The HIDDEN Genius Behind the Revolution | TMT 184

Summary

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Too Many Tabs with Pearlmania500

Episode 184 – The HIDDEN Genius Behind the Revolution

Date: July 5, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this spirited and hilarious installment of "Too Many Tabs," husband and wife duo Pearlmania500 (Host 1/Ryan) and Mrs. P (Host 2) celebrate the U.S. semiquincentennial (250th anniversary) with a deep dive into the life, works, and seismic impact of Thomas Paine—a founding father often overlooked in mainstream history. The episode explores how Paine, a poor English corset maker-turned-pamphleteer, inspired a revolution, angered the transatlantic elite, revolutionized the very idea of rights and democracy, and was both celebrated and condemned in his lifetime.

With characteristic humor, incisive commentary, and modern parallels, the hosts trace Paine's improbable rise, his fiery political work, the viral sensation of Common Sense, and how his radicalism got him cast aside by the very movement he helped create.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Do So Few Know Thomas Paine? (04:38–05:57)

• Paine’s Iconoclasm: Paine was infamous for alienating "every rich person he ever met on both sides of the Atlantic," later going on to insult George Washington, Jesus Christ, and various religions. After his death, only six people attended his funeral and his bones were eventually stolen and lost.
• Notable Quote:

  "He pissed off every rich person he ever met on both sides of the Atlantic. ... He then insulted George Washington, Jesus Christ, and every religion in the world, was nearly murdered by the French Revolution, only to return to America and only have six people attend his funeral. And then his bones were stolen and lost."
  — Host 1 (04:46)

2. Paine’s Early Life & Bad Luck in Business (05:57–14:25)

• Origins: Born to a Quaker corset maker in England, Paine was trained in the trade but failed in business multiple times. He briefly served as a privateer (state sanctioned pirate), but avoided disaster, often by chance.
• Recurrent Misfortune:

  "He gets married, his business folds immediately. And then his wife died in childbirth."
  — Host 1 (11:36)

• Notable Digression: Modern American parallels are drawn:

  "He became an excise officer. Everybody hates him. ... It's like that parking war show. Everybody curses out the parking meter maid."
  — Mrs. P (12:23–12:36)

3. Pamphlets as Colonial Social Media (13:14–19:35)

• Pamphlets of the era were likened to "the TikTok or maybe the YouTube essay of their day" (04:11). Paine learned to write with radical clarity and accessibility—the opposite of elite, opaque language.
• Exposing Injustice: Paine’s first official pamphlet was for unionizing excise officers, which got him fired (19:35–19:53).

4. From Poverty to Revolution: Meeting Benjamin Franklin (21:44–24:39)

• After losing his job and family, Paine meets Benjamin Franklin in London, who recognizes Paine’s talent and arranges for him to immigrate to Philadelphia with a letter of recommendation ("the old background check").

5. Paine Reinvents Colonial Journalism (27:48–32:15)

• Pennsylvania Magazine: Paine's plain, direct, and populist style as editor makes the magazine a runaway success. He writes about workers' rights and publishes one of the first American abolitionist articles.
• Quote:

  "Tom Paine writes in plain language and doesn't care about rich people. ...Why don't we just write for normal people? There's more of them.”
  — Host 1 (29:05)

6. Common Sense – The Viral Pamphlet that Changed Everything (32:12–68:07)

• Triggering Revolution: With the outbreak of war (Lexington and Concord), Paine synthesizes decades of elite arguments into a four-part, 47-page pamphlet readable by “normal people, aloud in taverns to people who were hammered” (37:13).
• Massive Impact: 500,000 copies sell among the 2.5 million in the colonies—"like a DVD of Finding Nemo in 2004" (38:19–38:28).
• Key Arguments:
  • Society is a blessing; government “even in its best state, is but a necessary evil” (38:48–39:23)
  • Mocks hereditary monarchy as “a principal ruffian of some restless gang” (49:52)
  • England’s claim as “mother country” is “farcical”—America’s parent is Europe; calls for independence and neutrality (54:45)
  • The simplest argument:

    “There’s something very absurd in supposing a continent can be perpetually governed by an island.”
    — Host 1 quoting Paine (61:16)

• Common Sense’s Effect: It radicalizes the masses, makes reconciliation unthinkable, and arguably forces the hands of elites in the Continental Congress.
• Notable Quote:

  “He writes the way we talk today. ... He’s like, ‘no, such a power could not be the gift of a wise people. Neither can any power which needs checking be from God. You can't check what is God?' Bars.”
  — Host 1 and Mrs. P (46:24–46:51)

7. Pamphlet Wars and Backlash (68:45–76:08)

• Pushback: Conservatives and Loyalists produce counter-pamphlets like "Plain Truth." John Adams writes "Thoughts on Government," objecting to what he sees as Paine's lack of checks and balances.
• Adams’s Wife Abigail LOVED Paine:

  "Mine you—Common Sense was written anonymously… Abigail kept written to John like, yo, who the wrote that? Yo, can you find out who wrote that? I bet whoever wrote that's really cool."
  — Host 1 (71:24–71:38)

8. Paine Names the United States of America (76:30–77:46)

• He’s possibly the first to print the phrase in an article—ensuring a legacy in American nomenclature.

9. Paine’s War Contribution: The American Crisis (78:49–84:09)

• Paine inspires troops with “These are the times that try men’s souls…” (79:42). His pamphlets, read aloud before the famous crossing of the Delaware, play a crucial role in American morale and eventual victory.
• Quote:

  "These are the times that try men's souls…"
  — Host 1 quoting Paine (79:42)

10. Post-War: Broke, Pissed-Off Rich People, and More Books (87:24–89:54)

• After the war, despite his fame, Paine is left nearly penniless and is denied proper recognition due to burnt bridges with the elite.
• Gets a Farm: “They gave him a farm in New Rochelle, New York” (90:07).

11. The Rights of Man & The Age of Reason: Fighting for Universal Rights (95:56–111:49)

• Rights of Man: Paine’s response to conservative Edmund Burke, advocating a welfare state, free education, social security, and the end of hereditary power, selling a million copies versus Burke’s 30,000.

  “If to expose the fraud and imposition of monarchy, to promote universal peace, civilization, commerce, and to break the chains of political superstition and raise degraded man to his proper rank... If these things are libelous, let the name of libel be engraved on my tomb.”
  — Host 1 quoting Paine (100:43–101:08)

• The Age of Reason: Written while imprisoned during the Reign of Terror in France. Declares:

  “I believe in one God and no more... I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, ... the Roman church ... My own mind is my own church... All national institutions of churches ... are human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind and monopolize power and profit.”
  — Host 1 quoting Paine (111:49)

12. Outcast, Death & Legacy (122:12–126:35)

• John Adams’s Judgment:

  “Call it, then, the Age of Pain.”
  — (123:06)

• Death and Aftermath: Paine dies in obscurity in 1809; only six attend his funeral. His bones are later dug up and lost, his memorial vandalized for decades, but his ideas endure—Abraham Lincoln was a fan; Common Sense remains an accessible classic.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Quote | Attribution | |-----------|----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|---------------------------------------------------| | 05:13 | "The more I read this guy's shit, the more I was like, everyone should know about him. ... They made poor people too horny for liberty." | Host 1 (Ryan) | | 38:48 | "Some writers have so confounded society with government as to leave little or no distinction between them. Society is every state a blessing, but government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil." | [Common Sense] read by Host 1 | | 49:52 | "That we should find the first of them nothing better than the principal ruffian of some restless gang whose savage manners or preeminence in subtlety obtained him the title of chief among the plunderers." | Paine via Host 1 | | 61:16 | "There's something very absurd in supposing a continent can be perpetually governed by an island." | Paine via Host 1 | | 79:42 | "These are the times that try men's souls..." | Paine via Host 1 | | 100:43 | "If to expose the fraud and imposition of monarchy ... If these things are libelous, let the name of libel be engraved on my tomb." | Paine via Host 1 | | 111:49 | “I believe in one God and no more... My own mind is my own church... All national institutions of churches ... are human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind and monopolize power and profit.” | Paine, Age of Reason, via Host 1 | | 123:06 | "Call it, then, the Age of Pain." | John Adams, via Host 1 |

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Timeline / Timestamps for Key Segments

• [04:38–05:57] — Introduction to why Paine is forgotten, his legendary outspokenness
• [13:14–19:35] — Paine as proto-union activist, first pamphlets, and first firing
• [21:44–24:39] — Meeting Benjamin Franklin and move to America
• [27:48–32:15] — Editor of Pennsylvania Magazine, rise in American print culture
• [32:12–68:07] — Invention, reception, and arguments of "Common Sense"
• [68:45–76:08] — Pamphlet wars, elite backlash, and political discourse
• [76:30–77:46] — Naming "The United States of America"
• [78:49–84:09] — American Crisis, keeping morale alive in the army
• [95:56–99:30] — Paine vs. Burke, the Rights of Man, the war for rights
• [111:49–114:54] — Imprisonment in France, writing the Age of Reason, cheating the guillotine
• [122:12–123:06] — John Adams calls it the "Age of Pain"
• [124:18–126:35] — Paine’s obscure death, vandalized memory, rediscovery

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Themes & Takeaways

• The Power of Accessible Language: Paine's genius was not only in his arguments, but in his willingness to speak plainly to common people.
• Radicalism and Loneliness: Paine was canonized, then cast out, because he pushed past comfortable boundaries (anti-slavery, anti-hereditary rule, against organized religion).
• Pamphlets as Virality: The pamphlet format was the social media of the 1770s—lightning quick by the standards of the day, memes and all.
• The Fate of Truth-Tellers: Even pivotal truth-tellers pay a high cost for their candor; their enemies build the statues; their friends remain few.
• Modern Parallels: Paine as a “shitposter” of his era; modern political sectionality and forgotten agitators; pamphlet wars as Twitter beef; discourse wars about democracy and rights.

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Final Notes

The hosts recommend "Common Sense" as a surprisingly readable, fast (40 min) and relevant text—"find it for free on Kindle or at your library" (126:35). They end with a salute to radicalism and encourage listeners to check out Mrs. P's ghost hunting video.

Next episode coming July 26.

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Transcript

[Narrator/Advertiser]

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Start your free trial on shopify.com we're on the wrong side of the table, but we're on the right side of history because we're here to tell you about a founding father that you probably haven't heard about. Maybe you heard about a little pamphlet he wrote, but you don't know about all the crazy stuff that this man did. We're entering into the age of Pain today on Too Many Times.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Remember to smile.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Welcome to Too Many Tabs, a podcast where a husband and wife duo sit next to each other at a table. And this time the husband's on the wrong side.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. And you did all the writing.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And I did all the writing and research. And I did everything this week. I know it's been fun for Mrs.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

P. It's been incredible because Mrs. P

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

is getting ready to go on vacation.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I need a vacation.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, we're gonna be off for the next two weeks, so enjoy this episode. And while you're enjoying this episode and then wondering where the next One is, watch Mrs. P's ghost hunting video.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I have a new one. I went to Asbury Park, New Jersey, and a weird marionette puppet might followed me back to the hotel room. I'm going to link it below.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, it's a. It's a really fun girly pop ghost hunting video that was lovingly and incredibly edited by Mr. Third.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Shout out Mr. Third eagle noise.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's right. And we're giving Mr. Third an eagle noise because it is July 4th weekend. At the time we're posting this video, which means it's the 250th anniversary of America. And, God, what the fuck is a dark goddamn anniversary? It is this year.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's really about.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We're having a time. We need to slate the fireworks so that we can brighten up our moods.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's kind of what it is. We do need to cut through darkness with explosions of fireworks, mirth, merriment, and barbecues. But why do we even have a Fourth of July in the first place?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Mrs. P, I think it's because we. We declared independence from the British.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. And why? And who inspired all of that?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, no, I didn't know this was gonna be a quiz. Okay, I'm gonna tell you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Don't worry about it. All right, Don't. I don't want to put your Catholic upbringing and schooling immediately on blast in front of everybody, but. Because I'm going to throw out some names of some founding fathers. Okay, let's see if you know them and these listeners at home. Play. Play along. See if you remember who I'm talking about. Number one.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

If you heard of the name George Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Great wig.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yep. From the money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

All right.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Number two. Thomas Jefferson.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Boo.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay, from the money, he's on the $2 bill.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

All right, what about Alexander Hamilton?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, from the railway show.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's also on the $10 bill. How about Benjamin Franklin, Shout out philly baby.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

$100 bill. But have you ever heard of the. The. A very, very, very famous viral pamphlet or Thomas Paine?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I've never heard of a viral pamphlet in my life. Okay, what does that mean? And who is Thomas Paine? It does sound like a wrestler name.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It does.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Payne.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I bring the pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Thomas Paine.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Thomas Paine was a bankrupt English corset maker who traveled to Philadelphia and anger translated the rage of the 13 original colonies into a revolutionary force. And he was the first person to ever say the name United States of America in print.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, but how do you go bankrupt making corsets?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, so there's. It's. The thing is, he's not really good at business. We're going to get into that a little bit more. But what do you need to know about pamphlets?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, pamphlets. I don't understand.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, they're. Pamphlets are like the TikTok.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or maybe like the YouTube essay of their day.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, so he's. He's. He's looking directly in the camera, alone in a room and making an essay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, he's not looking into A camera. Cameras didn't exist back then. This is from 1776. Oh, yeah.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Okay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's why I said comedy history podcast.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. Talking about 250 years ago.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, all right, that.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Enough with the eagle noises, guys.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I didn't have to do an episode this week. I get to just talk about buttons and noises.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay, so what you need to understand about Thomas Paine is that you have probably never heard of him.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, I don't know. That guy is.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because most people only know about one pamphlet. But what they don't know is that he pissed off basically every rich person that he ever met on both sides of the Atlantic. He then insulted George Washington, Jesus Christ, and every religion in the world, was nearly murdered by the French Revolution, only to return to America and only have six people attend his funeral. And then his bones were stolen and lost.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

