← Next Level Soul Podcast with Alex Ferrari
Next Level Soul Podcast with Alex Ferrari
BONUS MONDAYS: Woman TAKES HER LIFE; DEAD for 10 Mins; Meets Jesus Who HEALS Her CANCER! (NDE) with Rosemary Thornton
01:05:24
For 20 years, Rose Thornton enjoyed a national reputation as an expert on old houses. The author of nine books, Rose has been featured on everything from PBS’ “History Detectives” to BBC Radio. In 2016, her husband committed suicide and two years...
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- [00:02]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy. With Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year after two starter doses.
- [00:29]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [00:41]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means everything.
- [00:46]
Rosemary Thornton
Nothing is everything.
- [00:49]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [01:00]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family. Now through January 27th, shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers, Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddler's Diapers, Pampers, Cruisers Diapers and Similac Powder formulas and save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [01:31]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
This episode is brought to you by Peloton. The new Cross Training Series balances your workouts with 15 plus workout types for endless movements on and off your equipment. Stay motivated with weekly personalized plans that guide you from beginner to expert, and push past your goals with routines tailored to you. Get the new Cross Training Series terms apply. Welcome to Next Level Soul, the place where we deep dive into the mysteries of existence, uncover hidden layers of consciousness, and explore the journey of the soul. I'm your host Alex Ferrari, and every week we sit down with the world's leading spiritual teachers, mystics, scientists and truth seekers to illuminate the path towards awakening. Here we ask questions that truly matter. Why are we here? Where are we going? And how do we elevate our lives, our purpose, and our consciousness to the Next Level? This is a space for transformation, a space for expansion. A space to remember who you really are. So take a deep breath, open your mind and prepare to step into your Next level soul. Now, if you're ready to take your spiritual journey to the next level, explore Next Level Soul tv, our streaming platform filled with exclusive movies, docs, original shows, transformative series, guided meditations, channeling sessions, audiobooks, and deep spiritual teachings you won't find anywhere else. New content drops every week, helping you expand your consciousness and live from your highest potential. Start your journey today at Next Level Soul tv. The views, opinions and statements expressed by our guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect the beliefs or positions of Next Level Soul, its host, or, or any of the companies they represent. Now let's dive into today's episode.
- [03:22]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I'd like to welcome to the show Rosemary Thornton. How you doing, Rosemary?
- [03:27]
Rosemary Thornton
Hi. How are you?
- [03:28]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I'm good, my dear. Thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing your journey with all of us. So my very first question I have for you is, what was your life like prior to your near death experience?
- [03:40]
Rosemary Thornton
That's a really good question. You know, I've done about 75 of these and I hear pretty much the same questions, but that's a good question. Okay. You know, I. I met him. I met my second husband in 2006, and I was so grateful to find him. I'd been through a messy divorce, had five years of living single, and I had some success as a writer. I'd written books on architectural history. And in fact, after our first date, my. One of my stories, because I had, I had good publicity, one of my stories about one of my new books was written up in the Wall Street Journal. Above the fold, no less. No. So I was very proud that it looked like this happened all the time. You know, here's this new young, this new fellow I'm trying to impress. And I say, I was in the Wall Street Journal today, above the fold. He was like, wow. So he and I were married 10 years, and I thought it was a good marriage. In fact, in my wedding vows, I thank. I thanked God for bringing him into my life. The answer to a lifetime of prayers. My first marriage had failed after 24 years. And as anyone who's been through a divorce can tell you, that's. That's hard when you put your best energies, efforts and prayers into a marriage and a fail. So I really thought happy days had arrived. Really and truly. I thought all those hard years were over. And then after about nine and a half years of marriage, came home for lunch one day and ended this life. And as a sensitive soul and a writer to say I Was devastated would be an understatement. But we had a good life. In fact, there are times that I was prone to sadness. Typical creative type, you know, ruminate over everything, think too much all the time. And he would frequently tell me, we have a good life. You know, look at all the wonderful blessings we have in our life. And for him to do this for about two and a half years, I just, just lost my mind. And I learned how to. In the vernacular of the day, I learned how to mask. I learned how to pretend to be fine because nobody wants to be around somebody who's like, oh, my life is awful. So I learned how to. I liken it to the Romulan cloaking device from Star Trek. Are you familiar with that?
- [05:43]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Of course I am, yes. Well, I mean, look, we all put a little bit of Romulan cloaking devices on all of us most of the time, like, hey, how are you feeling? As that is that, how's you.
- [05:53]
Rosemary Thornton
How are you going?
- [05:54]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
How are you feeling? Is a thing that you say to everybody. And you always say fine, but never really fine. Are you generally. So we all put a mask on, but you really had to put on not only a mask but a performance to really cloak what was going on inside.
- [06:08]
Rosemary Thornton
That's the right word. It was a performance. In fact, I'm kind of fascinated. Well, I love words, I'm a writer. The word personality comes from the Latin, Latin word for mask. So our personality is often just something we don to survive in this world. But yeah, it took a lot of energy to maintain that. And as you know from the Romulans, they can't fire when they have the cloaking device.
- [06:29]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
That's very true.
- [06:30]
Rosemary Thornton
So much energy.
- [06:31]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
That's very true. You cannot attack while cloaked.
- [06:37]
Rosemary Thornton
So I thought we had a good life. So, yeah, this, this blew things up. And, you know, I learned so much. I guess I used to be one of those people that was afraid of the homeless. You see them out, they look unkempt and smell money and, you know, they have the scary look in their eyes. And I. One of the great blessings, if you could say that from this experience was in fact just about six weeks ago, I saw a woman not much younger than me out in front of a big cathedral in central part of Illinois. And she had a sign up, it said something like, you know, need a few more dollars for food or something. So I went over to her and I said, my name's Rose, what's your name? And she said, she gave me her name. And I said, terry, how did you end up here? What's going on? And she said, my son killed himself, and I don't know what to do. She said, I used to have a good job. I drove a BMW. I lived in a beautiful house in a beautiful neighborhood. And she said, I lost my mind and I lost my health insurance, which is what happens to people like that, and can't even afford a psych ward after that. And she said, now I'm out on the street begging. Don't know what to do. And she said, nobody wants to talk to me anymore. And that's what happens. People get tired of hearing the sad stories. But what they found out about trauma survivors is we have to tell the story over and over and over again, typically for two to three years, just. Just to. To sort it out in our own heads. So I have found that. And I gave Terry a little bit of money and told her I would pray for her, and I did. But I can't tell you how many homeless people I've encountered that the story begins with. My mother killed herself. My husband killed himself. My daughter killed herself. That American Psychological association came up with an assessment that said losing a close loved one to suicide is one of the most severe traumas a human can know. Oh, yeah. And yet in this country, we don't know how to deal with people. I mean, my husband was a successful professional. I was a writer who had some success. We had lots of fancy friends, had big parties, and lived in a lovely home. And after his death, man, those folks were gone. Those folks all disappeared. And even now, seven and a half years later, I'm not in touch with one of those people. And yet the people who rushed into the fray were what we would call the working class. They were the people who didn't have much, but they knew pain and they had the inner strength, which I think I finally developed. They had the inner strength to deal with somebody with as much pain as I was facing. And that's. That is the blessing, if you can call it that, that comes from an experience of this magnitude, is you learn, you know. Another quick example. I know this is not what we're talking about, but I ran into. I went to a Christmas party, traveled a thousand miles to go to a Christmas party with a lonely friend. He was alone and didn't have anyone to spend Christmas with. So I went up there, and after we ate, the. The host, the hostess of this fancy soiree, was standing at the kitchen counter, kitchen sink, doing the dishes, and she was sobbing. And I saw everyone gathered around the table, was kind of looking there and like, what do we do? She's the hostess is up there sobbing. And I looked at her and I thought, man, I can't watch that. And I got up and I walked over to her and I put my hand on her back and I said, what's going on? What's wrong? She said, you wouldn't understand. I said, well, I might not, but tell me. You know, sometimes the burden shared is halved. I do believe that. And she said. She said, my husband killed himself five years ago.
