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Mackenzie
My name is Mackenzie, and I started a GoFundMe for the adoptive mother of a nonverbal autistic child. The mother had lost her job because she wasn't able to find adequate care for this autistic child. So she really needed some help with living expenses, paying some back bills. So I launched a GoFundMe to help support them during this crisis. And we raised about $10,000 within just a couple of months. I think that the surprising thing was by telling a clear story and just like, really being very clear about what we needed, we had some really generous donations from people who were really moved by the situation that this family was struggling with.
Dave Anthony
GoFundMe is the world's number one fundraising platform, trusted by over 200 million people.
Mackenzie
Start.
Gareth Reynolds
Start your GoFundMe today at gofundme.com that's gofundme.com gofundme.com this podcast is supported by GoFundMe.
Dave Anthony
You're listening to the Dollop Van Edition. This Crazy is an American history podcast for each week, I, Dave Anthony, read a story from American history while in a van to my other guy, Gareth
Gareth Reynolds
Reynolds, who has no idea what the topic is going to be about. Also in a van. We're in Steven Seagal.
Dave Anthony
And you're enjoying a beverage. It's exciting. We don't have anything else to say. Right?
Gareth Reynolds
I mean, we're in a van.
Dave Anthony
We're in a van. The tour's about to end. It's all very exciting doing it in the van.
Gareth Reynolds
We want to see if we have this technology.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Let's see how this sounds.
Gareth Reynolds
Send your notes to Luke.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. I can't wait to hear your anger. 1850 or 1851.
Gareth Reynolds
You're getting a little fudgy on these years now.
Dave Anthony
You know, when you get to 1800s, people didn't write stuff down. They were still, like, just using pop.
Gareth Reynolds
It was lore.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. It was all mostly verbal.
Gareth Reynolds
Interesting.
Dave Anthony
William H. McGrory was born in Manhattan's Five Points to Irish immigrant parents Patrick and Honora McGrory.
Gareth Reynolds
Honora.
Dave Anthony
H O N O R A.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, you said it, right?
Dave Anthony
Honora.
Gareth Reynolds
Honora.
Dave Anthony
I mean, it's a weird one.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
I'd never heard that name before.
Gareth Reynolds
And what's his name?
Dave Anthony
McCrory. McGrory. McCrory. Rory.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
As like if you combine McG and Rory.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. Or like if McDonald's made a Scoville sandwich.
Dave Anthony
That's right. As expected, Billy's father died when he was around 8.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. As is the way.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. It has to happen for a dollar.
Gareth Reynolds
Yep.
Dave Anthony
After that, his mom, Honora, had to support the family by bringing in borders and psyching through a bunch of marriages.
Gareth Reynolds
You know, bringing in Borders. Oh, like people who crash there.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Billy, meanwhile, got involved in crime.
Gareth Reynolds
Nice.
Dave Anthony
That's how you do it.
Gareth Reynolds
It's a good start.
Dave Anthony
Billy's half brother, Johnny Thompson, was a well known Bowery actor from his father, mother's first marriage.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
I don't know how many times she got married, but it's pretty clear she got married a lot.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay. And that's cool.
Dave Anthony
No, fine with it. Whatever keeps the Valley.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm asking about your opinion.
Dave Anthony
Cool. As far as societally viewed, probably not, but they're like, they're like the dirt poor and fright points, like nobody cares. So the family had moved to West 16th street after the father died. And Billy starts running with thieves and other petty criminals as a teen. Now, there's no evidence that he was in a gang, but he seems to have been.
Gareth Reynolds
He was running with petty criminals.
Dave Anthony
He was, he's been part of like a pickpocket thief gang in the 4th and 6th wards. That is the most.
Gareth Reynolds
That's the way to do it. I agree. I like that. I, I, the Oliver fan in me always wanted to be a part of that. I always wanted to hang out with an older man who showed me how to pickpockets. And we'd come back at the end of the night and we'd just throw our, our fencing materials in a pile and then we'd all hang out.
Dave Anthony
How is that any different than this podcast?
Gareth Reynolds
Very different. Well, we don't steal. We're paid, we're compensated. Although we did steal the day. Luke did steal a U Haul sound blanket.
Dave Anthony
That is true. For the van.
Gareth Reynolds
For the van.
Dave Anthony
Because they wouldn't sell it to us. At 16 in 1866, Billy was convicted of first degree robbery and he used the alias Gilbert McGlair.
Gareth Reynolds
I like it.
Dave Anthony
The Times Record quote, all parties implicated in the Adams Express robbery have been arrested. Gilbert McGlare, alias Gilly McGlory.
Gareth Reynolds
So he had like an alias for his alias?
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
So they were like, we got you, Gilly. We know you both.
Dave Anthony
The well known sneaking thief.
Gareth Reynolds
Yes. As opposed to the obtuse thief, the loud thief. I'll be taking some of these items, too. Oh, no.
Dave Anthony
The cops, you know, can ever be a sneaking thief.
Gareth Reynolds
Luke. Luke could never be a sneaking up. I mean, good Lord, are you kidding me?
Dave Anthony
Smash bang.
Gareth Reynolds
He would, like, take himself out. They'd be like, he fell into handcuffs Somehow.
Dave Anthony
The well known sneaking thief was arrested in this city last Friday night. James Wells was also arrested the same night. They were all taken to Bridgeport and committed. The proof against them is conclusive.
Gareth Reynolds
But take. You don't even need to lock them up in Bridgeport. Just go there for an evening. I mean, we were in Bridgeport and oh man, it is tough to go to some of these towns.
Dave Anthony
As someone commented on the Patreon page. Why in God's name would you go to Bridgeport?
Gareth Reynolds
We didn't know until we went there.
Dave Anthony
We didn't.
Gareth Reynolds
And it was really. It is not doing well.
Dave Anthony
It is not doing well. So Billy gets five years of Sing Sing Prison where he just meets more criminals. Right.
Gareth Reynolds
Cool.
Dave Anthony
Now, Billy had long wavy hair and was said to have a.
Gareth Reynolds
Sounds like somebody used neutrophil.
Dave Anthony
Nice. And it was said to have a, quote, ministerial look.
Gareth Reynolds
Sounds like someone
Dave Anthony
who.
Gareth Reynolds
I don't know.
Dave Anthony
I lost you trying to think of the guy we did last night.
Gareth Reynolds
No, no, I was making another dumb joke. So what's the guy last name was? Joseph. Well done.
Dave Anthony
Look at you. Proud of you. Once out, Billy got into the saloon business and he opened a drinking hole called the Burnt Rag.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, God. Jesus. Try a little harder. That just sounds so. Chloroformy. Ah, that is like. It's really not hard to name an establishment.
Dave Anthony
No, it's not.
Gareth Reynolds
You do like the Tipsy Toad.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. The Burnt Rags. There's nothing appealing about it.
Gareth Reynolds
This is the Burnt Rag, the piston coaster. Sharded Cardboard. Hey, you guys want to come down to Sharded Cardboard? Don't order any food.
Dave Anthony
It was at 103 Bowery street in the 1870s. So it's a four story building frequented by the lower end of society. Right. The sailors, the tenement. The tenement people, sure. It was just 200ft from police headquarters in the 6th Precinct.
Gareth Reynolds
That's convenient.
Dave Anthony
And quickly became known as a thieves den. So a gathering spot for criminals, sex workers, et cetera.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
It was repeatedly raided by police for blatantly violating liquor laws and being, you know, fine with other illegal shit.
Gareth Reynolds
What are the liquor laws? Is it There's.
Dave Anthony
I'm sure you need a license.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, I see.
Dave Anthony
And then probably you can't serve. I mean, not at the time.
