HERITAGE COLLECTION: Greenlights

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Ride with Benito Skinner and Mary Beth Barone

Episode: HERITAGE COLLECTION: Greenlights
Release Date: April 8, 2026
Podcast Network: Dear Media

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Episode Overview

In this fast-paced, irreverent, and highly referential episode, Benito Skinner and Mary Beth Barone revisit a "heritage" episode for their new collection, focusing on cherished, standout memories from their podcast’s history. This week rides through a winding conversation about trends (like axe throwing and escape rooms), lizard-brain behaviors, and, centrally, Lorde’s album Melodrama, as well as the cultural significance of nonfiction books. As ever, the duo balances sharp pop culture commentary with hilarious and warm personal banter.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Heritage Collection Concept

• The duo introduces “Ride: Heritage Collection” – re-releasing favorite past episodes, retitled for clarity.
• They discuss iconic moments from the podcast’s past, highlighting the difficulty of cataloging great spontaneous bits (e.g., “taika and non taika”, “the lesbian cop at Ride Live Massive”).
  • “Sometimes we just don’t know what that moment would have been to include in the description…” (A, 02:30)

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2. Social Commentary on Axe Throwing, Escape Rooms, and Modern Team-Building Fads

Axe Throwing

• Both express utter bewilderment at the rise of axe-throwing bars as dating or team-building activities.
  • “It’s not a good place for people with intrusive thoughts.” (B, 04:30)
  • “I don’t want to throw weapons around with my coworkers.” (A, 05:24)
  • “White people have more time to waste, generally speaking.” (A, 06:31)

Escape Rooms

• The conversation extends into why certain activities catch on among certain demographics.
  • “Women are like, I sort of spent my whole life trying to avoid being locked in a room.” (B, 06:53)
  • “To me, it’s white nonsense.” (A, 06:23)
• The duo affectionately roasts the pointless energy modern corporate and social life invests in such trends.

Memorable Pipeline:

• “The tough mudder participant to bringing a girl on a date axe throwing pipeline, once again, linear.” (A, 04:54)

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3. Conversation Turns Cinephile

• Benito remarks on the podcast’s shift towards cinephile territory, referencing moments from movies like “Seven,” “Mother!” and the fictitious violence in Roku City.
  • “Honestly, slowly becoming like a cinephile podcast.” (A, 08:01)

Roku City Bit:

• Fantasizing about crime and social policy in a digital screensaver city (08:35–09:16).
• “Maybe in Roku City they have, like, universal wage and universal health care…we could probably eliminate crime in a huge way.” (A, 08:48)

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4. Ride or Die: Lorde’s Melodrama

Benito’s Major Pick

• Benito passionately “rides for” Lorde’s Melodrama, dissecting why it is a perfect and timeless album (16:41–25:34).
  • “Here’s the thing about Lorde’s Melodrama. This album is a perfect album. It was her second. It’s her sophomore album and she took her time with it. Some people were mad about how long she took.” (B, 16:45)

Track-by-Track Praise

• Deconstructs album structure as the story of a night at a party.
  • “This is a concept album. It’s supposed to be one night at a party.” (B, 20:15)
• Favorite Tracks & Lyrics:
  • “Green Light” – running in Adidas and a pink dress, feeling electric and alive.
  • “Liability”/“Liability Reprise” – emotions of being ‘too much,’ catharsis.
  • “The Louvre,” “Supercut,” “Hard Feelings/Loveless” – rich songwriting, track blending.
• “I miss lyrics.” (A, 21:37)
  • Laments current pop’s lack of depth in comparison.

Personal & Cultural Impact

• Melodrama as healing during the Trump era (24:24).
  • “This album came out while Trump was president, 2017. We needed her. We needed it the most.” (A/B, 24:24–24:32)
• Personal, emotional anecdotes about concerts and moments tied to the album; Benito details seeing Lorde live (22:11) and the near-religious status the album has among friends.
• Discuss the public’s sometimes unfair expectations on female pop stars (i.e., Lorde’s infamous VMA flu performance, 25:34–25:48).

Benito’s List of “Perfect Albums”

• “Brat, Melodrama, Norman Fucking Rockwell, Women in Music Part Three, and My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy.” (B/A, 24:04–24:16)
  • With side discussions about SZA’s “Ctrl,” Frank Ocean’s “Channel Orange,” and Rihanna’s “Anti.”

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5. The Case for Nonfiction: Mary Beth’s Ride

Mary Beth’s Major Pick

• Mary Beth declares she rides for nonfiction books (31:00).
  • “Nonfiction is when it’s based in fact and truth. There’s sources being cited and it’s like a record of what happened.” (A, 31:02)

Why She Loves Nonfiction

• Prefers reading truth-based material on science, politics, memoirs.
• Favorite examples: Britney Spears’ “The Woman in Me,” Gia Tolentino’s “Trick Mirror,” bell hooks, celebrity memoirs (Tina Fey, Amy Poehler, Molly Shannon).
• Warns listeners to avoid “crackpot/TikTok doctors” and to vet sources—personal responsibility in reading nonfiction (34:29–35:00).

Book Design Tangent

• Rants about book size variety and bookshelf chaos.
  • “It’s kind of weird to me that books are all different sizes. Think about it… all DVDs are one size…” (A, 32:30)
• Benito’s joke: “Biggest book in herstory next to the Order of the Phoenix turf, Hogwarts. We haven’t said fuck you, JK recently.” (B, 31:20)

On Fiction vs. Nonfiction

• Both love the memoir genre.
• Mary Beth advocates everyone read one nonfiction book a year (38:12).
• Witty summary:
  • “Let’s put some confines in it. Let’s give it a maximum page count.” (A, 35:18)
  • Appreciates “loosely based-on” stories and the appeal of historical fiction.

Notable:

• Even self-aware about describing their own show as “a nonfiction podcast in a lot of ways.” (A, 40:37)

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6. Harmonious Wrap-Ups and Callbacks

• Playful banter about “ride or die” friendships, sexuality, Lorde’s future, and the idea of the perfect album cover (37:14–37:31).
• Mary Beth requests Benito do a Bob Dylan impression—ending in hilarious song snippets (38:00).
• Reiterates admiration for partners who read nonfiction (38:33), and issues gentle warnings about some nonfiction leading to unfortunate political rabbit holes (39:02).