- [10:03]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Oh, geez.
- [10:04]
Rosemary Thornton
I had no idea. I had no idea. Wow. And she said, he and I had an argument and he went out to the front porch and sat down and. And, you know, used a gun. And she said, I can't face holidays anymore. She said, I try. I put on these big fancy parties, you know, I make sure all the silverware is just right, but I can't deal. And I smiled at her and I thought it's kind of inappropriate to smile. And I said, oh, golly. I said, I understand better than you think. And I told her my story very briefly. And she. She smiled. And then before long, I said something perhaps borderline inappropriate to her. I said, these men can really screw you up in the head, can't they? Except I don't think I use the word screw.
- [10:48]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yeah, yeah.
- [10:49]
Rosemary Thornton
And she laughed and she said, that's what he did. And I felt so comforted. And then I was able to just, you know, kind of hang out with her for a bit. So it's funny how many. Funny's the wrong word. Coincidences are miracles where God chooses to remain anonymous, I think.
- [11:06]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Synchronous Synchronicities.
- [11:08]
Rosemary Thornton
Synchronicities.
- [11:08]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
If you.
- [11:09]
Rosemary Thornton
Yeah, yeah. So I know that that was the right place for me to be.
- [11:14]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
Wow.
- [11:15]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
That's pretty remarkable. So it seems that. So before the near death experience, were you coping? Were you or were you still kind of in that lost space?
- [11:27]
Rosemary Thornton
Before I had three. That's a good question. I had three daily prayers. I prayed every day because I believe in persistence. You know, the Bible tells the story of the. The man who comes to. I can't remember. I think it's the judge's house. And begs and begs and begs and begs and won't go away. Actually, it's a woman, I think, goes to somebody's house and begs and begs and begs and won't go away. And finally the judge says in desperation, all right, all right, all right. I'll give you what you want. So I'm a big fan of persistence. But I prayed three prayers every day. One was I asked God, heal me or let me die. I felt dead. I felt like my soul was black, blackened out, that there was no light left in my soul or my heart. And I just felt like I might as well be dead because I'm dead mentally and emotionally and spiritually. And then the second prayer was I asked that when I do die, because I knew it wouldn't be, that there be no life review. I had seen what happened to me after my husband's death and I lost my mind and I was in embarrassment. I humiliated myself in many, many ways and I so I said, God, please, when I die, spare me that. Because I'd been a big fan of NDEs, I'd read pretty much every NDE book I could get my hands on before my experience. And then my third prayer was decision fatigue. There were some legal messes that had to be dealt with after my husband's death, and there were a lot of very hard decisions that had to be made involving attorneys and such. So I ask God, spare me these decisions I can't handle anymore.
- [12:48]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [12:53]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic plaque or phototherapy with Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year after two starter doses.
- [13:21]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [13:33]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [13:51]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers, Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes Pampers, Swaddler's Diapers, Pampers Cruisers diapers and Similac powder formulas. And save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [14:22]
LifeLock Commercial Voice
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- [15:25]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the show.
- [15:29]
Rosemary Thornton
So, in fact, I had a financial advisor take me aside and she said, so, Rosemary, where do you see yourself in two years? And I said, without missing a beat, I said, I'll be dead. I'm not going to survive this. In fact, at one point I went to a family member and said, I'm. I'm dying. And not to be melodramatic, but I'm not going to survive. I'm circling the drain. I'll either die by my own hand or I will, I will succumb to something, but I'm not going to survive this. And so many people don't know what to do when somebody says that. So anyway, that's where I was. And I was going out to lunch with friends and, you know, pretending. And, you know, an interesting thing happened. I was at a fancy restaurant somewhere, eating by myself on this particular day, but somebody opened a door to my side and the wind caught the door and it swam very, very hard. And it swam so hard and it startled me. And I jumped up out of my seat and I yelled. With children around and everybody else around, I yelled, what the f is wrong with you? And to nobody in particular, but it startled me so badly, right? And I, you know, people are like, just gaping at me and I, I left my, jumped up and ran out of the restaurant Because I was so humiliated by him now. But I was still pretty messed up. And then 29 months into it, I'd had a bunch of physical symptoms, very disturbing symptoms, including some. Some bleeding and, you know, gynecological problems, blah, blah, blah. And I went to a doctor, and I went to a couple doctors, actually went to three, and I was diagnosed with cervical cancer, stage two. And I said, you know, God, I was pretty clear on this. Heal me or let me go. I meant fast. Lingering illness.
- [17:11]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Details, details. You gotta. You're putting the order in. You gotta be detailed.
- [17:17]
Rosemary Thornton
And during a related surgery, somebody made a boo boo. And then I awakened from that surgery bleed, bleeding profusely. It had been a cervical biopsy. And I awakened, you know, in the recovery, bleeding a lot. And they. I told an RN, I said, look, something's gone wrong. 59 years old, I can tell you something's gone wrong. I believe once you get home and lay down, you'll be fine. So three times I protested. Three times she told me just to go home and lay down. And I did. And once at home was getting worse and worse and worse, and I had a friend staying with me, and I told my friend, I said, call an ambulance. I'm bleeding to death. And ambulance came, took me to another hospital, a little ER that was actually not connected to a hospital, and they made more boo boos. And, you know, I used to tell this in front of live audiences. And when I would tell the part where they gave me a morphine derivative as a drug, you know, I don't know why, but they did, everyone in the audience gasped. Because when a patient presents with dropping blood pressure and profuse bleeding, morphine depresses it further. Yeah.
- [18:21]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I was like, I even know that, like, you don't give someone who's bleeding. Why don't you just get a whole bunch of aspirin while you're at it? I mean.
- [18:29]
Rosemary Thornton
I mean, seriously does kind of grease this kids to the afterlife, you know?
- [18:33]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I mean, you want to go faster? Here's some more fenos. Just slow you right. You guys go right down. Exactly.
- [18:38]
Ryan Seacrest
Wow.
- [18:39]
Rosemary Thornton
And I had never been in an ambulance. And I get into the CR and this very kind RN about my age is attending to me. And I was so frightened because now I've made a decision, okay, I'm. I'm gonna live. You know, I've. I've agreed to go to the hospital. And I grabbed this RN's hand and I said, promise me you're not going to let me die. And she was so Compassionate and so motherly. And she grabbed my hand, she squeezed it and got right in my face very, very sweetly, almost as a mother consoling a child, and said, oh, honey, we're not going to let you die. We have many solutions for this. And then they gave me the morphine derivative, and away I went. And the thing is, to the onlooker, it was a pretty peaceful passing. And in my experience, what I was experiencing, the thing is, it after they gave me that Dilaudid, I don't know, the time, my friend was at my side. I'm on this gurney in a little cubicle in an er. My friend said that after they gave me the Dilaudid, I just passed right out. And, you know, the thing about that, it was actually Dilaudid morphine derivative. The thing about that is I didn't have much blood volume at that point. So that Dilaudid, you know, I don't know technically if I bled to death or if the Dilaudid was just the final blow to my little heart. It's going, I need fluids, I need.
- [19:59]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Fluid, and you're giving me morphine.
- [20:02]
Rosemary Thornton
That's right. Let's finish her off. But my friend said he looked at the blood pressure cuff, which is, you know, inflating and deflating automatically, and the medical staff have left the room. And he said at one point, it said, 35 over or 33 over 25, as my blood. Blood pressure well, which just mean you're on your way out. And he stood up to go get help because I, you know, she's dying. And as he did, my eyes popped open. I don't remember this. But he said, you reached your hands up to heaven and, you know, wiggled your fingers almost like a child reaching for a parent and said something. And he said. He got up and stood over me and looked right in my face, and he said, you looked right through me. You were talking to somebody that you could see and nobody else could. And, you know, there's a term for this. It's called terminal lucidity. Have you heard of that?
