← The Ultimate Human with Gary Brecka
The Ultimate Human with Gary Brecka
231. TJ Dillashaw: On Biohacking, Longevity, Injury Recovery and Life After UFC
01:04:04
Loading summary
Transcript370 lines
- [00:00]
A
If you want to be a champion, you can't leave no stone unturned. You got to have all energy systems trained to the best ability. Chasing peak performance and longevity go hand in hand. And if you treat the body the way that it was intended to be treated, and you recover the right way, you eat the right foods, you supplement the right way, your performance is so much better.
- [00:16]
B
Well, you suffered through a lot of injuries during your career. I mean, I know that you fought with two blown out shoulders.
- [00:21]
A
Yeah, I mean, just wear and tear from wrestling since I was 8 year old, through college and then more so as being a professional.
- [00:27]
B
You were doing stem cells early on in your career to try to preserve as much of that time as you.
- [00:32]
A
I do all my research trying to figure out like, wait, what are like the Kobe Bryant doing in the world to preserve themselves or whatever it may be to keep me in the game without having to get surgery.
- [00:42]
B
So you get the stem cells, you come back, you win another championship.
- [00:45]
A
Yeah, I win the world title back. Wow.
- [00:47]
B
Now that you're more woke to longevity and wellness, you've got this brand out there which I'm sure you're pouring your soul into. What made you say this is the next career path for me?
- [00:56]
A
Something I've noticed from just training, in my experience, is that.
- [01:04]
B
Foreign? Hey guys, welcome back to the Ultimate Human podcast. I'm your host, human biologist Gary Brecker, where we go down the road of everything. Anti aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between. And today's guest is no stranger to biohacking. Now he's into longevity. It's the everything in between that we're going to talk about today. And you know, I've got two time UFC bantamweight world champion, TJ Dillashaw. Dude, I am so pumped that you are on the Ultimate Human podcast, brother.
- [01:39]
A
I am beyond pump. This is exciting. I'm a fan of the podcast, I'm a fan of what you stand for and the whole Maha movement. So I'm, I'm, I'm ecstatic to be here.
- [01:47]
B
Thanks man. I really appreciate that. You know, I, I think that your journey is like so many professional athletes, journeys and so many a listers, celebrities, actors, people that have been had careers where they were very much in the public eye, you know, work themselves to greatness and then one day it just ends. Right?
- [02:13]
A
Yeah.
- [02:13]
B
And you know, I, I've read a lot about you and you know how, how disappointed you were about the way that your career ended. It didn't end the way that you had you know, planned for it to end. You know, you had some skirmishes along the way, which you've been very transparent about, you know, to your suspension for PEDs and, like, what you learned from that. But I wonder for my audience that maybe isn't into the UFC or into professional fighting or mma, but understands that, you know, people that achieve world championship status, you know, must have given so much for so long of their life. And when it ends, like, how does that transition go, you know, Because I think most people are building at the time when your career was decrescending, and I've heard you talk about it before, and I think my audience would get a lot out of it.
- [03:07]
A
Yeah. Becomes, like, a part of who you are. Like, my sense of purpose. I mean, the whole reason why I started wrestling, like, wrestling's not a very enjoyable sport. And I always think my little son is wrestling now, too. And it always baffles me of why kids get into it and they stay with it, but it's like this sense of accomplishment and purpose you have. And I was good at it, and it got rewarded.
- [03:28]
B
Right.
- [03:28]
A
I started at 8 years old. Yeah. My son's 7. He's wrestling now.
- [03:31]
B
And is he really?
- [03:32]
A
Yeah. And I became really good at it, and it was just something that, like, filled my cup. And now ever since that ever happened, I've just been chasing greatness ever since and peak performance. The whole reason why I went to college, it wasn't like a. A great student, but had to be. Had to turn into one because of athletics and, you know, student athlete and. Yeah, I had to do all that. So pushed through college, studied kinesiology just because it was. I thought it was going to make me a better athlete. Was going to possibly be a physician's assistant or physical therapy because I was just into the body.
- [04:06]
B
Right on.
- [04:07]
A
Got talked into fighting, and so I dropped out of grad school.
- [04:11]
B
Yeah. How did that go? So, first of all, I want. I want to just give a little credit to your dad. I think it was your father that was a wrestler. Hallelujah.
- [04:16]
A
Yeah. My dad. How was a wrestler?
- [04:18]
B
And he had a cool nickname. What was it?
- [04:19]
A
Yeah, Hazardous.
- [04:20]
B
Hazardous how? Like, okay, if you're raised by Hazardous Hal, at some point, you got it. Does your son have a nickname?
- [04:26]
A
Not yet. Man, I hope he doesn't turn into anything like Hazard. I mean, Hazardous. How? He's now in his 60s and acts like he's still in his 30s, and you can. Like, he's beat himself up. He's hazardous. You know, like, jumping off 100 foot cliffs into water, fracturing his arm, like, never slowing down.
- [04:42]
B
Right.
- [04:42]
A
But yes, he got me into wrestling and pushed me to where I am today. But to drop out of grad school. I had an assistant wrestling coach, Mark Munoz. He was a UFC fighter at the time. And after I got done wrestling, I never reached my goals. I never like, became a national champion, never was an all American. I just feel like I fell short and I'll. It'll come full circle that I overworked myself and didn't know how to compete yet to my full stability later. But he's like, hey, I think you're a real aggressive wrestler. You'd be a great fighter. You should give it a shot. Dropped out of grad school, said, I'll give myself a year. If I'm any good with fighting, then I'll stick with it. If not, I can always go back to school.
- [05:22]
B
And at the time, it wasn't, it wasn't the grand stage it is today. I mean, the sport grew while you were, your career was growing too, because, you know, UFC was like very much kind of in the fringes, you know, especially when Dana first and the fetas first bought it and, and then it became the fastest growing sanction support in the world.
- [05:40]
A
Yes.
- [05:41]
B
And, you know, and I think they did obviously an incredible job for it. I mean, I think and thing you buy for two and a half million dollars, you sell for four billion. Yeah, it's.
- [05:48]
A
I mean, I owe the world to put the. Build a stage that made me build the brand of myself.
- [05:52]
B
Yeah.
- [05:53]
A
The Ultimate Fighter came out my freshman year of college. Wow. Yeah. And that's what really took it off the map.
- [05:59]
B
Okay.
- [05:59]
A
Right. So my weight class wasn't even owned by the UFC yet. When I first started fighting, WEC owned it and then Zufa bought wec and so I was on the first Ultimate Fighter. So crazy story. I graduated college, dropped out of grad school, started fighting within nine months. Built up four fights, got. I was only. I was only 4. 0. Got on the first ultimate fighter for my weight class because UFC just bought wec and so I had a chance to make it in the UFC when it was only four.
- [06:28]
B
And that's phantom weight. It just hadn't. It didn't exist. I didn't know that you could own certain weight classes. What do you mean?
- [06:33]
A
Well, promotions, right. So WC was the promotion. They had 155, 145 and 135. The UFC at the time only had 155 and up. Okay. And so Once the lower weight classes started catching momentum, the UFC came in and acquired it acquired the WC and rolled it into the UFC promotion. Oh, right. So I jumped on the first Ultimate Fighter. I only had four fights, only been fighting for a year, made it to the finale and got myself a contract. And then, dude, three years later I won a world title. So it was kind of like a skyrocket career.
- [07:06]
B
That is wild.
- [07:07]
A
But your question was like, that was my. That was like my identity to a point. Like, I put so much work into it for it just to be over like that due to injury and not being able to perform anymore was. Was an eye opening experience because, like. And that's all I ever did. That's all what I was. I mean, I didn't really have much business outside of fighting. I mean, dabbled a little bit here and there, but how I fed my family, how I kept a roof over my head was by performing in that octagon. And so it was, it was.
- [07:37]
B
And it was really just getting paid for those fights.
- [07:40]
A
Yeah.
- [07:40]
B
Right. I mean, you had to make that work for the rest of the year or the time frame in between fights. And it's why, you know, you don't get paid to train.
- [07:48]
A
No.
- [07:49]
B
Right. I mean, maybe you get sponsorships.
- [07:51]
A
Yeah. I mean, thanks to social media, sponsorships became more prev. Prevalent for like organic lifestyle stuff.
- [07:59]
B
Right.
- [08:00]
A
And hopefully people are supporting brands that they actually use, which that'll come around to why I started Wild Society. But yes, sponsors help pay the bills in between fights. And luckily enough, I was able to build a brand by being a champion so that I can get bigger and better sponsorships to supply my lifestyle.