This guy sounds pretty cool. I want to be honest.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Fucking rules.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He sounds pretty cool.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The more I read this guy's shit, the more I was like, everyone should know about him. He wrote a bunch of major works. The one that most people hear about in, like, high school is his main pamphlet, Common Sense. But he also wrote American Crisis, the Rights of man, and Age of Reason. All of them were bestsellers of their day. Many of them were banned by multiple governments, including the Chinese government of today. They made poor people too horny for liberty. And as I was reading his stuff, I got a freedom boner that won't be satiated until I fire fireworks over a barbecue. Eagle noises.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, speaking. That was a lot. And I'm very excited to learn more about this man.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes, you should be. Because Thomas Paine was born in Norfolk, England, in 1736 to Joe and Francis.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, Joe and Fran.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, Joe and Fran Payne. No E. Okay. No E. So Thomas Paine spells it

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

with an E. Oh, he added an

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

e. He added the e later.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, boo.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Nobody knows Diva, diva Nobody knows where. Thomas's dad was a Quaker who worked as a stay maker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Let's go. Quakers out the gate.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I know. Always with the Quakers. He was a stay maker. Do you know what that is?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Corset. It's just another word for corset.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, hold on, hold on. His dad had a corset business, and then he failed at it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. He became an apprentice and learned how to make corsets from his dad.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And his dad, like, taught him the ways of the court. He was a practice. Whale bones, all that different stuff, lacing it up. And he was from. This thing is back then, corsets Were for men and women.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, the boys. The boys back then were fancy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They wore bows.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They didn't have a govi capri. The wigs.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So is this a Pride Month episode?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It might still be. We are. There is a lot of makeup involved. So as a boy. All right. He's around the age of, like, 13, 14 years old.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The first true worldwide world war. Worldwide war kicked off.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I didn't want to say world War.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because everyone me will go, oh, like with the German. The Germans were involved, but the sides were mad different.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This was called the Seven Years War.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This is a very, very famous war that most people don't really learn about because it's from, like, a weird period of history that nobody gives a shit about because it's right before capitalism really kicks off in the Industrial Revolution. So most of us in America will learn about the French and Indian War.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Which George Washington is involved. And it's like a fight over, like, the Ohio Valley and some other shit. And it's really about how the British ended up conquering Canada. But at the same time, this is a war of Great Britain and Prussia teaming up against France and Austria with a bunch of other countries involved.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And most of the fighting happens in the colonies, so it truly is. It's like on the Indian subcontinent. It's off the coast of South. South America. It's all over the world. This fighting is happening. And it's over seven years. And young Tommy Paine gets swept up in the fervor. Okay. And he signs that he wants to sign up desperately to join an English privateer ship.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. So he wants to be a little pirate.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, A privateer is a. Is a state sanctioned pirate.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I learned that from that movie with Johnny Depp.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The movie which. Oh, Pirates of the Caribbean. Yes, yes. Privateer. So he wants to sign up for this English privateer ship, and it was specifically a 26 gun ship named Terrible.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Wait, what?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was a boat called Terrible.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's pretty good. That's a pretty good name.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Guess what the name of the captain was.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Captain William Death.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Wait, shut up. So Tommy Payne got on the Terrible boat with Captain Death?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he didn't.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Didn't. Because his dad was like, do not get on that boat.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Bad vibes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You were such a little boy. And literally, ours is asleep right now. I can see him right there.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I got the monitor.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We got the monitor making sure I don't yell him awake. But he basically was like, you're my little angel, baby. I refuse to let you get on that privateer ship with Captain William Death. It's called the Terrible. It's actually a really good thing he didn't because Captain Death died one year into the Seven years War.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the Terrible was captured by the French ship Vengeance.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Vengeance captured Terrible.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They had really cool boat names. This was back when people used to know how to name a. Now they're like, oh, it's the USS Gerald Ford. No. Vengeance Terrible.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

When I get a pontoon boat, can I name it something cool?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Sure.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You can name it Terror. That's fine. He. So Tommy Paine, though, eventually did join a privateer ship.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He did become a sailor.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He was. He served aboard the privateer ship named King of Prussia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Wait, shut the fuck up.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. The King of Prussia is an area in the Philadelphia suburbs.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They just. We filmed our last episode there.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. And our Ellen looking studio we rented. We can't do that again. So now it's 10pm at night and we're filming after the baby went to bed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. And still 90 degrees outside.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's so hot.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, for, you know, King of Prussia is a huge mall.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. It's like the third largest mall, maybe fourth largest mall now in America.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's one of the only malls they close.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Every other mall around us keeps closing and being torn down to build a data center. Yeah. That's why it's hot. But the King of Prussia, for the most part. This was during the Seven years War. There's the King of Prussia at time. The time was Frederick the Great.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And everybody loved him and they thought he was so cool.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Freddy the Great.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Everybody was like. Everybody just kept naming. They're like, the King of Prussia. And so it's just like. It's a name that sticks around. And in fact, I looked it up to make sure.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

King of Prussia, Pennsylvania is named after an in slash tavern.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That was in that town back in like the 1780s, 1790s, and that even some like, Germans marching through. It was actually named King of Prussia because there were German mercenaries that were like, in the area. And they're like, well, maybe they'll drink here if we named it after one of their kings.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Smart.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then we just never dropped it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Going to be a whole town called Fuddruckers over there in like 100 years.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Probably. Almost. Almost definitely. So he joins the King of Prussia ship at the age of 19.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure. Oh, see, he waited till he's 18, then he died.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Dad couldn't tell him she's 19 years old. He goes on basically a four year tour. And at 23, he returns to England.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He finally becomes a master corset maker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Opens his own shop. He gets married, his business folds immediately. And then his wife died in childbirth.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Holy. Dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So he's a broke veteran widower at the age of 25.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I just. Oh, man. Bro.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So then what happened?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He becomes an excise officer.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What's that mean?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Basically he's a customs agent.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Is a custom. So he just looks at passports?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, he charges people tariffs.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, shut.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So like if you're bringing something in on a boat, like across the English Channel, he walks, he goes, hey, what's in there? He's basically a meter mate.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So his job is to like count stuff and be like, oh, okay, how much you bring? You got two bags of wheat. That's. That's a tuppence.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

A tuppence.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I don't know what the amounts were. They had weird numbers back then. It's a shilling, governor. Like that was what he was doing. Type of.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he becomes a excise officer. Now it's a rough job.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Rough job. People might get mad at you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, because everybody's smuggling.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, yeah, because it's like that parking war show. Everybody curses out the parking meter made.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And that one lady has the hairspray.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, she was incredible. Let me tell you something. If you watch Parking wars, the Parking wars episodes that are filmed in Philadelphia, I know almost everybody in those.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I knew. I knew three people who were actually like a focus of it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I know someone who got a DUI on Parking Wars.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I know somebody who had their bike taken and then rode off into the sunset. Their bike was taken because they were caught driving without a license. At the end of the episode, they drive off still with no license. But he got really good at stealing copper from walls.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, hey, tell them about the data centers.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, we're going to tell him. I'm going to Dylan. I'll find you. Okay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So now he's an excise officer.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Everybody hates him. Everybody's smuggling. So he's like chasing smugglers around and everyone's like, you fucking suck. But it's like, it's also not enough money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. So he could be taking bribes. So then he made.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But he's not taking bribes because he's a man of principle. And one of the things that annoys him is that the excise job, the excise officer wage has not been increased in 100 years.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So the minimum wage has not been raised in 100 years.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The minimum wage has not been raised, and so it's a whole thing.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But eventually he gets transferred around and he gets transferred to a town called Lose.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He went to Lose?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Not Lewis, Delaware. No, no, this is Lou's in Sussex. And he gets a room above a tobacco shop.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And eventually, the landlord who owns the room above the tobacco shop and runs the tobacco shop itself, he dies.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Tommy Payne marries the dead landlord's daughter, Elizabeth Olive.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's a weird way to get a wife.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's a very odd way to get her life. But it's also, like, kind of common for. Back then.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was just like, oh, your dad's dead. What you doing with all that property?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I guess you just need someone to take care of all this property for you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So that's what he did.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They got married.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And while he's there, he gets into radical Republicanism.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Radical. So mega stuff.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no, this is. This is good. This is the good type of. Oh, this is like. Think more like Irish Republicanism.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But this is English Republicanism.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

All right?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because this, you have to remember, this is about 100 years after the English Civil War. Okay, well, the second English Civil War, technically the fifth.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It doesn't matter. They've had a bunch of civil wars.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But this is after Oliver Cromwell and those guys and then the Glorious Revolution and others. And so there's still areas of England that were like, ah, things were better when we killed the king. They were. They would just sit around, they'd get hammered. And even the dukes were like. There was, like, a local duke who, like, is royalty. Was like, we should still get rid of all the royals, like, because there's a few of them around there. You know, occasionally you get a couple of them get sprinkled in. You know what I mean? He was like the George Soros of his day. This guy is sitting around, and basically he keeps writing this publication called Letter of Junius.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the thing is, is Letter.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I think that would get good SEO on YouTube.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, it'd be terrible SEO. That's the reason why, like, Thomas Paine isn't going to get good SEO. So I have to call this, like, the.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

The.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The House of Pain.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, House of Pain is that. That is specifically a song. Oh. And I think, like, House of Pain is, like, already buried. There's so many things called the House of Pain.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Of Pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Fine. Common. Common sense come out. Because you said this thing was.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's the name of the book. But Thomas Paine the author of the pamphlet Common Sense. No, we have to go with like the founder that history forgot on purpose because of conspiracy. Dun dun, dun.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hell yeah. That's going to. That's going to slap.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It'll probably do something like. Yeah, or maybe you won't believe that how they buried the name of this founder so you wouldn't know about liberalism.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Exposed. Exposed. Pain and suffering on the terrible boat.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, I'll have to text Phil and ask exactly which. Which ones to use. So anyway, the publication is this group of kind of letters and essays. Letters. Letter of Junius. And the thing is, it's named after Lucius Junius Brutus.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You just said three words that don't make any sense.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

One guy's name.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's his name.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He was a Roman patriot. And Lucius Junius Brutus is the legend. Semi legendary Roman patriot who chased the last Etruscan king out of Rome and founded the Roman Republic.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So these guys, and this is around the time of the 1700s, they're really learning a lot about like the ancient world because, like archeology is being invented.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And they're like, oh, we could dig stuff up and maybe we can like read it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And then they're going to eat all the mummy bones.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, they do that too on the side and they are mummy bones and black people. But that's not. That's a different subject completely. But so they. He's part of this thing where he's writing these letters and he's. He's joining in and he's like starting to write. He's learning how to publicize and we don't know for certain. And he wrote for this. But there's a lot of historians have looked at certain works from this publication and they think this is Thomas Paine because. Has a lot of similarities.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And all of them were using pseudonyms.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it. They didn't want to get caught by the government.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, they're all using fake names. So the same way like right now we all log into the Internet and we go by Pearl Mania 500 or something like this. A lot of these different guys are calling themselves Junius the Duke. Specifically he used Junius because he had already used the pen name Lucius and Brutus. And yes, by the way, Lucius Junius Brutus is related to the same Brutus that killed Caesar.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, perfect.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's like a distant relative. So that's why everybody brought it up when Julius Caesar declared himself dictator.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Dictator for life. It was. They were like, Brutus, come on, like your ancient ancestor. And he's like, guys, come on. Leave me alone. That's my Uncle Julius. He's like, oh, you should be like, fucking.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Come on.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Stab him a little. So that was the whole thing. So Thomas Paine gets super into writing for this. This work. And this is important because the things here. Right. He's writing, are actually treasonous.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And they're seditious. And if this was America, you would be tried and then put in jail for 50 to 100 years for that. Because we now arrest people for passing along zines.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Magazines, magazines, magazine.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's a real thing. That happened, like, 100 years.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Guy got 30 years. Wasn't even at the protest.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Moved a box of magazines, and they said, that's. That's terrorism.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. His girlfriend, I guess. 100 years.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, yeah. Something like that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So. So with that being said, he is working and writing and doing these letters, and he's actually also writing in the publications, defending the fact that some of the publishers have been being stopped from being able to print these letters.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because, again, remember, printing. But not everybody had a printing press.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Not everybody had that Epson printer in the other room that doesn't fucking work.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, Barry Weiss is in charge now, so you can't get anything through the cbs.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, exactly. And so they had to. Giant. Giant. Giant printers. And it took a lot of work and manpower, and it cost money. And so that was how this guy was printing as part of his business. And then they came in, and the government was like, stop doing that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so he was writing letters going, we should. He should still be allowed to do that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Going to other printers and printing that. In 1772, Thomas Paine joined a labor movement of excise officers who petitioned Parliament for a raise.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. He's trying to raise the wages for the. The park.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. He literally was like, the minimum wage has been the same for 100 years.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The baby is.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I'm sorry. Payne published his first official work. It was titled the Case of the Officers of Excise.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He distributed 4,000 copies and was then promptly fired as an excise officer.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, yeah. You gotta fire that guy who's trying to unionize.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, it's not so much that he was trying to unionize. It was that he left his post without asking.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's how they get you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Because he was. You know, he's in Sussex, and he left Sussex and went to London to go petition Parliament. Like, well, if you're here.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Then you're not doing your excise Job. And did you ask, did you. Did you file for pto?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, we don't offer pto.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, no. So basically he gets fired at the excise office, the tobacco shop fails, and then he was about to be thrown into debtors prison, Bro.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, okay, listen, you're going to pause. Listen to me.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

How the.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was basically a vape shot.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The corsets was one thing. I was like, I don't know how you could not make corsets work. Because love to be skinny. An hourglass waste for the boys and girlies. Because back then the boys are doing it too. Selling a corset to the boys and girlies, that is that. There's a million dollar business. I don't know how you failed at that, but I'm gonna say his wife got sick. That might have made the business go under. Yeah, but then tobacco, you couldn't sell tobacco.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was basically a baby sells itself. It's basically a small town vape shop. He's selling an addictive product and he couldn't sell it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, you get the people, you give them the first cigarette free. That's how it works.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And then you have to yell at your husband for a decade to quit. And then every day, every morning and every night, he looks at you and goes, just let me have one fucking cigarette. And I say, you're not gonna have one cigarette ever again because we have to take care of our child. You're not smoking, and they're that addictive and you can't sell them.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Mm.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I'm so confused by this man's lack of business attitude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, so what he ended up doing is he had to sell everything he owned because in England at the time, if you owed money, they could throw you in prison.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, they're bringing that back.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's called debtors prison.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, they're bringing that back.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He also separated from his wife because, you know, he lost her family business.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, I was gonna say she was probably pissed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So they got separated.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

