In-Laws, Legacy, and the Dad I Miss: What Fatherhood Really Mirrors (TDFD Ep. 8)

Summary

Podcast Summary: "In-Laws, Legacy, and the Dad I Miss: What Fatherhood Really Mirrors"

Podcast: To Dad From Dad
Host: Lee Wallace
Guest: Pete (“Mr. Pete” – returning guest from episode one)
Date: February 15, 2026
Episode: TDFD Ep. 8

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Overview

This heartfelt episode of To Dad From Dad centers around the deep and complex relationship fathers have with their families, legacies left by their own dads, and the profound mirrors that in-laws, fatherhood, and loss hold up to a man’s life. Lee welcomes back Pete for an open, winding conversation brimming with honesty, humor, vulnerability, and practical wisdom for dads at every stage.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Role and Influence of In-Laws

• Family Interconnectedness – Pete discusses how he has known his in-laws Amanda’s parents (Randy and his wife) since childhood (04:12), noting that their intertwined history and continued prayers shaped his life and marriage.
• Navigating Boundaries – Living with in-laws during tough times created challenging scenarios: “Are they parenting your kids or are you?” (05:33). Both agree that respect for the core family unit is crucial in healthy in-law dynamics (08:25).
• Adapting to Family Cultures – Pete highlights the need to balance being folded into a spouse’s family versus forging a new, independent family culture (08:40).

2. Losing a Father & Continuing His Legacy

• Honoring His Dad’s Life – Pete’s father was an attorney, Vietnam veteran, and “real life action hero” who died of complications from Agent Orange (09:15 – 10:13). Pete’s stories illustrate his dad’s immense generosity and honesty.
  • Quote: “If he saw somebody on the street that didn’t have shoes on... he would stop and give the guy his shoes. That’s literal.” (10:13)
• Baseball, Coaching, and Shared Role Models – Baseball was a family tradition connecting Pete, his dad, and his father-in-law Randy, who also coached him (11:23).
• Witnessing Decline & Caregiving – Pete describes his dad’s long illness—losing speech and mobility—and the bittersweet privilege of caring for him in his final years (12:06 – 13:26).
  • Memorable moment: Pete reprograms his dad’s speech device with silly phrases, bringing laughter even in hardship (12:31).
• Inheritance of Faith & Wisdom – Pete treasures his father’s tattered, annotated Bible (15:41), especially its marked-up Proverbs, as a living legacy. His dad’s way of “living faith loud” rather than preaching made the deepest impact.
  • Quote: “Even though he couldn't speak, he was still speaking to me... that’s not hyperbole... Every night with Proverbs.” (17:20)

3. The Model and Impact of Faith in Parenting

• Faith Should Not Be a Secret – Lee shares advice from his own father: “Your faith should not be a secret to your children.” (18:49)
• Living, Not Preaching, the Faith – Pete emphasizes action over words—kids absorb what’s lived, not just said (19:49).
• The Power of Grace – Anecdotes abound of faith manifesting in how fathers handle regret, illness, and even their mistakes (20:10, 24:16).
• Prayer in Action – Pete recounts how praying with his daughter over a stressful decision led to family growth and answered prayers (29:06).

4. Validation, Legacy, and Making Kids Feel Seen

• Desire for Parental Pride – After losing his mother young, Lee reflects on hoping she would be proud of him; Pete echoes this about his father (24:35 – 26:46).
• James’s Hope for His Kids – Referencing a past guest, Lee discusses how living for God reframes a child’s search for validation: “If you’re honoring God... this is exactly what dad would have wanted.” (27:08)
• Father Figures as Reflections of God – Pete draws a vivid parallel between earthly fatherhood and the biblical concept of God as Father: “It’s a parallel for your relationship with Christ... your relationship with your father is an exact parallel to what your relationship with God is going to look like.” (31:07)
• The Mirror of Fatherhood – The theme “nothing holds up a mirror like fatherhood does” (33:39) recurs, with honest talk about both love and anger as tools for growth.

5. Family Culture, Modeling, & Everyday Moments

• Children Imitate What They See – Pete and Lee discuss how their kids mimic their actions, whether it’s worship posture in church (41:50) or setting up a “podcast studio” just like Dad (49:39).
  • Quote: “Isn’t that interesting how they’re watching every move and they will mimic what you do in all things. If you are worshiping God... they will mimic that as well.” (42:14)
• Small Moments Matter Most – Both caution dads not to “major in the minors”—that is, don’t let spilled drinks or minor mistakes become big deals (64:36).
  • Quote: “If you make everything a big deal, nothing’s a big deal.” (64:41)
• Say “Yes” to Connection – Lee recounts the powerful impact of saying “yes” to his daughter’s request to play checkers during a busy work-from-home day (71:06). Pete points out the unseen intentionality and hope children invest in these invitations.
  • Quote: “Our daughters are begging for our attention, for our love. We are the biggest thing in the world to them, and we are so flippant sometimes with it.” (73:09)

6. Legacy Objects & Tangible Traditions

• The Air Raid Siren – Pete’s family passes around his dad’s Vietnam-era air raid siren as a trophy for their family Olympic games (44:42). This physical connection to his father sparks stories and shared meaning for the next generation.
  • Fun moment: Pete spins up the siren for the audience – “If we were ever gone, my dad would... crank the siren, and... that would be the sign to know dad was calling us.” (45:44)

7. Permission to Be Imperfect, Power of Apology & Next Steps

• No Statute of Limitations on Apology – Both encourage fathers to apologize for even old mistakes, creating a culture of grace (58:59).
  • Quote: “There is no statute of limitations on saying sorry.” (58:59)
• Progress Over Perfection – Lee repeats a key thread for the podcast: “It’s not about perfection, it’s about direction” (56:40), urging dads to make small, positive changes beginning now.
• Modeling Marital Love – Fathers show their daughters what love looks like—by dating their wives, celebrating holidays, and setting standards for future partners (54:40).
• Be Present, Not Just Physically But Emotionally – The initial reaction to a child’s request (“Do they feel like a burden?”) matters as much as following through (76:22).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Quote / Moment | Speaker | |-----------|----------------|---------| | 04:45 | “They’ve been praying for me for my entire life... praying for my spouse, they were praying for their own daughter.” | Pete | | 10:13 | “If he saw somebody... he would stop and give him the guy his shoes. He would give him the shirt off his back... literal.” | Pete | | 15:41 | “This is my dad’s Bible... Proverbs is literally so written in this book, it’s not even funny.” | Pete | | 17:20 | “Even when he couldn’t speak, he was still speaking to me...” | Pete | | 18:49 | “Your faith should not be a secret to your children.” | Lee’s Dad (via Lee) | | 19:49 | “It wasn’t that he preached to me... it was the way he lived.” | Pete | | 29:06 | “We started praying over Savannah... 24 hours later, it got resolved and Savannah was like, oh my gosh, the prayer worked.” | Pete | | 31:07 | “Your relationship with your father is an exact parallel to what your relationship with God is going to look like.” | Pete | | 33:39 | “Nothing holds up a mirror like fatherhood does.” | Ryan (quoted by Lee) | | 42:14 | “Isn’t that interesting how they’re watching every move and they will mimic what you do in all things…” | Pete | | 45:44 | “He’d crank this siren, and that would be the sign to know dad was calling us.” | Pete | | 64:36 | “Don’t major in the minors. If you make everything a big deal, nothing’s a big deal.” | Pete | | 73:09 | “Our daughters are begging for our attention, for our love. We are the biggest thing in the world to them, and we are so flippant sometimes with it.” | Pete | | 76:22 | “...the reaction when you—when they ask you for it is ultimately what’s going to kind of set the tone, whether or not they feel like they’re a burden or you’re put out.” | Lee |

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• In-Laws, Boundaries & Family Culture: 04:08–08:51
• Remembering Pete’s Father & His Impact: 09:09–17:43
• Modeling Faith for Kids: 18:49–21:04
• Validation & Parental Pride: 24:35–29:05
• Kids as Mirrors, Creating Family Culture: 31:07–42:49
• Legacy Objects & Family Olympics: 44:42–48:49
• Children’s Mimicry and Cultural Absorption: 49:39–53:58
• Tactical Dad Advice – Don’t Major in the Minors: 64:36–66:11
• Saying Yes to Small Moments: 68:21–74:19
• Emotional Presence & Nonverbal Signals: 76:22–78:36

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Takeaways for Dads

• Your legacy is lived now: How you love, correct, apologize, model faith, and react—these are what your children carry forward.
• Small moments are bigger than you think: Say yes, especially when it feels inconvenient.
• Apologize often and quickly: There’s never a bad time to make things right.
• Model faith and values visibly: Children need to see—more than hear—what you believe and how you live.
• Don’t major in the minors: Keep perspective. Messes and mistakes can teach grace.
• The way you react is as important as the decision itself: Your children are always observing and learning from you.
• Legacy is a team sport: Objects, stories, and traditions tie generations together.

