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The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast
1KHO 491: Jon Acuff Greatest Hits - Courage, Goals, and the Gift of Starting Again
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- [00:01]
Jenny Urich
This episode is brought to you by Hay Day. Feeling stressed? Take a moment for yourself with Hay Day. Stroll through rows of golden wheat, tend to cute Barnard animals, and discover the joys of a digital farm retreat. You don't have to hop in a car or catch a plane. Escape to the farm at the tap of a finger. With Hay Day, you're not just tending to a farm, you're tending to yourself. Hay Day Search Hay Day that's H a y D a y in your favorite app store. Hay Day is a free to play mobile game and offers optional in app purchases and random rewards welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Jenny Urich. I'm the founder of 1000 Hours Outside and I would like to welcome you to a very special summer edition of the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. Today we're doing something we have never done before, a mashup episode featuring highlights from all six of John Acuff's appearances on the podcast. We're going to be doing one mashup episode each week, top encourage and inspire you from some of your favorite guests. John Acuff is one of our most popular guests and for good reason. He's hilarious, honest, and full of practical wisdom on parenting, mindset, resilience, and living with purpose. So whether you're tuning in from a backyard hammock or a summer hike, or a walk around the block or sitting beachside or on a road trip, this episode is packed with motivation and laughter for wherever life has you. Today we are kicking things off with the theme John Acuff talks a lot about trying things on purpose. John's a big believer in auditioning your goals before you commit. Long term, summer is a great time to audition your 1000 hours outside goal. This is about why auditioning matters and how being remarkable will almost always make you look a little weird.
- [01:38]
John Acuff
I always tell people you should audition goals. One of the big mistakes people make is they commit to a goal for a New Year's resolution. They've never even dated and that's like marrying somebody you just met. Never commit to 12 months for something you haven't tried first. So audition goals. So I auditioned that goal, spending more time outside, and I kept enjoying it, Kept enjoying it, kept enjoying it. And I'll finish this thousand hours and I'll do it again next year and the year after that. So I'm such a huge fan of what you do. I don't know how many other podcasts I can say to the host. I invested a thousand hours of my life toward Your mission. So it's easy for me to like when somebody goes, do you really like what she does? I can go, well, I like it. A thousand hours worth. I can't say that about any other podcast on the planet.
- [02:27]
Jenny Urich
The moment you decide to live differently, people might not understand. John says that's part of the deal, because average is common, but remarkable. Remarkable is weird by design.
- [02:38]
John Acuff
Excellence can be very lonely if you're not careful.
- [02:41]
Jenny Urich
Yeah.
- [02:41]
John Acuff
And that's what you find out, is that you have to deliberately surround yourself with other people that are engaged in the same thing. Otherwise it can be lonely. You look weird. Like, when you dare to change your life. Here's what you need to know. Remarkable is weird by design because relatable is average. Average is average. Average is common. When you dare to do something and you say, this is how my family's going to be. This is how our home's going to be. This is how my business, this is how my health, whatever. When you dare to be anything other than average, it means you're stepping out. And so you're going to need people who step out, too, to keep you encouraged, to keep you inspired, to make you feel like you're not weird. I had an executive, really successful executive once, me, he said, john, have any of your relationships timed out? And I thought, what a great question. Timed out. And what he meant was, as you've grown, your family, your business, your health, your spiritual, you know, your faith, whatever, have there been relations that have relationships that have naturally timed out? And that does happen, because what happens is, especially in certain moments where you go, oh, we're going to host live events, or, here's what me and my family are going to do. We're going to try this thing. People go, why would you do that? Like, I've had people, at my age, I'm 48, I've had people say to me, jenny, John, why are you still doing so much? Like, why are you still writing books? Like, just speak a couple times a year. Like, just enjoy what you've done. And that, to me, is wild. I always say, ask a bird why it still flies, because it can, because it's built for that. So for me, when you plug into your purpose, you don't want to do it less, you want to do it more. And so that's what I try to wake up in people to say, like, no, you're remarkable. If nobody's told you that in a long time, I'm going to tell you that, and I'm going to help you figure out what your type of remarkable is, and you're going to sprint, and maybe you're going to go back to a town where there's not five other people that care about the same thing. But when you're in a community, you're going to experience it. That's what your podcast has done. Like, you've seen that. I know that you know, because we've talked about this. It thrills you when you see other moms and dads go, hey, here's how we designed our chart. This is our checkoff chart. You know, I know one of your favorite things is when somebody goes, this is my favorite challenge. I failed. And that might sound weird, but what they mean is we only got the 400 hours, but we would have done 50 hours otherwise. And those 400 hours were magical. So I do not give myself an f for those 400 hours. That was all a plus. That's what happens when you have a community. So you do need people that are trying to be remarkable too, because it creates this fuel that'll keep you going.
- [05:28]
Jenny Urich
And speaking of weird, have you ever thrown a party and no one showed up? John did. And the story that came out of it is one of our all time favorites. So it came in the section of people in the game. Always get criticized by people in the stands. And my husband had reminded me of this story that you had shared a while back about this meetup that you did.
- [05:48]
John Acuff
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- [05:50]
Jenny Urich
So for people who don't know that story, can you share that one?