She's like, they're addicted to this shit, dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so in 1774, Thomas Paine moved to London.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, great.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he goes to London, moving to the big city, and guess who he meets in London. Yeah, guess who he meets in London? 1774.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

1774. Okay, I'm gonna make a guess because you brought him up earlier. Is it Benny Frank?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes, it is.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He met Benjamin Franklin.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I know. He was over there waiting for a trip to go to Paris to meet his girlies.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, so Benjamin Franklin was in. It was in London, because he was petitioning Parliament to stop being dicks to the colonists. Because this was during a time when they were still, like, there was a thing called reconciliation that people were really trying.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because everyone thinks that we went from zero to revolution, but we didn't. We spent about 20 years being like, please stop being a dick. Please stop being a dick. Please stop being. They're like, stamp tax, intolerable acts, Townsend Acts, Tariff, tariff, tariff. And they're like, fuck you, fuck you, fuck you. And so Benjamin Franklin was very well respected and loved, and so he was, like, hanging out.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Respectability, politics is what we call it now.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That is why he was.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Maybe. What's his name? I'll write another strongly worded fucking letter.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, basically. But he was. He had more swag than Chuck Schumer. So he's. Ben Franklin's over there like, hey, let me try. But he's also hanging around with, like, the science societies and stuff like that. And so he meets Thomas Paine, and he's like, read some of his work. And he goes, hey, you're a pretty good writer, and honestly, you seem pretty miserable here. England kind of sucks. And you're a Quaker. Have you ever thought about Philadelphia, Pennsylvania?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, hell yeah. You got this to go to Philadelphia. Hardcore.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so literally, he's like, telling him all about Philly. He's like, it's a Quaker paradise. Blah, blah, blah. And he goes, here, I write him up a letter of recommendation. And he goes, take this. If you get there before me, know

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

that I would like to bring back letters of recommendation.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, we 100%.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, you want to move to Philadelphia? Where's your letter of recommendation?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I mean, I'd sign and stamped, but

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

it's also for work because again, now we do background checks. Now we just go and we type in somebody's name. It pulls up their entire background history. We do credit checks. All those things back then, they didn't have that. You just had to have some other dude vouch for you on his name.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then if you up, it hurt him. And Brent Franklin was like, you're kind of special. Yeah, I like you. You're mad in the right ways.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, wait a minute. Wait a minute. I'm seeing something. You're kind of.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You're kind of sexy when you're angry. So Thomas Paine got on a boat, and that boat landed on the shores of the Delaware River.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Do we have a name for this boat?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I did not find the boat, all right? I just know that some boat who Made it. Yeah, we'll just go with Boaty McBoat.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, great.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Bodie McMoat landed on the shores of the Delaware river at the Philadelphia harbor on November 30, 1774.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Great.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And a couple a little bit later is when Thomas Paine finally got off the boat because typhoid broke out on the ship.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, I got to keep him on the ship.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he got super sick to the point where he wasn't able to walk. And Ben Franklin's personal doctors actually arrived to check on him and they physically carried him off of the boat. And then he had to spend weeks getting better. And then once he was finally healthy enough, he then swore allegiance and became a citizen of Pennsylvania.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hell yeah, dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because back then when you were a colony, you still swore to, like, the individual colonies themselves.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, I swore an oath to Pennsylvania.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, we swear an oath to our country. Of Philadelphia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, exactly. I die for my country.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Eagle noise. You know what? Actually with that, let's eagle noise Right away to a sponsor.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

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[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Narrator/Advertiser]

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Summer feels good. Your clothes should too. And right now, summer is so hot. That means I have the air conditioners on, which means that Mrs. P is cold.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I'm very cold.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Which is why we're thankful for Quince. Because Quince keeps you comfy and keeps a cold misses P. Warm in the summer.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's right. Because I. They have beautiful cotton sweaters. This is the perfect beach sweater. You know what I mean? Like at night when you're on the boardwalk and it's a little breezy and chilly. This is the type of cotton sweater that works at the beach. And also when your husband has the air conditioning down to. What's that say? Negative 50 in here.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay, well, that's Celsius. That's fine.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. Also, I have a necklace. Whoa. It's a little pearl necklace. Isn't it cute?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That is cute.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's also from Quince.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's a pearl necklace for Pearl Mania.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, exactly. Also, I'm wearing Quince perfume.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, really? Oh, that smells lovely.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I know, right? You can get anything at Quince.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know what? It's not just clothing. Quince is your one stop shop for home, travel, luxury. They have high end furniture, durable waterproof luggage, and even organic supplements and vitamins. If you're looking for a gift for someone special, quince makes beautiful 14 karat gold jewelry at amazing price.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Or you just get it for yourself like I did.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Quince partners directly with ethical factories and top artisans. No middleman means you spend 50 to 60% less than similar brands. Make your summer wardrobe easier with quince. Go to quince.com/tmt for free shipping and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. Go to quincy.comtmt for free shipping and 365 Day Returns. Quits.comtmt so it's 1774.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Thomas Paine just reaches Philadelphia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He can walk.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He can walk. Finally. And he starts talking to people and he's. And he finds out about this new magazine.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Guess what the magazine's called?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I have no idea.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Pennsylvania Magazine.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They were really good with titles back. Yeah, it was really cool. Now, Pennsylvania magazine was important because a lot of people had tried Colony Wide magazines. These were magazines that were going to be printed and distributed all over the eastern coast.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Of America.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, regional. Gotta make them regional.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There have been some smaller ones. There's smaller printings and things like that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But everyone kept trying. And in fact, 16, basically, colony wide magazines had started and failed. Okay, But Pennsylvania magazine was going to be different.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hell yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because Pennsylvania Magazine, its first issue, they had Tom Payne write two articles.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

All right?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the. The owner of the magazine was like this slaps. Okay, this is really good. What are your thoughts on becoming editor? And he was like, all right. Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, hell yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. And with Tom Payne as Editor. The magazine immediately became a huge success, selling copies across all of the colonies. It blew up immediately. And know what the secret was? Tom Paine writes in plain language and doesn't care about rich people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He literally was like, why don't we just write for normal people? There's more of them.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Every other magazine was writing for people who were, like, highly educated and had, like, a snuff box and a curci.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he was like, I mean, as long as they can fucking read, they can buy the magazine. So why. So why are we writing dispensation in highfalutin language? He was like, no, hey, write normal.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Government sucks, huh?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, fuck the government. That's basically what. And this is actually a problem for him, actually.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because the. The owner of the magazine kept being like, please, please don't make it political. And he was like, okay, not to quote too many tabs. Everything is political.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Thomas Paine rules. He writes about. He couldn't help. He couldn't help writing about, like, everything. He talks about workers rights. And he even published an anonymous essay titled African Slavery in America that demanded the end of the transatlantic slave trade.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And everybody knew he wrote it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But he was like, oh, I don't know. And they're like, it's you. It's in the all caps.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He changed his name to, like, Thomas Tame.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, he was. He would change his name to, like, Republicus. He would do these, like, crazy names that were always. One of his names he chose at one point was, like, the Forester. It was just always like. It was like, borderline. It's like borderline bad DC characters. Like C tier DC characters. He's always running in the side.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I like that he's talking in all caps.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. He does that a lot. Also, he's using. This is during a time, by the way, of the long ask.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I don't know what that means.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was a special printing type. So one thing that happens. You know how they recently had the UFC fight.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

At the White House. There was a moment where I think it's the Declaration. It's Declaration Independence is on the wall inside the White House now, inside the Oval Office. There's a copy of it there. And one of the fighters, right before he went out had, like, the American flag round. He's like, looking at it. He's like, oh, man, I can't even understand it. They just wrote so different. Everybody gave the guy. The thing is, they did write different.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There was a time where the printers Actually were so annoyed with gothic lettering that they created what's called the long s and gave it special rules. So we're used to normal S. Yeah. Right. The long S looks almost like an F. Like a lowercase f with the hook. Yeah. You pull it up long, so it's that. And so the rule for the long S is this. If that's at the beginning of the word or the middle, you do it long. But if it's at the end, you do the normal S. Okay. And if it's a capital S, you do a normal S. I don't.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

This is like when the. The. The girls in summer camp used to be like,

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

no, I was never a girl in summer camp.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, that's your fault.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I know. I'm working on it. Ever since. Anyway, during this time, though, he's writing all of these. These different things, and they're all getting printed, and it's becoming a bigger and bigger deal. Okay. And one of the things that Thomas notices is that there's something special in the air. Right around the time he had gotten there, there had been brewing issues between the British Crown and the local colonists.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. He showed up in 1774.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, 1774. Shit's about to go.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. I was about to say this. The air was probably sizzling.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, yeah. 100%. And everyone could feel that something was happening, but nobody could quite put a word on it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know, there was the taxes issue. There were protests. There was the Boston Massacre and more. The colonists were arguing amongst themselves, but also internally, each of them themselves, about what their relationship was with England.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

With the Great Britain and Parliament. And many of them often were also arguing that the king actually doesn't understand what's going on. No, they were. There's a thing. I talked about it before in other episodes. Good Czar, Bad Boyers. This idea that if you could just get past the king's ministers, if you could just get around. If you look at today, there's people out there who believe that if they could just get Donald Trump away from Stephen Miller, then he wouldn't be, you know, a Nazi, but he's also a rapist pedophile. So there's, like, things in there that you're like, oh, these type of things. But this happens a lot, especially with, you know, absolute dictators, where the people who. The people want to love the ruler, they just do and a lot. And these people were all English for the most part. Many of them were English. And they were raised to believe in the King. They were, you Know, they had propaganda pushed in their brain their entire life. Their education told them, their religion told them.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That he is the king. He has the divine right of kings. And so they're arguing with themselves. They're English subjects. And they all kept having this fallback that eventually this is going to get smoothed over and they're going to go back in with England. But then April 19, 1775, happened.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Happened. Okay, April 19, 1775. Okay, I got it. I got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay. Do you know what that is?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay. So you, like, you. They just, like, didn't teach you about the revolution, huh?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What are you talking about? Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Have you ever heard of Lexington and Concord?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Exactly. That's what I thought. That's what I thought. You heard of Paul Revere? Yeah, that's what he was riding for. Basically, the local militias up there in the Massachusetts Bay Colony, they had all these guns. And then the British were like, we're gonna come take those guns and take an American's gun. Exactly. That was the whole problem. So the British showed up. Paul Revere did his midnight ride with a couple other guys around. The British are coming. The British are coming. And then there was a standoff. And then guns were fired.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, of course.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then some people died.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then the British went and started the siege of Boston.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure, sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Boston was under siege from April 1775 on. I think. I think it's the.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Boston was just under siege recently. Because I had all the Scottish guys there and their kilts putting cones on stuff.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, but they weren' shooting people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, they're having a great time.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They were riding down the cops.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They closed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They rode down the copside with a bagpipe.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, they also drank them.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Mr. Third put it in. Oh, you don't remember the copside? Mr. Third put in the cop side. And for the listeners out there, what you're hearing is the sound of a police officer going down a tube slide that I myself have written in. In Boston. It's terrifying. Okay, so go ahead. You were saying.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I don't remember. I was saying. Was making a joke about how the Scottish were there and they drank them out of house and home. The bars. Ran out of beer. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's insane.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Ran out of alcohol.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Boston did.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, Boston ran out. But so this news about this.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sam Adams should be ashamed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Sam Adams should be. And, you know, he was a founder, too.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Exactly.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They put his name on a bottle. So Thomas Paine is looking around at this moment, and he's hearing the news like everybody else.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Is. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And this moment for him galvanizes him and he immediately goes, reconciliation is no longer an option.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And in fact, as he's thinking about it more, he starts thinking about to what he's been talking about all the way back there in Sussex and goes, actually, not only is reconciliation not an option, hereditary monarchies are not the natural order. In fact, the entire system's a lie. And people have to be told this. In fact, I need to sit down and write it all out. And he did. He wrote down a four part, 47 page pamphlet called Common Sense.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. So I know for a fact that that's happened in this house, specifically where somebody gets a thought about politics and then is like, I need to go up to my room. And then suddenly there's either a 2 minute TikTok video or a 10 to 15 minute YouTube video of you looking directly in the camera telling everybody what

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

you think they need to know in very plain language.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And that's exactly what he did. Because other people have been talking about the issues, Right. Whether it be in Boston and Philadelphia or down in Virginia, people have been talking about the issue of the crown and how the no taxation without representation and all these other ideas that have been happening. The ideas of freedom and liberty and democracy and republics and more. And what he did is he sat down in a very, very plain language that could be easily read by anyone, but also most importantly, in language that could be read by normal people aloud in taverns.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

To read it to people who didn't know how to read while they're hammered.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, that's the best way.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And this is what it does. Common Sense is a pamphlet that walks the readers through arguments on the nature of societies versus governments, monarchies and hereditary succession. The current state of America as of January of 1776. And then the last section is all about how America needs to build a navy right fucking now. Plus some pretty incredible ideas around how government should work and look and be set up. So Common Sense kind of really is the most viral thing to ever exist in America, maybe ever.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Really?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So it is. If you take a look at the size of the population at the time versus how many copies that were sold. 20% of every American living in the colonies owned a copy. There were only 2.5 million Americans at that time. It sold 500,000 copies.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So like now if you saw like a video gets.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So it's Titanic. Yeah, it's, it's, it's a VHS of titanic.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It is.100 is a VHS, is such a. You know. You know what it is? It's a DVD of Finding Nemo.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, it's a DVD of Finding Nemo.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Back to last episode. Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So one glutton.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. One out of every five people had a copy to themselves. And I did look it up to compare it to, like, the Super Bowl. The thing I had to keep in mind with the super bowl is the super bowl is only one night.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This kept. Kept selling.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And also there were illegal printings of it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, hell yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because people would get it. They're like, oh, this shit's too good. I have to download it, rewrite it. It's like one of my fucking videos. When suddenly I open up and I'm like, oh, there it is. Oh, there's this guy that does this, that just points. You gotta listen to this. Yeah, that's the guy who reads it aloud in the tavern to everyone. Excerpts of it were being pulled. He goes through so many different things. It opens with the line, some writers have so confounded society with government as to leave little of no distinction between them. Society is every state a blessing, but government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil. I want you to notice I. Mrs. Payne.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I've been reading this on my iPad.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

