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The JTrain Podcast
Everyone Has the Same Opinion Now and It’s Weird! ft Jamie Lee - CHIT CHAT WEDNESDAY
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- [00:00]
A
Chit chat Wednesday for you to listen to. I have a guess who will be your new boo. You're gonna love them too. Chit Chat Wednesday. I hope you're having a good day today. I hope it's gonna be a perfect week too. I hope you have a nice poo. It's a chat Wednesday too. Hello and welcome to the J Train podcast. Before we get started, I am so excited for my new book, Walking Red Flag to come out next week, June 9th, and I want you to pre order the book. If you're not the reading type, that's fine. I'm not a big reader either. You're probably the listening type because you're here listening to this podcast. So I thought it would be fun to give you a preview of the audiobook. So today and every day this week I'm Gonna put a 16 minute taste test of the audiobook at the end of the episode. I don't know if you listen to every day. That's why I did it every day this week. Maybe you listen to one of the days and this is your first time hearing this ad. Maybe you listen every day and this is your third time and you're like Jared, enough already. I am so sorry for that. It's just this week. So just this week at the end of the episode is minute taste test of the Audi book. I want you to listen. If you haven't pre ordered, you can pre order it now. The link is in the bio. This episode. If you have a friend or family member or anyone that would enjoy an Audi book about dating or just about life in general, because the book is really personal stories and it's laughs every couple minutes on the audiobook and every page on the regular book. So this is a good opportunity to show it to them and maybe let them know about the book. And it's called Walking Red Flag. Dating advice from your favorite guy friend. If you're here already for my podcast, I'm sure you've heard about it from me and you're already sick and tired of it. This is one little tidbit for you to try and enjoy before it goes out next week. So at the end you're going to hear the beginning of the book. Sixteen minutes. That's going to get you a little, little wet. Your whistle for the book. And I want you to enjoy, send it, share it, share it with anyone you know that might enjoy the book and pre order it along with you. If you already have done that or this is your chance to give it a little try. And see if it's up your alley. So enjoy walking red flag at the end of today's episode. And enjoy today's episode. Welcome to J Train Podcast. This is J Train Jared Freed coming to you live from Delray Beach, Florida. That's right, every Wednesday is a chit chat Wednesday where I sit with a comedian, a fan, friend, an expert. Today we have all three. We have a comedian, we have a friend. I haven't seen them in forever, it feels like. And we have an expert in TV writing. They are an Emmy award winning writer for the show, Ted Lasso. Jamie Lee. Thank you for coming on the J Train Podcast. How are you?
- [03:19]
B
So good to see you. Thanks for having me.
- [03:22]
A
What's going on? Where are you? What are you doing? How are you? How's everything? It's been forever. We start this up, people don't know behind the curtain. I just get it going. We, we don't need to, we don't need pleasantries. Do it all in the air. We gotta, we gotta commoditize this conversation. We gotta get, we gotta monetize the convo. So I'm not gonna let anything get in the way. So how are. What's been going on?
- [03:45]
B
Everything's good. I'm in New York right now. Thought I would see you in New York. And then I find out you moved Florida.
- [03:51]
A
That's right. Delray Beach. I'm a be. I'm a Florida man. I am a.
- [03:56]
B
Do you love it?
- [03:58]
A
I like it. I like the separation of kind of work from, you know, from living space. You know, I could have done that by moving to, like, Westchester, I guess, but, like, my parents are 25 minutes away. I've enjoyed. Yeah.
- [04:17]
B
Oh, that's great.
- [04:19]
A
Yeah. So, like, that's been nice. You know, the hard part is trying to do stand up and, you know, I'm on the road so much that I was like, you know, I, I'll give up the two days that I'm in New York a week to have a little bit of normalcy. So that's been, that's been a nice part. Just like normalcy and just having a car, you know, I, I think, you know, New York can feel. How do you feel about New York? You're. I mean, you're in la.
- [04:45]
B
Well, I'm usually in la, so I'm very, very car centric.
- [04:49]
A
Yeah.
- [04:50]
B
Or centric kind of girl, usually. But I'm working on a show that writes and films in New York right now. And so I'm like fully walking to work every day. Walk like an hour and a half to work both ways. I'm like, yeah, I don't know, I'm, I'm really like enjoying that aspect of it.
- [05:09]
A
But yeah, I think New York, you know, if you, if you could play New York the way you wanted to, it's like you'd have a place there. Like, it's, I think if money doesn't exist and you had a choice in the matter, I think anyone who has lived in New York for a long period of time and goes in and out of it would be like, you know, that I, I, the thing that moving to Florida kind of shows you is people's insecurities of moving to Florida. Old people don't want to be known as old. They're insecure that they're like, oh my God, I'm a grandma, it's the end of my life. I'm the golden girl. Yeah, yeah, they're here. The what? Oh, yeah, this is a chill chit chat Wednesday now. Yeah, the old people are very insecure that they're considered old. Like I, it's a conversation I have with people around my parents age where it's like, well, we don't want to be old. We were afraid we're gonna look old. And I'm like, okay, well, I'm looking at an old person. Get over it, you know, like, you go, yeah, you are what you is. I, I, you look great. You can look great and look young and alive, but. So they kind of consider moving to Florida death sentence. And then young people are insecure because they're considered losers who have given up. They, their dreams didn't materialize, so they came to a cheaper land that can facilitate a, a lifestyle that they couldn't have elsewhere. So, and I would say that that's my insecurity in the way people even ask you about it. Why would you move to New York like as, or move to Florida? You go, you feel this need to defend weirdly.
- [06:53]
B
Well, I think the coasts, like, I think that to me that comes from a place of, I think in the entertainment industry you are basically in a cult. And like your cult leaders are New York and la. And if you stray from the cult, people feel threatened because they're probably, there's a piece of them that's probably like, I'd love to straight from the cult. And like
- [07:19]
A
the comedians questions I get is like, is it working? You know, like, is it right? And that's the deal on the road
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B
all the time anyway.