- [05:53]
John Acuff
Yeah, totally. So when I first started, I had a blog. I had a blog where I was writing kind of satire, funny things. And it gained some momentum and I thought, I'm going to do a meetup because, like, I kept hearing about all these other bloggers doing, like, meetups. You got to do a meetup. And so there was an event in town called Catalyst. I lived in Atlanta at the time, and I wasn't speaking at the event because no one knew I was a speaker yet except me. Like, I hadn't done it, but I was like, I'm going to figure it out. You know, I can do it. That was a positive soundtrack for me. And so I said, hey, can I use a room for a meetup? And they're like, sure. So my in laws printed, printed a thousand stickers, like, about the blog. Like, they were like, we're all in. We support you. So kind. I bought all these Skittles, like, because I had made a joke about Skittles on the blog. And I was like, I'm going to give out Skittles. And my wife was like, I think you got enough Skittles. I was like, we're going to need more Skittles. Like, I kept buying Skittles. So I go to the room and I'm there for 90 minutes and two people show up. And one is my friend who comes to just be like, you can do it, buddy. And the other one was a random dad who was like, I don't read your podcast, but my. My daughter does. Here, call her. And I had like an awkward 30 second phone call with his daughter and then he left. And I think he took one sticker. And I asked my friend, these two. Yeah, yeah, or some Skittles. Can I offer you 11 pounds of Skittle Queso? Yeah, so do. It was. And I had a friend, the friend that came take a picture of me surrounded by all those empty chairs because I wanted to remember that moment, but I also wanted to share that moment. So one of my soundtracks is It'll be a success or a story. Like, it'll either work or I'll get a story. And that's not easy. Like, I have to remind myself that. And when I shared that photo and I posted about it, it became my number one blog post. Because other people have that moment. I always joke, every real estate agent has had to do the cookie walk of shame where you over bake cookies for the open house and nobody comes and you have to carry them all back to your car and try not to eat them in sadness on the drive home. Like, everybody's gonna have a moment like that where your podcast doesn't get the listeners you thought it'd do, or you a store for spices and nobody comes in to buy spices. And so I wanted to share that. And it was fun for me because 13 years later, I got to speak in the arena that that room was attached to, And I was three or 400 yards away talking to 8,000 people, and nobody near knew it. Nobody there knew it but me. And I was like, oh, that's right. And I didn't see that when I was in that moment. I didn't. It's not that I applauded that my way to that, but I got to experience that. And so I always encourage people go first, like, share the photo, share the story, because the scars you share become lighthouses for other people who are headed to the same rocks. And so if you'll be brave enough to share them. And when you go first, you give everyone else the gift of going second. Even Your kids, it's hard to go first. It is. But you give your kids the gift of going second. You give your coworkers, your friends, your family. So that's what that moment was like for me. Again, it was one of those things. But I shared that photo yesterday. I spoke to a client, a big company in Missouri, and I shared that because for leaders where I related to leadership, I'll say old school leadership was if I share my weaknesses, people won't trust my strengths. New school leadership is if I pretend I don't have weaknesses, people won't trust my strengths. This generation can spot fake, I think, faster than any other generation. Like, your kids know when you're faking. Your friends know. And so moments like that are real. And they connect me to other people that are on the edge of doing a moment and they need to know, like, no, you're going to have some of those and you can come out on the other side. And that's okay.
- [09:26]
Jenny Urich
Yeah, I keep popping back to it like a soundtrack, like the title of the book, because it's nerve wracking and people roast you. This podcast is newer for me. In fact, almost exactly a year. Well, I had it. I had the podcast. I had done six episodes by myself in the basement with my phone and a little microphone. My little kids, they're crying. I couldn't put them to bed, but they're up 45 minutes. It wasn't working, so I set it aside and then I had someone reach out, you know, over a year later and said, hey, you know, I want to. I'm launching this book and I want to be on your podcast. And I kind of thought, I don't really have one. I mean, I kind of do and I've never done this before. And so it's nerve wracking. And it's been up for a year. We've had sound issues. And there was a couple weeks, I think, where I had a pretty bad cold, so I had cough drops. And then that's when people leave the reviews. Sounds like she's chewing, you know, I mean, this is what I got. Thank you. You know, all right, so I keep coming back to that. That's the choice. The choice is to do nothing or to do it and get the one star. So you're going to get some one star reviews. There's going to be people who don't like what you do.
- [10:27]
John Acuff
Well, what's the other option? The other option is you don't do the thing. I try to look at it as that's the admission price. That's the admission price. There's an admission price to doing things you love. And one of them is that there's people that criticize it because now it's a thing that exists and that's part of it. And so you go, but I wouldn't not write my book because of a one star review. Like, I wouldn't raise my kids with countercultural approaches because somebody else is going to criticize. Like, I would take care of my kids. Like, you wouldn't go, there's some strangers that I need to behave against. And you go, no. Like, these are the kids I'm in. Like, I'm raising these humans. Like, I'm going to do the challenging things, the challenging encouragements, the challenging principles, the boundaries, whatever. And I can't let what's going to happen on the outside dictate what happens on the inside. Like, imagine if you gave the outside of your house the permission to change the inside of your house. You'd go, wow, my inside is going to be really not what I want it to be. And then, like, with criticism, the thing and the metaphor I always use for myself is like, imagine if a stranger drove down your street and saw your yard and was like, your yard is terrible. Your heart must be terrible too. Your yard is terrible. Your parenting must be terrible too. You'd go, that person's crazy. Who yells that driving down the street? I don't even know that person. But then a stranger does it on social media, Instagram, whatever. And you go, I should really allow that to dictate how I feel today. Like, that person must know something. No, they don't. If they were driving down the highway and said it, you'd be like, what a weirdo. But because of social media, we over focus on it. And it's a work in progress for me. It's not that I'm immune to that. It's by no means does it not still. Like, it'll knock me off my pace for a minute. But over the years, I've just seen, like, no, like, these books are happening, the podcast is happening, my family's gonna happen. Like, I can't worry about what other people think.
- [12:17]
Jenny Urich
What's the lesson here? Go first, be brave. Share the picture of the empty chairs. And when that doesn't work, throw everything you've got at it. That's next.
