2819: You'd Look Better With MORE Body Fat

Summary

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Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth – Episode 2819 Summary

Title: You’d Look Better With MORE Body Fat
Date: March 21, 2026
Hosts: Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, Justin Andrews, Doug Egge
Main Theme: Challenging the fitness industry's obsession with extreme leanness, explaining why “looking better fatter” often equates to actually being healthier, more attractive, and better performing, especially for fitness fanatics who already have a solid muscular base.

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Episode Purpose & Overview

The Mind Pump crew cuts through prevailing body fat myths in the fitness industry, arguing that most fitness enthusiasts—and even some dedicated bodybuilders—would look, feel, and perform much better if they allowed their body fat percentage to rise above the commonly idolized ultra-lean standards. Backed with physiological, psychological, and practical examples, they coach live callers, address hormone health, performance, attractiveness, body image, and share real coaching stories that reinforce their science-backed, experience-driven approach to sustainable fitness.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. You’d Look Better Fatter: Why Lean ≠ Better

• Target: Overly lean fitness fanatics, not just extreme competitors
• “If you’re fit, have muscle, you probably—as a woman—would look better around 23, 24, as a dude 13, 14 body fat.” – Sal (03:00)
• Social media and fitness culture idolize very low body fat (e.g., 10% for men, 19% for women), but in reality, moderate levels are both healthier and generally more attractive.
• Surveyed preferences show most people prefer physiques with more body fat/muscle for their perceived health and vitality.

2. Physiology & Performance at Higher Body Fat

• Better hormone health, stamina, resilience, fertility, and immune function when body fat is slightly higher (e.g., 13–15% men, 22–25% women).
• Lower body fat for naturals often leads to “sacrificed testosterone, immune health, and performance” – Sal (07:20)
• Genuine athletic performance and hormonal profiles improve when not chasing extreme leanness.

3. Body Image, Self-Perception & Social Media Algorithms

• The fitness industry and social platforms “communicate body obsession, not health” – Sal (08:37)
• Constant exposure to images of extremely lean individuals distorts what’s healthy or attractive.
• Advice: “You have to consciously change your algorithm. Click less of this. It shifts how you view yourself.” – Sal (20:31)
• Notable discussion on instructing women especially to curate their feeds to protect their self-image.

4. Muscle Mass Is Key: The Look You Want

• Building muscle at a higher body fat percentage almost always improves appearance and health, more so than cutting to very low fat.
• “You would look better fatter…if you just added muscle, too.” – Adam (14:52)
• Use real coaching examples (e.g., Corinne and Danny) to show clients looked, felt, and performed better after increasing calories, lowering training volume, and gaining a bit of fat.

5. Face, Aging & Body Fat: “Ozempic Face”

• Extreme leanness leads to a gaunt, aged face for both men and women.
• “Your face doesn’t look as good as when you’re at 14% body fat.” – Sal (16:10)

6. Social Life, Flexibility, and Mental Health

• Being ultra-lean demands obsessive dietary restraint and kills dietary flexibility—potentially damaging mental health.
• The supposed happiness and health benefits at very low body fat are actually an illusion.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• “Some body fat on muscle looks great.” – Adam (04:41)
• “Most people…when you ask the opposite sex, they point to someone not as lean.” – Sal (03:10)
• “If you try to cut, you’re not going to like the way it feels.” – Sal to Rebecca (103:28)
• “You at a higher body fat percentage—if you just added muscle—would look better.” – Adam (15:48)
• “When you’re too lean, you just look older. Your skin doesn’t look as vibrant and healthy.” – Justin (17:46)
• “Focus on building muscle. If you put on 5 pounds of muscle, you’ll look 3% leaner, even if your body fat is unchanged.” – Adam (111:31)

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Notable Call-In Coaching Segments

[69:11] – Benjamin (Switzerland): Formerly 135 lbs Overweight

• Struggles: Burnout post-extreme weight loss, chronic fatigue, multi-career stress, fear of regaining.
• Advice:
  • Go into a year-long “rejuvenation & rebuilding” period (Maps 15 + walking)
  • Stop tracking, just hit protein and eat whole foods.
  • “What you did to lose 135 pounds is a lot harder than what you’re doing now…you’re being really hard on yourself.” – Sal (81:07)
  • Lean into sharing struggles; it makes you a better coach (84:00).

[93:04] – John (Kentucky): 47, Cancer Survivor & Lifelong Dieter

• Struggles: Coming back from years of being “the fat guy,” managing TRT, diabetic meds, recent weight drop, injury, consistency.
• Advice: Work with a coach for accountability, gradual habit change, honest communication; avoid all-or-nothing cycles.
  • “The coach will be very effective the more honest you are.” – Sal (98:06)

[101:27] – Rebecca (Florida): Should Lean Women Cut?

• Struggles: Both she and her husband want to cut after bulking.
• Advice:
  • She should not cut (“You look low 20’s % BF—don’t go on a cut, you’ll lose muscle and feel worse.” – Sal (103:28)).
  • Keep building muscle, maybe recomp by swapping alcohol for meals.
  • “If you just replace extra wine with protein meals, you’ll build muscle and lean out.” – Adam (107:09)

[111:51] – Angela (Indiana): Perimenopausal Multi-Job Mom

• Struggles: Lots of stress, consistent activity without body change, recurrent injuries.
• Advice:
  • Do less, not more—switch to lower-volume program (Maps 15 Muscle Mommy).
  • Increase calories slightly.
  • Be patient: “It takes a minute for the body to reorganize and say, hey, I’m being fed again…then comes the aesthetic results.” – Adam (115:19)

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Additional Important Topics & Timestamps

• Optimizing social media for body positivity: 20:31–24:58
• Parenting, teen social media & tech challenges: 25:19–43:38
• College as a rite of passage in AI-age: 41:09–46:21
• Farmed vs. wild-caught fish & food quality: 46:33–49:40
• Manukora honey healing properties: 51:51–54:05
• Money & Happiness: 55:36–65:37
  • “Best ROI on happiness: giving it away where you see the impact.” – Sal (58:29)

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Recurring Themes

• Individualization: What’s optimal varies by individual, phase of life, muscle mass, stress, and goals—rigid adherence to body fat “ideals” is harmful.
• Real-Life > Numbers: Scale and body fat numbers are less important than how you look, perform, and feel, and how sustainable your routine is.
• “Less is more” is often true—especially for recovery, hormone health, and long-term progress in well-trained or stressed individuals.
• Kindness to self, focus on health—especially for women 40+, chasing lower and lower bf is a losing battle.

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In Their Own Words: Top Quotes by Timestamp

• 03:00 – Sal: “If you’re fit, you got muscle…as a woman, you’d look better around 23, 24, as a dude 13, 14 body fat…”
• 07:20 – Sal: “Most natural dudes go from 15% to 10%—they sacrifice testosterone, hormone health, immune health, and performance.”
• 16:10 – Sal: “Your face doesn’t look as good at 10% as at 14% body fat. For women, teens are even worse than the low twenties.”
• 20:31 – Sal: “Change your algorithm…Click ‘see less of this.’ It’ll shift how you view yourself.”
• 55:46 – Sal: “Best ROI on happiness? Give it away—see the outcome. You get a high spike in happiness that lasts a long time.”
• 81:07 – Sal (to Benjamin): “You did something way harder than what you’re doing now…you’re afraid of going back, but you’ve done amazing.”

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Actionable Takeaways

• General fitness fans (not prepping for competition): Don’t chase the lowest body fat possible. Moderate, sustainable levels support health, looks, and life enjoyment.
• Women (esp. 40+): Stay in the low 20s% BF, keep building muscle rather than cutting; cutting risks muscle and hormone loss, fatigue, aging skin, etc.
• Muscle is the real body composition “hack.” Focus on getting stronger and your shape will improve, often without needing to cut body fat further.
• Social media users: Clean up your feed to support a healthier, more realistic body image.
• Post-dieters/weight loss maintainers: Prioritize recovery, patience, slow increases in food and strength—“less is more” for long-term success.

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For listeners who haven’t tuned in:
This episode is a must-listen if you feel stuck chasing “leanness” for the sake of it or wonder why you aren’t getting the look or feeling you expect from dialing up the fitness intensity. The Mind Pump hosts blend coaching wisdom, personal stories, and a no-nonsense approach that makes fitness realistic, enjoyable, and sustainable—for real bodies in the real world.

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Transcript

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most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, callers called in. We coach them, we help them on air live. It's always a good time. By the way, that happened after our intro. Today's intro was 66 minutes long. This is where we talk about fitness and family life and current events. We always have fun. If you want to call in and have us coach you on air, here's what you do. Send your question to mplifecaller.com now this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Butcherbox. Today we talked about their wild caught fish but they also have grass fed meat, heritage pork. This is all delivered to your door at great prices. If you like protein, which you probably do because you listen to Mind Pumpkin and you want it to be healthy and you want to save money, here's what you do. Go to butcherbox.com mindpump if you're a new user, you'll get your choice between free chicken breast for a year, shrimp included for a year or ground beef included for life. That's a great deal. This episode's also brought to you by Manukora. This is Manuka Honey but the highest concentration of MGO you'll find anywhere. Antibacterial human heals your gut anti inflammatory. It's great to add to your post workout shake for a little bit of that sugar and it's got health benefits. Go check them out. Go to manukora.com mindpump that's M A N U K O R-A.com mindpump the code mindpump gets you a massive discount. We also have a huge sale on a bundle, a brand new workout program bundle. It's the spring bundle. Maps Symmetry Maps prime and the advanced training techniques guide. All together, only 147. Head over to mapsmarch.com all right, real quick.

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[Sal Destefano]

Look, check this out. A lot of you would look way better fatter.

[Adam]

Are we talking about people that are, like, bikini bodybuilders, that, like, 5% body fat? Is that what you're.

[Sal Destefano]

That's obvious. I think that's, that's obvious, right? They're just too lean. You can't be that lean all the time. It's unhealthy. But I'm actually talking to fitness fanatics, like, dudes that feel like they need to walk around at 10%, women that need to walk around at 19% all the time. I, I, I think, and I know, you know, you're surrounded by the fitness space, you're getting all this stuff advertised to, but what's funny is that, I mean, if you're fit, you got muscle, you probably, as a woman, would look better around 23, 24, as a dude, 13, 14 body fat. And it's funny because when they ask the opposite sex, this is what they typically point to, unless they're in that space, in which case we tend to worship this.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Because it looks more healthy. Like. Yeah, yeah. You're not, like, struggling to get food in. Like, it's, yeah, your, your body's, like, just sits at that nice percentage. And, and it just looks like you're thriving versus, like, you know, you're starving yourself for a look.

[Adam]

I, I find this a really interesting conversation right now in, in particular with what I just kind of went through the last, you know, whatever. It was, I think almost a month ago or so that I had tested my body fat. And I'm pretty good about, like, being able to look at someone or myself and guess and judge your body. Yeah, judge my body fat percentage. It's not that often who. I've done that so many times

[Sal Destefano]

would

[Adam]

I have guessed that far off that I was. And it was really, like, enlightening for me and reminded me of something that I feel like I've, I've talked to clients about many times. But it's always neat to see that unveiled, even to myself. And what that is, and what I, what I realize is that it actually had less to do with My body fat percentage is that I have a good amount of lean body mass on me. Yeah, 180 pounds.

[Sal Destefano]

Some body fat on muscle looks great.

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah. And, and so why I like the direction you're going is that if you would have asked me even just a decade or so ago, what percentage body fat do. Do I like my physique, Cat. I'd say, oh, it's probably around 10, maybe 12 body fat, you know, somewhere in that range. And I think I'm the happiest there. I'm the most comfortable diet wise. I like the way I look, all these things like that. So to have already, to actually, to have the reverse happen to me, where I've been training for a while, back in my rhythm, you know, hearing from my wife, like, oh, you look so great right now, like, feeling good. I'm like, oh, yeah, I know. I. I like how I feel right now. I'm gonna probably lean out a little bit, but I like how I feel. And then I'm like, yeah, it might be a little bit higher than that 10 to 12. And I'm probably more like 14, 15. And there's always a part of me too that kind of lies to myself that says that I think I'm 14, 15, but I really think I'm more like 13. So I'm like, already setting myself up. And so to get the test back and to be as high as like 18, I went, what? Like, no way. Because the last time I was at. That's the closest to the highest body fat percentage I've, I've ever, I've ever tested. And I know how I looked and felt at 19, which is only 1% difference. So it's not a huge difference body fat percentage wise, but I obviously have a significant more amount of muscle at that 18, because when I was 18, I or 19, I was 211 pounds.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, when you did your first.

[Adam]

Oh, yeah. So this time I weigh 203, 33

[Sal Destefano]

pounds, 20 more pounds of muscle or at least.

[Adam]

So, but 1% body fat difference, but a significant difference in lean body mass. And looking at, looking at myself going like, oh, wow, that's crazy. Because if you would ask me. And so it really. And it highlights to me what I've communicated, I feel like, to a lot of my female clients in the past that get hung up on like, the, what you were saying, this number of like, oh, I think I want to be like 19%. Like, I know what I've looked like at 21 or 22%. I want to be a little bit leaner than that. And it's like, you know, that's a better goal than I'd say a scale goal. Like someone who says, like, I want to weigh one because that's a horrible goal.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right.

[Adam]

Right. But even the more I realize with myself, like, even a body fat percentage isn't ultimately that great of a gauge too, because how different a 12% version of me and an 18 version of me can actually look. Here's what you based off of lean body mass.

[Sal Destefano]

Totally. And here, here's what. So we'll talk just physiologically and even. We'll talk about athletic performance here, but physiologically speaking. So here's the context. You have two. You have the same person, both fit, both strong, both, you know, good fitness, good, you know, VO2, max strength, mobility, that kind of stuff. Right. We'll talk about a guy over here, he's 10. Over here, he's 15%. First off, the 15 version is going to have better athletic performance. And we know this by the better stamina, better strength, better stamina, better resilience. This is a big one. Like if you get sick or you get injured, he's going to be more resilient at 15% body fat. So that's number one. Number two, his hormone health is better. It's more likely to be better around 15% than a 10% a natural guy. And there's always exceptions to the rules. We'll stop pointing to the pro athletes that are genetic freaks, okay? I'm talking about most people, like 99% of people listening right now. Most natural dudes go from 15 to 10%. They sacrifice testosterone, they sacrifice hormone health, they sacrifice immune health, and they do sacrifice athletic performance as well. There's that part. Then there's this part when women are asked, majority of them, when they're looking at a dude who's fit, they kind of prefer the guy that's like 13 to 15% over the 10%. Why do they prefer that? Because we tend to look for signs of health and fertility. Now, I'll speak to women again.

[Justin Andrews]

It's subconscious.

