Music Does Matter - Episode 12

Summary

The Musers The Podcast – Episode 12: Music Does Matter

Date: September 10, 2025
Hosts: George Dunham, Craig “Junior” Miller, Gordon Keith
Theme: The meaning of personal passions – boats, sports, and music – and how they shape identity, family, and life’s most heartfelt memories.

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Episode Overview

In this episode, the Musers dive deep into the theme of personal passions. George leads the way in the “Things We Love” segment, sharing candid stories about the three great loves of his life: boats, sports, and music. Through signature banter and poignant memories, the trio explores why these passions matter, how they’re passed down, and the ways in which music, in particular, transcends generations and life’s challenges. Along the way, listeners are treated to George’s signature humor, the warmth and wit of all three hosts, and a special sneak peek at a new Bird Dogs song inspired by family and loss.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Boats: The Legacy of “Old Blue”

[01:49–17:24]

• Origin Story:
  George recounts his lifelong attachment to his family’s boat, a 17-foot Tim Craft named “Old Blue,” acquired when he was just six months old. It became the center of family gatherings and the backdrop for formative memories through moves from Texas to Minnesota to Chicago and back.

• Generational Bonding:
  Old Blue symbolized family connection, especially during annual trips and summers spent on the lake. George recalls how going boating wasn’t just recreation, but a ritual that brought siblings back together year after year.

• Maintenance, Mishaps, and Restoration:
  Despite periods of disuse—sometimes stretching into years—and the challenges of storage and neglect (“rodents call it home, the motor froze up, the floor rotted out” [10:30]), the boat’s sentimental value led George’s wife to organize a surprise full restoration for his 40th birthday.
  Quote: “For my 40th birthday… here comes Old Blue around the corner with my kids on it… just an incredible memory and an incredible gift.” — George, [10:59]

• Reluctance to Let Go:
  Despite gentle ribbing from Gordon and Craig about the boat’s current semi-retired state, George asserts he “can’t part with it” and dreams of one day fixing Old Blue up for perhaps a final adventure or even a Viking funeral (“just aim me at the dam and put the throttle down” [14:50]).

• Broader Reflection:
  The segment concludes with all three sharing the significance of holding onto heirlooms—be it boats, typewriters, or bicycles—and how these objects are repositories for life’s magic moments.

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2. Sports: The Thrill and Discipline of Competition

[20:01–33:43]

• Early Sports Memories:
  George reveals his competitive beginnings in swimming, inspired by his siblings, and shares a formative story of struggling through his first butterfly race without knowing how to breathe—receiving a blue first-place ribbon from his coach “for effort,” a keepsake he still has decades later.
  Quote: “He said, that was really brave what you did tonight. And this is what goes to winners.” — George, [24:15]

• Transition to Other Sports:
  Though he dabbled in football (with questionable skill) and became consumed with golf through junior high and high school, George realized his limitations early in college but never lost his love for sports.

• The Sports Broadcaster’s Challenge:
  Craig and George discuss how working in sports radio can sap some of the pure, childlike enjoyment from sports fandom—turning games into content fodder and analysis, but still, the excitement of unexpected triumphs lingers.
  Quote: “It has taken away some of the joy being in the business that we are in sports talk radio. But I still love the competition… I still love the stories, the undrafted free agent, the walk-on who makes it as a starting quarterback. That stuff to me is still awesome.” — George, [33:17]

• Passing Down the Passion:
  Watching his own kids compete has rekindled George’s fandom and provided new meaning, shifting from analytic critique to the simple hope for their happiness and victories.

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3. Music: The Universal Language and George’s Full-Circle Journey

[35:03–53:54]

• Childhood Roots:
  Music was present in George’s life from an early age, with siblings in bands and parents skeptical of rock (“My dad thought rock and roll was going to be the end of this world…” [35:23]). He tells of dancing as a toddler at band practices and being awestruck by a brother playing Buck Owens songs.

• First Steps on Stage:
  George’s high school foray into rock as part of the band “Pegasus” at the talent show brought the intoxicating thrill of performance (“…place just went nuts. I remember just thinking, this is the greatest feeling I’ve ever had.” [39:10]).

• Hiatus and Rediscovery:
  Family and work led George to set music aside for years. A Lou Holtz interview about setting “life goals” inspired him in his 40s to make a list; on it: to play music and record original songs.
  Memorable Moment: The list also humorously included “never lose this list” and “never do a podcast.” [43:50]

• Bird Dogs & Songwriting:
  Spurred by a profound concert experience with his brother at Billy Bob’s watching the Randy Rogers Band, George rekindled his music dream: forming The Bird Dogs, writing over 50 songs, and using the band to support local charities through events like Jub Jam.
  Quote: “It all started with just that love of music, that passion for music, and what it does to your soul and what it does to your heart.” — George, [46:21]

• Music as Healing and Connection:
  He reflects on the powerful role of music in caregiving and grief: playing for his brother with dementia and eliciting singing and communication in his final weeks, and writing the song “See You Soon” after losing his sister.

• A New Song Debut – “I Can Still Find It”
  A heartfelt tribute to family, memory, and the persistence of love. The song opens with a final voice mail from his brother and weaves nostalgia for Old Blue and childhood into its lyrics.
  Memorable Lyric Excerpt (sung live):
  “…Looking back for me / I can still find it / I can still… I mean, imagine all of those times, moving from San Antonio, sitting on that piano bench with my brother. I can still find [them]. Does hurt but it’s okay…”

• Reflective Finale:
  The trio playfully imagine alternate lives—boat salesman, Olympic swimmer, NFL quarterback, or music star—with George choosing “boat salesman who had a Neil Young tribute band on the weekends.” [54:11]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “That was my magic… to this day, I can still back a trailer as good as anybody.” — George, on boats and childhood independence [05:45].
• “You should never get rid of that.” — Craig, on heirlooms and personal objects [12:30].
• “The best smell ever… that oil mixture in the gas.” — Gordon, about the nostalgia of two-stroke outboards [18:38].
• “Those items… they have such a special place in your life. You should never get rid of that.” — Craig [12:30].
• “It’s not just about gathering, but about all the little rituals and fantasies you build as a kid.” — George [13:27 paraphrase].