- [12:28]
John Acuff
The try is an invitation to get better over time. That's all it is. A try is an invitation. Get better over time. And you go, okay, I'm not where I want to be yet. But I'm starting, which means I'm 90% of the way further than most people. Like most people don't even give themselves that permission. They hold back and go, well, until I've got everything I need. Until, you know, perfectionists are always saying, until I know all the information, I can't make a change. And we haven't lived in an all information world in 300 years. The reality is you'll never have all the info. You have enough information, you make a decision and you iterate. You make another decision, you iterate. It's kind of the joke I sometimes do is like Thomas Jefferson, one of the things I used to say about him is that he owned all the books. I don't mean he owned a lot of them, he owned all of them. Any book that had been published, he had. You couldn't do that today. Like you couldn't possibly. So if one of your kind of hang ups is, I don't want to make the wrong decision until I know all the information, you'll never make a decision. So you have to get comfortable with, I made the best decision I could with the information I had and I get to change that later. That's the thing fear tells you. This decision is forever. Fear loves to treat every decision like a tattoo. And they're not. Think of your decisions as temporary tattoos. You get to change that. You get to wash that off. If you made the wrong decision, you get to do something different. That's one of the things that I wrote about yesterday. People are afraid of putting their ladder against the wrong wall. It's an old metaphor from Stephen Covey. What if I climb to the top of this ladder and I realize it was against the wrong wall? And I don't think that's possible because whoever climbs a ladder without looking up, who only looks down when they climb a ladder? That's not how ladders work. As you climb, you're constantly looking up and going, is this still the right direction? Is this the right direction? And then here's the crazy thing. You get to change ladders. You asked me that at the beginning. Like John, you made job changes. I'm not done changing. I'm in the middle of a change right now. I think everyone listening should think about their lives in eras 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 different chunks. Arrows. Mine were from 20 to 34 was employee. I was an employee from 34 to 48. I was a solopreneur from 48 on. I'm a leader. I'm a brand new Leader. And one of my broken soundtracks was I'm a bad leader. I was saying that to a friend, I'm a bad leader. I'm a bad leader. I'm a bad leader. And he said, I think you need to change that too. I'm a new leader. I'm a new leader. And the same as moms. Any mom listening to this goes, I'm not a good mom. No, you're a new mom. You're a new mom. And guess what? You're a new mom at every age of that kid. You've never been a mom of an adolescent. Like Jenny and I were joking the other day, One of the hardest parts of parenting is this wasteland where every kid in the house needs to go somewhere but you still don't have a driver yet. Like the glory that is when you add a driver, like you get a 16 year old, a 17 year old, and you add a driver to your house, you don't understand the joy that is. But like when they're 15 and you've got five kids that all need rides and you're the only, only driver. And so it's new, you're a new mom. And so I think that's part of the challenge people face with grit is that they don't give themselves permission to try, which means they never get better.
- [15:43]
Jenny Urich
I used to do that with sports. Maybe you can't tell that I'm not super sportsy, but I would go out, you know, after church, there'd be like stand volleyball and I would just goof around because I was like, well, if I don't try hard, then I don't know myself if I'm good or bad. And nobody knows.
- [15:56]
John Acuff
I can always pretend I could have been good.
- [15:58]
Jenny Urich
Yeah, exactly, exactly. We were at the bookstore today talking about decisions and iterating and these business books. I didn't see them. They probably are there and I was in the wrong section. But I did see stuff.
- [16:10]
John Acuff
Christians like, hey, yeah, still going, still rocking.
- [16:14]
Jenny Urich
Yes. Barnes and Noble Rock in Brighton, Michigan stuff. So that's a decision and iterate, right? Like you've written books and now you've written books about other things and you've given yourself permission to adjust and change over time and the other ones are still there. I loved this as one of my favorite paragraphs, actually got really emotional and it did make me think about parenting because we're in the teen ages when you don't really know. Like, you know, do they date? Do they not date? You know, how much time should we be giving Toward academics versus social versus. It's a lot. And you're kind of. You're. I'm emotional about it. You really second guess. Sorry. So this made me really emotional and still is. Obviously. You really kind of sometimes second guess, like, should I have made that decision or should I have not? Here's what it says. The worst part of regret is that when we look back on a decision, we lie to ourselves. Equipped with the kind of information only hindsight can provide, we beat up our former selves for their stupidity and making the wrong decision. That person in the past, the you from before didn't know what you know now, though they couldn't have predicted. You are not a mind reader. Be honest about that. When you look back on a decision, remember that you made that decision with the best information you had at the time. You're gonna have to take over.
- [17:39]
John Acuff
Yeah. Yeah. So it's human nature to do that. Essentially, what I was saying there was. Say it's six months later and there's been a bunch that's come out like, your kid made some mistakes or maybe there's new science. You're a reader. You read a book that said the opposite of the thing you did. And, like, the title of the book is like, only Dumb Moms do this. And you did that. And you go, oh, my gosh, 1,000 hours inside. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You go, the sun is killing our children. Like. Like, oh, no. Like, circadian is a fake word. Like. And you go, man. And you hold yourself accountable with information and standards you didn't have. And then the other thing you do in that moment is you really beat yourself up, as if you didn't have the best intent when you made the decision. Even if the decision didn't work out, your intent was never, I'm making this decision so that my kid feels confused, so that they don't have friends, so that their future is shaky. I'm trying to really ruin this kid's life. That's never what you're doing. What. What you're always doing if you're an involved parent. Like, if you're an involved parent, you're an active parent. You're saying, I want my kid to be successful. I want them to be happy. I want them to be healthy. I want them to have emotional health and physical health and mental health. Like, I'm trying to set up their life in a way to foster that. That's where you start from. And I think that's a good reminder. And even just if you said, okay, it's a Month later, it's a week later or whatever. Am I the same person who made that initial decision? Like, meaning, do I love my kids? Like, that's what's interesting is because when you beat yourself up, you go, man, that there must have been a monster that did that. And you go, well, I'm not a monster now. Like, no, the same person, the same Jenny did that. It wasn't that there's a Jenny now in the future that loves her kids. And the one six months ago did not love her kids. Like, you're the same Jenny. And so that's the thing I try to remind myself. And then I'm trying to be really deliberate about second guessing and trying to catch myself on the second, third, fourth, fifth guess and go, wait a second, this isn't helpful. Like, what am I going to do with this information? Like, I did that the other day. I had a conversation with a friend and I said something. I was kind of reviewing it and reviewing it and reviewing it and I thought, I'm never going to be in that exact situation again. This isn't helping me. Like, you know, if it's something I need to apologize for, then I need to go do that. But it wasn't. It was something dumb. And my brain was just kind of scanning through things to be anxious about. And I was like, we don't have anything else. Let's just focus on this. And I had to go, wait a second. I, I see what you're doing. Like, no, like, my wife sometimes will tease me and be like, when you are anxious, it's like you've got a waiting room full of possible subjects and they're just taking a number and you're just calling the number. You're not even really anxious about the thing. It's just, you're like, man, I. I need to be anxious about something. You go, number 77. And that one walks up and goes, yeah, I'm that thing you said to the cab driver a week ago. So would you like to think about that? Or like, hey, number 88, number 88. I'm that you let your kid watch too much TV six months ago. So if you'd like to think about that. And so if I can imagine pictures like that, it allows me to kind of smile at them a little more and not do some of that. That beat up. And then the other thing is, like, I think you have to think about some of those moments you regret. And the way I think about them is this way. I imagine, like growing up, we went to Sunset beach the small beach in North Carolina every summer for a week with my family. That was our big family vacation. And I knew that beach pretty well because I had gone there 10 summers in a row. And every time you visit a regretful moment, you're adding another layer of detail and another layer of familiarity where you can go back there instant. And now it's even easier and easier and easier to get there. Now a song can bring it up, a word can bring it up. So I have to sometimes tell myself, like, no, we're not. We're not going to vacation in that regret. We're not going to go spend, like, go see it every summer or go see it every time we hear it. Like, no, we're not going to roll around in that. We're going to process that if we need to, but we're not going to vacation in the regret because that's not helping and it's not leading to life change. Often I'm using it as a. As a way to not do something I could do in the present because I can't do a lot about the past. You know, I can apologize, I can change some things, but there's a lot I can do in the present. So sometimes I have to be honest with myself and go, am I leaving the present because it's scary and overwhelming and I'm vacationing in a regret that doesn't force me to do anything other than to feel bad.
