School Gets the Best of Them, We Get the Rest of Them with Dr. Lisa Damour

Summary

Podcast Summary: "School Gets the Best of Them, We Get the Rest of Them"

Podcast: Raising Good Humans
Host: Dr. Aliza Pressman
Guest: Dr. Lisa Damour
Date: October 10, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode explores why teenagers often "dump" their emotional stress on parents after getting home from school, how parents can navigate these moments effectively, and when to worry versus when to relax. Host Dr. Aliza Pressman and expert guest Dr. Lisa Damour, bestselling author and adolescent psychologist, delve into the realities of adolescent stress, the importance of maintaining supportive roles as parents, and practical strategies for responding to teens’ daily complaints without taking on unnecessary anxiety.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Emotional Dumping Phenomenon

• Concept: “School gets the best of them, we get the rest of them.”

  • Kids work hard all day at school to hold it together; by the time they’re home, exhaustion and pent-up frustrations spill over.
  • Quote (Lisa Damour, 03:01): “School gets the best of them. We get the rest of them.”
  • Aliza: "If you just looked at that, you would think things are not okay." (01:10)

• Normalizing Teen Behavior:

  • It’s normal and developmentally healthy for kids to save their hardest feelings for their safe place—home.
  • Don’t conflate afterschool grumpiness with a sign that something is fundamentally wrong.

2. Masking vs. Building Resilience

• Clarifying "Masking":

  • Social media sometimes pathologizes normal coping; masking at school is mostly a healthy skill, not inherently problematic.
  • Lisa: “We want our kids to be their best when they're out and about. ... Home [should be] a place where they can let their emotional hair down.” (06:29)

• Uncomfortable vs. Unmanageable:

  • Stress is a natural part of growth; experiencing, tolerating, and learning from discomfort is crucial.
  • Lisa: “Healthy development isn't ‘I get to feel whatever I feel, wherever I feel it, however I want.’” (07:19)
  • Distinguishing between 'uncomfortable' (normal) and 'unmanageable' (possible concern).

3. The Parent’s Role: Emotional Garbage Collector

• A Useful Metaphor:
  • When you ask “How was your day?” imagine opening an “emotional garbage bag” for your child to unload into.
  • Lisa: “Just nodding and smiling and knowing they're just unloading … If when they come to the end of it, we just tie it off and set it aside—usually, they feel better.” (08:05)
  • Avoid over-analyzing or questioning each complaint unless patterns shift.

4. When to Worry (and When Not To)

• Signs That Warrant Concern:

  • If kids do not feel relief after venting.
  • Complaints are persistent and nothing seems to improve.
  • Feedback from school staff suggests your child is struggling in multiple environments.

• Check-ins:

  • Consult a trusted teacher discreetly if concerned. Make sure communication does not backfire by embarrassing your child. (14:00)
  • Lisa: “If the school is saying something, if you—you know, I hear about this all the time from families at boarding school. ... That's how I think we want to size it up.” (14:27)

• Parents Don’t See the Whole Picture:

  • The part of your teen's experience you get at home is not the full story; often, school and social life are very different.

5. Strategies for Navigating Emotional Dumps

a. Invite the Good (Without Forcing It)

• Prompt about positives later in the day or with open-ended, non-demanding questions.
• Lisa: “You can prompt it, but you can't prompt it as a way to preempt them from just sharing what was hard.” (17:16)

b. Ask Before You Advise

• Essential question: “Do you want my help or do you just need to vent?” (18:13)
• “Usually the kid’s like, ‘No, just listen.’ And then you’re like, okay, that’s what’s being asked.” (18:13)

c. Perspective Shifting

• Ethan Kross’s tip: “How do you think you'll feel about this in a year?”
• Use sparingly; helps reduce immediate distress by gaining a future-looking perspective. (20:05)

6. Avoiding Rumination

• Pay attention to signs you're “picking at an emotional wound.”
• Lisa: “Talking about feelings helps, until it doesn't. ... If that's happening, it's actually important to stop it.” (21:23)
• Offer a ‘pause’ by suggesting a shared activity and revisit feelings later.

7. Building Listening Muscles: The Editor Hack

• Imagine your teen is a reporter reading you their story; your job is to distill it into a headline.
• This helps maintain engagement and demonstrates true listening.
• “Mostly when we’re listening or think we’re listening, we’re waiting for the kid to stop so we can give them a great suggestion.” (32:21)

8. Parent Confessions: Imperfection is Okay

• Both hosts openly admit to falling asleep or getting frustrated during kids’ emotional dumps—but kids are resilient.

9. Respect, Not Friendship

• Adolescents want adults to “play their cards face up," seeking honesty and boundaries, not pandering or forced friendship.
  • Lisa: “They want adults to be adults, but desperately want adults to be adults. They just want adults to like teenagers. That’s all they care about.” (52:16)

10. Identity, Change, and Perspective in Adolescence

• High school transition is deeply rooted in identity work and social experimentation.
• What adults dismiss as “trivial” (e.g., jeans style) can feel hugely significant to teens.
• These interpretations and meanings are often invisible to adults; respond with humility, not solutions.