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Topic/Story | |:-------------:|:-------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:49 – 17:24 | George’s lifelong love of boats and the saga of Old Blue | | 20:01 – 33:43 | George’s sports journey: swimming, coaching, sports radio | | 35:03 – 53:54 | Music’s role in George’s life, Bird Dogs band, song preview | | 46:23 | Forming Bird Dogs and blending music with charity | | 51:22 | Live preview/excerpt of “I Can Still Find It” | | 53:54 | Rapid-fire: “Which path would you have chosen?” |

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Tone and Style

• Witty, Intimate, and Poignant:
  The trio’s signature banter keeps things light, with self-deprecating humor and side jabs, but the tone is anchored by George’s earnest storytelling and the clear affection and respect among the hosts. The stories are heartfelt, but never cloying—there’s always an undercurrent of wryness or left-field observation, making even the heavy stuff feel deeply human.

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Summary for New Listeners

In this episode, the Musers aren’t just reliving the “greatest hits” of their passions—they’re showing listeners how the things we love, from a leaky old boat to a first-place ribbon to a home-recorded album, weave together the story of who we are. With George as the guide, the conversation flows from laugh-out-loud banter to reflective, even moving insights on family, regret, legacy, and happiness. By the episode’s close, the Musers deliver on the episode’s title: Music (and all our passions) really does matter.

Transcript

[George Dunham]

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[Gordon Keith]

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[George Dunham]

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[George Dunham]

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[Gordon Keith]

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[George Dunham]

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[Gordon Keith]

Why? I'm relaxed posture. No, no, I'm relaxed. Laying back in the chair like this means that I'm just totally focused in on your voice.

[George Dunham]

You're not. You're gonna fall asleep.

[Gordon Keith]

The beauty of your voice and how arousing it is. I do think I'm gonna fall asleep.

[George Dunham]

Sit up straight and let's do a podcast.

[Gordon Keith]

I think I have sleep apnea. I think I need one of those fighter pilot masks that force.

[George Dunham]

Well, maybe you do, but it's time.

[Gordon Keith]

Because you're so fat you can't even breathe. So you have to have a fighter pilot's mask to force Aaron to make you breathe.

[George Dunham]

Okay, let's start.

[Gordon Keith]

Let's do it. The Musers, the podcast, episode 12, Music Does Matter.

[George Dunham]

Here we go with our third edition of Things we Love. And I am going last. I should say who I am. I'm George.

[Gordon Keith]

I'm Gordon.

[Craig Miller]

I'm Craig.

[George Dunham]

There we go. The Muses, the podcast. George Dunham, Craig Miller, Gordon, Keith, the whole crew, you guys have talked about your passions, what you love, and I'm afraid that I'm just going to bore you to tears here for the next 50 minutes or so.

[Craig Miller]

Okay.

[George Dunham]

Because I just, I came prepared.

[Gordon Keith]

I brought a video game.

[George Dunham]

All right. You play video games? I put it into three different categories and category number one, the first thing that I was really passionate about, and I still am, is boats. Really loved boats from a really young age. We got our boat, our family boat, a 17 foot Tim craft made in Gatesville, Texas with a Johnson 80 horsepower on the back of it when I was six months old.

[Craig Miller]

Old blue.

[George Dunham]

Old blue. And we still have that boat to this very day.

[Gordon Keith]

It's not seaworthy, but you still have.

[George Dunham]

Would last for a while. It's got as a slow leak and I don't think the engine's turning over right now.

[Gordon Keith]

Oh, no. Well, you let it set up. You can't Let it set up so long with fuel in the lines.

[George Dunham]

I know, but the backstory of Old Blue is why I still have it. Because to me it represented family time. Because from a very young age that's just where we gathered. We gathered on the boat. And when we lived in San Antonio and I was six months old when we got Old Blue, we would take it out on Canyon Lake and some other area lakes around San Antonio. And that's what my family would do on the weekends. And the first memory that I have was the day we moved from San Antonio when I was three years old. And I was just consumed. I remember it like it was yesterday looking back at Old Blue. And it had the COVID on it and had all sorts of like furniture in it and we went through rainstorms and I was just so concerned because we were driving from San Antonio to Minnesota and all I could do was just stay at the boat, face backwards and stare at that boat. And yeah, I was just worried about Old Blue. How could Old Blue go? We didn't even call it Old Blue back then, but how could it make the trip of 2,000 miles or whatever we were about to take?

[Gordon Keith]

What kind of vehicle was towing this thing?

[George Dunham]

That was the old Buick Electra that was towing.

[Gordon Keith]

You were towing it with a car and you had five kids and two adults in the car.

[George Dunham]

My dad was already in Minneapolis and that was the other reason that I was maybe nervous. My oldest brother Tad was driving and so was the five kids and my mom. So it seemed like we didn't have our captain there with my dad not there. And I remember looking back and just being really worried about how are we going to make it all this way? And then when we moved up north, we just didn't get to use Old Blue as much because your, your boating time in Minnesota lasts from about May until September. And in Texas you can boat year round pretty much.

[Craig Miller]

But in Minnesota you have 10,000 lakes to choose from.

[George Dunham]

You have 10,000 lakes to choose from. And we did take it out quite.

[Gordon Keith]

A a made up stat, I think.

[George Dunham]

About Minnesota it may be, but we did take it out on a lot of lakes. And again it that family tradition would continue. That's where we would, would gather together. And by then I had siblings that were going off to college. And so those boat trips became extra special. We would spend a week somewhere like at Detroit Lakes or Green Lake in Wisconsin and my whole family would be there and my brother would be back from college and my sister who was going to Iowa State at the time Would be back. And those were just the best memories of my childhood, was a week somewhere fishing with my dad, watching my brothers and sisters ski. I was too young to get out there and ski, but I started at a pretty young age, I guess seven or so, when I started getting behind the boat and trying to ski. But it was just. That was my. That was my magic. And from that very time, I constructed. Had a tricycle in Minnesota. I took my dad's pull cart that he used for golf and put a leaf basket on that. That was my boat. And that's why I think to this day, I can still back a trailer as good as anybody, Because I started at a very young age learning the.

[Gordon Keith]

Mechanics of backing up a trailer.

[George Dunham]

Go left and it goes right.

[Gordon Keith]

That whole thing, very confusing.

[Craig Miller]

But did your dad have a truck, or did he always put the boat into the lake with the Electra?

[George Dunham]

With the Electra, really? It was a big car, and it pulled the boat pretty well.

[Craig Miller]

Okay.

