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- [00:00]
Dr. Manny Arango
Hey, Bible nerds. This is Dr. Manny Arango and I'm your host for the Bible department podcast powered by Arma. This podcast follows a Bible reading plan we created to help you read the entire Bible in a year. You can head to the show notes or thebibledepartment.com to download our reading plan and join the Journey family. We're at day 59 and we got some controversial verses. I've chosen to focus on the most controversial verses I could have avoided where we're going, but I'm an eight on the Enneagram. I like confrontation, I like ruffling some feathers. So it's going to be a good one. Hey, if you have not done the reading, this is a good time to pause, scram, get out of here. Go do the reading. Okay, go read Matthew, chapter 17, 18, 19 and 20. You got four chapters to read and then come on back. So let's actually just get into Matthew chapter 19. I think that this is a passage that causes a lot of debate. I'm not going to say that I'm going to, I'm the authority on interpreting this, but I'm gonna try to add my 2 cents. So I'm gonna try to give some context so that we can actually interpret this passage to the best, at least to the best of my ability. Okay. And in the context in the comments, you can let me know if you agree. If you disagree, you can tell me what you think on my take on this. Okay, so this is divorce. Okay? This is Jesus's teaching on divorce. This is Matthew, chapter 19. I'm just gonna start reading. I'll read a good chunk and then, and then we'll discuss. All right. Verse one says this. When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason? Okay, so that's important for any and every reason. So, so let's kind of keep the nuggets that are important. Also they are asking, is it okay for a man to divorce his wife? Not is it okay for a woman to divorce her husband? This is a one way street. Before we just grab this verse and apply it into our current context, we just need to know that the, the number one thing that I think is on the heart and mind of Jesus is the protection of women. I think that is of foremost importance. Now I Know, we're living in a current culture that thinks that men are just some massive victims in society. And I get it. I like Jordan Peterson just as much as the next guy. And I. I get it. The manosphere's real red pill. I'm in. I'm in. But a lot of times I think that secular, and I know some people think Jordan Peterson is a Christian. I hear all of it. I hear it. I think that sometimes what happens is we're consuming secular content. And I think that people with a secular understanding or secular wisdom can pinpoint problems, but do not give biblical solutions to those problems. And so, yes, there is a problem in our society of men not being appreciated, validated men not being even protected. Like, I mean, just in terms of schooling. Like, that's all true. There's this woman that I actually love. She only represents men in divorce court because of. She helps men to get custody of their children. And so I have a lot. I'm gonna try to say a lot in the next 12 minutes that is gonna try to bridge the culture that Jesus is talking to with our current culture. I think that Jesus is okay with men getting the short end of any stick. I think that God, Jesus, the Bible is very much so okay with a man carrying his cross and being the sacrificial servant and cross bearer in any relationship. I think that what we have currently in society is men who want one end of the manhood bargain, but not the other end. So the first end is, I'm the leader. Okay? I'm the leader. God has called me to be the leader. If he's called me to be the leader, then that means he's called me to bear a cross. What we have in culture are men who want to be the leader. We want to be the boss. We want to have the authority. We want to call the shots. We want to be the leader. But then when we get put on a cross, now we're victims. Now we're shocked. Now we're surprised. And the reality is that the model for leadership is Jesus. And he's cool with carrying the cross, okay, for the people he's leading. So there's no part of me that's shocked when I as a man get the short end of a stick or the short end of any stick. Like, that is the cost that I pay to be the boss. That's what that means. Of course, I work more hours than any of my employees. I'm the leader. You kidding me? Of course. Like, of course there are benefits to being a wife and so our current culture, culture that we live in is not this culture of the Bible. The culture of the Bible, the only people who could do the divorcing is men. Women couldn't divorce men. We're now living in a culture where if a guy does get divorced and a woman takes him for half of everything he owns, now that guy, now it's a sad story for that guy. And it's kind of like, yeah, buddy, I mean, you chose. You chose to. You chose this woman. So, a, you should have made a better decision. You should have had more wisdom, and B, you should have known what game you were entering into. You're entering into the game where we nail you to a cross because you're the leader. Like, I hope you're tracking with me. But. But it feels like we're living in a day and age in a secular world in 2024, where we are pushing hard to reinstate men and reinstate patriarchal values, but we don't want to instate biblical values. So we got people running around like Andrew Tate, who are like, men are in charge, men are leaders, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then also advocating that men should be able to have such as many women as they want and essentially live a polygamous lifestyle, which is like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You can't be half biblical. Like, the biblical perspective is a conservative worldview. You can't be half conservative. You can't be conservative when it works for you and then liberal when that works for you. So you can't be conservative in terms of the role of men in leadership, but then liberal when it comes to being a man whore. Like, it doesn't work that way. And that is, again, the chaos of the culture that we live in. Let's get back to what Jesus has to say. Wow, that was like a six minute rant. Okay, I'm sorry. Let's. I got a lot to say, guys. So. Whoo. All right. