Melissa Nickerson (3:02)

Well, you're a stand up comedian, so Dustin tours nationally. And what else?

Dustin Nickerson (3:09)

You're the CFO of the business. You run a lot of the marketing, the newsletters and the manage the books and do the pod together.

Melissa Nickerson (3:17)

It's very much a forms or claims insurance. That's me.

Dustin Nickerson (3:23)

The motto I use around the house is big family, small business. That's what we're doing here.

Jenny Urch (3:29)

Yeah, I love that. I love it. And I love how you talked in this book about how marriage is a one of a kind. I actually never really thought about that before. You write marriage books are written for the masses, but this is a one of a kind creation that emerges that has never existed and will never exist again. I'm only an expert at being married to my spouse, I think. I don't know. That was deep for me, you know, because I think you read these books and you're like, oh, it's not working right. You know, and you're like, well, they're. They're nuanced.

Dustin Nickerson (3:59)

Yeah, well, that's. I think the idea is you just want to kind of be a student of your person and understand what makes them tick as opposed to, like, you know, just big, generic. I think all those marriage books are very well intended, but, you know, there's only so much generic advice that someone can give you that really applies. You know, I think the same goes with parenting where someone says, like, do this, do this, do this, don't do this. And you're like, well, you don't have a formula for every specific situation. Like, what am I supposed to do?

Melissa Nickerson (4:34)

Specific child.

Dustin Nickerson (4:35)

Yeah, exactly. I mean, we, you know that like, I mean, we have three kids. You're like, we didn't even parent them the same because they're different. You know, there's no. To use like a baseball analogy. Like, you're like, they're different hitters. You throw different pitches. You know, not that we're trying to get them out in this scenario, but, you know, everybody. You have a custom approach to 100.

Melissa Nickerson (4:59)

Yeah, okay.

Jenny Urch (5:00)

I have to tell you a story. So something happened to me that's never happened before. I. Well, and there's a little bit of a background, which normally I don't do this normally. I don't talk hardly at all. But I'm going to give you a little bit of the backstory. So. So in about 2021, we had a switcheroo in our. In our family business here. My husband used. His name's Josh. He used to travel quite a bit for work, and then we switched, and I started to travel more for work, and I hadn't traveled much, so. I hadn't traveled much. So I was Zone six.

Dustin Nickerson (5:28)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (5:28)

And Zone six is the worst of the zones.

Dustin Nickerson (5:30)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (5:31)

And you are, like, constantly panicked that you're going to have to check your bag, which you almost always do. Then you have to check your bag. You're zone six. So I'm. I started to travel. I'm traveling more anyway. I'm still Zone 6. And I was like, I. I don't know. Like, when will I be zone 5, 4? You know, can I work my way up the ranks? Well, then I would travel with my husband, like, if we went as a family, and he would always get sky priority. And for a little bit, I was like, okay, well, he'd been traveling for a while, I understand. But it got to be like, year two, year three. And I was like, huh? Like, why is he getting sky priority? And I'm still Zone 6? So I asked. I was like, something is wrong. There's. Something is majorly wrong. I'm still zone six. And it turned out that he was booking all of the flights under his account, so there was a bit of a marital tift. And I was like. Or tiff. I don't even know what the word is until.

Dustin Nickerson (6:31)

So that was.

Jenny Urch (6:32)

He had, like, a million bajillion. He was like, platinum, diamond, gold.

Dustin Nickerson (6:39)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jenny Urch (6:40)

Still Zone six. It was basically like, I had never flown before. So we finally got it figured out. And additionally, I've moved up the rankings. I am also a member of the Sky Club. Now, I did not know what this was at all. And I just found out within the last two months, it. It is. I mean, fairly heavenly. And we're in Detroit, so we go through this McNamara terminal. And I always would see the Sky Cup. They're the Sky Club people, like, on both sides.

Dustin Nickerson (7:09)

They're like, right when you come into the terminal and left, you look at them, right? They're like the ruling class looking down on you.

Jenny Urch (7:20)

They are Sky Clubbing. And I just thought, well, they probably have nice chairs and they've got wi fi. They probably have plugs. And anyway, that's not all. They have a full buffet.

Dustin Nickerson (7:30)

Oh, yeah.

Jenny Urch (7:30)

And if you go in the morning, there's orange juice and they switch it out for the different meals. So I've been missing out on this my whole life. So I just recently have learned about Sky Club. I think it is worth whatever you can do to get it because it's remarkable. And I was sitting just the other week in the Sky Club. Now, I have probably read about 500 books for our podcast, which means I have books with me all the time. I'm always reading books wherever I am and. But no one has ever asked me about a book I'm reading until yours. No one has ever asked. No one's been like, what is that you're reading? And this woman in the Sky Club was sitting next to me and she goes, excuse me, but I would like to ask some questions about that book. I was on page seven or so and I didn't really know the answers, but I did make them up. So I'm going to ask you what she asked me.

Dustin Nickerson (8:21)

Oh, great.

Jenny Urch (8:21)

And see if I got it correct. Okay. She asked me four questions. Here was question one. Okay, question one. Excuse me, Can I ask you questions about that book? Yes.

Melissa Nickerson (8:31)

Okay.

Jenny Urch (8:32)

Who wrote it?

Dustin Nickerson (8:33)

Who wrote it? Yeah, first question. Who? Dustin Nickerson wrote that book with some inserted POVs from Melissa Nickerson. And then a very talented editor, Jenny Baumgartner edited the book with me.

Jenny Urch (8:54)

I love it. So Melissa's got some tidbits in there. That was a pretty easy question. Question two, you actually already answered. She said, did he write it by himself? No. Okay. Melissa wrote it.

Melissa Nickerson (9:06)

We have a ghost.

Dustin Nickerson (9:06)

Right? I'll have a little. Let me have a little chip on my shoulder there. Every book has an editor. So Jenny did not write the book. I did write the book. There was no ghostwriter on that.

Jenny Urch (9:20)

So, yes, you did write it by yourself. That's a tricky question.

Dustin Nickerson (9:23)

Yeah, I just wanted to give a shout out. I wish more authors gave shout outs to their editors. Like, ghostwriters are a different thing. I think editors should be on the COVID of the book because they really turn like a pretty raw book. I mean, and I feel like I'm a good writer, but yeah, she's just a wonderful. This is a long winded way of saying I wrote the book and then I had a very talented editor and then Melissa wrote the book as well. Her parts. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (9:54)

Yeah, I Totally get that. I actually interviewed an editor one time, and I was like, how are you so fine with being behind the scenes? Yeah, because they'll come up with, like, cool phrases, and I mean, they really help shape the whole thing. He was like, so many authors turn in a manuscript that's a complete mess. It would never sell. You would look like an idiot. And they're the ones, and their name is nowhere unless you thank them.