[George Dunham]

And he always said, this boat pulls so well. It's well balanced on the trailer. That was always one of the copy points about.

[Gordon Keith]

So I'm shocked that this boat stayed in your family this long. I didn't think boats did that. I'm sure boats stay in families longer than cars, right? Or.

[George Dunham]

No, I would say that, yeah. Most people. And, you know, unless you really get tired after it a couple years and you're tired of messing with it and you. And you sell it.

[Gordon Keith]

What's the old saying about boats? The best day is when you buy it. The second best. No, no, the best day is when you. The second best day is when you buy a boat. And the. The best day is when you sell it.

[George Dunham]

Yeah, I've heard that, and I totally disagree because I have not been able to part with this boat since I was six months old. And now I'm 60 years old now. And then the tale of old Blue. We moved to Chicago, and at that point, we didn't use it nearly as much because we didn't have as many lakes around us. Lake Michigan, which old Blue did go out on, made my mom really nervous because we'd be going through some big waves.

[Craig Miller]

It's like going on the ocean.

[George Dunham]

My dad always said it had a deep V hole, so it can handle those waves. And I was right at the front of that boat, hanging on, and I thought it was the greatest thing ever. And we made several attempts to catch lake trout out of Lake Michigan. I don't think it ever worked. My dad and I would fish a lot of times. And not catch anything. But that, that was okay because it was just great father son time fishing on the boat. But then when we moved back to Texas, that's when old Blue and I really became close because my dad would drop my friends and I off at the lake. I'd back it in because his back started giving him trouble. And we would stay out on Lake LBJ at least once or twice a week, all day long.

[Craig Miller]

That's great.

[George Dunham]

An old Blue skiing driving over in my. This would make me, as a parent, so nervous now, but we would jump off cliffs on the other side of the lake and we just.

[Gordon Keith]

That was not in the boat.

[George Dunham]

No, no, you jump. We'd put the boat. We'd put the boat on a sandbar and then swim to the shore. And I checked it out for everybody. I swam down 20ft. I said, yeah, it's plenty deep here. I think we're good. It was just crazy that we did that. There could have been a. Yeah, like.

[Gordon Keith]

There'S not a boulder right next to it. You don't know.

[George Dunham]

Yeah, that was crazy. But, yeah, just endless summers on that boat. And again when my brothers and sisters would come in town, well, a lot of times, hey, you want to try to ski again? You skied since you're in high school, you're in college. And they could until, you know, they were well into adulthood and started having kids. And then when we moved to. To Dallas, Old Blue stayed in the resort and Horseshoe Bay. So it only get used two or three times a year and then maybe once a year.

[Gordon Keith]

So wait, it was down there? Was anybody living down there with it? No, just rental slip.

[George Dunham]

Yeah, dry storage. But when we would go down there, in fact, one time at training camp when it was in Austin with the Dallas Cowboys, I told you guys, hey, my parents have a condominium. They have a boat. Let's go up there one weekend. And Gordon was protesting the whole time. I don't know. That sounds dumb. I don't know if I want to do that. But we did it. And we had fun, didn't we? We went out blue.

[Gordon Keith]

We had dumb fun.

[George Dunham]

He's still that way, but, yeah, you guys got to go out on Old Blue. And then my kids did, and I thought that was really cool. And then as my parents got older, we just didn't have time for Old Blue. I didn't have time because I was working and I didn't know my wife, and I didn't have a house with a garage to keep it. And so I stored it in. My wife's uncle's barn for years. About 10 years after my parents got sick and we didn't really go use Old Blue anymore, which is great for a boat. It's terrible for a boat. It's that there, the rodents call it. Yeah. Gosh. Yeah. The. The, the motor froze up. The. The floor rotted out. And I didn't know this, but for my 40th birthday behind the scenes, my wife had that boat towed to a boat dealership. They replaced the floor, they replaced the motor. They called it Pimp My Boat. They really got into the, like a 1965 Tim Craft. I never even heard of that boat. And for my 40th birthday party, we were out on the dock and here comes Old Blue around the corner with my kids on it and a couple of my friends and my brothers. And it was just an awesome.

[Gordon Keith]

Oh, that's awesome. Credible memory and an incredible gift.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

That you paid for. But.

[George Dunham]

Yeah, I did.

[Gordon Keith]

But the thought. I mean, that was very, very, incredibly sweet of her to think of that and to execute that whole plan.

[George Dunham]

So it's still around and it's in a dry storage place again. And just like some of your old typewriters, guitars that you talked about. And you have an old car, too, that's.

[Gordon Keith]

Which is a Buick Electra.

[George Dunham]

Electra, yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

And I need to get rid of.

[George Dunham]

You can't part with it. I keep saying, okay, I'm going to get it going, I'm going to get it running. I'm going to fix that leak. And I'm. And I haven't done it yet, but I still have Old Blue. It's not our primary boat boating is something that I.

[Gordon Keith]

Wait a second. This statement needs to be examined.

[George Dunham]

That's something that I passed on to my kids was. That was our place where we would spend time as a family. Was at the lake. And it was wonderful as they grew up, especially my youngest, he really grew up at the lake and learning how to wakeboard and then learning how to surf and. Yeah. So lake still a big part of our. Of our family get togethers. And now my grandkids are saying, can we go see Old Blue? And I say, yeah, here it is. How come it's not in the water?

[Gordon Keith]

Well, it's. It's rotting once again. But it's the thought.

[George Dunham]

And people, even people in my own family, just say, why don't you just retire it? Why don't you put it somewhere? And. Well, I have put it somewhere and I will get it going one more time.

[Craig Miller]

You should never get rid of it. Back to my episode of Things We Love, talking about the bicycle. I restored my very first racing bike, and it's in perfect condition now. It's in my study on display, and I look at it every day, and it brings me joy to look at it every day. I haven't ridden it. I probably will at some point go out and ride it, and I'll be appalled at how ancient it is and how it probably doesn't function like today's bikes. But those items, and in this case, a boat, they have such a special place in your life. You should never get rid of that.

[George Dunham]

No. And, you know, not just the gatherings, but here we were, I was eight years old, living in Chicago, and the boat's in the garage. And I think, okay, if I got a couple of my friends, we could wheel that thing out and then just put, you know, some boards under the wheels.

[Gordon Keith]

And the object of so many boyhood fantasies about getting that thing going again and finishing it somewhere.

