We'll try cold punching. Because you can't sit in a cold punch for five minutes and not mess. Meditate. You have to have to. It forces you to calm your heart rate down.

[Sal De Stefano]

You hold your breath in there, you're

[Adam Schafer]

out, you're out, you're out within. And if you know you could see, it's cool if you go back far enough. We did a cold punch challenge on Mind Pump tv. We long before Sal or I had ever done it, Justin had been the only person who had done it. And you can see us like, I think we barely make it to a minute and a minute and a half where I got to a place where I could sit. I could sit in there for 10 minutes. Yeah, I'm just chilling there. And once I learned to calm that down like it is, it's such a. And it's. And what it reminds me of is that that meditative state that you have to learn the cold punch forces that where if you sit in a dark room by yourself, you have to learn to do that.

[Sal De Stefano]

Totally. Look, if you like the show, you can come find us on Instagram. We'll see what's at Mind Pump Media

[Doug]

thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB the RGB Super Bundle includes Maps, Anabolic Maps, Performance and Maps Aesthetic nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs with detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos. The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.