← The Parent Chat with Dylan Dreyer
The Parent Chat with Dylan Dreyer
What Parenting Actually Looks Like When You're Both Influencers
00:27:30
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- [00:00]
Natalie Joy
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- [00:30]
Nick Vile
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- [00:58]
Natalie Joy
If we had it our way, she probably wouldn't have social media until she's in college. 25 down in college.
- [01:08]
Dylan Dreyer
Hi everyone. Welcome to another episode of the Parent Chat. Today's guests, Nick Vile and Natalie Joy. They are the hosts of the Netflix show Age of Attraction and they are the perfect host because there's an 18 year age gap between them. You might know Nick from the Bachelor or the Bachelorette. He's also the host of the Vile Files podcast, which he hosts with Natalie. And Natalie is a certified surgical technologist and currently a social media star. She's an influencer and a content creator and we thought it would be a perfect conversation to discuss age gap parenting. But you know what? As it turns out, they parent exactly the same way. They couldn't be more compatible when it comes to parenting, but they have a lot of different takes on various different issues. We had such a wonderful conversation and I can't wait for you to hear it. Thank you guys so much for talking with me. This is going to be a great conversation. How excited is River? What kind of big sister do you expect her to be?
- [02:06]
Natalie Joy
She's honestly, shockingly for her, eight. I mean, I guess we just don't know any different. But she seems so aware of what's going on. She's got two twin little baby dolls that my best friend got her and she like walks them around, she changes their diapers. She's like, oh, there's two babies in mama's belly. Like she'll put her hands on and she'll ask them to kick. She. It's like the. She seems like she is an absolute genius.
- [02:33]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah, it is a good age gap, though. You know, by the time they're born, I think she is in that helpful phase. And kids do want to help a lot more than you think they do. Like, even if it's just grabbing the diaper, grabbing this or that.
- [02:45]
Natalie Joy
Yeah, she's good at that. Now. I like to. She likes little tasks. She has to pick up the dog bowls after they eat. And she's got her things that she does and she likes them.
- [02:54]
Dylan Dreyer
So I love that. So I have absolutely no experience with girls. I have three little boys. But one thing I do know. So I can't offer advice there, but one thing I do know is as a mom of boys, I feel like I get a lot of credit, right? Like, I'm kind of a superhero, right? Like, I'm a mom taking care of three boys. And Nick, I think for you, you are going to get. And Natalie, you deserve it. But Nick, you're gonna get all of that credit where it's like, oh, you're a dad to three girls. Like, are you ready for that?
- [03:26]
Nick Vile
100%. And, like, it's a bit of a cop out a little bit. I have a friend, you know, and I think most young men have a, you know, like, women. You think about, oh, I'd love to have a son someday, right? And so I have a friend who had three daughters first, and then he had a son for his fourth. And I was like, oh, you must have been really excited to, like, just, you know, get that one boy. And he mentioned that he was actually pretty nervous, and I was a bit surprised by that. And he kind of talked about how girls are really easy and that he had some kind of fears about projecting onto his son, you know, whether it's his failures or his accomplishments or whatever it is. And it really kind of resonated with me. And now that I've become a father of a daughter, that makes a lot of sense. Because, like, I think with little girls, with dads, it's just so easy to love them, you know? And I just feel like, you know, I think I have a big responsibility and maybe a difficult one, but my responsibility, I feel like, as a father of a daughter, is just to, like, give her the confidence to believe in herself and make her feel loved and make her feel valued so that when she goes out in the world, she knows what that looks like. And there's a healthy part of that. But that's Just like, all you gotta do is love your kid, you know, And I think sometimes fathers. And I know, you know, because I've always had this, you know, I would love to be a. To have a son. It would be harder for me to not project, you know, and do those things. And I think there's an effortlessness when it comes to fathers and daughters. And in a way that, you know, I'll take the credit, but I think it's a little easier for fathers to do that.
