I Spoke to My Dead Mom Through a Psychic | #121

Summary

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Secondhand Therapy | Episode #121 Summary

"I Spoke to My Dead Mom Through a Psychic"

Release Date: March 9, 2026
Hosts: Louie Paoletti ("Lou") & Michael Malone ("Yon")

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Episode Overview

In this candid and emotionally charged episode, Lou and Yon dive deep into their recent experiences with psychic mediums, specifically channeling connections to deceased loved ones. With their trademark mix of humor and heartfelt honesty, the hosts explore grief, skepticism, the longing for closure, and the messy journey of personal healing. Both share stories of speaking (or attempting to speak) with their mothers and significant others via psychic readings, unpacking the emotional aftermath and reflecting on what these encounters mean for their mental health and ongoing growth.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Entering the World of Psychic Mediums

• Both Lou and Yon recently tried psychic readings through the episode's new sponsor.
• Lou shares it's his first experience with a true medium, stating:

  "I have never had a medium before...I've had my cards read and things like that." (05:33)

• Yon is more familiar with psychics but not with this approach, highlighting some past upselling attempts.

2. The Reading Experience: Process & Skepticism

• Lou describes the process:
  • The medium asked for only his first name and requested he confirm or deny based on her descriptions.
  • She initiates spiritual connection through breathing exercises.
• Lou, initially skeptical, is struck when the medium describes an older woman with curly hair—matching his mother’s signature afro—but maintains his critical perspective throughout.
• Both hosts frequently interject with jokes to temper the intensity and display ongoing skepticism.

3. What the Medium Said: Messages from the "Other Side"

• Lou's medium identifies his mother, focuses on her regret for not spending enough time with him due to work, and warns Lou about his own workaholism:

  "She wants you to know that you're working too much and that you need to take some time for yourself because you'll regret it when you're older...more life, less work." (13:00)

• Lou tests the medium by asking for a nickname, but she doesn't get it, making him doubt again.
• The medium shifts, bringing in Lou's Uncle Mike—hit with more resonance due to recent thoughts Lou had about him and their shared love of motorcycles.
• Yon shares a similar reading, starting with his grandmother, then moving to a deceased ex-partner, both described uncannily well.

4. Emotional Fallout, Doubt, and Closure

• Both hosts admit to cycling between skepticism and being emotionally moved.
• Yon, upon hearing affirming messages, decides to abruptly end the call:

  "Either it’s going to keep going to a point where things are true, or...where she loses me. And neither of those are beneficial." (25:41)

• Lou feels more unresolved, caught between wanting more answers and not knowing what he actually wants or expects from such encounters.

5. Authentic Grief, Guilt, and Growth

• The readings surface old guilt and unresolved pain, especially for Lou, who grapples with his mother’s death and questions of self-worth.
• Yon offers a key insight:

  "It’s interesting that even your mom is done living in the past. She had no interest in telling you about the past 10 years. She’s talked—she’s, your mom is more present than you are. And I think that's why you're angry, because you have frozen time. And she hasn’t, she’s right here today." (32:23)

• Lou shares a vulnerable breakthrough after a painful personal history:

  "The revelation I had today: I need me. That's who needs me. I need me to show up, I need me to take care of myself, I need me to love me...For years, I've just been screaming that from the inside." (44:13)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Lou, on medium skepticism:

  "At that moment, I was like, this ain't real." (14:41)

• Lou, on a bittersweet message from his mother:

  "I haven't talked to you in ten years and you're like, d—stay away from the computer. You're on the computer too much. Okay, thanks, Ma." (29:05)

• Yon, on choosing his own ending:

  "So now, depending on the day, I can be like, oh, that was really nice. Or I can be like, meh...that is what it is." (27:13)

• Yon, psychoanalyzing Lou's anger:

  "Your mom is more present than you are…and I think that’s why you’re angry, because you have frozen time." (32:23)

• Lou's "aha" moment on self-need and healing:

  "The revelation I had today: I need me. That's who needs me. I need me to show up...For years, I've just been screaming that from the inside." (44:13)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• [05:33] – Lou describes his first medium reading.
• [08:34] – Medium describes Lou’s mother, matching physical details.
• [13:00] – Medium’s message about work/life balance.
• [14:41] – Lou doubts the authenticity after a missed detail.
• [17:23] – Lou’s encounter with Uncle Mike through the medium.
• [21:35] – Yon’s grandmother comes through with emotional family details.
• [25:41] – Yon reflects on why he chose to end his call with the medium.
• [29:05 & 32:23] – Lou and Yon discuss bitter feelings, the struggle for closure, and insights about living in the present.
• [44:13] – Lou’s emotional self-realization about needing himself for healing.

