Becoming Untriggered (with Lavinia Brown and Andrew Lynn)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Respectful Parenting: Janet Lansbury Unruffled

Episode: Becoming Untriggered (with Lavinia Brown and Andrew Lynn)
Host: Janet Lansbury
Guests: Lavinia Brown and Andrew Lynn
Air Date: February 3, 2026

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Overview

This episode explores the crucial topic of overcoming emotional triggers in parenting and life. Host Janet Lansbury interviews coaching duo—and couple—Lavinia Brown and Andrew Lynn, who specialize in supporting parents (Lavinia with moms, Andrew with men and fathers) to break unhealthy cycles, process trauma, and "reparent" their inner child. Through personal stories and client experiences, they discuss how childhood wounds resurface, especially in parenting, and offer actionable insights for moving from overwhelm and emotional reactivity to healing and connection.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Path to This Work: Personal Experience and Need for Change

• Guests’ Backgrounds:
  • Both Lavinia and Andrew came to coaching through their own struggles with trauma and painful inherited patterns.
  • Their approach centers on "healing the patterns keeping you stuck," often rooted in childhood or past unresolved pain.
    • Andrew: Mostly helps men (many of whom are dads 30-50 years old) struggling with anxiety, addiction, disconnection, and challenges maintaining relationships or careers.
    • Lavinia: Exclusively coaches mothers, focusing on the profound internal shift (often triggering old wounds) that comes with parenting.
    • ([02:01-06:04])

2. Why Coaching, Not Therapy?

• Therapy vs. Coaching:
  • Many clients turn to them after conventional therapy or medication has not produced results; therapy often "helps make connections but doesn't stop the patterns."
    • "What therapy doesn't do on the whole is stop you doing this. And that's why they come to me." – Lavinia ([06:04])
  • Coaching offers:
    • Goal attainment vs. open-ended therapy.
    • Focus on bodily-stored trauma, not just intellectual understanding.
    • An action-oriented, solution-focused process.
• Quote:
  • “The message is not you're ill, you're broken... The message is, okay, you had some experiences that are still with you, and there are some things you can do... to drastically change your state of being.” — Andrew ([04:41])

3. How Childhood Trauma Shows Up in Parenting

• Triggers & Emotional “Tantrums”:
  • Parents are often shocked and ashamed when they replicate the very behaviors from childhood they vowed to avoid.
  • “You are often having a tantrum. Mama rage can be like a tantrum.” — Lavinia ([11:25])
  • Trauma means responses aren’t willful; the adult is overtaken by unprocessed child parts.
  • Experiencing the out-of-control feeling as an adult is profoundly scary and shame-inducing.
• Quote:
  • “When your brain knows what you want to do, but you can't do it... that happens to us as adults, it is scary.” — Janet ([10:37])

4. Respectful Parenting as "Icing on the Cake"

• Role of Healing in Parenting:
  • Some parents find respectful parenting advice either unreachable or shaming without first healing deeper wounds.
• Quote:
  • “The analogy I use is a cake. Amazing parenting coaches like yourself, you're the icing on the cake...we need to sort our cake out. Our cake is not cooked.” — Lavinia ([13:01])
  • For those with trauma, healing the core must precede parenting strategies.

5. The Healing & Reparenting Process

• Andrew’s Approach:
  • Focus on nervous system regulation, releasing repressed emotion stored in the body, and integrating fragmented inner child parts.
    • “Regulating the nervous system, releasing all the repressed emotion... reconnecting with the body so you can be embodied and safe and connected to your truth.” ([16:33])
  • Healing is described as subtraction (releasing stuck energy), then integration (reparenting wounded inner child parts).
  • "None of my practice is through the brain... your body will tell you exactly what it's ready to release." — Andrew ([21:50])
• Lavinia’s Approach:
  • Structured, goal-oriented process, often tied to practical life areas (relationships, cycles, priorities).
  • "My major tool is the inner child... teaching them how to reparent their inner child." ([23:08])
  • Uses triggers and current emotional reactions as clues to past wounds.
  • Emphasizes not pushing but creating safety for the inner child to emerge at her own pace.
  • “Often your inner child's terrified. She doesn't want to do this work. So we have to work at her pace.” ([23:08])

6. Working with Memories and the Body

• You don’t need clear memories; the body stores the emotional residue.
  • If you don’t recall, “it’s because your inner child doesn’t feel safe enough to go there.” — Lavinia ([23:08])
• "If you can feel it in your chest, in your stomach... then you can pretty much release it straight away." — Andrew ([31:14])

7. Timeline for Healing

• Andrew: Typically 12-week, weekly sessions, moving from emotional release to action—sometimes clients shift careers or life directions as they “integrate” healed aspects of self.
  • “If you can connect, if you can feel, a lot of people... can release straight away.” ([31:14], [33:34])
• Lavinia: Every 2 weeks, allowing deep actions and integration; offers constant online support to “role model” inner parenting until clients can do it themselves.
  • “I offer 24/7 online access... In essence, I'm role modeling that inner parent role for them until they can do it for themselves.” ([35:27])