- [20:48]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yes, I have.
- [20:50]
Rosemary Thornton
Often at the very end of life, we get a burst of energy.
- [20:52]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yeah, there's. I've spoken to a few hospice doctors who studied and at the end of life and that just to see what happens to people as they're going. And there's just that moment, they just come up and they'll say something. And if you're. If in hospice, it's a lot, a little bit longer time for that so they could see what's happening in dreams and people talking and who comes to you, and they'll say things, but, yeah, at the very moment you're like, it happens. And then you. And then you're done.
- [21:23]
Rosemary Thornton
Next was I. I fell back on the gurney. I'd been trying to sit up, which is pretty impressive for somebody with a blood pressure of 33 over 25. But I. I fell back on the gurney. And he said, and then you just went real still. And meanwhile, I was having the time of my life. I felt myself awakening from what seemed like a deep, dreamless state. And, man, I was catapulted out of this body. And I mean, catapulted like toast out of a toaster. And I went flying off. And I remember thinking. I remember thinking about all those NDE books, but. But also there was just a knowing. And I knew that I had died. And the first words out of my mouth in this new experience were, my heart has stopped. And then I thought, how do I know that? I thought, I don't know, but I know that's right. And I was floating away in blackness. A lot of people say, could you see your body? No, I couldn't see my body. And I really think that's God's merc. Because I learned later, my friend, the medical staff did come rushing in when they heard the blood pressure alarm going off. And he said. They ushered him outside into the, you know, wait outside the little room and brought a crash cart in. He said, actually, it was kind of funny. Their nurse came running into the room first, and he said, she did a sternal rub. Have you heard of that? Where they take their knuckles and rake them over your sternum? Yeah, it's. It elicits a pain response. If there's any life at all. You'll. You'll wiggle or jolt or something. But he said, she did that for a minute and nothing. And he said. And then she. She went over to the blood pressure cuff machine and checked the plug at the outlet, like, well, this thing isn't working. It looks like she's dead. Wow. And then, you know, jostled the machine a little bit.
- [23:06]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Like, kidda, put some aluminum foil at the top to make sure you got the reception kind of thing. Well, okay. So.
- [23:13]
LifeLock Commercial Voice
All right.
- [23:14]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
So. So other than the. The ridiculousness that's going on in your room as you're dying or dead, what happened when you got catapulted out?
- [23:23]
Rosemary Thornton
It was so fun. It was such a great time. I was catapulted very dramatically and that. And that was my first Thought was, my heart has stopped. And then as I'm floating in this perfect blackness and I hear a lot of people talk about the love they feel, I would say the predominant emotion I felt was peace. In fact, I, as a writer, I've always had high anxiety, you know, and I do overthink everything and just a little bit nervous all the time and a little bit neurotic, I might say. And I thought, this is the most perfect peace I've ever experienced. And I thought about that Bible verse, the peace that passeth all understanding shall keep your hearts and minds through Jesus Christ. And I thought, this is that peace. This is what Paul was talking about, is perfect peace that no words could ever describe. So I felt this piece. And then my next thought was, you're dying. And then being the ever appropriate writer, I thought, actually, you're not dying, you're dead. Because when you're floating on to your reward, getting the tense right is very important. And I thought that was funny. And I laughed out loud because I thought, here you are, dead unexpectedly, I might add. And dealing with grammar, away from your body and dealing with grammar. And the beauty part is I thought it was so funny and I laughed out loud and I heard my funny little giggle. And I thought, okay, I don't have breath sounds, don't have vocal cords. I don't think, don't know about ears. And yet I'm producing sound and I sound just like I've always sounded. And I started life in broadcasting. I might. I have a. I actually have training in broadcasting, so I know what I sound like. And I thought, this is great. Everything I am has gone with me. My macabre, goofy sense of humor, my silly little giggle, the sound of my voice. And I thought, what did I leave on that gurney? And I realized the fear, the anxiety, the worries, the woe, everything negative was what I left behind. And what went with me was me, who I really am.
- [25:15]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [25:20]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends. But my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin, thanks to skyrizi risen Kizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy with Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year after two starter doses.
- [25:47]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [26:00]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi. There's nothing on my skin and that means everything.
- [26:04]
Rosemary Thornton
Nothing is everything.
- [26:07]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [26:18]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family. Now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddler's Diapers, Pampers Cruisers Diapers and Similac Powder formulas and save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [26:52]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the.
- [26:55]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Interesting so where did you go next?
- [26:57]
Rosemary Thornton
And that was very comforting, by the way. That was very comforting to know that everything I really am went with me. This floating went on for some time and at some point in this blackness as I'm still floating further and further away. And the thing is, I had always had this inherent fear of the dark. And I remember thinking, I'm in pitch black. I mean, you know, kind of came see your hand in front of you, and I thought, yet I'm not afraid. So maybe I'm not really afraid of the dark. And very early on in this experience, I felt a massive presence join me. And I mean massive. And he was, he, she was to my left and much taller than me. And I turned my head up and looked to the left to see him, her. And I thought, this is interesting. I'm turning my head to the left to look over my left shoulder. And I thought, so I have some sort of form, you know, I'm not just some ethereal spirit floating away. But I turned and I'm smiling because I'm like, wow, this is so much fun. All these ND ebooks I read, nobody told me how much, much fun this is, how just good you feel, how happy you are, how relieved, how relieved. And so I asked this massive spiritual being, I said, literally with a happy smile, I said, and who are you? And the answer was before, again, before I could even finish the sentence, the question. The answer was immediate. You are the image and likeness. I'm the original. I was like, Whoa, that's Genesis 1:25 and 26. You know, we're made. The image and likeness of God. My whole life, if I had to have one Bible verse that I never quite understood and always wanted to understand better, that would be that. I think that's what I get. How cool is that? How great is that? There's an original. So this went on, and in some point, he's still floating in this blackness. I felt the presence of what you might call spiritual beings or angels, but it was. They were welcoming me home. And it wasn't with words, but it was with a feeling like. Like, she's back. She's back. We're so glad you're back. And if I could summon up the. Sum up the entire experience in three words, it would actually be pretty easy, but it would be, welcome home, dearie. You know, my whole life I've been a weirdo and an oddball. I've just been that kid that. From the playground to career life just different, you know? But it was like these people got me and they were so glad I was back home. So glad. And that was so comforting that I. I was with my tribe, you know, and it was like they were saying, we know this was a hard one, but you're back. And I. I don't know, it's just so. So comforting. Comforting is the word, you know. Irma Bombeck once wrote an entire essay on the word comfort and comfortable. She said, it's become a word we don't use much, but comfort is the. Is a great word. So a lot of things happened to me in this experience. One of them was, while I'm still floating away in this blackness, I remember thinking, I've had this experience before, like, even in this lifetime. I've been through this before somehow. And one of the spiritual beings with me said, remember your mom told you you were given up for dead as an infant? I was 3 weeks old and I contracted a disease. And the doctors sent my mom home and said, this baby's dead. She's not gonna survive another couple hours. And yet the next morning, my mom went home and prayed that night. And the next morning when she came back in a nun Catholic hospital. But a nun handed me over to my mom and said, this baby isn't better. She's healed. So the angels in this experience said, you didn't almost die that night. You crossed over then and you were sent back. And I thought, that explains why I've been a weirdo my whole life, you know, I mean, I remember when people would die and I'd say, oh, did you see. Did you see our aunt just walk through? She's gone to heaven. She stopped through. And they were. My mom, God bless her, would say, you didn't see that, and you're not going to talk about that anymore. So you learn early on to shut up. You know, you learn early on to be quiet. So this was all kind of explained to me. And I do remember a predominant feeling because I was scheduled to start chemotherapy and radiation. It was. Let me get this right, it was once a week chemo, and it was five times a week radiation. And I hadn't been in to get the, you know, the tattoos yet for the radiation, but I was supposed to start the. The chemo tutorial and then start chemo. And I remember thinking, don't need to worry about that anymore, do I?
