← The Dr. Josh Axe Show
The Dr. Josh Axe Show
The Neuroscience of Prayer: Here is What REALLY Happens When You Pray
00:56:00
Dr. Axe dives into the transformative power of prayer with Mike Lynn, co-founder of Pray.com—the world’s most popular prayer app.
Loading summary
Transcript89 lines
- [00:00]
A
Most people turn to prayer and turn to God in times of tragedy. You know, when you're at rock bottom, most of the time, people think it's presenting their requests to God, sort of like God sort of some genie in the bottle to present your request. Now, that's not really what prayer is about. You guys have done some research studies, actual research studies on prayer.
- [00:19]
B
We did. There's neurotransmitters in your brain that fire off chemicals. So a daily prayer practice is actually firing these things in your brain. It's making you feel better. Why is that happening? Why would God make something do that for me? Well, he made that. He built you that way so that if you talk to him on a regular basis, he's gonna improve your life.
- [00:36]
A
A lot of people don't feel like praying or listening to the Bible at first. And it's for the very same reason that most people don't feel like going to the gym and working out. What happens when you pray is that. Hey, everyone. Welcome to Dr. Josh Axe Show. I am your host, Dr. Axe. And each and every week on this show, we dive deep into the science and principles behind how to grow in body, mind, and spirit and take your health and your life to the next level. On today's podcast, we're gonna be talking about the power of prayer. And if you're a person that wants to heal, if you're a person that wants a deeper connection with God, if you're a person that wants to live the most meaningful life possible, if you're not spending time in prayer, you're missing out. And for me, my prayer life has been one of the most important parts of connecting with God, living a life that I am proud of, having success in life. I really attribute everything to God's favor in my. And today, I've brought on an expert to talk about prayer today. It's Mike Lynn. He's the co founder of pray.com and the most popular prayer app in the world. Pray. And the first question I'm going to ask for him. Well, first, I want to welcome the show. Thank you so much, Mike. Welcome.
- [01:51]
B
Yeah, thank you.
- [01:52]
A
How do I get a pray shirt like that?
- [01:54]
B
We have a lot of merch, I assure you.
- [01:56]
A
Okay.
- [01:56]
B
And we'll get you one, no problem.
- [01:57]
A
Okay, awesome. Well, hey, if anyone else loves this shirt as much as I do, you got to get a prey shirt.
- [02:01]
B
Yes, we'll get you pray shirts. Absolutely.
- [02:03]
A
So. So, hey, tell me this before we dive into. We're talking a little bit about the app and more. Today we're going to talk about the power of prayer. But what caused you to start a company that's all about prayer?
- [02:14]
B
Yeah, it came from tragedy, actually.
- [02:16]
A
Really?
- [02:17]
B
Yeah. So my business partner was the CEO of an aerial production company in Hollywood. And so they actually made, you know, they would film shows from aircraft. Well, his business partner in that company died in a plane crash.
- [02:32]
A
Oh, no.
- [02:33]
B
And it was actually in a Tom Cruise movie called American Made. And so my business partner never experienced somebody die so tragically so quickly. And I think most people that have a faith background, I'm Catholic, so it's easy for me to fall back on that. In very difficult times, I know exactly where to go. And I think if you don't have that, you're kind of searching for an outlet, a spiritual outlet you can find that can help you through difficult times. And that's what happened with my business partner, Steve. You know, his mom is Jewish, his dad's Catholic, and his grandma used to, like, drag him to church. And, you know, it wasn't really important to him. Faith wasn't really a big thing for him. He was more into, like, computers and sports. And when this tragedy happened, it was like on a Friday at, like, 4:00, and he didn't know what to do. He heard the news and he was just, like, stuck in grief. And he needed an outlet. He needed a place to go. And the genesis of pray.com is that event. And that event was there should be a place that he should know right away that is going to comfort him and be there and actually is proven to work. And if you have a faith background, like I do, you know, you know, prayer is important. You know, prayer works for you. It's why when you go to church and when you leave church, all of a sudden you have a smile on your face when you leave is because it actually does work. And so it got started because of this event. And somebody sent him a pastor's podcast. He's like, you should check this out. Like, this might help you. And he was kind of like, not into that Jesus stuff. I don't know if that's for me. And his friend, who's a Navy SEAL, by the way, was like, look, like I've been through some tough times. This helped me. Let me just bring that back to you one more time. Press play. So he started pressing, or he pressed play. And he started listening to this podcast, going to work and coming home from work, and he couldn't believe it. He's like, this is the most incredible piece of content I've ever heard. I feel like it was written and spoken to me about exactly what I'm experiencing right now. He goes, I'm in Hollywood. I'm making movies in Hollywood. And I didn't even know this genre of content, faith content even existed. And that's the path of how his life changed. And that's kind of how the path of my life changed because he was my friend and he told me about it.
- [04:51]
A
Wow, it's so powerful. I mean, you know, I can tell you, I think that most people turn to prayer and turn to God in times of tragedy. You know, when you're at rock bottom, I like to say, and somebody said this before me, I'm sure, but, you know, when you're at rock bottom, the only place you can look, you know. And so I remember when my. The time when I prayed the most fervently when I was the youngest, and that was when my mom was diagnosed with cancer. I was in junior high. And when she got that cancer diagnosis, I remember going to my bed every night, getting down on my hands and knees and just praying for God to heal her. And I remember there was a time where she. We actually had my grandmother come in. She was staying with us. And she said, go say goodbye to your mom because you may not see her again with her last chemo treatment. And then I remember going in afterwards and just crying and just praying fervently. And then my mom miraculously survived. And my mom's actually in her 70s today. This was like 30 years. I mean, this is so long ago. And that was such a faith builder for me is seeing God really directly intervene. And I. Yeah. And so, you know, prayer has been so important for me. And I think too. And I'd love to hear you talk about this. I think oftentimes when we talk about prayer, most of the time people think it's, you know, presenting their requests to God. And for some people, it turns out like it's sort of like God sort of some genie in the bottle to present your request. Now, you and I both know that's not really what prayer is about, but share on your, you know, share from your viewpoint. What is prayer?
