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The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast
1KHO 573: Life is Good Today | Danielle Kartes, The Best Kids Cookbook
01:04:26
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- [00:01]
A
Hey friends, Ginny here. If you have felt a little heavy lately, this brand new episode is pure sunshine. Today I'm joined by cookbook author and TV chef Danielle Cardes and it is the most peppy, joy soaked conversation we've ever had in close to 600 episodes. We talk perseverance, Costco miracles, kids in the kitchen, and how to make dinner time feel like a warm hug, even even on busy nights. My hope is that this episode lifts you up today and if it does, would you text it to one friend who could use a smile? It takes just a few seconds and helps more families hear it. Are you ready to feel encouraged and inspired? Press play on. Life is good today. Fall is about to be in full swing. And because it's already starting to get a little chilly in the mornings and evenings, I've been slowly but surely refreshing my wardrobe with pieces that actually work. Things I'll wear on repeat, not just once. That's where Quince comes in. They make it easy to stay warm, look polished and save money. All without sacrificing quality. Speaking of chillier temps, I'm absolutely loving the Mongolian cashmere gloves I recently got because my hands seem to always be cold and I can easily toss them in my purse or backpack just in case the weather changes quickly. I've also been eyeing their wool coats. They look totally designer but cost a fraction of the price. And their 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters. They start at just $50 and are incredibly soft. What makes Quint's different is how smart their model is. They partner directly with ethical top tier factories and cut out the middlemen so you get luxury quality clothing at half the price of similar brands. It's a wardrobe upgrade that feels smart, stylish and effortless. Honestly, I've even been browsing their bedding and travel bags lately. Quint's is turning into a one stop shop around here. Keep it classy and cozy this fall with long lasting staples from Quint's. Go to quince.com outside for free shipping and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com outside.
- [02:01]
B
Hello. Hello.
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A
So nice to meet you.
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B
How are you? Oh my gosh. I'm such a huge fan of yours. So this is like a little fangirly moment for me.
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A
Oh so fun.
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B
Let's just put it out there. Girl. Fan girl. I love it. I'm so excited to chat with you. How fun.
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A
Danielle. I love it.
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B
Okay.
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A
This is fantastic.
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B
So huge.
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A
Congrats.
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B
I'm like, yeah, we both have our books. I love it.
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A
I know. And it is delightful. I took a whole bunch of notes on it and a little bit off of your website, too. Off of rusticdorfood.com.
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B
Thank you.
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A
Tell me, Danielle, what you want to make sure that we let the audience know about. Besides the cookbook.
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B
Besides the cookbook. Basically, what I do like rustic, joyful food. We really teach people that life is good today. Not if or when. I think a lot of times, as people, and women especially, we live like, gosh, if I just lose five pounds, I'm gonna be happy. If my kids are just listening, if I just work through my marriage, like, if I could just learn to cook if my fridge is full. These are the things that make us happy. But we gotta live right now, for right now with the Lord, period.
- [03:04]
A
I. We're just gonna go. We're in it. I can't. I'm not gonna be able to cut that out. So. Welcome to the podcast, everyone. We're already in it with lovely Danielle Cartes. Cartes. I didn't even. I didn't even say whatever you want asked Curtis. I mean, I didn't have a chance to ask because you just, like, dove in to, like, I'm about crying. It's been nice.
- [03:23]
B
You're gonna get my whole heart. There's so much. Everything that we do, it's not just about selling books and being kitschy and all the things. We're real. I'm really after people's hearts and just introducing them to Jesus. That's it. That's the end of my job. And if I can teach you how to make a cool pot roast or get your kids involved in the kitchen or to move through heartbreak, we're going to do it.
- [03:44]
A
Oh, I'm so glad that, you know, occasionally I get the cookbooks in the mail, and I'm like, how am I supposed to do a podcast about a cookbook? But, you know, some of them have. There's always extra themes and, you know, so I go back and forth about saying yes or no, and I was looking at all the things that you offer in this particular cookbook that's. You're gonna have to tell me. I would have asked you all the questions, but you started to say so many amazing things. I'm a little unprepared for.
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B
I love you.
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A
A quick second. Is it already out?
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B
It is already out. Came out August 19th. Yep. Bad boy into the world on August 19th.
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A
Okay, this is already out. So people can get it now. It is called I love this. It is called the best kids Cookbook.
- [04:23]
B
Yep. Very basic, very SEO friendly. Okay. Search engine optimization. We're really. You know What? As a 43 year old lady, I'm really finally trying to work the interwebs in my favor.
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A
Danielle, it's so amazing. Do you know, I have a book that just came out, is called Homeschooling.
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B
What? You're genius. Because guess what? You know. And I was proudly homeschooled from kindergarten to second grade.
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A
Amazing.
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B
Amazing.
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A
It just so. I love the title, the best kids Cookbook. And when I started to look into who you were and what you had to offer and you know, you're a celebrity chef featured on the Kelly Clarkson show. And today you have like 1 million cookbooks.
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B
Girl. We written 14. And in there is a sneaky little sweet memoir called you are always there that. It's essays about my life and the things that my husband and I went through and how we lost our restaurant and we went bankrupt and lost everything, but we didn't lose each other. Like, that whole book is so special to me. It's called you'd are Always There. Because I do think that women especially, we lose our identity to things that happen to us. We think we lose our identity, but I believe that you can never lose who you are in Jesus, period. Full stop. We can lose our way a little bit, but that book is special to me too. That's called you were Always There. There's a shameless plug for that guy. But it's a special collection of essays about motherhood and life and loss and just moving through it and finding the Lord in everything.
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A
I can't wait to read it, actually. I don't think. I'd hardly ever read memoirs, and still I started until I started podcasting. And then a couple got sent my way and I really adore them. You know, it's just a little bit of a twist on a biography. It's like where you're taking the really impactful stories and weaving these life truths through them. I. I love memories. I can't wait to read it. I'm totally gonna read it. Okay. So, Danielle, 14 cookbooks by age 43. I don't even know how that happens.
- [06:10]
B
It is actually the craziest thing in the whole world. When our restaurant closed. Rewind. 14 years ago, I decided I will never cook again. I'm like, hey, cooking is not. We went. We had to file for bankruptcy. We lost everything. We had this brand new little baby. And I thought, okay, you know what? I'm stepping Away from cooking. I'm getting back into makeup. I was a professional makeup artist for God. Just had different plans. And it's so funny, because when Noah was six months old, he's now 14, we couldn't afford baby food. And I was. We just got the little vouchers to get the little. So it was. It's called WIC here in Washington state, and we would get the little vouchers, and Noah would not eat the baby food. So I thought, I'm going to have to roast some vegetables. I'm going to have to see what I can do for this little guy. So I started roasting vegetables, and Noah loved them. And then my husband was like, well, gosh, if you're cooking again. Because I was really healing after the restaurant closed. He said, do you think you can make pasta? So I started cooking again, and it really awoken me. Like, I do like this. I really do enjoy it, and it is cheaper. And then I thought, maybe I'll write the recipes down from the restaurant so we don't lose them. And that's what started Rustic joyful food. My very first book is called My Heart's Table. And I was just sharing before we were healed, all the stuff that we went through and all the recipes and people really resonated with it, and we got that little guy into Costco. Then I wrote another book. What? Yes.
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A
That is my Lifestream. And my live stream has been totally dashed, Danielle, because Costco doesn't carry books anymore.
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B
This is a heartbreaking thing that I have had to get over for the last couple years. I don't know who is at the top over there, but if you are listening to this, we like buying our books at Costco. Okay.
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A
Yes.
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B
Joy did it. It was an iconic moment at the time because you remember what a big deal it is. It was like the Holy Grail. You get your book into Costco, and somewhere.
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A
Yes, it is the Holy Grail. It was my life's goal. Dash.
