← The Naval Aviation Ready Room Podcast with Ryan Keys
The Naval Aviation Ready Room Podcast with Ryan Keys
From Fleet to Formation: Armatas on Mastery in Naval Aviation
00:57:36
In this episode, Cmdr. Alexander “A-Train” Armatas, former Commanding Officer and Flight Leader of the U.S. Navy Blue Angels — delivers a masterclass on precision aviation, leadership under pressure, and the mindsets that separate good aviators from elite ones. Drawing from his career as a fleet fighter pilot and Blue Angel, Armatas explains how focus, trust, and communication shape both combat aviation and world-class formation flying.
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A
I decided that if I'm going to go into aviation, into military aviation, I want to do the hardest thing there is to do in military aviation. And many would agree that's landing a high performance jet aircraft on a carrier at night.
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Welcome to the Naval Aviation Ready Room
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podcast, where the stories, leadership and leading
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edge technology of naval aviation come alive.
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Hosted by retired Navy Captain Ryan Keyes,
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this podcast takes you beyond mere museum artifacts as he delves into the personal
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stories, pivotal decisions, and state of the
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art hardware that define the world's most prolific aviation force. Welcome to the Ready Room. And today's episode takes us into the cockpit of modern naval aviation excellence with a leader whose story spans combat missions, carrier landings, elite training, and the precision flight lines of America's most iconic squadron. Joining us in the radio room is Captain Alexander Armadas, call sign scribe, former commanding officer, or boss, as they call it, and flight leader of the Navy Flight Demonstration Squadron, commonly known as the Blue Angels. Captain Armitas has logged over 4,500 flight hours and nearly 1,000 arrested carrier landings. He's led squadrons across the globe, earned some of the Navy's highest leadership honors, and commanded the skies in front of millions each year. But behind the high speed maneuvers and thunderous formations is a story of trust, discipline and leadership forged in the crucible, both war and performance. Today we'll explore what it takes to lead in the air and on the ground. From lessons learned over the Arabian Gulf to mentoring the next generation of aviators, leaders and sailors. Scribe, welcome to the radio.
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A
Hey, Ryan, thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.
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B
We tried to do this before you left the Pensacola area and moved back to Oceana. Currently in your what we call a prospective Deputy Commander Air Wing Training Track, or PDCag Track in Virginia beach, going through all the required training after your current. So I guess you'd probably have a, a smaller training syllabus to do when it comes to flying the jet, but there's some other administrative training schools you have to go to and now we're able to meet up today and actually do this. So I'm very excited. So thanks again. Appreciate it. So I should have told you this before. I'm gonna lean out just with this question right away. Strike or fighter? As a Hilo guy, I wanna know this.
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A
I love them both. I would argue in the last 20 years we've made our money in the strike world as a Navy and as a military for sure, but I love them both. I couldn't pick just one. They're both awesome. They're both different.
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B
Yeah, that's a good answer. I like that as being the leader of the strike fighter premier, like I said, you know, demonstration squadron. So that's a good answer. Thanks for that. But I'm going to put that on paper now that it's both for sure. So quickly talking, I want to start actually at the beginning. What was it that the guy interested in the Navy and ultimately getting an appointment and nomination to the Naval Academy.
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A
Great question. I get that question a fair amount. I've thought about that a lot, particularly in the last few years. And it's hard to pick one thing, but if I had to, it was probably my dad early on in my life. But he got hired on at FedEx, not as a pilot, but just as a delivery man. And one of the first jobs you did back then. And he would brag a lot about his. He had a five digit employee number. So he was pretty early in the company as it was forming. And one of the first jobs you have is you go to the airport, you unload, you load and unload the airplanes when they come in. That was up in Syracuse, New York near where I grew up. And he would take me once in a while and I got to see that orange and purple 727 at the time coming in and out of Syracuse. And that was kind of my first exposure, really kind of up close exposure to airplanes. And I can't really describe what changed there, but I really liked it. I thought it was really cool. And from there on, kind of one thing led to another. The decision to go into military aviation kind of came later. Syracuse at the time also, they still have an International Guard unit. At that time that International Guard unit was flying F16s, which was pretty cool. I think it was Memorial Day every year they would kind of take a four ship and they'd fly around all the local little towns and we'd get to see that, which was a pretty neat experience and kind of got me into the military a little bit. And then at the end of the day I decided that if I'm going to go into aviation, into military aviation, I want to do the hardest thing there is to do in military aviation. And many would agree that's landing a high performance jet aircraft on a carrier at night. So that's what kind of led me to the Navy. Obviously there was no guarantee that I have an opportunity to do that. But it did work out and I was fortunate enough to have a chance to do that. But that's kind of what led me there.
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B
That's interesting. So aviation became an interest early on in your life because of that exposure from your dad. Did you start flying when you were young, prior to the Navy? I did not do my personal or my private pilot's license at all. Did you do that beforehand?
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A
Very little. So I kind of, through a neighborhood friend, I got a job at the FBO in Syracuse. For those who don't know what an FBO is, it's basically a gas station at an airport for people passing through. That's right.
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B
That's a good way to put it, actually.
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A
Yeah. So for most of my high school and a little bit into my time at the Naval Academy, me during the summers I would work at the airport in Syracuse and just fuel planes and whatever needed to be handled and. And just kind of be around airplanes. That FBO also had a flight school, so I flew a couple times with them just to kind of get some exposure. It was a lot of fun, but nothing that I continued on, mostly because it was expensive and just didn't really have the money to do it. So the short answer to your question is I flew a couple times prior to the military, and by I literally mean a couple, like, two or three flights. And then the next time, maybe the fourth or fifth time in my life that I flew, it was paid for and supported by the Navy.
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B
Yeah, that's always the best way to get paid to fly rather than have to pay to fly.
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A
Yeah, I don't regret it for sure. It was great.
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B
That's good. Did you go to prep school at all, or are you a direct entry guy?
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A
I went to the prep school for a year. Not naps. I went to a private prep school as part of the Naval Academy Foundation.
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B
Ooh, which one?
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A
I went to the Kent School in Kent, Connecticut. Oh, yeah? Yeah.
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B
I was a foundation guy myself.
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A
Nice. Yeah. So you could probably explain it better than I can. It's hard to explain to people, but the way I explain it is they just need somewhere to put you for a year and keep you in an academic environment. So I did not get in on my first try. Went to the Kent School for a year, got it on my second try and went to the Naval Academy from there.
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B
Yeah, yeah, exactly. I would call it a 13th grade. You go do that. I actually was a. Like I said, a foundation scholarship person as well. I went to Northwestern Prep School, which at the time still in Southern California, but it's moved around differently from Malibu, California to Santa Barbara to, like, the austere desert hills, which is where when I went there. That's where it was. So I will make a plug for that and not paid to do this at all. But I will say that I think the foundation gives a hundred scholarships a year in order to do this. So they find a semi qualified candidate who probably would make it in, like I said, the next year, not this year, the current year that you're applying for. And then the foundation reaches out to you or you reach out to them and you said, hey, can I do this instead? And they're like, sure. And there's so many schools. I have friends that went to a New Mexico military institute or the Hill School or I mean, you name it. And a lot of them are east coast prep schools that are mainly used for kids.