8. Inner Child Work: From Dismissing to Listening

• How to Reparent:
  • Combatting the urge to rush (“let’s just do this!”) versus tuning into the inner child’s fear, offering validation and specific reassurance.
  • “It's learning to understand what you're feeling... Because we're so used to dismissing our feelings.” — Lavinia ([40:13])
• Tips:
  • Listen before reassuring ("How are you?") to avoid dismissing the child part.
  • Practice self-compassion as a daily ritual (“You are not the inner parent, you are being parented... letting go of responsibility.”) — Lavinia ([41:59])
• Memorable Quote:
  • “If you’re saying to your inner child ‘you’re safe’ and they’re like ‘no, I don’t feel safe’, then you’re dismissing it but in a more subtle way. Right? So take that step back and go, ‘How is she feeling first?’” — Lavinia ([41:36])

9. Facing Resistance and Guilt

• Cultural, Societal, & Personal Resistance:
  • Admitting one’s own childhood pain is hard due to both social and personal barriers. Many minimize their suffering (“others had it worse”).
  • “My job is to help mothers see their childhood as a parent, not as a child. So to see the negative and the positive, to see how they suffered, to see how it was difficult because they don’t want to pass it on to their children.” — Lavinia ([44:51])
• Tool: Imagine your child in your shoes—often reveals justified anger or pain.

10. Empowering the Listener

• Action Step: Start by noticing triggers—track disproportionate reactions back to earlier life experiences.
  • “This work doesn’t have to cost anything... The most important thing you can start with is looking at your triggers.” — Lavinia ([48:21])
• Free Resources:
  • Lavinia offers a free downloadable workbook; Andrew has launched a weekly group healing group.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You’re having a tantrum. You’ve been taken back to the child part of you that first experienced these feelings.” — Lavinia ([11:25])
• “You had some experiences that are still with you, and there are some things you can do in the short term to drastically change your not only your state of being, but your life.” — Andrew ([04:41])
• “Therapy helps you make connections... But what therapy doesn’t do is stop you doing this. And that’s what they come to me for.” — Lavinia ([06:04])
• “Healing is about integrating all parts of yourself.” — Andrew quoting Gabor Maté ([16:33])
• “Part of this work is very difficult... you have to be able to acknowledge the ways in which your parents weren’t there for you. And to do that, you’re going to come across a lot of resistance... societal, cultural, religious, and from the child within.” — Lavinia ([44:51])
• “It’s not actually you releasing the emotion, it’s that part of you that was traumatized releasing the emotion.” — Andrew ([19:10])
• “You are not the inner parent. You are learning and practicing how to receive love, how to let go of responsibility to somebody else.” — Lavinia ([41:59])

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Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Topic/Quote | |-----------|-------------| | 02:01 | Guests’ backgrounds & why men/dads/moms seek help | | 06:04 | Difference between therapy and coaching | | 11:25 | Emotional reactivity as “tantrums” & personal stories| | 13:01 | Parenting advice as “icing”—trauma as the cake | | 16:33 | Andrew’s healing process: bodywork & integration | | 23:08 | Lavinia’s structure: goals, triggers, dynamic actions| | 31:14 | Timeline for healing & importance of embodiment | | 35:27 | 2-week sessions, online access, role modeling parent | | 40:13 | Inner child work: listening precedes reassurance | | 44:51 | Resistance to seeing childhood pain—and overcoming it| | 48:21 | Practical first step: notice and track triggers |

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Resources & Where to Find the Guests

• Lavinia Brown: laviniabrown.com • @laviniabrowncoaching
• Andrew Lynn: andrewlynn.net • @andrewglynn
• Free Workbook: Available from Lavinia's website.
• Group Healing Experience: Details on Andrew’s website.

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This episode offers an honest, hopeful, and actionable look at how parenting unearths old wounds—and how, with the right support, it’s possible to become “untriggered” and transform not just how we parent, but how we live.

Transcript

[A]

This episode is brought to you by Redfin. You're listening to a podcast, which means you're probably multitasking, maybe even scrolling home listings on Redfin, saving homes without expecting to get them. But Redfin isn't just built for endless browsing. It's built to help you find and own a home with agents who close twice as many deals. When you find the one, you've got a real shot at getting it. Get [e-mail] own the dream hi, this is Janet Lansbury. Welcome to Unruffled. Today I'm hosting Lavinia Brown and Andrew Lynn. They are a couple and they're the parents of three children. They also closely reflect each other's passion for the work that they do. Both of them do online coaching that's geared to help parents and others over overcome obstacles that are interfering with their ability to achieve their goals and be happier and more successful in their relationships and in life. Or as Lavinia puts it, heal the patterns keeping you stuck. These patterns often stem from childhood and other life experiences and emotional traumas, major and minor. Both Andrew's and Lavinia's work focuses on connecting with and reparenting as needed, our inner child. I was first introduced to Lavinia by a previous guest on this podcast, Alwyn Hines, a mom who shared her story in the episode It Will Get Easier, the intense struggles of a parent with childhood trauma. She was greatly helped by Lavinia's coaching. So I'm excited for this opportunity to hear more about the work that Andrew and Lavinia do.

[B]

Welcome.

[A]

Lavinia and Andrew, I've been wanting to have you on for a really long time, so thank you so much for joining me.

[C]

Pleasure.

[B]

We're so excited to be here. Thank you.

[A]

The work you both do is life changing. I know that term's thrown around very easily these days, but it's true in your case. And I've noticed that you both came to this work through your own experiences, which makes sense because it's very deep work. So you need to come to it with a deep understanding of the issues and all the challenges. And then both of you decided to take what you'd learned and use it to help other parents or. Well, Andrew, you don't necessarily work with parents. You work with all men, right?