- [05:06]
Dylan Dreyer
So you guys have been so open about putting so much of your life out there for everyone to take in. People love to celebrate with you guys. I know when you had the gender reveal, everybody was so excited to, you know, see the announcement. But you've also shared a lot of the hardships and, you know, especially the miscarriages and everything. Was there ever a, you know, maybe after the first where you didn't want to share anymore, but you felt like you kind of owed that to your fans?
- [05:36]
Natalie Joy
Not necessarily. I felt like they created a very safe space for us during that time. That was a really, you know, we didn't know after the first one, it was like, how do I come back to the show the vial files? How do I talk pop culture? Like, things that I don't care. You know, like, this is just real life things that are happening to me, and I can't go on this show and act like they're not. But I've had so many people be like, I couldn't ever put those feelings into words until I heard you say them. And, like, I felt. Because it's the most alone feeling you'll ever feel. And, you know, it's like this shame within your body. And so it's. To have someone else talk about it, it finally felt like, oh, I'm seen. Oh, I'm not alone. And so I think we've created a safe community within our audience of, like, this is what we're going through. And luckily, a lot of them, you know, allow us the grace to process and go through them at our own time.
- [06:35]
Dylan Dreyer
It is interesting when you put it out there. It is a very. I've suffered one miscarriage. And I remember we were kind of on, like, a group vacation, so there was just, like, a lot of people around, and everybody's happy, everybody's on vacation. And I was hiding the fact that I was pregnant, so I'm like, pretending to drink but not really drinking. And that night is kind of when the miscarriage happened. And I remember also hiding the fact that I was in addition to hiding the fact that I was pregnant, dealing with this miscarriage. And I'm like, I'm surrounded by people. There's literally no one I can talk to. I'm, like, crying in my bed in so much pain because no one really tells you how painful, like, physically painful it is. And I'm like, man, I just. I wish I could share this with someone. And I. And, you know, you can't always do that.
- [07:22]
Nick Vile
Well, it's interesting that you say that, because it's. It's almost like, why. You know, like, why can't you? Or, like. And obviously, it's a very personal thing. And when we found out we were pregnant with the twins and things were progressing in a positive direction prior to the last three, we were having this kind of conversation about, you know, we. We were really excited, and the more we progressed, we were telling more and more friends and family, and there's always this, like, you know, kind of, like, almost. Well, it's like, unofficial rule, you know, don't tell anyone until you know, because you. You never know, and you're kind of almost. And it's like. And I get the sentiment, but after having experienced it three times and because we chose to share it so publicly, and then we've chose to share every other time, I remember kind of saying to Natalie, it's just like, well, we don't really have to wait, or there's no, like, unofficial rule we have to follow, because no matter what happens, we have kind of chosen this path to share our journey. And obviously, we're in a unique situation because, like, most people, like, don't go on be like, hey, guess what's going on in my life? But while the sentiment makes a lot of sense, the almost like, consequence of that is that what you realize in the first time we experienced this with Natalie is just like, it's like this community that feels so alone, and they have no one to talk to because, like, I guess, I don't know, society or what has happened. Keep this private. Don't tell anyone. And I get it. Like, you know, it's difficult. Some tragedy happens, and you don't want to have to go back. But, like, I think as an almost negative consequence, we have made a bunch of mothers feel like they almost can't share it. In a weird way, I think it should be more okay for young parents to maybe not keep it so private, or at least not feel like, you know, like, you know what? I was. It's just kind of a weird thing that, like, we have Realized as a result of choosing to share it. Where, like, do parents, and especially mothers, have to feel so alone in those difficult times?
- [09:29]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah, it's so true. It does feel like something you, for whatever reason, we don't talk about. And I remember when I first came on the Today show, it was my. So it was after my miscarriage, and then I had secondary infertility, and I was scared to death to tell anybody about it because I'm like, well, everybody's going to judge me because I already have one child, and there are a lot of people who can't have one child. And here I am, you know, how dare you want a second child? But it actually turns out when I went to my doctor, there was something physically wrong. Like, my uterus was scarred shut. There was a reason why I kept having miscarriages, and I couldn't have any more kids. And then he cleared out the scar tissue, and I was able to have my second and eventually my third. So it's like, by sharing these stories, maybe somebody who's sitting at home can be like, well, maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'll ask the doctor about that. Right? Like, I think talking about it only does good things for everyone around us.
