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The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast
1KHO 762: Retire from Procrastination | Jon Acuff, Procrastination Proof
01:00:39
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- [00:00]
A
We have had so many guests on this show talk about how powerful the outdoors can be for kids, especially kids with ADHD or different ways of learning and processing the world. And if you are raising a child with adhd, dyslexia, a language disorder, or really any kind of learning difference, I want to share a podcast that I think you'll really appreciate. It's called Everyone Gets a Juice Box. It's parents just being honest with each other in a really safe, welcoming space about the highs and lows of raising neurodivergent kids. And what I love about it is how real it is. There was one story about a mom who had this big career running a major podcast division, and she realized she hadn't been home to see her daughter before bed for weeks. And at the same time, she was starting to notice these little moments, like her daughter freezing up during a simple preschool performance and just having that gut feeling like something's different here. And then all the doubt that comes with that. Like other people saying, she seems fine. Well, you're sitting here thinking, but I'm her parent and I know her. This mom eventually stepped back in and reconnected and created little games together just to help her daughter communicate better. It's such a good reminder that connection doesn't have to be complicated. It just has to be intentional. So if that interests you, go check it out to listen. Search for Everyone Gets a Juice Box in your podcast app. That's Everyone Gets a Juice Box. Welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Jenny Urch. I'm the founder of 1000 Hours outside and back for time number seven. Seven.
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B
Let's go.
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A
Did a mashup. I did a mashup one time. I was, like, trying to do that for a little bit, but then I. It fell flat. I only did it a couple times. People really liked it, but it was more work than I thought it was going to be. So there's also a mashup episode. So actually there's. And I was just looking. I was like, I wonder if John's gonna be able to see that. He has a whole section.
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B
Oh, nice.
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A
Right there.
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B
I'm trying to fill that shelf. Just trying to jam that shelf. I want that frame out of there. That's when I'll know I'm really doing it. Yeah, I wanna have so many books up there. The frame's gonna have to move to a different shelf. Put it somewhere else. I'm coming.
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A
It's a frame of Home Alone. Like, when he rolls out the thing and that's my favorite movie. My friend bought it for me and so I love it. But I will move it if you can fill the shelf. You have a new book called Procrastination Proof. It has got an incredible cover again, but I want to kick it off by this. You said in this book. You said by the time this book comes out, you are going to have a thriving YouTube bet, which what my kids say. So I was like, that's so great.
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B
No cap. No cap.
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A
So then I was like, oh, I'm gonna check into it. And I did. And I looked the other day and I was like, sure enough, in the last two months, it's video after video in this new space. So kick it off by telling us about this new space.
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B
Yes. So we have. You've been to Franklin, where we live, multiple times. We got a office above Taziki's, so downtown Franklin, across from the theater. And it's big enough. The exciting thing, we've got a studio space, but it's big enough for us to do small events. So we're gonna start doing. We're doing something in August called Stage and Page, where one day is about how to do public speaking and kind of climb the fee ladder. And then one day is how to do publishing, how to do your book, how to sell your book. And we haven't announced it publicly yet, but it's already half sold out because so many of my friends are like, hey, I need help figuring this out. I want to, like, how do I become a $50,000 a gig speaker without getting famous? Like, what are the steps I need to take? And it's my favorite thing. And so, yeah, it's a blast. We've had a bunch of fun conversations about this space already, John.
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A
Wow. It was. The first time I saw it was on YouTube. So how long have you had it?
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B
Probably only two months. I mean, the videos really kicked off when we were able to start. We had the space to do it. And again, it's, you know, it's like anything else. I avoided YouTube for so long because it's not what I'm good at. You know, you talk about procrastination, like we procrastinate things we're not good at. And then it was. I just realized there's two focuses for me, more video content. And then I'm going all in on LinkedIn. Like, I'm really focusing on LinkedIn. So that's been a fun. Those are fun, stretch moments. You know, I'm trying to do new things at 50.
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A
Yeah. And there's always new things you can add, but what's interesting about that is in order to stretch, because you were doing your podcast before in your house, so you're like, okay, I'm not going to bring anybody. I did a podcast one time in this room with somebody else, and it's so small, John. Like, I mean, I can almost touch the walls on either side, but someone lived close by, so they were like, we'll come do it in person. And there's two problems. First of all, we were almost touching the whole time. It was so awkward.
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B
A little awkward.
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A
And this room, it's great for podcasts. It doesn't have any vents in it. It's like just a weird add on room. So it's great for podcast. Yes, but it's so hot. And the guy was covered in sweat by the time he left. So I get it. Like, you can't do it in your. In your house, in your, you know, in that room. But what a cool thing that when you expanded, it's offering several different ways to expand.
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B
Yeah. And that's what's been fun, is that I realized the things I'm best at, there's two of them, are writing books and delivering keynotes. And I've had so many people over the years go, hey, I want to figure that out. And I really believe I can shave years off of people's experience, because there are things I've learned in the last 18 years that I'll tell a speaker, like, oh, no, here's how you do that. And they'll go, I didn't. We can do that. I had no idea. And I'll be like, yeah, that's a $10,000 idea that took me a lot of reps to figure out and change and grow into. And so that's been really fun to go over the last 18 years. What have I learned? How can I create a small event for 20 people? It's only 20 people per session. And you really get to kind of slingshot people into what I think is the greatest job on the planet. Like, you get to encourage people doing something you love, often in beautiful places. Like, it's, you know, like, you. You've been here several times because you've had events in Nashville. And, like, I'm sure you have those pinch me moments where you're like, wait, somebody wants to hear my ideas and also give me money and I get to go to Nashville. Like, it almost sounds illegal. It's so good. So, yeah, for me, the ability to serve folks in that and Invite them into this journey and then hopefully amplify what they're doing is just a blast.
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A
That's a big deal because, yeah, in my case, I have done it. But they'll be like, here's $700.
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B
Yeah, but there's specific things you can do. Like, I climbed. Like, I remember I found an invoice recently where I got paid $800 to fly from Atlanta to LA on my own dime and speak twice. And I was like, wait, I get all $800? Like, I couldn't. I was like, yeah, let's do it. So I know what that's like, and I know, you know, it's fun to figure out, okay, what are the. Again, it's a ladder. So you're just trying to figure out what's the next rung and what's the requirement. And each level has different requirements and it's. And once you know what they are, it's easier to climb it.
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A
I love it. I love it. John, you know, and this is an incredible story that you have. And you talked about how at one point you met or you did a book signing event with John Maxwell.
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B
Yeah, yeah. That was a humbling experience.
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A
It's a great story.
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B
Yeah.
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A
Well, talk to us about it. But then he did say. And you said you didn't like it, but sometimes I'm like, I kind of do like to know how long it might take, because then you feel like, well, I'm not so dumb.