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7. Greenlights (…The Matthew McConaughey Connection)

• In a full-circle twist, Mary Beth looks up the title of McConaughey’s memoir—“Greenlights”—just as “Green Light” by Lorde began the Melodrama album discussion. (41:17)
  • “Tell me right the now.” (B, 41:17)
  • “Greenlights.” (A, 41:19)
• Both are comically shocked by the coincidence, looping the episode’s themes together.

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Notable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• “You’re nobody until you’re talked about.” (B quoting Gossip Girl ad campaign, 02:55)
• “It’s not a good place for people with intrusive thoughts.” (B on axe throwing, 04:30)
• “To me, it’s white nonsense.” (A on escape rooms, 06:23)
• “This album is a perfect album. It was her second. It’s her sophomore album and she took her time with it.” (B, 16:45)
• “I’m just a sucker for good lyrics.” (A, 22:04)
• “Republicans don’t listen to music. Clip that, Dear Media. Clip that.” (B, 23:40)
• “My beautiful dark twisted fantasy… I know, I know. Sorry. It’s okay. To me that came out when we could enjoy it.” (B/A, 24:14–24:19)
• “You always taught me history isn’t done.” (B, 39:51)
• “How do we know where we’re going if we don’t know where we’re from?” (A quoting Hitch, 39:48)
• Final shock/callback — “Greenlights… I’m waiting for that green light. I want it…” (A/B, 41:19–41:26)

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Essential Episode Timestamps

• Heritage Collection & Ride Cataloging: 00:41–02:41
• Axe Throwing & Escape Rooms Riff: 04:02–07:09
• Cinephile, Roku City, and Digital Social Commentary: 08:01–09:39
• Lorde’s Melodrama Discussion Begins: 16:41
• Perfect Albums List: 24:01–24:19
• Nonfiction Book Rant: 31:00–35:18
• Book Size & Shelf Aesthetic Bit: 32:30–33:53
• Memoirs/Recommendations: 35:02–36:14
• Ride or Die Friendship Banter: 36:48–37:39
• Nonfiction’s Value, Partners Who Read, Wormholes: 38:33–39:17
• Greenlights Revelation: 41:06–41:26

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Overall Tone & Style

True to the show’s established voice, Benito and Mary Beth’s discussion is deeply referential, high-energy, and laced with inside jokes, rapid-fire pop culture analysis, and affectionate ribbing. The episode elegantly weaves together seemingly random cultural artifacts – from Lorde to McConaughey to the home edit effect on bookshelves – all with a self-aware, comedic touch that superfans and first-time listeners alike can savor.

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Transcript

[A]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Hey, can you come pick me up? Yeah.

[B]

What's wrong?

[A]

Nothing.

[B]

Are you sure?

[A]

Yeah, no, I just need a ride. Ride. I just want to have fun.

[B]

Start your engine. Take it. I'm Benito Skinner.

[A]

I'm Mary Beth Barone and this is Ride. Hello and welcome to the Ride Heritage Collection.

[B]

The Heritage Collection.

[A]

This is something new we're trying where we are going to release iconic heritage episodes of the podcast in no particular order, and we're going to retitle them so you know exactly which iconic moment to expect. Moments that come to mind. The lesbian cop at Ride Live Massive. We're talking about Amya Sista.

[B]

I was there. It was rare.

[A]

It was rare. NDA and of course, how many chickens there are in the world.

[B]

Oh, I just got a boner. Oh, my God. Wait. Mary Beth just cut her finger and is bleeding.

[A]

I guess we have to go enjoy this episode. We hope it's a tasty treat for you. We're gonna have fun going through the archives and picking out these episodes for you.

[B]

Think about what we're doing right now. We do exist in the world. Isn't that trippy to think about? Let's go on the journey for the ride Heritage Collection. How do these things stay in the air? I do my makeup in somebody else's sky. We ordered different drinks at the same bar. I said that to. Did I say that to Edward recently? Whoa. Edward is like five seconds. I got Eddie unbraided. I think we. He wanted to order a different drink. Drink. And I said, we order different drinks

[A]

at the same bar.

[B]

Which you can do with friends.

[A]

You can do with friends. You can do with strangers. That's what's cool about it.

[B]

Well, that was a huge hint of what I'm writing for today, I think in a huge way.

[A]

Don't say it yet, but I can't say.

[B]

Well, they never read the title.

[A]

It's breadcrumbs. That's what I love about the. Don't say it like. Well, we don't want to spoil. It's like in the title. We could have done like cryptic titles if you really wanted to. We could have named the episodes like a little wink.

[B]

A little hard to go back to your favorites.

[A]

I know. That would be crazy.

[B]

You're listening to these episodes up to five to ten times.

[A]

Well, what's funny is on the Reddit, a lot of the posts are like, does anyone remember the episode where blank. But we could never have known what that moment would have been. To include in the description because sometimes we just don't. We just don't know.

[B]

I can't imagine what they're saying. Do you know when. When they said taika and non taika back and forth for five minutes, was that. Which episode was that?

[A]

Someone did comment on the TikTok. I've been reading the comments more lately and trying to like, you know, just see what the conversation is.

[B]

It reminds me of this Gossip Girl ad campaign where for the first poster that of Gossip Girl when it was in like Seventeen magazine, it said, you're nobody until you're talked about. I still say that to people.

[A]

You do? I've seen you say, I told my

[B]

parents that this week.

[A]

That's also a little bit of an Easter egg for what's to come.

[B]

Oh, I'm just doing James Charles.

[A]

Someone. Don't do that again. Don't do that again. Someone, Someone commented. Can someone please explain taika and fight it to me? I've done so much research and I've done the work and I still don't know what it means.

[B]

I can't imagine.

[A]

May I refer you to the Encyclopedia of Ride, which we did at the end of the year last year.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's really a table of contents and it's a glossary and it's a bibliography. In a lot of ways, the amount

[B]

of stone faced straight men at dinners with us as we describe Taika and Faith, they're like their minds, one of them is just going to drop dead. Their faces, their forehead's just going to hit the platter.

