'No Kings' Is Even Bigger Than It Looks

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: Next Comes What

Episode: What 'No Kings' protesters get (but pundits don't)
Host: Andrea Pitzer
Date: April 3, 2026

---

Episode Overview

In this powerful episode, Andrea Pitzer explores the explosive growth and nuanced significance of the "No Kings" protest movement that erupted across the United States and internationally, in direct response to President Trump's escalating authoritarianism. Through a mix of reporting, expert interviews, and her own analysis, Pitzer challenges prevailing mainstream pundit skepticism of mass protest, arguing that these demonstrations are vital tools in forging and defending democracy—especially as institutional guardrails are eroded. The episode draws lessons from past global struggles with strongmen and considers how dissent can meaningfully shape America’s next chapter.

---

Key Topics & Insights

1. Historic Size and Scope of the "No Kings" Protests

• Scale: Over 8 million Americans participated, making it the largest single protest day in U.S. history ([01:39]).
  • “National attendance at thousands of events in the US had already exceeded 8 million people, making it the largest single day of protest in American history.” — Andrea Pitzer [01:39]
• Geographic spread: Protests took place across all seven continents, with large and small gatherings in over 3,300 U.S. cities and even remote towns like Oqiagvik, Alaska, and Thomas, West Virginia ([02:44]).
• Character: Mostly peaceful, with violence mainly instigated by police interventions, notably in Los Angeles where some protesters were arrested ([03:41]).

2. Motivations Behind the Protests

• Multiple Key Issues:
  • Immigration enforcement (76% cited as primary motivator) ([04:21])
  • Opposition to Trump (75%)
  • The war on Iran (73%)
  • Support for civil disobedience: 98% support organizations engaging in it; 79% support more confrontational action ([04:56], [05:01])
  • Personal Engagement: 69% willing to take future action ([05:17])
• Demographics: 96% identified as politically left, but with varied degrees of alignment ([05:35]).

3. Evolution of Protest Tactics

• Beyond Marching: Not only symbolic demonstration, but increased engagement in contacting officials, town halls, boycotts, direct action, and targeted buying ([06:41]).
  • “A greater than 10% increase in demonstrators who report either contacting an elected official, attending a town hall...or boycotting, or deliberately buying something for political, ethical or environmental reasons.” — Andrea Pitzer [06:41]
• Movement Maturity: Protest as just one layer in broader resistance—building alternative institutions, consumer boycotts, and targeted interventions ([07:21]-[07:35]).

4. Criticisms and Pundit Skepticism

• Mainstream dismissal: Weekend pundits and Democratic strategists challenge the protests’ impact, calling it “a big emotional release” or “group therapy” ([09:08]-[09:14]).
  • Quote: “Anyone participating...isn’t accomplishing anything, except maybe feeling validated. Perhaps they worried that anti-Trump sentiment was at the heart of it all.” — Andrea Pitzer [08:55]
• Counterpoint: Pitzer and guests argue protests are foundational, not merely expressive, drawing on global historical lessons ([10:05]).

5. The Dual Pillars of Democratic Survival

• Two Key Factors: Drawing from history, Pitzer highlights:
  1. A partially independent judiciary
  2. The public's ability to dissent openly
• Judicial Role: Lower courts, despite threats and a compromised Supreme Court, have acted to block or slow Trump policies and establish accountability ([12:14]-[13:44]).
  • “Our lower courts have been creating one such base of institutional legitimacy for a post-Trump era.” — Andrea Pitzer [12:59]
• Civic Resistance: Mass, visible opposition inhibits authoritarian consolidation ([18:29]).
  • “Authoritarianism can't fully consolidate when there are open and visible sides of opposition like mass protests.” — Professor Dana Fisher [18:29]

6. Protests as Power-Building, Not Performance

• Historical Context: Today’s protest movement is the inheritor of abolition, civil rights, farmworker, and more recent activism traditions ([15:09]).
• Necessary Ritual: Mass demonstration is a “single part of building movement infrastructure. It’s not just spectacle or performance for its own sake.” — Ashley Woodard Henderson [15:01]
• Community & Solidarity: Protesting counters atomization and loneliness, building new democratic “fabric” and local resilience ([19:26], [26:23]).
• No Single Leader or Demand: Movement is intentionally diffuse, refusing a singular figure or policy platform—its strength is in collective, distributed resistance ([19:26]).