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Tone & Style

The hosts maintain their characteristic blend of humor, heartfelt rawness, and irreverence. Their banter softens heavy subjects, but neither shies away from deep vulnerability—especially as Lou processes pain and growth in real time. The conversation feels intimate, sometimes even therapeutic for the hosts themselves, welcoming listeners into the complicated, non-linear path of grief and healing.

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Takeaways

• Medium/psychic experiences can stir up powerful emotions, doubts, and unexpected realizations.
• Grief and healing are ongoing processes, often without clear closure.
• Seeking answers from the “other side” may reflect an internal search for peace, self-forgiveness, and self-care.
• It’s okay to hold space for both skepticism and hope, and to not have all the answers.

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For more honesty, laughter, and deep talk on mental health, subscribe to Secondhand Therapy.

Transcript

[Lou]

Secondhand Therapy is presented by Pony Bear Studios. For ad free episodes, head on over to patreon.com secondhand therapypod if you're interested

[Yon]

in having the best time of your life, you should go ahead and check out our new sponsor, Psychic Source.

[Lou]

Oh, buddy, I cannot wait. Dude, I'm trying to talk to dead people. Do they do that?

[Yon]

They do mediums. They got mediums.

[Lou]

All right, I'll take a large medium.

[Yon]

All right, so here's the thing. That he already did it, okay? Now here. Here's the thing. If you want to talk to a psychic, and trust me, here's what you do. You go to trypsychic source.com/sht10, okay? You're going to get 40 minutes. 44. Zero minutes for $19.80. Now, you don't have to use all 40 minutes with one person. I didn't. I did 20 with. And look, mind your business. Talk about my love life.

[Lou]

Okay. All right.

[Yon]

Talk about my love life.

[Lou]

Trying to see some. Some.

[Yon]

Maybe some road bumps, just seeing if it's gonna be clear skies, and it's not. Now, I did the other 20 on just, like, a spiritual thing. See where I'm at? Let me guess. You're gonna do a medium.

[Lou]

Oh, my God, I can't wait.

[Yon]

All right, well, if you want to talk to a psychic, you can do that again. Trypsychicsource.com sht10. You get 40 minutes for under $20. Do it. And then DM us because I want to hear how it went.

[Lou]

Oh, I can't. I. Please, please DM us.

[Yon]

Oh, God, it's so much fun.

[Lou]

I want the tea.

[Yon]

Hello, my little bear cubs, and welcome back to another episode of Second Hand Therapy.

[Lou]

We need to remind you that we. That's us. That'.

[Yon]

We need to remind you that we are not there.

[Lou]

No, we're not.

[Yon]

Kind of like a pilot. We need to remind you that we are not therapists. We're not experts. This is not a substitute for therapy. And this is not professional lice in any way.

[Lou]

Pretty good. Thank you.

[Yon]

What are we doing? You're gonna hear some ads, and I gotta tell you, you already heard the Psychic Source ad.

[Lou]

Oh, my God.

[Yon]

This episode is all about the psychic readings that we got.

[Lou]

Yeah. Everybody in the house has got a. Has had a reading. I've had two, and they're gonna fuck. Yeah.

[Yon]

Yeah. So if you Skip the ads, trypsychicsaurus.com sht10 if you want to get a psychic reading.

[Lou]

Pretty great. Yeah.

[Yon]

Don't go bankrupt. We Might

[Lou]

all the money we make, it's going directly into me getting. Read some more.

[Yon]

You're gonna hear some ads. If you don't want to, please go support the podcast on Patreon or get a psychic reading that also supports the podcast. Patreon.com secondhand therapy pod would be great. Ad free episodes, another podcast live streams. We're giving away goodies when you sign up. All the details over there. SEC patreon.com Secondhand Therapy podcast and the merch. The merch has been revamped.

[Lou]

We got an updated merch page.

[Yon]

We got updated merch page. We. We were doing the street wear stuff, all that. We're going back to basics.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

The merch is as cheap as it's ever been.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

We're. We're done trying to be a clothing line with all the modern silhouettes and who cares, dude. You were selling good at the cheapest price. We can sell them.

[Lou]

So power to the people.

[Yon]

Yup. Secondhand TherapyPod.com for merch. All Vasectomy Farms merch is [e-mail] we officially really wanted to give it its own thing so we can have like a philanthropy branch to our business. So vasectomy farms.com for that. Yeah. Old douche face over here has a book out.

[Lou]

I do. I have a book that's available for pre order right now. And you get a signed copy, you get stickers, you get bookmarks, you get a couple other things in there. It's going to be fun. It's all about about love. Written by somebody who doesn't know anything about love.