Dustin Nickerson (10:16)

Yeah. And that's what I wanted to do there. Jenny. Jenny was unbelievable. Yeah, they're really, really.

Melissa Nickerson (10:21)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (10:22)

All right. Nice. Nice work. That was question one and two. Here's question three. Would a man read it?

Dustin Nickerson (10:27)

Yeah. Yeah, I think so. I, I hope so.

Melissa Nickerson (10:32)

We've had a lot of men tell you that they've enjoyed it.

Dustin Nickerson (10:36)

Yeah. I actually think that it's marketed more towards men because it's in the voice of the husband. It might have sold better had it been targeted towards women because women are more likely to A, read a book and B, read a marriage book, no less, and buy it. But, yeah, no, I, I think so. I, I've certainly got a lot of positive feedback from men over the years.

Jenny Urch (11:01)

That's what I answered. I figured that men would read it. Okay, here was the last question. This one, I was, like, a little sad. Would it help a marriage if just one person read it?

Dustin Nickerson (11:10)

Yeah, that's this call, this talk of the Delta Sky Club. Sounds like a cry for help.

Jenny Urch (11:18)

That's what I felt like.

Dustin Nickerson (11:20)

This whole. You just painted a picture of a woman who really wants her man to read a book.

Jenny Urch (11:27)

That's what I was wondering. It's like, are you able to sort of gain from those four questions, what's going on in that woman's life? And I feel like, yeah, yeah, I.

Dustin Nickerson (11:37)

Think it would help a marriage if one person read it. I think it would be better if multiple of both read it. And I think it would be best if the man read it. If I had to choose one of the two, you know, if it was a husband and wife, I think it would be best that the husband read it because, you know, again, it's my point, point of view, but, yeah, I think people would benefit if one of the two read it. What do you think?

Melissa Nickerson (12:02)

I've read a lot of books and then explained them to him.

Dustin Nickerson (12:05)

That's true, you know. Yeah, yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (12:08)

I just giving him the, like, short, you know, paraphrased version.

Dustin Nickerson (12:13)

And I've shown you a lot of tiktoks.

Melissa Nickerson (12:15)

That's right.

Jenny Urch (12:17)

What a trade.

Melissa Nickerson (12:19)

And I, I, I need that yeah.

Jenny Urch (12:23)

All right, well, here's what you say. We have figured out how to not. I read it wrong. We have figured out how not to get divorced. To us, that feels like an accomplishment. So we are in a. A day and age where half of marriages end in divorce. It might be even slightly higher. So this is the norm. Can you talk to the I. To me, that conversation was kind of sad. And actually, then she got on her phone. I thought she was going to order the book right away, but I was sitting pretty close, you know, But I was, like, trying to look. See what's she doing on her phone. I don't know. She probably did. Who knows? But I was trying to see, you know, I think the heart there was like, she wants it to work. That's what she was communicating. So can you talk about the beauty of figuring out how not to get divorced?

Dustin Nickerson (13:08)

Hmm. Yeah. I mean, I go out of my way in this book and in my life not to divorce. Shame. I do believe in my heart, genuinely, that sometimes the best thing. And I say this in the book, Sam, sometimes the best thing in a relationship is for it to end. End that people grow. They get in bad situations, scary situations, at times unhealthy situations, and then sometimes just frankly, incompatible situations. And we think that there is sometimes, for us, a dumb luck that we got married young and remained compatible. Because a lot of marriages, and a lot of young marriages specifically, I mean, we got married. I was 19, you were 20. That's five years before we had fully grown brains, you know, so we had kids before we had brains that were done growing, you know, so. Or developing. So that being said, I mean, I do think that there is. Well, could only speak to ourselves. I'm very glad and thankful that it's just not something that I think we've ever considered or quantified. It's never even really been a thought that we had where, like, oh, you know, worse comes worse, we'll get divorced. I don't think that that's even in our conscience. It's not there, you know, And I'm grateful for that because I do think that there is a depth of connection and understanding. I don't have any interest in starting over with somebody of just like, you learning about me. Yeah, exactly. You learning about me and me learning about you. So, I mean, for. For. For us, that's what it's been. What do you think?

Melissa Nickerson (15:00)

I don't know. I think, you know, I'm 41. Like, midlife is really challenging. Like, we're sending. We're two months from having our oldest, you know, away at college. Like, my friends are all, like, caring for aging parents and, and nesters. It's just a very difficult life transition that we're beginning right now.

Dustin Nickerson (15:26)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (15:27)

Our second daughter's about to start driving. Like, just you really up the ante at, like, age 16, 17, 18 with your kids. So. So I get it. Yeah. I get the stress and the, like, the depth of like, midlife.

Dustin Nickerson (15:43)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (15:43)

You know, so I, I guess I just. Knowing what I know now, you're like, gosh, this is really hard. And it's really hard to prioritize marriage, you know, when, when you're in the sandwich generation.

Dustin Nickerson (15:58)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (15:59)

You know, I guess just empathy and, and just embracing how difficult this season of life is.

Dustin Nickerson (16:05)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (16:06)

Yeah. Is what I would say.

Dustin Nickerson (16:07)

Well, I think too, that makes me. Because you are right, and that's a good point. Like, midlife is very hard for a million reasons. And I am part of the beauty. To answer your initial question, what I'm grateful for is that I am not worried about this, like, as far as the strength of our marriage and how much we love each other and our commitment to each other. If you were to throw in a strenuous marriage, a divorce, custody, lawyer, like everything else going on, you know, I'm, I'm glad and grateful that we're not dealing with that right now because. And I feel for my friends that are. Because you're like everything else we already got going on.