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B
Yeah, yeah. No. So, yeah, I did a book signing with John Maxwell in Dallas probably 12 years ago, and he had, I don't know, 300 people, 500 people in his line. Like, just people with armfuls of John Maxwell books. And then I was sitting next to, like, I had the table next to him, and nobody was in my line. And occasionally people would get out and they'd go, hey, I like your blog. Like, not in a buy stuff kind of way, but I like your blog. And then they get back into John Maxwell's line, and a stranger approached me from behind, patted me on the shoulder and said, 10 years, buddy. Like 10 years. And yeah, you're right. There are moments where, like, you. You do appreciate that. Okay, I'm not behind where I should be. Like, it'd be absurd for me to think, like, of course John Maxwell created a lot of this industry. Like, he's been doing this for 40 years. But I'm also like, how do you give advice in a way that encourages the person to take the next step without deflating them on the size of the mountain or the size of the endeavor. Meaning if somebody said, you know, it's gonna take seven years for your podcast to kind of turn into this self fulfilling thing, you might go, oh, seven years is a long time. But if they said, hey, I think you could record four episodes and kind of learn a lot during those four episodes, that might be a little more encouraging along the path.
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A
Yeah. So the new book, which has a phenomenally cool cover, is called Procrastination Proof. Procrastination Proof. Never get stuck again. And you are constantly writing about these human, very common human problems and one of them is procrastination. So I would love to talk about the part where we are and you called it the Procrastination industrial complex. So great, right? Where this is different. And I think people have always said probably things that they can zone out with. I mean, maybe less, you know, the further back you go in history. But you know, people zoned out with the newspaper. They zone out watching a sports game. But at this point, there are so many things that we could zone out on you. You call them. There's all these compelling alternatives to people who are incredibly wealthy and use that wealth to compel you out of what you feel like you should be doing. So you say it's an epidemic and there are signs of it everywhere. I would love to talk about the part in the book where you say, look, we don't have Netflix. If you are in your 30s and 40s, maybe you should quit watching TV. I mean, these are pretty bold things, John.
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B
Yeah. Yeah. Well, for me, you know, the way I think about it is procrastination is the most well funded fear in history. Modern history, anyway. Meaning Netflix doesn't fund inner critic, Hulu doesn't fund perfectionism, but all of those companies fund procrastination. Reed Hastings, the CEO of Netflix, said in 2017 at the LA Summit conference, Our number one competitor is sleep. They're worried you're going to get sleep. They don't want you to get in shape. They don't want you to spend time with your kids. They don't want you to read a book or write a book that takes away from your attention and their time, which is their business model. So I'm not mad at them by any means, but I know the score. Their goal is my time, to get my time. My goal is to keep it and to put it toward things that really matter and give me a deeper sense of joy. I think the older you get, hopefully the more you chase deeper senses of joy. Meaning Scrolling Instagram, watching Netflix, whatever. It's a pretty shallow form of joy, Shallow form of dopamine. But like holding a book you wrote in your hands is a pretty deep satisfaction. Driving home from a great conversation with a friend that you had time for is a deep satisfaction, deep joy. And, and so that's what I mean about, okay, how do we get deliberate about that? And also how do we give ourselves the grace to admit they've gotten really good at getting our time? There's always been distractions. I'm sure, like a caveman would go, that saber toothed tiger was so distracting, he's trying to eat me. But I just think we have to admit there's trillions of dollars at stake aimed at distracting you. And that's a reality. And so now that you know that, you get to make some different decisions and go, oh, this is why it's hard to focus or harder to focus right now. Some experts are trying to get me to not focus.
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A
Yeah. And a lot of them. So you say if you're in your 30s and 40s, quit watching TV. You talk about how in your 20s, these are the building years. Like, you know, you're, you've got, usually you have some extra time. So I mean, we've got a kid who's not that far from being in his 20s. I mean, these are good things to talk about. You say, don't even consider work life balance.
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B
Oh, yeah, no, I tried. Like whenever a 25 year old tells me, I'm really just trying to maintain work life balance, I think, no, these are the building years. You are poor in a couple resources, you're poor in finances and experience, you just don't have a lot of those and you shouldn't. But you're rich in time and energy, so go invest in things, go lean into it. So often when a 25 year old tells me, should I do this or that, I go, do both. Do both. Like, should I, you know, should I volunteer more or try to save more money? Do both. Should I join the gym or write a book? Do both. And so I just try to lean in, especially in your 20s, to that sense of you've got the time, you've got the energy, lean into it. And the rest of the world kind of tells 20 year olds things like, well, this is the hardest it's ever been, you'll never be able to afford a house. Like, there's this, there's a lot of negative messaging towards people in their 20s. And I try to offset that with, oh, this can be A great decade. This doesn't have to be the lost decade. You don't have to repair what you did in your 20s and your 30s. You don't have to make that choice. Like, that was kind of where I ended up in my mid-30s, was looking back on my 20s and going, oh, man, I wish I had done my 20s differently. So I have a real heart for people that are in their 20s, and I think there's some simple things they can do.
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A
Yeah. You talked about you had your fifth job by age 26, been fired at one company, quit the next one because you were mildly bored, laid off from the next one, and you're hired at both. And you say, my track record was spotty, only getting spottier. And I thought, you know, what is it like to be the parent?
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B
Parent or wife? Like, a lot of that I was married. Jenny said yesterday. We had the conversation yesterday, and she was like, atlanta was scary. And what she means was, in my early 30s, I was still bouncing from jobs. I didn't really have a future. There was not a career ladder I was on. And we had two kids under the age of four and no money. And she was like, yeah, that was. She carried a lot of that pressure as a spouse. And so, you know, I'm glad she has the space in our marriage to say that. You know, to say like, hey, this. This is a scary time, and we can have a good conversation about that. I wish it hadn't been that way, and I don't think it has to be that way. Which is why, like, when somebody goes, who do you write for? I'm writing every book to the me I used to be like. And I'm. And I'm writing to. And that's why when somebody goes, it seems like you really care about people who are stuck. I'm like, because I've been stuck. I know what the other side feels like. In the same way that if you could talk to the person that was you before you started this and you before you, and now you look at it and go, oh, my gosh, I'm in my third year of going for a thousand hours. That's why this podcast is so easy to say yes to, because I believe in it. Like, I'm. You know, I crushed it last year. I crushed the year before. This will be the third year I get a thousand hours outside. And I'm not necessarily your demographic maybe, but, man, I believe in the mission. And then I. You would say the same thing, though, to the Jenny before she started this, like, hey, you're gonna be so glad you did. It's not gonna be easy, I wouldn't lie to you, but you're gonna be so glad you did.
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A
Well, let's talk about the starting. So the book is called Procrastination Proof, a fantastic book. And you talk about all the decades in there, and you say, look, at this point in your life, your life is getting better decade by decade. You know, 30s better than the 20s, 40s better. And that's. That's what you want. So this is a book for any age or stage. You got someone in your life that's graduating here in a month, whether from college or. What a fantastic book to get them. Procrastination Proof. So you talk about the start. Where do you begin? And it's interesting because I think there will be people who would say, you know what? I can't start because I can't afford the. The space above Taziki's in downtown Franklin. Sure not going to have a space to do my podcast, and it's not going to look like that, and I can't get it up on a video, you know, and it's not going to have your cool logo up on the brick wall, you know, and. And so there's always that. That tricky part where you kind of wait because you don't know where to begin. You wrote this. I'd begin right this second. I'd be brave and bold if I could just figure out which door to open first. This project, this task, this conversation, this. Everything has a thousand possible entrances, and they all look like they could be the one. How do we handle that?