- [07:26]
A
So no, I'm enjoying it. I mean, like I feel like my act is growing. Like, that's, like, the thing. I don't want to do bad stand up. I don't want to do, you know, like, I don't want to do a show that I'm not proud of. And, you know, in this day and age where, you know, I want to be able to talk about people who are doing bad stand up.
- [07:46]
B
Yeah.
- [07:48]
A
I don't want to lose that. I want to be able to look at the person who has a podcast that started doing. What's that?
- [07:55]
B
And I want that for you.
- [07:57]
A
Thank you. I. Well, I. It is from a bad place. I. I don't want the person who has a podcast that got big that suddenly started doing stand up to have any ability to say that they do stand up. I want to be able to talk about that person forever.
- [08:12]
B
Yeah.
- [08:13]
A
Do you know what I mean? Like, especially you and I, who did the open mics, who signed up on a list that was taped to a wall. Like, if you didn't do that, I think less of you. I hate that I feel that way. That. That feels like it's like a bad energy voodoo. But how do you feel about that?
- [08:30]
B
No, I'm. I'm really glad you brought that up, because I. Especially when I'm back in New York, I'm like, wow. Like, when people say, like, we were in the trenches together, I'm like, no, actually, you and I were in, like, pretty much literal trenches because, like, we were in some, like, holes in the ground type ven hoops.
- [08:49]
A
Like, we were in the trenches together. I've heard people say that to me, and my. I. I'm like, do you see my eyes?
- [08:57]
B
Yeah, you go. You go. You don't know what a trench is like, because I. I had a day job, and when I would leave my day job, I would go straight to a 5pm open mic and sit for who knows how long, waiting to go up for, you know, three minutes of stage time sometimes. I mean, you really got not a lot right. And I would do that, like, two other times that night. And then if I was lucky, I would have a show also, which is.
- [09:24]
A
That's, like, when. When you say that to me. That's. That's. That was the schedule for, like, a couple years of, like, figuring it out. That was the thing. And, yeah, and you go. And you hear and. And texting someone, hey, can you sign me up? Hey, did they start a list? You know, Lulu's Lounge. You know, did they start a list at the Laugh Lounge? Oh, did you go to bar 82. Was there still time to get on at the end? You know, like, all these things. And I feel stupid because we're talking about on a podcast for people who don't do this. So you go, I. I. You know, like, I. How do you explain? Like, now we just sound like haters, you know, like. And I don't think I'll ever get over it. I'll never get over it. I'll never hear we were in the trenches together from someone who wasn't in those trenches. And again, even to call it trenches, like, I'm like, it's always from someone who never did it. It's. It's someone who never went to war, and it's someone who never went to open mics. Uses the term trenches. Like, I would never even use that word. I would. Because I. You said. And I'm like, oh, my God. I'm thinking of three different people that said that to me that I wanted to. Like, I wanted to scream.
- [10:34]
B
Well, I feel like. Yeah. I mean, listen, sometimes. And I've said this before, like, I think sometimes because we did so many open mics, I actually got really comfortable bombing. Because you would be performing sometimes to, like, two people, and neither of them were interested in you. Like, also. Yeah. So I. I feel like I got really a little too comfortable from, like, I think you can. Like, it can't work against you is what I. Oh.
- [11:04]
A
Like, I went to an.
- [11:07]
B
But I'm like, it's nice to have some separation. Like, now. Right now, I'm going up probably three times a week and as opposed to, like, every night of the week. And I do think it's good to have days where you think about what happened before you go up on stage yet.
- [11:21]
A
Well, it's the difference between being in grad school and then being in the real world. Like, you know. You know, you don't have to. Once you've done grad school, you got to go use those skills. You got to go figure out how they become workable skills. I mean, you're right. I went to an open mic down here in Del Rey. I was like, I gotta go on stage. I need to find something. And. And it was like. It was like going back, and all the same types of people were at the open mic. Like, the miserable person who's been doing comedy 80 years was hosting it, and the. The person who just yells racial slurs is doing it. You know, the crazy person that's doing it for therapy, the older person who's pretty good that you're like, man, did they do this before?
- [12:02]
B
Like, you have something. I. I wish you like, pursued this in a more real way at some point.
- [12:07]
A
Right? They have like the most sane version of it. They're like, yeah, I like to do it.
- [12:11]
B
And I tell myself, you're actually like, really good.
- [12:14]
A
Yeah, right? Yeah. And. And all those characters were there and I was there for like two and a half hours. Like, and I was like, I. And it made me worse for it. Like, I, I was like, I shouldn't. I don't think this is going to help me. Like, I. As hard as that is to say, because none of us have the confidence to say it. Like, if you've gone to an open mic, you're like, you need open mics. And then you're like, yeah, you got to graduate out. You gotta.
- [12:37]
B
I do think you have to graduate. And I think that like, that type of stage time is a very specific type of stage time. Like, it's not that you can't get an honest read on if something is working, you definitely can, but all of the other, like just sort of like the mindset it puts you in to be at an open mic, like. Yeah, I think, I think because we did it for so long, it's just one of those things where it's hard to just sort of revert back when you're like, I do feel like I kind of. Not that I'm like too good for them, but it's more like where I was at in my life when I did them. I've moved on from that. So it's like, it's like you're, you're regret. It's not a stand up regression. It's like an inside here regression. A little bit.
- [13:22]
A
Totally agree. Everyone needs to go see Jamie Lee. Really? Jamie Lee. So funny. The show is called My Friend Katie. Yeah, it is. In Philly, D.C. boston, New York, Louisiana. Now you got it. And she's an Emmy winner. So do you want to be at a show with an Emmy winner? Like, that's. I mean, who would even say no to such a thing? It's called My Friend Katie now. I read a little bit about it and then I was like, I kind of feel like I got to hear it from you because it's, it's, it's got. So the way I understand it is it's a show about your former roommate from college who passed away mysteriously and you kind of, you put on your detective cap and went and re. Did you really? Is this your own, like, podcast? Are you doing A, murder mystery. B, what's going on? Not explain it.