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B
Yes.
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A
Your first book. You got to tell me all more. Tell me about the restaurant closing.
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B
Okay, so the restaurant was incredible. But you know what? I was really selfish during that time in my life, and I thought I was super cool, and I thought, like, oh, my gosh, I've got it together. I don't need this husband that I just picked up. We've got other plans. He's gonna go his separate way. I'm gonna go mine. I'm gonna be this restaurant mogul, and it's gonna be wonderful. And then I was pregnant with Noah And I didn't. And Mike and I were like, we have to work this out. And so I know that they say, don't. I say this all the time in interviews. Like, they say, don't, you know, don't have a child to save your marriage. But God absolutely used Noah. Completely transform our lives. And so when the rest. I got put on bed rest, I had preeclampsia. So that was really difficult. And Mike was working his job, and he had swing shift delivering bread. Then he would go to the restaurant. Things were completely falling apart because that little guy is not a restaurateur. He hated it. And I'm at home in bed trying to, you know, trying to stay alive. And then Noah came. Everything changed. It was so hard, but we were also so happy. Like, this little baby changed absolutely everything. And so we literally fell in love again. Pound cake. No food. We had no food. We ate frozen pound cake for that whole summer. While we tried to figure out, like, what our next steps were, Mike continued working at his job. I had Noah, and we just slowly started putting one foot in front of the other. And then when I started writing this cookbook, like, I do everything big, and we had no means at the time. And I'm like, I want to write this little cookbook. I'm going to get it out there. I'm going to sell it to people. And so I was doing makeup one day in Nordstrom. I don't know if I can say brands and stuff, but I was at Nordstrom doing makeup, teaching a little class. And there was a woman who said, I love your makeup. Would you do my makeup for my wedding? So I said, absolutely. I'll do your makeup for your wedding. She hands me a little business card, and I said, oh. She was a buyer at Costco. And I said, oh, I have a cookbook. And it was like, oh, that's cute. Like that. That. She's like, how about you? Makeup, and I'll see what I can do.
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A
What kind of a story is this? She was a buyer.
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B
A buyer. She was a buyer at Costco. And she handed me her little card, and she was really taken aback because she was like, you're doing makeup here, and you wrote a cookbook, and it didn't match and didn't. I said, yes, I absolutely wrote this book, and I would love to get into Costco. I just had high hopes. Like, I feel like all through life, I've been like that kindergarten that was like, I'm going to be. I'm going to fly to the Moon, I have always felt that way. They never went away for me. Like, oh, you want to do it? Let's do it. Doesn't matter if we know anybody. So fast forward to me doing her makeup. She hands me a little envelope with my payment. And there was another info, there was another phone number and another woman's name. And she said, go ahead and give this gal a call. So I was so excited. I waited the whole weekend. So Monday morning comes, I give her a phone call and I was expecting a message, like a little answering machine. But she answered like she was ready for my call. And I was so pumped. And I explained who I was and she was so kind, but very dismissive. She said, you know what, we're just so happy that you love Costco. We are just thrilled for you, but it's just not, we're just not buying at this time. We're not interested. And I just kept talking. I was like, no, you gotta be interested. You gotta be interested. You don't understand. So she, I mean I literally kept pushing and it was back and forth and she was very nice and I said, listen, I live in Issaquah, Washington. At the time we did, you're in Issaquah, Washington. I believe this is a sign. Let me drop this off at the front desk for you. I don't even need to see you. If you don't like this book, please read the introduction. If you don't like this book, recycle it, thrift it, give it away. We never have to talk again. And she agreed. She said, okay Danielle, you can drop it off. I dropped that book off with a little one page summary on why Costco. And three months later she called me and she said, it's beautiful, we would absolutely love to carry it. And that decision changed my life. I started working from the Costco. We had sold out signing after sold out signing in our little local Costco's. But not because people knew who I was. I was working that line because I was self published. I was like, every single copy of these books.
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A
You got a self published book.
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B
Into Costco. She called me and said, we'd love to talk to your attorney. I said, well, I can pretend my name is Donna and call you from my mom's house. I don't have an attorney, I can't afford one. It's never going to happen. I had to work with my little print on demand self published company for six months to get them to say yes to going to Costco. They said, this will ruin you. You don't understand Costco orders. Big, big, big stuff. And in the world of books, you get to return what you don't sell. So it' on loan from the retailer. They're like, guess what? We care about you, Danielle. We've never met you, but if you get returns, you, your little lonesome self will be buying them back. And that's the publishing model that a peop that people don't really know even to this day. You pay for your returns. So I didn't go.
- [12:56]
A
That was risky.
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B
That was. That was risky. And I do remember I had $3,000 in returns. And even after great sales and I worked my little booty off that entire summer paying those returns back. And $3,000 worth was all the money in the world to us at that time. It's still a lot of. Still a lot of money. But, I mean, I remember picking up shifts, and Noah was so tiny. And it was just such a crazy time in our life. But being in Costco, people were like, how did you get in Costco? I had authors with big publishers. The big fives.
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A
Yeah.
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B
Calling me and emailing me saying, what did you do to get into Costco? How much did it cost? Who's your PR company? Who's this? Who's that? And I was like, listen, I have the best PR guy in the whole world. His name is Jesus. He absolutely loves me. I barely graduated high school. I have no formula or a secret sauce for you. It was the wildest time in our life. I mean, still wild. And that led to me working on our little local tv. We have this cute little show called New Day Northwest. I started doing cooking segments there, and then I was like, oh, my goodness. I asked my producer there. I said, hey. She said, you know what? You're cut out for tv. And I said, oh, this is wonderful. And I said, great. So how can you get me on more tv? And she said, well, I don't really know anybody. Fast forward six months. She said, remember when I told you I didn't know anybody? I said, yeah. She goes, I didn't like you then. Now I know you. But I fell in love. Not that she didn't like me, but she's like, I don't even know you. I don't owe you anything. She then says to me, I do know someone over at the Rachel Ray Show. So I heard. I pestered the Rachel Ray Show.
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A
I don't know anyone. Except I do know Rachael Ray.
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B
I don't know anybody at all. Yeah, this little. This 20, 30 minute meals ring a bell? So I wrote that show for a solid year, begging, put me on the show, put me on the show, put me on the show. They finally put me on the show. There's so much more to that story, but I feel like I'm just rambling on. You feel free. Ramble time. So we get on that show and you know, over those, over those years, just one door led to another door and then we started working on Pickler and Ben and Hallmark home and family for three years. And all the while I was self publishing my little books because if I could get a book out then I could go on tour and I had more things to promote, it would all, all ships rise. So I think, ok. We were literally barely living on. I mean every book I sold I made a couple bucks and I would, would cover printing. And I'm like, okay, if I can sell, you know, 20 books this week, it's X number of dollars for our family. And so it was just like it was this necessity until my husband said we got to come out with book number two. This is my side, this is my side job. So. And my husband is a photographer. He taught himself how to take pictures. Now here we are 14 years later and he's this sought after renowned photographer doing food and lifestyle and traveling. But this is what God did with our Y just said, okay, Lord, we don't have anything like what? What do you want for our lives? What do you want us to do? And it's so neat to see the progression and how. Mike and I have been married now for almost 18 years. He's my best friend, my biggest cheerleader. We still go through all kinds of stuff. I think that marriage is this constant healing and now we have kids that are teenagers, have an 8 year old and a 14 year old. It brings up so much. And like this is my partner. Mike doesn't complete me. The Lord does. We're, we just compliment each other. I think that that's a my marriage. You chase these like butterflies and gosh, I want to feel like I was dating. You couldn't pay me to go back to feeling like I was dating again. What you have in marriage after so many years is so much more powerful and fun than any of the butterflies. I never want to go back to butterflies when I have a fire now. So I feel like there's so much out there we just give in. And the heart, the hard stuff is where it's mined. So I mean my life has been this, honestly this fun culmination of broken dreams. Things I thought I was going to do, things I thought I was going to be. And then God just has said, hey, you know what? If you're willing, buckle up. And he gave me this quirky, weird personality. And I love people to a fault and it just doesn't stop. Like I said in kindergarten, people start to grow out of the things they think they can do. I never grew out of it. My kids will never grow out of what they think they can do. I'm still behind my husband, shoving him into areas like, I know you were made for this. I can't be the Holy Spirit in his life, but I do try often. God can do so much. If you say yes, get yourself there for everybody. It's not just me. We're not the special people. I never want people to look to me. I want them to look to the Lord and know that God created them with this unique set of gifts. They chose their kids for their home. God chose us to be the way that we are, lock, stock and barrel. All the weird stuff, all the problems, all the things that we go and go through, God chose that for us so we can learn to lean on him. And I just think that, you know, people are like, gosh, we live in such a horrible time right now. The world is falling.