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B
Well, I mean, one is that it's going to happen. You're going to have more dreams than you can possibly chase. So I used to teach goal setting the wrong way. I used to start with an idea that everybody starts with when they teach goal setting. They go blank piece of paper, write as many dreams as you have. And what I learned is the people that are into goal setting and dream chasing already have too many. On average, they had 28 when they sat down with me. And so I said to the overwhelmed person, hey, you know how you're overwhelmed and don't know where to start? You have too many things you want to do, let's double that, let's triple that so you can feel like an even bigger failure for not starting. And so now I do a lot more about, let's pick something. Let's figure out, like, what's a priority? What's an easy way for us to filter the list to give ourselves permission to audition something for a week and see if we like it. Not perfectly. Not the final stage, not where it's going to be. And the problem is. Well, for me, social media didn't really even exist when I was starting. Like, I couldn't post from Effingham, Illinois, when, like, there's 40 people in a Ramada and it's the middle of January and I've got a three hour talk. And the sound guy goes, I'll never forget this. He goes, hey, I forgot the clicker at home, so just say next slide. And I was like, bro, it's three hours. Like, I'm gonna say next slide like 200 times. How far is home? The problem is those. I couldn't even physically capture that because I didn't have a camera phone, because my phone didn't have a camera. And so, like, it's so easy to see the after and then go, oh, but I didn't see the before. And we know that intellectually, but we forget that. And so for me, to that person who's thinking about, like, okay, I want to start, but it won't be good. It won't. And that's okay. You and I have talked about that soundtrack. Be brave enough to be bad at something new. Be brave enough to be bad at something new. You shouldn't be good at it. And that's okay. And it's hard. It is. Like. But one of the things I tell people is go fast. Meaning, like, my first drafts are very fast because imposter syndrome is strong, but it's slow. I can usually keep ahead of the fear if I go quickly, if I stop to think about the sentences, or if I stop, I'm starting a podcast or a diet or whatever the thing is. And I kind of go slow. The fear can come in and set up shop. The procrastination can kind of get comfortable and go, who are you to think you can do this? The last diet didn't work. Why would this one work? And so for me, if you're thinking about starting, like, start fast, like, get ahead of the fear. Like, jump it. You know, get there first. And so little things like that, I think, do help people start.
- [18:19]
A
So you feel like, just do something. There's a thousand possible entrances.
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B
You're not going to find the right one. You're not going to like. The lie is, I'll start when I find the right thing. As if there's a right thing. There's not. There's really not. Like a much better Way to do it again is somebody said, I want something really tactical. Like if you picked one of the things on your list, just one, or if that feels like perfectionism, pick two, it doesn't matter. And said, for the next seven days, I'm going to spend 15 minutes a day trying this thing and I'm going to take notes. You should be the best note taker about yourself. You should know Jenny better than anybody. I should know John better than anybody. Like you should be a really good documentarian of your own life. So for seven days, try it. Audition that goal in essence at the end of the seven days, go. Did I like that? Do I want to double down on that and do 30 minutes? Maybe I'll just add five minutes. I'll do 20 minutes a day for seven days. Because I think that's a really great filter. If you won't try that, then maybe you've got some old goals on your list you just need to let go of. Like you've told yourself for years, I have to write a book. But you really don't want to and that's okay. Like you shouldn't feel the pressure to do that. That's probably in the way of something you really do want to do. Let's audition something for seven days and see what happens.
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A
It's good. You talk about how you're never ready. You're never ready. No, you're not ready to be a parent. But you just what you do. And you've talked about this before, but you talk about how you have to make a decision and then you look back and you review it and this is part of the book you're talking about dpdr and you review it and then you kind of move on. Now you have a better vantage point for what's ahead. Spring has a way of filling every open space on the calendar, activities, travel, time outside, all the good things. But it can make it harder to keep your curriculum learning consistent during the final stretch of the homeschool year. That's why having something flexible and easy to use can make a big difference right now. IXL is designed to meet kids where they are and fit into real life, not add more complexity to it. 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That's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com Wayfair Every style, every Home One of the things that you talked about in this book, Procrastination Proof, is that I really related to you and I was so glad that you wrote about it because I wondered sometimes like, is this wrong? My came from this book by a man named John Holt where he said kids should basically see adult work done, especially as they're growing up. Most kids are completely removed from adult work. And he's like, no, kids should see you build a table, they should see you right in. He probably didn't say write an email because he's dead and it's from a while ago. But like they should see you write a book, they should see you do these processes. And that really changed my whole motivation like for 1000 hours outside. In fact, I wouldn't be here if not for that section of that book because that's all I had as a vehicle to sort of show my kids. They were like younger at that time, but like show them how to have a meeting. How do you order T shirts, how do you pick colors, how do you talk to the guy, how you know, what do you do when you send the wrong size and someone's mad. And so I had that motivation and I feel like that has really helped me to stick with it. Oh yeah, and you talked about that in the book. So you talk about connecting what you don't want to do with the thing you really want to do. I asked someone one time who's kind of like she became controversial and like got really slammed through the media and I was like, how did she keep going? She was like, well, I had to pay for my kids college that's like a great honest answer. Joe, can you.
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B
I didn't know.
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A
Like, I was so glad I read it in your book because I was like, is this really appropriate? Is it? So here's an example. Our oldest is about to graduate from high school and he's like back and forth on college and you know, he's, he may not need a degree to go into the kind of career he wants. So I was like, well, we could hire him. So I have motivation to figure out how to grow our company for the sake of possibly hiring our kid part time or whatever. And you talk about that. You're like, look, you know, if you go down the ladder that you call it a daisy chain, like the nitty gritty when you get to the bottom, if I do these things, it's going to help provide what I really want. So can you talk about that motivation piece? Because I never heard of it and I think it works.
- [25:40]
B
Yeah. So for me, I mean, so much of life, to have a remarkable life is, is the ability to talk yourselves into doing something you really want to do, but you're probably not going to feel like it a lot of the time. Like, how do you talk yourself into doing something you really want to do but maybe don't feel like it? And like I always say, like, I'm the best John Acuff salesman. Like, and I know that because every decision I've ever made, first I talked myself into it. And so now I'm looking at as a positive and going, okay, in order for me to push through this, like, launching a book is a challenging experience. Like I. It just is. Like, you've launched books before. If you want to have your ego tested, if you want to have your pride kicked around, if you want to look at an Amazon number way too many times. Like, if you want to feel like all your friends who are like, we're so excited for you, but they didn't buy your book or review it or whatever, it's a hard thing to do. It's my 11th book, but it's still challenging. So for me, if I only look at that hard thing and not the real things that it allows me to do, I get really discouraged if I overstair the thing that's hard. So I've just learned through time to over focus on the things that really matter to me. So. And have big goals. Like, I don't want to be a financial burden to my kids. Now I'm hopefully a long way off from that chapter of my life, but I've seen Older generations where I've seen friends whose parents had no money, no plan, and then become kind of an anchor to their kids and it really hurts the relationship. So I'm thinking, like, how do I set up Ellian McRae for some success? Like, that's a long way off. But like, man, that, that fires me up. Or to your point, how do I do this next project in a way that does teach them a positive lesson. Like so, you know, I don't demonize work. Travel, for instance, like, that's one of our rules because I don't want them to have that as the experience. So like we. One of our soundtracks is Bags of Gold are Heavy. And so I'll go, oh, like they'll go like, dad, you have a 4am flight. I'm like, bags of gold are heavy. And it turns out the gold is in Kansas City this time. Like it's on like on a Tuesday. It's in Kansas. Somebody put it there and I have to go pick it up. And so like, as they can see that then they're not, you know, five years into their career going, I can't believe my boss is making me go to Kansas City. How dare them. They're like, oh no. That's part of, that's one of the ticket prices you pay to get to do the things that you really want to do. And so for me, it's constantly on, you know, in my, in my mind. And I'm constantly tying the things that really matter to me to the things that I maybe don't want to do because they do have a greater purpose. If I can see the connection, it's a lot easier to do them.
