← Thriving Kids
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- [00:00]
A
Hello and welcome to Thriving Kids, a podcast from the Child Mind Institute that helps you raise emotionally healthy children. I'm Dr. Dave Anderson, clinical psychologist and your host. Today we're taking on one of the biggest questions in modern how to guide our kids use of technology. How can we encourage them to use it in ways that are healthy, creative and connected without it taking over their lives? I'm joined by Dr. Linda Charmaraman, founder and director of the Youth Media and Wellbeing Research Lab and at Wellesley. Her work explores how young people use digital media to form identity, build community and express themselves. In this episode, we'll talk about what it means to parents in a digital age. From why there's no one size fits all approach to how communication can help teens build trust and independence online. Let's get into it. Hello and welcome to Thriving Kids Podcast. This week Our guest is Dr. Linda Charmaraman, who's here to talk to us about technology and youth and how we can understand and learn better from youth perspectives. Dr. Charman, welcome.
- [01:06]
B
Thank you so much for having me, Dave.
- [01:08]
A
Yes. So first thing is just we'd love to give our listeners a sense of how you kind of came to this work and what kind of work your lab at Wellesley does go.
- [01:18]
B
Absolutely. I founded the Youth Media and Wellbeing Research Lab back in 2018 because I had written an NIH grant that really tried to set the stage for trying to do this work that nobody else was thinking about back then. The connection between social media and mental health in the middle school years. I think there had been a lot of research in college years and then going down younger to high school, but in middle school was the kind of forgotten years. A lot of people think of middle school years as one of the roughest times to experience, but also to research. It's actually a very underreported period of adolescence in the research.
- [02:00]
A
Well, I think you, you raise such a good point because I'm constantly astounded by how much I will see generalizations about youth that are mainly based on college students or late high school and do not include anyone in, say, the 12 to 16 age range. Even though we also want to be clear that it's tough to do research on that, which is why you should be lauded because IRBs and parental consent are nothing to sneeze at. So makes sense. So that was 2018. In 2018, what kinds of social media were you beginning to research?
- [02:32]
B
Oh, gosh, yeah, that's a great question.
- [02:34]
A
Because if we give people like a seven year time capsule, right.
- [02:37]
B
I Mean, up until then, most of the research was on MySpace, on Facebook, on. And really, it was. It was very much about chat rooms and about the beginnings of everybody learning about social media. And it hadn't exploded quite yet. And back then, people started to really focus on things like Instagram, Snapchat, you know, TikTok didn't come in really, really first and foremost until really the pandemic stage of 2020. And so we were actually there before TikTok exploded. So it was really interesting to see what it was like before that happened.
- [03:17]
A
I'm sorry, I just need. My mind is blown for a second here because I did not know what you were going to answer. And then I didn't Even remember that MySpace was still a thing around 2017 and 18, when you would have been writing this NIH grant. Yeah, but. Wow. Okay. So just out of curiosity, did you ever do any particular specific research on MySpace?
- [03:36]
B
No, I didn't. And so I was looking for research that was not in MySpace area. I was looking for things outside of Facebook, you know, because some of the participants that I really want to research were young. And so Facebook traditionally was for people that were in college. You know, the original invitation was for only people with email address was very restricted and elite, actually. And then it opened it up and it helped adolescent researchers like me actually learn more about the online spaces of youth at younger ages. And so there's also the COPPA requirements, the Children's Online Protection act, that really limited companies from collecting data on any kids under 13. And so a lot of those social media sites were saying, okay, we. This is not for people under 13. And so. And so a lot of the researchers kind of did most of the research on teenagers and not tweens or pre adolescents, which is where I really wanted to study.
- [04:41]
A
So today, your research obviously spans the last seven years, includes the social media of today and spans in terms of age ranges. You really focus on middle school up. Right, or middle school up to what we're talking.
- [04:58]
B
Yes, yes. Our NIH grant, when it was awarded, we finally were able to get into the schools at the middle school, sixth grade, you know, entry point. And then we've been following them into high school and into college. And so that's. That's where.
- [05:13]
A
So you have a longitudinal data set of youth that you've watched grow up with digital technology over the last seven years?
- [05:20]
B
Yes, we also have them pre pandemic and during pandemic and post pandemic. So that's some natural data that is really hard to set up and predict that could happen. And so our lab is busily trying to get out as much of that data to the public and to health practitioners and educators and parents as we can.