[Sal Destefano]

It is. I'll speak to women both fit, both working out, both okay, doing well, 19%, 24%, the 24% woman. And this is even more true for women than for men because their bodies are more sensitive to this than men are. The 24, 25% woman who's fit, healthy muscle, the whole deal, she's going to have a better hormone profile. She's going to be more fertile, more regular periods, less you know, PMS symptoms. So hormone health is better. Much better resilience, better athletic performance. And most dudes would say, she looks better. She's got the curve, she's got the. And she looks good. And so what's happened is we've got this distortion because the people who are communicating health aren't really communicating health on social media. What they're communicating is a body obsession. And so they tend to present this extreme. Now let's talk about general health, like overall health for most guys, including the guys in this room who know what we're doing. If you're going to walk around at 10% body fat, you place a higher focus on your diet, dare I say a slightly unhealthy, in many cases a very unhealthy focus on your diet. You don't have a lot of flexibility. You're really paying attention to what you eat. So you can maintain this 10%, 15%. You generally eat healthy, but you enjoy the occasional going out. You're not that dude that goes out that's like, no, sorry, I can't have, you know, this. I gotta eat this particular way. Same thing for women. So mental health in terms of body obsession and stress around diet is much better. So, and I just want to communicate this because now there are a lot of people that are listening who are just getting into exercise, just getting into watching what they're eating. And so, you know, they're kind of aiming for this, what we're talking about. But there's also a significant percentage of our audience that are fitness fanatics who, you know, women who think they got to get to 19%, guys need to get 10%, and they think they're gonna have this dramatic improvement in health or happiness when the truth is the opposite. You're actually gonna sacrifice a lot of things for a look, and you're not gonna get much in return except for a body fat percentage that you're seeing on a scale.

[Adam]

I want to add to that and poke holes a little bit in that study. And not to debate you, but to, to add to an even greater point to this argument, because those studies that, like, take general people who generally keep themselves of that body fat percentage, the argument you're making is that most opposite sex likes the opposite sex a little bit higher body fibers than.

[Sal Destefano]

Right, right.

[Adam]

And even that is generally speaking, because if you were to take like using myself as an example again, what I look like right now at 18, I can show my wife or general population a 15 version or a 14 version of me, and I bet You. If I put them next to each other and you said, what are you more attracted to? Or what do you think looks better? More people would say, what the eight. What I look like right now at 18 than what I have even then. So even that doesn't tell the full story. It's like, in the case that I'm trying to make, is. Is the importance of building muscle.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, the muscle part.

[Adam]

And. And because that's the healthy. Yes. And the little bit of a higher body fat percentage and a lot of the research and the studies that we have. Oh, this is kind of optimal or ideal or healthy, again, is. Is taking a general population, I think there's a lot of people that could build 10, 20, 30 more pounds of muscle on them, and their body fat percentage stay the same.

[Sal Destefano]

Which means they added body fat.

[Adam]

Right, right, right. And which means they got. They've added more fat to their body, but they. But they added 10, 15 pounds of muscle and look. Be. Look better, feel better. More. The opposite sex be attracted to all the things, and not all those things are necessarily the most important, but it's like on all. All markers and cases improved.

[Sal Destefano]

We'll use the example of our trainer, Corinne, and I love using her as example because she's perfect for this. She's on our staff. She's an amazing coach, and she took the big step of letting someone else totally take over her training and diet, which was Adam. She was. She came to you. What was she sitting at? What was she walking around at?

[Adam]

18, 17.

[Sal Destefano]

Body fat all the time. Very lean. Okay. Not a good lean, or I should say, it's too lean to walk around it, but this is what she was at. She comes to Adam, he reverse diets her. She gets her calories from where to

[Adam]

where we were at, she was at 1900-2000 calories. We're at 26 to 2700.

[Sal Destefano]

So look at another almost thousand calories for a diet. Dramatically reduced her training volume. She's not exercising as much. Her strength went through the roof, where she's hitting PRs weekly. Almost weekly. Like big PRs almost weekly.

[Adam]

Squats, deadlifts, hip thrust, all the big movements.

[Sal Destefano]

Energy is better. Every single person on staff is like, man, she looks amazing. She looks great. Got her. Went and got a DEXA scan, gained only body fat. Her body fat percentage went from 17% to what?

[Adam]

Yeah, 19. 19.

[Sal Destefano]

Still lean. Yeah, but she gained 2% body fat, gained some weight on the scale, gained no muscle on the dexa. But she's stronger, feels better, more energy, and Looks better.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

So that's an extreme example, but better because she gained body fat.

[Adam]

Yes.

[Sal Destefano]

And her fitness improved. So she didn't compromise her fitness. Yeah, her fitness actually got better as. That's an extreme example. But we need to communicate this because

[Justin Andrews]

he's talking about that.

[Sal Destefano]

So many of our listeners are. We have so many female listeners who are fit and they're working out and they're good and they're consistent. Like, hey, I'm at, you know, 25% body fat. I want to get down to 20. What should I do? It's like, I can. I can tell you what you can do, but the truth is, like, you're better off staying where you're at and just keep improving your fitness and eating with some flexibility.

[Adam]

Right.

[Sal Destefano]

And we get guys like that, too. I'm a 15. I want a six pack. Like, bro, you get a six pack.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

You think you're gonna feel so much happier. You're not.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, it's not a performance advantage, you know, like, to be really lean. No, it's just like, you know, whatever is healthy and what that is for your body and. And what that consists of. And we have general ranges where we try to shoot, you know, where it's like, this is healthy, you know, And I feel like, you know, I'm adequate energy wise. I have that little bit of a buffer. But I mean, it kind of varies. But at the same time, if that's where you start, you perform the best when you're in that health zone.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right. And you.

[Justin Andrews]

You stray out of that, you know,

[Sal Destefano]

above, below, to chase a look.

[Justin Andrews]

And. And then it's, you know, you're compromising that.

[Sal Destefano]

You know, it's funny too, but you,

[Adam]

I mean, Justin always is going to add his performance point. You're always going to go the health direction. I always love driving home this, the look, though, because that's what most people are going after. That's what they're here for. Right. Like, I mean, what you guys are saying is so important, but the. The truth is so many people are chasing a look. And I think that's what I want to convey so much is, like, you at a higher body fat percentage, you know, to the point of how you open this. Like, you would look better fatter if you just added muscle, too. And a lot of times you can't do that when you're always trying to be at this low percent body fat. We had a call her just recently, and it's just like, you know, and she wants. She wants this like 20 to 22%, which is a total 5% to desire for a female. You can be healthy in that range. But I'm like looking at her going like, you know, I bet if you stay the same body fat percentage, which she was around 25 or 26 and just added 5 to 10 pounds of muscle, you would get the 22, 20 to 22 look.

[Sal Destefano]

The look that you think you want.

[Adam]

Yeah, the look that you think you want. It has less to do with the percentage. It's that you're. You're thinking about where you're at right now. Oh, I'm a little fluffy. If I were to lean some of that fat off, then I had this look. Well, I will argue you just gained some muscle to that same. In fact, some fat could come with it too, by the way. You added 10 pounds on the scale and 8 muscle and 2 fat. You would look. You would look better.

[Sal Destefano]

You would look.

[Adam]

The look that you think needs to be at 20, 20.

[Sal Destefano]

You know what's funny too about this, by the way, you know, when you're. You're a guy, you're walking around at 10% body fat, your face doesn't look as good as when you're at 14% body fat. This is especially true. I want to piss people off. For women, you get down to the teens, your face does not look as good as when you're in the low to mid 20s. Body fat on your face, you got to have some. And especially as you get older, especially as you get older, where you start to look like you're more aged. They're calling this ozempic face, or you know what's happening with that? People are just losing everything. Yeah. As they look old. Because. Why? Well, because you need some body fat, and some body fat is on your face, and it actually makes you look more youthful and healthier. And again, a lot of the messaging that we're getting are from people who, their hormones are artificially propped up so they could diet, they could do all the extreme stuff, get their body fat lean, and they're gonna be great. The average person chases this number. You're gonna feel like garbage. Your libido is gonna be down, you're overstressed with your workouts, you're over focused on your diet. And to Adam's point, you don't look as good. You might a little bit of a distorted view on yourself not realizing you just don't look as. And what's crazy about this, because I know I've done this before, is you'll have friends, these people listening have had this happen, I guarantee it, where they're getting really lean and then their friends and family come up to like, you don't look good. Yeah. But all they hear in their head is, yeah, it's because I'm shredded drift

[Justin Andrews]

that you talk about.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

And it really does happen. And that's the thing, is the irony of it. Everybody wants to look youthful, right?

[Sal Destefano]

You look older.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, when you're too lean, you just look older. Your skin doesn't look as vibrant and healthy.

[Sal Destefano]

A say. You know, there's an old, there's a saying in. I think it's in the fashion world in Italy. So. And it's not a great saying, but they say this to their models. They say face or ass. And what they mean by that is you pick either you have a round butt, you have a round. You have either you can have. You know you're gonna sacrifice one or the other. So you get too lean, you're gonna sacrifice your, your face or whatever. So it's like choose one of the other.

[Adam]

Oh, that's funny.

[Sal Destefano]

So. So if you have the, if you have the butt, you have. I don't know. Anyway, it's a saying that they say because they refer to getting too lean, how it affects how you start to look or whatever in your face. And you do, you look older. But this message needs to get out because if you go through Instagram and you go on fitness, even if you go on wellness, which the term wellness has been so bastardized now wellness is just fitness, but now it's packaged a little different. What I mean by that is all the wellness people now, they're still displaying this like overly lean body focused or whatever. It just now looks like, you know

[Adam]

who also such a great example on our team. I love to. I've actually, I got to sit down with her and talk to her about her whole journey and her calories and stuff like that. But I've seen her before and afters and that's Danny.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh yeah.

[Adam]

Like her, her physique, her that she's built. Oh yeah, she's built a total different physique than what's so strong.

[Sal Destefano]

She's so strong. So strong.

[Adam]

Yes. And I like to ask her, I like to ask her what she can eat calorie wise today versus what did

[Sal Destefano]

she come from a place where she was like super restricting?

[Adam]

I think so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like and just, just it looks like a whole different person. Totally different person. She's so much more muscle on her body and I. And I, like, when I talked to him, when we were getting ready to do Corinne, I asked her if she wanted to join. She's like, oh, no. Right now I'm eating and doing this and that. And like the fact that she can. She can eat what she wants and have that kind of flexibility and still have a physique that's like that, you know, And I think so. So many, so many people, women in particular, I feel like where my female clients get hung up on this, this look that they remember having or seeing when they were at their leanest. And, you know, some of them might have had their body fat percentage. And so they're either it's the scale or this body fat percentage. And, you know, I guess the point I'm trying to make is we always talk about like body fat percentage kind of being this gold standard.

[Sal Destefano]

Better than weight.

[Adam]

Yeah, it's better, but it's still, it's still good. It still still could be very distorted. Especially doesn't tell the whole story. Especially for. Hasn't muscle hasn't been promoted so much for women as it. As it has been men for a really long time. So this is, this goes both ways.

[Sal Destefano]

And they're also advertised from an, you know, image perspective or look much heavier.

[Justin Andrews]

The fashion industry is really fashion, fitness,

[Sal Destefano]

the health, the wellness, like everything geared towards women is, Is so focused on how you look.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

And it's coming from these really body dysmorphic people, unfortunately, are the ones that tend to get the voices. You know, one of the best things you could do, really, one of the best things you could do this is both men and women, but especially women, is change your algorithm on your social media, like consciously change it. When you're going through and you're seeing bodies projected to you, pictures of bodies and how they look and they're, you know, check. Click on the little. Whatever is the little. The three dots and say, I want to see less of this. And you have to do this every day because the algorithm's so smart. That'll revert back very quickly. So every day just say less of this. I want less of this in my brain. Less of this in my brain. And you would be surprised at how

[Adam]

positively, by the way you. I know you actively do that. I actively like the things that I want. Like, I actually, I go like every. It's like an exercise I do now where I will look at my explore page.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

To see if it's in my goal. Literally, my goal is always it to be like all the things that I

[Sal Destefano]

Want that you actually want.

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah, that I want to be consuming that I'm into or whatever that I think is, you know, give healthier or better. Right. For whatever reason, you. You actually go and click on it and then say, show me less of this.

[Sal Destefano]

Yes. Where.

[Adam]

Where do you see? Where is that?

[Sal Destefano]

So when you click. When, when. So when you're scrolling. Yeah. When something comes up, Right. You can click on the picture. I think there's like little dots. Yeah, the little dots. And you could say, less of this or don't show me this.

[Adam]

And so it's like literally on the, like on. In my feed. I have, like, I'm on Instagram right now. Okay, here's.

[Justin Andrews]

I. I've done that on Facebook. I haven't done that Instagram.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

So while you're seeing this post request, Community note.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, so I've done it on X a lot because that's the one that I'll be on. And that one, bro. Their algorithm's fast on X. Oh, my God, that changed so quick. Dude, you. You look at one thing and then you get five more.

[Justin Andrews]

I have a hard time with X just because it's so raw.

[Adam]

Sometimes I forget that you're mostly on X right now. I'm trying to figure out how to do it.

[Sal Destefano]

There's a way to do it on all of them.

[Angela]

Them.

[Adam]

I mean, it's a good thing right now. I'm going through my thing right now. I've yet to see something I don't.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, here's. You could also do with ads, by the way.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah, I do that all the time.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Benjamin]

So.

[Adam]

Okay, here. Okay. Not interested.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right.

[Adam]

Okay, so. So not interested.

[Sal Destefano]

Here's why this is.

[Adam]

Don't suggest these posts anymore. Don't suggest posts with certain words. Snooze. All suggest posts. And.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, that's right. Now, the reason why this. It's so important to do this.

[Adam]

This post made me feel uncomfortable.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. So. And you know what? That's. Think that's the strongest one seen. I think that's the strongest signal is that one right there. Yeah, yeah. Because I've done that. It's in. It's stronger. Because you have to like, repeatedly say, don't show me this, don't show me this. So the algorithms are so sensitive that it picks up micro fractions of a second longer that you hover.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, it tracks your eyes.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, yeah. So if you're like scrolling through.

[Adam]

Oh, no, that's so I pause for.

[Sal Destefano]

So you're longer. So your.

[Adam]

Your. Your Point. This is why I have to check back on my Explore page is because

[Justin Andrews]

so I always get.

[Adam]

I only like these, the things that I want fed to me. But even if I get caught looking at something for a minute, even if I don't like it, it'll still start to. It'll start to still change my explore page and feed it back to me again. So that's why I was asking you why, like how you do. Because the way I do it is like I get good at just really liking all the stuff that I want.

[Sal Destefano]

But you also have to say don't.

[Adam]

Yeah. Because if you don't, it knows that you pause for a second, it's bad. It'll. It'll feed again.

[Sal Destefano]

It's a, It's a self adjusting in the moment on the fly kind of

[Adam]

brilliant from their point, you know, it's brilliant and it's.

[Sal Destefano]

And you. That means you have to conscious, bro. You have to. I'll give you guys an example.

[Justin Andrews]

Pack your impulsive nature.

[Sal Destefano]

I told this story already, but I saw it. So my wife will be. It's okay with it, but I'll tell it again. So there was, there was a period, we're going somewhere and I was like, like, oh, maybe I should get some like, it's like sexy lingerie for my wife, right? So I went and looked up like,

[Adam]

you know, I've told you about this happen to me.

[Sal Destefano]

And so as soon as I did

[Justin Andrews]

that, bro, some of those emails.

[Sal Destefano]

So hold on. So as soon as I did that, when I would go on social media, you know the little ads that post underneath. Little ads would post for lingerie, but they're like, bro, it's like, yeah, it's like a half naked chick. Like, right? And I don't want to see that because it's soft porn for sure. I just don't want to see that. I've had issues with like, you know, looking at stuff in the past and so I just consciously now look away. And so I had to go, don't show me this. This is offensive. I did like four times before it stopped. Like I kept getting ads and I have to, I had to keep doing that.

[Adam]

I've bought a lot of like, I don't buy.

[Sal Destefano]

So I can't get away from it.