- [28:14]
A
And that's what you're talking about is you're talking about that there is a connection and you have to connect them. Here's the connection that you write in Procrastination Proof. I want to be able to pay for my kids college. And I think that's. That's great, John. And I think it's cool that you're saying those things. You say it means a lot to me that they won't graduate with crippling student loan debt. How do I do it? I speak at events. Okay, like so it could end there, right? I speak at events. But you're like, what, how, how do I speak at events? It's stage and page. Right? I write books that and the book this maybe is my problem. My book's called Homeschooling. I should have written a different book. Okay, all right. I do speak at those but you know, there's not that many stages for that audience.
- [28:56]
B
Okay, yeah, but you've built something that there's a lot of stages for. There's a ton of stages in your space. It would just take a minute to figure them out. Yeah, there really are.
- [29:06]
A
Okay, I agree. I agree. I have not found the stages. Okay, so. And I've tried to make the stages, but I have struggled with that too. Okay, but here. But I'm going through the book. You speak at events. How do you get to speak at events? You write the books that the clients are interested in. Well, how do you do that? You have to have had good books in the past. You know, you have to continue to sell your old books so that a publisher is going to say, yes, John, book 11. Sure, let's do it. And in order to do that, you have to write emails to your new newsletter. Well, how do you do that? You have to build a newsletter subscription list. Well, how do you do that? You have to have a loss leader. You have to post on social media. And so that's the chain with the top thing being I really care that my kids do not have crippling loan debt. And so what you said was and this is something that people can check out once the book is out. So I did. There's a couple like little fun extras. I went to John Acuff.com profile. I did my procrastination profile assessment.
- [30:01]
B
Nice.
- [30:01]
A
I am a hustler.
- [30:02]
B
Then I shocking. Who could imagine. Look how many notes you have right now. You don't have to tell. You're flipping through stacks of papers. I love it.
- [30:11]
A
Hustler. Yes. Okay. And then there was one called john acuff.com motivation actually you can go to john acuff.com outside.
- [30:21]
B
Yeah, we have a URL just for your listeners.
- [30:23]
A
Yes. Okay, so I'll make sure that that's in the show notes. But the motivation one. So slash motivation is a motivation portfolio. Remarkable. People always have a robust motivation portfolio. Wow. I'd never even heard of that.
- [30:40]
B
Yeah. And so I'll explain the concept and so that people can easily build one. The problem is that we kind of think you're gonna have one form of motivation like a true north, your why, your passion, your vision. And we go. As soon as I find that, then everything will change. I had a friend spend time some six months trying to figure out his why didn't do anything else to change his life. Just kind of was on this, this vision quest for the perfect thing. And what I find is that works a lot better is to have as many forms of motivation as you need. Because on some days those won't matter to you. There'll be some days where you go, the finances don't matter to me. Like, or you'll hit your financial goal and you go, okay, now what you see, successful people that only have one form of motivation quit all the time because they go, as soon as I have this amount of whatever, then I'll. And then they get it and they go, oh, there's nothing else to keep me going. And so what I like to do is collect forms of motivation. So, you know, you mentioned paying for my kids college. That's definitely one of them. The ability to take them on trips. Like, you know, I use my Delta sky miles to upgrade us on a flight to Italy. And that was really fun because I could tie that all the time. I'm delayed for a flight in Atlanta to my kids. I was able, like, we could never have afforded that. Like, hey, we're going to ball out. We're going to upgrade to this. It can be a song, it can be a podcast episode. It could be. You have a frame behind you of the Home Alone House. Like, I guarantee that gives you a feeling that probably makes you remember. Like, this is what I felt like when I first saw it. This is what it feels like to have wonder. This is what it feels like for me to be adventurous and come up with plans. And so you have behind you probably ten different forms of motivation. I just want people to kind of curate it again so that when they get discouraged because you're going to on the journey, so that when the world knocks you about, so that when you have a bad day, you go, oh, wait a second. I've got this portfolio and I like mine written out. I don't want to have to try to remember it. The older I get, the less tasks I assign to my brain. I might. You know, one of my big principles is like, how do we make this easy? Like, the solution to procrastination isn't work harder or it would have already worked for you. So I'm constantly saying the opposite. How do we make this easier on you? So the mom listening right now. You've got a tough job. Like, you've got a million things to do. Even if you just open up a note in your phone and we're like, here's the 10 things that really keep me going. It's a call with Carol and you're going to forget them. In the midst of fear, you get amnesia. You get kind of hope amnesia. And so I want you to have that note even if you have to put it on your calendar every Tuesday, because Tuesday is the hardest day for me. I have a calendar reminder. An alert comes up and goes, hey, read your motivation portfolio. And you scroll through it and go oh, that's right. Like this is why I'm doing the things I'm doing. That's a way different experience than hoping you stay motivated or hoping the one thing is enough.
- [33:29]
A
I really got a lot out of it, John. I've gotten a lot out of you saying, I want to pay for my kids college. I want to make sure that they have a reliable car and if they
- [33:36]
B
have those couple things, that's the best that like doing that, like here's my soapbox on that. Maybe I did it last time. When people in our community, because we live in a well off community, Williamson county is like one of the nice communities in Tennessee. There's dads I know who will say, well, I want my kid to know the value of a dollar so I'm going to give him a terrible car at 18, like a beater. And I always think like, if they haven't learned the value of a dollar by 18, that's not going to do it. Like you hopefully have taught them. And two, I would never put my greatest asset or greatest treasure, my two daughters, in a terrible car as they drive to Birmingham so they can break down on the side of the highway and have a. Like what? Like I enjoyed being able to give them a 4Runner that they'll take into college. I enjoyed that experience. So yeah, you're right. And that, that does, I mean, you know, the mama bear, like it triggers every mama bear part of you where you're like, oh. And I don't want their choices to be limited by my finances. Meaning I knew early on if there's a perfect college they're supposed to go to, I want them to have the ability to go to that not based on, you know, their options are limited by what we were able to achieve.
- [34:47]
A
Those are big things to say, John. I've not really read them in other books and they've stuck with me and they've really challenged me and they've helped us. We've talked about them quite a bit. You know, you talked about you want to be able to have just this magical home where the kids want to come home to, they want to bring their kids so the grandkids come. And I think you talked about in the book because you'd worked At Dave Ramsey. And you were like, you know, there is part and often in sort of religious culture like that's poo pooed on. And, and you talked about even like, you know, the motivation folder has the car that you loved when you're 8 years old. And you know.
