Finding Light After Loss: Rachel Uchitel on Grief, Growth, and New Beginnings | Bonus Episode

Summary

Miracle Mentality with Tim Storey

Bonus Episode: "Finding Light After Loss: Rachel Uchitel on Grief, Growth, and New Beginnings"

Date: September 24, 2025
Guest: Rachel Uchitel

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Episode Overview

In this deeply personal and honest conversation, Tim Storey welcomes media personality and "Misunderstood" podcast host Rachel Uchitel to share her journey through profound loss, public scrutiny, and personal reinvention. The episode dives into Rachel's experiences of grief after losing her fiancé in 9/11, being at the center of global scandals, and her strategies for finding hope and a "second act" beyond the labels others give us. Filled with vulnerability, practical wisdom, and moments of humor, this episode is an inspiring guide to resilience — addressing how we can move from the pain of being misunderstood to a miraculous mindset and empowered living.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Building the “Misunderstood” Platform

• Rachel’s Motivation for Her Own Podcast
  • Felt reduced to a "headline" & wanted to reclaim her narrative ([03:19])
  • Realized feeling misunderstood is universal, not limited to celebrities
• Dedication to Research
  • Spends 2-8 hours researching each guest — "I feel like an expert in either their life or the subject...the interview can flow really well." ([06:35])
• The Power of Vulnerability
  • Common thread from guests: feelings of isolation and shame alleviated by honest conversation The act of being vulnerable and relatable connects us all ([08:13])

2. Rachel's Personal Journey: Loss and Public Scrutiny

• Early Life & Family Background
  • Parents’ divorce, growing up without a present father, therapeutic boarding school (“cult-like”) ([10:47])
• Loss of Her Father
  • Father died of a cocaine overdose while she was at boarding school
  • Affected her ability to understand relationships
• 9/11 and Losing Her Fiance, Andy
  • Engaged just three weeks before 9/11
  • Worked at Bloomberg—covered the event both as journalist and as a victim
  • Her photo searching for Andy became symbolic worldwide; branded her as a "victim" ([13:48], [14:55])
  • Grief “in her bones”—triggered anew every September
• Later Scandal and Being 'Misunderstood' Again
  • A subsequent scandal made her globally infamous
  • Media “reduced me to a headline” and “made a caricature" of her ([14:56])
  • Still feels the impact: “My name precedes me...it is still how people think of me.” ([16:18])

“You have to realize that things are temporary. It’s gonna pass. And as long as you can let yourself let go, you will find love again. You will find pride again. You will be happy again. And whatever it is that you’ve lost, you will find that light again.”
— Rachel Uchitel ([32:00])

3. Grief, Identity, and “First Act” vs “Second Act”

• Sense of Loss Beyond Love
  • “I felt like I had lost my future...It was more than love.” ([21:24])
• The Waiting and Anguish
  • Didn’t get confirmation of Andy’s death until months after 9/11; the prolonged uncertainty was agony ([23:12])
  • Recurring theme: anguish when losing both Andy and, later, public reputation
• Discount Version of Ourselves
  • Shame and guilt can make us "hide," living as a diminished version of ourselves ([25:47])
  • “You have this, what I call shape-shifting move...so you don’t stand out.” ([25:47])
• Moving Towards a “Second Act”
  • “Getting out of that first act and into the second act, they have to know they were meant for that second act...get the lessons from [the past] and move out of it.” ([27:18])

4. Surviving the Setback: Seeking Help & New Tools

• Getting Unstuck
  • Warns against seeking advice from friends who haven’t experienced similar pain; look for those with lived experience
  • Landmark seminar: reframed her identity as the sum of all parts, not one painful moment ([30:21])
  • “I really had to make my world very small...the only person whose opinion and guidance really mattered was you.” (referring to Tim Storey) ([30:44])
• Turning Mess Into Message
  • “You can turn your mess into a message and your test into a testimony.” — Tim Storey ([27:00])
• Allowing Time to Heal
  • The process to transformation was not instant; took years and repeated effort

5. Rachel’s Healing Realization

A poignant, emotional story about how the loss of her dog and a lesson from Andy taught her to accept that “everything happens for a reason” — and that sometimes life’s length or events are “as they are supposed to be.” This allowed her to finally let go and move on. ([33:57] to [40:41])

“The reason that Mickey had to die was so Andy was the one to teach me that lesson and say to me...it’s okay if I die because I’m not supposed to live beyond 32. This is my life. So stop living your life thinking it should have been something else.”
— Rachel Uchitel ([37:54])

6. Advice for Those Stuck in the Past or Public Perception

• Don’t Live by Labels
  • Get out of your head—labels are a story, not a fact
• Most People Are Not Judging/Thinking About You
  • “Everybody’s really too busy worrying about themselves to worry about you.” ([42:21])
  • “How long it lives in your own head is so much longer than in others’...” ([42:38])
• Focus on What You’re Good At
  • Embrace even your perceived weaknesses with humor and honesty ([44:56])
• You Can Start Again, Any Time
  • “The second act really starts when you say it does...Dust yourself off and let’s go. Don’t wait any longer.” ([50:50])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Resilience:
  “You’re not able to stand up and be seen because you’re almost embarrassed...You gotta get out of that barrel and go to the next barrel and get out.” — Rachel Uchitel ([25:47])

• On Human Connection:
  “The biggest thing that brings us all together is being vulnerable...We might not share the same experience, but we share those feelings.” — Rachel Uchitel ([08:13])

• On Public Perception:
  “My name precedes me...I don’t have control over the narrative that’s been created for me because of the misunderstandings...” — Rachel Uchitel ([16:18])