[Yon]

Y and if you preorder one, I will sign a random page in the middle. I will write you and then put

[Lou]

my signature he we. I actually had my first request. Somebody slid my DMs and said I. I pre ordered a book. Yeah, I'd like Lou to sign the back.

[Yon]

Somebody commented on YouTube I just pre ordered. I can't wait for my. You Surprise.

[Lou]

Oh my God. That's great. So. So you can get that@velt tigerbooks.com and the book is called Modern Love and Other Natural Disasters. And then you can write us. You can.

[Yon]

I'm good at love. I don't even know what I. This book is in the same room as me for, bro.

[Lou]

I'm good at love.

[Yon]

Yeah, I'm not.

[Lou]

Well, you know, some of us out here struggling.

[Yon]

Yeah. If you want to contact us, all the info is below. You can text us 818-850-2448. All the other shit's a lot. It's below.

[Lou]

Yeah. Everything. You. Let's just get into it. I think that's it, right?

[Yon]

Yeah, that's probably it.

[Lou]

All right, well, who gives a. We love you. Thanks for being here.

[Yon]

Really do appreciate you being here. Give it a sonic reading and then go to Patreon. Appreciate you very much.

[Lou]

See you over at Patreon.

[Yon]

Hello, my little bear cubs. And welcome back.

[Lou]

Secondhand therapy. I have never had a medium before.

[Yon]

Never?

[Lou]

No. So I've had my cards read and things like that.

[Yon]

That's surprising to me.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah. I've always wanted to.

[Yon]

Have you ever been with a psychic and she tries to upsell you a medium? No, no, that's happened to me.

[Lou]

Really?

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

You re. That's wild, because not all psychics are mediums.

[Yon]

We've had this conversation.

[Lou]

Yeah. Okay.

[Yon]

Anyway.

[Lou]

Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah. I think the closest I. I've been, I was in Salem, and I got. And I think we talked about it on the. Maybe the show. I don't know.

[Yon]

No, I think it's a regular one.

[Lou]

Yeah. That was crazy. You know, Winning Rome.

[Yon]

Yeah. So our new sponsor, Psychic Source.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

You talked to a medium?

[Lou]

I did. I went into it. Like, I go into all of them where I'm like, yeah, right. Yeah. You know, So I go into it, and she. She's like, hey, I don't really want you to tell me any information at all. Like, I don't want you to give me anything. I'm just gonna try and, like, describe what I see and what's coming through, and I just need you to say yes or no if it makes. If it makes sense.

[Yon]

I like that.

[Lou]

I said, okay.

[Yon]

Did she ask you for your name?

[Lou]

She did. And that was it. Not even full name? What? Just first name.

[Yon]

What'd you say?

[Lou]

Bob.

[Yon]

Tight.

[Lou]

No, I said, michael.

[Yon]

Okay.

[Lou]

And she goes, okay. She's like, let's just connect. She's like, I need you to take a deep breath in. I'm also gonna be breathing. Like, let's take some slow breaths. And I was like, I'm also gonna be breathing. Well, you know.

[Yon]

I know. Just a fun warning.

[Lou]

Yeah. I'm also gonna breathe. Yeah. So I was like, okay. And then she's like. And then once we're connected, I'll see if anybody shows up.

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

I said, okay. And so we were breathing, and then she's like, oh, okay.

[Yon]

How long you breathing for?

[Lou]

Maybe two or three breaths.

[Yon]

That's quick.

[Lou]

Yeah, that's quick.

[Yon]

Yeah. All right. And then what Happened.

[Lou]

And she's like, okay, there's a woman here.

[Yon]

Damn it. Right?

[Lou]

I was like, wow. I think we're out of minutes. I gotta go. She's like, there's a woman here. And I was like, okay. And then she goes. She goes, I'm gonna just describe her to you, and you just give me a yes or no if it makes sense. If it's somebody you know, I want to make sure we're talking to the right spirits. I said, sure. And she's like, okay. She's like. She's a little older, but not by much, you know, she's like. She's a little gray in her hair, but not a lot. She. And her hair seems to be curly, almost like a perm. Like she takes a curling iron to it daily.

[Yon]

If you guys are new here. His mother had an Afro, dude.