- [10:26]
Natalie Joy
I mean, I found, you know, after three and after one healthy pregnancy, one healthy delivery, you know, I was 26 years old at the time, and it was like, you know, my doctors were like, what? We don't know what's going on. Like, we. You know, my OB was like, I've got to send you to a fertility specialist. Like, maybe IVF is your next route. And I'm, you know, I was like, I just. That feels like a lot right now. I just, you know, I want to figure out what's wrong with me. And we ran all these tests, and everything just kept coming back normal. And Nick went through all these tests, and he came back above average and perfect, of course. And it was like, well, then what is wrong? There has to be something. And finally they decided to test for something that they just don't really test for anymore. And that was the thing that I have. And it's like this gene mutation that basically my blood attacks the fetus as soon as it tries to attach. And, like, this thing that they just were like, I don't know, we'll just test for it. Cause it's the last thing on our list, I guess.
- [11:31]
Dylan Dreyer
And that's what it was.
- [11:32]
Natalie Joy
So it's the people who are sitting at home, like, I don't know why this is happening to me. Well, maybe it's this thing that they don't even test for anymore.
- [11:40]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah. Well, I certainly think you guys are doing good, and I'm so glad you're in the position you're in right now again. Congratulations. It's just such an exciting time.
- [11:48]
Nick Vile
I know.
- [11:48]
Natalie Joy
It's so surreal. Especially like, you know, finding out that it's twins.
- [11:53]
Dylan Dreyer
It's just like.
- [11:55]
Natalie Joy
It's so surreal. It's crazy.
- [11:57]
Nick Vile
So trippy.
- [11:58]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah, stay with us. We'll be right back after the break. So how did you two meet?
- [12:16]
Natalie Joy
I slid into his DMs on Instagram, like, literally.
- [12:19]
Dylan Dreyer
That's a true story.
- [12:21]
Natalie Joy
Yes. A modern day love story.
- [12:23]
Nick Vile
I don't know. I was like, I don't know if we'd make that one up, you know?
- [12:26]
Natalie Joy
Yeah, we'd probably be like, we bumped into each other at a grocery store. We were both reaching for the Ral's tomato sauce.
- [12:34]
Dylan Dreyer
So as the hosts of the Age of Attraction on Netflix, I think we can kind of dive into this age gap relationship you guys have. Nick, you're 18 years older. Yes. It's funny because I always thought it was weird when my dad was five years older than my mom, and then it turns out I was five years older than my ex husband, you know, when we were married. And it's like now it just doesn't seem to be a thing. Do you guys, like notice it day to day or it's just really not a thing?
- [13:01]
Nick Vile
Yeah, I mean, our day to day lives, I don't notice it at all. You know, I mean, I guess in some ways I definitely feel like I'm getting older and Natalie likes to. You know, the one thing that I really seem to have shortchanged Natalie is I was in some really, really great shape until I was like 37. And I'm in totally fine shape now, but I was really rocking and rolling. And there are some pictures online of that period in which I feel like Natalie feels a bit shortchanged. I think so much about relationships is, you know, I talk about it all the time, the compatibility. And I know, like a lot of people say, oh, what are these two people have in common? And blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, well, a lot, honestly, like, and sometimes it's like the little things, like, I've never enjoyed spending so much time with someone that I enjoy spending with Natalie. Especially in my. I'm in my romantic relationships. As a young man, I had this like, love will conquer all attitude that kind of turned into almost like this toxic, like, no Matter how much you don't get along or can't stand each other, as long as you say you love each other, you can make it work. And certainly all relationships take a ton of work. We work so hard on our relationship every day. But, like, given how hard a relationship is, it needs to be easy in between. We love being parents. You know, I've said before, I realize as a parent now there are people who want to have kids and there are people who love being parents. And I feel grateful to have married someone who, like myself, really enjoys being parents. And like, that that makes it easy for us to have our quality time together. And I feel very lucky to have that. You know, we like a lot of the same shows. You know, there's not all of them, but I don't think you have to have much of an age difference for women in relationships to be like, what the hell are you talking? Um, you know, and.
