← The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast
The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast
1KHO 478: Later Is Just Another Word for Never | Sahil Bloom, The Five Types of Wealth
00:59:06
Loading summary
Transcript78 lines
- [00:01]
Sahil Bloom
If you're a Christian, imagine what life would be like if you didn't have access to or had never even seen a Bible in your own language. For many people around the world, that is their reality. CREW has missionaries in almost every country and they're seeing people's lives changed. Thousands of men, women and children are coming to faith, but simply don't have access to a Bible of their own. In parts of Africa, CREW missionaries have to share one Bible between several people. In Europe, teens are asking for more Bibles than we can provide. In enclosed nations, this good news is spreading at an astonishing rate, but they need more physical Bibles to keep up with the growth.
- [00:37]
Jenny Urich
People are searching for truth and finding.
- [00:38]
Sahil Bloom
Answers in God's word. That's why I love partnering with Crew. With just $24 a month, you can give three people the gift of God's word every month. And as a thank you, crew will provide 12 meals to those in need and you'll receive a free copy of my book until the street lights come on. To give, text Our Hou R to 71326 or visit give crew.org our H.
- [01:03]
O U R that's Hou R to.
- [01:07]
71326 message and data rates may apply US addresses only. Your monthly gift can truly make a massive impact.
- [01:16]
Welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Jenny Urich. I'm the founder of 1000 Hours Outside. And this has hardly happened, but I have an author on today whose books are even in the airport. In the airport. So he'll bloom. Welcome.
- [01:31]
That does feel like the. The tipping point for a book. Like, I just remember when I started writing the book, I would walk around in the airport and just think, wow, wouldn't it be cool if I was walking around here one day and I saw my book and the first time it happened, I will admit it was a real life moment.
- [01:48]
It is a pinnacle. It is a big deal to get your book into the airport. And I just saw it yesterday. Yesterday I was in the airport and saw it. It is Phenome is called the five types of wealth, A transformative guide to design your dream life. And this book, I mean, it grabs you right from the beginning, right from the very, very beginning. And there are so many things in here that stood out to me. I want to kick it off with some of the ones that were so striking. And then it's also very practical. So this is a book that draws you in, really makes you think, but then also gives you practical solutions. And I want to kick it off with. This was so striking to me when you're talking about Warren Buffett and this concept of a time billionaire, which I'd never heard of, but this is about someone who's got a billion or more seconds left to live. And you gave this question, and I thought, this is such a striking question. Would you trade places with Warren Buffett? He's a billionaire. And most people would say no. Why would they say no?
- [02:42]
It's such an amazing frame of reference. In a simple question, you pull out this idea that places time and money next to each other. So the question that you ask is, would you trade lives with Warren Buffett? You framed it up. He's worth $130 billion. He flies around on private jets. He reads and learns for a living. He has access to anyone in the world. He's got all these houses, all these great things that we're supposed to want. But you wouldn't trade lives with him because he is 95 years old. There is no way you would agree to trade the amount of time that he has left for all of the money that he has. And on the flip side, he would give anything, anything to be in your shoes, where you are today, to have the amount of time that you have today. So in a simple question, you have highlighted the fact that your time has quite literally incalculable value. And yet on a daily basis, how much are we really recognizing that? How much are we appreciating the precious nature of that one asset that we can never get back? We spend so much of our days sitting on these things, these phones that capture so much of our attention, scrolling, you know, comparing our lives to other people, stressing about the past, anxiety about the future. All of these things that are fundamentally disregarding the one most precious asset that we have right in front of us, the time that we have for ourselves and with the people that we care about most in the world. So that is what that question is intended to bring to light, that we all need to treat ourselves as time billionaires. Recognize that that time is your most precious asset and that once it's gone, you can never get it back, and.
- [04:23]
That it's a form of wealth. It's such an incredible title and such an incredible premise. Almost everybody, when you think about wealth, you think about money. And this book is like, no, there's all sorts of types of wealth. There's your physical wealth and there's your time wealth and your relationships. Money does play a factor, you say right off the bat. I'm not saying that Money doesn't matter. It's in more of a tool to facilitate these other ones. And so you wrote, it struck me how we all have this hidden assumption, if we could just have a billion dollars, just a billion, we'd be happy. But then if you were going to trade lives with Warren, you would say, no way, no way, and he would trade lives with you back. So it's so striking and thought provoking. Would you trade places? Another thing that was really striking was you told this story about like, sort of the arrival fallacy. Like, I have arrived. And you talked about this person who. It's like, well, I'm going to arrive. And what will show that I've arrived is that I am going to get this yacht and I'm going to have all these people on my yacht and we're going to have this big party and I'm going to feel like I arrived. And the story is like, they're on the yacht and someone says, oh, there's a bigger yacht over there. Can you talk about this? You call it the poverty of more.
- [05:38]
Yeah. There is a. It's a rather natural human tendency to reset to new, higher expectations for the future. It's called the hedonic adaptation. It's this idea that no matter what highs or lows, you end up resetting to some baseline. It's sort of an evolutionary survival trait to some extent. You know, if you were in the wild and you got too high off of getting one meal, you were more likely to get eaten by the tiger that was hiding if you didn't come back down to the baseline and get back to this even keel. Unfortunately, what started as sort of a natural evolutionary survival trait has become something very negative in our lives, which is to say that what happens is you create this conditional statement about your own happiness. You keep saying things like, when I get X, then I'll be happy when I live here, then I'll be happy when I have this much money, when I get this title, this bonus, this promotion, you know, when I have a partner, all of these things. You are making your own happiness conditional on some arrival, on some idea of some getting to some place or something. And now all of a sudden you are going to be happy. When the truth is that what happens is, it's called the arrival fallacy. You get that thing and you immediately reset to this baseline and feel like, okay, now I just need to do more. It's this poverty of more you continue chasing. John D. Rockefeller was once asked, how much money is enough money? And he said, Just a little bit more. That's the idea. If you keep chasing more and more and more, if you keep making your happiness conditional on some end something, you are never going to get it. You are going to run off a cliff that goes to nowhere scientifically. We actually have proof of this. Michael Norton is this Harvard Business School professor did this study where he went and asked a bunch of high net worth individuals worth anywhere from a million on through a hundred million plus, how happy are you on a scale of 1 to 10? Then he asked how much more money would you need to be at a 10? And across the board, whether people were worth a million or 100 million plus, they all said two to three times as much. It makes no sense, right? There should just be some number that is like the happiness number. But humans have a unique capacity for resetting the goalposts. And so that was the story you referenced of this friend of mine who, you know, rented out this boat to do this big celebration with his family. It was a yacht to celebrate the sale of his company. And they got there and he was so excited, felt so proud to create this moment, these memories for these people that he loved. And someone, as they were boarding his yacht, looked over at the one on the next mooring, which was much bigger, and said, wow, I wonder who's in that one. And my friend said that all of his pride and joy and excitement around creating this experience was deflated at the comparison to the other yacht. And it was a reminder of what I write in the book, which is there is always going to be a bigger boat. If you try to measure your own self worth on the basis of some financial thing, some money, some title, some bonus, you are never going to feel you are enough. I referenced this quote from one of my favorite childhood movies, Cool Runnings, where the coach, John Candy, the late John Candy, is talking to one of the players and is talking about the fact that he had won a gold medal. And the player is incredulous at the fact that he cannot just be happy like he, he won a gold medal, he did these things. And John Kennedy replies and says, a gold medal is a wonderful thing, but if you're not enough without it, you're never going to be enough with it. And that is the reminder we all need in our own lives with all of these things that we may want that we hype up as the destination, as the arrival, we need to remember that if we are not enough without those things, we are never going to be enough with them.