[Adam]

Like there's probably at least six different brands that I've bought from. And so they all, they've all got me.

[Sal Destefano]

You know what I'm saying?

[Adam]

They find me, dude, wherever I'm at.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, dude, try to unsubscribe from Those emails. And then you get one of those emails.

[Adam]

I do this.

[Sal Destefano]

But I tell you what, just for people listening, like if you, you have to consciously do this every day, but change your algorithm because it shifts how you view the world, but more importantly, how you view yourself.

[Adam]

Are you guys, are you guys noticing with your teens, any news, any like, new like behaviorals around it, like them organically, not what you're restricting or telling. Do you think that you're seeing a increase in their, like addiction to it or are they naturally certain? Because one of the things that we predicted, like generally. Yeah. That like this generation coming up is, is, is becoming. It's more common that they're like.

[Sal Destefano]

I put, I put really strong restrictions on my daughter. So she only 10 minutes of Instagram. She has no tick tock.

[Adam]

Do you find yourself. So what I guess I'm getting at with you guys because you guys have both have teens that were like a part, part of the height, the height of this stuff. Is it always a battle? Is it something that's getting easier? Is it getting harder? Like what, what's it like managing it for the, for the, for the kids

[Justin Andrews]

and it's getting a lot easier.

[Adam]

It's getting easier.

[Sal Destefano]

He's got a lot more mature with

[Justin Andrews]

it than he was. It was a battle, dude. For a while.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I didn't want to give him a phone at all. Well, you know, and that was like really hard for me to reconcile.

[Sal Destefano]

That was a mistake I made was I gave my, my, My daughter has a phone.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Like, my younger kids, they're not getting one. They're not getting one till it's absolutely necessary, which I don't know what, what

[Adam]

were the two age. How early did you do your daughter and how early did you do your boys?

[Sal Destefano]

So let's see. My daughter. Eighth grade.

[Adam]

Eighth grade.

[Sal Destefano]

I think it was eighth grade.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Ethan was 13.

[Sal Destefano]

It might have been eight. Is that, is that when you're 13?

[Justin Andrews]

He was seven.

[Sal Destefano]

Seven or seven.

[Adam]

I think.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

It might have been seventh grade for me too, because I think it was around the same.

[Adam]

Okay. Okay.

[Justin Andrews]

So, I mean, yeah, there's a thing. Ideally in the ideal situation, you know, if you can, you know. Wait, that would be.

[Sal Destefano]

You know what.

[Adam]

Well, I get what I mean. It's real easy sitting from my seat, right. To say. But I understand. And I can only imagine how difficult it was for the two of you at the timing of it. Is that because I already see with my son's age, parents that like, like his best friend and we're really close to him. Like they, they don't. They restrict tech from his kid or their kid. Their kid doesn't get an iPad like, like ours. And so it makes it easy when the best friend doesn't too.

[Sal Destefano]

You know, I was just gonna say that's. That, that's the easier way to do it is if you, if you have.

[Adam]

Cultivate the friends. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I mean, that's what Katrina and I have talked about and plan to do. And it seems. And I don't want to say it's easy, but it's probably easier for me than it was for you guys when nobody was really paying attention, when everybody thought I was everyone. I mean, your guys's generation, meaning your guys. Kids generation, you were probably told if they don't learn tech, they're going to be behind. If they don't, they don't learn to use those, the computer outliers.

[Justin Andrews]

By waiting. For sure.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

He had to wait.

[Adam]

Right.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, a couple years to catch up to his friend's text message.

[Sal Destefano]

You know, it helps too, a lot. And I'm sure Justin could speak to this. When they're busy doing things like sports and stuff. When they're, when they have nothing to do.

[Justin Andrews]

Bro, I preached that from, you know, the mountains, dude. I have to keep them busy. You know, honestly, idle hands, the devil's work. If for real. Whoever like said that, like, that is such truth.

[Adam]

Yeah, it said a long time ago too. That's crazy.

[Sal Destefano]

He said that. Find out.

[Justin Andrews]

I don't know, but philosophy and I mean I. Because even with my oldest, it's like, you know, he'll. He'll do a good job with tack within, you know, he's roaming around town and all these things and it's like he's getting bored and it's like they, they find their way into mischief just like, you know, and it's like now I'm battling that and it's like I. It's just one of those things.

[Adam]

But you prefer that, right? Okay, so I do prefer. Funny you say that because my. But my buddy Mike, his kids. Similar age. Right. And we, we talked a lot about this for the last couple years and everything. And he's really active. Dad. Try. He's into cars. Always trying to get his boy to come do the car events. Kid's not really into it. He'd rather stay at home on the computer, the phone or on the games and stuff like that. And he recently has got into those electric dirt bikes.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes.

[Adam]

And he's like hardcore. But he's like, he rolls around with a group of kids that are like, getting in trouble. They don't just the cop. The cops have busted them because they're like, they go. Yeah. They go past where they're supposed to.

[Justin Andrews]

Way farther than we ever did when we were kids.

[Sal Destefano]

And so he's so electric.

[Adam]

Yes. And they go like 50 miles an hour, bro.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

And so he's like, so conflicted because he's like, I, for the last five years, I've been fighting to get him out of the house. Now he's out of the house, but then he's getting to mischief. And I'm like, yes. You know, I think I'd rather have that. I'd rather have him learn the consequences of the cop getting you in trouble for riding that bike where you're not supposed to and then the sitting plugged into a game all day.

[Sal Destefano]

Can we just say, like, straight up, like, there's always something raising, raising kids, especially teenagers. It's hard. It is. It's hard.

[Justin Andrews]

It's anxiety riddled.

[Sal Destefano]

They, they, they want the independence of an adult, but they have the mind of a child. And so, and they're rebellious by nature.

[Justin Andrews]

I got this. You don't even know what you're doing.

[Sal Destefano]

You actually know nothing. You realize. You know nothing. I love to, I love arguing with teenagers.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam]

I mean, it's crazy how early that is, how ingrained that is in. Because I, my son said that to my wife last night, Mom, I got this. You know, it was over something, you know, whatever. But it's like the fact that they, they already start doing that independent mind coming years old. Like, I got this.

[John]

Mom.

[Sal Destefano]

It's so hard too, because when you want, you want to tell them, like, no, no, this is, this is how it works.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

You know, like, half the time telling them is like, makes them harden even more.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. And you got to let them work through it, too. So it's like, I've had to really check myself a lot of times with that because I will be like, you know, try and squash his energy with that. Like, what? You don't know what you're doing. I'm like, let him figure it out. Let him work through it. Let him stumble.

[Sal Destefano]

My favorite is you have every one of your kids try to, like, tell you, like, figure out how much it would cost to, like, live on their own. They have no idea.

[Adam]

Oh, yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, well, if I made this much money. Oh, yeah, you, you, you would be able to pay rent in a room.

[Justin Andrews]

I know.

[Adam]

That's, that's why I really liked. What book was that that I read. I wish it's. I've. I've recommended it on the. On the podcast before, but it talked about the. The four stages of.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, yeah, yeah. I got to read that one again.

[Justin Andrews]

The coaching.

[Adam]

And you guys. And that's. You guys are coaching phase. And really, when you think about it, that's good. Coach. It's like you.

[Sal Destefano]

You tell them game changer for me.

[Adam]

Yes.

[Sal Destefano]

You know that.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Well, my daughter, it's been a game changer.

[Adam]

You're a coach. You're not daddy mode anymore. You're not telling them what to do all the time. It's like, hey, you do this, this and this, this will happen. You play that. You show the play.

[Justin Andrews]

Here's a potential consequence.

[Adam]

That's right. You show the play.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm going to let you figure it out.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

And you know, we're going to.

[Adam]

You encourage why they should run the play this way. And then when they veer off and do their own thing and they get tackled behind the line or they get hurt or the thing happens, like, that's why dad told you this is the play.

[Sal Destefano]

It's been such a game changer lessons for me and my daughter because I actually had to verbalize it to her, like, listen, we're moving a new phase. It's the coaching phase. And there was a period there where it was like, is this actually working? Because she's. But then I'd sit down with her, said, look, I'm not going to tell you. You have to do this. Right. Remember, we're in the coaching phase. But you need to hear me because if I feel like you're not hearing me and if you feel like you're just shutting me down.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Then we're going to go backwards and we're going to go to the other phase where I force you. Yeah. And it's actually. It's actually improved our relationship.

[Adam]

I think it's a great idea to communicate, even to the kid, like, letting them know that. I think that's a great. I didn't know you did that. I think that's a great. A great idea is to be like, hey, we're. I recognize that we're transitioning from me being daddy. Tell you what to do all the time to. You want to learn things, do things on your own. And I can appreciate that.

[Justin Andrews]

Love that the language is more like, might I make a suggestion?

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

That's like my new verbiage.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Adam]

Or let me tell you how that

[Sal Destefano]

played out for them.

[Justin Andrews]

I definitely gave him a lot bigger area that he can venture out and have adventures and do his thing, but it's at home. We're just like.

[Adam]

I mean, and we're also.

[Sal Destefano]

That's because you track your kids.

[Adam]

You're also talking.

[Sal Destefano]

You also track your kids. Nobody knew where we were going.

[Justin Andrews]

I know I don't. My wife does. And then I find out. I'm like, oh, what's he doing way over there?

[Adam]

Yeah. That support that trips me out is like, how much we. Because he. My buddy Mike's. They have air tag on his kid, too. And so it's like, so they can see when he's going beyond where he was told to. And so that. So it's like this. Now you're challenged with this.

[Sal Destefano]

Like, do I say something?

[Adam]

Do I say something? He's not.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, it only affects me because, like, then he gets dark and, like, I have to go pick him up my truck because you gotta take the bike and put it. The truck in his friend. And, you know, it becomes like, I'm like, look, you brought me into this.

[Sal Destefano]

The.

[Justin Andrews]

The whole idea is for you to have that freedom and independence. You come back, you do the right thing, then you get to do it again. Now, you know, we're not going to have that much freedom, and you have to earn it back.

[Adam]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

I think about some of the stuff I did when I was a teenager. Like, when we would ride off. Now, we'd have electric bikes, but we had a regular bike, but we would take off and we would do things. Man, I look back, I'm like, you

[Adam]

know, how do you guys both make peace, too? How do you guys both make peace with this also? Because you also know that. So imagine you have the kid who's the opposite, who. Who listens to everything, doesn't go beyond. Because I think about this from my perspective, because my kid seems to be different with a lot of this stuff. And my fear is. I also know that the. Those traits that you guys both have and you see in your kids are also the things that made you great entrepreneurs and successful at life. Because you are willing to stretch the boundaries, to think outside the box, to not just fall in line with what the other people say. Like, there's some characteristics that come with that.

[Sal Destefano]

What do you mean that, Adam, when you look at the data on it, because that's. That could definitely happen. But you know, what the data shows more often than not is that they're going to go through a rebellious phase. And so if they don't do it as teenagers, then they do it in college.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes.

[Rebecca]

Or.

[Justin Andrews]

Or I'd rather it be now.

[Adam]

Or.

[Sal Destefano]

I have a lot of friends like this. I have friends like this who are doctors. Okay. So they were very regimented, very disciplined.

[Justin Andrews]

College.

[Adam]

Then they wow out when they get the.

[Sal Destefano]

And then when they finally are done with medical school. Now I'm gonna go through. Through my Riv belly. If you're 30, that's.

[Adam]

I mean, that's a recipe for Peter Pan syndrome.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam]

I mean, that's like how that ends up happening to a lot of probably now. How do. So we're doing the perspective from the husband. Right. I imagine this is even more difficult for the wives to let. To let go and let like a

[Justin Andrews]

lot of the risky stuff especially too. And like, he. It's funny because, like, I love it because he. He's back into climbing on things and. And you know, like. Like, he'll go on these bridges and things that are super sketchy. And I'm like, you know, like. And Courtney will find out about it. But, you know, I. I'm just glad that he's adventuring and, like, being in the world and doing these things. So I'm like, you know, I'm okay with some of these risks he's taking. You know, that it's dangerous. He could get hurt and this and that. But so that. I prefer that.

[Adam]

That's an example of where you can be more laxed. And she's probably more freaked out.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam]

Where's the flip of that? Whereas she more relaxed and you're a little more. And she's like, hey, dude, calm down. He'll be like, is there. Is there an example that. Or she almost always that way, and you're almost always the one who's more like that. And same thing for you. So, like, is there a push and pull for you guys where there are certain things she's more relaxed about and you're more like over. And she's like, hey, chill out.

[Benjamin]

Let him.

[Adam]

Let him figure it out. And. Or is it. Is it all things? Because obviously the resting.

[Justin Andrews]

Think of an example.

[Sal Destefano]

I'll guess. I'll guess. I bet it's probably when you show a lot of anger, then she know she needs to calm me down. I'll bet that's probably when it kicks in.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, when I'm angry with him.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. When you start to lose it, she's probably like, okay. Oh, yeah.

[Adam]

She.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. She calms me down with. When it's like, I. I use that as something to like capture attention and like snap out of like his state. Like. So I don't, I don't raise my voice unless it's like very intentional. But yeah, I do do that sometimes. She, it freaks her out. Scares her, you know, sometimes, because I'll let that out just to let everybody know I got teeth. You know, it's like, you know, there's,

[Adam]

there's, there's value to that though too. I think a great way to communicate that is to. When you do it intentional and you're detached from the emotion, it's a very powerful tool.

[Sal Destefano]

Right.

[Adam]

When you do it in a response emotionally is when it's bad. Right. So that's.

[Justin Andrews]

Remove the reaction of it.

[Adam]

Right, right.

[Sal Destefano]

Like, but that's hard.

[Adam]

Of course.

[Sal Destefano]

That's.

[Adam]

Yeah. No, that's. No, that's a very.

[Justin Andrews]

I think that I, I was trying to think of like an example with like girls in relationship and all that. And I'm more like, you know, don't even worry about all that. Like, you know, that'll come down the road. And like, I'm not trying to like make it happen where he's gonna hang out and go on a date or like, you know, and she's all like, yeah, like how's, how's it going with so and so and you know, like she gets all into the relationship side of it and I'm just like, dude, stop asking him about that, you know?

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, he'll figure it out.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. This is a distraction.

[Sal Destefano]

You don't need this right now, son.

[Adam]

You know, that's like my energy.

[Sal Destefano]

I think you're right.

[Adam]

One dude,

[Sal Destefano]

total distraction when you're a kid.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, totally.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I mean, but she likes, she loves the idea of him, you know, having a relationship with a girl. And I, I appreciate that.

[Sal Destefano]

Until the girl. I'm sure then mama bear is going to come.

[Adam]

Now, are you the opposite of your house? Because. So my sister in law and brother in law are the opposite here. The, My sister in law is the one who lets the kids climb the trees, fall, bruise themselves, whatever. And my brother in law is more like boundaries overprotective that way. You seem like that to me.

[Sal Destefano]

It depends. I mean, it really does depend on the situation. I would say we have a different dynamic with the little ones than we do with my daughter because my daughter's with us every other week. Plus she has her mom.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Who's also involved. So Jessica has a parental, definitely a parental role with my daughter. But she's also got this which I think it's an advantage is she kind of gets to be the cool stepmom, you know, where she can kind of step in and have those conversations.

[Adam]

Right. She almost felt naturally into the coaching phase versus you had to transition from being daddy daddy, and then also just

[Sal Destefano]

to, you know, being divorced, having her half the time, like, that causes its own challenges. Like, you know, you want to discipline. But I see you. I didn't see you last week. And so now you're here.