- [35:17]
B
Yeah.
- [35:18]
A
Got big eyes thinking about it and like that's okay. And it. And it really works. Like I have used hills pay the bills when I go speak. And I've had the same thing. Like my slides have a bit of comedic timing to them. So like if I show up somewhere and they don't I my clue, they it's often that their stuff doesn't work. Yeah. And they're gonna be like, you're gonna have to say next. And I'm like, I cannot say next. It's gonna kill the moment. You know, not my head. Do I have to do some weird thing? But I'm scratching ear. I cannot say next is gonna ruin it. But. And I'm thinking hills pay the bills. And so do you get pushback on any of that ever?
- [35:56]
B
Yeah, I get pushback on the. I mean, you know, I, I grew up as a Christian and we have a lot. Our, our people have a lot of hang ups about success. We have, you know, kind of whether it's financial, whether it's public attention, we are really sure that Jesus wants you to be pretty poor and miserable. Like, that's his, one of his missions. Like he's the God of all gifts and abundance, but he's. When it comes to your individual life, like there's, you know, and, and I had a friend say a Christian musician, big Christian musician, he said in Nashville, if you buy an $80,000, $90,000 Suburban, they go, good for you. That's a family vehicle. You'll really be able to serve the family. If you buy a $90,000 BMW, they tell you Jesus rode a donkey. Same amount of money, just different perception. And so I've wrestled with that in my own life, in my own heart for a long time about how to be a good steward of the gifts that I've been given, how to use my talents in ways that I don't limit. The enemy wins with your gifts in two ways. When you abuse them or don't use them, them. That's it. Abuse them or don't use them. And if you abuse them, you use them in the wrong way. If you don't use them out of some sort of false humility, you don't get to extend this gift. My favorite, like, definition of generosity I don't think I've told you this story before.
- [37:14]
A
This episode is sponsored by Better Help. One of the things I've noticed over the years, both in our own life and in conversations with so many families, is how deeply financial stress can affect a marriage. It's rarely just about the money. It's about the pressure and the different expectations and the conversations that feel hard to have or the ones we avoid altogether. And I think for a lot of us, we come into marriage with completely different money stories. How we were raised, what we believe about spending or saving, what feels safe or scary. And when stress hits, those differences can really start to feel big. I've had moments where finances feel heavy, and it would have been easy to let that tension create distance instead of connection. But what I've learned is that sometimes what we actually need isn't a better budget. It's better tools for communicating, processing and understanding each other. That's where therapy can make a real difference. It's not about financial advice. It's about working through the stress, the anxiety, and even the conflict that money can bring into a relationship so you feel more like a team again. Better help makes that kind of support easier to access. They match you with a licensed therapist based on your needs. And if it's not the right fit, you can switch anytime. With over 30,000 therapists and millions of people served, it's a resource that's helping a lot of people feel less alone. Alone when life feels overwhelming. Therapy can help. Sign up and get 10 off@betterhelp.com 1000hours that's betterhelp.com 1000hours this is such a fun announcement to make. Womb Bikes is officially the 2026 bike partner of 1000 hours outside. And if you've been around here long enough, you know that's not a casual partnership. We care deeply about the tools that help families reclaim childhood. And Womb is doing exactly that. Womb was founded by two dads in a Vienna garage who simply couldn't find a bike that actually fit their kids. So they built one. And what makes Room different is that they don't start with engineering. They start with empathy. Every part of the bike, from the lightweight frame to the brakes, sized perfectly for small hands, is designed to help kids feel capable and confident in a screen dominated world. Bikes are more than bikes. They are freedom. They are connection. They're miles of memories before the street lights come on. So this spring we're launching something brand new. The 100 hour ride challenge. We'll release a brand new tracker chart just for logging 100 hours outside on bikes and for app members. Stay tuned. Integration inside the 1000 hours outside app is coming if you've got little learners. The Womb Go bikes are incredible. Available in six bright colors, including the sweetest new powder pink that just feels like spring. If you are working toward your 1000 hours outside this year, a great bike makes it a whole lot easier. Woom designs lightweight bikes built just for kids so they can ride farther and ride happier. Go to wooom.com and use code outside 10 at checkout for 10% off your bike purchase excluding the womb. Wow. That's outside 10 for 10% off at w o o m.com
- [39:59]
B
I was at an event and I was speaking. It was a high end fundraiser and I mentioned that someday I'd like to own a Porsche 911. And like, that's a kind of vulnerable thing for me to say because it does feel like, oh my gosh, get over yourself. But that's the car. As a little kid, like there was a dealership near our house and they sounded like dragons. Like, I still will take a photo of when I see, like, it's. And so I mentioned that from stage and after a couple in their late, probably 50s, early 60s comes up and they go, hey, we have a 911 here. Like, why don't you just take it for the night? Like, why don't you just, you know, borrow it for tonight, drive it all day tomorrow, bring it back. And I was like, there's no way I can do that. And they're like, no, no, take it, take it. So eventually they say it this way. They say we share it all the time because if we can't share it, it has too much power over us. And what a great definition of generosity. And so they give me the valet ticket, I go to the valet, I give him the ticket, he goes, what's the name on the reservation? I go, I don't even know their name. And he goes, ah, it doesn't matter. Brings around $180,000 911 Turbo S. I don't even know how to turn it on. A friend has to come over and be like, bro, you gotta do. I was like, okay. I laughed the entire way home. Like, I was so full, like so full of joy in that moment. It felt like this really fun God moment. So, yeah, a big part of my mission from a faith perspective is the parable of the talents. The 5, 2, 1. Like, I think there's a lot of people who buried their talents. And a big part of my Mission is like, let's grab a shovel. Like, let's go. Like, let's grab a shovel and see what happens when you. You do this, when you lean into this. And a friend said it this way. And we're getting a little. Like, I know I'm getting a little into my faith. A friend said, God gets the glory, we get the blessings, and that's a pretty good deal. And I was like, oh, that's a real. Like, so that's how I think about success now is like, how do I not limit what God's trying to do? I'm not going to idolize it. I know there's no part of me. A friend said, well, you know, a 911 won't make you less stress or less anxious. And I was like, no, I'll have the same anxieties inside that car that I have outside. I'll just be going faster. Like, I know there's no part of me at 50 that's like, I've sold enough books now that I know more book sales won't fix me. Like, I sat next to Henry Cloud, who wrote Boundaries on a flight. He sold 20 million copies. And I know that, like, I know that my million. And that feels small in that moment. But it. But like, no. What an amazing thing I've gotten to do. And I also know 10 million won't fix me. Like, 12 million won't. Like, I'm. I've gone down the path long enough to know, like, But I want to try that because I don't want to play small in some sort of false humility.
- [42:29]
A
Yeah. And I think the book frames it up so well because it's not about fixing. It's about motivation and that those things are really good motivators. You know, you want to give. You want to, like, my dream. And we've done it a couple times, but I love to rent big houses and, like, bring four families along. And we're going to be at Lake Michigan or, you know, we're going to go down to North Carolina. We're going to go to Virginia, Sandbridge Island. And I'm like, it really does motivate you to work.