• On Grief’s Endurance:
  “Here we are, by the way, in the week of September 11th...for me, if it’s brought up, I’m back into it. I am that 26-year-old girl. It brings me to tears.” — Rachel Uchitel ([13:48])

• On Beginning Again:
  “The second act really starts when you say it does. And it can be today.” — Rachel Uchitel ([50:50])

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Key Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Topic | |-------------|------------------------------------------| | 03:19 | Rachel discusses her personal reasons for launching "Misunderstood" and why the concept resonates widely. | | 08:13 | Common thread among misunderstood people: isolation, shame, and the healing power of vulnerability. | | 10:47 | Rachel shares her childhood and formative grief over her father's death. | | 13:48 | Describes losing her fiancé in 9/11 and the emotional aftermath. | | 21:24 | Explains the deeper losses accompanying grief (“I lost my future”). | | 25:47 | Explanation of the “discount version” of self after trauma or public shame. | | 33:57 | Rachel’s transformative story on learning to accept loss (“everything happens for a reason”). | | 42:21 | Advice on letting go of public perception and internalized labels. | | 50:50 | How to start your “second act” — practical closing guidance. |

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Closing: Looking Forward

Rachel shares excitement about her upcoming speaking engagements, her new book, her wedding, and being walked down the aisle by Tim Storey. She urges listeners that—regardless of where they are—miraculous change begins the moment you decide to “dust yourself off and go for it.”

“We don’t want people to stay stuck. We’ve all been there. It starts when you say it does—and it can be today.”
— Rachel Uchitel ([50:50])

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Where to Find Rachel & Her Work

• Podcast: "Misunderstood with Rachel Uchitel" (Apple, Spotify, YouTube, Patreon)
• Instagram: @rachelyoucatelnyc

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For those experiencing loss, grief, or living under the weight of public perception, this episode provides both empathy and a roadmap forward: your second act can start any time you choose.

Transcript

[Rachel Ukutel]

Was with somebody for three years. We got engaged a couple weeks before he died in September 11. I talk about it a lot. It's in my bone.

[Tim Story]

Rachel Ukutel is an American media personality, journalist, crisis management consultant, and host of the podcast Misunderstood.

[Rachel Ukutel]

During the scandal, I had nowhere to turn. No family, no friends. And I lost someone I thought loved me and that I loved. And it was just this anguish. It's going to make me cry. Sorry.

[Tim Story]

You could turn your mess into a message and your test into a testim.

[Rachel Ukutel]

So many people have this guilt from something and this shame, and they live there. They, like, can't get out of it. You have to realize that things are temporary. It's gonna pass. And as long as you can let yourself let go, you will find love again. You will find pride again. You will be happy again. And whatever it is that you've lost, you will find that light again.

[Tim Story]

Hello, my name is Tim Story. Welcome to Miracle Mentality.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Remember rooftops, drawing spaceships on the ground.

[Tim Story]

It's for the dreamers, the doers, the believers in something greater. In each episode, I'll invite you to rise above the mundane, to push past the messy and learn to live boldly in the miraculous. Every episode will have practical wisdom, spiritual insight, and my guests will explore what it takes to activate your miracle mindset. Remember to subscribe, follow and like. Welcome to Miracle Mentality. My name is Tim Story. Today, I have one of my favorite people on the planet on with me today. She is my friend. She's an entrepreneur. She has her own podcast called Misunderstood. She's also the founder of Ms. You Media. She's been featured on major news platforms for over two decades and. And as we have this discussion, you will find out more of who she really is. Let's welcome to the podcast the Amazing Rachel Yucatel. Hi, Rachel.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Hi, Tim. It's an honor and a pleasure. I'm so excited to be here and.

[Tim Story]

What a privilege to talk to a real friend and a veteran, even more so than me, of doing a podcast. How long have you been doing your podcast?

[Rachel Ukutel]

I think we're almost at three years now, but I'm excited to admit We've hit over 20 million downloads. We've hit number one numerous amounts of times in entertainment news. I feel very proud of it because we are kind of newbies in the world of podcasting because so many people have been doing it for so many years. And I just feel really honored to be to have some real credibility in this space. So I'm really enjoying it. I love it. And I'm just really excited to be here and be part of your podcast now.

[Tim Story]

Yes. So you are one of my first guests because you're literally one of my favorite people. And people will find out a little more about our relationship. But I remember when we were talking about you doing your podcast before it even launched. And you're right, the space is so crowded, but we knew that you would come up with something unique. Tell us how you came up with this title, Misunderstood.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Well, it's funny. For years, I wanted to do something like this. I wanted to have my own platform. And for a very long time, I've always been interviewed on other people's shows. I've always been a curious person. I love asking questions. I love getting to the bottom of things. I love picturing people's stories as they're telling me about themselves. And I always have so many questions in my head, so I knew it would be something that I was good at. But I finally, you know, I asked so many people. I think for a while we thought of doing a podcast, and for whatever reason, it was always stop and start, stop and start. And I think the reason that it didn't get off the ground at first is I didn't really know the niche yet. Like, I didn't know exactly how I could stand out in the field. And finally one day, I was just. I really tried to get raw, like, what makes me different? What makes me interesting and stand out? And I kept coming back to the thought process of just feeling like I had been reduced to a headline, feeling like I had been on a mission to change my narrative for so long. And I felt misunderstood. And I felt like, wait a minute, that's not just for someone like me that's been in a huge scandal. Everyone knows what it feels like to have been misunderstood at some point in their lives. I mean, we. I think we have always. Almost all of us have found ourselves trapped in a version of. Of ourselves that is not really us. And I thought, if this can resonate with more people than just people that are in magazines, then this is going to be a home run. And I was very nervous to start it. I did it literally all by myself. I hired a couple people that I thought were good in the business, fired all of them because they didn't share my vision. They didn't love the name. They didn't think I should do it alone. They didn't think it should be guest driven. I am 100% guest driven. I only do interviews with other people. And I started thinking I Was gonna have one a week. I now have three a week, and I have about three months in the can because I have so many people contacting me big and small about, you know, feeling misunderstood and wanting to share their story and. Sorry, I know that was a long answer to your question, but I just wanted to say it started with thinking big, like, people who had been in scandals like Lorena Bobbitt and Greg Lou Ganis, and big names that everybody knows from current or in the past. But then I started thinking it should be people who have been, you know, who are experts in fields that are misunderstood or that need to be reconsidered, like medically assisted suicide or, you know, plastic surgery or, you know, whatever it is. You know, you had somebody talk about sleep and sleep apnea and sleep, you know, people that don't understand how to sleep properly. So we now cover all gamuts of everything, and I'm really excited and proud of what I'm doing.