- [31:22]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Well, I mean, when you die, it kind of knocks out your itinerary here down on earth without question. So when you're.
- [31:31]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
When you're up.
- [31:31]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
When you're up there, did you.
- [31:33]
Rosemary Thornton
Did.
- [31:33]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Did you. Did the. Did God listen to you or did you have a life review?
- [31:41]
Rosemary Thornton
No life review, which was great. And I. The thing is, I could remember because my background is architectural history, you know, And I had a friend, a really good friend, who is a licensed architect, and when I showed him the home I was buying on the east coast, he said, I don't think you ought to buy that home. And I said, why? And he said, well, because there's no way to get a gurney in the front door. It was a cool house, had a massive fireplace right by the front door. And he said, there's no way to get a gurney in that house. And I was like, oh, I'm never going to need a gurney, you know, blah, blah, blah. Well, I remembered in this death experience the fireman trying to get a gurney in the house, and they couldn't. They couldn't get it up the stairs and around the corner. But I remembered I didn't have a life review. But I remember those firemen trying so hard because I was still conscious when I was taken out of the house. I remember I'm trying so hard to be helpful. And I thought, wow, they showed me so much love, you know, a total stranger. And I thought about how much love they showed me. But my predominant feeling, really and truly, was that I got early release for good behavior. I felt like I'd been. Somebody opened the prison doors and let me out. I did not Want to go back? And this, this just went on and on. And I mean, I read a book about it because it was pretty detailed experience. And then at some point, I don't remember the transition, but at some point I'm no longer floating, but I'm in a white room room. And I'm. I'm on my feet now. I'm no longer floating, but I'm on my feet in this perfect white room. And about 15 to 20ft in front of me is the door. And it was shut. I remember being a little disappointed that the door was shut because I thought, hey, I'm supposed to go through that door. And I. That door ought to be open for me. But as I'm walking through this white room and it was perfect white and I observed that there were no light fixtures, no traditional light fixtures. It was just illuminated from within, you know, because I'm looking for sconces. But I had a spiritual being or an angel with me at this point. And I asked one. There was this mist or fog in the room, and I asked about that. It was very. It was not just falling, it was encircling and very busy mist around me. And I asked the angelic being with me, I said, I feel like ought to be able to focus on one of the individual droplets. And the angelic being said, your eyes are not acclimated to this new environment yet, so you can't see it. But what you're seeing, these are particles of light. And that when we go to heaven, we have to be cleansed of the muck. And that was the word that was used, the muck of earth, which is a word I just don't use much in everyday language, you know, but that the muck and the denseness and the heaviness of earth has to be washed. And this was like most akin to a spiritual car wash. And as my friend said, leave your muddy boots at the door. We don't go to heaven with the, the heaviness of earth. And the other thing that was explained to me very clearly was we have a spiritual identity. And sometimes we get so accustomed to these physical disease process that we think, you know, like, I am a diabetic, I have hepatitis, I have this. We. We identify with the disease. And that the purpose of this was to. To strip that away and say, no, no, no, that's not your identity. Your real identity is spiritual child of God. That's who you really are. And so that's. It's kind of a reminder. And the other thing, somewhere, as I'M walking because I see that door and I think, okay, I know the gig. I everybody out of my way. I'm doing the door. You know, there wasn't like, oh, what should I do? I'm like, clear path, 59 years old, time served, let me out. And as I'm doing that, one of the messages that was very clearly conveyed to me, and I don't know at what juncture, because, you know, we want a timeline, we want a chronology. You know, this happened first and this happened in the middle, and this happened in the end. But Einstein said, to those of us who are committed physicists, the past, present and future are only illusion, however persistent. So while it looks to me like this thing happened and then this and this, it's really hard to say. But at some point in that white room, I was told that if I agreed to go, or if I ended up going, not agreed, but if I ended up going back, that I would be restored to wholeness. And it wasn't said that you'll be healed of the grief, you'll be healed of this disease, but you'll be restored to wholeness. And. And so I get to the door and I'm so grateful that I'm at the door and I don't even know by. I remember thinking when I'm first in this white room and see the door 15 to 20ft ahead, I remember thinking, I don't know if I have legs, but I know if I have an intention I can perambulate toward that door, which now cracks me up, that I'd use the word perambulate. You know, I think walk would have done, but I didn't know. And I'm so disappointed that I didn't look down at my feet, my legs, my hands to see I look like. But I've heard that from other people who've had this experience. So I get to the door.
- [36:26]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [36:31]
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- [36:59]
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- [37:11]
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- [37:29]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Flu season is here and the in store pharmacy has you covered with a free flu shot with most insurance plans. And as a thank you, get up to $20 off your grocery purchase. Plus it's cough and cold season. Stock up on all the season's essentials and get ready for relief with discounts on items like Mucinex, Children's Multi Symptom cold medicine, Zara B's children's cough syrup and Emergen C. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply and offers may vary by location. Visit Albertsons or Safeway.com for more details.
- [38:04]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the show.
- [38:08]
Rosemary Thornton
And I go to put my right hand up to move through the door and pretty interested by the fact right handed on earth and right handed in heaven, you know, still that that's part of my identity. But I paused and I asked the angel that was with me or spiritual being, whatever I said, is this the divine will for my life? And what I was going to say, is this the divine will for my life that a medical mistake sends me onto my reward? And before I could even get is this the divine? The answer was again, immediate. And the answer was no, no. But whatever you decide, you go with all God's blessings and mercy and grace and love and care. And that was the answer to that third prayer or the second prayer that I can't handle any more decisions. I mean, this is a pretty big decision. Decide if you go to heaven or stay on earth. And I was told it's okay. And one of the things, one of the takeaways for me on this is if we are trying to do good, if we are trying to do the will of God, we're not going to make a wrong decision. Because even if we take the long way around the barn, you know we're going to end up back where we need to be. And I guess it's been such a blessing to me when I'm faced with a hard decision, I think, oh, what do I do? What do I do? And I think just listen, listen to God and the angels and you're even if you get it wrong, God can help you navigate out back out to the right path. So that was. The answer is no. Yeah. But whatever you decide to do, you go with all the blessings. And so I thought, all right, I'm going. I'm done with this earth. I am so over this. Because one of the things about being the suicide survivor, as we are known, is that you become a 21st century leper. Nobody wants to be near you. You're scary. You know, I can't tell you how many people at the visitation walked past the casket and said. I mean, closed casket, of course. And said things to me like, I just lay down and die if anything ever happened to my Bobby. Like, oh, you're right. I didn't love my husband as much as you love him. Got it.
- [40:13]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
They have no idea what to say. They have no idea what to say or do.
- [40:16]
Rosemary Thornton
They stay amongst it.
- [40:18]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And it's also. And it's also I've had. I've talked to so many people who've gone through what you've gone through, and then also losing children and. And, you know, and these are pains that you can't quantify. It's something you cannot express or quantify. And people who have children or have a spouse, they automatically go to, like, what would happen if that happened to me? And then they just get scared and they have no idea what to say. And then they say something wrong. You know, like what I was talking. I was talking to a trauma survivor the other day, and he'. Like, yeah, they would just come in. They're like, ah, just get over it. Like, I'm like, yeah, like. Because they just truly have no arsenal of what to say to somebody who has gone through that. So sometimes that, you know, they try. Sometimes they're just like, I don't want.
- [41:05]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
To deal with you.
- [41:05]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Can you just move on?