- [14:58]
Natalie Joy
Or like, when he shows me a video that he thinks is funny.
- [15:01]
Dylan Dreyer
Yes. And that doesn't matter who's what age,
- [15:05]
Natalie Joy
no matter how old you are, it's
- [15:07]
Dylan Dreyer
still just not a good video. Do you ever play that stupid game where it's like, well, when I was 20, you were only 2.
- [15:14]
Natalie Joy
Oh, that's my favorite.
- [15:15]
Nick Vile
I hate that game.
- [15:16]
Natalie Joy
It's my favorite. I'll find like a. A photo will come up on my memories or something, and I'd be like, what were you doing in 2008? And he's like, it wouldn't be funny
- [15:28]
Nick Vile
if there weren't people online making the same jokes that have less of a sense of humor about it.
- [15:33]
Dylan Dreyer
That's a very good point.
- [15:35]
Nick Vile
It's so. Yeah.
- [15:38]
Dylan Dreyer
So I'm curious because I'm 44 and I know how I was raised by my parents, and I wonder if there's a generational gap there, because my parents were the kind where you just go outside, they don't know what you're doing, they don't know where you are, they ring a bell, you come home for dinner. There's not a lot of talking through feelings. There's not a lot of helicopter parenting. And Natalie, I'm curious for you how you were raised. Was it more hands on for you?
- [16:05]
Natalie Joy
I was raised by single mom who had four children and worked. She was working single mom. So I was kind of the same way. You know, we couldn't afford a babysitter around the clock, so it was a lot of like, call the cops if you need to, I guess, you know, and, yeah, come home in the street, like, comes on and a lot of that. I think that was another thing that Nick and I really had in common was how we wanted to raise and parent our children. You know, and I think there's definitely some things where we teach each other and we come to each other and we're like, you know, I think maybe this is how we should tackle this situation when this happens. And we have. And we've always been like that since, I mean, honestly since she was born, we've like over communicated. Do you think we should? But I don't think we're afraid to kind of push back and kind of open the door of like, well, what if it is, you know, more of the gentle parenting side that helps this situation but not that situation? You know, I think we are very much on the same page and that was something we realized that we had in common early on.
- [17:11]
Dylan Dreyer
Is there any parenting style you2 tend to disagree on?
- [17:15]
Nick Vile
Yeah, I think it's very situational. I mean, I don't gravitate towards like the. I don't even know honestly, what Dental parenting. I couldn't define it. But I think there's obviously a lot of value in a lot of aspects of that. Right. You know, and I think to Natalie's point, I don't think there's. It's not like a diet. There are situations where maybe you need some tough love with a child. There are some situations where, you know, like Natalie kind of like to literally get down on their level and communicate with them. And I think whether it's boys or girls, but I think as a father, especially with women, if I had one dream to like, one thing I could ensure I teach my daughters is how to, how to realize that they have control over their feelings, you know, and that their perspective on any situation can evolve and change over time. And when we initially feel triggered, that's okay. But like to be open to the possibility of reflecting on that tough love isn't a great way of necessarily teaching someone how to process, you know, their emotions and how to like analyze and reflect. And sometimes getting on their level and talking about feelings is a great way of doing that. I know enough and I have 10 brothers and sisters that like, you can be the most amazing parents and you're going to look back and realize maybe you made some mistakes or you would have done things differently.