11. Modeling Compassionate Communication

• Avoid labeling other kids (e.g., “bully”), as children change rapidly; instead, frame with hope for growth.
• Practice gentler, less judgmental language (the “Midwestern Translator”).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “School gets the best of them. We get the rest of them.”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (03:01)

• “Healthy development isn’t 'I get to feel whatever I feel, wherever I feel it, however I want.’”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (07:19)

• “Do you want my help or do you just need to vent?”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (18:13)

• “Talking about feelings helps until it doesn’t. Talking about feelings should bring emotional relief... But occasionally it’ll take a turn into rumination.”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (21:23)

• “Listening is really hard. Mostly, when we’re listening or think we’re listening, we’re waiting for the kid to stop so we can give them a great suggestion.”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (32:21)

• “What they want is that you are playing your cards face up. That’s all they care about. They don’t actually care what the cards are. They want them face up.”
  — Dr. Lisa Damour (51:32)

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Timestamps of Major Segments

• 00:10–06:26: Why teens dump on parents; “School gets the best of them.”
• 06:27–08:05: Masking vs. resilience; role of discomfort.
• 08:06–09:48: The ‘emotional garbage bag’ approach.
• 13:44–14:25: When to worry vs. when to check in.
• 16:38–19:28: Asking about positives and when to advise.
• 20:08–23:10: Tips from Ethan Kross; shifting perspective, rumination.
• 32:01–33:35: Editor hack for listening.
• 41:05–43:20: Handling repetitive concerns about the same issues.
• 49:59–52:16: Respecting teens; playing it straight vs. pandering.

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Tone and Takeaways

• Warm, compassionate, and realistic; both hosts blend expertise and humor, making parents feel less alone.
• Listeners are reassured that imperfection is normal—and most teen complaints are developmentally appropriate, not a crisis.
• Encourages parents to listen more than they fix, validate emotions, and trust in the resilience of their kids.

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Transcript

[A]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production.

[B]

Welcome to Raising Good humans podcast. I'm Dr. Liza Pressman and today I have one of my favorites, Dr. Lisa D', amore, a repeat guest on the podcast Teen Whisperer, New York Times bestselling author of the Brilliant Untangled Under Pressure and the Emotional Lives of Teenagers. And she also joined me and we did the masterclass called the Science of Parenting. It's awesome. It's a three part series. You can check it out wherever you get your masterclasses. I think just masterclass dot com. Today we're talking about when adolescents use you as their sort of emotional dumping ground. How to respond, what it means, when to worry, when to relax. And she's just the most brilliant at translating adolescence. So I love sharing her work with you. If you enjoy this episode, go ahead and give it a five star rating and write a little review and tell me what you want to hear about so I can keep giving you more episodes that you're looking for. Something I think we hear all the time is that our teenagers are being really bristly or prickly or whatever you want to call it, or complaining or dumping or just seeming like if you just looked at that, you would think things are not okay. And so I wanted to talk to you about, like the kinds of conversations that we might have with our kids where it's like normal dumping and the kind where you're like, this feels like it's getting out of hand and then generally speaking, responding to that because they live in the real world and we don't want them to get too comfortable just like treating somebody like an actual.

[A]

Trash can, a garbage can.

[B]

But like we want to be receipt, you know, like receive something so it's all just garbled, but you make everything untangled.

[A]

Oh, thank you very much. Well done. Well done. I see you, what you did there. Very good. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Well, it's always so good to be in conversation with you. It's like one of my favorite places to be. Eliza, I don't know if you have this happen, but sometimes like when I'm speaking to an audience, like it accesses a different part of my brain and I come up with stuff that I don't come up with and I'm just like hammering away at my computer or, you know, thinking on my own. And a few years ago I was in Toronto and it was the end of a long day at a wonderful school and I was speaking with the parents and the parent raised a question a little bit like this, like, oh, my gosh, my kid comes home and they're just like, so grumpy and, you know, so grousy. And I said, you know, school gets the best of them. We get the rest of them.

[B]

And it was like, yeah, yeah.

[A]

It was like one of the better things I've ever come up with. And it just sort of fantastic. And I think that's a great way to start this conversation. So here's how I think we are most helpful is if we picture being our kid, okay, the school day. I don't think any of us at this point would make it past third period. Like, okay, so you're like, trying to find your classroom. You are with a bunch of kids who you did not choose. And we have to bear this in mind all the time, right? And within that pack, in any given class, there may be one or two kids you like, one or two kids who make you really annoyed, and then a whole bunch of kids who sort of fill in the middle, right? Like, that's going to be a sort of a standard fare. And then you have the adult running the class who, you know, under best conditions, kids will have a couple teachers they think are fantastic, a couple teachers who make them bananas, and then everybody else. And it's so many people and it's so much stuff and it's moving around and there's all of these dynamics going on that are nothing to do with school, right? The weird social who sat there, who looked at whom, who said, what? Did I say something? And our kids hold it together all day. They very rarely throw themselves on the ground at school. They very rarely haul off and punch somebody at school, right? And they go from injustice to injustice or frustration to frustration, and they just manage. They're actually great at school. And it's work to be that good at school. And I know, and I've had kids tell me, part of how they can do it is they're like, oh, wait till I get home and tell everybody what happened today, right? That part of the grace that they are able to display is hinges on, I am holding this until I can tell somebody what happened or how I felt. Now, the dynamic it creates, this is not great from the family side, but this is the reality. You haven't seen your kid all day. You're super excited to see them. You yourself may be exhausted. I'm always invariably exhausted. You finally connect to at the end of the day, and you're like, how was school? And they're like, right? And they just dump. They just dump a Whole bunch of misery. And it. Honestly, Elisa, it's really unpleasant. Like, I will just say that as a mom, like, yeah, I don't enjoy it.

[B]

I concur.

[A]

And I think we don't talk about how unpleasant it is enough. Like, there's the piece about, like, how worried should we be about our kid? Which is very real. But also, like, this is just not fun.

[B]

Yeah. And it's annoying. And it's annoying.

[A]

Yeah. And you're like, I'm tired. Really? Can I just watch tv?

[B]

Yeah, I think that's a really good point. And we don't talk about it enough. And also to that point, I wonder if you could address, like, when. Because I think this is another thing that social media does sometimes. Yay. We're having conversations about things, but, like, people will call that masking. And they'll be like, when you say school gets the best of them, we get the rest of them. Which, by the way, is obviously going to be the title of this episode. I can just. I can hear the. The pathologizing starting and they.