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Final Words

Lee and Pete deliver a rich, often humorous, and always honest conversation exploring what it means to be a father in the shadow and memory of fathers before them. They challenge listeners to be present, humble, faithful, and to treasure the messy, daily grind—because that’s where the real legacy is forged.

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Next Week Preview:
Upcoming conversations will include grandfathers, parents of large families, and stories of walking through infertility and adoption.

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Favorite closing line:

“I will make everybody listening a guarantee... You will never get to the end of your life on your deathbed and think to yourself, I wish I had watched more YouTube. I wish I had scrolled Instagram some more... I guarantee what you will do is you will say, I wish I had more time with my family.” — Lee (74:19)

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Transcript

[A]

Let me get a mic. Check, 1, 2, 1, 2.

[B]

Mic check, 1, 2, 1, two. Mike check, 1, 2, 1st, 2.

[A]

Sounds good.

[B]

Times.

[A]

This is the to dad from dad podcast show, where we talk about what worked and what didn't. And today is our first returning guest, Mr. Pete. Pete was here for episode one, and some of you guys listening might be surprised to know, but it's can be hard to find people to come on the show and. And get coordinated with schedules and everything. Pete doesn't live very far from me. And so I texted Pete late this week and said, hey, dude, come back. And Pete was like, yo, full disclosure,

[B]

I was your Uber eats driver, and I happened to drop off the Chick Fil A, and you're like, hey, come inside. And then sat me down and we just started talking. So this has been really, you know, fortuitous. Thank you.

[A]

Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, you know, when you and I were texting yesterday and the day before, you, we were just, you know, kind of hashing out and you said, hey, I actually. I really am eager to come back because I've got some more stuff I want to talk about. And so the first time. If you haven't listened to the first episode, go back and listen to episode one with Pete. So it was. It was in the dining room, and we were still figuring stuff out, but some great wisdom there. And just. Would you. Let's just give just a little recap, though. So. Sure. You're married to your wife Amanda. You've got three daughters. You got Savannah, who's 18. You've got Eevee, who's 15. 15. And then you've got Georgie, who is 11.

[B]

10. 11 in couple months.

[A]

11 in a couple months. And your youngest and my oldest go to school together.

[B]

That's correct.

[A]

And you and I are also just really good, really good personal friends.

[B]

I would like to point out that I was the first person you met

[A]

in San Antonio at an ice cream social.

[B]

That's right. I saw the biggest guy I could find. Him like, that dude can protect me if I'm getting beat up. I need to go big friends with that dude. And here you are.

[A]

Absolutely. I'm so glad you did, man.

[B]

Yeah, it's kind of fun, actually.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You guys. You guys look like a couple lost puppy dogs sitting out there at the ice cream social. So, yeah, we were actually brought in to go and just kind of fold families in.

[A]

Yeah, no, it was great. I. I was very reluctant to show up to an ice cream social, if I'm being honest, but I'M very glad I did. Yeah.

[B]

When we did our ice cream social to like introduce us to the school and families must have been 115 degree in August. And the ice cream melted in like two minutes. It was just a mess. Yeah, we'd been in town for like two days. It was crazy. We drove in, unpacked our stuff and then came to school.

[A]

So also last weekend I sat down with your father in law. Randy.

[B]

Randy.

[A]

And so I just wanted to take a second to say for those of you that listened to last week's episode with Randy. Randy. Actually when we turned the mic off, Randy and I stayed and talked for probably another hour.

[B]

But you did.

[A]

And he has expressed a desire to come back with some, with some regular frequency to talk about topics that we either hear about from people that send me emails or people that comment on videos that want to hear about stuff. But also just because I think it's really healthy for me and I think just diving into topics with his like professional background and just, just the dude he is is just going to be phenomenal.

[B]

Such a good dude. And by the way, Randy's got a unbelievable life story. His journey, his path. I mean he was, he's a music. Well like in not just a, you know, a therapist to people you've probably seen in sports and tv, but like he's an all around good dude. And so to have him as my father in law has been interesting in a good way. He has kind of taken the place in my life of my dad.

[A]

Dude, this is a great segue. This is what we want to talk about today. So man, I'm going to just turn it over to you.

[B]

And so let me tell you about Randy.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I actually first met my in laws before I was even functional as a, as a human. I think I met them. They, they, they met me when I was still an infant. And my parents and my wife's parents were close friends and then they ended up going into a Bible study when my wife and I were both super young. And so my in laws have been praying for me. They've been knowing me. They saw me through good times and all my bad times.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But they, they've been praying for me for my entire life. I mean, how, dude, how insane is that?

[A]

Like, that's crazy.

[B]

But like by name though, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And praying one day for me and a wife and little did they know. And praying for my spouse, they were praying for their own daughter.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's not to say that there haven't been things we've had to work through. I mean, dude, life is messy. It's not, it's not clean. But we've had to, we've had to work through some things that were really difficult. You know, whether it was a lot of involvement in our lives. You know, I mean, here's the reality. I don't know if I mentioned this or not in the last podcast, but Amanda and I have had to live with her parents and my parents, her parents multiple times. We had to move into their house just because, you know, we bottomed out financially for one reason or another. I mean, I started a financial services company in 07 right before the market crashed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Probably not the best business decision, but we've, we've had to live under the roofs of our parents multiple times. And let me tell you something that creates a different type of relationship. Are they parenting your kids or are you parenting your kids? And where do you draw that line?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think Randy is a gem of a man because he is charitable. Randy is kind and, and he's thoughtful.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And. And my mother in law as well, she's just got the gift of hospitality and love and she lets everybody know that she loves him to the nth degree. I'm pretty sure my mother in law would kill somebody for me. I mean, that's how much she loves us. It's, it's. There's no question. But navigating that relationship is difficult. And every marriage you're going to have two sets of in laws that you're going to have to learn how to navigate life with. Because the reality is, yes, you, the two become one and you become your own flesh. Right. One flesh. And you know, navigating how that in law relationship plays into your marriage is crucial. And you have to have open and honest conversations. But couched in, in love.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Not couched in blame. Not couched in animosity. It's gotta, you have to approach it with such care.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because you're talking about the people that this person loves most.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, your spouse's parents are who she loves. I mean, those were her, her, her idols growing up. Right. Those are her foundation. And if she comes from a strong family like Amanda does, it's not so much trying to change that, but more how that relationship fits into your marriage is a, is a tough thing to navigate, I guess I would say. Does that make sense?

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. We, it's funny you say that. I, I think in laws are probably a huge point of contention just in general for a lot of married Couples.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[A]

You know, and I'm blessed to have some really, really incredible in laws on like Whitney's side, the weird dynamic on my side. I think I've said this before, but my mom passed away back in 2013 and my dad got remarried when I was 14. And my dad and stepmom are fantastic. We're just really blessed. We don't, we don't have a lot of drama, whether we live really close to them or really far away from them. Like, they're just great people. And I think what really makes them both sides very good is they respect the institution of our family unit.

[B]

Crucial.

[A]

Yeah. Does that make sense?

[B]

Oh, absolutely. It's interesting. Some, some in laws, and I'm not saying this is mine in particular, but some in laws are looking to fold you into their family.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

And for me, a big thing was I, I want my family.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I don't want your family. I want mine. And I want to operate my family, you know, with my wife as my partner and, and have us be the core unit. And so it's, it's tough to make that distinction sometimes.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. Well, you said something a second ago and I, I will probably will bounce back and forth a little bit with in laws, but you said something a second ago about how Randy has really of filled the void of your. For your father.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But take us back a little bit. Like, tell us about your father.