[Tim Story]

And I think your background in being in news has really helped you, because I watch every episode, and you're so good at, like, getting, like, under the surface of the real story. So how much do you love that? Like, delving into. Getting deeper into the story?

[Rachel Ukutel]

So, you know, it's a good question, because I've been interviewed so many times, right, for over 20 years now, I have been interviewed by the biggest interviewers, the biggest journalists, down to the smallest. And I will say it's very evident when somebody does not do their research. And, you know, it could be a little annoying because you feel like you're giving your time, you're sharing your story or things that are deep to you, and. And that person really has done no research. And so I spend at least two hours, usually it's up to eight hours, researching every guest I have so that I feel like an expert in either their life or the subject. And that way, the interview can flow really well. Like, I have my table in front of me because I have a show earlier, before you has papers everywhere, and I listen 20 to 30 questions in an arc of an episode, but I rarely have to look down and look at them because I'm so immersed in my thoughts. I know the content, I know the questions I want to get to. So it's a really good way if somebody's listening and wants to get into podcasting and wants to understand how to interview better, when you really know the subject you're talking about, you don't have to sit there and say, okay, my next question is, you know what? I Mean, it just flows really well. So I love doing the research.

[Tim Story]

Let's stay on this subject for a minute. So this idea of being misunderstood, when you're interviewing these people that feel like they've been misunderstood, what is like the common thread of how being misunderstood makes somebody feel? How does it make most people feel by the interviews that you've done?

[Rachel Ukutel]

I think the biggest common thread is that they feel isolated. They feel like no one else has ever felt like they feel. And they feel like they cannot share it, they can't talk about it. Cause no one would understand. And what you realize is the biggest thing that brings us all together is being vulnerable. And that makes you relatable. And when you are relatable to somebody, most people in the room or most people you talk to will say, well, I may not have gone through that exact thing, but I know exactly how you feel. And let me tell you why. And so it's a nice thing to know that we've all gone through similar feelings that have held us back. We've all felt stuck from being in something. And we might not share the same exact experience, but we share those feelings. So that's the common thread that everyone feels like it's the worst thing that's ever happened. No one will ever forgive them. They'll never be able to move on to something else. They don't think it's temporary. And they realize eventually that it is. And that the way they can connect is by actually talking about it instead of avoiding it.

[Tim Story]

So that's how we met, is that you had been misunderstood. And then we had a mutual friend that connected us. Because my background is kind of counseling people that are kind of in a setback of some form or fashion. But then when we started to really dialogue, wow. Like we just connected as human beings and as friends. So talk about this idea of you being misunderstood. For those that just see you as a beautiful woman and don't know some of your story.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Sure. I mean, you want me to explain why I'm misunderstood? Is that what you're asking?

[Tim Story]

Well, number one, first time I saw you was right after 9 11, which is one of the biggest things that's happened in America in the last hundred years. And I saw you on the COVID of these newspapers. So I saw this beautiful face and I saw the headlines that you were in search for your then fiance. And then later on I began to see you on the news and different things because you were very, very good at what you did in the nightclub space. Helping in Las Vegas. Well, probably the best at what you did. But then a challenge happened in your life and you were misunderstood. And then you met me down the line.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, I'll even start further back. You know, My parents were divorced when I was younger. I went. I lived in Anchorage, Alaska at the time. My parents started cable television there. They were both from New York City. Went there, became entrepreneurs. My parents were divorced when I was five and I moved back for her, back to New York City. And I grew up there without a father. They kind of used me as a pawn, didn't get along. So I didn't really get to see my father often. And my mother kind of couldn't handle having a kid on her own. She wanted to date, she wanted to figure out what she was doing for work. She was a very smart woman who was driven, but not necessarily, you know, what made her great at work made her terrible as a mother. So I was raised by my housekeeper and I was ultimately sent to boarding school, where it was one of these therapeutic boarding schools. And I only mention that because Paris Hilton has really made them a conversation piece and a talking point. But what, you know, what she hasn't addressed is what it was really like. I mean, I lived there for three and a half years. I went there when I was 13. I did the entire program, and I graduated from there. And while I was there, I mean, that's a whole nother podcast about cults. And you know what it's like to be raised in a cult because it was based on the Synanon cult. My father died when I was there and my headmaster had to tell me, and he died of a cocaine overdose. And as a 15 year old girl, that was the first, you know, kind of foray into this feeling of like, wow, this is the one man who's supposed to love you unconditionally, and he's now gone. Like, of course I didn't think about this then, but later on in my life, I started to realize I was gonna have a hard time understanding relationships between a man and a woman because I didn't grow up with that. I really didn't. And so then you Fast forward into September 11th, I'm engaged again. That's a whole nother podcast. But. And I was with somebody for three years. We got engaged a couple weeks before, and on September 11th, he died in September 11th. And I was working at a news outlet called Bloomberg News and covering it for news. And the two, you know, the convergence of, like, the woman who's covering the story and the man who dies in the story she's covering was very traumatic to my soul, I guess as a 23 year old. And I talk about it a lot, it's in my bones. It is not something I can get rid of. And here we are, by the way, in the week of September 11th that we're filming this episode and you know, everyone else has moved on, everyone else had moved on every year, right. And of course it's a terrible thing. And people all week long will watch on TV the replays of the whole week that happened and all the people we lost and. And people get to remember for that one day or this week. Right. For me, if it's brought up, I'm back into it. I am that 26 year old girl. I'm 50 now, you know, I am that 26 year old girl. It brings me to tears. Who was completely lost because my future was in this man. I finally found the man that I loved and I didn't know what happened to him and I didn't know what would happen for the rest of the my life without him. I mean, I didn't know who I was without him. And that was a really hard place to be. And there is a, you know, I am known as this girl in the photo that this Associated Press photographer took a picture of me looking for him became a very famous photo. That is, it was on the COVID of every newspaper around the world. And I was branded a victim essentially because of what I went through. And people helped me get through this tragedy. And I would say it made it easier for me because I had so many people to lean on. It wasn't that I was alone in my house crying, you know.