- [06:29]
B
Yeah, I would think of it in terms of being as close to the Creator as you can possibly be because you're speaking to him. That's prayer. It's you speaking directly to God. And I think to your point, he's not a magician. It's not him to grant all your wishes. Like, he's there to listen. And you Know, he gave us free will, right. He gave us the ability to do things on our own. And you know, there's a term called providence and most people think it's called coincidence, but it's actually providence. And some of that providence is actually those things that you pray for actually happening and the timing on when those things happen and how they happen. And when it happens, you don't predict it, it just happens. You know, I have a Catholic background, so I had not been introduced to the kind of evangelical Protestant world of Christianity before. I had no idea what that actually was. And we didn't even use the word providence. Like I never even heard that before until I started prayer dot com. And so, you know, praying for me was the traditional by the bedside, like what I learned in like memorized CCD in Catholic school. Right. And when I started hanging around my co founders of Prayer.com, they really introduced me into a new way to pray, which is, you know, pray without ceasing. And it's, it's about you having a conversation.
- [07:54]
A
That's right.
- [07:55]
B
And that's really what it is. It's, you're having a conversation and he's listening.
- [07:59]
A
You know, growing up, half my family was Catholic and half was Protestant. And it made for some, my grandma and my dad's mom and my mom would have some anyways, big disagreements about certain things. But anyways, all that being said, there was a, you know, there's a lot of. There was like, my grandmother was an amazing Catholic woman, just a fervent prayer. And so was my mom. I mean then I had a grandfather who was just incredible prayer. He would go up to people, he'd put his hand on his shoulder and he loved to be 96. He was a World War II Navy veteran, just an amazing guy. But he was such a powerful prayer warrior. And for anybody that's ever had somebody who was like this powerful prayer warrior pray for them. It is such a transformative experience. It's such a powerful experience for so many people. And one of the things that I will say about my grandfather and about other people I know that are very close to God is their prayer life. Is that there's one big thing that you said here that I just want to point out that prayer is not you just speaking to God. It's a two way conversation. And I think for some people they may be it's a different way of hearing than obviously this sort of audible voice. You know, majority of the time outside of a few, you know, sometimes in history when God has Done that. But for the most part, it's that still small voice. It's a similar voice to your conscience, and it's in that it's also looking for this providence to where you've prayed for things. Then be on the lookout. Be aware. God is trying to do things, orchestrate things in terms of. And he doesn't always answer the way we want, and sometimes he doesn't answer it at all in the way we think, because we've all prayed for people who have passed away, even though we were praying for them. What are your thoughts on. Yeah, yeah.
- [09:48]
B
And, Dr. Axe, I think about, you know, the times that we say coincidence. Right. And the reality is it couldn't possibly have ended up this exact way unless it was meant from. For it to happen from him. Yeah, Right. It couldn't possibly have turned out like this. It's too much of a coincidence. It's beyond coincidence. And, you know, when we started this company eight years ago, I didn't know how many of those providential moments I was going to have. I didn't know what it was. And it keeps happening over and over where you're just like, this is not possible. These 10 things can't all fall in a row for it to be perfectly happening at this exact moment. And when you experience that, you have your eyes open to it because you're allowing yourself to realize that that's actually what was taking place, is actual, real providence taking place. And that's been an incredible impact on my spiritual life. And we have those interactions within our company all the time. We hear it from the people that use our platform who specifically write to tell us, like, these things are happening to me, because now I'm praying on a regular basis. And I think that's the component that, you know, is the most rewarding for me is that I get to hear feedback from people that are having a, you know, constant, consistent prayer life, and everything turns out to be much better experience for them. And, of course, there's challenges in life. Of course there's going to be tragedy in life, but your ability to be resilient through those things because you have a communication with somebody who's created you. I mean, how special is that you can talk to the person that created you or the being that created you? And I'm just, you know, I'm very blessed that I get to do this, because I was sitting behind a desk eight years ago managing people's money, and I thought that was the path for my life until a providential thing happened. And I Met my business partner randomly at a conference.
- [11:44]
A
Wow.
- [11:45]
B
And so I think if you let yourself go a little bit and you open your mind up a little bit and you try a daily prayer practice, and it doesn't have to be on a digital prayer platform, by the way. You don't need a digital prayer platform. We want to help you by having a digital prayer platform that we can guide you through it. But if you have a regular, consistent practice, you will start seeing these things happen, and you'll be able to recognize it for the first time. So that's. I think, the exciting thing about diving into a daily prayer practice is things will start. You'll start realizing how it's actually happening because you're around it and you recognize it for the first time.