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason? Haven't you heard that at the beginning, the Creator made them male and female and said, for this reason, a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh. So then they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has joined together, let no one separate. Why then they asked, did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away? Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard okay, so this is a concession. It's not God's ideal. There's a difference between God's ideal, which is found in Genesis, and now a concession. Moses allowed you to give your wives certificates of divorce, A because your hearts were hard, but also to protect the woman. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality and marries another woman, commits adultery. Here's a couple of things that I want us to see. At no point does Jesus say that if a woman gets remarried, she's committing adultery. It's only adultery if the man is getting remarried, and it's adultery if the man is. Is divorcing the woman for any reason other than sexual immorality. So what is going on? I'll tell you exactly what's going on. Jesus is making a judgment that is there to protect the most vulnerable person in the scenario, which is the woman. All right, so if you divorced a woman in the ancient world, that meant that her whole life was upended. Her financial security, her place in society, her identity. Like marriage. If you're a man and you're. And you're taking a woman to be your wife, you are assuming the responsibility of being a husband. And this conversation is between Jesus and men. That is the context of this conversation. To make this conversation apply in a world where women work and women have a completely different life than the women of the first century, I think is a little irresponsible.
- [10:32]
Unknown Co-Host
What if I told you that what you're learning in this video was just.
- [10:35]
Dr. Manny Arango
The tip of the iceberg?
- [10:37]
Unknown Co-Host
The Bible department is actually powered by Armageddon. What is arma?
- [10:41]
Dr. Manny Arango
I'm so glad you asked.
- [10:43]
Unknown Co-Host
ARMA is an online subscription based platform that we design to help people, everyday people, learn the Bible for themselves. We started ARMA so that anybody, anywhere could have access to trustworthy and entertaining Bible and theology content. In addition to this podcast, we have over 60 courses on individual books of the Bible, on theology topics, and on some hot topics like homosexuality, tithing, and women in ministry. But really, ARMA is a community. A community of people that I've gotten to know. A community where thousands of people are currently finding family, asking questions and nerding out on the Bible together. If you want a community to read the Bible with you this year, or if you want to dive into some deeper theological content, or if you want more exclusive access to me and the entire armor team, how about you go to thebibledepartment.com I'll be sure to post the link in the description of this Video, let's make this your year to become a Bible nerd.
- [11:53]
Dr. Manny Arango
So let's get down to some. Some cultural context that I actually think can help us. All right? There are two cultural, cultural rabbis that are alive probably four or five decades before Jesus is alive. One of the rabbis name is Shammai. The other is Hallel. When Jesus says, take my yoke upon you, because my yoke is easy and my burden is light. This is actually a rabbinic saying or expression, okay? A rabbi had a yoke. And that yoke could be found in asking the rabbi, what are the two greatest commands? Now, the first answer was always this. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your mind, all your strength. But what the rabbi said as the second command began to tell you what that filter, that rabbi's filter was. So for Shammai, it was obey the Sabbath, okay? That was the second greatest commandment, obey the Sabbath. Hillel's answer to that question was obviously the first commandment. No one deviates. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your mind, all your soul, all your strength. And for Hillel, the second commandment was, love your neighbor as yourself. So when Jesus is asked about the commandments, he's actually siding with Hillel. And most of the time, Jesus is gonna side with Hillel. Shammai was known. His yoke was obedience. Hillel's yoke was love. Okay? So most of the time, Jesus is gonna side with Hillel. Except for divorce. When it comes to divorce, this is one of the only times where Jesus sides with Shammai. A more strict interpretation of Torah, a more Halel, was seen as a little lenient. Shammai was seen as strict. And why does Jesus go strict? Because when it comes to divorce, a strict understanding of the Torah is actually the most loving. So this is a blind spot for Hillel because the most loving thing is actually to be strict around this area. Why? Because a man can remarry with little to no issues in the ancient world. But it's the woman who is now relegated to a life of poverty and is going to be a social outsider and is, you know, a woman's virginity in the ancient world is a thing of value. And so to have children with a woman and to marry a woman and then discard of that woman would be absolutely. I think Jesus is saying that that is just the most despicable thing you could do as a man. Okay? Also, look at Jesus response in verse 11. Not everyone can accept these words, but only those to whom it has been given. For there are eunuchs who are born that way, and there are eunuchs who are made eunuchs by others. And there are those