[Tim Story]

Yes.

[Rachel Ukutel]

And then you fast forward a decade later and my face is again on every single newspaper in the world. But it's because of a scandal and a whole nother podcast about how you veer from one person to another because of turns you take. But the turns that I had taken led me to make some really bad decisions that got me in a lot of trouble. And I would say that part of it was choices and part of it was just metaphorically. I happened to get in a car that already was driving towards a cliff and I happened to be the woman in the passenger seat of that car when it went over. And I became uber famous because of what happened to someone else and a mistake that I made. But the fallout was what I was misunderstood for because it took every bit of who I was before and who I had the potential to be after. And it Reduced me to a headline and completely misunderstood that I was a complex person, as we all are, and made a caricature of who they, who the media wanted me to be and what the public wanted to feed off of. And that was what, 15 years ago at this point, 16 years ago?

[Tim Story]

Yes.

[Rachel Ukutel]

It is still how people think of me before they've met me in a room. My name precedes me. And so to get back to your question about why I'm misunderstood, it's been completely different ways misunderstood. Maybe in a good way, misunderstood in a bad way, but feeling like I don't have agency and I don't have control over the narrative that has been created for me because of the misunderstandings that have gone along with it. And again, I wanna reiterate some very much my fault, but also, also the fault of, you know, society and what people put on. I think a woman in our day and age, you know, I love that.

[Tim Story]

You, you always do talk and take responsibility for like, choices that you feel at this point in your life that you should not have made. So I love that about you. But I also love the fact that you bring up your backstory because with the challenges your father had to be put into that situation, that was not good as a young person, as a child, because so many of us are stunted and limited by the mentors and teachers that we have. And Rachel, for you to even get through that and start to find your way and because you find a lot of people that are watching right now, they're wondering and wandering, wondering and wandering. And so because I life coach people from birth to 20, those are the formative years when most people kind of either they make it or they break it. So you were not in good position then. But let's talk about, you know, we talk about 9 11, but let's talk about 910 for a minute. So the day before 9 11, what was your life like with your fiance?

[Rachel Ukutel]

So we had been together for three years at that point, had just gotten engaged, we had just bought a dog together. The next day on September 11, was the first day I was going to look at. I was going to Vera Wang with my mother and my maid of honor to look at dresses. I was so happy. We had just gotten back from a two week vacation in Greece together on that Sunday night. And the one thing I do want to say, because, you know, people idolize people who are dead. And I want to stop for a second and say I was so happy because I was 26, I was engaged, he picked me Right. He had just proposed to me three weeks before. I was so excited. But it's not. It's not like there weren't some issues, Right. Like, we were figuring each other out. We're young. He was 32. I was 26. I was, you know, working at Bloomberg. And I am a very driven person. I'm not someone who would get married and, like, not work, you know, and not that there's anything wrong with that, but I. A lot of my friends at the time, I remember, they were like, I can't wait to get married, so I can not work and be a mom and be at home. And I was just figuring out my place and my role at Bloomberg and really moving up there. And I was a producer on a morning show, on the live show, which, you know, I ended up being a producer on the next morning. And, you know, I was in a very good place with Andy. But also, it just wasn't without its challenges of figuring out who I was becoming and also who he was becoming. He was a very ambitious person. So when it happened, it's not like I lost my sense of self completely because I did have purpose at my job, and I had purpose and plans of who I wanted to become, but I felt very much like I was. My worth had to do with who I had paired up with. Like, my worth was leveling up because this amazing man who was too good to be true had picked me. Does that make sense?

[Tim Story]

Yes, of course it does. So. So let's go to the 911 for a minute, and then we're going to move on to a different subject. But I think this is very important because it's. I feel like your life was finding its way because we're all going through recovery and discovery at the same time. So you're recovering from your past childhood and things you've been through, but now you're in the discovery mode. You're engaged. It's looking like this is really the man you're excited about. Your life, your career is taking off. And then this idea of the possibility that he passed, because at that point, you didn't know for sure, but it was a possibility that he passed. What was that sense of groaning, that sense of screaming from the inside? I may have lost what? I may have lost what? It wasn't just love. You may have lost what?