[A]

Authentic at school kind of thing. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. So can you, like, clear that up for us?

[A]

Yeah. So, okay, first of all, this is actually how it should be. We want our kids to be their best when they're out and about. Right. And we want to have home be a place where they can let their, you know, emotional hair down, so to speak.

[B]

Oh, I love that.

[A]

That doesn't mean they get to be jerks at home, but it does mean they don't have to be holding it together in the same way. And I think there is such a thing as masking. I think there's also such a thing as developing the muscle to be socially appropriate under challenging conditions, which is a very important muscle that everybody needs to develop. Right. You can't go to work as an adult and be like, you're annoying. Get away from me. I don't want to deal with you. Right. You gotta be able to work with others even if you don't like them. So I'm sure there's some extreme version of this where a kid is covering up stuff they shouldn't have to cover up. But I would say the school gets the best of them, we get the rest of them. Is mostly healthy, typical expectable development. And it gets to something that you do such a beautiful job around, which is healthy development involves things that are hard, things that are uncomfortable for kids, things that make a request of them, asks them to adapt to new and difficult situations. Healthy development isn't. I get to Feel whatever I feel, wherever I feel it, however I want.

[B]

Exactly, exactly how. So I just feel like we have to keep hearing this from you in different ways because it's soothing and inspiring. And I do think, like, how. How can we get reminders of that, of distinguishing between uncomfortable and, you know, unmanageable?

[A]

Right? Like, that's like, for me, the big divide. Is the situation uncomfortable? Is it unmanageable? And, you know, school, by and large, is going to be pretty uncomfortable for kids in the same way that strength training is uncomfortable for people. Right. If you are doing something at the edge of your capacity and building capacity, it doesn't actually feel good. That's actually a sign that you're growing. So I think the more that we can normalize a degree of stress. Actually not even a degree normalize stress. Like school is supposed to be stressful. That's the nature of it. And focus instead on making sure kids are getting good recovery, good sleep, good leisure. We're already doing kids a favor. I think the other thing is once we put on the table what we are putting on the table, that they come in and they're often not that fun to be around because they're just complaining a lot, I think then it helps us to change our expectations for what that interaction is going to look like. And if we, you know, I've said this a million times, a million places, so I'm just going to repeat it. If when we say, how was your day? We picture ourselves opening an emotional garbage bag, right? And just holding it open and letting the kid just dump the, you know, injustices and frustrations of the day and just nodding and smiling and knowing they're just unloading all the stuff they've carried. If when they come to the end of it, we just tie it off and set it aside, usually they feel better. We have proven ourselves a very good garbage collector and have done a beautiful service, but we haven't mucked around it and we haven't said, well, why didn't you bring this garbage home? Or I'm going to go call the school about this piece of garbage. Right? I mean, like, we're just collecting and setting aside, and most of the time, the kid feels better at the end of that, and if they do, you're good to go.

[B]

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[A]

I think that's right.

[B]

Or our role.

[A]

I think that's right. And I think just so we. I always find it's helpful to say, like, when to worry, like, when do we actually want to worry about this? And I think we want to worry if the kid dumps the garbage and then they're still upset. Right. That they're not getting the relief that we would expect to see. I also think that a lot of families may have a trusted person at school that if they're really stressed about it and they can't tell, that they can maybe call the teacher and just say, look, I'm making a call to the side. Everything looking good on your end. She's a little grumpy at home, but it could be garden variety grumpy and checking in in that way. But I think you have to feel like it's a teacher you can trust who's not going to say to the kid the next day, like, I heard.

[B]

Your mom call me. Exactly.

[A]

That's not always so great. But you can do a check in like that if you're really anxious. Because it's better to not react if you can. Right. The more we can avoid reacting, the better. I would worry if the kid doesn't feel better. I would worry if the school is saying something. I would worry if you. You know, I hear about this all the time from families at boarding school. Right. I hear about this all the time where the kid, you know, calls dumps like, I hate it here. I don't want to be here. This is the worst place in the world. You know, the parent is awake all night, like they cannot get together. They call the kid the next day. The Kid's like, what's your problem? You seem upset. Like, they. And they can't get a read because they actually can't even see the kid. And I say to them all the time, pick up the phone and call the school because they have this going on all over. And I promise you, half the time they can be like, yeah, no, I'm watching your kid skip down the hall right this minute. And you can know that that was what happened and your kid's all right. That's how I think we want to size it up in terms of when to worry, not assuming it's grounds for concern. And another way to think about it. And then I'll that I can move off of this topic, but I'm, like, sort of obsessed with it. We cannot, as parents and caregivers, get a faithful look at our kids overall functioning. We just cannot. They do and accomplish things away from us that we would never imagine they can handle as beautifully as they do. They bring home to us the ways in which they feel most vulnerable, the ways in which they feel most unsure and insecure. We should never assume that we are getting a complete picture of our child's functioning. We just can't.

[B]

I just think that is so relieving, because how scary is it if you're only hearing the bad stuff, or you're hearing lots of good stuff too, but your antenna is just up for the bad stuff. Is it worth asking, like, at some point in the day, is it worth asking? Not in that moment of dumping, but if anything's going right, or is that just pouring salt on a wound?