[A]

Yeah. Eyes roll back into their heads.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

That sort of brings me to what you had said you wanted to discuss in the opening today, which was. I don't want to take it from you, ax throwing.

[B]

So I just, I just think we've lost the plot. Here's my thing. I just can't. I've done it once.

[A]

That's a shock.

[B]

Do it again. Well, it was kind of at the dawning process. No, Take a sec.

[A]

When was this?

[B]

This was in like 2017. I would say.

[A]

Okay, we hadn't met yet.

[B]

Well, it was the dawn of Ax Throw as we know it. It's just like what I was laughing to myself thinking if I had to date, like if that's. I only took my dates to ax throwing. I was like, yeah, do you want to like go ax throwing? God. I mean, it's not a good place for people with intrusive thoughts. Let's just say no. I would say a nightmare. It's a total hellscape. I Just think it's so funny that it exists and that it's everywhere. It's, like, where froyo places closed, axe throwing filled in. And that pisses me off, obviously, because, you know, I'm a froyo head.

[A]

And on that note, the tough mudder participant to bringing a girl on a date axe throwing pipeline, once again, linear.

[B]

No better place to show off for your girl than axe throw it.

[A]

My arms look so good.

[B]

Dude, look at this.

[A]

I just love hitting the bullseye.

[B]

Like, God, it's weird. I think I did throw one of them. I am built like a brick shithouse right now, so I feel like I could really let one of those rock. But I did one time, and it hit the wall and kind of came back a little bit. And that's where I'm like, I, no, no, no, I can't do this.

[A]

I guess also, like, I've seen it sort of, like, marketed as, like, oh, bring your team here for, like, a team building thing, like, at your company where you work. Like, I don't want to throw weapons around with my co workers. No.

[B]

I don't want to be at ax throwing, where, like, a bunch of guys who work at VaynerMedia.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean? Like, that's not cool for me.

[A]

No. I don't want to see their clothes.

[B]

I don't want to hear what corporate is throwing axes.

[A]

Oh, for sure.

[B]

Go to a gun range.

[A]

Like, men do that. No women allowed. Head. I'm on guys only.

[B]

That too. I don't think. Oh, I don't know. Maybe that gets it out of their system. I know there's all these things that are like, come trash a room and like, yeah, why is it in their system? Just beat the out of somebody.

[A]

But why is it in their system? No, why do they need to get it out?

[B]

I know.

[A]

Just do other stuff. Like, do the emotional work.

[B]

Like, listen to melodrama.

[A]

Like listening to melodrama by Lord.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In a huge.

[B]

That's how I get it out of my system. Oh, and escape rooms. We're dying to be kidnapped. I don't want to know. Sorry.

[A]

To me, it's white nonsense.

[B]

But so for me, yeah, I need

[A]

to see the demographics. And I mean this from a purely scientific standpoint, because, as you know, I'm a data scientist. I need to see the breakdown demographically of, like, who has time for that? Because I do feel like white people have more time to waste, generally speaking.

[B]

Well, you have that great joke where you go where straight men wake up with all Their rights, so then they have time to look up the population.

[A]

I want to go get locked up in a room. I'm good. I'm okay on that.

[B]

No, I'm good.

[A]

I'm okay.

[B]

Women are like, I sort of spent

[A]

my whole life trying to avoid being locked in a room. So the idea of paying to do it and having to solve riddles and

[B]

stuff, this is so cool. People have always asked us, what do we die for it? And we're all about positivity. But I think today, actually, I. I die for escape rooms and acts. Thrilling.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But you might catch me at both on accident, because streaming will just be like, what should we do tonight? Should we go to an escape room? And I'm like, or we could see a movie. Come on, dude.

[A]

Or we could just hang out and talk.

[B]

Oh, that too.

[A]

That's something I enjoy. Well, I'm always gonna put that on the table.

[B]

And I'm glad you are.

[A]

Yeah. Always. Always.

[B]

And we all appreciate this.

[A]

That's just gonna be my pitch.

[B]

It's never gonna be a throwing with the brownies, though.

[A]

I would, but I don't think an ax would be thrown.

[B]

Their boobs would. No, of course not. But their boobs would get in the way. That can't be easy for sure to throw with two cowabungas on your chest.

[A]

Not inclusive. And for my bones, you have to

[B]

do it from the side one hand.

[A]

My bone issues are a season two topic. We discovered another season two topic in the car on the way here that I can't. But we're not talking about it today.

[B]

Can we just say a little? Can we say it? 1, 2, 3, 7. The film Seven. We'll talk about it later.

[A]

The podcast.

[B]

Watch it now.

[A]

Honestly, slowly becoming like a cinephile podcast.

[B]

Well, I know, I know. Someone told me this week something about, oh, Cartier. He is in every episode now. He is an era for us in a lot of ways.

[A]

And people will get it once the show comes out, of course.

[B]

Like, why this week he goes. Overcompensating is kind of for cinephiles too. He's like, terry might be pissed.

[A]

Terry's furious Terry, like, he's in the edit. Like, cut this, cut this, cut this reference.

[B]

He throws an axe at our Roku tv.

[A]

Not Roku City.

[B]

Not Roku City. He's Godzilla to that city. Sis.

[A]

The first violent crime to happen to Roku City. Because while Terry's doing, Terry's like, I

[B]

wish there was crime that you could see happening in the city. Like burglaries. Like, you know, well, it's a

[A]

crime is a social issue. I learned that this year, maybe last year, Dear Media Clip, that crime is a social issue. So maybe in Roku City they have, like, universal wage and universal health care. Because if we had things like that, like a lot of minor adjustments to the way our society works and where taxes go and who's taxed and whatnot, we could probably eliminate crime in a huge way.

[B]

Do you remember, I would love, like, little Easter eggs planted in Roku City? Kind of like, do you remember the folklore of, like, that guy who got fired from Disney? So he put a penis on the priest in the Little Mermaid? He wrote Sex in the Air and Lion King.

[A]

But those are real.

[B]

No, I know they're there. And Aladdin, my favorite is Aladdin. If you crank it up, max volume and he goes, take off all your clothes. It's like in some of the VHS tapes. I need to know, like, actually the history of why this exists. Not looking it up today, but I might later, actually. Really, I'm really curious. This has got my interest peaked.

