Jeff Hiller

Summary

Podcast Summary: Thanks Dad with Ego Nwodim – Episode: Jeff Hiller

Release Date: January 20, 2026
Host: Ego Nwodim
Guest: Jeff Hiller (Emmy-winning actor, comedian, and author of "Actress of a Certain Age")

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Episode Overview

This episode features a lively, honest, and often hilarious conversation between host Ego Nwodim and guest Jeff Hiller. They cover topics ranging from childhood and faith to insomnia, text message anxiety, body image, improv comedy, parenthood, and giving thanks to the unsung heroes in their lives. The show retains its signature candid and warm tone, mixing jokes, vulnerability, and relatable moments throughout.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. On Needing More Time Off and Sleep Struggles

• Ego opens with musings about America's lack of adequate paid time off, comparing it to Europe, especially Italy (03:21).
  • "Let's all take July off... The girl with the podcast said it's okay." — Ego (04:36)
• Ego and Jeff bond over being tired and sleep patterns, with Jeff revealing he's 50 and never had Botox (06:36–07:55).
• Jeff shares an unconventional insomnia cure from a New York Times article: picking a word and riffing off its last letter to generate a new word, continuing until boredom brings sleep (08:10).
  • "It's so boring, you just fall asleep." — Jeff (09:09)
  • Ego worries she might enjoy the game too much and stay up even longer (09:17).

2. Childhood, Family, and Early Experiences

• Both discuss birth order and their family structures. Jeff is the younger of two siblings, with a much older sister (11:11).
• Jeff reflects on growing up as a nonconforming, "girly" boy in Texas, finding it challenging due to the cultural climate (12:51).
  • "I was really girly and didn’t conform to whatever gender roles, and people didn’t like that." — Jeff (12:51)
• Church became a haven and performance stage for both, despite potential judgment (18:42).
  • "Church was like this really safe space for me... and you get to kind of perform." — Jeff (18:35)
  • Both played lead roles in church plays (18:46–18:58).

3. Faith, Theology, and Identity

• Jeff attended a small Christian college in Texas intending to become a pastor, then studied abroad in Namibia, which sparked broader horizons (13:33–14:21).
• Studied liberation theology, inspired by how the church aided in dismantling apartheid in Namibia (24:32).
  • "I was studying this, like, kind of radical... and it’s the only thing radical at my college." — Jeff (24:29)
• Discovered limitations for LGBTQ+ clergy, causing heartbreak and a gradual move away from pursuing the pastorate (25:41–26:04).
• Both discuss their current "cultural Christian" identities, the radical nature of Jesus if interpreted literally, and the complexity of claiming religious labels (29:41–30:44).
  • "If you look at just what Jesus said, it’s like super radical by today’s standards." — Jeff (29:06)
  • "I guess I do believe loving people is good... Sounds like Jesus to me. It’s giving Christian." — Ego (30:39–30:44)

4. Improv, UCB, and Comedy as Community

• Jeff’s start in improv: joined a Denver improv group, planned to get a master’s in social work in New York but got "sidetracked" by the Upright Citizens Brigade (UCB) (37:40–39:07).
• Humorous reflection on the early 2000s UCB and the chaos of his first improv class during 9/11 (39:21–40:01).
  • "They told us on my first day of Level One, they said: 'Use it.'" — Jeff (39:27)
• Ego and Jeff’s UCB timelines overlap in LA, bonding further over the culture and benefits of improv (38:04–38:13).
• Discussion on the value (and limitations) of improv classes: everyone should try improv, but don’t get stuck in "perpetual student" mode (41:33–42:15).

5. Navigating Modern Communication & Anxiety

• Both commiserate about unanswered texts and emails, technology-induced anxiety, and the psychological impact of notification "red dots" (45:01–47:34).
  • "My phone was like, girl, we can’t do it." — Jeff (46:38)
  • "The red bubble really stresses me out." — Jeff (47:13)
  • "It’s called being human in 2026." — Ego (48:03–48:14)
• Playful blame-lobbing at Tim Cook (Apple CEO) for poor syncing between devices (46:59–47:34).

6. On Body Image, Sleeping Nude, and Naturalism

• Discussion on body image, the pros and cons of sleeping naked, and cultural attitudes toward nudity (32:59–36:01).
  • "As of New Year's Eve, I started trying to sleep naked... I wanted to work on body shame issues." — Jeff (32:59)
  • Both agree socks in bed are a "no" (34:54).
• Wide-ranging humor about answering the door nude, nudist vs. naturist semantics, and the societal limits of comfort with nudity (31:15–32:49).

7. Pets, Relationships, and Adulting During COVID

• Jokes about pets witnessing nakedness and sex; Jeff finds it deeply uncomfortable when pets are present (34:04–34:09).
• Both share their emotional responses and coping mechanisms during pandemic isolation, expressing longing for parental guidance and the stress of being “the adult” (57:36–58:54).
  • "I was like, I wish I was someone's child so that they could fuck this up and it would be their responsibility." — Ego (58:01)

8. Parenthood, Life Choices & Grace for Ourselves

• Jeff discusses not having kids, his husband’s strong opposition to parenthood, and reconciling with being child-free (54:07–56:44).
  • "I think I would be a good secondary parent... but my husband doesn’t want kids at all." — Jeff (54:42, 54:50)
• Both reflect on giving themselves and their parents grace, recognizing that everyone’s "guessing" as they go through life (59:31–60:32).
  • "Everyone’s kind of guessing... Most people are making the best decision they can with all the information they have at the time." — Ego (60:06–60:32)

9. Giving Thanks

• Jeff gives thanks to Maxwell, his manager’s assistant, for stepping in with publicist and logistics duties when Jeff couldn’t pay his (75:17–76:46).
  • "He has been basically taking over the duties of my publicist... He arranged my travel and stuff. I mean, I paid for it, but he’s such a saint." — Jeff (75:51–76:11)

10. Advice Segment

• Listener question: Should they hook up with a coworker due to being busy and single? (84:46)
  • Jeff: "No! ... You can have some sex with somebody that isn’t gonna be the long-term partner. But don’t do it with your coworker, cause that’s always gonna get messy." (85:27)
  • Ego: "I agree... It’s like having sex with a neighbor. You’re gonna have to see them." (85:37–85:59)
• Offer both good and "bad" advice per the format: If you want bad advice, just do it—just be ready for the mess (87:46–87:55).
  • "Sometimes people are asking for advice and they know what they want to do... Really, what they want is permission." — Jeff (88:04–88:08)
  • "This is my first time being human. I’m figuring it out for myself every single thing." — Ego (88:08–88:17)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On insomnia cures:
  "It’s so boring, you just fall asleep." — Jeff Hiller (09:09)
• On family and growing up:
  "I was really girly and didn’t conform to whatever gender roles, and people didn’t like that." — Jeff (12:51)
• On the inclusive roots of improv:
  "You’re supposed to have their back and make them look like a genius, and it’s actually quite lovely." — Ego (40:31)
• On cultural Christianity:
  "If you look at just what Jesus said, it’s like super radical by today’s standards." — Jeff (29:06)
• On email and technology anxiety:
  "My phone was like, girl, we can’t do it." — Jeff (46:38)
• On adulthood and responsibility during COVID:
  "I wish I was someone’s child so that they could fuck this up and it would be their responsibility." — Ego (58:01)
• On giving yourself grace:
  "Everyone’s kind of guessing... Most people are making the best decision they can with all the information they have at the time." — Ego (60:06–60:32)
• On advice-seeking:
  "Sometimes people are asking for advice and they know what they want to do. Really, what they want is permission." — Jeff (88:04–88:08)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp (MM:SS) | |--------------------------------------------------|----------------------| | PTO & American work culture | 03:21–05:37 | | Sleep struggles and aging | 06:36–08:10 | | Word insomnia game | 08:10–09:17 | | Birth order and family roles | 10:24–12:09 | | Growing up in Texas & gender norms | 12:51–13:23 | | Discovering theology and Namibia trip | 13:33–14:21, 24:32 | | Liberation theology & leaving the church | 24:29–26:04 | | UCB & improv beginnings | 37:40–41:33 | | Digital anxiety, texts, and unread messages | 45:01–48:14 | | Body image & sleeping naked discussion | 32:59–36:01 | | Parenting, regret, and COVID breakdown | 54:07–58:54 | | Giving thanks to Maxwell, the assistant | 75:17–76:46 | | Listener advice segment (coworker hookups) | 84:46–88:17 |

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Overall Tone and Flow

The episode maintains a lively, casually vulnerable, and self-aware tone. Both Ego and Jeff are quick with witty banter but also willing to admit uncertainties. There’s a mix of confessional humor ("My vagina just got clammy") with sincere reflection on topics like faith, friendship, and self-forgiveness. The discussion is nonlinear but weaves together themes of performing, belonging, and figuring life out as adults—often by laughing at themselves.

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Perfect for Listeners Who…

• Enjoy honest, funny conversations about identity, faith, and modern adulthood.
• Appreciate comedians being real about insomnia, anxiety, body image, text fatigue, and career confusion.
• Like getting equal parts depth and silliness, with friendship and empathy at the core.

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Memorable Closing:
"This is my first time being human. I’m figuring it out for myself every single thing you just said. Amen." — Ego (88:08–88:17)

Transcript

[Ego Wodem]

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[Ego Wodem]

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[Ego Wodem]

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[Jeff Hiller]

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[Jeff Hiller]

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[Ego Wodem]

nearby Lowe's on Colorado street in Kennewick.

Guys, hi. I'm so happy you're here. You're still listening, you're still watching. It makes my heart beam. I am really tired today. But that's okay. It be like that sometimes. But I do think this holiday break that we all sort of had varying lengths. I feel like it could have been longer for everyone involved. That's everyone. I think that we need more time off as a society here in America. We needed a lot of other things. Okay, but that's not what I'm talking about right now. Right now I think that we could all use more time off. And it can be paid time off. It should be paid time off because I like the sound of pto. I just think it sounds cool. Pto, Yeah, I think we need more. The Europeans, they seem to get that right. They kind of have. I went to Italy a few years ago, brag, and they were off. Somebody was like, they're off the whole month of August. Like basically everyone is. And I was like, that's amazing that you can just, as a society, largely be off. And I think we need that here in America, among other things. That is not lost on me. But more time off for all of us. I want that for us. I wish it for us. And I think my brain personally might work a little better if I had that time off. Because this holiday, it just went by. And I know the holidays also feel so busy for people and there's so much running around and parties and goodbyes and end of year this and that and the other. And that's not quite a break. So I'm petitioning for. I want it to be a summer month. Let's all take July off. Let's be pioneers. All the listeners of this podcast, tell your boss you're taking the month of July off. And that girl with the podcast said it's okay, let me know how that goes. But if it goes awry, know that I can't help you. And so there's that. Very excited for this conversation I'm about to have. I feel like it's gonna be a good one and I hope you stay tuned. Keep watching. Listening. See ya. I am sleep to pride. But I'm happy you're here. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Happy to be.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Let's do a song. Everything is better when it's a song. You can kind of say anything in music. Have you ever caught the lyrics of a song? I've been like, damn, those are crass. But it sounds nice.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes, 100%.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

I never know the lyrics.

[Ego Wodem]

You never know. Do you ever. But do try. Are you one of those, like, I still try to sing along and. Yeah, okay. Yeah, me too. I just saw a video of myself singing along to a Kendrick Lamar song, which I do, in theory know the lyrics of, but I was fumbling all around and I was like, this is embarrassing. Burn this footage. Okay. This isn't about me. This is about you. And my next guest is an Emmy winning actor, comedian, and author. You can get his memoir. Memoir. Memoire.

[Jeff Hiller]

Memoir.