[C]

Yeah, not exclusively parents, but most of the men I work with, I would say, are between the age of 30 and 50. So there's a lot of dads in there.

[A]

A lot of dads. And then what? What is it that gets them to the point where they realize that they need this kind of help.

[C]

I think from my point of view, there's a. There's a couple of different types of men that come and work with me. One of them is other people that are not happy with where they're at in their life and not happy with the way they feel. So they're feeling anxious, they're feeling disconnected, you know, depressed or addicted. And they want to improve their life. They're interested in a journey of self improvement. And then there's the other guys that are a bit further down the line where this type of thing, they're experiencing the same symptoms, but it's actually having a really negative impact on their life. Now. It's impacting their relationships, their ability to get into a relationship and hold onto a relationship, or it's really negatively impacting their marriage or their career or their health. And that's actually where a lot of men. I think it's the difference between men and women. But a lot of men come to me when it's. When these symptoms are having a really negative impact on their life.

[A]

And why would they come to you rather than a psychotherapist, a classic psychotherapist, or a clinical psychologist?

[C]

That's interesting. Actually. Again, half of the people have tried that route. So I get people that have been on medication for a while and have not got the results that they want from it. So it might be that they experience some improvement or some numbing of symptoms, but they don't get the positive improvement they're looking for. Or I get people that come to me and say, well, I've done therapy for 12 years, so I think it's about time to try something else.

[A]

Interesting. Are there therapists that recommend you as well that you get referrals from?

[C]

I get recommended from some therapists, but most of the people come from my content, from online, from talking about my experiences, from talking about trauma, from talking about the experiences of my clients. And I think that just resonates with people. And also the thing with the thing with traditional medicine or traditional routes is they don't talk about solutions, they don't talk about happy endings, they talk about managing symptoms. And the thing with trauma and the thing that, with the work I do is that there is, there's a. There's a route map to solutions and there's a chance of a different ending. And I think that's what inspires people. The message is not you're ill, you're broken, you need to manage this for the rest of Your life, you know, the message is, okay, you had some experiences that are still with you, and there are some things you can do in the short term to drastically change your. Not only your state of being, but your life as well.

[A]

I love that. I can't wait to hear more about what that process looks like, as much as you can tell us in a podcast. But first, Lavinia, so what about you and the clients that you work with? How do they get to this point where they realize that they need more support?

[B]

So I work exclusively with mums because it's such an initiation into not only having to look after someone else, but also into yourself and into understanding the limitations of why you can't look after that being in the way that you want to. So I. I only deal with mums because of that shift that happens. It just changes you. And because when my clients become mums, they suddenly see that stuff from their childhood that they may have thought they were well past. It's in the past. Forget it happened. It's got nothing to do with my life now. I'm an adult now. I take responsibility for my life. I can't be a victim. All of that comes up in the way that they're parenting. So they suddenly find themselves horrified by the fact that they've done something which their parents did to them, which they hated, which they had no intention of doing as a mum. And they feel really bad. They feel like they're passing on their trauma. They feel out of control. Most of my clients feel very volatile. They feel like they can't manage their emotions. They're shouting, they're getting angry. They're feeling anxious, constant, and they feel depressed. Even though they've got a life full of beautiful things. They've got beautiful kids often. They've got a wonderful partner, lovely house. They've got everything going for them, and yet they can't enjoy it because something is stopping. There's something missing. They don't feel present. They feel unable to rest and relax and enjoy it. So with my clients, it's usually the kids that are the pointer to something being off, and it's something out of their control. And to answer the second question you asked, Andrew, most of my clients have done years of therapy, and they always say they've made the connections. Therapy is good like that. It helps you make connections. Oh, I do this because of this. But what therapy doesn't do on the whole is stop you doing this. And that's what they come to me for. They don't want to be screaming at their kids anymore. They don't want to feel volatile, they want to be able to relax and feel calm. So that's the difference again. I mean I call myself a coach. So as a coach they set goals, that's what we work to, it's my job to get them to reach their goals. Whereas therapy often can be quite open ended and it's just see you next week, see you next week, see you next week. And they don't feel they're having enough momentum. And also I think an important point that Andrew and I both do that therapy doesn't is, you know, we can all talk about our problems until the cows come home. It's comfortable, we can all analyze, oh, I wonder if I do that because of, oh yeah, maybe I do that because of this. And it's all very comfortable. But what we do is we go to the body because that's where the pain is, that's where the, the emotions have been stored ever since childhood and they're what needs to be released. And in therapy often you're just talking about things, you're not feeling it and when you feel it with obviously the tools to make yourself feel safe enough to do there and blah blah, blah, that's what creates the shifts.

[A]

And you're able to do this online, right? Or do you do in person as well?

[B]

I've never done in person and actually weirdly I get asked this a lot but I think that women or mothers feel more comfortable actually online because you're in your own surroundings, you feel safe. Whereas you know, driving to some medical center, saying what you're there for, sitting down, anxious, worrying, waiting what's coming next, then sitting in front of a massive desk perhaps with someone looking down at you with a pile of papers, writing notes. It's seriously intimidating online. You know, you can make your screen as big or as, or as small as you want. I'm right there. I think it's more intimate and more safe actually. And also it saves time. Mums are busy, they don't have time necessarily to drive an hour somewhere, get on someone's waiting list. They just need to sit down at their kitchen table, put the laptop on. You know, it's very convenient online.