[George Dunham]

And. And we would take it out in the driveway, and I would wash it. And then my dad would get home and I'd say, hey, look, the boat's clean for the summertime. Let's go. And he's why, it really looks good. You use polish on that. And I went and got fiberglass polish. And I always. Yeah, I used to stare at that boat and just think of everything. Where we've been on it, where we might go. I always thought it'd be cool to take it on the Intercoastal Waterway from, like, Florida up to the Carolinas. Maybe that's what I'll do. I'll get it fixed up and take that trip, maybe with a couple of my kids, and we'll take one big ride.

[Gordon Keith]

Well, that also is the boat that you've designated for your Viking funeral, too, isn't it?

[George Dunham]

Yeah, that was my brother's idea for a business that instead of just the traditional funeral, that we would get old boats and we would bury you. Not at sea, probably an area lake. And we'd get a. An archer who had a flaming arrow, and it would light the whole thing up. It'd be great environmentally, I don't know.

[Gordon Keith]

But burn right there on the funeral pyre on the middle of a boat in Lake Texoma.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

With the permit you need for that.

[Craig Miller]

It's like cremation. It's a different form of cremation.

[George Dunham]

It's just a different form. I think it's a lot more fun for the family. But you.

[Gordon Keith]

But didn't you also have the Idea that you wanted to load it up with high horsepower engines and then just point it towards the dam with your body on.

[George Dunham]

That's what I've told my family. Yeah. You just aim me at the dam and put the throttle down.

[Gordon Keith]

Yes.

[George Dunham]

And then watch the explosion. Put some extra gas cans in there and just put on a heck of a show.

[Craig Miller]

I've always thought that if I was given two weeks to live and I didn't want to deal with, you know, a lot of pain at the end of my life, that I would just want to get on my bicycle, go to the steepest mountain I could find, and just point it downhill and just go. And when the first switchback comes, don't steer. Just go straight off the edge. And I die on my bike.

[George Dunham]

Okay, let's go ahead and make the pact. I'll hit the dam and you hit miss the switchback on your way down. Going 60 miles an hour.

[Craig Miller]

And Gordo can drown himself in Lee Harvey Oswald's bathtub.

[Gordon Keith]

What? I don't. I've didn't listen to the episodes. I don't know what you're talking about.

[George Dunham]

So that is a passion and one that's, I don't know, kind of strange, I guess, that I've still held on to that thing for so long and so many since the year you're going to finally get rid of old Blue and maybe take it to a boat. They have boat museums. I don't know.

[Gordon Keith]

Boat graveyards.

[George Dunham]

Yeah, they probably do. Also known as junkyards.

[Gordon Keith]

So is Tim Craft in any way related to Chris Craft? Like, are they brothers or something?

[George Dunham]

No, I don't think so. It was. It was made. Here's the unstable thing. It was. It was made in Gatesville, Texas, but it was assembled, I believe, in San Antonio at a furniture store.

[Gordon Keith]

Really?

[George Dunham]

Yeah. Tim Craft, they didn't. Only lasted like five years or so. And I wonder. That's the other thing. Why I don't get rid of it. It might be. I. It may be the only floating Timcraft left. Wow. They didn't make just a whole lot of them. And I've looked for them online and can't find them anywhere. Tem Craft, if you ever want to look up what a Tim Craft.

[Gordon Keith]

It'S like Temu. Temu Craft.

[George Dunham]

Kind of like that. So that's a passion that I still have. Still love going to the lake, still love spending time on the boat. And there's something about looking back at the wake, like if I'm not driving, I'm looking at the wake to me, that is really peaceful. Taking on either smooth water or taking on some chop in a boat. It's still. That's where I just feel at home, you know, three years old again on the rail of Old Blue up front and the bow riding. And that just takes me back to that. And I still feel just at home on a boat, not in the ocean. On a lake.

[Craig Miller]

Yeah. You don't like the ocean? It can be very rhythmic and hypnotic and relaxing because you're on water and.

[George Dunham]

Well, yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

And I have a. It's similar to yours, Georgia. I totally understand the getting that because my grandparents grew up on a lake. They lived on a lake. And we spent so much time at my grandparents. You know, a lot of people have grandparents live across the country. Yeah, I've met them twice kind of thing. But my childhood was spent with my grandparents a lot.

[George Dunham]

That's awesome.

[Gordon Keith]

Every summer, every Christmas, every Thanksgiving, every Fourth of July, every so. And they lived on a lake. Now, the boat that I got to ride around in was a john boat that had a 6 horsepower Johnson on the back of it.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

But it was the first vehicle that I was allowed to take out on my own. You know, this is one that you. You have to sit back by the engine and you have the little, you know, the handle. Handle there that you twist the throttle on that. But I got to ride around that lake, which was a 200 acre lake or something, which I thought that's what lakes were.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

Then I moved here and then Texoma. Wait a second. This is not the ocean. This is a lake. I can't see the other side. Um, but yeah, that I totally identified. And hearing you describe being out on the lake brings back so many memories for me.

[George Dunham]

Sound of that outboard engine starting up.

[Gordon Keith]

Yes. And that was a two stroke. My. My granddad's was a two stroke, so he had the oil mixture in the gas.

[George Dunham]

Oh, yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

Which is the best smell ever.

[George Dunham]

That. That is the best smell ever.

[Craig Miller]

I love hearing you guys and the stories of your grandparents and all the time you got to spend with your grandparents. Three of my four grandparents died before I was born, so I never. I never had those memories to make. So I appreciate your stories.

[George Dunham]

Well, my other passion. I'm sorry for your losses before you were born.

[Craig Miller]

I appreciate that.

[Gordon Keith]

I'm not sorry for them.

[Craig Miller]

I don't appreciate.

[George Dunham]

Sorry you didn't get to spend more time with your grandparents because grandparents are awesome.

[Gordon Keith]

I'm sorry your. Your three grandparents that died didn't have a boat. That's the only part.

[George Dunham]

I'm sorry, you didn't say that. They may have.

[Craig Miller]

No, they didn't.

[George Dunham]

Okay.

[Craig Miller]

Not a one of them.

[George Dunham]

Okay.

[Gordon Keith]

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[George Dunham]

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[Gordon Keith]

He's such a former athlete that can't let go of his glory days.