[Justin Andrews]

A window.

[Benjamin]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

And, like, what do we do?

[Adam]

Well, how often does that happen? Where. And it's. What's more like where. Because you have that. Since that's an interesting dynamic for me to ask about is that, you know, you're wanting your daughter to explore something or you're wanting her to. To fall on her own or allow it, and then your ex is like, no. Like, how often does that happen where you don't. You guys don't agree with, like. Like either restricting. Restricting something or boundaries or.

[Sal Destefano]

I got to be careful what I say here because I don't want to put too much out there. But I would say, like, right now we're looking at colleges. Even though she's not, you know, she's not going to be going for a couple years, but I'm much more interested in the culture of the college than I am. How cool it is or how nice it is or even what she thinks she wants. I'm interested more in the culture because I think it's super influential on a kid. Whereas, you know, my ex wife is

[Adam]

more like where she want to go.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Where does she want to go? And this is a great college. Maybe that's the one she wanted to go to that she didn't go to. Maybe there's a piece of that. But. So there's. So there's some disagreement.

[Adam]

Oh, that's an interesting one, bro. I feel like you lose that no matter what.

[Sal Destefano]

No. Yep. No, because I pay.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Boom.

[Adam]

That's a great. That's a great response. My first edition, I was like, oh, bro, you definitely. You lose that. Well, actually, I write the check.

[Sal Destefano]

I don't have to. I don't. I don't want to pull it, but if I have to. Oh, she could go to. She can go to that one corner. You pay for it. I don't care. She can go to that one. Oh, my God. What a good point. Oh, my God.

[Justin Andrews]

I was like, you think you're going

[Adam]

to win that one, bro? You're losing that one for sure.

[Sal Destefano]

I write the check. Yeah. Ultimately That's a trump card. I'll weigh all that out. Don't get me wrong. Wrong. It's a little while from now, so maybe things will change, but that's funny. Yeah, we're gonna go look at some. In fact, in a month. I won't say where they are because. Yeah, but we'll be looking.

[Justin Andrews]

It is the time, though, because.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

My oldest is same age, and he's. He's interested in looking at colleges right now.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

But, you know, there's a culture on campuses, and different colleges have different.

[Adam]

Well, that's school in general. Totally. Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

That's.

[Adam]

That's cool. In general.

[Sal Destefano]

But I have this. I heard this argument about. I was talking to friends about this, and I heard this argument, like, oh, there's bad cult kids and good kids in every college. Yeah, I know that's true. Okay, I get it. You can go to the best culture, but still run into the wrong crowd. But the odds are better. Like, let's not forget. Like, the odds are better.

[Adam]

I think as a dad, I'd rest. What I'd have a hard time with is if my daughter. Son is wanting to go to school or like their three best friends or two or three best friends are going and they want to go to that school, even though it may not be my favorite school for them to go to, but it's where their best friends are going that they went to high school with and grew up.

[Sal Destefano]

That makes a difference, because that would

[Adam]

make a hard time. Versus she's going off to somewhere where she's starting all over no matter what, and she really wants to go to this place. And I'm like, I don't know about Chico State or Arizona State or whatever the state is. I think I'd. Either you go this way.

[Justin Andrews]

That's good for them, though. You know, that's also that, I think, because, I mean, for me, it was transformative. It was like. I think we don't have that rite of passage anymore. And I think if we can look at college as, like, maybe an extension of that. It's like, you got to go off and. And reinvent yourself.

[Sal Destefano]

That's. There's. There's so much potential value in that. Yeah.

[Adam]

I mean. Yeah, I. That has a lot to do with probably you both evaluating their friends currently, too, though, of course.

[Sal Destefano]

Like, I don't want you to be.

[Adam]

Yeah, I mean, I think they'll still reconnect. Like, I.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, I don't know. It depends.

[Adam]

Of course, my best friend and I go all the way back to fourth grade. So. And so. And my other one all the way back to ninth grade, so. Of course you can. So I'm definitely somebody who believes that we can. And I went different states, all the things. Right. So. But I think that if I. If I liked my son's, you know, core group of buddies and they're like, hey, we're all going to Santa Barbara.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam]

You know, college after high school. And he really wants a huge pool. Yeah. I would. I would have a really hard time. And let's say it's not my favorite.

[Sal Destefano]

You know, there's another piece here that we're not even talking about, which I've never. I kind of had this opinion before, but now even more so, especially in two years or four years. Is it necessary?

[Adam]

Oh, yeah. No, I definitely.

[Sal Destefano]

Is it necessary to go to college? Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

This is what I fight with, Court.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, yeah. Because the roi, I don't think it's in a lot of cases is not worth it. Like a lot of situations, the degree you get is not worth the cost that you spent. You would have been better off maybe not going.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

And there's a lot of things now you can go learn in college that I'm looking at AI and I'm like, bro, by the time you graduate, it'll be interesting.

[Justin Andrews]

They better shift.

[Adam]

Yeah. Their options.

[Sal Destefano]

Totally.

[Adam]

Well, that's. I was going to say, Justin, it's going to be interesting how you tackle that where. Because you.

[Sal Destefano]

It's a weird time.

[Adam]

Especially. Especially when they. If what your kid tells you that they want to go do and study.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Adam]

Right. Because if they give you some.

[Justin Andrews]

That matters big time.

[Adam]

Yeah. I feel like that totally matters.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

Because it's like that.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I'd rather get them in a mentorship internship somewhere. It's a direct placement, you know, for something that they want to do. I think it's such a better path.

[Sal Destefano]

I've been talking to my daughter about, like, businesses that require people. So, like, do you like. Because she kind of wants to work with people. So I'm like, okay, those. Those. There's certain careers that will probably always need that, like occupational therapy, physical therapy, maybe even, you know, you know, cognitive behavioral therapy, where you're working with a person and I'm sure regulations will prevent AI from doing that kind of stuff like that. That I could see that potential. But, like, bro, it's just. Just six years ago, going to school for coding was like, this is the best thing you could do. Yeah. Now they're like, don't do that. Irrelevant, you know, did you know that they're. I'm watching interviews. I've seen a couple interviews or clips of people in tech who run these big companies and they're like, oh, our coders haven't written a single line of code since December.

[Adam]

What I imagine, I imagine one of the most popular degrees in the next two to four years is going to be AI degrees. Degrees in on like the ability to program run and, and by the time

[Justin Andrews]

they graduate that's gonna be irrelevant.

[Sal Destefano]

That's what I'm trying to say, dude. It's changing so quick.

[Adam]

I mean maybe, but let's if bro,

[Sal Destefano]

you know, four years the one.

[Adam]

Yeah, but the ones that studied it are gonna be on the front line of knowing how that's going to impact.

[Sal Destefano]

Either that or if you love it, why don't you go learn it?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, but then the CEO just be able to do everything.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, why don't you just go learn it? Go learn it on your own right now. Because whenever they come out with another version which is like, you know, however,

[Adam]

months later, six months later, that's easy for 40 something year old US to say. Like, tell that to it. Tell that to a 17 year old. Yeah, go teach yourself this. Like, yeah, good luck.

[Sal Destefano]

Well, I mean if they're into it.

[Adam]

That's part of, that's part of, that's part of the big benefit too is like, I mean I remember when I was, when I was 17, like I didn't know for sure what I had ideas. I mean I went through. I'm going to be an architect, I'm going to be a lawyer, I'm going to be a physical therapist. Like I went through a lot of different things. I was going to be or what I wasn't sure. I almost went, almost enlisted, you know, so it's like, yeah, you know, part of the, part of the, the good part of the college I'd say still is that ability to still try different classes, meet different people with different opinions and views and maybe backgrounds with different dads and moms that have jobs. That's like. And just being exposed to other things that maybe you and your little bubble would have never thought you would.

[Sal Destefano]

God, I wonder if the future of being enlisted is they're going to look at your resume and you're gonna be like, oh, how good are your videos? Yes, yes. Oh yeah, bro, 100, dude.

[Adam]

It's gonna be like, oh, you're level 56 in Call of Duty.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, you're in, you're in. Dude, that's gonna Be so wild to think about. All right, let's change, let's change directions here real quick because I was looking up, up the, the toxins that they find in farmed fish versus wild caught. Oh, wow. It's pretty bad.

[Adam]

It's so bad. Don't they change the fish changes sex in the, in there?

[Sal Destefano]

Sometimes, yes, Sometimes. So like higher and heavy metals, pesticides

[Justin Andrews]

really win though, right?

[Sal Destefano]

Say what?

[Justin Andrews]

You can't really win because even the ocean, like deep sea fish now, they're,

[Sal Destefano]

they have to find better ways to farm fish, I think. And you're right. Like that's the one place we, we get meat in the wild. Yeah, like we don't do that anymore anywhere else. We don't hunt cows.

[Adam]

Do you, Doug, can you pull up a screenshot too? Because I know that they do this with farm fish. You know, they dye the, the fish so it will look like it's the meat. Yeah, like how? Like, yeah, how, like how different does it look if they didn't dye?

[Sal Destefano]

What's crazy to me is there's a dramatic difference in the taste of just farmed salmon versus wild salmon. One.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I.

[Sal Destefano]

If you put them next to. And I ate each one and I didn't know any better, I'd be like, this is different fish.

[Justin Andrews]

And it's like the fat content.

[Sal Destefano]

It's the fat content. The fat. Like the fat amount. The fatty acid profile.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, the profile.

[Sal Destefano]

It's all so different, you know, Crazy. That's not saying it's unhealthy, but it's definitely better to go farmed salmon or not injected with diet. They are fed pigments. That's what it is.

[Adam]

Okay.

[Justin Andrews]

They're fed pigments.

[Sal Destefano]

Interesting.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

But while some often synthetic pigments are added to feed.

[John]

Same difference.

[Sal Destefano]

Give them red number 40. Well, I mean one of the unknown things that butcherbox does because we talk a lot about their grass fed meat all the time, their heritage pork. They have a great selection of farmed.

[Adam]

I still gotta smoke mine. I've got farm fish.

[Howie Mandel]

Wildfish.

[Sal Destefano]

I'm sorry, wild fish. Sorry. Thanks, Doug. You have a great selection. You have a great selection of wild caught fish. Yeah, they don't sell farm. It's all wild.

[Adam]

I have some in my freezer right now that I, that I got from them. That I have. I've been telling Doug I want to. I want to smoke it. Yeah, I want to. I haven't, I haven't. I haven't personally smoked salmon.

[Sal Destefano]

When you smoke salmon, you're not cooking it right or. Yeah, you Are. It is. It's just. It's with. With smoke.

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a slow. It's a. So, I mean, in my opinion, it's the. I rarely ever use my gas grill, ever. Almost only if I'm like, if I'm in a hurry to cook. Cook meat for something or maybe because I'm smoking on one and I'm using it for something else and I'm using the gas grill real for. But slow cooking meat over smoke is such a.

[Sal Destefano]

You know what? You know, Doug taught me in regards to salmon. Years ago, we went to an advertising, like. I don't know what it was convention or something like that course down in San Diego. And he was ordering salmon. I never heard somebody say this before. You order steak. What do you. What do they ask you? The temperature, Right? Medium rare, whatever. Yeah. He'd be like, I'll have a salmon, and I want it medium rare. I'm like, you could say that with fish. And so I started doing that. Oh, my gosh. It's way better.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, my God. It's way better. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

They don't even ask you. They just cook it that, bro.

[Sal Destefano]

Salmon.

[Adam]

Yeah. Salmon cooked medium is delicious because overcooked fish is dry.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, that's dry.

[Adam]

Yeah. Yeah. And you can eat fish raw. I mean, if you like salmon sashimi, then like, why not have it on the Almost the raw side? And you're probably better. Better off again, too. This is why I want to smoke it. Because I like. I smoke it to like a kind of a raw juicy. Yeah. And that's. I was. We were. Before we got on air. I didn't even know today was butcherbox. It would. Doug and I were talking about. Yeah, we're talking about salmon. Asking where you can get it like that. Like, I. I'll do it. I'll do it. And then they're all report back. My goal is to do it before the next.

[Sal Destefano]

I gotta show you guys. I'm gonna share this with you, Doug, so you can put it up on the screen. Do you guys want to see the. The coolest. This is not AI. This is a real. It's confirmed. It's a Russian wrestler, Bozie get easily. I can't even say his name. Forget it. I'm not gonna say his name. Doug, put up. Put on the screen this move that he did with three seconds left in the match. So it's three seconds left, he's down.

[Adam]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

And he does this move, bro. And I. By the way, I will argue this all day long. That I think overall general athleticism. I think wrestlers, high level wrestlers.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Are the best displays.

[Justin Andrews]

I can't disagree.

[Adam]

Well, we see that in, in ufc still with all these mixed martial arts, the guys that have the high pedigrees in wrestling almost always are top animals.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, click on that. And then. And then. And then you're a different kind of human. Okay, watch this. This is with 3 seconds left. Watch what he does. Ready? Jumps. Oh, what in the boom. Flipped over, jumps over him, gets him in a body lock, and then.

[Adam]

That's sick. That's sick. I've never even seen that before.

[Sal Destefano]

I. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Was that just like a spontaneous idea and he just jumped?

[Sal Destefano]

Well, that's a real move.

[Adam]

That's a real move.

[Sal Destefano]

That's a real move.

[Adam]

I've never seen anyone do that.

[Sal Destefano]

If you go over the top of someone, you jump over. So you bring your feet over and then you twist and do this kind of like. But he did it from of jump. So he wasn't like on top of the guy. And then. So he did it from a jump.

[Adam]

What a sick.

[Sal Destefano]

To catch it.

[Justin Andrews]

Like the Saquon Barkley twist your body.

[Adam]

Yeah. What a sick side.

[Sal Destefano]

Suplex or whatever.

[Adam]

Did you just pop up in your feed or something viral.

[Sal Destefano]

Right?

[Adam]

So.

[Sal Destefano]

So my. Speaking of algorithms, my algorithm often has times will have wrestling and judo. Yeah. On there.

[Justin Andrews]

Because I love that.

[Adam]

I mean, that's a cool. That's a cool move, right?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Isn't that right?

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah. That's super. That's super.

[Sal Destefano]

I got some studies to pull up on Manukora honey. Some really cool studies on Manukora honey, which is kind of wild. So I'm gonna go through some of these.

[Justin Andrews]

The healing honey. They should call it that, bro.

[Adam]

I want to try it on a cut.

[Sal Destefano]

Dude, it's crazy.

[Justin Andrews]

Experiment with that.

[Adam]

I do, man.

[Sal Destefano]

You put it on post surgical wounds and you get a a your heal faster. It shortens healing times for burns and surgical wounds. So if you have a burn, put monocora honey on it, put a band aid over it. It'll heal faster. It's good.

[Adam]

It's also delicious.

[Sal Destefano]

Don't lick it off, bro. It's also good for gingivitis. So. Yeah, dude. So if you have like inflamed gums or whatever, you could. I know, because of the sugar. No, it's the mgo and I think it's called. Is it mgo that's in there. That is antimicrobial.

[Adam]

I don't know.

[Justin Andrews]

It's because I have caps, but Sometimes I get, like, bloody, you know, gums like that.

[Sal Destefano]

That's probably because you're just. You're greeting.

[Adam]

Do everything hard.

[Justin Andrews]

Eat rocks.

[Sal Destefano]

Did you guys know that honey was more effective than over the counter cough suppressants for kids?