For the last two nights while laying in bed next to you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I did notice you were reading.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Yes, yes, yes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And it wasn't fiction, apparently.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was not fiction, and it was not a comic book for once.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I was reading Thomas Paine's Common Sense. And then I was getting up and marching through the backyard with a musket, ready to fix bayonets and run over a barricade because the shit slaps. It makes. It's just. It's so good. Because he goes through a thought exercise describing something that American colonists can picture.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

A very primitive early settler society.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Anywhere in the world.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And talking about, like, you're one person trying to survive on an island or a new continent. You're not gonna be able to survive. You don't have food, so you have to get some other people together. And then you work together. And inside that, you build a house. And then you realize, oh, we can go a next level if we have a couple more houses. And by that, you build a state house and it grows and eventually get to a certain size where you need to have rules, and then eventually rules have to become law, and then eventually this all turns into a government. But a government that is set up by the governed.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he goes, that's the natural order of how governments are born. He then pivots immediately to the English Constitution. Now, I know you know about the American Constitution. We do all the amendments. We had the big argument about the 14th amendment where three to four, three to five. I think of the. Depending on who you're talking to, of the Supreme Court justices said, the American Constitution isn't constitutional.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They're traitorous slugs anyway.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But when Thomas Paine starts talking about the English Constitution, the one thing you need to keep in mind is that it's not written down.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I'm sorry, what?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

English Constitution doesn't actually exist.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They didn't write that shit down.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, what they did is they have a series of laws and legal rulings and precedents over the years, okay, that are kind of just like, put together, that people kind of vibe about. And they go, that's part of the Constitution. That's the Constitution of the nation.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

England has been colonizing the whole world. And they have a ramshackle on vibes, babe. This is insane.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They go around. They go, flag, we're in charge.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Don't ask us any questions about what we're. What our rules are.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, that's. That's. That's a nice tea and spice, Flag. That's what they did.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's crazy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, that's 100% what they did. What he does, as he's looking at the English Constitution and how scholars talk about it, he immediately declares it a failure.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He states that the English Constitution is made up of the king, the peers, which are the nobles, and the commons, and that they all claim to keep each other in check. But then he proceeds to point out that this, the fact that they keep each other in check, makes them all invalid.

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

and I'm gonna use the exact Language he said these are the exact words to say the Constitution of England is a union of three powers reciprocally checking each other and is farcical a joke. Either the words have no meaning or they are flat contradictions. To say the Commons, meaning normal people and like the members of Parliament, is a check upon to the King presupposes two things. First, that the King is not to be trusted without being looked after, or in other words, that a thirst for absolute power is the natural disease of monarchy. Secondly, that the Commons are being appointed for that purpose are either wiser or more worthy of confidence than the Crown. But as the same constitution which gives the Commons the power to check the King by withholding the supplies, gives afterwards the King the power to check the Commons by empowering him to reject their other bills. It again supposes that the King is wiser than those whom it already has supposed to be wiser than him. A mere absurdity. Later he says, how can the King by a power which the people are afraid to trust and always oblige to check such a power could not be a gift of a wise people. Neither can any power which needs checking be from God. Because the point at this time of King George III is that King George is in power because God chose him. Yeah, but at the same time the Parliament says just in case he goes crazy, which he does. In case he goes crazy, we're around to check him. To which he points, you just said God is infallible and chose him, so why the fuck do we Have a parliament of regular people who are allowed to give him any orders whatsoever.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so in that moment he just goes, hey guys, the emperor has no fucking clothes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So then you just declare war on Iran and don't get congressional approval.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. That's basically 100% what happens. This whole section like breaks Americans minds.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because they literally haven't been thinking about it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They're too busy. No taxation without representation. Typhus. Like that's kind of how they've been walking.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. It's hard to process what's going on in the government when you're trying to get your bills paid and you're month to month on your rent and your bills aren't. You're. You're racking up debt and the eggs are going up in price and the gas is going up price. It's hard to focus on this stuff.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

What's crazy is I want don't notice. You want no one. I want you to notice one thing.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I only pointed out one word in there that. That might catch people off guard and that's farcical.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He writes the way we talk today.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No one else. Everyone else is too worth half tither. Type of. If you read anybody else. John Adams, Alexander Hamilton. These other guys, they all talk all up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And all highfalutin and.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he's like, no.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He said. They said we're putting on our high heels and kabir pants.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. Such a power could not be the gift of a wise people. Neither can any power which needs checking be from God. You can't check what is God?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Bars.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It is a bar. And that's just section one. He's got four more. Three more sections in section two. Pain questions that ultimately mocks the entire idea of kings and hereditary aristocracy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hereditary. The movie do.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Just hereditary.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Landlords.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Basically.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

For the most part. He. He goes back to biblical text and he goes through the Bible and starts just pulling quotes and he uses each of these to point out directly that the idea of the divine right of kings is.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Is.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the thing is, you have to understand is Americans at this time are just done the first great awakening where a lot of them like people like Puff.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There's a lot of these people who like read their Bible.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Universal friend.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Public universal friend. There's people who read their Bible and they went oh shit. That priest always said it said the opposite of that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or oh, I didn't realize that this passage contradicts this thing. Oh, we can kind of. There's so many things that we can use to justify other things.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Things.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he does that. He goes through it. He quotes Jesus directly render under Caesar the things which are Caesar's. But he points out that that is actually saying that like most things are gods.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They're not like, they're not Caesars. And also he points out that in that moment they were using that as justification for. Of the, the, of the Israelites in the Hebrew Bible and the Jews. Saying like that means that. Because that means that they can have kings and that kings are chosen by God. He's like, no, actually what that means is that that the Jews got their rocked by the Romans and they were actually a vassal state at that moment and that they were unoccupied by an oppressive force. You idiots. He then also goes into the idea of Samuel, who was a prophet and one of the early kings of the Israelites, and points out that Samuel kept trying to kill all of these fellow Jews because they kept being like, you should be the chief, you should be the king. And he was like, no, no, I hope, hope. I hope you all die. He just kept that. He's like constantly. He goes through the Bible. He's like, every part of the Bible literally says, pharaohs are evil, kings are evil, monarchs are evil. You shouldn't have these hereditary organizations like this. You guys are idiots.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he's like, why are you letting this, this weirdo in a crown say this to us? And he goes through this over and over and over again. And in fact, at one point he, he gins up something. I know you're liking him right now. Now I can feel it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He sounds pretty cool.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. But then he went like really hardcore anti Catholic because he's English.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, well, that happens to them. They can't help it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. He wrote the following. That the Almighty hath here entered his protest against monarchical government is true or the scripture is false. And a man hath good reason to believe that there is as much king craft as priestcraft in withholding the scripture from the public in popish countries for a monarchy in every instance is the potpourri of government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The potpourri of government.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The potpourri of government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I wish I could buy potpourri of government scented potpourri.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, I like that. I do. I do miss times of people just screaming papist. Yeah, maybe Trump will bring that back.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Probably.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He then openly attacks the idea of kingly birthright.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Thomas Paine writes the following. This is supposing the present race of kings in the world to have an Honorable origin. Whereas it is more than probable that we could take off the dark covering of antiquity and trace them to their first rise. That we should find the first of them nothing better than the principal ruffian of some restless gang whose savage manners or preeminence in subtlety obtained him the title of chief among the plunderers.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Because history is written by the victor. So people that are vicious and aggressive and take over places and kill and murder and rape, those people win. And then they claim themselves and their own history. And so they're like, I declare king and my son is king.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

All of the. All the early kings, especially from the medieval period, when you're looking at from the fall of Rome especially, are protection rackets. These are mob bosses. And all of the early fights are mob boss bosses. You're watching mob bosses slowly turn legitimate and then slowly have kids who aren't good at being mob bosses get usurped.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's 100% when most of them were. And he keeps going on because, as he points out, he's like, we. He's like, as Englishmen, we all know that your legitimacy comes from the biggest ruffian in the history of the world, William the Conqueror.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he says, England since the conquest hath known some few good monarchs, but grown beneath a much larger number of bad ones. Yet no man in his senses can say that their claim, the English kings under William the Conqueror, is an honorable one. He was a French bastard landing with an armed bandits and establishing himself king of England against the consent of the natives is, in plain terms, a very paltry, rascally original. It certainly has no divinity in it. Yet I should be glad to ask how they suppose kings came at first. The question admits but of three answers. Either kings came by lot, by election, or by usurpation. And so basically, he claims that from that point forward is he goes, listen, we could read the Bible. We've read all these other histories.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You were either chosen because they're getting around. They go, well, somebody's got a lead. Draw straws.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or somebody's got a lead. Jeff.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or stabilizer.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Which is most of the last one.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Mostly the last one.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But his point, then, he then goes into hereditary monarchy and goes into a whole thing about how hereditary monarchy is. Because if the first king was chosen by lots, then every king should be chosen by lots. And if he was chosen by electors, then every king should be chosen by electors. And if he was a usurper, then he goes against.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, then they should all Be chosen by.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, yes, basically. He's like, you can't pick and choose for different people. He points out that the chief argument for hereditary monarchy is that it lessens civil wars. That's what is always brought up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But then he uses stats and he goes, England has had 8 civil wars and 19 rebellions under 30 kings. Because we got. Most of the time there's a civil war or there's.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The numbers aren't actually that good.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, the numbers don't. Aren't good. He's. And that's not even counting the amount of times an old king has died and left the crown to a child.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. 10 year old.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Who then is stuck in a regency that then breeds another rebellion or has another issue. So he keeps going down this entire thing and it's breaking people's brains because he's like. And this is the guy we're supposed to reconcile with.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he keeps going into more and more of this. He starts pointing out that people are saying we have to stick with England because England protects us. He goes, do they?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Do they? Or are we in abusive relationship with England or.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes, 100%. He, he keeps saying, I offer nothing more than simple facts, plain arguments and common sense. And he does that. When he brings up the idea of the British Empire and how it doesn't protect Americans, it actually puts them in harm's way.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

All right. We have boasted the protection of Great Britain without considering that their. That her motive was interest, not attachment. That she did not protect us from our enemies on our account, but from her enemies on her own accord. From those who had no quarrel against us on any other account and who will always be our enemies on the same account. He's like, basically we're fighting the French because the French are fighting the British.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. We don't have to fight the French or the Spanish. No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or any of these people. It has lately been asserted in Parliament that the colonies have no relation to each other but through the parent country. Example that Pennsylvania and Jersey and so on for the rest are sister colonies, but only by the way of England. Not sister colonies because they're neighbors, not because they know each other, because this is certainly a very roundabout way of proving relationship. But his nearest and only true way of proving enemy ship, if I may so call it France and Spain were never were, nor perhaps ever will be our enemies as Americans. But as for being our subjects of Great Britain, he then goes back to being anti Catholic but pro immigrant.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He says the phrase parent or Mother country has been jesuistically adopted. I like the Jesuits. Jesuit adopted by the King and his parasites with a low papistical design of gaining an unfair bias on the credulous weakness of our minds. Europe, and not England is the parent country of America. This new world hath been the asylum for the persecuted lovers of civil and religious liberty from every part of Europe.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, that's just true.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Cuz he's pointing around, he's like, that guy's German, that one's Dutch.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

All these people everywhere, he's like, everyone's coming from everywhere.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They're not all English. Once they land here, they have to. Right now they have to swear allegiance to the King because it's a British colony. But they don't have to.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, if you love liberty, I think you should be cool here.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I love liberty.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I know you do. But he really keeps sticking on this European thing.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he's like. And actually that. That he's like, we're not citizens of England, especially if you're here in America. But he says the following. Admitting that we are all of English ascent. What does that matter? What does it amount to? Nothing. Britain being now an open enemy of the American colonies extinguishes every other name and title. And to say that reconciliation is our duty is truly farcical. The first king of England of the present line, William the Conqueror, was a Frenchman. And half the peers of England are descendants from the same country. Wherefore, by the same method of reasoning, England ought to be governed by France. And there's nothing more insulting to Englishmen being like, you should be French, then you just be. You sound very French to me.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And it's freaking everybody out. And so then he points out that every time England goes to war, it fucks up American trade. So he just says neutrality is the best option because we should fight with England and then we should be neutral to the rest of the world.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Wouldn't that be nice?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Would be nice. It would be nice if somebody looked around and realized that war keeps us up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But he does acknowledge and say that we need war in America.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because it's already started.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What war?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The revolution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because the thing is, is people keep looking at it right now as a rebellion. They keep looking at it right now as just, you know, a kerfuffle, some mob violence. But he looks at Lexington, Concord and the siege of Boston and he tears their bandage off of it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he turns to the public and he says to them, how can you go back to saying, we're gonna. It'll go back to normal after what has already happened. And he said it with the following passage. Men of passive tempers look somewhat lightly over the offenses of Britain, and still hoping for the best, are apt to call out, come, come, we shall be friends again for all of this. But if you say you can still pass the violations over, then I ask, hath your house been burnt? Has your property been destroyed before your face? Are your wife and children destitute of a bed to lie on or bread to live on? Have you lost a parent or a child by their hands and yourself the ruined and wretched survivor? If you have not, then are you not a judge of those who have. But if you have and still can shake hands with the murderers, then you are unworthy of the name of husband, father, friend or lover, and whatever may be your rank and title in life. You have the heart of a coward and the spirit of a sycophant. Bars then that moment you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