[Lou]

Afro. Motherfucking nan. Yeah, yeah, big perm. And so she goes, does that sound like somebody you know? And I said, yes. Ask her what she's doing here. Yeah. I said, yes, yes. And she said. She said, are you aware of how this person died? And I said, yes. And she goes, okay. She goes, sometimes they tell me, and sometimes I have to ask them. She's like. She also explained to me, like, how she was communicating with her or them or whoever shows up. She was like. She was like, maybe some things are going to be off or maybe it's a little, you know, it gets a little clunky here and there. This is my first time speaking with whoever stepped forward. And she's like, the word medium comes from the. The frequencies that we are meeting at. So she's like, spirits are on a high frequency, we are on a low frequency. And so we meet and At a medium frequency, and that's where the term comes from. And I was like, okay. So she's like, sometimes it might be a little clunky, you know, when. Until we start to talk more. I said, okay. So she goes, you. Are you aware of how this person died? I said, yes. And she goes, yeah, okay. And then she goes. She goes, okay. She's pointing to her. Her left arm, her left side. And she's like. She wants you to know that she. There was no pain, but it's something to do with her left side. Her whole left side. She's like, was it a stroke or something like that? Yes. She said, okay.

[Yon]

I think you should have hit her with a maybe, Maybe, maybe, maybe.

[Lou]

I said, yes.

[Yon]

What else you got?

[Lou]

She said, okay. She's like, are you pretty sure you're aware of who this spirit is? I said, yes. She said, she keeps pointing at her hair. I said, yeah, that's her. I said, yes. And she goes, okay. She's like, can you tell me who this is is to you? She's like, I think I. I have an idea, and I just want you to confirm it. And I said, it's my mother. And she goes, yeah, okay.

[Yon]

I think I would have played chicken with her.

[Lou]

Well, she said. She goes, it's either. Earlier on, when the spirit first. When she was describing the age, she's like, I can't get her good read. She's like, it's either a grandmother or a mother. And she's like, I'm getting the energy of that. She's like, I'm not real clear. I was like, okay. So when she asked me to clarify, I was like, yeah, it's Mom. She's like, okay, that makes sense. She's. She's on the younger side. She's like, but she's around that age, right? I didn't know.

[Yon]

Yeah. Ida said, you tell me.

[Lou]

You tell me my guy.

[Yon]

Yeah, that's why I mine up. Go ahead.

[Lou]

Yeah. So I said, okay. And then she said, she's trying to. She's trying to tell me something. I'm only getting one word right now because we're still trying to learn how to communicate with each other. She's trying to figure out how to talk to me and. And there, baby. Yeah. And she said she keeps saying the word work over and over. Like, work. Do you work a lot? I said, yes.

[Yon]

If you're unfamiliar with last week's episode,

[Lou]

you should go check it out. Yeah. She said, she also worked a lot when you were young. And I said, yeah. She said, I think she's telling me she had two jobs when you were really young. I said, yes. She said, okay. She really regrets that she really wants. Wanted more time with you, and she really missed that time with you when you were really young. And even though that you were taken care of, she's like, there was other people involved and things like that. Like, she knew that you were safe and taken care of, but she regrets not being there for you more and having more time with you. I said, okay. And she said that she wants you to know that you're working too much and that you need to take some time for yourself because you'll regret it when you're older and that you need some balance in your life with more life, less work. I said, okay. And at this point, I'm like, I, I, let's see if this is her or not. You know, let's see what's going on. Yeah. So I said, am I. Am I able to ask her anything? And she's, yeah, she's like, I can try. And she's like, again, it might be clunky or, you know, there might be some disconnect, but, yeah, we can. We can definitely try. She's like, also, whenever you want to talk to spirits or anything like that, they're always around, so you can always talk to them. You know, you. Obviously, you're probably not going to be able to, like, conversate with them. Like, I'm able to, but you're. They're always around. They're always listening. You can always talk to them.

[Yon]

Cool. He hasn't slept in four days.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Just yapping, buddy.

[Lou]

I said, okay. I said. I said, ask her if there's a nickname that comes to mind or like a pet name or a nickname or something like that between us, because there's two options here that I'm looking for. I didn't tell her that, but in my head, I'm like, there's two options that I know. Like, this is mom. And she didn't get either one of those.

[Yon]

She said, relieved or upset.

[Lou]

You know, at that moment, I was like, this ain't real.

[Yon]

Yeah, Ivy, of course.

[Lou]

And she's like. I was like, okay. And then. Then it became real again. She's like, oh, there's somebody else step stepping forward. I was like, okay, your mother's really excited that they're here. It's a male figure. I was like, who the. And she's like, she's pointing at him. She's excited. And I said, okay. And she's like. She's like, oh, you have a. You have a brother. And I go, no, technically, I have a half brother on my father's side. But, you know, if you've listened to any of the episodes about that, it's like, there's some drama there. And my mother would not be excited that he's. Yeah. Showing up like that. You know what I mean?

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

And so I was like, So I just said no to. Instead of going into all that. I said, no.

[Yon]

She's like, what about a brother?

[Lou]

I was like, I got a couple of those.

[Yon]

His name's Ricardo.