[Adam]

No way.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, there's a 2010 study because it coats the throat. No, it actually is a compound more

[Adam]

effective than the cough syrup for kids.

[Sal Destefano]

So they have stronger cough stuff for adults. But. So there are compounds in honey that actually affect the part of the brain that causes the cough reflex.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, I see. Okay. So it calms it down.

[Sal Destefano]

It actually. It actually reduces the cough reflu. Bucks.

[Justin Andrews]

Interesting.

[Adam]

What. What is the. What's the prescription? Just one. One teaspoon of honey.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. And. Yeah. And a couple times.

[Adam]

The next time Max gets a coffee

[Sal Destefano]

and it tastes good, I'm gonna.

[Adam]

I know. I'm still gonna try that. Versus giving some cough syrup.

[Sal Destefano]

Put it like lemon tea.

[Adam]

Just let them take it straight off the spoon.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam]

I mean, it's not like it tastes good.

[Justin Andrews]

Hot water, lemon.

[Adam]

You don't gotta. You don't gotta hide it or anything like that.

[Sal Destefano]

It's also good for H. Pylori. So if you have H. Pylori issues in the gut or gut issues due to inflammation, consuming it is good for that.

[Adam]

I made it.

[Sal Destefano]

I made it like nature's.

[Adam]

I know. We. We just went through colds in our household. Like, what is a couple weeks ago when we were all talking on the show and I made Katrina and I. Hot toddies with the honey. Yeah, I did. That actually was.

[Sal Destefano]

It's whiskey.

[Adam]

You know, that's the first time. Yeah, yeah. In lime and like, fresh. Yeah, yeah. Fresh squeezed lime whiskey and then water and then the honey. Okay. And then you could actually put a little bit. I. I did twice.

[Justin Andrews]

Cinnamon.

[Adam]

Cinnamon stick. And then I put a cinnamon stick in there. Yeah, yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

I think they used to give that to kids when they had coughs.

[Adam]

Dude. I. I have actually never.

[Justin Andrews]

Shots of whiskey, so.

[Adam]

Only because recently, like, alcohol has been a part of my life. Right. Since we've been doing this. I not. I've never done that. I have never made a hot toddy when I don't feel good. It's never thought. I've never thought I would want alcohol when I wasn't feeling good. I'm like, you know, I'm gonna make myself one. I knew I had the Monaco honey, so I'm like, I'll use that. I had. I have a lime or lemon tree, so I did a fresh squeezed lemon. It was like Katrina Was like, oh, my God, I feel.

[Justin Andrews]

This feels sick. All the ingredients in it.

[Sal Destefano]

Like. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Besides, it's gonna be a go to

[Adam]

move for me the next time I

[Sal Destefano]

have

[Justin Andrews]

to do that.

[Sal Destefano]

How many do you have to have before you feel better?

[Adam]

I mean, I had two. Yeah, I had two. I. You can make them pretty stiff. You know what I'm saying?

[Sal Destefano]

So.

[Adam]

And the. And the cinnamon stick is if you. If you like. I made the first one with no, no cinnamon, just water. And then I made another one where I did a cinnamon stick, and then I did it another time with apple cider, which has kind of a cinnamon flavor too, instead of the water.

[Justin Andrews]

Okay.

[Adam]

So if someone who doesn't can't handle the straight whiskey water, it's more like a hot cider. Yeah. So, like, probably, like, if, like, if you were.

[Justin Andrews]

I love that brand. It's a great brand.

[Adam]

Yeah. Dude, I wanted to hear your money and happiness. This.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, I'll bring it up again because

[Adam]

I saw you posting your story and I wanted to argue with you.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, no, no, this is so. So, no, this is. There's data. There's a lot of data around. Yeah, no, there's a lot of data. You've seen this before. I've shown you this data before.

[Adam]

But.

[Sal Destefano]

So they've done a lot of studies on money and happiness. And the reason why they do these studies is when people. Besides the necessities, because you need money for things that are necessary and a certain amount to feel secure. Right. So above and beyond that, people still oftentimes desire more money. I want to make more money. And you know, when you boil it down and you ask people like, why do you want more money? It all boils down to, I think it'll make me happier. Now, it might start out by saying, well, I want a bigger house or I want a new car. I want to go on this vacation. But then you keep asking, why? Well, why, why, why, why? And it's because, well, it'll make me happier. So they've done actually lots of studies on this, on what's the best ROI on money for happiness. So what's the best use of this extra money where you're gonna get the most happiness in return? Okay. And so giving it away. And so. Well, yeah, see, thanks for giving it away. Yeah, no problem. End of the story. But so they've tested it with the worst is to buy things. That's the worst. So buying something, you get a spike in happiness, but then you can't repeat that. So if you buy the same Thing again, there's no effect. And then the happiness wears off quickly and then flatline. So you buy a new purse, you buy cool shoes or whatever. And for the most part, generally what we see in the data is you get this like, spike and it drops down quickly and then nothing else. And then if you repeat it again, it's like a drug. You're just getting no effect. Right. Get the same exact purse. Again, there's no spike in happiness. Then the second which is better is experiences. So this is where you spend on, like a vacation because you create memories as you're going. Yes. And so you see a longer happiness spike. And then when you think about that, depending on what happened, the more meaningful the experience, the better the reoccurring happiness from thinking about it. Nonetheless, you still get this diminishing return over time. So I keep thinking about it, unless it was profound experience, like this is when I met my wife, or this is when I had my child or something like that, you get this diminishing return and you still get this kind of like, like a, like a drugs, like, like your body gets used to it. And so if I think about that vacation 20 years later, unless it was this profound thing, I really don't get this happiness again. And then the last one, which was wild is now there's some parameters around it. But the last one is if you use your money in a way where you voluntarily give it to someone to help them. And if you really want to maximize this according to the data, you see the outcome. So like, you have a friend who's struggling, evicted from their house, or they're sick and they need medical bills, and then you're able to step in and help them. And then you see the passively, but

[Justin Andrews]

you're like following it all the way through.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Then you get this high spike in happiness that lasts a long time. And then what they do in these studies, as long as they follow the people, so however long the study is, every time they recall that event, they get a similar spike in happiness with no drop. So it's like, hey, remember that time we, you know, help that, you know, our friend in that situation? Or hey, remember when we donated to those to help feed the poor, or we did that mission trip, they get the same spike. And so if your roi, if you're interested in is happiness, the best ROI based on the data is to give it away, which I think is really, really interesting.

[Adam]

So I, I knew where you were going to go with that. That's why I wanted you to talk about it because I've thought a lot about this and I, I think independent of each of those things that that makes sense logically. But I also think that there's a way that all three of those can be fed. Give you an example.

[Sal Destefano]

What do you mean?

[Adam]

I'll give you an example. Like, meaning like a materialistic thing that gives the other two.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh.

[Adam]

So I'll give you an example. Okay. An example that would be, you know, Katrina and I could have spent the rest of our lives in a, you know, a little condo that her, me, Max grew up in and said, I. I bought a house, Right. And this house, I designed it in a way and I bought it a certain way. And one of the most amazing parts about it is that it fits all of Katrina's family in it.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

We can all. And we've. I mean, we've thrown at least 10 or 15 parties in less than a year. So like once a month practically, where I host 30, 40, 50 of my family.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Adam]

One of my favorite things.

[Sal Destefano]

Totally, totally.

[Adam]

So it's like, it's, it is a materialistic thing, right?

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. But that's not what's giving you the happiness. Right. So it's enabling the thing that.

[Adam]

Right. So. So like, like, I think, like comparing those three cycles, like, I would say my shoes falls in that category.

[Sal Destefano]

Sure.

[Adam]

Because once you buy one, then you're on to the whatever. It's like, only serves me. You know what I'm saying? It's like very. But there's things like. And then I would even make that argument, like my buddy and I, who's a, Who's a car nut, like, who's. He's been in cars for a long time. Longer, even longer than I have. And we were having lunch one day after a drive and these, these kids, it was. There's two special needs kids came up talking to us and they pulled out and they were, oh, they're so excited. And we both let them get in and out of the car and stuff like that. And him and I were make having this conversation that. That's one of my favorite parts about that. Right. It like the initial enjoyment of the purchase and the drive of it once you've done all the cool things in it. But actually one of the gift that keeps giving about it is being able to share that experience to someone who's like, I've never sat or driven in one of these. And so I, I don't think it's as simple as this. Like, you can't get any of these other Benefits from material things.

[Sal Destefano]

What they call it is God. There's a term for it. It's like if it. If there's a social component, that's not the term that they use. So like an example would be like a guy who is pursuing. Growing his business because he wants to make more money, but he uses that money to, I don't know, I'll use an extreme example. Build orphanages. Right now he's got incredible.

[John]

Right.

[Sal Destefano]

Happiness from building his business.

[Benjamin]

Right.

[Sal Destefano]

So, yeah, I think you could tie lots of like, like lots of different things. That's why I said with the experience. I think it depends what happens in the experience. Like, oh, man, I went on this trip with my wife at the time we were dating, and this is when I proposed to her. And so then, you know, you remember that.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

So it's true. But generally speaking, and I know this because. Or I think this is. People believe this. Maybe, maybe not consciously, but subconsciously, maybe even sometimes consciously, because companies advertise to us what profit, what gives them profit, which is to buy things.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

And the way that they sell it to us is they don't sell us the thing. They sell us the dream of what the thing provides. Yeah. Which is happiness, freedom, status. You know, it's never like the purse. It's like the purse, but the people see it. Now you feel like you're more important.

[Adam]

Well, remember, that's. I remember. I. I've shared with you before on the podcast. The, the exercise that I do with myself before I make a purchase. There's. There's like boundaries.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. You wait like, yeah.

[Adam]

24 hours before I.

[Sal Destefano]

That's awesome.

[Adam]

I won't. I won't make. Then the next question is, is this something that I feel like I gotta show to everybody else or is this something for me, like. Right. So there's a lot of layers that. Because of that reason, because I know that I can be advertised market to impulsive about something, and just simply creating those boundaries makes me really think about that. But I mean, like, using the house example is like, man, I feel like it's. It's also a gift too. So it's like this. It's a gift, it's experience, and it's a materialistic thing. It's all three of those. It's like, like. And nobody in my family, in our family, has the, the ability to have a house like that that can host and do all that. So it's almost like every time, I mean, all together.

[Sal Destefano]

A great point. Imagine having your big place and not Being around any family. Right, right. How empty would that. Totally. Yeah, totally.

[Adam]

And so, and, and, and, and by the way, I. I learned this lesson. So, I mean, I know the last one, last podcast, we were teasing me about my b. This is like, me. My house is not that big. I had a much bigger. I've had a much bigger, arguably fancier place with views and everything to live. But we were just far enough away from family. Nobody came over. And I remember Katrina and I being like, what is this for? Yeah, we've got this cool place, you know, and maybe on Instagram, it would look cool to show people, but it's like, if. If I'm not using it to enjoy family, do that, then it defeats the purpose. And so being where we're at in a smaller place that's filled with love and people, and to know that you. That every time I do that, it's like. It's like I get to give a gift again, and I get to experience something again. It's like. So there's like, to me, there's a. A fine line because I feel like there can be very extreme people on both ends. It can be this, you know, I'm. I'm all material and status, direction you're going. And then there can be the, like, nothing matters like money.

[Sal Destefano]

I find it interesting, like, if you look at. I mean, you're right 100%. But I think a lot. I think more people struggle with the first part. If they real. Maybe they don't realize it, but if they really did an analysis, it's like, man, do I need all this stuff? And what do I think I'm going to get from getting these things? And what happens is, like, it's a feedback loop. It's like, I got this thing. I got the little spike of happiness. It's gone. It's not happening yet. Let me try getting something else. By the way, the data shows on the other side, too. When people give to help others, they are. Then they start to do it more because they start to feel it and realize it. And so it kind of becomes this positive, oh, yeah, feedback loop. So, I mean, it's really. I think it's fascinating. It's interesting because I don't think a lot of people realize that. But if you really think about it, what do I want with this? Like, I got my stuff taken care of. What do I want with this extra money? What do I really want? I just want to be happy. I feel secure already. I got my savings. We're good. Yeah. What do I Want from. I want to be happy. Okay, let me see. Let me try it in this way. Yeah.

[Adam]

Do you. Do you ever challenge yourself? Because do you. Or do you ever think of yourself on. On one side or that extreme or the other and challenge yourself to go outside that a little bit?

[Sal Destefano]

Because I'll.

[Adam]

I'll be the first to admit that the first 30 years, I was probably somebody who leaned on that. You know, I had to learn that lesson and maybe a little bit before 30, because I was doing things like the. The stuff that, you know, that I've done before for families and things like that. And I. And I got to feel that that was a big. Which, by the way, I think for anybody, that's such a great exercise. Like, if you've never done something like that, regardless of what. What level you're at, it doesn't have. You don't have to be at a super level. In fact, I would argue, because even when I did that way back when I wasn't in a major financial status to where I had lots of extra money to go give, like, I think it felt really good knowing that I didn't and actually still did that and being able to draw back on that memory of doing something for families like that and go, like, wow, I could still think about that and get. Get that spike, you know, here a decade and a half, two decades later or whatever. So I think that helps pull that back in a little bit. And then just becoming aware of. As you stack up some of those material things. I think my sneakers are a good example that. Very aware of the, you know, ridiculousness of. Of that. Right. Like, and it doesn't give it. There is no. Nobody else is getting enjoyment. There's no real experiences other than being on my damn feet that, you know, I'm saying, like, you should give them away.

[Justin Andrews]

I have.

[Sal Destefano]

I've given a lot of them.

[Adam]

Oh, yeah. A lot of my shoes. I've given away. A ton of my shoes I've given away.

[John]

So.

[Adam]

Yeah, so. But I do think there's also that. I mean, do you ever challenge yourself?

[Sal Destefano]

Like, you know, I would. I mean, I have. Boy, I have challenges in a lot of different areas. Like, I thank God that this one is for me, for whatever reason, has never been an issue. It never been, like, a challenge. Maybe because I grew up feeling secure in this way. It was never a big deal with my family, I think. So, you know, when it comes to, like, money in that way, I've never felt challenges there. Thank God. I have challenges in a lot of areas where I really struggle. But that's one where I, I thank God every day, like, okay, this is not one that I is a problem because I could see that one being a hard one. Especially if you become successful. I could see that being a real challenge for some people or not being successful. I think that would be even harder. Yeah, yeah. Imagine being challenged that way and also

[Adam]

feeling like, well, I think that's where a lot of people land. I think a lot of people land in that place of like constantly chasing this, this.

[Sal Destefano]

Well, look at the debt people have with like just buying cars. Yeah. Like the average car payment.

[Adam]

Insane.

[Sal Destefano]

It's crazy. And most people have. It shouldn't even own that car. But what are they doing it for? And I think there's. They bought this kind of idea.

[Adam]

Yeah. Did you see? I shared with you. I think you guys, Chris Nagibis, like, like on like the credit card debt. It's unbelievable what we're in right now. Like, and the, the ability now to defer like food and defer like your rent. Like, that's crazy.

[Sal Destefano]

That's crazy.

[Adam]

Yeah, it's wild.

[Sal Destefano]

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[Howie Mandel]

Our first caller is Benjamin from Switzerland.

[Adam]

Hey Benjamin, what's happening? How you doing, man? Hey, how are you guys? Good, good.

[Sal Destefano]

How can we help you?