- [05:46]
A
So as I'm sure our listeners are aware as, and I'm sure that Dr. Charmarman, you are well aware, there are a lot of narratives that are sort of correlation equals causation right now in the youth and technology space in the sense that parents look at the stresses that their kids are facing over, for example, the last seven years. And for a lot of parents, the explosion they see of social media becomes one of the things that A, they might wonder about and B, they're getting a lot of media narratives about its effects on youth. What do youth say is the effect of social media and kind of how it's affecting their development?
- [06:24]
B
Yes, that's a great question. Well, a lot of research instruments are measuring youth mental health and social media use using their own definitions of what social media means to adults and to researchers in psychology or communications. But when you ask youth themselves, you know, okay, how does it affect you? You know, for instance, we just collected some data in June 2025 off of over a thousand youth. And when we asked them, okay, how does social media help or hinder your well being? And when we analyze that using their own words, we didn't predefine the words. We didn't have them forced choice of, you know, positive and negative words they used, they came up with those words themselves. And it was really interesting to see just how much that. So first of all, it helps them more than it hinders them. Although a lot of people, a big, big group of people said it depends. So it could help in some, some instances and it could hinder in some instances. And they were very aware of how much social media does influence, you know, their mood or their, their well being in some ways. And so that alone was really illuminating.
- [07:37]
A
And so when you defined. So let's go back to that. That's June 2025. When you say how social media helps or hinders them, how are you defining social media?
- [07:47]
B
I'm defining social media as any kind of social technology in which there's a social aspect of the communication between having some kind of interaction component and some kind of way to maybe have an audience for your posts, people to comment and react to your posts, and you do the same for them. You can create a profile, you can create a community of people that want, you want to be your audience. And so it could be as simple as a text chain and it could be Snapchat.
- [08:25]
A
So Facebook. Yes. I'm just thinking like, yes, no on these social medias. Yes. Instagram, TikTok. Discord.
- [08:36]
B
Yes, Discord, absolutely.
- [08:38]
A
Snapchat. Okay. And then we're also thinking of just kind of group like configurations where teens get each other together and are in some way, you know, talking to a group, some kind. Now would you also define like, you know, if kids are in video games together in a chat as something that is social and media?
- [09:00]
B
Absolutely. Social mediated by digital technologies where they can connect with other people. So it could be. Yeah, talking about your homework while you're on Fortnite, you know, on your headphones.
- [09:15]
A
So I can't tell you how many of my patients have informed me that they've done homework while in some video game of some sort. Just talking to a friend while they do two things at once, which my neuroscience research that my wife does would indicate that you really can't do that. But they somehow are threading that needle. So when you talk about how they said that it helps them. How does it help them?
- [09:38]
B
Well, it helps them feel like they have social support. For instance, if it's almost like a 247 portal to. Somebody out there could understand that they need help. And it might not be a particular person that they're asking for, not a one to one, but it could be their community who is available at that time to be able to answer the call. You know, when you, when you call on them. You know, it's, it's an opportunity for, for young people to feel that they, they could raise awareness about issues that they care about. They can, they can spotlight things that they think are worthy of their communities to know about and to care about. It's a way to learn about how to do, you know, teach yourself how to do things like do it yourself videos. You know, you can have people, you know, teach you new techniques and help you with your homework or find new communities that you can't find in person. And so there's a lot of ways in which young people have said that it helped them to also think about their own beliefs and their values. If you realize that there's other people with very contrasting beliefs and values compared to your families. It's a great playground actually to, to be like, oh, wait, do I think that, you know, I didn't know people even thought that. Is there other alternatives to what I usually experience? So it's a wonderful way to figure out, you know, even just who you are and in relation to other people and to also Realize that other people's opinions don't have to matter as much. You have to just get used to people having thoughts and beliefs and opinions about what you post. And, and so you get used to that.
- [11:24]
A
So I want to play the role of one of our parent listeners here. Somebody's walking their dog or washing the dishes and listening to us and saying, okay, first of all, that sounds all well and good. Like, I just heard this expert say that my kids could form social connections, you know, do things for entertainment like, you know, maybe learn a new skill, find a community of support. All those things sound really great. I'm worried right now that my teen is being sexed. I'm worried that they're being groomed. I'm worried that they're in a chat room with a predator. I'm worried that they're being cyberbullied. I'm worried they're being fed content that's pro Anna content or telling them that they should hurt themselves. Tell us this outside of, like, your, your own perspective, what do teenagers say about how aware they are of those risks, how they're learning about those, how much those risks are hurting them? What do you hear?
