It Was All a Dream

Summary

The Book Lisp with Jon Ryan & Sarah Colonna

Episode: "It Was All a Dream"

Date: March 16, 2026

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Overview

In this lively, unscripted episode of The Book Lisp, married co-hosts Jon Ryan and Sarah Colonna embark on their customary week-three tangent episode—riffing on cultural topics sparked by themes related to this month’s book club pick, One Day by David Nichols. The main review awaits next week; for now, Jon and Sarah hilariously spiral through 80s TV history, family nicknames, the questionable legacy of “it was all a dream” plot twists, parental openness about sex, childhood career aspirations, and controversial musical preferences. The episode is a meandering but tightly connected conversation, blending heart, nostalgia, and lots of playful teasing.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Cohabiting & Catching Up (00:19–02:44)

• Jon and Sarah joke about being home at the same time for the first time in six weeks. They riff on plans (“So many activities I don’t like… I have so much planned” – Jon, 02:19) but ultimately concede that their idea of activity is “a few times at Tipsy Cow and being home, watching our stories” (Sarah, 02:37).
• Sarah plugs upcoming stand-up dates.

2. School Nicknames & TV Nostalgia (03:13–07:12)

• Prompted by the book’s characters, Jon lists childhood nicknames: “Jr, JB, JD, Jono, Junt Boy...” (Jon, 03:32).
• This leads Sarah to connect “John Boy” to The Waltons, sparking a nostalgic deep dive into 80s TV lore.

3. The Ultimate TV Plot Twist – “It Was All a Dream” (05:28–09:21)

• Jon and Sarah recall iconic plot devices including Dallas’s “Who shot JR?” and Bobby’s “It was all a dream” shower scene:

  “I think what happens is they killed him, then got a lot of letters, and someone goes ‘What if it was just a fucking dream?’”
  — Sarah (07:57)

• They compare to Roseanne’s dream season, calling such moves “the ultimate writer’s cop-out” (Jon, 08:24).
• Both agree: “The lesson probably was: think twice before you kill one of the most popular characters, because backtracking’s tough” (Sarah, 08:46).

4. Soap Operas & Wild Plot Devices (09:21–12:31)

• Sarah recounts soap opera logic, like One Life to Live’s “underground city” and children aging a decade overnight.
• “It's kind of a writer's dream, you just write whatever the fuck you want...the most outlandish shit and keep on going” — Jon (10:11).
• Jon notes some soaps started as radio dramas, leading Sarah to declare, “I'm not going to fact check you because it sounds right, and if it’s not, I don’t want it to be wrong because it sounds fun” (Sarah, 11:53).

5. Family Openness & Awkward Boundaries (16:01–24:24)

• Drawing from One Day, they discuss the boundaries (or lack thereof) in parental openness about sex:

  “I’m not trying to have conversations with my mom about sex. Never try to have. No, not your mom, not my mom, not my stepmom, not my dad, not my stepdad”
  — Sarah (17:55)

• Sarah retells with comic mortification the time her mom nonchalantly admitted to googling porn (“I just almost crawled inside my own body”, 20:27).
• They reflect on generational changes in comfort levels, the value of openness, and the limits of what anyone wants to hear from their parents (“You want to feel like you can talk to your parents about anything. But do you want your parents to be able to talk to you about anything?” – Sarah, 24:24).

6. Parental Encouragement & Chasing Unlikely Dreams (26:04–31:54)

• The conversation pivots to supporting children’s ambitions. Sarah laments protagonists with unsupportive parents (“Can you imagine having a parent that kind of laughed in your face about what job you wanted to do?” 26:04).
• Jon recounts how his parents had “blinders on” and unwavering support for his NFL dreams, even as he admits, “We just assumed you were going to do it…now looking back, oh shit, we really put all our eggs in one basket. Thank God we did.” (Jon, 27:41)
• Bob Ryan’s practical advice: “Professional football is right now, but this school will always be here.” (Jon, 29:13)
• Sarah reflects, “We all go through our things. And we don’t necessarily open up to our parents…” (26:05).

7. Childhood Career Aspirations (31:54–35:48)

• Jon reveals football was always his goal, but he’d give rote fallback answers as a kid (“I think when I was in high school…I wanted to be a high school teacher. Like, not really, but that’s what I would tell people…” 31:54).
• Sarah always wanted to act, with a brief fantasy of being a lawyer—“I used to picture myself in a courtroom as a lawyer. Then as I got older… I realized I just want to be an actress that played a lawyer” (Sarah, 35:06).
• Both relate stories of friends and family who achieved childhood dreams (Jon’s friend Peter Reed became an RCMP officer).

8. Roles, Typecasting, and Aspirations (35:48–38:22)

• Sarah laments being typecast as a comedian: “People just think…you’re gonna do the wacky one-liner, play the wacky best friend…They don’t realize you can also be a good dramatic actor.” (Sarah, 35:48)
• Jon: “You had a really good dramatic role in Battle Creek with Josh Duhamel and Dean Winters.” (35:52)
• She campaigns openly for a “hero lawyer” TV role: “If any casting directors…are listening…I think I should get a shot at being a lawyer on tv.” (36:49)

9. Random Cultural Pet Peeves (38:22–45:56)

• Prompted by One Day’s jabs at Tracy Chapman and political t-shirts, the duo debate much-loved music/bands they don’t care for:
  • “I’ll skip a Peloton class if there’s Red Hot Chili Peppers. I don’t think it’s good. Come at me.” — Sarah (39:50)
  • Jon confesses childhood disdain for Meat Loaf’s Bat Out of Hell 2 (“Even the voice…now fast forward 30 years…I love that song!”), but overall, he’s “a musical chameleon” (42:17).
  • Both defend Nickelback as “cheesy rock”—“Everyone hates Nickelback and then they sell out every fricking concert.” — Jon (43:21)
• Jon believes the people-watching at a Nickelback concert would be fascinating: “They’d all watch UFC and then go eat some Kentucky Fried Chicken and then they’d all go to Nickelback.” (44:08)
• Discussion of attending a Papa Roach concert together; Jon jokes about the archetypal rock show crowd.

