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Dr. Peter McCullough: Spike Protein Detox, Blood Clots & COVID Vaccine Effects Explained
01:31:20
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- [00:00]
Courtney Swan
On today's episode of the Real Foodology
- [00:02]
Dr. Peter McCullough
podcast, Covid vaccination in women of childbearing potential, men of childbearing potential, and in pregnant women was a giant disaster. It's never done for other new experimental drugs. It never should have been done for the COVID vaccines. These special groups should have been excluded.
- [00:21]
Courtney Swan
Hello, friends. Welcome back to another episode of the Real Foodology podcast. I am your host, Courtney Swan, and Today's guest is Dr. Peter McCullough. I was so excited when we booked this episode. If you were following me during COVID you know that I have been following this man for a long time. I'm so grateful that I found his work then because he was sharing a lot of science and research that was going against the mainstream narrative. And guess what? He ended up being right about all of it. He is so incredible. He is so well spoken, he is so smart. He is one of the most published cardiologists in his field. He has over 700 published peer reviewed medical journals. And we talk about that. But more importantly, we talk about if you did get the vaccine, things that you can do now, things to test for, what to look for, if you're dealing with any sort of side effects and you're concerned about maybe what it looks like for the future. We talk about all of that. We talk about how you can detox. This is a very requested episode from my audience because when I shared the few times that I did about this product that dissolves the spike proteins, I am still getting messages to this day about it and for good reason. A lot of people took this and a lot of people are concerned now about the science that's coming out afterwards. But let me tell you, this is such an amazing episode. Do not shy away from it. Do not be scared. Do not be like, you know what? I'm just not actually going to listen to this because I'm terrified of what he's going to say because actually the episode made me feel so much better about all my loved ones that got it. He has amazing, tangible tips. We talk about the science behind everything and it just was such a fascinating episode. I really hope that you love it. If you could take a moment to rate and review the podcast, it would mean so much to me, really, especially for this episode in particular, because this is such a hot topic that I can already see that I'm probably gonna get some hate comments and ratings and reviews that are gonna try to bring down my podcast. But I just felt like this was a really important episode to get out there. And Peter McColla is such a pleasure. I loved sitting down with him. He's such a sweet man and really just wants to help people and it's so apparent in this episode. So I really hope that you enjoy it also. Stay tuned to the very end. We're gonna share a code and a link if you wanna get his Spike detox protocol at a discount. When your mitochondria work better, everything just works better. And if you're like me, you've realized that you can't out train out coffee or out willpower low energy anymore. There was a time when I could get away with bad sleep and still feel fine. 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Cowboy Colostrum is whole, full fat, high protein, and incredibly nutrient dense, which is why it's considered the highest quality bovine colostrum you can buy. It's super easy to use, too. You just add a scoop of their chocolate, chocolate Madagascar vanilla, which is my favorite matcha or strawberry into your coffee or smoothie, and it genuinely makes you feel good all day. And beyond gut support, these peptides and growth factors help your skin and hair look amazing. For a limited time, our listeners get up to 25 off their entire order. Just head to cowboycolostrum.com RealFoodology and use code RealFoodology at checkout. That's 25% off when you use code REAL FOODOLOGY@cowboycolostrum.com Real Foodology. All right, well, Dr. McCullough, thank you so much for coming on the Real Foodology podcast.
- [05:29]
Dr. Peter McCullough
I can't believe I finally made it here, and it's right here in Dallas. I just live a few miles away, so.
- [05:34]
Courtney Swan
Amazing. Well, I was actually here filming for Dr. Phil, and we've been talking to your team about bringing you on. And when I realized that it was in Dallas and you're in Dallas, I was like, I need to get Peter on this podcast.
- [05:45]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, we made it. We made it happen. So much to talk about. Make America healthy again. Yes. It's on everybody's minds.
- [05:53]
Courtney Swan
It is, and it's very exciting. I've been waiting for this for a long time, and I'm sure you feel the same way. I started real foodology in 2011, so I've been talking about this for 14 years. And for a long time, I felt like I was really screaming into a void. And, you know, some people were listening and paying attention, but it's really cool to see that people are really starting to wake up and pay attention.
- [06:15]
Dr. Peter McCullough
I agree. I've always counseled my patients. You know, I think every doctor, nurse, and healthcare professional should have the ability to give brief advice. Of course, brief is important. And when I give my brief advice, my brief advice with respect to food and diet, I say, really, there's two elements to this. Healthy choices and portion control.
- [06:39]
Courtney Swan
Yeah. And emphasis on healthy choices. And unfortunately, what's happening right now, many Americans think they're making healthy choices, but our food corporations are adding so many additives and fillers and preservatives in there. And it's also happening in our restaurants, too. So if you think that you're going out and you're getting a healthy meal. There's a lot of additives and stuff in there that they don't have in other countries. And it's really sad because Americans want to be healthy and they're trying really hard. They're trying really hard to feed their families well. And they're getting duped by these large corporations.
- [07:07]
Dr. Peter McCullough
About 25% of all meals are eaten outside the home.
- [07:10]
Courtney Swan
Yeah.
- [07:11]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So that's a big part of it. And you're right, that's where you lose control completely. And many, many, many generations, including mine, was raised during the time where the moniker was clean your plate. Clean your plate. There's people less privileged than you in the world. And as the portion sizes got bigger and bigger, and the reason why they got bigger is not because the restaurants want to give away more food. It's because they were responding to consumer demand. So consumers felt like, listen, that was kind of a small portion. I'm not very satisfied. And the restaurants would get this feedback. So portion size have increased and again, people lose control over food content. And that's an area where you're quite an expert.
- [07:54]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, exactly. Well, and we were just speaking right before we started recording. I spoke to the Senate last fall with Senator Ron Johnson, Bobby Kennedy, Michaela, and Jordan Peterson, the food babe. So many people. And I, I'm really grateful for that opportunity because I feel like that really started the, the spark of interest for Americans in this country with Maha. I feel like it kind of prepped people because all of those videos that we did went super viral and, and everyone started going, wait, yeah. Why are American companies making different products here in the US For American children versus what they're making for American, or, sorry, children in the uk do you know about this? Yeah, well, the Fruit Loops and all
- [08:34]
Dr. Peter McCullough
the other products, it's astonishing. I was recently on Fox business with Liz McDonald and she had the data about how so many food additives, you know, dyes, preservatives, fillers, thickeners, how they're prohibited, for instance, in Europe, but they're allowed in the United States. And there's been a loophole called generally recognized as safe G R A S that previously the companies just asserted, well, it's generally recognized as safe. Trust our judgment. That may close.
- [09:05]
Courtney Swan
I really hope so. Bobby actually just mentioned this recently that he wants to get rid of that, and I think it's incredible. So hopefully we can get rid of that. And they just announced about the baby formula. They're going to clean that up, which I'm really excited about too. There's a lot of really exciting things happening right now, for sure.
- [09:19]
Dr. Peter McCullough
You know, people don't realize how public health policy can favorably affect foods, particularly with respect to fortification. This has been something the MAHA group hasn't talked about yet. But when I was a kid, I'll never forget the children in my school with spina bifida. And spina bifida is a problem where the lower end of the spinal canal, the neural tube doesn't develop normally. And the children had a characteristic gait of a pigeon toed gait. And what was terrible is they had no control over their rectum. And so even kids as they went through K12 had to wear diapers. And it was very noticeable by the other kids. It largely afflicted the Irish. Now I'm Irish, you could be Irish as well by looking at your features. And it was all due to a lack of folate in the diet. And the Irish are particularly affected with an impairment of methylation called mthfr, Methylene tetrahydrofolic acid reductase deficiency. And through public health efforts, the food supply was fortified with folate. So we saw folate in a whole variety of foods, cereals, what have you. And honestly, the rate of neural tube defects plummeted. And you don't see little kids with spina bifida before just recently on my substack focal points. Everybody should subscribe to Focal Points. It's free. Get your email. Every day we have an analysis in a peer reviewed published literature that now has suggested that the minimum daily requirement of vitamin D, which is set at 600 international units a day, really should be over 9,000 international units a day. No wonder we have manifestations of vitamin D deficiency, including osteoporosis, cardiovascular disease, neurodegenerative disease, predilection to infections.
- [11:13]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, yeah. Vitamin D rates are super low in this country and a lot of chronic diseases are connected to that. Right. A deficiency in vitamin D. Yeah. Okay, so I want to move the direction of this a little bit because the reason that I found you was during COVID and if, if you're down to talk about it, I would really like to talk about the spike proteins and all that. So I just first of all want to say I'm so incredibly grateful for the work that you've done over the years because I know it hasn't been easy. You were, or you are one of the most published cardiologists in your field, right? Yeah. So I want people to really understand that because I know before you came out and you started talking about the vaccines and everything that you were really concerned about. Everyone was, you were revered as this cardiologist that has been published so many times in medical journals. And then they really tried to smear you when you came out against this narrative. And I, first of all, I want to know, what was that like? What was your experience with that?