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A
There are. There's a bunch in the Northeast, if I remember.
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B
Did I say Northwest?
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A
I'm in Northeast, but you said east coast. And I think in the Northeast in particular, there's quite a few.
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B
Yes, it is a. I want to say a cultural imperative in the Northeast almost sometimes for some families who are trying to get their children into higher education institutions, put it that way. But then the foundation will leverage them and throw like. Did you have anyone else go with you or is it just you?
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A
There were two of us in my class of whatever, 150 or 200. There were two people that were on the way to the academy.
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B
Yeah. So you could have 1, 2, 5. It just kind of depends. And then. Yes, you then apply again. And then normally it's like a 99% acceptance rate, I think after that, as long as you didn't screw it up. So. Little rabbit hole there. But an interesting aspect of actually trying to get into the naval, any one of the service academies, actually, and do that. So went to the academy. I saw your Arrow, major while you were there, man. You're a better man than me, that's for sure. I was a Group 3 English major just because I wanted to graduate. So, man, good on you.
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A
Well, if you saw my transcript, it may not be that impressive. I made it through Arrow, but I wouldn't say that I was out in front, go across the finish line, that's for sure.
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B
I gotcha. That's valid, I guess. And then graduate, obviously, get aviation, roll down to Pensacola, go through all the flight training and then select jets. And then where did you go? Did you go to Kingsville or Meridian?
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A
So I was a Meridian. I went to Meridian, which was interesting because I did primary in Corpus Christi. So I kind of assumed that I would just go to Kingsville because It's right there. But I actually went from Pensacola API to Corpus Christi Primary and then to Meridian for jets. Okay.
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B
You know, being here at the museum, I do get to interact with some of the student or the SNAs. Right. Student naval aviators who are here and I think a lot of them still try to game the system and say I really want to go jets. So I'm going to put Corpus down for primary and then I'll just stay down there and get jets because they'd rather just send me to Kingsville rather than have to send me to Meridian. But you are proof that it doesn't matter.
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A
Does not matter one bit.
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B
But you know, we all try to game the system at some time, so that's actually pretty funny. So I don't know. Have you heard the recent decision about taking CQ out of advanced training prior to wings?
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A
I have. I'm kind of on the outside looking in, but yeah, I'm aware of that and I know that there's a few things that are driving that decision, but I am tracking that. That's. It's really. I guess at this point it has happened. It's not really even a pre decision anymore.
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B
Yeah. I recently read an article that I believe was written by Sturles Gillum, the director of the museum here, because he was a big LSO in his time. And I think really it's the advancement of technology in the jets today in the F18 Super Hornet Rhino and then the replacement for the T45 and the cost savings that that brings of not having to go to have an aircraft that is carrier qual constructed. So very interesting. So selected jets and then got F18 Super Hornets out of that or. I'm sorry, were you a baby Hornet guy at first? I didn't check that out.
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A
No, I am a Rhino baby, as they say. I guess they used to say. I don't think that phrases in common usage anymore. But the Super Hornet was still relatively young when I got to the fleet. But I'm all Super Hornet. I have a grand total of 39 hours in the Hornet, which I got as an FRS instructor kind of later in my career. The rest of my flight time is Super Hornet.
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B
Wow. So you are one with the aircraft.
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A
I hope so. That's the goal. Some days are better than others.
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B
That's for every pilot for sure. So then select. Was Lamour your first choice?
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A
It was not. I don't regret spending any time there. But as I like to tell people, I went to Lamour and every time I had an Opportunity to get orders and go to a new command. I asked to go somewhere other than Lamour, typically Virginia Beach. And on the fourth or fifth try, I forget which one it was, I finally got it. So despite my best efforts to get out of amour, it took a while. Again, I don't regret it. It was awesome. And I would do it again in a heartbeat. But no, Lamour was not my first choice. At the time I finished flight school, I was. I grew up on the East Coast. I was comfortable with the East Coast. I was young and excited to get into the fleet, and Oceana looked better to me. But the Navy had other plans and off I went out to the West.
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B
Yeah, and that's another thing I try to tell these young SNAs. When I first selected in primary, I wanted P3s and got told I was going helicopters. And I wouldn't change a thing. I wouldn't go back and change the thing. So, same thing. I think flying is flying, and it's incredible any way you do it.
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A
No, I agree. And I mean, that's worth foot stomping. I've as much as people kind of wring their hands about what they're going to fly, where they're going to go, where they're going to live. I've met very, very few people who look back on it and have and are sad. Everybody loves what they do. This line of work, and just the naval aviation line of work as a large community is awesome. And I think everybody loves their little piece of it.
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B
Yeah, I agree. You know, in the moment, sometimes you could be disappointed because you didn't get what you wanted to. But if you're, in my opinion, a professional or professional about it, then you will make it work and you'll make the best of it. So Fleet Jo Tour, frs instructor tour, went through the school in Fallon and then came back. And then you were a training officer Right back to the fleet again as a patch wearer. And then, I'm sorry, was department head tour also in Lamour.
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A
Department head tour was not my first tour outside of Lemoore, was department head VFA143 out in Oceana.
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B
Oh, puking dogs.
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A
Puking dogs.
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B
Was it still in CA7 at the time?
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A
They were in CAG7, but while I was there, we switched boats. So my deployment was actually on USS Harry S. Truman, but still part of CAG 7.
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B
Got it. And then where'd you go after that?
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A
After that, I went out to Millington, went to purse 43 and was the east coast placement officer for About a year and a half in Millington doing personnel stuff, which was my lone tour not in the cockpit. So I've been extremely lucky from that perspective. But that was it. We spent some time out there. We actually really liked it. Memphis is a cool town and the job was for non flying jobs. I'm a big fan of going out there. I think you learn a lot about how Navy manpower works and you're still surrounded. You're in an office full of naval aviators. So it's still your community, it's still folks that you have a lot in common with and kind of understand. I enjoyed it.
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B
One of the things that we do down here is last night and you know what? Just had an idea. We need to get the boss over here to do this. The current boss. But the School of Aviation Safety puts on while. Remember EPCOT Aviation Co's training that goes on down here. So they're one week during safety school, the CO will bring them over to the club and there'll be like 30 of them just sitting there. And then there's a bunch of 06s and we just kind of answer questions, you know, and try to give them some perspective on 05 command and whatnot.
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A
I made it to two of the quarters, eight rings while I was there. I never made it to the O Club, but there were a couple of off weeks. Admiral Chericho at the time had the thing at his house and I made it to those.
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B
Oh, that sounds cool. Yeah, that's gotta be neat. And so we were kind of talking about purrs last night during that meeting. And one of the things I brought up was if they asked how many of them have been to a board or at least been an assistant recorder on a board. And a few did raise their hands. I made it a point that, hey, when you're in a leadership position, you're eligible to go sit on a board. You need to go do that. You know, if obviously, if you can't do a tour at PERS and kind of see how the sausage is really made, you can at least get down there for a board for a couple of weeks and really observe what I believe to be a very fair process when it comes to promotions and screenboards. So I think it's very valuable.