- [14:16]
B
Yeah, I will. 100%. Yeah, there's. There's a lot to unpack there. Basically, it was my best friend. She. She was a little younger than me, so she was actually still in college or. Sorry. She was still in high school. I was in college.
- [14:32]
A
And you went where?
- [14:33]
B
I went to University of Texas in Austin, and she was only three hours away at Dallas.
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A
Okay.
- [14:38]
B
But, yeah, she passed away very suddenly, very mysteriously, and I never really understood what happened. I definitely had, like, my theories, my suspicions, but I think that this was, like, 20 years ago. So that was at a time when I don't think anyone was talking about mental health or honestly, no one was even talking about, like, true crime or, like, there was just not a lot of curiosity in the zeitgeist at that time. And I feel like now with podcasts and stuff, like, people start to realize, like, oh, there are actually, like, a lot of conversations that you could be having. And so anyways, at the time, I sort of, like, put it aside, tried to move on, and then basically, 20 years later, I ended up going back to Dallas, Texas, and trying to investigate what happened to her. And I actually brought, like, a documentary, a guy named Alex Hammer, who's, like, brilliant director. He does documentary. He has one coming out on Netflix soon. And so I brought him along with me to sort of, like, just be in it with me, trying to get answers, and I ended up, like, reconnecting with all of these people from my life back then, and that truly was a journey that I went on and. Yeah. So that the show is sort of about me, like, losing my mind and trying to be a sleuth.
- [16:06]
A
What's the first step in, like. I mean, you're. You know, there's a little bit, like, I. If I was to give. If I was to make fun of this. Okay. Not that. No, I love you. If I also.
- [16:21]
B
You can.
- [16:22]
A
I. Right. I know your sensibility enough to know that I'm not. Like, I'm not. The ideas sound like it's interesting. It's immediately interesting. I had a friend that I grew up with that passed away, and I just got to know what happened. But when this happens in a movie, you go, yeah, of course. You go back to your hometown, you start questioning people, and, you know, you're. You know, you're Dick Tracy. But I. But if I was. I'm like, man, this white woman has a lot of time on her hand to, like, start, you know, start asking a bunch of shit. No, One wants to talk about, like, you feel a little awkward going, do you keep up with her family? What, what's the first thing you do?
- [17:04]
B
So, I mean, yeah, I. Everything you're saying is also in the show. Like, I. All of the sort of like, I'm very like, the joke is on me the entire time because you do feel like an insane person and you look like an insane person. And to be honest, this show wasn't a show. It didn't start as a stand up out. It started as me genuinely just wanting answers. And then of course, because I'm a comedian and I can't not like comment on my life, I can't just live life. I have to like write about my life. And I ended up turning it into something more of like a piece or whatever. But it did start genuinely just as me like trying to cold call people or like send an email, see if someone will write me back. The craziest thing is that you would think in the age of the Internet that you would be able to get answers pretty quickly or get in touch with people pretty quickly. It was shocking how hard some people were to get a hold of.
- [18:04]
A
Is it, Is some of that Texas?
- [18:08]
B
I don't know. I mean, I think it was some
- [18:11]
A
of that small town. Where are you from in Dallas?
- [18:13]
B
Is that not small town? This is like Dallas proper, right? Yeah, it was more just like, okay, for example, there is someone in the story who like had a doctor's practice. And I go, well, this person's not that old. They probably still have that practice. Call that practice. That practice has been sold to someone else. So now I'm like, hey, like doctor who works there now. Can you call me back to try and put me in touch with the doctor who used to work there? Woman never called me back. Couldn't find her online, couldn't send her an email. It was like stuff like that where I was like, this is actually so much. There's so many more hurdles than you could ever imagine.
- [18:54]
A
What was the central, like, what's the initial thing you wanted to know about your friend that had passed? Like, what were you trying to figure out?
- [19:00]
B
Well, that's also part of the show because I think you go in thinking that once you have answers to certain things, that it will be closure. But I kind of learned that like closure's sort of fake, like.
- [19:10]
A
Right, yeah. Any guy who's been asked for closure after he's dumped a woman, I. I'll tell you, I don't have no answer for that. I've never had answer for closure. I've never. And I've thought about it, like, I, when I've ended a relationship, I've never wanted them to not have closure.
- [19:26]
B
Right.
- [19:27]
A
You know, like, I want you to have closure. I don't know how to do that for you.
- [19:30]
B
No. 100%. Like, I think that, well, that, that's also in the show where it's like, I'm, I'm thinking once I have the answer to this particular question, whatever it is, then I'll stop. Then I'll stop. I'll be good. I'll make peace with where I'm at, and that'll have to be enough. And then you start to realize it's never enough, because if you get an answer to something, it just makes you, makes you ask more questions. So basically, like, I found out how she died, like, in an official capacity, like, in a medical capacity. I found that out, but then that wasn't satisfying because I'm like, okay, but if this is true, then that means that this person. Da, da, da, da. And then I have to talk to this person, because how would she have. It's like it just leads to a larger web of thinking.
- [20:20]
A
What was it like connecting with her parents?
- [20:23]
B
Right. So that was kind of like the pinnacle interview for me was, was speaking to her mom, because I did not talk to her mom after the funeral, which was back in 2004. Like, that was the last time I saw her mother, was at the funeral.
- [20:38]
A
Did you have a, that close a relationship with her enough to, like, that, that, that's kind of weird to talk to her mom, you know, close enough with her that, like, maybe you would have thought you'd talk to the mom more.
- [20:51]
B
Yeah, I, I kind of deliberately didn't keep in touch. I was feeling really, like, conflicted about what had happened to Katie and how I didn't really understand why she died. I think that my inclination was, like, stay away from this. Like, stay away.