These people, they killed your dad.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. They killed your dad. It's like they burned your house down and you're gonna now go break red.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They kidnapped your neighbors.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They molested your children. They did all these awful things. And then. Oh, I'm sorry. After, after the next cycle of elections, we're just gonna be like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna forgive this person. Yeah, come on.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They shot her in the head on camera. They called him a domestic terrorist. They robbed them. This is just that. This is exactly what he's calling out. And in that moment when I read that, I had to take a walk and it was very hot outside and maybe you need to take a walk too. So we'll. We'll calm down with this next sponsor. Stop telling yourself you're gonna take it easy this summer. Actually do it with IndeCloud. It's Fourth of July weekend. There's fireworks going off. Does that scare you? They give you anxiety. Are you literally a dog? Whether you're watching the World cup or enjoying the sunshine in the cloud has everything you need to kick back and have fun. Look at some of this stuff. Okay. No, it's not coming.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Alright. It's not working. You thought it was gonna be cooler than it was.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

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[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Look. Okay. Wow. Look at all these.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

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[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

This one seems interesting. It's called in the Cloud Bliss Gummies. A perfect night. Every night. It's got melatonin and thc.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This one's Called Purple Punch.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What's that?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's a pre roll. Oh, they got fat pre rolls and high quality flour. THC cereal Bite edibles. Perfect for a day on the couch and just trying to forget that you're actually a dog. That you're not actually a person. All Into Cloud products are federally legal THC. Everything sold is DEA certified and lab tested. If you're 21 or older and a new customer, go to indicloud co that's co not.com and use codes tabs for 30% off your first order. That's IndeCloud code tabs for 30% off all month long shipped discreetly to your door. Plus free shipping on orders over $50 and $30 in free gifts on qualifying orders. After you order, fill out the survey and tell them too many tabs sent you enjoy responsibly and thanks Into Cloud now, Mrs. B. Again, it's a 47 page pamphlet and I've only covered the first two sections. There's two more and these are actually much quicker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because he begins to point out that London is three to four thousand miles away and it takes take six months plus to get an answer from the British government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They can't even get to us.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, they really can't. He's like, they're too far away. And he's like, eventually this whole system is going to fudgeing collapse.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because we got to write a letter, put it on a boat, send the boat over, have them read it, have them go, wait, what do you mean by that? Send it back.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He's like, let's just go. No contact.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's 100%. So what he says is he goes, we should just do it. We should just declare independence right now.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, let's go.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he then starts to speak to probably the dumbest argument I've ever heard that probably spoke to the most people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Is the simplest argument for an American revolution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh my God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Are you ready for it?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There's something very absurd in supposing a continent can be perpetually governed by an island.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He said, you are little.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's literally what he said. He's like, great Britain. More like Little Britain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You're on an island.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, we're a continent. Maybe we're a continent and you're in.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They didn't even know how far it went.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He even goes, I didn't even know

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

that California was that far away. Dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They didn't even know California existed.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's what I mean. They didn't even know.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

At one point, there's a line. I didn't write it down, but there is a line. And he's like, you know. You know, planets aren't governor. Governed by moons. Right. So what are we doing here?

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

He.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He just like, it's. It's such a stupid argument. I can tell you. I guarantee you 10% of people heard that was like. He's right, though. He's right. We are bigger.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, that. Okay. We.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We are bigger.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I need you to stop. Because so many people in this country, the United States of America, don't have great reading skills or interpretation skills or critical thinking skills. And because of that, they lack a certain ability to understand context and nuance and things like that. So I think we steal this and we make it our pitch in the next election cycle.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. We're bigger.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We're bigger.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We're bigger.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We're bigger, bitch.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Hey, welcome. We're bigger. This is. This has been one of the issues. We're bigger does work.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

It literally.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I mean, I have the lump. The Trump. Low prices. Kamala. High prices. Sign right over there. You just insanely work. You have to be caveman language.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Payne. After that line, then lays out the idea of a Democrat going to be

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

like, whoever the next nominee is.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

For president, if it's a woman or a man, I'm just gonna be like, dick's bigger.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Doesn't matter.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Bigger.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Knows how to swing it. That's it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What's that. What's her name? The. The. That. The gate. The lady that you almost open for at the strip club back in the day. Okay. She had intercourse with the president states, and then he sued her because she told everybody about.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He had a toadstool dick.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. She had a very. He said. She said he had very small penis.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. She said, look like a.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The name Stormy Daniels.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Stormy Daniels.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. You almost opened for her.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

There was a minute to cancel her tour for safety reasons.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. Because the local sheriffs were raiding every club that she went to.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And that was. And people were like, oh, that's as about tyrannical as it gets.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, buddy, buddy. Not yet.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Nope. Let's get back to Thomas Paine in 1776. Okay, I'm sorry. Payne lays out a democratic republican form of government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And this is one of the big issues, actually. One of the things that he goes out of his way and is in this whole entire pamphlet. Even though Pain is anti slavery, he never brings it up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because specifically, he's like, I need the Colonies to be together. And also he is very pro democracy, but at the time, a lot of the conservatives and elites in America were anti democracy. They were pro republic.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But they really had, like, a very specific idea of more of an oligarchy that they wanted of the rich guys that were already running everything to keep

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

running everything because they were building lawns.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. So he never uses the term democracy, but he pushes for democracy in this pamphlet. And he says that this is. Should be what replaces the tyranny of the monarchy. He also then demands that America immediately build a navy. And he points to the. He points to the terrible. And William Death as an example, because look how cool that fucking is.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That is.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Wouldn't it be cool? We had a navy. But throughout it all.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Well, again, because they can only get to you by the water because they're an island on the other side of the. The. The globe.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So you really just need a navy to stop them in the water.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. That's basically his big part.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That doesn't make sense.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like. He. What he does is, we're bigger than

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

you and got boats. Boom.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Throughout it all, Thomas Paine keeps pointing out that they cannot go back. He's like, there's no turning back. We can't go back to how things were in the 1740s.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We can never go back.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Go to the future, and we have to do it together. And he says, quote, to begin government at the right end. And finally, his last argument that he really pushes is a pragmatic reason on to why they should declare independence.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

A big part of it is that as long as they are officially British, this moment, this issue, will always be considered an internal British issue to the rest of the world.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So they can't ask for help because no one will show up in a domestic.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he said, if we declare that we are independent, then we're no longer rebels.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We're our own nation. So he closes with this passage. These proceedings may first at first appear strange and difficult, but like all other steps which we have already passed over, will in a little time become familiar and agreeable. And until an independence is declared, the continent will feel itself like a man who continues putting off some unpleasant business from day to day, yet knows it must be done, hates to set about it, wishes it over, and is continually haunted with the thoughts of its necessity.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He's like, it's your chores that you've been putting off.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, it's literally my. It's me doing the taxes every year. He's like. He's like, until you do this, it's gonna bug you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's gonna be on the weight on the back of your neck every day. You just do it. Yeah.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

He.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He also points out throughout this entire thing, he's like that this is the perfect time for America to do it because we're not that well developed yet.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, we have. Like, if you go. If you look at America now and you pull up a map and you look especially America at night and you can see the lights.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You notice, like, basically to the Mississippi now, it's. Everything is covered.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

If you go up to northeast is megalopolis from D.C. all the way through Boston. It's just. It's completely developed. He's like, we won't be able to defend this in the future.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, right now we have some small seaside towns in some cities. We can put our forces in specific places. And the British have to cross all this empty land to fight us.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

In the future, they'll just be going from suburb to suburb also, like, because.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And this is kind of not a nice way to think about it, but, like, they. They don't have a lot to lose because they don't have, you know, a lot of really well built up cities and yet, like, infrastructure. Infrastructure. So, I mean, like, there's not a lot of infrastructure yet. And so if it all gets blown to shit, they only have to rebuild so much.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. 100%. So common sense. The pamphlet.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Psychological bomb on the American colonists.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. After hits public, he dropped the pain.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He did. He brought. He welcomed to the halls of pain. Okay. After its publication, the idea of reconciliation among most Americans who were in disgust. Not. Obviously not the loyalists.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because not everybody, but not the lowest. But for most people, like, reconciliation. If you brought up, like, I'll fuck you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, fuck you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know what I mean? It was just that moment of like, we've. We've crossed the Rubicon. The common people could finally now put into words the idea of independence. Until this moment. Again, rich people, people with a lot of education, people who were, you know, in their letters, they knew how to talk about this.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But again, some dude who's a barrel maker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He didn't know what the. He didn't know quite how to say it. But now everybody had the words of Tom Payne. And conservatives in the Continental Congress are looking around because the first Continental Congress already happened.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the second one was coming.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure. And.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Or just begun. And they're looking around and they're realizing that they're about to lose control of the very movement that they started.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Classic.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because again, classic. They were trying because, remember, a lot of the founding fathers. And Thomas Payne, again, was a customs officers excise officer. A lot of the founding fathers were smugglers. A lot of them were mad. Again, the taxation that they were bitching about was the ones that they didn't want to pay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so the stuff that they found intolerable was them paying for their own defense. And Tom was like, all right, bet we're not paying for our defense anymore. Fuck you. Also, while we're at it, what about religious freedom? Like, what about direct democracy? Yo, I got an idea. No kings. Let's get rid of hereditary landlords. And they're like, oh, so he's just out here spitting fucking bars.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, dude. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was crazy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I love that so much.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Loyalists, on the other hand, they lost their mind completely. Reading the pamphlet, for sure. Ironically, they're Fox News. Yeah, they 100% were. There was a rebuttal pamphlet written to Common Sense. It was titled Plain Truth. And that was like, very fucking funny.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's the most Fox News response.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Plain Truth.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Plain Truth.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So here's a funny thing about Plain Truth.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It was the original draft title of Common Sense.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Damn.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He was originally gonna call it Plain Truth. Another guy was like, call it Common Sense. It's a better name.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he went with it. And then they're like, all right, well, you got some common sense. Well, I got some Plain truth. And they was like, this is bullshit.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The guy who wrote it from Maryland, he called Payne a political quack.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, okay. Yeah, quack.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he also said that a government without a king would degenerate to. Would degenerate into democracy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, no, not that.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because if you don't have a king, you're just gonna end up with a democracy. That's terrible. Because to them, they view democracy as the same as anarchy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Because again, the way that Republicans now think about socialism.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

What's the same way the Republicans now bring up all the time, that we are not in a democracy, we're in a republic.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They bring it up a lot. And they say it in a very specific way.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Because they're just trying to say that they were getting rid of our voting rights.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. So John Adams. You know John Adams.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, I said, oh, that. No, I was thinking of Sam Adams. Because we're talking about John Adams. Different Adams.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's a different Adams. He was in the movie. They had the HBO Miniseries with him. Paul Giamatti.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Oh, right. I remember.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. John Adams hated Common Sense.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He hated Thomas Paine. He hated him so goddamn much. Adams was a conservative. But you know who did like Thomas Paine?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Who?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

John Adams wife Abigail. She loved it. She quoted it in letters. And the thing is, is Common Sense was written anonymously.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

People eventually figured out it was Thomas Paine, but, like, they had no name on it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Abigail kept written to John like, yo, who the wrote that? Yo, can you find out who wrote that? I bet whoever wrote that's really cool. And the whole time, John. Absolutely. You can feel him, like, stewing. Be like the up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

But that's me being like, yeah, that comedian had a great set. You're like.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's like what we said before, though. Like how every guy who's like a radical or like somebody out there, like, always has like a wife who is like ten steps beyond him. And she was. Abigail Adams was like a radical feminist democrat.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

At one point, Abigail wrote to John, quote, in the new code of laws, which I suppose it will be necessary for you to make, I desire that you remember the lady. Do not put such unlimited power into the hands of husbands. Remember, all men would be tyrants if they could. Which is a Thomas Paine quote. If particular care and attention is not paid to the ladies, we're determined to foment a rebellion and will not hold ourselves bound by any laws which we have no voice or representation.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hell, yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's just straight up. Just like Lady Pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. Lady Pain. Oh, Lady Pain.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Lady Pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I'm not picturing merch right now.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Yes, I am.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no, it's like a picture of

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

John Payne says, like Lady Payne with an e at the end.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So Adam has reacted to common sense with his own pamphlet.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, okay. We're having pamphlet wars.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, this is pamphlet.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, so this is a tick tock discourse. This is tick tock this Christian Devine has stepped into.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. Everyone is stitching. Everyone. They're stitching. The Elder Millennial is there. That piece of shit. He hasn't been tased and pissed himself yet, but there's like, so many things are happening. So he writes a pamphlet, and his pamphlet is called Thoughts on Government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, got it. Now what he calls for, Thoughts on Government. Well, that's a good TikTok handle.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay. So Thoughts on Government. The big thing he really pushes back on is that Tom Paine has no checks and balances in his idea for a more representational democracy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He pictures like it's something like 300. A 300 seat Congress that each state has a certain amount of representatives that they're allowed to send. And then there are. Is every year that the president or governor is chosen every year by lot.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So basically what they do is each of the 13 states will be allowed to draw a lot.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then whoever wins. All right. They get to then choose out of representative who's going to be the governor.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then everyone else votes yay or nay on that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then when it's. Then when the next one goes, they're not allowed to enter in until everyone gets a term.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, fine. I. Who wrote this again? John Adams.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no, that's what Tom Payne wrote. That was Tom Payne's idea for government.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, but you said that John Adams wrote.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

John Adams wrote a separate one. He wrote. He. He came up with a bicameral legislator. He wants a House representatives and a Senate. He wants a separate executive branch, and he wants the independent judiciary. John Adams basically lays out the federal government that we have today. The one that sucks.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, the one that sucks.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The one that sucks. Shit.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

But so what you were saying at the beginning of that was that he. He read Tom Paine's pamphlet.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And he immediately was like, no, you're not describing how this government's going to work the way I think it should.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And so he wrote an angry pamphlet back, which in my brain I cannot get past because it is that exact thing that drives me insane on the Internet right now, which is people like, oh, I have this idea and this thought about this very specific topic, and people like, you haven't answered it completely fully. And I need. You didn't say this one thing that relates to it. And it's like. Like, we're allowed to have dialogues. Like, he's clearly the type of person who's starting dialogues and conversations.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the thing is, is pain. Pain did have. This was part of a dialogue.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So this. But this is. This is a serious.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I'm just mad because this guy's being like a common section. He's been souping. He's been souping.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