Gareth Reynolds
Maybe Sundays or something.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, definitely Sundays. So there's different things. Customers were just plied with booze usually, you know, supplied by the women. The women would be like, hey, you want another drink? That sort of.
Gareth Reynolds
I didn't mind if I do.
Dave Anthony
Oh, perfect. Yep. And their job is to keep them drinking. And once they're lubed up, they'd be drugged, robbed, assaulted by bouncers, whatever.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, God.
Dave Anthony
The women are also sex workers, so they can get your money that way.
Gareth Reynolds
Doesn't sound like they need to. That's what that. The whole thing I thought was they were going to get you drunk and then bang you.
Dave Anthony
No, I think you have to pay for it. But, like, quite a bit of just taking their money.
Gareth Reynolds
I don't like that. If I'm going to get. If I'm going to lose money, I want sex.
Dave Anthony
Okay.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. So just if. If the options. Well, no, no, hold on. Let me backtrack, because that's going to hurt my congressional run. Yeah, I'm saying if my options are to lose money, no sex, and same establishment, you know, I'm throwing a little money back into the economy. Sex, and I lose the same amount of money, I'll have the sex one. Okay, thank you.
Dave Anthony
But also, they can do both. They can give you the sex and still rob you.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm better with that one.
Dave Anthony
They essentially want all your money.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Look, you know, as long as I'm. As long as I'm not. And I don't mind having nothing.
Dave Anthony
Okay, that was really upsetting. So sometimes customers just got beat up, you know? Instead, in 1876, the New York New York Times was printing headlines like burnt Rag Again.
Gareth Reynolds
Burnt Rag Again.
Dave Anthony
Quote, officer Brown of the 29th Precinct on Saturday made a raid at the Notorious Den on 114 West 13th Street. So you'll notice it's moved, occupied by William McGlory. So now he's calling himself McGlory instead of McGrory.
Gareth Reynolds
I like that.
Dave Anthony
I do, too.
Gareth Reynolds
Curious where that takes us.
Dave Anthony
Well, remember his alias was Gilly McGlory?
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. So now he's just adopted.
Dave Anthony
So. Yeah. Yeah, it's a good one. It's pretty close to Billy McGlory.
Gareth Reynolds
But when I looked at my, like, stalker's alias list, which she had, there was a lot of, like, stuff where I'm like, oh, so she's been hanging on to that last name for a couple of fakes. She's fallen. Fallen in love with that one
Dave Anthony
Willie McGlory, formerly keeper of the Burnt Rag at 50 Bleecker St. 21 arrested. McGlory was held for trial on a thousand dollars bail. So he's. He's moving his saloon around.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
Billy's family connection also traveled in crime circles. Half sister, Honora. So he's got a sister Sister. Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. Well, it's a Beautiful name. Yeah.
Dave Anthony
Why would you not keep.
Gareth Reynolds
What a great way to honor your mom.
Dave Anthony
I mean, I knew when I wrote this that was coming.
Gareth Reynolds
No, you didn't.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Admit that it came at the perfect way.
Dave Anthony
She married thief Hugh Campbell.
Gareth Reynolds
Hello, I'm a thief. On his Tinder profile. Thief.
Dave Anthony
Hi. By the early 1870s, he had a ruthless reputation amongst cops and journalists. Billy got married on. That's Billy, by the way. Billy got married on January 29, 1877, to an unknown woman.
Gareth Reynolds
To a who?
Dave Anthony
Unknown woman.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
And then in April, he just bailed on her.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, probably why we don't know anything.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. And she tried to prosecute him in court for abandonment. Quote, Ms. McGlory also stated that when she married him, she had $1,000, which she gave him. And besides abusing her shamefully, he had failed to return any part of the money. The judge ordered Billy to pay her six dollars a month in support.
Gareth Reynolds
Wow. Six bucks a month.
Dave Anthony
He made off like band in that one.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
And now we know why he married her. She had $1,000.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
A couple of months later, the Tribune reported that Billy's mom, Honora, another sister, Maryanne, Billy and a guy maybe having an affair with Honora James Tennessee were in court.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, so it really is family. It's a family thing.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. So Honor's husband, the thief, he's in Sing Sing now, huh? And the Daily Herald now says Billy is the owner of Burn Rag Number three.
Gareth Reynolds
He's moved the burn and he's. I like how he's never changed the name.
Dave Anthony
No, he just changed.
Gareth Reynolds
He's like, you got a winner. What are you gonna rag? You're not going to come up with another burnt rag?
Dave Anthony
Quote, James Hennessy, barkeeper, was unfortunate to become fascinated with Mrs. Campbell.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, that's Honora, the ma.
Dave Anthony
No, that's the sis. That's the sister.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
And heads a row, which brought this family before Judge Morgan. It happened yesterday at 2 o' clock in the morning in front of the McGlory's abode at 354 W. 16th St. Not a terrible area now.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, that. I don't know. The bleaker location. I'm pretty sure I used to do an open mic at. I'm serious. I literally think it was. It was the called the Village Lantern.
Dave Anthony
That's funny.
Gareth Reynolds
You're not laughing.
Dave Anthony
I laughed a little bit and then I stopped. Mr. Sorry. Mrs. McGlory and her son Billy. So the mom and Billy attacked Hennessy and Ms. Campbell when she took his side.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
Ms. Mary and McGlory to make things more interesting. Interesting. Attacked her sister Honora. So it's Billy, sister Marianne and mom fighting with Honora and the guy.
Gareth Reynolds
Wow.
Dave Anthony
It was a fight all around. And the worst sufferers were Hennessy, whose head was pretty well battered, and Ms. Campbell, who lost three of her teeth from a blow by her brother. So.
Gareth Reynolds
So Hanrah, the sister got. Got the three teeth, knocked out five pills, and Hennessy has a bad head injury.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Which is payback, honestly, because I'll tell you, there's a number of times where I felt like I've had a bad head injury from Hennessy. So it's an interesting parallel.
Dave Anthony
The uproar was so great that the 16th Precinct brought a squad of men on the scene and arrested all parties. Judge Morgan fined Billy and his sister honora, who lost three teeth. $10 each.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
It's pretty. Yeah, it's pretty good. Although at this time, I would imagine they didn't like. She's probably. Probably now just had no teeth in front.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
You're not going to get those.
Gareth Reynolds
No, you don't get those ones.
Dave Anthony
Back in September 1878, Henry Snyder was beaten in the burnt rag.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
Billy said he had to hit him with a chair in self defense because Snyder pulled a knife.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
He went to Chamber Street Hospital and was told he needed to be transferred to Bellevue because his wounds were so serious. About 10 in the morning, two men came to see him and said they were taking him to Bellevue.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay. To the hospital.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. And then he vanished.
Gareth Reynolds
Watching Luke take his eyes off the road to try to find whatever item it is that he's questing for. So, I mean, he's pining for whatever he's looking for. Just another water.
Dave Anthony
How many waters have you had today? A lot. What's going on with the water thing?
Gareth Reynolds
He's drinking a lot of water because it feels better when he has water in his mouth because he has a toothache.
Dave Anthony
Oh, right.
Gareth Reynolds
Remember he said that earlier? It was one of the weirdest things I'd heard, but I said, okay.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, I'm relating to the story a lot. I bet you are. Luke is relating to the story, so now his family's frantically searching for the guy.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
The Tribune quote, the men who called at the hospital were John Thompson, the comedian.
Gareth Reynolds
John Thompson, the comedian. Hey, what are we doing here, huh?
Dave Anthony
And half brother of McGlory and James Kelly.
Gareth Reynolds
That's right. Let me do the talking.