- [12:23]
A
Yeah. So one of the things that I've talked about a couple times on my show, and I just think it's so important, is that people have resources and mentors and people in their life that are guiding them into spiritual growth and into the truth. And I was listening to a recent lecture and one of the. There's a psychologist and a pastor, Jordan Peterson has done the series on Exodus and on the Gospels, and he has a couple members from Cambridge and just some really brilliant, you know, brilliant theologians and people. Bishop Barron is on there and Jonathan Peggio and. And one of the things they talked about is the biblical literacy of today versus 50 years ago. They said if you would go to a school like Harvard or Princeton or a lot of these Ivy League schools today, they said that they believed that less than 10% of those people know the biblical stories. And Jordan Peterson said, because he was a professor at Harvard, and so he said, he said, you know, when I first started lecturing there, more than 50%, most people did, they knew the story of Jonah. They knew the story of Abraham, of parting the Red Sea and Moses, of Jesus feeding the 5,000, they knew those stories. He said, Today it's probably 10%. And to me. And he also talks about. Real wisdom tends to be more of a narrative in your head in terms of, you know, you heard the story of a biblical story, and now you have a frame of reference of why you should be generous or why you should honor your father and mother, why you should pray about certain things. And I also remember growing up, I was always at church for, like, three hours because we always did church and Sunday school, both every Sunday. I don't even know if most churches have Sunday school today. The reason I'm bringing this up is that we are exposed less in School. I used to be in the school system. We are exposed less to God now in the biblical principles than ever before. And we're spending also. What's part of exchange for that is more time on social media apps. And if you're going to spend time on a social media app, let's spend some time on pray.com. let's spend some time doing something where you're growing. I had somebody, there is a Bishop Barron was saying this. I was watching a sermon he was doing, and he said, I've heard people tell me that it would be impossible today for somebody to meditate for two hours. Which is what. There's a group of monks he was talking about, and they meditate on the psalms. Two hours every single day, this particular group. And he said, no, actually you could. He said, let me see your phone and how much time you spent scrolling on social media today. So I think pray.com and the prayer app, pray app is so needed today for people. What are some of the things that you've heard from people, especially like maybe Gen Z, millennials and some other people, in terms of, you know, how having this app and access to their app has changed their life?
- [15:22]
B
I think it's education, number one. I think back to your point, there's just not enough education about one of the greatest stories ever told legitimately. It's the greatest book that's ever been written, has the most copies ever printed for a reason, because what's inside it is absolutely incredible. And the fact that only 10%, I don't know the exact number, but seems, it seems logical to me really understand the biblical stories and teachings in it is. It's actually sad. And I think it actually, if you look at the environment of mental health in the United States and really globally, I think there's a component there that, you know, faith has always been a healing aspect spiritually. It gives you resilience. It reduces stress and anxiety. Those things are actually proven. One of the things that we've done is actually proven that. And, you know, not having those stories readily available to understand that what this, you know, what is the parable of this whole thing. I think there's a component with the younger generation who are used to seven seconds of quick information to get to the next topic, that having the ability to just sit down and relax and listen to, you know, a story from the Bible is really lost. And because they don't teach it in school, because, you know, attendance in traditional churches is dying in the United States. Yeah, we're down 20% in our pews. But the good news is, is that people are okay with hybrid church. And what is hybrid church? It's a combination of physically showing up and the digital experience when you're not there. And so we taught ourselves through Covid that it's okay not to show up. Yeah, everything will come to you. And I think that's kind of the Gen Z mindset is that, well, if everything is going to come to me, then perfect, and it needs to come to me in a way that I want it. And if you go to pray.com, we've created those stories in a cinematic way. The exact stories you're talking about, you know, and Noah's ark and all the, you know, Cain and Abel, those stories. We've done it in a cinematic way with, you know, professional voiceover actors and actresses, you know, Disney stars who will actually sit down and tell you the story in a way that is of high quality. And I think that's a component that's very important because there's a lot of content out there. And when you're, you know, younger, you want it quickly, and it has to be really good because there's so much competition for it.
- [17:57]
A
Yeah.
- [17:58]
B
And, you know, congratulations on the success of this program. You've got really great content, and that's what people expect now. And so it costs us a lot of money to create really good content. Yeah, we needed the Hollywood experience to even do it. And I think that's where we've found a lot of ground, is that if you make really good content, and by the way, you know, easy it is to make great content on the best stories ever told in the history of, you know, the world. Yeah, it's. It's actually not that hard. And, you know, people read the Bible every single year. Some people just read it from the start to the end. Start to the end. And, you know, the Bible is hard to read. If you read it from the, you know, King James Version, actually, it's pretty tough to read. So why not break it down, make it easy, make it, you know, compact and conservative.
- [18:46]
A
And the other thing that I love about your app, by the way, which is so amazing, is that you guys not only have the scripture written, you know, somebody can get the pray.com app, they can have the scripture read to them. But then you guys have pastors and priests and experts then share what it means for them. And I think that that's something we're missing in the world today, too, is that, you know, the Bible, I believe, was meant to be read somewhat individually, but also in a group and also to be chewed on and fought over and explained. I mean, you're supposed to have a relationship with, I think, about the word Israel. It's we who wrestle with God. There should be a wrestling with the text and with the truth there to get to the truth. And so I love that you guys have that in your app to where it's not just. It's multidimensional again, it leads people in prayer, it allows people to listen to these amazing lectures and sermons and educational content. And the Bible can be read to you on this app, maybe even in the voice of James Earl Jones or whoever, which I saw.
- [19:54]
B
It's pretty special to hear his voice, you know, read the New Testament. It's a pretty wild thing to happen. And I think to your point, who are we to say that we're the best publisher of how the Bible should be, you know, interpreted or read to people? Who are we to say that, you know, there's incredible voices that, and theologians that have done this, you know, decades and decades and decades longer than, you know, you know, we've been working on pray.com and why wouldn't we have their voices on our platform? Who do we think we are? That we're the best storytellers possible. And so I think that what makes our, you know, it makes it a platform, right? It makes it a platform for people who, you know, I might be really excited to hear a younger pastor tell me about his life and how, you know, the Bible's impacting him on a daily day basis or, you know, if I'm in, you know, the twilight of my life, and I can relate to an older pastor telling me like, hey, you know, you, you lived a rich life. You know, you're going to meet your maker. Like, that's a different, you know, person that I can relate to. So I think the person talking to you about it and the more you can relate to that individual, the easier it is to consume it. So having a platform of different voices, you know, making sure that it's Bible based and remaining true to what the Bible actually says is important as well. And, you know, we're just fortunate to have, you know, really impactful people that you may have heard of, like Drew Brees or Dr. Phil or, you know, these different voices who, you know, might attract you just to take a listen because you're like, oh, it'd be interesting to hear Darth Vader, like, read Genesis. You know, I'm willing to listen to that. And that's what makes it fun for us because we don't know who's next. Like, we don't know what voice we want next or what, you know, what it could be. So, like, we'll do a kid's Bible story and it'll have the same, you know, actress from like the Frozen as an example. Like, wouldn't that be interesting to hear, you know, her voice, you know, actually read some Bible content to, you know, Bible stories to our audience. So it makes the consumption of the content easier when you feel the connection to the person saying it.