7. Dissent’s Measurable Political Impact

• Effect on Politics: Research cited shows that single days of massive protest are correlated with increased electoral turnout, civic engagement, and candidate recruitment ([21:31], [21:52]).
• Influencing Democrats: Activist pressure forced policy responses (e.g., DHS shutdown), but party leadership is criticized for slow adaptation and a fixation on conciliating reactionary voters ([21:21]-[23:16]).
  • “Democratic willingness to reach across the aisle and make concessions to counterparts who embrace cruelty...ends up being a movement toward...white reconciliation.” — Andrea Pitzer [22:07]

8. The Danger of "White Reconciliation"

• Critique of Centrism: Pitzer, referencing Chad Stanton, condemns attempts to win back reactionary white voters at the expense of pluralistic democracy ([22:07]-[23:35]).
• Lesson from History: U.S. returns to authoritarian drift when it prioritizes exclusion and neglects marginalized communities ([24:17]).

9. Sustained Civic Engagement & Next Steps

• Movement’s Future: The episode closes with a focus on sustaining engagement—organizers call for ongoing activism, not just one-day mobilization ([27:20], [28:29]).
• Resources: Groups like Indivisible and Democracy Defenders provide training and next steps; local action is championed just as much as national ([27:55]-[28:19]).
• "Everywhere" Resistance: Listeners are encouraged to invent new forms of participation, meeting local needs as profound forms of resistance ([28:44]-[29:23]).

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On protest’s significance:
  • “Can you build a sustained anti-authoritarian campaign without mass demonstration? I think we can say unequivocally the answer is no.” — Ashley Woodard Henderson [14:41]
• On mass resistance:
  • “Large scale shows of discontent and resistance are very important during backsliding episodes.” — Professor Dana Fisher [17:58]
• On the need for community:
  • “So many lives have become atomized, isolated and lonely. Protesting is an antidote for all that and is also how you pull in people to understand they have a role.” — Andrea Pitzer [26:23]
• On the work left to do:
  • “The no Kings movement is a bottom up force that is creating pressure for a different kind of politics, and that is bound to be messy and take some time to sort out. But the protesters understand the assignment.” — Andrea Pitzer [19:26]
• On practical action:
  • “Rejecting Trump and his servants can fuse with the depth of our care for one another, for everyone. As we change our communities, the two together provide a blueprint for change in which accountability is to the people as a whole.” — Andrea Pitzer [30:07]

---

Key Timestamps:

• 01:39 — Landmark protest attendance
• 04:21–05:17 — Motivations & civil disobedience data
• 06:41–07:35 — Protestors expand tactics
• 09:08–10:05 — Punditry vs. grassroots insight
• 12:14–13:44 — The judiciary’s front-line resistance
• 14:41–15:09 — Activism as a nonnegotiable part of movement-building
• 18:29–19:26 — Mass protests as check on authoritarianism
• 21:31–21:52 — Protests’ impact on elections
• 22:07–23:35 — Critique of Democratic ‘reconciliation’
• 27:20–28:29 — Organizing for ongoing engagement

---

Conclusion

Andrea Pitzer’s episode makes a compelling, historically informed case for the necessity and power of the No Kings protest movement. Rather than chasing pundit-approved “solutions” or relying solely on flawed institutions, the episode spotlights the true engine of democratic resilience: millions of ordinary people, building networks of solidarity, resisting cruelty, and shaping their own future through visible, sustained dissent—no matter how messy or decentralized it may be.

---

If you’re looking for next steps, connect with Indivisible or Democracy Defenders for training, or invent your own mode of local resistance. As Dan says:

“That bigger is not about a single day. It is about getting people into ongoing, sustained civic engagement everywhere in the country.” [28:29]

---

Transcript

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

Foreign.

[Andrea Pitzer]

From New York, Dallas to downtown Los

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

Angeles to New Orleans, I'm looking at you, chattanooga.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Then Denver, Colorado.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

I'm looking at you, Memphis.