- [21:09]
A
You got a vibe?
- [21:11]
B
Yeah, yeah, I think I, I, I definitely did get a vibe. And also I was so angry that I think the only control I had over the situation where I had absolutely no control, was to, like, distance myself. So I really distanced myself. But when I reconnected with her mom, it was, it was a really, really big moment. And she doesn't live in Dallas anymore, so me and Alex, my documentarian director, and then some other friends, went with me to, to where she lives now, different state. And, yeah, we had, like, a whole weekend with her where I basically just, like, got to ask all the questions that I had been wanting to ask.
- [21:57]
A
How was she with it?
- [21:59]
B
Well, the really unbelievable thing is that she also is working on, we'll just say, a piece of art about Katie, which I found to be really interesting because we both were sort of simultaneously working on projects about this person, obviously from very different perspectives, but we seem to really, like, connect over that. So she really, like, Katie was a really, like, creative, funny person, and so her mom, like, kind of understands me because Katie and I were not dissimilar.
- [22:36]
A
Did, did you go to. Or does it make you want to go to a medium?
- [22:43]
B
Yes, I would love to go to a medium. I also did go to a hypnotist because I felt like I couldn't remember a lot of things.
- [22:51]
A
And so hyp is medium. I, I, I feel like there are two different. It's like a, an impressionist versus a standup. Like, I don't know if I, I don't know if we're at the same show.
- [23:00]
B
Well, I hit a point with in my investigation where I was like, I can't remember anything. Like, I almost, I wish I didn't have to talk to all these people and bother them, but I can't remember. So I'm having to outsource my information because I can't. It's not within. So that was sort of the point where I was like, I have to just see if, like, a hypnotist can, like, draw more out of me because I know the memories are in there. They're just like, a little bit stuffed under, you know, years of, like, whatever, repression or whatever.
- [23:31]
A
I have a medium for you if you want. Do you reference. She came on the pod on you podcast, and she's fantastic. Awesome.
- [23:39]
B
I definitely want to talk to her.
- [23:40]
A
Yeah, the modern mystic. She's. But she gave, you know, I, I'm not like a woo woo type, but we did it on the podcast. I was like, I'll put myself up for it. It did illuminate things for me. It did kind of, like, speak to what, you know, it did bring up, weirdly what direction. It encouraged me to go in a direction that I thought I should go in. Like, and, like, her saying it out loud. I don't know what. Again, like, I'm, I'm willing to be told. Like, if someone told me tomorrow, yeah, that woman, she's going to jail. She, like, bilked everyone out of their money, I'd be like, okay, yeah, I guess I got fooled. But I, I definitely think highly of her. We are sponsored wayfair you're ready for the summer. You get your outdoor space ready too, with Wayfair. Wayfair has everything you need to enjoy the season in style, all at amazing prices. Weatherproof seating, tables and umbrellas for al fresco dining. Basketball hoops and swing sets for the kids. Even big ticket appliances like fire pits and grills. Wayfair even offers installation and assembly services so you can sit back and relax all summer long. I had no idea that Wayfair offers installation and assembly services. That's huge. I also didn't know that they, they did basketball, basketball hoops and swing sets. They do absolutely, absolutely everything. Wayfair is for everyone and anyone. Any price point. I think that's the big thing. I didn't know that Wayfair has something that you might just use for one season and then say, ah, you know, whatever, we'll, we'll toss it, give it away or something that becomes like a home staple for the rest of your life. So that's a really great place to start. Go to Wayfair, find whatever you're looking for and find the price point. You're looking for. Anything. You know, it can go from your mom to anything for you. You know, I have a new apartment. I have used Wayfair. I love the stuff on their site. And again, it's for really any price point. Whatever your style or space, Wayfair makes it easy to feel at home. Patio season is here. I mean, you can get a basketball hoop there. That's great. Patio season is here and these deals won't last. Head to Wayfair.com right now to get your outdoor space ready for way less. That's W A Y F A I R dot com. Does having an Emmy allow you to kind of go in to these places? Like, were you like, like, does, does that like, make it easier? You think where you walk in like a cop, like with your, with your badge up, you're like, I got an Emmy. I'm here to ask questions about your dead daughter. Like, does that make it easier?
- [26:23]
B
Strangely, no.
- [26:25]
A
I thought it would have.
- [26:27]
B
I mean, maybe a little. Maybe. Well, probably something.
- [26:29]
A
What are you doing here, Jamie? We haven't seen you in 20 years. I'm doing a show. Oh, we heard about the Emmy. Yeah, I'm doing a new type of show. Like, I don't know.
- [26:39]
B
I mean, there were definitely some people and this is in my, in my show, there were people where I was trying to ask them, like hard hitting journalism questions and they just wanted to talk about Ted Lasso.
- [26:49]
A
Well, I want to. That's a good segue because I want everyone to go. I don't want to get too much into the show, but I think everyone, it is worth your dollar to go see Jamie Lee, who is fantastic, hilarious and wonderful. It is in Philly, D.C. boston, New York, Louisiana. It's called my friend Katie at really Jamie Lee. Go follow on Instagram and you'll see all the ticket information there.
- [27:13]
B
Yep.
- [27:13]
A
I was going to ask you about Ted Lasso. So you write for Ted Lasso?
- [27:16]
B
Yes.
- [27:18]
A
Now that show is beloved. That is a show that conversation starter and continuer, I would imagine.
- [27:28]
B
Yes, for sure.
- [27:29]
A
Let's play a game called this is Annoying. Okay. And you need to tell me the most annoying responses you get to. I am a writer for Ted Lasso.
- [27:42]
B
Oh, my God. The most annoying. I mean, people aren't. Well, for a while. And it was only annoying because it was the number one response was when it first came out. Every person would say, we needed this show because it came out during the pandemic. A time
- [28:03]
A
I am with you. Fuck off. Well, we needed this. The country needed a happy show that, that makes cute jokes, that doesn't swear. I don't know that that to me slides into dogma like that like, it slides into like territory where it's like. And if you swear on a show that is lesser form of comedy, like now it becomes, it becomes a religion at a certain point. Don't you think?