[A]

Absolutely. What you were talking about, this out of control feeling and I'm sure Andrew hears similar things. I mean that's actually how I found out about you is through a parent who was having all those feelings that you're talking about and just so out of control, who had worked with you and highly, highly recommends you when Your brain knows what you want to do, but you can't do it. It's the way that children feel a lot of the time because that prefrontal cortex hasn't evolved to the place where that can take charge as much as they might want it to or as much as we might want them to. But when that happens to us as adults, it is scary. Right? We know better, but we're still reacting in these same ways.

[B]

I think you're absolutely right. What you've said. It is childlike. I often say to my clients, you're having a tantrum. You've been taken back to the child. Part of you that first experienced these feelings and the trigger in your present is reminding you of an unprocessed experience from your past, which you weren't co regulated through by a safe, protective, grounded adult. And therefore it's still in your body and it needs to be. It needs to be processed. So, yeah, you're. You are often having a tantrum. Mama rage can be like a tantrum. And to comment on what you said about people come to you for that. Absolutely. I was. Recommended you when I first became a mom and I couldn't do it. I loved what you were doing. I loved. I was reading all the posts and I couldn't seem to do it. So that just made me feel rubbish. And then I stopped following you because I was like, I can't do this. There's obviously, I'm not, I'm. There's something wrong with me. I can't do this stuff. I'm just going to have to get through it badly or on my own. I mean, actually, at one point I was like, I can't do this. My kids are better off without me. That's what led me to this work.

[A]

I hate hearing all of that, that the work I'm doing, which I'm of course just intending to try to help and, you know, make lives easier to clarify things, actually brings on stress, you know, actually creates all those feelings that you're talking about. I can't do it. And I'm a failure and giving up on myself. That, you know, makes me feel terrible. I have to say, the thing is,

[B]

what you do is amazing. And it's only people with childhood trauma that can't do it. A lot of my clients come to me saying, I tried, Janet, I can't do it. It's just I spiral into shame. And I always say, do the trauma work first. The analogy I use is a cake. Amazing parenting coaches like, such as yourself, you're the icing on the cake for people like us. For people like us, we need to sort our cake out. Our cake is not cooked. A cake that's runny and all over the shop can't have icing on top. So I say do your work and then go to the parenting experts. Now that I've done the work that I needed to do, I follow you as you. As you see. I share your post. I think it's super valuable. But for women who've had developmental trauma, it's not going in to that prefrontal cortex. They need to do that work first. And then it's about conscious parenting. You have. They have to do the work on themselves first.

[A]

Yeah. For me, because, you know, I do have my own wounds, for sure. Not as overwhelming as a lot of people. You know, it's like what you say on your website, that your children showed you all these things that you needed to see, and each child, if you have more than one, shows you different colors. They bring out these different sides of you that you can see you need to work on. And for me, that happened more through working with my mentor, Magda Gerber, and observing, seeing the difference between what I was projecting into those situations, which could be just a baby, you know, playing or looking around. I could feel these things coming up for me that were my own projections and noticing, oh, that's me. It's not my child. And this person isn't just a reflection of me. This is a whole different person. So through that, it was therapeutic. I mean, not nearly the work that you guys do, but I think you

[B]

did have what we do. You had a safe, loving, respectful space holder in the form of your mentor. Right. So you felt held. I mean, I don't know, I'm guessing on your parenting journey, which is what we do. It's when women feel alone, which is what I felt, they feel disconnected from their partner because of their wounds. They feel out of control, and there is no one else to reflect with. I think that's the most important key. We all live in our ivory towers. You know, it's almost a cliche. We're meant to have a village. Of course we're meant to have a village. But if we don't have a village, do we? And it sounds to me like you did have that mentor space holder. Unconditionally supportive, loving, even relationship with your mentor, which allowed you to do this reflection.

[A]

Yeah. And just that whole practice of sensitive observation, that is, you know, one of the basic tools that she recommended and that I probably don't talk about enough. But, you know, starting that early, you do get this sense of that separateness of your child, that they're not doing this at you, they're not trying to swallow you up with their behavior, and that they really are, you know, even as an infant, their own, you know, entity. Anyway. So the work that you two do, do you have a similar process in working with people?

[C]

I think our process is probably really different, actually looking to reach the same outcomes maybe, but the process is different. Most of my clients have experienced some kind of developmental trauma growing up. So there are parts of them that are disconnected from themselves. Parts of their inner child are fragmented and still playing out in their lives. And they have the coping mechanisms that reflect that. So there's a lot of kind of self sabotage, procrastination, people pleasing Mr. Nice Guy, a lot of inauthentic behaviors which lead to an inauthentic life. On the other side of that, you've got the physical side effects of these traumatic experiences, which are linked to dysregulated nervous system and things like anxiety and fatigue, brain fog and addiction. So most of the people that I see have got a variety of those symptoms. And so my practice and my process that I take people through focus on those two things. So regulating the nervous system, releasing all of the repressed emotion and energy that's linked to childhood experiences, reconnecting with the body so you can be embodied and safe and connected to your truth and connected to your inspiration. And also, I think it was Gabor Mate that said that healing is about integrating all parts of yourself. And that's the second part of the process that I take people through, which is based mostly on reparenting the parts of you that are fragmented. And the result of that is that those parts of you then integrate with yourself. So you can basically experience life from the present moment in a safe body. Yeah. Instead of being triggered, instead of being like your present moment, being hijacked by repressed emotion, instead of coping mechanisms sabotaging your life, being inauthentic, it's the opposite of that. And that's the process that I take people through.