[Rahm Emanuel]

With 200,000 flooding into St. Paul, more

[Unnamed News Reporter]

than 8 million Americans turned out in

[Rahm Emanuel]

huge numbers yet again to protest against Donald Trump's policies. While President Trump spent the day at his Florida golf course,

[Andrea Pitzer]

I, and I suspect a lot of you went to one of the no Kings protests around the country. No ice, no war, no Kings. For consistency's sake, I went to the same one I went to in October so that I could compare this weekend's event to a few months ago.

[Rahm Emanuel]

With everything that's going on, I feel powerless. And today, in this moment, I feel like I do have a little bit of power.

[Andrea Pitzer]

A lot of fabulous people turned out. And the most significant thing I noticed as we were getting ready to cross from the Virginia side of the Memorial bridge over into D.C. near the Lincoln Memorial was how much bigger, visibly larger attendance was compared to October.

[Rahm Emanuel]

If Minneapolis and the twin cities in St. Paul are an indication of this, it's bigger all around the world. It's quite a sight to see.

[Andrea Pitzer]

That appears to have been a national trend.

[Unnamed News Reporter]

Yesterday's historic protests come at a moment when this country remains at war with Iran, solely at the decision of President Trump, who was reportedly considering sending more U.S. troops to the region.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Even before the west coast no Kings events had ended, Co sponsor Indivisible announced that national attendance at thousands of events in the US had already exceeded 8 million people, making it the largest single day of protest in American history.

[Unnamed News Reporter]

It's also a moment when Trump is trying to ramp through a voting overhaul bill that could disenfranchise millions.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Over the weekend, I saw some critics asking what the point is and what's gained by these protests beyond some kind of self centered satisfaction.

[Unnamed News Reporter]

Also at a moment when ICE agents who have aggressively ramped up operations under Trump's direction are now being deployed to US Airports, raising concerns about where the President could send them next.

[Andrea Pitzer]

For today's episode, I want to talk about what role no King's protests might or might not have in ending our authoritarian nightmares.

[Satirical King Character]

Mayor, they call me King. Now do you believe it?

[Andrea Pitzer]

Explain what I think a number of pundits are missing no King and suggest where dissent and resistance might go from here.

[Satirical King Character]

I'm such a king I can't get a ballroom approved.

[Andrea Pitzer]

By the end of Saturday, after four people showed up to carve no Kings into the snow in Antarctica, protests had spanned all seven continents of the globe. Today we want people to understand that we care as Democrats abroad, as Republicans abroad, Independents abroad. But the overwhelming majority of demonstrations took place inside US borders over 3,300 cities, towns, villages and hamlets along with major cities and mid sized towns. Hundreds of gatherings popped up in smaller places like Oqiagvik, once known as Barrow, Alaska with a population of just under 5,000 and Thomas, West Virginia, my home state whose population weighs in around 600.

[Rahm Emanuel]

There was also a number of no Kings protests taking place on the other side of the Ohio river as well. Event Organizers say over 600 people gathered in Wheeling at the intersection on National Road and Kruger street to make their voices heard.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Little in the way of violence took place and where the peace was disrupted, it was usually due to police officers. Late in the day, independent journalist Mel Boers, reporting from Los Angeles, showed LAPD officers spraying or pepperballing a crowd of protesters outside the Metropolitan Detention center, eventually arresting some, including one dressed as Lady Liberty in chains. Professor Dana Fisher has been collecting data on protests regularly with Trump's return to office. Early analysis of surveys her team conducted Saturday indicate that at 76%, immigration had the strongest effect in motivating people to show up.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

Our government as a whole has targeted immigrants and we've seen that it's actually moved beyond immigrants. Many American citizens are being targeted, followed

[Andrea Pitzer]

by opposition to Trump at 75%.