[A]

No, I think you could 100% do it. And I think the way you would do it is you would say, listen, you hold it together so great all day, and I am totally here to collect whatever junk you need to dump at the end of the day. Like that I am here for it. You'll let me know if there aren't bright points, right? I'm assuming there are bright points in all of this. You'll let me know if it actually feels like the whole thing is bad. You don't even have to make them produce the bright points, but you can just sort of like sort of a step back. Like, this is the dynamic we're doing with each other. Right? Okay, I get it. I also think sometimes later in the evening, kids will be like, oh, and then this funny thing happened. And I also think you can say, and I have a daughter who just started ninth grade. And I have a daughter who has started senior year of College. And. And I will sometimes say to my ninth grader, like, what's the funniest thing that happened today? Or, what's the weirdest thing that happened today? And then she'll come up with some hilarious story from the lunch table that she produces. So you can prompt it, but you can't prompt it as a way to preempt them from just sharing what was hard.

[B]

And how do you know when you should respond to the hard things? If you're like, I have such a good answer, or, I have such good advice. I'm so brilliant and I've been through this. Or, let's see, what else might you think? And by the way, lest anyone think that we're above this in our interactions with our teenagers, like, I don't know about you, but I definitely. More often than I'm proud of, I'm the most annoying. And I'm like, oh, my God. I. Like, if Lisa were watching me, she'd be like, what's happening?

[A]

What are you doing? I am like, I step in it like, it's my job. No, I do. I do. Okay, so first of all, like, the most valuable line in all of parenting is, do you want my help or do you just need to venture? Right? Like, you can't parent without it. You have to have that there. Because what it does is it actually gives you tremendous relief. Usually the kid's like, no, just listen. And then you're like, okay, that's what's being asked. It also, again, it kind of like creates a framing. Like, this is what we're doing, right? You're saving it for me, and you're giving it to me, and that's our transaction, and it works for you, and I'm going to make it work for me, too. Right now, some kids might be like, sure, I'll take your help, right? I would say it's like a 1%. Yeah. And then the nice thing is they actually are more likely to take your help. But I will tell you. And again, like true confessions from my own parenting, it is so hard when a kid's like, you know, you've got, like, you. You know the situation. Like, you know the answer. And you said, do you want my help? And. Or do you just need to vent? And they're like, I do not want your help. And you're like, but it's here. It's right there. So sometimes maybe I might have slipped it into another conversation. The great advice I wanted to give because I couldn't stand it. But that's a way to handle those moments. I think that works well for all.

[B]

Ethan Cross has something.

[A]

So Ethan Cross, a really smart psychologist at the University of Michigan who's a friend and colleague, does all of this good work on managing uncomfortable feelings and shifting away from discomfort. And his most recent book is Shift. But in the book before it, there was this wonderful, maybe two books before it, wonderful, wonderful thing that he had documented in lab studies that works really, really well, which is if somebody's really struggling with something, asking them, how do you think you're going to feel about this in a year? Or how do you think you're going to feel about this in five years? And I think this. You can't use it very often, right. If you say this to your kid.

[B]

Every day, use it wisely.

[A]

Yeah, Very, very judiciously. It is so helpful. It is so helpful. Because you know what? Feels like a total crisis of my locker jammed today. If you say to a kid, I hear you, that stinks. How do you think you're going to feel about this one in six months? They'll be like, I won't even remember it in six months. And what Ethan was able to document in his lab is there's instant relief. So I think that. Do you want my help or do you just need to vent this one? Do you think it's going to be staying with you in three months, two months, four months, or do you think you'll be past it? I think there are ways that we can enter the conversation that aren't fixing, that aren't getting too deep in mucking around in it too much. I think there are ways that we can stay engaged. And I think maybe that as we think it through together, I think that's sometimes a challenge is like, you feel like I'm just supposed to listen. That doesn't feel like I'm actually being very helpful. So there are some things we can try.

[B]

Now, you said mucking around in it, and I think that's worth spending a little time on, which is like, how long are we. Like, until what point is this trash can full and we're going to close it up and take it out?

[A]

That's a great question. Right? Because one of the worries we have is rumination. Right? And you know, the way we think, you and I and people with our training, talking about feelings helps, until it doesn't. Talking about feelings should bring emotional relief. You know, expressing feelings, putting them into words, should and often does bring those feelings down to size and let people move on. But occasionally it'll take a Turn into rumination, which is, you know, this is kind of gross, but it's like a really good metaphor. It's like the equivalent of picking at an emotional wound. You know that you're, like, going at it, going at it, making it worse. It won't heal up. Can't leave it alone. And so sometimes you start to think like, oh, man, the more the kid talks, the worse they seem to feel. This isn't working. If that's happening, it's actually important to stop it. And I think the way to do it without seeming dismissive is to say, honey, the more when we talk about feelings, you should feel better. But I feel like you're spinning your wheels. Like, the more you're talking about it, I'm watching you feel worse. Let's push pause. Let's go rewatch Derry Girls, my current favorite that I'm rewatching. Have you seen this?

[B]

I am so excited because I haven't.

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[B]

So I'll write that down. I have to watch it. Gilmore Girls.

[A]

I have to watch it with the subtitles because the Irish accents are very heavy and I'm not good on that. It is brilliant. So, like, let's go rewatch a Derry Girls or a Gilmore Girls or whatever Girls you're watching. And then I'm going to check in with you tomorrow and see where you are with us. That is a very nice way to stop it without seeming like you're just telling the kid to shut it down. And most of the time, you come back the next day and they're like, yeah, it's fine. I don't even know why I was so upset about it yesterday.

[B]

Well, and let's trust that. Like, can we trust that when they say that they're not avoiding talking to you about it now because they didn't like how you reacted or whatever it is. Most of the time it sounds like when we think of the worst case scenarios, like the masking was an example of, like, is that possible? Sure. But, like, most of the time, that's not what's happening. That's not what's happening most of the time. It's not avoiding talking to you if you have a good relationship. And so the most of the time is what we're talking about today.