- [21:55]
A
Well, you know, I think, I think this is a great thing to do with kids too. I mean, one of the things Chelsea and I do before bed, you know, we may start using the Pray.com app with some of our education of our daughter, but we have a four year old, you know, at bed, we have these books that are very simpler versions for four year olds of the biblical stories. So we sit down with her every night and we go through a different story and then we give her a short quiz, which she likes. At the end we'll say, hey, who parted the Red Sea? Okay, who had the water dumped on them and were swept away at the end? The Egyptians. And so we do this with her because we really want her to know and understand these stories because they are God's word. And she can then apply and use these principles as that narrative as she decides to make, as she makes decisions in the future. So I love, love what you guys are doing there. I want to talk a little bit more about prayer and I want to say this. We have a lot of people on the show here who are really hungry to grow in their health and grow physically healthier. And also a lot of people who want to grow and a stronger mindset become more mentally resilient. Also a lot of people that want to grow spiritually. And, you know, I had a physical health battle about two and a half years ago, three years ago, where I had a spinal infection and I didn't walk for an entire year. And I was told by a doctor that I may be permanently disabled and I could die. And so I had a time where, I mean, I had about 48 hours where I was. It was the lowest I'd ever felt in my life. And there were, I want to say this, there were emotions I had literally never experienced before. Like I'd never felt hopeless before or despair. Like, those are things like, okay, maybe I felt a little down for a day or disappointed or sad or minorly depressed, but I Never felt actually hopeless. And the thing that turned it all around for me was I prayed and I just said, God, I am so discouraged. I feel hopeless. I'm in the midst of, you know, this crisis, and I need a miracle. And I just felt like I heard from God. And again, it wasn't audible. It was just sort of this still small voice. And I just heard him say, like, walk with me and we'll get through this together. And it was such a powerful sort of image in my head and feeling like I was walking along the road with Jesus. And so the thing I want to bring up with that is. And then I just. I kept praying and praying and praying, and I had so many people pray for me. Like, it was amazing. I had a friend who's really connected to a lot of pastors, and some people love these pastors, some might think other heretics. But I just want to say, like, I had Benny Hinn pray for me. I had Bill Johnson. I had John Bevere. I had Lisa Bevere. I had. I mean, I could name a lot, like, you know, a lot of people. Just amazing prayer warriors pray for me. And then I started praying and asking God, Lord God, would you heal me? And you know what I prayed for? Instant healing. I never experienced that, but I did experience God sending people into my life constantly. Like, there was this person who was an expert. Actually, I had a friend call me. I didn't talk to him in two years, and he just said, hey, how are you doing? I said, well, actually, I'm having this issue. He goes, I have somebody you got to talk to. He's the world's leading expert in stem cells. I'm going to get you on the phone with him now. Like, add me on the other line, Things like that, that I was praying. God gave me another solution, another solution, and another solution. But I think that people need to have a level of spiritual awareness. And I also want to say this. One of the things I love about pray.com and the app is that I think in order to recognize the voice of God, reading the Bible or hearing the Bible read to you or hearing a sermon allows you to better recognize the voice of God in the truth.
- [25:47]
B
Yes.
- [25:47]
A
Because we all have these voices in our head. I mean, you have your own spirit within you that is telling you to do something. And it might be something that's really selfish or it might be down the wrong path. But if you really pray and listen and you listen to that voice of conscience, and maybe there's two voices, but there's One. And the Bible is going to help you recognize the right voice.
- [26:07]
B
And I think if you don't know why something happened, it was God. If you truly don't know, like, how could this all happen to me? Like, why did this happen in such a way that's like, I feel better now, or this turned out to be okay. And I was really concerned about it. It's because God worked. And you may not know why. It may have been somebody praying for you that you'll never find out. And I think that's, you know, when you think about prayer warriors and you talk about, you know, when, you know, I pray every day, but I also get to hear other people pray for me. And the real prayer warriors, it's almost like a. It's like a poem. It's like a. It's a beautiful poem of, you know, how to speak in a way that's basically God's voice to you. You can almost turn it back to him, be like, this is how you talk to me.
- [26:57]
A
Me.
- [26:58]
B
Even praying, the way that you talk was. It's so beautiful. And I think that's a component which we care about so much at pray is, you know, when you listen to the word of the Lord, you realize the healing benefits of just listening to it. And you do recognize it when you hear it out loud in the world. And those things are real things that actually do happen. And there's some science around it. And I think that's a component that, you know, we. We shouldn't get lost here, is that daily prayer practice does change the gray matter density in your brain.
- [27:30]
A
It changes you. You know, actually, I just had Daniel Amen was on the show, and he's the world's probably leading expert in brain and neurological health. And. And he was sharing with me that if you watch the news in the morning, later on in the afternoon, your anxiety is up by 27% on average just from watching it one time there in that day. But if you think about the inverse there of if you are praying in the morning or listening to a sermon or on the prayer app, it's probably going to be at least 27% of less anxiety. And I can tell you, I mean, if there is something that happens, and anybody who spends time in the Bible will tell you this, you can be in a state of anxiety if you go and listen to or pray through or read the psalms. I mean, you can feel the presence of God. You can feel your anxiety and your nerves diminishing very quickly.