- [12:12]
Dr. Peter McCullough
I was stunned. And as you mentioned, I'm in practice as an internist cardiologist. I'm trained in epidemiology, widely published. And the publication part of this is important because every single peer reviewed publication as the first or senior author, that's really where the line is being towed by academic physicians. It's almost equivalent to a PhD thesis, each one of them. Some manuscripts take two to four years to publish. These are labors. I mean, these are major, major deals. They become part of permanent medical history. The average professor of Medicine has about 25 of these listings in the National Library of Medicine. Yeah, I'm over 700. That's incredible. 700. I was over 600 going into the pandemic. And I had lectured all over the world. I was the named endowed visiting professor at Harvard in 2019 in two divisions, Cardiology and nephrology. And so when the pandemic basically beset upon us, I didn't see it coming. I got into response mode like so many other people, and I started waiting, like, where is Harvard Infectious Disease, Department of Medicine to give us a plan on what we should do. Well, it's not coming. It's not coming. Well, how about Mayo Clinic? There's nothing there. How about Emory? Nothing there. And we kept going and going. Wait a minute. Who is going to step up and give us an approach on how to treat patients to avoid two major bad outcomes, hospitalization and death? It became very clear we were all going to get this. We couldn't avoid it. And what my patients told me said, Dr. McCullough, listen, I'm willing to get this illness. I'm seeing everybody else get it too. But I don't want to be hospitalized. I don't want to die. And to this day, our blue ribbon marquee institutions do not have a protocol to be deployed to help their patients avoid hospitalization and death. We're five years into this. This is the biggest shortcoming, the biggest collapse of academic medicine I could ever have imagined.
- [14:20]
Courtney Swan
It just doesn't make sense. Right? You would think that you wouldn't want to flood the hospital. So why are we not getting people on protocols early so that we can Avoid them going to the hospital. Because also pretty much everyone knew once you went to the hospital it was possibly game over.
- [14:35]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, that's an important observation. If we look at death, virtually every death occurred in the hospital. Deaths were not occurring in the home. So there was something about the hospital that appeared to be in the causal pathway of death. We're talking about acute COVID 19. This is a respiratory illness where like any other acute upper respiratory tract infection, the principles are throughout medicine, whether it's a virus, a bacteria or other cause, early treatment is always better than waiting too late.
- [15:08]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, yeah, it was interesting. I also had a similar experience as you. So I have a master's of science in nutrition and I studied the human body, you know, a lot in my master's program. And I also knew a lot about the immune system. And I remember very early on because I had a following back then on Instagram as well. I was very careful because I didn't want to say anything definitively, but I was going on my stories and saying, hey, you know, I do know this about the immune system. It's good to make sure your vitamin D levels are up. Let's make sure you get vitamins. And I was very careful to say, you know, obviously we don't know what, how this is going to actually affect COVID 19, but I do know these things about the immune system and if you do these few things, you'll probably be in pretty good shape. And they started censoring me. My stories were getting deleted, my reels were getting deleted.
- [15:52]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Just helpful things like that.
- [15:53]
Courtney Swan
Just really simple stuff like that.
- [15:55]
Dr. Peter McCullough
General helpful advice.
- [15:57]
Courtney Swan
Oh yeah.
- [15:57]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Was being censored.
- [15:58]
Courtney Swan
Yeah. And there was the, the hashtag. I can't remember what the exact hashtag was, but I think it was naturalimmunity for. On Instagram, blocked for years. You couldn't even use that hashtag. Yeah.
- [16:12]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So that type of advice that we've just heard from Courtney would apply to the common cold, it would apply to influenza. It's just, you know, these are general observations supported by many, many peer reviewed papers that the immune system for sure, when there's deficiencies, if there's deficiencies of vitamin D, vitamin C, zinc, and we can go on and on, clearly it puts people at risk. And the converse is true. If we supplement, very likely the immune system is supported. So what we've learned through the pandemic is for instance, zinc in low levels, certainly during acute infection. Vitamin C for sure. Vitamin D for sure. Echinacea. Okay. Elderberry garlic has anti infective properties. In fact, there is a paper from Poland that I quoted that healthier diets and there's a way to grade healthier diets in terms of the macronutrient composition were protective against severe disease and the occurrence of disease with acute COVID 19 compared to unhealthy diets. I mean this was in peer reviewed comparative literature. So if anything early on, you know we should have had the public health messaging of come on everybody, this is serious. Let's everybody get on a healthy diet, let's get on a fitness regimen, let's consider supplements that you know in this category, Courtney's category of general healthy advice to get ready and as we analyze the data after the fact now it all made a huge difference for those who took these positive steps.
- [17:57]
Courtney Swan
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- [21:03]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Right. So this principle of risk stratification was very important. And we learned early that the biggest risk factor for being hospitalized or dying with COVID was older age. Then it was medical problems like diabetes, heart disease, kidney failure, obesity, cancer. And so because of the fact that even 40% of the deaths at the end of the day occurred in people who were beyond their life expectancy. So if life expectancy for a woman, let's say at that time, was 83, it means people in their upper 80s towards the end of their lives. Conversely, the risks for someone like you, young, healthy, vibrant, exercising, good diet, were so sufficiently negligible that I completely concurred with Dr. Bhattachara and Martin Kolldorf and Sunicha Guptra with the Great Barrington Declaration. For people like you and me, there should have been no restrictions. None. No lockdowns, no social distancing, no masking, no hand sanitizers, just going about our Lives as we normally do. 97% of people in our country developed COVID 19. Think about all the efforts to reduce the spread. Masks, hand sanitizers, social distancing. How about contact tracing? Oh my God, I touched you. You touched me. All of that was a complete waste of time. What we should have had the operating principle of listen, this is like a bad influenza. Everyone's gonna get it. Let's brace ourselves and take reasonable steps. That would have been a much better public policy. Yet to this day, we haven't heard that type of paradigm expressed by our public health officials or anybody really high up in government.
- [22:50]
Courtney Swan
I mean, it's a travesty. And we were just talking about comorbidities and it reminded me of something that I found so fascinating. And I'm wondering, listeners have heard this. So I remember in the beginning, because it was a respiratory infection, they were really concerned about smokers. But then what did you find about smokers? They were actually protected. And why is that?
- [23:08]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Very interesting. I was greatly worried about smoking. Now when I was a kid, smoking was 50% prevalence in adults. Now it's about 17.6%. What we know there is that nicotine actually, because smokers actually uniquely keep their nicotine levels up all the time. If you ever notice, they're always going outside to smoke when the nicotine levels go down, down. That nicotine blocks the spike protein, which is spine on the surface of the virus, its interaction with nicotinic acetylcholine receptors. And uniquely, you know, I've seen thousands of patients with acute Covid and now with long Covid and vaccine syndromes. I don't think I've ever seen a smoker with serious long Covid or vaccine injury syndrome. Not a single one.
- [23:53]
Courtney Swan
That's wild. And let's be very clear for the listeners, we are not condoning smoking. It's obviously very terrible for your lungs. But what was really fascinating about this is that now we know nicotine can dissolve the spike proteins, right?
- [24:06]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, it blocks, doesn't dissolve it. The dissolution of the spike protein is with some other interventions I'm sure we're going to talk about. But nicotine uniquely blocks it stoichiometrically on the receptor. And the observation clinically what I do is for a non smoker, I will recommend the lowest level of a nicotine patch, which is 7 milligrams a day. Patients say it's like a miracle. Their brain fog or loss of mental clarity clears up this numbness and tingling. Some of the other symptoms immediately improve. So this has Been a unique observation. I give credit to a doctor here in Dallas, Dr. Brian Ardus, who made that discovery.
- [24:50]
Courtney Swan
That is so fascinating. Well, this is a little anecdotal story, but my mom and I didn't get the COVID vaccine. But we couldn't keep our dad from getting it, my dad from getting it, and we were so concerned. But then we found out about this research and my dad has been totally fine so far and he was on those little Zyn nicotine pouches the whole time. And my mom and I feel like he was protected because of those.
- [25:13]
Dr. Peter McCullough
It's certainly possible. There's so much we have to learn. And you know, the Biden administration through the HHS Long Covid program, spent a billion dollars researching Long Covid. They never studied nicotine, they never studied the elements of now, McCullough Protocol based spike protein detoxification, never studied ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, colchicine. All the things we use in clinical practice were never studied. They never measured the spike protein either directly or indirectly through antibodies. So a billion dollars of our taxpayer money was completely wasted on, I would say, dumb ideas that have no scientific foundation because the medical community, just as they were lost on the treatment of acute COVID 19, they are equally lost on Long Covid and vaccine injury syndromes. Wow.
- [26:04]
Courtney Swan
Well, let's talk about spike proteins because I have been talking about this a lot recently on my Instagram. Now, first of all, let's define it. What does that actually mean? And what is a spike protein? From COVID itself and from the vaccine, can we differentiate that?
- [26:18]
Dr. Peter McCullough
The virus can be visualized as a ball and on the surface are these spikes, these little spines on spicules on the surface of the virus. Thousands of them per viral particle. The spike protein was intentionally engineered in the Wuhan Institute of Virology. It's now all completely in Congressional reports, all the agencies agree the controversy is over with.
- [26:43]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, the FBI has admitted that and the CIA.