[Ego Wodem]

Memoir, yeah. Why do they let me have a podcast? I heart. What are you doing? You can get his memoir, actress of a certain age, out now. Jeff Hiller. Hello. Hi.

[Jeff Hiller]

How are you?

[Ego Wodem]

I'm so happy you're here.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm very happy to be here.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm good. How are you?

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm good.

[Ego Wodem]

Good. Yeah, Generally good. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, generally. How are you? I'm worried about you.

[Ego Wodem]

Me too. I'm worried about me too. But thank you for doing this. I'm sleep deprived, but that's sad.

[Jeff Hiller]

Are you sleep deprived because you were doing stuff late at night, or are you sleep deprived because, like, you've went to bed but your body won't sleep? Does that make sense?

[Ego Wodem]

I went to. So it does make sense. I'm gonna present a third option. I'm sleep deprived because I went to bed early and I don't really do that. So I went to bed early being like, look at this, I'm gonna go to sleep at 9 o' clock and it's all gonna be good. But see, the problem with that is I woke up at. No, I went to bed at like 10 and I woke up at 3am and then I was just up until 30 minutes before I needed to wake up.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, I totally. I have that almost every day just since I got old. Yeah. But I just.

[Ego Wodem]

When do you get old? What's the number you don't wanna say your age?

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, yeah, I'm 50.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. You don't. Oh, my gosh. Alert the presses because I'm genuinely shook. You're 50? Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

I wouldn't normally tell people, but it's on the Internet.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. Okay. And also looking Damn good for 50.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I don't have kids, okay?

[Ego Wodem]

That's what it is. Do you have Botox?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, I've never done Botox.

[Ego Wodem]

You look really good. I'm shook.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, you know, I put a little.

[Ego Wodem]

I put a little something on that. That's fine. But then also the bone structure, the cheeks, high cheekbones. Anyway, please continue. Since you got. Since you got old.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. I just read this New York Times article, and my husband and I have been doing it, and it works. All you have to do is you think of a word. When you wake up, you just think of a word. This helps mainly if you wake up from anxiety.

[Ego Wodem]

I think more than please tell me.

[Jeff Hiller]

But you think of a word. Like, let's say the word is Mike.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then. So it starts with an M, it ends with a C. So then you think of another word that starts with a C. Cup. Then you think of a word that starts with P. Photosynthesis.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then you.

[Ego Wodem]

But hold on. I'm so confused. So now we're just thinking of words. So I'm slow, right?

[Jeff Hiller]

It's just like counting sheep.

[Ego Wodem]

So. No, but wait, so you. If you were to do Mike, it's C. C is low. How do we get to photosynthesis?

[Jeff Hiller]

So then I said cup, right? So the first letter is C, but the last letter is P. So now

[Ego Wodem]

we're going P. Photosynthesis. You would go snake.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

And then you'd go eagle.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right. And so it's like, not hard, right? No, it's not like a weird code that you have to think about hard. But then you just keep going. And then it's so boring. You just fall asleep.

[Ego Wodem]

You fall asleep.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm lucky. And you're not thinking about, oh, my God, why did I say that in that meeting?

[Ego Wodem]

Or, oh, yeah, yeah, I have to

[Jeff Hiller]

send that email or whatever.

[Ego Wodem]

I think. I fear that that would keep me up. I think that I would enjoy it too much. I like games a little too much. I'm like, we could go all night and feel like it's me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you play games?

[Ego Wodem]

Like emotional ones? Yes. Just emotional ones all the time? No, no, I don't play emotional games. But. Okay. Do I play the other kind? I did download chess on my phone recently because.

[Jeff Hiller]

So Hard.

[Ego Wodem]

I. I know. And. But I was so bad. I. I learned how to play maybe 10ish years ago when I was babysitting these kids. And they were just brilliant. Brother and sister. Sister duo. I think about them all the time. I just don't remember their names because only babysat them once or twice.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I'm like, how old would they be now? Gosh, like 20.

[Ego Wodem]

20. Like maybe even 25, one of them. Or 24 or something. But they taught me how to play chess, and they were legitimately good at teaching. And then they were also good at it. And anyway, I tried to. I downloaded chess the other day. I'm not good at it. But, Jeff, this isn't about me.

[Jeff Hiller]

I do well. My dad.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

My dad.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes. Okay, dad. Thanks, dad. Okay. Ding, ding. Thank you. You should be my co host.

[Jeff Hiller]

My dad taught me to play chess and I was so bad at it. He was like, it's okay, fella, you

[Ego Wodem]

don't have to play. How long before he gave up on you?

[Jeff Hiller]

I mean, if I went to him and said, I'd like to play, you know, right now, he'd be like, okay, let's try. But what a sweetie. Yeah, he's a real sweetie. But yeah, he was just like, that's not your. That's not your gift.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Did he figure out what your gift was or did you have to figure that out yourself?

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, I definitely had to figure it out myself. I mean, he's a sweetie, but he's still a man. From Texas.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, from Tejas.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, from Tejas.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. How many siblings do we have?

[Jeff Hiller]

One.

[Ego Wodem]

Just one.

[Jeff Hiller]

Are you just a sister? Older. She's older. I'm younger.

[Ego Wodem]

You're the baby?

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm the baby.

[Ego Wodem]

Did you love it?

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't know. Are you the baby?

[Ego Wodem]

I'm the baby.

[Jeff Hiller]

And did you love it?

[Ego Wodem]

Gotta love it. I mean, I never got to love me. Fuck. Cut that. Yeah, I did. I did, and I didn't because I felt like I have a few. I have three siblings, okay? And so it was like, I'm everyone's child, which is nice, but it's also not nice. And then there's this really sweet spot where it's like, you're everyone's child, but you're also an adult, but they still treat you like their child. It comes with its benefits, but you feel indifferent. It just is what it is.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I just have one sister. She's six years older than me. And so I've heard that you're really more like 2 only children then Although I am close to her. Yeah, we are, like, really good friends. But I never really felt like the baby. I felt more like the F word.

[Ego Wodem]

Fuck it. Okay. I just wanted to see if I could bait you into saying.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, you did great. Cancel me.

[Ego Wodem]

Uh. Oh, no, please don't cancel you. We can't cancel you. Cause you just got here. We have so much more to discuss. I don't want to cancel you. Okay. What was it like for you growing up in Texas? Did we love it? Why do I keep saying did we? I wasn't there.

[Jeff Hiller]

Where did you grow up?

[Ego Wodem]

I grew up in Baltimore.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh. Oh, right. I did know that.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes. Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, yeah. That's fun. Did you love that?

[Ego Wodem]

In many ways, yes. And then in many ways, and then in some ways, no. Because grass is always greener. Which, by the way, we said before we started recording. But I first want to know the answer to did you love growing up there?

[Jeff Hiller]

I didn't. It was really difficult. And I grew up in a different time. I mean, I think it's pretty bad now too, but I grew up in a time that was like, you know, I was really girly and didn't conform to whatever gender roles and people didn't like that.

[Ego Wodem]

What are you talking. I'm sorry. This is news to me. Let's dive in. No, I'm okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Explain.

[Ego Wodem]

No. How quickly did you get out of Texas then?

[Jeff Hiller]

Not quick enough. Because I went to college in Texas.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

At a Christian college that was only a thousand people.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh. Like for all four levels of school. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Total a thousand people.

[Ego Wodem]

Wow.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. And I. I wanted to be a pastor. And then I studied abroad. And when I studied abroad, that's when I was like, oh, I gotta get the funk out of here.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And. And it broadened my horizons.

[Ego Wodem]

Do you not cuss?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, I do.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm gonna get the fuck out of here.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. I just wanna get you to just say various cuss words and slurs today. That's all I'm asking.

[Jeff Hiller]

Shit.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't wanna cancel you at the top of the episode, but by the end we will catch you again. We'll get there. We'll get there. Where did you study abroad?

[Jeff Hiller]

Namibia.

[Ego Wodem]

Namibia. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Like, South Africa is here and Namibia is there.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Okay. Did you. You did enjoy that then, I'm assuming.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Was it just a semester?

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, just a semester.

[Ego Wodem]

And then you're like, I gotta go. Respect. And then where did you go?

[Jeff Hiller]

I went to Denver where I was a volunteer. Like a full time volunteer. Like A kind of like AmeriCorps, but through a church program. And then I worked for a couple years at the Department of Public Health doing std.

[Ego Wodem]

And people got chlamydia, don't they? There's face chlamydia going around now.

[Jeff Hiller]

Have you seen pharyngeal?

[Ego Wodem]

I don't know. The Internet said things.

[Jeff Hiller]

Can you get it on your face?

[Ego Wodem]

I want to show you on my phone, but I don't think. I fear I won't be able to track down the social media posts. But there's face chlamydia going around in, like, St. Barts or something right now.

[Jeff Hiller]

St. Barts. That makes sense. Those people, they got money, but they're trash.

[Ego Wodem]

It's Bethenny Frank who has face chlamydia. But I also should not speak on this. I also want to say that I am not a journalist in that I did not click the link. Sometimes I'll see the title of an article and I'm like, I read this thing that said I did it. I merely in passing saw the title of an article. I did not click or investigate further.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I should not be shaming people for having a sexually transmitted infection. That is unfair. I don't want to slut shame anybody that sometimes those things happen.

[Ego Wodem]

Sometimes you don't even have to be a slut to get one of those. It could be a one off.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is.

[Ego Wodem]

But why did we change it from STD to sti?

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't know, actually.

[Ego Wodem]

But, like, you're the expert. Like, tell me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I did work for the clinic, but I worked for the clinic before they changed it to I.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

I think disease maybe feels a little bit more permanent than infection.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, Maybe infect. Yeah, infection sounds fleeting. Speaking of fleeting, you said. I asked you before.

[Jeff Hiller]

We said, oh, right. And then after Denver, I moved. I moved to New York to. I told everybody I was getting my master's in social work, but I started taking classes at the ucb.

[Ego Wodem]

Do you know how many people at UCB are telling their parents they're getting their master's? Because I've heard this story before. I've heard this story from at least two other people that I know personally are like, my family thinks I'm getting my master's right now in la.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I did tell them I was deferring for it, but I said a year. Oh, and it's been 25.

[Ego Wodem]

Are you going to do it? Come on, do it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Can you imagine going back to school right now?

[Ego Wodem]

I don't. Ooh, this is bad. Kids Stay in school.

[Jeff Hiller]

Stay in school.

[Ego Wodem]

But I don't really fuck with school.

[Jeff Hiller]

I wouldn't want to do it even slightly.

[Ego Wodem]

Like, I feel like I've said this on the podcast before, but I actively wake up some days and I, you know, I think I'm so grateful I don't have to go to school today.

[Jeff Hiller]

Me too.

[Ego Wodem]

It's an actual thought, so I can't imagine.

[Jeff Hiller]

I get the Sunday night blues and I'm always like, oh, why am I so sad? And I'm like, oh, I think I have to go to school tomorrow. But I don't.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't. It's the best feeling. It's the best. My sister is older than I am. She's six years older than I am, and she does love school. And I cannot relate. Like, she has 1,000 degrees. And I'm like, girl, get out of there. Get out of there. They're controlling your mind.

[Jeff Hiller]

She's in a fire or something.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. I'm like, get out. Save yourself.

[Jeff Hiller]

Go down low and crawl.

[Ego Wodem]

Mondays can be fun again. Mondays are low key fun, but people do love it.

[Jeff Hiller]

They love the, like, structure of it and stuff.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, I don't, I don't. I don't. I don't like it. I feel like I couldn't wait to be, like, done with school. It was spooky to leave, though, like, after college when I was like, I'm not gonna go get my mcat or go get my mcat. Get my mcat. Take the mcat to potentially go to medical school. Probably wouldn't have got it.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's what you were gonna do.