Dave Anthony
They took Snyder to the Occidental Hotel in the Bowery where he was.
Gareth Reynolds
I didn't mean to take him there, but it was a bit of an accident. How are you? I'm a comedian. How are. How is everybody? Hey, we're here to find the truth and not the tooth. Although she lost a few of those. How are you? How is everybody?
Dave Anthony
Okay. We didn't really expect a comedian to show up here at 10 in the morning.
Gareth Reynolds
Well, I'll tell you what I didn't expect to be here. Normally, I'm just performing at 10 in the evening.
Dave Anthony
Okay.
Gareth Reynolds
That's when some of my shows are all right. You should come check one out.
Dave Anthony
Why are you here? I'm sorry? Why are you here? It's a hotel.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm not 100%. I'm with them, though, so we're just. We're transporting him to Bellevue.
Dave Anthony
Well, why are you at the hotel in the Bowery then?
Gareth Reynolds
Why am I at the Bowery? Well, listen, a hotel's better than notel.
Dave Anthony
Or is this common?
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, yeah, no, here it is. You know what they call it? A hotel. That's when the brothel starts talking. That ho told that's a hotel. And I use that term because it's of the time. In the future, we probably will be much more understanding towards that kind of
Dave Anthony
work in the future. You remind me a lot of the comedy of Rob Snyder.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, that's a huge compliment. Rob is very good. Rob is very good. Rob is a very good comedian. He's. You know what I like about Rob? Nobody gave a shit. And then he pretended to be pro life, and now he's huge. He's a good friend. Every time I see Rob Schneider, I wish I was pro death.
Dave Anthony
Well, your comedy's kind of pro death.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, my. Wait, come on now.
Dave Anthony
So they take him to the Occidental Hotel in the Bower, where he was convinced not to press charges against Billy. When Snyder's family found out where he was, Snyder was quickly moved to Billy's mom's tenement building, which she owns.
Gareth Reynolds
Huh.
Dave Anthony
Snyder's sister went to the tenement but was not allowed inside. And Snyder lead on the window and said, I'm fine. Billy appeared in court the next day, but Snyder did not make an appearance as a witness. Quote, as he had done out with McGlory's brother to take. As he had gone out with McGlory's brother To take a walk. Okay, why is he a witness here? He went out with the. The charged brother for a little walk.
Gareth Reynolds
Well, that sounds lovely. And your honor, not you. I'm the comedian. I'm having a laugh.
Dave Anthony
So, I mean, I always do comedy.
Gareth Reynolds
We're having a joke.
Dave Anthony
I never not do comedy. That's. I'm terrible at this. I'm really bad.
Gareth Reynolds
I. I don't think I'm that bad at it.
Dave Anthony
Okay. In December 1878, Philip Marks went to Billy's Saloon around 3am and Marks walked up to the bar, pulled out a wad of cash, peeled off a bill, and ordered a drink.
Gareth Reynolds
Normal, 3am Was there a closing time?
Dave Anthony
No, Kind of stayed open all the time.
Gareth Reynolds
Awesome.
Dave Anthony
He was then attacked from behind and beaten bloody. Yeah, because you can't pull out a wad of cash.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. It's crazy.
Dave Anthony
It's insane.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm on. I'm on the side of theft.
Dave Anthony
This is like a. This is like a suicide in a way.
Gareth Reynolds
It's crazy.
Dave Anthony
So the beating became a big story for some reason. I don't know why, because people are beaten all the time. But this guy got pressed. The New York Daily Herald headline was the Bowery Outrage. Marks pointed out the men who beat him to police and quote, gave their names as Peter Thompson, a song and dance man.
Gareth Reynolds
Hey.
Dave Anthony
And waiter Leroy Peters, who was a deaf mute.
Gareth Reynolds
Well, we're talking about two. I wonder how those guys hung out.
Dave Anthony
Oh, Jesus Christ.
Gareth Reynolds
One of them won't say a thing. The other one shut the up. I know which one I am. Out of those two.
Dave Anthony
He also said Billy was there. So he was also arrested.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
And then also arrested was John Flynn, who had apparently taken Marks after he was beaten to a restaurant. That.
Gareth Reynolds
Would you. You want to get a shrimp? My friend here will do the scampi.
Dave Anthony
I know. Yeah, I was gonna say it's. It's scampi time.
Gareth Reynolds
My friend here will do scampi, and I will have the bolognese.
Dave Anthony
You know what's nice after a beating is a beautiful, subtle scampi.
Gareth Reynolds
There we are. You just wake up into a scampi.
Dave Anthony
The restaurant was a 113-1-3.
Gareth Reynolds
I don't care.
Dave Anthony
And that's where he was held. Maybe. Maybe to try to get more money or for a ransom.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
Either way, Flynn was then arrested for kidnapping.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
Flynn also happened to be the guy who held the liquor license for the burnt rag.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, so. So it's like the elevator certificate. It had to be on site.
Dave Anthony
Well, I. I don't think. I think McLory didn't want it so he could run it and then not.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, like, keep it out of his name or something.
Dave Anthony
So this is the end of the burnt rag. The license is pulled.
Gareth Reynolds
God damn it.
Dave Anthony
Because you can't do a kidnapping.
Gareth Reynolds
Like, sure you can. At the burnt rag.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, you should be able to do whatever, so. But then there's no charges. There were accusations of coercing a witness. The judge was so concerned about that that he denied Billy and everyone's bail for a long time. And at one point, Billy's lawyer got Mark's doctor's report to show that he had healed. So he said that if he's healed, Billy should get bailed.
Gareth Reynolds
This guy got better.
Dave Anthony
Hey, why is my guy still being held if this guy's fine now?
Gareth Reynolds
The person they almost murdered is out, they should be, too.
Dave Anthony
What are we doing here? Good Lord, where's the justice? The judge was like, no, that's insane. That's not how it works. Look at his style.
Gareth Reynolds
If they go in, then they should go out together.
Dave Anthony
Your Honor, we gave him scampi.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, my God, he's scampi.
Dave Anthony
This guy.
Gareth Reynolds
This judge keeps acting like this guy didn't get any goddamn scampi.
Dave Anthony
So Billy opens up a new.
Gareth Reynolds
I can't wait for this name.
Dave Anthony
Armory Hall.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, better, better, better.
Dave Anthony
At 158 Hester St. This, he turns into one of the city's most famous joints.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay?
Dave Anthony
He has cancan dancers, boxing matches.
Gareth Reynolds
Can I love a can.
Dave Anthony
And then boxes where the girls would squeeze every penny out of customers by selling overpriced booze and doing. Sure. The sex stuff.
Gareth Reynolds
What do you mean?
Dave Anthony
They were the handies, suckies, all the things.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, okay. I didn't realize you knew the menu that well.
Dave Anthony
Oh, I have the menu at my house, Andy.
Gareth Reynolds
Suckies, jerkies, vaginas. Okay.
Dave Anthony
Assies, footsies. Billy had trusted staffs slash thugs like John Kane and Andy Kelly, who would beat up and throw out anyone who caused trouble. Also didn't cause trouble.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
They were not to be robbed inside, but once.
Gareth Reynolds
Rules are rules.
Dave Anthony
But once out on the street, anything is fair game because now they're not in.
Gareth Reynolds
So you got to throw them out, then rob them.
Dave Anthony
So that's Billy's big rule, right? Once outside, they could literally be robbed of everything. And it was very common for them to be stripped naked.
Gareth Reynolds
I like that move. You know, it just kind of makes you not want to fight anything. You know what I mean?
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Like, if you're naked, you're like, shit. Well, I got to figure this out first.
Dave Anthony
You just see a guy. You just see a guy walking home naked.