[A]

And needless to say, you know about this stuff, right? I do.

[B]

The priest of the Lone Mermaid has.

[A]

Has a boner. So we're doing a U turn episode coming up, which I just want to preface, like, if you haven't listened to all the episodes of Ride, you probably should, but we're going to actually be revisiting some topics that maybe were even covered on Obsessed.

[B]

Bleep it, bleep it.

[A]

And see if we still ride for them or if there's just more information we want to share, more thoughts, feelings and things.

[B]

Because it's hard sometimes. Like the one I'm choosing. Like, I've grown so much as a. As a Stan of this, as a

[A]

writer, you're an even bigger stand than when we talked about it.

[B]

Yeah. And it's so much more to share.

[A]

I think we're going to get earnest on that episode. Not that we're not usually.

[B]

Can I say I agree?

[A]

Yeah, you can. So my bones, I have really brittle bones.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so that's going to be coming up more and more.

[B]

You'd go with the ax, literally. I would do, oh, my God, wait, I leave it.

[A]

And I'd hit the bullseye.

[B]

You guys don't even know that Benny Drama went to a bachelor party that was duck hunting. Like, shooting the discs that fly up.

[A]

Oh, like, what do they call it?

[B]

Yeah, it was like an Orvis.

[A]

They fly up, someone throw. Oh, skeet shooting. But like, with skeet clay pots.

[B]

Yeah. With skeet shooting.

[A]

You, you, you, you shoot caraway caskets.

[B]

I literally. Yeah, yeah. They fly a little. A sage green skillet. Simo. So here's the thing. That whole day I just thought it was so fun, funny and stupid. I was like Lara Croft, Tomb Raider. If she's like, if she never got even more. If she actually like really ate down Laura Croft.

[A]

She refused to slay.

[B]

She refused to slay. If actually she had no training at all. Oh, sometimes I really want to go to the academy that Uma Thurman went to and kill Bill with that guy. That's all I'm going to say on that. So another movie. I just would love to see what he could do for me this whole day. It was my brother's bachelor party that someone else had planned. Obviously today is a huge day for me and I think I'm finally ready to talk about it. Enough pussyfooting around. I will be writing for Lord's Melodrama.

[A]

I just put down the hair tie I've been fiddling with to give you my full attention.

[B]

Thank God you did.

[A]

Today I'm going to be writing for non fiction books. Let's get into it. Hey you guys, it's Mary Beth here. This episode of Ride is brought to you by Article. As you all know, I have several article items, the most famous probably being the cup chair, which, truth be told, hasn't been getting a lot of action lately. But it's ready. It's ready whenever the time comes and I think that's what's important. As you know, Article offers a curated range of mid century, modern, coastal and scandi inspired pieces that not only shine with their own, but also pair seamlessly with nearly any other article, product or a cuckoo. It's. It's really beautiful. This thoughtful design approach makes it incredibly easy to mix and match, helping you create a space that feels cohesive and stylish. There's no filler. Every item is chosen for its craftsmanship, design and lasting value. You can immediately tell the difference in quality when you receive an article piece. 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I would choose Gold belly for Mother's Day cuz as you know, my mom likes to cook about 300 meatballs at a time and enough lasagna to feed a ship of naval officers. And sometimes she just needs like the day off. Like she just needs to open a box that says, we're thinking of you. Why don't you sit down and sit still if you can and read a book instead of cooking all day. And I think that that's really special. So if you're looking to make Mother's Day perfect or you just want to impress your friends and family with an epic meal next time you host, which is something that Benny and I have to do because Lord knows we don't cook, go to goldbelly.com and get free shipping and 20% off your first order with promo code RIDE. That's goldbelly.com code RIDE for free shipping and 20% off your 1st order. Enjoy. Bon appetit. Wait, where are we going?

[B]

Who cares?

[A]

Ride.

[B]

Whoa. This one's for like geniuses.

[A]

This is a really highbrow and it's an episode based in intellect and academia.

[B]

I do my makeup in somebody else's car. Here's the thing about Lord's melodrama. This album is a perfect album. It was her second. It's her sophomore album and she took her time with it. Some people were mad about how long she took.

[A]

I like when artists do that.

[B]

I agree. And sorry if you come back and it's a perfect album. No notes, start to finish. I think I've probably listened to it 10,000 times. I feel everything. I have a new favorite every week still. This album, I'm gonna read you through the set, like track list, the track list, but also the set list in a way.

[A]

In a way, yeah. Yeah, totally.

[B]

But I think people are still trying to make an album like this. And it starts with greenlight. We haven't seen Lord for. We didn't see her for a year.

[A]

A year. Imagine the pressure to follow up Royals and an album like pure heroine with something. Take your time.

[B]

She got into that studio she looked at Jack Antonoff and she said, we're

[A]

going to make history.

[B]

Should we make history? And she. Because she only calls Jack gnofa.

[A]

Right. Even though he's straight and married to a woman.

[B]

Well, of course. So green light to come out with Green light. I'm waiting for it. That green light. I want it. I want it in the video where she's running around in the Adidas and the pink dress. Like this song. It has such energy. It has a Verve verb. It's what you do.

[A]

And a lot of life.

[B]

It has a lust for life. She's having the time of her life and she's having it in the back of an Uber. How many times can you say that's happened to you? Tons.

[A]

Tons.

[B]

Like I felt that. I felt the human experience there. And also seeing yourself in. In the mirror at a bar and you're kind of like, I might do something crazy tonight.

[A]

Because the lighting's so good. Because the lighting, you've never looked better.

[B]

And you're like, wait, I'm kind of sickly looking too. Like, I'm like a little like my eyes look a little like purple and I'm like. And the colors of this album also just melodrama 7 when you think about it.

[A]

The COVID the painting.

[B]

I want that painting above my fireplace. It's in the loof down the back. But who cares? Come on, it's the best record.

[A]

It's. So I call this a record.

[B]

So then it goes from green light into sober. A perfect song, honestly. I remember she has an amazing.

[A]

Is it called I want to stop recording and just Listen to be honest.