- [17:43]
A
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- [19:58]
B
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A
Listen, this is what this was what I was expecting. How do you make homemade ketchup?
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B
Lot of vinegar. That's what I was expecting. Oh, you're so cute. How do you make homemade ketchup? We didn't know we were going to church. Okay, I am available.
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A
Oh wow. This is so intriguing to me because you really do have so Many cookbooks. But there are so many facets to your story and what you're sharing with people. Do people have any idea?
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B
How do you know? That's so funny. I've been trying to figure out ways to, like, get it out there a little bit more, because this is my heart. And it's funny because God chose the vehicle of food. I used to be like, when I first got into this game, I thought, how am I supposed to teach people about hope and then how to make a recipe? Like, how does that even work, Lord? Like, oh, I'm in a church or a MOPS group, and I'm like. And then you stir the cabbage like this, and you know that your life is worth more than mothering. Don't you ever get caught up in a lie? This is so funny. I went to a church years ago, and I was teaching at their ladies nights, and I wanted so badly to share the gospel, but they just wanted me to stir a cake up on the stage. So I would literally try to work a message into the cake. Because I'm like, listen, the cake is fine. We all get a cake. You can Google a cake recipe. What's the secret? The secret is, do you know that your life is not worthless? Do you know that you're not the sum of all the horrible things that have happened to you? I would literally just try to work it in. And I do remember them saying, like, hey, stick to the recipe. And I wouldn't. And then, I mean, I probably did that five or six times during the little ladies nights. And then they didn't have me back anymore because I wasn't, like, a vetted preacher. But it's funny how I just knew deep in my heart that that's what women are hungry for. We love recipes, but we are hungry to know our worth in the Lord. And it's funny because I want to feed your soul first, and then I'll show you how to figure out how to make a really fast, cute little curr. Uh, I mean, I love cooking, but it's not. It's not my love. Do you. Does that make sense?
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A
Yeah.
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B
Like, I love cooking. It's not who I am, though. God just chose cooking as a vehicle so that I could share with people how much they were worth.
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A
Danielle, you know, people listening with their kids.
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B
Yeah.
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A
I want them to make sure they're hearing your perseverance. So kids are listening in. What did you do? You know, you. Every single day for a year, you're asking, can I? Come on. The.
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B
Rachel.
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A
Rachel.
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B
Yeah.
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A
You Know, you're. You're going to the lady who says, we can't get yourself published book in Costco because Matthew McConaughey is in Costco. And, like, I mean, what in the world? Like, the books in Costco are just like, I have a book through DK Publishing. It's sitting right there. I'm pointing at it, and it's like, they've had books in Costco that are the same trim level and the COVID fields and matte cover. I'm like, get mine in there.
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B
Get mine in there.
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A
Yes and no. No DK books. Nope, didn't go in there. But you're self published because the lady said no. And you're like, yes. Can you read it? I'm going to bring it to you.
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B
For any child listening, too, don't take no for an answer. Sometimes, just because something's hard doesn't mean the Lord didn't bring you to it. Just because something is difficult doesn't mean you should stop now. I really do believe in the power of discernment and the Holy Spirit. Like, hey, you know what? We tried. God closed that door. We do move on. That happens in our life all the time. But that quiet determination, like, why not you? I think Russell Wilson said that. Like, hey, why not us? Why don't we go to the football. Why don't the football dream. I don't even know what it's called. The Super Bowl.
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A
Let's go to the football dream.
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B
Go to the football dream. You and me. Why not us? Why not you? Kids are listening.
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A
Oh, yes.
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B
I also believe that we're so far removed with agents and agencies, they're never going to be into a project like you are. You poured your heart and soul into that book and that baby. And I'm always like, get me in the room. If you can get me in the room, it's as good as done. I believe that. I'm like, get me in that room. And it's funny, too. Even booking podcasts and things like that. My publisher now, I love them. They're listening to this. They do a wonderful job. But sometimes they don't know you as well as you know yourself. And they could be pitching you to a show. And then the show is like, oh, no, great, we're passing on this. We're not going to have it. And then I'll try to look around like, okay, who do I know that knows this producer that. That knows this person that. I could write a little. This is what happened with you. I was like, not that you Guys said no, but I sent you a little DM one evening. I was like, listen, I'm obsessed with Ginny. 1000. 1000 hours outside is on a bucket list. So sure, lo and behold, I went to look you up. I almost peed my pants because I didn't know you were following me. And when I saw that you're following me, I was like, the DMs are wide open. Dear Jenny, I love you so much. Would you. Can I be on your podcast? Here we are.
- [25:38]
A
I do the same thing.
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B
Thing.
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A
I do the same thing.
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B
Yes.
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A
And then I'll be like. And then you're like, who are they connected with? So you're like, I've had this person on my show, and that person, and I kind of once spoke to that person or touched their shoulder. So, like, you know, we're all connected.
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B
Absolutely quiet.
- [25:54]
A
Determination. Kids listening in have perseverance. These are incredible skills. And then the other thing for especially for, like, a person that's younger, is their sort of heading off into their life. You're talking about how the vehicle of food is a vehicle. So what is your vehicle? What is your vehicle? To spread light into the world and look at it that way.
- [26:14]
B
Yes. And you look at too, like, what are your gifts? And be open to what God wants to use and to get your gift into the world. I never would have known. Even when Manola was closing, I remember standing on those doorsteps, crying, weeping, saying, God, you promised me you were going to provide for me through this place. But God had a completely different plan, and he did. Look, here I am 14 years later with this robust career that makes me feel, like, pinch myself. I can't believe that I get to do the things that I get to do. And it's all because. And I didn't think back then, I was like, gosh, you, you, Lord, you told me, and did I not hear you? And he just had it in a completely different way. Like. So I just look at these things like, they're just setbacks. I try to tell that to my kids, too. That confidence that you have when you. You can be a superhero. You can fly, you can do all these things. Don't let anybody tell you that you can't, because maybe you're going to invent something incredible. Look at the Wright brothers. They believe that they could fly and they made the first airplane. So I know that if you are out there and you know that there's something that you used to want to do and it feels too big, keep going and trying because God's going to use a different vehicle and you might build a machine that can rip through the air.
- [27:21]
A
This is so good. You might one day write the best kids cookbook.
- [27:27]
B
The best. Not just any old cookbook, but when you are searching at 11:30 at night and you want to know what's the best kids cookbook, you may come across this collection written by a wild lady in the middle of the night on her phone. Do you know I write all my books on my phone?
- [27:44]
A
No, I didn't know that.
- [27:45]
B
In the notes section on my phone. That's actually sort of a crazy, fun little thing.
- [27:49]
A
Unbelievable. It's so unconventional.
- [27:51]
B
It just goes to show you don't.