10. Full Circle, Upcoming Content & Sign-Off (46:19–47:17)

• The episode wraps with Jon and Sarah laughing about their penchant for digression: “They’re all random, as they always are. And that’s why we have fun…” (Sarah, 46:23).
• Teasing next week’s full discussion of One Day.
• Reminder: April’s pick is Little Secrets by Jennifer Hillier; plus, Patreon content updates.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|---------|-------| | 02:19 | Jon | “So many activities. So many activities I don't like. I have so much planned.” | | 07:57 | Sarah | “What if it was just a fucking dream? What if we never killed him?” (On the Dallas writers) | | 08:24 | Jon | “It just seems like the ultimate cop out—a writer’s cop out.” | | 10:11 | Jon | “In a way, it's kind of a writer's dream because you just write whatever the fuck you want—the most outlandish shit and just like keep on going, no problem.” | | 17:55 | Sarah | “I'm not trying to have conversations with my mom about sex. Never try to have. No, not your mom, not my mom, not my stepmom, not my dad, not my stepdad.” | | 20:27 | Sarah | “I just almost crawled inside my own body.” (Reacting to her mom’s confession about internet porn) | | 24:24 | Sarah | “There's a level of openness that's nice to have, but then all of a sudden, do you want your parents to be able to talk to you about anything?” | | 27:41 | Jon | “We really put all of our eggs in one basket. And thank God we did.” | | 29:13 | Jon | “This school is always going to be here. Professional football won't be... but this school will always be here.” | | 35:06 | Sarah | “I used to picture myself in a courtroom as a lawyer. And then as I got older…I realized I just want to be an actress that played a lawyer.” | | 39:50 | Sarah | “I'll skip a Peloton classic... I never enjoyed Red Hot Chili Peppers. It gives me anxiety. I don't think it's good. Come at me.” | | 43:21 | Jon | “Everyone hates Nickelback and then they sell out every fricking concert across the fricking world.” |

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:19–02:44 Cozy couple catch-up, trip plans, stand-up tour plugs
• 03:13–07:12 Childhood nicknames, 80s TV (“Dallas”, “The Waltons”)
• 07:12–09:21 “It was all a dream” TV plot contrivances, narrative cop-outs
• 09:21–12:31 Soap opera logic, underground cities, rapid aging
• 16:01–24:24 Parents, sex, and generational comfort zones
• 26:04–31:54 Parental support, unlikely dreams, making the NFL
• 31:54–38:22 Childhood dream jobs & typecasting in showbiz
• 38:22–45:56 Musical pet peeves, concert crowd comedy
• 46:19–47:17 Next week’s book, Patreon tease, sign-off

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Tone and Style

The entire episode flows with Jon and Sarah’s typical warmth, teasing chemistry, and freewheeling comic rapport. Their open-book vulnerability and shared laughter make for a thoroughly enjoyable listen, mixing book-club thoughtfulness with pop-culture nostalgia and riff-heavy banter. The tone is both affectionate and irreverent—they don’t shy away from poking fun at themselves, their parents, or each other.

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For Next Week and Beyond

• Full in-depth (spoiler) review of One Day by David Nichols
• April’s pick: Little Secrets by Jennifer Hillier
• Patreon bonus: Famous Once by Jane Green – now available

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For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In:

This episode is less a book discussion and more a rollicking, heartfelt gab session between two funny, thoughtful partners, using One Day’s characters and themes as a springboard into everything from childhood ambitions to awkward parental confessions to the quirks of 80s/90s TV and music. You’ll leave both entertained and feeling like you’ve just hung out with good friends, ready for next week’s substantive book analysis.

Transcript

[A]

Hi, I'm Sarah Colonna.

[B]

And I'm John Ryan.

[A]

And you're listening to the Book List. The Book List.

[B]

The Book Lisp.

[A]

Oh, that's right. You're listening to the Book Lisp. Hello and welcome to the Book Lisp with John Ryan and Sarah Colonna. How you doing, John?

[B]

Good, how are you?

[A]

It's great to see you.

[B]

It's great to see you.

[A]

Do you think anyone's ever going to get tired of me starting off the podcast with saying it's great to see you when I know that you're just

[B]

in the living room, I'm 20ft away

[A]

or in the house. See, it's not 20ft. It's like 30.

[B]

Yeah, I'll give you that. Maybe 35. Maybe 40. That'd be 1343 yards. Okay.

[A]

Oh, you're good at that. I'm not good at that. I would. Sometimes if someone's. Someone's 20ft away, it could easily be 2 inches away and I'd still say, I agree. So. Hi. Hi, listeners. We're now on week three. Three already week three of March, which means next week is already our full review of One Day by David Nichols. However, of course, since it's week three, we will be doing no spoilers, no in depth book talk, just riffing off some things that came up in the book that make us have topics and things to say. Hey, if you happen to be In Wisconsin, the 26th of the in Appleton, come see me at the Skyline Comedy Club. If you happen to be in Arlington, Virginia, come see me at the Drafthouse April 10th and 11th. Mary Radzinski will be with me for both those dates. If you are a crossover, are you my podcaster? You know and love your Mary very much. And more dates to come. Just come this week. This week I'm home, babe. This week I'm home. So are you.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

We're home for the first time at

[B]

the same time in a month and a half.

[A]

In a month and a half. I mean, listen, we're fine. It's not a big deal, but we haven't. We like our time together. We do enjoy each other's company, which is nice. And so I am excited for us to have like the week together. I mean, what's gonna happen? What are we gonna do? What's doing?

[B]

So many activities. So many activities I don't like. I have so much planned.

[A]

Oh, yeah, we're going to do ceramics, maybe a painting sip.

[B]

I rented a kayak. And we're going to go zip lining. And then we're just going to talk about our feelings for the rest of the time, like we do.

[A]

Or we're going to go to Tipsy Cow a few times and be home, watch our stories. That's more likely.

[B]

That sounds about what we do.

[A]

That sounds about right. Maybe talk about books. You okay? So, David Nichols. One day. What we're talking about this month. I picked out Little Secrets by Jennifer Hillier for April. We are. Oh, today, same day this episode comes out. The 16th is also your Patreon short story. So you can listen to it whenever you want. It's always there for you if you're overwhelmed by too much of us today. But that was a famous once by Jane Green.

[B]

Green and the kids in school used to call it old Gangrene.