[Ego Wodem]

That's, in theory, the same way you were gonna be a pastor. Yeah. The same way you were. Yeah. Say sure. And I need to ask you about that. You're gonna be a pastor.

[Jeff Hiller]

I was gonna be a pastor.

[Ego Wodem]

Where did that desire come from? No, because pastors are cool, but I'm just some of them. Some of them, Some of them, not all of them, as is the case for any other profession.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's such a good point.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Well, when I was growing up, the church was like, the only nice place I could be in public. Cause school was awful. And anywhere I was around, like, even at the grocery store, people would like, you know, not like me, because I'd be like, did y' all see Designing Women last night? You know

[Ego Wodem]

who didn't like Designing Women?

[Jeff Hiller]

People at the grocery store in Albertsons.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, my gosh. Albertsons. That's why you gotta go to Gelson's. They didn't have that in Texas. Did they?

[Jeff Hiller]

They didn't have Gelson's. They had heb. We should have gone to heb.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. And so church was like this really safe space for me. And, and also like, you know, you get to kind of perform.

[Ego Wodem]

I know. That's where I was in the first. The first play I was ever in was at church.

[Jeff Hiller]

Same.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

And I was the lead of the Christmas play.

[Jeff Hiller]

I was the lead of a play about Noah. I played one of the bumblebees.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, you played one of the bumblebees. Did you have lines?

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And later.

[Ego Wodem]

Uh huh.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is such a brag. Tell me later. Someone came up to my mom and said, how come they gave Jeff a microphone and none of the other children? Because I. What project?

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

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[Jeff Hiller]

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[Ego Wodem]

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[Ego Wodem]

Jeff a star Natural born. I love also that you felt safe in church given it was not safe elsewhere.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. Which is ironic.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, because most people be like no. If you were feeling that in the rest of Texas, surely church would not be the place to go for shelter. In theory to people.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I'm sure they there were a lot of people talking behind my back at church, but they didn't say to

[Ego Wodem]

my face they kept it cute. Yeah, yeah, they kept it cute. I'm sure there's people talking behind all of our backs, though, all the time. So then you wanted to be a pastor because it felt like a safe space.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

And what was it like studying theology? Because I'm actually curious about theology. I'm not going to study it. I'm not. Just to be clear, this isn't me being. I might remember how I feel about school, but a big fan of CS Lewis. I am.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, yeah, I am.

[Ego Wodem]

I did that to honor the old timey nature of that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Is that how they. No, that's interest. That's Yoda that says that.

[Ego Wodem]

I am big fan. I am.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

Of cs.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. I am not. I don't know a ton about CS Lewis. That's the lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe guy.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't even read his fiction. It might be. I think it is in Chronicles of Narnia, but I've never. I don't read the fiction. I like reading the theology.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, love the. The.

[Ego Wodem]

Because he was an atheist.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

And then he wasn't. And I feel like it's interesting. That perspective is so remarkably interesting to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is interesting. Now what? I just.

[Ego Wodem]

What a nothing word, by the way, that I said as something interesting. Interesting. What does it even mean?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, it means we're. It means we're. We're caught by it, you know, that it's taken us in and that's all

[Ego Wodem]

we'll share about that and we'll move on.

[Jeff Hiller]

Gotta keep a little thing.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, Sorry. I'm sorry.

[Jeff Hiller]

What I mainly was studying was what was called liberation theology. So it was about looking at the text and really understanding how God wants us to be serving each other so that we're not under these systems of oppression. And that the church. That's why I went to Namibia, because the church was a huge part of the fight to end apartheid there. And the. And so I was studying this, like, kind of radical, and it's the only thing radical at my college. Literally nothing. And like, all the students would be like, this is blaspheme. They were like, not into it at all. But the professors were rigorous and intellectual. And so then I was like, oh, I want to be like, I want to be called to justice. And then it was like this real slap in the face when they were like, oh, you can't be gay and also be a pastor. I mean, you could be, but you had to be celibate and other pastors could get married. And I was like, well, that's rude.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, that's not fair. That don't sound like liberation to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And so that's kind of why I was like, well, I don't want to be a pastor then.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. And was that, I imagine, heartbreaking or did. Yeah, Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

I had to kind of mourn it because that really was my identity for a long time was like the granola Christian. And it was like, a bummer to be like, oh, now I guess I'm just another one of those people who used to go to church.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, and do you go to church now?

[Jeff Hiller]

No.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Do you miss church at all? Yeah, yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

I miss, like, the pageantry and the community and stuff like that. I like the songs.

[Ego Wodem]

The songs. Some of the songs.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. That's true.

[Ego Wodem]

I will say sometimes the songs sound the same. Like, I can hear the guitar at the beginning. I'm not going well. No. I appreciate it all a lot. I'm gonna get cooked. I don't want to get cooked. I'll stop here.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't think you're gonna get cooked for saying you don't like praise music sometimes.

[Ego Wodem]

Well, some. Well. Cause some of it I really like. You know what I'm bumping regularly? Fred Hammond. I love Fred Hammond. He's kind of sounds like an R and B singer to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Well. And that's the thing is that, like, sometimes there are people in the church who are like, you know, real hardcore great musicians. And then other times it's just like, I get to come here and play.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

And it's like I just hear the guitar.

[Ego Wodem]

Sometimes I can tell it's a Christian song just by the strumming of the guitar at the beginning of a track. Say we did a blind. Like, why do I have to have my eyes closed to listen to music? I don't, it turns out, so jump tired. I'm making no sense. But I feel like you could hear the beginning of a song. And I'm like, this is a Christian song. And I'm like, they don't have to sound the same. That's basically how I feel about it. So some of it is great, as is, again, the case with anything else. But left.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's really the point we're coming around to here is balance.

[Ego Wodem]

That's gonna be the name of the episode. Jeff Hiller and Haga, what do we talk? Balance. That's gonna really grab people. And they think balance is interesting.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right. Especially in this culture where everything is totally just chill and we're not just picking sides and punching people in the face.

[Ego Wodem]

No problem at all. Was anyone else in your family a pastor, though? Where did this desire come from.

[Jeff Hiller]

Nobody else in my family was a pastor, but our church was sort of our entire social outlet. And so it was like, you get to be the most popular person in your social group if you're the pastor and you got to wear the little collar.

[Ego Wodem]

You were always gonna be an actor. Church. I loved the pageantry of it all.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh my God. They light the.

[Ego Wodem]

Before you go on, I'm on stage. Captive audience.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. I loved Pentecost. Cause they were red.

[Ego Wodem]

Jess, I would have gone to your church. I would have gone.

[Jeff Hiller]

It'd been fun.

[Ego Wodem]

It would have been so fun. Do you still identify as Christian

[Jeff Hiller]

Culturally? Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, what does that mean?

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm a little more woo woo than I think most Christians.

[Ego Wodem]

Ooh, tell me. I might be too though. Let's hear.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you identify as Christian?

[Ego Wodem]

Yes. In some ways? No. Well, actually I do. Hold on. And I talked about this on Caleb Herod's podcast. I don't get cooked for being lukewarm. I'm not lukewarm. It's just that when you say you are what you have to do so

[Jeff Hiller]

much work to be like.

[Ego Wodem]

Not like that, but yeah, exactly like Jesus.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

Christian.

[Jeff Hiller]

Who by the way, if you look at just what Jesus said, it's like super radical by today's standards. And it goes against everything that the people on the right who have co opted Jesus say.

[Ego Wodem]

And I think you have said that perfectly, genuinely. And so I will attempt not to add to it. I will really make the best effort because I think what Jeff said is clear and it's concise and I agree.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Last DLA essay. Seth.

[Ego Wodem]

Seth Myers. No, that's not how you play. It would be, it would be.

[Jeff Hiller]

It could be a proper noun. It could be a proper noun.

[Ego Wodem]

But then I said Seth and I went on to Myers. Not compound word. Yeah. And so I failed. And see, this is why I would stay up trying to beat myself at this stupid, fucking stupid game. But culturally, what does it mean for you to be culturally Christian?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, that's where I grew up. Like, I'm like, my, my background is super like, you know, Protestant down the middle. Waspy kind of a situation because my husband is Jewish and he really, even though he is more of a Buddhist now, he identifies culturally as Jewish because he's like, he's got all the sort of stereotypes and things like that. But I guess I do believe loving people is good. I do believe in helping people. I do believe that if somebody is hungry, you should give them food. I do believe if someone is in need of A place to live. You should give them a place to live. And I don't know.

[Ego Wodem]

Sounds like Jesus to me. It's giving Christian.

[Jeff Hiller]

Hey, I am edgy.

[Ego Wodem]

It's giving Christian. That's so edgy of you.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'll say it. I'll say it. I think people shouldn't be naked.

[Ego Wodem]

I think they should be fed as well.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. I mean, unless they wanna be naked, then fine.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Shout out to nudists. We love you too.

[Jeff Hiller]

You know what? I heard that nudists are actually called naturists now. Isn't that interesting?

[Ego Wodem]

See, I identify culturally as a nudist as well. Do you genuinely?

[Jeff Hiller]

Are you?

[Ego Wodem]

What does it mean, though?

[Jeff Hiller]

Like, when you're home? Or are you just like, I'm naked if I'm home?

[Ego Wodem]

Low key. Yes, I've answered. This is awful to say. Am I gonna get sued by someone? But I answer the door naked sometimes when my glam team is coming to get me ready for an event, believe me, full frontal, no cooch. Okay, Cooch will be. But it's nude underwear. So you think it's. You think you're getting cooch, but then you're like, oh, she has underwear on the same color.

[Jeff Hiller]

But is that because you have to get, like, your neck done or something, too, or.

[Ego Wodem]

No, it's because I, like, probably just got out of the shower and, like, I timed things poorly. And then they're at the door and I don't like. I think it's so rude to make people wait at your door.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, well, that's definitely true.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. And so I'm like, hi. And sometimes like, nice to meet you, Jayla. Hi, nice to meet you. Come on into my house.

[Jeff Hiller]

My eyes are up here. Sit down here, down here.

[Ego Wodem]

Look wherever, you know. So I think culturally. But I've never googled what it means to truly means to be a nudist or a naturist now. And for me, when I hear naturist, I think that's like, that person wants to be in the woods. And like.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, that does sound like someone in the woods.

[Ego Wodem]

It sounds like Dylan Ephron to me. He seems like a naturist. I don't relate to that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Wait, is Dylan Ephron a naturist? I only know him naturist.

[Ego Wodem]

The way I think of naturist. I think he likes to be outside. Oh, and I think he likes to do outside. No, not naked.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, oh, oh.

[Ego Wodem]

I like to be naked.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right. He's always, like, climbing mountains and stuff.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, I don't want to do that. But I'm talking being naked. So when I hear the word nature, I think they should keep it. Nudist. This is my petition for that.

[Jeff Hiller]

All right, good.

[Ego Wodem]

Please talk to them about it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, we're in close contact. Yes.

[Ego Wodem]

Please talk to them about it.

[Jeff Hiller]

See, I. This is. Okay, this is so weird to tell

[Ego Wodem]

you, but tell me.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is. As of New Year's Eve, I started trying to sleep naked. I can't do it every time.

[Ego Wodem]

I can't sleep naked either. What's going on with you? What's the trouble?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I wanted to do it because I want to work on body shame issues. And I was like, maybe if I'm just always naked, I'll just be like, this is the skin you're in. Or whatever. But what I don't like is around 3am When I wake up and I'm

[Ego Wodem]

spelling words because it's going to happen every night.