- [41:07]
Rosemary Thornton
Like, all that. I know. And all that stuff they say, it became clear to me fairly early on in this process. All that stuff they say is for their comfort. Hurt.
- [41:15]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
Correct.
- [41:16]
Rosemary Thornton
Make themselves comfortable. Yes. And there's a guy who does grief counseling online who lost a beautiful teenage daughter to disease. I think it was the flu or something. But somebody actually said to him, if he hadn't gone, if you hadn't given her that cough syrup, she'd probably still be alive. They're not saying that to comfort him. They're saying that because they think, oh, I'll make sure I don't make that mistake. And the thing, the one thing I will not answer on a Podcast. There's a couple, but one is, why did he do this? You know what? Doesn't matter. It's done. He's dead. He's gone. And the end. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I had one podcaster I threatened to disconnect on because he was like, it's important to know. And I'm like, no, you know what? That's Kim. Oh, wait. He's dead.
- [42:01]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Horrible question to ask.
- [42:04]
Rosemary Thornton
My God, I'm prepared for it now. I'm ready.
- [42:08]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Kidding me? That's irrelevant to the. To the story. I mean, it truly is irrelevant to just. I'm a filmmaker, so as a filmmaker and a screenwriter, you kind of like, doesn't matter. It's called a MacGuffin. Like, it's like. It's just the point. It's point of what moves the story forward in a narrative standpoint. So I would never ask a question like that. Just as another human being like, what? What are you talking about?
- [42:36]
Rosemary Thornton
So amazing.
- [42:37]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
So you're in the room.
- [42:38]
Rosemary Thornton
Tell you what, I was gonna say. Yeah. And I get to the door, and I'm ready to push through. And, you know, whatever you decide, you'll be richly blessed. I'm like, cool. I'm out of here. You know, have to ask me twice.
- [42:47]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
You gave me the get out of.
- [42:48]
Rosemary Thornton
Jail card time ago.
- [42:49]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yes.
- [42:50]
Rosemary Thornton
Right. And then. And then I am shown a scene, and to say it was people. I tried to call it a vision. I realized people are misinterpreting that. Like, you know, I had some dream in heaven. But what happened was I was in a room, like, kind of mentally in this asylum observer in a room where this nurse who'd shown me such kindness is sitting on a little metal stool, and she's surrounded by linens and hospital supplies and everything. She's in this little quiet supply room, and she's leaning forward on the stool, head in her hand, sobbing, uncontroll. And I'm watching this. I'm like a silent observer. And it wasn't just a vision. I was in the room with this woman, you know, and this was a potential future. This wasn't happening because they're busy trying to get my heart going again, you know? But she's sobbing, and through her tears, I hear her say, I promised that woman I wasn't going to let her die. And I lost her. And I was like, oh, come on. This isn't fair. She looks to be about my age. She's 59. She's lost people before. She'll get over it. You know, life Goes on. And then. And then I didn't just observe her, but I felt that pain, I guess, in the solar plexus, that grief, that deep, haunting grief and regret and despair and self recrimination, all the rest of it. And I recognize that it's the same thing I'd felt because the last conversation I had with my husband before he did this was over the phone. We had a. An argument that he started, which I've learned, by the way, for all suicide survivors, that's very common woman. It's like they have to get their angst up to go through with the act, sure. But I felt that same angst with her. And I remember thinking, if I can spare one human being that much suffering, I think I have to go back. And, you know, the. The moral of the story is God knows his empaths. God knows how to get us. You know, there you go. So sure.
- [44:36]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And then I was, so what happened? So what happened after you made this.
- [44:39]
Rosemary Thornton
So cool is in a millisecond, I was. There was no backwards whoosh. There was no, you know, there was no rolling back size back in that body in that er. And I was. I opened my eyes, I'm like, wait a second. And I remember being pretty tick because I thought I died. That was a lot of energy involved to die. And I remember there was an angel in the upper left hand corner of the room, just like a being of light. Sounds crazy, but it was like an energy ball of light. And I could see that angel up there. And I said, mentally, I said to the angel, hey, I was Robert's rules of orders. We had a first, we didn't have a second, and we certainly didn't have a discussion phase. I don't remember agreeing to this. And the angel just kind of. Angels aren't real good about answering questions. The angel just kind of looked at me, said, hi, you're back. And very early on, I don't know the precise timing because I, you know, I had bled to death. Your brain activity slows a little bit when it doesn't have any blood or oxygen. But that nurse was back in my face. I think it was the same nurse. But, you know, my eyes are open like, whoa, whoa, whoa. And the nurse says, what is your name? And I said, rosemary. And she said, what year is it? I said, 2018. And she said, where are you? And I said, a crummy excuse for an er. But she kind of took umbrage at that. And she goes, have, you know, this is an accredited facility so loaded that's amazing because the thing is, the thing that's really cool is I was dead, well, more than 10, 10 minutes.
- [46:09]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And so you were clinically. So you were clinically dead.
- [46:12]
Rosemary Thornton
You were out for more than 10 minutes. And I didn't find out about that till the next day at the hospital where they explained to me, yeah, your heart stopped. So that that was correct. I mean, I have documented medical evidence. My heart did indeed stop, but I was gone for more than 10 minutes. And the thing is, I interviewed, to write my book, I interviewed a lot of medical personnel. When, when you bleed to death that so much that you. Your heart stops beating because it's just a pump, you know, ran out of fluid. They plug the leak, refill the tank and restart the heart. That's the order in which they do things. They cannot do CPR on somebody who's bled to death because it just forces more blood out of the system. So I was well more than 10 minutes with no blood supply to the brain. So when that nurse said, what is your name? I actually interviewed an anesthesiologist about this because they have to make. They have to. Doctors often make decisions about bringing somebody back where it's been too long. And he cried when I told him the story. When the nurse said, what is your name? And all that. That. And I said, why are you becoming emotional? And he said, you have no idea how relieved the medical staff was when you responded intelligently to their questions. Because when you bring somebody back after five minutes, it's an iffy proposition. You don't know. The belief is that after five to six minutes there'll be substantial brain death. And there wasn't. In fact, I think I got a serious upgrade. As my friend Brian says, I didn't come back as Rosemary V2. I came back as Rosemary V27. But they loaded me in an ambulance pretty quick. You know, when you died little we are. They can't be like, oh, away you.
- [47:41]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Go, get out of here, get out of here.
- [47:44]
Rosemary Thornton
Yeah. And then in the ambulance, they were afraid I died too. And I was taken to a trauma center. And there I was there for several days. And my friend who observed this, he had been a Vietnam era medic. And he said, because he didn't see me again until they wheeled me out to the ambulance. And he said, you've heard the expression white as a sheet. He said, you were literally white as a sheet. And he said, but your lips were dark blue and under your eyes was dark blue. Blue. So it was a pretty profound experience. And Then I was at the hospital for several days and they took good care of me and I was sent home and I wasn't really ready to go home because, you know, in the hospital they bring you applesauce and jello and drinks and you say, I think I'd like a cranberry juice now. And boy, it's right there.
- [48:26]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [48:30]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA, a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy. With Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year. After two starter doses.
- [48:58]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [49:10]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Guy Rizzi to learn more.
- [49:29]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Flu season is here and the in store pharmacy has you covered with a free flu shot with most insurance plans. And as a thank you, get up to $20 off your grocery purchase. Plus it's cough and cold season. Stock up on all the season's essentials and get ready for relief with discounts on items like Mucinex, Children's Multi symptom, cold medicine, Zara Bees, Children's cough syrup and Emergency offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply and offers may vary by loc. Visit Albertsons or Safeway.com for more details.
- [50:04]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the show.