[A]

They didn't.

[B]

Gangrene. Gangrene.

[A]

Actually, they probably did. You're probably right.

[B]

They probably did.

[A]

Yeah. Did anyone call you, like, a weird nickname in school?

[B]

I've had a ton of nicknames. Jr, jb, JD Jono, Junt Boy.

[A]

What's jb?

[B]

John Boy. Oh, JD Was John Deere because it was really fast when I was a kid and they said nothing runs like a deer, you know, like John Deere. So it's called John Deere for a while.

[A]

Like the tractor company.

[B]

Yep. Johnny Ray.

[A]

Why Johnny Ray?

[B]

Johnny Ryan.

[A]

Why Johnny Ray?

[B]

You remember that song, who wants to know? Who are you Johnny Ray?

[A]

Who?

[B]

Then it just became Johnny Ray for

[A]

a bit float of that song. Not once.

[B]

If I played it right now, you would get up and boogie. It was a damn banger.

[A]

I'd get up and boogie, would I?

[B]

You get right up on top of that chair

[A]

and boogie Ogie oogie. So I just couldn't boogie no more.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Why is it that they say John Boy? Like. My stepmom calls you that, too. She's always like, John Boy.

[B]

No, I've had a lot of, like, people.

[A]

Oh, because it's from a. Isn't it from a. I feel real stupid right now.

[B]

I think it's from a lot of

[A]

an old TV show, right?

[B]

Oh, really? A lot of people from that generation call me John Boy.

[A]

Yeah, it's. It's from it. It's from a TV show. Hold on. Walton. The Waltons, they call John Boy.

[B]

Then a lot of. I remember that generation character from the world. It was always the people from that generation. Especially, like 20 years ago, I would say, oh, who. Who shot Junior? Who shot you? Because my initials are Junior. A little Dallas reference. Oh, who shot Junior?

[A]

And then turns out, you know Got shot. Right, right.

[B]

But you know the.

[A]

Okay, you know, spoiler alert.

[B]

Thank God.

[A]

Wait, he didn't get shot, Right?

[B]

Can't remember how it all came out in the end.

[A]

He. Because Remember or was that Bobby?

[B]

I thought it was all a dream.

[A]

No, that was Bobby.

[B]

I used to read Word up magazine. Salt and pep and heavy D up in the limousine.

[A]

No, it was. No, because it was Bob. The thing where Bobby died was. It was all a dream because. Remember? And then he just showed up back in the shower.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Anyone?

[B]

Right? Right.

[A]

Anyone?

[B]

Yes. No, I remember that.

[A]

Here for Dallas recaps. Is anyone here for Dallas recaps from the 80s?

[B]

What? When was the last episode of Dallas not like the new. Cause they came up with a new one.

[A]

Oh, right, yeah. They redid it. Yeah. It referred to the fictional mystery surrounding a murder attempt against Archville and Jerry Ewing. Blah blah blah. Mystery was not resolved until the fourth. Fourth episode. The fourth season titled Whodunit. Eight months later, 83 million American viewers turned in one of the most watched television broadcast in his.

[B]

That's almost like the Super Bowl. That's almost like the Super Bowl.

[A]

That's crazy.

[B]

That is hilarious.

[A]

Final scene, here's a noise outside his office. Wait, why don't they just fucking say who did it in this? It was real to be Kristen Shepherd. Mary crosby. Kristen was JR's scheming sister in law mistress who shot him in a fit of anger. He did not press charges as Kristen claimed she was pregnant with his child as a result of their affair. Boy, do I want to go back and watch all of this.

[B]

I love the old, the old shows like, I got shot but I'm not pressing charges. It's like, that's not how it works in the real world. You can't just like murder somebody like, oh, they're not pressing charges. That's not how it works. If you commit a crime, you're still charged with a crime.

[A]

Yeah, but I mean, it's got to go after you. Yeah. So what we were talking about before that was Bobby Ewing. Patrick Duffy returned from the dead in the 86 shower scene, revealing his entire Season 9 death and storyline was just a nightmare drunk by his wife Pam. So I. Because I think what happens and listen, don't correct me, it doesn't matter. It was in the flipping 80s. It's over. But I do, I remember him like turning around in the shower. I remember that. I can't remember a lot of things in my life, but I remember Patrick Duffy being like, what's up? And then Just saying it was a dream. Because I think what happened was they wrote him out, they killed him off, and then what happens? They got a lot of letters from my mom.

[B]

Oh, your mom wrote letters?

[A]

She wrote letters and a lot of other people. And they go, I don't know how to get out of this. We killed him. And someone goes, what if it was just a fucking dream? What if we never killed him? And it's not going to make sense for the rest of the season because then now the whole rest of the season has to be a dream, but we're actually just going to imagine that it was just Pam's part of the season that was a dream. And that's it. Fuck it, he's back in.

[B]

It's the ultimate cop out of how to end a series. The show Roseanne before it came back, is the Conners. The whole last season was a dream that Roseanne had. John Goodman actually did die. It was all a dream. And it just seems like the ultimate cop out, A writer's cop out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I don't like it.

[A]

No, I agree. I think the lesson probably was think twice before you kill one of the most popular characters, because backtracking's tough now. They did sort of. I don't know. I'm not saying that Dallas started this, but I do actually think that you and I should maybe consider doing a Dallas rewatch podcast. Just FYI. But I'm not saying Dallas started this, but soap operas have always been known for being able to kill someone off. Bring them right back.

[B]

Right. Well, soap operas work a little differently, but.

[A]

I know, but Dallas was a soap opera. It was just a nighttime soap opera. But it was a soap opera. It was a nighttime soap hunting.

[B]

I mean, I was four years old. Gimme a break.

[A]

Is that a dick?

[B]

No. I'm having an allergic reaction to our cats right now. My left eye just going crazy.

[A]

Oh, we'll try not to use any clips from this moment where you're in pain. Anyway, my point is that the soap operas, daytime soap operas, are very good at bringing people back. You can. Someone can die. Next thing you know, they're back, they go, oh, they moved away to the underground city of such and such. That was a one life to live thing. There was an underground city for a while. Oh, there was an underground city. Oh.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

I'll Google it right now. This is so rare.

