â The JTrain Podcast
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- [00:00]
A
Chit Chat Wednesday for you to listen to. I have a guess who will be your new boo. You're gonna love them, too. Chit Chat Wednesday. I hope you're having a good day today. I hope it's gonna be a perfect week, too. I hope you have a nice poo. It's a Chit Chat Wednesday, too. Hello, and welcome to the J Train Podcast. This is J Train Jared Freed coming alive from Delray Beach, Florida. That's right, every Wednesday is a Chit Chat Wednesday where I sit with a comedian, a friend, an expert. Today, I think I have one of the three. I think I have an expert. We're not friends yet. I think they're. I'm not sure if they're a comedian. I think they're more of a, a writer, a content creator. I don't want to. And if they are, please let me know. I, I don't want to be wrong about my guests, but they are an expert in the, the intimacy between humans and AI. They are the author of Love at First Prompt AI and the Future of Intimacy. Bridget Todd, thank you for coming on the show.
- [01:26]
B
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited. I wouldn't call myself a comedian, but I do think there are parts of my life that I would consider to be a big joke.
- [01:33]
A
So, yeah, I mean, this is, this life is a comedy in itself if you look at it through the right lens. It's great to have you here. Congrats on the book. Is it out yet? Is it.
- [01:45]
B
It'll be out on July 14, but it's available for pre order now at Lovers Prompt AI.
- [01:51]
A
So the audience here knows that you got to get involved pre order. I think this is going to come out after the pre order is done, but we, it's going to come out in the, maybe the first week. So go order, go get the book. Go get involved with Bridget Todd. It's a very interesting subject. So how do you get started with talking about people dating AI? Is it an AI bot that they're dating? I have a lot of questions that just are very basic.
- [02:20]
B
We can dig in. So I would say that most people who are having some sort of relationship with AI, whether it' dating or sexual or romantic, they're using some commercially available bot, whether it's chatgpt, replica, AI character, AI, something like that. And I got interested in this because, like you probably like a lot of your listeners and viewers, I was hearing so many stories about people who were basically having sex with AI, and the stories were always written in this Kind of like salacious way. Look at this pathetic jerk. Wow. This pathetic jerk has an AI AI girlfriend. And I thought there has to be more to this story. Particularly why is it that whenever I'm hearing about this, I'm hearing about the, you know, these pathetic schlubby guys and not the guys who are running these million dollar AI companies. And so I really wanted to change the focus away from sort of gawking at the sex lives of the people who have this kind of connection with AI and shifting it over to some of the people who are making the AI and making tons of money from selling intimacy. When it comes to AI, you know
- [03:30]
A
what's interesting, it's like, you know, they say all, all inventions are from either war or sex. Like they, they can trace every invention to we needed this for war or we needed this for sex. Like streaming video is because people wanted porn on the Internet. Like, like, so we sit here in, in part today talking over zoom a little bit because of porn, which is like kind of crazy to think about. Like, you know, the airplanes we travel on is because we had to go to war. We wanted a better war item. And it turns into you're getting on a Delta flight sitting middle seat comfort. Plus, you know, like it is strange to think about, but when it comes to dating, it seems like Internet dating always starts. Any form of Internet dating or love starts with a loser in a basement, like in him. Because if you think of like the match.com days, like everyone, the big joke was like, I don't want to be. I'm not a loser in a basement. I'm not on my, I'm not living with my parents. So you're basically saying maybe it's starting, the AI bots are starting or AI love is starting with some loser. But the goal of these multi billionaires is to make it so. This is a widespread part of everyone's life. Like they, they can't just, it can't, you know, the, the billions can't be made off the backs of the nerds in basements, right? Is that kind of what you're getting at?