[A]

When you talk about integration, can you explain a little about what that is, what that process looks like?

[C]

The first part of the process is subtraction. So I'm sure you've heard of the book called the Body Holds the Score. Essentially, your body holds the story of your trauma, even if your mind doesn't. So you're carrying around in your body all of the stuck energy from the traumatic experiences. You had, and also all the repressed emotion that you couldn't express at that time and that keeps these traumatic experiences live within you, and it also keeps those parts of you that experience, those traumatic experiences live as well. So the process that I go through is connecting to all of those parts of the body. So that stuck energy and that repressed emotion is physical. And if you can turn inwards and connect to those parts of you, then that emotion and that energy will release. And once it releases, it doesn't come back. And once it releases, you're able to go and inhabit those parts of your body that were disconnected, which makes you feel present and makes you feel connected and makes you feel safe. It's not actually you releasing the emotion, it's that it's the part of you that was traumatized releasing the emotion. So we go through this process, we might be in a session and your 5 year old has just released the emotion, the anger, the sadness, the guilt about being rejected by their parents. And once they do that, there's an opportunity right then and right there for you as an adult, the part of you that is present, to build a connection with that part of you, that inner child, and actually give them a new experience, give them what they needed at that time. And when you do that in the moment, you can feel that part of you, you feel that inner child release something, relax, feel safe, and that part of you actually integrates into you right then at that moment. And it requires a bit of maintenance, like children, like children do. And sometimes there's a lack of trust there and you need to go back. But that process allows you to do those two things. Heal your body and integrate those parts of you that were fragmented by the trauma.

[A]

And then you don't actually have to know, you're not necessarily remembering exact things that happened. Right. It's just a feeling.

[C]

Yeah. So none of my practice is through the brain because the, the brain is all about the stories of your childhood. So often they are the stories that got you through that moment. So, you know, I had a story in my head for many years that it was really good that my dad left us as a family at five years old. Yeah, it was really good because my stepdad was good at sport and, you know, he taught me how to play football. That was my story about my past, about my childhood. Well, that was a coping mechanism. That was a lie I was telling myself to get through that moment and get through the subsequent couple of decades afterwards. But the real story about the rejection that I felt, the pain That I felt and all of that emotion was stored in my body. So the process of releasing it and healing can't be through the brain, but it can be directly into the body. And your body will tell you, if you listen, your body will tell you exactly what it's ready to release at that point in time. Wow.

[A]

I find all of this really fascinating. And Lavinia, your process is different than that somewhat, or mine's a bit more

[B]

structured, I think, in terms of my clients set goals with me. So one goal that's about the kind of thing they've come to me about, being a calmer parent, being a more connected partner, releasing their past, understanding themselves better, knowing who they are, and then a more practical one. So it might be something about prioritizing the things that are important to them. Or I work quite a lot with the menstrual cycle because that's another great tool for understanding how you react in any given moment. So it might be something around that, living in alignment with your emotional ups and downs, not against them. And then from that point, I get them to explore those goals. That's the first task they have to do. Unpack. Why did they come up with those goals? Why are those goals relevant to their lives? Why did the psyche come up with that, not something else? And then from there, my major tool is the inner child. So I start straight away with teaching them how to reparent their inner child. Because you touched on it earlier. You said not everyone remembers it. It was not always conscious. A lot of my clients come to me saying, how can I do this work if I don't remember anything? And I say, well, you don't remember it for a reason. And usually that's because your inner child doesn't feel safe enough to go there. You know, it makes sense biologically. You're not just going to walk down the street divulging your trauma, being a complete mess, that our bodies don't work like that. We. We hold a tight rein over what didn't work because we need to function. But when your inner child does feel safe enough and held enough, and that's a process that you have to go through, and obviously you have to be ready to even undertake this process, then the memories start coming back, they always do. And the psyche presents the work that it needs to do next. So it's very much led by the client. And I work with the client with my tools. I often liken it to like a road. There's a road going towards their goals. That road is full of Potholes. And those potholes represent the fears, the self limiting beliefs, everything that they've inherited unconsciously from their parents or through their lifetime. And our job is to jump into those potholes together, work out which tool we need to fill it up and then move on. So it's a very dynamic process. I think it's more dynamic perhaps than Andrews because I set a lot of actions. We come up with a lot of actions every session. So it's very action orientated, it's very results orientated. But never dragging your inner child with you, which is what I have a tendency to do. And I think a lot of us do. We're like, yep, come on, yeah, let's do this. I want to be healed quicker the faster. Can I do more sessions in a week? I would just, let's just do this. Like you want to tick that box and move on, but part of you wants to do that. That's great. That's the achieving part of you, the successful, efficient part. But often your inner child's terrified. She's absolutely terrified. She doesn't want to do this work. So we have to work at her pace and create the safety that she needs and the holding before she can go back because she's the one doing this work. And sometimes the memories don't come back, but that's never happened to me. But if we only have a few memories, then that's fine too, because we work with triggers. Our kids are our biggest teachers. They, they will press every single button that you have because unconsciously they want you to be the best version of yourself for them. They want a safe, grounded parent and they will push the buttons that are in the way. So we'll work with triggers if we can't work with memories. And those triggers are pointers to unprocessed feelings, like we said before.