- [09:29]
And one of the things you Talk about. And I think that people maybe wouldn't know this. So they read it in your book the five Types of Wealth, along with the piece that this two to three times, which is so bizarre, Sahil, two to three times because you're like, well, for a millionaire they would say, well, 3 million would be enough, but for 100 millionaire, they would want 300 million. I mean, that's pretty wild how that works. So you learn that, you know, everyone's always like, I need more, I need more. You talk about your own personal story. I'm sure everybody listening can relate. You know, you're like, I hit all the markers. I was 30, I'd done all the things. But still feeling like, well, what's the next thing? But you also talked about this. You talked about these levels of wealth and you go up. I said, level one, level two. And you say, people think that when you get to the next level, you're not going to have any problems. And it's not true.
- [10:19]
The problems just change. You know, the interesting thing that happens as you accumulate more financial wealth is that you have this assumption that's hard grained in you, you know, hardwired into you rather from a young age, which is that money solves problems. And that is true. Money is very good at solving money problems, which are a specific type of problem. Those are the things that you experience in your early years, especially if you didn't grow up with a ton of money. All of the stresses that you maybe experienced as a child from, you know, money being tight in your household are things that can be solved by you making money in those early days. You know, stresses like paying bills like rent or like mortgage payments, like, you know, being able to afford basic needs, basic pleasures like not stressing about vacations or, you know, certain luxuries like that. Those are money problems that are very directly solved with money. But as you accumulate more financial wealth, as you come up the rungs where you are no longer worried about those earliest sort of basic needs and basic pleasures, it's not that you no longer have problems, it's just that the types of problems change and money no longer solves those more challenging problems. Money solves money problems, but in a vacuum, it can't solve much else. This is the reason you come across people with extraordinary financial wealth that are miserable. Right? That doesn't make sense. That breaks people's brains. When you are coming up the income curve or the wealth curve and you look at someone that has so much money and somehow they're miserable, maybe they Commit suicide. Maybe they're, you know, maybe you just find out about them having, like, massive depression. It makes no sense to you because you think, like, they have all of the things that I'm striving for. But the problems just change now. It becomes about identity, it becomes about purpose, and it becomes about the fact that relationships are very hard to maintain. All of these other things start to become issues, and money doesn't solve them. So unless you are building these other forms of wealth as you come up those curves, you are not going to find the level of fulfillment and joy that you thought was just going to be on the other side of the money.
- [12:26]
Oh, it's such a good book. It's already sold over a quarter of a million copies. It's so good. You wrote, to be satisfied with what one has. That bat is wealth. And this other part about understanding, we talked about this at the dinner table with our kids. We've got teens down to age 8. And so this has been a big conversation at our table about happiness. And our. Our kids definitely are like, well, if you got money, you're happy. So we've been talking with them about all these concepts in your book, and we talked about the different levels. And you say that when you go from one set of problems to the next, you're often going from problems that are relatable to other people to problems that sound ridiculous to other people. And so that actually kind of crosses over loneliness piece. If all of a sudden you have unrelatable problems that most people don't have and sound ridiculous to them, I feel like then that's harder to connect.
- [13:13]
This is a huge issue for a lot of people that, you know, achieve a level of financial success and financial wealth, but are feeling those struggles is that it becomes very lonely. No one wants to hear about your problems. I mean, look, I have. I played sports at a high level most of my life. I played Division 1 baseball. A bunch of my teammates and people that I knew went on to make a whole lot of money playing professionally. And a lot of those guys are now my age, mid-30s, and their sports careers are over. They made a bunch of money, but they need to figure out what to do for the next 50 years of their life. If that's how long life expectancy is. You can't do nothing just because you have a bunch of money and you could do nothing on paper and still feed your family. You have to do something because you need a reason to wake up in the morning, otherwise you're really going to struggle mentally And a lot of those people are having serious mental struggles. And I mean like depression, loneliness, all of these challenges, lack of purpose, lack of identity. You were attached to one thing your whole life and now it's gone. What do you go do? It is very difficult for you to go talk to your neighbor about that problem, to talk to your friend about that problem, who maybe the friend is living paycheck to paycheck or close to it, struggling to make ends meet. You just went and made $50 million. You can't go and complain to that friend. They are not going to want to hear those problems because they don't feel relatable in that way. Even if they are just as real. They're just a different type of problem that most people cannot relate to in that context. And so that further creates this negative, self fulfilling prophecy for a lot of people like that as well.
- [14:49]
It was very eye opening. Like with our kids talking about these things, it really got their wheels spinning. And I just think it's a phenomenal book, a great one to read with your family. You have this question, everybody should try and answer it. What would my enough life look like? I mean, I've never thought of it.