[B]

So my dad, my dad was a, my dad was a real life action hero in my life. He was the most important person to me. And he, I mean, I look back and the, the thoughts and feelings I have about my dad are nothing but admiration and love and respect for that, that man. And it's, it's, you know, he's dead. He died in 2022, January 2022. And he died from complications from being exposed to Agent Orange in Vietnam. And he had this really rare disease called psp, which is Parasy. And essentially it's like Lou Gehrig's meets Parkinson's. Tough. And my dad was such a live, lively, vibrant person. Loved with his whole heart, Gave, gave without end. My dad did really well for himself, but he was so giving.

[A]

He.

[B]

If he saw somebody on the street that didn't have shoes on, it didn't matter if he was wearing thousand dollar shoes. He would stop and give him the guy guy his shoes. He would give him the shirt off his back. And that's literal. And I saw that happen over and over and over again. And so that having that as an example. It's huge. My dad was an attorney, and my dad is the most honest man I've ever known. Who can say that about an attorney, number one, and number two, their father. And both those things combined. My dad was honest through and through. And that's something that resonates with me is. Is that honesty thread, like in all things. Right. It's interesting. So, funny story. Growing up, my dad actually was my baseball coach. Baseball's in our family. We. My. My great uncle John was Colle College's most winningest baseball coach. I coached the US Olympic team in 84. It was like. It was before baseball was entered in the Olympics. It was like a trial run to get baseball into the Olympics. And so he was the coach of Team usa. It was like Will Clark, Jose Canseco. It was just young, young guys, by the way, in like, their early 20s, late teens. And it was. And I was. I was able to be part of that. And so baseball was always in our blood. And Randy was actually the coach of the All Star pony team, which I made. So Randy. Randy, growing up, was my baseball coach as well as my dad was. And so having that connection with Randy and my dad, you know, my dad started to get sick probably in 2011, 2012. We started to see some. Some signs. Losing the ability to balance and eventually walk and eventually talk and just kind of slip into a bit of a state where he wasn't moving or talking, but he was still alive. So the brain was still fully functioning, but the body had failed around him.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Which is tough for a guy that had so much life and so much love. And you know what's crazy is right in the time of my life, when things got super difficult for me and I needed my dad and my. And my dad's advice because he was so wise, my dad. And I brought something to show you that my dad was so wise right at that time in my life when it was so difficult, he stopped having the ability to talk and speak into my life.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that was brutal. That was brutal for me because I was going through really tough things, man. Like, you know, going through really tough stuff at work. I had some. I got promoted and had some issues at work with just the structure and the company I was working for at the time. And I needed his help. I needed my dad. And he was the one person that I needed and wanted to hear from. And he couldn't even talk. It. It's funny, he. When he lost the ability to speak, the VA gave him one of Those Stephen Hawking machines where you push the buttons and it's like, yeah, I love you. You know, one of those things. And so I took his. I took the Stephen Hawking machine and I reprogrammed a few of the buttons to say phrases and they were bad words and my dad didn't swear. And so I programmed one of the buttons to be like, I hate you. And it was. It. He thought it meant, he thought the button was going to say I love you. My sister was there and my dad had had the machine and he went to hit I love you and was like, I hate you, I hate you. And he kept hitting. It was like, I hate you, I hate you. It was hilarious. Then I programmed to say some terrible things. It was so funny because my dad, that was so not him, but in his state, he realized what I had done and, and he, he couldn't audibly laugh, but he would, yeah, dude, it was hilarious. I had my dad and I almost killed my dad early, early on. Cause I had him in stitches so hard because I reprogrammed his machine. But it was funny. So, yeah, my dad, my dad was, was amazing. You know, it's funny. My dad lost the ability to speak, but he didn't lose the ability to put his hand on me and give me a hug. And I got to actually jump in and take care of my dad. We had a full time caregiver, but I would be able in and take care of him. You know, shower him, clean him up, get him dressed sometimes. And I, I, that was such a gift to be able to have that time to take care of him. Because I know he and my mom did that for me, for my life growing up, and cared for me in a way that was sweet. And there is nothing you get in return. You're doing it because you love. And so I got to reciprocate that to my dad in his. In his final days. And we moved out to Texas and he died six months later. I wasn't even there when he died. I was actually. I was at a funeral for a friend's wife in, in Kansas. And I found out the morning of the funeral that my dad had passed away. So that was, that was heavy. I wasn't even there and I, that, that, that was eating at me a little bit. Yeah, because I wanted to be there. But this opportunity for work came up and he actually was able to communicate to me and my mom that he wanted us to go and pursue this opportunity which brought us to Texas. And that was sweet. But then he passed away when I wasn't there, and my sisters were there when he. When he passed. And so, you know, it ate at me a little bit. But my dad gave the blessing and wanted us to go. He left me a legacy of being a godly man. And I actually brought something today.

[A]

Can I. Yeah, absolutely. Go for it.

[B]

Sorry. So this is my dad's Bible.

[A]

And.

[B]

And here's what I wanted to show you that he left me growing up. My dad would take this Bible. This Bible is old and beat up. I'm not sure if you guys can see that, but his name is here on the corner. And my dad would take this Bible into my room every night at bedtime, and he would crack it open, always to the same place. He'd jump into Proverbs. And I'm not sure if you guys can see this or not, but in Proverbs, everything is highlighted and underlined. My dad would sit there and read Proverbs over and over and over again. Stars, underlines, red circles, black circles. Proverbs is literally so written in this book, it's not even funny. And he's got notes in some of the margins. But my dad, this is the legacy he gave me. He instilled proverb wisdom into me from the time I was a little boy. Now. Didn't always sink in, but Proverbs is my favorite book of the Bible because my dad and I gleaned so much wisdom from this because it's. It's so simple.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And yet so many people don't even follow what this. This says and the guidelines. So this was. This was a legacy that he left for me. So even my dad couldn't talk anymore. And I was going through hard times. I went to Proverbs right away. So even though he couldn't speak, he was still speaking to me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like I was a little boy. Like I was laying in bed and like he was reading me the Proverbs again. Every. Every night when I say that. That's not hyperbole, by the way. Every night.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

With Proverbs. So that's. This. I brought this because this entire Bible is so marked up from the front to the back, but nothing is quite as. Quite as marked up as Proverbs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. Highlights everything.

[A]

So a couple things. So my dad, I think at this point, is probably the number one fan of the podcast.

[B]

Hey, dad.

[A]

Pretty much. Pretty much every week after Sunday mornings, when the episodes post, he'll. He'll send me a note or he'll, you know, have suggestions or comments. Or additional thoughts or wisdom. And a couple of weeks ago, he called or sent me a message. I can't remember. And. And he said, hey, it occurs to me, after listening for a couple of weeks, and he said, you should. You should share this. He said, your faith should not be a secret to your children. Right. And is. It was interesting, you know, I didn't really unpack that with him, but, you know, dad's gonna listen to this, you know, and, you know, we grew up in church, and my dad's father was a. Was a pastor for a long time. And my dad was a music minister and very engaged in church my entire life and still is to this day. And I think that my dad. When my grandfather passed away, I think that my dad realized that even though his dad was a preacher for a very long time, I don't think my dad knew a ton about his father's walk with the Lord. And my gut kind of says, you know, later in life, my dad has been tremendously more active in talking about his faith and his testimony and sharing. Sharing with us. But I think that's kind of. My dad was saying, like, hey, I wish I had done more of this earlier. And that was the wisdom that he gave me was, your faith should not be a secret to your children.

[B]

That's so wise, dude. It's. You know, it's funny is you. As a kid, my dad never preached at me, but my dad lived this out. And I don't ever want to preach to my kids. I want them to see this book alive in my heart.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In action every day. That's what speaks to them. That's what I noticed about my dad. It wasn't that he preached to me and read to me Proverbs every night that let me know that he loved Jesus. It was the way he lived. And even up until the very end of his life, dude, he was still praying with. Without even a voice. He was still praying. My dad. And my dad was. Oh, man. I remember back before my dad lost his ability to speak, he said something that he said. He said, I hope. I hope I'm forgiven for the things that. That I had to do in Vietnam. And he said, I. I wonder if my sickness is me getting punished for. For what I was tasked to do as a soldier.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it wasn't like he was involved in anything terrible, like a, you know, the massacre or anything like that. It was just being a soldier, but taking somebody else's life. And he.

[A]

He was. But.