[A]

Yeah. And I think, again, you're looking for patterns. Right. If you feel like this keeps happening, that your kid is, you know, feeling like you're not engaged in a meaningful way, then you're going to pay attention to that. But I'll tell you, Eliza, for 20 years, I consulted to a girls school in my community. I spent a day and a half a week there. So much fun. I learned so much. And it would sometimes happen that a girl would see me in the hall and she'd be like, barely holding it together, on the verge of tears, and we would tuck into my office and she would absolutely lose it and fall entirely apart. And then it would sometimes happen that like, she or I needed to leave, right? That I had a meeting I could not miss, or another kid coming in that I couldn't. Or she was like, I gotta go to class. And. And I would say to her, get your calendar. When are you free tomorrow? I'm back here tomorrow. When are you free? And we would put a time for her to come back to me. Never once in 20 years did the girl come back and say, okay, let's pick up where we were. Every single time. She would stick her head in my house and be like, I'm fine. I'm okay now. Wow, that's so good.

[B]

And I'd be like, good to hear.

[A]

And it was like, you know, the kid had come to me. Like there was like. It was. It was so. I just want adults to know. I want parents and caregivers to know most of the time they just need to get through that moment and if they can, then move on. And one of the things I always try to bear in mind, I've always said teenage years are like dog years. Like, you know, a year in our life is like seven years for them, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so like for a teenager, the thing that happened on Tuesday and it's now Thursday, like, I don't even know what you're talking about. Right. And that's an important thing for us to remember. They do move on fast.

[B]

And now for a quick break. Well, I have to just tell you about Saks because it's that time of year again when I am getting back into online shopping and I've got some occasions coming up. So I'm going to Saks.com because I do not like shopping in person. I know that is like a fun pastime for some people, but for me it is most certainly not. And Saks.com makes it super easy for me. Also now I've got one off to college and sometimes she needs something and voila. Saks.com. so here's the deal. If you're like me and you're looking for a special occasion outfit for the holiday season, which, yes, we're already there. I know it's ridiculous, but we are go to saks.com and for me, I was looking for something for Thanksgiving already because I'm traveling a lot for work and I'm trying to organize myself properly and I also like wanna celebrate my wedding anniversary. So if you're like me and you're looking for good outfits for work or for special occasions and holiday is go to Saks.com and make shopping fun but easy. Head to Saks Fifth Avenue for inspiring ways to celebrate and elevate your personal style every day. Movement is what brings us together. Each step forward becomes a journey towards something more. More community, more connection, more miles. And it's not about the number of miles you go, it's about the number of miles you share. Move your body, move your mind. With Asics, movement is power. And it's actually October's Mental health Month. And probably the most important thing next to a good night's sleep for your mental health is movement. Whether it's a daily run, a casual stride, a walk with a friend or one of your kids, these Asics shoes are engineered to support your growing mileage. They're as ready for a fast 5k as they are for the convenience of everyday life. A little hike if you're trying to get out in nature, or just a walk to the grocery store. So whether you're hitting your first mile or chasing new distances, ASICS legendary favorites such as the Kayano 32, Gel, Nimbus 27 and Novablast 5 give you the comfort and energy to go further. Also, the older I get, the more I realize how truly important every step is. It's so important for your physical health, it's so important for your mental health. If I could impart that on any mom in particular, but everybody that feels like they don't have time for that, it's the most important thing for your well being. I probably could sit for days because my natural state is quite slow. I feel so much better when I make sure to get up and walk and move. Visit asics.com and use the code HUMANS at checkout for $10 off your order of $100 or more. Exclusions may apply. So, speaking of time and teenagers, how is the transition to high school like your daughter's starting high school? I think that's a great time and a great example of like, what are the changes that we should expect this fall and what are the changes that we can help them with?

[A]

Yeah, you know, it's so hard and I don't know if you feel this as a parent sometimes, like when Your own kid is in something. It all feels so rich. Like, it's hard to actually think about the generic of, like, years of practice. But there's something I'm watching, but I also know maps onto years of practice.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And maybe you've seen this too. Like, there's a lot of identity work at work. Right. A lot of, do I wear my makeup this way? Do I wear my outfit this way? What's my jewelry story? Right. This is girls. But of course, boys too, you know, are figuring out, like, who am I in this moment? What's my brand? Is often a way I think about it, and I think it's pretty intense for ninth graders to figure out, like, what's my brand and who do I hang with. I will tell you. Typically, though, I think this is a little bit changed post pandemic. By 10th grade, kids are pretty easygoing, feel less attached to their own brand, or care less what everybody else's brand is. But ninth grade, I've always seen that as something that they're working really hard on. Does that fit with your blessings?

[B]

Completely. And actually, I really liked the specific examples because I think sometimes we might understand that it's identity forming. And then in the heat of the moment, all these tiny little things that we're looking at seem so stupid that we're like, this can't possibly be identity forming. So I think it's really important to remind everybody what it means to figure out what your brand is.

[A]

Yeah. What kind of jeans do you wear? Do you wear with them with rips or no rips? And I think the piece that is really, really hard for adults to be able to know is that it has. It's very laden with meeting meaning for the teenagers. To us, we're like genes. Whatever. Genes are genes.

[B]

Who cares? Right.

[A]

Yeah. Whereas in their world, and I say this without judgment, it's just. This is an anthropological observation. Oh, you wear jeans with holes. That is encoded with all sorts of meanings. Oh. But you wear these other kind of genes that's encoded with all this other sort of meaning. We cannot perceive these meanings. And I think all the time, Eliza, I've been thinking more and more, like, I picture myself walking into, like, a seventh or a ninth grade lunchroom. Right. And I think the activity in that lunchroom is occurring in 40 dimensions. Right. There's so much at work. We may perceive 2, the teenagers may perceive 10. There's so much happening. And. And I think that the. The watchword, then for what kids bring home, the watchword becomes humility, humility Right. The kids like, this happened at lunch. And we want to be like, well, you know what you should do? Okay, yeah. No, we don't get what happened. The kid only gets part of what happened. Listening is a very nice thing to do instead.