- [18:38]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah, it's funny you say that because I had a situation over the weekend. My four year old, it was flag football practice and my six year old also plays on the same flag football team. But my 4 year old was having one of those meltdowns where he just did. Would not detach from my leg, did not want to go out there. And he, he rarely does that. And I'm like, just go, just go, just go. Half hour later, he still didn't want to go. But then we hit this point where I think he wanted to go, but he was too embarrassed to go because now all the other kids on the team will, oh, oh, Rusty, thanks for coming over. You know, that kind of. And I sat with him and I said, you have the power to change the way you're feeling right now. No one out there cares but you in this moment have the chance to just turn your feelings around and go out there and play. Right? Like, you don't have to be embarrassed. It didn't do anything. You still hung onto my leg the rest of the time. But it was the effort. It was the effort of trying to explain to him like, you can turn your day around, you know, And I think that's something my parents didn't necessarily talk to me about. And, you know, I'm so open to trying to get all of those feelings out on the table with my kids.
- [19:46]
Nick Vile
Just to even attempt that to a
- [19:47]
Dylan Dreyer
four year old is psychotic.
- [19:51]
Nick Vile
Well, no, I mean, like, it's great, you know, I mean. Cause I remember being in my 20s and like, the idea that you could change how you feel about something and you had control is like. I mean, I've told this story a million times, but I was going through a bad breakup and my dad was like, suggesting it's time to get over it. And I literally told him that I had a better chance of levitating. And I believed it when I said it, you know, because I was just convinced. I was, I can't change how I feel. I'm at the mercy of whatever. And that's obviously not true, but I never, like, considered the possibility. And so, you know, it's amazing that you're doing that at such an early age. And I imagine it will take a long time, but planting that seed early, I think is a great thing.
- [20:39]
Dylan Dreyer
More of the Parent chat after the break. So, I mean, you guys, I feel like, for the most part, have a positive relationship with social media and the fans that adore you guys. So thinking ahead, of course, not anytime soon, but thinking ahead to how your kids will take on social media, is that something you want to keep away from them for as long as possible or do you want to teach them
- [21:19]
Natalie Joy
about it being in the world that we're in? I Think we obviously see a lot of the negative sides of social media. I think watching my like, nieces and nephews who are in their teens who are all on social media, I think I've seen kind of what it has done to them of the compare. And I think it's just a dangerous place and you can't control it. And I think we're gonna try.
- [21:50]
Nick Vile
I really empathize and feel for parents seven, eight years ago when they had no idea how dangerous these phones were. I mean, they're literally weapons of mass destruction. I think that they were putting into kids hands. And you're g giving the entire world access to your kids without you knowing, you know, to help me do what I do. And thank you for saying we have a positive relationship. I don't always feel that way because obviously when it's coming at you, it always, you know, it's just like, to your point, like, it's easy to feel like the main character on your phone and not in a positive way.
- [22:24]
Natalie Joy
I think it also starts with us, I think, being very conscious about like being on our phones, around our kids. And like, you know, if we're sitting on our phones at the dinner table, then why wouldn't they also want to sit on a phone, you know? And so I think it starts with us of like, setting this expectation of, you know, she. If we had it our way, she probably wouldn't have social media until she's like, in college.
- [22:51]
Nick Vile
I don't see the upside. You know, I don't either. It's. It's. I don't. I don't think anyone's better for it. You know, I think I have learned to. I'm grateful, you know, like so much of our business, you know, is around social media. So I'm grateful for the platform, but I think there's a cost of doing business and. And I don't think it's added a ton of meaningful value.
- [23:16]
Dylan Dreyer
Well, I think it's interesting you say that because as parents, we can control for the most part what our kids do, right? And I don't let my kids go on the phone or the iPad. And there was a friend of my son's who's like, are you on Roblox? And I was like, no. And he's like, can I get Roblox? And I was like, no. And he's like, well, he wants to talk to me on Roblox. And I'm like, calvin, we have a house phone. Here's the phone number. And if this kid wants to call you he can call you on the house phone and you guys can set up a play date. And it's really cute because this kid also happens to have a house phone, and there's one number written by our phone, and it's his friend's phone number. And every day after school, they just saw each other at school, but they call each other, they ask for playdates, they come over and it's like, if you don't give it to them, they. They don't have it right. So it's in our control to not give it to him. But I, I agree that we all kind of be on the same page because they don't want to miss out on what their friends are doing.