- [26:46]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So the spike protein is a very unnatural protein. And I can tell you as a doctor, I think it's the most dangerous and deadly protein ever devised. And it was devised by mankind. The spike protein gets into the human body and we don't have enzymes to break it down or clear it. It literally gets stuck in our body. Now with the natural infection, just the tip of the spike protein gets in the body. The base of it is sacrificed at the ACE2 receptor. So we have the S1 segment and found within the body. Now, white blood cells tend to grab it pretty Quickly. And Bruce Patterson at NCL DX has published that it's about a year and a half that we can detect S1 segment in patients after they've had the SARS CoV2 infection. No vaccine. So that's a little scary. I've had the infection three times, I've had it twice. So there you go. So all of us have a little piece of Wuhan China in us after having the infection. That's kind of a creepy thought. Well, the vaccine is way worse. Now 94% of people who took a vaccine took Pfizer or Moderna there it's the full length spike protein is installed in the human body. The genetic code runs continuously producing more and more spike protein in the body. No way to shut off that genetic code. We don't know how long the messenger RNA lasts in the body, but I'm telling you it doesn't look good. A study from Stanford showing two months, it could be much longer than that. The spike protein, which from the vaccine again is the full length spike protein, probably far more dangerous, has been found in blood. It travels in trimer, so it twists in threes. It's been found in blood in a study by Brogna in half of vaccine patients, not all of them half circulating for six months. And now a recent study from Yale shows at least nine months this in the blood. Now when it deposits in the heart, the brain, the vital organs, it's probably there for years. And I've come to the conclusion that the body needs enzymatic assistance in clearing it up.
- [28:48]
Courtney Swan
And we're definitely going to talk about that. I just want to line all this up so people really understand. Does the COVID vaccine turn the body into a spike protein making machine? Is that what it does?
- [28:58]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yes.
- [28:59]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, yeah. I have a lot of concerns about it. I mean a lot of people do, obviously you do. But you know, it's affected me personally in the sense that my fiance, who you just met got two doses of the COVID vaccine. My dad got it, a lot of my friends got it. What I know we, we don't really know. Right. Because it was an experiment. But what are you seeing in the studies that have come out? You've kind of said a little bit, but let's dive a little bit further into that. What are you seeing as far as long term effects for this for people? Will they ever be able to turn that off?
- [29:29]
Dr. Peter McCullough
You know, I testified in Congress about a year ago on this and I cited the FDA guidance on genetic technology platforms which Pfizer, Moderna, And Janssen are, and the guidance says we have about a 5 to 15 year window of concern. That's how long lasting they could be. But let's sort through the vaccines first. So Pfizer and Moderna are messenger RNA vaccines. And the messenger RNA is a synthetic genetic code that has been pseudouroginated and it's been intentionally produced to be long lasting in the human body. It's not like normal messenger rna. Our cells make that and we make it and then we dissolve it within a matter of minutes or hours afterwards. The Pfizer Moderna for sure has been found stuck in the human heart for sure. In a paper by Crossan and colleagues. It's been for sure found in lymph nodes as shown by Rolkin and colleagues in Stanford. I mean, this is Harvard and Stanford papers. I mean, these are very solid. That's disturbing. Okay, now Janssen, which is nearly the same as AstraZeneca, that's an adenoviral vector. The body should clear that out.
- [30:38]
Courtney Swan
Is that J&J one?
- [30:39]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yes, JJ, that's Janssen and AstraZeneca. They were actually made by the same biodefense contractor. Another disturbing part of this is these vaccines are not made by drug companies. They're made by military biodefense contractors.
- [30:52]
Courtney Swan
That's creepy.
- [30:53]
Dr. Peter McCullough
That's creepy. So emergent BioSolutions makes AstraZeneca and Janssen, by the way, both off the market. Both off the market.
- [31:00]
Courtney Swan
Do you think, can I ask you really fast, do you think that's because they really wanted to push these genetically modified MRNA vaccines? Because that was my thought too.
- [31:08]
Dr. Peter McCullough
The messenger RNA vaccines from the beginning have had enormous push and support. I mean, so, so much so that Pfizer Moderna contracted with the same PR firm, Weber Shandwick, which is part of IPG Group. It's a huge marketing firm. They had an installed marketing office in the CDC vaccine unit in Atlanta, Georgia.
- [31:30]
Courtney Swan
Yeah.
- [31:31]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Senator Rand Paul wrote Walensky and said, you can't have Pfizer Moderna in your offices. Like an installed marketing firm.
- [31:38]
Courtney Swan
Insane.
- [31:38]
Dr. Peter McCullough
And nothing was done about it. And so Pfizer and Moderna were incessantly pushed. It turns out there's one vaccine that's still on the market that's not a genetic vaccine. That's Novavax. That Novavax is just 5 micrograms of the spike protein only. And you know, I'm like you. I didn't take the COVID vaccine. I'm a doctor. It was not safe enough for me or my wife. But if I had a gun to my head and I had to take a vaccine, it would have been Novavax. Hands down far safer than Pfizer, Moderna or Janssen.
- [32:12]
Courtney Swan
If you're looking for a delicious drink that will improve energy, focus and support healthy inflammation levels and you need to try Paleo Valley's Superfood Golden Milk. It combines the profound, well demonstrated health benefits of turmeric with other nourishing certified organic superfoods such as Lion's mane, Reishi, Cordyceps, Shiitake, Ceylon Cinnamon Ginger and more. Plus they've added organic coconut milk for its brain supportive mcts black pepper, Himalayan Pink Salt and organic monk fruit for an amazing taste and maximal absorption. Inflammation is an important part of the body's natural healing process, but unfortunately our modern lifestyle diets high in sugar, unhealthy fats, stress, allergies, poor sleep, environmental toxins can trigger chronic inflammation which can become the foundation of modern day disease. Turmeric tea is also something that the Okinawans who are known for their longevity, drink on a daily basis. However, turmeric tea can have a harsh bitter taste that does not appeal to everyone. Furthermore, without black pepper, its range of beneficial compounds may not be fully used by the body. Which is why they created a blend of slightly spicy and sweet ingredients that your body can recognize and use efficiently to support heart, healthy levels of inflammation, brain and immune health and overall wellness all in one deliciously creamy drink. To try these Superfood Golden Milk today go to paleovalley.com Real Foodology and you will save 15 off when you use code Real Foodology. Again, that's paleovalley.com RealFoodology this time of year it feels like everyone is trying to stay healthy through the winter months and I'm always looking for for simple, natural and honestly delicious things to add to my routine to just help my immune system stay on track. I've been reaching for Manu kora honey a lot more in the winter, colder weather, more time indoors, travel and just wanting something supportive that actually feels nourishing. What I love most is how rich and creamy it is. This isn't regular honey. It has this depth and complexity that makes it feel almost indulgent, but it's still very intentional for your health. Manicora is ethically produced by master beekeepers in the remote forests of New Zealand where bees collect nectar from the manuka tea tree. That's what gives this honey three times more antioxidants and prebiotics than regular honey which support your gut and that's where most of your immune system lives. It also naturally contains mgo, a rare antibacterial compound that really sets Manuka Honey apart. All you need is one heaped teaspoon in the morning. I love taking it straight off the spoon and letting it melt and coat my throat. But you can also add it to tea, yogurt or smoothies and even use it to replace other sweeteners throughout the day. I also love adding it to my morning coffee. Now it's easier than ever to try. Manukora honey head to manukora.com realfoodology to save up to 31% plus $25 worth of free gifts with the starter kit, which comes with an MGO850 plus Manuka honey jar, five honey travel sticks, sticks, a wooden spoon and a guidebook. That's Manukora. M a n U-K-O-R-A.com real foodology to save 31 plus $25 of free gifts. Wow. I didn't even know about that. The Nova vaccine. I just knew about JJ and I said the same thing. I was like, okay, gun to my head, I'll take J and J, but I don't want to do any of this. And I was so grateful that I had found your work. Very beginning on I, I was already skeptical going into it. I was like this, this seems weird. We're pushing past all of these regulations and we're not doing the long term studies. And then I found your work and I was so grateful for it because, yeah, it just validated what I was feeling.
- [35:45]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, wait a minute. People have pushed back on this and said, Listen, Dr. McCullough, a thousand people were dying a day when the COVID vaccines were released and we didn't have time for long term testing. There was just one month of the primary series, two months of observation and boom, they're on the market. And my response to that is, okay, 1,000 people a day were dying. My analysis is they were largely dying because they weren't treated for COVID 19. So if we would have had a broad early treatment program, we wouldn't have 1,000 people dying a day. And of those adjudicated, it was probably 10% really died of the illness.
- [36:22]
Courtney Swan
And a lot of them were dying from remdesivir. Right.
- [36:25]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, the complications in the hospital, so secondary pneumonias from being on the ventilator, toxicity from remdesivir all played a role. But even having said that, if we just had to have a vaccine program, then it should have been Very limited. So I was leading a proposed research program with a modulon vaccine. I was the co principal investigator and when I presented Operation Warp Speed, I said, listen, if we're gonna do a vaccine, I'd say 2.7 million Americans tops. Nursing home patients, those around them congregate, living settings. That's it. We would never broadly expose the public to a brand new genetic technology. Young people like you who didn't need it, and then children who are growing and developing. And to this day the emergency use authorized vaccines, which the boosters, by the way, are not fully FDA licensed. They've been installed on the ACIP childhood vaccine schedule. Now little children have, at this stage in the pandemic, have negligible risk of any adverse outcome. How in the world could a committee recommend a brand new untested genetic vaccine given on a regular basis to children?