- [50:07]
Rosemary Thornton
But the doctor came in and that was the other interesting experience. After you bleed to death in a big corporate hospital, you get the doctor that's been around a while. You don't get the doctor that you know might make a boo boo here and there. You get the doctor's been around, he was very kind and he's the one who explained to me me that they thought I would have substantial heart damage because of the severity of my heart attack, which is technically what I died from was a heart attack. But I said, no, no, no, don't need to worry about that. The angel said if I agreed to come back, I'd be whole. Whole and fine. Fine and whole. And they still wheel you off for all the little tests, you know. And the doctor. I remember every morning that nice, lovely doctor would sit down at my bedside and say, Mrs. Thornton, you're a very lucky woman. There's no damage to your heart whatsoever. In fact, your heart's very healthy. Which did not. Not correlate with the first blood test that showed I'd had substantial heart damage from elevated enzymes. So this went on and on, and they sent me home, not because it was time to send me home, but they said my white blood cell count was so low from having bled out that I was. Well, the way the doctor explained it, which was very thoughtful, he said, if you pick up an opportunistic infection from the hospital, he said, we won't be able to save you. So I was like, oh, I guess away we go. And then it took some time. I had to find another doctor. I went back to the original oncologist where I. I supposed to start the chemotherapy, and he said, you're. You're. We're having our tutorial on Monday, and then a few days after that, we'll start you on the chemo, you know, a few days after you've recovered from this ordeal. And I said, well, actually, I was healed in heaven. And I was told if I agreed come back, I'd be healed. And they, you know, they do this portal thing where they make your chart online, make your chart available online. He put in my chart. I was mentally ill, so I had to go find another oncologist in another part of the state. Oncologist was a lot more interested in the fact that I had bled to death from a cervical biopsy than I was healed in heaven. It's all good news. But I did want an affirmation, you know, I wanted to be sure. And that second oncologist was very kind and very thorough. And there was another surgery, and she took lots of flesh from a lot of places and had it checked by multiple. What do you call the people who do those biopsies? The lab people. Anyway, multiple people people and even had them present in the operating room and sent off samples, blah, blah, blah. But she. It all came back. In fact, what she told me, she said is not only do you not have one cell of cancer anywhere that we've looked, she said, but your flesh is so pink and pretty and perfect. I wouldn't believe you'd ever had cancer had I not seen the original test. Because I don't know if you know. So once you get diagnosed with something like this, there's MRIs with contrast, MRIs without contrast, pet scans, physical exams. And at the first doctor, I mean, the re, the thing that started all this is a lot of physical symptoms, a lot of very disturbing physical symptoms. And you know, I've already had people say all the usual stuff. Oh, you never had cancer to begin with? Well, that's not what three doctors said. You know, actually it's two doctors and a, what do they call that? A nurse practitioner. It was visible upon examination. And why would three people lie at three different offices? You know, so it's funny, people come up with all these excuses, you know, Occam's razor. The simplest solution is usually the right one. Oh yeah, people. Because people can't believe that we're spiritual beings.
- [53:35]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
So that brings me to my next question. So I, I, as you know, I have spoken to, I think, nearly a hundred near death experiencers at this point in my show. And a lot of times people, you know, the constant of, oh, they were just dreaming. Oh, it's some sort of liquid that went off in their head when you're dying, all this kind of stuff. Or for the skeptic who's watching right now, because you actually are interesting, because one, you had admitted to being a near death experience, you know, enjoying those stories. So you have had an obscene amount of these stories in your mind already. One, two, you're a professional writer on top of this. You're unique. I've never had that happen before. So for everyone listening who might be questioning the validity of this experience, what would you say to them? Because you, I mean, on a, on a logical standpoint, you understand where I'm coming from, right?
- [54:35]
Rosemary Thornton
Oh, I do, I do. And my favorite is when people say she's just in it for the money.
- [54:39]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Of course, she wrote millions, right? You get millions, don't you?
- [54:44]
Rosemary Thornton
From the books?
- [54:45]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Millions.
- [54:45]
Rosemary Thornton
These people. I have a co author who wrote a couple architectural books with me and we, we repeat that line and laugh ourselves silly. Yeah, oh yeah, we're in it for the money. How much did we lose on that second book? Oh, we only lost five grand on that one. That one wasn't too bad.
- [55:02]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
That's the thing that everyone thinks I've published books. And I know, like you make, look, if you self publish, you make some money, if you're smart and you have an audience Audience. But no one's retiring on it.
- [55:15]
Rosemary Thornton
Publish picture books? No, no.
- [55:17]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Oh no, no. Picture books are way too expensive to publish yourself. So that's the thing. Yeah, people always use that excuse. Unless your last name is King Patterson or Rolling, you're not gonna get a super rich off of these things. Generally speaking. Generally speaking.
- [55:31]
Rosemary Thornton
Well, and the other thing is, you know, the, the urine for the money. I love that one because one I had, it was actually involved two mega hospitals, corporate owned mega hospitals were involved in the killing of Rosemary. You know, if I was in it for the money, I would have sued them to kingdom come and I probably would have gotten a fair settlement. But I, I chose not to sue because when you sue somebody, you're declaring war on an individual. And I didn't want that. I wanted peace. And the second thing, when I was being loaded into that ambulance to be transported from the little ER to the trauma center, I remember thinking, wow, my whole life I spent reading about NDEs and this was nothing like any of them. I never heard about a white room. Now subsequently I've got a lot of emails from people saying I went to a white room too.
- [56:24]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I've heard we've had, yeah, we've had a couple of white rooms, but not like yours.
- [56:28]
Rosemary Thornton
But to the scoffers, I say, if I was going to write a book about this, I would follow the traditional patterns. I would not come up with all this crazy, you know, not so much love, but peace floating away, perambulate white room. I would have stayed truer to the original. And then the other thing, you know, this is just the brain shutting down. I hear that a lot. Okay. When I died, I had stage 2 cancer visible upon physical exam. When I came back, it was gone. Now that's not the brain shutting down. That's something divine. That's something spiritual, ritual.
- [57:02]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And then that's when people say, oh, well, you didn't have cancer originally. And oh, there must have this, right? Because it's, it's so fascinating. It's fascinating when I, because I hear this all the time because of the people I interview with. I interview near death experiencers, channelers, even spiritual gurus. And, and when they talk about miraculous stuff, they, people just like, they don't know how to talk to you because you're a suicide survivor. The same thing is like, they don't know how to talk to you. You, if this exists in the world because it completely disrupts their paradigm, their programming, to the point where like, well, wait a minute, if there is a heaven Then that means, wait a minute. Oh, and, and they start short circuiting. So either they attack you or they come up with something to make themselves feel better so they can go to sleep at night. So like I can't live in a world where there are near death experiences because if that world exists, that means that there's bigger things in the world that I'm really not who I am. And, and it just starts to spot. You start going down a rabbit hole, hole of all of these things that just. Your foundation is disrupted. So that's why I think do that so much.
- [58:06]
Rosemary Thornton
And one of the things that happened, and I remember this so clearly, I. I've read in multiple places people say when they had an nde, it was like waking up from a dream. You know, when you die, it's like. And that was my experience when I, when I was floating away from my body, initially catapulted out of my body. I remember thinking, well, that 59 years sure went by in a flash. And I was like, this is reality. This experience I'm in now. You know, floating away from my body is reality. It really was like waking up from an intense dream. And I mean, that's the best description I can come up with. But the scoffers, I've had so many scoffers. And I get the emails too. I get either, you know, spawn of Satan.
- [58:47]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Oh, obviously this is demonic work. Yeah, demonic work. Obviously. That's, that's a, that's a go to do. You're possessed. Demons work. You can imagine when I have a channel on and they channel someone live on my show, they're like, that's the devil. I'm like, obviously it's the devil. He's just talking about peace and love.