[A]

So sometimes do people come, just say, I just want to stop yelling. I don't know why I'm yelling. You know, just that kind of very, a very practical issue that's getting in their way. And then through that you uncover all the reasons.

[B]

That's the main reason people come to me. I can't stop being mean and shouting at my kid. I don't want to be a shouty mum. Yeah, absolutely. Yelling is probably the biggest reason that people come to me. They're losing it. They feel out of control with their child. Their child is creating reactions in them that is making them act in a way that they hate and then they hate themselves. And it's a vicious cycle.

[A]

Well, I mean, I'm so grateful for people like both of you that you're doing this work and that you're there for parents and for all people to just to, to find what's holding them back.

[B]

And likewise you, Janet. You do incredible work. I think healing has its own timeline and for my clients, that timeline consists of working on themselves first. For many women, it doesn't, you know, they don't have the baggage that we're carrying. So I mean, your work is just as valuable. We're just looking at a different timeline really.

[A]

And what is the timeline in terms of just your coaching and you as well, Andrew? Like how long does it usually take? Or is there a usual we collect hundreds of photos on our phones. Most of us. Holiday celebrations, family trips, sporting events, baby's first step, first birthday, first day of preschool. But for the most part, that's where these precious memories live right on the phone. Journey Print makes it ridiculously easy to finally do something meaningful with them in just minutes. You can turn your digital photos into beautiful high quality photo books simply drag and drop. And Journeyprint's smart algorithm organizes everything by date and handles the layout for you. Just like that, you're telling a story. And the quality, it's so good. Thick pages lay flat binding and your choice of matte or glossy finishes. Personally, I've got a zillion pictures of our dog Diego with the kids here. He's a bit of a ham. So I made a book. It took all of five minutes and I gave copies to all my kids. A photobook is something real and tangible you'll cherish forever and enjoy sharing with friends and family. And so much easier than scrolling through your camera. So go to journeyapp.com podcast unruffled and use the code unruffled to get 30% off your next purchase. That's Journey spelled J O U R n I applied app.com podcast unruffled and use code unruffled at checkout at the start of the year. I've always tended to rethink my finances. Paying down debt, building an emergency fund, planning for big milestones like my kids education or even buying a home. The problem was in the past, I was mostly just tracking what I'd already spent. Not very helpful. Monarch gives me the tools I need to be proactive and actually plan ahead. Why not set yourself up for financial success this year? Monarch is the all in one personal finance tool designed to make your life easier. It brings your entire financial life, budgeting, accounts and investments, net worth and future planning together in one dashboard on your phone or laptop. Feel aware and in control of your finances this year and get 50% off your monarch subscription with Code Unruffled. So it's not just about tracking expenses. I can do that with bank statements and credit card bills. Right. Monarch helps me focus on the future with a complete picture of my financial situation and what I need to do to hit my goals. Set yourself up for financial success in 2026 with Monarch, the all in one tool that makes proactive money management simple all year long. Use code unruffledonarch.com for half off your first year. That's free. 50% off your first [e-mail] with code unruffled.

[C]

For me, I normally work with people over like a 12 week or 12 session program. When I do one on one work. The reason for that is because it creates a container. So it's not just 12 hours of my time, it's 12 weeks of us working together like in between sessions. That time in between sessions is also there to create the safety. And to be honest, this healing can happen really quickly. For me, the determiner of how quickly it happens is how quickly can you connect to your body. I'd say like 10% of the people I work with are really dissociated and disconnected from their body completely. And that's because they had significantly traumatic situations or relationships or environments where they had to do that out of necessity. And if that's the case and that takes a bit of time to bridge that gap between their mind and their body. But if you can connect, like if you can feel, a lot of people come and they say, like, I can feel it. I can feel it in my chest, I can feel it in my stomach. I've got this energy inside me. I've got this, this emotion that comes up and I can feel it. If you can feel it, then you can pretty much release it straight away. If that happens, then we do a lot of subtraction in the first three to six weeks and then building and integrating in the subsequent kind of three to four weeks. And then often I do some coaching towards the end of it looking at, okay, now you're feeling safe. Now you've integrated those parts of you. Now you're can hear your inspiration a bit more. Now you can hear your truth. Your life feels more purposeful. Okay, what we're going to do with that. Yeah, how, how's that going to impact your career, your business, your habits, your health? How's it going to impact your relationship with your wife or your partner? And how, how does it affect your parenting? So that's the kind of process that I go through over 12 weeks.

[A]

So you get into action at the end?

[C]

Yeah, get into action at the end. And again, it depends how quickly we get into your body, depends on how much time there is to do the action at the end and whether people want to get into action at the end. Once you do this work, it's very hard to carry on doing what you are doing. So many of the men I work with, they do this work. They connect to their truth, they heal all this stuff that they thought they were going to have to carry around for the rest of their life, you know, and most of them turn around and they say, okay, I want to do this. I want to help other people. Yeah, I need to pass this on. So a lot of my clients end up changing what they're doing, changing careers, whatever their passion is, whether it's content or coaching or technology, a lot of people turn around and they start doing this work as well.