- [37:40]
Courtney Swan
I mean, it's criminal. Especially when we know that, and we knew this at the time, by the way, the emergency use authorization could only be pushed through if there was no other viable medications. And we knew that ivermectin was, was working, we knew that hydroxychloroquine was working and they purposefully suppressed those because they wanted to say, nope, nothing else works. Now we have the ability to push this EUA through.
- [38:05]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah, it could have been technical, but I really don't think so. Remember that Bamlifimab, which was the Lilly product as a monoclonal antibody that was approved, EUA approved before the vaccine. So we actually had, quote, an outpatient solution. That wasn't the issue. I think the reason why, broadly applicable, available, effective strategies that were in this multidrug protocol, McCullough protocol, most widely used protocol out there. And it included a range of choices, by the way. It was Ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, pexlovid, Molnapiravir, Bamalivumab, nasal sprays and gargles. It was really the package. The reason why the whole package was suppressed was to prepare the population to accept only one answer. And that was the vaccine.
- [38:51]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, exactly. And then they stood to make a lot of money off of it.
- [38:54]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Oh my gosh, the money. You know, a blockbuster drug, let's take Lipitor by Pfizer, would take years of development, could be even, you know, half a billion dollars in investment of their own money, of the own money of pharmaceutical companies. If it earned a billion dollars in its first year of sales, it'd be considered a blockbuster. Do you know these vaccines and the government footed all the Bill for development footed all the marketing efforts there'. Salesforce, nothing else. They raked in tens of billions of dollars in their first year. So you could see that now the vaccines became an all powerful part of the biopharmaceutical complex.
- [39:33]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, I mean it's upsetting and it's crazy when you really start to dig into it. I'm curious about this. Is long Covid a thing that you can get simply from the virus or is long COVID vaccine injury?
- [39:47]
Dr. Peter McCullough
You know, there's a paper by Diechner and colleagues in Germany studied tens of thousands of long COVID patients. The conclusion is about 70% of long Covid is really attributable to the vaccine because the vaccine is the main loading of the spike protein in the body. But you know, 30% is just due to the infection itself, but is caused by the spike protein. It's not caused by anything else. So when I tell people, listen, you know, in order to get better you have to get rid of the spike protein. That's the base, everything else on top of it. And some patients say, well, Dr. McCullough, I've been taking antidepressants for years or low dose naltrexone. And they mention all these things. I said, that's not getting rid of the spike protein. We have to rid the body of this as the pathway to restoration of health.
- [40:29]
Courtney Swan
And we're going to dive into that. I just want to dive into everything leading up to it. First, I wanted to ask you about this. The thick white blockages that they've started finding in people's arteries, what are those? I know people have attributed to that, they have attributed those to the vaccine. Do you think that's coming from the spike proteins?
- [40:50]
Dr. Peter McCullough
First off, it's real. These blood clots are real. They are long, they are white, they're bigger than any blood clots we've ever seen. And by the way, I see them in living human beings. It's not just in corpses.
- [41:00]
Courtney Swan
Can people test for these by the way?
- [41:02]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah, we do ultrasound, we can see them. But a typical blood clot that would form in the leg would be a centimeter or two in size. We're seeing blood clots that go from the ankle to the hip. I've never seen blood clots this size. In fact, there's a paper from the fda. Emily Wu is the first author. She published on thousands of blood clots developing after COVID 19 vaccination. Ankle to hip, about 11% are fatal. These are a disaster. And we've had all kinds of public Figures. Now develop these massive blood clots. Lauren Boebert, who's a representative in the House of Representatives from Colorado, develops them and actually needs surgery to pull up blood clots. Now, they can happen with the viral infection and the vaccine. I don't know her vaccine status, but she's been pretty vocal about vaccine safety. So she probably just got it from the virus itself. Kirk Herbstreet, my favorite ESPN announcer. He gets Covid. Long Covid makes the mistake of taking vaccines, develops blood clots, they shoot to his lungs. He's hospitalized. Same thing happened with Al Roker, my favorite weatherman. He took multiple Covid shots publicly on tv, gets Covid blood clots, hospitalized repeatedly. We had Justin Bieber's wife, Hailey Bieber, have a blood clot shoot to the brain. I mean, we can go on and on and on. So what we know is when the blood clots are examined, they're loaded with spike proteins, and the spike protein folds. It's called an amylogenic protein. In any protein that can fold and there's about three dozen of these, it becomes rubber, like so. The rubberiness of the clots and the size of them is due to the spike protein, which continues to drive more thrombosis. My great concern is that all of us who've had Covid and have taken the vaccines, we are all slightly prone to blood clots now.
- [42:56]
Courtney Swan
Yeah.
- [42:56]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So everybody ought to be thinking about this. There is a genetic predisposition of this. We've all been exposed to the spike protein and the circumstances of which blood clots form. For instance, is on long airplane rides, long car rides, when there's immobility of the limbs, spraining your ankle and having an ankle boot or cast, for instance, having surgery, major orthopedic surgery is at risk for blood clots. So everybody should be on alert for blood clots and do everything they can to prevent them.
- [43:27]
Courtney Swan
So what is being on alert for blood clots look like? Like, if you suspected you would have a blood clot, what would be maybe some of the symptoms to look for?
- [43:35]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Swollen leg. I've had college students get swollen arms. We've seen athletes develop symptomatic thoracic outlet obstruction syndrome and develop a blood clot in their arm. Actually, the defensive player of the year in the NBA, just San Antonio Spurs. He's out because of a blood clot in his arm.
- [43:52]
Courtney Swan
Oh, wow.
- [43:54]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Certainly related to increased blood clotting either from COVID or the vaccine or both. I've had several people in my practice here in Dallas take The shot in their arm, and then immediately the whole arm develops a blood clot in the next few days.
- [44:07]
Courtney Swan
That is so frightening.
- [44:09]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah. So I mean, I went on Fox business with Liz McDonald and that's, you know, that's an audience, that's Wall street, that's, you know, the kind of straight laced business community. And I went on with her and I just kind of let the anchors run with this. She goes, Dr. McCullough, what's going on with these vaccines? One of my friends took a vaccine. Two days later he's hospitalized with blood clots. I was like, well, I don't need to tell Wall street about the danger of these shots. Liz is gonna do it for me.
- [44:37]
Courtney Swan
That's amazing. I love that. Okay, so that's one of the concerns about the vaccines. There's also the concern that the body's gonna continue making the spike proteins. And now I'm actually concerned that since I got Covid a couple times that I might have spike proteins in my blood. So how can people get their blood tested for the spike proteins?
- [44:55]
Dr. Peter McCullough
There's no FDA cleared way to directly measure the spike protein. I mentioned the Yale assay that just was recently published. There is a Brogna method in Italy. Multiple companies are racing to do this, by the way. One company far along in this is called Albany Labs. But what is available to us now is an indirect proxy of how much spike protein is there. And that is measurement of antibodies against the spike protein. So it's in a immunologic measure. But if the spike protein is reducing or out of the body, there's no reason to produce antibodies. And so the antibodies fall. So the most popular test is called the LabCorp Extended Range Anti spike antibody test. The manufacturer of the essay is Roche Alexis. And the interpretive framework here is less than 0.8 is normal. That's very rare. I've only seen a few people in my practice less than 0.8. Anything less than a thousand is actually a good number. So if you had it done, it'd be less than 1000. Or if your fiance had it done, it would reassure you that, you know, there's not much spike in the system greater than 1,000. You know, watch out. I've seen yesterday in the office, I saw patients with 5,000, 10,000, 15,000, over 25,000. And at that level, the blood clots and heart damage are almost ubiquitous. So when we see a high anti spike number, we know we need detoxification.
- [46:19]
Courtney Swan
Yeah. Wow. Is there any concern? Because I know there was a lot of concern. Around fertility. And this was one of the many reasons that I did not get this vaccine, because I've always wanted to be a mom. Is there a concern. Do I need to be worried? And you can be very honest. It's okay. I can handle the truth. But is there any concern that since my fiance got it, that I need to be worried? Worried about our future children?
- [46:41]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Okay, so let's just tackle fertility. Sounds like it's a topic of personal interest for you. An interest to actually many people. Courtney's viewers. Sure. So fertility depends on a woman's cycle to be perfectly timed. So there is the generation of the egg. There's release of the egg, it travels in the fallopian tubes, it meets the sperm. It. There's conception that occurs there. The nascent embryo lands in the uterus. It has to implant and then begin to grow. Okay. So that is a very carefully timed cycle. Anything that throws off that cycle, by definition, will lead to infertility. Right. Because it has to be a perfectly timed cycle, because when the egg is released, the uterus is getting ready. If the egg is released too early or too late, it's out of phase with the uterus, for instance. Right. And even if it's released too early or too late, the fallopian tubes are not advancing it along. So the timing of the female cycle is the first part of the fertility equation. So what do we know there? Well, large numbers of women who had Covid had their periods disrupted for months afterwards. That's been shown. There is a research program called My Cycle Story, but the EVA project, there's been a ton of research on this. It is true that when women take the vaccines, their menstrual cycles are enormously disturbed for a long period of time.
- [48:11]
Courtney Swan
It's happened to a lot of my friends. Yeah, I had several friends come to me and say they regretted taking it because of this.
- [48:16]
Dr. Peter McCullough
But Courtney is even more nuanced. If you did not take the vaccine, but if you are around a friend who did take the vaccine, it influences your cycle in about 70% of cases.
- [48:30]
Courtney Swan
I heard this too.