[Lou]

It's like, I know that dude. He owes me $300. See if he's got it on him, you know? I said, I said, no. And she goes, oh, it's her brother. You have an uncle on the other side, Uncle Mike. I sure do. And she said. She's like, you guys have a lot in common. I said, yeah. And she said, he died tragically. I said, yes. And she said, too young, too. He was young. He's in his 40s, it looks like. I said, yes. And she's like, you're doing a lot of the same things that he was doing in his life. And he sees that. And my Uncle Mike rode motorcycles. And. And I. I have been having those thoughts lately when I'm out on my bike, like, just recently, too, you know, just thinking like, oh, yeah, man, My. My Uncle Mike used to ride bikes, and now I'm riding bikes. And like, this is. I don't know. I just looked up to him so much when I was. I just. I wanted to be him, you know? And. And, yeah, she said that everybody was there, and. She said that they were proud of me, and. Yeah. So that was.

[Yon]

That was fun, huh?

[Lou]

That was my first call. Yeah. Yeah. That was with the medium.

[Yon]

Well, I told you. I was like, I'm not going medium.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Curveball. I went medium, right?

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

But I. I mean, dude. All right, look. She goes, is there anybody you're trying to reach? And I go, nope. Who do you got?

[Lou]

Who's on the mystery caller?

[Yon]

Yeah, because I'm just like, come on, man.

[Lou]

I did the same thing, but just because I wanted to just, like, have a blank slate, I didn't want to be like, I want to talk to my mom. And then she's like, your mom's here? I was like, no. Yeah, yeah. So that's a good call. All right. Yeah.

[Yon]

Because I was like, all right, let's see what we got.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And she starts describing a woman and proceeds to describe my grandmother to a

[Lou]

T. Oh, my God.

[Yon]

My dad's mom, which is my mom's mom, is still alive.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Very surprising.

[Lou]

Yes.

[Yon]

This is real. Very surprising if it's real.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Yeah. Described her to. At. Personality, physically, really. Energy, all that. Yeah. She pinpointed that she really wasn't in my life after about middle school and not. Because she died.

[Lou]

Spoiler alert. Yeah.

[Yon]

But they moved. We were in Arizona. They moved to Georgia. And she's like, yeah. And there's some space. She's like, she. She didn't die when you were young. But she said there was a lot of space between you guys. And I was like, yes, I could see that.

[Lou]

And are you still skeptical at this point in the conversation? Really? Oh, yeah. Even after she describes her and everything,

[Yon]

you're like, My good guess.

[Lou]

Wow. Okay, Okay. I know we talk about better Help a lot on this show, but now they're a sponsor.

[Yon]

They are a sponsor, dude.

[Lou]

I'm using better help. I'm loving it so far. It's so easy to find a therapist, find out what I'm looking for and if it's not working out, because that has happened, I've been able to switch therapists with no problem at all.

[Yon]

Yeah, yeah, you had that one. That was not a good fit.

[Lou]

It's not a good fit. And that happens. Finding good therapist is like a lot like finding, you know, being out there in the dating world and finding the right partner for you.

[Yon]

And you're married now.

[Lou]

Oh, no. You're in love.

[Yon]

Never. Never. You're in love now.

[Lou]

I have to talk about this with my therapist.

[Yon]

Dude, you're the. Can I meet this person? I don't even know their gender. Can I meet this person?

[Lou]

Absolutely not.

[Yon]

Let's do one together.

[Lou]

Well, we should sign up for couples therapy on BetterHelp.

[Yon]

I'll do it. You think I want to do it? You think I won't win couples therapy with you, dude. You think I'm not gonna walk out with the trophy?

[Lou]

I know you will.

[Yon]

All right, here's the good news. They really are a sponsor. And if you have wanted to get in therapy and maybe you don't know where to start, maybe you don't have insurance like us, you can go to BetterHelp. They were nice enough to give us a discount. So if you hear this, you can go to betterhelp.com secondhand therapy and you will get 10 off your first month. There's a link below the episode. Starting therapy. It helps. It really helps. No matter what you want to work on, give it a shot. Betterhelp.com secondhand therapy. We love you guys. And then she goes, she wants to tell you how sorry she is. And I was like, okay. And she. She goes, your grandmother was a very polar opposite from your grandfather.

[Lou]

Is that right?

[Yon]

I was like, yes. My grandma was the sweetest person on earth.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And my grandfather was like a very high ranking Air Force man.

[Lou]

Oh, okay.

[Yon]

Very different personalities. And she goes, yeah, she wants to tell you she's really sorry because. Because your grandfather was so different, she really had to treat your dad differently. And she says she's really sorry because he doesn't know how to be there for you now. And I was like, good guess.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Huh?

[Lou]

The weird one, huh?

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

So. And you're still like, yeah.