- [28:32]
B
Yeah, I mean, it was just interesting how this, I, it was like every person I was like, because I don't consume, I don't think I have like a thing that I say about shows that other people say the exact same thing. It was the first time I had experienced, like, is this like a tagline for the show that is like circulating that I don't know about? Because how is every person from all these different walks of life saying the exact same thing? Like, it's really interesting. I think also because we consume so much information sometimes, like we read something somewhere, but then we think it's our own opinion.
- [29:07]
A
Oh, I mean, that's the story of life right now.
- [29:10]
B
Because it wasn't even that that annoyed me. I was like, that's probably true. This probably did unify people in a certain way. Or it was what the country needed or whatever.
- [29:18]
A
Well, it was a conversation that was about something cutesy and not divisive, you know, like, I think, you know, I, I, I'm surprised there wasn't an SNL sketch about this. The, we needed this right now. TV show like, yes, we and, and. But we get that all the time. I call it Internet approved languaging. Like we. There's stuff that's like pre approved that you know, you can say, you know how many. Oh my God, we have so many. There's conversations you're allowed to say, you know, with dating, everyone's so disposable now. That's an opinion that you were told you're allowed to have. That sounds a little bit higher minded than I'm on a dating app now. It's. That's a, like you were given like a thoughtful opinion that was probably six years late.
- [30:07]
B
I think about this all the time when I just hear people say things where I'm like, you're definitely not the first person that I've heard say that. And it's almost like, yeah, is that a thing or you. You coined that.
- [30:20]
A
I've been talking about it for years now because I don't have any respect for the opinion. It kind of outs them for me as a, as like a hack. Like I. And I deal with that a lot with dating content.
- [30:33]
B
Yeah.
- [30:34]
A
Because you'll say if they say it well, that's kind of half the battle. So people believe it, say it with confidence, say it well. But like to me, you're walking in this footsteps that someone else took the chance. I, you know when I noticed it. Yes, I noticed it with I. We would do. We did for a minute Love is Blind recaps and we got sent the screeners and when you get sent the screeners, as you have gotten screeners yourself.
- [31:06]
B
Yeah.
- [31:07]
A
And then you had to tape a podcast before people came out with their opinions on it. So.
- [31:14]
B
Right.
- [31:15]
A
I was having my opinion before I saw what the Internet had allowed and not allowed and what was considered problematic and not problematic. And I noticed how nerve wracking it was for me to be like, I hope people agree that I think this guy is a total douchebag or I think this guy who people would assume is a douchebag isn't that bad of a guy. Like, it was interesting because I, I noticed it myself that you know, like, and, and I think that's like so it. So I'm. When I would do these recaps and then you know, we would talk about it like, oh my God, like, I hope. Because you know those like opinions that you see people have right away and then they go, hey, this, this, this PhD level book on, on race relations says that you're racist because of that and you're like, oh, I missed It. And then everyone's like, oh, got him. You know, like, yeah, you didn't even see the problematic coming, you know, like. So I kind of thinking of that, you know.
- [32:19]
B
But yeah, I. It's really. I'm so glad that I'm. I didn't think I was the only person who felt that way. But it's really nice to hear somebody else talking about it because I would say it's My Roman Empire is how people say things where I'm like, you don't. You got that from someone, right? Because I've heard that before. I've heard that before.
- [32:40]
A
Right. This is safe.
- [32:43]
B
Yes. And it's happening all the time. I'm like. Or we're. I don't know if it's. If it's like a chicken or the egg, where it's like we're all consuming the same or. I don't, I actually don't know. But I just hear it all the time where I'm like, people used to like, kind of disagree on things and now it's very. Like the way you relate is by agreeing or something.
- [33:07]
A
Well, you're either on one side or the other. You know, we, we, we. It's like organized in a way where it's like, you can have this opinion that makes you a good person or you can have this opinion that makes you a bad person. Right, right.
- [33:23]
B
There's no nuance anymore. It's really bizarre.
- [33:27]
A
It's really tough. And nuance gets you nowhere.
- [33:29]
B
Like, nuance is like illegal.
- [33:33]
A
Well, it's also makes you no money. You know, it gets you no react, no money, no reaction, no fun story. My dad, I mean, this is a story that I've been like trying to bring into my stand up, but. And I don't know how to do it without ruining the show. But my dad was like, what do you think about Iran?
- [33:52]
B
Yeah.
- [33:53]
A
And I came back with this, like, I don't know, you know, it's so complicated. And, you know, I, you know, does the world. Do we need war? You know, And I'm going on and on and then my dad literally gets in my ear and goes, are you for America or are you against America? And I'm like, I wish I could be that. I wish I could. I wish I. And he was like, he was so not having my, I don't know, fucking anything opinion, which he's putting me on the spot to have. Like. But he was like, I need you to either rage for what I agree, like with me or against me. None of this, like, yeah, this is a fucking complicated issue. You know, no one wants that.
- [34:42]
B
I think it's also because we just need things to be shorter. Shorter. Shorter. We have, like, no attention span. That. What I just said is one of those opinions.
- [34:50]
A
We have no right. We have no attention span. That's in the. That's in the bucket of opinions.
- [34:54]
B
Oh, Jamie, that's so unique. You think people don't have attention spans, you fudgeing dork.
- [34:59]
A
But no, but I agree with you. You're making a good point.
- [35:03]
B
That is true. Which is why I. But I do think the no attention spans does contribute to just generally, we're like, we don't have time to disagree. We got to pick a side and move on because it's taken off fast.
- [35:15]
A
I got to know what you are so I can move on. It's kind of like even my dad,
- [35:20]
B
who doesn't know, energy for this. Yeah, right.