[B]

Come on. She's an amazing. I think it's called Song Exploder. And she talks about sober and you realize like how brilliant she is and just. Oh, God, Ella, you've got us by the balls, darling. So then Homemade dynamite. A couple Rebel Top Gun fat with nowhere to be. Fuck. Then it goes into the Louvre, which for me personally, first time I heard that in Supercut, I was on the subway and in your car, the radio up. I was going absolutely fucking feral. It's crazy. Every song on this is. Is a masterpiece.

[A]

You're going to know exactly what my favorite song is on it, but I'm not going to say it yet.

[B]

I know it's not right. Or in the dark. I bet it's. You know what? Liability Reprise is looking at me cross eyed right now, but I think you might be. I'm a Hard feelings Loveless. Are you serious? That's when telepathy. That Is every time I listen to it, you hear it.

[A]

I love when songs are two different songs.

[B]

When I listen to. Oh, totally. Slash. She has a slash.

[A]

It's a slash. It's different.

[B]

Well, this album really plays with, like, that in a fun way. This taught me what reprise could mean.

[A]

I'm a liability.

[B]

She's like, wait, it's great. I'm not done. It's.

[A]

Wait, it's like, oh, you thought I was done.

[B]

Let me circle back right quick and tell you what else I have to say about that. But this is also what people forget, is that this is a concept album. It's supposed to be one night at a party.

[A]

I actually. Inspiration.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So then, like, you know, you're kind of feeling it. Sometimes you're in the bathroom and you're really sad. It's supposed to be like a night at a party.

[A]

You know where else she comes back around is sober, too.

[B]

Well, yeah, of course it's sober, too. Wait, I have to hear the top of that. Oh, sober too. You mean sober two. Melodrama. Yeah, we told you this was melodrama. Yeah, you wanted something that we'd offer.

[A]

When you hear the Louvre and you think, that's a perfect song, and then you hear liability, and you're like, oh, I'm actually sobbing right now.

[B]

Yeah. And then you think you're, like, safe. Like, you think you've made it out of the party. And then she goes, liability reprise. You're a little much for me. And then at the end, but you're not what you thought you were. Oh, I just got chills.

[A]

Isn't that crazy?

[B]

One time, I just. Terry and I were in the car listening to it one time and just fully sobbing. You know what I mean? You have to have that moment, like, and writer in the dark. I think about all the time when people are like, hey, wait, like, is someone inspired by me in the show? And I'm like, that you ru the day.

[A]

Maybe when they're like, don't write Stand

[B]

up about me when I go shopping with Adam DeMarco in a video comes out that says that straight guys take too long to shop. Bet you rude. The day you.

[A]

You kissed your writer.

[B]

And by kissed, we mean went shopping with yes.

[A]

Yeah. Another thing I want to point out on this album is just like, I miss lyrics. Do you get what I mean?

[B]

No, I miss lyrics.

[A]

Like, lyrics can be so powerful. I feel like there's a lot of flimsy pop right now, and.

[B]

Which can be fun.

[A]

Which is fun.

[B]

I think there's a place for it.

[A]

It's so fun and it's. It's frivolous and it's sexy. And it's summer, summertime. You know what I mean? But in the winter, sometimes fall even. And spring.

[B]

Yeah, maybe all the seasons, sort of every.

[A]

Every day.

[B]

I would say all year.

[A]

Every365. I like lyrics. And I'm. I'm just a sucker for good lyrics.

[B]

Oh, and this just has so many good ones. Like. Well, summer slipped us underneath her tongue, Our days and nights. I also saw this tour live at Barclays. It was unbelievable. Yeah. And then I thought I was safe.

[A]

I fumbled that.

[B]

And then I thought I was safe. And then she did Yellow Flicker Beat and which. I'll talk about Lord's Hunger Games album at a different time. I can't even get into it right now.

[A]

I saw her at Glastonbury two summers ago.

[B]

Glastonbury?

[A]

Lastonbury. And she played a cover of Cruel Summer, but not the Taylor Cruel Summer. And I just want her to release it so bad so I can put it on my playlist of important covers.

[B]

Well, you know, there's one track on this that she didn't put on it. I think it's, oh, Precious Metals. And it's.

[A]

Well, you showed it to me on YouTube recently.

[B]

I know. I played it for you outside a restaurant.

[A]

Yeah, it was urgent.

[B]

Well, I said I have to play you Precious Metals.

[A]

When a straight guy plays you a YouTube video, it's never urgent. When a gay guy plays you a YouTube video, it's life and death.

[B]

It could either be the best song you've ever heard or the worst.

[A]

The worst.

[B]

That time I chose the best.

[A]

The best. And I'm thankful.

[B]

Yeah, she's performed it live a few times. I need it so bad. But also she has a cover of Take Me to the River. It's unbelievable. Take me to the River.

[A]

I gotta hear that. Why haven't you played that for me?

[B]

I'll. I'll play it right after this. Once we leave the Gotham Bank. Once we blow this place to smithereens. The Gotham Bank. Do you know much how many dynamites I got in the basement here, sister?

[A]

I want to know how girls who don't hang out with gay guys find music. That's something I'd be.

[B]

Republicans don't listen to music. Clip that, dear media. Clip that.

[A]

Clip that. That's a perfect clip. I would be willing to post that. I think that's a clip. I'm not even kidding.

[B]

No, I think that's an absolutely Perfect clip. Sorry. Yeah. This album, it's almost one of the things I write so hard for. You almost find that you can't even, like, put it into words at times. It's. It's a top five for me. I have five albums that I think are perfect.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Are you ready?

[A]

I'm ready.

[B]

Brat.

[A]

Of course.

[B]

Melodrama.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Norman fucking Rockwell. Women in Music, Part three.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And then one. I feel it's problematic, you guys, but don't be mad.

[A]

What?

[B]

My beautiful, dark, twisted fantasy.

[A]

I know, I know. Sorry. It's okay. To me, that came out when we could enjoy it. Of course. So it's.

[B]

Of course.

[A]

I want to point out that this album came out while Trump was president, 2017.

[B]

We needed her.

[A]

We needed it the most.

[B]

And she goes, I'm on my way.

[A]

I'm on my way. Super nanny.

[B]

Can you do. She's from New Zealand, right?