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A
I agree. I was fortunate enough. I was actually a board member this past March, which was my first time as a member, not the first time I'd been in the room. But I agree it is a fascinating process. It's an important process and one that to your Point I think maybe not as many people have seen it as we meet.
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B
So moved on in for everyone kind of listening to and wants to really kind of learn more about naval aviation. Those jobs at Millington are hand picked jobs. I mean for sure there's a few in the Pentagon, there's some at Millington, at Pursuit that are, let's just say the people who are on the path to command. Those are the ones that go there. So that's I think a direct reflection of your performance up to that point and then going up and then obviously screen for command. Pick the command that you want to. Maybe as a detailer, that is one of the perks.
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A
Yeah. I get to directly involve myself in that process for sure.
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B
That's probably maybe one of the first times you've ever been, I want to say, guaranteed what you're going to do for your follow on set of orders, which is great. Like I said, it's a benefit for doing that.
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A
It is great. Almost as great as that too is you have an opportunity and it oftentimes doesn't work, but you have an opportunity to pick folks to go to that command as well. Not just yourself, but you can kind of, you know. And for me personally, I really only got to choose one that the timing worked and all the pieces will fell in place. But there's an opportunity to kind of stack the deck, for lack of a better term, which is going to come up again when we talk about the Blue Angels.
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B
I totally agree. When I was the CEO of the frs, one of my mantras was building the empire and trying to bring in the best people as possible into that command. Yeah. So if you can influence that and build your team that's going to support you and support the command as a whole. I mean, why would you not do that? I think that's great. And especially with department heads because a department head or a lieutenant commander to me in a normal operational squadron, they are, I mean, pivotal to the success of the command 100%. So I want to do want to anchor here on command tour a little bit and kind of talk about maybe some leadership lessons that you got from that. So talk me through kind of when you arrived during their training the squadron or the air wings training track and kind of what you experienced when you were the skipper there.
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A
Yeah. So I was very lucky. I went to VFA 105 here in Oceana, the gunslingers. And I was scheduled to arrive later than I actually did. I moved out to Virginia beach from Millington and the plan was to go do JPME2, which is a 10 week school. And right after I got here, the CO called and said, hey, do you want to join the squadron early so you can go through sfarp? Which is really the very first stage of the workup cycle. And obviously, yes was the answer. I'd love to. So we canceled JPME2. I joined the squadron five months before I was going to be XO, which is unusual, but the command was very welcoming. They were helpful in the sense that they're willing to have me there. And it was great training for me. It was great opportunity to spend some time in the squadron and it allowed me to get the training to get back up to speed and get ready for cruise. So joined the squadron early, went through all of workups. So I did the whole thing, then became XO in, I believe it was September of 2019, but don't quote me on that. And then from there went into the rest of the cycle. So we're about halfway through the cycle when I became XO and then we deployed in January of 2020. I'm sure if people think about what was happening in the world, they're very quickly going to realize that was the very, very beginning of COVID So USS Dwight D. Eisenhower got underway in January of 20. That was before COVID actually really spread in the United States. It had only been found in a couple spots. And we got underway and then 206 days later, without a single stop, we were back in Virginia. So interesting Covid deployment there. I always like to say, people always joke when you go on deployment, you probably agree with this. We always say, like, you know, I wish the world would while I'm gone, I don't want to miss things. I don't want to miss events with my kids and my family. And I wish like everything would just freeze. And it happened. That was probably the one and only time where I left in January of 20. I came back in August of 20. And other than Covid, not much had happened. Kids were a little bit older, but I didn't miss any sporting events, didn't really miss any gatherings. It was just the world was frozen.
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B
Wow. I never really thought about it that way. To depart and to come back and kind of nothing has changed because of all the other deployments you've done in the past. Things have changed. They said the world has moved on, man. Honestly, I cannot wrap my head around that right now. I'll be honest with you. That's pretty me. And then you come home, like in the throes of it as well, you know, with the. All the restrictions and everything that follows and. Oh, my goodness, that is. Like I said, I'm kind of a hard time wrapping my head around that. How did you handle that with your troops?
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A
So we talked earlier. You brought up leadership challenges. That was one of them. There was a lot of concern about how that was going to go, how it was going to. You know, people were concerned about their families at home and what was happening. And obviously we could watch the news and watch this thing happen from afar. And it was very strange in the sense that we didn't have Covid on the ship. We left before it got there. So the carrier was completely isolated. We weren't bringing people on board. We were able to continue our mission, but it was totally isolated. So from the perspective of the people on the ship, life was normal. But every time you turn on the news or you got an email from back home or talk to somebody back home, you would hear all these crazy stories. You remember there was that run on toilet paper at one point. We heard stories like that, and it was very foreign, and we didn't understand it because we're not there. And we didn't really understand how that was all happening. So it was difficult to kind of follow along. But other than that, it was a normal deployment. I think there were some, certainly some concerns from senior, senior leadership about people's kind of mental health. What I saw, kind of on the ground, if you will, was that was not an issue. People were happy to do their jobs. They were happy to know what was happening at home. But being underway all that time was maybe not ideal. You kind of miss out on part of your experience as a sailor, but I don't think it was as bad as people thought it would be. And it's hard to say why. Maybe it could have been worse. But sailors were awesome. The VFA 105 sailors were awesome. The CAG 3 folks, Dwight D. Eisenhower crew, everybody did a great job. We all kind of knew what was happening and what was coming, and everybody just did their job and did it well.
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B
So no port calls with 5,000 of your best friends?
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A
That's right. Not a single one.
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B
I mean, literally not a single. Like, even from when? January until March. You didn't hit a port call then before COVID kind of broke out?
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A
No. So we did comp2x in January. And then as Covid started to spread, the decision was made that we weren't even going to pull in for deployment. So it was a Comp2X and go so we stayed underway from Comp2X in January all the way through the deployment to the end of August.
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B
Yeah, I'm trying to remember that. I'll be honest with you. I was the Deputy Commodore at the wing at the time and dealing with all that because HSC 7 was in CAG 3 and honestly I don't remember that. Maybe I, maybe, maybe I blacked out during that time or something. I removed it from my memory.
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A
Well, and if you remember concurrently, that was when Theodore Roosevelt pulled into Guam.
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B
I do remember that.
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A
So that was the same time Ike was underway, Truman was on their way home, and they actually got back to the east coast of the US and didn't actually pull in for a. It was a while. I want to say it was a month or two before they could pull it. So those two things were happening which were significantly more attention grabbing, I guess than a routine deployment for Dwight D. Eisenhower.