- [35:23]
A
I so listen. Ever so. Hold on. So annoying. Other annoying things you get from Ted Lasso. What. What is another annoying response?
- [35:33]
B
Oh, I mean, like, just, you know, people asking, like, like, is how. Like, is. It's. There is this. This part in my show where I have to talk to this guy and he's like. And he's like, is Jason Sudeikis as funny as a. Wait, as a boss, as he is on tv, or is he just a boss? It's like an older man. And it was just. Again, I didn't think it was annoying, but I did think it was just funny wording. Like, people always want to know, like, are these people, their characters are there?
- [36:06]
A
Well, there's got to be a lot of Sudeikis questions. Is he nice? Is he fun? All those things that you, like, you know, in what world do you want to answer? Like. And I. I was at. Oh, my God. Oh, I was at. I was in LA for the Netflix is a joke.
- [36:24]
B
Yeah.
- [36:25]
A
Thing. And I was at the comedy, the Improv, and I walked into Aaron Andrews and Christina. I'm blanking on her last name, but Aaron Andrews, the sports Fox NFL woman reporter. And. And she does a show. They have a podcast, and I've. I know that they have a show, and I know it's. And I was. I popped in. I was like, I'll watch, you know.
- [36:47]
B
Sure.
- [36:48]
A
And they were doing Q A at the end, and a woman in the crowd goes, so, when's the Taylor Swift wedding? Like, where. You know, when is it and where's it gonna be? And I just saw both of them, like, do you think we're gonna Tell you, right? Like, honey, when Taylor Swift's wedding is like, do you think we are going to risk our Taylor Swift wedding invite right. With this conversation right now with. And we think you're a nice woman. Like, she was nice, right. But you're like, what on what earth.
- [37:19]
B
You're not in the inner circle. Why would you.
- [37:22]
A
I feel lucky to go. What do you think? I'm like, oh, yeah, it's next Tuesday. You know, just show up to the Park Plaza.
- [37:28]
B
Yeah. I'll text you the address. What? Yeah, exactly that.
- [37:33]
A
So, okay. I did want to ask this. You're right. TV writing.
- [37:37]
B
Yeah.
- [37:37]
A
Is like, I. I would say, am I right in thinking that TV writers want to do stand up and stand ups, want to do a TV show? Is there some element of truth to that there?
- [37:48]
B
Yeah, I think so. I think that. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. You get asked a lot, like, what do you like better? But I do think they kind of like, feed each other. Like. Yeah, I definitely think because I write tv, it's the reason my solo show, my friend Katie is stronger, I would say, because I ha. I understand. Not that standups don't understand, like, a TV narrative. That's not what I mean. But I. Because I'm so in it writing television that I can try to apply that to shaping my app. Like, it definitely helped me be like, all right,
- [38:28]
A
one would help the other, you know, like, the other, you know, a standup would help the TV writing. TV writing would help the standup. You know, Like, I.
- [38:38]
B
They are, they are like, they are like brother, sister, those two things.
- [38:41]
A
Like, what's the major difference between a TV writer and a standup? Like, just personally, I.
- [38:48]
B
For. I can speak for myself. Like, I'm on staff with people who are not standups. Some are, but some aren't. And the ones that aren't are just so much more, like, disciplined in that. Like, they, like, for me, I mean, this might. I don't know if this is a standup thing or a ADHD thing or if those are more connected than maybe we realize. But, like, I really have a hard time, like, being a good student. Like, I need to get up, I need to go. Do I need to. Like, I gotta get a snack. I gotta, like, I'm always like, kind of moving. And for standup, that works well because, like, for the time you're not on stage, you kind of just are like, doing whatever you need to do. So I think, like, the structure of being on a staff, it is like a more structured job. Even though you have a Lot of freedom and fun within it. You know, it is like a job you have to show up to every day. So I think that for me as kind of like the whimsical artist that sometimes is not. Does not come naturally to me and it's something I have to work on.
- [39:48]
A
I. It. When I meet someone who does stand up, it is so when I, when I like someone who does stand up, when I think they're like, when it's a good hang. Yeah, it is. So it is like getting under a very comfortable comforter for me to find out how alike I am.
- [40:09]
B
Standups.
- [40:10]
A
I never. I was always better at getting out of homework than I was doing homework. I always wanted to like, figure out a way to get work done on the sly at the last moment. My ideas are horrible, but then they're genius in five seconds.
- [40:28]
B
Yep.
- [40:29]
A
You know, like, it's just like such a. And that's why, like, you know, I'm protective of the standup world because then you, you know, you meet someone who's like really good at making clips and you're like, I don't think you were what the group is like, you know, like when I meet a good stand up, I'm like, it always feels like we have a very similar, like the want for control but also like pushing things off and you know, all that stuff. Yeah. Like, but I could understand like a tv, right. Like, I even. I worked with a ghostwriter for my book that's coming out and yeah, I'm excited. Taylor was, is so funny. She writes for John Oliver and she, she even spoke to this like she was like, I know, like, we were like two sides of the brain almost like. And then we kind of had this in the middle because Taylor does stand up and I've written other things. So like, you know, so we had this like Venn diagram middle that kind of met and it was like, it was so different but the same. I don't know, it's. It's got to be interesting to be in that. I mean, it's. And having health insurance. It's like, I think there's a type that wants health insurance and another type that goes, I'm going to live forever.
- [41:45]
B
But I definitely, like, yeah, it's, it's interesting, I think because of Ted Lasso. Like, I took that job kind of not knowing where it would go and then it turned into this like, bigger thing. So I feel like it cemented me more in the writing world maybe more than I had thought it would. And now I'm At a place where I'm like really excited to sort of like still have that part of my life, but like also get on stage a lot more and like, you know, be on camera and like, I like all that stuff too. So I, I want to make sure I have like balance in my life with that.