who choose to live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it. How do we start talking about eunuchs? Well, because Jesus is talking to men. Only a man can be a eunuch. And so this is a conversation between Jesus and males about manhood. That is what is happening here. Here's how I know that that's what's happening here. The next verse, verse 13. Okay, Matthew, chapter 19, verse 13. Then people brought little children to Jesus for him to place his hands on them and pray for them. But the disciples rebuked them. Jesus said, let the little children come to me and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these. When he had placed his hands on them, he went off from there. So Jesus deals with women and then who does Jesus deal with? He deals with the disciples about how they treat children. So these are right up against each other for a reason. I mean, I would bet good money content created by the secular world. I think that we have a lot of men who care about men. You know, I think we have a lot of men who are out here being passport bros and a lot of men who they care about protecting their masculinity. So they're over correcting. And I think the role of men is always to put women and children as the number one priority. The goal of my marriage is not my happiness. The goal of my marriage is to present Tia as a spotless bride to Jesus at the end of this life and the dawn of the next life and to raise children in the fear and the admonition of the Lord. That is my job as a husband and a father. My happiness fulfillment has literally nothing to do with anything. And I think we've got a bunch of weak, whiny children out here who are marrying women and complaining about how unhappy they are. And divorce. As long as it depends on me, me and Tia will never get a divorce. I will continue to lay down my life for this woman, to sacrifice my life for this woman. Whether we're talking about postpartum or whether we're talking about her being pregnant or whether like whatever scenario you throw at me, my job is to lay down my life for this woman. I firmly believe that every single man, or most men, I won't say every, most men have the capacity to turn the culture of their Marriage around. If you're a man and you're a leader, you have the capacity to pray with your wife, to love your wife, to romance your wife, and to completely and utterly revolutionize the culture of your marriage, that that ball is in your court. I've done a lot of marriage counseling, and I have things to say to the wife every now and again. It typically revolves around, like, respecting their husband. But I have a lot of things to say to men because I'm like, this is. Until you get on a cross and you die for your bride, we have nothing to talk about. Now, if you're telling me you are a sacrificial. And I have a handful of examples that I know of of men who have sacrificed and they've gotten on the cross, they've carried their cross, and their wives are obstinate and selfish and stubborn and rebellious. And in those scenarios, I have counseled men to walk away. But that is because those women are not damned or screwed or socially discarded. That's not the world that we live in. So I would say that what no one really talks about when reading this, that is glaringly apparent to me, is the protection of women and children adamantly, that men are to die to themselves and prioritize women and children. And I think that if that happens, and, you know, for years I thought that, you know, dying to myself and prioritizing my wife and my son meant working and just providing money for them. And, like, a lot of hard conversations had to be had between me and my wife where she began to genuinely teach me what dying for her and my son really looked like. Cause I don't get to define that. And now there's compromise in that. She can't just totally disregard the fact that I'm the dominant breadwinner in the family. And she does honor me for that, and she thanks me for that. But the ability to turn things around lays with the leader. I currently have multiple employees. No one has more influence over ARMA than me. Nobody has more influence over Manny and Rango Ministries than me. And anytime I'm giving any of our team members or an employee's critique, I'm also critiquing me, because these are people that I've chosen that I've selected. And so when we talk about marriage, we're not placing equal weight of responsibility on men and women. There is a disproportionate amount of weight on the man, and it's designed to be that way. And I think that the number one thing that Jesus cares about is the protection of women and children. I think that's at the forefront of this conversation. There we go. That's. We got a lot of context. We got some nerdy nuggets in there. Timeless truth. Care about women and children, period. Like, act like a man, be a man. When you were a child, you thought like a child, acted like a child, reasoned like a child. Now that you're a man, think like a man. And part of thinking like a man is getting on your cross and dying. Dying to your lust and dying to your selfishness and dying to your pride and dying to yourself and actually being the leader that God wants you to be and being the leader that your wife needs you to be and being the leader that your kids need you to be. So that's my. That's my. I don't know, maybe that's my unorthodox approach to Jesus talking about divorce, but you heard it from me. All right, let's get it. We got day number 60. And let me know in the comments what you guys think. This is a good one. All right, I'll see you guys tomorrow. Proud of you. Love you. Peace. Foreign thanks so much for joining us on the Bible Department podcast. You can find us online and learn more about the show@thebibledepartment.com and on Instagram. The Bible Department. If you enjoyed this episode and want to dive deeper into the Bible, you can get free access to our library of courses at the Bible Depart. We'll see you back here tomorrow.