[Yon]

I'm like, I Mean, that could be anybody.

[Lou]

That could be anybody. Yeah.

[Yon]

What page of the script? Yon, sweetheart. You got lucky.

[Lou]

Oh, my God.

[Yon]

What's a guy to take? Nothing, dude.

[Lou]

I just.

[Yon]

I'll be like, yeah, come a good guess.

[Lou]

What if she's like, your Social Security number is.

[Yon]

Who called you? What are you in my mail? What do you.

[Lou]

Yeah. Oh, my God.

[Yon]

Uhhuh. And then she goes, it's. She's really. She's like, I'm. She's like, is there anybody you'd like me to see if is. If is out here? I was like, well, I know this is. But let's threw my deceased ex partner's name out there. And I said, why don't you take a roll call for this name? What was funny? What?

[Lou]

Okay.

[Yon]

What?

[Lou]

Nothing.

[Yon]

What's wrong with you?

[Lou]

Take a roll call for this name.

[Yon]

Take a roll call. What am I supposed to say?

[Lou]

Oh, my God. Okay.

[Yon]

And then she. See, but this is where. Because she's like, okay, yeah, I'm getting a female. And she goes, around your age, it seems like appear. And I'm like, yeah, of course. Why would I be asking if it.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

I mean, my mom maybe, but no. So I was like, 50. 50. It's either my mom or a wife or something, right?

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And then she described her to a

[Lou]

T. Oh, my God.

[Yon]

Yeah. Mentioned her big gleaming smile. I was like, yeah, she was known

[Lou]

for her big smile.

[Yon]

And she said, She goes, there was distance between you when she died,

[Lou]

buddy.

[Yon]

I was like, yes.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And she goes, yeah, she wants you to know that you shouldn't feel guilty about that. I was like, okay. And she said she also wants you to know that you were the only person in her life that ever actually saw her. And she's very grateful for that and she's very sorry for how dark things got for her. Okay.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And then I ended the call. And I'm not kidding.

[Lou]

Oh, my God.

[Yon]

I was like, that's enough of that. What good does that do me? You know?

[Lou]

Are you being.

[Yon]

I'm being 100 serious. I ended the call. I pushed Star, and I said, do you really want to end this call? And I said, one, yes.

[Lou]

Why?

[Yon]

Because a couple of reasons, okay? Either foreign, it's going to keep going to a point where things are true, or it's going to keep going to a point where she loses me. And neither of those are beneficial if she keeps getting true, true, true. It's. It is something that I feel at peace with. And stirring any of that up is just. There's no benefit to it other than satisfying an emotion in that moment. And if we keep going and she loses me and I'm like, okay, it's getting real generic. Then any inkling of, like, that's nice. That's also gone.

[Lou]

Yeah. The validity is gone. Of, like, what she.

[Yon]

Yes.

[Lou]

What was. What was true.

[Yon]

Yeah. So I don't know. I think I already have a doubt of whether it's real.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

So this way, I kind of have a Pick my own ending.

[Lou]

Yeah. And you already have the closure. It sounds like you already have the closure that you.

[Yon]

Yeah. So it's. It's either going to stir up emotions that are gonna. With me.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Or it's just gonna be like, oh, okay. Well, who gives a. So now, depending on the day, I can be like, oh, that was really nice. Or I can be like, meh.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And that is what it is. Which is kind of an interesting thought for me because my whole thing is like, well, if it's not real, who gives a. Yeah. So now I kind of get to decide if it's real. And I think. I don't know. That was the best choice for me. Does that make sense?

[Lou]

Yeah. Thoughts?

[Yon]

You couldn't believe it, huh? You thought I was joking, but I ended the call.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Oh, you would never.

[Lou]

I don't know. I. I still struggle with the validity, too, of what was said and what happened, you know, in my call. I just. You know, I just don't have the same. I'm not at a point of closure like you are.

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

So I'm still seeking. So. Yeah. I don't think I would be able to log off like that and be like, got what I need. I'm like, oh, no, I am.

[Yon]

I also don't even know if I feel like, got what I need.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Yon]

Some days I would be like, that was nice. And some days I might. Might mean nothing, but.

[Lou]

Yeah. Well, that's because you don't need it.

[Yon]

It's. It was enough for me to leave it.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Leave it or take it. I can do whatever I need.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah. For me, there was a little bit of. I was a little bitter, you know, I was like, I haven't. You know, it's been 10 years since my mother passed, and, you know, I bring you back from the dead, and you're like, you're working too much. Like, I haven't talked to you in 10 years. And you're like, d. Stay away from the computer. You're on the computer too much. Okay. Thanks, Ma.