[B]

In a way. In a way, it'd kind of be like a writer's dream because you just write whatever the fuck you want. The most outlandish shit and just like keep on going, no problem.

[A]

And the. And they can also, like, one of my favorite things. So Bobbers did General Hospital, All My Children, One Life to Live. It was the trifecta. It's. It was All My Children, One Life to Live, General Hospital. If you want to go in order of how they aired, 12 o', clock, 1 o', clock, 2 o'. Clock. Anyway, if you wanted to have someone have a baby and then have them not have a baby anymore, but have a child because it just like didn't work for the storyline anymore. They're like, we gotta, we gotta, we gotta get this kid 13, 14, so they can start being in the storyline. Right. Or 15, 16, whatever. But we're not gonna age the mom or dad at all. They're gonna be the same age. It's gonna be the same year in the soap opera. But their kids Suddenly fuck at 16 that they just had last week. And boy, they could do that, no problem.

[B]

Is there any more daytime soaps on the air?

[A]

Underground City, One Life to Live, Eterna, The Underground City, 1989. One Life to Live. Vicki, Roger, Tina, Cord, Gabrielle, Leo, Christine, Wade and Michael have all discovered a city beneath. Yeah, I mean, who remembers Eterna Storyline discussion anyway? Are there any more? Yes, yes, General Ops 1's still on.

[B]

But didn't, didn't some of them start off as radio shows in like the 1920s?

[A]

I don't know, like a lot of,

[B]

a lot of the old soaps started off and then when TV came out, this moved into tv. Someone.

[A]

Oh, like there was dramatic readings on radio.

[B]

Yes, they started.

[A]

Sounds right. I'm not going to fact check you because it sounds right. And if it's not right, I don't want it to be wrong because it sounds fun.

[B]

There's an underground city in Seattle. I heard there's also an underground city in Las Vegas where a lot of the homeless people live. Is this true? Can someone please confirm or deny that this happened?

[A]

Well, it's never going to be as good as the lost city of Interna on One Life to Live. No. Well, this started random. What were we talking about?

[B]

Baby? I have no clue.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

I don't know. I don't know how that started if

[A]

you didn't know jr.

[B]

It started off with nicknames. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, your nicknames. Who shot jr and then I went

[B]

to jr and then after shot jr and then it went to that. And now 13 minutes later, we're talking about soap operas.

[A]

This is why I love doing a podcast with you. Thank you.

[B]

Baby, I love doing a podcast with you too.

[A]

My mom will tell you everything you need to know about all my children. In case anyone's wondering, maybe I'll get her on for the Dallas recap podcast that we're starting soon. Okay, so that.

[B]

Imagine if you started a podcast and every week you just watch a new episode of Dallas, like right from the hop and just reviewed it. That'd be a good podcast.

[A]

It sounds really fun. Yeah, I feel like someone probably already does that.

[B]

Yeah, I'm sure I was awesome. I love Dawson's Creek.

[A]

I mean, people do a lot of rewatch. I don't know if anyone's gone as far back as a Dallas or. Remember Falcon Crest?

[B]

Never heard of.

[A]

You never heard of Falcon Crest? Mm.

[B]

Mm.

[A]

Falcon Crest starring.

[B]

Was it a soap opera?

[A]

Yes, it was also a nighttime soap opera, just like Dallas was. Knott's Landing was another one. Oh, I remember. Falcon Crest starred Lorenzo Lamas, Jamie. Yeah, is that right? Primetime television soap opera created by Earl Hammer Jr. For nine seasons. Blah, blah, blah. Jane Wyman was Angela Channing. She was the tyrannical matriarch of Falcon Crest Winery opposite Robert Foxworth as Chase Gioberti. I might be saying that wrong. And later, David Selby as Richard Channing, the illegitimate son of Angela's ex husband. Other notable series regulars, Abby Dalton, Margaret Ladd, Lorenzo Lamas, Susan Sullivan. I mean, this is. I'll tell you what, I think we need to bring back the nighttime. Knott's Landing was another. That was Donna Mills, Joan Van Arc, Ted Shackelford, William Devane.

[B]

Nothing.

[A]

This is nothing. You don't remember Nuts Landing. That was a good one.

[B]

No, I remember. I don't remember. I remember the name, but I don't remember watching it. I have, like.

[A]

They were called soap operas, by the way. They're just called primetime soap operas.

[B]

Oh, they were.

[A]

Okay, go ahead.

[B]

I said, my eyes so itchy. When I look in this little camera here. It looks like I've aged 10 years in the two hours between the two episodes we're doing today.

[A]

Oh, okay. I'm sorry that your eyes itchy. You don't normally have reactions to our cats.

[B]

No.

[A]

You were just holding Ralphie and.

[B]

Yeah, I was holding him on my shoulder and maybe a little.

[A]

Well, he was at the vet earlier, so maybe he was around other. Like, maybe he got some other dander on him or the cat dander on him. Anyway, he's fine, in case anyone's curious. All right, back to. We are reading David Nichols one day. I love it. I Can't wait to talk about it next week. I'm finished with it now, finally, by the time we're talking about this. Loved it. Like I said before, slow start. Doesn't matter. Loved it. Great point. Great choice. Can't wait to talk about it. It's a little bit different than your picks normally.

[B]

Yeah, it's a little, it's not quite as, you know, beach ready romantic, but it's, you know, I liked it. I really liked it, actually. I really, really liked it.

[A]

And so. And we'll dive into all of it next week. But so without spoiling anything, just so we can do topics off the book like we do for these weeks, Dexter, who is one of the main characters in the book, most of you at least probably know that by now. He's like, he's a little bit of a complicated character. Yeah, he's his mom. I don't know. He seems like he's just all over the place. We'll talk about it more. But there's a scene in the book, or a chapter, a story, whatever you want to call it in the book, where he goes to meet up with his mom, and she's had some wine because she's got some news to tell him. And, but, and she, but she gets a little crazy. Like, she gets a little. Not crazy, but a little unmom, like, for most people, right? She talks, she jokes about first, she, she kind of shits on his. Well, not first, but at one point, she shits on his dreams. He says he wants to be a photographer. And she goes, you'd be a great photographer. You just get your finger off the lens and she starts making. And then she starts hysterically laughing in the street. And he's like, what is happening? And then. And it gives you a little insight into him, which is good. But then she also went. But right before that, when they're talking, she's asking about his dating life, and he says, you know, kind of that nothing's going on. She asked him about Emma. Cause she remembers Emma from when Emma got a little bit drunk at their house one night and picked a fight with her dad because her, Emma's very sort of politically upset.