- [27:53]
A
Have to do things the way that everybody else says. You don't have to follow the same paths. You don't have to, you know, and, and, and there's that verse that says, in our heart we plan our course, but the Lord determines our steps. And you can look at something like the Nordstrom story.
- [28:08]
B
Yes.
- [28:09]
A
That changed your life. And you're like, well, what if you wouldn't have been there that day?
- [28:12]
B
I got scared. Yeah. What if I. Oh, she's, she's from Costco. She doesn't want me. I just have a little self published, homely little book. What if she doesn't want me? I have this weird confidence. I was like, no, guess what? Why not? Let me ask. And it's funny because sometimes people will scoff at you a little. Not meaning to be mean, but they're just like, oh, yeah, really? I bet you wrote a cookbook. She's like, that's really special. I'm happy for you. People don't think like, oh, wow, she's real. It's real. She's really, she's, she's determined and serious. Even when I was writing the Rachel Rachel show over and over and over again, I'm like, hello, my name is Danielle. How's your day? What's up for lunch? Can I be on the show? Can I come on the show? Can I come on the show? And I just think it's so funny because sometimes people are like, oh my gosh, we got to get this lady on here so she can get out of our hair. And then it opens up this beautiful relationship. And relationships are far more paramount than just making that connection. Like, okay, they said, yes, but you do want. I mean, I'm never an annoyance. I mean, I don't think I do have some good self awareness, but I never know if I'm totally annoying. But I do think that it's great to be self aware and know when it's time to, you know, jump ship. But there is. There's rare times that I jump ship. I was on a an did interview recently and someone was like, well, how did you know it was time for your restaurant to close? And I said, listen, I am a hanger honor. I will hang off until the Lord picks me off and says, oh, no, you sit down. That determination is my greatest blessing and sometimes a curse.
- [29:41]
A
I mean, in all of the things that have happened since then. Since you were doing makeup at Nordstrom.
- [29:46]
B
Yes.
- [29:47]
A
What did your heart have to heal from?
- [29:50]
B
My heart had to heal from broken expectations, I think. That's so funny. We think things are supposed to turn out a certain way, especially when you get saved or you learn to live life with Jesus. We think, oh, gosh, I love the Lord. This sets me apart. But sometimes it puts a target on you because you are living for the Lord and you can't stop. Like, I. I did have to heal from what I thought it was supposed to be. I thought that my restaurant was supposed to be great. I thought my marriage was supposed to be perfect. I thought I was going to have easy pregnancies. I mean, it took an act of God to get both of my children into the world because they will change the world. And that sometimes we think, gosh, it should be easier than this. Says who? I mean, says who? It's not supposed to be easier than this. We're not supposed to have our bank accounts full all the time. That doesn't mean God is good. God is good all the time. And all the time, God is good. And I believe that with every fiber of my being. I know what it's like to lose my house. I know what it's like. I could cry right now. I know it's like to have my car repoed. My son was like 3 years old when our car got repoed. And he stood in the window and he said, mama, they ticked our car. And I was so, like, embarrassed and devastated. And I said, yeah, buddy, but that's what God gave us. Legs. We can walk and we can catch the bus, and we can do all kinds of wonderful things and we can save up for a new car. And God never left us. He never left us. We never went hungry. And I just. I want people to have that same sort of unwavering hope. And it's easy on this side. People think like, oh, gosh, it's easy for you. You work on television shows or you have book deals. Or, you know, cool people. It was not always like that. I know that at any drop of a hat, if God said, hey, I want you to lay this down. I might be sad about it, but there, hey, it's me and the Lord we're walking on. You can catch me in a different job if that's what God wants for our life. And that's what life is all about. It's this journey to get closer to the Lord. I'm a woman in my 40s now. I'm 43. And the things that I enjoy now, I never enjoyed in my 20s, like being outside and looking at bees. I could literally watch a bee go from a flower to a flower to a flower, hour, for an hour. And that you would never catch me doing that. My 20s, I was like, that's so boring. That's so weird. That's for old people. Now. I'm like, in awe. I will weep at a sunset. I make my kids stop and peel their eyes open. I'm like, look at God's creation. Look what God did. I'm like, in a couple of years, you guys are going to weep at this. I know you don't get it now, but you will stand before the glory of this sunset and understand that. This is so cool. Look how tiny we are. I mean, it's just my life is nothing but a bless. It has been a bless. It's a blessing to be alive.
- [32:28]
A
Wow. And all of that came out of broken expectations and store that closed down and things that are so hard. It's never the end.
- [32:36]
B
Never.
- [32:37]
A
It's never the end. It reminded me of that verse about the secret of being content. You know that there's one where it's.
- [32:44]
B
Like, Paul, I love Paul. Oh, my gosh. Talk about cool beginnings. Truth.
- [32:50]
A
Yeah. But learn the secret of being content, whether well fed or hungry, and. And what a secret to learn.
- [32:56]
B
Yeah.
- [32:56]
A
What a secret to learn and to be able to pass on to your kids and to have that expectation.
- [33:01]
B
It comes from pressing.
- [33:02]
A
Yeah.
- [33:03]
B
And you've got to be open to the Lord too. Sometimes I'm like, oh, Lord, give me strength. Who now? I used to be scared to pray that. I'm like, I just asked you to give me strength. I mean, you're going to give me some trials. We're about to go through some stuff now. I don't fear it. I'm like, okay, bring it on. I may cry in it, but it's funny, too. One of. I went through a really difficult time a couple years ago. One of my dear Friends passed away. And I've always known the power of the Holy Spirit. Like you, I grew up knowing it. I'm like, oh, the Holy Spirit is our helper. All those things. But there was a realness and a rawness to the comfort of the Holy Spirit during my. During that time in my life. And I just started sharing with everybody. I mean, I was broken during that summer. And I remember just sharing with people. Do you know the power of the Holy Spirit? And they're like, yeah, of course I know the power of the Holy Spirit. Yes, it's great. He's great, right? We take it for granted this is the only side of heaven that we get to experience this level of comfort from the Holy Spirit. When we go to heaven, it's different. And we forget these, like, gifts that are here on earth for us to just run to. And I feel like I view my relationship with Jesus so different after breaking and pressing. And you got to understand, like, if we can get on the other side of it and not allow the bitterness to take root, because there are people listening that have been through things that are far harder than anything I experienced. I mean, I think my hardness is like a blip on the radar of things. Radar of things that are actually hard. I mean, but if we can harness the power of the Holy Spirit and allow that, the comforting of our soul, we can get on the other side of it and see Jesus in all of it and become unshakable.
- [34:36]
A
And I think you look at a story like yours and you. And you listen. And if people read the memoir and it causes you to pause and think, does God have something immeasurably better for me? You know, like you talked about when you were saying your restaurant closed. And I'm like, I don't know what the restaurant is. And then you ended up seeing it in conversation. You said, Manola. Yeah, I never heard of that. But guess what? I've heard of Costco.
- [34:57]
B
Yes, you have. You know, and what if I stop? What if we stop because we learn and the enemy's the ruler of this world? He thinks like, he comes. Comes to steal, kill, and destroy. If you have little. Little guys, little kids listening, that's the biggest goal, is distraction and discouragement. Sometimes it's not like a big, giant, huge thing. It's like, if you can get distracted and you can get discouraged, you're going to stop. And that's the. That's the point. Well, if he can stop you, then you don't step into God's fullness for your Life. And God's fullness for your life doesn't mean being on shows. It doesn't mean being known by people. God's fullness for your life is that fulfillment of the gifts of that he's given you to call people for his glory. I could care less if at the very end of this, you do not know my name. If you can't remember my name, I would appreciate it if you bought a book, but I could give boots. But I do want you to remember some things that came out of my mouth. That's it. I don't care if you know my name. My name is not the name to be glorified. And if we can live like that, it does get infinitely interesting. It gets pretty cool. I mean, God's gonna open fun and funky doors. I never wanna leave and be like, gosh, I hope they remember me. I don't ever worry about somebody remembering me.