- [48:31]
Dr. Peter McCullough
70%. So this is well known in the literature. And so that's the process called shedding. So on the female side, we're kind of set up for infertility that hopefully is transient. Now, on the male side, I'm more convinced that it is transient. And there's two papers, one from Israel, one from China, both showing that when a man takes a shot and the two indices of male fertility are sperm count and motility, and they're different. But in the two analyses after the shot, both sperm count and motility go down for about six months and they rebound. So the men predictably rebound. So I'm hopeful that as we go farther and farther away from the shots, farther and farther away from COVID that we won't have problems with fertility and we won't have problems with conception and organogenesis. And the great disturbing news from Thorp and colleagues in multiple papers has shown that there is an increased risk of birth defects in women who've taken the vaccine. Not in women who've had Covid, but in women who've taken the vaccine. That's been shown. It's worse if you take a vaccine right during pregnancy. There's also a risk of fetal hemorrhage and maternal hemorrhage that occurs and obviously, as you can imagine, with that, a great risk of fetal loss. So fetal loss is defined as a miscarriage in the first trimester, which the natural rate is about 15%, but that's markedly amplified with the vaccines. Stillbirth is defined as loss of pregnancy in the middle trimester, about 20 weeks. That should be less than 1% that has been increased with the vaccines. And then in this recent analysis from Thorpe, premature delivery, defined as having a baby before 37 weeks, is increased with the vaccines. And when the baby is delivered, increased risk of hemorrhage, both for the mother and the baby. So Covid vaccination in women of childbearing potential, men of childbearing potential, and in pregnant women was a giant disaster. It's never done for other new experimental drugs. It never should have been done for the COVID vaccines. These special groups should have been excluded.
- [50:48]
Courtney Swan
It was criminal, in my opinion. It was completely criminal that they even suggested it. And I'm so grateful that I didn't do it. Also, I'm grateful. It sounds like I kind of was protected from both sides of this because my fiance got it about three years ago, probably maybe four. Four years ago, and I wasn't around him then. We. We hadn't even met yet. Because I always say I wish I'd met him then because I would have saved him from this, because he would have definitely not gotten it. But so I. I was protected from the shedding, although I probably got a lot of it in, in la, let's be real. And we're far enough away now. And I also have him on your ultimate spike detox, which we're going to talk about in a minute.
- [51:26]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Right? That's probably the biggest we'll get to that. But, you know, the point is, there's great hope now that whether how many times people have gotten Covid or how many times I've gotten the vaccines, there's something they could do now to cleanse their bodies. And we'll talk about detoxification and we'll talk about other assistive methods. So this is very important lifestyle methods.
- [51:48]
Courtney Swan
Amazing. I love that. I want to ask you one more question about the vaccines and stuff, and then we'll go into the detox protocol, because I know this is something my audience is very, very intrigued by. Every time I bring this up in my Instagram, I get. Get just loads of DMS about it because a lot of my following got it. A lot of. Or a lot of their loved ones got it. So my last question I wanted to ask you about was the pericarditis and the myocarditis that we were seeing from the vaccines. I personally, one of my really good girlfriends got one shot and got pericarditis from it. And she was in and out of the ER for over a year. And her cardiologist, and this was actually wild to me because this was in 2021. Her cardiologist told her, then, you cannot get any more vaccines. This is from the COVID vaccine. And I was like, wow. He actually told her that. And then actually, more recently this week, I made a new friend who. Who was working with me with the Dr. Phil stuff, and he got myocarditis from the vaccine. And before that, he had been an avid mountain biker and had to completely give up his mountain biking because of the. The injury that he got from the vaccine that he got myocarditis from.
- [52:49]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah. So many public figures have gotten myocarditis, and the FDA says the vaccines cause myocarditis. This is not controversial. It's right in the package. Insert Pfizer Moderna. You can get myocarditis, heart inflammation, heart damage from the vaccines. So this is not something that really anyone denies. Now, two studies, one by Mansugi and one by Bergen, where they had all the measurements of the EKG and the blood tests before the shots and then all the measurements after the shots, determine the rate of heart damage that occurs per single shot. Like your friend, the rate's 2.5%.
- [53:31]
Courtney Swan
Wow.
- [53:32]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Now that's a big number when you think of how many people took the shots. 90% are younger men age 18 to 24. 10% are younger women. But, you know, it can happen to older ones. A public figure of interest, Bruce Arians, former coach of the Tampa Bay Bucks and won the Super Bowl. He took the shots. He spent an entire month in the hospital with COVID vaccine myopericarditis, inflammation of the heart muscle as Brucerins. He's in his 70s now. The great concern is that there's a small patch of inflammation too small to be seen by mri. And a recent paper in JACC Journal of the man in College of Cardiology has proven this now that there's little micro spots of damage due to the vaccine, but it's small enough to trigger a cardiac arrest. And we think this is almost certainly what happened with Demar Hamlin, safety for the Buffalo Bills. Even though he won't come out and say he took the vaccine, Michael Strahan really pushed him in an interview. And he goes, well, I don't want to talk about it. Well, yeah, he doesn't want to talk about the vaccine causing a cardiac arrest, but I can tell you pilots, no, he was unafraid to talk about this. He took the COVID vaccine and about two months later had a cardiac arrest on the Jetway here at DFW airport after he landed a big plane. And the miracle of pilot Snow. I wrote a subtech on this on focal points was the fact when they called 911, the DFW paramedic unit happened to be at the gate next door. Think about the luck of that. They raced over, took six shocks to bring him back. So he was deep in a cardiac arrest. And Snow told me when he went out, it was lights out. He just, just literally remembers nothing. And when he was in the hospital here in Dallas, he lifted up his shirt, he showed all the where his body was burned by the defibrillation. He goes, the vaccine did this to me. That's COVID vaccine cardiac arrest. Nick Hoelcher and Myself and the McCullough foundation have published in the European Journal of Cardiology that for sure, the vaccine myocarditis causes cardiac death for sure.
- [55:39]
Courtney Swan
Wow.
- [55:39]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So this is, you know, anybody who's had chest pain, palpitations, EKG changes, what have you, watch out. I think they need the type of intervention we're about to discuss greatly because I have seen cardiac arrest now from shots taken in 2021, particularly in young men. I've seen cardiac arrests in 2025.
- [56:02]
Courtney Swan
So this is what I'm really concerned about. And it's what I think about a lot with my fiance and with my dad. So now that we've gone over all of that, I'm sure there's a lot of people listening that are either in my position where they have loved ones that have taken it, or maybe they themselves have taken some shots. And we've talked a lot about a detox protocol. So what does that detox protocol look like?
- [56:22]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Let me tell you. For years, and I worked on this for years myself and colleagues, we tried a lot of things and studied a lot of things. So it wasn't our first try, typically in research and we have no funding. I told you, the Biden administration didn't even even study the spike protein as the cause of the problem, which it is. So it goes to show you how inept the biopharmaceutical complex is right now.
- [56:47]
Courtney Swan
Is that just because they just wanted to push a solution, which was the vaccine, they didn't want to even bother with anything else.
- [56:52]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, remember, any research in and around the spike protein would lead to the conclusion the vaccines have caused population harm and they're just not going to let that avenue develop. So that's really what it is. If you go to Mayo Clinic right now with vaccine myopare carditis, they won't measure anything with the spikes protein.
- [57:11]
Courtney Swan
I mean, this is so crazy.
- [57:12]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah, you go to March key institution, they won't. And the first thing I see when they see patients, I say, well, you need to measure your antibodies to the spike protein. And then of course, the aha moment is, oh my gosh, it's 15,000. No wonder, you know, I have heart damage. Well, there you go. So what we had discovered with great assistance from the Japanese Dr. Tanakawa, is that nattokinase, the fermentation product of soy that the Japanese have been eating in terms of a breakfast food called natto. And I've had it. I actually like it. They've been eating natto for over a thousand years because of its cardiovascular protection effect. It's anti atherosclerotic, antithrombotic proteolytic that Tanakawa showed that indeed, nattokinase miraculously dissolves the spike protein both in intact cell and cell lysate models. And we're talking nattokinase given in a capsule. In a capsule. Right. So you could take this as a supplement. He went further to show that if you take the nattokinase capsules on an empty stomach, you can actually measure blood levels of nattokinase. So this is legit. This gets into the bloodstream. This is like a medicine that's called pharmacokinetics. That's legit. The next discovery was that a different set of enzymes also works and that's enzymes collectively referred to as bromelain. Bromelain is derived from the meat of a pineapple, stem of a pineapple. It also dissolves the spike protein. It also is antithrombotic. It's somewhat of a blood thinner like nanokinase. And bromelain is actually an FDA approved drug. It's actually used as a topical ointment in burns because it's of its proteolytic effect. So natto and bromelain, these are over the counter supplements, but I'm telling you as a doctor, they work like drugs. And then the third is very interesting. This is one broadly embraced by those in, in the Indian subcontinent and that's curcumin derived from turmeric. So the orange. Right, the orange there it was being tested as an anti Covid nutritional strategy and in randomized trials it actually did ameliorate Covid. It doesn't dissolve the spike protein, but it blocks spike protein mediated inflammation. So McCullough protocol base spike protein detoxification is the intentional combination of nattokinase, bromelain and curcumin in medicinal doses applied to patients who have long Covid syndrome or vaccine injury syndromes. And we published this in 2023 in the journal of American Physicians and Surgeons and then later on in the Springer Nature, curious journal Biomedical Sciences. As a proposal, we've carefully observed thousands of patients, we've published cases and presented cases where we've demonstrated the antibodies to the spike protein going down over the course of a year and symptoms improving, blood clots resolving, syndromes resolving. I mean this is really, really gratifying. The caveats are we started low in our initial recommendations, which we should because we were concerned about safety, particularly bleeding. Also additionally those with a soy allergy, there's trace soybean oil that could be an issue. So we always want to be forthright about safety and then we've advanced the doses over time. Now the lead product, the lead combination product in the world is by the wellness company TWC Health Courage. TWC Health Courage Ultimate Spike detox. Ultimate Spike detox, It's the combination of nattokinase, broma and curcumin and minor ingredients. Now we believe Irish Sea moss and dandelion root extract and black sativa that they also have salutatory effects as minor ingredients. The wellness company and I serve the company as a chief scientific officer, we believe on kind of packing the products with a lot in it so you don't have to buy single jars or single bottles of products. The dosing now on the bottle is actually two capsules twice a day on an empty stomach that's going to deliver 8,000 fibrioltic units of nattokinase. We started out with 2,000.