- [59:03]
Rosemary Thornton
Talks about, right. The Bible talks about the fruit of the spirit. What have I done with my life? I sold off all my personal possessions. I saw. I had a fancy new shiny car. I bought, I sold it. I bought a used Prius. C. I don't know if you're familiar with the Prius. Oh, I know. Look like a Cadillac. I got rid of most of my possessions, pretty much all of my furniture, and I moved a thousand miles due west of the Midwest because I like to watch corn grow. People laugh at that. I put it on my match.com profile, let's just say my online dating profile. And I like to watch corn grow. I literally love it. You ever really watch corn? It's fascinating.
- [59:41]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
It is a pretty. I've actually not sat and watched it, but it is a pretty Interesting crop from where it starts to where it grows up to pretty quickly. It's pretty awesome.
- [59:50]
Rosemary Thornton
Yes it is. I mean take it's little itty bitty seed.
- [59:55]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [60:00]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day as sand, salt water and friends. But my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to skyrizi risen Kizumab RZA a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy. With Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year. After two starter doses.
- [60:27]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [60:39]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi. There's nothing on my skin and that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [60:58]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your fav baby care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers, Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddler's Diapers, Pampers Cruisers Diapers and Similac powder formulas. And save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [61:32]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the show.
- [61:36]
Rosemary Thornton
And it's shoved into the ground. You know, it's just trounced into the dirt and it looks like all hope is lost. And then they, they give it a little, a little fertilizer. You know, they put more poo on it. You know it's not enough to be trounced in the ground and now it gets poo on top of it and then it gets soaked and then it springs forth and I just something about corn. I love watching things grow and I mean love. I mean this thing changed me a lot. Lot. It ch it. I had a, a neuroscientist travel from a nearby state to meet me and we went out, had a Lovely dinner together. And she said the reason she believes my story is not because of, you know, the cancer and it's gone and is. She said human beings are not hardwired to change that quickly. The brain just doesn't switch from this way to that way in an instant. She said, but you did. Something profound happened to me, to you. To go from one this deep grief and the thing I was told in heaven about my husband's death, and this is probably the most important, which I, you know, tend to forget. But I was told that everything that had happened around his suicide and all that misery had been encapsulated, which is a very interesting word. And that's often what we use in architectural. Like if a house has a contaminant in it, you know, lead paint or other certain white asbestos. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't even like saying the word. But that's what they do. They'll often encapsulate it because the process of removal can release more contaminants into the air. In some cases, when they try to do this in school buildings, they have to destroy the school building because it's just releasing it everywhere. But I was told that this whole misery, which is what it was, have been encapsulated. And it was a thing and it had happened and it was there, but it couldn't hurt me anymore. And that was profound. That was explaining it to me in a way that I could understand. So that gave me so much peace. And I still cry over him and I still feel sad at times. But I'm not in the depths of hell anymore. You know, the Bible says, if I make my bed in hell, thou art there. I'd set up housekeeping in hell. I was just. I had settled into that and this experience said, you're not going to get to stay and have hell. You know, that's not. That's not what you're made for. That's not where you're supposed to live. So it. It took me out of hell. So the, the healing of the disease process is very important. But, you know, Psalm 23rd, Psalms 23 says, he restoreth my soul. My soul got rebooted, my soul got restored. That's the real healing. And the thing I just. I mean, this happened five years ago next month. This whole thing. The, the near death experience occurred. The thing I just thought about in the last six months because. Because this I don't remember anymore. But the experience continues to unfold. My body was on that gurney. It's my soul or my essence or My spirit that went to heaven. But that's where the healing happened. And when I went back to my body, the cancer was gone. So, I mean, it's not my body that got hauled up to heaven for a reboot. It was my. My consciousness, my spirit, my essence, my soul. So I really believe, and I get in a lot of trouble for saying this, too, but I really believe the next great frontier in medicine is going to be spiritual healing. I really do.
- [64:53]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
I understand what you're saying. Now, Rose, let me ask you. When you came back out of this and you had this experience, it seems that you did not have any issue psychologically dealing with what had happened. Did you come out of the closet, start talking to everybody? Hey, guys, you know, this is what happened.
- [65:12]
Ryan Seacrest
Did you.
- [65:12]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Did you keep it quiet for a while before you kind of came out? No, I didn't sound like it. You were like, I've been waiting for this for a while. I want to talk to everybody.
- [65:22]
Rosemary Thornton
But I don't care if you listen.
- [65:23]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Or not, because a lot of people hold on to it for a decade sometimes because they can't process it. You seem to have been able to process this experience in that sense very, very easily. And you start yapping about it to everybody who would listen.
- [65:40]
Rosemary Thornton
Well, in fact, several people said, you're going to write a book about it. I said, I've writt nine. Not going to be a tenth. You know, I'll share the story with people that it will help and bless, but there will be no 10th book. We are cooked and done on this book business. But, yeah, I couldn't. I couldn't shut up. You know, I couldn't shut. And that is a neophyte mistake. You know, we all do that. And then I learned to be more circumspect. And then I did write the book, but I didn't write the book until I was sitting in church about six months afterwards. And I know this sounds crazy, but an angel appeared to me at the end of the pew and said, hey, where's the book? I mean, I thought the angels be love and light and grace and gentleness. Yeah. And he was dressed like a warrior. You know, the sword and the. The. The. The fancy warrior armor. What do you call it? The protect. Yeah, the armor. Thank you. And he was like, hey, stop worrying about your pride and your physical. Because I'd been having a tummy ache for several days. He said, stop worrying about your stomach and your pride. Write that book. I was like, okay. So I went home and started on the book. But yeah, I felt very directed. And you know, the book, the book is. I've had a lot of good comments. If you go to, you know, the world's number one bookseller, the reviews are either this book has, has helped me so much or she's from Satan. There's nothing in between. And you know what I get in the most trouble for is using a feminine pronoun to describe God. Now if, if I met the original in heaven in this experience, if I met the original original and I'm female, why can't I say that God might have feminine qualities? But that's what produces the most, the most email really. Well, you know why this in the book, my father abandoned the family. He was bad news, not a nice guy, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I think of God as father. I'm like, no thanks. I think of God as mother. I think, yeah, I can get by.
- [67:30]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Well, it's because Michelangelo did not paint a woman on the Sistine's chapel. It was an old white dude with a beard. And that's what everyone is holding on to. And also Charlton Heston is Moses. But, but that's just the images that you. It's. It stuck with us throughout history because of that. That's why Santa Claus looks the way Santa Claus does. But Santa Claus, St. Nick never looked like St. Nicholas, never looked like the Coca Cola. Literally the Coca Cola marketing budget thing that was created. Created. But it's really interesting. And again that's. That goes back to what I said earlier, is when you rock someone's foundation of their programming, it really. They fight, they slash out or they comfort themselves in by whatever. Oh, that couldn't this or that. Because. And that's what this show does, is a general statement. It challenges people's foundations so often that people who are ready for it tend to listen to it and people who are, aren't. It's the devil's work. It's the demons work. It's. It's funny too. Some, some of the stuff is hilarious. I read the comments. They're genius. Really good writers. Let me ask you, what is the biggest takeaway you got from this near death experience in your life?
- [68:47]
Rosemary Thornton
This sounds trite, but we do take things too seriously, you know, and, and we really are. My favorite story, St. John the Divine at the end of his life, you know, he knew Jesus, he walked with Jesus. He was the last surviving disciple who actually walked the earth with Jesus. People come up at the end of his life and say, what was it like? You know, walk with Jesus. Talking with Jesus, shores of Galileo, what was it really like? And he would only say five words to them. Have you ever heard this story? No matter what anybody said, what was like Jesus, what. What did he dress like? What were sandals like? Blah, blah, blah. He would only say five words. And the five words were, little children love one another. And I think that's what we're supposed to do, is we're just supposed to love. You know, it's so easy to judge. Judge comes from ego. Ago somebody told me years ago, ego stands for edging God out.