Gareth Reynolds
Hey, I was the other tonight, I was robbed.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. It was a good night, though.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, it's a nice place.
Gareth Reynolds
Like Having to go into a place and say, they took my money when you're naked is worse. Excuse me. Hold on. I know you're having a good time. They took my money.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Hey, buddy, your stuff's out.
Gareth Reynolds
Can I have a sarsaparilla?
Dave Anthony
What are you gonna pay with?
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, yeah, they took everything.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
It's hard to sit on these leathery barstools.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, you're gonna stick.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. You ever wonder if cats butt holes hit the surface they're sitting on?
Dave Anthony
Because I have an answer. I don't.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, see you later.
Dave Anthony
Do they?
Gareth Reynolds
See you later.
Dave Anthony
Do they?
Gareth Reynolds
I will reveal the answer in part two every.
Dave Anthony
There's no part two.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, then. No, they don't.
Dave Anthony
How do they not?
Gareth Reynolds
God made them. Like a parliament filter. Just a little indentation.
Dave Anthony
Is that true?
Gareth Reynolds
Yes, true.
Dave Anthony
But it's a 24 hour bottle, so you can always see it. Like in the bottle.
Gareth Reynolds
You can always see it.
Dave Anthony
Buttles never hidden on a cat.
Gareth Reynolds
That's really one of the things that's always so strange about our relationship with the animals is the fact that it's like I. I would feel very uncomfortable walking around with hole showing all day. Yeah, but like a dog or a cat, you're like, hey, there we go. Look at that. And then they're so comfortable. They're like, I'm gonna eat my ass for a minute, then we should nap.
Dave Anthony
But my dogs are like three times a day. Can I sniff your butthole?
Gareth Reynolds
Yours?
Dave Anthony
No, my nose.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, each other's.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, each other's butt. Like, they'll walk over and start sniffing. I'm like, you just did that two hours ago.
Gareth Reynolds
I know. I'm catching up.
Dave Anthony
Same butthole.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm catching up on him. It's like their version of posting. All right. Ain't got any new thing in there. That's nice. Oh, so you went to the far side of the fence. That's interesting.
Dave Anthony
Okay, so Billy's bouncers were mostly criminals that he knew from Five Points who were quote, some of the most expert rough and tumble fighters of the period. Okay, so they strolled through the saloon. They would have pistols showing knives, brass knuckles.
Gareth Reynolds
Hey, here's a question.
Dave Anthony
Why'd you go there? And bludgeons.
Gareth Reynolds
Why would you go there?
Dave Anthony
I actually went there to get bludgeons.
Gareth Reynolds
Why would you? Like what you'd be like, I don't know. They're robbing people pretty hard here, but at least the girls will do a foot job.
Dave Anthony
Can I get. Can I get a tequila and then a knife between my third and fourth Rib.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, go outside.
Dave Anthony
All right. Army Armory hall makes Billy a fortune. He would. By the time he's done, he would sell for 100,000. So over the time, he hasn't. It's a. A hot joint.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
I can't believe I just said hot joint.
Gareth Reynolds
I can't believe I allowed you to say it. I was like. But I think you're like in the time. Yeah, you're like, it's a hot joint. It's a lot of hustle and bustle. Oh, you got games as far as the eyes can see, fellas.
Dave Anthony
So a visiting. So now reporters from around the country would now go there because it's so notorious just to write about it. So a visiting reporter from the National Enquirer described Armory hall as having, quote, a beastliness and depravity compared with which no chapter in the world's history is equal.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, so the. The roughest bar of all time.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. It was the spot for thieves, pickpockets, con men, and continued that way for years.
Gareth Reynolds
Great to be able to steal your own stuff back after you were robbed.
Dave Anthony
It really was.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm gonna pick his pocket now.
Dave Anthony
I'll pick your pocket. There were often bar room brawls. Gang violence would break out in there all the time. From. So when you go from the street, there's two double doors and then you walk down a long 50 foot hallway that is completely painted black and there's no lights.
Gareth Reynolds
That's cool. So that's what they. Which just. Why would you go to like the worst establishment ever for theft? And you'd walk down a dank, dark hallway where you couldn't see anything. It sounds like going to prison.
Dave Anthony
It's insane. So no lights, like I said. And then it opens up into a dance room that could fit 700 people.
Gareth Reynolds
You know, part of. It's the age, but I just would hate every part of this.
Dave Anthony
Every. There's nothing about this at all.
Gareth Reynolds
700 people in a place.
Dave Anthony
No.
Gareth Reynolds
Would absolutely be the worst thing ever.
Dave Anthony
The best place I ever went to, I went to was Speakeasy in San Francisco. And because I was with someone who knew the owner, I went into the front part and it was packed. And then there was a second. You go through a second wall and it's not as packed. And then there's a third room that's behind another wall that is like hardly any movie.
Gareth Reynolds
And yet you claim to be a socialist. And that's strange. Once you're given access to the palace, you don't give a shit about anyone, do You.
Dave Anthony
And that's where I ran with the big boys.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
Oh, the titans of industry.
Gareth Reynolds
No, and it's always so great when I read. I've done a couple of those where you get into the little sneaky room and you're like, I'm in the sneaky room?
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Oh, this is where the good booze is. Yeah. And the coke and the cocaine and the dance.
Gareth Reynolds
I used to go to this guy's bars. He ran a couple bars in LA and a couple in Vegas and he loves to do coke. And then he'd love to have you ask him the entertainment only questions from Trivial Pursuit decks.
Dave Anthony
I mean, that's pretty normal.
Gareth Reynolds
And so you'd just be there and you just like, say what? He'd be like Marilyn Monroe. And you'd be like, yeah. And you'd be like, it's kind of a one sided relationship. I would love to do something else.
Dave Anthony
This is. This is a new version of Trivial Pursuit called Show Off. Trivial Pursuit.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, I have he.
Dave Anthony
I got them all memorized.
Gareth Reynolds
Luke is on water 9. You can't drink that much water. That's coming from me.
Dave Anthony
Have you taken an Advil or anything?
Gareth Reynolds
Okay, okay.
Dave Anthony
All right.
Gareth Reynolds
Well, I'm worried our diagnosis is out.
Dave Anthony
I'm worried he's not going to make it till Tuesday. Now now is brought to you by Nutriful Neutral, of course, is a. It's a hair supplement. It is a growth supplement. It is tailored to men at every age because the root causes of hair thinning change over time. And Gareth, your routine should too.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, that's interesting. I didn't know that, Dave.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Are we in the episode?
Dave Anthony
Yes. Nutrival men for ages 18 to 49, which helps improve hair growth and achieve thicker, fuller hair in three to six months. And then there's Nutrival New. This is new. Nutrival Men 50 plus.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm getting confused. There's a couple news.
Dave Anthony
It's a double new.
Gareth Reynolds
So we're making news by saying there's a new neutrophil.
Dave Anthony
That's right.
Gareth Reynolds
Whoa.
Dave Anthony
The first and only hair growth product specifically formulated for Men 50 plus, which is my Nutrafol. And look, it's coming in thick. I'm growing it back.
Gareth Reynolds
I love when you pat yourself.
Dave Anthony
Damn right. So, yeah. So Nutrival is the number one dermatologist recommended hair growth supplement brand. It's trusted over by over one and a half million people. You use it? Yep, I use it. Your hair looks luxurious.
Gareth Reynolds
Yep.
Dave Anthony
Sexy. Wonderful.
Gareth Reynolds
Yep.
Dave Anthony
Thick. Yes, I would. Yeah. Okay. And I use it too. And I'm growing my hair back in after, after the treatments. And I look good. It looks good.
Gareth Reynolds
You look good. People are noticing.