[Becca Good]

We are law abiding. That's why we detest the illegal actions

[Andrea Pitzer]

of Trump et al and then opposition to the war on Iran at 73%. They are waging an imperialist war of aggression on Iran right now. Demonstrators supported organizations engaging in civil disobedience at the staggering level of 98%.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

My name is Erica Chenowitz. I'm the Frank Stanton professor of the First Amendment at Harvard Kennedy School.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And movements embracing more confrontational actions against the Trump administration at 79%.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

VDEM the varieties of Democracy Project out of the University of Gothenburg released its annual update on trends in global democracy in 2025.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Asked whether they would personally take part in actions in the future, 69% of respondents said they would provided the opportunity.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

According to V Dem, the largest Democratic declines between the years 2024 and 2025 came in the United States.

[Andrea Pitzer]

96% of participants polled considered themselves to be on the left politically. Within that group, a little less than a third consider themselves to be the very left.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

In fact, the Liberal Democracy Index that BDEM measures saw the biggest annual drop in US History.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Just over half identified as left and about one in seven considered themselves to be slightly left the speed with which

[Professor Dana Fisher]

American democracy is currently dismantled is unprecedented in modern history. Legislative constraints, the worst affected aspect of democracy is losing one third of its value in 2025 and reaching its lowest point in over 100 years.

[Andrea Pitzer]

One of the results that most interested me in Fisher's surveys was a shift over the last year to increasing levels of engagement outside no Kings itself.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

My team at the Crowd Counting Consortium released our latest data update, and I actually was somewhat surprised, I guess, to see that the largest volume of protests in any month so far in the second Trump administration was in January 2026.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Between January 2025 and now, the surveys have shown, on average, A greater than 10% increase in Demonstra who report either contacting an elected official, attending a town hall meeting, participating in a direct action, or boycotting, or deliberately buying something for political, ethical or environmental reasons.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

Typically, in the civil resistance space, people talk about not just protest, which is considered a symbolic method of persuasion, but they also talk about methods of non cooperation.

[Andrea Pitzer]

People are doing more than just going to no King's protests things like consumer

[Professor Dana Fisher]

boycotts or limited strikes, and they talk about the development of alternative institutions or other methods of intervention that allow power building in the midst of consolidation, of authoritarianism.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And if Fisher is looking at the big national protests, it's important to remember that overall protests have been growing steadily since Trump's return and are outpacing those from his first term at a staggering rate.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

We're seeing really an expansion and escalation of peaceful protest in the country month over month.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Everything didn't go magically Saturday. Because planning was decentralized, events could sometimes feel a little scattered. Here in the D.C. area, for example, there were four different events. One in front of the Kennedy center, one at Frederick Douglas Bridge, one at the National Mall, and the one that I was at, crossing the Memorial Bridge. And there was no exact umbrella event connecting them. And that might have been a lost opportunity to bring everybody together. One person who attended the Memorial Bridge event, their first protest ever wondered at what point these demonstrations would telescope their focus down to a single irresistible demand. The US Will never be free until the stewardship of this land is returned

[Professor Dana Fisher]

to its indigenous people.

[Andrea Pitzer]

They wondered when a leader would rise for the movement that would carry it to electoral victory, activism, or entitlement.

[Rahm Emanuel]

Our next guest says anyone participating in

[Unnamed News Reporter]

the nationwide no Kings protest isn't accomplishing

[Andrea Pitzer]

anything, except maybe feeling validated. Perhaps they worried that anti Trump sentiment was at the heart of it all.

[Rahm Emanuel]

Let's bring in psychotherapist and author of Therapy Nation, Jonathan Alpert and that it

[Andrea Pitzer]

might not be enough.

[Rahm Emanuel]

It's a big emotional release, but I feel like maybe we set a record for the biggest group therapy ever.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And it's true that on Saturday, when I stopped to ask people why they were attending the march, defying Trump or ending his regime was often the first line out of their mouth.

[Satirical King Character]

I thought we gave up kings like in 1776, wasn't it?

[Andrea Pitzer]

And given the multiple and occasionally inchoate demands on the signs carried by protesters over the weekend stop funding private prisons, the wish for some kind of tighter focus on messaging and goals is understandable. We're not gonna take it anymore. Weekend pundit analysts seem to agree with that criticism. What do you think Democrats should be doing?

[Megan Hayes]

What are they doing?