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B
Yeah, I guess so. And I mean it's not the first time that someone's done over 180 days straight without a port call. I mean that has happened. I think 911 actually had that happen with the TR I believe too. But anyway, you're right, but it is a little different when I mean, talk about ultra mission focused, I guess during that time, or at least your mantra as the XO or CEO has to be that yes, there's a lot of the stuff that's happening back at home. We're not sure, a lot of unknowns, but we need to stay focused on what it is that we're doing out here, which is normal. But normally you don't have this huge distraction back at home.
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A
That's right.
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B
Yeah. That is wild. So did you take command then when you got home or was it out on the boat?
- [21:59]
A
No, it was actually going into the next deployment. So I did that full Covid deployment as xo, finished that calendar year as xo. And then probably too long a story for this, but we basically did a pre deployment ROM for our 2021 deployment. And during that lockdown I took command. So my change of command, my fleet up from XO to CO was a airborne change of command with nobody there, just the squadron. We were isolated, we weren't allowed to have families there. So the only people outside the command that saw it were the outgoing CO's wife and kids. They were allowed to show up and watch and then that was it. And the change of command party was basically like pizza and Cokes in the ready room was pretty much the change of command party.
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B
Well, I Mean, that's better than the change of command, being in CAG stateroom and one of you leaving on a code.
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A
It was memorable. I'll never forget it, that's for sure.
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B
Yeah, it was memorable. That's a good way to put it. That's positive attitude right there, man. So then now kind of honestly back to normal deployment, but was that next one. But you still had a bunch of restrictions too. Because I remember the PXO of 7 coming out there and having to ROM in a hotel, I think in bahrain for like 30 days prior to cutting out to the boat.
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A
There were still restrictions to get us out on deployment. And the funny part, of course, is we did all these things to try to isolate Enrom and all that. And within two weeks of being deployed, we had about 500 cases on the ship. Incidentally, they had zero effect on the ability to carry out the mission. Everything was fine. And this is by no means medical evidence, and I know that this is a hot button political topic now, but about a month into the deployment, the vaccine was authorized. Basic. Almost everyone, if not everyone on the ship got the vaccine. Then they got the second one, whatever it was a week or two later. And then about a week or two after that, there was no Covid left. So we very quickly eradicated Covid on the ship. And then from there it was just careful management of people kind of coming and going. So that second cruise was a little more normal. We stopped three times, we never left the pier. They were pier only port calls. We did Suda Bay once and Duke them Aman twice, just on the pier. But even that was worth it for people to get off the ship and walk around a little bit. So it was a little bit lighter, but still a Covid cruise. I tell people I basically missed most of COVID between January to August of 20 and then January to July of 21. I was underway.
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B
Maybe that's actually the better way to have done it.
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A
There were a lot of things that were simpler for sure, man.
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B
Just remove yourself from the problem and go into your own little microcosm and float around on the ocean. Man, you're blowing my mind today, I gotta be honest with you. All right, so now after command, what was next?
- [24:35]
A
So after command, I was still in command and I had verb. This was around November of 20. And I've told him this story before, but former team member, guy by the name of John Hiltz, Johnny Kittens, who was a good friend of mine, we were roommates in Meridian. He called me in November of 21 and he basically opened the call with, hey, I heard you were thinking about applying for the Blue Angels, which was not at all true. I had never once even considered it. And in hindsight, I think that was his way to just kind of open the door to talk me into it. So he started with that. He talked to me about it, talked to me about the team, talked to me about the experience. And after that call, I was like, you know, maybe I'll look at this, and did a little more research and said, hey, you know, I'll throw my name in the hat for this, for the Blue Angels. And the timing works out, which is also kind of an interesting result of COVID By no means am I happy about COVID but it's also responsible for me even having the opportunity because Brian Kesselring, who was the boss before me, stayed for an extra year, which would not have happened were not for Covid. So I threw my name in the hat. Even then. My thought was, this is going to get me a funded trip to Pensacola for an interview. I'm going to see some folks I haven't seen in a while, some old friends. They're going to tell me it's somebody else, and I'm going to fly home and be done with it, and that's fine. But obviously it didn't work out that way. So by the time I interviewed, which was April of 22, my change of command was May of 22. And I had already had verbal orders to go up to D.C. to do a joint job. So that's what I was planning on until the interview in April. And then I was fortunate enough to be selected to join the team change of command the following month, and then moved a month later and started the process.
- [26:06]
B
So that was one thing I was thinking about this morning beforehand. So Johnny Kittens calls you. Obviously, there's a list of people to be able to do this. Well, let me back up. You've seen the Blue Angels in the past, obviously some at Naval Academy graduation. I assume you saw them at air shows before that. Is that a good assumption?
- [26:25]
A
So I had to think about this, and I think there's somewhere. I told him it was earlier, but as I really, like, dug down in my memory, the very first time I saw the Blue Angels was my first year at the Naval Academy during Commissioning Week.
- [26:35]
B
Wow. No kidding.
- [26:36]
A
Yeah. I had not seen them as a kid. I knew who they were.
- [26:39]
B
Yeah. And I mean, if you don't live near somewhere where they're going, a major metropolitan area, where they're going to necessarily do an air show, then you may not ever be exposed to them. Growing up in Syracuse, New York, you'd have to go. I mean, where would be the nearest place you would go to see the Blue Angels fly if you're up there?
- [26:56]
A
Yeah, it's hard to say. I don't know the air show schedule way back then. It's embarrassing how long ago that was now. But the Northeast in general doesn't have a lot of air shows as well. Air shows are less common in that part of the country than everywhere else, just by virtue of the massive amount of commercial air traffic that exists up there. So I don't know. I would have had to travel, though.
- [27:12]
B
Okay, so you see him at the Naval Academy. You're a strike fighter pilot throughout your whole career. You're a Top Gun graduate, so really kind of more involved in the tactical employment of the weapons systems and rather than on the flight demonstration side of it. And I'm sure you knew people throughout your career. Maybe even when you're a CEO, you had a jail who wanted to be a Blue angel, and they became Blue angel or whatever it was. Obviously, you know, they draw from your community, so, you know people. So before you got that call, had it ever entered your mind that you would ever be a Blue. I mean, you're kind of past the point now, right? Because you would have been one as a lieutenant or lieutenant commander. So this is like the last part. Had it entered your mind, or you're like, hey, joint tour, man. That's what I need. Let's do this.
- [27:56]
A
Not really. You already hit it on the head. There's really only two opportunities as a F18 pilot, as a demo pilot, to join the team. That one is as a JO Kind of out of your first JO tour, maybe starting your shore tour. That's your first window to apply, and that's where most people apply, and which is where all the F.18 wingmen are drawn from. After that, the next opportunity is the boss. So it's. That's a post operational command job. It is always a post operational command job. So your next opportunity is that post op command. Probably the only time I thought about it was, interestingly enough, was as I was leaving Millington, going to start my move. One of the last things I did in placement was write the orders and kind of set up the training track for Boss Doyle, because he had just been selected, and he was on his way to join the team at that point. So basically going through that process, and then I went off, did the command thing. And I remember as I was leaving Millington, kind of doing the math on the Every other. You know, because every other year they take a new boss. And I looked at when I would have been leaving 105 and looked at the Blue Angels, and I dismissed it right there. I was like, oh, the time won't work. Not a big deal. And that was the last time I ever thought about it until that phone call from John Hiltz years later. And I wasn't really. When a boss stays an extra year, it's not widely publicized. It's just a quiet manpower management thing that happens. So I honestly hadn't even been paying attention closely enough to realize that it was a turnover year. That was really. That kind of came out of the phone call with Johnny Kittens when he called.