John Adams is being. Souping.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because. But John Adams is picking part of the four points that he made, and he's really drilling on this one specifically. On what?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Straw manning it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no, he's. He's not straw manning it because straw manning is inventing an entire other argument. He is bringing up a thing, though, that Tom Paine did not see coming.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Which is the idea of that A democracy, which we've seen happen many times, can be overthrown by a strongman easily.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And you do need to have checks in the government. Our government now would work if we actually use the checks that we have.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Supreme Court, Congress.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, well, that's the thing. We. We are stuck right now in a one party government which is bending over completely to allow the executive to do whatever it wants. There weren't enough checks in that sort of way because they always assumed Tom Payne would have assumed that people would have fought against it a little bit more. He assumed that if you have more education, if you have more common ideals, other things along this nature. He also didn't. Didn't expect a South African Nazi to buy Twitter and then send AI bots at everyone with Mecca Hitler. There's a lot of stuff that wasn't predicted.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Addicted.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. What's up with them?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

What happens? Okay, so after this, he keeps writing letters to everybody, and the pamphlet sells incredibly well.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Nice.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He does get into arguments with printers about. About the sale.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, they gave him a strike on Tick Tock.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, they give a strike on Tick Tock, which I can have two of right now. But they go back and forth for a minute on this. Right. And when he finally gets some money, he sends all of it to General Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he says, buy the boys some mittens because it's cold.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's nice.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He literally does. He takes all the money that he makes from common sense and he dumps it all right back into the war effort. Because at this moment, we have a continental fighting force. Yeah, there is the Continental army, and they are currently, like, fighting and moving all around. And so the Continental Congress is trying to, like, decide of whether or not to disband Washington or keep it going. And he's like, here's some money. And he keeps talking up Washington. Paine then urged the Continental Congress to come up with a name for the country. He's like, you should declare independence, and then you should call yourselves the United States of America. He wrote this by using the handle Republicus in the Pennsylvania Evening Post. He noted that the revolutionary leaders kept saying. They kept talking about the united colonies as United States. And he goes, I like that. United States of America. Done. And he just printed it. And so he. He's. He's not the only person to say that name. Yeah, but he allegedly is the first one to get it in print.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Listen, first one to get in print wins.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, that's 100.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

First lie wins. We learned.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

First lie wins. Yeah, he says he Says in here, we cannot offer terms of peace to Great Britain until, as other nations have done before us, we agree to call ourselves by some name. I shall rejoice to hear the title of the United States of America in order that we may be on a proper footing to negotiate a peace.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Hell, yeah, dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The warhead, like, in his mind, is like, yeah. Wait, listen. He's already. He's already planning for peace.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And peace isn't going to come for, like, another seven years.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Years.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, it got some time. Some claim that Thomas Paine may have helped Thomas Jefferson write the Declaration of Independence.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There is a note on one of the copies of the Declaration Independence. On the very back, it says, quote, a beginning, perhaps original, with Jefferson copied from original with TP's permission. And a lot of people think that the TP is Thomas Page.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, for sure it is.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But also, that note was written by John Adams. So everyone's like. Because, again, fucking hate each other. They hate each other.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I love. They're such little bitchy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This is the thing is. The thing is, everyone looks back, they're

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

in their wigs, with their bows on, with their little high heels and capris.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The bows are on the back.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The bows are in the back. And they're just like, no, I bet T. Pain did it. Oh, my God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

T. Pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I'm on a boat. Okay. So immediately. Immediately. The Declaration of Independence was adopted 250 years ago on July 4th, 1776.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Let's go.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Thomas Paine joins the army at 39 years old, buddy. Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Immediately, my knees cracked. Immediately.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The war goes to shit.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, boy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's like, it's bad. Pretty quickly, pretty rapidly. Washington's army was in retreat from New York by November, and they were stationed in New Jersey. And then across the Delaware, a cold winter was setting in. Soldiers began talking of defeat. And Congress, by this point, had fled from Philadelphia, fearing that the British were about to invade and take the city.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But Thomas Paine, he don't know how to quit.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's never heard of L's. He don't take them. You know what he writes, baby?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Double use. Because back then they used to write two use.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It wasn't a single letter yet. That was the different thing that came up a little later. He wrote W's. And he sat down one night at his army camp, and he used a drum as a desk.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he wrote with a pen by the light of a campfire, and he wrote these words. These are the times that try Men's souls, the summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country. But he that stands by it now deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered. Yet we have this consolation with us that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly. It is dearness only that gives everything its value. Baby still sleeping.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He did toss and turn a bit. He rolled over.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He rolled over. He heard the revolutionary words of daddy. Yeah, Daddy. Thomas Paine. So he shows these to the general that he was with.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

General's like, yo, that shit's fire.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yo, dude, let's go.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's like, you need to print.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You gotta bang on the drum while you say this, dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He was like, you need to print that right the now.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Thomas Payne rushed back to Philadelphia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he found a printer and he wrote out a new pamphlet that was published in the Philadelphia Journal, and it was titled the American Crisis.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

All right. And it was published in the Pennsylvania Journal on December 19, 1776. It was basically a TikTok propaganda edit. It was a fan cam, babe.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It was a fan cam, and it

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

kept America in the war. This hit the soldiers like crack. All right, the day following its publication in Philadelphia, Washington. General Washington himself got copies of the paper, read it, and he goes, you make everyone read this. There's a way. He ordered all of the troops to read it. And the ones who couldn't read, he had it read to them.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he did that while he prepped them to cross the Delaware. Oh, the frozen Delaware on Christmas to murder German mercenaries in their bed. Which they fucking did.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They did.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Eagle noises. Yeah, that's right. We murdered troops in their bed.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

There's a really famous painting of it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's the painting, you know, is George Washington committing war crimes? Yeah, that is it. That him standing on that boat? That's him. He's like, they're sleeping. The Germans are sleeping.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Stab.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, but that. That. That victory at the Battle of Trenton and. And retaking Princeton and everything was very important because that was like, they finally had a W on the board. And they were like, all right, it's not a sweep. Like, hey, hey. I don't hear no.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We only lose when Trump's here.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So in total, for the American crisis, it's a series of pamphlets. There's 16 total pamphlets.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because he keeps writing. He writes. And they're like open letters. Some of them are like, to The British generals, like. And again, they're all propaganda pamphlets.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He has a blog. I get it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, he does. He does. And he's, like, cutting different ones to different people. They explained to the colonists, though, that this is a total war and that all of the colonies rise and fall together.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know, reminding everyone that the works boosted morale and enlistment. And he wrote this all feverishly over the entirety. The last ones in 1783, when they finally reached the peace accords, and even writes them as he travels to France as part of official delegations where they ask the French remarks money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And so that was that. He was part of the official delegations to France and others. And it was a. It was a big deal. This was a big deal. These pamphlets are the. The second thing that he's really, really well known for. And so in a lot of books, when you're reading about the American Revolution, he. He comes up for American Crisis because his words. We think about a lot of the founding fathers, but it's really. These are the words that speak to the common people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know, like, so when you go and you look at. At stuff like, from the 60s. Right. And you think about what the soldiers are listening to. They're listening to Jimi Hendrix.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know, they're listening to the Mamas and Papas. They're listening to, like, you know, soul music and normal stuff. They're not listening to orchestral music and opera.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And that's like the type of that, like Nixon's listening to. You know what I mean? So it's like that's. That's kind of where this is. This is again for the common troops or the common people is what kept them in.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And made sure that they, too, would push back against. Against the British.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

The way that I listen to Flow Rider in Kesha.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

A hundred percent. And you know what, Mrs. P. Yeah. We're gonna flow ride right to this break.

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Right now, someone out there may be

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

so Mrs. P, it's 1783 and the war is over.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, thank God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

United States of America has been found.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Be Thursday. Because the war always ends on Thursday.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, the war ends on. No, Warren's war ends on Sunday nights.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I thought it ends on Thursday so that then it happens again over the weekend. But we pretend we don't know.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no, no. That means the word starts. Oh, the war starts Friday. You're talking about the around Iran. Yeah, the war start every Friday at 5:30pm Eastern. Yeah, when the markets close and right before markets open. Right before markets open. So it's like late Sunday, except when there's a long weekend.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, long weekend.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, long weekend. I mean, who knows? We're recording this before July 4th, so. Oh, I got the third off. Except Mr. Third, you keep working, so now you take time. Mr. Third, if you're a little late, you got to answer angry comments. So when the war ended, Thomas Paine is famous. Yeah, and broke.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Wait, why is he broke?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because he donated all of his pamphlet money to the war.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

God damn it. You Just gotta buy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He was such a good guy. No, no, no, no. So now that he's done, he then turns to the new government. He goes, hey, guys, I'm just. I'm not saying that you wouldn't have won without me, but I helped.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

But I'm the voice of the people.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The voice of the people. The Bob Dylan of my age. Yeah, maybe you should, you know, give me some money. And he ran into a major issue.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What's that?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, the first issue was the Articles of Confederation.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's what we had before the Constitution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The Articles of Confederation. There was a big issue with them. And the biggest part was that each individual state controlled the money. There was no centralized government. And so you basically had to go to each individual state and beg for money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he had pissed off a lot of people. Payne had pissed off rich people, conservatives, slave owners.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The elite of Philadelphia, the entire state of Virginia, and a New York lawyer named Gouverneur Morris.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, but who has it, by the way?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

His name is Gouverneur Morris.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

His name is Governor.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, his name was Governor.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's crazy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's a piece of shit. He's the worst, man. He's such an asshole. He's such a dick.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, I'm sorry. Somebody looked at a newborn infant and was like, governor.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Governor. I'm going to give you the title that you should get.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Governor.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So it should be noted that in most of these conflicts, with everything I listed here, Payne is right. I just want to be clear about that. But he's such a stubborn dick about it. So the issue we have with Governor Morris is there was. There was an issue where this friend of Governor Morris was working in the French delegation.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And was. Basically, there was, like, a bribery scandal, which is kind of like how, like, things are supposed to get done. But Payne went too hard about it, and he was like, you were a dick about it. You have to keep bringing it up so much. And then for Virginia, Payne was like, hey, Virginia, you're too big. You should give up your western territories. And Virginia was like, no, fuck you. He's like, you should give up your West. That. You don't need that. All that extra stuff.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You got that area that we now call West Virginia.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Basically, he was like, you should give that up. That didn't happen until the Civil War. And then rich people, obviously, conservatives, obviously slave owners, obviously. The Philadelphia elite is because Thomas Paine basically did a Hassan piker and, like, use, like, the. Almost the equivalent of, like, the Pennsylvania DSA to rewrite the Pennsylvania Constitution. Constitution. And set up this new form of government that everybody hated. So it was a whole thing. He made everybody mad. But he had three really close friends.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. We got Benjamin Franklin. I know that much. Who else?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Thomas Jefferson, Tommy Jeff, George Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. So he's got big bowler, big friends. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So these three work really, really hard. And they were able to get Thomas Payne $3,500 and a farm in New Rochelle, New York. Yeah. The farm was like a loyalist farm.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But he, you know, he ran away. And they're like, let's give that Tom Paine. And New Rochelle is like, just north of New York City.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he's like, okay. They gave him like this nice. I want 100 acre farm.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I want 100 acre farm.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, well, I know. Well, that's what he got. So he. So he gets all of this. And Thomas Payne is like, all right, I guess. I guess I'm done. I guess I'm gonna retire. When I get into.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Like, he's not gonna. Because I can tell by this energy that he's not. He's gonna. He's gonna sit and his legs gonna shake, and he's gonna tap on stuff.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, he's super into science.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He has stuff in the engineering stuff he needs to say.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, listen, he gets into engineering and he designs an idea for an iron bridge that's gonna go over the Schuylkill river outside of Philadelphia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But he needs money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And there's no money.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

There's no money.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Everybody's broke.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They won the Revolution, but everybody's broke.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

There's. You're broke after the war.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So Thomas, when he hit up some friends of his, and he. He got in a boat.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he left and he went back to. He went to go visit London and Paris.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

After everything he said?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

After everything he said.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Balls of steel, dude.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So In April of 1787, he left. He sailed out of Philadelphia for London.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he was like, I'll be back in a year.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Year. Yeah. Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. He doesn't come back in that year. He goes over. He starts hanging out with the Marquis de Lafayette, who is a famous general from the American Revolution. It was a French officer who came over and worked closely with it with General Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he's wearing the Marquis de Lafayette, and he's also hanging out with Thomas Jefferson, who is in France.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Why is he there?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because he's just hanging around. There's again. There's revolution in the air in France. And again, at this Point. The United States and French and France are very close because. And the French, like, this shit rules. You guys defeated the English and like, yeah, fuck the English, baby. And everybody's, like, being. Yeah, cool about it. So he's like, hanging out. He's just, like, hanging with them, drinking, you know, they're asking rich nobles and banks for bridge money. When on July 14, 1789, the French people storm the Bastille and start the French Revolution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, he was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, he was in the right place at the right time because he was over in London when he heard about this. He went, excuse me, what was that? So it should be noted that there was a very famous interaction, okay. Between Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Paine. There's this quote that's posted a lot of places. Benjamin Franklin said, where liberty dwells, there is my country.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And apparently Thomas Payne replied, where liberty is not there is my country. Because basically, Thomas Paine is like Trotsky. He believes in the eternal worldwide revolution. He didn't think that the American Revolution was the end. He thought it was the beginning. And so when he saw the French rising up and overthrowing the king, he was like, let's fucking go. Who's next? England? And he just lost his shit. He was like, whoa. He turned into, like, Ric Flair. He's like, another one, another one, another one. So he loses his mind. He gets fucking. She gets so hype. Revolutions on everything. And the thing is, he's in England and England doesn't like revolutions, obviously. They clearly just lost the American Revolution. They don't talk.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And his big shit talker just showed up. The guy who talked all that shit is in their town.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But the thing is, is you gotta remember, too, it's kind of a different algorithm. A lot of Thomas Paine's stuff, some of it did get back to England. And even though it was very treasonous and at the time, it was still like, he said it over there. He didn't say over here. So now that he was like, back on the island, they're like, well, he won't say it here.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. So it's like the grandpop down the street that's like, oh, I didn't. I don't watch Truth Social. So I didn't hear what he said.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