[Benjamin]

So, bit of context here, it's a two part question, but a few years ago, basically I lost a substantial amount

[Adam]

of weight

[Benjamin]

and so it was a great benefit for my life. But I eventually pushed things way too far with training, volume, running intensity and especially the whole like calorie tracking aspect of things, which basically saw my hormones, energy and just a lot of blood markets kind of just completely tank. And so for the last few years it's really been more of like a uphill battle in a way of trying to rebuild my body, my relationship with it, but also just managing overall stress better, especially with I'm kind of leading two to three careers at the same time, so that's definitely a challenge. I've run quite a few of your programs over the past couple years. Right now I'm doing performance again. Not too sure if I should stick with it, but it seemed like a decent fit. And so my goals. Goals right now, basically are to try and put on some muscle again, because I feel like I've been spinning my wheels, but without overdoing the volume. I've been very into mobility and, like, handstand trainings also, and recently did pick running back up, which I know sounds counterintuitive, but I've really focused more on just the joy of it without tracking metrics too much. And I've been loving it so far, so. So, yeah, more than anything, I think, to be honest, it's more about getting back to feeling like the little ball of energy I used to be known for being. I guess so, yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Good question. So in your email, it says you lost over £100.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. In the space of around two years, I lost around £135.

[Adam]

So.

[Sal Destefano]

Great job. Oh, yeah.

[Adam]

You look great, dude.

[Sal Destefano]

Great job, man. And. And so now the main goal is I just want to feel better and have more energy.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. I think obviously the muscle and all that, like, that's something that will come with time. But it really is just like you said, the daily energy, just feeling good, and whether that's also with my relationship with food, exercise, and it's gone so much better already. But obviously it's always a work in progress.

[Sal Destefano]

And then you said you have about three careers on right now. Can you explain that a little bit?

[Benjamin]

So basically, I'm a professional musician. I'm a chist, so I'm a performing soloist after having done my postgrad in that. But at the same time, I'm working in my family business, which is dermatology, but also longevity clinic now. So I'm working in that aspect of things and studying to become a health coach at the same time to kind of mend the two together.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, so this is a lot of. A lot of work.

[John]

Yeah.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. Long days.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay. Okay. So losing that much weight is a. Is profoundly transformational, but also it's a big deal on the body. You lost the whole human off your body, and what it takes to get there is not. Not where you want to stay to maintain. And you're probably feeling the low energy because you're just. You're just doing too much and you want to go through a period of rejuvenation and rebuilding. And you're going to need to go through this period for probably a year or two before you start to ramp things up and, and chase different goals. So you gotta, you're gonna have to go through a period of rest essentially. Now that doesn't mean you don't exercise, but everything that you do is kind of moving in that direction or centered towards that or aiming towards that. And what you'll notice from that is more energy. So less is more with this process. You know, Maps 15 would be your strength training protocol.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

If you really, really love running, I guess it's okay. But I, if you want the energy, I would walk and just focus on steps.

[Adam]

I'll just make sure you're fueled if you're gonna do that Running like we're, we're. I mean you don't want to be running and really low calorie too. That would be really bad recipe. Running with, with the proper amount of nutrients and calories for the enjoyment of it, I could see. Okay, but if I was training you, I'd want to, I'd want to know where we're at calorie wise before I let you go run and do that. I mean, kind of where Sal's going and where my brain goes with where you're at in your life. He did such an incredible job getting down to where you are. You're very, you're, you're, you're a much healthier, fitter place. Your workouts should try your, your workouts actually shouldn't be your focus. Your focus should be kind of the career, your passions, staying healthy. And so you should train to, to be that person. You've, you've done such a good job getting here and then all the other things, the energy hormone stuff, all that stuff will balance itself out because you work out to support your lifestyle and what you're doing not to get to a certain place, you're at a place in your life where you have a lot of stuff going on. You've already accomplished the big, the big rock, which was getting all that weight off your body and putting yourself in a healthy weight. Now, now what like your workout optimization looks like is, is really doing the, the least amount to elicit the most change, which is just a minimal dose that keeps you strong, get you good rest, keeps you mobile, but not trying to stretch yourself and like hit these goals and trying to gain a bunch of muscle or get really good at BJJ or it's like, that's what's going to optimize you for longevity.

[Sal Destefano]

And Benjamin, that doesn't mean you're always going to be there.

[Adam]

Right? Right.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay. Because this period of your time, this is a season. So to put it differently, you went through a radical physical and psychological transformation losing all that weight. And so now your body needs to go through a period of rest. That was a radical change. So like, like when I work with a woman who gets pregnant and has a baby, they're always like, how quickly can I get back in shape? How fast can I get back to highways? Like, well, hold on, we just went through a radical change. It's gonna. Now, that doesn't mean you don't progress afterwards, but it's gonna take a couple years before you start to feel like, oh, like I'm back to my old self. Because that radical change, your change was massive. 135 pound weight loss physically is a big deal, but it's also psychologically a big deal. Like your mind had to change quite a bit to go from where you were to where you're at now now. So now you got to go through a period of rest and recuperation, which is probably going to look like a year or two.

[Adam]

Which also by the way though, is the fastest path to you feeling better. You white knuckling though, you white knuckling it and trying to work your way back to a healthier version of yourself is not going to work.

[Sal Destefano]

No.

[Adam]

So this is not like one of those things. It's like, can I do this and can I do that? Can I do this to get to me to feel this way? It's like, honestly, the less you do in this situation and focus just on healthy rest recovery, doing as little as possible to build some strength and, and that's what it looks like. So this is not one of those things. Of what are all the things I can do to get there faster? The fastest path actually looks like the kind of laying off like what Sal's alluding to right now. That is the fastest path. And I think you'll, I think you'll see positive changes relatively quick before I think he's setting the table. So you have to set your expectations right, that this could take a year or so to get back to feeling like the best version of you. But you could, you could start to feel that right away and a lot sooner, but it's not through doing more.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, the reason, the reason why I'm saying a year or two is because you are going to feel better quickly and you might be fooled into thinking, now I can ramp things back up. Because if you, if you started following Maps 15 right now and you did no additional strength training, no additional workouts, and all you did was maps 15 and walk, walk. Okay. No extra exercise, no running, no calisthenics, no bjj, no nothing. Just, just walk every day. Make sure I get, you know, 8 to 10,000 steps. And then my lifting looks like maps 15, which is like two lifts. Energy be through the roof within. Within a month, you're gonna notice an increase in energy and you're gonna feel good. And then you're gonna be fooled into thinking, okay, now I can ramp it back up.

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

What I'm saying to you is you gotta have a year of that, a year of feeling good, a year of that rest before you start to ramp things up. Maybe even two years. Because that's £135 is not nothing. Most people don't even get close to that weight loss. You literally lost an entire human.

[Rebecca]

So.

[Sal Destefano]

So that's the direction you want to go and the reason why you feel like you're doing these things. But your energy isn't good, is too much. It's time now to let your body settle after all that massive shift. Because if you keep pushing, which by the way, pushing isn't going to look like a lot. So. Because you may judge it, you may think, well, this is not that much. I know people who work out like that.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

But they didn't lose 135 pounds. So give yourself like a year or two of sitting in that rest and then I promise you it's going to be like, oh man, I can start ramping things up and you'll be a brand new person.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. It's funny because like I obviously, and it's what we always say, like, I know deep down that that's exactly what I would tell others. And it's always harder and it's always way. Yeah, we, we never follow our like own advice. And that's why I already, I've now, it's been what, maybe eight or eight months maybe or so that I, I decided to put BJJ on the side. And that was tough. Like I, I really fell in love with it. And it also, it was one of my outlets in the beginning to kind of shift my focus away from all the calorie tracking and all that. And it gave me this kind of focus that, I mean, you've talked about it of like just performance and. Yeah, that kind of aspect. But I realized that it's still not the right moment and I'll pick it back up, I'm sure, later on. But that, that was kind of. I, I know that was rough for me, but if I, if I'm honest with myself, like, like, I know that over the past four years, since I lost our weight, like, I've hovered around the same 5 kilos, which is maybe like 10 pounds of like trying these, like, kind of bulks, but then stopping a bit shy because I felt uncomfortable with it. Also, from my perspective, there's a side of. It is always hard to judge in terms of. I know I like this, obviously some new skin and stuff like that. So judging, like, also where I'm at body wise, like, like body fat percent and all that is objectively deceiving. And that often is a barrier in itself to, you know, just trust the process. And I've really worked since, like September or so to just stay on. I, I set this goal of whatever happens. Like, I'm not going to do anything too drastic in terms of trying to. Even approaching the holidays. It's the first time I didn't approach it with a cut or anything. So, like, I've done huge improvements in terms of that. But it's always. Yeah, it's. It's something I know. Like, it will take time. I'm just trying to navigate kind of this. How do I. Yeah. The working out in terms of. Benjamin, I know you don't need much.

[Sal Destefano]

Let me encourage you. Let me encourage you.

[Benjamin]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

What you did to lose 135 pounds is a lot harder than what you need to do right now.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay. You're being really hard on yourself. Number two, I've never seen somebody lose over £100 and look as good as you do. Yeah, never.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

You sent some pictures. I'm like, muscular dude. Yeah. You talk about loose skin. Like, you look really like your body bounced better than I've ever seen. Yeah. And I've worked with a lot of people who've had some pretty radical transformations through bariatric surgeries and the like. So you're doing great. Here's. Here's the deal. Okay. You're afraid of going back to where you were before, and I get that. Here's how you should approach your nutrition. Stop tracking. Eat until you're satisfied. Eat whole foods. Hit your protein. That's it. That's it. Don't weigh yourself because that's going to mess you up. Up. And try not to study yourself in the mirror or take pictures of yourself too much with your shirt off and

[Justin Andrews]

don't try and feel good.

[Adam]

Don't try and bulk or cut. Feed the body when it's hungry. It's a beautiful thing when it'll tell you how much. When you're getting healthy and you're strength training with like a maps 15, it will tell you when it needs more calories to build that muscle and it'll tell you when you're satisfied and fine. It's a beautiful thing.

[Sal Destefano]

So long as it's whole natural foods, you can trust your satiety signals much more. So you just eat, eat whole natural foods. Hit your protein targets, which is your body weight and protein. Eat that first. Follow Mass 15 and just walk. Two lifts a day.

[Adam]

You're good.

[Sal Destefano]

That's it, dude. And yeah, it's going to be hard, but it's. I'm telling you right now, it is what you went through to get here, way harder, dude. Yeah, you're being really. I think you've just got some fear because you're maybe afraid of going back to where you were before or whatever, but I don't think that's going to happen.

[Benjamin]

Yeah, for sure. And like, I think it's kind of part two of the question, if that's all right.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, yeah.

[Benjamin]

I think you hit a right note about the fears that like, I'm very aware of it. But there's in a sense also a bit of imposter syndrome, I think, because a big thing for me right now, like a massive goal and like driving purpose in my life, which I've always had from playing the cheddar, you know, performing for people. It's. I want to help people and like serve and in this case I basically want to help them avoid the mistakes that I made along the way. And so, like, I know that everyone goes through their struggles, but there's that aspect of I'm still struggling with certain things and I'm very honest about it. I have no issue talking about it, but managing that kind of reality of things while also being able to help others in their life journeys and transformations.

[Adam]

Lean into it. Lean into it, Benjamin.

[Sal Destefano]

That'll make you better.

[Adam]

Lean into it. You've been listening to the show for a long time.

[Benjamin]

Yeah, I knew you were going to say that.

[Adam]

Of course I'm going to say that.

[Benjamin]

I could have quoted you, I think.

[Adam]

Yeah. Because if you've listened for a long time, you know, that's what makes this show is that we're not afraid to share our struggles. The things still today, you know, what we go through and Our mishaps and what we learned and how silly and stupid we were before and how we keep making mistakes. And people connect with that, and people will resonate with that, and they'll. They'll respect that. So lean into that. Lean into where you're at in your journey. Where you get imposter syndrome is when you try and pretend you're something you're not and. And people will appreciate the vulnerability and appreciate what you've accomplished already is amazing and can help so many people from. From your story. Don't try and pretend like you have all the answers and you've figured it all out. Let them know.

[Sal Destefano]

Then you'll be an imposter.

[Adam]

That's right. Then you'll feel imposter syndrome. Be who you are and where you're at and open with what you're still trying to figure out. And that is what will resonate with the people that you're helping. And you'll help way more people that way, and you'll be far more successful if you come from that place.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. Yeah. And I. I started sharing, actually some social media content, like, focused around cooking because I love cooking and giving, like, kind of healthier tips around that, like meal prep. Like, you often, like, I may have used you a couple of times in terms of cooking batch, meats, the dinner before. But, yeah, trying to, like, because it's been a way to reclaim kind of power over food, like the way that it controlled me, and I'm trying to funnel that also. But, yeah, I. I know I'm stepping in the right direction. It's more just kind of being able to strip things down and get a clear view.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. I have. No, I have a lot of confidence that you're gonna do great.

[Adam]

You're doing good, bro.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. I think that the discomfort you feel is because you're such a fast grower, it sounds like. Sounds like you're pretty rapid with personal growth when you kind of decide to go in a direction, and that's always uncomfortable, but you're going, you're doing great, bro. You're doing really, really well. Give yourself a good year of rest. So that's how you approach your exercise. A good year of rest around food, which means you're not watching every bite. You're just eating when you feel hungry. Sticking to whole natural foods. Hit your protein first. That's your. Those are your. Those are your guardrails. I think it's great if you help other people. I think that's one of the things that saved me from going too Crazy was that I helped other people and be honest and be just totally honest. Make you a better coach, better trainer. That's it.

[Rebecca]

It.

[Sal Destefano]

That's it. Yeah. You're doing great, dude.

[Benjamin]

Yeah. And I just wanted to say. Yeah, thanks for all the stories also that you guys share. I know recently, Adam, everything you've been talking about, like, it just like what I want to be able to provide to others, like, it really does help give a lot of a more human, like, approach to this. So I think it's. Yeah, it's amazing what you guys have been doing.

[Sal Destefano]

Awesome. Thank you.

[Adam]

You're going to do great, brother.

[Sal Destefano]

Do you have maps 15? Do you have any of those programs also? So.

[Benjamin]

Actually I do have 15, but I was wondering if maybe to make Justin happy also, do you reckon Maps 15 performance could be something to look at?

[Adam]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Sal Destefano]

I'll send it to you. They're both great.

[Benjamin]

You'll love them. Thank you so much.

[Sal Destefano]

Yep. You got it, dude.

[Adam]

Good. All right, buddy.

[Benjamin]

If I can ask one last little suggestion.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Benjamin]

You guys should consider doing some sort of like, Maps Inner or Maps Inner Circle program with Jordan Siren once.

[Sal Destefano]

Great, dude.

[Benjamin]

I'm sure that's something a lot of people would love.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Awesome.

[Adam]

We love Jordan.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, he's great.

[Adam]

Sure, man.

[Sal Destefano]

He's great.

[Adam]

All right, Benjamin, take it easy, brother. Keep it up.

[Benjamin]

All right.

[Sal Destefano]

By the way, his. The way he looks after losing 135 pounds, that's like, best.

[Justin Andrews]

I know. It's crazy because 135 pounds is huge.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, it's massive. You gotta. You gotta go through. Look, you go through a drastic, dramatic. First of all, losing 30 pounds of body fat is a big change, mentally, physically. 135 pounds. Yeah. You're gonna need a year to just sit in it and just let your body rest, recuperate. You were chasing for that whole time.