[Yon]

Even though that's Like. But even though that's, like, what you're working on right now.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Is like, yeah. Only living in work mode, having her be like, hey, stop it.

[Lou]

Yeah. I just talked to my therapist about it, and he asked me what I. What was the expectation then? Like, what. What is the ideal thing or message from her that I would want to receive? And I don't even have that. I don't know.

[Yon]

That was my question.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't even know. You know, I told her. I was like, it just. I don't even know why I pretend to know, like, what all goes into it, even if it is real, you know? But, like, that is. The bitterness is like, you know, you're spending. You know, it's been 10 years. You're spending all this time and energy to meet with this medium and learn how to talk to her and do all these things and, like, you know, to conjure up enough whatever to speak to me, and that's what you say, you know? And the other part of me is like, well, how do I even know what her thing is right now? Like, what is time to her? Has it been 10 years? Maybe it's a moment, maybe it's not. Maybe it's not even real, you know? Like, maybe it's no energy at all. Maybe she's just here all the time, you know? Like, there's so many, like, unknown things, and I'm getting worked up in my head about a process that I know nothing about instead of just enjoying, like, just being like, all right, yeah, there's some validity there. There's like, I am. This is something that I am working on, like you said, and, like, it makes sense in the moment, and, like, the way that that woman was describing who that was saying those things. Sure sounded like my mom. So.

[Yon]

You sound angry.

[Lou]

A little bit. A little bit.

[Yon]

I have a thought, if you're interested.

[Lou]

Sure.

[Yon]

It's. It's interesting that. I mean, one of your things with the dead is the guilt of leaving them behind.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Even, like, the storage unit in Ohio. You're like, that's where they live. Like.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And. All right, give me. Give me your gut. You believe this or not, the experience you had with the medium.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

It's interesting that even your mom is done living in the past. She had no interest in telling you about the past 10 years. She's talked. She's. Your mom is more present than you are.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And I think that's why you're angry, because you have frozen time. Yeah. And she hasn't she's right here today.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

Does that make sense?

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

You know how I keep telling you I'm doing a psychology class? Doing it.

[Lou]

All right. Okay. Are you really.

[Yon]

I'm really doing it, dude. Our new sponsor, Southern New Hampshire University, found some classes, bro.

[Lou]

Oh, you fancy.

[Yon]

Now I'm out here.

[Lou]

He's a schoolboy.

[Yon]

Hey, and here's the thing. If you're like me and you're just like, dude, I like learning stuff sometimes. Snhu, go learn some stuff. If you were like me in the past, maybe you feel a little stuck in your career, you want to start a new thing. Snhu, what about you?

[Lou]

I mean, I love to learn.

[Yon]

Oh, God, he's never learned.

[Lou]

I need to. I need to do it more officially,

[Yon]

you know, Never learned a thing. Anyway, if you want to check out SNHU and you want to see what kind of programs they have, you can go to Snhu. Edu Sht. And you can request more information. It costs nothing to request more information. It's a great way to support the podcast. Learn some stuff. Start a new career. Do whatever you need.

[Lou]

Go back to school.

[Yon]

Snhu. Edu Sht. There's also a link in the episode description. Get some info. Start some learning. You're welcome. You take a break.

[Lou]

No.

[Yon]

What's going on?

[Lou]

Just thinking here.

[Yon]

Share.

[Lou]

Yeah, I just, you know. Yeah, my therapist was like, you know, maybe this is. This is the message, you know? You know, she has this short window of time to get to me, and this is what she wants to. Needs to say or whatever it is. Like, it is important.

[Yon]

So if that is the message.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

What do you hear? What is she saying to you?

[Lou]

That I'm. I'm not living for myself, you know?

[Yon]

Oh, I know.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Yon]

Me and Nancy out here knowing.

[Lou]

Yeah. Yeah. I. I had a big revelation today, and I didn't know if I was going to share it or. So, yeah, my therapist and I were talking. We went down this path because again, he's. He's pretty new, you know, we've only been talking for a few months, and so there's a lot of gaps every once in a while that I forget are there. And so we were talking about mom and time and, like, all these things and. And, you know, I had said

[Yon]

I

[Lou]

don't even know how to get here. Like, we were. I was talking. Not showing up for myself and how I kind of fucked things up for myself after Wayne died. And I really wasn't present the last time I saw my mother. And it Was because I was numbing myself. And I was kind of, you know, talking about the guilt that I carry with not being more aware when I should have been more aware. You know, the last conversation I had with my mother, I was stoned. I woke up and fucking had some weed because I thought it was just another day. And I was numbing myself and got real high and went out on the porch, and then mom came out to join me, and that was. Now I'm suddenly in a thing. You know, I was like, oh. And not knowing that that would be the last time that I would sit with my mother. And. He said, it sounds like you carry a lot of guilt with that. When I said, yeah. And then mom died a year after that. And then I just got more numb and went, you know, I just stopped showing up. And. Then we talked about Little Rock, which you and I talked about a little bit today. And, you know, I was. I was at a point where I wasn't showing up for myself or anybody in my life. And then it carried over into work where, you know, I was doing 46 weeks a year on the road. I was touring all the time. And then it just. I remember. I remember vividly trying to get out of a New Year's Eve date in New York City and calling the booker literally the night before I'm supposed to get on my plane trying to get out of it.