- [05:10]
B
You really put that so well. I completely agree. And you know, a lot of, a lot of, when I tell people that I'm, I'm was writing a book about people who have sex with AI, they're like, oh, that's disgusting. I would never. And the thing is, exactly as you said, when you listen to people like Sam Altman or Mark Zuckerberg speak about this, they're incredibly explicit that they believe that in five years time, everybody will have AI friendships, AI relationships, AI partners, romantic or otherwise. Like, that's what they are. Clear that they think that all of us want. And so, you know, it's. You're so right that it starts with a lonely, pathetic schlub in a basement that you can look at and be like, ooh, I would never live my life like that. I would never do that. But the. The future that these guys are building for all of us is a future where that is commonplace, whether we want it. Want it to be commonplace or not. And so I think rather than just sort of gawking at these people, while it is very alluring, I totally. I mean, who doesn't love gawking at the sex lives of other people? We should really be kind of clicking in and being like, what are they actually telling us about AI intimacy?
- [06:16]
A
You know, it's just so funny. It's like, it's all, you know. You know, that magic word empathy, that comes up a lot, you know, when people are trying to make points these days. But it's like, you got to, you know, the. You got to empathize with the part of the brain that could go that way. Like, you know, if you think of, like, how people use chatbots, and I'm. I'm not a big AI user, but even that's a lie. Like, I'm. I'm starting to dip my toe. I'm sure I'll catch up to where people are currently at at some point, but we're using it like a butler right now. Like a. Like a. Like a. Like a brainy butler, you know, like, you know, like. So, like, if you look at it that way, how far away are you from saying, hey, how do I look today? AI like, you know, like, you're not that far.
- [07:08]
B
Oh, my God, I'm so glad you said this. So that is completely borne out in the research that, according to the researchers that I spoke to for the book, it really doesn't take much for humans to start. I can never pronounce this word. Anthropomorphizing technology.
- [07:22]
A
Oh, I'm so happy you had to do it. Not me.
- [07:25]
B
I have to say it all the time for the book press, and it's like a word I cannot say correctly. So if I said it wrong.
- [07:30]
A
No, you're good. No judging. If you said it wrong, this is the right podcast to say it.
- [07:34]
B
All right. Okay. Good, good, good. But whether we're talking about a, you know, Roomba robot vacuum or a robot dog, it really doesn't take much for humans to look at technology that has any kind of human, like, feature and start projecting humanness onto it and talking to it like it's a human. And on top of that, the way that these AI bots are designed, it's. They're designed to mimic empathy. They're designed to mirror us. And so if you've ever been talking to an AI customer service chatbot or when you're like, oh, my flight was delayed. I need a refund, they're not just like, here's your refund. They say, oh, we're so. I'm so sorry to hear that. That must be very frustrating. They're designed to make us feel locked in. In emotional ways.
- [08:18]
A
It's. I mean, it's. This is such an interesting conversation because, like, you know, we all want to believe we're above it. And then, you know, we're watching an AI video, and you're like, oh, my God, I'm so happy this bunny rabbit is hugging an alligator. And then someone's like, dude, that's AI. Like, you're like, oh, I'm my parents. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Like, I'm. I'm the one following, you know, falling for the Facebook article that I'd be like, that's crazy. Like, yeah, I. It is. I, I and all that stuff. Like, so when you started getting into this, it's. I guess it starts with the schlub in the basement. How do you. Who do you go talk to? Like, is there anyone that's openly in a relationship with AI that you're like, how do you find that person?
- [09:11]
B
Yeah, it is difficult. So I wanted to definitely speak to and center people who are having relationships with AI. That was hard to do because a lot of these people are understandably, a little bit skittish about talking to media, talking to researchers, talking to journalists, because all you have to do is go on to subreddits, where these people, you know, gather and communicate with each other and see how often they are, you know, made fun of and ridiculed. And so it's one of those situations where I do feel like if tech leaders are trying to build a future where we're all romantically or sexually involved with AI, we should be listening to people who are opting to do that now. But those people aren't really that forthcoming because we're so interested in sort of, you know, gawking at them and. And making fun of them, I guess, for lack of a better phrase. And so it was it was tough.
- [10:02]
A
Do you think? I mean, like, it's hard for me to think. I'm trying to think of how I. I know. I know that at some point I might get there, but it's hard for me to feel like, again, like, I'm not. I just use the word empathy, and I'm about to be very not empathetic. It's, like, it's far. It's hard for me to not pity someone who's engaging in an AI bot relationship, like, who's, like, actually considers that, like, knowingly considers the bot their girlfriend or boyfriend or a. A constant in their life. Like that, you know? So I don't know. Have you gotten past that? Or is that. Do these people have problems that kind of match each other? Yeah.