[Andrea Pitzer]

Megan Hayes, a former special assistant to Joe Biden, said Sunday on MSNOW's the Weekend that being anti Trump isn't sufficient. I think Democrats need to continue to

[Professor Dana Fisher]

focus on the economy and they need to have actual solutions.

[Andrea Pitzer]

But I think something bigger is afoot, something that's easy to miss. I've talked repeatedly on this podcast since November 2024 about the two things that have helped countries reverse course once they had become concentration camp societies. One is the existence of at least a partially functioning, semi independent judiciary. The other is to hold onto the ability to dissent in public. I'll briefly touch on what's happening in the courts, even though it's tangential to the events from over the weekend. The Supreme Court, of course, is deeply compromised with an out of control right wing majority. The conservative justices appeared skeptical about allowing states to count ballots that are mailed on time but arrive after Election Day. Reports of deep corruption have touched sitting justices with no consequences. The Court's ruling could upend the voting process in more than a dozen states just months before this November's midterm elections. In addition, expanding dodgy uses of the shadow docket or downright incorrect citations, Conservative

[Rahm Emanuel]

Justice Samuel Alito predictably, was pretty upset about all of this. He said, we used to have Election Day. Now it's election month or election months.

[Andrea Pitzer]

The Court's rulings are in many cases abetting the destruction of laws and institutions meant to protect democracy in the United States.

[Rahm Emanuel]

Folks that are serving overseas in our military especially right now, may not be able to get their ballots in on time, even though they are postmarked by Election Day.

[Andrea Pitzer]

But it very much matters that the lower courts are by and large holding the line on their interpretations of the

[Megan Hayes]

law, whether it's immigration, the economy, or who he can hire and Fire. President Trump's second term has been marked by one battle after another with the federal courts.

[Andrea Pitzer]

It is easy to make a strong case that US Laws have been flawed or tilted toward corporate interests or plagued with systemic issues when it comes to sexism, racism and immigration.

[Megan Hayes]

One estimate from the Brennan center for justice tracking more than 650 lawsuits filed against the Trump administration to date and over 150 decisions where courts have at least partially ruled against the administration.

[Andrea Pitzer]

But what lower courts have been doing that's helping tremendously is twofold.

[Megan Hayes]

We've seen across the country with judges who were appointed by Democratic presidents, Republican presidents. We've seen very broad, strong statements by the courts that many of these policies have crossed the legal line.

[Andrea Pitzer]

First of all, they are insisting on accountability to existing law. By doing so, they show that Trump's second administration is no administration at all. It is a power grab antithetical to the concept of the republic and government itself.

[Megan Hayes]

Just this week, a federal judge blocked Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr's changes to the immunization schedule for children, finding proper procedures weren't followed.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Second of all, they're showing what a functional court system looks like when institutions dissolve. Part of the challenge of establishing functional government is the absence of any steady ground on which to stand while you rebuild. Our lower courts have been creating one such base of institutional legitimacy for a post Trump era. And the actions of a significant number of judges, many of whom are facing death threats, are heroic.

[Megan Hayes]

NBC News has reported that harassment and threats have changed the lives of some judges who have ruled against President Trump.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And by heroic, I mean as a group, these judges appear less about creating saviors, but instead putting democracy first.

[Megan Hayes]

Prompting Chief Justice John Roberts to sound the alarm about the disturbing trend.

[Rahm Emanuel]

Personally directed hostility is dangerous and it's got this out.

[Andrea Pitzer]

They're preserving the best part of their branch of government. If that's what courts are doing to preserve us from authoritarianism, what about the other thing that often helps countries stop or reverse mass civilian detention? Maintaining the right to dissent.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

Thank you for being here. My name is Ashley Woodard Henderson.

[Andrea Pitzer]

I would argue that the emerging protest movement is the most visible sign of a new national fabric.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

The real question here isn't does a protest change everything?

[Andrea Pitzer]

Our best chance to enshrine a real and lasting democracy in the United States is a path to democracy that relies on citizens and other residents being engaged and not expecting democracy to be a self executing concept.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

It's can you build a sustained anti authoritarian campaign without mass demonstration? And I think we can say unequivocally the answer is no.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Of course, the current protest movement is built on the back of key efforts that laid the groundwork for both networks and tactics in preceding decades and even centuries.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

We can't skip it. It's a single part of building movement infrastructure. It's not just spectacle or performance for its own sake.