Jenny Urch (16:49)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (16:49)

We have a partner to go through with it. Like to go through it together. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (16:53)

Yeah. To your point. Yeah. Melissa, you said, like, you up the ante, so to be able to do that together. And I think that's interesting advice for someone who's in the early years of their marriage, maybe they're in their 20s, and they're in year four or five or six to think ahead. They. They don't know. Right. They don't know, like, what it's going to be like when a child graduates or when you're dealing with parents with health problems. And so I think it's good perspective. When I think back on my own childhood, I remember the freedom of the neighborhood, hours spent riding bikes with friends until the streetlights came on. That's what childhood should feel like. Movement, laughter and connection. And that's exactly what our friends at Womb Bikes are helping families rediscover. Womb makes the lightest, smartest and safest bikes on the market. Perfectly designed for kids, not just shrunken down adult bikes. Every detail matters. The balance, the brakes, the handlebars, the way the frame fits their growing bodies. You don't just learn to ride with boom. You learn to love the ride. In our own family, we've seen that magic firsthand. Our daughter received a Womb Explorer 6 in that stunning magnetic blue. And from the moment we opened the box, we could feel the difference. The packaging was intuitive, the setup was simple, and within a short period of time, she was riding down the driveway with the biggest smile on her face. When kids have a womb bike, they want to be outside. And that's the heartbeat of what we do. Helping families reclaim time, connection and joy through real world play. So this holiday season, don't just give a gift. Give them adventure, give them confidence, give them outside. Check out all the holiday deals now@womb.com that's W.com, you guys. The holidays are almost here and you know what that means. People to feed, guests to host, and a whole lot of cozy moments ahead. I've been getting our home ready with Wayfair, and it's amazing how just a few updates make everything feel warm and welcoming again. I grabbed a beautiful new dining bench so everyone has a seat at the table, swapped in flannel sheets for the guest room, and found the cutest Christmas wreath, all from Wayfair's Black Friday sale. Everything shipped fast, the prices were unreal, and it made me actually excited to host. This year. Wayfair really is the place to shop for all things home, from sofas to spatulas, rugs to refrigerators. And during their Black Friday event, you can save up to 70% off. Plus they have styles you won't see anywhere else. So your space actually feels like you. And if you haven't heard, Wayfair now has a loyalty program where you earn 5% back, get free shipping, and have access to member only sales. It's totally worth joining. So don't wait. These early deals are already happening. Head to Wayfair.com now to shop Wayfair's Black Friday deals for up to 70% off. That's W A Y-F A I R.com sale ends December 7th. You know, in general, people are getting married later. We got married at 21 and 22, so older than you. But still, I guess in today's standards would be considered young. And I think that in some ways it's helpful because you don't, you know, you kind of establish who you are alongside the other person and you and you sort of build your life together. Just because that cultural message is so strong, people wait so Long. Can you give a. It's hard, too, because you talk about, like, you know, we lost our house. We did, too. We lost our house, you know, in that. In the 2008 thing, like, we lost our house. And you're just. You're kind of struggling through. But then also there's beauty in having struggled through it together. So can you give the counter message toward waiting to get married and talk about some of the benefits of getting married young?

Dustin Nickerson (20:13)

Oh, yeah. I wouldn't. Yeah. Again, I. And I don't mean to deflect in any way. I can only speak to us and what's been beneficial for us. What's been beneficial for us and why I am glad we got married young is it's just been a lot of fun. You know, those are, like, fun years and being active and starting a family and, you know, getting your. Your first place together in your 20s and doing, you know, make. Going through your graduating college together is fun. Like, we had college announcements that we sent out together and.

Melissa Nickerson (20:54)

Oh, announcements. Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (20:55)

Yeah. There are just, like. I don't know. I. To me, it's. Your 20s are fun years, and you're my best friend, and I've been glad to have my best friend with me, so I don't. It's not even like a big sell to me. I'm like, you're the person that I enjoy the most. And so I wanted to spend every hour and every year I can with you, and if you can find that person, then what a gift. You know, just like a life. We have so many. So many memories over the 24 years we've been together that I'm so grateful for, that are literally the best parts and memories of my life.

Melissa Nickerson (21:30)

Yeah. And I think, like, starting our family young, too, like, there's biological perks, you know, we didn't have all the answers, and we didn't have a lot of money, but we had a lot of fun, and we were still very, like, playful and childlike. So I don't know, it has kind of set our family culture. You know, like, we're all playing volleyball outside, and we're like. We're all, like, very active and, you know, silly.

Jenny Urch (22:05)

We're.

Dustin Nickerson (22:05)

Well, we're. I was gonna say we are deeply unserious people.

Jenny Urch (22:09)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (22:10)

And that might be because we feel like when you meet at 16, you get married at 19 and 20, and.

Melissa Nickerson (22:17)

You got nothing to.

Dustin Nickerson (22:18)

You got. You know, you can't take yourselves too seriously, you know, so. Yeah. Yeah, we're. We call it any time we have an Accomplishment in life, we always, like, look at each other and we just have a phrase like, these two idiots. Like, we pulled it off somehow. Like, because it is. It is quite silly to meet that young and still. And it is very, like, impressive to some people. But, I mean, I'm sure you've seen this too, where it's impressive to some people that you married that long and other people. It's very strange and peculiar that you've. You've been with somebody since you were a teenager.

Jenny Urch (22:55)

Well, it's interesting because one of the things that you don't think about at all when you're 17 years old or 19 or 21 and you're getting married is that, like, someday, hopefully. My grandma always says, lord willing, you'll be a grandparent. And you don't. That is not in your purview at all. When you're young, you're like, what? But the two of you could possibly be grandparents in your 40s.

Dustin Nickerson (23:16)

Yeah. I mean, if, if, if Joel, our oldest, was on our timeline, then you would be a grandma at 45, which is crazy.

Jenny Urch (23:29)

I think that's actually really cool. Then you active. You can play volleyball with your grandkids.

Dustin Nickerson (23:33)

I know it is crazy to think, like, you aging four years and walking around like a grandma. Everyone's like, I'm sorry, you're a grandma.

Melissa Nickerson (23:41)

No, my. My niece got married this summer and her parents are 44.

Dustin Nickerson (23:48)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (23:48)

You know, like, yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (23:50)

You're like, yeah, 19. Yeah, I know.

Jenny Urch (23:52)

It is.

Melissa Nickerson (23:52)

You guys, like, awesome.

Dustin Nickerson (23:53)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (23:54)

Right? Father of the pride.

Dustin Nickerson (23:55)

Yeah. It is fun and interesting to think about that. You're like, how, How? Great, great, great. Can't grandkids. Could I maybe get to. You know, you're like. Because you assume maybe grandkids, but yeah, I mean, we're. The reality is, is we're. We're going to be, Lord willing, empty nesters. In seven years, our youngest will be out. I'll be 47, and you'll be 48, and you're like, oh, wow. And I mean, our son will be, you know, 25 at the time. So it is. Yeah, it's very interesting to think about how you'll be at that stage. And our peers are so much older than us, which is fun and unique, but also sometimes, like, I don't know, I do feel a little distance from them. I don't know if you feel that.

Melissa Nickerson (24:41)

Yeah, no, I mean, it's. It's pretty normal for, like, my friends who have kids myself, you know, who just had graduated a senior, like, my son to be like 10 years older than me.