[Yon]

Yeah, that's a bad look. Professionally bad look.

[Lou]

Yeah, yeah. And then I showed up to New York and. And it wasn't great,

[Yon]

performance wise.

[Lou]

Kill the shows.

[Yon]

Okay.

[Lou]

But I would just lay in the green room in between. There's a little couch in there in Syracuse, and I would just lay on that couch. And then they'd be like. They'd peek in and be like, you ready?

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

And I would go and I would do the show when I go back to the couch. And eventually, you know, you do that enough times and people stop working you. And I found myself in Little Rock in a.

[Yon]

In a.

[Lou]

Working a club that I. I told myself I'd never work again. And I laid in that bed all week.

[Yon]

And

[Lou]

I was there for four days, and same thing all day, all night, I would just lay in that bed. And then I would go and do the show, and I'm going, come back

[Yon]

and lay in that bed.

[Lou]

And that was the weekend I decided. I was like, you know what? I think I'm done here. My fiance and I had broken up. My mother was dead. Wayne was dead. There was nobody that needed me. I thought, you know, Nobody's gonna. Nobody's checking on me. Work has slowed down. Everybody's dead.

[Yon]

Is it that nobody needed you or no one was checking on you? Those are two very different things.

[Lou]

Both.

[Yon]

Okay.

[Lou]

I didn't think that anybody would notice if I went missing and I got back to LA and I was living alone for the first time. And I thought, yeah, that's. I remember checking in with friends and being. And being very honest and like, yeah, I think I'm done. And there. And nobody really wasn't on their radar.

[Yon]

What do you mean it wasn't on their radar?

[Lou]

Like, they didn't. They weren't clocking it, you know?

[Yon]

What would clocking it look like?

[Lou]

A little concern, a little conversation. Yeah. And then I thought, you know, my grandma and all the stuff that she had been through, and I, you know, I. Every conversation I had with her since my mother died, she would tell me about how guilty she felt about not being able to save my mother. She was right there and she couldn't do anything and she blamed herself and she already had a hard life. And so I was like, yeah, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna do that to her. And so I thought, you know, when grandma's gone, that'll be. That I'll check out. Then Grandma lived for another three years. That.

[Yon]

Yeah. And then.

[Lou]

And then in that time, I. I met my ex and her daughter and I had suddenly, like, with the daughter aspect, like, I had like, this new love experience that I'd never had in my life before. Like the love of a child. Like, what the. Like that me up, you know, Like, I, you know, I've talked about it on here before a little bit, but, like. Yeah. That understanding that I had of Wayne when he would say things like, yeah, you're like my own son and things like that, like, it suddenly made sense and like, you just have like this little person in your life and anyways, the revelation I had today,

[Yon]

I've been

[Lou]

crying about this all day and I thought I could get through this.

[Yon]

Yeah. Open your eyes, though.

[Lou]

Yeah, man. I don't want to.

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

Oh, God damn it. I really thought I could get through this.

[Yon]

I didn't

[Lou]

trash Petty.

[Yon]

Oh, he's gonna cry for sure.

[Lou]

Oh, my God.

[Yon]

Yeah.

[Lou]

Yeah. The revelation I had today. I need me. That's who needs me. Yeah. I need me. I need me to show up. I need me to take care of myself. I need me to love me. I need me to. I just need me. And for years, I've just been screaming that from the inside. And I don't. I have. You know, it's such a simple idea. Like, of course. Of course. And. And I felt different ways of, like, oh, I need to be better at this or I need to do whatever. But, like, this was the first time it was like so clear that, like, you need you. And, You know, I'm not gonna lie. The last few weeks I've been feeling a little overwhelmed and. And I started to feel the way I felt in Little Rock. I started. I caught myself. A few days ago, I caught myself being like, nobody needs me right now. Nobody would know if I. If I wasn't here or. Nobody's checking on me. Nobody. I'm so lonely.

[Yon]

Like,

[Lou]

You know, nobody needs me.

[Yon]

You believe that? Yeah.

[Lou]

Yeah.

[Yon]

And we know that. Jesus, that's a bear.

[Lou]

It's not.