- [29:19]
B
Wow, interesting. So there's gotta be a list of eligible people to have the timing and the pedigree to be able to become the boss. Not a very long list, I assume. So when you went down to interview, did you know how many other people you were going against? Three.
- [29:35]
A
So we started to piece it together as the potential bosses put in their applications. The team has their applicants officer who does a lot of the coordinating for the events and the interviews and all those things. So they would start sending out emails and start sending out texts and things like that. And we could very quickly see who was on that list, who are the people that applied. And unsurprisingly, because this is a small community, just like every community in aviation, we all knew each other, so we would start our own discussions and kind of build from there. So my year, there were seven applicants total. And obviously all of us had crossed paths at some time in the past, and all fantastic folks, great officers, great pilots. But we had seven people that were kind of on the list that had the timing and all the stuff you talked about, and most importantly, had taken the time and the willingness to apply for the job and go through the process.
- [30:20]
B
So you get down there, you pass the interview, find out that you have been selected. At that point, your change command when you left 105 was May of 2022. You said you took over when of the Blues.
- [30:33]
A
So I didn't take command of the Blues until November of 22. But we call them newbies. The khaki newbies show up and traditionally Oceana is the first air show for the newbies. We show up in early September to start shadowing the team. So starting actually next week at the Oceana show. And you probably want to cut that out since it's going to be in the past by the time this airs, but starting at the Oceana show, you'll see about a half a dozen, maybe seven or eight people in khakis around the com car and in the airplanes and doing that stuff. And those are next year's team members, next year's officers starting to learn the job of the person they're replacing. And they'll basically follow the team through the entire schedule from then on. And then, in my case, as the boss, I showed up a month before that, so I showed up in early August to kind of go through some of the command stuff so that I was prepared in September to start learning the Blue angel stuff. And then the change of command was in November.
- [31:24]
B
Were you nervous?
- [31:25]
A
Yes.
- [31:25]
B
I can imagine.
- [31:27]
A
I think if you show up there and you're not nervous, you're going to be in trouble. The job, the boss job in particular, but all the jobs, you're there because of skills you already have. But it's hard, and you're going to learn a lot of new things and learn how to do a lot of new things. And if you don't show up there with some nerves and a heavy dose of humility, in my opinion, things aren't going to go great. So you've got to be prepared to learn something new. And that's something I don't think as a fleet aviator, and like, I'm sure you were the same way. Most fleet aviators are the same. They don't really pay attention to the Blue Angels. They're vaguely aware of what they do, but what they're aware of is the piece that's presented to the public. The naval aviation fleet is essentially the same thing the public sees. What you don't see is the time spent training, the time spent on the road, just the amount of work that goes into that job. And that's something I really took away from it was how hard and how challenging that job is, how much work goes into it, and how stressful it can be at times. So, going way back to your question, I was definitely nervous, mostly because I didn't really know. People ask me all the time, like, was the job what you expected it to be? And my answer is, I deliberately went in without any expectations. I knew it was different from the fleet, but I didn't know enough to even know what to expect. So I did my best to go in with an open mind, prepared to learn what I had to learn and learn how to be a Blue Angel. And I was nervous for sure.
- [32:44]
B
Wow. That's a great answer. I can only imagine. To me, when I look at it as a whole, I know the flying is difficult, right? It's challenging. But I'm sure you've probably been, you've probably dropped bombs all over the world in combat and I'm not a rhino guy, but I can only imagine that target fixation at night to me is a little bit more scary or risky than necessarily 18 inches from another aircraft, from a very competent pilot similar to you. Can you compare those two or are they just so totally different that the comparison can't happen?
- [33:22]
A
They are different, but there's certainly some similarities. And I agree. The fleet flying, especially like high end combat flying is very difficult. And Blue angel flying is also very difficult. The types of flying are different. And the easy answer is out. They're just out there flying formation. How hard that. We learn that in primary. How hard can that be? Which is fair, but we don't do a lot of those kinds of maneuvers in primary. But the focus is really what it is. The focus and the tolerance the Blue Angels use is significant. And the way I compare it, I guess for folks that have flown the ship, you know that last little bit of time before you land on the ship, we call it the groove, is 15 to 18 seconds. Ideally don't always hit that, but that's the goal. But that little period of time is. Requires absolute laser focus the entire time or something bad's going to happen. I would submit that the Blue Angels demonstration, the whole 45 minute demonstration requires that level of focus. So you are hyper focused on exactly what you're doing in that very moment for the full demo, which is difficult and takes a lot of practice and a lot of training, not just to be able to fly the maneuvers and move the airplane, but to do all the other things that are required while you're doing that. So especially in my job as the flight leader, I'm not flying for them. I'm trying to put the airplanes, as I like to tell people, my job was to get the formation to the show center. Everybody else made the formation look good. The only thing I could do was ruin how good it looked.
- [34:41]
B
Or get lost.
- [34:42]
A
Yeah, exactly. So my job was to be as smooth as humanly possible and get us all the center point. The tolerances, I mean we measure our misses from center point in tens of feet. And I mean a basketball rim is 10ft high. So like that's the kind of tolerance we're using for six 40 plus thousand pound airplanes that are each 60ft long. So the precision that we're trying to get to at the end of the season is much, much tighter than you're going to see in most places in the fleet.
- [35:09]
B
Precision, That's a great word. It's a great way to describe it. Two things I want to definitely hit on. So the first thing I think about is you just, I mean, got off, came off of deployments back to back. Essentially deployments did the same thing as one's the xo, one's the co. You're pretty tired after that and now you are stepping into probably I don't want to know what your DTS account looks like. That's Defense Travel System looks like. When it comes to working on or being in the Blue Angels and traveling, that to me over a two year period just seems to me to be the most exhausting part of your experience there. How were you able to wrap your head around? I mean we always. Debt, right? You talked about SFARP earlier, right? Strike Fighter events, readiness program, helicopter van. We do harp. Same thing where you deploy, you debt somewhere for a few weeks and we're doing that regardless prior to even deploying on board the ship. So yes, we spend a lot of time away from home. But to me, the Blue Angels is like travel on steroids. How did you convince your family that this was a good thing to go do, that it's gonna be worth it for them with daddy who's been gone so much? Because I think I'll probably get this wrong. You have four or five kids?
- [36:23]
A
Four kids.
- [36:24]
B
Four kids.
- [36:25]
A
My wife will tell you we have thoughts, but she counts me as one of them.
- [36:27]
B
Oh yeah, me too. My wife does the same thing. Welcome to the club. How are you able to convince them to say this is going to be a once in a lifetime experience? It's going to be awesome. Cheerleader it up and go and do this.