[Rachel Ukutel]

No, I felt like I had lost my future, Like I had lost my. It was more than love. It was like I lost my childhood because I no longer had. I no longer could be led by this man. You know, who I kind of followed around. I thought he was so amazing. I had to grow up immediately. But I also had the sense of, like, he's my entire future. He's everything I banked on. Who am I now? What do I do? Like, how will I ever find somebody who makes me realize that I'm gonna be okay? And it was a terrible feeling to go through because I was so convinced that he was the person that I was supposed to be with. And I was so convinced that, you know, he lost his life. And this was the most tragic accident. And now fate or, you know, things. Destiny wasn't happening. I was like, this is. This is. My life has been completely interrupted, and I don't know how I'm ever going to fix it again.

[Tim Story]

I think one of the things that drew me to the photo that I saw on the newspapers is the look on your face. And because of what I do as a therapist and a life coach, I don't see that exact look, obviously, but I do see that look of what the hell just happened to my life. Because sometimes I have to visit hospitals and it's maybe somebody's husband was in a car accident, now he's in a coma. And I see the wife's look on her face of like, what the heck if I lose him? So we find out that he actually passes on what day? Because it was 9, 11. How many days later is it official that he had passed?

[Rachel Ukutel]

Well, I didn't get an official call from the coroner's office until New Year's Eve, and they had found his body on New Year's Eve.

[Tim Story]

New year's Eve happened September 11th. We don't find out till December 31st.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Yeah.

[Tim Story]

Yeah.

[Rachel Ukutel]

So it was a long time. And in between those days, you know, I kept getting letters sent to my house with little tidbits that they had found. So burnt ID cards or credit cards or things that had his name on it. And there was no letter in it, no nothing. It would just be an envelope and that piece of something. So I knew they were finding little things here and there. But, you know, for me, it was very important for closure that they found his body. Because, you know, the not knowing. And when you talk about that picture that was captured in the face on that. In that picture, that is a level of such anguish that, like, brings me to tears every time I look at it. It's hard for me to look at. Cause it looks like a different person to me because it's so long ago and it's so painful that I can't look at it. But it also feels like I can go back in. And that is me. I know what that anguish is. I've had that anguish a few times. When I found out my father died. When my whole world crumbled around me because everyone hated me during the scandal, years later. And it was just like I had nowhere to turn. No family, no friends. And I lost someone I thought loved me and that I loved. And it was just this anguish of the utmost. Heartbroken. I don't even have words for it. But it's. If you've been through it, you know it. You know, it's just. It's a. It's a feeling that. It's almost like you can't. It just comes out of you. It's not something you can even control, you know?

[Tim Story]

So it's an interesting thing because if you look at your life now, that this is what you're helping people with, to become resilient, to be able to bounce back, that if they're misunderstood, that they don't have to be a discount version of themselves. So when you teach this idea of they don't have to be a discount version of themselves, no matter what they've been through tragedy or setbacks or wrong choices, what do you mean by they don't have to be a discount version of themselves?

[Rachel Ukutel]

Well, after this thing happens and listen, for everyone that's listening, you may not have been in a scandal, you may not have had somebody die. And you're dealing with grief and loss. For you, it's your own story. And it doesn't diminish any of it. For you. Your biggest thing is your biggest thing. So, like, you know, I want to say that, and you have to remember that that is something that happened. But so many people have this guilt from something and this shame, and they live there. They can't get out of it. It's like imagine a barrel, and you're in this barrel and in the darkness and you've just given up. And to me, that's what we're talking about. When you say a discount version of yourselves. You're not able to stand up and be seen because you're almost embarrassed. You don't wanna cause a lot of commotion or attention to yourselves because you're stuck in this version that you don't want people to know who you really are. You have this, what I call shape shifting move where you kind of just go along and you do what other people do. Cause you don't wanna stand out. You don't Want people to call you out. You don't wanna be the center of attention anymore in a negative way. So this discount version of yourself is a place we all know. We've all been there. We are stuck, stuck there. And you know, I know this space because I've survived it, I've lived it, I've been in it. And it took me over a decade to figure out how to get out of it. And by the way, it's a work in progress. I will always be getting out of it. As you should be. Because when you get to the top of that barrel, you'll have crabs pulling you down and wanting you to come back again. And you need to keep. Get out of that barrel and go to the next barrel and get out. Because you. You should always be striving for more and better. But it was learning a lot of lessons along the way that got me out of feeling stuck and realizing that everybody, you know, getting out of that first act and into the second act, they have to know they were meant for that second act. They have to know they have to be finished with this marinating in this negativity. And in this first act, get the lessons from it and move out of it. And until you get.

[Tim Story]

Let's go into that idea of the second act because we talked about this in private just at a dinner. And I love what you're doing with this idea because I think it's so true. So when you think about grief, because I've studied grief quite a bit when something or someone dies, that we're very close to a person or in a situation even, sometimes when someone loses their career, the grieving process usually lasts two years of intensity, where it's like an inner groaning. And I was writing my notes here that usually people feel this anger and this sadness. Was. Was yours anger, sadness, or give me some other emotions maybe you felt, and then we'll get into second act.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Well, and I'll say I also closed a business, so I understand you lose your identity, right? Like I lost who? My brand, my identity. So for different situations, I felt different things. But the loss of my brand, which is actually when I met you, culminated after all these other things. I felt embarrassment, I felt lost. Cause I didn't know who I truly was. I felt no credibility. Like at dinners, I wouldn't have this title to say that I held or these things that I was doing. I felt anger because people would reduce me, you know, for a little while. It was during COVID and I got this terrible job just to make some Extra money. And it was like I was 20 and an assistant when I had been the CEO of a company, right? So it's like you feel so angry, like no one sees you, but what are you gonna do to get out of it? And it was. It definitely for me, there was a lot of sadness, a lot of anger, a lot of frustration that you. You want to just scream because you just feel so stuck, you know?

[Tim Story]

So at that time, when you're feeling this. This anger and really feeling misunderstood, as your podcast is named, what were some things you leaned on to try to find your way? I know that maybe you went to different seminars, maybe you saw different famous life coaches or read books, but what did you kind of lean on?