[Jeff Hiller]

I need to kick my leg out and, like, get a little Cool.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I just don't like having my bare ass out. And then, like, my dog or my cat is gonna see my butt somehow. Like that, I think, is probably why I should continue doing it. Cause my dog and my cat don't care about my ass.

[Ego Wodem]

They don't care about ass.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I've seen their literal buttholes.

[Ego Wodem]

You've seen everything. You've seen them shit. They shit in public.

[Jeff Hiller]

The dogs not only do they shit in public, but then they demand I pick up this shit.

[Ego Wodem]

They're like, you pick that shit up. I'm ready to go on to the next stop. I'm ready to go pee all day. Someone's bike. Yeah, I think they're fine. How do you feel about pets? Seeing you have sex,

[Jeff Hiller]

not into it.

[Ego Wodem]

It's spooky.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. And it feels like a child.

[Ego Wodem]

It feels like a child is watching you.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes. I feel like it's a real. It's actually really difficult because our dog does sleep in our bed, our marital bed.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, wow.

[Jeff Hiller]

And you know the cat would be welcome if she would want to.

[Ego Wodem]

She doesn't know. She's like, I've seen what you guys do in that bed.

[Jeff Hiller]

She's like, thank you, meow. Thank you, meow.

[Ego Wodem]

Thank you. Okay, so as far as sleeping nude, I have to say I also cannot do it. I do have a specific way I need to sleep, though, which is. Needs to be T shirt and no bottoms. I need the underwear on. But I don't like. I don't like wearing shorts. I don't like wearing sweats. I Don't like. I mean, socks to bed. Oh, no, that's insane to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, same.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't know how anyone sleeps with socks.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Well, I.

[Jeff Hiller]

What I like is a cold room with heavy blanket.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then, like, you can occasionally be

[Ego Wodem]

like, yeah, yes, same, same. But I'm getting, like. I'm currently sleeping with my room at 69 degrees. I've announced on the podcast before for people who listen regularly. They know. But now I've gone down to. Exactly. It's kind of symbolic in a way. But now I'm down to 68.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh.

[Ego Wodem]

I fear it's just gonna get lower and lower. I'm just so hot. And I refuse to, like, I'm 52. I refuse to remove blankets. I'm like, no, I need that weight. I need the weight of the blanket on me. And when I've gone to a hotel or something and they don't have a comforter and it's just the sheet, I'm like, I'll never rest in this place.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. What is that about?

[Ego Wodem]

I don't understand.

[Jeff Hiller]

Sometimes it's at fancy hotels.

[Ego Wodem]

At fancy hotel. And I go, where is the comforter? Where is the Duvette?

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. I need a little weight.

[Ego Wodem]

I need weight. I will not be able to sleep without weight. And. And so naked to me, even naked, going to bed. Can't do it. I would never be able to fall asleep like that. I need the weight of a T shirt, which is nothing, but I need it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

And somehow being that exposed does feel wrong. For the people who are able to sleep naked, I'd be curious for them to chime in in the comments.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. I think some people are just, like, really into it. I always feel naked when I'm naked.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

The idea of answering for Adore the glam team. What?

[Ego Wodem]

Butt naked.

[Jeff Hiller]

I mean, I just have one lady.

[Ego Wodem]

I sometimes. Yeah. And that would be. I feel offensive. Like, penis in her face. Unnecessary. Somehow I think tits are fine.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right. Yeah. It's very European.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. But a lot. Apparently you're allowed to walk around New York with no shirt on. Yeah. Or bruiser.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. They freed the nipple, which.

[Ego Wodem]

I wouldn't do that. That doesn't interest me. That doesn't. So maybe I'm a person.

[Jeff Hiller]

I wouldn't do that.

[Ego Wodem]

You wouldn't even show my nipples.

[Jeff Hiller]

If you see my nipples. I have been paid an exceptional amount of money.

[Ego Wodem]

Are they big or small?

[Jeff Hiller]

They're very tiny.

[Ego Wodem]

They're tiny.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Pink or brown?

[Jeff Hiller]

Sort of a red. You know, like that 90s lip color that women would wear. That kind of color.

[Ego Wodem]

That's a beautiful nipple, if you ask me. Gorgeous.

[Jeff Hiller]

But I'm very big. I think they're probably just normal nipple size, but they look. They look like beady little eyes. Like a little caricature artist made. Little beady eyes on my big chest head.

[Ego Wodem]

Can I just say, God must have spent a little more time on you. The character artist was God. Well done.

[Jeff Hiller]

Thank you, God.

[Ego Wodem]

It all comes back. It all comes back to church, always. When I have to understand how you found your way to the ucb. And if you've told this story a thousand times. Pardon me.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't think I have, actually.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. I'm just. I am curious.

[Jeff Hiller]

I took. I was in Denver. My friend Katie was like, will you come with me to join this improv team? Because I'm afraid that there'll be like a cult or something.

[Ego Wodem]

And it maybe is a little bit. Yeah, we're still in the cult because I'm in it. Yeah. And it. When you.

[Jeff Hiller]

What's your deal? Are you a UCB person?

[Ego Wodem]

I am.

[Jeff Hiller]

Because I wasn't sure if you actually were a UCB person or if, like, you did your own thing and sometimes you did it at UCB and then

[Ego Wodem]

they just cooped you. Claimed me. No, I was very much a ucb. I'm a UCB purist. I truly.

[Jeff Hiller]

Like in la.

[Ego Wodem]

In la.

[Jeff Hiller]

But when did you start there?

[Ego Wodem]

I started. It had to be 2012.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh. So we had a little crossover.

[Ego Wodem]

We did.

[Jeff Hiller]

Cause I didn't leave till 2015.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, yeah. We definitely had crossover then. I wasn't on the main stage on Harold Night, which is the main stage Monday nights until 20. Well, fall 2015.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

So we were.

[Jeff Hiller]

So I just missed you.

[Ego Wodem]

Ship's passing. But now we're here and I'm happy about it. But you went and you're like, like, okay. But that wasn't UCB in Denver. It was like an improv troupe.

[Jeff Hiller]

It was just an improv team. And then I said, I'm going to get my masters in New York.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

I think I was still planning on actually getting it.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

And they said. And I said, I'm gonna do this. I looked it up and I'm gonna do Chicago City Limits. And they said, don't do that. Do ucb. That's where everything is happening.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then I started watching their TV show and I was like, okay, I'll do that.

[Ego Wodem]

The ass cat. Right. Or was there a different show?

[Jeff Hiller]

They had like an Upright Citizens Brigade TV show on Comedy Central. It was like a sketch show with just the four main people.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And so then. So then I just started taking classes, and when I was in level one, 911 happened.

[Ego Wodem]

Ooh.

[Jeff Hiller]

And they told us, like, on my first day of Level one, they said, use it.

[Ego Wodem]

They were like, yes. And that. You said. You said, okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, they said, amy Poehler got on snl. And I was like, who's Amy Poehler? And they were like, the girl. And I was like, oh, okay.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. The one of the four that you were watching on Comedy Central.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

A lot was happening then, huh? 9, 11. Amy Poehler got SNL. And you were in improv 101, and

[Jeff Hiller]

I was in improv 101. It was a terrible class.

[Ego Wodem]

Why was it so bad? Because of the tragedy or something else?

[Jeff Hiller]

I think the tragedy didn't help.

[Ego Wodem]

Sure.

[Jeff Hiller]

But there was just a lot of. There was, like, three people in it. You know how, like, sometimes you have a class and there's one person who's just like, you are sucking up all of the energy. We had three of them, and they were all trying to suck up all the energy, and it was exhausting.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. It can be a lot. And improv is such, in theory, meant to be such a supportive space that when people are sucking up all the energy like that. Or there's that person who, like, really doesn't even. Or, for instance, doesn't get it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

You're supposed to, like, have their back and make them look like a genius, and it's actually quite lovely. And then at times you're like, can we bring a little bit of the real world into this and let them know I might tag you out? Yeah, how about that? That's. Your power lies in tagging them out.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you know how sweet. There are a couple times when I've been like, can I tag out the person in the scene that I'm in the scene with?

[Ego Wodem]

How do I tag you out?

[Jeff Hiller]

I want to tag you out and ask someone to come in and play the same character.

[Ego Wodem]

You will do what they're doing, but better. It'll make more sense.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's not good improv.

[Ego Wodem]

I know. And that's not good improv. That's being a bad teammate. And we don't endorse that.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't endorse that.

[Ego Wodem]

We do not endorse that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Same Stan. School kids.

[Ego Wodem]

No, no.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, don't.

[Ego Wodem]

Because we don't like school or anything.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know, but didn't you say. I had to say stay in school.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, yeah, Stay in school. But go to improv school. Everyone drop out of regular school and go to improv school.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you recommend it?

[Ego Wodem]

Well, I don't think you should drop

[Jeff Hiller]

out of school especially to do improv school.

[Ego Wodem]

Not to do improv school, but I do think improv school is good for everyone. Regard of what you want to do professionally.

[Jeff Hiller]

I agree with that. I do think that you can stay too long. There are some people who are taking classes, and I. But I guess it's also like, if that's what. If that's what brings you joy, who cares?

[Ego Wodem]

I know. I mean, if. But I don't. The thing is, like, how many improv classes could you really take? I'm sure someone could answer that for us and say, I've taken 100. And I go, that's fascinating, but interesting. I. Interesting. It's interesting. I've been taken by what you just said. I love improv. I really do think everyone should. But yeah, if you stay too long. Yeah, I guess it's a. Who cares? I know that I couldn't. Couldn't be me, but it could be you. You know when people say, that couldn't be me, that's fine. Could be someone else. I didn't know I would say that was such a judgment.

[Jeff Hiller]

I didn't think that. Oh, that's interesting.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes. You know, people go, couldn't be me. It's like, that's fine. It doesn't have to be you.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, I don't like that kind of thing. When people are like, there's like an inherent. I mean, I say I don't like that kind of thing, but I don't really have anything more to say about it. But I just feel like when people are like. Like little judgy like that about, like. Because that implies, like, it couldn't be me because I'm better than.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm better. I make better decisions than that. You know, it's like, okay, well, it will be you. Something else that someone else doesn't like. How about that? Could it be me? It could, actually. I know you don't have all the details.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, where are the details?

[Ego Wodem]

I need the. You better get some ditayes before you talk like that.

[Jeff Hiller]

The diet? Yes.

[Ego Wodem]

It's Spanish for details. Oh, it's not. It's if you couldn't tell yet. I just feel like I should tell people because I like to brag that I know Spanish. Do you like Como esta usted? Sure.

[Jeff Hiller]

Me la PIs says amario.

[Ego Wodem]

And you know what's so crazy? I don't Even know what la piece means. And Amarillo pencil and yellow. Amazing. I could have deduced that la piece was pencil if I had taken some time. I just want to say, what if I did that Sleeping game, but in Spanish.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, my God.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, how I was struggling.

[Jeff Hiller]

That will keep you. That'll keep me awake.

[Ego Wodem]

I would stay awake. What's the last thing that kept you awake? Honestly? Because, like, did this happen last night? Did you wake up at 3am it

[Jeff Hiller]

didn't happen last night.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. God, I love this for you.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. It happened maybe like two nights ago, and I woke up being like, oh, my God. I have been really neglecting my email. I just remembered I never wrote back.

[Ego Wodem]

That happens to me all the time in the middle of the day, too. Was it someone important? Everyone's important.

[Jeff Hiller]

It was.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

It was. I mean, you don't have to say who. I'll say. I'll say.

[Ego Wodem]

Reveal it on the podcast.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'll say it.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. Jeff Hiller is about to say who kept him up at 3am or woke him up at 3am because Jeff hadn't responded to their email. Please reveal.