Dustin Nickerson (24:52)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We got a lot of friends with younger elementary kids.

Melissa Nickerson (24:55)

They're in their 50s.

Dustin Nickerson (24:56)

They're like first day kindergarten and we're like college drop off.

Jenny Urch (25:01)

I think all of it is just really interesting to think ahead. And you don't really, you know, when you're 22, you don't really think about, well, how old will I be when. And I just like highlighting that there are some benefits of doing it young.

Dustin Nickerson (25:14)

Oh, 100%. I think there's perks to both ways. I think that you're probably more, I mean, not probably. You're significantly more mature. The longer you wait. You're significantly more physically able, capable both in the labor, in the pregnancy and. And the sleepless nights, the postpartum, the activity, the bending, the getting. I mean, truly. I mean, I think about now how I'm glad I'm not picking up toys off the ground.

Melissa Nickerson (25:45)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (25:45)

You know, I got a bad back and a bad ankle right now you're just like, oh, I'm glad that I spend less time on my hands and knees.

Melissa Nickerson (25:53)

You're not carrying a car seat.

Dustin Nickerson (25:54)

I'm not. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My 25 year old back was better at that strange stroller than my 41 year old back. So there are purely biological benefits to getting a jump start on it, you know.

Jenny Urch (26:07)

Yeah. And culture is strong about waiting. So I like the other message about hearing the other side of it. When you do talk about that when you were younger, that you did have some people helped you, you had friends who stepped in to help. So you talked about you had a friend. I thought this was a wild story. You. So you're struggling with finances, you know, which is like typical when you're young. And we did too. And so you said that you had a friend who had a dream that he had a chest full of gold coins and God told him to give you the coins.

Dustin Nickerson (26:39)

Crazy, huh? Yeah. That guy's brother in law, now he married into the family. Yeah. Isn't that, isn't that surreal?

Jenny Urch (26:49)

Yes. You say because of this dream, for months he helped close the gap for us. It takes a village to raise a child, but it takes a city to raise a marriage. We rebuilt from rubble. Can you talk about the power of community? It's good writing. Maybe that was the editor.

Dustin Nickerson (27:03)

No, that one was a Dustin Og. That was.

Melissa Nickerson (27:06)

You just forgot about it.

Dustin Nickerson (27:07)

Yeah, it's a, you know, it's a lot of words in a book. No, we had hugely. You were just talking and we were just Talking about the importance of community and for raising it. Yeah, there is, there is this like movement right now and I think it comes from a very good place of self protection of like, I don't owe anybody anything. And I hear and understand a lot of that sentiment. I don't share it in the sense that I feel like. And you know, we owe. I want to give a lot of myself to people, to my wife, to my kids, to our neighbors, to our community, to our kids, schools, to people and make them laugh and give them content. I feel the total opposite because people have done that for us. You know, people have helped us financially, they've helped us with childcare. People were there for us. Our, our friends, our family, our church community, our neighbors. People have been hugely. And you. That's like Mel, two things on. To sing Mel's praises on this one. Mel has built that community up here on. In a remarkable. We call it mom's Network. Like, it's like you're like, hey, we got a ride here. We got someone to go to this. We're going to have this. It's incredible. And also you do that action that I was just talking about more than anybody I've ever met as far as like, I mean, you have a friend who had surgery and has a mom going through some health stuff and you're like, hey, I'm going to go bring him coffee and go hang out with him for a while. Like, you go, you visit people in the hospital, you go spend time with friends, you pick people up for church. You're just pouring, constantly, giving. And I think that that's in part just your DNA and I think it's in part because we've received a lot of it as well.

Melissa Nickerson (28:57)

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. No, I was, we were saying yesterday when our third child was born, she was tongue tied and for about two to three weeks we didn't know what was wrong with her. Like she, she was, you know, screaming at us. And I was at a preschool, like co op thing and a mother of five goes, she's hungry. Like, I had just fed her and, and, and she had fallen asleep because she couldn't eat. And then the mom was like, that's a hunger cry. And that was before like I could see a lactation nurse and, and you know, like go through the steps to get her fed. It's just, it's just moms, you know, parents like that are in it and yeah, anyway, you're just, it's just invaluable. Yeah, that can be huge.

Jenny Urch (29:48)

And someone that's not afraid to say that.

Dustin Nickerson (29:50)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (29:51)

Well, this person might be offended for me to say, well, your baby's hungry.

Melissa Nickerson (29:55)

I know.

Dustin Nickerson (29:56)

Yeah. That is intention. Yeah. Right. Because she was bold to say it. Because we've talked about before, you know, there are moms and parents in our lives. So you're like, you. Sometimes you'd like to say something, but you're like, I don't know if they're gonna receive it right.

Melissa Nickerson (30:09)

And people don't like unsolicited advice, you know, so. Yeah, no, I think for me, that I don't know if this makes sense when you had your children, but I had two in Washington state and one in San Diego. And so for me, like, in my postpartum, like, deliriousness, I was like, it's just. It's so hot and I'm uncomfortable. And she probably is. It's a different climate, you know?

Jenny Urch (30:33)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (30:35)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (30:35)

And. And so I had kind of opened the door, like, something's going on, but I don't know what. And then the mom was able to me. So those kind of moments of connection and help are just so invaluable.

Dustin Nickerson (30:49)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (30:49)

And you just don't know, like, you don't know who's going to show up when. Who's going to get the dream with the chest of gold coins.

Dustin Nickerson (30:55)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (30:56)

Like, hopefully somebody gets that dream.

Dustin Nickerson (30:58)

Hopefully get that dream. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (31:01)

I mean, it's remarkable. Okay. All right. I want to talk about this. I thought this was a super interesting and very relevant topic. So you're talking about. This is. This is a one of a kind relationship. It's a one of a kind marriage. It's never happened before. It's never going to happen again. And one of the things that you do. And you had talked about how you've had mentors in your life that, like, we do this and so you'll try it. You know, you take some of it, some of it works, some of it doesn't. But one of the things that you do, and you're like, people judge this, but it works for us. And I thought this was so interesting. You're like, I can have a better conversation if my mind is doing something. And I think actually this. It's just not socially accepted necessarily, but, like, people will crochet. You know, they got something going on with their hands. And I talked to this lady one time who said her best student, she was a professor. She said her best student never took one note. She didn't take one note the whole semester. She crocheted A sweater while she sat and listened and she got the best grade. Yeah, I feel like my mind. I'm like, I need something kind of feeding my mind. And so you're saying, look, I have better conversations when I'm playing Angry Birds.