- [22:18]
Jenny Urich
This episode is brought to you by Better Help. Let's talk about something important. Men's mental health. There's this idea that being strong means keeping it all together. Providing, performing, pushing through. But here's the truth. Real strength is being honest about what you're carrying and taking steps to heal. Each year, over 6 million men in the US experience depression, and most of it goes undiagnosed. It does not have to be that way. Therapy is a great way to learn positive coping skills and set boundaries. If you're feeling the weight of the world, talk to someone. A friend, a loved one, a therapist. Better help makes that easier than ever. With over 35,000 thousand licensed therapists, BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform and has helped over 5 million people worldwide. The app is a 4.9 out of 5 star rating with more than 1.7 million reviews. And for good reason. You can start therapy at the click of a button. No waiting rooms, no pressure. And you can switch therapists anytime because taking care of your mind is strength. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Talk it out with BetterHelp. Our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com 1000hours that's betterhelph E-L-P.com 1000hours Summer's here and you can now.
- [23:34]
John Acuff
Get almost anything you need for your.
- [23:35]
Jenny Urich
Sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. What do we mean by almost?
- [23:39]
John Acuff
Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get a chicken parmesan delivered. A cabana? That's a no.
- [23:44]
Jenny Urich
But a banana?
- [23:45]
John Acuff
That's a yes. A nice tan? Sorry, nope. But a box fan? Happily, yes.
- [23:49]
Jenny Urich
A day of sunshine? No. A box of fine wines? Yes.
- [23:53]
John Acuff
Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost almost anything delivered with Uber Eats.
- [23:57]
Jenny Urich
Order now.
- [23:58]
John Acuff
Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by Regency app.
- [24:01]
Jenny Urich
For details, get into your body's vitals with the Vitals app on Apple Watch. The Vitals app tracks key overnight metrics so you can spot changes in your health before you feel them. The Vitals app ON Apple Watch iPhone XS are later required. The Vitals app is for wellness purposes only and not for medical use. All right, friends, I have no idea how this is going. I thought it would actually be a lot easier than it is to splice these together, but it's pretty cool. I love listening back and hearing all of this encouragement. Similar to dealing with regret, sometimes we struggle with the day after perfect and especially in the summer if you've got some ideals of how things are going to go and then you have a day where things derail. The day after perfect is often when most people quit. But what if close is still worth celebrating? We want people to stick with it for the year so that they can look back and be so proud. People, I mean they're just constantly talking about how proud they are and they're celebrating and life is all about that. Let's be proud of the effort that we put in to keep balance between screens and real life. So you have this is amazing book. It's the perfect book to read. Give yourself the gift of done. And you talk in there a ton about perfectionism but also about and this I really related to the day after you mess up. This is a big day.
- [25:28]
John Acuff
Day after perfect. Yeah, it's one of the biggest days in a goal setting challenge. So Jenny, what I would say sometimes what happens is that during a vacation moment you make a big goal when you've got a bunch of free time and you go, I'm doing It, I'm doing it. And then real life starts again and you have to adjust. And what often happens is somebody on Day 7 of trying to goal Day 8, they miss it. And then Day 9, they miss it. And then day 10, and then they look up three months later and they've missed it. So one of the greatest gifts you can give yourself is the gift of starting again. The gift of going, okay, starting again. Okay, starting again. You can define resilience a million different ways. I think resilience is the ability to start again. I don't think it's the ability to be perfect. I think it's the ability to start again, to say, okay, I had a busy travel season. I had four business days where I didn't get to be outside or, you know, there were family complications. So let me, you know, let me start again. And we're often so unkind to ourselves to not notice when life has changed and we don't adjust the goal. So what happens to me is people go, john, I was doing really good at my real estate goals. I'm trying to be a successful agent and I just don't know what, what happened. I'll go, well, tell me some more about your life. And they go, well, I'm now taking care of my mother who has early stage dementia, and that's about 20 hours a week. And I go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Did you adjust at all? And they go, no, what do you mean? I go, you're a completely different person right now than you were six months ago. So how do we adjust? And that's what's fun about a long goal like yours. It teaches you the power of adjusting. It teaches you the power of flexibility. You're a hundred percent right in that in the journey of the thousand hours outside, you're going to learn 50 other lessons you can't even anticipate. And what happens is the goal you're encouraging people to do floods into other parts of their life. You, I guarantee people come up to you and go, hey, you know, that thousand hours outside goal really helped me get my finances together. And you go, whoa, whoa, it's not a financial goal. And they go, I know, but like discipline begets discipline, hope begets hope, curiosity begets curiosity. So when you put a marker in the ground and say, I'm going to do this with Jenny in her community, it spreads to other parts of your life. That's one of the best parts of a long term goal, is that it moves into other areas and you get benefits you can't even imagine.
- [27:30]
Jenny Urich
Okay, so one of the things that perfectionism says, close doesn't count. Close doesn't count. It's an all or nothing mentality. So what would you say to that?