- [36:15]
A
That's who you're pointing to. Yeah. And what a thing. I think then you have that as a foundation forever, where you're like, okay, if something doesn't go your way, where you think you have an expectation of how it's going to go, and it doesn't go your way. You remember Manoa?
- [36:27]
B
Yeah.
- [36:27]
A
And you're like, listen, that's what I thought was going to be the pinnacle. That was my plan.
- [36:32]
B
What a different pinnacle in that basket.
- [36:36]
A
Yeah. And what a higher mountaintop. Costco and Rachael Ray and Kelly Clarkson and today and 14 cookbooks. And what a legacy. Then you leave for your family. I mean, it's incredible.
- [36:49]
B
All right.
- [36:50]
A
Ketchup.
- [36:52]
B
Super cool. You know what's so cool about ketchup? Tomato paste and vinegar and certain seasonings are actually really delicious. And you're not going to get that silky smooth, high fructose corn syrup ketchup, but you are going to get a slightly grainy, delicious, quick ketchup if you're a texture person. Like, I love texture. My kids sometimes balk about it, but I'm really trying to train them. Like, just taste it. Just try it. And the cool thing is, too. I learned this a while ago. You have to taste something 15 times before you know if you actually truly like it or you don't like it. And so I never try to steer an adult like, oh, my gosh. Okay, you don't like mushrooms. I'm not trying to change your mind. You don't like a mushroom. But for kids, I like to say, hey, okay, try it. What is it about it that you don't like Is it the earthy flavor? Is it because water squishes out when you bite it? I mean, what are the things that make you not like a mushroom? And it's funny because kids, like my.
- [37:44]
A
Son will say, it's slimy.
- [37:46]
B
It's slimy. Or the water that squishes out of it. I'm like, oh, I can fix that. I'm going to heat my pan up. I'm going to evaporate that water. We're going to add oil to it. So when all the water's cooked out, when you bite the mushroom now, is it squishy? Do you like the texture? And so I'm working on my kids that way. Like, that's the power of cooking, which is kind of cool. Cool. What don't you like about it? Do you like a cherry tomato? But you love tomato sauce. Well, you don't like that popping texture in your mouth. So, I mean, there's certain fun things you can kind of uncover. I went to a girlfriend's house 15 years ago, and she had, like, little tiny bowls of, like, apple slices, peas, like, crazy little things before dinner. And she called it toddler topis. And she said, okay, everybody get around. Like, you all have to pick three pieces, and you eat it. And I was like, oh, my gosh, this is so cool. Cool. To this day, we have little bowls of peas, apple slices, cubes of cheese. And it's. It happens at dinner time. So your kid's not, like, grazing, and then they're not going to eat their, you know, piece of meatloaf. But it is this little fun appetizer y thing. And then it gets your kids in there with you, and you're kind of, like, having a little snack and chatting, and it just builds on the whole communal meal. Such a cool thing. My kid's 15. I'm sure he will have little bowls of peas, pea pods, and cubes of cheese at his house. His wife's gonna be like, what are we doing?
- [39:00]
A
These little touch points in life. That's such a small touch point now. Is it going to be like your grandkids are doing that? You know, someday? I mean, what an interesting thing to look at life in that way that. That we plan our course, but the Lord determines our steps. And so all of these things are happening according to his plan. And here you are. Book 14, the Best Kids Cookbook.
- [39:20]
B
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A
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B
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A
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- [41:21]
A
And I want to talk about because I really love when things are geared toward kids. And this is very much geared toward kids. It's very much something that it's a skill. It's a skill that is very likely. It's lost. This is the skill of cooking because you know, they, they like marketed that it was drudgery and it's not. It's actually not. It's so good for you.
- [41:45]
B
I love it. The cool thing about this book too is I wanted to write it as a tool and when we get in the kitchen, I think a lot of people think, okay, I need a recipe I have to follow that's teaching me to cook. And it does, but it's not the whole picture. What teaches you how to cook is like thinking on Your feet. Okay, I'm open my pantry. I've got some half a pound of ground chicken, or I'm in my freezer. I've got some chicken thighs that have been in there, and they're starting to get. Freezer broom. We got to pull those bad boys out. What are we gonna do with the chicken thighs? What kind of sauce are we into? What will my kids eat? But what will my. My husband and I enjoy? I mean, what are some. I want people to start thinking, like, what do I have? How can I pull it together? And let's say there is a recipe, like, you want to make fajitas, but you don't have bell peppers, and you don't have chicken breast, but you have some chicken thighs, and you do have onions, and you have some zucchini. Well, there's. There's little fun things in here called flip it or skip it. So you can flip a recipe. You can get your kids thinking, if I don't have this, I can substitute this. What do we have? And so then I give suggestions like, hey, these little pancakes. Top with raspberries, Top them with fruit, a different fruit. Top with peaches. Skip the fruit altogether. If that's in our house all the time, it's like, oh, there's no fruit. The kids ate it all. And I haven't gone to the grocery store. Bananas are out, apples are out. I might have some applesauce. Well, you could make a really fun apple cinnamon topping to go on that same pancake recipe. So the cool thing is about this guy is that it's really teaching kids crisp, critical thinking in the kitchen. What can I do? How can I do it? And there's a whole section in the front that talks about how to season and when spices, culinary terms. What does it mean to boil versus simmer? So these things are so fun for kids, like, and you gotta treat them like an adult. I mean, I treat my kids like adults, probably to a fault, but I'm like, you can do this. You can handle this. What does the book say? And I love that piece of this because that's missing in a lot of kids cookbooks. You get a collection of recipes that seem to be kid friendly, but this is actually giving those life skills to children so that they can cook for their. The rest of their life. Yeah. And they'll get. I mean, there's recipes like rockin Red beans and sausage, and then there's chicken little individual chicken pot pies. But every recipe's got an offering of how you could switch it up which is so cool.
- [43:55]
A
Yeah. It's the lost skills. It's the last skills of how to know when your cake is done. How to line the pans with parchment paper that are, you know, the round pans. How do you mince herbs, you know, how do you multiply recipe? You know, hey, guess what? You're going to have a party. You're gonna have a birthday party. You know, how do you multiply that recipe? So these are life skills that really, over time, they were lost because the processed food industry marketed. And I've looked back at some of the articles, like, look, you guess what you can do. You can throw in the microwave and you can sit in front of the tv. You know, that was the marketing message for a really long time, is taking those domestic skills and putting them in a bad light. And so there's people and, like, you know, it's like, I didn't cook with my mom or I didn't cook with my grandma because it was lost in the generations. So this is perfect.
- [44:37]
B
Yeah.
- [44:37]
A
For teaching those lost skills. And you say this. When we cook, the world opens up. We get to explore different tastes. We get to find new favorites. We get to show love. And my mom always says, if you can cook, you'll have more friends.
- [44:50]
B
Amen. That's the truth. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I love that. I love your mom.
- [44:56]
A
And I have this friend named Amy Curry, and she is the best cook I know. And I swear I was like, I probably should have another baker baby, because then she'll bring me a meal.
- [45:06]
B
I would.
- [45:06]
A
I'll probably go through nine months, plus the labor. If only Amy will bring me.
- [45:12]
B
If I lived by you, I would deliver you dinner all the time. That is something I actually do. You can ask my friends. That's something I love to do, is deliver food. I like to show up with a little foil pan and all the little sections, and here's your instructions. And nine times out of 10, it's just open and enjoy. But I. That is my love language to drop food off to people. Because I know what it's like to be like having a baby or in the throes of something and have food show up or provision. And you're like, thank you, Lord. That is the coolest thing in the whole world. That's one of my superpowers, is making you dinner and bringing it to you.