[B]

And they kind of liked that. They liked that. She was a little feisty. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. And, and then, and then she basically starts asking them more about his sex life. And he goes, what are you doing, Mom? I don't want to talk to you about my sex life. And she says, you know, your sister's basically a virgin, so whatever. I, I, I gotta live Vicariously through you. So she's a few glasses of wine in talking about this and it just made me think about our own moms, our own parents and how far do we go? How comfortable are we with our parents talking about. And not just sex but just personal things. Sex wise. Obviously I'm not, I don't. I'm not trying to have conversations with my mom about sex. Never try to have. No, not your mom, not my mom, not my stepmom, not my dad, not my stepdad.

[B]

Might talk about it a little bit

[A]

with you but some of them. A little bit. A little bit. Yes, she sure did. Always has and that. And she's. Yeah. She actually a couple times would sort of be open about not anything inappropriate.

[B]

No, nothing. Nothing too.

[A]

No, no, no. She would.

[B]

I was the best.

[A]

I would realize that her made dad still had a good step life. Sex life. Sorry. Step life. But just from little comments. But I never wanted to talk about this stuff. Now I did write a whole book where I wasn't too shy about some experiences in my life. My mom just thinks that they were made up and I just let her believe that. But I will never forget there was one time that my mom and I were driving somewhere and I was visiting. I mean as a full blown adult. This was not that long ago. I think I was with. I was with you and she was talking about, I don't know, Internet and what people look up and this and that and then, and then at what point she just kind of. She goes, I mean, you know, people look around it, it's. I mean it's nothing to be ashamed of if you like a little porn, you know. And I was like okay. She goes, I mean, you know. Well, I remember one time when Eric and I first got a computer and he was like what do you want to look? You know, what do you want to look up? And I was like mom, oh my God. What? Like in talking about nothing bad, just, just you know, probably googled a little porn and on their dial up computer. I think that's what she was saying. And I just almost crawled inside. Inside of my own body.

[B]

And I wonder with someone like your mom, which you're going to be uncomfortable with. Who didn't grow up with like porn being all over the place. Who, when they finally get the Internet, what do they Google? She's probably like Luke Bryan's dick.

[A]

Don't you dare.

[B]

She probably did. I'm just saying like what, I'm saying like what? I don't want to know. I don't even want to know what you're going to guess, but I wonder, like, what they put into the search engine, right?

[A]

Yeah, because I know, yeah, it's not. I know it's not going to be dirty, but it's just more like, hey, I, I. Her. What she was trying to tell me was basically from her plate, her place of, we're into spicing it up if we want to, right? So we'll look up stuff. And I was just like, what? And I didn't even know where the conversation was coming from, but it was kind of coming from someone else bringing something up to her. And they were a little bit ashamed. And she was like, what's that to be ashamed of? It was nothing. It wasn't gross. You know what I mean? So. So her response was, what? I mean, Eric and I look shit up too. Whatever. What do you want to do? What are you looking for? And I just remember thinking, oh, my God. And I texted you immediately.

[B]

I know you did. This is seven years later. I'm still getting uncomfortable right now. You just talking about this?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Anyway, but not in a bad way,

[B]

but I'm just saying.

[A]

No, no, no, of course it's not. But I. My mom, I could talk to her about anything. Yes, 100%. I will talk to her about anything that I need to, but I'm not going to talk to her about anything that makes me uncomfortable when it comes to. I don't. She doesn't need to hear anything about that kind of stuff. And sex life, whatever. Your mom is very open too, though.

[B]

She's very open, yes. And I do not share anything with her.

[A]

But if you wanted to, you could.

[B]

Sure. And I have two older sisters, especially my oldest sister. Her kids are very, very open with her about everything. She kind of set the press. She's like, I want to be completely open with my kids. I want them to be plea open with me. And they are very open. They tell her things that I was like. I would never tell my mom that in a million years. But I think it's amazing that your kids tell you that. I mean, it's very, very positive. Especially like teenage kids talking to their mom and their dad openly about what's going on in their life.

[A]

Yes, I agree.

[B]

Whereas I wasn't like that. I kept a lot of things to myself.

[A]

Well, I think there's such a. A line for that too, because you want to feel like you can talk to your parents about anything. You want to feel like you can come to them with anything and they'd be supportive and not, you know, put their hands over their ears and scream or judge you. But then there's certain things where you're like, I just don't wanna talk to my parents about this.

[B]

Right.

[A]

However, sometimes the most experienced people in your life that could probably give you the best advice might be your parents. Mm.

[B]

100%.

[A]

So I think there's just a line to walk and how you grow up and what you think about. I mean, I never grew up feeling ashamed of anything or. I never. I'm very lucky. There's. I don't think there's anything I could have told my parents where I felt like they would have judged me. I feel like they always would have accepted me for anything, you know, unless I was, like, a serial killer or something. They might not like that. But. But point being, there's. There's a level of openness that it's nice to have, but then all of a sudden, you want to feel like you can talk to your parents about anything. But do you want your parents to be able to talk to you about anything?

[B]

No. Right.

[A]

That's a good point.

[B]

That's a really good point.

[A]

Wow. Yeah.

[B]

I never thought of that. No. I don't know. No, you. You. You had. You had a mom, and now she's dead, so you don't get talked to anyone about that anymore.

[A]

Yeah. You just go, oh, God.

[B]

I think I didn't talk to my mom a lot about a lot of things because she was so disapproving of every girl that I'd bring home or every girl that I dated.

[A]

Yeah, because they were idiots.

[B]

That's true. And so, I mean, I haven't lived in the same city as my.

[A]

Other than playing stupid bitches.

[B]

Other than playing professional football for two years back in my hometown. That was like. For like, four months of the year, five months of the year. I haven't lived in the same city as my mom for 22 years now. And so I could. If I was, you know, if I was, like, seeing a girl or dating someone, I didn't need to call my mom and tell her, like, I would leave it for. You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

She didn't need to know every date I went on or anything like that. I kept that. Unless I was seeing someone. Seriously. I think I told my mom about you pretty quickly, to be honest, babe, because I knew she'd approve of you, and I knew she didn't approve of a lot of people that were around.