[B]

So if you struggle with listening because you're just like, I know, but in this particular case, I just need to.

[A]

Point out one thing. I've seen this one.

[B]

What are some concrete. Just sort of things we can say in our own head. Things we can just force ourselves to say out loud. Body language just, like, help us.

[A]

Okay, I've got a hack. I've got a hack. Because listening is really hard. It is really hard. Mostly when we're listening or think we're listening. We're waiting for the kid to stop so we can give them a great suggestion. Right. Which is not the same as listening. So my hack. And I don't remember where or how I came to this. And, you know, I didn't invent this really is. I pretend that my kid is a reporter and I am an editor, and I pretend that she is reading me the article of what she's upset about.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And that my job, when she gets to the end of the article, is, I have to have a headline for the article. I have to take what she has said and distill it into a headline that would capture it. Okay. I never get a good headline. I never. I hardly can ever. I mean, it's really hard to do.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But they can tell that you are actually tracking very closely on what they're saying. And my younger daughter, who is very direct and very funny, she's like, mom, I can tell from your face when you've stopped listening.

[B]

Mine can tell, too. It's terrible.

[A]

So if I know that's a risk and I really want to listen, which I really hope to be the person who really wants to listen. I play the editor game.

[B]

That is so great. That is exactly what I was hoping for. Just something that we can all do. Because listening is seems quite obvious. It's so hard. And when I check out from listening, I think there are two challenges. One is you're like, I have so much that I can say right now to fix this. Which obviously is not really true, but it feels true. And then the other side of, how much longer do I have to listen to this? I kind of know where we're going here, and I'm finished. But the minute I'm in that place, it is so clear. So I'm like, it's. It doesn't work to check out. I mean, I may as well just acknowledge, like, I've. You've lost me. I mean, my daughter, my older one now to just. Well, not now, because she went off to college.

[A]

Well, we can talk about that.

[B]

I know. Lisa, can we just help me.

[A]

Let's take a minute.

[B]

But we used to have this joke that.

[A]

But she.

[B]

If I was really tired, I would say, come, just talk to me about physics. And I would just fall asleep. And it was like how we met, because in the beginning, when she was so excited about this particular subject, I was, like, trying to be excited about it, but really just wasn't. And eventually I just acknowledged it's just still not. I'm not there. But I love how soothing it is.

[A]

And I love how it just lulls.

[B]

Me up so I'm having trouble sleeping. She'll do that. But there was a time when I would just fall asleep while she was talking, which was. Luckily, there was no emotions in the physics discussions. It was just her excitement and my lack of excitement. But it's happened before. The. I, I. I'm not proud to say that I've fallen asleep while both of my kids were telling me about their day. And it's, like, late because I am. I'm like, nine o' clock is when I start to just get a little sleepy and I've fallen asleep. It's terrible. So your kids are very durable.

[A]

Luckily, kids are pretty durable.

[B]

But I'm. I like, I remember one time Penelope said, I'm. I. Did you just fall asleep while I was telling her?

[A]

I might have.

[B]

Whoops.

[A]

Okay. But actually, I can see you and raise you, so. My very sweet husband. I like to talk at night. I like to talk all the time. And he's a quiet guy. And one time I knew he was already asleep and I heard him in his sleep go, mm, no. Yes. It was awesome.

[B]

That's so funny. He's just trained.

[A]

He's just trained. And he did it in his sleep.

[B]

So good. How long have you been together?

[A]

We've been married 26 years. And this coming. We're almost 30 years together.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I feel like he's got.

[A]

I'll be 55 this fall, and we met when I was 25.

[B]

So crazy.

[A]

That's so crazy. I know, I know, I know.

[B]

But look, it's changed. He now can listen in his sleep.

[A]

He can now listen or pretend to.

[B]

Listen or pretend to listen to sleep. Yes. But I really like this editor idea because it feels like if you struggle to listen, it works. It really lets somebody know you're listening.

[A]

Well, and then. And then you can try your headline. You can say, oh, is it like this? And you don't even have to get it right, because you could be like, no, but it's like this, right? But they will see, like, you are trying. You are really putting your effort into it. So either you don't produce a headline at all, which you really don't need to, they can just tell you're listening, or you produce one. And I mean, rare occasions, they're like, yes, that is it. And if you're off, they don't. They're very forgiving because they can.

[B]

Because you were listening, you were trying.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And now for a quick break. All right, I'm going to tell you about SUV because this is like a whole other level of meal prep and coolness that I only just learned about. So this is a way to feed your family without any planning, prepping, or exhausting cleanup. Does that sell you? SUVI is a smart countertop oven and a flexible meal delivery service. So they have a kitchen robot that has built in refrigeration. Is that not so cool? You can set up dinner in the morning, leave, and Suvi will keep it cold until it's time to cook. So you don't even have to be home to start it. You just have this tap to cook technology. You can prep dinner in a couple of minutes, load the meals into the sous vide cooking pans and tap the card to your appliance and set what time you want the food to be ready. I think that's mind blowing. And since we're all trying to figure out how to get all the meals and all of the stuff done in the day, sous vide kitchen robot feels like the Jetsons has come true. So go to s u v I-e.com humans to get 16 free meals when you order. That's s u v I e.com humans save time, eat better with Suvi. That's s u v ie.com humans to get 16 Free Meals when you order. Flavcity's mission is simple. Upgrade your everyday with better for you sips. From protein smoothies to anytime essential drink mixes with collagen, fiber and electrolytes, they make it easy and delicious to sweat junky drinks for real ingredients. And with Flav City, what you see is what you get. Every ingredient is real, recognizable and trustworthy. There are no fillers, no fake stuff. And now they're bringing the same real, craveable approach to coffee. My favorite Thing with Flav City Cafe so you can say goodbye to your barista and make your coffee ritual crafted instead of manufactured. It's made with real ingredients and you can skip the coffee shop line and have Flav City Cafe to give you barista worthy lattes in seconds for a fraction of the cost. They just launched seven lattes made with 100% grass fed whole milk. The flavors are my favorite vanilla latte and there's also salted caramel macchiato and chocolate chunk mocha and cinnamon and just so many. And for a limited time there's pumpkin spice latte because you know, Halloween. Visit shopflafcity.com and use the code goodhumans15 at checkout for 15 off your first purchase. That's S H O P F l a v C-I-T-Y.com Use the code Goodhumans15 for 15% off your first order. Exclusively for raising good humans. Listening. Okay, so we. Do we get the answer to the trash bag? Do we know when to close the trash bag? I think we got. We did.

