Podcast
Money, Meet Meaning
Hosted by Interfaith America and Tom Levinson · EN
How do we find meaning in our life with money?
In a culture where money shapes nearly everything we do—yet remains taboo to discuss—Money, Meet Meaning explores how faith and wisdom traditions have long grappled with wealth, possessions, and purpose.
This award-winning podcast features candid conversations, practical insights, and centuries-old teachings brought into today's world. The podcast was created by Interfaith America and Tom Levinson and co-sponsored by Apella Wealth, in partnership with the Religion News Service and Princeton University’s Faith and Work Initiative.
From spending and generosity to technology and consumerism, each episode illuminates timeless guidance for navigating our financial lives—whether you’re religious, spiritual, or simply searching for meaning in money.
Season 1 was named Best Religion Podcast by the Religion News Association and received an Award of Excellence from the Religion Communicators Council (Wilbur Awards).
28episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
Sacred Assets, Tough Decisions
3d ago00:50:02Tap to summarizeMany of us were taught an unspoken deal: live faithfully, do the right things, and life will work out. In this episode, Amber and Tom gently - but firmly - challenge that transactional model of faith and money with Amy Butler, a pastor, author, and founder of Invested Faith. Amy shares how her own ministry journey exposed the limits of “cosmic vending machine” theology – and why she believes faith communities are called to something deeper: interdependence. Drawing from her books Beautiful and Terrible Things and Holy Disruption, she explores how churches can move beyond scarcity thinking and creatively repurpose their assets to fund social enterprises that challenge unjust systems. Along the way, the conversation gets refreshingly practical: why pastors need balance sheets, not just Bible studies; why financial literacy is a form of pastoral care; and why closing or transforming institutions can be holy work. It’s a hopeful, grounded look at how faith communities can steward money, power, and privilege with courage, imagination, and a little disruption. About Pastor Amy Butler: Pastor Amy Butler has led some of the most iconic pulpits in America, including becoming the first woman to lead New York's Riverside Church. She's a writer, community builder, and founder of Invested Faith, a movement helping congregations use their aging assets to fund the work of faith-rooted social entrepreneurs building businesses that are changing unjust systems. Amy’s Books: Beautiful and Terrible Things Holy Disruption (co-authored with Dawn Darwin Weaks) For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Effort, Surrender, and the Money in Between
1w ago00:26:24Tap to summarizeAfter their conversation with Amjad Quadri, Amber and Tom turn to a deeper question beneath financial decision-making: What is actually in our control, and what do we need to let go of? Drawing on the islamic concept of rizq – the idea that our provision is ultimately in God’s hands – they explore the tension between effort and surrender in everyday financial life. From saving for retirement to pursuing a calling, managing debt, or stepping back from work, they wrestle with how to act responsibly without becoming consumed by outcomes. Amber connects the conversation to the idea of “solving for peace,” while Tom reflects on the wisdom of focusing on inputs rather than results. Along the way, real-life scenarios bring the tension into focus, and ancient wisdom – including the Serenity Prayer – offers a way through it. It’s a thoughtful guide to making financial decisions with intention, trust, and a little more peace of mind. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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What Makes an Investment Halal?
2w ago00:47:02Tap to summarizeWhat does it mean to invest in a way that aligns with your deepest beliefs? In this episode, Tom and Amber explore the principles of halal investing with Amjad Quadri, who works at the intersection of faith and finance. Amjad explains how Islamic investing avoids “sin stocks” like alcohol, gambling, and interest-based lending – and how it’s guided by both spiritual principles and practical financial frameworks. From navigating homeownership without traditional mortgages to understanding gratitude and trust through a faith lens, he offers a window into a system that is both disciplined and deeply values-driven. The conversation reveals a broader appeal, with many non-Muslim investors drawn to the approach. The episode wraps with a lively “Halal or Not at All?” segment, putting real-world financial dilemmas to the test. The conversation is a thoughtful look at what it means to invest with intention, regardless of your specific spiritual beliefs. About Amjad Quadri: Amjad M. Quadri joined the Chicago office of Saturna Capital in June 2015. As a Regional Manager, he brings experience in Islamic banking, including business and product development. You can find Amjad on LinkedIn. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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How Much Should We Give?