- [28:20]
B
And, you know, we're an environment and what I love about you is science is important. It's important to us too. And you guys have done some research.
- [28:28]
A
Studies, actual research studies on prayer.
- [28:30]
B
We did this for the first time. You know, nobody has ever done it. We've never. No one's ever done a clinical trial of digital prayer applications to prove their effectiveness on your mental health. And we did three of them. We did a cross sectional study, and then we did two clinical trials, both randomized control trials. A little technical there, but the results are very clear that when you have a daily prayer practice specifically using our platform, because that's what we tested on, it shows an improvement in stress, anxiety and depression in individuals that use the digital prayer platform on a daily basis. So what is that actually saying? Could any content be used? No. Faith based content being used on a daily prayer practice allows for stress, anxiety and depression to be improved in those that use it. And we also found something very interesting in our base clinical trial is that marginalized groups like black and Hispanic Americans, because we were focused on the American population, had an outsized return on prayer when they used pray.com. so they had even better returns in terms of their mental health.
- [29:37]
A
You know, I have a theory of why that is, and I think it's due to when you read the biblical stories, the people that tend to be some of the most victorious people are people that were oppressed, they were people that were orphans, they were people that were maybe the outsiders or the outcast of society, or the second born, not the first. And for the Bible in its time, females having a huge, huge impact in transforming the world, which was very different at that time than other religious texts and groups. So all that being said, I love that. I mean that to me. And that's why if somebody really digs in and starts reading the Bible, I mean, it just in spending time praying, it's the most transformative thing you can do. Absolutely, is praying and read the reading the Bible.
- [30:26]
B
And I think people are nervous about it if you haven't done it before because you're like, I don't know. But that's what happened to my business partner. He was like, I don't know if I really want to do this. Like, you know, my business partner just died. But I don't know if I'm even comfortable pressing play on a podcast. It's like, let go a little bit. Like just, you know, there's something in your head that there's this wall, there's this, you know, there's this idea that that's not it's for other people. It's no, it's for everybody. Like. And the only way you'll know is if you try it. And again, you can press stop. What you'll find out is you won't because once you start going, you'll realize it and then maybe press stop for the day, but the next day you're like, huh, you know what I learned yesterday that just happened? Or I'm seeing that over there and I didn't recognize it until I heard that. And, you know, this story was written thousands of years ago, and you're seeing it right now, today. And the people that you know have a regular prayer life, they've known it always, all along. They've always been awake to it. And I'm excited for people, you know, to continue their prayer life and strengthen their prayer life. But even more, the people that, that are nervous or haven't done it before, it's like once you give it a shot and you just try it, you'll realize your life will be better and you'll see things that you've never seen before, which is very clear that this is God's hand in your life. And you'll start seeing those things. You'll see it on a regular basis. And it's incredible. It's such a gift for me, not only personally in my personal prayer life, but that I get to have people write in to say I'm actually seeing God having an impact on my life. I. You know, there's two stories that stick very clear with me was there was a police officer in Ohio who was going to go home and he was going to kill himself. Well, he had planned to kill himself and he got a text message from somebody when he was driving home and said, you should check this out. And it happened to be the pray.com application. So he opens it up and he writes back to us to tell us, like, I want you to know that this saved my life today.
- [32:38]
A
Wow.
- [32:39]
B
And, you know, I'm not saying that we're a suicide prevention platform, but it happened at that moment. It actually did save someone's life at that moment. And the person, you know, felt called to let us know that that saved his life. And you know, one of another review that we got in that so impactful is, you know, woman had stage four cancer. She's in a hospital, she's on a hospital bed. And she wanted to write in to let us know that she's so happy that every single day she gets a daily devotional that gets read to her because she feels like she gets to hear the voice and the words of the Creator that she's going to meet very soon. And you have someone write that in and you're like, I didn't know what I was going to do starting pray.com, i didn't know the impact it was going to have and the spiritual impact. For me, just hearing other people say that it's helped them. And those are the people that just wrote in.
- [33:36]
A
Wow.
- [33:37]
B
I don't even know, you know, all the people that it's impacted them and who I'll never hear from. And that's the exciting thing about, about prayer is, you know, I'm not here to take credit. You know, for me, there's this thing called the, you know, the grand commission. And, you know, my job is to get this access to this, the word, to as many people as possible. And it's going to impact you in one way or the other. But you got to give it a shot. You just got to give it a shot and, you know, press play or, or go to your church or talk to somebody that, you know, prays on a regular basis. And what you'll find out is it can impact you personally and you will feel better and things may change around you that you didn't even know were going to change until you give it a shot.
- [34:21]
A
Yeah. You know what's so interesting is, is that a lot of people don't feel like praying or listening to the Bible at first. And it's for the very same reason that most people don't feel like going to the gym and working out or doing other hard things. Is that what happens when you pray or you have a really hard workout is. Is that you change, you become different. There's something to where neurologically, I think where we say, I want to be comfort, and that means I don't change. So when you're thinking about the immediate right now, it's like, I just want to be comfortable. I don't want to leave the house. I want to stay in my pajamas. I want to, you know, and there's a time for comfort. But for the most part, if you want to get to the end of your life and say, I've ran the best race possible, I've done the most with my life, is you want to change, and you want to change towards the good, and prayer will help you do that more than anything. Change you for the good, make you more like Christ. I mean, when you're reading the Bible, you're constantly reading about Jesus going off to pray, you know, and you're reading, you're seeing a very similar thing with every prophet, every saint, every priest. You're seeing them go and connect and pray to God. And it's amazing to see.