- [42:54]
B
Yeah. What a blessing. What a blessing.
- [42:56]
A
So fun. So I love this idea and this. People can find this online with this motivation portfolio. And if you order the book ahead of time, you get the audiobook.
- [43:06]
B
What, A whole audiobook? For free.
- [43:09]
A
Okay. I'll make sure all the links are there so people can know when you order it. You know, this is gonna come out a couple days before the book comes out. You can also come to your remarkable you in person event, which we loved. We came last year and brought our teenagers. It's in April.
- [43:19]
B
Got a shout out from the stage. We're so excited to have you guys there.
- [43:23]
A
It was awesome. And there's a shout out in the book, a pretty good shout out. So that was, that was really cool. That's in the book too. You talk about 1000 hours outside and you. My favorite line in the book actually was about nature. My favorite line was, the older you get, the more you appreciate walks and birds.
- [43:43]
B
I think I said I didn't. I didn't notice a single bird in my 20s, I think is what I said.
- [43:48]
A
Like, I think they were there.
- [43:50]
B
Yeah. Then all of a sudden you get to a certain age, you're like, birds are a mirror. The dawn chorus is a miracle. Like, yeah, you start to. You start to care about that. Totally.
- [43:59]
A
Yeah. So I love. That's in the book too. The book is called Procrastination Proof. I would love to talk about this concept of, okay, night me versus morning me, which we maybe have talked about a little bit in the past, but you took it further in this book. So night me, morning me. But then you also talked about Monday me versus Friday me.
- [44:17]
B
Yeah.
- [44:18]
A
And then you talked about, which I thought this was really perceptive, January me versus July me versus September me. Can you talk about thinking about your future self and kind of setting your future self up not just for a 24 hour cycle, but also like for the week ahead, the months ahead, possibly.
- [44:36]
B
Yeah. So for me, it started on a small micro level of going morning me would wake up and would say, I want to have a great day. I want to jump into it. And it wake up tired, exhausted and go, hey, what happened last night? At night we'd be like, oh, I stayed up till midnight scrolling Instagram and I ate lasagna. Good luck. And they were in constant kind of argument. So eventually I got them on the same page. And I also recognize their unique strengths. Like, Morning Me is a great doer. I'll run through a wall if you just point out the right wall first. But I'm a terrible planner in the morning. Meaning if I wake up at 8am on a Monday morning, I don't have a plan for the day. I feel instantly overwhelmed. Like, emails are coming in, text messages are already started. People need me and I feel kind of overwhelmed. But night me is a great planner. At 7pm there's not as many people that need my attention. If I spend 10 minutes and come up with a plan for the next day. I feel like night me just sent morning me a gift. It sent a tiny little gift into the future. So then when I discovered how that worked, I was like, oh, let me expand it. What can Monday me do to hook up Friday me? My favorite definition of discipline is make tomorrow easy today. Make tomorrow easy today. So I just started to think, I want an easy Friday afternoon. What can I do on Monday to send that person a gift? And then I started to think, okay, if I want to relax to June, what can I do in April? You have a podcast. There's moments where you go at that big house. I don't want to be thinking about episodes stacking up. Like, oh no. And I get it.
- [46:10]
A
I totally do it already. I'm like, in June and July and in August, which are the only good months in Michigan, I want to be on the water. So I have to.
- [46:18]
B
Yeah. And so you do stuff in April and May, February.
- [46:22]
A
Are you kidding me? It's the worst ever.
- [46:24]
B
Yeah, you should stack tons of episodes. And so then Jenny, where it really hit home for me was I started realizing we send our letters in the wrong direction. Meaning people say, what do you wish you could tell your 20 year old self? And I was that person. He was not looking for wisdom. If the 50 year old me showed up to that 20 year old, he would all. The only thing he'd say is like, our hair is so white and are you wearing clothes from Costco? Like that would be it. Like, that person's gone. I can't help that person. But the seven year old me actually exists. And what can I do now to send that person gifts? Like if I want good knees in my 70s, if I want to be the grandparent house where the kids want to come back to, what do I do now to kind of foster that? That's where the hooking up your future you gets into into. And you don't have to think that way at the beginning. Just think about like, okay, morning me versus night me, or Monday me versus Thursday me. What can I do? It really? It helps you break the kind of spell of procrastination. Like one of my soundtracks is, the person who has to do it later is also me. The person who has to do it later is also me. It's not a fictional different person, you know, like I'm the same person. If I go, I don't want to do this right now. I was like, you think the next that tomorrow you wants to do it? They're gonna be really upset that we didn't do it. I'm like, oh, you're right. And it's just one of those funny games that I play with myself to stay active and engaged in what I'm trying to accomplish.
- [47:48]
A
I love the book. It has, like, these sort of deep, philosophical things to consider. Like that, you know, when you started to go through the. The part about, like, the future me and, like, today, Tomorrow is yesterday, you know, like, there was a part about how tomorrow is today's yesterday. Where is it? I hope it was about dealing with regret.
- [48:12]
B
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know. I know what you're saying. Yeah. Here's the point I was making. We give the past a lot of power. We say, I can't become who I want to be because of mistakes I made in the past. And so the question I was asking was, well, then, when does today become the past? Meaning if five years ago you made a mistake and you're now going, I can't be the kind of mom I want. I can't have the kind of family I want. I can't have the kind of finances because of something I did five years ago. Five years from now will be the past. What if today was powerful, too? Like, if we're going to say the past is powerful, today is eventually the past, why don't we just take this power in today? That's. That was kind of the concept of, like, when did we stop believing that today had power? Like, is it only in your 20s and whatever you did in your 20s has. Has ruined your 40s? Like, that can't be the case.
- [48:58]
A
Yeah. And at some point, it's going to be your 60s or it's going to be your 70s. So your book includes these really philosophical, topical things, like, what would I put in my motivational portfolio? And is that okay to do that? You know, and you're talking about this sort of future self, and how could I set myself up better tomorrow? I mean, these are great concepts for kids and for teenagers, but then there's also really practical things, too. So what I wanted to hit a couple of the really practical. It's just a great combination, John, of both things. So one of the really practical is the blow pop.
- [49:29]
B
Yeah, yeah. I love the blow pop.
- [49:31]
A
Can you talk about the blow pop trick?
- [49:33]
B
Yes. So a friend of mine taught me that her. Her principle is, in essence, I can do anything for the length of a blow pop. So she kind of puts the reward principle and does it opposite. Meaning most people go, when I do this, then I earn a reward. She goes, no, no, no, no, no. I have. I have 10 minutes or 15 minutes of something I've been putting off. I don't want to do it. I get to eat a blow pop during it. So she has a bag of blow Pops. And, like, as an adult, you're kind of like, when's the last time? I like, we never have lollipop. Like, you're never at a party. And somebody goes, hey, Jenny, you want a lollipop? You're like, oh, thanks, I love lollipops. And so she says, I have to do this task as long as it takes for me to eat this blow Pop. And what usually happens is once you get through, like, it's. It's not a long period of time. Once you get through that first eight awkward minutes or that first 12 difficult minutes, that first 15 frustrating minutes, you look up and go, oh, I've already spent 30 minutes doing this. Like, this wasn't as hard as I thought it was. And so it's her way to kind of get into a task that maybe she's putting off.