[A]

I know. And I mean, I. Even. Your. Your mom even Told me she's like, I read your books too cool with them. Like, she, she liked. I mean, anyway, it doesn't matter. When you put something like that in the world, you kind of forget that people. In a way, you forget people are going to read it. We've talked about this before. People that you love are going to be like, oh, I don't remember you being a little bit of a mess here and there. And certain times in your life, it's like, yeah. Cause I didn't talk to you about it.

[B]

Like, we were all through.

[A]

We all go through our things. Yeah, we all go through our things. And we don't necessarily open up to our parents or you find who. But I think it's nice when you can talk to your parents. And that was another thing. Whereas in this book where at the, in the same scene, which I already mentioned, where he starts talking about how maybe he wants to be a photographer and do this and that and she's making fun of him. And I know we've discussed this before about just how our parents. We were lucky. Our parents were encouraging. But can you imagine having a parent that kind of laughed in your face about what job you wanted to do? I mean, and, and, and I, and he just, he's just saying photographer. I mean, yes, it's very difficult to, to be a photographer. Yes. To be a, you know, there's, it's a competitive field. Yes. You gotta be really good at your job. Cause you don't wanna F up someone's wedding photographs. I mean, I know there's a million different jobs photographers do, but you get what I'm saying. But it's not that uncommon for someone to want to be a photographer. It's probably a little more uncommon for someone to go, I'm not only gonna try to be in the NFL, but. Or not only wanna be in the NFL, but I'm gonna try to be right. Sometimes it's more of a pipe dream because it's just such a smaller feel amount of people that can make it. Comedians, actors. Yeah, there's a bunch of them. But just saying, like, I, I definitely was trying something growing up in Ark, Arkansas. That was a little bit out of the norm for the people that I was around in a small town in Arkansas. But I was lucky. I had parents who both were just like, okay, yeah, I mean, all four of my guts.

[B]

Because when you, when you look back and you're like, the person who I used to live in her freaking womb, the person that shot me out of her womb doesn't even believe in me. It's a. It's. It's. It's. It's a battle from there. You know what I mean? Like, that'd be a really tough when. It's like, my mom always, like, she was always like, yeah, of course. Like, you're gonna. You're gonna play in the NHL or I'm gonna. You're gonna play in the NFL or. Or whatever you're gonna do. You're gonna do it. And it was just. It was like. It was. I don't think I've ever had someone in my life at that point that young that might. She was just like, yeah. Like, we even, like, almost, like, laugh when we look back on it. She's like, I just, like, assumed. You're just gonna. No fucking clue how hard it was. I didn't know, basically, you were doing an impossible task. Coming from a town, coming from a province that no one's ever done it before, people were like, oh, for a million. And somehow we just assumed that you were going to do it. And there was never any doubt in our mind. It's kind of like, wow, we just really had blinders on to a certain degree. Or just like, we're going to do it, and no one can tell us no. And now looking back, like, oh, shit. We really put all of our eggs in one basket. And thank God we did.

[A]

Yes, thank God you did. And also. And can you imagine if they would have laughed in your face instead, the way this mom laughs at Dexter? And it kind of tells you a little bit about his sort of insecurities and why he's bouncing from woman to woman. Not saying that. That Those always conflate, that. Not conflating the two. But a lot of times when you look psychologically at someone, if their mom sort of didn't support them, I look

[B]

back and I look at that whole, like, my whole. I'm making this about me again, babe. My whole journey. And I remember my dad used to have the best fricking advice. And I left school a year and a half early to go play in the Canadian Football League. People always like, do you leave a year early? Do you not leave a year early? You signed for $10 million. Whatever. I signed for $900 signing bonus. I left school a year and a half early to sign for $900. And I think my contract is for $39,000 Canadian, which is about 25, $26,000American. And my dad has the best advice. He's like, school. This school's always going to be here in 30 years. If you want to go back to school, this school is going to be here. Professional football won't be. Professional football is right now. He goes, but this school will always be here. And I was like, that was the best advice because I was like, just like, just go for it. If I need to go back to school in five years, don't make it in the NFL or cfl, whatever, I can go back. The school is always going to be there. Football won't be.

[A]

That's a really good point. I never thought of that.

[B]

Wise man.

[A]

Wise words from Bob Ryan.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Rest in peace.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay, so. Well, on that note, it was a very sweet story, by the way. On that note, because we're talking about how Dexter's mom talked to him a couple times. He also says he's got when. When we first start off and meet him. And again, no matter how far you are in the book, this isn't really a spoiler, but you've probably at least gotten to this. We kind of first meet him, he's a little bit of a. Kind of a dreamer guy. He talks about how he wants to make his parents proud and just sleep with. And also sleep with more than one woman at a time. Those are his dreams. He's a simple guy. He talks about how he wants. When he talks about photographer, he's like, I want to live a life that when you put them all these random photos together, you wouldn't see any sadness. There's enough sadness in the world. I want everything to look happy. So he's just sort of this surface when you first meet him guy that's just not really looking for anything too serious. But he talks about how he wasn't sure what he wanted to do, but he thought about cool sounding jobs. And he said like a heart surgeon or an architect. And I was wondering, I know that you kind of not kind of, but pretty much always knew that you wanted to play in the NFL and you wanted to play football, but was there ever any other weird random jobs? Cause I got a couple that I had. So I'm curious.