- [35:38]
B
I mean, yeah, there's, you know, there's neurotransmitters in your brain that fire off chemicals in your brain that make you feel better, right? There's these things in your brain that you don't even have control over it. So a daily prayer practice is actually firing these things in your brain, and it's making you feel better. And it's like, why is that happening? Why would God make something do that for me? Well, he made that. He made that reaction on purpose because he built you that way so that if you talk to him on a regular basis, he's going to improve your life. He put that in your head like he. He built you that way. So you praying. He's rewarding what he built. And, you know, I. It's like when you work out, you work out after a stressful workout, all of a sudden you have this energy. All of us like, how did I have energy?
- [36:28]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [36:28]
B
And you feel great, and you're in a good mood. And by the way, you know, you're getting other people in good moods because you're in a good mood. And all of a sudden we're, you know, we're leapfrogging to everybody that we're touching, and everyone's in a good mood. You do that with daily prayer. You know, if I pray every day, and I'm literally changing the gray matter density in my brain and these neurotransmitters are going off, then I feel good. And when I feel good, I got news. Whatever condition you're in, I'm going to make you feel better. I'm going to lift you up just a little bit. And if you're a little bit better, guess what? You might treat your spouse a little bit better. You might. Might treat your kids a little bit better. So there is a true power of prayer, and I love how you started the show off in that way, because there's a lot of power. There's. There's an incredible amount of power. There's the power to change your own life, and there's the power to change other people's lives that are just around you, because once you change yours, everyone's going to get impacted and you don't even realize it.
- [37:20]
A
Mike, I have a practice that is. I mean, profoundly changed my life. And by the way, this goes all the way back to college. When I was in college, so I grew up. I went to a Christian school through eighth grade. Then I went to a public high school. And then my first couple years of college, I sort of. I don't know, fell away from my faith or really didn't focus on my faith at all. And I kind of had this thing in my head for a couple years where I thought, I'm trying to think how to say this, but something like, christians aren't fun. That's probably the best way I could say it. And then I realized, I don't know what made me start thinking this or believing this lie. And then I had a time my junior year of college where I just was feeling so empty because it's like I knew what it was like to have God in my life. And then I had two years of just not having God in my life and not having that conversation, not praying, not reading my Bible. And when I finally went back and just. I remember just praying, I got on my hands and knees and said, God, like, I need you. I feel meaningless, like my. You know. And on the outside, everything would have probably looked great, but I just had. I just was not fulfilled. And I really felt like. And so what's crazy is I prayed. I said, but, God, like, I don't feel like I have any Christian men or friends in my life right now because I joined a fraternity and it just wasn't. They weren't real friends. And so I ended up saying, this is what I prayed. I said, God, would you send a flood of great Christian men into my life that can help mentor me? I can connect with, grow with, have fun, you know. And three days later, I saw this flyer, and it was for this Christian event. It was called the Rock. It was a campus ministry at the University of Kentucky, which is where I was. And I showed up there, and there was a time of praise and worship. Somebody gave a talk, and then at the end, the most random thing happened. So somebody said, are there any Sigma Chi's? This is the fraternity I was in, in the audience or people here. And there were probably like 100 kids there. I was the only one that raised my hand. And he goes, I'm going to talk to you after.
- [39:25]
B
Okay?
- [39:26]
A
And this is a pastor. His name is Brad Waller. He's in Missouri now. He's a pastor there. And he ended up saying, hey, this is like, hey, I was this in college, whatever. And he said, hey, I'd love to connect with you. And hey, I'd love to Invite you to church. And I went with him, and it was crazy. It's like, the next week, I showed, and he's still a friend. I mean, I've talked to this guy anyways, we're still friends 20 some years later. And then I ended up the next week going, and I had a guy, and I was in a conversation with him. He said, hey, I'm starting a growth group. Do you want to be in it? And I was like, sure. And actually, that guy was in Nashville now. I'm still friends with him today. And so I found this amazing group of guys, and it was like, boom, immediately. And since then, God has flooded amazing Christian mentors and people in my life. I mean, I've had so. I mean, I could list off the people. Some are well known, some are not well known, but amazing. Just Christian people that have just flooded into my life. And so that, for me, was just the testament of the power of prayer, but also of reciprocating, of once I prayed, the thing going and being on the lookout to go and know that God is doing something and acting on my behalf because he's a perfect father.
- [40:37]
B
And I wish your experience would happen more often. I think what's happening today when you send your kids to colleges is there's this secularism that permeates that. You know, that same thing happened to me, Dr. Axe. I was not focused on my Catholic faith in college, and everything around me has to do with school and sports and parties and fun.
- [41:03]
A
Yep.
- [41:04]
B
And, you know, it certainly wasn't, hey, it's Sunday morning. We're not going to church. Like, who's coming to church with me? No one's talking about that. And you had an experience, which I hope everyone can have, which is, if you fall away from it, can you find your way back? Is there a way to find your way back? Will you have a moment that you had where you're like, actually, I think I'm just going to pray right now. I'm not sure what's going to happen, but I just need. I feel compelled to do it.
- [41:33]
A
Yeah.
- [41:33]
B
And then everything kind of lines up and a domino happens. Right. And I'm just concerned that we've pushed the idea that, you know, these institutions have been removing the faith component for, you know, little by little.
- [41:49]
A
Well, what's crazy is when you look at most of these, the most prestigious universities in America, again, Princeton's a great example. Harvard, I mean, you know, they were founded by Christians, and many of them started as, like, you know, you know, with their theological and their seminary parts of them were their main part of their school. So when you look at the. It's sort of of crazy how they've gone from being Christian to so far left and woke and where they are politically.
- [42:19]
B
Well, here's what we're going to teach you and then you're going to go off and goodbye.
- [42:24]
A
And it's sort of about the full human. It was about God. Now it's, let's get you as far away from God as we can.