3w ago00:30:54Tap to summarizeAfter their conversation with philanthropists Kim Duchossois and Jessica Swoyer Green, Amber and Tom return to explore one of the thorniest questions in generosity: If you have more, should you give more? What unfolds is a candid, thoughtful look at the tension between purpose and self-preservation – between the call to give and the instinct to save. Drawing on wisdom from Jewish teaching, Christian scripture, and behavioral science, Amber and Tom dig into why giving is hard to do – yet why it feels so good – and how to know how much giving is “enough.” They wrestle with questions about timing, limits, legacy, and control: Is it better to give now or later? How much should we direct our gifts? And what do we owe our children – security or the opportunity to struggle and grow? It’s a warm and honest conversation about generosity, trust, and the values that guide us when the stakes are high. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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What We Pass Down
Apr 2101:07:27Tap to summarizeWhat does it mean to leave a legacy? In this episode, hosts Amber Hacker and Tom Levinson sit down with Kim Duchossois and Jessica Swoyer Green, a mother-duo from one of Chicago’s most community-minded philanthropic families, to explore what gets passed down through generations besides wealth. Kim and Jess share how their family shifted from transactional to transformational giving, the rising influence of women in philanthropy, and why values like integrity, empathy, and connection can matter more than a balance sheet. Together, they look honestly at the challenges of raising children with grounded values, navigating generational transitions, and choosing service over status. Whether you’re thinking about your own family’s story, what you hope to hand down, or how generosity can reshape a community, this conversation offers a rare window into a legacy built not on money but on meaning. About Kim Duchossois & Jessica Swoyer Green: Kim Duchossois and Jessica Swoyer Green are a prominent philanthropic mother-daughter duo redefining generosity across generations. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Ethical Spending Without Losing Your Mind
Apr 1400:24:21Tap to summarizeAfter talking with Harvard Business School’s Nien-Hê Hsieh about moral gray zones in leadership, Tom and Amber zoom in on the everyday gray zones most of us face: What do you do when ethical clothing costs twice as much? Should you switch banks if yours funds fossil fuels? How much label-scanning is too much? From private school garage sales as a surprisingly ethical hack to choosing a local community bank over a national giant, they explore creative “third ways” that move beyond cynicism or naïveté. Tom introduces the idea of a spending “shot clock” – a time limit to keep values-driven decisions from turning into analysis paralysis. Grounded in listener questions and ancient wisdom from the Bhagavad Gita, this episode offers practical guidance for the conscious consumer – and helps us let go of the illusion that any purchase can ever be perfect. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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A Spiritually Mature Economy
Apr 700:43:36Tap to summarizeEver tried to buy some chocolate and ended up in a spiral of label-scanning and ethical cross-checking? Tom and Amber open this episode with the dizzying reality of ethical consumerism – and then zoom out. They’re joined by Nien-Hê Hsieh, who grew up with the Doomsday Clock on his family’s kitchen counter – a daily reminder that money, power, and human choices carry existential weight. Now a professor at Harvard Business School, Professor Hsieh teaches leaders how to navigate the moral gray zones where profit, fairness, and human dignity collide. From childhood lessons about generosity and anxiety to teaching The Spiritual Lives of Leaders, Professor Hsieh explores the tension between ambition and integrity. He challenges listeners to imagine a “spiritually mature economy” – one that treats money not as an end, but as a tool for care, justice, and shared flourishing. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Trusting the Universe…or Your Retirement Account?
Mar 3100:26:46Tap to summarizeAfter their conversation with Buddhist teacher Cara Lai, Amber and Tom return to one of the deep tensions at the crossroads of spiritual life and financial planning: Do we save and prepare for the future, or trust that resources will appear when we’re living into our purpose? From Cara’s confessed hatred of her 401(k) to modern-day parables, Buddhist wealth teachings, and listener stories, Amber and Tom explore the tension between trust and stewardship. They also wrestle with real-life dilemmas: giving generously when you have a family to support, helping a friend in need, navigating a spouse’s very different approach to money, and wondering whether saving money blocks the flow of generosity. A relatable guide for anyone trying to build a future while maintaining trust, openness, and a generous spirit. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Trust the Flow: Money, Fear and the Practice of Generosity
Mar 2400:50:39Tap to summarizeWhat if your money habits say more about your heart than your bank account? In this episode Tom Levinson and Amber Hacker talk with Cara Lai, a Buddhist mindfulness teacher, about the spiritual side of money. Cara shares why she hates her retirement account, and how she’s learning to move from fear-based saving toward generosity and trust – including through a pay-what-you-choose model for her teachings. Together, they explore what it means to balance the practicality of providing for a family with faith in the flow of life – and how generosity can be both a spiritual practice and a source of real-world abundance. About Cara: Cara Lai is a Buddhist teacher, artist, and writer known for her humor, honesty, and ability to make ancient wisdom feel accessible in modern life. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Mission, Money, and Machine
Mar 1700:38:03Tap to summarizeAfter talking with AI investor Colin Evans, Amber and Tom return to the mic to wrestle with the thorny questions Colin’s episode raised. Can purpose win out over profit – or does money have the final say? If AI frees us from toil, is that liberation – or the loss of something essential? And what values should guide the people building our machines – should there be a “Hippocratic Oath” for AI programmers? Through wit, warmth, and a few well-timed tangents, Amber and Tom explore how spiritual traditions might help us navigate this new frontier – where work, wisdom, and technology meet. It’s a conversation for anyone wondering how to stay human in an age of machines and algorithms, and whether we can build with both head and heart. For more episodes and info, visit Money, Meet Meaning. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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