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Pilates Business Podcast
100 Locations in 14 Countries: The Systems, Strategy & Secrets Behind Strong Pilates' Global Growth with Michael Ramsey
00:34:26
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- [00:02]
A
Well, hi there. I'm Sarah Glanfield. I'm a business and marketing strategist just for boutique fitness studio owners like you. If you're ready to be inspired and make a bigger impact, you're in the right place. All you need are a few key strategies, the right mindset, and some support along the way. Join me as I share the real life insights that will help you grow a sustainable and profitable studio. This is the Pilates Business Podcast. Welcome back to the Pilates Business Podcast. I'm Saran. I'm the founder of Spring3 Studio Business Consulting. And this is where we help boutique fitness studio owners grow profitable, sustainable businesses without burning out. So if you love what you do, but you want to think more like a leader and a CEO, you're in the right place now. Today's guest is someone who has built one of the fastest growing Pilates concepts in the world. Michael Ramsey is the co founder and director of Strong Pilates. It's a global fitness brand that combines Pilates and strength training into a workout that is high intensity and low impact. And it's really adding and evolving the category. Since launching in 2019, Strong has grown to 100 studios across 14 countries and has over 155 planned in the US alone. He has a background in marketing and has owned six very successful F45 franchises. And so Michael really understands what it takes to build, yes, a great workout experience, but also a scalable business. Today he oversees the global operations for Strong and leads the international expansion. And I'm absolutely thrilled to welcome you to the show. Michael, thank you so much for joining us today.
- [02:01]
B
Thanks so much for having me. That was a fantastic introduction. So thank you.
- [02:06]
A
Always, always. Welcome, welcome, welcome. So, so many questions I want to ask you today. So many different directions we can go in, but why don't we kick off and let us know and talk through a little bit about the strong Pilates concept and what it was that kind of drew you to developing this in, in the way that you have.
- [02:28]
B
Yeah, absolutely. So there is a bit of a backstory. I, I was right into the F45 space. So the, you know, that high intensity, high impact sort of training. And I actually broke my ankle and I rehabbed on a reformer with a clinical Pilates instructor. And what I found was, you know, not only did my ankle heal, but all my injuries dissipated very quickly. So I had like sore knees, bad lower back, all those sorts of things. And very, very quickly my body healed and I felt better than ever. And it was one of those sort of every time I'd go in for a session, I would just feel stronger and better. So I kind of fell in love with Pilates and. But I always felt like I needed a little bit more. So I always felt like I needed to go for a run or go lift some heavy weights, which is sort of where I became a personal trainer young age. And I was right into sort of that, that sort of area of the fitness industry. And I just, I just thought, I'm really loving Pilates, but I need a little bit more. And then I found it was actually built in, in the us the row former. So effectively reformer with a rower attached to it, all in one. If you can imagine, you know, you've got one big carriage and then the one of the other carriages actually becomes a row seat. So it's all in one. And I flew over to the States, to Orange county, and I tried this machine and it just solved all the problems I felt all the things that I wanted within a workout. So very, very quickly, myself and my business partner Mark, who was with me at F45, we decided that we would get the exclusive rights for the row former and build a fitness experience that was sort of aligned with those values. It was taking all the best parts of Reformer Pilates, adding a cardio element and then later adding a strength element. So, yeah, now we are a hybrid concept that is a very new space, I think, in the industry. But, yeah, our members seem to love it so far.
- [04:45]
A
So, yeah, so for those of us who have yet to participate in the class, what does the structure of the class look like? And because how do you move between those different elements and how do you build that out?
- [04:57]
B
Yeah, so we have a bike former and a row former. So when you check into a class, you can choose whether you're going to ride or rope. For the class, we have dumbbells to the sides that are, call it 35 kilos or 70 pounds at sort of the top end.
- [05:16]
A
Yeah.
- [05:16]
B
So like proper heavy dumbbells. It is, it is. And we will tend to run a class where people have their own space, they have their own reformer and they will work between, call it. Our most common class would be a strong body class where they'll do, let's say 10 minutes of reformer, 5 minutes of rowing, 12 minutes of reformer, 4 minutes of rowing, and just go back and forth. So your heart rate is staying elevated the entire time and you're still sort of getting all those benefits of Pilates, but it's, it's very, very different. Like, we have Classes that are, it's no rowing, it's just Pilates. It's strength training and Pilates. It's strength training, Pilates and, and cardio. It's, it's everything. So it's really important that we sort of program for someone who would be training seven days a week.