[Andrea Pitzer]

From abolitionist movements to farm workers to civil rights activists and act up to Occupy gatherings standing up for water rights and Black Lives Matter protests, we see

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

and witness your grief and your joy, y'.

[Dan]

All.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

We're building here day in and day out on and between these big moments of mass mobilization.

[Andrea Pitzer]

This heritage has made the current movement possible. A movement which began even on the campaign trail, but became visible nationally from Trump's first day in office, January 21, 2017. A national convulsion took place that day, and a global protest happened simultaneously. It was understood from the beginning that Trump himself was antithetical to the democratic ideals of the United States. Of course, he was the culmination of another heritage in the country, one with its own long standing vision, a grim one.

[Satirical King Character]

And for those who have been wronged and betrayed, I am your retribution. I am your retribution.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And Trump's presence was enough to provoke a clash between the two visions for the country.

[Satirical King Character]

Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States.

[Andrea Pitzer]

And protests continued even after his arrival. Think of the same kind of convulsive, immediate response to the first attempts to impose a Muslim ban, or the visceral response over family separations. This is the people's house. You cannot keep us out. Those were specific policies being rejected by Americans in real time. But those protests didn't gather the nationwide momentum we're seeing right now, or the ability to continue it. We're joined by Lee Gelernt. He's an ACLU attorney who presented the first challenge to Trump's executive order on immigration. His argument resulted in a nationwide injunction. In my opinion, this was due in part to. To the extremist policies the public had protested, being dialed back somewhat or addressed at least marginally in some way, even if the underlying issues weren't really resolved.

[Rahm Emanuel]

I think we're in one of those real civil rights moments where it's not just the lawyers presenting arguments in court, but it's the community and everyone rallying together. And I think that's what it's going to take.

[Andrea Pitzer]

It was also due to the reality that however bad it was, the public understood that Trump was at least somewhat constrained by those around him.

[Rahm Emanuel]

I joined this campaign in a heartbeat because you have nominated a man for president who never quits.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Now what we're seeing is nothing short of a rejection of Trump, of everything he stands for, of his collaborators and the system that has allowed them to rise.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

Large scale shows of discontent and resistance are very important during backsliding episodes.

[Andrea Pitzer]

It is a movement against Trump and for inclusion, for aid to those in need, in favor of community and love. Not in some generic, self congratulatory, kumbaya sense, but in an understanding that we need each other, that we are reliant on each other, and that policies of cruelty and exclusion can only carry the country into a cul de sac of fascism.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

I think authoritarianism can't fully consolidate when there are open and visible sides of opposition like mass protests.

[Andrea Pitzer]

It is an idea that protesters are shaping as they arrive to the moment.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

It demonstrates that the consolidation is contested and incomplete and that sends important signals both to the pro democracy population and it sends signals to the aspiring authoritarians.

[Andrea Pitzer]

It's a resource just knowing that millions of others also believe enough in a different world to make an effort on behalf of something better. Even in the tiniest, reddest towns, it

[Professor Dana Fisher]

can provide encouraging signals of people not being alone in their opposition and registering in very large numbers that there's a significant number of people in the population who not only don't like what's happening, but are willing to commit their own time, resources, energy and social capital to pushing back on it.

[Andrea Pitzer]

When I refer to the national fabric, I mean it in almost literal way. You have to see the bolt of cloth and you have to know what there is to work with before you can begin making that new garment. What's emerging is the base for a new kind of democracy. It may adopt a more specific slogan at some point than no Kings, but in my opinion, it won't have a single policy goal or a single leader. It will have several of each, but its power will remain with the vast body of those who are standing up to the current threat. The protesters coming out for no Kings and those holding vigils at detention facilities or showing up in cities and towns under attack by ice. Those speaking out against bombing school children in Iran or working to block warehouses from being converted to concentration camps. The no Kings movement is a bottom up force that is creating pressure for a different kind of politics, and that is bound to be messy and take some time to sort out. But the protesters understand the assignment. The most important place they can be doing it is right where they are. No Kings is binding together the core movements we have seen in Chicago, Los Angeles, Minneapolis and elsewhere. We are seeing a massive shift in favor of of the abolition of ice, deep support for trans folks, and fury over the Iran war.