- [42:22]
A
That's the dream. I mean that's a certain dream is to be able to, you know, get it all, you know, to do a little bit of everything and have it be successful. So everyone go follow Jamie at Really Jamie Lee, my friend Katie Philly, D.C. boston, New York, Louisiana on the road. Awesome comic. You're gonna love it. Thank you for coming on.
- [42:41]
B
Oh, thanks for having me friend. This was really fun. I'm so glad to see you. I miss.
- [42:45]
A
I know. Great to see you. Miss you too. Back next week with another chit chat. Wednesday. Boom. The first time I ever called a girl I liked, I had to use the phone book. I was in middle school. Her name was Morgan Marks and I was going to ask her to be my girlfriend. My 12 year old logic was sound. She lived near me and she was like cute, but not in a way that made every other prepubescent guy obsessed with her. That's the play for any self conscious middle school boy. Find someone who you can see yourself hanging around Aeropostel with for two or three weekends, who's also totally pretty but not so popular that you ever have to find out how you stack up against literally anyone else. Her name wasn't really Morgan Marks for privacy stuff, but you bet your ass I remember her name in this audiobook. I'll never use real names. I can't shake the idea of a woman in the suburbs being bothered by this audiobook while trying to get an iPad out of her kid's hands before bed. Once I decided I was going to call, I thought about it the whole day. My life was going to change. It was the 12 year old equivalent of buying a peloton. You know how you start imagining yourself with abs and hanging out at the beach? Like, totally. Let's take more pictures of ourselves. Well, that was me. Except instead of confident swimsuit posts, I had visions of us holding hands in the hallway and and slow dancing at parties. This was it. I was about to move from an adolescent side character into the cool, confident main character of maturity. I was going to be dating someone as soon as I got home from school. I went up to my room. I practiced saying hi, is Morgan home? And would you want to be my girlfriend? Over and over and over again until I felt sure I couldn't mess it up. I got her number from the previously mentioned phone book and picked up my house's second phone line. Do you remember the second line? When a call came through and someone was already on the phone, the call would push through to the other line. Our second line was one number away from our first line. 9022 and 9 021. Yes. Like 90210. Yes. I used that as a pickup line multiple times in high school. And maybe a couple of days ago at a bar in the West Village. For some reason, I decided that it would be safer to use the second line to permanently alter the trajectory of my existence. I picked up that receiver and started to dial. Almost the instant I pushed the seventh and final number, my mom picked up the phone. Jared, who are you calling? Why are you on the second line? She screamed. She continued yelling questions in rapid succession and increasing volume without leaving any space for me to answer more accusations than inquiries in classic Jewish mom style. Jared. Jared, answer me. Who are you calling? Do you know this is the second line? Why aren't you answering me? Then Morgan's mom picked up. Hello? Who's this? It's Kim. Who is this? I threw down the receiver, sweating and panting as if I'd just outrun a murderer. I could still hear my mom on the floor below. Who is this? Eventually she yelled up the stairs. Jared, why are you calling the Marxes? It was an accident. I lied to my mother for the first and only time ever in my life. That's a lie. Why are you even on the phone? I ignored her and started playing video games, refusing to so much as look at the phone on the other side of the room. To me, the three way call disaster was a sign and a warning. A bad thing had happened, so that romantic prospect was over. I never told anyone what happened. I never called back. I never asked Morgan out at all. The end. I know what you're thinking. Did this idiot just start an audiobook about modern dating with a story about using a landline to dial a nut number he found in the phone book to not actually ask someone out? Yeah, I did. Because the dating advice, I think is most important is at its core, timeless. Number one, most romantic disasters make good stories. Number two, you should always try again. I guess technically the message of this story could be summed up as don't be a middle school boy about shit. But I would hope that's a code you're already living by as I speak to you. Now we are in the mid-2020s and we are living in an absolutely bonkers era of dating. In the past 20 years, we've gone from calling crushes on landlines to poking them on Facebook, to saying ew, they still have Facebook, to scrolling, to swiping, to watching their stories, to liking those stories, to flirting in the comments section of a TikTok standup clip about gender reveal parties. And because the trends and platforms move and change so fast, it can feel like we're constantly playing catch up. It's like you learn something new every day, except it's always about dating and it's going to be irrelevant tomorrow. On top of that, this onslaught of change means there's a big market for advice on how to handle it. Sometimes that advice can feel more confusing and guilt inducing than the actual dating world itself. There are listicles and relationship therapists and any motherfucker with a podcast out there making a lot of money telling you how wrong you are about something and how much your romantic situation is your own fault. But dealing with all this is not as simple as just plugging your ears and going la la la la. Anytime someone talks about dating. Dating is a huge part of life. We don't do it in a vacuum. We want to learn from and quietly laugh at other people's experiences while taking lessons from them and feeling glad we're not them. Which is, I'm guessing, a big part of why you're listening to this audiobook. You've either committed fully and already gotten the whole thing, or you're listening to a free trial. I don't know where you are, but you're deciding right now, do I want to listen to this book? And you're doing it. Maybe at a gate while you wait for the flight to Charleston, while you inhale a cold $20 chicken salad sandwich. Either way, you're the kind of person who sees nine hours of dating advice and thinks there might be something for me here. That or you hated me in college and you were like, this idiot has an audiobook and you started listening so you could take a screenshot to send to a huge group chat of people who will discuss how little I banged and question why anyone would ask that guy who frequently wore three polos with all the collars popped what he thought about dating. In which case, hi, I'd probably do the same. But joke's on you because they paid me a lot of money for this. No matter who you are, I want to start off by saluting you, my comrade in the dating trenches, for deciding that your friend who got married to their third grade sweetheart but still has really loud Tinder opinions at the brunch table probably isn't the best