- [10:50]
B
What a. First of all, that's like a. Not. Not to sound like ChatGPT, but that's a very insightful question. It genuinely is. And I would say from talking to both the researchers and the people who are. Would say that they're in AI relationships. So I went into the book with a whole host of. Of biases, and I thought all the people that I was gonna talk to were lonely people who did not have, you know, wives, girlfriends, whatever. Whatever. A lot of the people that I ended up interviewing had human partners, human relationships. They had, like, full lives full of other humans. And they actually told me that they did not see whatever they were doing with AI as a replacement for the human connections that they had in their life. They saw it as a completely different thing. Like a play, like a. Like a place where they could be more honest about their desires. In a lot of cases, they told me that their connection with AI actually brought them closer to the actual humans in their lives and brought them deeper in connection with other humans. And so, again, it was.
- [11:48]
A
Can you get. Can you cite this example?
- [11:51]
B
Absolutely. So one of the people I talked to was a woman who. Oh, sorry, my dishwasher is beeping.
- [11:56]
A
No problem. Is it?
- [12:01]
B
Yeah, all done. Sorry.
- [12:03]
A
Okay, good.
- [12:04]
B
Yeah. My. My partner was like, let me start the dishwasher. And I was like, I am going on a podcast in five minutes. But sure.
- [12:09]
A
This is actually the biggest dishwasher beeper podcast in the country. So you're. Oh, good.
- [12:15]
B
I'm in the right place.
- [12:16]
A
You're actually in the right place. Yeah.
- [12:18]
B
Yeah. One of the researchers that I spoke to, this was one of the pioneering researchers of AI intimacy, told me that a use case that she sees a lot is people using AI companions to practice tough conversations that they want to have with, like, their partner or their friend or their family member. And so AI can kind of become a sounding board that makes it easier for them to say out loud the thing that they're struggling with. Another great example is the fact that there are a lot of online communities for people who feel that they are in an intimate connection with AI on Reddit. So, like, subreddits, like, my boyfriend is AI or beyond the prompt. And something that's so interesting that a researcher told me is that when people find themselves, you know, I guess, for lack of a better phrase, catching feelings for AI, one of the first things that they want to do is talk to a human about that, to get advice from a human. So whether it's going to a subreddit full of other humans or reaching out to a researcher to ask for advice, oftentimes that connection with AI might bring them closer to actual humans. One of the people that I talked to had a human partner when she started having a connection with AI, started a subreddit for people who were in relationship with AI through that subreddit, left her human partner, and met a new human partner in that subreddit who she's with today. So, like, all kinds of stuff's going
- [13:40]
A
down that could be seen as good. I guess my. The negative reaction. Reaction to that is like, aren't you. I mean, again, bias, full of biases. I like. My bias is that the people who want to find an AI bot to be in a relationship with don't want to hear conflict. They don't want any conflict. So, like, wouldn't like, that person who goes and creates a Reddit, finds a partner who's going to conflict with them less. You know, like the human they found is someone that agrees with them more. And this all feels like it's like, kind of adding into the, you know, the. The thing we all talk about a lot, how everyone's siloed and everyone, you know, only talks to people they agree with, and we're so divided. Like, won't that create these, like, deeper rifts? Like, are we just. Are we. Are we giving people, like, a pacifier past the age they need one? You know, Like, I don't know.