[Rahm Emanuel]

The American people were lied to about the war in Vietnam, we were lied to about the war in Iraq, and we are being lied to today about the war in Iran. This war must end immediately.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Democratic politicians have by and large had a hard time keeping up, though we see the effects of public pressure on actions like the current DHS shutdown.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

There's also plenty of research that shows that even single days of protest can have, or at least are correlated with changes in electoral outcomes.

[Andrea Pitzer]

One reason why Democratic Party leadership is still struggling even as they manage some good steps is because they are listening too closely to the Sunday morning pundits and consultants I mentioned earlier.

[Professor Dana Fisher]

When it comes to turnout, when it comes to how many people run for office in the end and become engaged in their political scene, and how many people vote for the opposition party come midterm election time or during presidential elections.

[Andrea Pitzer]

While those folks surely believe they want what is best for the country and have figured out a reliable path toward it, I would like to suggest that what they're actually proposing is something else. Chad Stanton, who is known as Doghouse Riley on Blue sky, has been saying something I think gets to the heart of the current institutional Democratic response. Whether they realize it or not, democratic willingness to reach across the aisle and make concessions to counterparts who embrace cruelty and throw vulnerable communities under the bus end up being a movement toward the rejection of a diverse and pluralistic democracy. Instead, it's a kind of longing for what Stanton calls white reconciliation. I think that many reactionary centrists would be surprised and even offended to think about what they're doing in those terms. A vocal force in politics with no shortage of opinions about the State of the Union. So please welcome back Rahm Emanuel. It's probably not how they picture it.

[Rahm Emanuel]

We were permissive on immigration. We were permissive on a host of other cultural issues.

[Andrea Pitzer]

But look panoramically at their arguments, how they're framed, and the degree to which they rely on embracing the mistreatment and exclusion of whole groups to win back reactionary white voters that boxed us in

[Rahm Emanuel]

a place that took a whole group of voters that we could have won. And they said, look, you look like you sound like you're from Mars.

[Andrea Pitzer]

In that context, the white reconciliation framing seems accurate. But I don't think it's going to work because reactionary white voters are not going to save democracy. Just as some people have outsourced their thinking to AI lately in ways that I think are dangerous, many in the country have outsourced their authority to actors and institutions they now realize have not protected them and who are unwilling to act in critical ways to help the average American, let alone the groups being targeted for violence and hate. We are paying attention, and so we're

[Dan]

here to show that together we'll put

[Andrea Pitzer]

our voices together and we're going to change the system because we're together. But millions on the ground see what's actually happening and have realized that the times that the United States has built democracy on exclusion and bigotry, it has harmed and destabilized the country in ways that required massive course corrections.

[Satirical King Character]

Pretty amazing, right? I'm a king. If I was a king, we'd be doing a lot more. I'm doing a lot.

[Andrea Pitzer]

As we move toward another such correction here, it would be a tremendous self own to fail in the same ways the country failed in the past.

[Satirical King Character]

Thursday, the disciples gathered with Jesus as their teacher stood in fear as he was arrested and betrayed. He was really betrayed. We know the feeling.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Planting seeds for more discord that will bring us right back to the same place in the future.

[Satirical King Character]

The Son of God was nailed to the cross, crucified, and he died for all of us. It was a day of darkness, but it wasn't the end by any means.

[Andrea Pitzer]

I think the 8 million plus demonstrators who took to the streets on Saturday also understand that public dissent is not only a performative ritual, but also a stand against the current regime and a direct blow to the dictatorial authority that Trump wants to represent.

[Satirical King Character]

There's no talking to these people. They're crazy.