- [06:04]
A
Okay, that's the idea. Okay, got it. So tell me a little bit about the vision you had when you first, you obviously, you saw the, the row former. You knew that you wanted to do something with that. You were, you were obviously looking to build something. What was the, was the, what was the vision initially and did that change for the way the business grew?
- [06:24]
B
Yeah, I mean Strong's a very different business today than what it was when we started in 2019. It's, it's sort of, that vision has evolved over time, but initially it was creating something that was low impact, that we could get all the benefits of Pilates, you know, mobility, stability, core strength, but still have the ability to really push yourself and sort of get a good calorie burn. I think strength training now has really. Well, it's really having its day similarly to Pilates in the fitness industry, like you could probably argue strength and Pilates are the sort of the two top genres right now. And then, you know, it sort of developed into just creating a one stop shop workout where people don't need to have a players membership, have a gym membership and train at all these different places. So we just wanted to sort of, you know, create that. Yeah, that, that all, all encompassing workout.
- [07:24]
A
Yeah. And was the vision to always franchise or did you start out as sort of a studio owner operated setup? What, what in the very beginning was the goal to be in, you know, hundreds and hundreds of studios around the world? Or is that from the beginning? Or was that something that kind of came after you'd proven the concept?
- [07:43]
B
So yeah, being, being a franchisee previously, you, you always look at things and you think, well I, I, I think I can do that a little bit better. Or, or there's, there's things that I would. So the goal was from day one to franchise and believe it or not, we opened our first corporate owned and a month later we opened our first franchise.
- [08:02]
A
Wow.
- [08:03]
B
So the growth, you know, and being in 14 countries now and heading to Japan and seeing Strong Tort in Japanese and things like that, like it's mind blowing. But what's really driven this growth is probably the consumer demand. Like it was really, really interesting because when we launched Strong for the first time in Melbourne, we had and this is how we knew we were onto something special. We had all the Pilates teachers from the surrounding Pilates studios coming and training at strong and paying. And like for me that's a, that's a sign that the early adopters are looking at this and they're intrigued by this. And then very, very quickly as we started to launch studios, you know, people loved it as well. They would come across from their functional training studio or from their Pilates studio or. Actually our biggest sample size of members is from regular gyms, which is quite interesting, but. And the consumer demand has just really rocketed the business. Well, we're in our seventh year now and it just seems to be compounding year on year. So it's very exciting at the moment.
- [09:11]
A
And who are the people coming into the studios? Because I presume because of you, you have made it broader than just the Pilates element. Do you see a mix of men and women across equally or is it shifts to one or the other?
- [09:25]
B
Yeah, we're very deliberate about being very gender neutral in our branding. So if you jump on our Instagram, it's just wrong. On Instagram you'll see that it's, it is very neutral. It's black, white, splash of light blue. We hero men equally as we do women. So men, over time and what we've seen with the studio life cycle, over time a male member will increase. So I see sort of females in the boutique spaces as very much early adopters like they. We'll launch a studio and it could be with 300 members and 260 of them are female. But over time eventually like we can get up to say 25% male within our business, which I think is still quite heavily. That's a good amount for Pilates. Call it that. So yeah, we get a mix of everyone, all ages. We get a mix of people with different abilities, which is really cool. But also we don't just get people that love Pilates and want more. We get people that have been doing things like functional trading, CrossFit, whatever it is, and their bodies just don't want the impact anymore. So we're kind of getting everyone, which is. Which is really exciting.
- [10:44]
A
Yeah, absolutely. And it's showing on your growth for sure. So you started out with one owners operated studio, you've quickly franchised. Tell us a little bit about some of the. Obviously you came from the franchise world, so you have a lot of experience in this. But what would you say are the biggest chain differences or shifts that make a business from the get go franchise ready what do you need and what, what do you need to have in place? You know, in terms of your, your setup and processes and so on and the people.
- [11:16]
B
Yeah, and, and the boring answer is systems. And I know, I love that word.
- [11:21]
A
It's fine.