[George Dunham]

Well, this was when I was 7 years old and all my brothers and sisters, I'm the youngest of five. They were all swimmers and really good swimmers, really. Four of them to some degree swam when they were in college. But they were all in competitive swimming growing up and I was a little behind because most of them had gone off to college and no one was around to teach me how to swim all the different strokes, backstroke and breaststroke and butterfly and free. And my brother, who was really a good swimmer, Rick, came home one summer and we had a swim club right behind us in Chicago. And he was going to be an assistant coach on the team. And so I wanted to be on the team and I'd go to work out. You know, I wasn't very good, and he didn't have much time to spend with me and. But he taught me how to swim butterfly, with one exception. He didn't teach me how to breathe, to take a breath, to put your head up and then, you know, bring your, your hands over. So it came time for a meet and I told him, I said, I think I'm ready to swim. He said, you're not ready to swim? I said, no, I think I am. And I said, but I don't want to get disqualified by stepping on the bottom because I don't think I can make it 25 yards, one lap of the pool without stepping on the bottom. And he said, well, okay, then don't swim. But I want to swim. He said, okay, you're going to have to figure it out. So I remember standing on the side of the pool getting ready for my race, and I'm one of six swimmers, seven years old. Swimmers, take your mark. And my thought was, I just won't breathe. I'll just do a no breather and just go all the way down. And the story goes that about halfway down I had the lead because I actually had a pretty good butterfly. But then it came to, okay, I've got to take a breath. And I took the most ridiculous porpoise coming up for desperation breath. Didn't touch the bottom.

[Gordon Keith]

You look like Shamu coming up out of the pool at SeaWorld.

[George Dunham]

And apparently, according to my brother, it just took forever for me to get my breath go back in. And then I'm kind of defeated. And I got tangled up in the lane, flailing, flailing, and. But I finished and I did not touch the bottom. And my brother grabs me out of the water. Yeah, we did it. You did it. You did it. And he said, we'll work on the breathing thing, you know, and this is so great. I'm so proud of you and all this stuff. And so I thought, you know, it was the best, even though I got last place. But the head coach of that team, that night, I was waiting for my brother, and the head coach of that team said, hey, come here for a second. And he said, that was really brave. What you did tonight. And this is what goes to winners. And it was the. It looks purple now. It's a blue first place ribbon. No tag on the back to say what it was.

[Craig Miller]

Wow, that used to be blue.

[George Dunham]

It was, yeah, that's how old it is.

[Craig Miller]

Wow.

[George Dunham]

And all my. So after that, I took that as confirmation of I can do this and I ran home, showed my parents and everything, but I didn't show anyone else this ribbon because I didn't win anything. I didn't do anything that was really, you know, significant outside of what it meant to me. And the rest of the time. When I was swimming in the summer, Trident Conference, Fairwind Swim Club, I dominated. I became a good swimmer for, for my age group and especially in the summertime because I really liked swimmin for fair wind br rile and the winter wasn't as much fun. It was kind of a labor and. But I've hung onto this ribbon all my other first place ribbons and trophies. I threw them away, but I kept that because it really taught me a powerful lesson of, you tried, you stepped out, scared to death. Those, those swim meets, they would have 200 people. It might as well have been 200,000 people.

[Craig Miller]

They were nationally televised, weren't they?

[George Dunham]

You felt like it was, you felt like, oh my God, everybody in the world is watching right now. And finished.

[Craig Miller]

And that's great that coach did that for you.

[Gordon Keith]

Yeah.

[George Dunham]

And that saying about, well, you don't give ribbons to everyone. Well, you know what? Maybe sometime you should because here, 50 some odd years later, I still have that as and I've kept it all these times of, okay, this is going to be tough. You're going to have to work through this. And I've looked down at that ribbon.

[Gordon Keith]

But he gave it to you not as, hey, you did win first place. He gave it to you as, this is what you win when you win first place and this is what you're going for and I have faith that you're going to get one of these.

[George Dunham]

And he appreciated, he said no one out there gave a better effort than you did. And this is a ribbon for that effort. And you take that and you work with it. And by the next summer, I was winning blue ribbons and red ribbons and yeah, it was, it was a really cool moment.

[Gordon Keith]

And do you still swim competitively?

[George Dunham]

No, I don't. I still swim and I still like the water. The water feels great to me, but it's weird. I like outdoor swimming. My brother and I sometimes will go to a facility and we'll work out together and he still swims laps and I'm kind of barely making it through. That's not fun to me. But swimming outside in an outside pool because it reminds me of Fair Wind. And I always had better times in the summer than I did in the winter. The winter just seemed like drudgery. 2 hour workouts. I wouldn't get home till 9 or 9:30. Tack on violin practice along with that. And it was just, it seemed just like it wasn't fun, but that was fun.

[Craig Miller]

Takes a special discipline to be a swimmer because you're doing laps in a pool and all you are looking at is that black line on the bottom of the pool over and over and over and over. You're not looking at anything else. So you're really, you're captive with your mind.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Craig Miller]

The only thing you have and it's. Yeah, it's tough.

[George Dunham]

And to my brothers and sisters, that's still a great feeling for them. That's where my, my sister talks about it all the time. She swims somewhat competitively. Her husband does, in fact is one of the best master swimmers in the country now. But she works out three, four, five times a week and she loves that. It's still really cathartic to her and I can understand that. But it hurts to me it, you know, to go any sort of distance. But maybe I'll, I'll stretch out that distance. But it gave me that, that entry to sports competing. And then I discovered football and the Cowboys and trying to play other sports like football. I was so bad, but I wanted to play it because I love the game so much. I wanted to be the next Roger Stallback or I wanted to be, you know, the next Randy White. And I was just a horrible football player. But then I discovered golf. My dad played golf. None of the other kids did, but I did and loved that and therefore stretch, I'd say from junior high till my senior year in high school, I was all about golf. I just was convinced that's that was my way in the world. I was going to play golf and I was going to go on the PGA Tour. And a few episodes back I talked about my golf career in college that lasted three days. Walked on at North Texas, then was told to walk off. I guess that's when the dream officially died that I wasn't going to be on the PGA Tour. But then watching my kids in sports and from little league baseball to high school football, just the competition of it is in probably an overused word now, the process of it was really Cool to me. And this job that we've had, being in sports radio for all these years has, has been a way for me to be around sports. And when I was doing play by play at North Texas and getting to be around those teams, that was really cool to me to see them put in all that work. Sometimes not be paid for it with wins or conference championships or something like that. But just being around a team as they go through a season was just, it was fascinating. And I just had such a great appreciation for the work that goes into it from coaches and trainers and the players. And being around a team was really, really something special.