- [36:40]
A
Good question. So I approached it as less about convincing them and really more about trying to just present as unbiased picture as I could of what life would be like on the team. Which is tough because at the time I also knew nothing about what it was like to be there. And I tell people this all the time that are thinking about applying to the Blue Angels. That process is designed just as much for the team to decide if a specific candidate is right for them as it is for that candidate to decide if that job is right for them. So I always tell people the Blue Angels application process from start to finish is really kind of a two way interview. It's an Opportunity for the team to figure out if they want somebody. And the opposite is true as well. So really, even before I applied, I've tried to track down as many phone numbers as I could for folks that were on the team. And as part of that, I tried to get phone numbers of spouses and family members that were along for the ride as well, that were part of that so that my wife Sandy could talk to them and kind of learn about what their side of it was. But honestly, at the end of the day, you can only do so much. And I still remember the discussion was my wife asked me, do you want to do this? And I said, dad, I think I kind of do. And she said, I think you should do it. And we kind of went in with like through caution of the wind and cross our fingers and hope it works out. So there's only so much you can do for something like that. When it's just such a unique experience and there's so few people that have done it, it's hard to get a ton of information. And then like most things, and I wouldn't say this is exclusive to the Blue Angels, even being a fleet aviator, you know, it's telling somebody about it can get you pretty far, but it's never the same as living that life and going through it and actually doing it. So I don't know if I answered your question necessarily, but we did our best to get as much information as we could, but the experience was still kind of different.
- [38:19]
B
It's so unique, you know, and like I said, it's a small contingent of people. When I first moved to Pensacola, my down the street neighbor was a guy named Ben Welborn. And he had been a blue as a jo. Had did his command tour and then did his another tour, was in his post command job and then got called back to the blues for a second tour because of, you know, like I said, there's a very small pool of people in case there's a mishap or someone has to leave or whatever. It is fun.
- [38:47]
A
A bit of trivia. I know Ben. Ben's brother Jason was in VFA115 with me as a Jo and his brother Steve was my CAG paddles when I was a Jo as well. So he's got several brothers.
- [38:58]
B
There's three of them in the strike fighter community.
- [39:00]
A
Yeah. And there's actually four of them that were naval aviators. They have a fourth brother as well, who's I believe he's the oldest, but Jason was in my wedding. They're all great guys, and I've known the whole family for a while, but a few connections there.
- [39:10]
B
Yeah, no kidding. That's pretty awesome. So here's another one, too. Right? So you're the boss. Do they call you the skipper?
- [39:17]
A
No, they call you boss.
- [39:18]
B
Oh, man.
- [39:19]
A
I'm learning now that that name sticks forever. People still call me Boss, which is strange.
- [39:24]
B
Well, hopefully they'll call you cag.
- [39:25]
A
Yeah. Hope so. I gotta get there, but that should be next.
- [39:28]
B
But you're still there. You are the commanding officer of the squadron. You still have to do CO stuff, right?
- [39:33]
A
You do.
- [39:34]
B
I mean, you're still signing fit reps Chief Evals.
- [39:37]
A
That is part of the reason that that job and the Thunderbirds actually changed how they do their command structure to mirror the Blue Angels. The reason the Blue Angels, boss, is always a post operational command co, as I can tell, is that that job is too busy to try to learn how to run a squadron. You need to go into that job having already done it to know how just a basic Navy squadron should operate. Because most of your learning, certainly early on, especially, is learning how to fly the demo, how to be the flight leader. Everybody has two jobs on that team, at least. And my job specifically, it was in my title. I was the commanding officer and the flight leader. And as people have said to me, and I've repeated multiple times, you're always both, but you're never doing them at the same time. At any given moment, you are either functioning as the CO or you're functioning as the flight leader. And very seldom are you doing them simultaneously.
- [40:27]
B
That's probably the best idea.
- [40:30]
A
Yeah.
- [40:31]
B
Talk about risk management on steroids.
- [40:33]
A
Yeah. Wow.
- [40:34]
B
Whoever thought about that one was definitely smart. So were the Thunderbirds. Before making it their first command. Was the command of the unit like their first, oh, five command? I bet you the Air Force was doing that.
- [40:45]
A
I'm not sure exactly when they changed, but there was a period of time where you would screen for command, and one of your possible commands was the Thunderbirds. And I'm not close enough to it to know if there were issues with that or how that all went, but I do know that it changed eventually to mirror the way the Blue Angels do it.
- [41:00]
B
Well, good for them. I'm glad the Air Force picked something up from us. Always a friend of our brothers and brothers and sisters.
- [41:05]
A
Yeah. You know, and while we're on that topic, especially in recent years, the Thunderbirds and Blue Angels have spent quite a bit of time together. They typically train together for about a week every Year and they're awesome. The Thunderbirds are great. They're great people. Their demo's cool, the airplane's cool. Their demo is very different, which is largely a product of the S16. But the both teams have, in my opinion, have improved based on what they learned from the other teams. There's some things that, in my opinion, the Blue Angels do better than the Thunderbirds and vice versa. And we've definitely both learned from each other and tried to adopt things wherever we could to kind of take those best practices and apply them to our own teams.
- [41:38]
B
That's really cool. I mean, I hate to use this term a joint demonstration squadron, but wow, that's actually smart. Why wouldn't we not do that, right? It's funny. My buddy, I'll give a shout out to him. Wayne Andrews, call sign Winker, another Hilo guy, he's an instructor at ndu. He sent me a picture this morning of the Thunderbirds arriving at Andrews because I guess they're doing an air show this weekend. And I've seen the Thunderbirds one time. It was at Maxwell Air Force Base when I was going to war college and I don't remember it. It's like 2010 time frame. Now that I've seen the Blues a lot because I can walk right out the museum and see you guys practice twice a week. And now that I've been underneath that several times now, I would really like to go and see what the Thunderbirds is like and like you said, kind of tell the difference between the performance of a Rhino, performance of a Viper and see how that differs in the air show context.
- [42:30]
A
It's fun talking to people that have seen both because they tend to pick up on different things, but they're different demos. For sure.
- [42:36]
B
Yeah. Because last year there was a, I guess a 12 plane flyover mixed section between. Or was it separate next to one another of the Blues and the Thunderbirds?
- [42:47]
A
No, we did both. So last year for the homecoming show. The Thunderbirds came to the homecoming show last year and we did a beach run essentially with both Deltas together.
- [42:55]
B
That's pretty cool.
- [42:56]
A
It was. It was pretty cool.
- [42:57]
B
We had a T shirt in the store here, the museum store with it, so it was a big seller. So kind of coming up on our time here. But I want to ask you, can you give me top three experiences of being the boss? And that could be anything from the people to a particular air show or like a geographic location of the air show because it was so gorgeous or anything like that. Something about your sailors.