[Jeff Hiller]

It was Broadway superstar Gideon Glick.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, Gideon Glick.

[Jeff Hiller]

You know who that is?

[Ego Wodem]

I don't know who anyone is.

[Jeff Hiller]

He was in Spring Awakening. He was just in that show Etoile. Do you remember that show, Etoile? What's her. Amy Sherman Palladino and Dan Palladino's new show.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, I haven't seen. I haven't seen it.

[Jeff Hiller]

I didn't either. They canceled it. So you're not gonna.

[Ego Wodem]

But I would love to meet Gideon.

[Jeff Hiller]

He's great. And he wrote me an email and I forgot to write him back. And I woke up and I was like, it's been like a week and a half.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, you're better than I am. You're better than I am.

[Jeff Hiller]

How long.

[Ego Wodem]

That's the reverse of couldn't be me is you're better than I am. But I genuinely mean it. There's no condescension in that baby. When I tell you I have text messages from November in here. Oh, better yet, I have a reveal. I have text messages from, like, April May unanswered. I think about. They keep me up. I know. I'm sweating a little bit as well now.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well. Cause why are they. Because the things I don't answer is when I'm like, I don't have all the information. I need to think about it more. I need to.

[Ego Wodem]

Sometimes it's that sometimes I get the text. I'm Like, I'm gonna come back to this. This is really nice. And then time passes, and then so much time passes. And I want to apologize to everyone. It weighs on me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, it.

[Ego Wodem]

Like I'm carrying this weight of unanswered everything. Emails, texts. And I saw this thing once that was like, if I owe you an email, imagine what I owe myself. I think about that. It's really profound. It was an Instagram thing. Sometimes Instagram is deep.

[Jeff Hiller]

Sometimes it is.

[Ego Wodem]

And I feel that. And so this woke you up at 3am I can relate.

[Jeff Hiller]

But also, you know, when I was about to tell you a story requires

[Ego Wodem]

me bragging, but please brag, Jeff.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is when I won an Emmy.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. I actually also think that's very fucking cool. So congratulations.

[Jeff Hiller]

Thank you. But I got so many texts, and I have this, like, deep need to respond, but there were so many that my phone kind of was like.

[Ego Wodem]

It got really hot.

[Jeff Hiller]

My phone was like, girl, we can't do it.

[Ego Wodem]

Your phone tried to jump.

[Jeff Hiller]

And so, like, there are, like, on my. On my. You know how you can get your imessage on your phone and also on your laptop? Yeah, I do it on my laptop. It still says that there are 32

[Ego Wodem]

messages and you're trying to find them.

[Jeff Hiller]

I cannot find them. They're so deep.

[Ego Wodem]

Let's speak on it. Let's address Apple right now.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know.

[Ego Wodem]

I. Tim Cook. Tim Cook, yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is what you have to answer for this.

[Ego Wodem]

Nothing else. Everything else is all good. Tim Cook. This. Jeff Hitler has 32. Jeff knew the exact number.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's a little red bubble. Because the red bubble really stresses me out.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't get it. I don't have the red bubble. I have no notifications on my phone. The red bubble is not allowed on my phone specifically for text. I had to make peace with it on my computer because there were these phantom unread texts, but you can't track them, and your phone will tell you it's all answered. But then. And the computer is saying something else. They need to fix it.

[Jeff Hiller]

They do need to fix it. And I know that there are people because then sometimes now I'll go back to text somebody about something else, and I'll see that they sent me a congratulations, and I didn't even give it a heart.

[Ego Wodem]

You Hollywood motherfucker, you. Holly. Oh, Jeff thinks he's so much better ever since he won that Emmy. See, that's what my concern would be. I have every intention of responding to people.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes, same.

[Ego Wodem]

I tell you what, before I die, those 150 texts are gonna get answered.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, it's 150.

[Ego Wodem]

I know. Trust me. My vagina just got clammy. My butthole is clenched. I am now sweating through the gray of this sweater. Just want you to.

[Jeff Hiller]

Very cute sweater, by the way.

[Ego Wodem]

Thank you so much. Guest in residence.

[Jeff Hiller]

Really?

[Ego Wodem]

Gigi Hadid.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, yes.

[Ego Wodem]

Who has made this incredible brand, but very wisely made herself not the face of the brand. I was reading this whole thing on Instagram about it. Yeah, I should be responding to texts instead of reading things that don't concern me.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is the other thing.

[Ego Wodem]

Such as?

[Jeff Hiller]

That is that, like, I'm like, wait a minute. How come I wasted this whole day? And I still have things like.

[Ego Wodem]

But you know what? It's okay. It's called being human in 2026. And I can say that to you, and I can say it with full confidence. And I want to soothe you and let you know that those 32 people who have not been answered are going to be okay. And no one is actually thinking you've turned Hollywood because you didn't respond. And in fact, most reasonable people, not all. Most reasonable I know from experience, are understanding that your phone probably blew up that day, that week, and are like, I sent the love. I wanted to send the love. Jeff has no responsibility to get back to me. I can't imagine getting that many texts again. Reasonable people are thinking.

[Jeff Hiller]

Reasonable people.

[Ego Wodem]

And so I want to soothe you, yet I can't be soothed by that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Me neither.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, I hear that. But I'm the person who responds to everyone.

[Jeff Hiller]

And when I have someone who has in my life who I personally know, who has, like, a moment that's sort of, you know, very public, that I want to congratulate them, I'm like, oh, they're gonna be mad if I don't congratulate them. And it's like, they're not even gonna notice.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, it's true. In the celebration, like, it's like a good birthday party or a good party. We don't actually know who came or didn't come.

[Jeff Hiller]

You can Irish goodbye. And they will not even realize it.

[Ego Wodem]

They will not know. They'll think you were there the whole night. Exactly.

[Jeff Hiller]

And later you can be like, oh, my God, that was so great. And they're gonna just be like, wasn't it?

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. And that's it. And no one's thinking that deeply. Except for the weird people. For the weird people. Except for the weird people. Some of them are thinking it, I found. But I. It's Okay. They should seek counsel and just have somebody. Yeah. I've been saying that to people. A lawyer or a therapist. You pick when I say seek counsel. Lawyer or therapist. Which sue me if you'd like. But. Or talk to a licensed.

[Jeff Hiller]

I will be taking legal action.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. For you not returning my text, as you should. That might get a response out of me. Won't be very, very nice, though.

[Jeff Hiller]

I might respond, you have been served.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't. But you know, when people go just. Yeah. I get overwhelmed by the amount of written communication incoming. It's not normal. It's not healthy. It wasn't supposed to be like this. And. Yeah. And so I have grace for you. But I do think Tim Cook. Mr. Cook. Fix that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Because I even do the thing where it's like you filter out just the unread and there's nothing there.

[Ego Wodem]

Look at slaying hands.

[Jeff Hiller]

There's nothing there. Please. Hold on.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't know.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is my.

[Ego Wodem]

There's nothing there. There's nothing there. I know it. I had to make peace with that red bubble on my computer. I had to make peace with it, but I don't. Yeah, it's. It's so. But even the fact that it's. I'd be curious about the psychology behind the design and, like, is it meant to induce anxiety the way that it does? Because I have genuinely eliminated it from my text messages.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's really smart.

[Ego Wodem]

It's smart. But then there's. It still weighs on me. So I haven't sorted anything out for myself except for I can't look at that red bubble on my phone and feel like I haven't gone back to people. Somebody needs me. It's an emergency. Like, red for me. Signals alert.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Emergency.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right. Me too. Me too.

[Ego Wodem]

That is why everything has gone awry.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

Studio is red stressing me the fuck out. I'm so damn stressed.

[Jeff Hiller]

This studio is red.

[Ego Wodem]

It is red. It's an emergency alert. You're in trouble, Jeff.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, my God.

[Ego Wodem]

This is. You're living inside the Shining or something. You're living inside of the 32 text messages you haven't answered. I am one of them, and I'm here to confront you.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, my God.

[Ego Wodem]

What the fuck? I congratulated you on your Emmy. I don't have Jeff's number. I congratulate you.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm so sorry.

[Ego Wodem]

You didn't say shit.

[Jeff Hiller]

I really wanted to. I blame Tim.

[Ego Wodem]

Are you better than me?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, I'm a victim. I'm a victim.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, of course. How narcissistic of you to now play victim.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's true.

[Ego Wodem]

It's true.

[Jeff Hiller]

You know what? Do you want to hit me?

[Ego Wodem]

I do.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

I won't, though, because then I believe you will seek counsel. You probably need both kinds. If I hit you. This woman, I said that he has to. Doing her weird ass podcast. She struck me. Not the good way. And now I need a lawyer and a psychiatrist.

[Jeff Hiller]

I have been stricken. I have been struck.

[Ego Wodem]

I've been struck. I've been taken by you today, Jeff. I have to say, I find you interesting, darling.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, interesting, yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Jeff, do you have kids?

[Jeff Hiller]

No.

[Ego Wodem]

Any interest? I used the word again.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know, right?

[Ego Wodem]

I'm curious about it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you have interest? I have an answer on this. I'm curious.

[Ego Wodem]

I do have interest. I've always wanted to have kids. I've never had baby fever. I don't think. Once, when my cousins were babies, I think I was, like, so obsessed. My one cousin, Choma, as a kid, her chubby cheeks just entranced me. She's a grown woman now. She's engaged. She's beating me. No, no. I joke.

[Jeff Hiller]

And it is a race.

[Ego Wodem]

It's a. To get to the. To get to death. We're all trying to get. I need to do all the things.

[Jeff Hiller]

I need to have some accomplishments.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. She was obsessed with her little chubby cheeks. Never had baby fever. And that's a thing. I'm like, I hear people speak about baby fever. Never had it, right? So now I'm like, am I. Did I. Am I missing a chip there? But I've always wanted kids, but now I've gotten so used to not having them, I'm like, do you want them? But I believe that I do want them. I've just gotten so accustomed to. It's all about me.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. And I also. Okay, so I've never been the kind of person that's like, I want a baby. I want a baby so badly. Like, I wasn't like the person who had a baby toy when I was a kid, but I was. I've also never been the person who's like, oh, these fucking kids. I hate these kids. And you're like, It's McDonald's. Calm down.

[Ego Wodem]

You're in the ball. Pedestrian. That's not the kids.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. I've never been that person either. Like, I love kids. I like playing with them and stuff like that. And I think I would be a good secondary parent. I think I'd be a great secondary parent.

[Ego Wodem]

Do you mean like a step parent or as in like, Your partner really wants kids, like Neil really wants kids. And you'll like, help. You'll lend a hand?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, not lend a hand. Like I would be active, but like, if work called me away, I would go away.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. Cause it's gonna be work over them kids.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. And like, obviously this is historically very gendered where it would be like, the mom has to know where the doctor's appointments are and schedule the camps and stuff, whereas the dad is just like,

[Ego Wodem]

let's go play, let's go play.

[Jeff Hiller]

You know what I mean? And so my husband doesn't want kids at all. He is the kind of person who's like, ugh, these children. He is that person. And I'm always like, calm down, parents. We are at a one year old's birthday party. They're allowed to be here.

[Ego Wodem]

You know what? But the one year old's birthday party, I have to say, to your husband's credit, does feel like a party for the adults. Cause I'm like, the one year old don't give a damn.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's true, that's true.

[Ego Wodem]

The one year old doesn't know. And then you spend all this money. I haven't done it yet. But who is this for?

[Jeff Hiller]

I had a friend and she was like, these people are throwing a birthday party for their one year old. It's so fucking stupid. I can't. They think like they're gonna just shove it in my face that they have a baby. And I was like, I think this might be about you.