- [08:16]
B
Yeah. You know, I think, I think everyone, you know, we get wiser as we get older and I've actually heard you talk about how you wish you knew then what you know now. Right. I think we're all kind of that way to some extent. But you know, what changed after your career that you wish you had known during your career? I mean, I. Obviously you must have had excellent training or you wouldn't have become, you know, a two time world champion. So you can't really point a finger at how I wasn't training properly. But were you missing like the nutrition piece, the recovery piece, the supplement piece? Like what. What was missing then that you wish you could have plugged in. And do you think that would have changed the trajectory of your career when you made your comeback?
- [09:00]
A
Yeah. I'm so glad you asked that. I mean, 100. It would have changed. I could have Been better in my mind because the things that I changed in my 30s, I wish I would have known when I was in college. But if I would have, you know, known this in college and performed the way I should have in wrestling, I might, might have never dabbled into mma. So there's your wrestling career.
- [09:17]
B
Could have taken you a different direction.
- [09:19]
A
Yeah, it could have. I could have become, you know, a national champion, all American. And maybe I stick with wrestling, which I'm so glad I was meant to become a fighter. Just my mentality so that could have happened. But even the way that I was training in my 20s and became a world champion training this way, I. But I was burning the candle at both ends. I was training six, seven days a week as hard as I possibly can, two or three days and wasn't taking my nutrition or my supplement, supplementation the right way. I was, I was a wrestler. And growing up as a wrestler, you're always taught just to outwork your opponent. Just whatever it is, just outwork him. Just do it harder, do it more, do it better. Which leads to being overworked. And I had no idea what being overworked was. Yeah, to where when I would get to the end of my season in wrestling when I was in college, it's a nine month season, it's really, really long. And I'd always peak in December and then nationals is in March. I'd always felt like I was either really injured or I felt like I was out of shape. And I was like, how is that possible? I've trained so hard. I'm not drinking out with my friends. I'm, you know, doing all the right things. I'm getting up in the morning and I'm running and then my body would just crash.
- [10:22]
B
Yeah.
- [10:23]
A
And I held. I, I learned a little bit more when I first started fighting through Uriah and the way that he treated his body at alpha male, but nowhere to the extent that I learned once I hit my 30s and was like just needed to figure out why I was waking up tired, why I didn't want to train. Like just cortisol up. Hormones low. I met a coach, Sam Calvita. A lot of us call him coach.
- [10:49]
B
I read about that.
- [10:50]
A
He owns the training lab. A very eye opening.
- [10:53]
B
What time frame is this?
- [10:54]
A
This was when I was coaching the Ultimate Fighter in end of 2016. Yeah, into 2016, going to the beginning of 2017. I met him, I brought, met him through another fighter. He, he came out to the Ultimate Fighter just to kind of pick my brain and I wanted to teach some of the guys some of the knowledge that I was learning. And it was just an eye opening experience of the things that he knew that he can make me better. We did blood work, we did hair analysis, all these things to find out what my body was doing, what toxins. I had one of my hormones.
- [11:27]
B
Wow. He was actually measuring toxins back then. Good for him.
- [11:30]
A
Yeah. I found out that I had insanely high levels of arsenic.
- [11:33]
B
Yeah.
- [11:34]
A
Which we've tested a lot of wrestlers and for whatever reason, a lot of wrestlers do. I don't know if it's like what the mats are cleaned with or the mats in general or just obviously lifestyles.
- [11:42]
B
Yeah.
- [11:43]
A
But yeah, a lot of the wrestlers we've tested have a high arsenic. So it was an eye opening experience that he was like, hey, look, you were a world champion, but we can make you this much better.
- [11:53]
B
Yeah.
- [11:53]
A
So when I met him, I was living in Colorado at the time. I decided to go do two weeks with him in Southern California, where I went to school at Cal State Fullerton, but down in that area to go do two weeks with him. And I was blown away with all that. He was informing on the way that we train, that I had to move my whole life back down there. So I moved from Colorado back to Southern California because of Coach Cal.
- [12:16]
B
Wow. When you move the coach out, dude. Yeah. You didn't have the money at that time. Definitely. Yeah.
- [12:23]
A
I mean, also, it's hard to move like someone else. I tell us building a gym don't pay for the fighters, pay for the coaches. Right. But also coaches hard for them to move their entire lives. He has nine kids. He's got a setup, like spot in your Belinda. So I'm the athlete wanting to get better. I was the one willing to make the sacrifice and I would move my life.
- [12:43]
B
Right.
- [12:43]
A
I was from California too, and I was living in Colorado at the time because of training with a coach. And so I decided that this was my next step of evolution. So I moved back to Southern California.
- [12:53]
B
Right on. And how much of an impact did that make making that shift?
- [12:58]
A
Oh, it was game changing when it came to. I think the biggest thing that he taught me too is how I periodized like my entire life when it came to, like, when I was training hard, what days I was recovering. MMA is the hardest sport, in my opinion, to train for because we use so many energy systems. So he teach me, like, when I need to do my Zone 2 training, which we call our low base, how many times a week and what days I should do it. Turning TJ Dillashaw into the CEO of my own body. Like, wow, me, really? Rather than just like, having all these coaches pull me in different directions, I set my schedule. So Mondays was low base in the morning, and then I would do wrestling or jiu jitsu.
- [13:39]
B
Right.
- [13:39]
A
And then Tuesday would be my really hard day where I'm sparring, I'm doing insane strength and conditioning to where that's where I'm gonna. But I learned what pushing lactic thresholds were.
- [13:49]
B
Oh.
- [13:49]
A
And learning what even a lactic threshold was.
- [13:52]
B
Yeah. That is brutal.
- [13:54]
A
And I. I'm so glad now that's the only thing I'm glad of of retirement. That I don't have to do lactic threshold training anymore.
- [14:01]
B
Because for people that don't know what that is, I mean, what. You're not talking about restriction bands, are you? You're talking about just getting into that zone. Yeah.
- [14:09]
A
Well, so I guess I'm skipping so much. There's so much information to talk about. But the first thing you do when you meet Sam Calvita is you test your body. When it comes to your VO2 max, what you're doing RMR. So what I'm breathing at rest. You know, how much if I'm burning fat or carbs at rest and learning when my body is, you know, hopefully I'm burning 100 fats at rest. But due to lifestyles in the way that we were training, most athletes and just people in general are burning carbs at rest.
- [14:37]
B
Wow.
- [14:37]
A
You know which. You're producing lactic acid. So the longer you can burn fats for energy, the. The farther off you can start producing lactic acid. So first you test your RMR and then you test your VO2 max. And he finds that exact crossover point of when you start per heart for your heartbeat, when you start burning carbs for energy rather than fats.
- [14:56]
B
Wow.
- [14:56]
A
Dominantly. And then that's your zone two. So it's like his algorithm knows to the beat when I'm in zone two.
- [15:04]
B
Wow.
- [15:04]
A
So I knew when I first met him, my heart rate at 141 and below, I was burning mainly fat for my energy system. Once I got over 141, I started burning carbs. And when I start burning carbs, I start producing lactic acid. And then you have a threshold. And knowing what that threshold is by doing a VO2 max.
- [15:21]
B
Wow. So this helps you keep pace during a fight. So you're like. Even though you're not looking at a heart monitor during a fight, you kind of trained Enough that, you know, this is. I'm getting out of that zone, and I need to, like, ease back and. And get back into that zone where I'm actually burning fat.
- [15:35]
A
Yes. And by. By changing your lifestyle, when it comes to the way you eat, the way you train, the way you recover, the supplements you're taking, you can change your zones. So when I first met him, I was living in Vegas coaching Ultimate Fighter, eating bad. He met me the day after my birthday. I went out drinking for my birthday, and, like, he did all my tests, right? So I was at 141. But after working with Sam for my first camp, I moved my. My heart rate up to, like, high 50s, like 158. Anything under that, I'm burning mainly fats for my energy.
- [16:04]
B
Wow.
- [16:05]
A
And so now I can go to my heart rate to 158 before I start burning carbs and start producing lactic acid. So by creating a lower base. That's why we do zone two, training this low base to build this base.
- [16:17]
B
Right.
- [16:17]
A
And by doing that, now I'm not burning, you know, I'm producing lactic acid to158. So now if I move that threshold, then I can move my. My lactic threshold further and then learning how to stay in it longer.