- [27:38]
John Acuff
Yeah, so that's an interesting example of that, is I'll meet people that will say, john, my. My goal is to. I want to walk two miles every day. Today I only had time for one, so I didn't do any. And you want to go, well, you know, one is infinitely more than none. But a perfectionist, one of their secret rules, or broken soundtracks, if you will, is I'd rather get a zero than a C minus. Like, a perfectionist would rather not do it at all than do it halfway. And so part of breaking out of perfectionism is going, no, if. If I get a B, that's okay. If I get a C, that's okay, because I didn't get a zero like Y. Yes, I tried a little bit. And where we saw this happen, we. We saw this happen. When we looked at weight loss goals, if somebody said, okay, my goal is to lose 10 pounds, and then they lost eight, they felt like they failed by two and they gave up. But if they said, my goal is to lose five and they lost the same eight, they go, I won by three, I should keep trying. And so there's so much kind of mindset in this, but a big part of it is to go, okay, I'm going to continue. I care more about the continue than I do about the perfection. Like, perfection says it has to be 10, and if it's not 10, give up. I care more about what'd you do in the month, what'd you do in the third month, what'd you do in the fourth month? And I'll give you an example from real life. A woman told me, John, my goal was to walk 10,000 steps every day. And it just. I couldn't do it. There'd be some days where I was really busy. I only got 2,000 in. So she. She allowed herself to walk 70,000 in a week. She did an average. So what that meant was if she missed some on Thursday, she knew Saturday is a different kind of day. I've got more time outside. Like, I'm going to do 15,000. And so she gave herself an average. And so it's the same. If you said, some people will love the streak approach, they'll, I do three hours outside every day because that's how I'm wired. That's awesome. But some people go, you know what? We camp, we're going to camp four times this year and we're going to catch up on some hours. That's awesome too. I love that you're giving people what I would say is the gift of modifying it. Modify it to your life. Any advice you hear, any business book you read, any outdoors book you read, you should modify it through your unique life, your unique family versus. Okay, it has to fit in this box because the challenge is people like me will write books that go. The way to do it is you got to get up at 3am and if you're not doing up at 3am you're already failing. And that person might be naturally wired for the mornings where somebody else is wired for the afternoons. And the person who's wired for the afternoons reads that book and feels like a failure and they go, okay, well I didn't do it perfectly, so it doesn't count. So I shouldn't try. But I'm always going, okay, well, how can we be kind to ourselves to continue? Kindness leads to continuation and continuation leads to consistency. And that's where you start to see magic happen.
- [30:08]
Jenny Urich
So good. I just talked to Katie Bowman. She's a biomechanist and she has this platform called nutritious movement. And she said to your point about the walking, and I thought this was super interesting, you can be a person that's consistent. Every day I'm going to walk three miles. But she said, actually, for the way that your body is set up, it's great to vary it that one day you walk one and one day you walk four. And that gives your body all these different inputs. And so either way, there are benefits to how you spread that out. And that is how 1,000 hours outside is. We always say, even if you fail, you win. So at the end of the year, people are like, they got these kids, they're holding up their sign. It says 822 hours. And they're jumping and they're celebrating. It's great because we should. We have to celebrate what we're accomplishing. 225 hours and a mom will say, I've got joint custody or I've got split custody. And this is what we can do. And we prioritize it for an entire year. We were intentional. It's wherever you get is a win because you look back and you have made progress. So I love that. Close doesn't count is a lie from perfectionism.
- [31:05]
John Acuff
Well, here's. Here's how I'd say here's a. Here's a way to kind of a Practical way to think about that. Measure against zero, not against perfect. So when you did 225 hours, measure that against zero. I did 225 hours more than zero. Wow. Don't go, I did 700. Well, I'm terrible at math. 775. Less than a thousand. You're not going to feel great. You're not going to do it a second year. Measure against zero, not against perfect.
- [31:31]
Jenny Urich
Let's go one step deeper. Here's how John builds goal ladders with low rungs that anyone can climb.
- [31:38]
John Acuff
So there is some frustration there. I think we'd be dishonest if we said, like, no. Like goals are. It's always easy and super fun. Like, no, but it's worth it. The joy of what you get on the other side is worth that work. Holy cow, it's worth it.
- [31:51]
Jenny Urich
Yeah. And I think like you said, with this sort of zoom life and Covid life, and even if someone listening, as a parent, this is something that I struggle with is as the seasons change, the amount of time you have ebbs and flows. And I think if you're not intentional about how you use it, then you lose it. So it's an interesting part of the book just to sort of audit your time and like you said, see if you're over committed and what could you offload, what could you change? And then you think about your goals in terms of time to do. I have five hours a week to throw at this. If not, maybe I need to start in a smaller place. I had a friend who joined in on one of your webinars at the beginning of the year. I did too. Those were so great. She still talks about all the time. One of the things she loves about the middle goals and you talk about is that you have just basically a bucket of ideas of ways that you can work on some of these middle goals. Because we don't always have the same amount of time and energy and commitment level. She loved that. So could you talk about that just a little bit on this podcast? Then she'll be thrilled.
- [32:56]
John Acuff
Oh, yeah, sure. Well, I love the idea that I can move it forward in a lot of different ways because I'm a recovering perfectionist. So as a perfectionist, you go, no, for it to count, for it to be the thing, it has to be this exact thing in this amount of time. And this, this is the only way to operate. And that's really limiting because then unless the circumstances are perfect, you can't do the thing. And so one of the phrases or soundtracks I Use all the time is some Beats none. Some beats none. Sometime outside beats none. Some writing beats none. Some exercise beats none. Some financial awareness beats none. What I like to do is come up with a list, like, 10 to 20 things that I know regardless of how much time I have or how much energy I can move something forward to write, I have to be high energy. I have to have some time. Like, it'd be hard for me to say, jenny, I can jump into a book if I've only got 10 minutes. Like, no, it takes me a little time to get ready. But what I can do is say, okay, there is a research topic I need to look up. I can do that in 10 minutes. So if I have a 10 free minutes and I go, oh, I have a task to plug into that. Part of the reason I don't waste time is that when 15 minutes shows up, when 20 minutes shows up, when somebody's late for an appointment, I go, oh, yeah, I got a small thing I can plug into there. I can do 30 minutes here, I can do 40 minutes here. And then I get to move it forward, and then I get to be creative about it. And so what the exercise is kind of if you have a goal you're trying to do, sit down and think for a couple minutes and go, if I wanted to accomplish this goal, what are 10 to 20 actions I could do with this? And you can do that over time. You don't have to do it all at once. You can think through that over a couple days and then think, okay, how much time do these cost? How much energy? Because say, I'm flying home on a plane and I'm exhausted. Maybe I watch a documentary on a subject I'm interested in. Like, that takes very little brain power. If I have a little more brain power, maybe I listen to an audiobook. If I have a little more brain power, maybe I actually read the book. Because reading the book I'm underlining, it takes more if I have a ton of brain power, or maybe I write a little bit. So again, think about that goal ladder. Let's break it down to the goal ladder. A little bit of time, a little bit of effort. If I feel like I only have a little bit, I want as many rungs on my ladder as possible. I don't want a big gap between the rungs. I want to make that ladder really fun and really simple to climb. So if I have 25 actions, I now have 25 rungs and I can go. And I'm climbing my ladder versus going there's. A huge gap. And I have to be my favorite writing spot and my favorite coffee shop. My favorite time of day with my favorite music. And I have to slept well the night before. Like, no, that's two conditions. That's too many conditions. I want to be able to do it a little bit at a time when a little bit of time is all I have.
