Podcast
There's More to That
Hosted by Smithsonian Magazine · EN
Smithsonian magazine covers history, science and culture in the way only it can — through a lens on the world that is insightful and grounded in richly reported stories. On There's More to That, meet the magazine's journalists and hear how they discover the forces behind the biggest issues of our time. Every two weeks, There’s More to That will give curious listeners a fresh understanding of the world we all inhabit.
Host Ari Daniel is an independent science journalist who has reported across six continents and contributes regularly to National Public Radio among other outlets. In a previous life, he trained grey seal pups and studied wild Norwegian killer whales. In the fifth grade, Ari won the "Most Contagious Smile" award.
32episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
The Remarkable, Amazing Stories of Route 66 Reflect the Twists and Turns of 100 Years of Americana
Apr 2300:34:43Tap to summarizeThe famed Route 66 has had many lives. It emerged in an era when cars were new but roads were dangerous and intended for horses. But there were those who imagined a highway that would connect the cities of the Midwest to the West Coast — and Route 66 was born.During the Great Depression, the roadway helped migrants find their way to new jobs in the West. During World War II, it facilitated the transportation of munitions and armaments en route to the Pacific theater. Later, it became a busy thoroughfare for Americans wanting to explore their country. Storefronts, towns, gas stations, cafes and much more grew up along its edges. Then, as major interstates became the main byways for traveling Americans, Route 66 fell into obsolescence, becoming more a time capsule than roadway. Today, some of those roadside stops still exist, catering to tourists seeking a dose of unvarnished Americana.This episode chronicles the origin of the federal interstate system and how Route 66 fits into that history — before the massive tangle of highways and roads we know today were paved and packed with traffic.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about an interactive map commemorating the 250th anniversary of the United States, the ongoing fascination with the sinking of the ’Edmund Fitzgerald’ and the moving return of personal belongings to the Rosebud Sioux tribe, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Images via Library of Congress and public domain.
Transcribe →
A Photographer's Glimpse Into the Dwindling World of the Cascade Red Fox
Apr 900:32:09Tap to summarizeGretchen Kay Stuart is a wildlife photographer who has cultivated a special relationship with the Cascade red fox. She first spotted the rare animal in 2020 on the slope of Mount Rainier in Washington State. “I instantly fell in love,” she recalls.So Stuart started documenting the foxes wherever she could. Sometimes she’s witnessed tragic endings, but other times, the outcome has been more rewarding. For instance, she received exclusive access to photograph a family of these foxes, and her documentation is helping bring awareness to this subspecies that has only 50-some individuals remaining.In this episode, host Ari Daniel talks to Stuart and Jocelyn Akins of the Cascades Carnivore Project about what makes these foxes special, the threats they’re facing, and what’s being done to keep them from going extinct.A transcript is below. Stuart’s favorite Cascade red fox photograph will be featured in a new exhibition, “The Nature of Hope,” celebrating the life of Jane Goodall. The image is also part of a fundraiser sponsored by the conservation group Vital Impacts to benefit the Jane Goodall Institute.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about a prehistoric cave that entombed animals for millennia; the teeming world of migrating birds, bats and bugs above our heads; and the army of experts and citizen scientists devoted to protecting native bees, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Images by Gretchen Kay Stuart and public domain.