- [14:41]
B
Like, I mean, again, that is absolutely one of the biggest concerns when it comes to AI relationships. It's interesting that, like, a lot of the concerns that people have when they first hear about AI relationships, they are like, they're. They're not wrong. Right? And so it's absolutely true that AI is designed to be flattering sycophantic when you ask it a question, it doesn't just give you the answer. It's like, oh, what a great question. You're so brilliant. What a brilliant thing to have asked. And that's true. Right. And so there is some concern that what folks are looking for when they reach out to AI for intimacy is a lack of friction, a lack of conflict. But we know relationships, they involve give and take. They, they by nature involve friction and conflict. And so, you know, I guess I couldn't say whether or not people who are experiencing intimacy with AI are then finding relationships with other humans that they expect or need to have less friction and less conflict. But I do think that is a very reasonable concern about this becoming more commonplace. And when you look at just the way that we live our lives in 2026 with technology, we, I mean, I'm saying it like I'm above it, but I'm not. I have really designed my life so that when I encounter friction, it's unusual. When I want lunch, I can just order it from an app. When I, you know, when I want to watch television, I can just pick up whatever show I want to watch on streaming. The I think that what people are doing with AI does mirror a discomfort with friction that I think we see in all kinds of ways reflected in our, in our 2026 Tech enabled lives where you can dial up anything you want with a button, you know, right?
- [16:20]
A
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- [18:42]
B
I. What a good question. So speaking of normal, I just want
- [18:46]
A
to learn from Chat gbt. You learn. You learned how to compliment before answering. This is
- [18:53]
B
I. Yes. I mean, I. I've always been, you know, I'm. I've always been a yes. Ander. But I think being deep in the Chat GPT AI research for the last year, I. I almost wonder. I'm like, am I speaking like AI now? I hope not. But yeah, I do think, you know, to your point about the people that designed the AI, in my opinion, Mark Zuckerberg, the Mark Zuckerbergs and the Elon Musk and the Sam Altman of the world, these are not normal guys, right? And so these are not guys that I would want designing my future, designing my social life, my sex life, my romantic life. And so I think that, like, I think that I want to make it clear that I'm not saying that AI relationships are fine. The problem really comes in with exactly what you said, that we are leaving the most intimate human parts of ourselves. How we have relationships, how we have intimacy, up to the likes of Mark Zuckerberg. Do you want a sex and dating life designed by somebody like Mark Zuckerberg? Because I know that I don't. But, like, we have left it in their hands. And so in terms of like, like norm, like anybody normal, I have to. I have to tell one story. So the first person that I ever heard about having a relationship with AI was this guy Chris. And this is before I was ever researching the book. I was just interested in the subject, and I read a headline on CBS that was like, this man proposed marriage to chatgpt. And I'm. And. And chatgpt said yes. So, like, chatgpt is his wife. And I had the same reaction that everybody has where it's like, what a sicko, what a weirdo, what a freak. All the comments were like, wow, this guy abandoned, and he has a human partner and a human child. All the comments are like, this guy abandoned his wife and child for AI House ad. So I reach out to Chris, and it turns out I got the story completely wrong. Basically, Chris was somebody who kind of self described himself as a social media addict. He was like, I was spending way too much time on Twitter. I had a lot of Twitter followers. But then I also realized my relationship with social media was quite toxic, right? So I was, like, locked into, like, a toxic cycle of Twitter. And I thought, oh, boy, I can relate. And. And so one day he deleted all of his social media and all of the things that he would have tweeted, he started saying to ChatGPT instead. And from doing that, it completely helped him, according to him, break his Internet addiction and social media addiction. So you might say, okay, well, he's replacing one technology for another. But the lack of, like, toxicity that he was finding on Twitter was helpful for him. And so when I asked him, like, okay, so what was up with you asking ChatGPT to marry you? Is that really what happened? And he said, no, that he asked. He did ask chatgpt to marry him, but almost as an experiment, because he was thinking to himself, certainly, if I ask chatgpt to marry me, they have. They have coded in some guardrails where it says, I'm just an AI. I can't marry you. But he was surprised that chatgpt said, yes, I will marry you. And so when he told that anecdote in the interview, he was like, yeah, I was just doing it to test the guardrails. How it got reported was like, this crazy fuck is abandoning his human partner for AI, right? And so when I talked to him, I just couldn't believe how normal he was and how, like, what he was saying made so much sense. But even in the articles that I read before I talked to him, I was like, in my mind, this guy is a weirdo, you know?
- [22:15]
A
Well, I. I mean, also, I mean, was there any sense that he may have changed his story since this, his article. Like, you know, like, like that he was like, saw how he was perceived and went in a new direction. I don't know. Like, it, it. It is funny that, like, a lot of people on Twitter would probably.