- [16:28]
B
Well, because you won two championship fights in the fifth round, right?
- [16:32]
A
Yes. Yeah.
- [16:33]
B
Yeah. Because, I mean, so clearly.
- [16:36]
A
3. Oh, no. 2. You're right. 2.
- [16:38]
B
Yeah. Yeah, it was. See, I did my research. Yeah, I did my research. Actually. My team did the research. Malia, thank you. No, I mean, I was fascinated by that because, you know, I. I'm a fan of the ufc. I. I don't pretend to, you know, understand Jiu jitsu at this. At that level or. Or the competitive fight sport at any. At any high level. But, you know, I always respected athletes that still had a gas tank in the fifth round, because, you know, just for a layman, if you put on a set of boxing gloves and you just stand in front of a heavy bag and you just go off on that heavy bag as hard as you can for 60 seconds, you're taking a knee.
- [17:19]
A
Yeah.
- [17:19]
B
And. And. And to be watching, you know, this. These guys go at that level for 25 minutes. I'm. I'm exhausted watching. I used to be fascinated. Nate Diaz would do that a lot and, like, get into these late rounds and just kind of start slapping people around. He looked like he was having fun.
- [17:35]
A
Y.
- [17:36]
B
And. And, like, he wasn't worn out at all.
- [17:38]
A
Nate Diaz is. And also, you got to go, like, everyone's genetically made up a little bit different too. He's a slow twitch athlete. He's not someone that I'm going to say he's like real explosive, real powerful, not really muscle bound. He's a. So his thresholds are different. Right. Like he's, he's probably doing a lot of aerobic training to where I feel like there's that perfect balance. You look at a guy like Marab. I think genetically he's made up differently as well too and probably produce a deals with lactic acid a little bit differently than a lot of us do. But he's explosive as well, like strong. So I want to be anaerobic strong, I want to be aerobic strong and I want a great lactic threshold. Like I want to be a well balanced athlete. So if I looked at Nate Diaz, yes, he has cardio for days, but where he's lacking to where, if you.
- [18:19]
B
Want to be a champ, knockout strength.
- [18:20]
A
And yeah, if you want to be a champion, you can't leave no stone unturned. You got to have all energy systems trained to the best ability. And I think he lacks that power like that explosiveness, that squeeze strength. Like, you know, like Habib had really good like grappling strength and cardio to where he can grab your wrist. He's going to hold you down forever. Right, right. So missing that a little bit.
- [18:40]
B
Right. If you know me, you know I'm a huge believer in the benefits of hydrogen water. H2TAB delivers cost effective portable tablets that generate ultra clean molecular hydrogen at 12 parts per million, one of the highest concentrations on the market. With over 1300 published studies showing benefits of oxidative stress, energy, weight recovery, brain function and so much more. Taking charge of your health has never been easier or more cost effective. Just drop a tablet in water, let it dissolve and drink it back. It's less than a dollar a day, science backed and part of my daily routine. I never travel without this and it is my favorite biohack. Visit drinkh2tab.com that's drinkh to tab.com and upgrade your hydration today. Now let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. But, but do you think that understanding this lactic threshold and actually knowing that you're not in the car burning zone and accelerating towards lactic acid, I mean this is, this is what allowed you to win two championships in, in the late rounds, I mean in the fifth round. Yeah, I mean I won deep into a fight.
- [19:50]
A
I won my first championship before I met Sam Calavita. It Was more so when I got to my 30s and like, how much better I felt like before. I was burning the candles at two ends and I just like felt tired all the time. Yeah, I was a stimulant junkie. I would drink a. Which is, I live my life not the way I do anymore.
- [20:08]
B
So right now we're gonna get into that too.
- [20:10]
A
I've been on this longevity path for like a decade now, but before that I was drinking fiverr energy drinks, those little shots at like 6, 7pm Wow. I know. And. And I might. Obviously my adrenal glands were toast. I learned this from Sam. Then my adrenal glands were toast because the way that I was living my life. But I was, I was exhausted all the time. So I drink a 5 hour energy drink because I was gonna go hit mitts at 7 or 8pm and then I'm expected to go to sleep.
- [20:34]
B
Yeah.
- [20:35]
A
You know, but I processed. I feel like caffeine different back then because I was just. Wasn't treating my body right.
- [20:42]
B
Yeah, your metabolism was probably just screaming at that point. I mean, I mean, you're burning so many calories. But it's fascinating to know how much structure and architecture goes into this. Obviously not just the, the training game for jiu jitsu and stand up and for wrestling and, and, you know, but studying, you know, your opponent. I've watched podcasts of yours and how much tape that you would watch and how, you know, you would, you, you would look at how a fighter stance, they would hold a right hand up and try to keep you off with their left hand and open it up for your. For your left cross. And like, you would have game plans. In fact, I watched you talk about how you had your game plans ruined. You know, in, in fights where they substituted another fighter, like 24 hours out, you're like, yeah, I spent my. I spent my whole training camp, you know, training to fight one guy and I, I forget his name. But you had actually trained with him. Yeah. In your camp to get ready for the fight, and then you ended up fighting him.
- [21:36]
A
So I had the biggest in UFC history at the time I beat Hindenburg. I was undefeated his entire career. Like number one, pound for pound chain. I was an eight to one underdog going into this fight. But I think I know the way that my mind works is just delusional optimism that I knew that I was going to win like you did most. This is the utmost belief in myself, no matter what. I feel like that's what has gotten me to the top. But Also got me in a lot of trouble as well that we can get into. But I was a massive underdog, won that fight. And I was on an ultimate fighter contract. Wasn't getting, you know, paid to be a champion yet. So it was awesome to get to rip that contract up, get paid different, go into Dana's office and the Fertittas and be like, congratulate me, give me a bonus. Like, yeah, I made it. Yeah, I'm getting married three weeks later, they pay for my honeymoon.
- [22:25]
B
They did, yeah.
- [22:26]
A
They paid for my honeymoon out at one and only Palmia. Amazing place. Like I hadn't lived the life that I got to live at my honeymoon forever. And then they hit me up like, hey, but we need you to fight eight weeks later, it was kind of like, here, little cherry on top. We need you to fight eight weeks later.
- [22:43]
B
Yeah.
- [22:43]
A
And I need you to defend the belt against Cinema Brow. This monster that I just beat that no one thought I was going to beat. So I'm, I'm training on my honeymoon. I'm waking up in the morning, I'm hitting the treadmill, I'm sprinting just because that's the way my mind works. I just, and I just knew that I had to train harder than the next guy. That's my, like, what I would do. So I'm training on my honeymoon. I got back, get into camp, an hour before weigh ins, I get a call from Linzo Fertitta saying like, hey, champ, Brow's not going to make weight. He fell, hit his head, got to be hit, rushed off to the hospital. We need you to fight Joe Stodo. So I knew Joe Soto.
- [23:16]
B
So you're preparing for this champ. So you, at least you were taking it about as serious as you've ever taken a fight, obviously.
- [23:22]
A
Yeah, but completely different fighting styles. Right. Like, Bar was a dominant striker. Yeah, he's got good jiu jitsu, but very knock high knockout power. Dominant striker to where Joe Stto was a wrestler that I've knew wrestling since we were kids and we were in training camp because he was going to fight in Sacramento. So he trained in Sacramento with us a little bit and I got to train with him. He was the Bellator champion. His first fight at the ufc, no one knew who he was yet and I knew how tough he was and.
- [23:48]
B
I had to lay because you trained with him.
- [23:50]
A
I had everything on the line to fight someone that no one knew. I had everything to lose. The most nervous I've ever been for a fight. But Lorenzo called me, he's like, hey, we need you to take this fight.
- [23:59]
B
Lorenzo Fertitta called you.
- [24:01]
A
Yeah, you, I mean, you got to take it. Lorenzo's calling you, man, the boss.
- [24:04]
B
And he's so calm. He's actually a very nice guy.
- [24:07]
A
He is. I love him, but.
- [24:08]
B
Yeah, yeah, he's a, he's a great human.
- [24:10]
A
Yeah. So the whole game plan had to go thrown out the window and like, within 24 hours, just kind of had to switch it up, you know?
- [24:17]
B
Wow. Yeah, but you don't have 24 hours to like retrain everything that you, you had done because you, you were preparing for this guy using a lot of, you know, I remember you talking about it, you know, put his left hand out and he would hold his right hand up and you were going to be using your left cross and you, you had a whole different game plan. So, I mean, how much did that throw you off going into that fight?