Dustin Nickerson (32:03)

Yeah. Very dated reference, by the way. The game has changed on my phone. But it's the same idea. I mean, we did last night. I got. We were just sitting down and we started chatting and I got out a little dumb game on my phone. Nothing that occupies nothing. I'm thinking about that. Totally mindless. Just something. I think I use the metaphor, the comparison. It's. It's the ideas in the shower. It's the same thing that sometimes when you're doing something physically, you know, that's just occupying you enough, then you're not, you know, it's just less boring. I think this is particularly with an ADHD brain, which I very much have of just being like this can. And so I'm not just. This is all I have right here. I mean, we have our best conversations hiking. You know, we have a. We have a Cows Mountain where we live near here, and it's an hour hike up and down. It's a. And it's a challenging hike, but that's good for me and it's good for you. You. You know, I don't have to sell your audience on being outdoors, but do.

Melissa Nickerson (33:05)

You think it's, you know, if you have the generic advice of like once a week, date night or something, and it's in the book, like the two of us sitting down in a restaurant.

Dustin Nickerson (33:15)

We hate restaurants.

Melissa Nickerson (33:17)

That is just not a fun environment for the two of us. We're not going to connect and we're not going to have a deep conversation.

Dustin Nickerson (33:24)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (33:24)

So it's great to take a piece of advice, but then to make it work. Relationship.

Dustin Nickerson (33:30)

There is an argument to be made, and I would, that. I would say that this book was written out of a rebellion on date night advice. Because someone saying date night is totally fine. But we've had people and we've been in these communities, and you still see where people are like, that is the foundation of our marriage. And you're like, that doesn't work for. For us. Yeah, let's not particularly like the dinner out because. And that's what would hit us. You're like, first off, we're not foodies. We don't like the formality of it all. Somebody will list the specials, and you're like, whatever. And it's not a good environment. All right. It's pasta with sauce. I get it. I'm distracted easily. None of us like how much it. We don't like the formality of it. We don't like how long it takes. And I'm not saying we're replacing the fast food. We're just like, we could have done this. Now we like takeout. We like take out in a park is what we like. You know, there's just one. Is you find something for you that works. Now that being the said the phone thing is like, that's another example of like, if you were observe us in a coffee shop, you'd be like, that guy is being a real a hole. That guy's not talking to his wife. And like, he won't get off his phone. And you're like, oh. To quote Melissa Nickerson's favorite phrase, it's not that simple. There's more to this story than. But you're right, there is a lack of social acceptance to is a powerful thing.

Jenny Urch (34:58)

I mean, I feel like I doodle on everything. I'm constantly. I really cannot concentrate well unless I. I'm doing something.

Dustin Nickerson (35:04)

Yeah, totally.

Jenny Urch (35:05)

And so I thought you said people are appalled by it. But you found what works for you. So you're playing a game, or you're throwing a ball against a wall, or you're going on a hike, or you're out at a park. And the whole premise of finding what works for you and not feeling bad about it because other people are judging it or it's like the date night thing has not worked for us either. In fact, we have tried to do this 52 date night thing and we got to three, and one of them was a funeral. And I was like, I don't know if that really counts, but it was just the two of us. We didn't have any kids, so it.

Dustin Nickerson (35:36)

Was food, you know, you gotta dress up. You know, I kind of got.

Jenny Urch (35:41)

There was music.

Dustin Nickerson (35:42)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (35:43)

So, I mean, I don't know. Speakers.

Dustin Nickerson (35:47)

Yeah, yeah.

Jenny Urch (35:48)

But I. I did. I appreciate that. I appreciate reading things. That's like, look, you know, this is what really works for us. You say, I need something to make me a little less fidgety and a partner who doesn't take it personally.

Dustin Nickerson (35:59)

I heard someone say recently, the best diet is the one you stick to.

Melissa Nickerson (36:05)

An exercise, and the best exercise is.

Dustin Nickerson (36:07)

The one health plan is the one you'll do.

Jenny Urch (36:09)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (36:10)

And I think that that is such a universal truth for every part of life, like health, your marriage, your relationships, your work, whatever it may be. Like the one that you stick to is the one that works for you. That's one thing that I would say again, to answer your earlier question about getting married and sticking together. Like, I feel like I know how to do this marriage, you know, and even when we mess up, it's almost like I know I'm messing up when I do it. Like, you know what I mean?

Melissa Nickerson (36:40)

Like, yeah, after 20 something.

Dustin Nickerson (36:43)

Yeah. You're like, okay, we got in a fight. I know how it happened. I probably could have stopped it actually. I just didn't, you know, for whatever reason that I, I. Yeah, I just feel like I'm very familiar with how this operation works.

Jenny Urch (36:57)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (36:58)

You know. Yeah, there's not a.

Jenny Urch (37:00)

You talk about, you talk about learning how to fight, how to end a fight the right way. So that's in the book. Ending fights is hard. And so that's some of the advice. And you know, like you said, it's. It's a bit of a memoir type. You know, you tell all your stories like you say, you can always weaponize history. I told Melissa she was a big cheap, like always. There's funny parts.

Dustin Nickerson (37:21)

It's funny parts.

Jenny Urch (37:22)

All right. The book is called how to be married to Melissa. A hilarious guide to a happier one of a kind marriage.

Dustin Nickerson (37:29)

She goes, now she's mad. Remembering old fights.

Jenny Urch (37:33)

There we go. And this categories game is in here. So it's an. It's an entertaining read but also a thought provoking read. And obviously you have your podcast too, called don't make me come back there. People can come see you live. I've got a bunch of other short questions, kind of like how we started with.

Dustin Nickerson (37:48)

Right.

Jenny Urch (37:48)

And I got a long list of them. So we're gonna go, what is the worst city in America?

Dustin Nickerson (37:53)

Lancaster, California. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (37:56)

Oh, that's so interesting because there is a city in Pennsylvania called and they say it Lancaster.

Dustin Nickerson (38:03)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (38:03)

And it's actually kind of cool. They have this thing there that's like this Christian theater. It's called Sight and Sound. And it's. And then they have Hershey Park. So I. So tell us.

Dustin Nickerson (38:15)

No, I've been to Lancaster. Lancaster is great. But Lancaster, California is the worst city in America. And I have a personal grudge against it and that your family moved there and I thought you guys were moving to Southern California. And then I got out of the car when we got there and it was 118 and I was like, what this is. This, this place is devoid of anything nice. It's got no. It's just strip malls. It's the People are. People are nice in every city in America. For the. It's nothing to do with the people. It's just the city. It's the location, it's things to do, it's lack of to do. It's buildings, it's weather, it's climb. All of the above. So Lancaster, California is the.