[A]

Yeah. Kiwis really hate when you do Australian and label it New Zealand.

[B]

I think I've done that a lot in this episode, but I'll figure it out.

[A]

You've gotten a lot. I think it's.

[B]

I mean, I'm trying to mill Drama.

[A]

Mila drama. Mila drama.

[B]

Sing that. Mila drama. 7.

[A]

Here's the thing with a perfect album like this, I could listen to it every day, and I still do.

[B]

I put it my story recently. I go, oh, I'm back on this album. Watch out.

[A]

And what was I listening to when you got in the car this morning, Mila Jerma.

[B]

Because it's just like, it's a perfect album. You can listen to it start to finish whenever you want to. You know what it is? It's such a tour de force. A sophomore record that took its time and was kind of punished for taking its time in a lot of ways, because you don't have, like, the whole machine behind you like you did previously. If you're coming off a huge record, I think labels want you to come out with an album, like, a year later to, like, stay on the hype. She took her time and.

[A]

And made how artworks.

[B]

She made an iconic. You know what it is? It's a masterpiece.

[A]

But do you remember when. And this goes into just, like, female pop stars just. They can't do anything right in the court of public opinion. Remember when she had, like, the flu and she had to perform at the VMAs, so she just danced around the stage and everyone gave her shit for it. She still fudgeing. Showed up.

[B]

You know, I was obsessed with that. That was my Vma thing that I was.

[A]

Okay, good.

[B]

I believe that's what I was a long time. I know we've been. It's hard to like this many things.

[A]

If the flowers, though, it's kind of

[B]

us at a party when we're like, wait, play melodrama. It's just like straight guys sitting around and we're just like, I'm fudgeing, vibing.

[A]

I don't care.

[B]

I'm tweaking.

[A]

It's our world and they're just living in it. Oh, the universe. What?

[B]

The remix. Homemade din, mate.

[A]

That's a perfect segue to what I wanted to discuss post Malone.

[B]

Khed.

[A]

Khed Sza was put under similar pressure after Control came out, which I feel Control is a perfect album.

[B]

Oh, I should have put that on Control.

[A]

Control is perfect. But then her second album took a little longer and it's.

[B]

So is Channel Orange.

[A]

Yeah. There can be more than five.

[B]

Yeah. Those were just.

[A]

Were on my list because to me, so is anti. I'm glad that Lord has never given us a reason to have to not listen to this album.

[B]

Oh, and she never will.

[A]

Huge shout out to all the artists that are just sort of keeping it all above board.

[B]

Have you ever watched her break the ice when she does the Britney Spears break the ice in the woods for Vogue?

[A]

No.

[B]

I'll play that outside a restaurant tonight for you. When people keep leaving dinners to have cigarettes outside, which. Stop it. Stop it. We're at dinner.

[A]

Stream the album. Finish this episode first. Let's get it back into the top 10.

[B]

I think we could easily get it back into the top 10. Top five.

[A]

You know when those tweets would go viral, that was like, Frank Ocean's Channel Orange is back in the Billboard top 100. And everyone would be like, are we okay?

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

But no. But I think if melodrama. Melodrama should just sort of always be in the top 100, in my opinion.

[B]

I agree.

[A]

And if. If it's not, you and I aren't doing the work that we need to be doing.

[B]

But to me, I'm like, I'm doing so much work for this record.

[A]

We could always be doing more. Spring means more movement, trips, eating out. Stay consistent with your health wherever the season takes you. AG1 travel packs make it easy to keep your routine. Spring is a season of change, but it doesn't have to throw off your foundation. Reset with one simple daily habit that supports your energy, gut and immune health even when everything else is shifting. AG1 is a daily health drink clinically shown to support gut health and fill in common nutrient gaps. With 75 plus ingredients including five clinically studied probiotic strains, AG1 replaces the need for a multivitamin, probiotics and more. It's just all in one little pack. Spring brings daylight savings, packed calendars and changing routines as well as season two of overcompensating. One scoop 20 seconds. That's all it takes to keep your gut routine steady so you can reset, recharge and embrace the season without missing a beat. Whenever I drink my AG1 pinky looks at me with jealous eyes cuz she would like some as well. Most supplements over complicate things. A pile of pills, confusing timing and impossible schedule to stick with long term. AG1 simplifies it. Multivitamin, pre and probiotics, superfoods and antioxidants all in one scoop. The superfoods and B vitamins in AG1 provide nutritional support to help you stay steady and consistent. Treat AG1 like a non negotiable ritual, not a supplement. It fits into our lives. It fits into set life hashtag actors life, hashtag bts and I just can't go a day without it. And I think that's good. Go to drinkag1.comride to get an AG1 flavor sampler and a bottle of vitamin D3K2 for free in your AG1 welcome kit with your first AG1 subscription order. That's a 72 value and it's yours free only while supplies last. Go to drink ag1.com ride whether you're renting or paying a mortgage, one of your biggest monthly expenses should be working harder for you. That's where BILT comes in. BILT is the membership for where you live that rewards you with points on every housing payment wherever you live. We can all agree that housing is expensive. Rent, mortgage. It doesn't matter which one you're paying. It stings every month, but BILT can make it feel a little better. Let me explain. BILT started out rewarding members on their rent. Now, as of 2026, BILT members can also earn points on mortgage payments wherever they live. You heard that Benny? Every housing payment earns you points you can use toward flights with top travel partners like United and Hyatt, Lyft rides, Amazon.com purchases, and so much more. Personally, I redeem my points for all of my Amazon orders. As you know, overcompensating is on Prime Video and that's also where I order things like pens. But here's what I think is the most underrated part. Let Me sip my tea. Built members also get access to a neighborhood concierge. It can make restaurant reservations, book fitness classes and find new local spots, all while being rewarded at more than 45,000 merchant partners. It's like having a personal assistant baked into where you live. It's simple. Being a renter and now owning a home is better. With bilt. Join the membership for where you [e-mail] ride that's J O I N B I L T.com ride make sure to use our URL so they know that we sent you. There are so many ways to redeem built points. Let me list them for you. Rent Credit fitness classes like Soul Cycle, Berries, Pure Bar, Core power Cycle Bar Rumble Y7 Yoga 6BFT built home delivery Powered by Gopuff, Built Travel Portal. Ooh, sounds fun. And the Built Home Collection. I mean, if you're not convinced, what's it going to take? So this week I'm going to be writing, as I mentioned, for non fiction books. Now this might surprise people because I'm a storyteller.