- [24:37]
A
It just turned into, you have to shut the brain off, which you hope to do in most fights anyways, and just get into.
- [24:43]
B
Starting to try to say, I'm not ready for this. What if this happens? What if that happens?
- [24:46]
A
Yeah.
- [24:47]
B
Going down pathways of worst case scenario, my delusional optimism.
- [24:50]
A
Right. Like everything in your mind wants to tell you that you're not going to win, that you're not going to be successful, that this fight's not the fight you should take whatever it may be. And it's so generic that I just smash it with, with positive affirmations like, yeah, I have a negative thought, I slam three positive ones on top of it, and eventually just trick my subconscious to believing that I'm the baddest man on the planet. Nothing can get in my way. And it's helped me a lot throughout my career.
- [25:18]
B
Yeah.
- [25:18]
A
And like I said, it's also got me in some trouble. It's why I can't lift my arm to the sky and I need a reverse shoulder replacement, things like that. But without it, I don't think I would have became a world champion either.
- [25:30]
B
Well, you, you, you suffered through a lot of injuries, you know, during your career. I mean, I know that you, you fought with two blown out shoulders. You know, you were, you were doing stem cells, you know, early on in your career, you know, to try to preserve as much of that, you know, time as you had. And, and I wonder if you'd talk a little bit about that, like, what were some of the things that you were doing before you really had your arms around biohacking and, and, you know, you had your Own supplement line. And you really dialed in.
- [25:57]
A
Yeah.
- [25:58]
B
What were you just doing as a competitive athlete and with that kind of shoulder pain? You know, first fighting through it and training through it. But how were you able to compete at that level? Do you think it was the stem cells? Were you doing regular rehabilitation therapy? Like, what were you. What were you doing?
- [26:14]
A
Both. All the above. It's a good story for you. So, yeah, again, I'm coaching the ultimate fighter. It's 2016, and at the end of the season, there's a coaches challenge for me and Cody o' Brien were. Cody Garbrandt were the coaches, and we have to do a challenge against each other. And whoever wins this challenge, like, we win like 15,000, and then we win 2,000 for every one of our fighters. So it's fun, right? It's like gambling out there. So we're playing tetherball, but it's in the winter and it's above a pool on a gymnastics balance beam. I'm on a balance beam. He's on a balance beam. And we got to play tetherball.
- [26:47]
B
Okay.
- [26:48]
A
And the first one to get to 20 or 10, whatever it was, wins. And if you fall off the balance beam, you have to get up and get back on the balance as fast as you possibly can before he hits it to the end. Oh.
- [26:58]
B
Because he can just keep racking up, going.
- [27:00]
A
You're not there. Right. It's like. It's like when you're a kid on the. On the playground, you're hitting and it's over their head and you just keep going. Right?
- [27:05]
B
Yeah.
- [27:05]
A
Yeah.
- [27:07]
B
I actually remember that I'm kind of dating myself because we used to play tetherball.
- [27:11]
A
Yeah, me too.
- [27:12]
B
I don't think anybody plays tetherball anymore.
- [27:13]
A
I don't know if they.
- [27:14]
B
There's a whole generation going, what the is that?
- [27:18]
A
Yeah. So I first dislike. I had my first shoulder surgery in 2004 during wrestling. But. And that was 2004. And then I re injured it playing this tetherball game. I fell off and I tried to catch myself on the balance beam so I can get back up as fast as I can before I let him score. Yeah, I'm very competitive.
- [27:35]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [27:36]
A
Like, I don't want to lose at anything. I don't care if we're playing Monopoly. Like, there's nothing I want to. There's nothing I want to lose that. Right.
- [27:42]
B
So I'm like.
- [27:43]
A
And I dislocate my shoulder out the back. No, it subluxes, though. So it goes out and Goes right back in. I didn't think anything of. It was like, whatever just finishes the game. And then afterwards, my shoulder was hurting. I tried doing stem cells here in the state. Well, to get. So me and Cody were coaching ultimate fighter at the end of ultimate fighter. We're supposed to fight each other for the world title. I had lost my belt, which was just burning me because I shouldn't have lost the fight. It was a split decision. Lost against Dominic Cruz that still to this day, I feel like I won. So I wanted my belt back so bad. I'm fighting Cody Garbrandt at the end of the show and I blow my shoulder out. Like, I can't afford to get surgery because if I get surgery, I'm out for a year and a half, two years, like a year just to get back to what I need to and then obviously get back into fight shape again.
- [28:28]
B
Right.
- [28:29]
A
So I do all my research trying to figure out, like, wait, what are like, the Kobe Bryant stuff doing in the world to. To preserve themselves or whatever it may be to these other alternative medicines to keep me in the game without having to get surgery. And I find stem cells. And so I go down to Panama for the stem cell. Neil Reardon's stem cell institute. He's like the godfather of stem cells. That was my first. First treatment. Amazing. Held me together. I had intra articular and also intramuscular stem cells that then I was able to do as much bands as I possibly could to kind of encase my shoulder in concrete.
- [29:08]
B
Right.
- [29:09]
A
Like, I knew since the capsule was.
- [29:11]
B
Probably stretched or torn, you need the muscles to kind of.
- [29:14]
A
I had a full tear, right? I had a full tear. So I knew it was not going to just like, grow back. Like stem cells are going to grow something that's not there, right. But all my other, like my delts and also my other four rotator cuffs, like, in their muscles as well. I knew my other ones really need to be as strong as possible just to kind of like encase that thing in concrete so it wouldn't sublux again. It would sublux here and there, but it did a lot better job of being able to like, strengthen those. It sped up my recovery a lot. And even more so, I met a very influential person at the Panama instance place. And he got into, like, testing cells all over the world. And we found out the bio accelerator placed on a meta. Ian had by far the most powerful cells. The biggest competition out there, actually. Their viability of their stem cells were zero compared to what bio accelerator was.
- [30:04]
B
Wow.
- [30:04]
A
So I knew that's where I needed to go. So from 2017 to the end of my career, Bio Accelerator held me together in multiple facets. My shoulders down there, my L4, my L5 disc were bulging, and I had to get those, like, to reabsorb, which helped with that. I had arthritis.
- [30:19]
B
Did they put you under and do the thing? Oh, yeah. That's the way to go. Because those inner articulates are not fun.
- [30:25]
A
Yeah.
- [30:25]
B
And then. And then the soreness afterwards is no joke either. You know, like the. For a few hours afterwards, you're like, oh, this isn't. This isn't so bad. And then the next day, you feel like a truck ran over your shoulder. But then they. Then they absorb and they. They really get to work, from what I've been told.
- [30:40]
A
Maybe you can help me with this. Is that, like, usually if it hurts more after your injection is because you have more inflammation there. And it was like going and working. It was doing its job.
- [30:48]
B
Oh, yeah, right.
- [30:49]
A
Like you inject your knee, which I've had a massive knee surgery, too, was like, very painful in my understanding, was. It's because it was working. It was doing.
- [30:57]
B
Oh, yeah. The more damage, the more inflammation. The more inflammation, the more pain.
- [31:00]
A
Okay.
- [31:00]
B
So, you know, that's. It's. It's a great sign that it's working. It's just not fun to go through it.
- [31:05]
A
Yeah.
- [31:05]
B
I had the same thing. Not. Not quite to that extent at all, but I had a torn bicep tendon. Not completely torn, but a torn bicep tendon. And I had it injected. And we've done a lot of injections in the NFL Alumni association with professional athletes and. And they are game changers, man. I mean, I don't know professional athlete alive today that if they weren't facing a similar injury, wouldn't be thinking about stem cells, exosomes, those kinds of things.
- [31:31]
A
And even things I didn't realize that were going to come from it, that happened too. Like, again, I wasn't treating my body the right way before I met Sam and wasn't eating the right kinds of foods, and so I'd have psoriasis outbreaks.
- [31:42]
B
Wow.
- [31:43]
A
And when I went down to Bio Accelerator and I got the IV stem cells, like, my psoriasis would go away.
- [31:50]
B
Right.
- [31:51]
A
You know, like.