[Andrea Pitzer]

They are reclaiming the power they've ceded far too much to others in the past. In the same way, people are practicing for the harder tests that may be coming in the wake of the murders of Porter and Good and Preddy. Few people are unaware of the risks. Now they are girding themselves to help because we know where authoritarianism goes and how far it will stoop to expand its power after it's already seized so much. The more who stand up now, the fewer who will have to pay with their lives later.

[Satirical King Character]

I believe that so strongly, so many

[Andrea Pitzer]

lives have become atomized, isolated and lonely. Protesting is an antidote for all that and is also how you pull in people to understand they have a role. No kings is both performative and substantial.

[Ashley Woodard Henderson]

I want y' all to give a warm welcome to Leah Greenberg, co executive

[Andrea Pitzer]

director of Indivisible Showing up with a sign is in and of itself a powerful action to take in this moment, but it's also the path to doing more.

[Dan]

You know, as we do that no one day of protest is going to fix things. No change is incredible. It's also a tactic and a strategy.

[Andrea Pitzer]

We can see it in Professor Fisher's statistics that people are already engaging in tactics beyond the protests themselves at a rising rate, and they are reporting a willingness to do more.

[Dan]

The strategy is about fostering mass defiance and local power everywhere in this country to resist Trump and MAGA's attacks on our freedom, safety and well being and ultimately to build something better.

[Andrea Pitzer]

The size of the crowds and the breadth of their presence are an important part of showing us what's possible.

[Dan]

Trump is losing support fast. He is flailing. Flailing would be dictators are dangerous. They don't go quietly.

[Andrea Pitzer]

If you're looking for something immediate to plug into for your next actions states at the core, your friendly neighborhood Democracy Defenders holds trainings on the specifics of organizing.

[Dan]

That is why he invaded Minnesota. That is why he launched an illegal catastrophic war with Iran. That is why we are fully expecting him to try to sabotage the upcoming midterms elections. How do we stop that?

[Andrea Pitzer]

Indivisible is hosting calls to focus on next steps, from learning how to host a local meeting and organize your community to a national May Day on May 1st.

[Dan]

We stop it by building our power. We talk about 3.5% of the population that is needed to mobile at us to successfully stop dictatorship. Every time we do one of these, we're like, oh, we're getting a little closer.

[Andrea Pitzer]

If you're looking for how to translate Saturday into something more lasting at the ballot box or in your community, there are people ready to train you to bring that kind of change to your hometown.

[Dan]

But that bigger is not about a single day. It is about getting people into ongoing, sustained civic engagement everywhere in the country.

[Andrea Pitzer]

But you don't have to follow that path. You can make something completely new too.

[Dan]

Dan is what actually defeats dictators.

[Andrea Pitzer]

I've been astounded by the ways that people all over the country have been inventing new approaches or expanding existing ones. Whether it's watching real time flights or pouring through contracts to help prevent warehouses from being converted into concentration camps in your backyard.

[Becca Good]

Becca Good, the wife of Renee Goode, has asked me to read a statement which I am honored to do.

[Andrea Pitzer]

Whether it's driving immigrants to court hearings hours away, creating diaper banks for every baby, or food deliveries for those targeted by ICE and Border Patrol. Everyday people have been seeing the needs that exist close to home and they have been meeting them.

[Becca Good]

I know I am not alone in feeling in awe of your generosity. The reality is I am so heartbroken. I miss my wife. The world now knows that my wife sparkled with sunshine and shone with kindness that is unmatched. We were robbed of an incredible human

[Andrea Pitzer]

Learning to care for one another at this level is one way we begin to exert pressure for the government to care for all Americans.

[Becca Good]

It has made people pause and take a breath and have to choose sides. We choose the side of love, the

[Andrea Pitzer]

force of our presence at protests. Rejecting Trump and his servants can fuse with the depth of our care for one another, for everyone. As we change our communities, the two together provide a blueprint for change in which accountability is to the people as a whole. The people who are showing they are not afraid to demand something better for America than the scraps thrown to them by corrupt billionaires and their elected servants. And that's it. Thanks for listening to Next Comes what? Please share this with one person who's looking for ways to survive this mess. To support this podcast, please become a paid subscriber at andreapitzer. Com and consider giving Next Comes what? A five star review where you get your podcasts.