[B]

I love tell people what nonfiction means.

[A]

So nonfiction is when it's based in fact and truth. There's sources being cited and it's like a record of what happened.

[B]

There's no flourish like Matthew McConaughey's book.

[A]

Exactly. Like, and sometimes you can add weight to it physically, but it's still nonfiction.

[B]

Like the Last of the Mohicans.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Biggest book in herstory next to the Order of the Phoenix turf, Hogwarts. We haven't said fuck you, JK recently. On this very day when I'm writing For Lord's melodrama, you J.K. j.K. Lord

[A]

could do Harry Potter, but J.K. could never do melodrama.

[B]

Well, it's like how I told Terry that Terry could do Nara Smith, but she could never do him.

[A]

I totally agree with that.

[B]

You get that?

[A]

I do.

[B]

Like, she could never, like, go on tour with. Yeah, you know. You know what I mean by that.

[A]

I do. So I love building worlds, I love creating universes, and I love to put words on the page. But what I really enjoy reading when I'm consuming books is nonfiction. So whether they're based on science or politics or it's a book of essays, like Trick Mirror, for example, by Gia Tolentino, which took me three years to read.

[B]

I love perfect length of time to

[A]

read about the perfect length of time. I love my meditation book fiction. I love bell hooks. I just want to read things that are rooted in truth and facts. So I can share that knowledge.

[B]

Well, the Woman in Me was my favorite book of, like, the last 10 years.

[A]

Give me a memoir any day of the week. Now there are a collection of fiction books that I believe are perfect books, one of them being my year of rest and relaxation. Catcher in the Rye.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

The Awakening, which is short. And that gets me into something else I want to talk about. So I made a video about this a really long time ago. But it's kind of weird to me that books are all different sizes. Think about it. They're different size. And I don't even mean page count, which I'll get to. But why did we say, like, all DVDs are one size, VHS are one size. But books, we said, just. Just have fun with it. I know that makes a bookshelf a very, very difficult place.

[B]

Well, it sounds like you're the home edit. What's that show that was on Netflix where they make all of it rainbow coated? I keep going into houses and that happens. And I'm like, pride's over.

[A]

I have a. I have my books arranged by color. It just happens.

[B]

That's crazy. You do that. Let him. Let him rock. Chaos.

[A]

Oh, oh, Mr. OCD. And I can't organize.

[B]

Sorry. My OCD didn't manifest in that way. I don't know how to describe it either way. Books, I'm like, I just. I let her.

[A]

Let her rip.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, Terry has a, like, designer's eye way of organizing books. And I love the way your books are organized.

[B]

He does. He really does.

[A]

But for me, it's like there's a. There should be a place for everything and everything in its place, and that's next to other pink books. If it's a pink book, it should be with other pink books. And maybe that's just growing up in a. In a society, I should let my books sort of just find their friends and stay with them. But. So I actually think there should be a standard book size, and I think there should be a maximum book length. And if your page count is over that length, that's two books.

[B]

People are out here doing the work, especially Penguin.

[A]

Penguins doing a lot.

[B]

The big publisher, Fox Books, Penguin. But they're making, like, remakes where all the books are, like, all the classics

[A]

are the same size.

[B]

So you could have that if you wanted to.

[A]

Fox Books. Oh, my God.

[B]

I said Fox.

[A]

Tom Hanks in you've Got Mail.

[B]

We talked about how I want the sequel of that. No, it's like, I know that he came crawling back to Meg Ryan. Because she was like, oh, now you want mom and Pop bookshops, bitch, you're out of business. Borders Bookstores, gone now Spirit Halloween.

[A]

Well, he probably retired off all the money he made at the big conglomerate.

[B]

And no, I think he killed himself.

[A]

Oh, okay. Well, that's in the sequel in 2008. I do love nonfiction books, and I think if you love fiction, maybe once a year just pick up a nonfiction book. I'm not going to give you any examples because it's really whatever piques your interest. But what's cool about nonfiction books is there's nonfiction books about everything. Now, having said that, make sure it's not a crackpot doctor like Dr. Oz or a TikTok doctor who's writing about stuff that's just actually not true. Because a lot of times nonfiction, there's. It's like with documentaries, like, everyone has an angle. Everyone has an agenda they're trying to push, so.

[B]

Except Britney.

[A]

Except Britney, obviously. She was just writing what happened.

[B]

God, it's so good.

[A]

As it unfolded. Jessica Simpson's memoir. I really loved Amy Poehler's memoir. Tina Fey. There are so many great celebrities who've written memoirs.

[B]

Molly Shannon's is fabulous.

[A]

What a great read.

[B]

Oh, Molly, right.

[A]

What a fabulous read.

[B]

Fabulous.

[A]

Oh, I put that book down.

[B]

That's an absolute must.

[A]

Made me laugh out loud. There's enough fake news going around. That's how I think about fiction books. What? You could come up with anything. That's not fair. Let's put some confines in it. Let's give it a page. Let's give it a maximum page count.

[B]

Compensating is kind of somewhere in the middle, wouldn't you say?

[A]

I. I really would. And I love that about it.

[B]

Playing with form.

[A]

I love things that are, like, inspired by slash. Loosely based on. That's like, we're very loosely based. Perfect thing for me. That's the perfect middle ground for me. And historical fiction can be so beautiful as well. Now, that's a great genre because you're mixing. And, oh, the research that's going into

[B]

historical, into the Steve Jobs book. Do you remember when everyone was reading that?

[A]

Yeah. Not me, though.

[B]

Well, not me either.

[A]

Couldn't be me. So again, couldn't be me. Oh, and the Sir Isaac Newton biography. That's two books, my love. A Little Life.

[B]

Don't look at me.

[A]

Sorry. 500 pages.

[B]

Oh, a Little Life that. Oh, that ruined Terry for a while.

[A]

Do you know what it's about?

[B]

I don't want to.