Transcribe →
The Real Story Behind Abigail Adams' 'Remember the Ladies' Letter
Mar 2600:31:55Tap to summarizeIn March of 1776, Abigail Adams — who would go on to become the nation’s second first lady — wrote a letter to her husband, John Adams, as he and the other founders were debating independence. She wrote, "I desire you would remember the ladies and be more generous and favorable to them than your ancestors. Do not put such unlimited power into the hands of the husbands."A common contemporary interpretation is that Abigail Adams was advocating for women’s suffrage and rights more broadly. But most historians offer an alternative understanding. They believe that she was condemning husbands who had unchecked power over their wives.In this episode, host Ari Daniel speaks with historian Cassandra Good about the role of women in revolutionary America, the importance of this letter at the time, and how it has been interpreted since.A transcript is below. To subscribe to “There’s More to That” and to listen to past episodes about Smithsonian magazine’s interactive map to celebrate the 250th birthday of the United States, the discovery of an enslaved man’s narrative about his fight for freedom, and a baseball field resurrected in a World War II-era Japanese internment camp, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Images via Massachusetts Historical Society / National Gallery of Art and public domain
Transcribe →
Venomous Snakes Represent a Serious Public Health Problem. Scientists Are Biting Back With a Groundbreaking Antidote
Mar 1200:28:16Tap to summarizeSnakes bite five million people each year, killing some 125,000 and disfiguring or blinding three times as many. Antivenoms aren’t always readily available where the problematic snakes live. They also can be deadly themselves, as they could induce life-threatening allergic reactions.Within the last couple years, however, researchers have made substantial progress toward creating safer antivenoms, reducing the chance of anaphylaxis. Some dream of a universal remedy, but venom is a complex brew, and many of its most dangerous components remain unknown to science.In this episode, host Ari Daniel speaks with journalist Victoria Malloy, who wrote a story for Smithsonian magazine about antivenoms, and researcher Irene Khalek. They discuss the danger of snakebites globally, the history of antivenoms and their traditional manufacture, and the various efforts underway to create safer versions.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about the teeming world of migrating birds, bats and bugs above our heads; a prehistoric cave that entombed animals for millennia; and the army of experts and citizen scientists devoted to protecting native bees, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images from Paul Starosta via Getty Images and public domain.
Transcribe →
How to Fit 250 Years of American History and Culture Into One Map
Feb 2600:30:21Tap to summarizeIn honor of the United States’ 250th birthday this year, Smithsonian magazine has curated an interactive map, “250 Places to Celebrate America.” The map features 250 of the most dramatic, intriguing, and surprising places to visit across the country, spanning ten categories including food, film and oddball Americana.In this episode, we speak with one of the editors behind the map project. In addition, we interview a preeminent historian and co-host of the podcast “This Day” to discuss the significance of the 250th anniversary, how other national birthdays have been celebrated in the past and the larger context of this moment in American history.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about the growing concerns around human-made objects in orbit hurtling back toward Earth, the vast fleet of shipwrecks at the bottoms of the Great Lakes and the L.A. wildfires as viewed through the eyes of two photographers, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images via public domain.
Transcribe →
The Tragedy of the Alps’ Disappearing Glaciers for Those That Live, Visit and Ski There
Feb 1200:28:15Tap to summarizeSome 2,500 huts dot the landscape across the Alps. For more than two centuries, hikers and climbers have sought out these refuges as they’ve navigated the snowy, high elevations. But the mountain glaciers that have defined this region are melting, putting these huts, the entire culture of alpine hiking, and nearby towns and communities in danger.Avalanches, rockfalls, mudslides and flooding—brought on by a changing climate—are happening at a time when the Alps are more popular than ever. And the subject of an altered alpine habitat takes on additional importance amid the Winter Olympics in Italy.In this episode, we speak with Smithsonian magazine’s Megan Gambino, who edited a story on this topic, and environmental scientist Markus Stoffel, who studies how climate change is impacting higher elevations. Both are skiing enthusiasts, so the issue is personal to them as well.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about the growing concerns around human-made objects in orbit hurtling back toward Earth, the vast fleet of shipwrecks at the bottoms of the Great Lakes and the L.A. wildfires as viewed through the eyes of two photographers, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images from Martin Bergsma via Adobe Stock and public domain.
Transcribe →
A Stunning Escape From Slavery Told on Tattered Pages
Jan 2900:29:40Tap to summarizeIn the mid-1800s, before the Civil War, Thomas White fled his enslavement in Maryland for freedom. It was a risky escape, one that involved a horseback ride under the cover of darkness, abolitionists helping to hide him, and a northward journey through Delaware and Pennsylvania.Ultimately, he arrived—safe and free—in Massachusetts. The details of White’s flight are chronicled on 40-odd sheets of paper and were written most probably by other people who heard his story. Such slave narratives are exceedingly rare, and this one’s length made it especially unique. Smithsonian magazine wrote about the discovery last year.In this episode, we speak with Rachel Fortuna Cabral, the Roger Williams University undergraduate who helped study the manuscript, and scholar Deborah Plant to learn about White’s escape, how the papers were discovered, and what such narratives tell us about slavery and emancipation in the United States.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about a recently solved mystery surrounding the burial of JFK, the only battalion during World War II composed entirely of Black women and a baseball field resurrected in a World War II-era Japanese internment camp find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images from Anastasiia Hevko via Adobe Stock / Collection of the Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture / Cindy Elder.