- [15:05]
Yeah, I mean this is, this idea of enough life to me is one of the most important concepts for everyone to really think about. So when I talk about enough, the tendency is for people to think that that means something Spartan or bear. Like, okay, my enough life, well, I can put food on the table. That's enough. I don't mean for it to be that way. Your enough life could have two houses. Your enough life could have travel all over the world. Your enough life is about you. It doesn't matter about what anyone else thinks it should look like. It's about what you actually want to build towards. My enough life does have two houses because I want to be able to create a life where I can entertain and bring people together to create amazing experiences with people I love that matters to me. I don't care about watches, I don't care about cars, I don't care about private jets. I'm not going to do any of those things. I would love to be able to have two houses where I could bring people together for meaningful experiences. Defining what that enough life looks like to you is really important because having a clear picture of the life is what stops you from doing this natural 2-3-x thing that we talked about earlier. Numbers tend to do that 2 to 3x thing. But an actual life, a vision of what the life looks like doesn't have that natural inflation, the 2 to 3x that numbers tend to have.
- [16:26]
Okay, true story.
- [16:28]
Jenny Urich
Once the temps started rising, I realized I was right back in my same old rotation. You know the one that worn out.
- [16:34]
Sahil Bloom
Tank top and those overworked shorts.
- [16:36]
Jenny Urich
So I finally gave my daily uniform a little upgrade with Quince. Let me tell you, this brand gets it. Quince has pieces that are simple, elevated and somehow make you feel totally put together with without even trying. I've been absolutely loving the 100% European linen shorts and dress I got, which I paired up with their super cute Italian leather platform sandals for some of my speaking engagements this spring. It is all beautiful, breathable and built for real life. And here's the best part. Quint costs 50 to 80% less than similar brands. How they work directly with top artisans and cut out the middlemen so you get luxury without the crazy markup. Plus everything is made in safe, ethical factories using premium fabrics and finishes. Feel good, look good. It's a win win. Treat your closet to a little summer glow up with quince. Go to quince.com outside for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com outside to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com outside go ahead your summer self. Well, thank you. You know that feeling when you're standing in the snack aisle squinting at a label that says Natural flavors but gives you zero clue what that actually means? Yeah, I was so over that. That is why I love Thrive Market. My go to online grocery store for getting all of my healthy essentials delivered right to my door. No crowds, no label confusion and no junk. Thrive market bans over 1,000 harmful ingredients so I know I'm getting clean products without having to turn into a nutritionist. Their Healthy Swaps scanner is a game changer. I just scan a product I used to buy and it recommends a cleaner version instantly. I've swapped out sugary snacks for simple mills, crackers, chomps, beef sticks and lesser evil popcorn. And guess what? My kids don't even know the difference. In fact, they love the products from Thrive Market even more. Plus I love their Buy it Again feature. It makes reordering our favorite items super easy. And since I can't always find the things I want locally, throwing Thrive makes it stress free with auto ship. Go check them out. You're going to be hooked. Ready to make the switch? Go to thrive market.com 1000hours for 30%.
- [18:45]
Sahil Bloom
Off your first order plus a free $60 gift.
- [18:48]
Jenny Urich
That's T H R I V market.com 1000hours thrive market.com 1000hours.
- [18:58]
Sahil Bloom
This episode is brought to you by a company I genuinely love so much and Active Skin Repair. As a mom of five and someone who spends a lot of time outside, bumps, scrapes and the occasional odd rash come with the territory. That's why I'm so grateful for Active Skin Repair, an all natural, non toxic solution that helps our skin do what it was made to do heal. Whether it's a skin knee, a bug bite, a rash, or just a little bit too much sun, this one product does it all. It mimics your body's natural healing process to soothe irritation, reduce inflammation, and support recovery without any harsh chemicals. Safe for kids, safe for adults, and even safe for sensitive skin. And here's what makes me love it more Active Skin Repair is a proud 1% for the planet member. That means 1% of every sale goes to grassroots organizations protecting wildlands and restoring marine ecosystems through partners like the Conservation alliance and ctrees. So if you're spending more time outdoors, and I hope you are, check them out. Visit activeskinrepair.com to learn more about Active Skin Repair and their commitment to 1% for the planet and use GO1000 hours to save 20% on all active Skin Repair products. Let's heal ourselves and the planet together.
- [20:14]
So let's talk about these time graphs. I've seen people post them. I posted one once and I I mean it is really striking. You have these time graphs that show your age and how much time you're spending with different types of people. The implications are really interesting. Coworkers is one. Your kids, your spouse, your time alone. That's one of the graphs in there. So I thought the implications were super interesting. Can you talk about A lot of parents listen in about and this is something I've said for a long time. I've never felt like you get 18 full summers and people I know people are like that's cliche and stop talking about it. And people feel stressed out. But I want to make it more stressful because I've always been like, well do you really get 18 good summers with your kids? Like no, the first three, they're not potty trained and you know you're nervous that they're going to drown and you know they're crying all the time and then it changes a little bit and then by the time they're 14, they want to be with their friends. So. Or they're going to get a job at 15, they've got a boyfriend, they've got a girlfriend. So this window of time is short and you talk about that in this book. Can you give a message to parents?
- [21:23]
There's so much I could say on this. I mean, I'm in the middle of this. I have a son, one son who's about to turn three years old. I hope to have more children in the future. The statistics are cold and jarring. 95% of the time you have with your kids is gone by the time they turn 18, 75% is gone by the time they turn 12. So to your point, it is striking to think about the fact that for 10 years you are your child's favorite person in the entire world. And after that they have new favorite people, they have friends, best friends, boyfriends, girlfriends, partner, spouses of their own, children of their own. And you will never occupy that same place in their world. And yet in traditional culture, that 10 year window coincides with the period of time when you are told to be chasing every single more that the world tells you you should want. Every promotion, every bonus, every work trip, every dinner out late, all of those things. And to be able to think with your own eyes wide open about what trade offs you are willing to make. What is the price of all of those things that you are chasing so that you can come to your own decision around where to navigate and how to navigate that tension and balance. That is the fundamental question that we all need to face as parents. I mean, I got a text from one of my dear friends the other day who has a 8 year old son and he told me for the first time my son didn't want to hold my hand walking up to school. You know, he walked him to school every day and he was like, it felt like a turning point, like he wanted to run off and go to his friends. And he asked me like, oh dad, do I have to hold your hand? Or like my friends are here, can I run ahead? And you know, it's a coming of age, it's a beautiful thing to some extent, but it's sad because it's a reminder. He's 8 years old. That could have been. There is a last time that your child will want to hold your hand walking to school. There is a last time that your kid is going to want to get into bed because of a nightmare and sleep with you in bed. I don't do that with my parents anymore. There was at some point, some last time when I came into their room. They probably were really annoyed being woke up in the middle of the night when I did that. And it was the last time I did it. And that reminder, I write about that in the book that Sam Harris, the philosopher, has talked about this. This idea that there's a last time for all of these things that you're experiencing should be a call to arms to appreciate the present moment around these moments that we create with the people that we love. It's your kids, but it's also your parents who are getting older. It's also your friends who you're not going to see as much. It's your siblings who you maybe aren't as close with as you used to be. All of these things, there is going to be a last time you're going to experience them. And at the end of the day, those relationships are what create the texture of a life well lived. It's not the money. It is not the extra dollar that you earn from staying late in the office. It is not those things. It is the relationships.