- [45:43]
A
Do you have a cookbook about that?
- [45:45]
B
You know what? I have a cookbook called Meant to Share. And it is so cool. I wrote that. And it's funny. Because it got dropped during the pandemic when the world shut down. So it didn't perform as well. But it's one of my favorite books and it's called Meant to Share and it talks about food. Complete meals. And those are great because they're meant to share with people. For littles, for love, for Company. So each book, each of those books are broken down into sections. Like, these are the menus for this situation and scenario. Super cool. Yeah, I love that.
- [46:13]
A
Yes. Because when I get asked to do one of those and I'm actually in a season of life. Danielle. Okay. I feel like you go through these seasons. Like I'm actually not in it. Right. Right now. I was. You're in it for a really long time. Everybody has babies and now, like, we're sort of. I'm nearing the end of that. I mean, probably it's going to be like grandparents and surgeries. It's like the next phase, right? Yes, that's the next phase for me. But I mean, I'll break out in cold sweat when that sign up genius comes. I'm like, everybody already picked baked spaghetti. What am I going to do?
- [46:42]
B
Everybody picked taco pasta. There's like five meals on there that everybody picks. I'm in a shepherd's fight just shepherd's pie phase. That's an easy one for me to throw together, put a little. And that's fun too. I'm making one for a shoot tomorrow. We're gonna do a beefy French onion shepherd's pie, which will be so yummy. But I'm in a shepherd's pie phase. Where here. I'm like reiterating the shepherd's pie life. But that's a good one to throw in a pan, potatoes on top. It's easy to reheat a little green salad. But I still get panicky too. Like, what travels well? What's gonna still taste good and look good reheated? Cause that all changes. Changes. You're making taco salad for someone. Unless you have the components all separate, it doesn't deliver well. So I'm into all that kind of stuff. I love it. My husband I were recently at one of our good friend's wedding, but she's 20 years younger than us. So I told Mike, I'm like, we. We phased out. Now we're in our 40s. Mike's. Mike's pushing 50. We are going to be the grand. Mike said the next phase of weddings we're going to go through is our 14 year old, all of his friends. When it when they're all going through all that wedding, we'll be the adult. We'll be the parents on the dance floor, the old parents. It's so funny to see the phase of life change, because you're right. We're out of baby mode. I'm out of wedding season. We're going to be the next phase. I'm like, oh, my gosh, in a couple of years, we'll be hitting those weddings in a different way. Because I remember 10, 20 years ago, it was like all of our friends, and it was wedding after wedding after wedding after wedding. I'm like, we do 10 weddings in summer.
- [48:08]
A
Yep.
- [48:09]
B
And now it's like, it's been years since I've been to a wedding.
- [48:12]
A
Yes. Yes. And you know what's the best part? Now it's like, you know when you were like 22, you give someone 15 bucks, you know, so, like, you're going through all your wedding stuff, like 50 bucks. And then if someone gave you like a hundred dollars or $75, remembered.
- [48:26]
B
And now you're at a different phase of your life. You're like, oh, I got a couple hundred bucks for you. Pick something cool. And that used to blow my mind when I. When Mike and I were getting married. Like, the people that would pick something expensive off our registry, like the pots of pans that were like $200. I'd be like, it's all so much money. Like, how could you do that? And it was normally the adults. Yes. Yes.
- [48:45]
A
It's like your parents. Yeah. Your parents, friends, and it matters. Like, I had. It just broke. We've been married over 20 years.
- [48:53]
B
Yes, I love 20.
- [48:54]
A
And we got married in 2003. So 22 years we've been married. And just within the last six months, I had this gorgeous bowl, like a punch bowl, but I used it for trifle, which is like a cheater dessert. But anyway.
- [49:06]
B
Oh, I love a trifle. Yeah.
- [49:08]
A
But it's such a cheater dessert. It's like I do the prepackaged cake mix.
- [49:12]
B
Yes.
- [49:13]
A
Sometimes I talk in here about health. People are going to be like, this is ridiculous. But it comes from my childhood. So, like, this is the big thing that we always would take to the potluck. It's like the cake mix and then pudding and then Cool Whip and then a candy bar Heath and no food diet.
- [49:26]
B
Oh, people love it. People love it. It's so funny, too, because I'm. I'm seriously, like, I have two minds of this because. Mike, I'm sorry. I'm Gonna say it. We do hit the McDonald's drive thru every so often. Often. But I'm like, I love the eat the red meat. No seed oils. All the stuff like that's me. But then I do it. There is another side of me. There is balance. And we go on vacation. You're gonna catch me the Cheesecake Factory. And we are all chasing the high of a boxed cakes mix. Let me just tell you, there's nothing wrong with that. Okay. Melt some butter, add a scoop of Greek yogurt. Do what you need to do to get some protein in there. But it's so fun and funny to have balance. I totally get it. We're the protein. Eat your 85 million grams per meal. We are that family too. And I love health and I love whole. But you get me at the box cake. Miss. I would absolutely have a nice big dollop.
- [50:11]
A
Yes. So now you can make your own ketchup. That's going to balance you out because it's going to be no chemicals.
- [50:16]
B
You make it from your own ketchup.
- [50:19]
A
Gorgeous bowl that we had was like this thick glass. It just broke. And I thought, you know, for 22 years this was a beautiful gift that someone.
- [50:29]
B
Yes.
- [50:30]
A
Like my parent, my parents, friends got for our wedding. And it's just been such a blessing. So I am excited to be able to in that stage of that and like helping throw the showers and you know, to be in that phase of life is super exciting. Okay. Let me tell you something I was shocked about in the the best, the very, very best kids cookbook that's out there. You can get it wherever cookbooks and books are sold. This is now this one is published through Thomas Nelson and I love Thomas Nelson. So you'll be able to find this at the store, the best kids cookbook, or get it online. And actually people can check out your website because you've got all sorts of things there as well, all sorts of resources, recipes. It's called rusticjoyfulfood.com you have recipes by season and recipe by recipes by course. So like dinners and breakfast. Okay, how about this for a chapter heading?
- [51:15]
B
Yeah.
- [51:16]
A
Dear Dinner Time, we love you. I was like, no one says that.
- [51:21]
B
Actually, they don't. You know why? Because like Dear Dinner Time, you have stressed me out from the time that I woke up this morning and I don't know what I'll serve, but I'm like, no, we're flipping the script. Dear Dinner Time. Because you know what? When you're sitting in front of that bowl. Bowl. And it's done. You do love it. You're like, I am hungry. This is a stressful day. I'm gonna eat it. So I did want to teach kids, like, dinner time can be a super not stressful thing. We plan ahead a little bit, or even if we don't, you get a big old bowl of hot water and pull the frozen meat out of the freezer and stick it in the hot water. I mean, I love it.
- [51:52]
A
It even has an exclamation point. And I actually think that's a really important reframe, Danielle. Because actually, if you were to talk to most mothers, I would say. I would venture to say, say most. Most mothers would say, dear dinner time, we hate you. Yes, dinner time, we loathe you. Dear dinner time, you stress me out. And so when I open this up and it says, dear dinner time, we love you.
- [52:13]
B
Yes.
- [52:13]
A
That's a. That's a really good seed to start planting.
- [52:16]
B
Yeah.
- [52:17]
A
And there's a lot of things to learn.