[A]

There's something so deeply rewarding about giving away something that really helped you, which is actually what keeps me motivated. Many of us wait till later in life, like I did before we really get into that, like, how do I really want to spend my time? I want to do something that really helps people somehow or feels really positive in that way. But also the timeframe that you're talking about, how it's, you know, once per week that the 12 weeks actually matters. And Lavinia, you were talking about that too, that sometimes people want to come and just do a cram session, get it all in. But it's the way that I learned my work. It's not that, you know, you necessarily need all this training time, but you need all the time to absorb it. You need time on the calendar. You can't rush that process of, like, absorbing, integrating it, internalizing it. That's what takes time, and that's actually part of the process, which is why

[B]

my sessions aren't weekly, because I want not only my mums to have enough time to do the actions that we've set, which aren't just write a pros and cons or do this with your child. They're often very deep actions, especially at the beginning. We are unpacking the ways in which their mother and then their father or the mother figure, they didn't have a mother or the father figure, were unpacking the effect that that had on their lives and the ways in which their parents weren't there for them. That's a huge task. So they have two weeks in between sessions with me so that they have exactly what you said. Not just the time to do the action, but the time to process and integrate what comes up. So I offer 24,7 online access to me in between sessions, because that's that holding we were talking about. I don't think your inner child would be able to do it by themselves. So they know that I'm there on the end of an email, whatever happens, whatever they want to share with me. And in essence, I'm role modeling that inner parent role for them until they can do it for themselves. So it's very, very powerful.

[A]

Oh, that's beautiful. And you both talk about the inner child. That is what we're healing. We're re parenting that. But what does that actually look like? I think you talked about it a little bit, Andrew.

[C]

For me, there's a couple of things. So I, I did, I did inner parenting as part of my own healing, and it was, it was very useful. But I think there's a time and a place for inner parenting. And for me, in my process that I, that I teach people, there's a moment after that part of you releases the emotion of that time that is a part of you where there is duality within you. There's a present adult and there's a vulnerable inner child. That's the opportunity, that's the timing for me where the inner parenting can be most effective. Now in terms of what and how. Now the first part of inner parenting is listening. That part of you, that inner child, will tell you in that moment what they needed at that time. And a lot of this trauma is not necessarily about bad things that happen. It's not necessarily about violence or abuse and that type of thing. A lot of it is about what didn't happen. Children that feel that they don't get any attention, that they weren't safe, they weren't encouraged, they weren't seen, they didn't get enough love, they didn't get enough affection. You know, that has a significant impact

[A]

on children, and that's all relative to their unique sensitivities. Right. So like the same child in the same family wasn't wounded by that, but you were because you needed something more.

[C]

Yeah. So at that point in time in the process where you're connected to your inner child, you're in. A child might say, oh, I feel rejected. I don't feel you love me, or it's my fault, or, you know, I'm no good. And whatever that language that, that inner Child uses at that point in time. That's your ammunition as the inner parent. Yeah. So you need to listen to what your inner child has to say, and then once you gather that information, then you can give them a relevant, tailored message at that point in time. Yeah. And that's what makes it effective. But you need to do the connecting and the listening first.

[A]

And then do you have people say this out loud?

[C]

Actually, I do whatever feels comfortable. And again, like Lavinia said, sometimes you need a bit of coaching. You know, if you've never received love or affection, like, how do you give it? So sometimes people say, I don't know what to say. And then we just try some things. Yeah, It's a bit of trial and error and feeling and connecting. And you say it out loud or say it in your head, whatever works for you. And then finding that thing, you can feel both at the same time. And again, it's my job to hold space for all of this, to talk to you into in the present moment, to get you to witness your inner child, to listen to your inner child, to try some things and notice what happens, how your inner child reacts. And then once you find the words that. That hit home, you can just use them. You can use them for the next day. Use them 50 times a day if you need to, until you. That part of you feels safe. And seeing them.

[B]

Just to add, I find a lot of my clients, and I used to do this again, back to the listening point, they jump into that. You're safe, you're loved. Like, for me, it's definitely listening. It's releasing what you feel in that moment. It's learning to understand what you're feeling. Like, what the hell do I feel? Am I anxious? Am I scared? What am I feeling right now? Because we're so used to dismissing our feelings because we're too busy or we've got something else to do or the kids need something. So it's like, it doesn't matter what I feel. I. I not even go for a pee, even though I've been dying for two hours. Because the kids need their lunch preparing. So it's learning how to understand what you're feeling, saying that, and then the validating and the reassurance. Because with my clients and with me, that's. I never got that. I never got any validation, and I never felt reassured or safe. But often we can take that the wrong way and just go straight into, you're safe, you're safe. It's okay. It's okay. I've got You. You're loved. And it's like, well, hold on, are you asking the child how she is? Because if you're saying to your inner child, you're safe, and they're like, no, no, no, you're safe. No, I don't feel safe. You're safe and you love, but I don't feel safe, then you're dismissing it, but just in a more subtle way, right. To take that step back and go, hold on, let's just check in. How is she feeling first?

[A]

And it's also like, what does that mean to feel safe and love to that particular person? But I mean, it's got to be listening to, like you said, the child in you. Saying, when you turn away from me, when you have that expression on your face, it makes me feel scared, it makes me feel rejected, it makes me feel, you know, it's got to be that specific.