Dave Anthony
People are talking, coming in, looking good, nice and healthy. So you can also feel good with what you're putting into your body. Because Nutrival hair growth supplements are backed by peer reviewed studies and NSS 10 certified.
Gareth Reynolds
I was in on those studies. I was one of the people who was evaluating and going around. They got a bunch of us and we met in Geneva and we were clipboards, lab coats, the whole nine.
Dave Anthony
So none of that is true or makes sense. So we both like it. Garrett gets a lot of compliments on his hair. I do too. Even my hairdresser was like, what's going on, bad boy? Literally what she said, what's going on?
Gareth Reynolds
You know, we haven't been talking about how we're the bad boys enough.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, we.
Gareth Reynolds
We've dropped that.
Dave Anthony
We are still the bad boys. So we recommend it. I mean, everybody loves our hats. So start Nutriful today and then they
Gareth Reynolds
sign off on that.
Dave Anthony
Everybody loves our heads. Start Nutrival today and make the hat optional. Visit nutrival.com and enter promo code the dollop for $10 off your first month subscription and free shipping. And find out why Nutribull is the best selling hair growth supplement brand at nutrival.com spelled n u t r a f o l.com promo code the dollop. That's ninjavot.com promo code the Dollop. We're in a van, okay? So there's live music, obviously. There's a balcony around the entire room. So that's where the little boxes are. Also the little boxes where that stuff happens with the little.
Gareth Reynolds
Where the jacket, Little Jack.
Dave Anthony
We don't call it Jack Shake. There's a lot of stuff that goes on. And there's sucking, there's jacking. I remember there's vagina.
Gareth Reynolds
She starts jerking you off. I'm sorry I ordered foot. Oh, sorry. This is for another table.
Dave Anthony
Big spending, out of towners knew about it now, and they would come despite the reputation, right? So they could get robbed. But they're like, yay. In the boxes. The ladies entertained and it was called, quote, even more degraded than the hay market, which is like a famous, naughty, dirty spot.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay?
Dave Anthony
He also had dudes dressed in women's clothing working as waitresses. And they'd move throughout the crowd singing and dancing. They were, quote, painted like women and had high voices painted like women. And he very much encouraged gay activity amongst all The Patriots this very progressive
Gareth Reynolds
in a way, I do think. Or is it just capitalism trumps everything?
Dave Anthony
Well, I think capitalism trumps everything, but I also think amongst this class, they're kind of fine with everybody doing everything. Sure, it's the religious and riches that get mad at the. At this. But everyone else is like, hey, Frank's a lady today.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
And they're like, whatever.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
In January 1879, Billy was indicted for running a disorderly house, which is a brothel.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
But he just didn't go to court.
Gareth Reynolds
I didn't realize that was an option.
Dave Anthony
And he had put down a $500 bail, so he just forfeited the bail and then that was it. That was the end of it.
Gareth Reynolds
That's awesome.
Dave Anthony
Nothing else happened. He's like, oh, I just don't go. And it's. You keep the money.
Gareth Reynolds
There you go. Yeah, I just didn't want to go.
Dave Anthony
It's like getting fined $500 and then you're done.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, right. Although that's gotten worse, obviously. I remember one time I didn't pay like a parking ticket or sub ticket, and when I went to the courthouse, that's the worst. I was like, wait, what? $700?
Dave Anthony
It's. It's crazy.
Gareth Reynolds
Crazy.
Dave Anthony
And now, you know, they're putting. They legalize the cameras everywhere. So LA is going to be covered in camera. Yeah, yeah, it's great.
Gareth Reynolds
It's good because we live in hell.
Dave Anthony
Because the poor should pay for everything, not the. Not the wealthy.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, right. Yeah.
Dave Anthony
So he opened. He opened up some other drinking holes like the Windsor plays, all focused on vice, bringing in big crowds, looking for music, gambling and sex. They all have brawls, they have scammers. Staff are getting arrested. In 1885, Billy's brother Michael was convicted of drunken destruction. I couldn't find anything else about this, but that's.
Gareth Reynolds
I mean, that is something to be super disorderly proud of.
Dave Anthony
Drunken destruction.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, that is. Yeah.
Dave Anthony
Journalists would go to write about it. Like I said, one described Armory all as close. The most vicious resort he had ever
Gareth Reynolds
seen, but they're all dying to go there and write about it. Is Vegasy.
Dave Anthony
It's. Yes, it's Vegasy, but they're also like, they want to go there and have the craziest description.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
Which makes other people want to go there. So it's just feeding on itself.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
So reform candidate Abram S. Hewitt became mayor in 1887, and he promises to clean up the vice and red light districts. So this would start a long battle, but when authorities Tried to close armory hall in 1889. They ran into problems. Now he is supposed to be connected to Tammany hall, which I'm sure he was.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
So the next mayor comes in, who's also a reform mayor.
Gareth Reynolds
Wait, this is the one mayor didn't do shit.
Dave Anthony
Tried to. Couldn't do shit. So the next guy comes in. Hugh. Hugh Grant.
Gareth Reynolds
What? Yeah, he's gonna love this place. He was gonna fucking dig this spot a lot. I was just wondering, could I shoot it on your hand?
Dave Anthony
But I forgot. Did he get caught with a trans woman?
Gareth Reynolds
No, he got caught with a.
Dave Anthony
It was a trans woman.
Gareth Reynolds
No, it wasn't.
Dave Anthony
That was just Murphy.
Gareth Reynolds
Huh? Yeah, he got caught with a black prostitute named. I can't remember what her name was, but. But, yeah, no, he just. He was in Beverly Hills and he got like. Yeah, he was in Beverly Hills.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, he got caught. And she was a street. A street walker, or was she.
Gareth Reynolds
I think she was just a sex worker. I don't know. I don't know. I feel like.
Dave Anthony
You got caught in a car.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, she. Yeah, she went in the car and then the cops were like, ah, there we go. And there was like. You know, she was doing something. This is when he was dating Elizabeth Hurley and everyone's like, oh, I can't believe it. And then he went on the Tonight show and he was like, oh, gosh, my touch has gotten me into another bit of a predicament. Jay Leno was like, hey, what are you gonna do? And then that was the night that Leno started beating Letterman because America is the dumbest place of all time.
Dave Anthony
I forgot about that. Yeah. Fuck.
Gareth Reynolds
Then we had to deal with Leno.
Dave Anthony
Jesus. We really. That was. That was the. Still the darkest time in American history. Leno having the Tonight Show.
Gareth Reynolds
And what was it like when cock went inside of her mouth? Just very oj.
Dave Anthony
It's gotta be. It's gotta be such a bummer to be getting a hummer from a sex worker on the street. And then the light comes in the window.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, yeah, no, hi. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let me finish.
Dave Anthony
Oh, God, I'm a huge actor. What have I done?
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, gosh.
Dave Anthony
Okay. So he meets with the new mayor, Hugh Grant, and said. Billy says he has been trying to rent out the building that the Armory is in as a church, but he just can't find any tenants.
Gareth Reynolds
Look at you. I've been really wanting to convert this money making machine that is renowned throughout the country to a. A place of worship, but I just can't figure it Out. Take anybody to do it, but I'm here.
Dave Anthony
So that obviously didn't go over well.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
A month later, police go to Armory hall and reported that they've seen nothing. Nothing obscene, nothing improper. Quote, not even a can can.
Gareth Reynolds
I didn't even see a can can.
Dave Anthony
I saw no can cans. Sensing this was going to be a serious problem, Billy sells the building to a furniture manufacturer. Auctions off the bar, the piano, the icebox, and the stage scenery in June 1889. So $100,000 is what he gets.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
Which is a crazy amount of money.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
He then buys the Hotel Irving, which is a respectable restaurant and boarding house in uptown Manhattan.