- [52:19]
B
Picked up on that because that was 100% the motivation behind that phrase. Because I'm like, dinner is. It's the number one question I get. People want to know all kinds of personal things. Things like, what's Kelly Clarkson like? And how did you get into this? But then on the flip side of that, it's like, what do I make for dinner? Those are literally, how did you do this? And what are you serving for dinner? So it's funny to see that out there. But I do want people to start to reframe it a little bit and go easy on yourself. I mean, I don't know about you guys, but when I was growing up, there was, like, five staple meals. I mean, there was all kinds of things we ate. But there's nothing wrong with repetition if it is wholesome and healthy. And it's the majority of what you guys eat if you're a ground meat family. I mean, we make hamburger patties three nights a week because both of my kids love them. They're. It's great. And people are always surprised to hear that. Like, I wonder what dinner is like at your house. I'm like, it's probably very similar to your house because we have kids in sports and activities and all kinds of crazy stuff. We grow a garden. We're doing all kinds of fun things. And then it's like, oh, it's dinner time. Everybody pull together. I know my kids like green vegetables. That is a humble brag. They like zucchini and asparagus and broccoli. They eat those things and sometimes they. They don't want to eat them. But I'm like, I know you're willing. Take a couple of bites of that first, and then you can have your hamburger patty. Sometimes it's got a bun, Sometimes I'm ambitious and make brioche buns. Sometimes it's plain, sometimes it's literally on bread. I mean, but we just eat. There's repetition and spaghetti and stews and soups, and my kids happen to love curry. We make a quick version of curry probably twice a month. And that's. That's often. So, I mean, I want people to start forgiving themselves first. Like, hey, there's no expectation to live up to. You just want it. You want your kids to eat, you want them to be nourished, learn some skills and mostly build the connection. It's funny, I was doing. I told somebody a couple of days ago, I keep saying I was doing an interview. It's just because I've got a book out. So I'm doing a lot of interviews right now. It's not like I live my life giving interviews, but I also lost the train of thought of what I was going to say during that interview. But it'll come come back to me. We can skip that. But I had a good point, and I was like, wow, you said interviews so many times. But that's why. It's only because I got a book out that I keep saying in another interview, I said this and I liked it, but I forgot I just had.
- [54:34]
A
That the other day, and it never came back to me. Normally it comes back, but it never. It never came back.
- [54:39]
B
Yes. Yeah, I was like, literally just talking about. What was I talking about? Dinner time.
- [54:45]
A
Repetition, you know, forgiving yourself, and it's okay. It can okay to eat something.
- [54:49]
B
I said something the other day. Oh, this is what I said. They were like, well, what's your favorite signature meal? And like, what's something really memorable? And I said, you know what? It's more important that people remember how they feel when they ate around me or in my home than what I fed them. So if you think about your kids, they're going to remember how they felt at dinner time, how they feel in your home. You want your home to feel like respite and a warm hug and all these things. And it's. It's covering from the world. And so I think about that, like, that's what I want people to remember, how they feel, not just what they. So dinner time really is like, hey, dinner time. I love you. How do we feel around it.
- [55:28]
A
Yeah. I want to read you something that's so powerful. I just read it and I've talked about it on here. I interviewed this man named Arthur Brooks and he talks about.
- [55:34]
B
Oh, Arthur Brooks, he's a dream. How cool is that?
- [55:37]
A
He is. And how cool is it? He talks about happiness. And so he was talking about. You're going to think this is so interesting if I can find it. He was talking about, I want to be able to read it, but I don't know if I'm going to be able to. He was talking about this mother and daughter, and she was not gaining weight. So she was four years old and she was failure to thrive, and she wasn't gaining weight. And I'm like trying to frantically search through it in my notes, but she wasn't gaining weight. And they said that she had anorexia, like, as a 4 year old. And he was like, oh, was it Arthur Brooks? No, it wasn't. That's what I'm looking. I'm looking in the wrong spot. Okay, scratch that. I do like Arthur Brooks, but.
- [56:18]
B
We love them more, too. Okay.
- [56:19]
A
Arthur Brooks talks about happiness. You'll be happy if you eat meals together. Leonard Sacks talks about how important family dinner is, like, wildly important based off research. I was talking to this man named Dr. Bruce Perry who works with kids who've had trauma. And he was, oh, my gosh, I have to be so fast. Okay. Because I have more questions. So he was saying that there was this mom and daughter, and the mom. Mom had been in foster care and. And in a period of time when they would bop kids around all the time. So, like, they, they didn't want the kids to become attached. And so every six months as a baby, they were moving this mom to different foster cares. And so she just grew up, like, without really strong attachments. So then she becomes a mom young, actually, and then she ages out of the foster system. And they made her. I don't even totally understand it. Like, they made her completely lose contact with the. With her main foster family. She was just like, alone. It's just a heartbreaking story.
- [57:08]
B
Yeah.
- [57:08]
A
And she becomes a mom and she has this little girl, and the little girl's failure to thrive. And they. They're saying she has infantile anorexia. And this Dr. Bruce Perry is like, I never heard of that. What? Infants have anorexia. Like, never heard of that in my life. You know, they're trying to say she's refusing food. So he goes to go and visit them at the Hospital and they, she's on all these high calorie, you know, feeding tubes and, and they're like, she's like 20 something pounds. Pounds.
- [57:33]
B
Yeah.
- [57:34]
A
And he said, when I went in, he said the mom and the daughter were there and they were just disengaged. The mom's disengaged the dog, but she loves her daughter. She's bringing her to the hospital, trying to get her.
- [57:44]
B
Yes.
- [57:44]
A
And what he said was that she didn't learn about like loving touch and that loving environment and how to care for children in that sort of like you talk about the way that they feel.
- [57:56]
B
Yeah.
- [57:56]
A
So they ended up sending her to live with this other mom for a while who was also a foster mom, like to help teach her with her daughter, you know, how to rock her and how, you know these different types of. You think are maternal instincts, but ones you can.
- [58:10]
B
But there was. If they're broken. Yes.
- [58:12]
A
Yeah. And she gained 10 pounds in one month.
- [58:15]
B
Oh, just by hum. Wow. That makes you cry.
- [58:19]
A
It says without the physical stimulation to release growth hormones, the little girl's body treated her food as waste.
- [58:31]
B
Wow.
- [58:31]
A
Oh, isn't that powerful? Yes, so powerful. And so that whole environment, it really is so much more than the food. And I read a book by Carlos Whitaker and he was talking about how the Amish spend an hour around the dinner table. And I'm like, you know, my kids.
- [58:46]
B
Would be like, what?
- [58:47]
A
But we're really trying, like, we're really trying to be like, let's have supper club. You know, let's have, you know, spaghetti spaghetti supper club. We're gonna, we're aiming for 12 minutes. Can we all be here?
- [58:57]
B
We love that. And you know, it's so cool, the measurable time, like even the 1000 hours outside. I was explaining it to my dad the other day and my dad was like, just loving it. I'm like, this is so cool. Like, and depending on where you live and you could break this model up. And these are like, get your time outside. Like get. It's so funny. I got my husband outside this morning. He's like, I should take my shoes off. I haven't had my sun on my face. It's like literally outside. We take the kids to school. He's like putting his, his face in the sun. And I was like, thank you. Like, it's just such a cool thing. Like when you start to create those habits, how much better better you feel. And like the connectivity between like God's creation and then the food that we eat, it's all Connected. And we live in a society too, that does want to break us apart. We're the only society. I tell my kids, I'm like, hey, you go find a wife, bring her back here. If you guys want to live here, we can do the whole communal thing. Okay? I am so into it. We're the only society in the world that doesn't have the elderly living with us and brand new marrieds and everybody on a little tiny area where everybody's living together. Together. I mean, I. Maybe that's not your cup of tea. Maybe you don't want to live with your in laws, but I need them.
- [59:58]
A
No, no, no, no, you need them. And that's actually what all the books are saying, is that the grandparents, if the grandparents are involved, it allows the children, the adult children to have more babies and to earn more money. It matters so much because you're held that I talk about this book because they were so powerful. This Dr. Bruce Perry, he talked about this mom who struggled so bad. Dad. But her whole extended family helped her to raise her oldest child. And so he was like super fine and like really well adjusted. Well, then when she went to have her second child, she had to move because her husband's job changed and she just like was struggling so bad. So she would leave the baby in the apartment and take the older boy on walks. She was so overwhelmed. Like she just kind of lost it. And then the younger boy ended up having crazy problems and trace back to that. But the whole point was she lost, left her support system. It's just so needed.