Transcribe →
The Foods and Flavors That Make Our Holidays Delicious
Dec 1800:33:10Tap to summarizeCherished recipes are often passed down from generation to generation, but how much do we know about the stories that shaped those foods? Whether a tasty cookie, a flavorful side, a resplendent showstopping entree, these dishes have a strong association with the holiday season. To celebrate, we’re honoring the origins of traditional foods lovingly prepared by two of our correspondents.In this episode, host Ari Daniel drops into two homes to explore two holiday traditions. We start with Elisa Hough, an editor at the Smithsonian Center for Folklife and Cultural Heritage, and the Filipino torta recipe that her mother prepared every Christmas. Now during the holidays, Elisa is the one making torta. And it’s the time of the year when she connects most closely to her Filipino heritage.Then we head to Jamaica where we meet Vaughn Stafford Gray, an independent journalist and former chef, who explains the history of jerk and what it means in contemporary Jamaican culture.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about those who pursue the divisive durian fruit, an award-winning restaurant in New Orleans that showcases Senegalese cuisine, and using fruit depicted in Renaissance paintings to rescue modern agriculture, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images by Jane Dulay / Joshua Resnick, anaumenko, annapustynnikova, zoryanchik, Kris Black, cunaplus and Africa Studio via Adobe Stock / public domain.
Transcribe →
The Astronomical Problem of Space Junk
Dec 400:26:45Tap to summarizeWe have launched all manner of satellite and machinery into low-Earth orbit. But what goes up must come down. Most often, these items burn up in the atmosphere upon re-entry, which isn’t good for air quality or the ozone layer.But not everything incinerates — and increasing amounts of debris are hurtling back toward Earth and landing in backyards and farm fields. Falling detritus disrupts air travel and risks collision with infrastructure and people on the ground. There are those who argue that additional regulation is required around the launching and de-orbiting of these materials.In this episode, host Ari Daniel speaks with astronomer Samantha Lawler and Smithsonian contributing writer Dan Falk about space junk and the concern among researchers that it is becoming a growing threat to public safety.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about all the shipwrecks hidden beneath the waters of the Great Lakes; the river of birds, bats and bugs fluttering, often invisibly, in the skies above; and the story behind the timelessness of Superman, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.“There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images by Samantha Lawler / NASA / smspsy via Adobe Stock and public domain.
Transcribe →
Why Are There So Many Shipwrecks in the Great Lakes?
Nov 2000:32:29Tap to summarizeBeneath the waters of the Great Lakes, thousands of shipwrecks, hulking carcasses of a bygone era, have been hiding for generations, just waiting to be revealed. Once someone stumbles upon one of these sunken treasures in Lake Michigan or Lake Superior, Tamara Thomsen gets a call.Thomsen is a maritime archaeologist with the Wisconsin Historical Society’s Maritime Preservation and Archaeology program. Her job is to investigate and survey shipwreck sites. Over the years, Thomsen has added some of these ships to the National Register of Historic Places. And she and her colleagues have also unearthed dugout canoes that were fashioned thousands of years old by the Indigenous people who lived on this land.In this episode, host Ari Daniel speaks with Thomsen about how she took up this profession, why she views shipwrecks as time capsules, why so many vessels met their watery grave on the Great Lakes, and how one stays warm at depth when diving for these wrecks for hours at a time.To subscribe to “There’s More to That,” and to listen to past episodes about the S.S. Edmund Fitzgerald, the return of a set of important belongings to the Lakota community and a baseball field resurrected in a World War II-era Japanese internment camp, find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts. “There’s More to That” is a production of Smithsonian magazine and PRX Productions. From the magazine, our team is Ari Daniel, Debra Rosenberg and Brian Wolly. From PRX, our team is Ali Budner, Cleo Levin, Genevieve Sponsler, Sandra Lopez-Monsalve and Edwin Ochoa. The executive producer of PRX Productions is Jocelyn Gonzales.Fact-checking by Stephanie Abramson.Episode artwork by Emily Lankiewicz. Illustration by Emily Lankiewicz / Images by Zach Whitrock / Wisconsin Historical Society and public domain.
Transcribe →