- [43:20]
A
So it's hard to break that. I don't know that I can give you a top three, but I can give you some of the greatest things about the team. 1. And people ask me, what's your most memorable thing? Without a doubt, the best part of being a Blue angel is being with Blue Angels, if that makes sense, that the entire team, and I'm not Talking about the six Delta pilots or the 17 officers, the entire team, all 160 folks, they are handpicked. And the funny thing about the Blue Angels and the Blue Angels get a lot of credit for kind of leadership stuff because they're such a high performing organization. I kind of chuckle that if you're going to find leadership challenges, they're going to be harder to find at the Blue Angels because you have such good. The deck is stacked top to bottom. The people are so good. The hardest part of being a leader of an organization like that is really just making sure you can properly manage this massive amount of talent you have and not waste it. Like, the biggest stressor for me as the CEO of the Blue Angels was not letting one of these 160 incredible people slip through the cracks and miss an opportunity to make their own lives better and do their own thing. The number of people I'm really proud of, the number of folks that went into officer programs out of the enlisted ranks, the Blue Angels, just while I was there. And I know that's very common. But going back to the beginning of this, the just the team, every member of the team is awesome. They're fun to be around, they're extremely good at their job, they're dedicated, their attitudes are fantastic. And we're all there kind of pulling the same direction. Everybody knows what the mission is. We share that every day. We talk about what we're trying to do and everybody understands that. And it's a product of the level of talent. It's also a product of the small size of the team. That team's about 2/3, maybe just actually less than 2/3, but a little more than half of an equivalent sized fleet squadron. So it's a very small command by Navy standards. But just getting to be around those folks every day, that was the thing I really look forward to. The flying's a lot of fun. Don't get me wrong, I love the flying. The travel's fun. There's some incredible places we got to go, some incredible people we got to meet. But for me personally, I loved being around the team. The enlisted team members are great, the officers are great. The civilian support is great. Got some Boeing tech reps and some other people on the team. They're all in, they're all there, and they're all on board with the mission, which, as a leader, sometimes the hardest thing to do is to get everybody in the command to buy into what you're doing, especially when there's obvious questions about whether or not it's worthwhile. So I generally didn't have that issue. I found that people were on board and getting people to help was not difficult. So I felt really lucky to be there. And I'm not perfect at this, but when I refer to being a member of the team, I generally make it a point to say that I joined the Blue Angels. Not I took over or took command or ran the Blue Angels. I joined them. I was just one of the people on the team. I had a job to do. My job was to be the commanding officer, just like every member of the team has a job to do. And we all do that job to the best of our ability. So I felt like I was very much part of a team, much more so than in charge of a team. And that distinction may not seem like much, but at least in my mind it was. So that was memorable. In terms of the show sites, you may not be surprised to know I get that question a lot about what my favorite show site is. It's very hard to pick one. The interesting thing about the Blue angel schedule, they do 32 shows a year, eight of those shows. So exactly a quarter of those shows are annual show sites. They go to them every single year. So one is El Centro that starts the season in El Centro every year. Pensacola twice, the beach show in the summer and then the end of season show. That's three. Seattle, San Francisco are major cities that support the team and have them every single year. Virginia beach and San Diego at the miramar show, that's two more, that's seven. And then the eighth one is Annapolis. So those eight shows are repeated every single year. The other 24 shows are different. There's a couple that alternate, so there's a couple every other year shows, but for the most part, they're all different. But the ones I remember flying over Annapolis was really cool. I mean, having graduated from the Naval Academy and then seeing the Blue Angels from the ground and then getting to fly over Annapolis was cool. Flying over any major city. For any aviator that knows what it's like to be able to fly in, like, the Class Bravo airspace in San Francisco or San Diego or Chicago, any of those places, not Only do we get to fly in that airspace, but we get to just fly a high performance jet at 200ft and just rage. So flying around those cities is deep because it's just such a unique opportunity to get to do that. So those were all memorable, but every show was memorable for one reason or another. I could go down the schedule right now and tell you something about each one of those shows. So it's hard to pick a favorite. They were all special and they're all different.
- [47:45]
B
Could answer, no bias towards any one of the cities. That's good. I like that. I'll tell you. Yeah, man. I can only imagine that when you have such a high performing unit and you are trying to lead it, I can only imagine what the pressure is like to maintain your standards and your level of performance so that you don't fall below the people who are trying to lead. Because when you lead from the front, you're the one. You're like, hey, follow me. And because like I said, they're the. Since they've gone through a screening process, the best of the best. You know, I've kind of felt the same way. When I was the CEO of the frs, I had the number one, number two Jos and Chiefs from the whole seawall sitting there, which made for incredible command climate, the most incredible team you could ever ask for. But, man, there's pressure to perform.
- [48:34]
A
There is. And there's pressure to establish your credibility early and then maintain it, which is difficult, especially as a new boss when you're stepping in with half of your Delta that just finished a full season. Flying in the air shows there's some challenges there. And the Delta turns over 50% every year. The three of those six pilots are in their first season anytime you see them. And then fully a third of the team is new as well. So building that team through winter training is tricky. And the team has figured it out. I mean, they do the same thing every year and it's got proven results, it's gone pretty well. But it's tough, it's stressful. When you're that person, when you're brand new and you're in this room full of people that have not only done this job already and proven they can do it, but they're expecting you to do it that well, that's a lot of pressure to meet those expectations and hopefully pull your weight.
- [49:19]
B
And it's different from going from 05 command, which you have done right, and now to go be a CAG leading the squadrons that you've already done. So you have experience with that and you can be a mentor and you still have to have, you know, I mean, be on your A game all the time as being an air wing commander, but when you have never had the experience of being a flight demonstration pilot before, then you have to come in and be it like, from day one.
- [49:47]
A
It is. It's unique and it's interesting. I mean, the boss of the Blue Angels, with only one exception off the top of my head, but that might be the only one. The boss is almost never a former team member. So going in as the CEO, typically, that is. It certainly was for me, that is your first time being a Blue angel.
- [50:06]
B
And we can sit here and think about that.
- [50:08]
A
Right?
- [50:08]
B
So I guess that's to come in without any biases.
- [50:11]
A
Well, so that's a good question. I don't know if that's deliberate or not. I don't know if it's just coincidence. There have been so few bosses over the years, it's hard to say if it just hasn't worked out that way. When you look at how few Blue Angels wingmen there are and how many of them, you know, the stars that need to align to get all the way through their career to command a fleet squadron, then go back and be the boss, I don't believe there's any deliberate prohibition on that on a former pilot coming back to be boss. I just know it doesn't happen very often.
- [50:37]
B
I'll tell you, great stuff. You've blown my mind today, that's for sure. How long do you spend in El Centro?
- [50:42]
A
So we normally go to El Centro. It's really just the first workday of January, so you get through the New Year's holiday, and then we fly to El Centro from there, and then we are there until the first air show, which is in El Centro. So the first El Centro air show, which is typically the first or second weekend in March. So short answer is two and a half months. Normally.
- [51:00]
B
Do you get to come home on the weekends to get breaks?