[Craig Miller]

You know, from our standpoint of being reporters, journalists, if you will, talk show hosts at our radio gig. Like you, I grew up passionate about sports, and it's all I thought about. Has the job taken that love away from you and sports? A little bit. And that I've found that with me over the years. You're so analytically looking at these games, you're not really looking at them from a fan's perspective anymore. You're thinking, okay, tomorrow on our radio show, how am I going to break down this defensive performance? What am I going to say about this athlete who lost his mind? All of that. And that's taken away a little bit of the passion for me that I had when I was younger about sports.

[George Dunham]

It has. It's maybe a little more cynical, but with the ability to watch my own kids compete and then not really worrying about, you know, analyzing the game. I just want them to win. Their coach or. Yeah. Or doing that, or my son who's still coaching. You know, I'll probably think, oh, man, they should have done that. Or they should have done that. But I'm just. It's turned me back into a sports fan of, man, I hope they win. Yeah, I hope, I hope he does well. And I, that was my, my advice to him when I was coaching and in baseball or if it was basketball, or my oldest son who played golf and was really good, sometimes that's what I would tell him. Well, what advice do you have? Compete. You have the ability to compete. That's what's so great about sports. It's not scripted. You don't know how it's going to turn out. And in terms of golf, you may have the round of your life today, but, you know, you may struggle and you may have to somehow come back. And I remember one of his rounds when he was in high school, he had really bad luck in the first couple of holes and he started off five over. Sounds like me in the first two holes. Yeah, one of my rounds too. But I was so proud of him because he came back and he's going into 16 now, one under par. And he had these coaches watched him because, man, look at this kid hit it. And it was at regionals and I never made it to regionals as a high school golfer. And I remember. And then it kind of fell apart for him in the final couple of holes. But I just remember thinking, you know, all these years I've told you just to get out there and compete. And that's one of the greatest examples of competing I've ever seen. You were five over. After two, you're, you're gone. Yeah, you're not going to help your team, but you came back and you put up a good score that they took that day and it was a very respectable score. So, yeah, that's. It has taken away some of the joy being in the business that we are in sports talk radio. But I still love the competition. I still love the games, I still love the stories, the undrafted free agent, the walk on, who. Who makes it as a starting quarterback. That stuff to me is still awesome. It still drives me, it still gives me a passion for, for what we do of sometimes it's, it's not a. Hey, they're not. This, they're not. This is. Sometimes we come in and talk about, could you believe that game last night? They were down to their last strike and they came back and somehow won that thing that still drives me every day to do our show.

[Gordon Keith]

Yeah, I still see that boyish enthusiasm in you as, as a fan. Certainly of the three of us, you still get the most, man. I believe, I believe. What if, yeah, what if this could be happen?

[Craig Miller]

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[George Dunham]

Availability varies.

[Gordon Keith]

Brooks Running reminds us that we're all powered by something. Whether it's the me time energy of a run after a day at the office, the electrifying energy of Your first marathon or the infectious energy of a.

[George Dunham]

Group run with your friends.

[Gordon Keith]

No matter what energy powers you, Brooks has gear specifically designed to unleash it. So lace up and let it out. Let's run there. Visit BrooksRunning.com today to learn more.

[George Dunham]

Okay, so the other one, I broke it down to three categories. Boats, sports, and then music. And I mentioned about my first memory, moving to Minneapolis at the age of three. And my next memory may have been when my brother came home to see us in Minneapolis. My oldest brother. And I've got a picture of that moment. And we were sitting on our piano bench, and Minneapolis, and here comes my brother home for Christmas, and he's got his guitar, and he played a Buck Owen song, truck Driving Man. And I said, play that again. And I remember sitting right next to him, and there's a picture of us that I still have to this day. And a whole world just opened up to me of, wow, that is amazing. How does he know who. Who came up with that song? How does my brother know it? And what he was doing in that guitar, that was just incredible. And I think I was 4. I don't remember this, but apparently that same brother, he was in a band in high school, and they would practice at our house before my dad got home from work. Very important, because my dad thought rock and roll was going to be the end of this world World War II vet who didn't get it, didn't get Elvis, didn't get the Beatles. But they would practice. My mom would let them practice at our house. And this is the age difference. My brother is about to graduate high school, and I'm 2 years old, shy of 2 years old, still in diapers and apparently hanging onto that same piano bench and dancing to every song that they played. Beach Boys, Beatles. And I don't remember it, but my siblings do. And they say, oh, yeah, for the entire practice, you would spend it dancing, listening to your brother's music. And that's. I guess that's where it started for me. But we'll. We'll talk about getting back into music. And when I was in high school, I thought about, you know, taking some guitar and learning how to play guitar and had some friends who played guitar. And so we got this makeshift band together. And where did all bands start in high school? The talent show. Right. And so that was at the time where the Stones were doing this tour and a video that always played on MTV was them doing Going to a Go Go, the old Smokey Robinson song. And so we tried out and made it. And if you could get through a song, kind of like, I was so impressed with my brother getting through a song when I was four, for some reason. Among your high school classmates, if you could get through a song, you were a rock and roll. You were legit. How do you do that? How do you know that Kiss song? Or how do you know that Beatles song? Or in this case, Rolling Stones. And the place just went crazy.

[Gordon Keith]

This is your high school senior year?

[George Dunham]

This was my senior year. Yeah. We tried out my junior year and didn't make it because we were a little too loud and a little too metal. We tried out with Judas Priest when I was a junior. We didn't make it.

[Gordon Keith]

And this was the band Pegasus, I believe.

[George Dunham]

Yes. Pegasus. That didn't last too long.

[Gordon Keith]

I have a picture of the band Pegasus.

[George Dunham]

Do you really?

[Gordon Keith]

I don't know how I ended up with it, but it's a picture of you up there, and you're wearing a sleeveless white shirt.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

And I think, like, a red bandana was somewhere on your body, and you're wearing, like, tan, tight pants.

[George Dunham]

And I was impersonating Mick Jagger, and I was really skinny back then.

[Gordon Keith]

Yeah, you're like a bean pole.

[George Dunham]

I was just a bean pole. And I could pull it off. And the place just went nuts. And I remember just thinking, this is the greatest feeling I've ever had. I've never been a part of something like this. Orchestra concerts we play, people barely applaud. But now people that I care about what their opinion is of me are just going absolutely crazy out there.