- [11:23]
B
Yeah, it's, it's, it's not fun to talk about, but you cannot, you cannot grow without the systems in place. And, and running a franchise with 20 studios compared to 100 is also very, very different. So it's systems and infrastructure and being very clear on things like whether it's the teacher training and the experience or the brand, tone of voice, how we look, feel, sound, all of those things. You need the systems to ensure the quality exists across 1, 10, 50, 100, 200 studios. So having that infrastructure in place is very important and there's a lot of pre planning. So, you know, we're planning now for 250 locations currently with 112. So you kind of build that infrastructure as you go and you can build the plane while you're flying it. You can't survive without, without that infrastructure and those systems and processes.
- [12:20]
A
Yeah, I'm sure the cracks start to show pretty quickly.
- [12:23]
B
They do.
- [12:25]
A
So tell us a little bit about what that growth looks like right now. We've talked, you know, we know you're in 14 different countries and you have 100 studios right now. You mentioned you've got more coming. What does that look like for you?
- [12:35]
B
Yeah, probably the most exciting market for us right now is the U.S. so there's around 155 locations on the way. We'll launch 30 this year in the U.S. alone, which is very, very exciting. I always say one to 20 is the hardest in franchising. And the UK will hit 20 this year, probably 25. Canada will hit 20. So we're kind of, we're a mature sort of, we're a household name in Australia, which is, which is. It always makes it tougher when you come over to countries like the us. I live in Austin, Texas now, but it's just that sort of constant monitoring those sort of other markets and building them as we go. So it's really nice to sort of get over the hump this year with, with the uk, Canada and us But a lot of our efforts and infrastructure and our new hires and, and getting our master trainers, it's predominantly in the U.S. so that's where a lot of our focus is.
- [13:34]
A
Yeah. And as a founder, that's a hugely different ball game to seven studios in one country. So how are you thinking differently and how have you felt you've evolved as the leader or one of the leaders of the business as you kind of step into this sort of huge opportunity? Right. What is that? What has changed for you?
- [13:56]
B
It's about sort of being a lot more structured. With my days being very deliberate in the messaging. One of my favorite pieces of advice was never assume. So never assume that the members know the thing. Never assume the members actually understand that strong is strength plays in cardio. Like all that messaging needs to be out there. Never assume that staff know the thing to deliver to franchisees. Like it's very much about being very deliberate and just giving that sort of clear pathway. Because now I'm managing and my business partner, we're sort of co CEO, we're managing big teams, we're managing general managers in different countries and it has to trickle down from staff to franchisees to members. Like this is almost sort of three different types of sort of stakeholders at play here. So the messaging needs to be very, very clear from the top. But yeah, I don't generally jump in and teach a class or I won't go in and run marketing for a studio now. Like I need to sort of look at this from a top level perspective. Yeah. So it's just. Yeah. Being more definitive with my role.
- [15:16]
A
Yeah. And evolving as your business is evolving. Right. It's all, it's constant. So you mentioned a little bit of that, of what I wanted to ask you next, which is about how you scale at this pace and at this size and maintain that consistency in experience and culture across, you know, not just different, a few different locations, but across different countries. What do you have? What systems or processes or guidelines do you have in place? What are you doing inside of Strong to ensure that you have that? Because presumably that consistency is really critical for you as a brand.
- [15:52]
B
Yeah, it's really, it's everything. The onboarding process for a strong franchisee. If someone signs up, they want to buy a studio, it's very, very intricate, it's very well built out and there's a lot of training behind that. Like we will literally teach them how to run their business, how to ensure that pre sale is fantastic. And I always say this pre sale is so critical for studios. You will never get the cost per acquisition in a pre sale that you will any other time in the life cycle of a studio. So the pre sale, the marketing, even how to hire the right teachers. And then that stems down to what does our teacher training and academy look like, ensuring that we're hiring really well. There, ensuring the brand is delivered correctly, the workout is delivered correctly, all those things just tie in. But yeah, there's, we're starting to get really consistent with it, which is fantastic. But it's just, I know it's boring. Systems are boring, but it's just something we need to do.
- [16:58]
A
Yeah, it is, it is. And it is what holds it all together for sure. And, and you know, you know, tell us a little bit about, you know, because of you, the life cycle of your consumers and the things that you do. Obviously, you know, there's a lot of competition right now in the industry and what are you doing to sort of work to ensure that you're retaining your members over, you know, extended period of time?