[Rachel Ukutel]

Okay, well, I leaned on a lot of things for a lot of time that didn't work. I'll start there. And leaning on friends. Unless your friend has actually been through something that you have been through, do not take advice from somebody who really does not know your situation. You may going through. You may be going through a divorce. They know you, they know your husband, they know your life. Terrible idea to ask friends because they all just have an opinion.

[Tim Story]

So.

[Rachel Ukutel]

So for me, it's like I had to find someone who had been through what I had been through. Even talking to therapists about what happened in 911 and losing somebody, it's something you can't explain to someone who's never been through it. And I cannot take advice, and you shouldn't, from somebody who doesn't know real loss and not knowing what happened to someone and how your whole life changed and your future. So you have to be very clear on who you're letting into your life and who you're letting into your heart and your emotions. But when I started to find the right people, it was. I found a seminar called Landmark, where it opened my mind for the first time about the fact that essentially you are more than just this one thing that happened. You are the sum of all parts of yourself. And you have to remember that. And you have to essentially, if you were a little piece of chrome and you got it all dirty, you. You have to start dusting off this ball and you have to start being shiny again. And how are we gonna do that and how are we gonna get these layers off? And then for me, I mean, I really had to make my world very small. And I trusted you, and you were the only. I mean, I had plenty of friends at the time, but the only person whose opinion and guidance really mattered was you. And at first, you were a Total stranger who I was speaking to over the phone. And. And it was just a connection and an understanding that really got me to take advice and look at a problem from a different angle. Look at a problem, the same problem, but shine the light in a different view and tackle it a different way.

[Tim Story]

Part of my connection to you and your story was this, is that I've been through so much pain in my own life. Like my father dying when I was 10 years of age, my brother passing away from addiction. But I also was connected to the fact that when I first saw you on the 911 photos, everywhere, they were all over the world. And then because I work a lot in Hollywood, I would then see you around celebrities like you were in the celebrity space. And then when the. This situation that became a scandal hit later, I had a heart for you. Like, my perspective was more like, you know, there's two sides of her story. I wonder what her side is. Because I had already liked you from the photo that I saw early on of you being in so much pain. And I kind of thought, like, you know what? I want, I do want to meet her, I want to talk to her, and I want to try to figure out how we're going to get her up and out, because I believe this. As we always talk to each other, you could turn your mess into a message and your test into a testimony. And doggone it, that's what you've done now. And you got, like millions of people following you, a new book that's going to come out, and a lot of wonderful things happen in your personal life.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Yeah. I mean, but it didn't happen overnight, and that's okay. And I think that's important for your listeners. And can I tell one story before we go? Of course. I think it's really important for listeners that when you're working on moving, you know, getting unstuck and changing your mess into a message and doing all this stuff, something I learned. It took over a year to learn this, but it was the biggest lesson for me. And it's that I spent so much time in my head thinking about the what ifs. Now I'm talking about first it happened with my grief. Like when I was thinking about when my father died. Well, what if he had been here? What if he had been the one to walk me down the aisle? What if. Blah, blah, blah. After September 11th, I had a very hard time moving on. And I would be. I'll never forget. I would be in a taxi cab. Cause I lived, of course, in New York City. And I would be alone. The seat next to me was alone. And it would make me feel sick in my stomach. Cause I was like, well, Andy should have been here. Or on May 11th. This was the day we were supposed to be married. Supposed to, supposed to, should have been, should have been. And I was stuck, okay? Like all of us have felt from whatever situation. So I think I've told you before that I have two dogs. And right after Andy and I had bought a dog, I think I said, at the beginning of this. And the dog died right before. We had had the dog for about three weeks. And the dog actually died right before we went away on our trip to Greece. And it had distemper. We bought it from this pet store that every day when I would walk home from Bloomberg, its little face would be in the window. And Andy forbid me to get this dog. Forbid me. One day he was away on a golf trip for the day. He comes home and. Or, excuse me, I called him in the men's salon or whatever at the golf course. Because, by the way, the guy who listened to him have this conversation spoke at his funeral and told me his version. But they could say, andy, you have a phone call from Rachel. He gets on the phone. I say, andy, I got the dog. And he yells, I told you not to get the dog. I said, okay, let's try it for a week. If you don't like it, we'll return it, okay? In this week, I have pictures of Andy sleeping with the dog. The dog was this big, okay? Sleeping with the dog, playing with the dog, running with the dog. Loved this dog, okay? The dog ends up getting distemper. We get called into the emergency room. The doctor says we have to put it to sleep. It's over. I'm sobbing. We go to dinner. And at dinner, Andy says to me, rachel, I need you to realize that the dog lived for a month. The dog didn't know it was supposed to live for a month. It didn't maybe have 18 years of life. This was the life this dog was supposed to have. Everything happens for a reason. And you might not know the reason today why, but you have to know that this was the life that this dog was supposed to have. It was so loved by you. It had a mother. It had a home. It had. And that's it. And you can't live thinking that this dog was supposed to live any longer. You were supposed to be its mom, and this was its life. And that's it. Okay? So now we move on. He says, as soon as we get back from Greece, I'm gonna buy you a dog. Well, the next day, Andy dies. So on that Wednesday morning, I walk into the same dog store and I say, my fiance died, my dog died. I need a new dog. And they said, pick out any dog you want. So there was one dog that his eyes went sideways on each side. He was a Brussels Griffin. And I said, I want that dog. And when I walk back and forth, he would follow me with these little beady eyes and I want that dog. I named the dog Rudy Giuliani. Okay, so I take Rudy Giuliani, which.