- [12:19]
B
What I'm hearing is not so much about worrying about cyberbullies. It's more about the worry about their own friends ignoring them or leaving them out. They're worried about being the odd one that, like, they're the only ones that think this way. They feel. They worry about being isolated. They worry about not the extreme examples that you hear in the news. A lot of the main headlines of very, very distressing instances of people accessing stranger danger type stuff online. And of course, we all should have that kind of prep and guidance from educators and parents to look out for that. But young people are more worried about, oh, gosh, you know, who, who am I? Who am I? Who am I going to be? Like, look at these amazing people with their accomplishments, these online influencers, these people that look perfect. Like, who. Who am I? Can I afford that? Can I do my friends? You know, would they be okay if I had this new hobby? Will I be accepted? So those are some of the things, kind of like the similar things that they worry about in real life, not just online life, you know, So I think, I think the extreme examples of like, illegal activity, for instance, are things that definitely parents kind of, they can't, you know, they can't get over some of the what if scenarios. But what's happening every day in their children's, you know, social media feeds are things that, you know, you want to think about. How do you maintain relationships online? What happens when somebody is being, you know, mean and teasing, but they're actually your friend, they're not like some stranger? You know, I think a lot of the extreme examples of adults and researchers are about strangers and adults, you know, preying on minors. But it's really, it's about your peers that you actually care about the most to their own opinions, not just these random people that are coming in to your feed.
- [14:30]
A
And yeah, so is that one of the main areas that youth say, at least in the research that you've done, that it can be hurtful? Is it the loneliness and exclusion, the kind of social dynamics from the real world writ large in the virtual? What else do they say can be harmful to them?
- [14:49]
B
Well, one big huge thing over the many years that I've been collecting the data is some of the top things that they've struggled with and they wish they had had more advice on from adults is how to help them with their self confidence and their self esteem. Now it might sound very broad and hard to manage with a quick fix, but that is something that young people, it could be very vulnerable if you have a very low self esteem or you really care about other people validating who you are and your worth. And if you're online, that could be something that, that adults might want to like, look out for if you have a vulnerability in that area. And so yeah, so self esteem is a big one. Also knowing when to self regulate, you know, because they start realizing that they probably are spending a little bit too much time on that. And so instead of parents saying, okay, this is the number of hours I think that, that are right for you. And this is what my, my other parent friends are doing. So I'm just going to do it randomly. But actually it's, it's this, it's this combination of how you know what is right for that particular child. Like are they able to, to gain and talk about their homework for three hours but their grades don't suffer, they're able to have good social relationships, they're able to go to school on time and get enough sleep and I mean really, is the number of hours the thing that matters? No, it's actually how it affects them that matters in the end.
- [16:22]
A
So I think this relates to another question that's incredibly pertinent here, that if, I mean, I want to go into kind of two directions and we'll go in both these directions not simultaneously, but sequentially. You know, you've obviously Given us some insights into what you've seen teens highlight as helpful, what you've seen teens highlight as hurtful. First, if a parent is sitting here then saying, well look, I want them to be socially connected, but the downsides outweigh the benefits, wouldn't it be most helpful for me as a parent to just say to them no, like they won't have to be. I won't have to worry about whether or not they're vulnerable, about their self esteem. I won't have to worry about time limps at all if there's just no time. And you know, maybe I can find other ways because after all, I want them to connect with their friends in real life. What do you say back to that parent?
- [17:14]
B
Oh yes, I totally feel for you because I'm a middle school parent myself and it's so easy to have that instinct to try to, you know, take away any of that potential harm, that potential hurt feelings of being left out and any hits to their self confidence. But in the end, you know, exposure to a lot of these very normal developmental tasks like learning how to navigate, you know, relationships that are toxic or knowing when somebody is just not healthy for you because they don't make you feel good about yourself because they're always saying things that undermine your worth. That can happen in real life and it can happen online. And, and so avoiding all of that actually gives them less, gives young people less tools to know how to navigate it in different situations. And so I would say what happens if you take all this learning that they could be doing in adolescence and then they go off to college or something like that and they never learn how to do that. And then in college they are trying to navigate self regulation of, of devices, they're trying to navigate the online spaces and this is their first time doing it and everybody else knows what they're doing because they were, you know, practicing early on. I think it also would, would put them into a category of, of feeling a little bit ashamed of even asking for help because they, a lot of people would, would think that they would know these, these, you know, strategies already.