Gareth Reynolds
Not anymore. Not anymore.
Dave Anthony
But then he turns it quickly into an all night saloon and dance hall. And it's right across the street from the New York Academy of Music and very close to Tammany Hall. So he's. He's just gone in to the middle of them.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, he's just changed.
Dave Anthony
Like, he's punching him in the mouth, right? Like they came after him and he's like, all right, how about I show you how it works?
Gareth Reynolds
They're like, oh, God.
Dave Anthony
So complaints just coming in immediately. People are flipping out about the music. There's violence on the street, but the cops are not doing anything.
Gareth Reynolds
Imagine.
Dave Anthony
But he is now irritating a whole new group of people who have influence. And the New York Herald does this huge expose revealing what a fucking hellhole it is, okay? And the Evening World paper also gets in on the attacks. And so people, they're getting people just fucking riled up. And, and they're now, they're not just going after Billy, but all these types of saloons. They recalled the quote, outlaws of New York, the men who run in defiance of law and order. Resorts where men are nightly robbed of goods and reason, where women are shameless, where crime in its worst and deepest shades is fostered and encouraged.
Gareth Reynolds
Isn't it funny that the solution and the issue to all of that is money? It's like, amazing how long we've been trying to figure out why this. Everything's so crazy.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
And it's always just money. It's money, money. Everything's money. And you know, it's a really bad idea.
Dave Anthony
So now the city passes reforms. So they go after Billy. First, his liquor license is pulled, but he just keeps selling booze without the liquor license.
Gareth Reynolds
Sure.
Dave Anthony
And then his longtime bartender, Edward Kelly is arrested. And then after that, Billy is arrested as the owner and the prosecutor. Now, because of the laws that have been passed, he just has to prove crimes are happening there that Billy knows. So he shows that Billy just didn't know. But he took part. And Billy came to the trial. So they arrested him. Having the tombs. But he comes to the trial in his, quote, fine brown beaver overcoat and high silk hat.
Gareth Reynolds
Now, it. It's interesting because I would think you come in a more meek on something.
Dave Anthony
You would think so.
Gareth Reynolds
But instead, he dresses like a Bucky's spokesperson.
Dave Anthony
Well, he clearly thinks he's untouchable.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
He's all gonna get away with this, too. So the child.
Gareth Reynolds
By the way, you wear a beaver jacket around me. You're very touchable.
Dave Anthony
That is a.
Gareth Reynolds
That is a fun to pet fabric.
Dave Anthony
So the trial's not long. Several people testified, including a florist he ordered plants from but never paid. And then the most damning are all these people he worked with. An investor said he got screwed over. One of the sex workers said she got screwed over.
Gareth Reynolds
Don't.
Dave Anthony
A bookmaker.
Gareth Reynolds
What?
Dave Anthony
The jury convicts him in seven minutes.
Gareth Reynolds
That's cool.
Dave Anthony
That's a long time. Literally. Is there enough time to walk into the.
Gareth Reynolds
And most of that was dinner orders.
Dave Anthony
So Billy sentenced to a year of hard labor at Blackwell's island for running a disorderly establishment. Part of the conviction forced any saloon he owned to be closed, and he bar and barred him from reopening one in New York until 1896.
Gareth Reynolds
What year are we in now?
Dave Anthony
I think we're. I think it's like 92.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
Or it could have been 91, but it's like five years.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
So while he's in prison, Billy became a member of the Salvation army and said he now supported the temperance movement.
Gareth Reynolds
What? Lies?
Dave Anthony
No lies. Why would that be lies?
Gareth Reynolds
Yo. So now I'm a. I'm a member of the Salvation army, and I. Yeah, I think all this terrible debauchery with this. It's the boots, it's the boost, and we got to stop it.
Dave Anthony
That's what made me do it.
Gareth Reynolds
God, so glad I found you guys.
Dave Anthony
But then when he gets out, he said that the. The temperance thing would not actually work because he was a, quote, awful example. Wait, he's saying. He's saying I can't fight for temperance because look at what I've been doing, right? Like this.
Gareth Reynolds
You know, now that I'm free, I realize I should be doing what I used to do.
Dave Anthony
Just saw an Amish guy.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, really? A real one?
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Down Amish in the wild. It was a little horse carriage trotting along, but the Detroit Free Press quoted him by spelling it Hoffle Hexample. H A W F U L H E G Z A M feely. What kind of accent is that?
Gareth Reynolds
Hoffle Hexample.
Dave Anthony
Is that like a New Yorki waffle?
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, maybe a little Hexample doesn't work. No, that's what we're gonna need when we convict Pete Hegseth.
Dave Anthony
Oh, that'll never happen.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh.
Dave Anthony
If anything, he'll be made emperor. Oh, right after getting out.
Gareth Reynolds
I got a good feeling right after getting out.
Dave Anthony
He re emerged in New York society and attended a very high, high profile, bare knuckle boxing match between John Sullivan and Patty Ryan at Madison Square Garden. He's just. There, there's. There. There's more. There's more.
Gareth Reynolds
We got a bunch of Amish out here now.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, buggies.
Gareth Reynolds
And yeah, for those of you wondering, there are a lot of Amish out here. Oh, we're in Pennsylvania, duh.
Dave Anthony
We're. Yeah, we're in Dutch country. We're on Lancaster, probably.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, man.
Dave Anthony
So he's just out there openly hobnobbing with cops and politicians and prominent sports figures. Gets a lot of media attention.
Gareth Reynolds
All right, I can pay. It's just UFC night.
Dave Anthony
What?
Gareth Reynolds
It's UFC night?
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Basically, just like the New York Herald then dubbed him the Vicar General, mocking his flirtation with religious reform.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
So what's out? The law goes back after him and they serve him to appear for unpaid bills to a liquor distributor, but they can't find him to give him the papers.
Gareth Reynolds
That is really one of those great loopholes of being served.
Dave Anthony
Did you see the Mr. Pillow guy getting served the other day?
Gareth Reynolds
Mr. Pillow is my new favorite name for my pillow guy.
Dave Anthony
Mr. Pillow.
Gareth Reynolds
Hello, I'm Mr. Pillow. I used to smoke crack and now I've been served. Cpac. Yeah, it was awesome.
Dave Anthony
I'm. I'm getting interviewed on television.
Gareth Reynolds
On television when he was just on some website.
Dave Anthony
The reporter's like, yeah. Oh, no. What is this? What?
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, the reporter's like, what? What are you serving it for? He's like, not now. We're talking about the Future of America. Mr. Pillow, you're under arrest. Same with you, Mr. Smarty, and you, Mr.
Dave Anthony
Mean. So they can't find him, and they're trying to find him for a long time, and then they find him guilty of contempt for avoiding being served. And then he finally comes to court. Okay, that went on for like a year. So when he gets to court, he's being questioned. He said he went to college for a year, and now Live with his wife in a home.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, I was at college. I just learned how to be a bunch of stuff.
Dave Anthony
He said he learned how to be a blacksmith.
Gareth Reynolds
Now I'm a blacksmith.
Dave Anthony
It's.
Gareth Reynolds
I went to blacksmith at college. Who wants a sword?
Dave Anthony
And then because they're trying to now find out his financial situation. Right, so you can pay back people. Oh, it's a fire. That's a lame ass fire. California does way better.
Gareth Reynolds
That's what happens on the Amish. Get a phone.
Dave Anthony
So. So he says he lives with his wife in a home he thinks she owns, but he's not sure.
Gareth Reynolds
We never talked about it.