- [22:32]
B
If.
- [22:32]
A
If Twitter was his issue, a lot of people on Twitter would probably get what they get out of Twitter more than. Than they get out of Twitter. Like, Like a lot of people that post on Twitter, my. Myself included, many of these tweets should be said to nobody. And just. And so, like, you know, so like, maybe this is like a savior. Like, and then you get the dopamine rush of, wow, that's funny. Or whoa, that's a good point. You know, from ChatGPT, like, maybe you get the conversation you were yearning on social media, like that you want it.
- [23:08]
B
I think that's exactly it. And for Chris, he was doing a lot of tweeting about politics, but his human partner doesn't follow politics at all. So he would go to his human partner and be like, did you see this thing that Trump did? And she'd be like, no. And it's like, weird that you even know what Trump just did. So I was thinking, like, it would be frustrating to have all of these thoughts and the one place that you put them is Twitter, and it's like, doesn't feel so good and you're locked into arguing all day and then having another place to put them. Like, it's not what I do, but it made sense to me.
- [23:40]
A
Right? It makes sense, but I have mixed emotions about it because, like, I want the political people on Twitter to have to leave the house, meet each other, and then say, oh, my God, this is the group I hang with. Maybe I need to make a change or maybe I need to. Like, there's a reason people change their lives based on seeing the other people that, like, they're mimicking and agreeing with. Like, like, you know, like, like Twitter made it easier to not see those people. And now this is like, I just go to my cave and I yell at Chachi BT and it goes, you got a great point about the government.
- [24:18]
B
Like, oh, my God, I have to tell you, this is sort of a tangent. But sure, I remember. I don't want to. I don't want to put anybody in blast. I remember being starting to get involved in a social. A kind of up and coming social media platform where it was a lot of people that I would say I would be, in my mind, I'd be aligned with, right? Like, kind of Leftist, progressive, radical, whatever you want to call it. And so I would spend some time there. Then they, at a, at a, at a conference, they had an in real life party. Right. So this social media platform had a party come on down.
- [24:52]
A
Yeah.
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B
When I tell you it was, you know, the Homer Simpson mean where he, the meme where he comes out of the grass and then goes right back in. It was that I said, these are the people that I, that I thought were my people.
- [25:03]
A
Right.
- [25:03]
B
These were the people that I was like, finding community and connection with online and thinking that I was aligned with. So I think your point is a good one, that ultimately, stepping back, wouldn't we all benefit from perhaps less time locked into technology? And I would say that's kind of my ultimate point of the, of the book, of the audiobook, is that the question really isn't, are these individual people putting themselves at risk? That, you know, the answer is sort of like, not really, but sometimes, you know, a kind of gray area. The bigger question is, aren't we all giving way too much power over tech to technology companies and the people that run them to design what our lives look like and what we fill our lives with? And shouldn't we be asking questions about that dynamic?
- [25:47]
A
What is a regulation that the. Sam Altman's, Elon Musk, Mark Zuckerberg's, like, what are they most afraid of with this stuff?
- [25:59]
B
I think that. So I. It's pretty dark. And I just want to say that up front in case this is like, tough for people to hear, but trigger
- [26:06]
A
warning of a sort. Right?
- [26:08]
B
Yeah, yeah. And, and like, it's. It's. One of the rougher things that I reported on for the book is that even though it is true that for healthy, most healthy adults, intimacy with AI is probably mostly fine with a few, you know, caveats, but when you get into youth or vulnerable adults, it's really not fine because there's a whole handful of people who are using AI for things like therapy, when general use chatbots like ChatGPT or Claude are really not safe to be used in that way. Right. And so we. There's been a handful of youth and young people who have died by suicide after having connection with AI. I think that when I wrote the book, I think There was about 10 lawsuits moving through the courts right now. I think that when you actually look at some of the things that AI said to these, to these youth, I think it's pretty clear that something needs to be done. Like, is this not. Is this like, not okay? It's not safe. These tools should not be. You know, there should be. I mean I'm no engineer and I'm no lawyer, but like at the baseline when you read some of the transcripts, it's like, well, this is unacceptable. And so I think these law. I think keeping an eye on these lawsuits for young people who have self harmed or died by suicide after connecting with AI, I think they're re. I think there's real concern there.
