Secondhand Therapy – Episode #111

Emotional Defensiveness: Why Softness Feels Unsafe
Release Date: December 15, 2025
Podcast by: PonyBear Studios
Hosts: Louie Paoletti and Michael Malone

Episode Overview

In this engaging and candid episode of Secondhand Therapy, hosts Louie Paoletti and Michael Malone dig deep into the topic of emotional defensiveness, exploring why vulnerability and "softness" often feel risky—especially for men. Through their signature blend of self-deprecating humor and raw honesty, the pair unpacks real therapy takeaways, relationship struggles, and the complicated process of learning to express emotions directly (and softly). Expect a frank, funny, and relatable discussion on masculinity, communication, and the perpetual challenge of true personal growth.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Directness as a Defense Mechanism

• Louie opens up about feedback from his therapist, who labeled his "direct communication" as a defense mechanism ([09:11]):
  • Louie: "My so called direct communication is a defense mechanism. So I am getting a new therapist… I'm getting someone who gets me."
• This sparks an honest back-and-forth about how Louie typically avoids vulnerability, often defaulting to matter-of-fact statements rather than communicating feelings.

2. The Struggle to Be Vulnerable

• Michael gently but persistently pushes Louie to explore why softness and sincerity are so hard for him ([13:05]):
  • Michael: "Why don't you want to have the conversation at all?"
  • Louie: "I don't think it's interesting… I just don't want to be vulnerable."
• They highlight the discomfort many (especially men) feel when directly expressing needs or fears—contrasting "soft" vulnerability with defensive, blame-laden honesty.

3. Therapy Homework: Speaking Feelings Without Blame

• Louie shares an example of therapist-led "coaching" on how to express softer, more vulnerable emotions to his partner ([15:09]):
  • Louie (paraphrasing therapist): "Since you've been thinking about going back to work… I feel really sad, and I'm really going to miss you. And I feel scared this change… will threaten our connection."
• The difference between this and Louie's default "directness" is discussed—one centers on feelings, the other subtly points blame.

4. How Masculinity and Programming Make Softness Hard

• Louie wrestles aloud with how expressing sadness over his girlfriend's job feels "unmanly":
  • Louie: "I'm not a bro. That's why I think I might be a dude. That's not bro behavior."
  • Michael: "That's strength, dog. Feeling like you're going to miss your girl… that's strength." ([16:27])

5. Receiving vs. Giving Softness

• Michael asks Louie which style of communication he'd prefer to receive, exposing gaps in his own emotional fluency ([18:28]):
  • Louie: "I think the first way… the way my therapist told me."
• Louie admits that, before therapy, softness "wasn't even on [his] radar."

6. Autism, Directness, and Emotional Blindspots

• The conversation veers into whether Louie's communication style is related to being neurodivergent ([20:00]):
  • Louie equates "directness" with clear, unbiased truth-telling, often missing subtle emotional cues.
  • Michael points out the challenge (and sometimes danger) of misinterpreting or skipping over unsaid emotions.

7. Learning to Soften Communication

• Louie pledges to "soften" his words when appropriate, realizing the value in simply naming feelings without explaining or blaming ([21:22]).
  • Louie: "They don't need to know why I'm feeling a certain way. I can just tell them what I'm feeling and what the fear is, I guess. Makes sense?"

8. The Control Factor & Fear of Loss

• Michael introduces the idea that controlling the narrative is a form of self-protection ([43:44]).
  • Michael: "Control comes up a lot for me. Because of fear."
  • Louie acknowledges the validity but insists his reaction is rooted in fear and sadness rather than control.

9. Testing New Approaches and Outcomes

• Louie shares that when he communicated more softly with his partner, it "was received very well," making him feel "annoyed" because it requires effort and repetition ([41:08]):
  • Louie: "Now I have to do it again. What the…"
  • But admits, "she understood. She feels the same… very connected, very repaired."

10. Playfulness, Deflection, and Defensiveness

• A sidebar about using humor or “playfulness” to avoid direct vulnerability ([54:30]):
  • Michael: "Being playful is a defense mechanism."
  • Louie: "Nope. Sure isn't."
  • They debate whether jokes, disclaimers, or invoking anxiety are shields against true emotional disclosure.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “My so called direct communication is a defense mechanism.”
  — Louie ([09:19])
• “You can’t call a woman piggy. I never did that during sex… I gotta tell you, I met her. It wasn’t even that smushed.”
  — Louie (about derailing with humor/deflection, [10:51])
• “What are you afraid of in this moment, that you’re gonna come off too sincere?”
  — Michael ([12:42])
• “I’m not a bro. That’s not bro behavior.”
  — Louie ([16:22])
• “Feeling like you’re going to miss your girl? That’s strength, dog.”
  — Michael ([16:31])
• “They don’t need to know why I’m feeling a certain way. I can just tell them what I’m feeling and what the fear is.”
  — Louie ([21:23])
• "I think there's room for context without blame."
  — Michael ([21:50])
• **"I'm sure for my partner, it's very helpful to hear you just be like, ‘hey, I’m gonna miss you, and I’m sad and scared...”
  — Louie ([18:06])
• "If all those luxuries are true… I would make the choice to…meet people where they are. Which I’m always trying to do, but sometimes it’s easier than others."
  — Louie ([34:02])
• “Being playful is a defense mechanism.”
  — Michael ([54:30])
• “You often hear what I’m not saying.”
  — Louie ([56:36])

Important Timestamps

• 09:06 — Therapist calls out "directness" as a defense mechanism
• 13:05 — Louie avoids discussing his feelings about girlfriend's new job
• 15:09 — Louie models his therapist-coached vulnerability script
• 16:22 — Louie resists "bro" stereotypes around expressing sadness
• 18:28 — Michael asks Louie which communication style he'd prefer to receive
• 21:23 — Louie comments on sharing feelings without justifying or blaming
• 41:08 — The outcome: Soft vulnerability is well-received; Louie is (annoyingly) validated
• 43:44 — Michael introduces "control" as a hidden emotional driver
• 54:30 — Debate over playfulness as a form of defensiveness

Tone and Takeaways

Raw, banter-filled, and unflinchingly honest, the episode blends playful roasting and self-discovery. There’s a persistent undercurrent of “men need better models for softness,” and both hosts cycle between laughter, sarcasm, and genuine emotional insight. Those unfamiliar with vulnerability in relationships—especially men—will find this episode both validating and challenging.

Key takeaways:

• Directness can signal emotional defensiveness, especially if it blames or masks underlying fear.
• Vulnerable, "soft" communication is scary but deeply connecting—if difficult for those unpracticed.
• Masculinity programming can make softness feel unsafe or "unmanly."
• Humor and playfulness are often shields against true emotional honesty, but recognizing that is the first step toward change.
• Ultimately, being open about fears and sadness leads to deeper connection, even if the process is awkward and hard.

For more: Ad-free and extended episodes are available via Patreon, and community engagement (including listener questions) is encouraged via their website and social platforms.

This summary captures the main content and emotional journey of the episode, emphasizing both the humor and the vulnerability that make Secondhand Therapy a unique listen.