[Ego Wodem]

I think you should seek counsel because it seems like there's some things to unpack there.

[Jeff Hiller]

I was like, I get it that you don't want to have to change your life around kids, but they're allowed to throw their child apart.

[Ego Wodem]

Absolutely, absolutely allowed to. Yeah, they are. Yes, yes. It couldn't be me, but yeah, but no, they are allowed to. They're allowed to. And I think that's fine if you're exactly.

[Jeff Hiller]

You can just not go.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes, that is always an option, by the way, being offended, like, yeah, it's an interesting choice. So it sounds though, like given you want to be secondary parent, your husband has no interest in kids and you guys aren't going to have kids.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, no, definitely. I mean, and also, like, he's 62, I'm 50.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Like if we had it tomorrow, we would be like, I would be in my 70s when they graduated college.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't think you should have kids. Cause you just said it. And so also, I live in a one bedroom apartment.

[Jeff Hiller]

There's Barely enough room for my dog crate. Wait, am I gonna put the baby in there? The dog's in there.

[Ego Wodem]

The dog's in there. Okay, I'm voting and it's not my place and it's not my business and it's not appropriate. This isn't appropriate, but I don't think

[Jeff Hiller]

I should, to be really honest. I had like a real freak out about it, like, where I, like, had like a straight up breakdown.

[Ego Wodem]

Why?

[Jeff Hiller]

Because I didn't have him. And it was during COVID I was 45. My career had been nothing at that point. And my. I think before then I had used improv as like a salve to make me feel like something was happening. But there was no improv happening during COVID And so I was just sitting alone in my apartment and I was like, right now I should be protecting my child. I need to protect my child.

[Ego Wodem]

I should have called you because I needed protection. I wish I had your number so that I could send you a text. You wouldn't answer.

[Jeff Hiller]

I tried to. I can't find him.

[Ego Wodem]

Genuinely, I.

[Jeff Hiller]

Were you in New York or la?

[Ego Wodem]

I was in New York and I had this big. I've said this before, but I had this moment where I was like, I'm an adult now. I have to decide if I stay here or go to la. Going to LA was an option and I was like, I need to figure out what's right. If I get on a plane and I get sick in this disease and I don't know that I thought it would kill me. I don't know what I thought, but I was so panicked because I was in midtown Manhattan and I was. I had just moved for snl, like, say two years prior, and I would go back to LA on every break. So every two week break we got, I'd go back to la. So I still very much was rooted there in many ways. And so I kept. During COVID when I was trying to decide if I got on, should get on that plane or not, I specifically, like, had him. I cried in the shower. I was like, I need. I need. I wish I was someone's child so that they could fuck this up and it would be their responsibility. I'm like, if I make the wrong choice, it's like, like on me. And I guess I'm an adult now, so I. I wish I had your number at the time because I'd be like, take care of me. Hold me. You can do this.

[Jeff Hiller]

I will hold you all.

[Ego Wodem]

Five, eight.

[Jeff Hiller]

Come on, don't hold me. I'M very big though. I could. I could actually hold you.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Next time.

[Ego Wodem]

Next time I'm calling you if I'm not someone's mom.

[Jeff Hiller]

But you know, I probably would. The other thing is though, that as a parent, like hearing you just say that makes me think, oh, I shouldn't be a parent. Because I was like, oh, I probably make the wrong choice.

[Ego Wodem]

I totally make the right choice. I think that's what it is though. I don't know. Cause I'm not a parent, but I'm sort of like everyone's guessing, I believe is the sense I get. So I don't even mean to say that as some childless harlot.

[Jeff Hiller]

Now you're a full on harlot.

[Ego Wodem]

Where'd that come from? I'm gonna unpack. I'll work on that. Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Maybe you should go talk to your lawyer. Okay,

[Ego Wodem]

I will. She's great. I bet she will have something thoughtful to say about that. She's brilliant and so fuck therapists. I don't know that it's my place, but I get the sense now and it's why I've been able to like give my mom grace is I'm like, everyone's kind of guessing. It's every. I heard this thing, which is maybe not profound but was impactful to me. I feel like I just heard it a month ago, two months. Every. This is everyone's first time being human. And that means your first time being a parent. Parent. Even if you a first time being a parent to each child because each child is different.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

My understanding is you can love your kids and do your very best and they're all going to kind of just turn out how they turn out. And that sounds all very stressful, but I'm like, I. No one knows what they're doing and they're guessing and so you probably would have fucked it up. But even me, like making the decision to stay in New York versus go to la. Like they both had their pros and their cons and everyone's making the best decision. Or most people making the best decision they can with all the information they have at the time.

[Jeff Hiller]

And the decisions are personal too. It's like, yeah, that's so true. Did you go to la?

[Ego Wodem]

I didn't. I stayed in New York and I became a woman. I say covet made me a woman. Okay, I became a woman.

[Jeff Hiller]

There's like a breath in there.

[Ego Wodem]

I became a woman. It sounds like I started touching myself during COVID That's when I first discovered masturbation during COVID the sweets. That's when I began to explore myself as a woman.

[Jeff Hiller]

I wish I was still on snl. This is like. This is your next update character during lockdown.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, I became a woman.

[Jeff Hiller]

I feel like I became like, I didn't get any. I could be like, everyone else is like. Like, oh, I grew so much during it. And I was just like, I didn't do anything.

[Ego Wodem]

You're like, that's why you needed the child.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly.

[Ego Wodem]

And then, much like people did with their pets, you give the child away at the end of lockdown. And I go, oh, this wasn't actually for me. We need to re home you. We have to re home you. I thought this. This was. I was home. And now work is calling. I'm gonna have to go win an Emmy. So we're gonna re home you.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know you take cats and dogs. Do you take babies? Human babies? I guess. Toddler? I don't know.

[Ego Wodem]

I didn't just leave it in a basket outside of the dog shelter.

[Jeff Hiller]

I left a note. Please take care of this bear. That's Paddington.

[Ego Wodem]

Jeff. Now. I almost wish you had done it. No, I'm kidding. We're kidding. Remember, we're chamedians around here, guys. We are comedians. It's comedians. It's not that deep. What's this accent?

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't know. But I'm a woman now because of it.

[Ego Wodem]

I really did. I really grew up. I really was like, bitch, you better figure it out. I was like, what, are you going to leave your apartment that you pay for and go stay on someone's couch? Which is low key.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh. Cause you didn't have your own space in la.

[Ego Wodem]

I didn't have my own space in la and I could have stayed on couches and they would have welcomed me, but I was like, I need alone time and I don't know how long I'll be out there.

[Jeff Hiller]

And you'd have been out there a

[Ego Wodem]

long time, it turns out. And I don't think that would have worked for me.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, no, no.

[Ego Wodem]

So instead I get.

[Jeff Hiller]

But you could go, like, hiking and stuff there. Whereas here I did feel a little trapped.

[Ego Wodem]

I felt trapped. And you also out there. Yeah. They did it. I went to LA in June of that year, and my friend had her birthday at a park and they were all trying to hug me, but I had come from New York and I was like, don't touch me. I was in the epicenter. I'm done. I just can't. I was like, I don't want to hug I don't want to hug. And they were like, diego, it's fine. Because they did not have the same experience as us here. And I'm at the birthday party at Griffith park, being like, I was at the epicenter. I have pt. I kept saying, I have ptsd. I was in the epicenter. Happy birthday. Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday. Happy birthday, Please. I was in the epicenter. I had ptsd.

[Jeff Hiller]

There's something about this hand motion while saying happy birthday, that is very funny to me. Happy birthday.

[Ego Wodem]

Happy birthday.

[Jeff Hiller]

Stay back.

[Ego Wodem]

Just give us a hug. It's fine. No, no. This is a boundary. Happy birthday.

[Jeff Hiller]

I am riddled. It's all over me. Leech me down.

[Ego Wodem]

It was truly, like, looking back, how chaotic I was. I love my friends because they loved me through it. And these are wonderful people.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm sure afterwards they were like, did you hear it?

[Ego Wodem]

Did you hear? Ego was in the epicenter. She has ptsd. Talk about Happy birthday. She would have stayed in New York. The. She come over here with this energy for. Keep that weird over there.

[Jeff Hiller]

Putting her hands like that.

[Ego Wodem]

Putting it from a Happy birthday. Each hand represented one word. Happy birthday.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. She's a hugger.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. And I am. And I say that to you. When you came.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. When you came in.

[Ego Wodem]

And now she's giving me hands.

[Jeff Hiller]

Now she's giving me hands.

[Ego Wodem]

She has ptsd. That was. I. I diagnosed myself.

[Jeff Hiller]

Didn't, you know, Have. Do you. Are you in therapy?

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, I have a really good therapist. I think. You can have a bad therapist. I think you have a mediocre therapist like any other profession, so. Yeah, well.

[Jeff Hiller]

Cause EMDR is really good for that kind of problem.

[Ego Wodem]

It's the, like, blinking.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, it's the bilateral stimulation.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, it's not the blinking. I just made that up. I'm winking at you. How is my wink, by the way?

[Jeff Hiller]

Let's see.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, so fast. Wait, you did it. Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do it slowly.

[Ego Wodem]

My last season at snl, I think we spent like a month. It was either a week or a month. I can't remember. Time. Time is a construct. And I'm trying to be like, how good is my wink? And everyone's like, yours seems like a twitch. It is.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's very fast.

[Ego Wodem]

I was also the one who started the conversation. Cause I was like, I have a very good wink. And I want to see how, like, say you were at a bar, and I was trying to proud. I was proud of you. Wink. I was like, this is a wink. This is a nice wink.

[Jeff Hiller]

I held my Self esteem and my wink abilities.

[Ego Wodem]

And I was like, let's see your winks. And everyone was, like, in full agreement that my winks were twitches.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, it's very fast.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, let's try again. Again, Genuinely. Okay, so, like, this is how we did it at work at that time. Pretend. And I have so many more questions to ask you, but I do feel like we need to pause for this.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, no, this is important.

[Ego Wodem]

The commercial break is for my wink. Okay, so, like, this is how we set it up. Say you're at a bar.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

You're talking to a friend. You're. Yeah. Drinking a drink. Okay. We kind of. And then you kind of keep glancing at me and I. I notice. And then, like, at some point, it's

[Jeff Hiller]

so weird to be flirty.

[Ego Wodem]

You're like, I'm not attracted.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do straight guys flirt like this? Where they, like, weirdly masturbate? Their straw mama's churning butter for you, baby.

[Ego Wodem]

You'd be surprised, Jeff. That's all I'll say about that. Okay, so. Okay. I don't want to wink at that man. Unfortunately, we have to start this over.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay, okay, okay, okay, Wait, hold on. Let me do my stripper.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, but, like, maybe you're looking at me. I set this up wrong. You're looking at me, and then I'm like, oh, okay, that hot guy. That hot guy who can't close his mouth is looking at me. Okay?

[Jeff Hiller]

That's how straight guys are that can't close their mouth.

[Ego Wodem]

They can't actually. And you mean that in every sentence. Okay, so, okay, so then I would be like this. Okay, I would glance. I'm getting nervous now. Okay, this is good. I'm getting nervous. And then I go, is it a twitch or is it a wake up? I'm getting the dirtiest look from a friend.

[Jeff Hiller]

I mean, I will say. Say, I don't know, there are other people here. But I will say, when you did it, I did feel the need to flinch. You know what it feels like? It feels like you're like, I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. I did it.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm so hurt. Okay, no, this is hurting my feelings.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm so sorry.

[Ego Wodem]

I appreciate honesty because I'll work on it. Let me try.

[Jeff Hiller]

I will say, your eyes are gorgeous.