[B]

But that's his heart, though, dude.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That heart posture is just wild. And my dad, my dad was such a loving man and a God fearing man. And to watch him live out his life and then watch him face down a sickness like that with bro, I'm gonna cry. He, he faced that illness with such, such poise, such grace. Never woe is me always. Even, even when he was sick, trying to, trying to give and do for others. He couldn't even walk. He'd fall over and hurt himself and, and he was still trying to, to love and serve others even in the midst of it. Like he was such an incredible human being, man. And my wife, it's funny, my wife loved my dad. Amanda loved my dad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And, and we talk about him often. We actually talked about him. We were, my wife and I sit in the sauna and we, we have our little chats and we were in the sauna, I think it was a couple days ago, and it was really quiet. She usually uses about five times as many words as I do in the sauna. She's trying to sweat through the, the.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And she said, what are you thinking about? And I said, I miss my dad. And she goes, oh, what a man. What a sweet man. You know, I mean, bro, that's, that's the goal is when you are remembered. I wanted people, I want people to talk about me, how they talked about my dad. Dude. At my dad's funeral, so many people came up to share stories about my dad and talk about my dad that we actually like went, we were, we were at Annandale. It was, it's a country club in la and my dad was member there for years and years. And at a certain point in time, my dad knew all the staff, he knew the janitors by name. Yeah, that's my dad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He just didn't know the CEO. He knew everybody top to bottom, and he loved everybody. We went over by like two hours because people kept on coming up and telling stories and they were like, it's okay. Yeah, it's for Harry, it's for Harry. It's okay. And you know, they had other stuff going on and we took up, we took up like the entire banquet hall plus the outside and people, one after another kept on coming up and sharing stories about my dad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And brought. What a legacy. Yeah, I just, I, I, I pray I can have a quarter of the impact that my dad did on others. Yeah. Yeah, he was, he was the absolute man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. Just showed me how to love, you know. Was he perfect? No. But man, I, you know, it's funny, when he was, when he was getting close to death, I remember I talked to him. He was trying to apologize for something, you know, with his computer. He was not tech savvy, so it was pretty messy, but he was trying to apologize. And I said, pop. I called my dad Pop. My kids call me Pop. I said, Pop. I said, you don't have to apologize for anything. I said, you were an amazing parent. I needed the correction. I needed the correction. You weren't hard on me. I needed that as a young man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was a little bit wild as you. As you know, and I needed to have. I wasn't spared the rod, but for good reason.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I needed it. And now as an adult, here I am in my late 40s, I can look back in hindsight and say, man, what a blessing to have a dad that actually loved me enough to punish.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I was a wild kid. So, so sweet kid loving kid. But I, you know, had a wild streak in me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's fun. I saw the back of a cop car once.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Maybe twice.

[A]

You know, a couple things there. One is, I think it was in the conversation with James. He brought up something that really stuck with me, which was we through conversation ended in this place where, you know, when we're gone as fathers, I think a lot of the, the lasting implications of that is children want validation from their dads big time. So it's a big deal. You know, you see in households where fathers are absent or, you know, divorced families where kids will act out or, or do extreme things. Right. And a lot of that is, you know, attention seeking behavior or it's to get validation or get attention in some regard and fast forward probably out of adolescence and into early adulthood. I think when your parents are gone, a lot of what you think about is, would my dad be proud of me? Right. I. I hope that I'm making my dad proud. Right. You know, I lost my mom when I was 20 or 21 years old. I can't. Or 22, I can't remember now, actually. I guess I was 23 years old. And that's, that's probably one of the biggest thoughts. I have two big thoughts about my mom. One is, I'm so sad that she didn't get to meet my kids. That's. That's a big one. But another one is I hope that she'd be proud of what I've. What I've done and who I've become. But James said in our conversation that his biggest hope for his children is that when he's gone, they understand that if. If whatever they're doing and the choices that they're making are in pursuit of the Lord or if they're. If they're, if they're honoring God and their decision making, that they can rest assured that. That that is his number one hope for them when he's gone.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so they don't have to ask, like, would dad be. It changes the question from would dad be proud of me? To just simply, am I. Is this decision in pursuit of the Lord? Is this decision glorifying to God? Is this decision, you know, am I following the path that. That, that God wants me to follow? And if the answer to that question is yes, then, you know, this is exactly what dad would have wanted. Yeah, dude, I just thought that was so powerful.

[B]

James is such a special dude. I mean, I think you and I both have a lot of admiration for the man that he is. And actually, dude, I mean, we surround ourselves, I think, with some exceptional men.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think that comes through in the podcast. Man, I. This has been so fun to. To listen to on a consistent basis. Every time a new episode pops, I'm throwing it in the car. You know, I got a long drive and I always am able to just consume it. And it's so good because you have these top tier men on here, you know, present company excluded, but top tier men on here. That. That just has such wisdom. I think James is so thought out and purposeful and intentional. Intentionality is what's something I'd use to describe James.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, he's intentional. I mean, we've been to his house before and bro, he's so intentional. To make sure that everybody is taken care of.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you and I both know the kind of guy that he is. And.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To see somebody that's so giving of themselves in that way and in a position like James is just exceptional. He's an exceptional human being. Same with gray man. Exceptional human beings. Right, Rick as well.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think it's funny because I. I dovetailing off that. I think that was my dad's longing for his children, was just to follow the Lord, you know, and it. And even when he wasn't there, like you just said, I had his wisdom pouring through the Bible into me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, this was his guidebook. And so even when he wasn't there to talk to me and. And give me the right words or whatever it was, I had this and this was his legacy. And so it's almost like he did what his goal was, the same as James's in that sense. Where. Seek after the Lord. Right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Proverbs 3, 5, and 6. Yeah, right. Trust in Lord with all your heart. Lean not on your understanding, in all your ways. Follow him, and he'll make you pastrate. And. And so I think that's. That's a great place to be because it takes the guesswork out of a lot, doesn't it? We look at these decisions we make, and sometimes, you know, is it the right decision or the wrong decision? And when I'm talking with my kiddos, especially my oldest, Savannah, we were actually making some tough decisions lately. And, dude, this is so cool. This is so cool. She was really spun up about something, and she wasn't sure what to do. And I said, we're gonna pray about it. And so Amanda wasn't at home, and the girls and I were there. And so the three girls and I held hands and we started praying over Savannah for it, bro. 24 hours later, it. It got resolved and Savannah was like, oh, my gosh, the prayer worked. I'm like, yeah, that's how it works.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it takes longer than 24 hours. But it was so one of those cool things where it wasn't preaching about it. It was putting into action. Putting your faith into action. And that's what my dad taught me as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pretty neat. I mean, I know I wanted to come on here and talk about my dad because I know that our conversations are usually about being a father. And I don't think from the. I mean, I know you've touched on it before with your father and a few of the other conversations dads were brought up, but it was never really talked about extensively about our dads.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And how we were parent and how we were raised as men by our dads. And I think that is absolutely crucial to how you are as a father.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And how we operate, because that's my first example of a man. That was the first thing that stuck in my head as the. It's essentially. It's a. It's a parallel for your relationship with Christ, with God. Your relationship with your father is an exact parallel to what your relationship with God is going to look like.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's that similar in path, and I think it's actually designed that way, which is unbelievable how God just has this foresight when he was creating everything. He put that relationship in place because it's Going to give. It's going to give a guidebook on how we're going to be acting with God as the father.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And when it talks about love and punishment and consequences, but also, like, also blessings. Yeah, bro. That is absolutely parallel to the way it works with my dad and your dad growing up. Now, granted, I know that dads are never perfect. Earthly fathers are never perfect, but I think having that structure in place, it just makes everything come into focus.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Doesn't it?

[A]

Yeah. You know, a couple things. One, when Ryan was on, he said something that really stuck with me, which was, nothing holds up a mirror like fatherhood does. Right. Yeah. And, you know, we're kind of studying through the book of love and respect right now, you know, and one of the things that I guess I've never considered before is, you know, we're called to love our wives like Christ loved the church. Right. There's a tremendous amount of reflection that goes into that statement. Right. From a standpoint of, number one, understanding what that kind of love looks like and what that kind of love looks like with your wife. Right. But there's another layer to that when you have kids, which is, you know, if. If you believe in the triune God. Right. That are. That our biblical father. And. And, you know, this is funny. This theme has come out several times, but we've talked a lot about dad anger, you know.

[B]

Danger.

[A]

Yeah. Danger. Yeah, dude. I mean, there are multiple stories in the Bible where God got pretty freaking pissed at the Israelites.