Jenny Urch (38:57)

Is the answer that clears some things up for me. Or how about this one? What is the second most powerful position on an airplane?

Dustin Nickerson (39:04)

Oh, well. So this is an old joke of mine I think I might have done in the book. I used to the. The power position is the window. Because the window controls the whole row and can make people get up.

Jenny Urch (39:20)

Okay. So I'm gonna. I know words. Books have a lot of words. So let me jog your memory. You were talking about having opportunity to be Delta 1. I didn't even know this was actually a thing. So I think you were saying that was the most powerful is Delta 1.

Dustin Nickerson (39:33)

Oh, yeah.

Jenny Urch (39:33)

Or first class. And that the window is the second most powerful.

Dustin Nickerson (39:37)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Delta one.

Jenny Urch (39:38)

You said you go left.

Dustin Nickerson (39:41)

I mean. Oh, yeah, yeah. Delta one's unbelievable. Delta one. Yeah. You walk onto the plane and you turn left, which is crazy because it's just you and the pilots up there. It's insane.

Melissa Nickerson (39:51)

Is it mostly international?

Dustin Nickerson (39:53)

Longer flights? Yeah. Delta, Detroit to San Diego. But the second most powerful is the window because you can dictate. You'll wake somebody up, which is crazy. Like, that's the. Because you would never do that.

Melissa Nickerson (40:04)

Any other joke is also like, here's my trash.

Dustin Nickerson (40:07)

Yeah, you have. They have to handle your trash.

Jenny Urch (40:09)

Yeah, I lean over. I lean, but I try and lean over so that they don't have to touch my stuff.

Melissa Nickerson (40:15)

Try. But sometimes it's, you know, that being.

Dustin Nickerson (40:18)

Said as now that I'm 40 and I have to pee constantly, I'm in the. I take the aisle every time because I'm like, I'm getting up.

Melissa Nickerson (40:24)

I like the aisle too.

Dustin Nickerson (40:26)

I need to walk. I need to pee. I gotta stretch. I need that aisle. Now, a younger me was comfortable over there.

Melissa Nickerson (40:32)

Yeah. In the window.

Dustin Nickerson (40:33)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (40:33)

I always laugh when people tuck their knees up like young people in the window. I'm like, how are you doing that? Fall asleep.

Jenny Urch (40:43)

It is impressive. I've never been in Delta 1, but you say you get an apartment. The seats fully recline. You have your own at home entertainment system. It is pretty incredible. I'm. Are you ever surprised at who you see at the airport? Like, there are people that I think, shouldn't they have their Own private plane.

Dustin Nickerson (40:58)

Oh, yeah. Real famous people fly commercially. Yeah. Have you seen some people out there?

Jenny Urch (41:04)

Yeah, well, my husband just saw Chris Tomlin. I was like, I feel like you should have your own plane by now.

Dustin Nickerson (41:10)

I think that people underestimate how. Yeah. How expensive it is. I One time, on a whim, I was like, what would it look like? Because it's literally an app that you book it away and from San Diego to Las Vegas, which is a 45 minute flight, it's like 20 grand, and that's $150 ticket round trip.

Jenny Urch (41:34)

It's like Uber for airplanes. Private jet, basically. Is that what you're saying? The app.

Dustin Nickerson (41:39)

So I. Because I work with some people more famous than me, I've flown private a couple times. And it is the craziest, simplest experience. I mean, you've gotten rid of the airport, which is crazy. But it is so expensive. And I do. T. Pain had a great video about this where he was like, up in first class, and people are like, dang, T. Pain, you're not flying private. You're really falling off. And he's like, why would I do that? It's so expensive. And I'll tell you once you do start, even if, like, because I travel every weekend. I get on a plane every Thursday or Friday, and I come home around Sunday, Monday, so I get it. But, you know, once you. I've. The. The airport has gotten as comfortable as an airport can get for someone who travels as much as me. I'm in the shortest lines, you know, to check my bag, to go through security. I go through. There's usually a lounge for me. I'm the first one on and off the plane. Like, it's even when I'm not in first class. So, I mean, car center.

Jenny Urch (42:38)

You just like my husband.

Dustin Nickerson (42:40)

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (42:42)

Stealing all my points.

Dustin Nickerson (42:43)

Yes.

Jenny Urch (42:45)

Okay.

Dustin Nickerson (42:46)

All right.

Jenny Urch (42:46)

Interesting, Interesting things about a plane. I'm going to spell some words and I want you to pronounce them.

Dustin Nickerson (42:50)

Oh, okay.

Jenny Urch (42:51)

Ready? S A L S A S. Oh.

Dustin Nickerson (42:55)

Yeah, you go first.

Melissa Nickerson (42:59)

Salsa. I did.

Jenny Urch (43:03)

You live really close to Mexico.

Dustin Nickerson (43:05)

What's that you say?

Jenny Urch (43:06)

You live 15 minutes close, you know, 15 minutes from Mexico. So salsa comes up a lot.

Melissa Nickerson (43:12)

Yeah, that's from my mom. I get that from my mom.

Dustin Nickerson (43:16)

All right.

Jenny Urch (43:18)

How about this one? E S, P E, R E, S, S O. Oh, I spelled it wrong. I think it's spelled right. Hold on. Es. I'm actually a really bad speller, so it's on my sheet. Wrong. E, S, P, R, E, S S.

Dustin Nickerson (43:33)

O. Espresso oh, espresso. Yeah, espresso. We know how to say that one. We. We can hit confidently. A couple northwest baristas here.

Melissa Nickerson (43:41)

Seattle baristas.

Dustin Nickerson (43:42)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (43:43)

Yes.

Dustin Nickerson (43:43)

But the people, people. I think it's funny when people say it wrong. I think it's even funnier when they spell it wrong, like on signs. Like when I'm in like small towns in Louisiana or something and I'm like. I was like, oh, you guys don't even know that. And that's okay. I guess I can see where your brain went there. Fast express. Caffeine, you know, Caffeine. I get it. I get how the brain went there. But it. That one does drive me crazy.

Jenny Urch (44:08)

All right, I got one more. Z, O, L, T, A, N. Zoltan. Okay, that's what I was hoping. Okay.

Dustin Nickerson (44:14)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (44:14)

So you're talking in the book about Tuesdays with Zoltan and I thought you. It is why it would be wildly different if it was Zoltan, but if it's Zoltan. That sounds really exciting. Tuesdays with Zoltan. Tell us about that.