[Adam]

It's really good that we had a discussion around that because I know what you mean when you say that, but I think a lot of people hear that and they think, a year. I gotta wait a year to see results. Yeah. To feel good. Yeah. You know, I just think that it's. Or just think it's going to be that long until they feel good at all. It's like, no, you'll feel. You'll feel better and better every week,

[Sal Destefano]

and then you got to just wait a year.

[Adam]

And you're right. What happens to people is they start off the right path by taking the advice, and then a month or two later, like, oh, I feel great. And then they start to ramp it up.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right.

[Adam]

And they go right back. And so that's really the advice is that, listen, you're going to be, you're going to be feeling really good pretty quick.

[Rebecca]

Quick.

[Adam]

You know, a couple, couple months of taking that advice, walking and eating like that and, and training mass 15. Yeah. You'll be humming 30, 60 days. He's gonna be feeling really good. What the, what he doesn't know is that his body's not really good yet and it needs to stay in that place for a year. And that's going to be the, the hard part is the temptation to want to ramp up and do more.

[Howie Mandel]

Our next caller is John from Kentucky.

[Sal Destefano]

What's up, John?

[Adam]

How you doing, John?

[John]

How you doing, Gus?

[Adam]

Good, good.

[Sal Destefano]

How can we help you, man?

[John]

Well, I'll just start with the emails. Most people do. I said hello guys. First of all, I want to thank you for the information that you guys put out and the way you put it out there. So many people like to make things sound so complicated and I really appreciate the, the simple way you guys put it out. So that's common. Folk can understand it. Backstory time. I'm 47 years old, 6 foot 4, 322 pounds, down from 380 at my heaviest. It's been several years to get there. Yo, yo, back and forth, on and off. So type 2 diabetic. I am on mancharo more for the diabetes and the weight loss, but my doctor keeps pushing me to try to get my dose up. I'm currently on 7.5 milligrams weekly. It's the, the auto injector, all or nothing. Do have low Testosterone. I was sub 100 when we found out about it. They put me on 200mg every other week. Levels come up to about 404 average. So I've talked to my doctor into putting me on 200mg weekly. And after listening to your MP Hormones podcast the other day, I've decided to start even breaking that up and doing the Monday, Thursday like, like he had suggested on that video. So doing the 100 on Monday, 100 on Thursday. Just started that this week. So I can't really tell you how well it's working for me, but hopefully works a lot better than what this has been. I am a stage three rectal cancer survivor with a stage one reoccurrence almost two years later. Luckily, you know, they were able to catch that reoccurrence super, super early. So it allowed for A surgical procedure that didn't leave me with any kind of a permanent colostomies or stuff like that. So definitely thank God for that one because I was struggling with that one. So. I'm an athletic trainer at a local high school here where I live. Job's not always physically demanding, but there's lots of standing, lots of moving and I've always been, always been the fat guy, always been the fat kid and started to stop more times than I can count. Kind of tired of it. Time to make a. Time to make a change. Sorry I waited so long in life to do it, but I gotta do it. So looking around on Spotify for a podcast on Fitness over 40 and I found your episode about the best workout, diet and supplement routine for men over 40. I wrote everything down, started doing everything to the letter. As with most knuckleheads, I decided to add a third day to it instead of doing the two days. And it's what it is, right? More is better, right. So after 10 weeks of that, which we're at 12 weeks now, I'm making good progress, at least I was. Ended up with a pinched nerve in my neck. My doctor, that's my medical director here, confirmed that yesterday. Put me on some high dose steroids and some muscle relaxers. Doing a little bit of PT with a buddy of mine to kind of hope to get that lined out pretty quick as quick as I can and get back into to doing everything. My nutrition isn't perfect. I work some crazy hours, do the best I can. Was trying to eat whole foods. Doesn't always work. Sometimes Subway is the best I could do that day. Or you know, unfortunately pizza. So I'm averaging about 2600 calories a day, 160 grams of protein, 236 grams of carbs, 121 grams of fat.

[Benjamin]

So

[John]

I was losing with the pinch nerve. I was losing some actually a lot of strength in my left arm as far as the triceps go. Having pain and muscle spasms in that tricep. Didn't know if I was over training or if it was the pinch nerve. Then to find out it's the pinch nerve. I probably over trading a little bit too with not enough calories would be my guess. But elbow kind of kicks out, gives out when I'm trying to do any kind of chest or a tricep exercise. So started to go backwards on that. Really kind of hit me a little bit. I was doing some good. That, that, that, that back spot kind of hurt me there a little bit. But I just, I want to know you guys opinion on what I need to do now. I mean, obviously after I get this pinch nerve under control, where do I need to go from here?

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, you're doing pretty well. I mean the, the, the, the black and white answers. And by the way, in your email you said they wanted to up your dose of Manjaro.

[Justin Andrews]

Yes.

[John]

Yeah, my doctor keeps trying to get me to push that up and I keep fighting her. And as a matter of fact, I've got an appointment next week and I'm going to tell her I want to drop back down. I want to drop down to the 5 milligram to get off to 7 5. It causes so much GI problems with me. It really hits me hard. I, when I take it at the beginning of the week, for the first two or three days it's miserable. Then it kind of gets better, but then it's time to take it again and I'm just tired of the GI problems with it.

[Sal Destefano]

Is it constipation, diarrhea, Is it acid reflux?

[John]

All the above, it's diarrhea. It's just nausea, that kind of stuff.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay.

[Adam]

I will tell you too though, just so you know, the most likely, at least in my experience, the subway sandwiches and the pizza will exacerbate that for sure too. Just so you know, like, yes, it definitely does not do well on foods that your body doesn't digest easy. It definitely makes all those things really, really difficult. So my clients that have struggled with this, helping them connect those dots that, hey, it's like when you're taking that stuff, it's even more important to eat super clean. And if you don't, you're gonna, you're gonna end up paying for it.

[Sal Destefano]

You could take, you could try, you could try psyllium, husk fiber, and you take that with each meal. And oftentimes it makes a difference. Okay. Yeah, with, with the GI stuff. Okay. So I mean, here's the thing. You want to be consistent with nutrition.

[John]

Yes.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay. And maintain that. And then as far as workout is concerned, I can send you one of ours so you have something to follow. But you know, also just taking a step back, John, you said this is something you've been just cycling. That's a challenge you've been dealing with since you were a kid. Yes. Okay. Your best bet is, I don't know if it's, if it's feasible for you, but working with a coach is going to be your best bet because it's going to be a bit of a process. So we have really good coaches. You would work with them, and what they would do is they would take you through step by step. So they start you off with nutrition, they look at what you're doing. We'll start tracking, make adjustments as we go along. They'll also make adjustments to your workout programming where you could send videos of your technique and your form and then just continue to coach you along the way. Because it is going to be a bit of a journey. I will say, I think you're doing a great job. Yeah, you got the hormones down. Looks like you've already lost like 60 pounds or something like that, which is really good. You're moving in the right direction for sure, which would make you a really good candidate for now, taking the step and working with a coach. And I think six months of coaching would be super transformational for a guy like you. I think it would be very, very, very transformational.

[Adam]

Also, really good timing with you getting the TRT up because 400 is still low now. You're gonna. You're gonna end up being higher than that now, which is gonna be so nice. And that's. And, and if you do hit those macros, if we can hit those Mac, those are good macros. Your, your. The numbers you gave. If we can be consistent with that TRT levels up following good programming, real good consistent progress. Yeah, you. You should, you should start doing really well. So now, that doesn't mean we won't have tough weeks and backslides, but that's what the coaching and what Sal's talking about is in those moments, in those times that the, the coach who's just like, all right, this is what I want you to do from here. Probably the biggest mistake clients do when they're on their own with this is hard swings one way or other, either doing really, really good or, ah, you have really shitty, bad eating and bad, bad couple days or like that.

[John]

Yeah.

[Adam]

And. And sometimes that's over. Committing yourself to too much too soon at certain stages. So that. And this is what good coaching looks like. Is that. That consistent conversation where it's like, you know, as a coach, I can see, okay, there's a couple things he's doing here that I don't want him doing, but I don't want to tell him to stop all that stuff. I'm gonna have him just focus on this one thing, right. And let's get better at that. And then this and that. That's what it looks like is just attacking one. One thing that's going to make Improvement. And then another thing that's gonna make improvement.

[Sal Destefano]

You left. The coach determine that.

[Adam]

Yeah. And the coach determines that for you to help you stack these wins. So it doesn't feel like this pendulum swinging back and forth really hard just to give you.

[Sal Destefano]

Just so you know, the hard swings. Part of the reason why it's a hard swing to the, to the good side is because you feel like crap about, you know, what just happened. I just fell off, I just ate a whole pizza, whatever. Then you swing real hard in one direction and then you hate it, and then you swing hard in the other direction.

[John]

And so, yeah, here's several times I've let you know. Several times I've let you know a bad day or two bad days or something just kind of, kind of sabotage that. And I'm like, well, crap. And then, yep, you know, here we go.

[Sal Destefano]

But, and you know what? Here's the deal too. Like, feeling crappy about yourself in that way only makes it all worse. And this sounds logical, by the way. You know, you probably understand this up here, but, you know, getting through the process and feeling it, you know, in here makes a big difference. So I'll give you this advice right here. The coach will be very effective the more honest you are and the more you turn to them. Okay, so what you don't want to do is keep from them the little mess ups. Keep from them the challenge, keep. They tell you like, look, I don't want to do that. Be honest with them. That'll allow them to coach you in a very effective way. I think in six months, you'll be huge, huge difference. You'll have some, definitely some physical changes for sure, but just the mental place you're going to be in, very different in six months. And it'll be, it'll. Your odds of success, consistent success will go through the roof. So. So that's essentially what you'd be looking at.

[John]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

Yep. You want somebody to call you?

[John]

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I'll talk to somebody.

[Sal Destefano]

All right, I'm gonna have someone call you, John. Okay. And I'll let them know what we talked about and then I hope to see you in there, dude.

[Adam]

Yeah, sounds great. All right, brother. You're doing good, man.

[Sal Destefano]

Yep.

[John]

Appreciate you guys.

[Adam]

Thanks.

[Sal Destefano]

I just want people to know too, like, listening, like, it's, it's very easy for us experienced, you know, fitness guys to tell them the right answers. Of course, that's. That's not hard. That's easy. The hard part is like, okay, now we got to do it and we Gotta do it consistently. And then, oh, you messed up. What do we do now? And, you know, you're looking at, you know, for a guy like this, with what he's gone through, you know, between six months to a year of that real transformation, where then it's like, you know what? I can do this. I got this. I can do this on my own.

[Adam]

Well, and I'm so glad you said what you said with the last piece of advice of being honest with your coach, because a lot of the success or the failure of this is hinges on that.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right.

[Adam]

If he's really transparent and like, man, that was really hard to do those things, or I really like that, or, you know, I screwed up and I did this thing, a good coach will be able to see that and go

[Sal Destefano]

work with what you tell them.

[Adam]

Yeah. And then, then I know it's like, okay, I gave him a little too much. I did a little too much too soon. Let me just have him do this. And. And then we start stacking wins and then I can add another thing and so. And getting that. And that's a six month to a year type of journey.

[Sal Destefano]

What happens sometimes, oftentimes I would say is the person does well in the beginning, then they start messing up. They hide it from the trainer or they tell them, and then they get sick of telling them that they messed up a bunch of times. So they hide it and then they stop seeing the coach. But it's not because they don't like the coach. It's because they're like, I just don't want to deal with this. I don't want to be that. That failure or whatever. So you just got to keep turning to them. Keep turning. They'll be way more effective if you do that.

[Howie Mandel]

Our next caller is Rebecca from Florida.

[Sal Destefano]

Hi, Rebecca.

[Adam]

Hi, Rebecca.

[Rebecca]

Huge fan. So excited to be here.

[Adam]

Thank you.

[Sal Destefano]

Thanks for calling in. How can we help you?

[Rebecca]

So my husband and I are starting our first cut. We've been on a bulk, so we both like to give you a little background. I started weight training about a year ago, got in a big accident, had to kind of change up my routine. So started weight training for the first time, fell in love with it, started doing a bulk to build up my muscles. So I've been doing reverse diets. We listen to your advice all the time and kind of working out every day, four, five to six times a week. Now we want to start a cut, and one is your nutrition advice. Workout advice. We're thinking about changing our workout routine to about three days a week. Our training and kind of doing more full body. We did the push, pull legs, and then a variety of other exercises. So want some advice on that and some advice on nutrition?

[Sal Destefano]

All right, Rebecca, first off, I'm going to ask you why you want to do a cut.

[Adam]

You look amazing for me.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, you look like you're, like, low 20s. Body fat burs. Like, what do you want to try to get to?

[Rebecca]

Well, like, I've gained 10, so I've gained about 10 pounds. I'm about a 22 body fat, but I've gained about 10 pounds. So I'm feeling like, what do I do next? I don't want to, like, keep gaining, but I want to make sure that I like.

[Adam]

Where are your cal. Where are your calories at right now?

[Rebecca]

So I don't track that.

[Adam]

Okay.

[Rebecca]

I feel like I've been super hungry since I started.

[Adam]

That's such a good. That's you getting.

[Rebecca]

No, I eat a lot. Like, I. You know, we try to get. Keep up our protein goals, but I don't. We don't track macros or calories.

[Sal Destefano]

So, Rebecca, what's your. What's your husband's body fat percentage at? Did he test it?

[Rebecca]

He is now at 21. So he gained. He went from 1 75. He went up another 10%. And then the also question is, we love working out together. We're really busy. We have three kids. This is our time together. Can we be doing the same or should we be doing the same workout?

[Sal Destefano]

Your workout's fine, but. Okay, so here's what I'm gonna tell you. I don't think you should go on a cuff cut.

[Adam]

He could go on a cut.

[Sal Destefano]

He could go on a cut.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Your body fat percentage is low 20s. You're 22%. I can see that you got some muscle, healthy range. You're 50. If you go on a cut, you're not going to like the way it feels at all. In fact, the better way for you to get leaner is to keep building

[Adam]

muscle, especially if you're getting the signal that you're still hungry.

[Justin Andrews]

Feed.

[Sal Destefano]

You'll actually get leaner easier. Yeah, you'll get leaner easier if you just focus on building for you.

[Adam]

Yes.

[Sal Destefano]

If you start to cut, what'll probably happen is you'll lose some muscle. Hormones are going to go, not that good, and you're not going to be very happy. So I would have you continue on the reverse, and you can slow it down if you want and just try to keep building muscle. I don't know where your husband's calories are at, so unless they're low, then that would be different.

[Rebecca]

But if he's at 21, we both try to eat. I mean, we have free kids, teenage kids. We have big dinners, but we have a lot of protein. We eat a lot of meat.

[Adam]

Okay, good, good, good.

[Rebecca]

He is. So what about the fitness? What about the training routines? So we've been doing like. Like five days. We were thinking about doing now cutting it to three days. Full body.

[Adam]

I love that.

[Rebecca]

Anabolic maps Anabolic, cardio on the off days.

[Adam]

Like on two days.

[Sal Destefano]

Perfect.

[Adam]

Love that.

[Sal Destefano]

That's perfect.

[Adam]

Love that. Map's anabolic with the cardio on the off days, two days a week.

[Rebecca]

Justin actually bought me Muscle Mommy. Muscle mommy maps 15, but I can't figure out how to get it into the routine that I'm doing.