- [35:29]
Jenny Urich
Remember, when your progress is invisible, it's easy to forget it's happening. That's where scorecards come in. Consider how you could use scorecards this summer. The sentence is, your brain wants to know you're making progress in life. Your brain wants to know you're making progress in life. So there's two ways you can do that. You can have a scorecard or you can compare. And comparing is not working out very well for us. No, there's a lot to compare to because of social media. So talk to us about how a teen could use. What kind of scorecard should a teen have?
- [36:03]
John Acuff
Well, it really depends on what they're trying to accomplish or what they're into too. So, you know, if you said, okay, I'm trying to do better about getting to school on time, like, the school's keeping a scorecard. Like, they've got a scorecard of tardies. So you could easily go, hey, I need a little scorecard. Need a little check box. Like, I need to be motivated by this. Like, I don't know, it could be saving money. There's a teenager in our neighborhood who bought an old Nissan 300 ZX that he's been repairing it and he just saved up finally $1300 to get it repaired. You could have a scorecard about the money you're saving to your passion, which is he's got this old sports car and he's done a million things on it. So it could be around money you're saving up or a project you're doing. You could have a scorecard about a sport you're playing. There's not a single cross country runner in high school that doesn't know their pr. Like they, they have a scorecard. Like, they know. Like, oh yeah, if I want to get to this level, this is what I, this is what I need to do. So you can, you can find a lot of different scorecards. And again, with kids, I'm trying to make them fun. The tracking, the hours outside is fun to me. Like, it doesn't feel like a chore. Books read is fun. Like Goodreads. A kid can, a kid can enjoy Goodreads and go, man, look at my shelves building up. Like, look how many I read this year. I've got 12 books. You know, I would even say like, I have a nine year old nephew and he's got, got kind of a shelf that runs all the way around his wall and he's got every Lego set he's built up there. That's a form of scorecarding because he doesn't put them in the closet. He says, wow, I did that truck and I did that rocket and I did that castle. And he can even see the progress because he can see that. And he would probably say this, that set was kind of for babies. Like that's when I was a little kid. The pieces are kind of big. It's more Duplo, if you will. But now, like I'm getting into more technical stuff. Like, look at that one. That's a complicated Star Wars, Starfighter, whatever. So that can be a form of scorecard. It's really about celebrating progress. Because the thing you need to know, human nature, like progress you don't measure, doesn't exist. Failure is loud and neon. Every human knows when they failed. You don't have to track or measure failure. Failure shows up and is like, I'm here, I'm going to bother you for 10 years. Even though this thing you said is long ago, I had somebody apologize to me, yes, like this week on a DM for something they had awkwardly done at a speaking engagement I was at four years ago. I didn't remember, it wasn't a big deal. And they said, this has been killing me. Every time I see you online, I feel bad about this. I'm just so sorry. And I said, I release you from that guilt. I forgot what you're talking about. So you don't have to track failure. You do have to track progress. Because if you don't, it's so easy for fear to come in, especially with kids and go, go. You've never done hard things. This is the hardest thing you've ever done. You've never accomplished anything. Like you'll never be able to. And so the scorecarding can be as simple as a parent reminds them of the things they've done that are challenging. So you better believe that. Like when McCrae, my youngest daughter, went to college this year, I said to her multiple times, it's amazing that you did nine weeks at camp this summer. You were in charge of 10, 11 year olds. You spent nine weeks with no air conditioning taking care of kids. Grand. College is going to be a breeze for you. You've already done something way more challenging. You've been away from home. We're going to take away the live. Like, whoa, I'm going away for home from long time. You did nine weeks. You got air conditioning at your college and you're not in charge of 10, 11 year olds. Like this is going to be a dream. And so I scorecarded back to her like, hey, this is helpful. Like let me remind you of something you've already done that's that's successful. So it can be something as simple as that too.
- [39:46]
Jenny Urich
McCrispy strips are now at McDonald's.
- [39:49]
John Acuff
I hope you're ready for the most.
- [39:50]
Jenny Urich
Dippable chicken in McDonald's history. Dip it in all the sauces. Dip it in that hot sauce in your bag. Dip it in your McFlurry. Your dip is your business. McCrispy strips at McDonald's.
- [40:03]
John Acuff
Craftsman Days are here at Lowe's with big savings on the tools you need. Save $100 on the Craftsman V26 Tool Power Tool Combo Kit Kit now at $199. No matter what the project is, Craftsman's high quality, high performance products empower you to build on. Stop by your nearest Lowe's store and check out the full line of Craftsman tools today, valid through 618 while supplies last selection varies by location. Does it ever feel like you're a marketing professional just speaking into the void? Well, with LinkedIn ads, you can know you're reaching the right decision making. You can even target buyers by job title, industry, company seniority skills. Wait, did I say job title yet? Get started today and see how you can avoid the void and reach the right buyers with LinkedIn ads. We'll even give you a $100 credit on your next campaign. Get started at LinkedIn.com results terms and conditions apply.
- [41:02]
Jenny Urich
Beyond the scorecard One of the things I absolutely love that I learned about from John is about the dialogue. Dial down, don't switch off. Another theme that has been rolling around in my mind since reading the book is this concept of switch versus dial and how I think a lot of times in life we think we can just flip a switch, but really life is about growth. So can you explain that concept of switch versus Dial?