- [17:24]
B
Yeah, you really, and I'm huge on, on client research, market research, and it is really all about identifying what your clients want, need and value. And for us, we've, we've realized our clients value progression. So part of it is actually ensuring the workout is, is built and is purpose built for clients. So for instance, we have progressive overload blocks so people will stop, rest, go heavy with the strength training week on week so they can start to build muscle, get stronger. The cardio is overloaded and also the Pilates is overloaded. So there's that progression over time. So that's really, really important. And through that our clients see physical adaptation. So they're getting stronger, they're feeling better, their bodies are changing and that's really what's keeping them like, I don't want to use a buzzword like community, because everybody does. And yes, we have amazing community, but what our clients want are results. And that's what we can give them. We can give them really great heart health, good VO2 max through good conditioning. We can give them all those amazing benefits of Pilates and they can build lean muscle and look fantastic at the same time and get stronger. So those things are what's keeping clients there. Yes, we have milestone grip socks for 200 classes and hoodies for 750 classes and all those like cool little touch points that clients get. But it is about the results and the product first. So. And we, we never forget that.
- [19:02]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The retention element is, you know, it is the lifeblood. Right. Of every studio. That's, that's what, it's not just about the acquisition, it's about the retention as well. I think sometimes that's overlooked. Not always, but sometimes that's overlooked and it's just absolutely critical. But you're absolutely right, you know, people are there to get results. Ultimately, I don't think people, you know, Google find me the best Pilates studio that has community. It's more about the results first and the community comes second. And that's why they keep coming back for sure. Yeah. So tell us a little. I want to go back to just really quickly talking about the differences between, you know, being a solo or a single location owner or operator or franchisee versus multi location. Just out of interest of the, of your, all of your franchisees, how, what, how many of them or what percentage of them have more than one location?
- [19:56]
B
70% have more than one.
- [19:58]
A
Yeah. So when you look for franchisees, are you looking specifically for those who are wanting to have that?
- [20:06]
B
Not really. Like, it's. We sort of, we prefer we work with good people. Right. And that's, that's number one. But naturally, like, as a business is performing, it does make sense for a lot of these franchisees to get another studio. I'll give you an example. We had a fantastic studio launch in Long island and they're now probably our highest revenue owner in the network. And so, yeah, that was six months ago. And these guys are already looking at their second. They never really had the ambition to get another studio, but they're doing so well, it makes sense. It's working. So, and that's what we've seen. Like our franchisees will generally reinvest over time. Now you do get these big developers that will come in and buy a hundred studios or they'll want to buy 50 or they'll want to buy a whole state, and that's great as well. And they generally have sometimes bigger teams than us, but that one is more about, you know, supporting them, training them on how to run the business and then they sort of take over from there. But really it's about the person and working with the right person. And the culture of the franchise is very, very important as well.
- [21:17]
A
So when you're having those conversations in the early days, what are you looking for in those people?
- [21:23]
B
Like the ideal candidate is someone for, say a single unit operator is someone who is a hero within their community, someone who knows the baristas and the hairdressers and they don't have to be in fitness. It's not that important. Have a guess what our most successful franchisees, what background they come from other
- [21:48]
A
than marketing, or is it marketing?
- [21:52]
B
Close. It's actually sales.
- [21:55]
A
Yeah.
- [21:55]
B
Okay. So our most successful studios in the world as an average actually come from. The franchise owner comes from a sales background. But generally, generally we just, we just want to work with good people. It's good if they have some sort of business experience. It's great if they. They've already been in the fitness industry, but it's not, it's not essential. I would say being a hero within your community and being a competent operator are really the two big things.
- [22:26]
A
Yeah, yeah. Leadership and is really important, I think as well, isn't it? Because when you've got people you're managing, it's not. It's a skill that you have to have to, you know, but that sales, number one sales is. Yeah, that's always going to help.
- [22:41]
B
I think, like leadership's important, but also we have franchisees that will put in a studio manager and they just, they. The franchisees are great managers of the studio manager who sort of has the leadership skills and has that sort of outgoing personality that knows every member's name and all that sort of stuff. It's. It's very different studio to studio. Like, I love it. I love getting franchisees that work the floor. You know, they're on the front desk and they understand their numbers intricately as well. Like, we can talk to them straight away. They understand break even. They understand how many leads they need this month, what their conversion needs to be, where their attrition needs to sit. All those things are fantastic. But they're all teachable as well, so. And quite often we are coaching these guys, so.