- [24:26]
And I like that you really focus on the fact that this is hard because you say, and I feel that way. It's like they coincide. It's like you've got these kids and you got to pay for their basketball shoes at the same time that you want to spend time with them. So it is a balance there. But you talk about how, I guess I want to say this. I like how you talk about the value of the work, too. You talk about both. It's like it's good for kids to see parents that work hard, not that you're just kind of sitting around all the time. So you say seeing the people that you love work hard on things is an important thing that they're going to remember. But also you want to be present. And you had. I got chills at this sentence. It is a bad trade to be special rather than happy. That's what people are doing when they choose the 14th hour of work before the first hour with their children. So you're really showing, especially in this day and age with the more, more, more two to three times more, that it's not about not working, but it's about really making sure that you prioritize that devastatingly short window during which you are your child's entire world. So the graphs are really meaningful. The other one that really stuck out to me, Sahil, that I think is really pertinent to this audience because we are creating space in our life. There's a lot more boredom when you're Getting outside and you're setting the screens aside and that type of thing. Your time alone really increases as life goes on. And I was surprised to see that and thought there's a lot of implications there because it's. If you don't enjoy being with yourself, you've got a lot of time to be alone, a lot more time to be alone as you get older.
- [25:59]
Yeah, the. I think it was Blaise Pascal that said all of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit in a room alone. We are increasingly terrified of boredom as a species and in modern society, I think about the number of times you would have been bored that you otherwise grab your phone and just scroll on something. You know, people don't go to the bathroom without having their phone with them. Right. Like I do it. Right. It's just. It has become the default state is to have our phone scrolling something. We have an inability to be bored. And unfortunately that boredom actually creates a lot of upside in our life. It is where you have your most creative ideas. It's where you allow that space for thoughts to mingle, for new insights to be sparked. And we don't create enough space for that. So the fear that I have for most people, for myself included, is that chart of the amount of time you spend alone over the course of your life. It is going to be increasing. But if that alone time is increasingly infiltrated by millions of strangers through your phone and through social media, it is the worst kind of alone time that you can have. If you were to map your own unhappiness over the course of a day or over the course of a week, I would guess that a lot of your unhappiness comes from social media and the news. I would guess those are two things which are two primary activities that people are doing when they're scrolling on their phone. And so just think about, how can I retrain my mind a little bit? How can I adjust my information diet, if you will? Because the quality of your outputs is based on the quality of your inputs. We know that when it comes to health, like if I eat a whole bunch of junk and processed foods, I'm not going to feel very good, I'm going to get sick, my body's not going to be healthy. Same exact thing applies to your mind. If you are inputting a whole ton of junk information and things that make you feel envious or jealous or negative on a daily basis, scared those things are going to impact how you feel and how your life develops.
- [27:57]
Gosh, it's Such good stuff to think about. And we're seeing that chart was really, really eye opening. Like, okay, all right. Time with my kids, that's decreasing. Times with my co workers, that's decreasing. What's on the up and up? Time by myself. So it's important. This book is, you know, it's like almost 400 pages of fantastic information coming into the summer. If you've got kids that are, you know, 10, 12 or older, you want to read this with them because you also give really good career advice. Building storytelling skills was one. And having a reputation for being the type of person that can figure things out. I mean, these have really sparked phenomenal conversations in our home. Dive through every cracked open door. You're going to get so much out of this book. It's called the Five Types of Wealth. But I want to talk about this because this is another thing that was so striking, was that your grandpa built a house for him and your grandma in a cul de sac near their friends. Goodness, is that one of the most loving things to do?
- [28:52]
Yeah, this is, this is one of those old fashioned things that needs to come back in style. This used to be a big thing. Like, you know, you would, you would sort of live near friends and that was, you know, communities. That was how you fostered connection and you knew that your people were taken care of after you might be gone. And that was the real genesis of it for my grandfather and his few friends. They were all kind of part of the science community in India. They were all professors and they built these small, humble houses on the end of this little cul de sac. And they all did proceed to be outlived by their wives. And it was the most beautiful thing because after they all passed, the others rallied around the widow and there was a community. And I really, I really mean it when I say that from the time my grandfather passed away in 2005 until Covid started in 2020, my grandmother did not go a single day without having someone come and call on her. Someone come and spend time with her, read with her, chat with her, have lunch with her every single day. She had real meaningful social connection. And over those years, 15 years, she did not age very much. Covid hit India, gets locked down. My grandmother, over the course of 18 months of lockdowns in India, probably aged 20 years. I cannot describe how impactful, negatively that loneliness was on her health, her physical health and well being. We have science to support that now. We understand loneliness is worse for you than smoking or drinking, than abusing cigarettes. And Alcohol, it is worse. And that is something that needs to be talked about a lot more than it is that investing in meaningful social connection, taking actions that prioritize social connection rather than, you know, financial gain, is something that feels weird in the modern era, but actually aligns with the science of what it means to live a good life. I mean, as a society, this is just something I could rant on this for forever. Because we look around and we celebrate and admire examples of success stories. I'm putting success stories in quotes of men who have made hundreds of millions, maybe billions of dollars that we pat on the back and we celebrate them and we admire them and we ignore the fact that they have three ex wives and four kids that don't talk to them. And we write books about those people. We tell them that they won the game and you as an individual and all of us need to decide for ourselves. Is that actually a game that I care to win? Because for me the answer was no. That is not what I define as a good life. There are so many things in life that we understand the list price. We understand the hard work it would require to go and do those things. The late nights, all of the work, all of the energy, the effort to go build these big things, to make all this money. But we very rarely think about the real price, which includes all of the other trade offs and sacrifices that a lot of these people made. The relationships lost, the health, the stress, all of these other impacts. And there are a lot of things in life that may look like a good deal based on the list price, but they're a ripoff when you think about the real price and eyes wide open about what the real price is. Such an important mental model for making better decisions on your own journey.