- [41:27]
John Acuff
That one's game changing for me. And that came from a guy named David Thomas who's the he's one of the founders of daystar, a counseling center for kids in Nashville. And one I love that that's something that kids have access to. You know, growing up as a kid, like I didn't there was no counseling, like I didn't have access to that. And so it's so fun to see great centers like that help kids develop some tools for stress, for anxiety. And so one day we were having coffee and I was talking to him about negative thoughts or broken soundtracks. And he said, john, the problem or the challenge is most people want there to be a switch. They want to find the one thing that turns it off forever. And adults do this. An adult version of this would be, I'm going to do yoga and yoga will fix it. And then you do yoga for a week and you feel a little less stressed. You're like, I fixed. And then a week later life is stressful again because that's what life does. And you go, ah, yoga wasn't the right switch. And perfectionism says, well, let's go look for another switch. Maybe there's another one. And you just keep. That's why people change diets 50 times. That's why they half read 50 books and go, this book will fix all my emotional problems. And by chapter four, they're like, oh, I still got problems. Maybe it's a different book, different books. And so he said, john, life is about a dial. So when your dial gets turned up to a 10, you do things that turn the dial back down. That's what life's about. And so where that launched me and my daughters was what are our turndown techniques? What are the things we do when life gets loud? Now the challenge is often that when we're stressed out, when life feels loud, we end up not doing those things unless we're reminded of them. So loneliness is one of those examples. Loneliness lies to and goes, you feel lonely right now, you should spend some time alone figuring out why. And you go, oh no, that, that's not. That just creates more loneliness. Like I need to reach out to community. I need to be present in other people's lives. So what we encourage people to do is think about some turn down techniques. So it can be, you know, for me personally, personally, one one of mine is like running or walking. I need some endorphins. So when I'm stressed, I got a stressful week. I need to make sure that I'm doing the, that friends I need to be in relationship with people that can, can tell me the truth about situations. I think of friends like archives. A good friend archives your moments and repeats them back to you when you've forgotten. So sometimes when you're stressed, Jenny, you go, this is the hardest thing I've ever done. I've never done this before. And a good friend will go, wait a second. Remember, like a year ago we walked through a similar situation. I archived that for you, remember that? And you go, oh, you're right, I forgot. So good friends are archives. Lists. I love to keep lists when things are out of control. Spending 10 minutes to write them down on a list of what I actually have to do is really clarifying for me. A dorky one is Lego sets. I love doing Lego sets. It's one of my turndown techniques where most of my life doesn't have clear instructions, it doesn't have clear steps. So like, be a good dad, be a good husband, be a writer, be a speaker. There's not steps, but when I get a huge LEGO car and it's 4,000 pieces and there's a book that can follow with instructions, it's meditative for me. Some people it's knitting, some people it's gardening. So what we encourage parents to do do is figure out those for your kids. So, like, I know that McCrae likes to run, but when she's stressed, she might forget that and she might lose access to those. So, hey, why don't we go on a 1 mile run? Why don't we get some fresh air? Like, that's a turndown technique for you. Or why don't you reach out to this friend that's a turn down technique for you. My oldest daughter, Ellie, playing the piano, that's when it hurts. She has a piano, she loves to play. She's taken lessons forever, but they're really casual lessons. She just does it for joy. She's bringing her piano to college. She goes to college in about a week. And we bought her one that slides. Slides under a bed. Not because she's going to major in it or take classes in it, but because when she has stressful moments, putting on the headphones because she can plug in, she's the only one that hears it. And playing piano is a great turndown technique for us. So that's one of the things we encourage people to do, is figure out your turndown techniques. Write them on a list so the next time you go, wow, like life just went to a nine. I got a flat tire, I missed an appointment, the podcast didn't work, my kids are in a terrible mood. And you go, oh, I need to do one of those five things, or I need to do one of those 10 things to turn the dial down a little bit.
- [45:38]
Jenny Urich
Yeah, I bought too many Skittles for my event.
- [45:41]
John Acuff
Yeah, like, I failed Tremendously. I need, like. And that's one for me where writing is one of my turndown techniques. So in that moment, what did I do? I shared the photo and I wrote it out. I didn't try to hold it all in my head and go, good luck, head. Figure that out. I wrote it out and I found a way to help other people with it. So it's amazing what happens, how encouraged you get when you encouraged others. It becomes cyclical. And so, yeah, that's one of my turndown techniques. So sharing it removed a lot of the shame and it really helps me process it.
- [46:12]
Jenny Urich
The Lego thing is really intriguing to me because they are. You can see it, they're coming out with Legos. It seems like they're for adults. Right. There's Seinfeld Legos. I've seen all sorts of. Right. So we're in this world that's becoming, I think, increasingly chaotic with the job market and life is less systematic. So you almost wonder if a lot of people are drawn to that and that might be coming out with those different Legos for adults.
- [46:39]
John Acuff
I think so. It's funny. I'll talk about that when I do leadership events. And now the clients will send me Lego sets after. And which is like, my dream. Like, I found a way to create a job where people mail me LEGO sets. Like, it's the greatest. No guidance counselor told me I could do. Like, Holland just was. They're holding one up. I came home from an event yesterday, and this was in my. This was on my front porch. And it's the new Ferrari. And it's ridiculous. It's like 4,000 pieces, and I don't even know which client sent it to me. Like, I'm gonna have to go on a scavenger hunt to be like, who? And it was so fun. And I like, I. Absolutely. And now, like, I'll thank clients with small sets. Like. So I had a client the other day that he said, I read your book. The reason you're here at this event is I read your book when I lived in Tokyo about doing over your career. And I changed my career. Now I'm with company. So I brought you here to speak. So I sent him the Tokyo skyline. LEGO has one. That's the Tokyo skyline versus, like a random thing. Like, here's a pen like that, you know, like. Like something that maybe an adult. Yeah. That says John Acup on it. Like you're going to throw it in a drawer. And so, yeah, I. For me, I do see other adults that do that. And I think it's a lot of it's being curious. And I think part of your job as a parent is to help your kids see those things about themselves. Part of your job as a parent is to throw fuel on their strengths and their curiosities. Not for performance, not for perfection, but to go, hey, that thing, that thing you're interested in, let's, let's spend some more time doing that or let's pull the thread a little bit about not suffocate you with it. I think that's a mistake parents make is like, when their five year old is into art, they're like, you're an artist. And then every birthday, every Christmas is all art, all art, all art. And then like by the time they're 11, the kid hates crayons. He's like, I'm over art. And so I think it's a dance. A lot of parenting to me is a dance, but I think it's, it can be really fun when you find.