[Tim Story]

I still think is the funniest thing.

[Rachel Ukutel]

In so you so me, because 20 years later, I met Rudy and told him all about it. It was.

[Tim Story]

And interviewed him.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Yeah, yeah. So I name him Rudy Giuliani. I have Rudy with me. Anyways, we move on. A year later, I have a little bit of a breakdown. Oh, and by the way, on the day I was supposed to be married, I went to the White House correspondents dinner cuz I was working for Mike Bloomberg. And I sit in between Ari Fleischer and Ozzy Osbourne. And I bought a new dog that morning and I end up naming my other dog Ozzy Osbourne. Okay, so I have Rudy Giuliani and Ozzy Osbourne. So a year after September 11th comes along, I need to take a month leave of absence because everyone else has gotten over it essentially. And I'm seeing all the things in the news and it's all over and my heart is breaking. I go to Brazil, I'm doing all this work, mind work, body work, soul work. I wake up in the middle of the night and I have this roommate and I shake her and I go, susan, I'll never forget. Never seen her again. Don't know anything about her. I know why Mickey died. Mickey's the dog. Mickey died because Andy says everything happens for a reason. And the reason that Mickey died was so that I knew that Andy was supposed to die. It's gonna make me cry. Sorry. The reason that Mickey had to die was so Andy was the one to teach me that lesson and say to me, it's okay if I die because I'm not supposed to live beyond 32. This is my life. This was the time I'm supposed to be in your life. So stop living your life thinking it should have been something else. Move on. I was here. I loved you, you loved me, and now you can live your life beyond me. It was such a great lesson because I didn't believe that everything happens for a reason. And I didn't know why he died. And I could not get over the fact that my life was ruined because Andy had died and was taken from me. From that minute on, my life changed. I was able to. Of course, obviously, I'm still sad about it, but I'm able to know that I wasn't supposed to be with him. I wasn't supposed to marry him. He was supposed to die that day. And I'm okay with it now. So I wanted to tell you that story, that everything does happen for a reason. You might know it, not know it at the time. You will eventually know it. But also, you have to realize that things are temporary. It's gonna pass. And as long as you can let yourself, let go, you will find love again. You will find pride again. You will be happy again. You will find success again. Whatever it is that you've lost, you will find that light again. So that's why I want to sit.

[Tim Story]

In this for a second. Just because we're such good friends, we can actually go there. That what you are saying is so powerful, because I think that that's been the challenge of my life, of being a visionary, because I envision things. And then I thought certain things would last for so long, and then they didn't. And then even me, as a coach and a person who should understand, I didn't know what to do when things died because I thought they were going to kind of last forever. But this understanding and awareness that, you know, sometimes life doesn't go the way we thought it was going to go, but you find a way to get through, to get up and get moving once again. So that even touches, like, my heart.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Thank you.

[Tim Story]

So I have a question for you. What advice would you give someone who feels defined by their past mistakes or public perception? Do they feel defined by their past mistakes or the way the public might see them? What advice would you give them?

[Rachel Ukutel]

Well, I would give them the advice that you got to get out of your head. Those things are a label. Those things do not define you. And, you know, you don't have to live in your head thinking these things and these labels. You could be whatever you want to be. You could be whoever you want to represent. And I think that when you. You know, first of all, everybody's really too busy worrying about themselves to worry about you. So I know that everyone thinks that everyone's talking about you.

[Tim Story]

Can you take some time on that for a second? Because when it comes out of your mouth, it's very Strong and very real. So I think a lot of people are so inward, they think everybody is really talking about them, thinking about them. Say that statement again and maybe help us with what you say.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Sure. So I know that you think what you're going through is the biggest thing ever and everyone is talking about you. That is really not the case. And yes, people might be gossiping and talking, but. But it lasts a very small amount of time for others, much more than it does. And how long it lives in your own head. And it is not as life impacting in the slightest to others as it is to you, because everyone is dealing with their own problems and is way too focused on what other people think about them to deal with what other people think about you. So let's just start there. But once you realize that and you go inward and you realize most of these things that you're telling yourself are just labels and it's insecurities and it's guilt or shame wrapped into one. And you just have to start to change the way you talk to yourself, change the way that you look at yourself and give yourself a little grace.

[Tim Story]

Yeah.

[Rachel Ukutel]

And say, I don't have to be that person. I don't have to be the person they're. They're making me out to be. I have. Listen, even a murderer has some good qualities to him. I interviewed one of the biggest criminal defense attorneys and he's like, you know, it's really hard for me because some of the people that have done the worst crimes in the world have really good other qualities. And so do you. You know, so does everyone. So you gotta focus on the things that you're good at. I mean, you and I sat with somebody who their label was that they had some learning disabilities and that they were dyslexic or whatever. That to them was this huge label. And they couldn't get over it and they thought they were such a loser every time they walked in the room. And you kind of want to shake them and be like, that's in your head. So don't take a job where you have to write and read. What are you really good at that makes you succeed? And by the way, laugh about the fact that you have some things that you're not great at and say, listen, I'm terrible at this, but I'm great at this. So it's just a sidebar and no one cares. And people understand what that feels like, so they'll have some empathy to that.

[Tim Story]

I'm loving this side of you. So in the midst of her being a amazing podcast and having one of the best podcasts in the world in the midst of her being an entrepreneur and teaching me and her fiance about business when we go eat together. Because you're so bright. Now she is speaking and really helping people, like, as a thought leader. So when you think of Brene Brown, Jamie Kern Lima, now you have Rachel, you could tell. So we had her speak in Bel Air, California, to a really amazing mastermind with some people from all walks of life, from a doctor from Stanford University to another doctor who's one of the best veterinarians in the world that works on horses that are worth up to $10 million. All these people were in the space listening to Rachel talk just a couple weeks ago, and we're blown away, not just by her story, but by her wisdom. So, Rachel, what are we gonna do with this side of you now that you are speaking more and more? Is this something you're excited about?