- [32:24]
You know, it, it seems so loving to think, well, first of all, he's like doing something for his wife for when he knows he's probably not gonna be around anymore. I thought that is one of the most loving things that you could ever do. And then you also talk about this episodic, I think that's how you pronounce it, future thinking. You're talking about that with your physical body too, your physical wealth. But to have that wherewithal to think, gosh, I might not be around. And what would be the thing that would be most supportive of my wife? It would be that she's in this cul de sac with her dear friends. And you talk how people have heard this, but like loneliness is worse for your health than smoking and regular use of tobacco Alcohol. And it's like, well, everybody's had the time when they go to the doctor, and the doctor's like, do you smoke? Do you drink? But they never say, do you have friends? Do you live in a cul de sac with a couple people that you really love to be around? It was so striking. And it's your own grandpa. Like, what a man.
- [33:15]
Yeah, we do need to. I mean, that is the entire reason that I wrote this book, is because I think that we need to expand the scoreboard, if you will, for how we think about measuring our own lives. You know, if what you measure really matters, because the things that you measure end up being the things that you focus on and try to build around and grow. And historically, money has been the only thing that we've measured about our lives. It was the sole focus. It was the way that we defined our entire worth as human beings. And unfortunately, it is not the only thing that contributes to a good life. It is part of a good life. But the blind pursuit of that one battle of making money can actually lead you into losing the much bigger picture war and measuring for the right things. Measuring your social wealth, measuring your mental health, all of these other things. Then you are able to win these battles and win the much bigger picture war of living that good life that you were striving for.
- [34:11]
So then talking about relationships and your relational wealth, your social wealth, you have. I mean, this is such an important book for I. I cannot tell you. So Your son is 2. Our oldest is 16. I was like, we have to talk about all of these things because he's just right on the cusp of adulthood, and it was surprising to heal. I mean, even with our family, like, we're trying to get outside, we do things a little differently. And, you know, he was definitely singing the. The money song. Like, oh, yeah, you know, if you make this. And. And I was like, oh, no, you're probably misguided in some of this, and I don't even know where that messaging totally came from. And so when you're talking about social wealth, this is like the teaching that people don't get in school, right? It's like you get the teaching of science and chemistry, and this is like, no, no. Here's how you have a conversation. This is what you need to know. They say the competency of the future is relationships in terms of jobs and things. So you talk about this stop sign. It's so good for parenting. Stop sign versus doorknob types of questions. Can you talk about that?
- [35:13]
Yeah, this is My favorite for thinking about conversations, you know, but with your kids, with your family, with, you know, potential professional networks. I am naturally something of a socially anxious person. I don't think of myself as someone who just thrives in a big social setting. And so I've always looked for little tricks or tips that allow you to be more effective in these conversations. This is the one that I think is the absolute best, which is this idea that most questions people ask are stop signs, meaning the answer they invite is an answer that halts the progress of a conversation. It is asking a question like, where did you get married? The person is going to answer that with a location. It is a stop sign. They say the location. That is the answer to the question. You have to now come up with something else if you want to keep the conversation moving. The alternative to a stop sign question is a doorknob question. The idea there is that as the person is responding, they are opening a doorknob and walking through the door with a story. It invites a story in response. So for that same question asking someone, where did you get married? The doorknob version of that question could be, how did you choose where you got married? It's the same general question, but it fundamentally changes the way the person responds. Rather than just saying, oh, Sahil, I got married in Boston. I would say, well, I grew up in Boston. My wife always had these dreams of a winter wedding at the Fairmont in Boston. It was this thing, like her childhood fairy tale dream. And so when we decided to get married and we wanted to do it in winter, it was just such an easy decision to do it there. Now all of a sudden, the conversation has momentum. I just said 30 seconds. Responding that you have all these opportunities to grab onto, to go deeper on these things. Oh, that's such an interesting thing. So did you know your wife growing up, you know, did you always plan on a winter wedding? Because that's a little bit different. There's all sorts of things that you can now latch onto rather than just having the stop sign, which puts you into sort of defense mode. And so I've just always thought that that was an interesting framing for how to approach these conversations.
- [37:18]
Okay, that's so good. And I also. I think it relates to. Because you're giving career advice. In talking about this, building reputation for figuring things out, you wrote, there's nothing more valuable than. Than someone who can just figure it out. I mean, it is so true. P.E. you say, if you do that, people will fight over you. And then I talked about earlier, dive through every cracked open door. And you say, if a door cracks open, that might present an opportunity. Dive through it. It doesn't matter if the opportunity is exactly what you want. Become useful now, the opportunities will appear later. And you are. Every great story starts with a tiny crack. So spot it and dive through. And you talk about building storytelling skills. And this is how you do it. You do it around your dinner table by asking these doorknob type questions. And the book has so many options of them. So then you want to have it on your shelf. I mean, you could keep this right by your dinner table. And it's got conversation starters, conversation developers. It just goes on and on. How to be a good listener. And then there's another page of them. There's a list of engaging questions on page 183.
- [38:22]
I need to hire you. I need to hire you as like an advocate. You're gonna listen. This is the best.
- [38:27]
Well, you don't, because it's already sold a quarter of a million copies. It's just a really, really needed book. It's a needed book and it's needed for the adults who read them. Right? It's needed for the adult because the adult is in the poverty of more situation. But it's also needed as a teaching tool within the family.
- [38:45]
I agree with that. I hoped when I wrote it that it would end up being a resource that was really useful for a lot of young people just as much as people who are later on in life. And I completely agree. I mean, I think it's an incredible tool for conversation with your kids to see what they're thinking about, what they're doing, what they're getting interested in, like all of these things that you're talking about. I totally agree with you.
- [39:06]
I mean, even just this one little piece of advice, like, if you're. Because we're really in this spot, like we're about to launch a child into the world. Like, what do you hope they know? What do you hope you've passed on? And to say to them, you know what's not really a good question?