[Craig Miller]

It's intoxicating.

[George Dunham]

Yeah. And I thought, okay, I'm gonna be in a band. And then I thought, there's no way my parents would disown me if all I did was rock music and I was in a band. And I think back at that, and I've heard since my sister was at this performance that night, sitting next to my parents, and she told me recently, I said, gosh, mom and dad must have just been. I bet my dad couldn't even watch. And she said, no, they thought it was great. And I wish I would have known that then, because I would have, because.

[Gordon Keith]

Then you could have been a rock and roll.

[George Dunham]

It could have been a rock and roll star.

[Craig Miller]

I was gonna say, as much as they wanted you and all of you kids to get into music, I would think they would have supported that, you.

[George Dunham]

Know, said, whatever you do, don't get in a rock band. I just.

[Gordon Keith]

You just assumed it.

[George Dunham]

I just assumed it. And I Just thought, boy, dad's not gonna like this. But apparently they got a real kick out of it. And it wasn't that hard drive in a song. It's an old song Going to a Go Go came out in the late 50s or early 60s. So I think my dad kind of went, okay, this is all right. You know, and that's my. That's my son. Yeah. Up there. And, yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

Videotape of this performance, I think there is.

[Craig Miller]

Wow.

[George Dunham]

And I haven't seen it in 20 years. And I remember when I saw it 20 years ago, I went, oh, my God, we were horrible.

[Gordon Keith]

Yeah, it's. It's. It's so much worse than you remember.

[George Dunham]

It, because we had. We were not all in the same PA system. I was singing over the auditorium pa.

[Gordon Keith]

Then there was then the guitar amps are not mic. They just.

[George Dunham]

Right, that's.

[Gordon Keith]

The amps are what's providing that sound. And then usually drummers had no mics on them. So it was just the drum sound, no mics.

[George Dunham]

I could barely hear that. It was so.

[Gordon Keith]

Worst mix ever.

[George Dunham]

And I remember right before we went out, the guys who were playing guitar going, hey, I'm turning up. And I was like, well, wait, wait, wait. We got to have some sort of balance here. And then it was just on. But that was. You know, we played a couple of things after that. And then there was when my freshman year in college, we got back together and practiced because my friend who was at SMU said, hey, come play a fraternity party. But we got together and realized, how long do we have to play? Because I don't think we can do more than five or six songs. This better be a really short party.

[Craig Miller]

Yeah.

[Gordon Keith]

You have two sets, and they're an hour and a half.

[Craig Miller]

Each play the same song over and over.

[George Dunham]

Right. So I. I let that go. And, you know, I've always loved music, and Craig and I really bonded over you two over the years. And music was always a big part of. When we were in college, we had albums, and we'd listen to albums, and, you know, I've always loved that. But then I became a young father, and even playing guitar on the side or violin, I just. I didn't pick it up for years and years. And then after my parents passed, if you Fast forward another 20 years or so, I'm now in my 40s. I just thought about, man, I haven't played my guitar in a long time. So I picked it up and started playing. And then this epiphany happened where I saw Lou Holtz of all people talk about the. One of the times he was fired.

[Gordon Keith]

This isn't a dream.

[George Dunham]

No, no. I saw it on espn just one day. And he said, yeah. First time I got fired, I just wrote down a list of things I was going to do, and I said, okay, that's a pretty good idea. And I was in my 40s thinking, you only have so much time on this earth. So I wrote down things I want to do, and one of them was, I want to play music again. I want to play guitar again. I want to be in a band, even if it's for one more day. Just one day. I want to do that. And I want to write music, and I want to. I want to record at least one song if I'm able to write something.

[Craig Miller]

I never knew Lou Holtz was behind this.

[George Dunham]

Yeah. And I just wrote down another one of the things, and I cannot find this list anywhere. I wrote down, like, 10 things.

[Craig Miller]

If you had given me 1 million guesses, I would not have guessed that.

[Gordon Keith]

Lou Holtz figured primary musical inspiration for.

[Craig Miller]

Music in your later life.

[George Dunham]

I love the Bird Dogs. It's really good. And. And so I. I wrote down this list, and one of the things I wrote on that list was, someday hold a grandchild. I wrote that down. I remember that. But I don't know where this list is. I've looked for it and can't find it.

[Gordon Keith]

And the last one was, never lose.

[George Dunham]

This list, don't lose list.

[Gordon Keith]

That's one of my goals, is to never lose it.

[Craig Miller]

Next to last was never do a podcast.

[George Dunham]

I don't know what that is exactly, but I'm not going to do one. So about the same time, same brother who played guitar in front of me when I was four years old, came down from Kansas because I'd started listening to Texas music, and I knew that he had, too. And he came down and he said, hey, let's go see Randy Rogers at Billy Bob's. And so we took my middle son. He was 16 at the time. And I remember being really excited, like, I was going to my first concert all over again. Hadn't been to a concert in years. And I was with my brother. Never been to a concert with my brother. And he was excited, and he had a kind of a slow draw and said, yeah, maybe even tonight. Oh, Blake, you get him a sip at Billy Bob's, you know, so Blake's your son? Blake's my son.

[Gordon Keith]

16 years old.

[George Dunham]

16 years old. And we all got a kick out of that. And for all I know, he Met up with some friends. He may have gotten his first sip that night at Billy Bob's, but we saw Randy Rogers. And all that time that I spent as a kid listening to my Brothers and Sisters albums, being on the stage at R.L. turner at the talent show, being on a piano bench with my brother at four years old, listening to a Buck Owen song, all those things rolled into one. Playing violin for all those years and seeing the Randy Rogers Band and hearing these songs, Some of them I was familiar with. Most of them I was not hearing Brady Black play fiddle like that. I just had this moment of Tad, this is it. This is what you did all those years ago. And he goes, I know. This is the Texas sound that I remember from the 70s. And he said, I love this. And I said, what do you think about writing songs together? He goes, yeah, I got some ideas. And so I went home, and from that day on, I started writing music and I started writing songs. And he did, too. And he helped me write eight or nine songs. And I started the band the Bird Dogs. And I thought, okay, we're just going to play at least one gig. And we played that first gig in 2008, and here we are going 17 years later and about to put out our fourth record. That records that no one has really heard, but we've produced them, we've written and arranged over 50 songs. And it all started with just that love of music, that passion for music and what it does to your soul and what it does to your heart.