- [31:51]
B
Yeah, because, you know, the. These are, you know, not to steal the podcast, but they're. Our skin is not just a barrier. It's a. It's a gateway. And we use the skin as a secondary route of waste elimination. Very often. I mean, this is why you get the cold sweats, right? I mean, when you're, when you have a fever and you're. And you're actually, you know, sweating, sometimes you're actually freezing cold and you're still sweating. That's your, that's your liver using the skin as a secondary route of waste elimination. And if you look at eczema and psoriasis, there's certain classes of bacteria that are very often tied to being absent in people that have those. And stem cells are excellent for those topical inflammatory, interesting conditions. So. Okay, yeah, so that's good. It has a systemic effect. Even if you inject it into the shoulder, they're going everywhere. They're going into the bloodstream. They're going every. You're breathing them out of your lungs. They're actually really good for your lungs. Now if you do an IV of stem cells, about 80% of those or if you do exosomes will actually come out through the lungs.
- [32:45]
A
Okay.
- [32:45]
B
You'll breathe them out and. And so it's really good for your lungs, you know, interesting. Which is a, you know, part of that competitive sport too. Yeah, but, so you get, you, you, you get the stem cells, you come back, you win another championship.
- [32:59]
A
Yeah, I win the world title back.
- [33:01]
B
Yeah. Yeah. Wow.
- [33:02]
A
Yeah.
- [33:03]
B
With two blown shoulders.
- [33:04]
A
Yeah, well, yeah, that was the first one. And then throughout my second camp, I tear my super. So I tore my super spinatus in both shoulders and a little bit of a partial labrum tear and bicep tendon tear. A little bit of everything in my left and my.
- [33:17]
B
What?
- [33:18]
A
Just where it's always.
- [33:20]
B
Somebody crank it.
- [33:20]
A
And wrestling, grappling and jiu jitsu. Wrestling is always, I feel like the sport that hurts me. It's a very intense sport. You get yourself into these leverage positions to where like striking doesn't do that to you, but jiu jitsu and wrestling do. Like, you know, and they're accidental. Like, I'll shoot a double leg and my arms over my head and guy's sprawling on it and puts a lot of pressure on a joint that's not supposed to move that way.
- [33:43]
B
Right, right.
- [33:44]
A
So, yeah, I mean, just wear and tear from wrestling since I was 8 year old through college and then, you know, more so as being a professional.
- [33:50]
B
Yeah. Listen, there's what I share on this podcast and then there's what I share with my inner circle. If you've been following me for a while, you know how I hold nothing back here but my VIP community. That's where the Real magic happens. Picture this. You're struggling with energy crashes, brain fog, or just feeling like you're not operating at your peak and you don't know where to get real answers. But here's what really sets this apart. You're not just getting my insights when I have incredible guests on the podcast. VIP members get to submit questions for a private podcast segment. So that world renowned expert we just interviewed, you get exclusive access to their knowledge, tailored to your specific situation. This section is under the private podcast section in the Ultimate Human Community. And speaking of exclusive, you're getting my personal protocols, the exact tools I use for water fasting, gut optimization, and morning routines that have taken me decades to perfect. This isn't theory. This is what works in the real world. The community launches challenges throughout the year where you get direct access to me and my network of experts. It's like having a personal health advisory board for less than a hundred dollars a month. Your health is your wealth, and this investment pays dividends for Life. Join the VIP community at theultimatehuman.com VIP and step into your ultimate potential. Now, let's get back to the Ultimate Human podcast. So I want to get to two highlights of your career. You know, one, because I, I, the first one, because I think that this would really benefit my audience. You know, when, when, when you're facing adversity and you basically at the height of your career, you know, you use a PED to cut weight and, and then they pop you and you get a two year suspension.
- [35:29]
A
Yeah.
- [35:30]
B
And then I, I know that you talked about what a low point you hit immediately after that, and I wonder if you could talk about that a little bit. Like, is it, was that the, because your identity had been stripped from you, were you worried about the public Persona because you immediately took responsibility, owned up to it and, and stood tall and said, I'm not mad that I did it. Here's why I did it. And you know, these are the rules of the game. And I violated the rules of the game and I'm going to take this suspension and I'm going to come back stronger. But, but after that, I think you went, you went maybe to a dark place.
- [36:07]
A
Yeah, I mean, it was, it was hard not to. You know, being a champion of the world was gonna drop a weight class, so I was fighting 135s, was going to drop to 120. I did drop to 125s to try to get a second belt, submit my legacy, you know, make more money. All the dreams you're Chasing and I went full, full blown anemic.
- [36:29]
B
Wow.
- [36:29]
A
Like I was. My hematocrit was in the low 30s. Like I'd wake up, I'd be cold, I wouldn't want to train. I was like a fraction of myself. And so I started taking anemia medication, which an anemia medication has erythropoietin in it to help you produce more red blood cells. And was told that it would be out of my system in time. And no matter what, it was the wrong choice to do. What I should have done was backed out of the fight. But again, my delusional optimism brain was like, no, I got this. I'm gonna get it done. Like got myself in trouble.
- [36:55]
B
And.
- [36:55]
A
And I just knew coming out and hitting it and admitting to everything I did was going to be the best for my overall health and my stress and my well being. To where if I feel like I was hiding from things, it was just gonna pile on. So I feel like just admitting to it was the best way to get her get or get out and get it out.
- [37:14]
B
Taking ownership and saying, yeah, but I.
- [37:17]
A
Did go to that very, very bad, dark place. Like you said. My identity was like stripped for me. And like everything that I had accomplished in the past, like that's the worst part of, of failing a drug test. Isn't the two year suspension? Is that what everyone thinks? The, the years beforehand got you there?
- [37:33]
B
Yeah.
- [37:34]
A
Like everything I did was just in my mind destroyed. Like it was like, oh, he's been doing this his whole career called into question.
- [37:41]
B
Yeah.
- [37:41]
A
Yeah. And, and you know, you saw it, did a very good job and you saw it as very, very strict. They show up to your house at six in the morning all the time and drug test you. I got drug tested like, I don't know, almost 100 times in a year because I was the champion. No kidding. Yeah. All the time.
- [37:55]
B
A hundred times in a year I got drug tests.
- [37:58]
A
And all these are like, you can go and look them up and what, what they, what they. When you get tested. I would get drug tested days back to back. The drug test me on Tuesday, then they drug test me on Wednesday.
- [38:07]
B
And you don't know?
- [38:08]
A
No, it's completely random. There's an app on my phone that to tell them where I'm at 365 days a year. It could be Christmas. And they can show up and drug test you. Hasn't happened. But they could. Right. But they always collect an A and B sample. The A sample, they test right then and there. The B sample they keep. For any instances like mine that came back. And so I've been drug tested since 2016 on. They went back and retested all my samples and to make sure that this wasn't happening beforehand. So even though they did that and it's public, it's still, like, the public guy's gonna beat you down for it. Right. And that's the. But that's why it works. Right. Because no athlete should want to go through that. And it was a very, very dark place. I'd say for the first, like, six months, I just wanted to, like, bury myself and, like, drink and, like, not have to think about it.
- [38:53]
B
Did you stop training?
- [38:55]
A
Oh, yeah. Well, I got double shoulder surgery when I got suspended. Oh. So not only was I, like, well.
- [39:00]
B
I got some time off, I might as well just get.
- [39:02]
A
Well, my identity was stripped for me. I got surgery on my left on my right shoulder, and then eight weeks later, got one on my left shoulder. As soon as I was able to get out of a sling, I got one on my left shoulder. So, you know, eating pain pills and being suspended wasn't the best choice, but.
- [39:16]
B
Right.
- [39:16]
A
I want to get back to being myself.
- [39:18]
B
Wow.
- [39:19]
A
Yeah.
- [39:19]
B
And. And so talk about the. The walk back, because, you know, walking out of that. That hole, it takes.
- [39:30]
A
It takes a strong mental fortitude to be able to do it. I feel like a lot of people maybe would have got broken and just did something else, but I think that mental toughness that has turned me into a champion has also got me back into the. The line. And I also. I also felt like I had to do it right, because I was being questioned so much. It was like, yeah, I have to come back.
- [39:49]
B
Like, I have to come back and improve myself.
- [39:51]
A
Yeah. Yeah. So there's a little bit of that that fired me up as well, too. Like, wanting my identity back, wanted myself purpose back.
- [39:58]
B
Because two years is not that long of time. When you start thinking about dual shoulder surgery, you. If you stop training and let yourself get out of shape a little bit, maybe you were drinking, you were taking pain medication. You know, you're in kind of a dark place. But then you have to. From that ground zero back into the octagon is not that long of a time frame. Maybe a year. Yeah. Right. And so where was your family and all this? Like, were they like, hey, tj it's okay if you don't want to go back, or was your wife, like, you're a world champion. I want to support you all the way. Like, where. What other support systems did you have going on or was this just all inside of TJ's head?