- [50:32]
A
Yeah. I love the book. It's got all these short chapters. It's a new format for you.
- [50:36]
B
Well, that was on purpose because procrastinators don't want a thick, onerous book. Like, I'm a procrastinator. So whenever I read a Kindle and it says in the corner, 82 minutes left in the chat chapter, I'm like, Bro, 82 minutes that I can't do it. I wanted people to win so many times in this book. So the chapters are short so that you're constantly winning, you're constantly finishing, you're constantly building your own momentum.
- [51:01]
A
Yeah, it's good.
- [51:02]
B
It's good.
- [51:02]
A
It reminds me of, like, Steven Pressfield stuff. I really like the format of it. So it's got all these chapters in there, and you're talking about dream plan, do review with a lot of these sort of philosophical underpinnings where you are challenged to think about, what do I value? What do I really want out of life? What do I want out of my future? And then there's all these practical things about, like, the blow pop or don't watch television. You wrote the average American watches 21 hours of TV a week. And there's more statistics like that. Procrastination is an epidemic, you wrote, and there are signs of it everywhere you look. So I just want to hit a couple more of the practicals.
- [51:35]
B
Sure.
- [51:36]
A
One is using a countdown timer. I use a countdown Timer. Every time I read, I have to. At this point, I have to set my timer for 45 minutes. You just get distracted. So you talked about that and having the cue of noise canceling headphones.
- [51:49]
B
Oh, yeah. So for me, again, it fits back into that philosophy of how can I make it easier? How can I make this so easy on myself? Like, you're already trying to do a difficult thing. Reading and focusing in this chaotic world is a difficult thing. Why wouldn't you make it easier? So some weeks, the app I use the most on my screen time is my time. Because I'll sit down and go, I've got to write for 30 minutes. I can do it for 30 minutes. And while I'm writing to this, I'm going to use noise canceling headphones that I only use when I'm working and I'm going to listen to. I'm really in right now. I'm really into like ambient fireplace sounds because YouTube has a million where it's like nine hours of pretending you're in a Swiss chalet. I did one where I listened to studying with gandalf for like 10 hours where it's just. You hear like, it sounds like a quill on a piece of paper. Like, and it's supposed to be you and Gandalf are in Lord of the Rings studying. And I'm like, I'll do that. So I'll do a million things to kind of get into that spot so that I can actually do it. Because I'm a very kind of busy brain person, like, very distractible. And so I had. There's some people that don't have to have a lot of kind of tools or guardrails. But for me, the more I have, the easier it is for me to do. Do something that I consider difficult, which is writing.
- [53:01]
A
Yeah, yeah. The timer just completely changes things for me. I don't know what it is. It's going and then I can focus in. I was so intrigued that you write your first draft on paper and I thought that is the most brilliant idea because when you got that computer in front of you and you can just delete, delete, delete. You often get nowhere.
- [53:21]
B
Yeah, paper. The thing I like about paper is it only goes forward when I am writing in a document. I can jump back up. I can jump back up. Paper is all downhill. So, like when I'm writing, writing, writing, I never jump back up three pages and go, oh, let me easily change this because it's too hard to do it. So I end up with this really big. And then the second level is as I type it in, I'm editing, I'm rewriting, I'm editing, rewriting. And so for me, and my Notebook doesn't have Instagram. Like, it turns out it doesn't have Instagram, it doesn't have Netflix. Like, my Notebook is pretty limited. It just has paper. Like, that's all it is.
- [53:55]
A
That's brilliant. The page naturally urges you on paper kills procrastination. So the book is filled with all sorts of practical ideas as well. I was curious, John. You talked about, and this is kind of brief, but you talked about when you just decided to become an entrepreneur to begin with. So you say until 2013, I was content to have it be someone else's job to manage me. That's so great. This is really not that long ago in the grand scheme of things. 2013, I mean, that's only 13 years ago, John. But then I did the unthinkable. I started my own business, lost all my support systems overnight. I was woefully unprepared for the amount of self discipline this new structureless landscape of employment would require. My main problem was that I had only one employee and that employee was terrible. So it's been 13 years. What was the impetus for the leap to begin with?
- [54:48]
B
I wanted to try it. I wanted to see if I could do it. I had a great job. I worked for Dave Ramsey. There was a lot of tremendous opportunity there. It was a fire hose of information. But eventually I had the entrepreneur bug and wanted to see if I could do it. I wanted to see if I could start my own company. And I was writing all these books daring people to be brave, and I wanted to be brave. And so that was the impetus for it. And yeah, it was challenging. And this is the thing. I have a lot of empathy for people who during COVID went to work from home. It's really hard to work from home unless you're incredibly disciplined. And the reality is, Jenny, nobody in 2020 instantly became disciplined. They all went home, but they didn't become really good at managing their calendar and their time and focusing and avoiding snacking all day, whatever. And then they go, I just, just don't feel like I get the same thing done. And they forgot that there's all these triggers, all these cues. Like, you know, you have co workers, you have breaks, you have a boss that checks in every now and then, you have an expectation of a dress code. You had so many different helpful frameworks that made it easier for you to stay Productive. And that's what took me a while to figure out, is like, oh, this is the wild, wild West. And if I don't learn some discipline, if I don't learn how to not progress, no one will teach me in this moment. Like, I'm in a lot of trouble if I don't figure this out.
- [56:06]
A
But you did it. You did it. You left Dave Ramsey. I got to interview at Dave Ramsey once a year or two back with John Deloney and Rachel Cruz.
- [56:15]
B
Oh, yeah, they're great.
- [56:18]
A
I was like, these people have teams.
- [56:22]
B
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- [56:23]
A
Such an experience. John.
- [56:24]
B
It was like.
- [56:25]
A
Like, the lighting person was like. I mean, there was, like, people buzzing around everywhere. They were in different rooms, and in the one room, everyone was wearing a shirt that said Deloney. And, you know, they. I mean, they just are taking care of all of these different, like, the sound. And I'll never get in Rachel's room. One guy was like, color correction. I don't even know what that is. So Luna.
- [56:47]
B
Well, I think people forget it's a small. Like, some people because of the radio show. So popular. You think it's like 50 people and a radio station. And it's like, no, he's got a 12,000.
- [56:57]
A
Yeah, he's got over.
- [56:58]
B
Yeah, if you come to Nashville, it's. And they do. They. I think they do tours. It's a fun building. Like, it's a great stop if you're in the.
- [57:05]
A
Yeah, they do. They do. And you can watch the radio show live. And they come out and say hello and do pictures. They'll ring the bell if you're out of debt.
- [57:12]
B
Debt free. Debt free. Scream.
- [57:14]
A
But after having seen it, I was like, it's kind of wild that John left this.
- [57:20]
B
Oh, yeah, sure. And now, granted, I left when there were 350 employees, so 13 years. Like, it's hard to kind of capture the size of the growth they've had. I mean, they went from 350 to. What is it, 1100 now. So I. And I was in a different building. So. Yeah. And I didn't. I didn't have a team. That's it. Like, they've really dialed in kind of what they would call personalities in the last 13 years. Like, and so it's. And I get to run into a bunch of those. I mean, Franklin's a small town, so you run into each other at events, so. Yeah, it's fun to see what they've turned it into.