- [39:18]
What?
- [39:18]
What do you do? Because that's what everybody does. Hi, I'm so and so, what do you do? What do you do? And you're like, no, it's not a good question. First of all, they might hate what they do, you know, and second of all, it's a canned answer. People, they respond without thinking about it because they've said it so many times. So all of these things are so important for, I think, quality of life. It's such a good book. So I don't need to be your hype person because it's in the airport. It's in the airport, so everybody knows it's good and it's just a really, really, really good book.
- [39:49]
Sometimes I catch myself staring at my kids and wondering what their futures will look like. And then, bam. One of them yells, they're starving. And just like that, I'm snapped right back into reality. But seriously, what will their futures look like if I'm not here? It's a hard question, but one we all need to consider.
- [40:06]
That's right.
- [40:06]
I want to tell you about Select Quote. They make finding life insurance simple, fast and affordable. Select Quote is one of America's leading insurance brokers with nearly 40 years of experience helping over 2 million families find the right coverage in just 15 minutes. A licensed Select Quote agent can match you with a policy tailored to your family's needs and budget. And get this. Some policies cost less than a dollar a day with no medical exam required for those in good health. So if life has felt too busy to think about insurance, or if you've been putting it off because of the cost, don't wait. Get the right life insurance for your family for less@SelectQuote.com 1000 hours. Go to SelectQuote.com 1000 hours today to get started. That's SelectQuote.com 1000 hours select quote they shop, you save. Okay, can we just be honest for a second? Health insurance is a mess. I mean, since 2000, wages have gone up 54%. But insurance premiums? They're up 200%. That's four times faster. And even when you have coverage, one in five in network claims still get denied. What even is the point? So if you're out there without health insurance, I see you. Seriously, you've managed to dodge the premiums, the paperwork, the we regret to inform you letters. That's not lazy. That's savvy. But as a mom, I also know how fast things can go sideways. A car accident, a weird test result. One moment and suddenly you're buried in bills with no way out. That's why I want to tell you about crowd health. It's not insurance. It's something completely different. Crowd health is a community of health conscious people who help each other when it counts. No networks, no premiums, no fine print. Just people supporting people. You've made it this far on your own. Now here's your off ramp. Before things go wrong, get started today for just $99 per month for your first three months by using code 1000hours@joincrowdhealth.com Crowd health is not insurance. Learn more at joincrowdhealth.com that's joincrowdhealth.com and use code 1000hours.
- [42:15]
Unknown
Member week is here at Lowe's. Don't miss your chance to get up to 40% off hundreds of items like paint, outdoor and home essentials and more shop. Our exclusive deals happen, happening in store and online now through May 14th. Not a rewards member. Join for free today and get ready to save more. Lowe's we help you save loyalty program subject to terms and conditions details@lowe's.com terms subject to change.
- [42:44]
Sahil Bloom
Okay, holding off doesn't work. It doesn't always work. So we're talking about waiting for happiness, which is, I think, something that we succumb to as people. And what you say, and I think this is so important, is there's a false assumption that you know you're going to be working, working, working, and you'll invest in relationships when you're 40. You're going to be working, working, working. You're going to invest in your health when you're 62. And so you talk about this false assumption of future opportunity. Can you talk about why that is such a false statement? I don't know if that was a really bad question. I messed up where I was going.
- [43:21]
Later is the most dangerous word in the dictionary. I'll simplify it down to that. We constantly use the word later when it comes to these things in life. We say, I'll spend more time with my kids later. I will focus on my health later. I'll invest more in my partner and my relationships later. I'll find my freedom and purpose later. And the sad thing is that later just becomes another word for never, because those things will not exist in the same way later. Your kids are not going to be five years old later. Your spouse, your friends won't be there for you later if you're not there for them now. Your health will not be there for you later. If you don't invest in it now, you won't magically wake up with freedom and purpose later. So either you find a way to design those things into your life in some tiny way right now, or. Or you're just going to end up regretting it later. My grandfather, ever the wise man, used to say to me, later, we'll all be dead. And while morbid, it is very true.
- [44:24]
Well, wait, but he really was thinking that way. Yeah, he was Thinking in a futuristic way. This is the same grandpa that built those.
- [44:30]
Same grandpa.
- [44:31]
Wow.
- [44:32]
Yeah. You know, I think that that follows with a lot of like stoic philosophy as well, which he was a big fan of ancient wisdom. And it is true, you know, we. We always think we're going to have more time. And that fundamental tension of needing to balance the fact that we want to think long term, we do it long term. Thinking is a great thing. But at the same time, we need to act with urgency because there's not always going to be more time. And especially for these magical windows that we get with certain people. I mean, if I decided that I was going to take some job that was going to have me traveling 300 nights out of the year for $10 million a year, right now I would be giving up the only five year window that I am ever going to have with my son. Right. I would literally be giving that up. And so like this summer, my definition of a wealthy life is being able to take my son in the pool at 1pm on a Tuesday. I cannot capture it any better than that.
- [45:29]
Is that your life raiser?
- [45:31]
That is my. I mean, I guess you could. I could call it my life raiser. For me, my life raiser is that I will coach my son's sports teams. Just similar idea. Like I have the time, freedom in order to do that. I am healthy enough, I have the relationship with him to do that. You know, I'm someone that people are proud to have around in the community in that way. But to me, to go and give up these windows of time that we have in search of something like, I don't need $10 million a year to be able to go in the pool with my son at 1pm on a Tuesday. I can already do that. And so if we lose sight of that, if we lose sight of the fact that we are already living out what we dreamed of and that going and chasing more and more and more might actually pull us away from the thing that we really wanted. We need to recognize that in the present.
- [46:17]
Yes. This is so good. I brought up that phrase life razor, which I learned it from your book. Did you make that up?
- [46:23]
Yeah.