Dave Anthony
Well, because he never asked her. Because, you know, quote. To tell you the truth, sir, I don't know. I never asked her. It wouldn't be decent seeing she's giving me her goodwill. So he doesn't know how much she makes and what she does for work and if she owns the house.
Gareth Reynolds
It's unbecoming for couples to talk about.
Dave Anthony
Well, that's rude. Why would you ask your wife that? Excuse me, I am a gentleman. He also claimed he had been sick since graduating from the institution at Blackwell's Island.
Gareth Reynolds
It's a prison, right? The institution graduating from the Evening World
Dave Anthony
noted he was now dressed in a moth eaten coat. So that was what you're saying?
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. Now he's like the moths took everything too.
Dave Anthony
Well, now that he's on trial for to see how much money he has.
Gareth Reynolds
He has nothing.
Dave Anthony
No, he has nothing.
Gareth Reynolds
The moss took it.
Dave Anthony
The trial allowed the liquor distributors lawyers
Gareth Reynolds
ate some holes in my memory too.
Dave Anthony
I don't know what's going.
Gareth Reynolds
I don't remember a bunch of stuff.
Dave Anthony
The trial allowed the liquor distributors lawyers to bring in witnesses to close to disclose all money he had made over the years. Okay, so the evidence.
Gareth Reynolds
That's not good.
Dave Anthony
The evidence is very against it.
Gareth Reynolds
The moss took it.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. I don't know. He still appeared to own the Irving Hotel. Then he suddenly became too ill to go to court. He's like, I'm way too sick to show up to this. Because he's getting hammered.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
So the judge had him arrested. The judge then ordered him to pay the $766. This is all over $766. He sold. He sold the Armory hall for 100,000. This is over 766,000.
Gareth Reynolds
I don't know how much my wife makes.
Dave Anthony
So he either pays it or goes to jail. By March 8, he hasn't paid it. So it's just a couple weeks. And with interest it's up to 1100 and then suddenly the papers report that Billy's in Denver dying of consumption.
Gareth Reynolds
Damn. God, I'm.
Dave Anthony
That'll happen.
Gareth Reynolds
Got it. Sucks.
Dave Anthony
On July 1, 1893, the Evening News headline was quote, Jail for McGlory, the Ex Dive keeper, arrested in his home in Baldwin's Long Island. He had just returned from Denver, where he wasn't dying.
Gareth Reynolds
So he went on vacation. Basically, it was like, he's dying.
Dave Anthony
He must stay in jail until he pays the judgment. After six weeks in jail, his mother declared. He tried to have his mother declared mentally incompetent to get control of her assets, which included the tenement building.
Gareth Reynolds
He's a good kid.
Dave Anthony
He is.
Gareth Reynolds
He's a good guy.
Dave Anthony
Although she might not have been a great mom.
Gareth Reynolds
Still,
Dave Anthony
in 1896, there were a bunch of towns who suddenly became worried that Billy was going to open a saloon there. So all these towns like a data center. I looked at. Yeah, totally. I looked over the. And there's just all these towns, like Buffalo was freaked out. Rockville. They're all just scared.
Gareth Reynolds
You don't want to.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, yeah. Some bought the land they thought he was eyeing.
Gareth Reynolds
That is hilarious.
Dave Anthony
Turned it into a park to stop him.
Gareth Reynolds
That is what America became beautiful for. Fear of a Billy tavern.
Dave Anthony
But there's no indication he was considering it.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, that's just if you're like a landowner, you're like, you know, they say Billy's gonna open a tavern over there.
Dave Anthony
Oh, God. Get a park going.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, okay. Buy it off me.
Dave Anthony
But also like, how do you know that's the plot? So they've been busy.
Gareth Reynolds
Exactly. That's what I mean.
Dave Anthony
You just could be another one.
Gareth Reynolds
He's been looking at this one a lot over here.
Dave Anthony
God, we got so many parks.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm gonna buy Maine. I'm buying Maine.
Dave Anthony
So then it was reported Billy had moved to Syracuse with his wife. Some of associates joined him. Billy bought an old temperance resort called Elmwood park, which had previously been home to William Pardee's first class Temperance Resort.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
The Temperance resort.
Gareth Reynolds
Temperance is just now going to be like a cool bar.
Dave Anthony
It's just.
Gareth Reynolds
Welcome to Temperance.
Dave Anthony
The temperance resort had swan boats on two man made lakes. There was a merry go round and a picnic spot. Quote, it being strictly a temperance resort, parents need not fear to allow their children to go unattended.
Gareth Reynolds
Excuse me.
Dave Anthony
Hold on.
Gareth Reynolds
Sorry there. Mr. Epstein.
Dave Anthony
Welcome to Peto Island.
Gareth Reynolds
Don't worry, your kids can now hang out here and you don't have to worry about us being drunk.
Dave Anthony
Well, this. This is definitely a time when they always tried to. It was the. The whole temperance movement was mostly pushed by people going like, they're leaving, they spend all the money on booze, and the kids are starving.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah. Right.
Dave Anthony
So Billy said he would rename it Elmwood Elysium. And the plan is to turn into a hotel, concert hall, boating lake and bar. Okay, so locals are freaking out.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
The Reverend James King called his community to action, warning them of, quote, tufts and hoodlums that would be running loose on the streets of Syracuse.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay. Luke is about to go into water 10 10. So legally drowning on earth.
Dave Anthony
He got one. Quote, we must uphold the good reputation of the neighborhood. Protect your homes, your children, and your church and fight in a body to down this great evil which threatens us.
Gareth Reynolds
He is a data center.
Dave Anthony
I mean, it's really crazy how much they're scared of a bar. Yeah, it's a bar.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
So a meeting was held days later, and a hundred citizens formed a law and order league. And they were really mad at William Pardee for selling the land to a guy who would bring the Five Points to Syracuse. But Billy was so rich, they all knew it would be really hard to stop him. So they try to stop him from getting a liquor license, but he got one. And then they were really mad at the guys, the two guys who gave the liquor license. But still, construction is not starting. And after a year, Billy said, quote, feeling. I'm feeling underappreciated.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
But he. And he says he's putting the property up for sale.
Gareth Reynolds
Wrong.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, you're right. How'd you know?
Gareth Reynolds
Because he's playing victim. That's what they do. They're like. They do that to elicit sympathy. And then there's so like, Elon does that all the time, you know? Or they just do this thing where they're like, oh, don't you feel bad for me?
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Trump does it. They all do this, like, woe is me thing, and then they still do the evil thing.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Right.
Gareth Reynolds
They always posture like they're going to have a change of heart.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
And then. And then they get headlines out of it, and then people start talking and then they do the shitty thing.
Dave Anthony
Right. He told the reporter, quote, the people out there tried and convicted me before they had the least idea of what I was going to do.
Gareth Reynolds
I'm going to be a fucking nightmare.
Dave Anthony
Here comes hell. He added that if he had started this type of business out west, the towns would be doing everything possible, go there to help it and keep it Going, yeah, right. Go to Denver. And yet Elmwood's Elysium opened a year later.
Gareth Reynolds
Doesn't surprise me.
Dave Anthony
Reynolds, you saw the future.
Gareth Reynolds
I did,
Dave Anthony
but it really didn't matter because the whole venture. Oh, wait. So there was no huge concert hall. There was an orchestra in a small theater. There were variety nights with good music, beer and vaudeville acts. No violence, no crime. In August 1897, the Syracuse Standard reported three black women were barred from entering due to their race, which was against New York law. They had passed 12 years before stating businesses had to provide full and equal access.
Gareth Reynolds
Okay.