- [61:24]
Courtney Swan
Oh, wow.
- [61:24]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So. And now Jordan Vaughn, who's running the largest COVID vaccine blood clot center in the United States in Birmingham, Alabama, who testified in Congress. Jordan, by personal communication has told me he's starting dose now is 16,000 a day. And so I'm doing this now in clinical practice. That's four of the wellness company Ultima Spike detox. Four capsules twice a day. That's industrial strength detox. We continue this for about a year, I think indefinitely. For those who've had complications, those with baseline atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease, we recheck an antibody level as a proxy for detoxification of the spike at about nine to 12 months. And we want to see about a 20% reduction in the SPIKE antibody. If we've done that, we know the mass of Spike is going down, down.
- [62:11]
Courtney Swan
That is so fascinating and I love to hear all the science behind it because I, I didn't, I haven't heard all of that. It was cool. I just knew that you had this product and I've seen you talk a little bit about it before. And so I immediately ordered it for my fiance and we've had him on it for about, I think it's been about six months now.
- [62:26]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Okay, good. Did he have baseline Spike antibodies?
- [62:29]
Courtney Swan
I never tested him for those and now I wish that we had.
- [62:33]
Dr. Peter McCullough
You can catch it, you know, you can add this to any lab he's going to have and get them measured. And we've recently published a paper, McCullough foundation, which is kind of the academic arm of what I do. McCullough foundation has published this in the World Journal of Cardiology. So this is cited in the National Library of Medicine, where there's a risk stratification approach. You'd want to see our fiance now, Courtney. Less than 1,000 units per milliliter on his test. If he's had good solid detoxification, less than 1,000 is down to ambient levels. That's probably where you are, are. I'll give you my story. So I didn't take the vaccine, but I had Covid three times and I just seem to be more prone to more severe illness. And so, I mean, when I had it, I, like, I couldn't go to work and I never miss a day at work. I mean, for me it was a serious infection, wasn't Hospitalized. But after my third episode of COVID my ears are ringing so loud I could barely hear my stethoscope. I couldn't run like I used to. I didn't feel well. And I measured my spike antibody levels. They were 2,300, so definitely above the thousand threshold. Now, my co author on my book, and I have my book here just so you can see it, Encouraged to face COVID 19. My co author of my book, John Leake, who's a best selling author, he lives here in Dallas. John came in and said, doc, I really want to measure my antibody levels. So I said okay. John didn't take the shot either, but he had like one episode of COVID He kind of, kind of skated through it. We measured his antibodies. 800.
- [63:59]
Courtney Swan
Oh wow. Okay.
- [64:00]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So it's like, John, no wonder you're so much better off than I am. So there's many studies now show that the antibody level does relate to how much spike is in the body, but also how bad one feels and overall risk. And I feel really uncomfortable with anybody over a thousand who's not undergoing detoxification. Now some people, like you said, Listen, Dr. McCullough, I'm low risk risk, but I'm exposed to other people or my mom is vaccinated, my dad is vaccinated. Can I take these? Well, of course. These are natural products that people take for general health. Anyway, I have atherosclerosis, so I have some cholesterol blockages in my arteries. I'm older and so you know, I don't have any side effects from this. I've actually already taken today, I've already taken a full 16,000 of natto on an empty stomach along with the bromelain. Bromelain. I've taken 1,000mg curcumin. I'm at about a thousand milligrams empty stomach. And because I have no side effects and the published data are so favorable as a supplement to take, I'm going to continue them indefinitely.
- [65:04]
Courtney Swan
Okay, that's fascinating. I also have a question. I know you can't give personalized medical advice, but I am curious because I did read on the website that if you're on blood thinners, you may not be able to take it. And I was concerned about my dad because he does take a baby aspirin every day because he's same as you, has some heart. I actually don't know exactly what he's been diagnosed with, but something with a heart can. People that are on things like Advil
- [65:28]
Dr. Peter McCullough
take it or well, remember that aspirin has a blood thinning effect. And so I do take aspirin.
- [65:34]
Courtney Swan
Okay.
- [65:35]
Dr. Peter McCullough
And you know my advice there is 81 milligrams, which is a baby aspirin. And if somebody has a stent in place or something serious. Yeah, 81 a day atherosclerosis, no stents. That would be me. I take it every other day and then days that I travel. I think that's a reasonable approach. Now people have asked, what about serious blood thinners like Eliquis or Xarelto or Pradaxa or Warfarin or Coumadin? The answer is yes, we can do McCullough protocol based by protein detoxification. But the caveat is bleeding. So I always ask patients look for easy bruising. We don't want people doing high risk activities. This would not be the time to load up on this and do bungee cord jumping or things like this. Right. And any signs of bleeding, let's say nose bleeding or bleeding from the gums after brushing the teeth, that's a sign that we have to reduce the dose. Very important. I've only had one serious bleeding event of someone on the detoxification. It was a patient with liver disease and it was a GI bleed and we simply stopped the detox. He never needed transfusion and he's fine. So we use these in addition to blood thinners. But people need to understand the caveats. Now if I have a patient with a large Covid or a vaccine blood clot in the leg, I have not found they dissolve with the prescription blood thinners alone. They don't. So I've had patients on Eliquis for a couple years and these things don't dissolve. I think that's the reason why the surgeons have gone in and taken them out. For instance, in Lauren Boebert, they took hers out. But what I have found is that they do dissolve slowly when we add the spike detoxification, the nattokinase, bromel and curcumin to the Eliquis. I have a lady who came in, she took I think seven shots. Spike antibodies over 25,000. So just loaded with spike protein. Both legs had blood clots in them. She couldn't even walk. And she's been on Eliquis. It's now been, I think about 14 months. I had a visit with her recently and the blood clots are nearly gone. We do serial ultrasound. They're nearly dissolved.
- [67:38]
Courtney Swan
Wow, that is so fascinating. That's so cool. So my next question is actually from a friend of mine. Who's really struggling with her family right now because they won't stop getting the boosters. And she wanted me to ask you if you have any advice, how can you have an educated conversation with family members, loved ones, to try to help them see that these boosters and these vaccines may not have their best health in mind? And maybe there's nothing you can really do, but if you have any advice
- [68:06]
Dr. Peter McCullough
for that, boy, I tell you, that's a tough one. We know that probably 80% of the US population took a vaccine. You and I are in the 20%. We didn't take it. I bet you're happy you didn't take it.
- [68:20]
Courtney Swan
I am. I'm so grateful. I've never been so grateful.
- [68:22]
Dr. Peter McCullough
It's the best health decision I've ever made. People said, Dr. McCullough, I've lost my job because I didn't take a vaccine. I said it was worth it. I hate to say it.
- [68:31]
Courtney Swan
I would have quit my job. Oh, yeah. But people, yeah, that lost their jobs.
- [68:33]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah, but I would have. Honestly, I would have lost a job. I would have quit.
- [68:37]
Courtney Swan
Me, too. I would have moved. I would have quit my job. I would have done it.
- [68:40]
Dr. Peter McCullough
And, you know, tens of thousands of US Military walked off because they wouldn't take a shot. Recently, they've been restored by Trump. And I actually got an inside piece of information. I don't know if it's verified or not, but interestingly, what I've been told is very few came back to the military.
- [68:58]
Courtney Swan
Really.
- [68:59]
Dr. Peter McCullough
They maybe have gotten jobs in the civilian sectors, what have you.
- [69:02]
Courtney Swan
But I think they were probably mad.