- [57:51]
A
Yeah. But really, it's a big thing to leave. I talked to a woman recently who left Google. And it was like her dream job, but it was just like, you know, ruining her health. And so she did her own thing, and you did that. I want to hit one last topic as we're wrapping up here, because it relates to this conversation. You talk in the book about dealing with doubt. So with procrastination, you know, I think there's a lot of doubt. There's regret. You have to deal with regret. You talk about dealing with perfectionism. You say, they're so closely related, that's basically a total eclipse. Perfectionism and procrastination. So without you say, and I think this is a good thing to know, you're like, okay, I've been at this for 13 years. I've never gone under. You know, I've. It's always grown. I've never been in the red, I guess, is what people say, right? It's always been profitable. You say it's been even more successful than you could have ever imagined. Here you are in your. In your Franklin podcast studio.
- [58:44]
B
Brick wall was afraid.
- [58:46]
A
I know it's fantastic, you say, and yet. Yet almost every morning I need to remind myself what I want to believe, because it isn't automatic yet. Can you talk about renewing your permissions each morning?
- [59:02]
B
Yeah. So I'm a very naturally sarcastic, pessimistic, cynical person. Like, by my natural nature is that glasses have to empty. Like, glass has been stolen. Like, you know, so I have. I start from a negative place, and I work really hard on positivity. I practice positivity. So that's one of the things, you know, like, I practice soundtracks. I think people related to the soundtracks book because I wrote it from the same trenches they're in. And I think that when people read the books I write, hopefully they walk away and go, oh, here's somebody who's doing this too. Like, I wasn't naturally born positive. It always. The joke I always think about is, like, steph Curry, who plays for the Golden State warriors, has a master class on how to play basketball. And lesson one should be be born to the Charlotte Hornets, third leading scorer of all time. That definitely helps. Like, have your dad play in the NBA, like, be six, four, whatever it is. So for me, it feels like the opposite, where I do have to renew permissions. I do have to, you know, and every time you try something new, there's new doubts and new fears, and it's okay that they're there. Like, that's part of the process. Like when I spoke to a hundred people for the first time I had a hundred person size fear, but I did it. And then I spoke to 500 people and there was new fears there. And I spoke to 10,000 people and there are new fears there, there. And you start a new podcast and you try something new. Like you did the mashups. You tried the mashups that took bravery and you were like. And then to stop them took bravery too. Because there were people that were like gonna say, hey, we love the mashups. Could you do more mashups?
- [60:38]
A
They did. I wrote it down. They really liked yours. I wrote down what they said. They said, love the mashup. Looking forward to the next one. And the next one said, this is the encouragement that I needed. It's not cliche, it's not abstract. It is painfully clear for someone like me. That's what they said about yours. I hardly ever get comments, but I look back at the ones and that's what they said.
- [60:58]
B
But then you had to not then you decided, rightfully so as a business owner, hey, it's not the right use of what I'm doing. And you had to decide, like, that took a level of bravery too. That's why for me, it's fun to be on the other side of you because I've had a front row seat to what you've been building. Like, I've seen the growth and the progress and I know like when I'm on this podcast, the things that come after it, like how you use Instagram and how deliberate you are, like, it's amazing. And so that's why, like, I know you might say like, oh, the stages for homeschool aren't right there, but I think there's so many things you've done as a business owner that are equally easy for you to talk about and think about. And that's the thing that's fun for me to hold the mirror up to you and go like, but look at what you're doing. Like, there's not a lot of apps I pay for. Like, yeah, I pay for the thousand hours outside app.
- [61:49]
A
So cool.
- [61:50]
B
You know, I used it this morning. I was outside for an hour this morning. No big deal. It's 5:30 in the morning.
- [61:56]
A
So great. When you talk about it in the book Procrastination Proof, you talk about just being kinder, giving yourself error rates. So that's the concept. And you talked about at remarkable you as well, the event that we came to last year and then this is coming up again in April. But you were talking about how like it doesn't have to be perfect and you give yourself an error rate and you say over and over again, no big deal. No big deal.
- [62:18]
B
I have to. Because my natural bit is everything's a big deal. I take everything as a big deal. So I have to, I have to naturally work on going, no, no big deal. Like, no big deal. No big deal. Like, because my brain is going, this is the biggest of all deals of all time. And this whole thing could fall apart at any moment. And I go, no, like, no, no big, no big deal. Like, no big deal. Like you're gonna, in your amount of podcasting, you're gonna have some episodes that you think were amazing, that just don't do anything and you're like, oh, this is the one. Like, I talked to a friend the other day, John Crist. I had John Crist on.
- [62:55]
A
I saw that on your YouTube. I saw that on your YouTube channel.
- [62:58]
B
Exactly. He, I, this is funny. I saw him at the Orlando airport in the trailer terminal. We were flying back to Nashville. What are you doing? And he was dressed up as a Disney employee. He had flown to Orlando to film all day by himself at Disney World. And it was flying back. And that video wasn't successful by his standards. Like, and you think like everyone listening to this, if you do Instagram has had that moment where you edit something and you're really proud of it and it just bombs. He got on a plane, he bought a ticket. He's bought a ticket to Disney World. He shot all day, his team edited. And it's still. You're just gonna have those moments and you have to have little soundtracks that keep you going.
- [63:37]
A
No big deal. John Acuff, New York Times best selling author whose books, including Soundtracks, finished All It Takes is a Goal. This new one, Procrastination Proof, sold more than 1 million copies. Named one of Inc's Top 100 Leadership Speakers. Delivered keynotes to Microsoft, Walmart and Comedy Central, among many other companies. Host of the popular podcast All It Takes is a Goal. What an honor. What an honor.
- [64:02]
B
Honor for me. Hey, who's been on more did it
- [64:05]
A
the very first time we did it more. Who?
- [64:07]
B
You might, you might have been on more than me. No, baby, somebody's gone eight.
- [64:11]
A
Possibly my midwife.
- [64:14]
B
Well, yeah, I can't compete with.
- [64:18]
A
There wouldn't be anyone. The woman.
- [64:20]
B
I'm the most frequent non midwife guest. That's you.
- [64:23]
A
It is you. You are the winner. And I, and I, I remember back to the very first time and my husband Josh was like, make sure you bring up Queso.
- [64:31]
B
Don't forget John really likes so I saw him at Jefferson Bethke's house. It's probably been like two or three years ago at this point. Yeah, it's been a while. Are you guys coming back through Nashville anytime soon?
- [64:42]
A
We're there often. We're there often, so. Well, I don't know. I've never seen you there. But only I saw you in Franklin at your event.
- [64:50]
B
Yeah, but we did stock your house
- [64:50]
A
well next time you're here, remember we stocked your house that one time.
- [64:55]
B
Yeah, totally. Josh.
- [64:57]
A
Congratulations.
- [64:58]
B
I love the book.
- [64:59]
A
I love procrastination proof. Never get stuck again. Thanks for being here.
- [65:05]
B
Thanks for having me.
- [65:07]
A
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B
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A
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A
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B
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A
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B
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A
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B
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B
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A
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