[B]

Well, there were some wild kids, man.

[A]

Right. You know, and. And I think having a dad, I think there's a level of frustration with. With your kids that you can't really relate to the frustration that God must have felt for his people until you've been a father. Right.

[B]

We were made in his image.

[A]

Exactly. Right. And it's like, how can I simultaneously love you so much and also, like, just question everything that's going on in your life right now, you know, the decisions that you're making. Right. And, man, it's a. It's a purposeful design.

[B]

Yeah. Funny, right?

[A]

It is. Yeah.

[B]

There's comedy to it. There is, yeah. It's wild, I think. Oh, man. So much to say about that. Right. As a father, you can be pushed to your max by these kids one day, and in an hour or two later, you want to bless them in ways that are beyond. Right. You want to be the provider for those kids and bless their lives. Right. And we. I think we both kind of want to bless our children as they as they grow older and set them up in certain ways. Right. For success in this life. And isn't. Isn't that the dichotomy of fatherhood, though?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because in order a good father takes both. A good father has to be loving and stern. A good father has to give blessings and punishment.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right. And not in like a fly off the handle and smack your kid with a belt kind of way. More like measured punishment.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But that. That all has to exist within fatherhood, and it exists within God. And we see that he blesses the Israelites, He. He punishes the Israelites. He lets them get taken into slavery. He frees them. He gives them the land. Right. Milk and honey, like over and over and over again. The Bible is just. Is telling these stories, but those stories are completely applicable to our lives personally, our lives at large and our. Our family structure as well.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

That wild. Yeah, dude.

[A]

That.

[B]

The book. This book. This book is unlike any other book.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In that it's alive.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And because the Holy Spirit is working in the lives of believers, the. The things written on this page are not just words. This is life. This is life.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wild, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'm so happy. I had a dad that instilled that into me. Funny, my dad had a terrible voice, and he passed that along to me. I'm tone deaf, man. I can't sing. And one of the distinct memories I have in church is my dad was always in church and he was always singing praise songs, but he never actually sang the words. He just mouthed. He would mouth the words because he was such a bad singer. He didn't want other people to be distracted by how bad his singing was. And so he would just mouth. He would stand up and sing for every praise song, but no sound would come out of his mouth. He would just mouth the words every time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I thought that was just always so funny to watch. And I think now if you ever see me in church, I'll be singing sometimes, but ain't no sound coming out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So. Thanks, Pop.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Just to. Just to hang out there for a second. This. It's funny. We. We kind of. We moved really, in the middle of COVID to San Antonio, and then church kind of normalized a little bit after. But I don't know, for the last couple years, we've gone through spurts of, like, going to church very regularly, and then, you know, we just kind of. We get busy in the summer or whatever and we take some time off. But Whitney and I, at the really, kind of towards the end of last year, we committed to, like, hey, we're. Let's double down. We need to. We need to show up to church, you know? And I think growing up Southern Baptist, singing hymns, like, with a piano and an organization in church, the majority of the time, the kind of praise and worship, worship band is something that I never really was exposed to until college. And I have this weird. Like. I have this weird complex. Okay.

[B]

About contemporary worship.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm saying this because I'm. I'm number one. I'm hoping that some other people listening maybe may relate to this. But I also. Look, I. I'm just. I'm literally just bearing my soul on this podcast, kind of. Even if it's embarrassing to me. But, you know, it's something I've been. I've struggled with for a long time, is I see these guys in church who are just singing with reckless abandon, and, you know, they've got their. They've got their hands up, or they've got one hand up, you know, And I've never been comfortable doing that, because growing up, it was very, stand up straight. You're holding the hymnal, everybody's reading, you know? And here lately, I'm. I'm kind of slowly dipping my toe in the water. Right. And, dude, I got to be honest with you, I know that in church, it's not about me, and everybody else is just worried about what other people are thinking about them, and it's just all in my own mind. But, man, just. It's so silly how. Just kind of even just, you know, raising one hand, like, partially up, Taking my hand out of my pocket, the

[B]

small hand up, or this. This little move.

[A]

Is he just gonna do this just right? Yeah, right.

[B]

That's right. That's super safe right here, bro.

[A]

Super. Yeah.

[B]

If you don't want to go here, because if you get higher in the shoulders, you're Pentecostal, and you can watch out.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it's. I mean, yeah, I.

[B]

It's funny, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But isn't it funny, though? Like, as we get older. You know what? It's funny. As we get older, I think we care less and less what people think.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I think we realize that no one's paying attention to you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

When you're young, you think everybody's looking at you. Everybody's watching every move. You're trying to be so cool. You're trying to do all the right things.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then in your 20s, you really don't Care you kind of like, I don't care what anybody thinks. In your 30s, you in your 40s, it starts to dawn on you that no one's watching you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It doesn't really matter what you do. It's. It's vertical. It's not horizontal.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

And it's funny. Our church was pretty buttoned up growing up. It wasn't Baptist. It was a. It's a congregational church, but a lot of hymns. And then at some point in like, the early 90s, late 80s, early 90s, they started throwing some guitar. A little wild. A little wild acoustic and, you know, and people started to express themselves in. In praise a little bit more. And so I actually. I'm like, right in the middle. I'm kind of with you. Like, I don't. Two hands in the air. Hi. I'm not sure about that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But, you know, I'll do the. I'll do like a little half posture right here sometimes. Yeah. Funny.

[A]

It's. It's something I'm working on, though. Like, you right. Wrong. It doesn't matter. It's not. One way is right, not right. One way is not wrong. But I just kind of have it in my mind that, like, this shouldn't be as uncomfortable as it is, and I'm leaning into it a little bit. That's just where I am in life.

[B]

You want to do something funny? A little experiment. When you're singing praise and worship, if your kids happen to be in service with you, if you raise your hands and start praising God, if you look over, your kids will start to mimic what you're doing.

[A]

Oh, dude.

[B]

I remember. I remember distinctly. We were at church in la. It was at. Might have been at, like, Fellowship or Calvary Chapel. Like, I don't remember where we were, but we were singing praise and worship. Actually was kind of going about the shoulder height with the hands up. And I was singing, and I look over and I see my kids, and they were mirroring exactly what I was doing. Praising God.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And isn't that interesting how they're watching every move and they will mimic what you do in all things. If you are worshiping God and living your life for Jesus, they will mimic that as well. If you are living a life where you're being selfish and you're being unkind or whatever, if you're living in a life of sin, they will mimic that as well.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I think. I think it's important as a father to remember that you were being watched.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Every. Every waking moment. They have in there around you. They might not be directly looking at you, but they are watching everything you do.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think it's so important because I was watching my dad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And now I see my kids watching me. And I remember my dad,

[A]

he.

[B]

He lived life like no one was watching. And it didn't matter who was around. He would do whatever he wanted to do. My dad. My dad was really good attorney. Yeah. He was a personal injury attorney, and he helped a lot of people. I mean, my dad actually, he wasn't one of, like, those ambulance chasers. My dad took cases where people had been genuinely wronged and he wanted to right the wrong and take care of folks. And my dad would. My dad dressed really well, you know, nice suits. He had to go to court all the time. And even as with that, you know, the fine linens that my dad had, he would be so quick. It didn't matter who was around, he'd be so quick to give it to somebody.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, and just. Just. I mean, he would. He would literally. He would literally give people suits.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, and they weren't cheap. They were from a really nice suit shop. But, you know, if he saw somebody that needed a suit that was down and out or whatever, he would. He would take care of that person. He'd go buy him clothes, whatever it was, food, whatever.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so again, I saw that. And he didn't do it as performance.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And he didn't do it because people were watching.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, he did. He lived his life as if no one was watching. Just. Just lived it all out for the Lord. And it's funny, my dad left such an impact on the family that we often. So we get together as a family once a year, either for Christmas or for Thanksgiving, and we will have what's called the. The Olympics, but we'll put our family name in it, and we call it the. The Olympics. Fiscal Olympics.

[A]

Right. Yeah.

[B]

And do you know what the prize is for the family that wins the school Olympics for the year? What?

[A]

Oh, you brought. You brought another prop.