[Ego Wodem]

Thank you. No, you don't have to try to build me up after that.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, no, no, no.

[Ego Wodem]

But

[Jeff Hiller]

I want to make you in my image.

[Ego Wodem]

The damage is done.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm like the military. I break you down and then I Make you in my image.

[Ego Wodem]

It's okay. The damage is done. I would like the opportunity. And this is me spending way too much time. Many people will skip through this section when it's important to me. And you've given me a microphone and a platform for some God forsaken reason. I don't know why anybody would be watching this, but I would like the opportunity to try again with my right eye.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay. Okay. Oh, okay.

[Ego Wodem]

In a way that is not offensive. Okay, Greg. Grr. Or maybe gentler flirting. I don't want to make you flinch. I want to make you go, oh, sex.

[Jeff Hiller]

Wait, is this how people flirt? I don't think that's what you do. That's very like 1920s.

[Ego Wodem]

I guess this is my problem.

[Jeff Hiller]

It feels very old fashioned to be like I winked at him.

[Ego Wodem]

Well, wouldn't that be nice?

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't know.

[Jeff Hiller]

To have an old fashioned cute instead

[Ego Wodem]

of just like, yes, a swipe and a. Yeah, okay. Anyway.

[Jeff Hiller]

And a U up or whatever.

[Ego Wodem]

And a U up. Come on. A wink at a bar. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, that's nice. Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. So I'm going to try again with my right eye.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay, great.

[Ego Wodem]

My dominant eye. It is my dominant eye. If you could have one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then I'm going to try with my left and then we're going to close the case.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay. Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

And we'll get back to asking you questions. You didn't come here for this. But since I have a caption, I just did.

[Jeff Hiller]

This is exactly what I wanted.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. They're going to cancel the podcast any day now. She's winking. It's. It's an audio first thing. It's an audible platform. It's. And she's winking. It's fine. I'm waiting for them to call. Okay. All right. So you're over there. I find you attractive. Your mouth is open. You're a straight guy, whatever. And then I'm like, okay, okay. So that first time was aggressive. And I'm like, oh, cute, cute, cute.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, that was good. That was good.

[Ego Wodem]

Growth.

[Jeff Hiller]

That was growth.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, now I want to try with my left. Because I was like, I'm pretty good at both. Okay. All right, so you're over there. Same deal. I find you attractive. And I go, that one, that one,

[Jeff Hiller]

I have to tell you, was a little muddled. That one felt a little bit like you had something in your eye.

[Ego Wodem]

It's time for us to move on. I think we're gonna cut all of that out. No, we're not. We're Gonna keep it.

[Jeff Hiller]

It felt like that. Felt like you.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't need the feedback.

[Jeff Hiller]

Had an eyelash out of place.

[Ego Wodem]

I don't need the feedback. I know it was bad. Thank you for.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't think I'm a good winker.

[Ego Wodem]

Can I see with your better eye? Just so I feel. But you have to do the mouth with it. Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I have to, like, move my. I'm not emoji Gucci, eighth grade. Yeah. Anyway, this is. This has always worked for me.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm into you.

[Jeff Hiller]

Let's have sex.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, gosh. Peaceful sex. Maybe there can be three other people because I'm one of the fingers.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's ironic that I would be choosing this symbol to have sex because it's really. It's more like it should be this.

[Ego Wodem]

And I'm over here like, okay, this

[Jeff Hiller]

is how they do it.

[Ego Wodem]

I feel like this is how they do it. You just seem like a responsible adult. I keep looking for guidance.

[Jeff Hiller]

You need a dad.

[Ego Wodem]

I need a dad. Oh, no, it's too late.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

She's too far gone.

[Jeff Hiller]

Same, by the way.

[Ego Wodem]

Fatherless child. But you had a dad.

[Jeff Hiller]

A good dad.

[Ego Wodem]

We're not trying to circle back to dads. I actually have a Covid question for you and your husband.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

Did you guys get closer during. Because you said nothing happened. Some people got closer. Some people fought more. It was just like you guys were. It was status quo for you guys.

[Jeff Hiller]

At first we got close. He was an early adopter of the disease, so he had it in March of 2020.

[Ego Wodem]

Chic.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes. And also, he is like. I don't know why, but his body just, like, is like a whore for Covid. It's like he is also, like, as a Covid slut. He just gets up all the time. And so there was a lot of me sleeping on the couch and him being in the bedroom and, like, me bringing soup to him and stuff. Like. And I felt like, ironically, that actually did make us close because I really felt like I was caring for him and stuff. But then around seven months in, I was like, go away.

[Ego Wodem]

Please.

[Jeff Hiller]

Go the fuck away.

[Ego Wodem]

Go somewhere.

[Jeff Hiller]

Exactly. And I would just, like, walk around. We live on the Lower east side, and so I just walk down by the river.

[Ego Wodem]

Just be, like, looking out, like, at

[Jeff Hiller]

the end of a Reese Witherspoon movie or something. Cable knit sweater. Just looking out, dreaming. Dreaming of something where I had a room of one's own.

[Ego Wodem]

How did you guys. How did you guys get past that moment?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, the only thing that saved us is he's a visual artist and he has an art studio, and he was sharing it with someone, but the woman he was sharing with is a painter, but she's also a medical doctor.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh.

[Jeff Hiller]

So she, like, was like, I'm not going to the studio at all. And so we could go to the studio when we needed to. I mean, it's not a place that has a bathroom or anything, but you. I mean, it has a bathroom, but it's like down the hall and stuff, but.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, how inconvenient.

[Jeff Hiller]

Listen, I don't want to be shitting down the hall.

[Ego Wodem]

Not down the hall. The steps away, please. I think that's okay that it's down the hall, but. Okay. So you. But then you guys would both go, no, no, no.

[Jeff Hiller]

He would go. And I would be like, okay, he's gone. I need a little alone time.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. All right. That's nice. Shout out to the studio. Yeah, this is what this is.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then we had a pod with our friend sue and her cousins, who are a straight family. Had a house.

[Ego Wodem]

How is that a straight family?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, there. There's a reason I say that they let her bring us in our pod and stay at their house in the Fire Islands Pines neighborhood, which is like the gay part of Fire island, but we got to go and stay there for free for a week. And even though they're a straight family, I don't know.

[Ego Wodem]

Do you think it was them trying to maintain residence? Cause they were gonna get kicked out of the neighborhood for being straights. And they thought, let's let the gay couple come. We need to put our allyship. I'm kidding.

[Jeff Hiller]

I 100% do not believe that that was what it was. I think they were like, okay, yeah, you can go stay there. I think that's what it was.

[Ego Wodem]

Were they not there?

[Jeff Hiller]

Not at that point.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, nice people and their extra properties.

[Jeff Hiller]

Isn't it wild?

[Ego Wodem]

Incredible. Do you have an additional property?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, but I want one so badly. But I can't even afford, like an assistant or a. I can't. I don't even have a. Oh, I was gonna thank someone.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, my gosh. I keep. What is this podcast who gave me this podcast, and I need to talk to them and tell them you've made a gigantic fucking mistake.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do not say that. You've been so good.

[Ego Wodem]

Thank you. But I. I can you believe. And it's 11:11. That's how woo woo I am that I need to. We need to do something. Okay. Okay. Thank you. I think we paid homage to 1111. I'm sorry that I. Oh, my God.

[Jeff Hiller]

The person who's listening to this is so confused right now. And then there was some beating happening,

[Ego Wodem]

and then they're just making noises you'll have to watch on Jump. Okay, so what's that accent? What is that accent? Oh, my gosh, Jeff, what's going on with me? Okay. What's the very last thing you said to me? Cause I'm drunk on power right now.

[Jeff Hiller]

I said I was supposed to thank someone.

[Ego Wodem]

Thank you. You should take over this podcast. Moving forward. That's what I was gonna say. This podcast is now thanks, dad with Jeff Hiller. I'll come on from time to time to show face, let people know I'm still alive.

[Jeff Hiller]

Jeff, come wink at it.

[Ego Wodem]

Come wink. I'm gonna get good at it, too. While I'm away. What? Who or what do you want to say thanks to?

[Jeff Hiller]

I want to say so you know how. Okay, so we were just talking about how, like, I don't have enough money to have another property. Which I often thought, like, if I had a TV show, I would have money, but it's not.

[Ego Wodem]

It doesn't work that way.

[Jeff Hiller]

No.

[Ego Wodem]

Especially not in this day and age.

[Jeff Hiller]

No.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

And so I can't afford to pay my publicist always. But I have this great publicist. This is Sam Suni Bassin. She's great.

[Ego Wodem]

Shout out to Sam.

[Jeff Hiller]

I can't pay her right now because, like, what am I, a Rockefeller? And I'm not promoting anything. So I was gonna thank Maxwell, our manager, Lucas assistant, because.

[Ego Wodem]

Maxwell Barnes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Maxwell Barnes, because he has been basically taking over the duties of my publicist. And at one point, he arranged my travel and stuff. I mean, I paid for it, but

[Ego Wodem]

he's such a saint. I made the assistant.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm not a monster. But he, like, helped me. Cause I was like, I don't know, like, Delta doesn't fly from LA to Chicago. And he, like, found me a United flight. It was very, very sweet.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, I could have told you that. You gotta get my number after this. So Chicago's a hub for United States. Why do I know that? I don't know. I travel a lot. Perhaps. I don't.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't know. Do you have a loyalty program for applying?

[Ego Wodem]

I do. So here's what I'll say. Whoever wants to give me endorsement money, I will. We will edit out what I'm about to say. The truth, and then put in your brand.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay, great.

[Ego Wodem]

But I'll edit out the truth. The truth is, it's Delta. I'm a Delta Diva.

[Jeff Hiller]

Me too. I'm Diamond.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm Simon Su.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh my God. Isn't it so nice?

[Ego Wodem]

It's really nice. They give you the little tags for your bag. Uh huh.

[Jeff Hiller]

They call them brag tags.

[Ego Wodem]

The brag tags. I don't put them on my bags. Cause it just feels too. It feels braggadocious.

[Jeff Hiller]

I didn't put mine on yet.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah, it just feels good. I have them. I said, yeah, yeah, you're. Put them on 20, 26.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, maybe I'll do it.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, wait, we have to say thanks to Maxwell.

[Jeff Hiller]

Maxwell who? Yes, and who is so. And he's like so, so patient with me too. Because sometimes I forget some of the emails that I wake up in the middle of the night. It's him, it's him.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, by the way.

[Jeff Hiller]

And he'll text me like, okay to confirm.

[Ego Wodem]

I know. Maxwell, a saint. I was saying to Lucas the other day, I was like, you and Maxwell saved my life. Maxwell. I sent him an email sometime this summer being like, I'm sorry, there's like five emails about one thing, like separate threads. And I still have not adopted the Gmail app on my phone. So I'm using the good old native iPhone email app and the search function is botched. Tim Cook, bro, get it together. I should switch to Droid, but I won't.

[Jeff Hiller]

Unless they pay me.

[Ego Wodem]

Unless they pay me, of course.

[Jeff Hiller]

And then I will fuck up everybody's little green bubbles.

[Ego Wodem]

I will be green bubbling all your asses. Okay, so I can afford a second property, but you know what I mean.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes, I know what I mean.

[Ego Wodem]

But Maxwell. Well, I've been like, I'm sorry. It's just really hard to keep track of the emails because it's separate threads and the search function doesn't work and I can't find. And he's like, I got you. Which he should really be like, bitch, fuck all.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know.

[Ego Wodem]

Exactly.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. And I even said to him, I was like, I'm sorry, I know I should be using a personal assistant for this. I mean, I'm not like making him get my dry cleaning. He lives in la.

[Ego Wodem]

But I mean if he did live here, you would.