- [18:52]
A
Yeah.
- [18:52]
B
So.
- [18:53]
A
Well now, now you get to, I think what is the fundamental and the question that I want to do a second of the sequence, which is every parent I feel like is looking at, you know, this period of time and you said that you're a middle school parent. I'm still late elementary and early elementary myself, so I'm, I'm getting a jump on this here. But they look at middle school, the, the kind of, you know, explosion of exposure to all kinds of technological things around middle school, all the way through high school. And then it's very likely that after high school, kids may be striking out on their own somewhat independently. Some may be going to college, some not, things like that. But whatever it is, they're probably going to be striking out to some degree independently around that age. How do we best ready them for the digital world given the formative years we have? Like, what do you think should be the way stations for parents that help get their kid ready for this? Or what would be the parenting style or tips that might help a kid to be ready for this world on their own?
- [19:49]
B
Oh gosh, that's, that's a million dollar question for sure.
- [19:53]
A
Exactly.
- [19:54]
B
But, but what I could say for that, parents of younger kids feel so much more confidence in themselves. They have a lot of self efficacy on how much they can control or know what their kids are doing online in elementary school age, for instance, preschool age. But as parents and kids navigate middle school, everything kind of shifts. There's puberty, there's hormonal changes, there's a change in peer environment. And so too should be the conversations that parents have with their kids not making assumptions that they're still looking at those cute little YouTube videos, the content going to start becoming more PG13, R rated and, and their peers are also going to expose them to all kinds of fun things that people look at, you know, as adolescents.
- [20:38]
A
Fun thing, sorry, making air quotes right now. Yes.
- [20:41]
B
And, and so instead of saying okay, I don't want them to look at that at all, know that it's you, you can't control everything that they see on the bus, in the school, other people's houses, at their cousin's house, you know, on their older siblings, you know, tablet. So better to have conversations and be that I call it a ready to listen parent. And so if they see something, you know, that they feel is inappropriate, they have questions about it, like you want to be the parent. Where they're like, I, you know, you, you won't overreact and say, oh my gosh, you'll never go to that person's house again because they expose you to that. But actually it's an opportunity for you to have this conversation. It's kind of like that, you know, those, those difficult conversations you have in, in, in middle school about, you know, the facts of life, you know, and, and middle school digital technologies and their online world is, is part of their, their fiber of their being of even learning how to be A teenager. And. And so I would say definitely be the.
- [21:42]
A
The.
- [21:42]
B
The parent that uses some restriction, but not as punishment. The restriction in order to help keep them, you know, on track with the other things that they need to get done in life, like make sure that. Get their homework done and have their meals, get their enough sleep, have, you know, social relationships. But. But. Yeah, but. But be ready and to. To listen to the hard conversations of. Of things, fun things that are happening online. And. And that you won't necessarily just take away their device or tell them not to be friends with somebody because you'll end up with a kid that won't tell you anything anymore. And that's the last thing a middle school parent wants.
- [22:19]
A
Is.
- [22:19]
B
Is a K down?
- [22:21]
A
Yeah. I mean, you. What strikes me about this, and this is where I think when doing podcast episodes, we get the. The benefit of talking to lots of experts around lots of controversial topics, whether it's sex, consent and safety, drugs and alcohol, social media, technology, you know, friendships in high school, romantic relationships. Like, there's. There's so many teenage topics that we talk about that I know keep parents up at night. And what's interesting is that, you know, I like to think that, like, the research is oftentimes just us as mental health professionals discovering the obvious, and we keep discovering the obvious over and over, that we need structure, like Baum runs right, that there's an authoritarian, there's an authoritative model to this, and that, like, you know, structure is needed. Like, restrictions are still needed. We need parents to, as you said, place restrictions such that kids are getting these really core developmental tasks. They're getting their homework done, they're seeing people in real life, they're getting enough sleep. And then beyond that, we're trying to get parents to be in an open space of curiosity to understand kind of the teen's world and help them to navigate challenges. So if we were to go into your home on a Tuesday night, or as we're recording this right now, it's a Monday, but on a Monday night, and you're the parents of a middle schooler, what are we gonna hear? Characterizing what your best parenting self is trying to do in discussions about these worlds, what will we see?