[A]

Yeah. Like, I think. Yeah. Yeah. Don't let him ruminate. And if it doesn't feel better. Okay. We're concerned. Yeah.

[B]

Now if, if the concerns are the same every day, but they seem okay when they're finished dumping. Are you.

[A]

I think that's probably the reality, right. That I have had years where one of my daughters had a very, very, very tedious classmate and they were in close, you know, sitting next to that kid at a table or something and they held it together really well all day with the catalog of the things that kid did that was really tough. And every dinner was the catalog, unpacking, you know, and it was just. And I think it was like, yeah, the kid was hard all year and my kid held it together all year. And this was the bargain is that dinner was all about this kid. And then, and so then that's an interesting moment, right, because it's not great. It's not great for them. It's not great. You know, it doesn't make for nice dinners. I think, you know, the kinds of things that I would find myself saying, I would say, you know, like that sounds incredibly hard, you know, and I'm sure that that kid is coming by it honestly. Like, you know, if it was sort of in the range of like just a kid who's sort of of bumping along through development in a hard way, you know, to say, I'm sure the kid's coming by it honestly, like, I don't doubt that that's really frustrating to sit next to. I'm sure there's a reason why this is happening. I will say in my particular circumstance, I never intervened. I never called the school. I never said, does my kid really have to sit next to this kid? I happen to have two daughters who are very capable at school. They can handle this without it disrupting their learning. And so for me, I was like, you know what? You got to be able to live in the world, and this is not a real problem for you. This is an annoyance for you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I will say, if I had a kid who I didn't have that particular endowment, like, where, you know, where this was actually arriving as an act, a real problem in school, I. I probably would have, you know, checked in to see if, like, you know, there could be a little bit of rearrangement of seats for just a little while. But I. I think it does get to something interesting, though, that happens. And you've had this happen too, where a kid is talking about your own kid, is talking about another kid and talking about them a lot. And it may be a kid who's having a really hard time or even being really unkind. And I think that there's sort of an interesting dynamic around, like, what do you say? Like, what do you say as an adult? And so I've always tried to, you know, I'm sure they come by it honestly. Or that does sound hard. Or like, I hope they grow through that. Like, I will say that.

[B]

I like that. I hope they grow through that.

[A]

Yeah. Because kids grow and change all the time. What I don't love, and you probably feel the same way. I have seen kids grow and change so much, and development is so long. I don't love it when adults are like, yeah, well, that kid's a bully. Right. Those words are sticky. They are hard to shake. So I will say, look, that kid's not handling power well. Why don't you steer clear of them till they figure it out? I think there's ways you can acknowledge what's happening and make it. Attach it to the timeframe you're in without indicting a child development.

[B]

True confessions. So I'm more careful about that with my daughters, but with their friends, I'm so. I'm so immature. So, like, like my, like my daughter's best friend, whom I love like a. Like, yes, I know this feels.

[A]

I know exactly how this feels.

[B]

You know what I mean? She's sun, moon and stars. She has a couple friends. I just don't care For.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I have such a hard time when she talks about them not being like, well, you know why?

[A]

Because that kid's a drunk.

[B]

Yeah. And I'm like, I watch myself. My best friend watches me and she's like, I cannot believe what a hypocrite you are. Because I'm like acting in this very bizarre role of. I'm not a mom in this position. I'm like her aunt friend or something. I don't know what I am, but I'm not proud of it. Because mom or not mom, I would rather not shit talk a child. That's not cool. And so I struggle with that sometimes because it's not just what we say to our kids, it's how we live our lives and how we move through the world. And I was watching myself do that the other day with this teenager whom I adore, and I. And she was smirking because she kind of knew I didn't even say anything. I kind of just made a face and she was like, I know. And. And I was thinking, I really need to be as mindful about that with other people's kids as I am with my own, because that's just not helpful to anyone. And it's so true. These guys are evolving and changing. Who they are today has nothing to do with. If you're Talking about a 35 year old, they might be a little more set in their ways. You might have a real picture of what they've become. But these are changing.

[A]

They're changing fast. But that is interesting about giving us more latitude.

[B]

I'm not proud.

[A]

No. But it's sort of fascinating to think about how that comes to be. And I think part of what our universe is informed by is that like, we're very Midwestern. Right. It's like a very funny, wonderful thing to be in the Midwest where like, I can't do.

[B]

You can't behave like I do.

[A]

Well, no, you actually. It's just like, it's just not done. Right. I mean, it's just like. And, and people think, and then maybe there's some truth to it, like that we're sort of like pulling our punches. But I think there's a gentleness in the language that we all understand the code of. Right? So like, if you say to God, oh, that person's not my favorite. Right. It means you can't stand their guts. Right?

[B]

Right, Right, right, right.

[A]

So it's funny. Like, it's not that we don't have strong opinions, it's that we haven't agreed.