- [69:03]
Dr. Peter McCullough
They felt burned. Yeah, they felt burned. So this idea of how do you approach this? And I think it's important to understand that there is a vaccine ideology. An ideology is like a religious directive. It's like an ethical religious directive. There are people who believe vaccines are like a talisman. A talisman is like a good luck charm. It's something that's going to bring you good health. And when people have a deeply held religious belief, that means they accepted the vaccines based on faith. Based on faith. So if you go in, Courtney, and you're going to go in and blast against the vaccines, you're going to go against their faith. That would be the same as going into a mosque and start putting out some anti Islamic statements. Now, people in the mosque, if you started doing that, if they were nice to you, they would say, I don't want to talk about it. I don't want to talk about it. If they were not so Nice to you. They'd tell you to get out. Yeah, right. So you're confronting faith. You have to understand vaccines for some people are faith. Now, fortunately, it's a few. I'd mentioned 80% took a vaccine. But how many are taking boosters now and how many have taken all the boosters? Well, I can't think of anybody outside of President Biden. Former President Biden publicly took six shots. He did six shots. And I do believe he has a form of a vaccine injury syndrome because he has this neurodegenerative problem that has features of Alzheimer's disease, but it also has features of Parkinson's. But it's not classic for either. And that's what my observation has been. The peer reviewed literature suggests that. I think it's because of the accumulation of messenger RNA and spike protein in his body with six vaccines. But the point is, Biden may be among the very few. And I have less than 1% of my patient population has taken all the vaccines and most of them have said, you know, I took a few. Covid is less severe. You know, they may not come around to wanting to understand that they made a mistake, that they made a personal health mistake, but they're not going to take any more. I think the conversations become a lot easier now that we have a solution. We have McCullough protocol based by protein detoxification. We can say, listen, we've learned a lot. And when people took the vaccines, they really thought they were doing the right thing. And it was a tough time in our country and around the world. But we've learned the vaccines for sure are not readily cleared out of the body. And here's something that can help. I think it's a nice suggestion to people. You could even kind of put it as a little birthday present or a Christmas present. Just a suggestion, you know, it's good for your health and why not?
- [71:53]
Courtney Swan
Yeah, yeah. I mean, if it can save their life, you might as well try. But it is, it's tough. In my experience. Most people I know are not getting any of them anymore because most of them feel now either either immense guilt or not a guilt, but like regret. Regret was the word I was looking for. They're feeling immense regret or they're just like, I don't feel anything to get anymore. So that's kind of what I've been seeing now.
- [72:17]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Do you know anybody who like you did not take the vaccines in the initial wave? What have you, and now in 2025 said, you know, I think I'll start taking them It's a good idea.
- [72:27]
Courtney Swan
Not a single one.
- [72:28]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Not a single one.
- [72:29]
Courtney Swan
No.
- [72:29]
Dr. Peter McCullough
No one is gonna start taking them now. So it's interesting. The vaccines did divide us. Now, some people, Courtney would say you're an anti vaxxer. You're kind of against vaccines. You're against the religion of vaccines. And people have said that to me. And, you know, before COVID I took all the vaccines. I counted up all the vaccines in my body. I counted up like 69 vaccines. Wow. Took flu shots every year because I was on medical staff, I traveled, I took more vaccines. So I'm definitely not anti vaxxer. But what I am is I am vaccine risk aware. I am far more aware of the risks now. And just like anything else, vaccines have a risk benefit relationship. And we have to talk about both.
- [73:18]
Courtney Swan
Yes, absolutely. With any pharmaceutical intervention, you're going to have side effects and some people are gonna be affected, some people are not. It's just very plain and simple, black and white like that. And it's wild to me that we can't even have a conversation about it without people attacking us saying, oh, you're anti vax. I can't even believe you're asking these questions, Courtney. Oh, my God. I can't even believe that you had Peter McCollough on the podcast to ask him these questions. God forbid we dive into the research.
- [73:42]
Dr. Peter McCullough
It's wild because it's religious. Now. Vaccine ideology, by the way, goes back hundreds of years. It's not new. It's probably started with the great smallpox vaccine campaign. But the ideology goes like this. Mankind is vulnerable to infectious diseases. We have a weakness. But through the greatness of human ingenuity and science, vaccinology, we can make the body more robust to infections. We can improve upon God's creation. I mean, this is the ultimate hubris, right? We can improve upon God's creation. However, the vaccines aren't perfect. And so for this to work, everyone must take vacation them with no exceptions. That's how the ideology is. When vaccines are rolled out, no one is exempt from these. All of them. You must take all of them. And if there is an injury, a side effect, a death, then that's acceptable. That's acceptable. Collateral damage that you have to take it. For the team, it's considered so acceptable that 1986 in the vaccine Injury Compensation act, the manufacturers are held immune from liability.
- [75:00]
Courtney Swan
Oh, yeah.
- [75:00]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So this is stunning. So that is vaccine ideology. It's a religion and they're accepted as articles of faith. The COVID vaccine is the best example because when they were rolled out December 10th of 2020, we had one month of just giving the primary series and two months of observation. That's all that existed. No one in the world could have known what would have happened on month four. No one could have known. And yet people were on tv. Once you take it, you're good.
- [75:28]
Courtney Swan
I remember it.
- [75:29]
Dr. Peter McCullough
You're good for left. Remember Rachel Maddow? You take it, the disease won't get you, and the implication is you're good forever. People lined up here at Dallas in Fair park to take these. They were accepted as articles of faith because no one could have known what was going to happen.
- [75:44]
Courtney Swan
Well, what I remember during that time, watching her, watching Biden say, if you get the vaccine, you're not going to get Covid, you're not going to spread it. But I remember in the Pfizer studies that they never even tested whether or not you were able to get it and then transmit it. So I remember already. It was like, oh, they're lying already about this. Like, we have papers.
- [76:05]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Yeah, good observation. In the clinical trials. Remember, this was at a time where test positivity rates in hospitals, community centers, labor and Delivery departments were. Was 15%. This is in the fall of 2020. That's when I got Covid. So Covid was raging. Do you know, in the trials of Pfizer, 1% of people got Covid? Wait a minute. In placebo, 1% got Covid. So how is that. So they got a very frightened, concerned population to take these shots who are obviously not in contact with a lot of other people. Number one, they didn't do routine testing, which they should have every week, to really see who got Covid. So they let it be kind of symptomatically driven. And on top of that, everyone who took the shot had a sore arm. So they knew they got the real thing. Everybody who got the saline shot the placebo, they knew they got placebo. So those who got the shot were much less likely to come in with a suspected cold because they thought they were protected. Those who got placebo were coming in in droves. And so the trials falsely reported that the vaccines prevented Covid. They had a 90% protection effect or greater. It was all flawed reporting. And a paper by Michaels and colleagues, when they counted up the deaths in the end, and there were deaths reported after the submission deadline for the briefing booklet for the fda, when they counted up the deaths, more people died with Pfizer than they did with placebo. I remember that there was no reduction in hospitalization, none so when people said, take the shot, it's going to save you, it's going to keep you out of the hospital, that was all false advertising.
- [77:43]
Courtney Swan
I mean, it was lying. They were lying. Okay, I know I get a lot of questions about this and I meant to ask you earlier when we were talking about the detox. I want to make sure we get to it. If someone took the vaccine, how long should they be taking this ultimate spike detox?
- [77:58]
Dr. Peter McCullough
For at least a year. You know, we started out thinking wishfully, it was going to be three months. And we've been studying patients carefully. It's at least a year. I can tell you for me, it was at about nine months or so. That ringing in the ear is called tinnitus. And how I gauge it is in the morning when I wake up. Anybody who has this, you know, in the morning, wake up, it's quiet and you're sitting on the side of the bed, that's when it's the worst. And a lot of people have tinnitus. They have ringing in the ears. By nine months, that was noticeably declined. But I can tell you I went three or four or five months, no difference. And I don't want people to start this and say, Dr. McCullough, I did it for two weeks. I'm not better. Listen, the spike protein's been in your body a long time. It's going to take a year or more. This is something we need to have great patience with. Detoxification.
- [78:49]
Courtney Swan
What is the latest research that you've seen with? Because I know there was something that just recently came out about the spike proteins. Right. Is there anything else that we need to update people on that we haven't covered yet?
- [78:59]
Dr. Peter McCullough
There are certainly some broad vistas. I say to finish on a positive note, we continue to see ever increasing data that a healthy diet and fitness is a pathway out of this pandemic. I can't emphasize it enough. Now is the time for everyone to do a self appraisal of where they are in their health. Our naturopathic doctors were right in that nutritional supplements, things that you take intentionally to supplement your diet can lead to better health. This is legitimate. It. I've spent a lot of time with my naturopathic colleagues. It's probably six to eight different supplements to figure out what's the best combination. Detoxification, boosting immunity, boosting cardiovascular health. I mean, I think this is very important. Anti cancer, believe it or not, there are anti cancer medicinal and culinary herbs supplements. I think everybody should be tuning in to Courtney's Podcast, become expert and adroit in navigating independent media. Independent media is where you're hearing about this. You can't turn on CNN and hear about something innovative in dealing with long Covid or COVID vaccine injury syndromes. You can't turn on CNN and hear a counter narrative to the bird flu biosecurity program.
- [80:26]
Courtney Swan
Exactly.
- [80:26]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Right now, our major media, and I know this, I am a commentator on the major news stations, so you'll see me on national tv and I can tell you that independent media is now carrying the day. So you asked about Secretary Rollins and Robert F. Kennedy and are they hearing counterpoints on biosecurity? Well, yeah, they are through independent media and I know they are for sure on focal points. Focal points. Everybody should subscribe. Go to the focal points.com or substack focal points. That's our substack. Every day between 4 and 5am a critical release will come out with the graphical abstract, the update, giving people something actionable. And many have said, Dr. McCullough, you've been on Capitol Hill, you've been critical of our leadership. I've been critical of the leadership. I said, well, yes, I have, but I've also come to the table and I've brought solutions and so have you.
