Podcast
Stance of Curiosity
Hosted by Gillian Boudreau and Joelle vanLent · EN
Child Psychologists Joelle vanLent and Gillian Boudreau tackle topics related to schooling in our modern times including navigating impossible expectations and the power of curiosity in education, empowering educators to redefine success, overcoming fear and shame and their effects on school communities with open dialogue, and balancing high demands with compassion and understanding.
22episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
What is the spirit of inclusion and can we sometimes get in our own way of success?
Mar 2300:44:22Tap to summarizeJoelle and Gillian wade into the murky waters of creating a plan for inclusion for students that are not responding to our best and most creative efforts. Belonging, a sense of connection, and authentic engagement in experiences that are growth promoting in ways that are relevant to each person seems to be the goal. There are some situations where “being with the group” does not get us to that goal. When we begin to think more broadly about inclusion, what are examples of what that could include? We consider guiding questions, varied ways to measure success, ethical considerations, and guideposts to ensure that we don’t go so far with our capacity to challenge the norm that we revert back to exclusion. Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Collaborative and Proactive Solutions: Can it work for even our toughest challenges such as truancy?
Mar 1600:46:55Tap to summarizeGillian and Joelle sit alongside parents and educators to consider how to support a student who is chronically refusing school. What happens when the student realizes we cannot force them to go? What happens when we’ve done everything we can think of and they are still not going? The common pitfalls of feeling panic, incompetent, and deflecting blame are counterproductive. CPS is an alternative approach that can help us avoid those responses and remain engaged with the child/teen as they navigate their path out of a stuck place. Plan B Organizer: https://thinkkids.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/Plan-B-Organizer_ThinkKids.pdfCollaborative and Proactive Solutions website: https://livesinthebalance.org/Find us on Instagram! Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/ Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Accommodation versus agenda in supporting PDA nervous systems and Beyond: A dynamic conversation on supporting our youth in moments of stress and overwhelm.
Mar 900:43:18Tap to summarizeIs it possible that in our effort to mitigate overwhelm, we sometimes remove growth promoting opportunities and reduce healthy stress tolerance? Joelle and Gillian talk through their decades-long journey of understanding the experience of neurodivergent youth and the complexity of how to support their capacity to cope with a world built by and for neurotypical people, while offering authentic and worthy learning and skill building experiences. All of us in supportive roles can play the short game to relieve overwhelm and the long game where we face healthy challenges alongside youth. All of us can make the wrong call at times and push too hard for the wrong reasons or overaccommodate to provide immediate relief. As we navigate these decisions, we can polarize each other and go to extremes that further confuse the kids and eachother. In this discussion, Joelle and Gillian identify some guiding considerations for teams to help us align our approaches.At a certain point in this episode Gillian shares some potential drawbacks of Brene Brown's approach, which is better encapsulated in this article:https://drcareyyazeed.com/the-dangers-of-courage-culture-and-why-brene-brown-isnt-for-black-folk/Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Re-Release: Who's Afraid of What? What to do when team interactions get dicey.
Mar 200:48:14Tap to summarizeHello, listeners! So far in season four Joelle and Gillian have experienced some illness and even some getting stuck in the tropics and as such we don't have a new episode for you this week, but we hope you will enjoy the re-release of one of the most popular ones from Season 2 and we will catch you next week.First released in June 2025, Gillian shares her strategy of processing adult interactions that don’t go as expected, including at times conflict and defensiveness. Stepping back to consider how fear may be inspiring our responses and re-approaching the interactions with some perspective and curiosity can be very helpful. Joelle and Gillian share some of their key strategies that may help when stress and fear are taking over-Who is afraid of what? Slow down and back upShare the worryGet consultation from a trusted sourceVisualize the situation as a contingency map - what is the goal and is there a different path? https://autismclassroomresources.com/contingency-maps-for-behavior-proble/Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Plans, Plans and More Plans!
Feb 2300:40:56Tap to summarizeDedicated, creative, and hardworking school teams make all kinds of plans to support students. Those plans are created in hopes of inspiring regulation, engagement, and the development of new skills. Confusion can arise when the intention of the plan has not been emphasized. Joelle and Gillian discuss the many types of plans that school teams may create, the psychology that informs varied approaches, and the common pitfalls that school teams can fall into in this endeavor. Here is a link to the mindfulness-in-schools ideas Gillian mentioned:Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →What is Alexithymia and how might it be a helpful concept?
Feb 1600:41:20Tap to summarizeJoelle and Gillian explore together the connection between the outward expression of emotion, internal awareness of varied emotional states, and social interactions. How might the capacity to recognize and express emotions vary among those who are neurodivergent, depressed, anxious, and coping with the impact of trauma exposure? Are there ways that educational staff and other supportive adults can help when there is either a character trait or state that results in restricted expression of affect? Some helpful insight and tips were identified, as well as increased curiosity into this internal experience and outward expression. Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Finding hope in the midst of chronic stress
Feb 900:41:39Tap to summarizeGillian and Joelle take a walk down memory lane to recall all of the helpful strategies and insights that we learned during the immediate aftermath of the COVID-19 pandemic to consider how those approaches may help us now. Overwhelming, disheartening, and even at times terrifying events are happening in our country and world. We bear witness to those events while keeping our lives and work moving forward with diligence. This can all combine into feelings of defeat, anger, frustration, and learned helplessness. We learned many powerful and accessible ways to face this situation that we can recall and access now. We recall ideas, such as sharing the worry and finding hope through action, as well as find new ones, such as time confetti. Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →"It's Not Your Fault!" What the movie Good Will Hunting has to teach us as far as the toll of offering support.
Feb 200:42:32Tap to summarizeIn today's episode, Joelle reflects on re-watching Good Will Hunting, the 1997 movie classic, on a recent flight. She and Gillian consider the themes highlighted in this film of the real psychological and energetic toll of supporting someone in a resistant stage of change, and how we can apply this to supporting the nervous systems of school professionals and helpers in general.Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →"Fear Barfing" and "Parallel Process:" Putting words to the difficulty of working with parents.
Jan 2600:40:07Tap to summarizeJoelle and Gillian explore a concept from the world of psychotherapy and how it could play out between a child, their parent, and a school professional. When a child expresses their anxiety related to school demands to their parent, their parent may in turn express that distress to the school professional. We are all seeking reassurance and regulation from each other. We can trip over each other or we can compassionately respond in a firm and supportive manner. There is a concept from the world of psychotherapy called “parallel process” that resembles this dynamic. This concept can help us both respond effectively and shift our own stress response. This discussion relates to this video from Josh Ship- Like the Lap Bar on a Roller Coaster, Teens Will Test You to See if You Will HoldFind us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →Two wrongs don’t make a right but sometimes they do make us feel better. Why??
Nov 300:36:19Tap to summarizeGillian and Joelle do a deep dive into justice seeking behavior, which can present as someone treating others the way they were treated or seeking to make others feel like they are feeling. It turns out there are a lot of reasons why we might be inspired to do so. Our most helpful response in such situations is empathy, validation, and reassurance that their needs are as important as everyone else’s. An emphasis on the use of visual processing tools to find an alternate path to express distress, feel calm, and self-protect is highly effective. Some options include contingency maps, comic strip conversations, SODAS, and behavior chain analysis. Find us on Instagram!Gillian: https://www.instagram.com/clearconnectionpsychology/Joelle: https://www.instagram.com/joelle.vanlent/
Transcribe →