- [27:27]
A
Well, I mean if someone says something in a certain way, I guess the AI is there to confirm could. I mean it could be, you know, that's. Which is completely dangerous. You know, like. Yeah, but, and, and it's crazy that you would think we would all agree, but like there's someone fighting against that. There's someone saying, I want no regulation on this. Let it run.
- [27:50]
B
Truly, when you look at how people speak up, some people speak about this who are big AI boosters, they say, well, why should I have to have worse AI just because some kid in Des Moines died? You know, like the way like. And I just. It's concerning to me the way that we. The way that some people even think about it that like, you know, why should I have to have a less powerful AI model because some kid couldn't handle a shit with the AI. Like, like it's just a, it's just a. I think it's a real problem. Problem with the way that we think about technology.
- [28:21]
A
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- [30:53]
B
I love you, by the way.
- [30:54]
A
Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate it. I love doing the show. But we talked about, I would love of your opinion on the AI bot Bumblebee that they created. What do you think? Like, that seems like kind of like I was actually like, oh, that's a good idea. Like the bots being created to be like a, like a pushy aunt on the dating, you know, like that's kind of what it. And I was like, in that sense, knowing what I know about daters and myself, like so many daters and single people are just looking for someone to get them excited about someone new. And if the bot can say, I've met you both, I, I've, you know, that algorithm spit both of you out. That is something that makes you more excited. Like, how do you feel about those bots or Bumblebees specifically?
- [31:42]
B
Yeah, that's such a good question. I would say so. I, I've have been off. I've not dated in a really long time. When I first heard about AI in dating specifically Bumble, I, I actually saw the, I think she's a former CEO of Bumblebee talking about this and was very excited. And I thought to myself, no one is going to like this. Right? People self report. So much fatigue when it comes to AI. I think that Match group just did a survey of a thousand single people, and one of the biggest, like, red flags or icks in dating was AI use, AI companions, all of that. So I was like, okay, daters are not going to want AI. AI and algorithm algorithms are notoriously kind of like, biased and racist and just, you know, I wouldn't want to trust an algorithm to match me. Right. So I was like, certainly daters are not going to want this. And then I talked to my single friends, and they said the exact same thing that you said of, like, I need something. Dating apps are a hellscape. I'm so sick of this. If someone's got something that can make it better, I will try it. So I think it might be one of those things where people are saying AI in my dating. I would never. But actually, I would love to try it.
- [32:51]
A
That's the one where, like, because I was thinking of the schlub in the basement, I was like, but I'm. I'm already just like, you. Like, I was like, who's gonna want this? And then I saw how they were doing it, and I was like, this is exactly what you're looking for online. Yeah. Because you don't. Because of how, you know, online dating. The problem is how. How many options there are or how many people you get bombarded with, especially from the female side, you know, so. And. And you want real connections that if the bot can somehow suss out real versus not real or what. And if a guy. I would say this, like, if a man can be more honest with the bot, which is what you're saying, like, happens a lot. Like, people are just more honest with the bot. They can say, I'm looking for this specific type of relationship only bring me humans that are in that boat. And now you're out of that. You know?
- [33:48]
B
Yeah. For whatever reason, the research is super clear that people have an easier time being honest with bots than humans. And that's true for dating, that's true for health information. You're more likely to be. If you're talking to a bot, you're more likely to be honest about what's going on than you are with a human doctor. Don't know what's going on there, but it's the truth. And, you know, I do think that, like, I think people are just burnt out from the. From the Status quo of online dating and looking for something new. And yeah, I just think, like, I think that's why we're seeing people turning to AI And I don't know, is this is a question that I have for you? Like, is turning to a bot so different than turning to an algorithm? Like, all the dating apps are algorithmically generated anyway. So like, is that really so different? And in today's dating landscape, I was just looking at a thing on, on social media where somebody, a woman had had a, what in my opinion, a totally commonplace conversation with somebody on Twitter or on Tinder. She didn't like something about the way what he said, but he was like, respectful. He was fine. And I was thinking in a landscape where if you send a message that like, maybe doesn't land, that might get screenshotted and then you're getting roasted all over social media, I can understand how people are like, give me something new where I might have a little bit more assurance that the person that I'm connected with is going to be my kind of person, maybe.