- [23:45]
B
Well, I have to say that I often think about what I have given advice to. To other parents, you know, in other, you know, webinars or research presentations. And I think of that self when I'm, you know, like, trying to juggle, you know, being a parent and a. And a researcher and all these kinds of stresses and to Remember that this child also deserves the best of the what the research offers. And so I, when she shows me something that is very like I would, I would freak out. Inside my mind I have a face where it's like tell me more, you know, and how did this happen and where did you get this idea? Those kinds of questions, you know, in a way that doesn't sound that as judgy as I'm thinking in my head, like oh, that person, I know it came from that person. But also knowing that the fact that she came to me was exactly what I wanted her to do, asked me with curiosity, what is this? Instead of worrying that I would flip out. I think it's also this amazing, valuable window into how she's doing with her friendships too. Like what are her friends, you know, thinking about? And, and what are they grappling with? What are they, you know, what are the viral things happening, right? What are the, what are the trends? You know, because those are things in which this is my opportunity, you know, not just out of the blue saying okay, well you know that if, if this happens, you know, here are some options, right? You know, you know, because sometimes it's really hard to sneak those, those little mini talks in unless you have like a, a topic that just kind of lands in your lap, you know. And so that's something I wanted to mention. It's an opportunity to like sneak in that little, little word of, a word of wisdom in there.
- [25:49]
A
And I think this often comes up in the sense that we will hear people in news media often touting perspectives, you know, or any sort of like conflict between like so called experts than what they do in their own home. What are the tech boundaries that you try to set for yourself and for your middle school age child at home?
- [26:10]
B
Oh gosh, I think definitely the screen use before bed is really important. You know, like having the screens away from the bedroom is a good one.
- [26:21]
A
The way you said it initially you were like screen use before bed is really important. And I was like, I don't think that's what you mean. You mean what?
- [26:27]
B
Right, yes, where it is located, where it's being charged, you know, because in the end if you want to conversations to arise from their screen use, they need to kind of be in the living space, in the kitchen, in the living room and not in the bedroom where they're going to close their door and they're going to like they're just going to, you know, scroll and scroll and get into the doom scrolling. Although in middle school it's Very different. Doom scrolling is not like adult doom scrolling.
- [26:54]
A
Yeah, so I can imagine that there's other aspects of it. But so in a sense, like you're thinking keep devices and open spaces in the house. So there's the hope that maybe you can orbit by and this could become a conversation or an open dialogue. Not in bedrooms or infringing on sleep. Right?
- [27:13]
B
Yes. And it's also another check on the techno solutions that people often have of, oh, if I just, you know, put a limit on the apps or downtime on the phone, that, that'll just take care of it. And so I think this is an opportunity for us to remember as parents, you know, that we actually want to encourage dialogue, you know, with our young people and not just have like a rule and not talk about why there's a rule. And it's not just about screen time, it's about content as well. We want them to tell us about, okay, what are they looking at? And you know, why is this funny? You know, I had a, yeah, I had a parent friend recently be shocked by what her young, innocent teenage boy was looking at in terms of influencers that were, you know, very anti women and misogynist. And she was like, I didn't think that he was, had it in him, but I guess his, his, his peer group think it's funny, quote unquote. And so this is where it all starts sometimes, you know, but it's, I
- [28:17]
A
think that that's a very, very interesting example because if you don't ask why they're looking at it, you could become very, very scared and very limit focused versus being able to understand that actually their worldview is to, you know, find this to be hilarious. And in fact they think very differently. And that kind of confirms for you an aspect of the person that you were raising, but also still is scary. This is out there. My only other thing too, and this is like what I have to remember with my own kids is like, you know, only teach them what they're asking you to teach them instead of just didactically lecturing them all the time. Because I also would be like, guys, this is based also on eyeballs. So the reality is, even if you think this is funny, this person can't differentiate between the people watching their videos who think it's funny and the people who actually believe in this stuff. So more content appears like this and then the algorithm gets fed even more and I'm spinning out already and I should just go back to the fact that they're watching it for perhaps a Different reason than I originally thought. So then here's, here's my. I've got a couple last questions, and I'm gonna try to bring this podcast episode in for a landing. Let's say that a parent says to you, I love everything you're saying. You sound, and I'm just reading into you interpersonally right now. You sound like you have a spirit that says, I can be curious, I can slow down. I might not yell at my child almost immediately about these things. And that might be also a naturalistic part of who you are. What if I am that overreactive parent and that, you know, I know I may not be able to slow down enough to have these conversations, but I've got to give my kid some good information somewhere. Like, maybe I could just say, listen, I'm not going to scream, but please take a look at this. Or, you know, that kind of thing. Like, if a parent says to you, where can I get my kid lessons on digital literacy, even if I can't actually teach it? Or I still don't understand Snapchat and my kid has shown it to me seven times. What do you think? Where would you send them? And anything you mention, we're putting in our show notes. But what do you got?