Dustin Nickerson (44:28)

Tuesday's resultan was a great little season of our life where I had a show that I was hosting. I would do it every. Every Tuesday here in San Diego. Zoltan, who was fresh off a divorce, was going through it a bit and he would co host it with me. And we were at a time. This is a good example of how date night didn't work because we were like, I was gone. I was working both jobs at the time.

Melissa Nickerson (44:54)

I think you were just on comedy.

Dustin Nickerson (44:56)

But we just switched. But we did not have a lot of time to spend together. And you were. And our kids were young, so we couldn't go out and we couldn't go out of town very often.

Melissa Nickerson (45:06)

Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (45:06)

But we could stay up later on one night and that's what we would do.

Melissa Nickerson (45:11)

Living with us.

Dustin Nickerson (45:12)

My dad was living with us. That's right.

Melissa Nickerson (45:13)

The. The kids were asleep and Don was home and so. Yeah, I would like uber or you would uber?

Dustin Nickerson (45:19)

Well, we. We would uber because we would go to the show and then we would go have a couple beers and then we would go eat a quesadillas. Yeah. And go home and we would just talk to a friend about comedy life and see how he's doing and. Yeah, he's still. He's still one of my closest friends.

Jenny Urch (45:36)

Zoltan.

Dustin Nickerson (45:37)

That's a great comic. He's a great comic. Yeah, it's. It's a Hungari.

Jenny Urch (45:43)

Oh, that's interesting. I have that in my heritage, I want to say your comedy is clean. It is family friendly. So everyone who's listening to this can go listen to that. You will love it. What is the kick game?

Melissa Nickerson (45:57)

This is what happens when you get married and you're teenagers. Dustin used to wrestle, and so he made up. Well, and then he was a youth pastor. So, like, life is just a game. Games and games and games.

Dustin Nickerson (46:11)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (46:12)

So this game, the point was that you couldn't kick Dustin off the bed.

Dustin Nickerson (46:17)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (46:18)

And so he was like, hold on to the mattress, like, with his legs and his arms. And I would kick him.

Dustin Nickerson (46:26)

The whole goal was to get me off the bed via foot. He would try and kick me off the bed.

Melissa Nickerson (46:31)

Best kick game.

Dustin Nickerson (46:33)

I love it.

Jenny Urch (46:34)

You said, look, the lonely childhood that you had is like, what allowed you to come up with all these games? Boredom.

Dustin Nickerson (46:40)

You're like, yeah.

Jenny Urch (46:41)

All sorts of family games. There's one called Chicken Nuggets. There's one called Trash Bag, Raccoon, Soccer, Assassin, Burger Trap.

Dustin Nickerson (46:51)

Those. Those ones are years ago. I couldn't tell you. I can remember the Chicken Nugget game, but the other ones I forget the rules of now, we've just switched to volleyball because they're older kids, we have more structured rules, but we have.

Melissa Nickerson (47:05)

The kids got too dangerous with the trampoline. They started jumping off other things onto the trampoline. It got bad.

Dustin Nickerson (47:13)

It got bad. Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (47:14)

And there came a point where we were like, we have to get rid of the trampoline.

Dustin Nickerson (47:18)

But we still. We still play a lot of games. And I was making one up last night or two nights ago with Claire, was it. It didn't have a name, but we were. You know, she's a volleyball player. Both our girls are. And we're in the back, and it was dark. And so we were just doing some basic stuff where we were working on her serve receives and her bumps and stuff. And then we both were kind of like, this was getting a little too much like a coaching session, which nobody wants that. So then we just went. And I would just throw it as high as I could. And it was dark. And that was fun to see if, like, she. Yeah, just try and find the ball. And then it's like you're kind of scared, but then hitting it at the last second, you're like, there's just a lot of stuff like that that you're just like. And it's fun to see them have fun in it, you know?

Melissa Nickerson (48:03)

And I tried to get my. She's turning 16 next week. I tried to get her to do a glow in the dark volleyball party with like black light. And like, she had no. She had no interest. She's like, no way, Mom. But I thought it would be fun.

Dustin Nickerson (48:20)

I know.

Jenny Urch (48:21)

Maybe someone will steal that idea. That's a really good idea.

Dustin Nickerson (48:23)

Good idea.

Melissa Nickerson (48:24)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (48:25)

I love it. I love that you do all these games.

Dustin Nickerson (48:28)

It's almost my birthday. We should play kick again.

Melissa Nickerson (48:30)

And he would also, like do a trap.

Dustin Nickerson (48:32)

We had a game called trap, which was when, which sounds terrible, but the basic idea is I would kind of get her in a hold of some type ceiling, kind of, you know, lock, and then you would just have to get out. And it was. This was all fun, by the way. We were laughing while we were doing this, and then there were just like. You'd be like, you can't tighten your grip. You have to stay with your. Retighten your grip.

Jenny Urch (48:57)

What a fun family. I don't think people play. I don't think people play enough. You have this whole list of games that you have that, you know, that's like.

Dustin Nickerson (49:04)

Nobody will ever say that of our family. Not playful enough. A lot of. A lot of games. I mean, even still, I mean, when we talk about date nights, I mean, we have been doing a version of coffee and Yahtzee for 20 plus years, you know, and we still. It switched to wine a few years ago, but it is, you know, it's still super fun for us. We're just. Yeah, we like. We like playing you. Well, you called me the cruise director early on in our.

Jenny Urch (49:37)

The cruise director. I love that. Tell me about this acronym. Bkim.

Dustin Nickerson (49:42)

Oh, yeah, yeah. Bk. BKIM was a joke that I would do on stage and had, I think 1. I don't know if our kids ever bought it. I think maybe once or twice they did. But bad kids in Mexico, where we would give them the empty threat.

Melissa Nickerson (49:57)

The kids were 4 and 2.

Dustin Nickerson (49:58)

Yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, here. Yeah, yeah. That's where all the pad kids go. They get on the floor.

Melissa Nickerson (50:04)

We'd see a bus.

Dustin Nickerson (50:05)

Yeah.

Melissa Nickerson (50:06)

Oh, those children.

Dustin Nickerson (50:07)

Which kind of hits differently given current political climate and relationships. I would not do that joke now.