100. It's 100 that. Oh, I'm not on Facebook. It's that type of feel. It was kind of how if you post on Facebook, it doesn't count.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Thomas Paine is in England. The revolution kicks off in France. In France. And an English politician named Edmund Burke thinks that the French Revolution is stupid.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he writes a pamphlet called Reflections on the Revolution in France.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Where basically it shits on every single revolutionary idea out there. It defends the divine right of kings. It says that people have no right to food or medicine. It says that people do not have the right to overthrow oppressive governments. It points to private property and prejudice as things that maintain the national order. And it is actually considered the founding document of the idea of modern conservatism. And it sold 30,000 copies, bootlickers. It is 100%. And I've said this before, the idea of conservatism is that hierarchies exist, are natural, and should be maintained. That is, every conservative believes this, whether it be racial, gender, economic. They believe that everyone is at the point they're at, and that is the choice of God. And if you disrupted in any sort of way, then that is evil. That is their belief as conservatives. And Edmund Burke goes through this entire treatise of this entire pamphlet, laying this entire idea out. And it is hugely popular among rich people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, there it is. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because it's basically prosperity gospel.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's prosperity gospel.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Prosperity gospel.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, you're poor because you're a sinner.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Not because you're born into poverty. And that we as the rich people have stacked every card possible against you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's your fault and your burden, and therefore you are in the wrong.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's not that the king came down and burned down your entire fucking village or that a famine just happened to happen, or a hurricane or there was

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

a famine and we stole all the food for ourselves.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Ireland, you know, all these things that they point to. So there's 45 major literary replies.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

By literary scholars of the age page. Sure. Two reflections on the Revolution in France by Edmund Burke.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

There's a lot of different.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

A lot of discourse. A lot of discourse.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. The biggest one is 90, 000 words, and it eventually sold a million copies. And that book is called the Rights of Man by Thomas Paine.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, he got big mad. He told you he wasn't going to be able to sit down and be quiet.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He ratioed the motherfucker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He's gonna be an engineer. Get out of here, baby.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He ratioed him. It selled eventually a million copies. He's like 30,000. That's cute. That's a cute amount of likes.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Boom.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Payne argued that human rights come from nature. Quote, it is a perversion of terms to say that a Charter gives rights, it operates by a contrary effect, that of taking rights away. Rights are inherently in all the inhabitants, but charters, by annulling those rights in the majority, leave the right by exclusion in the hands of the few. Basically he's saying if some motherfucker says that a piece of paper gives you rights, that actually gives that motherfucker rights. Who wrote the piece of paper to take those rights away from you? And he is correct, by the way.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, because if you give the power to someone to feed you, you also give them the power to starve you.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's 100%. And it's the same thing. What you see it like, who can crown kings? If a pope can crown the king, then a pope can take the crown off a king. Yeah, it's that same general idea. Paine goes on to say even more about the only point of government is to protect people and their inalienable rights. Paine then starts listing reforms that he believes the British government should do immediately. Again, he advocates abolishing hereditary titles for the aristocracy. He pushes for a welfare state, demands free education, care for the elderly through a Social Security safety net system, the end of the poor houses, and a Europe wide republican government revolution that would end all wars and eventually form the basis of the modern European Union.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He called it pretty early, so I'm assuming everybody hates him. Oh, yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, I mean this is, this is a pretty classic leftist shut. You know, he's not wrong, but he is early.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He's as early.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. So Thomas Paine is looking around and he's like, people really like this?

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It looks like people in Britain are like, yo, you're allowed to write this.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No you're not. The British government was immediately pissed off. Immediately. They're enraged, but they didn't want to make him a martyr.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And they didn't want to make a big deal about it. So what they did instead is they hired a guy to write a false biography calling Thomas Payne a drunk.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, but it's London. Isn't everybody drunk?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, but they were like, he's extra drunk. And the thing is, he was kind of known that he was like a mean drunk.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It was mean.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, he was mean. He wasn't like an out. Like, I mean, everyone was kind of an alcoholic back then. He was clean water.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They just drink.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He, it was, he wasn't intemperate in the way that other people were at the time. But they kind of made a big deal of like. They tried to claim that he was like bipolar. They tried to claim he had all these issues. They just spread a lot of lies about him, and then they paid other people to then amplify those lies. Like a botnet. Like a botnet in a comment.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He got astroturfed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He did. Thomas Paine then kept writing.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Writing, yeah. Of course.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because why described you, by the way, was the first part. That was the Rights of Man Part one. He later released Rights of Man Part the second.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's what it was called.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's what they called it back.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We'll workshop that. That later.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The Rights of Man Part the second, which continue. Continued dunking on the entire concept of conservative governments and laying out a total utopia. It sold even more copies because it was even more popular. It's like when the season two of Netflix comes out of the thing. Because everyone had heard about season one, they wanted to get in early.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And the government officially started moving against Paine in his books. Anti Painite literature began to spring up all across England. Church and king mobs began to attack democratic leaders homes and burn copies of books in mass. Book burning.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, yeah, this is definitely going to make people not want to be interested in what's inside that.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Paine's writings were officially labeled as seditious. Mind you, the entire time this is happening, the King of England, King George, is literally insane.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's actually been labeled legally dead because he is having full manic episodes, foaming at the mouth, and talking to trees that he thinks are the King of Prussia.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So you have a person in charge who is demented.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And if you. And then the people that talk about that situation are being silenced.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Huh.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yep.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Wow.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And labeled as traitors.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And being defamed.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And being attacked.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Payne responded to the sedition and libel charges as they were being put out against him because, again, they weren't, like, sticking yet, but they were just kind of like, you know, putting things out. Like, I'm gonna sue you. I'm gonna do these things.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We're getting you for sedition. We're gonna get you for libel. He replied with a banger. And he quote, he said, if to expose the fraud and imposition of monarchy, to promote universal peace, civilization, commerce, and to break the change of political superstition and raise degraded man to his proper rank. If these things are libelous, let the name of libel be engraved on my tomb,

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

bro.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He said, bitch, if I'm wrong, then I'm wrong.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

If I'm wrong, bury me with the title, bae.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Put it on me. That's fine. What yeah.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Damn.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So it gets to a head. On September 13, 1792, the poet, the poet William Blake warns Thomas Paine that the government is coming to arrest him.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So Thomas plain fled England, never to return. He never returned because he went to Paris, France.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, okay. Well, Benny Franklin's there probably.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So what he did is he. After he leaves, the British try him in abstention. They basically, they're like, yeah, we'll just empty thing. They hold a kangaroo court.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And they try him. They find him guilty of seditious libel.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And then they suppress all of his works. Yeah. And they, they. They basically destroy the entire democratic movement in England for over the next decade or so.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And that's why, like this, the rights of man isn't talked about as much anymore because it had this, like, flare up. It was like this rules. And the government was like, like, we'll kill you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

All right. Oh, oh. It seems like maybe if we talk about having rights and human rights.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But again, you have to remember this is. This is in England about 100. 100, 150 years after they had had a revolution that had had the king decapitated that ended up in a dictatorship with Oliver Cromwell that ended up being replaced by just them being like, ah, do over. Sorry, we don't know how to work without a king. And they've never got. Now they have sausage fingers sitting there.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They have old sausage finger Epstein list hanging around. Well, sorry, brother of Epstein brother.

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[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, Mrs. P, we're back. And Thomas Paine has made it to France.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He made it to France.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He did crepes and the fruit. Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And more steak tartare.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Steak tartare.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Escargot.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Champagne. Moulin Rouge.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay. Anyway, because the. The France that Thomas Paine arrives in, very different than the one he left years earlier.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because again, remember, he was there. He was hanging out with the Marquis de Lafayette. He's hanging out with Thomas Jefferson. He leaves, goes to London, hears about the revolution. He gets back, and it's fucking crazy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, dude. Jean Valjean's there going nuts over a loaf of bread.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He gets off. He gets off the boat in Calais, and immediately he's met by a huge mob of people who were like, guess what, buddy? A week couple weeks ago, we made you an honorary Frenchman. We fucking loved your book. Your book rules. You're French. He's like, okay. And like. And we elect you to the government. He's like, what? No, because here's the thing, he doesn't speak French, but he is now officially a Frenchman and a member of the National Convention.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, all right. This could go poorly if you don't speak the language.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, well, you know, French people are always cool if you don't speak French. So what happens next was that he started to, like, hang out. He's, like, hanging out with, like, radicals, American radicals, English radicals, Irish radicals.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure, sure, sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They're all talking about all this different shit that's going on.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They're just in coffee houses having thoughts, basically.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. But imagine sitting around like, revolution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So cool.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, my God. Fuck the king. I hate hereditary monarchy. And he's like, hell, yeah, dude. But he gets added to a committee. That committee is supposed to draft the new constitution. And this is kind of an issue because pain is there. And they're like, you're such a smart idea with your ideas of liberty and democracy. And he's like, yeah. And he's sitting there and he starts telling about it, and they're like, oh, I didn't know you were liberal.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, shut the fuck up.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They're in England and America.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He's a leftist.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Thomas Paine is a radical lunatic.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And then in France, he's a centrist.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's a moderate centrist. And so, like, legit. They're like, liberal, liberal. Look at this. Lib

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Blue Mega 100.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They are, like, screaming at him. What are you talking about? No, we gotta go full tilt. We gotta get rid of God. He's like, yo, chill. They're losing their mind about everything. And he's just like, this is crazy. There's a group called the Jacobins. They hated Thomas Paine. And one of the big things that actually came up and that when the big, like, catalyst moment that happens is when they're arguing over whether or not they should execute Louis xvi, who at this point is known as Louis Capet.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

We should.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Well, there you go. You are a Jacobin. Thomas Pain was against public comment, was against the death penalty.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because he was raised a Quaker.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So he was like, you know what?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Honestly, he's like, listen, France invented guillotines for a reason.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

That's literally one of the things he points out, because you guys are a little bit too horny for this new thing. You're a little bit too horny for the choppy choppy. But he says in a big speech, he says to them, he goes, listen, Louis XVI really helped out America. If anything, what you should do is you should just exile him. You should just kick him out, send him to America. And what happens? As he's giving this speech, a guy named Jean Paul Marat stood up and said, of course. Of course Thomas Paine would say this. He's a Quaker. Quakers don't believe in the death penalty. And in fact, I don't think Quakers should be allowed to vote because he's like, you don't have an open mind. You're coming to this with your religious beliefs.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Beliefs.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And we're against religion.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And we killed God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And we killed God. So, like, you are. You are stupid and we hate you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And there's even an argument, too, because he's using a translator. Thomas Paine is using a translator who's translating things into French. And they even try to. Marat even tries to argue that the translator is lying and trying to make the language more, like, normal or, like, saying different things. And Thomas is actually saying even, like, more moderate, even conservative things.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And that they actually had to have an Argument. He's like, no, here's a transcript of the worst. I was going to say, like, you can translate them again. And that different person translated that they then trusted. Thomas did vote against it, but Louie was narrowly convicted.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And beheaded, obviously.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Of course, a few months later, Marat then led an insurrection that took all of Payne's political allies out of power and began the reign of terror.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know the reign of terror with Robespierre. Yeah, they start chopping people's heads off every day.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

So he really liked the Guild scene. This wasn't.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, this is.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

We're.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We're at choppy, choppy time. They're like. They're guillotining people over and over and over again. And ironically, this is actually one of the things that Edmund Burke was like, I'm just telling you right now, if you go down this route, you guys just start fucking killing each other. And there's gonna be a weird dictator like Edmund Burke in some ways. And again, so does John Adams. Some of these conservatives, when you look at the push and pull of history, and you have. Look at some of these examples, there are checks that need to happen. There are things people do. And many of them, what they argue and the forms of government that they're trying to create are that people are inherently greedy. Payne believes that people are inherently good. And he keeps thinking that it'll go back to these moments. Yeah, he keeps thinking that these are just blips on the road.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

But basically, meanwhile, we're sitting here in 2026 experiencing the same.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Basically.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Got it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

100. So basically, at this point, while all of his allies are being arrested.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. How's my boy?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's writing a new book. And then one day, Payne gets arrested by the Committee of General Security. And that is the group that is basically the government at this point.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The Committee of General Security is run by Maximilian Robespierre. And some people, and even Payne himself believe that actually the United States had a hand in this. Specifically, United States Ambassador, and his name was Governor Morris.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