[Rachel Ukutel]

I'm so excited about it. Listen. And I'm so excited because I feel like people get it, you know, again, for somebody who's felt misunderstood for so long, you know, I think everyone understands the sentence of, like, you don't know me. You know, everyone said that once in a while, you don't know me. I'm behind the picture of the story of what you think. You know, there's so many other complicated layers, and I think people should get excited if you've been misjudged or misrepresented or feel stuck, because think about all the other avenues of you that you could bring out. So I'm really excited to. To do more speaking, to have my book come out, because I love connecting with people. I love having those conversations. I love when people come up to me and say, oh, my God, this little bit of what you said made me think of this in myself, and that makes me want to do X, Y, Z. Like, I needed that so much. I needed to find someone I connected with. Beyond your friends. Right. Like I said before, someone out there that had just been through it and got it on a soulful level and wanted to walk that journey with me. So I'm excited and hopeful that that's where this will go. You know, I hope that you do more of these kind of conferences, and I can be a part of it. I hope that, you know, we do podcast together, whatever it is, we're teammates. It's so fun for me to open people's minds and have these kind of conversations.

[Tim Story]

Okay. As we're winding down, I'm Going to talk about just a couple of things. So, number one, she has a new book coming out that she's working on. She's going to do more speaking, but she's going to speak all over the world, and life is just, you know, it's evolving for her. It's being uncovered for her. She's going through this discovery zone. And the same thing can happen to all you that are watching or listening. So don't sit in your setback and don't settle in your setback. Look at Rachel just keeps getting up again. Can we talk about the fact that you're about to get married and I get to be a part of this situation?

[Rachel Ukutel]

I'm so excited. Yes. I'm getting married at the end of the year, and I have asked Tim to be the officiant at my wedding, which was like, first of all, Dan thinks of you as, like, the biggest celebrity ever. So I hear him on calls with people, and he'll be like, oh. Oh, my God. And you won't believe. And we have a couple celebrities coming. Okay. He doesn't even mention them. He's like, oh, my God. You won't believe. Who's the officiate at the wedding? Tim Story and blah, blah, blah.

[Tim Story]

I love him.

[Rachel Ukutel]

He goes on and on.

[Tim Story]

I love her fiance.

[Rachel Ukutel]

He goes on and on like you're Tom Cruise. Okay? Like, we have Mission Impossible coming in to do this. So he's so excited about that. And not only that, as I've said on this podcast, my father died. And I have made my world, even though, again, my world is big, But I've made the people that I really love and care about small. And I have asked you to walk me down the aisle because at first I thought I should give myself away because I'm strong and independent, and this is me doing it. And then when we all kind of talked about it, the only person that I would feel so honored, emotional, like, oh, my God, this is my moment, and I wanna walk down this aisle with someone, would be with you. So I'm so excited to tell you guys that Tim will be walking me down the aisle and then becoming the officiant at the same time. So pretty amazing.

[Tim Story]

So just. Just so you know, so I'm getting emotional because I truly love you so much. And, you know, I. I see the shine you have. We. We recently were eating together with your fiance, and I see the way people look at you. They stare at you. They're trying to figure out how to place you. Was she in this movie or Was she in that movie? Or where did I see her? But they just all stare. So you've always had that about you, but also know the childlike side of you. I know that you're a phenomenal mother and I'm so excited that you're going to be an amazing wife and married to an amazing man. So what a privilege to do that. All right, so Rachel, let's talk about. We have our podcast, Misunderstood. Talk to us a little bit about where they could see this. It's in the obvious places, but tell us where.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Yes, it's called Misunderstood. With Rachel, you could tell you can get it anywhere you find your podcasts, which is Apple, Spotify, literally everywhere. And we also have it on YouTube. We video every episode. We do. And so you can watch the full episodes on YouTube. We also have a Patreon where I do talk more about personal things that are going on and get into details of stuff once a week. And so those are all the places you can get us. And also on Instagram, which is rachelyoucatelnyc, we do little clips of every episode, like 30 second to one minute clips, so you could decide which ones you wanna watch and see little tidbits about everybody that's on. But I wanna say one final thought about what you were talking about, which is the second act really starts when you say it does. And we don't want people to stay stuck. We've all been there. You're there right now, that's listening. And it starts when you say it does. And it can be today. So like dust yourself off and let's go. You know, like, don't wait any longer.

[Tim Story]

I like that. Rachel, gimme a little commercial on why people should watch my new podcast.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Oh, gosh. Oh, I'm so terrible at these things. My name is Rachel Ukatelle and you should watch. Wait, what is it called?

[Tim Story]

It's called Miracle Mentality.

[Rachel Ukutel]

Okay. Okay. You should watch Miracle Mentality with Tim's story because it is going to change your life.

[Tim Story]

That was good enough. Okay, Rachel, so we're still doing the podcast, so. Okay, I just want to say to you, thank you for being you and thank you for getting back up. Thank you for having a heart for people, because you like all types of people. You love the underdog too, and I love that about you. And I'm excited that you're going to be taking stages all over the world and I'm excited that we're doing projects together and I appreciate you being on my show. The Miracle Mentality.

[Rachel Ukutel]

It's been my honor.

[Tim Story]

Thank you for sharing space with me on this episode of Miracle Mentality with Tim Storey. If today sparked your courage or helped you understand why you're created for success, I invite you to carry that miracle mentality forward. Visit [e-mail] that story with an eye on the end. Until next time, walk by faith, embrace possibility, and create your own comeback story.