source of advice on how to text someone back. And yeah, I just did the thing where I kind of compared dating to war. But not because I think love is gruesome or that texting requires boot camp training at West Point, or because I wanted you to know that I'm masculine enough to put the words boot camp and West Point in my book. Twice. Ladies, Is my penis big enough yet? Okay, I'll stop. To me, the dating is a battlefield stuff rings true because it's all so fucking messy and confusing. That and it has led to many good hot people to get really bad haircuts. And don't worry, this book wasn't written from the other side. It wasn't written from a dining room table at the home I've built with my soulmate and two kids in Live Life Love, Connecticut. It didn't get written from a working vacation on the beaches of Cannes with my beautiful girlfriend walking funny because the 30 carat diamond ring I'm about to propose with is weighing down my right pocket. I didn't even write this from the bed of a successful friends with benefits situation that I finally figured out how to make not weird. Nope. I wrote this book in the notes app of my phone while sitting on the toilet inside a 700 square foot studio apartment that I rented. I'm about as far from a high horse as you can get. I'm right there with you. I'm here to make you sigh. A big old sigh of I'm not alone relief. I'm here to be relatable. Not in the oh wow, they have the hair, skin and bank account of my wildest dreams. But sometimes they also say you too, when the Uber driver tells them to have a nice flightway. It's more in a I have also worn a swimsuit as underwear to work because I'm behind on laundry and don't totally understand what a 401k is way. I think a lot of our collective anxiety from dating stems from the feeling that we are the only people in the world who feel certain things, act in certain ways, or have certain ideas about how things should be. I'm here to reassure you that that is entirely wrong. No one is better than you. No one has this shit figured out. And critically, no one is thinking about you and your dating life that much. And before you call me out in the comments, that's not supposed to be Harsh honesty. That's supposed to be freeing honesty? The lies we tell ourselves don't always make us feel better. In a lot of cases, they make us feel worse and more alone. I hope this audiobook can give you honesty in a way that makes you feel more confident that it can free you from berating yourself for hours worrying. Maybe I messed up that text I just sent. Because you didn't. I promise. You didn't mess up anything.
- [54:08]
C
Okay, but who are you?
- [54:11]
A
Whoa. Hey.
- [54:13]
C
Hi.
- [54:14]
A
Who are you?
- [54:16]
C
I asked you first.
- [54:18]
A
Yeah, but you just kind of showed up in my audiobook.
- [54:21]
C
And I'm the voice of every woman reading and or listening. Almost kinda. You can call me Vera. It's almost kind of an acronym. Voice of every woman reading and or listening. Almost kind of Vera.
- [54:38]
A
Hey, Vera. That's a clever thing you did there with the name.
- [54:42]
C
Thank you. I was almost named. The women listening now are thinking. But the almost kind of acronym for that is twalmat. So, yes, Vera is better.
- [54:54]
A
Yes. Yes, it is.
- [54:57]
C
I'm here so that you can address questions or concerns or thoughts that the listener might have without having to say. And I know you might be thinking 3,700 times over the course of the audiobook.
- [55:09]
A
That is super helpful. I was concerned about that. I know, because you're me.
- [55:16]
C
Technically, yes.
- [55:18]
A
But you're also the listener.
- [55:21]
C
Yes.
- [55:22]
A
Okay, cool, cool. And you're going to be hanging out the whole audiobook when it's helpful.
- [55:29]
C
Like if you say something dumb and need an excuse to explain further.
- [55:34]
A
Awesome.
- [55:36]
C
Can I ask my question now?
- [55:39]
A
Yes, of course.
- [55:41]
C
Who are you? More specifically, who the hell are you to be giving anyone advice?
- [55:48]
A
This is a very fair question, Vera. Listener. Given my less than impressive stats and opener, I can appreciate that I might not feel like the most comforting guide for this high stakes journey. Imagine your mom asking, oh, what are you listening to? And you'd have to say something like, I'm learning how to date better from a 40 year old man who wrote most of his books shirtless in a studio apartment with nothing on the walls and sheets that get washed bimonthly. Obviously don't actually tell her that we want her to live to her next birthday so she can passive aggressively say, should I wish for my daughter to find someone right before she blows out her candles. It's not even a studio apartment with an alcove, which, honestly, I'm not embarrassed about. Nobody is more annoying than a person with an alcove. Studio. We get it. You found a weirdly shaped apartment that helps you feel less like you sleep next to your stovetop. Imagine an apartment shaped like a shoebox where there is a couch next to the bed and absolutely no room for a coffee table. That's where I've written this book that you've found in the self help section. If we went out, had a few drinks, and then came back to my place, I think that you'd react differently depending on your age. If you're in your early 20s, you'd be like, wow, he doesn't have a roommate. Did I just sleep with Christian Grey? But any woman who has filed more than five years of income tax returns would probably wake up and think, is this where my life really is right now? I thought I'd be married with kids in the suburbs, but. But I just hooked up with a guy whose sheets smell like an under dried towel. He has a photo of himself next to a portrait of Tom Brady and they're not even hung up, they're just leaning against the wall like that's the same thing. He can't even hang up a photo. He can't even hire a task rabbit to hang up the photo that he can't hang up. And I'm expecting this to go somewhere. Honestly, I don't know who is worse off right now. Me, a guy who just realized all his socks are in the hamper so I'm going to have to go sockless in the middle of winter until I decide to do laundry, or you, the person who is taking my advice to become a better dater. And look, I'm not trying to scare you away. I'm trying to lightly shake the romanticism out of you. I'm a normal guy, which means I can help you figure out some of the whys you wanted from your ex during the breakup. The answers he was never going to give. Because sometimes it's just too hard to say outright that you like someone but you'll never marry them. I know that stung. I'm sorry. Remember how my apartment's so small sometimes I roll over in bed to get my phone and accidentally grab a spatula that still has some egg on it from yesterday? Feel better? Okay, good. I know this because I've been talking about dating for more than a decade. My podcasts have millions of listeners, and I've sold out shows across the country. Yes, I'm bragging. I'm not going to serve you up some bullshit like I'm just trying to make you feel confident in my credentials. I'm straight up bragging because I know my shit. I've talked about every dating scenario under the sun.