[Craig Miller]

Where was that first gig?

[George Dunham]

It was at the Green Elephant, just right off of Greenville in Dallas.

[Craig Miller]

The Green Elephant.

[George Dunham]

And I think we had eight songs. And I didn't know how we were going to make it, how I was going to make it through eight songs. And, you know, now we'll go play 14, 15 song sets and not think a thing about it. But eight songs? How am I going to remember eight songs just like that, when I was four years old, how's my brother know one song, let alone eight songs? And you got to remember the words. And somehow we got through it. I was really bad. Not that I'm any good now, but I can get through a song. And yeah, it is because of that passion. And it's been. It's been really cool because, as I said in a previous episode, I felt like I was called to do it. I know that sounds kind of corny, but I was called to go back to music, to pick up a fiddle again, to pick up a guitar again, to do something with it. And Then do it for good. Not to sell out an arena, but to, you know, do it for the Senior Source of Greater Dallas for serve Denton for the LV project. And if you add everything up as a sidebar to all of this and what turns out to be, I think the most important thing to all this, we have made a difference with music and we've raised 1.5 for the senior source and I estimate more than a half million for other charities over the last 17 years. Just doing some of these events that we've done.

[Craig Miller]

Yeah, that's great. So huge Jub jam has turned into such a great event. That's your passion project and it's just, it's like the best event of the year.

[George Dunham]

And so this year it came full circle. This year's feature performer, it was Randy Rogers and Brady Black. And being up on that stage playing some of their songs, Brady played some of our songs with us. I just remember thinking, I never would have believed this back in 2007, in December at Billy Bob's where Blake got his first sip, probably, and I was standing next to my brother just like I was when I was 4 and he would have been 20 coming back from college and playing that old Buck Owens song. It all just went totally full circle for me.

[Gordon Keith]

That had to be one of those movie moments for you in the movie of your life. Like that's a highlight when that came full circle and you're up on stage with the guy who inspired you to play to begin with. Yeah, it was a great night. That was also the night where I contracted the coronavirus and lost my sense of smell.

[George Dunham]

Sorry about that. I'm so sorry about that. I sure hope you get it back.

[Gordon Keith]

Yeah, thanks.

[George Dunham]

So here's another full circle moment. As I mentioned, we're working on our fourth record. It's going to be called see you soon. I played that song for you a little bit on our radio show a few weeks back. There's another song on it that's called I can still find it. And it's see us soon was the last really word words in person that I heard from my sister who had pancreatic cancer after I'd taken a three day visit to see her in Iowa. And I went home and wrote a song for her called see you soon. And the last conversation that I had with my brother was because of music. And I went up and he was in really bad shape, hadn't talked, he had dementia. And I played some of her old favorite songs for him. And a guy who hadn't talked in weeks, sang for an hour and a half.

[Craig Miller]

I remember this story. That's amazing what music can do.

[George Dunham]

Yeah. And for the rest of his life, he lived two more months. After that, he didn't. He never had another day like that.

[Craig Miller]

Wow.

[George Dunham]

And even after that, that singing, it brought out him saying a few things to his wife and to his son and to me, and that was so powerful. It's like, see, this music does matter. So I can still find it. It's. It's about being on Old Blue. It's about being around the people that I love. And it starts with the last voice message that I got from my brother, who would never leave long messages. He'd just say, hey, holla. And I knew it was him, so I knew I had to call him. And I went back in my phone and I. Oh, wow. I've still got one more message from Tad. So that's how the song starts.

[Craig Miller]

That's awesome.

[George Dunham]

It's not very country. It's kind of YouTube crashes into Neil Young somehow. If we were reviewing this song on our radio show, we'd say, could we get to it already?

[Gordon Keith]

This is very YouTube, that guitar in particular.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Craig Miller]

You'Re right, though. It's also Neil Young.

[George Dunham]

Yeah.

[Craig Miller]

I like it.

[George Dunham]

I'm very down in the mix here because I had a hard time with the rhythm.

[Gordon Keith]

But you're in your guitar or you're. You're actually singing here, and I'm just not hearing here.

[George Dunham]

Comes singing here. Okay. Yeah. Back when we would listen to records like Mango, one by one One left home Youngest of five I was left alone don't hurt looking back I can rewind it Be reminded no don't hurt looking back don't revive yeah I could be blinded I can still find so, yeah, looking back for me I can still find it I can still. I mean, imagine all of those times, moving from San Antonio, sitting on that piano bench with my brother. I can still find does hurt but it's okay it's okay that it hurts but I can still look back and.

[Craig Miller]

Find it all those passions, all those loves. If your radio career hadn't worked out, would you rather it have worked out where you were a boat salesman, an Olympic swimmer, an NFL quarterback, or a music star?

[George Dunham]

I'm going to take boat salesman who had a Neil Young tribute band on the weekends.

[Gordon Keith]

You could probably find one of those in Louisville right now.

[George Dunham]

Drinks a lot of beers, probably smokes, you know, but he'll make you a good deal on a glass draw.

[Gordon Keith]

Great deal.

[George Dunham]

Make you a great deal.

[Gordon Keith]

Come on down.

[George Dunham]

See him. So those are the three things that I'm passionate about still to this day. Boats, sports, and music. Was that fun? That was fun. Well, thank you. Thank you for putting up with me and yeah, putting up with a few bars of a bird dog song from our fourth album. See you soon. And we'll talk to you soon on another episode of the Musers, the podcast.

[Gordon Keith]

Man who doesn't love them? Some jubjub.

[George Dunham]

Don't forget whatever.

[Gordon Keith]

You're listening to this on, follow or subscribe.

[George Dunham]

That way you'll get every episode when.

[Gordon Keith]

It appears on Wednesday and also the new upcoming Thursday Cowboys Weekly special. You can also reach out to the musers on email themuserspot gmail.com the musers the podcast is a tired head production.

[George Dunham]

Oh, you okay, Gordon?

[Gordon Keith]

That was you.

[George Dunham]

One mate.

[Gordon Keith]

Like a cow.

[George Dunham]

For a limited time at McDonald's, get.

[Gordon Keith]

A Big Mac Extra Value Meal for $8.

[George Dunham]

That means two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun and medium fries. And a drink. We may need to change that jingle.

[Gordon Keith]

Prices and participation may vary.