- [46:23]
Okay, so that's. Okay. So people, if they haven't read the book, then they haven't heard that phrase before. Liferaiser. And this was very striking too, because this is like a statement that you make about yourself. Yours was, I will coach my son's sports teams. And it seems simple, but also there's a lot packed in there. Like you Said you'd have to have flexibility of time and schedule, you've got to be around and that type of thing. And so you think that it's too simple to make a difference. And you gave this example of a man and then you give a bunch of examples. I actually really love this part of the book because you gave all these examples of different people in different stages of life. And what does this statement? And I have not really been able to figure out mine, but I've been thinking about it. But this man is like a high up businessman. And obviously like you talked about, it's like a lot of times when there's divorce and there's fractured relationships with children and that type of thing. And he basically says he has this non negotiable statement that he's going to be at Tuesday dinner. That's it. That's his definition of success. This is it. This is the life razor. Okay. It's seven words. I will never miss a Tuesday dinner. Like, okay, that doesn't seem like that much. But it really, when you distill it down to that, you're like, oh my gosh, it shows that you can prioritize. And then there was something funny where he says, if there is a crisis, we gotta wrap it up by 5. So this is a non negotiable thing. I'm always gonna be Tuesday dinner with my wife. Can you talk about. I don't think that people do this. First of all, you talk about the importance of doing it and how it would affect everything. And then you say, I'm, I'm blabbing. I just really like the book. But you also say you can change it, you know, you can change it at different times. Yeah.
- [47:57]
The idea in essence is to just have a identity defining statement for your life. Sort of a statement that clarifies how your ideal self shows up in the world during this present season of your life. That statement for me is, I will coach my son's sports teams. Not because it has anything directly to do with sports. My son is almost three years old, he's not on any sports teams yet. It has everything to do with what that means to me about who I am and how that person shows up in the world. It's the type of person that creates boundaries to be there around family. It's the type of person who prioritizes his relationships with people, who is a strong community member, who never jeopardizes his integrity or morals to chase money and other things, who builds the relationship with his son that his son wants to have him around at these things and what that does. If I have that in front of me, I will coach my son's sports teams. Anytime some new chaos or opportunity enters my life, I can ask myself, what would the type of person who coaches his son's sports teams do in this situation? That is a really powerful thing. Because now asking that question, I can then act as that ideal self in the world. I don't need to leave it to chance. I can actually envision, okay, what does that person do? I'm going to tap into my ideal self when I go make this important decision. That is something that is all about awareness and action. It's like pulling my awareness of who my ideal self is into that present moment so then I can go and act on it.
- [49:29]
Because if you have an opportunity that's a really good one that causes you to have tons of work travel, that life razor would keep you on the path that you want to be on. Some people might like work travel, or they might not have kids, so they don't care about traveling for work. But you're like, well, that would make it so that it would be really hard for me to coach the sports team. And it really informs all of your decisions. It affects all of these decisions that you make. I mean, these are really, really good. Some of the examples were, I wake up early and do hard things. I always tuck my kids into bed. I never let a friend cry alone. And you go through all of these different examples of different people. You know, this is a mid-30s entrepreneur. This is a mid-60s retiree. This is a mid-30s stay at home mom. I'm a caregiver. I am the mother I wish I had when I was growing up. I always have energy for my kids. No matter how tired I am, I'm in a season where I prioritize their growth and development. I always tuck my kids into bed is my life raiser. That's good stuff.
- [50:23]
I love these.
- [50:24]
I'm like, how can one book have so much good stuff in it?
- [50:28]
I mean, I really tried. Like, I'm so glad it comes across to you as you read it, because, you know, I really tried when I wrote it to capture a lot of different things into a single book. Like, you know, one of my sort of lamentations about the broader, like, personal development book industry is that publishers really try to push you to write a very narrow concept for a book. You know, even, like, when I pitched this book, a lot of the publishers said no because they thought it was too broad.
- [50:58]
Oh, no. It's in the airport.
- [51:01]
Yeah, well, I mean, like, I wanted it to pull all these things together, but it was very difficult to convince people that I could do that. They want you to write, like, write a book on just social wealth and you make the like narrow 200 page book on that. And I really wanted it to pull together all of these areas of life. And so I'm thrilled that that comes across to you and that you're finding value in all the different areas in that way.
- [51:22]
Do you ever wonder if the publishers are like, whoops.
- [51:27]
You know, I, I don't know about the publishers. You know, there was an agent who turned down the book when I first pitched it, who I would guess feels that way because it ended up being successful. But look like that's. They didn't try to make a decision that didn't work out. I totally understand why it didn't make sense to them and I think very highly of all of these people. But it is just funny because the incentives of the entire industry are to push people into the very narrow, you know, kind of like simple nonfiction personal development idea. And it's good sometimes to push back if that's not what your vision is.
- [52:01]
Jenny Urich
Yeah, yeah.
- [52:02]
Sahil Bloom
It's in the airport and it's hitting the pinnacle. You talk about your funeral, front row people, which I thought was really thought provoking. Who's going to be the front row in your funeral? And you say this, I think big sentence, be one to someone else. Be one to someone else. I was curious about this. That was just a random thing. It was in my notes and I didn't want to skip it. There's a lot in there about your funeral front row people. You have these hacks in the different chapters where you talk about like social wealth hacks. I wish I knew at 22 and one of them is my favorites actually. Don't focus on looks and status in others. Good teeth and a high paying job. Don't predict faithfulness and kindness. Seek out evidence of the two latter traits, which I love that it said good teeth because we watch Survivor as a family and everyone on Survivor has good teeth. We always talk about it and I don't even know if they do. Like that's how they pick their people that go on Survivor. But I just love that it said good. Good teeth and a high paying job. Don't predict faithfulness and kindness. But here's what I was curious about with these different hack pages. How did you choose the person to collaborate with?
- [53:08]
I'm a big believer in just Asking people you admire to, you know, work with you, support you, spend time with you on different things. Like, I'm a big believer in just this idea, especially as a young person, that, like, closed mouths don't get fed. And I've had these people that I've read and admired their work for many years. Arthur Brooks and Susan Cain are two of those people. And I kind of just figured, like, what's the worst that happens if I ask one of these people to collaborate with me on one of these lists? They say no or they can't do it or whatever, and we move on, and that's that. And fortunately, both of them, along with Ramit Sethi and the in the financial wealth section, were willing to Ends up creating this incredible connection and bond. You know, like, I can count all those people as mentors and friends. Now, Arthur, who is the one that you're referencing in the social wealth section, is really one of the most thoughtful scientists and rigorous scientists when it comes to happiness in the world, has had a long, long career and is in some sense just beginning in terms of his influence and impact. And so it's very cool to me also to have been a conduit for some of his ideas to be shared more broadly beyond what's normally done.