Jenny Urch (50:18)

If you are example, because there's not. I'm like, I don't know if this is a normal thing parents do, but, you know, we're. Obviously, we try to get our kids outside. So when they were little, you know, and we've got five and they were eight and under, so the third one, when he was like a toddler, we would be out on a mile hike Or a mile and a half hike. And then he would just be done. He would sit on the ground. He's not leaving the woods. And I was like, this is a problem. Like, I've got all these other kids. I'm carrying them. I've got the stroller. I. I would like this. I would push the stroller with my stomach like that. Because you're holding so much stuff. I got this baby that I'm holding, and the stroller's filled with. No one can sit in it. It's got everyone's clothes, and I think I used to bring everyone, like, an extra pair of shoes, flip flops, because if their shoe would break. All sorts of random things happen when you're in the woods, so you have to be prepared. So I got this massive stroller filled with all our stuff. I'm pushing it with my stomach. I'm holding babies. And he was like 3 or 4, and he would just lay on the ground and start screaming, and he wouldn't. He was not going to leave the woods as a. This is a problem. Yeah, I'm not. I'm not quite sure. So for whatever reason, he was really scared of coyotes. And so I. So this is so bad. I thought someday I should write a book called Coyotes are Coming. And I would go, charlie, I think I hear the coyotes. I think. I think they're going to come. And it's starting to get a little dark. And if you don't. And he. And he would just perk right up because he was scared, and then he would walk with me out of the woods.

Dustin Nickerson (51:41)

We use the threat of bats to get our child out of the pool once or twice. Oh, no. We saw a bat. Bats love pools.

Melissa Nickerson (51:49)

As soon as it get dark and you can't get out of the pool and you're like, oh, here come the bats.

Dustin Nickerson (51:55)

Here come the bats.

Melissa Nickerson (51:57)

So, yes, we prove this parenting tactic.

Jenny Urch (52:01)

What does it sound like when Melissa pees?

Dustin Nickerson (52:03)

Oh, you learned this in the book?

Jenny Urch (52:08)

It sounds beautiful, is what I've heard.

Dustin Nickerson (52:10)

It's great. Yeah. Real strength of stream. Yeah. I've admired just one. You know, it's like a strong river. You know, it's like at the base of the mountain, you know, just where it's still flowing like the glaciers have just melted. Everything's. It's magnificent. Yeah, I covet it.

Melissa Nickerson (52:29)

Jealous.

Dustin Nickerson (52:29)

I'm jealous.

Jenny Urch (52:31)

Well done. All right. Speaking of bathrooms, how many bathroom breaks are you allowed during a sermon?

Melissa Nickerson (52:36)

One to two. Yeah.

Dustin Nickerson (52:38)

Yeah. I think we've let up. It used to be a hard One, and now it depends on the length of the sermon. Depends who's preaching.

Melissa Nickerson (52:46)

Two, if you don't bring your phone.

Dustin Nickerson (52:48)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (52:53)

Then they're just gone for a long time.

Dustin Nickerson (52:55)

You know what's funny is the sermons are oftentimes the places I wish I could most be. On my phone playing a little game. Like, I would get a lot more out of this. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (53:03)

Maybe learn the crochet.

Dustin Nickerson (53:05)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (53:06)

That's socially acceptable. Isn't that interesting? Or knitting. That is completely socially acceptable.

Dustin Nickerson (53:11)

There's some gender stereotypes there, too, because I don't think people think of men crocheting. Broching. Yes.

Jenny Urch (53:18)

Okay, listen, you should buy that URL right now. That has got some legs. That is like, a total business. Brocheting. Okay. All right. My kids do. Would you rather. Okay, so to get the most laughs. You're trying to get the most laughs. Would you rather be a pastor speaking to a congregation, or would you rather be a person speaking to the Amish? How can you get the most.

Dustin Nickerson (53:41)

Oh, congregation. It's so easy to make congregations laugh. I mean, I talk about that in the. Like, pastors can just have the softest jokes and crush. Because they're just, like. They're just dehydrated in the desert, waiting for anything. Because they go in, expect to be bored. And then when he has a couple jokes in there, you can annihilate. Annihilate. Yeah. When there was a sweet spot there where there was, like, a couple years where I was doing comedy and preaching, and I was like, oh, man, I'm. I'm really in my wheelhouse as a preacher here. These people. I don't know if I'm teaching them anything, but they're enjoying it.

Melissa Nickerson (54:21)

The. The Easter. The pre.

Dustin Nickerson (54:23)

I would always get Palm Sunday. Okay.

Melissa Nickerson (54:25)

Yeah, great. Palm Sunday sermon.

Dustin Nickerson (54:27)

Yeah. I would always get that, you know.

Melissa Nickerson (54:29)

Because they gotta tee up the lead pastor for Easter.

Dustin Nickerson (54:32)

Yeah. He gets Easter. So I would get the Palm Sunday one. And then people would be like, we actually like you more.

Jenny Urch (54:41)

Well, there's a lot of politics there, so you get the pumps on it.

Dustin Nickerson (54:45)

I.

Jenny Urch (54:46)

Listen, I have to say that if I go anywhere to speak and people are wearing head coverings, I'm gonna crush. I mean, I. I think, you know, I don't think they've heard anything funny.

Dustin Nickerson (54:57)

Yeah, well, you know, know your audience. Yeah. You know, feel comfortable in that environment. Yeah.

Jenny Urch (55:02)

So those kind of work, too. The book is fantastic. How to Be Married to Melissa. A. Hilarious. It's a. It's a memoir, but there's A lot. You'll get a lot out of it. A hilarious guide to a happier one of a kind marriage, actually written by Dustin Nickerson. And also, even if just one person reads it, your marriage will be better. It has been an honor to meet you. People can check out your podcast. Don't make me come back there. You call people the Backseaters. We always end our show with the same question. What's a favorite memory from your childhood? That was outside.

Dustin Nickerson (55:33)

You've told me before. Your God. Your coldest. Yeah, you go ahead.

Melissa Nickerson (55:39)

What were you gonna. No, sorry.

Dustin Nickerson (55:40)

I was thinking of yours, but you.

Melissa Nickerson (55:43)

Oh, gosh. Yeah, I have swimming. Swimming? Yeah, with my family.

Dustin Nickerson (55:49)

Yeah, we had a trampoline in the. In the height of like the WWF attitude era. So this was like stone Cold and. And the Rock and like the couple names that you people actually know. And we would have big trampoline wrestling matches. So dangerous. Just.

Melissa Nickerson (56:11)

That's kid game.

Dustin Nickerson (56:13)

Highly, highly recommend against it, but like jumping off the swing set, dropping elbows on each other. I mean, just crazy vicious stuff that you should absolutely not do. But it was fun.

Jenny Urch (56:28)

People definitely have to check out your podcast. Come see you in person. And check out the book, how to be married to Melissa. Dustin and Melissa. Thank you so much for being here.

Dustin Nickerson (56:36)

Thanks for having us. This is great. Thanks, Jenny.