- [30:11]
B
Absolutely. Okay, so for practical resources online that are free and available to anybody, you can go on the American Academy of Pediatrics site on Family media Use plan. And it's by age. And you as a family choose what you really want to focus on. And there's a menu of items of like, let's say you want to talk about privacy or content or screen time or where do you want to, you know, have restrictions in the home or when. Those are all things you can pick and choose yourself. And you can have it change as the kid ages, too. You can keep coming back to these agreed upon limits so that, you know, teenagers like to think that they have some control over their lives. And so they're more likely to listen to those rules if they both, you know, you kind of have this sense of that you cared about what they think about these rules and why you have these rules and can kind of feel that together. There's also common sense. Media has digital censorship, you know, curricula that are mainly for educators, but parents can also look into them. And you can watch videos together. You can have talks. You know, it's all free. And there's also stuff that's new that's about AI literacy, too, in case anybody's interested in that, because that's. That's that's coming up.
- [31:25]
A
I just saw that come up. Yes, the AI stuff is real good. Anyway. Yes, we didn't even get to that on this. I'm going to try to do another podcast episode later on that. But yes, yes, Anything else?
- [31:33]
B
And I guess also in the literature, just going back to my research hat again is that in the end, the biggest predictor of if there's going to be less problematic Internet use, problematic gaming, problematic social media use in the household is a family that has really good quality relationships and good communication between each other. Because some of the research has been showing too, that sometimes the kids are on the screens because they're trying to avoid the tension in the house. They're trying to avoid the conflict. And so think about why they might be on it. Just we were saying earlier, Dave, that they could be trying to drown out the noises of like, you know, family and contract conflict. You know, there's a lot of, you know, noise out there that they're trying to drown, drown out. So. So really focus on communication, knowing more about your kid and just keep that dialogue open. It might not happen anytime, you know, in, during the time that you are available. You know, when you come home and you are available to talk, it could come into spurts, like maybe something happened to your kid a week earlier and then they're ready to talk about it and then just be there, ready to listen. That's my main, my main thing. It could be in the car on the way to school, it could be, you know, in the grocery store together. But be ready to listen when they're ready to talk.
- [32:56]
A
So you actually got to the last question I was going to ask because I wanted to make sure we talked about the parenting style that leaves the best tech outcomes as the parting thought. So I'll just say any last parting thing where you're like, I'm burning to tell parents this if they've listened this far.
- [33:10]
B
No matter what, going back to the quality of relationship. Yeah, you can really try to help that fear of yours that something really dire is going to happen to your kid if they see something that will make them question their, their will to live or things like that, please remember that. Tell them that you'll love them no matter what happens on their phone. Anything that could happen, some kind of sextortion, any kind of, you know, leaked out nudes, any kind of, you know, thing that could go wrong that might not even be your fault. Like somebody could just be posting your. Your face on. On and it wasn't even, you Just remember, remind them that no matter what they tell you, you will love them and you will help them through it. So yeah.
- [33:58]
A
God, that is such a good point. You just made me think of at least three different client stories I don't have time to tell. But that stuff is real?
- [34:03]
B
Yes.
- [34:04]
A
Like, and if a kid really believes they can go to a parent, like, I, I get so worried because some of the most difficult situations where a teen has been most unsafe in my patients in the last few years have been kids who feel incredibly embarrassed and ashamed of something that happened online, don't feel like they can tell their parents about it, and don't feel like there's any other way out. And it's like, I just never want a kid in that situation.
- [34:25]
B
Right.
- [34:26]
A
In the sense that, like, there might still be consequences sometimes for this stuff. Like, some parent might decide, yeah, I'm gonna ground you for a couple weeks because this is like a little bit crazy and I do think you made some bad decisions. But at the end of the day, you're still gonna love your kid, you're still gonna help them, even if, you know, you might tell them that, like, we do need to think about this after this thing has happened, but that's the thing we want our kids to think about as the worst case scenario instead, like, there's no escape. So that was an incredibly wide final wise, final point. Dr. Jamarman, thank you so much for joining us on the thriving kids podcast. And I'm sure that we will have people running to the show notes for various tech friendly plans that you've just recommended at AAP and at Common Sense, so thanks a lot.
- [35:04]
B
No problem. Thank you for having me.