[B]

Right, exactly. So I get them to. For me, it's. Of course, I get them to use it in the moment, but for me, I get them to practice it every single night. It's a nightly practice or a daily practice that. That takes time to connect. It is. It's a relationship. So what? You know, we don't expect our children to suddenly be best friends with a random person they've just met. It takes time for your inner child to trust the inner parent and to receive. My clients find it so hard to receive. So my big emphasis. And I don't know if it's different to other people, but for me, inner parenting is about being parented. You are not the inner parent because otherwise it's just another chore. It's another person that you're responsible for. And that's what's so overwhelming for mums. It's like, oh, my God, I just put my kids to bed and I have to put my inner child to bed. Seriously, I don't have the bandwidth. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. You are being put to bed. Someone is saying, how are you? How was your day? I'm here to listen. What do you need? Do you need a back rub? Do you need your hair stroked? You know, what words do you need to hear? So you're not the inner parent. You are learning and practicing how to receive love, how to let go of responsibility to somebody else. And that, for my clients, is a really big shift.

[A]

Yeah, that makes sense. I love how you said Lavinia, you say on your website, I will love, motivate, cheerlead and fight for you whilst teaching you how to do this for yourself.

[B]

I'm quite fierce. I am so passionate about women not feeling the way that they do when they come to me. I mean, it's just not fair and it's not right and they deserve to feel happier. And I know how it felt to feel like that. Like I said, it was very black for me and I just, I want to do everything. It's probably a bit of a savior complex, to be honest. I'm sure part of it's wound driven. I want to save them. But yeah, it's very important to me. And I am fierce because part of this work is very difficult to do. You have to be able to acknowledge the ways in which your parents weren't there for you. And to do that, you're going to come across a lot of resistance. There's societal resistance. I mean, it's still quite taboo, right, to say I didn't have a great childhood. It's not really.

[A]

Especially if it wasn't terrible, you know, Especially if it wasn't just obviously off the charts trauma. That's the hard stuff, right? That both of you work with is people saying, you know, okay, I don't even know if I deserve to say I had trauma, but these things don't feel comfortable to me and I'm having a really hard time.

[B]

Exactly. The societal resistance, there's cultural resistance, there's religious resistance sometimes, and there's resistance from that part of you, the daughter part, the child part, that is wired to see the good in her parents because she had to in order to attach and attune to her family. A child can't survive on its own. It needs the tribe. So psychologically, you're in a child part can only see the good or only wants to see the good. That's what keeps them in the family unit, keeps them going back to that relative safety. Part of you also saw the negative, but that fragments off. And my job is to help mothers see their childhood as a parent, not as a child. So to see the negative and the positive, to see how they suffered, to see how it was difficult because they don't want to pass it on to their children. And a tool, I always say, which is very useful if you're finding it hard to accept that something wasn't okay that was done to you. Imagine putting your child in the same experience so your parents are doing the same thing they did to you, to your child. How do you feel? And suddenly it's like, oh my God, no, I'd like deck them. Or no, not okay, I'd Be furious. And I'm like, exactly. You're now seeing this, the experience, through your fierce mama eyes as an adult. So this is. This is the very. This is the hardest bit. This bit takes the longest amount of time, getting over the resistance towards seeing that your childhood wasn't perfect and that you suffered. And then comes the release work, which Andrew was talking about. But that bit's a big deal. Yeah.

[A]

Gosh, I could talk about this all day. I'm fascinated by the work that you two do, all the details of it. You know, I feel like we can all relate to it, really. Even if we feel like we had the best childhood in the world, these are human issues. And we get messages from all kinds of experiences that we take in as flaws in ourselves and hold onto, and they become part of our story. Well, thank you both so much for sharing with us. And is there anything that's coming up for you? I know that, Lavinia, you have a book that's downloadable.

[B]

I have a free workbook. Yeah. So this work doesn't have to cost anything. You can start straight away. I always say to people, the most important thing you can start with is looking at your triggers. What is it that creates a disproportionate reaction in you? And then they go, oh, but how do I know it's disproportionate? You know, you feel it, you feel out of control. It feels visceral, it feels physical. Notice what that is and see if you can track that back to an earlier experience where you felt this way. And then that's starting at least that process of noticing how you're feeling, tracking it back to your childhood. And like you said, it's not personal. Your child isn't attacking you. This is your stuff. So, yes, in that workbook, I've got some tools that people can use for absolutely free. So no one needs to feel excluded from this work.

[A]

I love that. And what about you, Andrew?

[C]

I get a lot of people come to me from all over the world. Africa, Indonesia, India. You know, that can't necessarily coach with me. So I've just launched a group that's on my website that's going to be like a weekly group healing experience where I teach people how to go through the process I've discussed. So I teach people how to release the repressed emotion and heal their body and integrate all the parts of themselves.

[A]

Wonderful. Thank you so much. And I hope we get to talk again soon.

[C]

Yeah, my pleasure.

[B]

Thank you, Janet, for what you do.

[A]

All right, take care, you two.

[C]

Bye. Bye.

[A]

You can find Lavinia Brown's work at lavinia brown brown.com that's L A V I N I A brown.com and her Instagram is Lavinia Brown coaching and Andrew is at andrewlyn l y n n.net or on Instagram. Andrew G Lynn thanks so much for listening. We can do this. Toogood and Co Coffee Creamers are made

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