- [51:03]
A
We get one. We call it halftime. There's normally one break. The team will come home just for a weekend. Kind of dead center. Mid February, maybe early February. But that's it. That's the only break. Otherwise, the pace in El Centro is something else. The team flies 15 times a week, Monday through Saturday, takes Sunday off, and then does it again. So it's. They alternate three flights a day and two flights a day for six days.
- [51:25]
B
Dude, is that a known thing? Because I've never heard of that. And to me, that boggles my mind.
- [51:30]
A
I'm certain it's known because there's a handful of Blue angel fans who are dedicated is probably an understatement. But they will stand out of the Flints in El Centro and they'll film the practices, all of them. So it is definitely a known thing because there's people out there watching, but I don't know how widely known it is beyond them.
- [51:46]
B
I mean, that's a lot. So how many flight hours in a year do you get with the team?
- [51:51]
A
So I'd have to go back and look. I don't think the hours are significantly higher than you'd see elsewhere because the flights are all 0.8, but sortie counts. Crazy. So I know in El Centro, I would fill sometimes three and be starting a fourth page in the logbook for one month. And I only learned this because I have this job I had. There's 19 lines in a standard Navy logbook. So you're getting through pages in your logbook pretty quick.
- [52:13]
B
I'm going to have to write that one down. 19. I'm going to go back and look at my logbooks now and go through 19. Oh, my gosh, he was right. I don't believe it. 19 lines. Never knew that. Like I said, you blow my mind. This is so fun.
- [52:24]
A
So not a lot of hours, necessarily. Still a lot of hours. But, uh, but they come in small, small chunks. It's a ton of sorties. It's a lot of flying.
- [52:31]
B
All right, so right now, like I said, in currently in Virginia beach, going through the training track, you're obviously current flying, but not necessarily with strike or fighter quals or anything like that. So you got to go back through the FRS or through the weapon school to get recalled, go back to the boat. What is your timeline now for becoming dcag?
- [52:50]
A
So you hit it on the head. The biggest thing's the boat. For me, I'm going to have a little bit of time to try to get some other tactical training, to try to get some of that tactical proficiency back and kind of learn the things that changed in the last few years. But CQ is the big one, which will be in November. So I'll go out to the boat right now, at least the plan is November, obviously subject to change with ship schedules, but November CQ for me, and then I will join the Air Wing in February. I will become DCAG in March, and I will deploy in April. So pretty quick process to get moving on the next deployment.
- [53:18]
B
And that's CAG 3, right? CACH 7 freedom fighters.
- [53:21]
A
Freedom fighters, yeah.
- [53:22]
B
I was in CAG 7 for a couple of deployments myself.
- [53:24]
A
Kind of a cool coincidence because all the squadrons have moved around, but BFA105, when I was in command, was in CAG3. They are now in CA7, so I'll actually get to deploy it with BFA105 again, just in a different airway.
- [53:35]
B
Oh, that's awesome. Because when I was there, we had the dogs, the Jolly Rogers and we have 130 Wildcats.
- [53:43]
A
Wildcats are 131. They're now in CAG 7 as well.
- [53:46]
B
Okay, well, I'm trying to think who the other strike fighter squadron was that we had out of the four. Man, I can't remember. That's a long time ago.
- [53:52]
A
Yeah, there's been quite a bit of squadron churn last few years, especially with the F35 swaps and some of the movement with squadrons. So as I understand, Elise, I wasn't around in the 80s and 90s, but the kind of traditional like these squadrons are always in X Air Wing is not really a thing anymore. They move around quite a bit.
- [54:08]
B
Yeah. My first air Wing was CAG 8 and we had two Tomcat Squadrons, super old 41 and 14. And they were always in CAG 8 for a long time. And then they switched to two Seat Rhinos, I believe. Two Seat Rhinos and then moved to West Coast Cags.
- [54:27]
A
So only one of them did VFA 41 into two Seat Rhinos. VFA 14, which is where I did my training on tour, they were single seat. They are still single seat Rhinos.
- [54:36]
B
But west coast though, right?
- [54:38]
A
Both west coast. And this is before my time as well. But somewhere along the way there was a decision that the Tomcat was never going to be in Lamour. So when as the Tomcat started to sundown, the Tomcat squadron stayed here in Oceana. And as we started changing squadrons to Super Hornets, they started filling in spots on the west coast and Lamore got it.
- [54:58]
B
Yeah. Okay. So like I said, DCAG in March 26th. Go on deployment, man. And the fun continues.
- [55:04]
A
Yeah, that's right. It's a good problem. I love this job. I've enjoyed the career and I'm looking forward to it. It's going to be awesome.
- [55:09]
B
Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah. Now, definitely congrats on your selection as being an air Wing commander, man. I mean, it's the pinnacle of naval aviation, the strike fighter community especially. So. Yeah, man, that's fantastic. Any other closing thoughts for the viewers?
- [55:22]
A
I appreciate you having me. It's fun to have an opportunity to do stuff like this. I love this business. I've loved it my entire life. It's been incredible an opportunity and an incredible experience and it's fun to have a chance to talk about it. So thank you for giving me the opportunity. I hope people can go see the Blue Angels. They continue to produce incredible results and they're just a lot of fun to watch and they are genuinely good people and I hope people get a chance to interact with them as much as possible within their extremely hectic schedule because it was a really cool experience and I'm thankful for it every day and at the same time I'm really excited for the next thing. So thanks for the chance to be here and then chat about it for a bit.
- [55:55]
B
Yeah, well thanks for taking the time except out of your busy schedule there in Oceania with moving home and the kids and whatnot. Hopefully get to make it back here to Pensacola maybe before, you know, it gets too hectic or maybe in between deployments or something like that. And it would be actually pretty cool to meet up again and do it again after your deployment as DCAG and get your perspective now as a Deputy Air Wing Commander and deploying and who knows what that deployment is going to lead to and what's going to happen in the world today. So from an operational standpoint, I think that would be actually really cool. So that's awesome. Thank you for joining us on this flight through history and innovation here at the Ready Room. We hope today's episode inspired you with new heights, new insights, and the incredible stories that make naval aviation so extraordinary. If you enjoy the journey, be sure to describe, Leave a Review Share the podcast with your network. It helps us reach more listeners like you. And why don't you come visit the National Naval Aviation Museum in Pensacola, the cradle of naval aviation. Until next time, thanks for listening to the Ready Room. Thanks Greg.
- [56:52]
A
Thanks Ryan. Appreciate it.
- [56:54]
B
Thank you for joining us on this flight through history and innovation here at the Ready Room. We hope today's episode inspired you with new insights and the incredible stories that make naval aviation so extraordinary. If you enjoyed the journey, be sure to subscribe, leave a review and share the podcast with your network. It helps us reach more listeners like you. Don't forget to visit the National Naval Aviation museum in Pensacola, Florida, or explore our online resources at navalaviationmuseum.org to dive deeper into the stories we've shared. Follow us on social media for updates, behind the scenes content, and a sneak peek at updates coming episodes. Until next time, thanks for listening to ready room. See you on the next flight.