- [60:51]
B
Yes.
- [60:52]
A
So it's wild how this one thing about the, the family table, the food that we come around, the relationships that we build, the love that we feel permeates into so many other things. And, and the last thing I want to share because I just think this is so powerful, this man who's talking about trauma for children over and over again. He just talked about rhythm. Rhythm is essential. I'm going to read a couple of things. Rhythm is so important, it's often overlooked as a therapeutic, therapeutic tool. Rhythm is essential to a healthy body and a healthy mind. Everybody can probably think of something rhythmic that makes them feel better. Walking, swimming, music, dance. The sound of waves breaking on a beach. So this rhythm. And so I love that you said, what if it's Monday night? Is this. That's what they do in the Waldorf schools. Tuesday night? Is this Wednesday's your spaghetti supper club? You know, like whatever it is. And that takes the pressure off. They don't have to Feel like you have to do 21 new meals and rotate it every three weeks. You know, you take.
- [61:48]
B
You're not seeing something on the rotation for six more months. I'm like, hey, if you guys like it, make it every night, three times a week. That's why we move into a new season. That stuff isn't growing anymore. Like, move into this. Like, it's so funny. Like, that's why the summer is like watermelon and grilled whatever and all the. And barbecue. And then we move into, like, soups and stews and casseroles. And then it's winter time and we're hitting springtime with all your spring greens. It's so, so fun. Eat all that food up during that season and then say, hey, I'll see you next year, and then eat all that food up during that season. And God gives us so many fun things to choose from.
- [62:22]
A
Right?
- [62:22]
B
So I don't know. I. This was. This filled my heart up way more than I was anticipating. I was like, oh, we're gonna talk about the book, and we'll talk about certain things. I had no idea. We're gonna get this. This was special.
- [62:33]
A
Oh, I feel the same way. And like I said, I. I'm always on the fence about cookbook podcasts because I believe in it. But then I'm like, is there gonna be enough? Enough, you know?
- [62:41]
B
Yeah. Like, what are we to talk about after a minute? And then if you're stumped for dinner, what are some other things you can do?
- [62:51]
A
What do you like to find at thrift stores?
- [62:53]
B
Oh, my gosh. I love vintage silverware. And I. I'm so upset. Here I am sitting really, literally with all this transfer wear. I just didn't move it because I was, like, looking through it. I'm obsessed with old, like, 1800 style transfer wear from France. Here, let me get all these little guys out. These are some of my favorite favorites. I'm obsessed. They're gorgeous.
- [63:13]
A
What do you do with them?
- [63:14]
B
I use them in food shoots and we eat off of them. I should get a lead tester because I'm sure they would absolutely test hot. But I do still eat off of these guys. And These are probably 18th century, 19th century, at least from 1850. But these little guys were €17. I went to Paris this last year, this. This last January with my girlfriend, and we thrifted in at all the little flea markets until our hearts were content and we flew all these bad boys home in our suitcases.
- [63:39]
A
Is unbelievable. Do you know what would be such a Cool idea, too, is like, what if you delivered the meal to the new mom on that, and then they could keep it gorgeous, you know, or anything. You find some cool thrifted thing.
- [63:50]
B
Oh, my gosh. I love that whole thrifted thing. Have you seen that, too? Like, where they're like, hey, go. Go to the thrift store, actually get your 9 by 13 pan, because once I give it to you, I don't want it back. Like, if it's yours, it's gonna be stressful enough to, like, try and get everything together. I. I recently, too, I was getting. Giving some. I was doing some dinners for a family more regularly, and I was like, hey, just wash it out and give it back to me. Halfway through, I was like, what am I doing? I need some disposables. Like, don't wash anything out and give it back to me. You have little kids. Don't I never want to see it again? So that was really, like, a little tipping point for me. Like, don't ever make anybody wash a darn thing and give it back to you.
- [64:23]
A
So many good ideas.
- [64:24]
B
Unless it's your sister or your mom. Like, hey, I'll see you. I'll see you in a couple of days. I'll get my back.
- [64:28]
A
Yeah, that's right. That's right. Oh, I love a good thrift store. That. Those are just really fun things that you can do. All right, I got it. We got to wrap it up, and we're at the last minute. It's called the best kids cookbook. It is fantastic, and it is cookbook number 14. We talked about some other ideas. You are Always There, a memoir, and also the cookbook called Meant to Share. And you can. People can look. I'll put all the links in the show notes, but just wonderful, wonderful options. And if you want to pass on these life skills to your kids and have it be enjoyable. There's so much value here in what you're doing and in this new cookbook, the best kids cookbook that's out there. It's cute. It's whimsical. It's got a lot of special little illustrations in it, too. So your kids are going to love it.
- [65:04]
B
Danielle.
- [65:04]
A
We always end up our show with the same question. What's a favorite memory from your childhood that was outside.
- [65:08]
B
Oh, my gosh. Gardening with my mom or going down to the creek. We'd literally roll our pants up, and we would go down to the creek, and we would try to find these little crawdads. So we would walk to the Creek literally almost every day in the summer. And just wade through barefoot on the slimy rocks. Like, that's probably, like, pinnacle childhood fun memory for me Is being in the creek or in my mom's garden.
- [65:26]
A
The best. The best. I tell you what, a good creek is, like, worth its weight in gold. They're hard to find.
- [65:31]
B
Oh, they are hard to find.
- [65:33]
A
Yeah.
- [65:33]
B
And you know what? When you find it, travel to them. There's a little creek we found. It's about 40 minutes from our house. And it's called veterans creek. If you're local here to, like, the buckley, western Washington area. It is so cool. And the kids can kind of float down. And we spent so much time in this creek this year. And, I mean, it was a new one for us, but it was. It's super fun. Called veterans park out here, but just fun. They are hard to find.
- [65:54]
A
Yes. 40 minutes. If it's worth it. Because you go and you stay for hours, you go. Because everyone's occupied.
- [66:00]
B
And we took cues from everybody else. The first day we got got there, we were underprepared. I didn't have lunches or anything. And I saw all the other families. I'm like, oh, when we come back, we're going to do this. So pack your little lunch, Pack camp chair, and go for it.
- [66:11]
A
I love that you said that, because, actually, that is some of the best advice that there is for getting outside. People always ask, what's your advice? I think you have to look around and copy.
- [66:19]
B
Yes.
- [66:19]
A
And that's how we have figured out so many different ideas of things that we do and places that we go. Or you go and you're like, oh, wait, next time. I saw people jumping off that rock over there. We can do that the next time. And you. You look around, and then you just steal all the ideas.
- [66:33]
B
Yes. That's what we're here for. Like, we were literally checking out everybody's setup. Because when we first came, we brought water shoes, A bag of chips, and a towel. And I was like, oh, we need a setup. And then we have all the other camp chairs. The next time we went, we had camp chairs, and we brought our wagon down. Like, there's such fun stuff to do. And I was like, oh, I didn't even think of this. But all these families. And then some families had their. Their chairs set up in the creek. Because there's, like, a fun little flat part. And I was like, oh, we're gonna do that next time. Like, so just. And it gets our kids thinking, too. We brought a little inner tube. So, yeah, I love that copy. Just figure out what other folks are doing and do it.
- [67:07]
A
Take cues from everybody else. Danielle, what an honor. I'm so glad that we had this conversation, and I am so glad that we've connected and hopefully we get to do it again sometime.
- [67:15]
B
Absolutely. You have a wonderful day. Thanks so much.