- [40:36]
A
Mostly was inside of my head, but I do have a rock of a wife that is supportive. We've been together for 20 years now. All through my, like, wrestling career. She's seen, like, all of it. She knew my mindset. She knew I was. That was never a question if I was going back. That was just like.
- [40:51]
B
She knew that, right? Yeah.
- [40:52]
A
She knows my personality, she knows my mentality. Like, I don't. I don't shut off. I don't. I don't stop.
- [40:58]
B
Right.
- [40:58]
A
So that was nothing. But she's always been a rock there to support me, and that's what I felt. The worst about my situation too was like, not only that it affected me and how bad it hurt me, but it hurt my coaches, it hurt my family, hurt my training partners. Like, it gave them a bad.
- [41:12]
B
Yeah, yeah, They're. They're all on this journey with you too.
- [41:16]
A
Yeah, yeah. So the ripple effect of that was. Made me feel really, really bad as well too. And I took a lot of, like, extra just punishment on myself for that too, you know. But luckily I've had a great support system, great coaches. My family. My family is the most supportive family in the entire world.
- [41:33]
B
I mean, that's awesome.
- [41:34]
A
They live in Northern California. Seven hour drive to Fullerton, where I wrestled that my dad would finish work a little bit early as a contractor, drive all the way down to Fullerton, watch me wrestle, drive home that night because he didn't want to miss work the next day. Seven hours, so 14 total trip just to watch me wrestle a dual match.
- [41:52]
B
Oh, my God.
- [41:54]
A
My dad's cr. That's where I get it from. Like. Yeah, my dad's very intense. Hazardous. Hell yeah.
- [41:59]
B
Hazardous. I see where the hazard comes from now, dude.
- [42:03]
A
Yeah.
- [42:04]
B
Yeah, that's a. That's a hazard on the road, even if you're sober.
- [42:07]
A
Yeah.
- [42:08]
B
So. So brighten the mood now a little bit because I. I want to talk about, you know, the, the transition to where you are now. You know, I know. First of all, I know Dana thinks the world of you, and I think the world. Dana. And you know, he's. He's actually doing a documentary, you know.
- [42:25]
A
Yeah.
- [42:26]
B
With you, if. Can we talk about it? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. He's doing a documentary with you about, you know, life after fighting. Yeah. And. And I think this is awesome because I've always been. I've always watched those shows growing up, like the one hit wonder. And you're like, like, oh, yeah. I remember that song. You never heard from him again. And I. And you know, professional athletes and, you know, actors, a listers, those people have been very, very in the public eye. You always do wonder what, what, you know, happened to him after, after achieving that level of fame, stardom, whatever you want to call it, notoriety. So what made you choose longevity wellness, you know, supplements? Because I know you have. Your undergrad was in kinesiology, but you've talked about how you didn't learn anything there. You actually learned it in the real world. Probably learned most of it from Sam. You know, what. What was that direction about? I mean, what, what made you say this is, this is the next career path for me? It's like I'm disrupt. I. I want to disrupt the supplement industry, or I'm just not happy with what's out there. I'm starting to, you know, pull back the layers of, of what's really on the market, and I realize how many charlatans and how much garbage is out there, and I want to change that game. Like, what was that about?
- [43:38]
A
Yeah, I told you this when I first got here and started checking out your. I mean, I'm very jealous of your longevity center that you have here and all the tools you have, because I've been made fun of for what I have. I got a hyperbaric chamber, the red light, the sauna. Like, I have it all as well, too, but you just. You're blowing me out of the water. I was very jealous of it, but.
- [43:55]
B
And you. And you want a hydrogen nanobath today?
- [43:58]
A
I do. Yeah.
- [43:59]
B
I'm giving them a hydrogen nanobath. That's gonna be awesome.
- [44:03]
A
But something I've noticed anecdotally from just training in my experience is that chasing peak performance and longevity go hand in hand. And if you treat the body the way that it was intended to be treated and you recover the right way, you eat the right foods, you supplement the right way, your performance is so much better, and the way you feel is so much better. And I noticed that by meeting Sam Calavita and training in his garage. And when I retired from fighting. It's a great story, too. When I first met Sam, he came to Vegas and I had all these supplements on the counter, and they were. And they were all garbage. Like, really? Someone I was sponsored by. Yeah, I'm promoting it. I'm saying, like, what do you mean these are bad? He's like, stop taking these instantly. I was like, what do you mean? He's like, they're horrible for you. Like, Packed with sucralose and artificial sweeteners and things I didn't know about.
- [44:50]
B
Right, right.
- [44:50]
A
And he made me throw all these away and turn me on to the good supplements that were made naturally and organic and things that I needed. My whole style, my whole life changed. Meaning salmon. That was a big part of it. So when I retired and I had felt so much better from the training I did in supplementation I was doing, I knew that that's what I wanted to chase.
- [45:11]
B
That's awesome.
- [45:11]
A
When I retired, it was kind of like, what am I going to do now? Right. Like, same way as when I got suspended. It's kind of like my identity was taken away. Like, what am I going to do now? I needed to put my energy towards something and the lifestyle that I was living in. Longevity and health and wellness is what I wanted to continue in. And so that's where Wild Society Nutrition started.
- [45:29]
B
Yeah. I love your stuff, by the way, man. My son and I eat your ribeyes constantly. The, the dried ribeyes. Yeah.
- [45:35]
A
The caveman eats.
- [45:36]
B
Yeah. I take them on planes. I take them, I take it with me everywhere. Yeah, yeah. So, so, and I tried him first at that Sprouts con. Yeah. When, when, when I, when I met you at Sprouts Con. And my, my son had been taking him for a while and he's like, dad, you got to come over and meet TJ Jaw. And I knew who you were. And, and he's like, I've been eating this stuff. I love this stuff. And now like, I, I love it too, man. I'm amazing.
- [45:56]
A
I, I, I love to hear that because that's why I built it. Not only, I mean, I built it for everyone, but also selfishly myself.
- [46:03]
B
Yeah.
- [46:03]
A
Right. Like products I wish I would have when I was competing to strive for Peak Performance Arcade May that we're talking about is a 20 ounce grass fed ribeye in sea salt. That's all it is.
- [46:13]
B
That is so awesome. In a bag.
- [46:15]
A
Yeah. We slice it really thin, we air dry it, we put it in a five ounce bag and we, and it's, it's crazy how well it's doing, dude.
- [46:22]
B
It's, it, it is, it really is. And I'm not, I, I've got no affiliate link with you guys or anything, but I will tell you, man, they're, they're, they're amazing.
- [46:29]
A
Thank you. I mean, talking about traveling, I mean, that's the selfish reason why I created them. Like I had to do a, a lot of traveling for business or when I was fighting. And I can't eat in an airport.
- [46:37]
B
No, no, no.
- [46:38]
A
There's no way.
- [46:38]
B
Dangerous place in the world.
- [46:40]
A
It's insane. Like, I can't buy a water that's not in the glass and it's not in plastic.
- [46:45]
B
Transportation secretary Sean Duffy's trying to change that right now. So he just got a lot of flack for it too. They just announced that they were going to add extra breastfeeding stations for women. They were going to put playgrounds in for, for kids, get the Zoomies out in airports and, and turn some of the bars and into gyms and shower and changing facilities. And people went nuts. And I was like, dude, I would much rather fly next to somebody who had just had a workout and a fresh shower than some dude that had four beers and a basket of fries.
- [47:11]
A
Yeah.
- [47:12]
B
And, you know, and, and if you're a breastfeeding mother, I mean, you got to go into a public restroom, kind of hide in a stall right now.
- [47:18]
A
What?