Dave Anthony
The three women sued for $500, and then two other women joined the lawsuit. But it really didn't matter because the whole venture was a disaster. The Syracuse Journal called it a, quote, dismal failure. And in 1898, Billy said he was walking away and that he was going to become a Presbyterian minister.
Gareth Reynolds
He keeps doing that where he's.
Dave Anthony
Because he knows it's with him. It makes him. It enrages them.
Gareth Reynolds
Yes.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
And I think it makes some people be like, he's not a bad guy.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. Yeah, it does.
Gareth Reynolds
Book. Yeah, I saw. Dude, I saw this clip of Trump the other day, and he's going. He's just. He's reading off the page, and he's like. And in Corinthians 2, the second Corinthians, best Corinthians.
Dave Anthony
She's like, that's Corinthians, the most awesome Corinthians.
Gareth Reynolds
Unreal.
Dave Anthony
It's. He's so funny because he can just totally picture being like. And then the crib. The best. Corinthians 5, the one I love to read. I read all the time.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, well, they did.
Dave Anthony
I read to Melania that interview where
Gareth Reynolds
they were like, gee, are you an Old Testament or New Testament guy? He goes, probably new. And then they go, and what's your favorite book? And he goes, I don't. I don't. I actually never say my favorite book. I don't get. And they're like, well, just say what I would. I'm really not gonna do that, Mark. I'm not gonna do that.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, I don't want to bias anybody.
Gareth Reynolds
I think he says, I like them all equally. I like them all equally. They're all really good.
Dave Anthony
So he says he's gonna close it. But then on May 25, he returns, hoping to open Elmwood for the summer season that only lasted a month, and he closed Elmwood for good on June 21, 1899, as a combination of his reputation, boycotts a Lot of competing resorts in the area. Sure. On January 7, 1901, the Syracuse Evening Herald reported Billy was, quote, done with Syracuse. Elmwood park was sold after foreclosure at the courthouse.
Gareth Reynolds
They did it. They got him out.
Dave Anthony
Got him. So Billy leaves town. He now refuses to talk to reporters about it.
Gareth Reynolds
Right.
Dave Anthony
One wrote that his quote, face is hollowed in as he walks with the feebleness of age.
Gareth Reynolds
That's not nice.
Dave Anthony
He's 51.
Gareth Reynolds
He's 51.
Dave Anthony
51.
Gareth Reynolds
And his head's cave again. His face is gone.
Dave Anthony
After New York once again scrutinized his wife's holdings, he said he was leaving the city for the west because, quote of the constant razzle dazzle.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
And yet he persisted on J. On May 30, 1903, he was arrested for operating an unlicensed saloon named the Emerald in the Bronx. At his trial the next day said he said the violation was due to a clerical error in which he applied for a hotel license accidentally instead of a saloon license.
Gareth Reynolds
Oopsies.
Dave Anthony
My bad.
Gareth Reynolds
But he. He's. He's worth a shitload, right? I mean, yeah, I understand why you just don't off.
Dave Anthony
But he. I think he is spending all his money for sure. Like he's. But. And I think buying. Buying Elmwood and having go bust. I think that cost him a lot.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
So this time he's unable to post the $500 bail and he gets held in Harlem prison. After he was released, he disappears from the public. In 1912, there were rumors he was living in poverty in a modest cottage along the East river at 125th Street. And then he was threatened with eviction by the owner of the property, which was the Pennsylvania Railroad Company.
Gareth Reynolds
Jesus.
Dave Anthony
They wanted to build a dock. No one knows when he died. Some say he died in Orlando when he was 77.
Gareth Reynolds
Oh, my God. Or what a nightmare.
Dave Anthony
Or. Yeah, right. Or it could have been.
Gareth Reynolds
Can you imagine that being the last place you have to be the worst. Oh, my God.
Dave Anthony
Jesus.
Gareth Reynolds
No. Like you'd crawl just to the city limits.
Dave Anthony
Or. They said he could have been the William J. McGrory who died at 70 in the Bronx. That was the last name, right? McGregor.
Gareth Reynolds
I believe that one.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, I do too. But his later years were marked by property disputes with family, including trying to declare his mother incompetent again.
Gareth Reynolds
That's how I want my last. That's how I want to end it.
Dave Anthony
Yeah.
Gareth Reynolds
Just arguing over land with my family.
Dave Anthony
Yeah. The last time you want to see your family is in court.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah.
Dave Anthony
So, yeah, so that was it. That's the story of Bill McGlory.
Gareth Reynolds
It's. I mean, I don't know how long this episode was, but if we measure it in. Waters. It was six. Luke Waters. Thoughts on the first Van Dollop, Dave?
Dave Anthony
I think it went fine.
Gareth Reynolds
I think it's pretty good.
Dave Anthony
Yeah, it could be done.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, it can be done.
Dave Anthony
We'll see how it sounds.
Gareth Reynolds
Yeah, we'll see how it sounds.
Dave Anthony
People will complain.
Gareth Reynolds
People will complain. But this was done inside of Steven.
Dave Anthony
I think people will be upset they couldn't see the Amish people in the fire. Yeah, I get it. Yeah. Facing forward. So for the Amish, you would need one sideways, out the side window. Sources New York Times, New York Tribune, the World Newspaper, Detroit Free Press, syracuse.com thegildedhour.com and the New Yorker.
Gareth Reynolds
Thank you, everybody. Love you. Love you a lot.
Dave Anthony
You're all good people, except the people who complain.
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The Dollop with Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds
Episode: Saloon Owner Billy McGlory (March 31, 2026)
Host: All Things Comedy
In this episode of The Dollop, comedians Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds dig into the wild and tumultuous life of William H. “Billy” McGlory, a notorious saloon owner in 19th-century New York City. As always, Dave shares the story—rife with crime, vice, and underworld antics—with Gareth reacting blindly, leading to classic riffing, dark humor, and insightful commentary about corruption, poverty, and the mechanics of vice in Gilded Age America.
Notable banter:
Gareth, riffing on Victorian crime tropes:
“The Oliver fan in me always wanted to be a part of that… hang out with an older man who showed me how to pickpocket… throw our fencing materials in a pile…” ([03:59])
Quip:
"If I’m gonna lose money, I want sex." — Gareth ([08:49])
“What are we doing here? Good Lord, where’s the justice? The judge was like, no, that’s insane. That’s not how it works…” — Dave ([22:34])
Memorable exchange:
“Once outside, they could literally be robbed of everything. And it was very common for them to be stripped naked.” — Dave
“I like that move… makes you not want to fight anything, you know what I mean?” — Gareth ([24:20])
“Why would you go there? …I don’t know, they’re robbing people pretty hard here, but at least the girls will do a foot job.” ([26:50])
“It’s amazing how long we’ve been trying to figure out… why everything’s so crazy… and it’s always just money.”
— Gareth ([42:38])
“He’s just changed… Like he’s punching them in the mouth, right? Like they came after him and he’s like, all right, how about I show you how it works?”
— Dave on McGlory moving the vice operation uptown ([41:26])
“Welcome to Peto [sic] Island.” — Gareth, shuddering at temperance resorts doubling as child-safe amusement parks ([54:01])
“He does that to elicit sympathy. And then they still do the evil thing… [like] Elon, Trump… they always posture like they’re going to have a change of heart.” — Gareth ([55:53])
The tale of Billy McGlory is a microcosm of vice, survival, and reinvention in Gilded Age New York—a world where criminality and commerce were deeply entwined, and where notoriety brought both fortune and constant scrutiny. Dave and Gareth turn this history into a wild ride through American hypocrisy and the roots of urban infamy, never missing a beat for a joke or a pointed observation.
For more wild stories from American history, visit the Dollop archives or subscribe for new episodes each week!