[B]

I did. Okay. So for those of you that are listening, audio only. This is an air raid siren from Vietnam. This was my dad's air raid siren from Vietnam. And this is the prize that we passed back and forth to the family that won the school Olympics. My dad's impact on us was so substantial that we have something from his life that he brought back from. From the war. And he used to, actually, when we were young and running around the neighborhood in SoCal. We had a small. It was a cool neighborhood we grew up in called Lower Rancho in. And. And you could hear this air raid siren for blocks.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And most of us had friends that live within a few blocks away. So if we were ever gone, my dad would actually come outside, crank the siren, and I would know it was time to come home because he didn't know where we were. Could be at the baseball field. We could be at my friend Bobby's house.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But he'd crank this siren, and that would be the sign to know that our dad was calling us. And so this air raid siren is. This is the prize. This is the. This is the thing that matters most to the family. And we actually compete really hard. There's physical challenges, there's mental challenges. There's puzzles, there's brain games, there's balance. You name it. We make these things so elaborately. It's like a four to five hour. It can be a four to five hour, like Olympic, with probably 10 different events. And we will go so hard to win this.

[A]

That's amazing.

[B]

And I got it this last year, but, hey, so I fought tooth and nail for it.

[A]

You. You spun that thing up the other day when I was at your house. I did. Look for. For the folks that are just listening, you got to give it a little spin. I'm gonna mute my mic.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Just. Just give. Just. Just a little. Let's see what happens. Everybody who's listening, just prepare. We're gonna spin this thing up for a second.

[B]

It's really difficult to spin it up. Hold on. Sorry about that.

[A]

We probably just ran some folks off the road if they're listening to this in their vehicles.

[B]

So I think when you came over to the house, my daughter was upstairs, still sleeping, and I decided that instead of walking up the stairs to wake her up, we were just gonna have a little air raid siren happen. And, you know, bombs incoming.

[A]

Yeah. So, dude, that's incredible.

[B]

That's a prize possession, man. I've got my.

[A]

I didn't know that you won that in the school Olympics.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. And it gets passed around from family to family, depending on who wins.

[A]

Man, that's so cool.

[B]

But I've got my dad's, like, memorabilia around my house. I've got his American flag. I've got his uniform, his military uniforms.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I've got. I've got a couple of hats I used to have. Actually, I still have it. I've got a blanket that he took with him to Vietnam. And growing up, I loved everything Army I wanted to be a soldier like my dad so bad, dude. My room was decked out and like camouflage. I had gi. I would have. I would, I would. I would stage large scale ground conflicts with all my GI Joes outside in the backyard side yard. I'd flood the planter so it'd be muddy. You know, they were in the jungle, obviously, because I was essentially playing my dad. Right. And I would. I would stage full scale battles. I mean, people were missing limbs. I mean, I think I broke planes and tanks. I just destroy them.

[A]

Super messed up. But you know the kid in a famous Pixar movie that I'm thinking of right now?

[B]

Which one?

[A]

Oh, Sid, the one from Toy Story.

[B]

I might have actually blown a few up with M80s. Listen, we live near the border. We'd go down, grab M. 80s, come across from Tijuana and. And I would blow stuff up in the yard. But I would, I would stage these large scale battles.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And every time I played, I was my dad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Dude, isn't that something?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

My character was always my dad. He would always save the day.

[A]

He.

[B]

He would get. He'd get. He'd get battered.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But he'd always come through and save the day, dude.

[A]

So I. I snapped a picture of it, but the first day when you came over to record the podcast.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm. I'm saying this because just to piggyback on what you're saying about how much your kids watch you. A couple days after you were here, I went upstairs and keep in mind, I mean, the girls are 8 and 11, so they're not like really young anymore. And I went up there and they had, in the corner, they had set up a podcast studio. And on the chalkboard it said, welcome to our podcast.

[B]

I love that.

[A]

You know, And I actually snapped a picture. I've got it on my phone. I snapped a picture of that chalkboard because in that moment, to your point, I was just floored at how much you just take for granted how much your kids pay attention to what you're doing. I really, I mean, is just. Then that extends. Something else I've been thinking a lot about lately is Whitney and I have been trying to be healthier, not like crash diet and, you know, all of those things. But we've been exercising together a lot, which for all the husbands out there, if you've ever tried to work out with your wife, it is incredibly hard.

[B]

So ridiculously hard.

[A]

It's so ridiculous. Like. But here's what I would say. It went really terribly for us, like, the first five or six times we worked out together, because on one hand, I had to understand and learn that she is not my dude, bro in the gym. She doesn't want to be hyped up. She doesn't want me to slap her on the shoulders before she squats. Okay. That's not lightweight, baby. Yeah. The Ronnie Coleman sayings went right. Right over her head. She didn't understand. Right. And she also had to learn me a little bit that I do want some of that, you know? And I. Let me tell you something. When your gym bro in the gym looks at you and says, come on, get one more. Get one more. Just get one more rep. Get one more. Right?

[B]

Yeah, for sure.

[A]

That motivates you. When it's. When it's your gym, bro.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But when it's your wife and she's looking at you like, you weak, man.

[B]

You weak, man.

[A]

Get one more rep. You can't. Right? I'm gonna tell you, I've never experienced motivation like that in my entire life. So, you know, all jokes aside, I. I said. Sorry, I went on a weird tangent there, but the reason I was saying that is because. I didn't necessarily grow up in a family where fitness was a big deal. I would say largely, my parents were healthy as. As much as you can be, with my mom having genetic heart disease and breast cancer and all the things.

[B]

Were they active?

[A]

Very active, but not in a. Not in a fitness sense. But it was working on the yard. Working on. Sure, right. Like busy, busy weed eating.

[B]

There's a difference.

[A]

Cut. Cutting the. Mowing the lawn, doing the things. And something that my parents did always do is they always went for walks, which, as a kid was the craziest thing to me because it felt like they just walked forever. But what I've noticed is because we've been interested in being healthier and we've been working out together, and the girls have gotten to watch us do that. They're starting. We're not coaching them. I mean, they're. They're. They're still young enough. Their metabolisms are so. They pretty much eat whatever they want, but.

[B]

So unfair.

[A]

But I've noticed they're starting to pay attention to those things, and they're starting to. I'll look out in the backyard, and one of them will be out there doing jumper jacks, you know, and so this is super random. This is probably one of the most obvious things we've ever said here. But I think it was. I think it was James that said this, too. Your kids live in the culture that you create.

[B]

That's right. He said that, right? Yep.

[A]

And that culture, just like listening to you talk about your dad, don't take that lightly because that culture extends. That culture extends far beyond emotional and psychological safety. That culture extends beyond just your faith. That culture extends to how do you take care of yourself, how do you love your wife, how do you love your spouse? How do you celebrate birthdays? How do you celebrate holidays? Like, man, when James said that, dude, that is just permanently etched in my brain.

[B]

Isn't that something? Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

By the way, happy Valentine's Day.

[A]

Oh, it is Valentine's Day.

[B]

Glad I'm staring at you lovingly.

[A]

I wore. I had a pink shirt on and I took it off, cuz I, I was just worried about wearing pink. But you.

[B]

Oh, I got a red belt on too, to match. Don't you worry, guys. I'm coordinated.

[A]

I love it.

[B]

Thank you. Yeah. But, yeah, they, they. It's funny. They're. They're watching us show up for their mom on Valentine's Day. We have daughters. You have daughters. So I got my wife a. A kind of a nice gift for Valentine's Day. And the first thing she did was show it to the girls and they're like. And so, you know, you're. You're teaching them what to expect. Yeah. Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think we touched on this last time. It's like, I date my daughters.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I want them to look for someone that will love them the way I love them. And if you can set those expectations where they have those expectations now, anybody that falls short of that expectation.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right. I mean, I hate to say this. I'm going to stack the deck in my daughter's favor. I want, I want to do. To come through and just be stellar. And I, you know, I look back on my. My marriage and the mistakes I made as a young man. We got married. I was 27. She was 25. I think 20, 24. And I made so many mistakes, dude, in my brokenness, in my selfishness. And so, you know, there's no time to make up for the past, but you can do better in the future.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that's all you have. If you, if you, if you go back and you spend so much time in the past, you end up living in a place of regret. And you're almost. You're holding yourself hostage in that place and you're not forgiving yourself and allowing yourself to move on and to be better because you're so fixated on what you did wrong. Yeah. Isn't that something? I think that's a key to marriage is ask for forgiveness quickly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Acknowledge the mistakes you've made. Don't live in. Don't live in it. Be better. Be better today. And you can't be better moving forward if you're always looking behind you.