[Jeff Hiller]

I would, I would. Like, I can afford dry cleaning anyway. That sounded pitiful. Yeah. He's so nice. And did you know he took classes at ucb?

[Ego Wodem]

I didn't know that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do you know how I found that out? He didn't ever tell me.

[Ego Wodem]

Tell me, how do you know?

[Jeff Hiller]

Because his girlfriend, so sweet named Audrey, she works at. I guess this is okay to Say she works at Charlize Theron's production company, and I had a general there, and she was like, maxwell's my boyfriend. And he was like, I told her not to tell you.

[Ego Wodem]

Aw, Mom.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know, right? And she was like, yeah, we take classes at ucb.

[Ego Wodem]

That's amazing.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know.

[Ego Wodem]

Mainly the girlfriend snitching.

[Jeff Hiller]

I know. And they're both like. I could tell she was just as organized and put together.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, that's gonna be such an organized child. Should they wed. Should they wed? And bear child.

[Jeff Hiller]

Bear fruit.

[Ego Wodem]

And bear fruit.

[Jeff Hiller]

Bear organized fruit.

[Ego Wodem]

Jeff, I've taken up so much of your time. It's time for a segment called that's Nice, but what about Me?

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay, great.

[Ego Wodem]

But I fear I spoke too much about myself already.

[Jeff Hiller]

I don't think so.

[Ego Wodem]

But I guess my question for you.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes.

[Ego Wodem]

How does one go about winning an Emmy? What's the formula?

[Jeff Hiller]

I have given so much head. No, come on.

[Ego Wodem]

I knew I'm supposed to be sucking dick. I knew it. And I'm sending emails. It's all in writing. Me being like, can someone tell me whose dick I am? This.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's not just one. It's multiple dicks simultaneously.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, King. Master at your craft. That's not. You don't have to answer that question.

[Jeff Hiller]

You have to admit that it was, like, so lucky. I mean, it was just, like, a weird coincidence. I happened to be promoting my book right when the Emmy nominations were coming out. I think that's what helped. I mean, when it happened, Lucas cried. That's our manager. He cried.

[Ego Wodem]

By the way, we love our manager.

[Jeff Hiller]

We love him.

[Ego Wodem]

He's my fan.

[Jeff Hiller]

He's the best. And he cried because he was so shocked.

[Ego Wodem]

Are you sure it wasn't just because he was so happy for you?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, he was. He was so happy. But I'm saying, like, it was not expected to even get the nomination. And then he was all like, you know, just, the nomination is such a big deal. Don't worry about winning. It's fine. And then when I won, he was like, this is so much better.

[Ego Wodem]

The truth. So I know that he's told me with nominations, like, this is huge. This is a. So I now know he's just saying that to make me feel.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, no, he said. He goes, you're a practical person and a humble person, but now is not the time to be either of those things.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, go off. I love that. A little fire in the booty. Okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

It was exciting. It was like in the car on the way away from the epic store.

[Ego Wodem]

I was like, okay, he's the best. And I am truly so, so happy for you. I was. I very, very happy for you. And so congratulations. And that was the. That's nice. But what about me? And I made you. Yeah. Because. Yeah. You answered my question.

[Jeff Hiller]

Have you been nominated for an Emmy?

[Ego Wodem]

Are you trying to make me cry? Are you trying to make me feel like shit? You told me my wink was trash. No, I haven't.

[Jeff Hiller]

Not for Lisa from Temecula or Miss Eggy or nothing.

[Ego Wodem]

Nothing.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, that's not fair. And that's not right. And that's. That's the thing, what I'm saying about. It's a luck. It's about luck too. It's like about this weird, bizarre, like, whatever hurricane storm happened.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

Also, I'm not worried about you. You're.

[Ego Wodem]

You're so sweet.

[Jeff Hiller]

Look at this. You made this blood red room. We're in a podcast.

[Ego Wodem]

Stressful room. It's thumping, throbbing, throbbing. The heartbeat of New York City. That's what we're in, Jeff.

[Jeff Hiller]

I heart. Oh, is that what it is? I heart.

[Ego Wodem]

I heart radio. I know.

[Jeff Hiller]

Is that why this is?

[Ego Wodem]

I believe so.

[Jeff Hiller]

Is this a heart? Are we in?

[Ego Wodem]

But it's not like everyone's nodding yes, so I'm gonna say yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. It's not a cartoon heart, though. It's like aorta.

[Ego Wodem]

Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's like Indiana Jones when he pulls out of his.

[Ego Wodem]

What if you also to the viewers of this podcast found out that there's actually no one else in the room when I go. Everyone's body. What if they once said they discover there's no one here but me? And you, my guest, are always very gracious about it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, man, I would love that. I think that would be amazing.

[Ego Wodem]

I know. To sleep. I'm unwell.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm telling you. Cup plate. That's what it should be. Just dirty words.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Like cup pussy.

[Jeff Hiller]

I can't think of a dirty word that starts with lie.

[Ego Wodem]

Lie. Yuchi. But it's coochie. But it's. I don't know. You can make. But if you made words up, you'd really be awake.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, it's true.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay. We have to help a listener. This has been. I took up so much of your time, but I am so grateful because you have been pure delightful. Well, I've just been self deprecating. Leave reviews of me in the comments. I know you will.

[Jeff Hiller]

Do they.

[Ego Wodem]

Do they probably.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, don't read.

[Ego Wodem]

You can't read the reviews. And I do. Not of me. Of restaurants. But People have things to say always.

[Jeff Hiller]

People do have always things to say.

[Ego Wodem]

Oh, we have. Okay, the guest, the guest. The listener who needs advice has texted. You can text guys, you can.

[Jeff Hiller]

So is that like an I heart phone?

[Ego Wodem]

This is an. In many ways. In many ways.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, that's just your phone. That's just your phone.

[Ego Wodem]

That's just my phone. This is just my phone. I thought about lying. I thought about saying yes. But why, why, why not just answer the question truthfully?

[Jeff Hiller]

In many ways.

[Ego Wodem]

In many ways. No. And then all the other podcasters go, they gave ego a four phone. Oh my goodness, I'm unwell. Okay, so somebody's going to ask us for advice. I've declared I'm unwell. But that's okay cuz we're going to give advice. Okay, the. It's been texted to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Ego Wodem]

Hi Ms. Eggy and guest. I need some bad advice. Well, I can certainly help with that. I'm single and I don't have a lot of free time because I work a lot. Should I just hook up with a coworker to bide the time? Jeff, what do you say? What say you?

[Jeff Hiller]

No, I mean I think you can hook up to bide some time, but you can do that.

[Ego Wodem]

What does bide mean? It's short for biden.

[Jeff Hiller]

It means fucking on a Nam track.

[Ego Wodem]

Nuff said. That I understand.

[Jeff Hiller]

I think you can have, I think you can have some sex with somebody that isn't gonna be the long term partner. But don't do it with your co worker cause that's always gonna get messy.

[Ego Wodem]

I agree. I was about to say I tend to agree. When people say I tend to agree, just say you agree. Right. But I agree. And I'm kind of like, I was just talking to people this morning about making irresponsible choices and that's so not my bag. So I was never gonna be the girly to tell you to fuck your co worker. It's like having sex with a neighbor.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Ego Wodem]

You're gonna have to see them.

[Jeff Hiller]

Right.

[Ego Wodem]

Are you gonna get a new job if things go awry and it gets awkward and you like, there's no need. There's so many other people in the world.

[Jeff Hiller]

A next door neighbor or like on your apartment floor neighbor. But I think neighborhood is okay.

[Ego Wodem]

Neighborhood okay. I could be open to, I could be open to it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I guess it depends on. I tend to agree, okay. That someone who you're gonna see all the time is bad. But sometimes you can be in a very dense neighborhood and then it's Just nice to have an FWB Friend with

[Ego Wodem]

benefit, friend with boner so you can get too quickly. Friend with big cop.

[Jeff Hiller]

You can go get your bang on and then get home by 9:30 and get in bed.

[Ego Wodem]

I love that.

[Jeff Hiller]

So that you can wake up at 3.

[Ego Wodem]

At 3 and do the little game by yourself like I do, like Jeff does, and then win an Emmy like Jeff. Fucking Jeff. You have all the solutions and the answers. I think this is right. I'm looking at it again to make sure we didn't leave them hanging in any way. This wasn't me just casually checking out of the podcast.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, I really need to return this text.

[Ego Wodem]

151. I can't simply can't have that.

[Jeff Hiller]

151.

[Ego Wodem]

We're at 141 right now. But that's okay. That's okay.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's so funny that you exaggerated only by 10.

[Ego Wodem]

I know, but I remember being 10. I remember it being 150, but I feel kind of good right now because it means I answered nine. Oh, good. some point in my sleep, probably you

[Jeff Hiller]

just wrote them cup pussy.

[Ego Wodem]

Cup pussy. Egalitarian. That's a good one.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is a good one.

[Ego Wodem]

Okay, but I think they wanted bad advice. But I guess if they want bad advice, it's do it.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, do it.

[Ego Wodem]

So, yeah, so we've given good and bad. You take your pick.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, and a lot of times, like if. If you hear advice from somebody and you just are like, no, it doesn't mean that that's bad advice. It means you've already made your choice.

[Ego Wodem]

Yeah. Some people are asking for advice and they know what they want to do.

[Jeff Hiller]

Really, what they want is permission.

[Ego Wodem]

They want permission and you don't need it from me, honey, because I don't know what I'm doing. This is my first time being human. I'm figuring it out for myself every

[Jeff Hiller]

single thing you just said. Amen.

[Ego Wodem]

And that is a sermon. And Jeff, you have been a pure joy to speak to. Thank you so much for your time.

[Jeff Hiller]

Thank you.

[Ego Wodem]

I really, really appreciate you and everyone. Take care of yourselves. Get your sleep. Drink your water.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Go get an eye. Exactly. Exam.

[Ego Wodem]

What are you trying to tell me? My wig is bad? I know. Bye.

[Jeff Hiller]

Honestly, I think it's clinical, Jeff.

[Ego Wodem]

I'm going to talk to a lawyer about it. Okay. All right, great. Thanks, Jeff. That was my beautiful conversation with Jeff Hiller. If you listened to all the way through, God bless you. Because how disjointed was I again, you don't need to tell me because I know. So tired. Because not enough time off. And that's why we all are taking July off. Remember? We're all taking July off. We're making a pact. I'm putting my hand in. I'm pretending you all putting your hands in and it's July off for us. Okay? Love, Jeff. That was fantastic. So fun. What a joy. Really. I. I really enjoyed him. I really enjoyed him. What a. What a way to speak about someone. I enjoy you. Anyway, guys, we can also give you bad good mid advice as well. You just have to call and leave me a voice message. It might be texted. It might then be transcribed and texted to me and that's fine too. But if you want advice from me and my guests, all you have to do is call 502-849-3237. That's 502-849-323-7502. Thanks, dads. Yeah, that's right. Thanks dad is a production of Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and I Heart podcast. I'm your host, Ego Wodem. Our producer is Kevin Bartelt, and our executive producer is Matt Apodaca.

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[Ego Wodem]

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[Jeff Hiller]

This episode is brought to you by Bobcat. They started the compact equipment industry through grit, determination and a whole lot of think we can't do that. Watch us. They set standards, broke records, empowered people to build bigger and higher, to dig deeper, to make the impossible possible. We've all been there with doubters telling us what we can't do. Who cares what they think? We don't need their permission or forgiveness. We just get things done. So go ahead and doubt me. Judge me, Challenge me. But when the time comes, watch me. Bobcat

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[Ego Wodem]

This is an I Heart podcast.

Guaranteed human.