[A]

Don't ever read what that Book is about ever. If you can write anything in the world, let's write a happy book. Have we ever considered a happy book or a happy play?

[B]

We've talked about this. Walk two moons. I'm not. I'm really not speaking on that.

[A]

I just feel like there's enough bad.

[B]

So much for my happy ending.

[A]

That's why I just keep watching hitch.

[B]

Oh, totally. Any day. Oh, it's flair. She get into ride or die? You know what you are, Mary Beth?

[A]

Bisexual.

[B]

Well, yeah, but you're also my ride or die. Ride or die.

[A]

Of course I ride for lorde's melodrama. It sort of goes without saying at this point.

[B]

That's one of my girls.

[A]

She's a true artist. To make a timeless album in a time, much like Charlie did, where it feels like, could anything timeless ever be made again? And the girls are telling us yes. So I'm. I'm happy. I'm happy when my pop girl puts out a new album. I agree. She's one.

[B]

Whatever she's got next, I'm excited. I love solar power. It was like driving home from the beach, having a good time.

[A]

I love the COVID Oh, that's an upskirt shot. But it's artistic.

[B]

Perfect cover alert. That's on my perfect cover. Actually, every album I listed has a perfect cover.

[A]

Agree.

[B]

When you think about it.

[A]

Agreed. Yeah, totally. So I'm. I plan on streaming it on the way home. And hard feelings. Love. I mean. Yeah. It's just. I could cry right now.

[B]

No, I know. Oh, I'm gonna do a doo wop version of that at your wedding.

[A]

Thank you. Can you do Bob Dylan? Everything is romantic.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Because it's been a while.

[B]

Bad tattoos on leather.

[A]

Incredible. Your mind.

[B]

I know. Timmy thought. Timmy Chalamet.

[A]

Watch your back.

[B]

I ride for non fiction books. I should read more. I think we all agree.

[A]

I think one a year is enough.

[B]

Okay, well, then I'm fine.

[A]

Then I'm one non fiction year.

[B]

Well, Brittany, the woman and me. Check, check. I'll let you know what happens in 2025. I might read Rick Rubin's book. Who knows?

[A]

What's that?

[B]

I don't know. Okay, so I'm feeling like that.

[A]

Dear media.

[B]

Well, you have to.

[A]

That felt like a perfect clip.

[B]

Completely agree. I just totally freaking love nonfiction books.

[A]

Terry's reading a nonfiction book right now. And one day in the green room, he's shared some insights from it. I actually think having a.

[B]

Can you promise not to bring up song of Achilles to him?

[A]

I don't I don't know what that is.

[B]

Just promise.

[A]

So. Yeah, I won't.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I think it can be so powerful to have a partner that loves non fiction books. Unless it's a straight guy.

[B]

And then it teaches me so much. Yeah, he teaches me. And I. He has my consent.

[A]

Of course. You should always ask for people's consent before you share something you learned from a non fiction book.

[B]

Oh, totally.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yes, of course.

[A]

It's like, can I bend your ear for a second? Can I potentially blow your mind? And don't read non fiction books that are going to lead you down a wormhole. For example. Like I'm sure there are some non fiction books out there that are making people right wing. Do you get what I mean?

[B]

I just thought about punching Ben Shapiro in the face. Yeah, it happens to me like once a week. I just thought that's awesome. Quick it would happen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There it was. There was that ax that I love.

[A]

Just about to say instinct. That's. That accent came out.

[B]

Now I get it. I'm going to go tonight. I'm going to get that anger out of my. Because I don't want that anger. I don't want that hate in my body.

[A]

Well, I'm a pacifist most of the time.

[B]

Agreed. So wait, tweet that.

[A]

I will. And that's true.

[B]

I think nonfiction books are incredible. We can't go anywhere until we know where we've come. Let's see how far we've go.

[A]

That's a quote from Hitch.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

How do we know where we're going if we don't know where we're from?

[B]

And you always taught me history isn't done.

[A]

It's not.

[B]

It's important to go back to the sacred text.

[A]

As much as there are still timeless albums left to come from our pop girls, there are many non fiction books to come. I believe we'll both write memoirs.

[B]

Oh, I just thought about becoming.

[A]

Oh, Michelle.

[B]

Michelle Obama.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I just thought about it and I'm excited.

[A]

And so that's out there now. Yeah, that's in the universe spoke that.

[B]

Oh, I'm glad I did.

[A]

Let us know what non fiction books you're reading. I'm excited to see everyone's reports on holes.

[B]

Yeah. 500 words. Assert, support, explained. I still think that's a perfect paper. Assert, support, explain. Five paragraph essay. I.

[A]

Some people never learn that.

[B]

I got perfect on the writing in sat.

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

I got perfect on the writing in sat.

[A]

You wouldn't be getting it today, girl.

[B]

Not even close. Whoa, dude.

[A]

Next week. U turn. I can't wait to get into. I can't wait to drudge up the past. This is a non fiction podcast. In a lot of ways, they're a narrative podcast. And then there's non fiction podcasts. And we fall into the ladder. How cool is that?

[B]

Break the news. You walking out to be good man for someone else. Sorry. I was never good like you. Those are the first words of Matthew McConaughey's book. What's his book called?

[A]

You look it up really quick, and

[B]

once you do, we'll. We'll. That'll be the last thing we say

[A]

on that Matthew McConaughey book. You are not going to believe what it's called. You wouldn't guess this in a million years.

[B]

Tell me right the now.

[A]

Green lights.

[B]

I'm waiting for that green light. I want it. I do my makeup in somebody else's car. We order different drinks at the same time. This is ride herstory. This is non fiction.

[A]

You can't. You can't imagine when I saw that.

[B]

I'm in shock right now. All right, all right.

[A]

We have to end it there.

[B]

I'm waiting to. How On. Oh, my. Exit.

[A]

Ready, babe? Eyes on the road. There you go. Ride, ride, Ride. Ride.

[B]

Ride.

[A]

Ride, ride. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.

[B]

And, Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show. Hey, everyone.

[A]

Check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?

[B]

Oh, no. We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird.

[A]

Yeah, the bird looks out of your league.

[B]

Anyway, only pay for what you [e-mail] Liberty.

[A]

Liberty. Liberty. Liberty.