- [48:26]
Jenny Urich
Something your kid loves and it goes along with what you said earlier. Their lists are different. Ellie and McRae's lists are different. And that's how, I mean, I don't like to write. When you say writing is a turn down technique, I'm like, oh, that's, that's nice.
- [48:38]
John Acuff
Yeah, that's torture for me. Yeah. No, yeah. Some people I know, people that like Excel spreadsheets, and Excel spreadsheets might as well be called like panic attack. Like, if I get into an Excel spreadsheet and they're like, you got to do a macro. I'm like, I don't know how to. But some people. Like, my CPA is like, I love making numbers make sense. And I'm like, if I see more than four numbers in a row, high stress. So, yeah, every. You only need to have two kids to realize they come to the planet with different brains and what motivates them, what excites them. Like, the joke I always do is like, if you punish an introvert kid with more alone time, they're like, oh, no. Like, if you tell an introvert kid, go to your room and spend some time by yourself, they're like, oh, what torture. Like, they're in the room. Like, this is the best. Where if you, you know, if you tell an extrovert kid that they're like, okay, what do I need to do? I need to change his behavior. This sounds like torture. So I think it's really funny to see how different kids are different.
- [49:32]
Jenny Urich
Yeah. And it's interesting. Those are Interesting to look for those dial down techniques is an interesting lens to learn about your children. Thank you so much for joining for this very first ever summer best of episode, this one with John Acuff. We're going to wrap it up with a reminder that enough is a myth. Can you talk about that a little bit? The concept of enough is a myth.
- [49:54]
John Acuff
Yeah, so it's really this idea of like, okay, there's this thing I can achieve when I'll know I'm enough. Like, there's a moment where as a teenager, like, if I do this, then I'll feel enough. And the problem with life is that it always moves. Like, so what happens is you go, if a teenager says If I get 50 likes on this photo, then then I'll be enough. And they get 50 likes and they realize, you know, a hundred, like somebody else got a hundred on theirs or it didn't go viral. Like, and you realize teens are so manicuring their Instagram feeds because they're deleting things that don't get enough attention. They're fault. You know, it's such a, like we as parents use Instagram, but there's so many layers to it that teens are adding that, that we have no idea about. So it's that sense of how do you determine what your enough is? Like one the big capital enough is enough myth, you're not going to reach it. Parents don't reach that. I mean we all know people that go, yeah, as soon as I make this amount of money then. And then they, they reach it and it's, it's not. And then you go, well, what about. And you go, okay, like, how can that 82 year old CEO be unwilling to step down from power? Like, how can they. And they go, well, there's no enough. Like they're gonna, they're gonna, like they're missing that. They miss their kids, they miss their wife, they're on marriage seven. And you go, well, how did they. Because they believed in enough and now they spent 60 years trying to change it. And a leadership expert told me about that exact situation. A guy named Marshall Goldsmith, who coaches CEOs, he said it's better to leave a year early than a week late. And what he meant was, you as a CEO, it's better for you to retire a year early than a week late. Because if you stay too long chasing the enough, you don't prepare the organization. You make a lot of mistakes. There's a lot of ego involved. So I think enough is something that's very Human. So if we can teach our kids that lesson, then it's going to serve them for the rest of their life. Because I can tell you right now, my first job, what I made annually, I've X that multiple times. But my happiness didn't scale at the same rate. So if I had said, okay, Jenny, this is how much I make. And if I triple that, if I quadruple that, if I quintuple that, that my happiness, my fulfillment, my sense of wellbeing will follow that too. And it hasn't. So as an adult, you come to a point where you go, I either have to admit that and do something else and learn how to have my own self value, learn how to not put my identity in my book sales or my success or whatever and find it in something else, or I have to lie to myself and go, now what if it was more books? Like, what if it was double? Like, what if it like as if the next thing and then you keep chasing enough. So that's the, that's the principles. How do we teach kids? Kids enough is a myth at that age because they're going to face it for the rest of their life.
- [52:39]
Jenny Urich
And in the end, maybe it all comes down to this.
- [52:43]
John Acuff
I just, I'm a goal nerd. I love goals. I feel like a goal is the fastest path between where you are today and where you want to be tomorrow. So how does, what does it look like to have a goal? As a parent with my kids, I would say that most people do a pretty good job having goals for most of their life. But most people don't, don't do goals for their relationships. We hope that our parenting and our relationships kind of happen organically. So there was a time where I realized I want my family to get the best of me, not the rest of me. I don't want them to get the rest of what I have left over at the end of the day, at the end of work, at the end of my real goals. And so that's how I look at life is okay. What does a parenting goal look like? What's a goal I can have with my kid? What's a goal I can have with my wife?
- [53:26]
Jenny Urich
And that's the heart of it, isn't it? Give your family the best of you, not what's left over. Be brave, be weird. Audition your goals. Go first. Track your progress. And when life gets loud, turn the dial down. I hope this John Acuff mashup leaves you with fresh energy, fresh soundtracks, and renewed sense that what you're doing matters. If you love this episode, share it with a friend, screenshot it tag us on Instagram, or send it to someone who's trying to make a change and needs some encouragement. Thanks for spending part of your summer with us. I'm Ginny Urich. This is the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. See you next time.
- [54:00]
John Acuff
Do you want to learn the Bible in a way that's encouraging, surprising, and even entertaining? Check out the Bible Stories podcast. Each week, Bible Stories brings you classics, you know, and hidden gems that you might have missed. Have you ever heard about the time that King David fought a giant and he lost? Or when Paul preached so long a guy fell asleep he tumbled out out a window and had to be brought back to life? Did you know that God himself buried Moses and that Michael the Archangel and the devil fought over Moses body? Yeah, it gets wild. So tune in for storytelling that's biblical, insightful and a lot of fun. Subscribe today to Bible Stories with Matt Mullins and Todd Hammons, available wherever you get your podcasts.