- [54:19]
And then they wrote the endorsements right on the back.
- [54:21]
Exactly.
- [54:21]
What a thing. Goodness, is this wonderful? It's such a great book. Even those pages, you know, you sit down with your kids, go through one each night, you know, in July or something. It can be your summer thing that you talk about at dinner. I want to end with the math. I like math. I have a math degree. You wrote, it was the math that changed my life. This is actually where the book really draws you in. Like, from page one, you're just really hooked. It's really impressive. I mean, my first page is my first page. And I don't know if you can see, it's, like, blurry, but it says, oh, my gosh, what an opening line. Wow, I've got all these things underlined. And I just put. It's such a strong first page of an opening of a book. It's math. And the math is that you only have a certain amount of times to do certain things. And in this case, it was a certain amount of time that you would maybe see your parents because you didn't live close by, and you see them a couple times a year, and they're this age. It's just math. And you talked about your own dad, which I actually love this. He would Come home for dinner. Play catch with me outside. This is how I grew up. Then work late once I went to bed. So your dad modeled this. He modeled prioritizing relationships. And now you're in this sort of flip flop spot where they're aging and someone says to you, you're only going to see your parents 15 more times before they die. It's pretty remarkable, that one conversation. And that's a pretty bold, brave thing to say, whoever said that to you, right? I mean, it's a little, it's morbid and it's, it's not floofy, fluffy. You know, we talk about so many surface level things that that one conversation got a book into the airport. I mean, it's pretty incredible. Can you just talk about that initial conversation that you had? We're sort of wrapping up here about how your friend responded that, you know, you're like, well, I'm busy, I'm busy, I'm busy. And he's like, I'm making time for important things instead of saying, I'm busy.
- [56:11]
Yeah. I mean, that conversation was the entire inflection point in my life and in my journey. I had spent the first seven years of my career chasing all of the things you're told will lead to a good life, namely money and status. And I had started to see all of these other areas of my life suffering. And leading into that conversation, I'd started to have this sensation that from the outside looking in, it seemed like I was winning the game. But if that was what winning felt like, I had to be playing the wrong game. And that conversation was the turning point. I mean, it was the punch in the gut that sometimes you really need in life. And I went home and told my wife that I thought we needed to make a change and that we needed to reevaluate what our center really was, what we wanted to build our life around, what our true north was. And within 45 days, I had left my job, we had sold our house in California, and we had moved 3,000 miles across the country to live closer to both of our sets of parents. And in that one decision was a really impactful realization, which is you are in much more control of your time than you think. We had taken an action and created time that number 15 more times before they die. It's now in the hundreds. I see my parents multiple times a month. As soon as I get off this call, we're driving back to their house to spend the weekend with them for my son's birthday and for mother's Day we took an action and created time. And that realization was the spark that changed everything. That was the catalyst to realize that your life is yours to create. You do not have to consent or accept these defaults that have been handed to you about what should matter, about what mountains you should climb, what races you should run. You get to define what matters to you, and then you can go take actions to build your life around those things.
- [57:58]
If you have any sort of, like, curriculum you're doing with your family, it's a weird thing to say, but, you know, it's like we're trying to pass on values and virtues and important lessons about life to our kids. Like, what's happening in the. In the walls of your own home. Like, to me, this is the book. Like, this could be the curriculum for your family in terms of imparting such important messages that go against the cultural push toward money. Money, money, wealth, wealth, wealth, status, status, status. And you had this one sentence that was so striking because you talk about this friend you had as a kid, and I think everybody can relate to this. Like, you had the rich friend, the friend that had all the video games, the friend that had the best shoes, the friend that had all the clothes and. And he got all of it, the sports equipment. And you said, I never questioned whether all that stuff actually made him happy, whether he would trade the chef prepared dinner he ate alone for a takeout meal at a table surrounded by love. These are the important conversations that we need to be having with ourselves, but also with our children as they grow. This is a phenomenal book. I couldn't recommend it more highly. Also, if you're at the airport, you can get a copy of it. It's called the five types of wealth. A transformative guide to design your dream life. Sahil, what an honor. We always end our show with the same question. What's a favorite memory from your childhood that was outside?
- [59:09]
Oh, so many. I mean, my. My entire childhood was spent outside playing baseball, often with my dad and with my friends. Basically all of my memories from my childhood are doing something like that. My parents had a little cottage in Connecticut where we would spend most of the summers. And there was no television. And I would basically like, wake up in the morning, brush my teeth maybe half the time, and then just run outside and spend the whole day with my friends, with my dad when he was around, you know, just playing, playing sports, swimming, doing all sorts of things. So I was very lucky in that regard. And I hope my son gets to have a similar experience.
- [59:49]
Yeah, wow. No television. That's incredible. Thank you. Thank you for sharing your story. You know, talk about the importance of storytelling and you've shared your story and hearing it. So compelling. And this is a life, life, life changing read for people. Thanks for being here.
- [60:03]
Thank you so much for having me.
- [60:08]
Unknown
Are you hungry for guidance about mindset, relationships, health, finances, career decisions, and dealing with your past? I'm Trey Tucker, licensed therapist and speaker and host of Rugged, a podcast where I help young men and women navigate life's challenges and find solutions to help them live lives of service and meaning. In this podcast, you'll learn mindset strategies to harness your thoughts and emotions in ways that help you achieve your goals. I bring a blend of straight talk and empathy, and I'm open to addressing any topic and treating it and the people connected to it with respect and curiosity. Come join us. We have a space for you. Search for Rugged with Trey Tucker wherever you listen to podcasts and make sure to hit the follow button so new weekly episodes will be delivered straight to your personal podcast feed. My hope is that this podcast will leave you feeling encouraged and empowered to take charge of your life and close the gap between who you are and who you want to be.
- [61:10]
Hi dear one. I'm Dr. Edie Wadsworth, your new favorite Christian life coach, and I want to invite you to the House of Joy podcast. If you're a woman over 40 or the daughter of one who wants to build a positive mindset, healthier habits and thriving relationships, this is the show for you. We talk about personal growth, faith resilience, and creating a life you're obsessed with. So if you're tired of feeling stuck and ready to step into more joy and purpose, come join us. Listen now wherever you get your podcast.