- [23:29]
A
Yeah, yeah, excellent. Sounds like they have a lot of support from you in both. Across the process.
- [23:36]
B
Everything you can think of. Yeah. They're effectively assigned a performance manager that works with them. If they're absolutely crushing it, they may only meet with the performance manager fortnightly or even monthly in those early stages, might be a couple of times a week until they really understand their numbers. But, you know, our marketing teams are working with the digital agencies that are bringing in the leads. We're working on their sales training. We're working on small things. Like one of the most important things is instructors saying the names of clients in class like these, these little things that convert to community and memberships. They're kind of intangible, but they need to be taught. And, you know, again, you can never assume that they know that or the instructor knows that. There's all these little things that we've learned along the way that you just need to keep passing that on to franchisees and building case studies around things that have worked and haven't worked as well.
- [24:37]
A
Yeah, interesting. So what hasn't worked? Tell me more.
- [24:42]
B
Yeah, actually there's. There's there's, I love the saying never let a good disaster go to waste. Things that I've seen that haven't worked would be getting too intricate with a pre sale. So using AI agents using like interesting sales tactics like you know, $1 sign on and things like that, like all those little things there's, I believe there's a lack of authenticity there. So all those things like you learn as you go and you have people that bring ideas and that's fine. But yeah, never let a good disaster go to waste and learn from it all.
- [25:18]
A
Exactly. So tell us a little bit about. You know, obviously you are incredibly optimistic for the future of strong and the industry but generally what else do you see happening or where do you see the industry heading in the next sort of three to five years? There's been a huge growth and evolution but where do you see the beginnings of other things or where do you see the world going in boutique fitness specifically?
- [25:45]
B
Yeah, we're one of our core pillars is innovation. So every year our team presents generally one to three major innovations per department at a conference to the rest of the network. And that started with us for machine based innovation. So it was initially like we did a reverse spring system where you could do 100 pound deadlift and all these kind of things. Now they're very tech led and driven. So one thing we're launching in Q1 and this is where I, where I believe the industry is going. We, we're going to a fully connected brand. So the monitors on the row and the ride screen. So think about like a concept two row, you've got the monitor there, they will effectively go to iPads and we can then hold all the client performance data. So their lifetime meters, road and written we can give them based off their profile we can give them suggestions for spring changes for things like what dumbbells they should lift for a certain exercise. And then to take it one step further, you know we can put sensors in the springs and reward based off things like time under tension and give them a score and. Pretty cool. I know, it's amazing. Yeah. And we have a camera there. Not saying we're going to do this, but we're exploring the technology where AI can actually pick up on someone's squat form and send notes to the instructor that hey, like if you're in a class of 20 you may miss something. Hey, so and so's squat form is off. Have a look. So we, we're going to have the ability to do that stuff. We're going to have the ability to layer in AI, I think like performance metrics are important for a brand like us. So that's where I think the industry is going. It's going to be a lot more connected. Not tech for the sake of doing tech, but tech to not only improve the client experience, but to help the instructor. Like, I'm so big on tech supporting instructors. We have TVs so effectively, it's like a Canva presentation they click through and it's got all the exercises there. It's still instructor led, but the clients can actually look up at the TVs. And when we brought that in, our mail conversion from child to member went through the roof. And what we realized was men were feeling intimidated in plays classes at the time. We realized they were looking around the room because we launched it without the tech looking around the room at other members quite often. The instructor hasn't got a spare reformer there. And when we launched the TVs, our male conversion went through the roof. So all these things are there to support the instructor. Even things like with the new tablets, we're going to have a heart rate zone. So when they're rowing, the tablet will light up. If they're going at 90 to 100% of their max heart rate will light up red. They can see from the corner of their eye that someone's working hard and someone isn't. That just saves probably a thousand steps in a class. Do you know what I mean?
- [28:41]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [28:43]
B
But tech to support the experience, but not tech to be fancy for the sake of tech.