[A]

Yeah, I. I'm so excited to have Randy come back because we. We talked a lot about the difference between guilt and shame and just listening to you talk. I've actually, over the last couple weeks, I've had quite a few people reach out who've been listening to the podcast and have said some very encouraging things. And I've been struggling the last couple weeks with just a lot of self doubt about this thing because I don't know if I'm doing it right. I don't know if, you know, this is content that people care about. You know, I mean, how the devil just sneaks in.

[B]

Oh, yeah, bro.

[A]

But I've had. I had a couple of really strong words of encouragement this week, which was exactly what I needed to hear, but something that I want to make sure that is a constant thread throughout this is. I've said it a few times already. It's not about perfection. It's about direction. And specifically based on a couple of the conversations that I had this past week, I. I want it to just be abundantly clear that you are only one decision away from changing the trajectory of what's going on. Like, I could see how when we. When you listen, how you could start to think, oh, my gosh, I've messed this up so bad. Oh, my gosh, I'm not doing this right, dude, trust me. That's what every single one of these podcasts has been for me. I walk away from this table and I think to myself, oh, dude, you were screwing this up so bad.

[B]

Right? Sure.

[A]

But there's hope, dude. Literally, when you listen to this, just leave the conversation and just make one decision that starts you down the down a new path. Ask for forgiveness for that thing that you should have asked for forgiveness for a long time ago. We talked about with Randy last week about dads. There is no statute of limitations on going back and asking for forgiveness and telling your kids you're sorry for something that you've screwed up. Don't delay. Do it.

[B]

That's so funny you say that, dude. I just remembered something a couple days ago where I snapped it. My middle daughter, Evie. And she's got the sweetest heart, dude. Like, dude, Evie is just such A she. She is such a love bomb. Right. But, like, I did something. I got mad at her at a restaurant. It was just a random thought, but I got mad at her at a restaurant, and I was so harsh with her with my words, and I was literally thinking about this, like, a couple days ago. I'm like, man, I really want to go back and approach her and apologize for that thing that I remembered that happened five years ago, you know, And. And it was just on my mind, and it was just. I think that's to your point. Like, when you get that feeling, go do it. Like, don't. Don't sit. Let it sit. And Brandy is so wise, dude. Randy is such a. He's just an absolute Niagara Falls of wisdom, you know?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But, yeah, there is no statute of limitations on. On saying sorry. I think something I do is I try to give as many hugs as. I love hugs, man. I think hugs are. Are they conveyed, you know, just love and support. And so I try to hug my girls at least once a day. And I travel a lot, so I. Every time I get home, I walk around the house, and I'll find each kid and I'll give them a hug and a kiss and just say, hey, I missed you. You know, because one day, they're not going to be in the house when I show up. They're not going to be there. They're going to be gone. And I won't have the opportunity to do that. So I'm going to steal all the hugs I can right now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Till I'm unable to.

[A]

I want to tell you something that's funny. The first time you and I sat down, I told you the story about. I wasn't quite as honest with it last time, but spilling a beer when we were working on the furniture upstairs

[B]

on the carpet that was getting thrown away anyway.

[A]

Yeah. So I. This is just. This is one of the ways that the podcast is working on me, but I want to. I want to connect a couple things that have happened.

[B]

Please do.

[A]

Was talking to Randy last week about the development of kids in. Kids who. The impact we have on parents, on how our kids experience guilt and shame from the standpoint of. Let me. Let me just tell you the story. Gray and I, two or three weeks ago. Well, a month and a half. Two months ago, Gray, out of the blue, calls and says, hey, I'm about to buy tickets to a very small Coulter Wall concert.

[B]

He told me. Yeah, such a good dude, by the way.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Gray's such a good dude.

[A]

Yeah. And he Was like, it's a pop up concert. It's gonna be at the country store out just outside of San Antonio. And do you want to go just me and you? I was like, colder wall, small concert. Absolutely. The tickets were 50 bucks a piece. Just unbelievable for, for this guy. So, you know, Gray and I get nice and dressed up western and we're going on a man date out to see Colter Wall, which was fantastic.

[B]

Did you buy or did he buy? I just want to know what the structure is.

[A]

He bought the tickets. He bought the tickets. I bought the dinner.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But we sit down at the Mexican food restaurant before we go to the concert. And within 30 seconds of sitting down, I get a big glass of tea. And I spilled the tea, like all over the table. It got on my pants and a little bit got on Gray too. And Gray's response was the most even keel. It's not a big deal. Don't worry about it. And I was mortified. And dude, I'm really close. Like, I've done stupider stuff with Gray. But I, I just. And here's what's funny. After talking with Randy last week about how you experience events like that as a kid and how it impacts you as an adult. I have not spilled a drink like that at a table in probably 15 years. And when I spilled the drink at the table, I had flashbacks to being a kid and spilling a drink and, you know, having dad or mom get upset with me. Maybe not upset with me, just upset about the commotion of being in a public place and spilling a drink. Right.

[B]

Clean up, cleanup, all the eyeballs dart over to the table.

[A]

Exactly. Yeah. And what's funny is I just, I just. Like this past week I've thought about this whole circumstance because spills are not a big deal to dads. Spills are the biggest freaking deal on the planet. Or they can be. You know, And I. I just had an opportunity to reflect on what was going on in my heart after I spilled the drink at the table with Gray. And I saw his reaction, which was the calmest, coolest, collected. This is not a big deal. Let's just clean it up and then never say a word about it again. But for like the next 20 minutes of me sitting at the table, I'm sitting there thinking like, you are such an idiot. I cannot believe that you just spilled your drink. What's wrong with you? Like, you haven't done that in forever. All of these things, right? And I guess where I'm going with this is just. I just wanted to maybe Like a very tactical thing for dads, if you're listening, is think about yourself and the response that you got from your parents when you were growing up and think about the way that you react when your kids make the same mistakes today. Because I had an opportunity to do that over the last couple of weeks and it was very, very sobering for me. And it's really hard in the moment to wrangle the emotion of being frustrated when something like that happens. But it was just incredibly convicting for me because I. I felt like at the table with Gray what I felt like when I was 10 years old and I spilled a drink. And so I. Sorry. That. That took me a really long time to say, dude. I just. I just needed to throw that out there.

[B]

I think this is great. This is actually a new segment on the to dad from dad podcast and this is called Tactical Dad Advice.

[A]

There you go.

[B]

Right. And this week's lesson is this. Don't major in the minors.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Tactical advice for dads. Don't major in the minors. Because if you make everything a big deal, nothing's a big deal. Yeah.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Right? Yeah. By the way, it's funny you say that. Growing up we would. Big family, five kids, we would all sit down for dinner together and almost every night somebody spilled a drink. Almost every night because you had. Age ranges from my little sister all the way to my oldest sister. And there was probably a. Oh, golly, man. It must have been like a 15 year gap. Not a 15 year gap, maybe like a 12, 13 year gap in between all of us. So you had all these different kids at all these different stages of life and somebody was always spilling something because it was such a large family. We had a huge table and all the foods on the table and we're reaching to grab things. And dude, almost once a night somebody would knock over a glass. And I think we did it so often that my parents just stopped caring. And my dad actually would come to the table. My dad would come to the table with a rag over his shoulder and just sit there, sit there. He would be ready and wait for this fill to happen, man. Yeah, funny.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think the tactical. Tactical dad advice is don't major in the minors. And I think that's so huge because keep it all in perspective. Yeah. You know, there's going to be bigger screw ups in life that your kids are going to have bigger obstacles to face. Don't make the small ones so big where it's not safe for your kids to come to you.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Right. You Want your kids to come to you when they make a big mistake?

[A]

Man, we talked about that last time.

[B]

We did.

[A]

And, dude, that's something I am working on hard right now.

[B]

Yeah. Isn't it funny? You need to create that space with your children so that you are their first phone call.

[A]

But, dude, I think spilled drinks, spilled snacks. I've talked about the broken banister upstairs last week, the cracked drywall. Whatever it is, man, it's. It's how you react in those moments, I think, that ultimately culminate in the culture of am I psychologically safe here? Is it okay to make mistakes in this house? And the little things are the easiest. They're the ones that you're going to have the most opportunities to react to in the right way. Right. Like, if you really think about it, the smallest mistakes are the ones that are going to happen the most often, which means it's the ones that you have the most opportunities to respond to with grace and love and patience. Right?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Don't major in the minors. You're exactly. You're exactly right. And I think as I. As. After we first talked, I thought to myself, I'm hunting for whales. I'm looking for, when is the next big thing going to come up so that I can create this very safe space? That's unrealistic, dude. You know, there's a great story.