- [47:19]
B
Why wouldn't we give extra places for that? And, and, you know, playground for kids to get the zoomies out. You know, I walk by these vape booths and smoking booths and there's like six bars between when you get out security and get to your, get to, you know, get to your gate. You know. What are the top three reasons why I prefer a vertical cold plunge versus a lay down tub? Well, I've used both. When you're in a vertical position, your body naturally regulates your breathing better. So if you're holding on to the sides and you're in a vertical position, you can just focus on your breath work and you can stay calm. A lot of people feel more calm when they're in a vertical position than when they're laying down in the water and think they might slip under the water. So when you're vertical plunging, you're fully immersed faster, you can focus on recovery, inflammation reduction, and you're not struggling to just stay in a lie down position. Your body floats in an awkward way sometimes. So it's just a more efficient, comfortable experience. In my opinion. It takes up way less space too. It has a smaller footprint. So you can put these on your patio, your garage, your bathroom, your locker room, you can really put it anywhere. I've got one on my balcony. I've got two in my bathroom. So this is why Cold life is my favorite cold punch on the market. So click the link below and you can order yours today. Make sure you get the ultimate human version. Now let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. So I love that. The genesis of this, because, you know, if I was to sort of summarize, a lot of the guests that come on my podcast and they. They're the most impactful, very influential, passionate, purpose driven people. It's always the people that solve the problem in their life. They don't necessarily have to be the most qualified. You know, there's some, some of the soccer moms that I've had on my podcast have solved problems like Lyme disease and, you know, being on the journey with Jelly Roll and he conquered drug addiction and alcohol addiction and being £510 and. And this, this overwhelming sense of self hatred. So what, what would you say is the, the problem that you. You solved that started this journey into.
- [49:14]
A
The space, learning that the products I was being paid to talk about on my social media and felt end up feeling really bad about it, that I'm not promoting something now that. And even, even after I found out about it, I was getting paid to talk about it and I kept doing it because I was getting paid. It's like I felt so guilty about that. So then once I retired and I didn't have these sponsorships, it was like, I'm going to create something that I know is good for you. The reason why I rolled out into Sprouts first as well, too, like, a lot of professional athletes will build the product again. I built these selfishly for myself and we'll get into why I built them, but like, I wanted to roll out into Sprouts first because a lot of professional athletes will slap their face on a brand and then you could. And then release it on the website. On their website. I mean, I could be building this.
- [49:55]
B
Same thing happens in my. Yeah, my space. A lot of people that I, Some of them that I look up to, they get to the top of the mountain. They just become a prostitute for every product or service.
- [50:03]
A
Yeah. And then there's like, especially in the supplement industry. You could be building this product in your garage and selling it. Like the, the way that it's not regulated is insane.
- [50:12]
B
You were talking to me about protein powders at the Sprouts Con. And I forget what you said to me, but I remember it blew my mind. I actually wrote it down. I meant to talk to you about it on the podcast and I forgot what it was, but it was about like the scam and how they can artificially inflate the protein content.
- [50:29]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [50:30]
B
You know, on, on the label and I didn't know about that. Tell me a little bit about that. Because I found it fascinating and well.
- [50:35]
A
How much is actually like usable and bioavailable and like only like, you know, sometimes some of these products are only 20% what actually is in the product. And until you're doing third party testing, what they say does not like you have no idea what it is.
- [50:49]
B
Somebody's like, wow, it's 30 grams of protein, but really 10. Yeah, it's got 10.
- [50:53]
A
Right. And there's a lot of that out there. So multiple reasons I built this is so chasing peak performance and, and simplifying some products. Sprouts was a great partner to partner with. I didn't sell one product online first. I went straight to retail. Well, that's, I went, I went.
- [51:09]
B
That's a different strategy. Wow.
- [51:10]
A
Yeah, I went straight to Sprouts first, which obviously you're probably.
- [51:13]
B
How did you get them to carry your stuff? Just because your name. Yeah, okay.
- [51:16]
A
Yeah, the, the name and the marketing I was going to put behind it. And Sprouts is a great partner. They have this innovation center to where they give like new brands a chance because they are in tune with like what's popular right now, what's healthy for you.
- [51:30]
B
Yeah. My son sells his hydrogen tablets there. We, we met at Sprouts Con and it was, I, I, that was the first time I'd met a whole team.
- [51:38]
A
Yeah.
- [51:38]
B
You know, from behind Sprouts and they really do have an awesome team and they're very intentional about what they're putting on their shelves for the, for the public, which I like too. Yeah, they're, they're a great brand. I hope they continue to explode.
- [51:50]
A
Oh, they will. They're, they're growing really, really well. And the reason why I wanted to go into Sprouts because they have a kill list of ingredients you can't have within your product and live within their four walls.
- [52:01]
B
Wow.
- [52:01]
A
Like, you can't have artificial sweeteners, you can't have preservatives, things like that that you want to avoid anyways. So you know, when you're shopping at Sprouts, you're shopping.
- [52:09]
B
Somebody is. We wish our FDA would do that for us.
- [52:11]
A
Right, Exactly. Yeah.
- [52:13]
B
But that's cool.
- [52:13]
A
And so that was bring, bring a lot of validity to what I was building. Rather than me to slap my face on something selling online, I could be building my garage and who knows what's in it. Another point was that we went straight third party testing from the get go for every product we've made has been by informed choice, informed sport. So you know that what's on that nutritional effects panel or supplement facts panel really is in there. And we test all heavy metals, all that stuff. Right.
- [52:37]
B
So good, man.
- [52:38]
A
And being as very transparent as possible.
- [52:40]
B
That means a lot, man.
- [52:42]
A
Yeah.
- [52:42]
B
Yeah. No, it means a lot to the consumer. And I think, I think the, the general populace is becoming more woke to these things. I think the pandemic did us all a thing.
- [52:51]
A
Yes.
- [52:52]
B
You know, we realized, hey, maybe our government elites don't have our best interests at heart. And I think they do now in, in this current administration. But you know, in the past, maybe not so much. And, and also we just can't trust everything that we read and, and hear out there. So I think people follow people and not brands too. So just knowing that your heart's behind this and you develop this as much for you as you did for them.
- [53:16]
A
And my 7 year old son, like, you know, if I'm giving it to my.
- [53:19]
B
Smashing the ribeyes.
- [53:20]
A
Oh yeah. He's like, when I get so it's been hard for us to keep our caveman eats in the house because it's selling so much. Like I have to stay in front of production and everything I'm building is going straight to sprouts, like onto our website. So when I bring it home, he's. He smashes in. It's always been a battle to like, I'm really into my diet, I'm really into performance and so it's always like I'm trying to feed my son the same way and I always want to increase his protein content. He's growing really good for his brain and it's like that's the easiest hack for me is to give him caveman east because he loves it and he'll MAU it it. And there's 95 grams of protein in one bag.
- [53:51]
B
That's so.
- [53:52]
A
And he'll eat half a bag. Yeah, dude.
- [53:56]
B
Maybe that's going to be his nickname, you know?
- [53:58]
A
Yeah.
- [53:58]
B
Cave Mandela Shaw.
- [53:59]
A
There we go. I like it. He'll be the new guy. He'll be able to turn to the king.
- [54:05]
B
Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. And so what's, what's like a typical. Now that you're more woke to longevity and wellness, you've got this brand out there which I'm sure you're pouring your soul into.
- [54:18]
A
Oh yeah.
- [54:19]
B
What is it? What does a typical day look like for you now? I mean, clearly you're keeping yourself in good shape.
- [54:24]
A
Yeah, I, I ran this morning.
- [54:26]
B
Yeah, you and I ran the same route down here in Coral Gables. Yeah, we should have run into each other.
- [54:30]
A
I know I can't not work out. Like, it's my happy place. It's what I do. It's like. And now knowing about longevity and taking care of. Taking care of yourself, it's. Being active is very, very important. So trying to squeeze that in wherever I can, you know, it might only be 30 minutes. I think I've heard you say this, like, snacking on exercise.
- [54:50]
B
Yeah, I use the term all the.
- [54:51]
A
Time to where, like, I might only have 30 minutes at lunch because I'm in between calls. And like, I'll get a little workout in.
- [54:56]
B
Yeah.
- [54:56]
A
Or. And I'll do multiple of them throughout the day, but they're little. Or maybe I'll just go for a walk after I eat dinner with my family. Like, finding little windows to be able to work out to where I used to. That's all I did.
- [55:06]
B
Yeah.
- [55:07]
A
Right. So my life is very busy now. I remember towards the end of my career telling my wife, man, it'd be nice to retire one day and live a normal life, you know?
- [55:17]
B
Well, now I. I would go as a UFC fighter.
- [55:20]
A
Right. I would. I would love to go back and kick people in the head again. It was way easier than it. Than it is running your own business. And being an entrepreneur, you have to be very mentally tough. Being a CEO and founder of your own brand and running it because there's fires every day you're putting out. Like, you always feel like the company's on the verge of, like, being destroyed. You're, like, nervous about it because there's, like, logistics problems, like showing up to sprouts in time or manufacturing problems. And until you become completely vertically integrated and control all pieces, you're relying on so many other people.
- [55:52]
B
Yeah.
- [55:52]
A
And the ball gets dropped.
- [55:53]
B
Still your brand, though, man.