[B]

I think, I think there was things like in the back of my head or almost some. Cause I never always I said this when I did the hall of Fame thing, I go, I only told one person my entire life that I was going to make the NFL. And I told that person every day and that was myself. Because I always felt like it was stupid to say it out loud to like other people that I was going to. That I wanted to play in the NFL said I was like, kind of like not make up things, but always have things in the back of my head. I think a lot of the time when I was in high school, because I loved high school, I wanted to be a high school teacher. Like, not really, but that's what I would tell people, like, oh, I'm gonna be. I'd like to be a high school teacher. That was one of the things. And then I think when I started playing football professionally, I always thought like, you know, if this lasts for two or three years, I think I'll probably get into like real estate, something like that. Something where I can kind of be my own boss. But those are really the only two things I really remember kind of, kind of faking and saying that that's what I was gonna do until, until, until the end of my career when I was like, well, I'm gonna own minor league baseball teams and in minor league sports teams. And that's actually what I did do when I got out of it. So, yeah, I don't ever remember even

[A]

like, like as a kid, you didn't have a weird random dream other than football, which is already a pro athlete

[B]

for most since I was like five or six years old. I just wanted to be a professional athlete. That's it. And I have one of it's cool story. One of my best friends, Peter Reed, who you've met a few times, he was at my hall of fame thing. He wanted to be like his first day of play school. When you're four years old or however old you are, he, he put. I wanted to be a police officer. I wanted to be a Royal Canadian Mounted Police. Which is really cool because now he has been for 20 years now. And that's what he wrote down. Like in the first year. He never ever changed his mind. Like all through high school, all through, like everything, that's all he wanted to be. And that's what he was. I think that's really cool too.

[A]

That is cool.

[B]

Yeah. But I can't remember of any other thing that I wanted to be other than a football player. And then I think I just, I faked everything else.

[A]

Okay, could I do mine now?

[B]

Yes, please. My way can be way more entertaining than what I just said.

[A]

I never was a comedian when I was younger. It was always actress. But then when I got older and learned more about like writing and stuff, that's when I wanted to do both. But even when I was a kid, watching all my children with my mom, all my children, one life, children at General Hospital. I wanted to be an actress, but then I was like, if I'm not going to be an actress, I'd like to be a lawyer. Really, I wanted to be a lawyer. And if you do listen to Are you? My podcast, you would probably know that I would have been a good lawyer. Okay. Because I, I call bullshit real fast on people. Oh, of course you do. I don't know that I would be a good lawyer as far as successful or allowed in a courtroom. But I'm just saying I can shut someone down really fast if they're both, if they're full of shit. I just, I go, here's the fucking. Here's the proof. We're done. So maybe I wouldn't have been a good lawyer, but I did. I used to, I used to picture myself in a courtroom as a lawyer. And then as I got older and, and started watching more television, I realized I just want to be an actress that played a lawyer. But I haven't gotten to do that yet.

[B]

No. Oh, God. Now I really want you to. You'd be a great TV lawyer.

[A]

I'd be such a good TV lawyer. Here's the problem with. When you kind of. It's different now, but when you first delve into becoming a comedian and an actress, you get sort of. People just think that you can do the one thing you're gonna do, the wacky one liner. You're gonna play the wacky best friend or you can't. They don't realize that you can also be a good dramatic actor. Now a lot of people have changed that. I've done it myself. I've done more dramatic roles and I know that what I can do.

[B]

You had a really good dramatic role in Battle Creek with Josh Gamal and Dean Winters.

[A]

I did, yes. And even in Insatiable I had dramatic scenes. But that's changed over the years. You've got Jim Carrey, you've got Robin Williams, you've got all these people that have been. Carol Burnett's an incredible.

[B]

Jack Black has done some crazy dramatic roles.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, it's, it's like that sort of stigma thing that used to be wore off, but I used to, you know, when I, when I first started wanting to act, I thought I was going to have to be on like LA law or something. I think I was 12 years old when that show started. And then I, many years later, I started when I was bartending. I waited on one of the guys from LA Law, but I still never played a actor. I mean, a lawyer. Lawyer On a show. So just. If any casting directors or directors are listening. Big listeners. I think I should get a shot at being a lawyer on tv. I think I'd be really cool.

[B]

Agreed.

[A]

Yeah, agreed. Yeah, I would just. I just want to scream, like. And if you.

[B]

The whole court's out of order.

[A]

I just want to say something like. I don't. Just something like, if you can't put all this information together and still come out of here thinking that this person is not guilty. Well, no, that's not a good speech. I have to work on it. I'm not

[B]

Cash.

[A]

I shouldn't improvise. Well, yeah, this is my tape. I shouldn't improvise. Maybe as a lawyer, but because I want. Because I want to play someone defending someone innocent. Do you know what I mean? I don't want to play. I don't want to defend the OJ or whoever that's going to go write a book later and admit that he did it. I don't want that. I don't want to egg on my chest.

[B]

The book was called if I Did It.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Good point.

[A]

I don't want. I don't want to egg on my face. And I know that we're still talking about just acting, but if I. If I. I want to play a hero lawyer when I do it, I want to defend someone and then go.

[B]

Or like, you. You like, get someone who's been in prison for, like, 30 years and you know they're innocent, and then you're going to get them, like, to freed. Yeah, that'd be a good role for you.

[A]

That's my dream role.

[B]

You just did it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Tell me to write it. I'll write it right now.

[A]

Sure. LA Law, too. Electric Boogaloo. Okay, real quick. Yeah. You know what that is, right? Electric Boogaloo. It's like everyone used to. It was break into. Electric Boogaloo is the sequel to Breaking. And then, I don't know, most of my friends, anytime they reference a sequel, they would always say something to Electric Boogaloo because that was the sequel to Breaking. Anyway. Really losing John here on this one. You guys showing our age difference. Okay. There's also a reference in this book where he talks about how Emma is. She's very politically outspoken and she likes to wear political T shirts. And he says at one point that there's nothing more or nothing less conducive to him being sexually turned on or whatever than a political T shirt. He goes, other than that Tracy Chapman album. And I thought, that's quite a Dig. We love Tracy Chapman.

[B]

Of course we love Tracy Chapman. How dare you.

[A]

So I was just wondering if there's any albums that you are. I know that I've talked about how a lot of people are big Red Hot Chili Pepper fans and I'm very anti ready.

[B]

I know it's not my thing. I am too. And it's very unpopular, especially in California. It's very unpopular,

[A]

yeah. People love the Red Hot Chili Peppers. So much so that I'll skip a peloton classic there. I just don't. I never enjoyed their music. It gives me anxiety. I don't think it's good. Come at me. I also don't like Fat Burger. Whatever. We'll talk about it.

[B]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You love Fat Burger. You don't like In N Out.

[A]

Oh, yeah, sorry. That's what I meant. In N Out. Thank you for correcting me. No problem.