[B]

Can I tell you? Okay. And I'll close it with this. And I'm sorry if I. If you guys hear me ramble a bunch, I apologize. But as.

[A]

As.

[B]

As Lee said, I talk fast. So mom and this dad sit down, and they have. They have their very first daughter. And the dad says, okay, here's what we're going to do. Here's the plan. I'm gonna. I'm gonna help guide her in all the big decisions in life, and you're gonna help guide her in all the small decisions in life. And that's how we're gonna split up the parenting. I'll take all the big stuff, you take all the small stuff. And the dad was never once consulted on a decision because our life is just a series of small little teaching moments. Yeah, that's what. That's what it comes down to.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

It's not a great story, but it's a story. Yeah, but it just kind of drives home the point of every single day there's an opportunity, and it might be something super benign where your daughter comes home from school and she says, you know, my kids will say, pop, will you go for a walk with me? Down to the park. I don't want to do that, man. I'm tired. I've got my work clothes on. I'm, you know, sweating through them all day. I've been hauling lasers around Texas like I'm exhausted.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The park is not. The park is not the point.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

The point is time.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Spend that time with me, Pop.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

You know, and I can say yes.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Or I can say no, because I want to sit on the couch and I want to hammer out some YouTube and doom scroll for a while.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Or when. When my little one says, will you. Will you lay down with me for bed?

[A]

Yep.

[B]

I'm on the clock.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

And pretty soon, probably in the next year, I'm not going to get that request anymore.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

So do I want to go downstairs, pour myself a double and watch some sports, or do I want to take five minutes, lay down, tell her a story, give her a tickle, give her a kiss, pray over, and then, you know, she'll be out?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So that's it.

[A]

Yeah, I. This is. Yeah, we'll. We'll wrap up here. One. One thing I wanted to. Again, just trying to be transparent with everybody listening about stuff going on with me and the kids. I had a. I had to work from home yesterday. Whitney had in service at the school, and I had wall to wall virtual meetings from 8 to noon, and then from 1 to about 4. So I had a break for an hour. And Kenna went over to Lolly's house for the Galen. And so it was just me and Cali here for. For four or five hours. And when I got off the call at like 11:50, I went out and I said, hey, let's eat some lunch, make you grilled cheese sandwich. And she had been upstairs for like an hour doing something. I don't know what she was doing up in the playroom.

[B]

She was recording a podcast.

[A]

She was. Yeah. And so she comes down and she says, hey, are you done working? And I said, no, I have to get on another call at 1. And she said, so you. How long do you have for lunch? And I said, I have an hour. And she said, okay, if we eat our sandwiches really fast, can you ups. Can you come upstairs and play with me until you have to be on your next call? And I was like, this is not what I want to do. I've been. Been getting my brain scrambled for four hours, and I've got to do it again this afternoon, you know?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

But I went upstairs, we. I made her a grilled cheese Sandwich. I ate a ham sandwich. Like 10 minutes. I'm upstairs. We've got like 45 minutes left. And what she was doing upstairs was setting up the checkerboard. And she. She made like this little seating area for us because she wanted to play checkers. And. And so, dude, I went up there and I sat crisscross applesauce, which, by the way, is way harder than it should be. I need to work.

[B]

Super. Your flexibility. And mine is in the toilet.

[A]

Yeah. So I sat crisscross applesauce for 40 minutes upstairs and played checkers with an 8 year old on my lunch break. And there were several moments while I was up there where, because of this. Because of what we're doing here, because of this podcast, I got to be honest with you, I would not have done that two months ago. But more importantly than that, I would not have valued it as much as I did in the moment because there were several times where I was very uncomfortable. Crisscross applesauce playing checkers with an 8 year old. But I had the conscious thought of what an amazing blessing it is for me to be sitting right here where I'm sitting right now, doing exactly what I'm doing with my daughter.

[B]

Pause. Yeah, go back. She was upstairs preparing.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

She had put thought into it. She made a seating area. She set up the board. Did she put the pieces on the board?

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Yeah. So she was preparing and hoping you would say yes. And she put time and effort and love into creating a space in a setting where you and her could just connect. And we miss those times all the time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

They're begging for it, dude. Our daughters are begging for our attention, for our love.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

We're the biggest thing in the world to them, and we are so flippant sometimes with it.

[A]

Oh, man. I just. Listening to you say that right now, I. I can guarantee you there have been ten, twenty, a hundred times. I don't. I don't even know where one of them has probably done exactly that and came down and said, hey, can you come upstairs for a minute? Or hey, can you come play with us upstairs? And not even thinking about it, I

[B]

was like, shut down.

[A]

I don't. I can't. I don't. I've got stuff to do. I can't do it. And they would never say, hey, I spent all this time setting this thing up. Right. Dude, you want to talk about just. That's just devastating to think about. Right?

[B]

But you. But see, here's the cool thing. You said yes, and then you got to experience that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it fulfilled something in her that she was. Was desperately longing for.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And we miss those moments a lot. Yeah, I know I do.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

But isn't that cool that you actually said yes and was able. You were. You were able to meet her in that space.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And pour into her.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. So, man, I mean, my word of encouragement there is just. I've said this before. I. And I. I will make everybody listening a guarantee. And that guarantee is you will never get to the end of your life on your deathbed and think to yourself, I wish I had watched more YouTube. I wish I had scrolled Instagram some more. I wish I had scrolled Facebook some more.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I guarantee what you will do is you will say, I wish I had more time with my family. I wish I had more time with my kids. And that's something we're going to keep harping on.

[B]

Yeah. One last thing. I want to make two call outs. Number one, Crothers said by the time his kid was like. Was it 18?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He'd spent 95 or 99 of all the time he's gonna spend with him.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

And then the other one was what Gray said in his episode, which was, I don't ever want to make my kid feel like they're a burden to me. Yeah. And I think there was some stories about how his dad was. Him and Han haven't puffing about having to come pick him up, and with grand with him and his daughter that doesn't live in town, about picking her up. And everyone never feel like that. And I think when our kids engage us and ask us to engage with them in those sweet ways that your little one did, saying yes immediately takes that. Them feeling like a burden to you off the table, and you're happy to spend that time. And I think that's the takeaway.

[A]

Yes. Say yes, man. And, you know, just to add to that, don't squander the opportunity, because I think a lot of times as dads, what we do is we ultimately end up agreeing to do the thing, but the hesitation, the. The behavior that's going to make the kids feel like it was a burden. It's. You've already the damn. I don't want to say it, but it. I feel like the damage is done.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, it's the reaction. It's the initial reaction. And look, if you're going to go outside and play with them or if you're going to sit upstairs and play checkers, if you're going to do it anyways. Just consider the fact that the reaction when you. When they ask you for it is ultimately what's going to kind of set the tone, whether or not they feel like they're a burden or you're put out.

[B]

That's right. You might do the thing begrudgingly.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But you might as well have done it.

[A]

Not at all, man. I hate to say that, but I. I mean. I mean that in the most encouraging way possible, because I just don't think we realize, like, you're robbing yourself of the opportunity to just say, you know what? I would love to go do that thing with you. And then go do it. And then. And then if it's. And then if you really don't want to be there, freaking suck it up. And don't, you know, just put a smile on your face, because that's all your kids want is your time, you know?

[B]

So, bro, like. And subscribe.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Solid.

[A]

Yeah. Well, hey, thanks for being here. We will do this again. And just. Just an update for those listening. We are going on. We're gonna. We've got a weekend lined up here in a couple weeks to get a handful of these episodes recorded with some very, very important men in my life from our chapter before we moved to San Antonio. Some folks that really poured into Whitney and I before we had kids who are now grandfathers. So we've got a couple. Couple of those coming up. We've got some folks coming up who have got some larger families, you know, four or five kids running around. We've got some folks coming on who have struggled with infertility and then ultimately adoption. So, man, just appreciate everybody for. Who's listening. Pete, appreciate you for being here.

[B]

Happy to do it.

[A]

Being such a rock solid dude. My life.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

We will. We'll have you back on again soon.

[B]

I love it, man. I appreciate it, brother.

[A]

All right, brother. See you.

[B]

Bye,

[A]

Sam.