- [69:35]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yeah. Yeah, that's a great one.
- [69:37]
Rosemary Thornton
So I do think we are just supposed to be loving. And now when I see homeless people, how you see homeless people think, get a job. And now I see homeless people, and sometimes I just cry. And usually not usually. Sometimes I talk to them. I kind of listen for, you know, am I getting a message here? But every homeless person I've talked to lost somebody to suicide. I'm sure that's just the angels saying, hey, hey, hey, hey, you, you, you, you go talk to him.
- [70:00]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yeah, yeah. You're not the only one. Essentially, like, you can help somebody with what it's gone through. Now I'm going to ask you a few questions, ask all of my guests. Rose, what is your definition of living a fulfilled life?
- [70:12]
Rosemary Thornton
I don't know. When my kids were little. I have three girls. My kids were little. When I would send them off to school, I'd give them a kiss on the head and I. I'd say a prayer that God would help them realize their full potential. And I think that's what we're all supposed to do, is realize our full potential. I'm not sure the path is pathway. I think it's just listening and loving. I really do think we're supposed to love. Love, love, love to a fault, you know, if somebody loves. I just read a story, Fred. Oh, gosh, what's his name? I think his name is Fred Winter, a pastor. Fifteen years ago, not far from where I live, some crazy guy walked into his church and shot him and killed him. Now, on the face of it, that seems like such a tragedy, but. But maybe that was as a result of that, there's been a lot of awareness about Christianity and the problem of mental illness and all kinds of kinds of stuff. And we say, oh, no, what a tragedy. But what if, you know, what if that's just the gig? What if that's the cost of love as we have a few years shaved off our life? I think it's better than everybody being armed and chasing each other around the block with a knife.
- [71:23]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
- [71:28]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends. But my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Risankizumab RZA a prescription only 150mg injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or photography with Skyrizi. Most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free at four months. Skyrizi is just four doses a year after two starter doses.
- [71:56]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [72:08]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi. There's nothing on my skin and that means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [72:26]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year, don't forget about the little ones in the family. Now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby cash care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers, Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddlers, Diapers, Pampers Cruisers Diapers and Similac Powder formulas. And save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [73:00]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
And now back to the show.
- [73:04]
Rosemary Thornton
I guess what I'm saying, if. If I by loving somebody, if I love somebody and my life ends what the world might call prematurely, I'm okay with that. You know, I really am. Who's to say how long our life is supposed to be?
- [73:20]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Fair enough. If you had a chance to go back in time and talk to little Rose, what advice would you give her?
- [73:25]
Rosemary Thornton
Oh my gosh. These are toughies. You should have sent these in advance. Forgive yourself for not knowing what you didn't know. And be kind to yourself. Be gentler with yourself.
- [73:39]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Amen. And how do you define God?
- [73:45]
Rosemary Thornton
God. God is love. Love is God. And the also there's words. In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God Logos. You know, word. God loves words. You know, if You're a wordsmith man saying you got it going on. I think God loves words. And I think the biggest things, because some I've been having this thing about, you know, I'm. I'm aging, and I look in the mirror and I think and look at pictures like, oh, you're so old, you're not attractive. And then I think you're talking about God's creation. So I think we have to be real careful. The words we speak over ourselves.
- [74:23]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Yes, very much so.
- [74:25]
Rosemary Thornton
God is the Word, and words are God, and words are very powerful. Powerful.
- [74:30]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And finally, what is the ultimate purpose of life?
- [74:34]
Rosemary Thornton
Love. Love alone is life.
- [74:38]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And where can people find out more about you and your book? Books in general, but this book specific.
- [74:45]
Rosemary Thornton
And the others are about old houses. Who cares about that nonsense? Plus, they're all out of print now. My book is Remembering the Light, How Dying Save my. My Life. And I do talk a lot about suicide. Surviving it. Suicide. We're coming up to September, which is Suicide Prevention Month, which I personally eschew, because every time I hear about that, I think, you know, it's. It's the coulda, woulda, shoulda. If only I'd. If only I'd been there for my husband so he could talk out his troubles, he'd still be alive. Wrong. There is nothing I could have done to stop this, and there is nothing I could have done to make it happen. I believe with teens and young people, maybe we have a chance. Maybe sometimes, maybe we have a way to talk them out of it. But when a grown person decides to do this, we need to give the survivors a break and say, you know what? There's nothing you could have done. You did everything just right. My website is temporarydeath.com because I did not come near death. I did die. And my. Yeah, my book is Remembering the Light, How Dying Saved My Life.
- [75:43]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
And do you have any parting messages for the audience?
- [75:46]
Rosemary Thornton
No. I'm grateful for the opportunity and if you can contact me through my website. But. But the biggest parting message I would have is if you have survived the suicide of somebody you dearly loved, you know, it doesn't matter what you had to do to survive, but you learn how to live around it in time, and it does get better. Just, I think you learn how to live around that spot in your heart.
- [76:17]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Rosemary, thank you so much for being on the show and sharing your amazing, amazing journey with us. And I hope that this conversation helps a lot of people out there. So I appreciate you, my dear. Thank you.
- [76:28]
Next Level Soul Host (Alex Ferrari)
Thank you for spending this sacred time with us today. If you feel called to explore this conversation further, you'll find the show notes for this episode at nextlevelsoul.com forward/340 and if your soul is craving an even deeper journey, step into Next Level Soul tv, our streaming sanctuary for spiritual films, documentaries, original shows, guided meditations, channeling sessions, audiobooks and transformative teachings. It's a space created to support your awakening, your healing, and your return to the truth of who you really are. Begin your journey at NextLevelSoul TV. Until next time. Keep expanding, keep seeking and keep walking your path towards the next level of your soul.
- [77:24]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
My perfect day has sand, salt water and friends, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can take me out of the moment. Now I'm all in with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi Rizankizumab RZA a prescription only 150mg injection injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy with Skyrizi, most people saw 90% clearer skin and many were even 100% plaque free. At four months, Skyrizi is just four doses a year.
- [77:49]
Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice
After two starter doses, don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vents vaccines.
- [78:03]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Thanks to Skyrizi, there's nothing on my skin and that means everything is everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [78:22]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family. Now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby cash care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers, Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddlers, Diapers, Pampers, Cruisers Diapers and Similac Powder formulas and save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details. Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year. Don't forget about the little ones in the family. Now through January 27th. Shop in store and online and save $10 when you buy two or more of your favorite baby cash care items. Shop for items like Happy Baby Formula, Pampers Pure Diapers, Pampers Baby Wipes, Pampers, Swaddlers, Diapers, Pampers Cruisers Diapers and Similac Powder formulas. And save $10 when you buy two participating products. Offer ends January 27th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [79:23]
LifeLock Commercial Voice
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- [79:54]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
This is Julian Edelman from Dudes on Dudes with Gronk and Jewels. Sunday mornings I've got my Game Day.
- [80:01]
Rosemary Thornton
Ready Ritual coffee, Lucky socks and now.
- [80:05]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
New Morning Uncrustable Sandwiches. It's all about that 12 gram protein boost with the new Uncrustables Bright Eyed Berry or Up and Apple flavors.
- [80:16]
Rosemary Thornton
Bright Eye Berries got a feisty receiver.
- [80:20]
Skyrizi Commercial Voice
Energy up an apple.
- [80:22]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Your classic Do it all tight end, soft, pillowy, packed with protein and easy.
- [80:29]
Rosemary Thornton
To enough for Grunk to grab from the freezer.
- [80:32]
Podcast Interviewer (Julian Edelman)
Whether you're on the couch, driving to the tailgate or heading to the locker room, New Morning Uncrustable Sandwiches are the MVP of snacks.
- [80:45]
Rosemary Thornton
Your new Sunday kickoff ritual starts here with New Morning Uncrustable sandwiches packed with 12 grams of protein.