[B]

Upon A graceful way.

[A]

Yes, yes, yes. Agreed upon discourse. If you say, I don't really know that person, that means I can't. I really don't like that person at all. And I'm not getting into it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's. And so it's.

[B]

Keep on coming, Lisa. I want more of that.

[A]

Do you want more of the Midwestern translators?

[B]

Yes, we do. I think they're really good habits to give our kids by living in this. I'm gonna. I was born in Columbus, Ohio. I could use this. I can do it.

[A]

What I. Okay. And I do. I like. I'm such. I'm like. I really. I'm compulsively honest, so I don't. Like, there's. I want to be open to the idea. Like, is it disingenuous if we say, like, you know what, that, you know, not my favorite. You know, we all understand, to be.

[B]

Severe, what it means.

[A]

Like, we can say just this much and everybody knows what we mean, and we'll leave it at that. You want more? Okay, so.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You like this. Okay. If somebody wants you to do something you don't want to, you say, oh, I'm okay. I'm okay.

[B]

My stepson says that, by the way.

[A]

That's, like, absolutely not.

[B]

I'm okay means that. That's funny. Truly. My stepson, Will says I'm okay every time I ask him about, like, doing something that is totally. And it's so sweet the way he says it, but. Okay, I'm gonna translate it.

[A]

Yeah. That means, like, definitely no way.

[B]

Definitely no way. Not happening.

[A]

Yeah. No, I. It's so. It's kind of a wonderful. It's kind of a wonderful thing. Yeah. But the number one indictment of somebody.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They're a character. Yeah. You don't want to be called that.

[B]

I did not know that, Lisa.

[A]

Well, that person. That person's a character. So, anyway, there's your Midwestern translator.

[B]

Okay. But I think those are really good habits because they're ways of just saying enough that you're a person.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But not. Yeah, you have an opinion, but you don't need to make a mess anywhere, and you don't need to hurt it.

[A]

I mean, of course, there are plenty of Midwesterners who violate all of those rules, but I think there. There is something that. I think that is sort of an agreed upon kind of, you know, style.

[B]

I'm going to change. I'm shifting my way of speaking.

[A]

You're going Midwestern? Are you going.

[B]

Yeah, I'm going to go Midwestern because I Think it's hypocritical if I have this expectation that I'm going to do this in my house and then, you know, with my kids. It's like. It's like when you compliment somebody's. If you've said to your kids, these are not values that we hold as important. And then you go out in the world and you, like, compliment that thing with someone else. Like, if you're staring at bodies all day, except for at home, you're like, oh, I would never talk about bodies.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it was. It's true. And nothing, nothing highlights one's hypocrisies like having adolescents. I will tell you, they're really good at pointing them out. And I have a lot.

[B]

It's so true. It is so true. It's also interesting because, you know, you can't use a script with them because they're like, I'm onto you, so don't do your thing with me.

[A]

It's true. Like, you cannot put anything past them. They can tell when you're trying to, you know, play them in one way or another. I think I've always felt like if I can do, if I can maintain the respect of teenagers, that will be for me, all I could ever want.

[B]

Now I really imagine that when everybody is trying to maintain the respect of teenagers, or I think that that's like, what is a better compliment? But I think maybe it gets misunderstood and you try to befriend teenagers, and that maybe isn't the same thing.

[A]

No, I'll give you a good example. I'll give you a good example. Okay, so say I have a kid who shows up in my practice because no, often when I've been seeing kids, I've been seeing girls because she had to leave a party really drunk, right? And it got really scary. And as part of trying to make things right, kid ends up with me. And so, of course, my job is to say, talk to me about your drinking, and I will listen to whatever the kid has to say. And sometimes I'll say, yeah, I'm not sure I agree with you. Okay, right. Like, she'll say, like, oh, it's no big deal. Like, everybody does this. Like, everybody's overreacting. And I'll say, you know, I'm not sure I see it the same way. Or I will, you know, just sticking on the drinking thing. Like, I'll have a kid say. I'll say, do you think you have a problem with drinking? You know, and I'll listen to what they have to Say, and sometimes they'll be like, actually, I do. I mean, that's what I love about teenagers, is you can just ask a straight question, and if they can tell you're really asking, they will give you a real answer. And then sometimes kids will say, like, ah, da, da, da, da, da, da. And then I'll say, well, I'm not sure if I think you have a problem with drinking or not. I'm gonna keep just. We're gonna just keep getting to know each other, and I'm gonna let you know what I think. So, like, it doesn't have to be pandering or complimentary or anything. Like, I have said very hard things to kids. What they want is that you are playing your cards face up. That's all they care about. They don't actually care. They don't care what the cards are. They want them face up.

[B]

Amy, you know how I put a lot of quotes on Instagram per episode? This is like. This is just. I'm listening. I can give you that headline. And also, I'm like, oh, my God. These are really helpful reminders. Yes, they will take. You're absolutely right.

[A]

And another version of this is, if you ask teenagers, do they want the teacher who's trying to be cool and get along with the kids? No, they want the straight shooting, earnest adult who likes teenagers. They want adults to be adults, but desperately want adults to be adults. They just want adults to like teenagers. That's. That's all they care about.

[B]

Well, I think you and I both agree that there is nothing better than teenagers. Literally nothing better. And I. I think you have very much. I think you probably are responsible for rebranding adolescence in general because it's, like, so awesome. It's, of course, hard, but they're so awesome.

[A]

And, well, if that's what I. If I. It means the world that you think I've done that. I don't know. I think you have. I feel like then I should just retire right now, because that is as much as I could ever hope to accomplish in my career. Please note that this episode may contain.

[B]

Paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a.

[A]

Direct or indirect financial interest in products.

[B]

Or services referred to in this episode.