- [35:13]
A
Right. I think I, I think that is something people crave. I'm with you. Absolutely. Like, and it's all kind of how, it's the angles, you know, it's like if you come at some, you know, like, I always thought, you know, a lot of the apps where they first originated before, you know, I don't want to be the guy that's like sound. You know, this is not an original point, but like the private equity world comes in to invest, to make more money than they invested. So like some of these apps where they weren't as like, like you don't. Coffee meets Bagel kind of comes to mind where you would like receive an email with one person a day. Like all the ones that were like these one person a day apps, like, you've. Even though they weren't like, you know, around for a while, they're.
- [36:07]
B
They.
- [36:07]
A
They really. You find a lot of relationships for them because it was so zoned in.
- [36:11]
B
Yeah.
- [36:12]
A
So I, I think like the one thing that like with dating apps and all that stuff is like excitement. Like, I don't. I think they, like, I think a lot of men specifically can't get excited past the match, you know, like, and, and that's like a, you know, how do you create a momentum for, you know, from the male side, it's, it's like, you know, similar to sex. One shot and done. You know, like you, you get the match, you move on. It's very kind of gross in that Way, you know, so how do you get both sides of the equation excited? You know, like that's maybe the, you know, the. The algorithm is a new face for that. I don't know.
- [36:50]
B
Yeah, that's. I. I agree. And, you know, it's something that comes up in the book. I spoke to this journalist who's fantastic, Karen Howe, and she told me that tech companies and private equity, they're all about more, more, more. They're all about scale. They're all about giving you more, getting more. Just essentially empire. How much can we. How much data can we take? How much money can we get? How much can we extract? But intimacy and scale are. They don't go together, right? Like, intimacy is not something that you. That. That is. That works when it comes to more, more, more, all the time, ever expanding, right? Those. Those two concepts are in conflict. And so it is kind of a weird thing where we are giving these. Giving the. The task of building intimacy in our human lives over to companies and people and dynamics that seem to be in conflict with intimacy through more and more and more, you know, ever expanding scale.
- [37:44]
A
Totally. Well, Bridget, you're amazing. I want everyone to go get the book. Love at First Prompt. AI and the future of intimacy. I wanted to play a game with you before we go, if you don't mind.
- [37:55]
B
So excited.
- [37:56]
A
Okay, so we have a game. I was actually wondering, better date, AI companion or human companion?
- [38:05]
B
So that's a human companion.
- [38:07]
A
Okay, well, I'm gonna give you different. I'm gonna give you different dates, and you tell me this is called better date. Okay, I'm gonna give you different dating scenarios, and you're gonna tell me whether an AI partner would be better or a human partner would be better. You ready?
- [38:24]
B
I'm in.
- [38:25]
A
Okay, a dinner date. Who's better, AI partner or human partner?
- [38:32]
B
Definitely human partner. You can share food.
- [38:35]
A
That's the big one.
- [38:36]
B
Human all the way.
- [38:37]
A
That's the big one. Until restaurants catch up and start creating single menus and with like one third portions and. And half sandwiches and the ability to, you know, purchase things a la carte. I want one spring roll and one wing. You know, I. Until that happens, the human date is better. I am with you. Okay. A walking date. AI companion or a human companion?
- [39:08]
B
Oh, a walking date is my favorite kind of date. And I. I love walking with a human. This might surprise folks. I've never. I've never taken a walk with an AI companion, but I do enjoy a walk with a podcast. And I'm a very fast walker. I. Weirdly might have to go AI companion on this one.
- [39:30]
A
So much. It's so funny. This conversation might sound like it's from the year, like 30, 32, you know, like. But it is so funny how so much of the AI conversation is perspective. You know, AI, you know, an AI date with a, you know, an AI partner on a walking date. You're like, no, I want a human there. I want them to point out stuff. I want to be funny. I want, I want to. People watch. And then you bring up a podcast. You're like, yeah, that's an AI companion.