[Sal Destefano]

Why don't I just send you the original muscle Mom?

[Justin Andrews]

Me would. Yeah, probably be better fit.

[Adam]

Yeah, the original working out a three,

[Sal Destefano]

you know, a few days a week.

[Justin Andrews]

The trigger sessions. You do your cardio.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, that's it. I'll send you that program. You follow that, and your husband can follow along if he wants to change

[Adam]

some of the switch, Give him muscle, give him maps, anabolic. And you guys can both be working out at the same time doing similar stuff. It's a different programming. But put him on it. Put him on anabolic. He can run a cut. You stay the same. And so. So is there. Since you don't track, should we track?

[Sal Destefano]

I mean.

[Adam]

Well, I'm not gonna. I never would force a client because you. You especially as great as you look, and you're doing such a good job, but I'd ask a little bit deeper questions about you, like if you were to tell me what's our bad thing? Like, do you. Are you are. Do you. If. If you're not eating. Perfect. What does it look like?

[Rebecca]

Our bad thing is not food, it's drinking. So we're trying to not drinking during the week.

[Adam]

Okay.

[Rebecca]

Like wine with dinner and.

[Adam]

Okay.

[John]

So.

[Adam]

Okay, so here's my advice to you. If you want to. To lean out a little bit, try and replace the alcohol calories with meals. So instead of. Instead of drinking, instead of 160 calories

[Sal Destefano]

of the wine, have a meal. Like a real small.

[Adam]

You're not having 160 calories. Nobody has 160 calories. This guy. Do you have. What do you have?

[Sal Destefano]

What?

[Adam]

Say, do you have 12 out 12 ounce glass? I'm sure you have I'm sure you have four or five hundred calories worth of wine, which is normal when someone's having an nice night of drinking. So that Katrina and I enjoy that everyone. But if you want to see your body change a little bit more without tracking doing that, do your best to replace the alcohol with a good meal, a good balanced meal. With the way your metabolism going, the way you're building muscle, you will build more muscle. You will lean out if you can do. And listen, I'm not going to tell you to do it forever. Just do it for me for a couple months and I'll show you what that. That your body. And guess what? When you build the more by switching that for a little bit, building the muscle, your metabolism going, then you can get away with more of the alcohol later on and still keep a better body. So that. So if that's your thing, it sounds like you're doing a lot of the other things right. And I, and I bet the extra protein that your, your body will need will fuel that building muscle. That would be it. That's all I would change. That's enough. You told me enough right there to go that little tweak for a couple months will not only lean you out, you'll see yourself, your waistline probably come in and you'll build muscle and you'll look amazing. Your husband could probably go a little bit on a cut on Anabolic. You guys would be awesome.

[Sal Destefano]

You could cut the alcohol, not replace it.

[Rebecca]

With Marcelo from your team, I gave him, got some nutrition advice. He had a call with him who gave him some advice on like how to like look at food with using your hand and it was really helpful.

[Adam]

Okay, good. There you go.

[Sal Destefano]

Perfect.

[Adam]

Yeah. Portions.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. You guys, that's it. You're set.

[Adam]

Yeah, but Sal's right. I would not put you. I wouldn't put you on a cut at all.

[Sal Destefano]

It doesn't make any sense.

[Adam]

And that and the especially since you tell me too, you have these crazy hunger. Your body's trying to build, build. It wants to build more muscle.

[Sal Destefano]

You'll run the risk if you try to go on a cut of losing muscle and ending up with less muscle, same body fat or.

[Rebecca]

What I don't want to do is lose because I've worked really hard to gain.

[Adam]

Yes.

[Sal Destefano]

Keep going in that direction.

[Adam]

If you just replace the extra calories that are coming from alcohol with meals with pro high protein meals, you'll build muscle and you'll lean out.

[Rebecca]

Do you, do you guys recommend a three meals a day or like Eating more frequently with personal preference.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, it depends.

[Adam]

It's personal preference, but keep this in mind. Okay. It's really hard for both men and women to hit their protein intake with like three or less meals. It typically takes at least it is. It's hard to get that many grams of protein unless you guys, you're eating 10 ounces of meat every time you eat. It's hard to get enough protein each time, especially early on in breakfast meals. That's where most people have the hardest time. So four meals totally normally looks like a good, good spot. You know, with, with balanced protein is, is a good spot to be at if you do less. You just gotta keep in mind the, you gotta really eat a big portion of meat to make up for that protein. So.

[Rebecca]

Yeah.

[Adam]

And if you guys were to ever track anything, that would be the thing I'd have you track first is just, just see if you're hitting your, your grams of protein every day consistently. And I bet, I bet if we were to just track that and watch that because you get some of these empty calories from alcohol occasionally, if anything's low, it's protein. And I bet if you bump that up, you'll see more muscle come on and you'll lean out because those are just empty calories. They're not doing anything for you other than enjoyment. But I'm not going to tell you that forever because if you like that, I like that. Katrina and I, Katrina loves wine. I like having a nice glass of whiskey. I absolutely balance that in my life. But what I'm trying to make some changes.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam]

That goes aside for a little bit. Give me a couple months of running it and making good choice and it makes a huge difference. Huge difference.

[Benjamin]

That's right.

[Adam]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

And you're fight the fitness routine, changing it from the five days to the three days of weight plus the two days of walking, you're good with that.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. You'll probably get stronger.

[Adam]

You're going to get, you're going to get stronger and you're going to build muscle. It's going to be great. Yeah. Yes.

[Justin Andrews]

You're going to build.

[Rebecca]

Well, I wanted to thank you guys so much. You have helped us both boats personally in our relationship by starting this together professionally. I run a small company that trains teachers and we've, I've started like with hard behaviors with children and started introducing some of this wellness to them and it has changed the way that they walk into their classrooms every day. So I listen all the time and a lot of what you share, I try to share with the teachers I work with and it's been super helpful.

[Benjamin]

So that's so awesome.

[Adam]

You thank. Thank you.

[Rebecca]

That's really been life changing.

[Adam]

Thank you.

[Sal Destefano]

You got it. Thank you so much.

[Justin Andrews]

Keep it up.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. I gotta say I'm just gonna, just people listening. If you're a woman over the age of 40, you've been strength training your body fat percentage is in the low 20s. Don't go on a cut. Don't go on a cut. You're going to get negative effects from it almost always. Listen, I don't care 22%'s lean.

[Adam]

I don't care what you age, what age you are as a female feel this is what we're experiencing. I experienced with Corinne right now.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam]

Our body fat percentage was too low that our, our like before we started seeing the results. When I see it needed to be up to C. That's right. It's like the most put it back up. And you've been saying this for a very long time. Most one there's always exceptions to the rules. Right. But for the majority most women do better. 19 plus percent as far as the results see and in and we've talked about that. You, you recently talked about this with just being mind blown about where I just came in at high body a body with more muscle on it at higher body fibers looks way better than you think it does just a a skinnier body. So if she puts on 5 pounds of muscle she'll look 3% even if

[Sal Destefano]

her body fat percentage.

[Adam]

That's what I mean. Even if she stays the same she puts 5 pounds of muscle on she'll look 3% leaner and so and and be eating way more and healthier and stronger and that faster metabolism then gives her that flexibility then to have that glass of wine here and there and be okay.

[Howie Mandel]

Our next caller is Angela from Indiana.

[Sal Destefano]

Hi Angela.

[Adam]

Hi Angela. Hello. Hi, how you doing?

[Sal Destefano]

How are you?

[Angela]

Thanks for having me.

[Sal Destefano]

You got it. How can we help you?

[Angela]

Okay, I'm just going to read my email like most people do.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay.

[Angela]

Says I'm a 47 year old perimenopausal mother of 3 teenagers. I'm a recovery long dist runner otf go goer, orange Theory fitness and beachbody workout person. I work a full time job and two part time jobs. I have been working out consistently for the last 18 months but really haven't noticed any changes in my body. I'm reaching my protein goals and sleeping seven to eight hours per night. I have done muscle mommy Twice and anabolic once. In addition to other 9 non mind pump workouts, I would love your help to actually see changes in my body. I also have recurrent tennis elbow in my right arm and this has caused me to avoid workouts for up to six weeks in the past. And then I get an injection and it gets better. And just any. Any recommendations on how to prevent this in the future?

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, cool. So when you're doing our programs, are you doing anything else on top of it? Like cardio, like any other exercise?

[Angela]

So for the most part, no. Just walking. Try to get 8 to 10,000 steps in a day. On the days I do a workout, it's probably closer to like seven, 8,000 steps. But on the days that I don't have a workout, then I make a leisurely walk. My workout for the day.

[Sal Destefano]

Good. And then when you say for the most part, what do you mean?

[Angela]

I did try running again a little while back, but I've stopped it since because I was just tired of not seeing changes. But I've stopped that probably about six weeks ago.

[Sal Destefano]

Okay, so you're just, you're just, you're just burning the candle at both ends with full time, two part time. You got three teenagers. You also have a history of just getting after. Seems like that's your MO. One of our maps. 15 programs would work better for you. You would get much better results with something like that. Do you work out?

[Angela]

I had a feeling you were gonna say that.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Do you work out in a gym or do you work out at home?

[Angela]

Right now I work out at home.

[Sal Destefano]

Good. Oh, good, good. I'm gonna send you, you like muscle mommy type style. I could send you maths 15 muscle mommy.

[Angela]

Yeah, that'd be great.

[Sal Destefano]

I'll send that to you. Do that. Maintain the walking, keep hitting the protein and getting good sleep. And I think you're gonna start seeing some good, good, some good progress.

[Adam]

And as far as the, the perimenopausal thing, are you doing anything on the hormone side? You got somebody checking in and watching that. Is that all good?

[Angela]

Yes. So I start. Well, I have a gynecologist. We started looking into it last year. I've actually been on hormone replacements since about September.

[Adam]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

Oh, it's perfect.

[Adam]

Yes. Okay, cool.

[Sal Destefano]

Perfect. Yeah, you're just, you're just doing so much that you need your. The, the dose of strength training needs to be less.

[Rebecca]

Okay.

[Angela]

I do plan on cutting back my jobs at some point in time, but I have twins and FL Flight school and so my husband and I Are trying to pay off their flight school loans for them so they don't have a lot of debt.

[Adam]

Oh, wow. Wow. Very cool.

[Sal Destefano]

No, no. The 15 programs. So after maps 15, muscle mommy, if you feel good on it, which I think you will, then go to the next Maps 15 program. Mass 15 symmetry or power lift or traditional Mass 15. I think that protocol is going to give you great results.

[Adam]

Are you. Are you tracking calories or anything right now, or do you have any idea where you're at right now?

[Angela]

No, at the beginning. Beginning of the year, maybe a couple times a year. I do. I'm Normally between like 19 and 20. 100.

[Adam]

Yeah, yeah. Just really low for a lot of activity you're doing so that you're not too bad. You're probably going to want to bump another 100 to 200 calories and then drop to that 15. And I bet your body responds better to that. So for as much act, if you're getting eight to 10,000 steps every day and you were trained that much and the jobs and every. That's a lot.

[John]

Lot.

[Adam]

And so you are probably just. Your body is stalled. Here's the thing, though, when you come out of this, be patient because some. It takes a little bit of time for the body to kind of reset, get healthy again, and then it'll respond. So what it looks like a lot of times you'll start to feel better right away as far as, like, rest and just energy and like mood, all those things will start to improve. And then what will start to happen slowly is strength. You'll start to see strength good in the gym. And then what comes after that is the body change in the results. So just be patient. It takes a minute for the body to kind of reorganize and say, oh, I'm being fed again. Oh, this feels good. Oh, here, let me reward you. You're getting stronger in the gym, and then comes the aesthetic results. So just be just, this is the path. This is what you need to do. Trust the process. And then. And. But it. Just know that. Just know that it takes a minute to. For it all to get going. Don't abandon it and go, oh, my God, this is enough. I need to start doing more stuff. Because then you'll just go right back to where you were.

[Sal Destefano]

Were.

[Angela]

Yeah, that's kind of why I reached out, because like I said, I've been trying to do it for 18 months. Obviously getting older. My husband's actually very fit. He goes to the gym frequently. My all. All my kids are sons. They all like run, they go to the gym, they do all kinds of stuff. And so, you know, I just, I kind of want to, I want to look like I work out. I don't have to obviously be like a beachbody competitor. I've had twins, my stomach is a disaster. I understand all that. I just want to, I want people to look at me and look like I take care of myself.

[Adam]

Yeah. Have you, have you considered joining our muscle mommy group? We have a group of women that's. And a lot, I'd say good. Half of them are menopausal, perimenopausal, going through very, very similar stuff and it's incredible. Community and weekly coaching and help along the way.

[Angela]

Yeah. I've thought about it, obviously trying to pay off my kids student loan. We try to be mindful of how much we spend right now.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. Why don't I get you in there for a month for free. You could bounce after that, but just get some advice.

[Angela]

Oh, that would be great.

[Sal Destefano]

All right, we'll send that to you.

[Angela]

Okay.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah. And you're doing good.

[Adam]

Yep.

[Sal Destefano]

You're doing good, hun. Yeah. Be kind to yourself. You got a lot of.

[Angela]

Well, I appreciate you all. I listen to you all on my walks typically.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, you're doing good and I really do think that's just too much. So I think within a week or two you should start to see strength gains and that's when you know you're moving the right direction.

[Angela]

Yeah, I want to be, I want to be strong as I age.

[Sal Destefano]

Good, good, good.

[Adam]

You will, will, you will.

[Sal Destefano]

All right, so we're gonna send you a maps 15 Muscle Mommy and then we're gonna get you in the muscle mommy group for, for 30 days for free. So you get some advice.

[Angela]

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thank you.

[Sal Destefano]

You got it. All right, Andrew, I think people need to realize just like how much all the life stuff affects your body's ability to adapt to exercise.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, yeah, of course. You got to factor that in. But it's hard because it just seems like that's your, you're normal.

[Sal Destefano]

Yeah, right.

[Justin Andrews]

But that's stress.

[Sal Destefano]

That's right.

[Adam]

Well, and, and also in the context of age, how low your calories are like that stuff. It just hormones, kids, bills. Yeah, it's, it's redlining your engine with no oil in it or gas. It's like it's eventually going to shut down on you and then that's frustrating because you're still stepping on the gas, hoping to go somewhere and you're not going anywhere and and then also then being patient when you start to do the right thing. Because the right thing, it takes a minute for that body to reset and get back to where it needs to be to start to show you results. And that what happens is most people hear that advice and it makes sense logically for them, but then they don't see the change quick enough and then they bail on it and they go back to old habits.

[Sal Destefano]

Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram.

[Howie Mandel]

Mind Pump Media thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body dramatically, improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB Super Bundle includes Maps, Anabolic Maps, Performance and Maps Aesthetic Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs with detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos. The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the like by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

[Angela]

Has the news been getting you down? I'm Megan McCardell and I'm here to help.

[Adam]

I'm the host of a new show from Washington Post Opinion called Reasonably Optimistic and it's an antidote to the pessimism

[Rebecca]

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[Angela]

Know every Wednesday I'm going to talk

[Adam]

to people who see a path forward.

[Sal Destefano]

It does seem to me that there

[Adam]

is some awakening of a desire to

[Sal Destefano]

act together to solve problems where they are.

[Benjamin]

You know I am a believer in America and it's worth fighting for.

[Adam]

Join me Wednesdays on YouTube or wherever

[Angela]

you get your podcasts.