- [81:18]
Courtney Swan
If you had 60 seconds to wake people up about the healthcare system, what would you say?
- [81:24]
Dr. Peter McCullough
I would tell the audience broadly that the healthcare system over the course of COVID unfortunately has become corrupted. They've been corrupted with the ever increasing strength of this vaccine ideology carried to the COVID 19 vaccines which have led to record injuries, disabilities and deaths. And the healthcare systems were complicit in suggesting, promoting and in fact mandating vaccines on their employees, doctors, nurses and then of course the patients. So as patients navigate from here, they should be checking with their healthcare system and their doctors on where they are with these Covid vaccines. An honest answer is we were initially enthusiastic and now we realize there's been great harm. A dishonest answer would be we should take more vaccines. That's a dangerous answer. When you get that answer, I suggest you move on on.
- [82:20]
Courtney Swan
And I would urge people to look into who funds our media, who funds all of the medical schools, who's funding all the medical journals and hopefully that will wake people up. Dr. Peter McCullough, thank you so much for coming on. I do want to share. So your website is TWC Health and we you gave me a code which is amazing code, real foodology for 10% off plus free shipping on all orders. This is not just a One time use code, which is really amazing. Thank you so much for that. And hopefully everyone listening will order the Ultimate Spike Detox for either themselves, their loved ones, their family members. They make great gifts. I buy them for my dad and my fiance. So if you are concerned about anything we talked about today, just remember we have a lot of solutions now. There's a lot of amazing research that you've put out there and I'm just so grateful for the protocol that you have. And I would encourage everyone to go to the website and check all that out and order what you need.
- [83:16]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Well, let's say it again, TWC Health. And then when you get to the checkout, use real foodology as your promo code for the discount. Okay. Also consider getting a membership. There's three different levels of membership. My wife and I are members there at the highest level of membership and the codes applied to the membership costs, the supplements are free. So you can order free supplements. Now you order two by two and so you can go on and order two by two at a time. So free supplements. And my wife and I do this. And at the highest level, free prescription medications. So we get our prescriptions through the one Wellness Elite member. Now the middle level one gets, I believe free supplements and prescriptions. And then the lowest level, there's kind of a deeper discount. So many people actually get a membership to the wellness company because the idea is if you're going to buy more than maybe two supplements a month, you actually save money. And who doesn't want to save money nowadays?
- [84:20]
Courtney Swan
I do. I'm on subscription right now for the Ultimate Spike Detox. In fact, I just got an email yesterday that it shipped out. So I need to look into that. And also you guys also have something called the contagion kit that people can check out too, right?
- [84:32]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So the wellness company kits, and there's a whole array of these kits allow you to have pre prescribed medications and other necessary supplies for a disaster. So the ultimate prepper kit kit is called the base kit and it comes in a big tan box. It has everything in it, dozens and dozens of medicines. Does it have ivermectin, Ivermectin, hydroxychloroquoic or azithromycin? Amoxicillin goes on and on and on. That's the big kit. And then there's other ones you can travel with. A common one that people have in their household is the light blue medical emergency kit, the aqua blue kit. We have that one. We've already used it a couple times. There's a forest green travel kit that's mainly focused for gastroenteritis. The black contagion kit is specifically for Covid flu and bird flu. And now we've made a special one for the farmers that's specifically for bird flu to help them through this illness. The kits are the best way to be prepared ahead of time. Remember, during these disasters, a lot of times pharmacies and clinics are closed. Do you know that during the hurricane Hilton and Helene, with all the flooding, pharmacies were closed. People couldn't get drugs, so people got infected cuts. If they didn't have a wellness company kit, the infection continued in their legs or arms when they were in the water with all the glass and everything. So remember, in the case of natural disasters and emergencies, you must have a kit on board. Remember, when you're traveling, when you're traveling, especially overseas, you're traveling. Do you want to navigate an ER in a hospital in Italy or Mexico or Brazil or what have you if you. If you get, you know, bad gastroenteritis or a cellulitis or a urinary tract infection? No. So get a wellness company emergency kid and you can use real foodology as your code to get a deep discount on the kid.
- [86:15]
Courtney Swan
That's amazing. And I love that you have ivermectin, because I personally just take ivermectin anytime I get any sort of like more recently I had, which I now believe is probably walking pneumonia.
- [86:26]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Oh, my gosh.
- [86:26]
Courtney Swan
The second that I started getting symptoms, I immediately started ivermectin and. And I got through it a lot quicker than I think I normally would have. And ivermectin's been hard to find. I still have friends that hit me up and they don't know where to find it. Right.
- [86:39]
Dr. Peter McCullough
So if you get one of the kits and the black contagion kit, the aqua blue home medical emergency kit and the base kit all have ivermectin in it in a high dose. If you use some of the ivermectin in the bottle, we have a refill kit. So refill program. So you just get online and say, I use my ivermectin and you can get it refilled. And it's very affordable. So you have to rebuy the whole kit. So take advantage of that. The other point I want to make, I couldn't leave this podcast without saying it, is that more and more research suggests, look at you. You're young and you got nearly got walking pneumonia. You must be doing a nasal spray on Gargle every day. This is really, really important. If you were to leave here and you were to walk through somebody's viral cloud in the hallway and the virus is in your nose, you don't feel anything. It needs a stable environment for five days. And lymphatics drain back to the throat. Your first signal, you got a problem. Sore throat. When you have a sore throat, the virus has already been in your nose for five days. You had five days to do something about it. So because of this lag time, you always need to be doing a nasal spray on gargle twice a day. That way you disrupt the virus, setting up shop in your nose. And there's a whole variety of products, they're fairly equal. You could use something as simple as salt water, just saline. My favorite is clear. X, L, E, A R. I was
- [87:59]
Courtney Swan
gonna ask you about that one.
- [88:00]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Xylitol based. So I use clear. And his companion is spry as the gargle. So I did like this morning I did a couple sprays of clear up, I sniffed it back, I spit it out. And then you blow out the rest. So you're just disrupting any nascent viral infection. And then I gargle with spry. Now, if you wanted to use an iodine based wellness company, you can use your promo code, Rufus Real Foodology, a wellness company, they have immune mist, which is an iodine based. If gargling is too messy or on the plane, use a throat spray. Just hold it back there for about 10 seconds. This is proven in prospective, double blind, randomized placebo controlled trials. This is the way to go. During COVID I didn't have my act together and people saw me on the news. I was sick almost every month. Almost every month. I counted. I could not get well. My wife and I have been doing this religiously. I'm now at eight months with no infection whatsoever. None. And If I go 12 months, which is four more months, if I go 12 months, it'll be the first year of my adult life without getting an infection. And I've interviewed Courtney, some people on my show, they've gone 10 or 20 years with no colds because they do the nasal spray twice a day and gargle twice a day religiously, just like you brush your teeth. And if we get fewer of these viral infections, I just think we're healthier. We don't want these things to keep making us sick. So everybody get on this, find a plan. Saline, xylitol, iodine, colloidal, silver. Pick what you want to use but do something twice a day and do it regularly. Don't wait till when you think you're sick. Do it ahead of time.
- [89:32]
Courtney Swan
Okay. Well, you've inspired me. I'm going to go buy the xylitol nasal spray today.
- [89:37]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Good. Yeah. Clear X, L E, A R. And then the companion is spry. Spry is listed as a dental rinse, but you gargle with it. The other advantage with the xylitol, which is a natural product derived from corn cobs and from leafy green leaves. It's with grapefruit seed extract and xylitol and saline. The other added benefit there is it strengthens the teeth in prospective trials. So it actually heals cavities, prevents cavities. Every time I go to the dentist, say, Dr. McCullough, your teeth are so wonderful. It's because I'm using xylitol based products.
- [90:06]
Courtney Swan
Yep. I use xylitol toothpaste and I have xylitol gum. Perfect for after meals. Great. Well, thank you so much, Dr. Peter McCullough. This was amazing.
- [90:14]
Dr. Peter McCullough
Thank you.
- [90:15]
Courtney Swan
As promised, I have a code to share with you. If you go to TWC Health and use Code Real Foodology, you are going to save 10% on any of the supplements that we talked about today. Again, that's Code Real Foodology at checkout. Thank you so much for listening to the Real Foodology podcast. This is a Wellness Loud production produced by Drake Peterson and mixed by Mike Fry. Theme song is by Georgie. You can watch the full video version of this podcast inside the Spotify app or on YouTube. As always, you can leave us a voicemail by clicking the link in our bio. And if you like this episode, please rate and review on your podcast app. For more shows by my team, go to wellness loud.com see you next time. The content of this show is for educational and informational purposes only. It is not a substitute for individual, individual, medical and mental health advice and doesn't constitute a provider patient relationship. I am a nutritionist, but I am not your nutritionist. As always, talk to your doctor or your health team first. Are you ready to rock middle age? I'm Dr. Tina Moore, Gen X truth teller and holistic physician. On the Dr. Tina show, one of Apple podcast Top alternative health shows, I share what actually works for metabolic health, hormones and strength. Backed by decades of clinical results, not trends. From loving the gym and hitting your protein goals to peptides and microdosing GLP1s, it's all done the right way, not the hype way. Because menopause doesn't have to suck if you're fit. New episodes every Thursday. Produced by Drake Peterson and Wellness Loud.