- [55:55]
A
And like, if. If my product doesn't show up and say my Cayman east doesn't taste the way that it's supposed to taste, that's on me. Even though my manufacturer is the one that messed it up. And, like, that just, like, stresses you out to so much, you know?
- [56:07]
B
Yeah. I told my kids early on, you know, because my son owns H2 tab, my daughter's launching a chemical free skincare line.
- [56:13]
A
Awesome.
- [56:14]
B
My youngest wants to launch a chemical free activewear line, which I'm super supportive of. I mean, having my kids close proximity to me is the greatest blessing of my entire adult lifetime. I mean, there's nothing better than being best friends and kind of on the journey with your kids.
- [56:28]
A
So cool.
- [56:29]
B
And. And your son is Learning more by observation than he is by what you teach. And tell him, you know, he's, their eyes are a lot more open to what you, you think. And like, seeing dad in the grind is that's. And you know that that itch is going to get planted into him too, so. But, you know, I, I, I told them, you know, when they wanted to start their own business, I said, it's great. I mean, just don't start it for the wrong reason. Just remember, you're never going to own this business. It's always going to own you. Yeah. Because, you know, if you're a good entrepreneur, your, your reputation in that business means everything. Right. 100 and so talk to me a little bit about. And it should be great for your business. You know, this documentary that's going on with, with, Is it Paramount?
- [57:12]
A
It was. It was going to be released this year, but now with the whole Paramount deal, we're going to wait till next year.
- [57:17]
B
Okay.
- [57:18]
A
Just because.
- [57:19]
B
So it's on the shelf.
- [57:20]
A
It's on the shelf right now. It's already been recorded. They followed me around for, like, seven different days, all the way out to, like, meeting with venture capitalists in New York to sprouts con, to going into sprouts and going to my manufacturing and show them how the process is made, to formulations and my office at home, my office in Orange county, you know, filmed, like, all that. This all started because Dana is a very, very passionate entrepreneur. Like, I think that's his first love. I know he's got the UFC and everything, but, like, he loves entrepreneurship and building something and making it, turning it into something successful. And we just got in touch. I probably stayed in touch with them more now since I've retired than even when I was fighting and just kind of filling him in on what's going on with my brand. And it was a joke because I heard he was like, teaming up with first Foreman. Excuse my link, excuse my language, but I said, yo, first form, you know, I was like, just joking. I know wild society is not big enough yet, but we did.
- [58:14]
B
We did.
- [58:15]
A
I sent some numbers of the sales we did in April, and we're just getting started. And like, that same savage I was in the cage is the same savage. I'm outside the cage, and I'm gonna get this done. I'm gonna make it success, successful, and I'm going to turn the supplement industry upside down. Well, he loved it. It resonated with him. He's like, this is awesome. Gave me a great idea, and I was like, awesome. What's the idea? Ghost me for, like, two years.
- [58:35]
B
He'll go. She'll be like, hold tight, or something like that. And you're like, no, dude, I don't want to hold.
- [58:39]
A
It's like my brain's going. He's like, I got a great idea. It's like, oh, maybe I'm gonna partner with you. See this and that. And, like, he goes to me for, like, two days. And like, 10:30 at night, he calls me, like, two days later. It's like, hey, man, I want to create a documentary of what you're doing, what success looks like after retirement and still being on that same grind that you were as a fighter, now as an entrepreneur. And so that's it. Film. They followed me around filming it, you.
- [59:00]
B
Know, and if Dana says it, it. It happens. He's not just like, yeah, I think we'll do this documentary. It sounds like a great idea kind of guy. He's like, oh, no, we're gonna do a documentary where it's. I mean, it's happening. Yeah. He doesn't. The thing I love most about him, he's very black and white. Like, you know exactly where he stands. But talk about a guy whose word you could take to the bank. 100. If he tells you that he's going to do something, there's 100 chance to get done. We were sitting here at my kitchen table a few months ago and with his daughter, and my son was here, and he started talking to my son Cole about the great world race. He ran seven marathons on seven continents in seven days. And he was like, wait, what the fuck? He ran a marathon in Antarctica and then Africa and then Australia. He's like, when you do documentary on this, he goes, do you want to do it? You want me to do it? And Cole goes, I want you to do it.
- [59:52]
A
Yeah, of course. Yeah.
- [59:53]
B
He literally picked up the phone right then and called his team. And now it's. Now it's underway and.
- [59:58]
A
Oh, it's so cool.
- [59:59]
B
He's. We're meeting with the documentary film crew, and yeah, he's. He's. He. He's either all gas or all break. Yeah, there's no sort of in between. So that's awesome. And I think that's going to have a huge impact on your. On your career.
- [60:12]
A
It is just kind of sheds light on what I'm building and why I'm building it. You know, I've always talked about, like, I'm building products that I wish I would had when I was competing. You Know like my concentrates that are grass fed and we added organic mushroom complex to it to deal with I'm not only athletic ability, but reducing stress and cortisol and my longevity protein that's you know, got creatine, whey protein isolates, collagens, lactoferrin, urethan, A like and listen to you, man. Yes.
- [60:39]
B
I love this. Yeah.
- [60:41]
A
And just the reason why I created what I did and, and the benefits behind it and caveman needs be able to take it on the road. And like most the pro, like I'm on a very high protein diet. You know, high protein, good fats, lower carbs, like good carbs. I've been wanting to put on size, but I'll put on lean size and it's been fantastic for that. But most of my protein I get is from the food I eat. Why we created Caymanes 100.
- [61:05]
B
I think you get it from whole foods.
- [61:07]
A
Exactly. But it's nearly impossible sometimes when you're working hard or you're working out hard to, you know, get the nutrients you need right away. Right, right. So the like the longevities of the isolates we created, like I can drink them while I'm working out and I get, you know, the rapid absorption of amino acids and proteins and things that I need for protein synthesis and just thought about chasing world championships and that's what wild side nutrition is.
- [61:31]
B
That's so awesome. So where do you see this brand going? You're going to continue the. You have an online presence now. Yep. And you can continue to go after the retail channel.
- [61:40]
A
Yeah, I love retail specific channels too. Like especially around the natural sector. We're looking to roll out into whole foods here in the beginning of 2026. We're in sprouts. GNC has actually been a, a massive help for us as well too. GNC has trying to turn around what they've been known as in the past and only like putting out like weight gainers and products have artificial. They still have that.
- [62:04]
B
Yeah.
- [62:05]
A
But yeah, so our like our longevity product is solely at GNC right now.
- [62:09]
B
Yeah.
- [62:10]
A
Because they want a whole longevity section. You know, they want people like the times are changing, people.
- [62:15]
B
Totally agree.
- [62:16]
A
People like you people.
- [62:17]
B
Yeah.
- [62:18]
A
And they're educating like me, educating me and educating the world on like what we should be eating and how we should be treating ourselves in the GNCs. Like seeing that trend.
- [62:27]
B
Yeah, totally agree, man. I'm. I'm really excited for you. Well, so I have a group of followers that call my VIP group and they're the only guys that I earn and women that I let know what guest is coming on the podcast before they come on. So I want to take you into a room with them. I do a private podcast with them. I want to. They have a whole list of questions for you. But if you're interested in becoming a VIP, just go over to the ultimate human.com VIP and you can sign up to be a VIP today. You get private podcasts, you get Q. And as with me, you get all of my protocols, including becoming the ultimate human version of yourself. And maybe I'll even negotiate a discount for. For TJ's, for. For some of those yummy ribeyes.
- [63:10]
A
Love it.
- [63:10]
B
Yeah. But before. Before we go into that room, I always wind down all my podcasts by asking my guests the same question. What does it mean to you to be an ultimate human?
- [63:22]
A
I've heard your podcast. So I had a little bit of time to think about this. I did. I knew it was coming. But for me, it's the pursuit of excellence, mentally, spiritually, and physically. I just. I just need to be chasing something. I need a sense of purpose. I know that sense of purpose. Purpose keeps me going, keeps me motivated when I'm motivated for something, like, greatness can happen. And I want that excellence all the time. And I want that excellence to rub off on my son or my family and maybe people that follow along on my journey.
- [63:52]
B
Yeah. TJ Dillashaw, I wish you all the success, man.
- [63:56]
A
Thank you.
- [63:56]
B
You're moving the needle in this world. I really appreciate you coming on the Ultimate Human.
- [64:00]
A
This is amazing. Thank you.
- [64:01]
B
And until next time, guys, that's just science.