- [28:49]
A
Right. Usable has to be usable. Yeah, I mean, I'm so excited for, to see all of that get rolled out because I, you know, there's such an opportunity to make so much of movement so much more efficient when you've got that, you know, the feedback at the rate and the precision that you can get with tech, it's, it's, yeah, it's interesting. I'm excited to see how that, how that goes. So much there for sure. And it just makes this, the session, so much more effective and the teacher so much more effective and the whole experience. And again, coming back to what you said earlier about how, you know, results are why people come, keep coming back. So it's all part of that same, you know, ethos.
- [29:31]
B
There's, there's some really fun stuff we can do as well. So if it's someone's 100th class, you know, they'll get a celebration message, they'll have their name on there, then their grip socks will be Sitting on the row forma before they come into class. Like there's all these little things we can do also to help with retention.
- [29:48]
A
Yeah.
- [29:50]
B
Which is really, really cool. We can put marketing on the screens. We can. If it's someone's first class, there's a little introduction video because yes, we're still going to take the client through, show them how the machine works. But if they're there 15 minutes early, they can watch a quick video on how, how each, how to do a spring change, how to, you know, how to unlock the row seat. Like all those little things, it's just going to enhance the experience. I don't think it's going to water it down or become reliant upon it because we're not using it at the moment. Right. So. Yeah, yeah.
- [30:22]
A
And what you said earlier about having the screens with the, with, you know, even though you might be, someone might be demonstrating in the room or you can see other people doing it, even having that extra visual prompt is so interestingly how powerful that is is really fascinating.
- [30:37]
B
Yeah, it's. We call it instructor assist technology. I'm, I'm not a fan of self service Pilates. I know it's got its space in the industry but it's been incredibly helpful and even myself, when I'm in a class and there's a complex exercise and I'm completely gassed from the rower or the bike, it's very easy for me to look up and just see what's next because we actually show a visual of what's coming up next just to be ready. You lose that transition time as well. People know what's coming and the transitions are faster so beginning a more efficient workout. But I'm all for it. But as long as it's under the guidance of an instructor who is qualified and can pick up any sort of horrific form. But yeah, all for it.
- [31:27]
A
I'm in agreement. I'm in agreement. Absolutely. So you've got a lot of, you're going to be very busy in 2026 and 2027 for sure. Where is your next big kind of focus in terms of your openings in the US and elsewhere?
- [31:44]
B
Yeah, hopefully Florida soon, which would be great. But we've got some big, major markets. So you know, we're in New York but we're not in New York City yet. So that will launch in the next few months. Cities like Boston, Chicago are very amazing markets. We just launched West Hollywood so we've got a bit of an LA rollout from here. Texas is going great guns, you know, we've got Charlotte coming on board. There's, there's a bunch of new markets, so there's a huge amount of education required at the moment just to show people who we are and what we do. And then we've got some other countries coming on board. So we've got like Poland, Brazil, all across the Middle East, Saudi, and I think we'll be in 20 countries by the end of the year as well. So Europe's a huge market for us and we'll just keep going.
- [32:40]
A
It's exciting times. Congratulations. I'm excited to see what comes next for sure.
- [32:45]
B
Thank you. I'd love to get you into a strong class at some stage.
- [32:48]
A
Yeah. Yep. Well, when it comes, I will be there for sure. Well, thank you so much for coming on and sharing all of your insights and a little bit more about what you've been working on. And I really appreciate you taking the time. And if you are interested in listening in or Learning more about Strong, where should folks go to find out more
- [33:09]
B
StrongPilates Co so doco or just go to Strong on Instagram. Perfect.
- [33:16]
A
Awesome. We will link to all of that. Thank you so much, Michael. Great to have you on.
- [33:20]
B
Thank you. That was a great conversation.
- [33:21]
A
Awesome. Well, I hope this is helpful to you as you go about building your boutique fitness studio business. And if you enjoyed what you heard, I'd be so appreciative if you could go to wherever you're listening to this, take a quick minute and rate and review this podcast. It would mean so much to me and help to get this out there into our fabulous community of teachers and business owners. Just like you. Did you love this episode and want more? Head to spring3.com and check out out my free resources that will help you run a profitable and fulfilling studio business. And before you go, one last reminder. There is no one way to do what you do, only your way. So whatever it is that you want to do, create or offer, you've got this. Thanks again for joining me today and have a wonderful rest of your day.
- [34:18]
B
Sa.