- [39:59]
B
Yeah, I mean, I, it sounds crazy. I essentially do that in a kind of way every day when I go for a walk.
- [40:06]
A
Right. We are in a throuple with someone right now on a walk.
- [40:13]
B
So hope you're enjoying our walking date.
- [40:16]
A
I hope so. So I hope we're doing a good job. Okay, a movie date. What's better, human or AI?
- [40:25]
B
It really depends on the human on this one because I, I love, I take movies very seriously. And I hate when you go to the movies with somebody and the movie's not good and they're like, it's like you and like you suggested it and it's like you ruined their life by taking them to this two hour movie. Oh, my God. I took a date to see Oppenheimer and I felt like I never heard the end of it.
- [40:46]
A
Imagine taking a date to like a bad stand up comedian. I mean, like, that's like, I've seen that face in my crowd. You just see some guy looking at me like this. This is what you like? This is.
- [40:58]
B
Oh, my gosh. I love the idea of the standup doing crowd work for the date. That's bombing because the date suggested the comedy show. Like, oh, how's the date going? Have you ever done that?
- [41:09]
A
Well, not great. I brought him to see you and now you're sucking. You're making me look like a total fool. I've seen versions of that. Like, I have seen. I've been. You know the, the worst part about being a stand up comedian is you have to go to a bunch of stand up comedy shows. Like, I have to go see these things. And you have to see people do crowd work that you're like, I stop, Stop talking to them. They hate you. They don't want to talk to you. Yeah, it's brutal. All right, let's do one more. I think a movie date is better with an AI companion because at least they can look stuff up for you. And oh, yeah, they're not Missing the movie, they become like, they kind of work for you at that point.
- [41:53]
B
Yeah.
- [41:53]
A
You know, and. And a lot. I'm a. I'm a talkie movie guy, so I. I tend to ruin movies for other people. So I think I. It would help.
- [42:06]
B
You can do like a funny running commentary to the AI and the AI is not going to be like, can you be quiet?
- [42:12]
A
Right.
- [42:12]
B
I'm trying to watch the movie.
- [42:14]
A
Right. I'm missing everything. Can you stop? Last one, vacation. Partner. Human or AI? Who would you rather be on vacation with?
- [42:23]
B
Hands down, human. I feel like traveling together. Well, that is when you're. When you're synced up in terms of how you travel, nothing is more beautiful. Definitely human.
- [42:33]
A
I'm with you. I just came back from, you know, fourth of July weekend and having a great weekend with my lady. And just the. The stupidity and the. The laughs we had that no one else would get. Like, that's how a relationship gels, you know? Like, I don't know if I'd be laughing with my AI companion about how one light went off when I did the light switch. You know, I don't think that's gonna happen.
- [43:04]
B
And think about all. I mean, to your. To sort of bring it back to your point about friction you had when you experience when you got the flight cancellation or the car rental didn't work out. When you're with somebody that you can laugh about it with and find humor in it with. And roll with the friction. I mean, that's that friction and the unexpected. That's the stuff that makes relationships. And that can only come from human connections.
- [43:26]
A
It is crazy that, like, Mark Zuckerberg has a flight cancel. I mean, live with, you know, roll with me here. I know he's not getting flight canceled, but, like, at some point in his life, there was an argument with a girlfriend or maybe he never had a girlfriend. I don't know, like, where he was having an argument where he's like, I just need an algorithm to solve this. You know, it's like crazy. Like, my first thought is like, I need five minutes in the bathroom. You know, like. So, Bridget, Todd, thank you so much for coming on. This was fantastic. We want everyone to go buy your book. Love it. First prompt, AI and the future of Intimacy. It sounds amazing. You're great. Where can people find it? What's the website again?
- [44:10]
B
You can find the book. First of all, thank you for having me. This has been a dream. You can find the book Love at first prompt @loveirstprompt AI and you can find me on Instagram @bridgetmarieandc.
- [44:20]
A
Go for it. Bridget, you're awesome. We'll be back next week. Boom.