- [42:31]
B
It's very robotic, it's very cold. And I think it sets up for a lot of problems later in life, you know, and I think that has to do with the way that we've taught, you know, kids growing up and we pulled Bibles from every possible school there is. Right. And you know, there's an attack on being a Christian. I mean, the reality is there's 200 million Christians in the United States that identify themselves as Christians. 200 million, that's crazy. And who actually goes to church on a weekly basis? About 50 million. Right. And so that's who you'd say are, you know, religious. But people identify themselves as Christian, which, what is that saying? If only 50 million go, that means there's 150 million that are probably in the same spot you and I were, where maybe we fell away, but we still identify ourselves as Christian. But what are we actively doing to get ourselves back? And, you know, I pray that there's an opportunity where they can have that moment to pray or somebody prays for them and gets them to have that moment, they go, something feels wrong. I feel like I've lost my step here. And I remember how it used to be, or I know there's a resource out there and I just don't want to go grab it. Because if you were, if you have any faith background or you've been to church, you understand what that felt like and the groundingness of what that was on a morality perspective. And sometimes it's just scary to go back and just grab it quick because you don't know where to go to grab it. You don't know who to go to grab it with. And sometimes you don't even want to say it out loud. You know, I live in the Los Angeles area. The last thing you want to do is talk about your faith out in the open. You much more rather talk about like, you know, political things. And it's like. But here in Tennessee, if I talk political, like, no, let's talk about our faith first.
- [44:18]
A
It's different we're in the Bible Belt here. So.
- [44:22]
B
So I think the component of realizing that have you fallen away but you still identify as a Christian, what are the resources you can have that you can fall back on quickly? And I'm not saying it has to be pray.com, but it's an easy entry point because life you do is download an app. You know, there are other platforms than us and we're not saying we should be the only one. And you should explore all the avenues because something's going to click for you and when it does, you won't go back again.
- [44:50]
A
Yeah, yeah. You brought up schools and I've brought this up on the show not too long ago is that I remember looking at a chart of when the Bible in Christian principles were removed from the schools. And I'm trying to remember if it was 1962. That's what I have in my head. It was somewhere around there. And you look at certain other metrics around happiness and a number of other things and how it's sort of like.
- [45:21]
B
You know, exactly correlated.
- [45:23]
A
Exactly correlated with these things. And in terms of the decline of marriage and the decline of just a number of things. And to me, again, like with our daughter, we are super, super vigilant and my wife is a 10 out of 10amazing mom at discipling our daughter and we're doing everything we can to educate her and we're going to send her a Christian school because, well, we just think that every lesson that she has, everything from math to science to English, we want the Bible woven into it. We want it woven in. And so for us it's just, it's a, you know, and I was so blessed to go to a Christian school through eighth grade. Like my mom worked, I was at two jobs and she worked at that school in order to like the school I attended in order for me to have tuition. So she was my gym teacher at the Christian school I went to for, for, for that. And so because my parents just believed it was just so important and I'm so glad because I was able to learn those Bible stories and some of those things. But like there's a lot of adults too where if you don't know these, it's not too late learn them now. I mean, here's the thing, if somebody would go and devote, let's say you get, you know, you go to the pray app, pray.com and you listen while you're driving to work. I think the average work drives 22 minutes, something like that. Your average 30 minute TV show about how long it. It lasts. 22 minutes. If you did that for an entire year, you would know most of the biblical stories.
- [46:53]
B
And what if your kids are in the car when you're listening?
- [46:55]
A
Wow.
- [46:55]
B
You know, there you go. What if your spouse is in the car while you're listening? Hey, I just want to check this out.
- [46:59]
A
Can I tell you another thing for dads out there and for men, I saw this study around how if the father comes to faith, the percentage of time the entire family comes to faith, it's something like 90%, like 92%. Like, it was incredibly high versus if it was someone else. It's not as. And it's not to say it's not important, but just statistically.
- [47:18]
B
Yep. Because it tends to be the hardest one in the family to commit. I mean, you know, women will drag their spouses to church. They're the first ones to reach out and go, you know, we even seen that in the demographics of prey.com, we skew more heavily towards women, and they tend to be open to and gravitate to spirituality faster, earlier, and easier. And men tend to be stubborn and kind of be dragged into it until they realize how beneficial it is. And they go, oh, okay, sounds good. And it makes sense, because if you get the last stalwart who finally is going to go, all right, let's do it, and he goes, oh, this is an amazing thing that. Just that we should be going to. On a regular basis, everyone's going to toe the line as well. Everyone's gonna go. That makes sense. So I. That. That totally makes sense to me.
- [48:10]
A
Yeah.
- [48:10]
B
In terms of, like, if we can get the men to go, it'll. Everyone's gonna fall in line anyway. If we get the women to go, the women's got to drag the husband there, you know, and, you know, we shouldn't have to drag anybody. We should introduce it into a way that they can feel comfortable having, you know, that interaction for the first time.
- [48:27]
A
Yeah. I have another belief around why part of this is as well, and I think it's because churches today have become so soft, and it's sort of like, you know, from, like, a political stance.
- [48:38]
B
Or from, like, a teaching stance or everything.
- [48:41]
A
Both of those. Yes. But everything. I think they've become, you know, a lot of. A lot of churches, and I believe it's. I believe it's across the board, especially Protestant and Catholic both. I think it's where it's like, don't break the rules, and we're going to lower the Bar to where you say a prayer one time, and that's all it means to be a Christian versus Christ. Said, follow me. Pick up your cross and follow. I mean, there was like, he's calling his disciples to live this radical, extraordinary, selfless, amazing life and literally change the world.
- [49:11]
B
You're so right.
- [49:12]
A
And for me, like, I like to think of myself as somebody who, like, again, like, for me, I would just. I want to get at the end of my life and be proud.
- [49:20]
B
Yeah.