- [24:08]
Nick Vile
The, the optimist in me is, is hopeful that I think more and more people are literally waking up to what social media and its impact on our lives as individuals, as parents, as children. I don't think it's ever going to go away, but I think there, I'm hoping there's going to be a renaissance, you know, like post pandemic, you know, type like to get outside to just to, you know, whatever it is to like movie theaters, you know, just row, whatever it is. I think that, you know, as humans, we are, we are social creatures. We literally need that. And I'm hopeful that we will continue to challenge ourselves and advocate for maybe an old school way of socializing than on Roblox or in the DMs.
- [24:58]
Dylan Dreyer
Well, we're working on it. The three of us are working on it. So we like to end on a parenting win. I think for both of you. I'll give you a chance to just something you can think of that happened recently that just made you feel like, I've got this. I'm really good at being a mom, or I'm really good at being a dad.
- [25:16]
Natalie Joy
The other day, I was in River's room. I was building her like a building as a stretch. I was screwing in a couple of screws into a step stool so she could like, stand at her sink in her bathroom, you know, and brush her teeth. And as soon as I finished, she looked at me and tapped, patted me on the shoulder and said, good job, mama.
- [25:36]
Dylan Dreyer
Aw.
- [25:36]
Natalie Joy
And I was like, oh, my God. I just like, so sweet. I needed that, you know, it was like I had been so stressed, the screws weren't going in.
- [25:45]
Nick Vile
I'm like, hot.
- [25:46]
Dylan Dreyer
I'm uncomfortable.
- [25:47]
Natalie Joy
And she just was like, good job, Mama.
- [25:49]
Nick Vile
Aw.
- [25:49]
Natalie Joy
And loved it. And so I think that was her favorite.
- [25:53]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah.
- [25:54]
Nick Vile
So sweet. I'm trying to think. Well, recently nanny had to leave town for a night and I was left with River. River really likes me. She's obsessed with her mom. And so she slept in our bed that night and she kind of woke up hysterical wanting her mom. But I think it's just more like even when that happens, I've never panicked, you know, type of thing, you know, And I think looking back, I don't remember things thinking in the moment, but I'm, you know, answering the question. I sometimes, you know, it's a little scary sometimes when your kid's freaking out. But you know, to, to keep that poise is when you look back, it gives you some confidence. I think I'm a great dad. But like, it's amazing the little things that Natalie does that I, I mean, you know, if I didn't have Natalie, I. I wonder if I'd figure some of this stuff out. Thankfully I have her just like, you know, just things I don't know, just the little things I don't, you know, I'm sure, you know, that I just take for granted or that she will introduce into Rivers world and things like that that I'm very grateful to have her. But sometimes when I think of those little things on my own, it's.
- [27:01]
Dylan Dreyer
I'm pretty proud of myself as, as you should be. But it's also really special that you recognize that. And I think you guys are such a great couple. Just watching from the outside and getting the chance to talk to you. You guys are so great. Thank you so much.
- [27:13]
Natalie Joy
Thank you for taking the time to chat with us.
- [27:16]
Dylan Dreyer
Yeah, thank you for joining me. Wasn't that such a great conversation? I mean, it was so special to watch a couple so in love who supports each other so much through this journey, through the ups and downs that they've had over the course of their relationship. Thank you guys so much for tuning in today. I'd love to hear your comments, so be sure to comment below. Also follow us on Instagram today Parents or Ylan Dreyer the in keep commenting, keep watching and we'll see you next time. Bye Bye. This episode was produced by Anne Legamayo with video production by Andy Tavares. Rachel. Paula Abramson is our parenting reporter. Our senior producer is Tyre Nobles. Our audio engineer is Joe Plorde. Our head of audio production is Jessica Fenton. Ashley Domagola is our production manager. Sadie Bass is our supervising producer. Ariana Davis is the executive editor the of the Today Show. I'm Dylan Dreyer and this has been the parent chat a production of the Today show. See you next week.
- [28:20]
Nick Vile
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