[B]

You gotta get that straight.

[A]

I don't like.

[B]

In N Out's the most popular.

[A]

I like to order place. I love these fat fries.

[B]

They have a good veggie burger for my high cholesterol.

[A]

I do. The impossible Burger is really good at Fat Burger.

[B]

Proud of the bullshit.

[A]

So are there any albums that you think other people love that you don't?

[B]

Okay. There was when you asked me this. There's a lot of artists that I like that it's not popular to like. But the one album that I could think of was. I believe it was 1993. Meat loaf came out with the Bat out of Hell Part 2 album that was called Back Into Hell. And I think that the song number one was I would do Anything for Love in the whole entire. It's like an eight minute song. But the whole album depressed me. I was 11 years old. I hated the album. I didn't like it for some reason. I don't know if it was big. It must have been big everywhere. But I know back home it was huge. Everyone had the album. That was back right in the heyday of CDs. Right when had bought the CDs. HMV was a big place in Canada where everyone bought their CDs. And I did not want this CD. Then my aunt bought it for. Bought it for me for my birthday and I think I took it back. But I remember everyone loving that album and I'm. I hated it. I thought it was so depressing. Yeah, just. Even the voice with the. And then fast forward 30 years. I love that song. I love that fucking song.

[A]

That I would do anything for love. Especially when it picks up the end. I would do anything, but I just want to do that.

[B]

11 year old John Ryan did not like it. It was. Didn't like it at all. Hated it.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And that was, that was. That was really the only. Because now we don't really have albums anymore. And I kind of think that I'm kind of like a musical chameleon. Like, I kind of like. I like a little bit of everything.

[A]

Yeah, that's true.

[B]

I'll listen to Garth Brooks, Frank Sinatra, Alison Chains, and then listen to a little Tracy Chapman or Nickelback. I like, I like it all, really. Taylor Swift. Fucking come at me with Taylor Swift. She's fucking amazing.

[A]

And then I didn't even know, by the way. And that's one that a lot of people hate on.

[B]

I didn't even know Bad Bunny was. I went to the Super Bowl. I didn't know who Bad Bunny was. I knew he was huge. I knew he was amazing. I never heard him before. I'm going to Puerto Rico tomorrow. I can't wait to hear fricking Bad Bunny for six straight days. I love Bad Bunny.

[A]

Now. I know now every time we hear it, we just dance. It's great music. He's great. But that. But the. Wait, the one you just said is one controversial one. Nickelback.

[B]

So Nickelback.

[A]

I never understood why people didn't like it. It's like cheesy rock. I love cheesy rock.

[B]

No one, it's like the old Yogi Berra used to say. No one goes to that restaurant anymore. It's always too packed. Remember that? That's Nickelback. Everyone hates Nickelback. And then they sell out every fricking concert across the fricking world.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And so I don't know what all the hate is. I like Nickelback. I mean, I'm not going to go to their concert or anything. I'm not spending a million dollars. Go to the concert. But I enjoy their music. Okay.

[A]

Would you spend a couple hundred bucks to go to their concert?

[B]

Probably. Oh, I was going to go to the big one. I was going to give a sweet at Wembley. Okay. But I would spend a few hundred dollars to go to Foo Fighters any day of the week.

[A]

But anyways, what if I get you tickets to go see Nickelback?

[B]

You know what I don't think I would like is all the people that are there to see Nickelback.

[A]

Like, I feel like that's. This is where we're different. I think that's one of the best parts.

[B]

Maybe the people watch. I think they'd all go like, they'd all watch UFC and then they'd like go eat some like Kentucky Fried Chicken. And then they'd all go to Nickelback. Yeah, their Harley Davidson and Nickelback.

[A]

No, no, no.

[B]

I'm. I'm way off.

[A]

That would be a bunch of people like me and you and people that on their Harleys and people with chicken. I don't know why the chicken had to come into it.

[B]

I have absolutely no clue why the chicken came into it.

[A]

I'd be one of the people with some chicken. But I. No, you're wrong. Think about. I took John. I mean, I took John to Papa Roach concert.

[B]

Papa Roach.

[A]

And that was not something he was going to be interested in. However, I have video of you completely singing along with Last Resort. You seem to know all the words.

[B]

I did know the words. That's what I'm saying. I'm a musical chameleon.

[A]

I know, but you did make fun of the crowd and I took offense.

[B]

The crowd, everyone was wearing black. It was like this, this, this group has not really had a hit for 25 years. No, I'm not throwing shade. I'm not. I'm not throwing shade at them. I'm saying that's amazing.

[A]

Ours is an amazing.

[B]

Okay, okay, fine. But they're selling out a fucking 20,000 seat arena. It's amazing. Good on them. I respect it. But everyone there was like, I think we already talked about this. I was like, your dad's not coming home. He stepped out 95 to grab a case, a case of Bud Light and some cigarettes and he's not coming home. But you have to move on.

[A]

It was making me laugh.

[B]

Like, everyone's dressed all in black, but now instead of being like 15, they're like 40. And there's like fucking dad. John kept with you.

[A]

John would just point out someone to me. I'd be like, that guy's dad's still not coming home. Still not coming home. He left. And I'm like, stop.

[B]

Was a very fun concert.

[A]

It was really fun. Anyway, who shot jr?

[B]

Who did shoot jr?

[A]

This is a really random.

[B]

Oh, God.

[A]

They're all random, as they always are. And that's why we have fun over here on the book list. We appreciate you listening. We'll be back next week with the full recap of One Day by David Nichols. April, we are reading Little Secrets by Jennifer Hillier, your Patreon short story. In case you're not caught up by the time this episode comes out, which is the same day the usually comes out on the 15th, but John was out of town. So the Patreon short story is up as of today, the 16th as well. That was Famous Once by Jane Green. We have a ton of fun doing the short stories and of course you can listen to them whenever you want because it's just on the Patreon app. It's podcast. You can listen whenever you want in case you're behind. That's only $5 a month. And we always do other podcasts too. Join us Join us. Thanks for being here. Rate, review, subscribe, and we will see you next week with the full discussion of One Day by David Nichols.

[B]

Bye. The Book Lisp the Book Lisp the

[A]

Book List the Book Lisp the Book Lisp.