- [49:20]
A
To say, you know what? I poured out my entire life and did something meaningful. And for me, if I have a church and the message is, hey, we've lowered the bar, we keep lowering it, and all you have to do is show up here and you don't have to change. That's not inspiring to me. I'm not going to show up. Like. John Maxwell wrote a book called the 21 Irrefutable Laws of Leadership, and he talks about the level, you know, are you. Where are you on the scale of a level one to 10, where he says, if somebody is a level three leader, then they're not going to attract level seven leaders or nine or 10. And so the highest level of leadership are those people that have the coaching and nourishing mentality where it's like, I'm calling you to your highest level of potential possible, asking you to sacrifice and give it all. And, like, I know from the men, I know that I am most closely connected to all of them. They want to do something meaningful and big, and they're warriors. They want to fight a fight.
- [50:16]
B
Yep.
- [50:16]
A
And so that's. That's not what most churches are calling men to today.
- [50:20]
B
You've nailed it. The. The bar is so low that it basically is to this point. You don't really have to commit much. And when you don't commit much, is there any value to anyone? Just psychologically, if I don't have to commit really anything, and there's no real consequences because no one's going to care if I'm there or not, why am I even going? And I think. I think part of that had to do with the declining. You know, it's. It's almost like a cycle. It's like we've got less people in the pews, so let's make it easier for people to come, and we'll water it down to the point where anybody can come and there's no real thing that you can do that's, you know, sinful or wrong or bad. And so maybe we won't touch topics that are clearly not biblical like that are clearly biblical topics. Maybe we'll not talk about them very much because I just want to include everyone I could possibly have. And by the way, we do want everybody to include everyone, but we also have to these, these principles that are very clearly written in the Bible that we're afraid to make very clear. This is actually what it says and this is how we're going to live. And you should join up on this. But if you make it too, too easy, then it becomes, well, well, if everyone can do it and it's super, super easy, then is it really worth doing?
- [51:29]
A
It's so good. You know, Dietrich Bonhoeffer wrote a great book called the Cost of Discipleship, and he refers this to as cheap grace. It's cheap. It's not worth anything. To your point, it was such this. It's not. There's. It doesn't feel like it's a value versus when you're reading in the Bible they're talking about it's a pearl of great price. Sell your field, sell your house, sell everything to just get this one pearl. And you think about the model that Jesus gave. It wasn't this lower the bar. I mean, if you go and read the Sermon on the Mount and go and read some of his teachings, like the rich young ruler coming up and he's like, sell all of your, all of your possessions and give them to the poor. And it said. And he walked away like downtrodden and depressed about that. But my point there is that he's calling you to something more. And if you're a person listening to this and you're saying to yourself, I want more. I feel empty. I feel like I need more. I want to have that true deep connection to my creator. Then the greatest prescription that I could give, that I know anybody could give, that's a Christian, is that pray. Spend time in prayer, spend time reading your Bible, spend time pursuing a relationship with God. And if you do that, I truly believe he's going to show up for you in an amazing way. And Mike, I want to say thanks for coming on today. You know, I want to encourage people go and download the Pray app. It's awesome. It has again, when you look at this app, it is multidimensional. You have the Bible read to you by again, some amazing people. You can actually pick some of the voices and people there. You've got some amazing pastors and teachers and experts that are teaching you what that word means in your life. And again, it's all on an app. And you're able to download this app. You can play it in your car in the morning. You can play it when you're making breakfast in the morning. You can play it as a family. And it's a powerful tool. So, Mike, thanks so much for coming on. Thanks for this incredible thing you've created. Any last words of advice for the audience?
- [53:35]
B
Well, thanks for having me, first of all. And I think the opportunity now for anyone listening to me is just go and pray. Just pray. It doesn't even have to be on the Prayer.com map. Just try it right now. If you're listening to this, just do it right now. See what happens. See what happens. You'll see it very clearly.
- [53:54]
A
That's so powerful. I'm actually going to end in prayer and praying for everyone out there today. I know that we have so many people who watch this broadcast are struggling with their health and other things in life. And so I'm going to pray here. Quick. Dear Heavenly Father, we just love you and praise you. You're such a good father. Lord, we know that you love us even more than we love ourselves. We know that you're a God that gives good gifts and you work all things out for our good, and we thank you for that. Lord, I pray for all the people right now that are suffering, Lord, I know that there are people suffering with autoimmune disease, with hormone imbalance, with gut issues, with chronic pain, with cancer. And Lord, I pray for incredible healing miracles for people right now, Lord, that you would touch them in a way as Jesus touched them and that you would heal them completely. Lord, I just pray for those people that are searching for their faith. Lord, I pray that same prayer that I prayed to you many, many years ago, that the people that are listening to this podcast right now, I pray for a flood of amazing influences and saints and Christian influences to touch them and support them and help them in transforming and becoming more like you and meeting their true needs, Lord, in that way, Lord. And I just pray for Mike and his team@pray.com I pray that this business would be blessed at reaching more people and helping them connect with you. Lord, we just love you. In Jesus name, amen.
- [55:13]
B
Amen.
- [55:14]
A
Well, thanks so much, brother, for coming on and just want to say, hey, thanks everybody here for tuning in to the Dr. Josh Axe Show. Remember, every week we're diving deep into both the science and also those principles, like biblical principles to help you heal, to help you grow in your body, your mind, and your spirit. I want to say thanks so much for watching. And by the way, if this episode really touched you, I want to encourage you to share this episode. You know, there are, as Mike mentioned, there are millions of people that don't know the truth of God's word. They have maybe fallen away from the faith and they want to it can be a powerful, it's the most powerful thing for them to be able to reconnect with God. So thanks so much for sharing this and being on mission with us. Thank you to all of you that are subscribed and we'll see you on the next episode.