More. Wait, his name was Governor Morris?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes, Governor Morris, the New York lawyer that he made as an enemy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, my God.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because what happens is Payne gets arrested, and 16 different Americans go to the Committee of General Security, and they're like, hey, you should free him. He's an American.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And they're like, no. And the American ambassador doesn't say anything about it because it's Governor Morris.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And what the Committee of General Security said is, Thomas Paine is actually an Englishman. And we're at war with England, so all Englishmen should be arrested. And so he was. He was thrown in the Luxembourg prison. While he's going through this entire ordeal, Payne continued to write this new book.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And this new book is called the Age of Reason.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, yeah, I've heard of this one.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Okay. It's a book about religion.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And it's a book about how pain is a deist. And he also attacks the idea of organized religion and priesthood because his view was, we've done a revolution against monarchy, we now need to do a revolution against religion. Because he believed that monarchy and religion go hand in hand.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yes.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So you have to overthrow a priesthood to overthrow the aristocracy. And that was what his belief was. He opens the book by stating a few things he believes in, and this is a very short version of it. And this got him in a lot of trouble. He wrote, I believe in one God and no more, and I hope for happiness beyond this life. And then he proceeded to write, I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my own church. All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind and monopolize power and profit. I do not mean by this declaration to condemn those who believe otherwise. They have the same right to their belief as I have to mine. But it is necessary to the happiness of man that he be mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not consist in believing or in disbelieving. It consists in professing to believe what he does not believe. By the way, when he says Turkish church, he means Islam.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I was about to say that.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, he just. He had, like, no real bearing or understanding of it at that point. This is around the time, too, in Islam, they call it, like, Muhammadism. Oh, like, there's. It's again, it's. It's whisper down the lane for a lot of this stuff for these guys all the way in the Western hemisphere. Thomas Jefferson has the copy of the Quran and others, but they're translations that, again, missed the mark on some things. But he was just, in general, just like, I view all of them the same. Yeah, he doesn't even mention Buddhism. He doesn't mention Hinduism because, again, he doesn't have a concept of these things. They haven't really reached him in that way through all of 1794. Pain was in the Luxembourg prison awaiting execution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, they were going to execute. Well, of course, they're choppy, Choppy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes. Choppy, choppy time. Everybody was going to prisons, getting their head chopped off.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. You don't have to keep feeding them, you know.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, no. 2600 people were killed by the guillotine. And in July, Payne came down with a fever, and that fever almost killed him.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But also saved his life.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Why?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So, basically, he gets this horrifying fever, and it's in July, and he was sitting on July 24, the order of execution is laid out for Thomas Paine. But on the night of the 25th, he is laid out with this fever. And his cellmates beg the guards to leave the very heavy cell door open. Because it's a big wood door with little slat. Yeah, he said, leave it open so we can get a little breeze in here. He has a fever, and we need the fever to break. So they left the door open, and they're like, we're not gonna escape. Where we're gonna fucking go? Yeah, leave the door open. And the thing is, how the guards used to pick up the people they would execute was a guy came through with a list of names, and he would just write chalk on the door. And so the next day, they would come by, and anybody would chalk on the door, they would take them, and they'd chop their fucking heads off. Yeah, well, they came by, Thomas Paine's door was open. They put chalk on the door, and then that night, they closed the door. So the next day, when they came to pick up everybody, his chalk was on the opposite side of the door. They didn't see it. They didn't execute him.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. Did that happen again?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, it didn't need to happen again because that was on the 25th. By the time anyone realized that a mistake had happened that he should have been executed on the 27th, Maximilian Robespierre himself was overthrown, attempted to commit suicide, failed, and then was executed himself on July 27th by guillotine, ending the reign of terror, bro.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

What, are you kidding me?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Meanwhile, he's sitting there being like, nah, I don't know. Religion's fake. And then, like, God saves him by giving him a fever.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, my God. That's crazy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So then another thing happens. Shows up to save us.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Them.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

America sends a new ambassador to France.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

They got rid of the governor.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They got rid of Governor Morris, and they sent James Monroe. A future president, I was gonna say. Yeah. So James Monroe shows up, and he works to free Payne from prison. Once he frees him, Payton stays with Monroe as he tries to get better. Because he's still recovering from his fever.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah, prison fever.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

In July, he's got prison July fever. It's like November or even December now by the time they free him, while he's there at the U.S. ambassador's official residence, healing, he writes rights, the second part of the age of reason. And he was accepted back into the French government again. And then he was part of them trying to, like, write a new constitution. He got mad about it because they got rid of things like universal suffrage and other ideas that he had and things back and forth. But in 1796, okay, Paine, finally, his anger been boiling over.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because again, the American government didn't try to save him until James Monroe showed up.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. He had high blood pressure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Meanwhile, the entire time Washington was president. Washington supposed to be his boy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Washington.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

President George Washington. The general who he called all those

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

left him to rot in prison.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

His mind. Yes. So Thomas Paine writes a letter, an angry letter to George Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, he doesn't subtweet this.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No. But he wants it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

He tags him in it.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No, this is a dm, okay. He writes a letter to Washington and he gives it to Monroe. Monroe, like, reads it, goes, I'm not fucking sending this to Washington. Insane. So he goes around him, he goes, like, fuck you. And he sends it to Washington.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It. Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Washington doesn't respond, so he sends it again to a publisher in Philadelphia. Oh, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. I'm saying he's like, I tagged him in it. Yeah, he did. And Payne attacked the character of the first president, United States.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Payne wrote that the world will be puzzled to decide whether or not you, George Washington, are an apostate or an imposter. Whether you have abandoned good principles or whether you ever had any. Payne declared that without France's aid, Washington could not have succeeded in the American Revolution and had, quote, but little share in the glory of the final event. He also commented on Washington's character, saying that Washington had no sympathetic feelings and was a hypocrite. He basically was like, you got autism. Basically. Yeah. And this was all in 1796. Yeah, he. He blast watched. He's like you, your everything about you, blah. But the thing is, Washington, you are a liar.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You did chop down that cherry tree.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Washington's the most, like, beloved man in America.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You know, like he won both parties nominations. All this. He. He basically, like, he runs a pose, but, like sweeps the electoral college. Like, this is this is crazy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Everyone in this life's like, do not post that. And he posts it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

His wife is like, please, please don't post that.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And you're like, but I had a couple Miller Lights and a fireball. It seems like a good idea.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But here's the thing. Thomas Paine doesn't have a wife to tell him not to post that.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Right.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But James Monroe's wife was like, dude, don't post that. He's like, I'm old and crazy, so.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And maybe drunk.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Maybe drunk. So he's still in France for a little bit, and the year 1800 hits up, and he meets this guy named Napoleon Bonaparte. And Napoleon tells him how much he loves Thomas Paine. And he's like, just so you know, I sleep with a copy of Rights of Man underneath my pillow. And he went so far as to say that, Pain, there should be a statue of gold erected of Thomas Paine in every city in the universe.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. That kind of goes against everything he said.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. And then Thomas Paine's like, cool, yo, you should invade England. He's like, yo, free England from themselves.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Napoleon's like, you rule, dude.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I need you to know. I don't. It's. It's the amount of spiteful vengeance he holds towards people that make me understand why you love him so much.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I love him so much. So at this point, it's 1802, and Thomas Jefferson's president.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay. His other boy.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

His other boy. And he reads the. Writes a letter. Thomas Jefferson writes a letter to Thomas.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Thomas Paine. Oh, okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Basically, he's like, hey, man, you should come back to America. You're kind of a problem. It's like, you should come back. He's like, listen, I'll send a US Navy vessel and they'll give you a ride back.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

This becomes a minor scandal for Thomas Jefferson because everyone's like, yo, we fucking hate that dude. He talks shit on George Washington and Jesus. Like, what are you talking about? But eventually, he does return. Thomas Paine comes back to America in 1802, and immediately he's being attacked by everybody in the public because they're just so mad at him. But also on top of that, when he arrives back, America is now in what's called the Second Great Awakening.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So, like, during the American Revolution, that's like the Age of Reason. Like, this is that, like, gosh, everything's scientific. We're having these different thoughts now that they've won the war. Like, yo, maybe won the war because

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

God really loves Maybe God, maybe we're the blessed.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, so people are going like, like crazy, talking in tongues. A lot of new religions are springing up everywhere. And he's just like, oh, everybody's nuts.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. He's been gone so long that the people that are in America don't remember all the pamphlets.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, well, some people do. Like the, the veterans do.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But like regular people who weren't involved as much like they aren't thinking. It's a lot of it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's like people that were little kid. Yeah. What he's done.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

What have you done for me lately? And what he's done for him lately is he's like, yo, religions a lot. There is no, you know, there's only one God and there's probably not even a heaven. His idea of deism is actually that there's a first mover and they got everything right. He believes that God is so perfect that God got everything right immediately.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

So why would God show up again to fix it? And actually he believes that the idea of worshiping Jesus is atheist because he's like, you're actually worshiping a man instead of God. That's his arguments that he keeps using, and it makes people so mad. In fact, the end of his life, from 1802 to the end, basically, almost once a week, some lunatic shows up to his farm. It's just like, hey, do you want to accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior? And he's like, no. It's just like every day somebody is writing to him. We're knocking on the door, being like,

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

is he back at the farm in upstate New York?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah, he's at New Rochelle. He's in upstate New York and every day.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

And does he have a gun? Because we got property laws.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

He's got people, people. He's got people.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Because you get enough people coming, knocking, you're trying to save your spirit in this way, babe.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

It's constant. It's constant. And here's the thing, at this point, though, here's the thing you need to know what John Adams still hates him. John Adams in 1805, wrote a letter to a friend of his, Okay. A physician named Benjamin Waterhouse.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And John Adams wrote the following. I am willing you should call this the Age of Frivolity, as you do and would not object if you had named it the Age of Folly, Vice, Frenzy, Brutality, Demons Bonaparte, Tom Paine, or the Age of the Burning Brand from the Bottomless Pit, or anything but the Age of Reason. I know not whether any man in the world has had more influence on its inhabitants or affairs for the last 30 years than Tom Paine. There can be no severer satire on the age for such a mongrel between pig and puppy, begotten by a wild boar on a wolf. Never before in any age of the world was suffered by the poltroonery of mankind to run through such a career of mischief. Call it, then, the Age of Pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, number one. Number one, he doesn't know what it's like to live through what we're living through right now.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

No.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

But number two. The Age of Pain.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The Age of Pain. The age of legit. The whole mind you. Mind you. The whole time Abigail's been like, yo. But he was kind of fire, though, right? He's like this.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

It's like, I bet you one time. I bet you one time. She's like, no, but Hassan's kind of handsome, though, right? And then. And then he's out here. Huh? I see. I see what's happening.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. 100. But again. But you know what it is? It's just like all of these twitch streamers, though. They all.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

You.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You go back to all of them. They all have these hangouts where they're, like, kind of friends for a minute. They get what they need out of each other, and then it's just stab, stab, stab, stab. And that was the entire revolution.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. And I like that. He's like, nobody's ever made America worse, baby.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Wait till you see it be made great again.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

You don't even know.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Oh, my God. But I love that he just kept going down. He's like, the Age of Pain is the age of pain. Meanwhile, this entire time, he's writing the third part of the Age of Reason.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay, great.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because this. This is. He's finishing up because, again, he's an old man. Old men think of religion.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he's 72 years old by 1809, and he dies.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Thomas Payne dies at his farm in New Relle. He had no children, and only six people attended his funeral. His obituary in the New York Evening Post read, quote, he had lived long, done some good and much harm.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Damn.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. Quite a few people said if he had written common sense and then just died, people would have really liked him. Like, that's good. Common sense is good. I guess he's kind of like Kanye in that way.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Bro, don't do that. What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I mean, to some people, maybe this. Maybe he was the Kanye of the Founding Fathers.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

No.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Payne requested to be buried in a Quaker cemetery, but that was refused because of the Age of Reason. They were like, you just. You said, fuck you in this whole book. He's like, well, my dad was a Quaker. I'd like to be like, no. So he was buried beneath a tree on this property, and 10 years later, his bones were dug up because they were sold to a man who was a writer in England.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Okay.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Wanted to give him a proper English burial and to be like, oh, look at this man. You know, at this point, like, revolutionary ideas are beginning to bubble up again. Like, we're thinking about democracy.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And he wanted to build this entire monument to pain.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

But that didn't happen. They just sat in a trunk in an attic for 15 years, and then that man died. And then they got lost to history, where they were, like, passed around somebody, like, carved into one of the leg bones at one point. And eventually somebody claims that there's a jawbone around there somewhere. At some point, somebody did find a lock of his hair in his brain stem. And those were buried back in America. A memorial was built to. To Pain in New Rochelle, but it was regularly mutilated by religious fanatics. Even after he did, they built, like, a little. Like, little. Little thing for him, and they just kept on. They kept attacking it.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Classic.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

In 1899, it was fully restored, and they added a bronze bust of Pain to the. To the memorial.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

And Abraham Lincoln was a great big fan.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Oh, that's nice.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The end. Wow.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I have never learned so much in such a short amount of time.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I wrote a lot. I wrote a lot. Because you've been writing a lot.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

You had a whole gay month. So I was like, you know, let me go. Let me do one Revolutionary founder.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah. A really good one.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

They thank you.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

I like the way he yells about stuff.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

I want to tell you. I want to tell you the Common Sense is a good read.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yeah.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Actually is a good read. I think that if you are. If you have any interest in the American Revolution, you should. It's a very easy. It's a very fast read. I think I read it in, like. Like 40 minutes.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Yep.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Because again, if you're reading it on, like, a tablet, too, the pamphlets were, like, this big. You can find it for free on Kindle or get. Get it from your library. If you go to Libby.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Let's do Pizza Hut. Book it. Okay. It's a summer read. Get this. Read it, and then go get yourself a pizza.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yeah. We're not paying for it, though. You're buying your own pizza.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

No, you gotta go buy your own pizza.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Go buy your own pizza. Get your little personal pam however you want and then sit back. And this is the thing. The thing is, I always do remind, remind myself, because this happened in 2016. It happens like almost every year now. Yeah, PBS or npr, one of them, they read the Declaration of Independence. And every year, conservative maga people get real mad and assume that they're talking about Donald Trump when reality, they're, they're laying out grievances against the King of England. But yeah, that's where we are right now.

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

That's where we're at.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We have a dementia riddled king. Oh, if you want to know more about the dementia of George iii, check out the, the movie, the Madness of King George. It's a really good movie. I really enjoy it. It's, it's a lot of fun and it's, it's harrowing. But beyond that, Ms. P, got any final words for everybody beyond reminding them about your ghost hunt?

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

Go check out my ghost hunt in the link below. Also, we're going on a little break. We're taking two weeks off and then we'll be back.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

Yes, we'll be back at the end of July. I don't know exactly what the date is on that because this is coming out.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

What?

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

The fifth is coming out.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

The fifth.

[Host 1 (likely Ryan or main podcast host)]

We'll be back July 26th. There we go. July 26th. We shall return with an all new episode of Too Many Tabs, but we'll still try to post some content over to the Patreon and other things there. So join [e-mail] thank you and have a good night. Too many frauds and too many scammers that we wish weren't real. Too many cons and too many spammers and we're starting to feel like we've got too many tasks

[Host 2 (likely Mrs. P or co-host)]

too many times.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Remember to smile.